1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,279 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,160 Speaker 1: I'm Holly Fry and I'm Tracy V. Wilson. And this 4 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:19,800 Speaker 1: episode is a topic that I believe is on both 5 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 1: of our lists. I had not gotten to it, and 6 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:26,240 Speaker 1: then I met and had a chat with Avon. So 7 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: she is one of the women selected to be part 8 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: of the Seneca Women Podcast Academy, and Avon had suggested 9 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: to me Mabel ping Hallie as a show topic, and 10 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:38,280 Speaker 1: so she moved to the top of my list. Also, 11 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: keep an ear out for Avon's podcasting coming months. She's 12 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:44,600 Speaker 1: developing one with that program and it will be out 13 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:49,120 Speaker 1: at some point later this year. Um, Mabel is one 14 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:52,120 Speaker 1: of those people who is Chinese. She tended to use 15 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 1: her Anglicized name of Mabel Lee throughout her life, at 16 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 1: least publicly. So we will do the same um in 17 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: parts so that no one has to listen to me, 18 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:06,119 Speaker 1: probably do a really bad pronunciation of Asian vowels, which 19 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,039 Speaker 1: is always very tricky for me. UM, So just know 20 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 1: that as we're going through it, and also, as you 21 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:14,959 Speaker 1: may know, May is Asian American Pacific islander history month. 22 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 1: And while we are not generally governed on the show 23 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:20,400 Speaker 1: by calendar months, because we'll try to talk about people 24 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,839 Speaker 1: from various communities throughout the year, this one does line 25 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 1: up nicely with the wrap up of May. So. Mabel 26 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:32,680 Speaker 1: Penguali was born in Guangzo, China. It's also known as 27 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: canton In and when she was still a small child, 28 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:40,959 Speaker 1: her father, Lito, left China to be a missionary in 29 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 1: the United States. So you'll also see his name, of 30 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: course as Totally, and the spelling of Toe sometimes varies 31 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 1: from source to source. When he first went to North America, Mabel, 32 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: her mother, and her grandmother all stayed in China. Lito 33 00:01:57,600 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 1: was part of a movement that wanted to see cha 34 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 1: and a modernize, and part of that modernization, in his opinion, 35 00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 1: included transitioning to Protestantism. Protestantism was linked to the kind 36 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:11,520 Speaker 1: of social reform that really appealed to him. He had 37 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 1: been a laborer in China, and he thought that without modernizing, 38 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: people like him would never really be able to improve 39 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 1: their lives beyond a very modest existence. So he learned 40 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 1: English and a missionary school and was assigned a position 41 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 1: in the US Northwest by the American Baptist Home Mission 42 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:32,240 Speaker 1: Society in the late nineteenth century, so he was going 43 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: to work within the Chinese community there. And in nineteen 44 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:39,480 Speaker 1: o four, Leto or totally either way you would like 45 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 1: to do it, was transferred, promoted really to a position 46 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: in New York City doing the exact same kind of 47 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 1: work he had in the Pacific Northwest, this time in 48 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: the Morning Star Baptist Mission in Chinatown. It was in 49 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,400 Speaker 1: nineteen o five, not long after Leto's moved to New York, 50 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:00,079 Speaker 1: that Mabel and her mother joined him. Mabel are he 51 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 1: spoke English when she arrived in New York, and she 52 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 1: was enrolled at one of the oldest schools in the country. 53 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: That was Erasmus Hall Academy, which was founded in seventeen 54 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 1: eighty six and it still exists on Flatbush Avenue in Brooklyn. 55 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: It's on the National Register of Historic Places, although it 56 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: is not open to the public. And as a student there, 57 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: maybe Lee was surrounded by other immigrant children. Some were Chinese, 58 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:26,919 Speaker 1: but most of them were Jewish or Italian immigrants from Europe. 59 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:30,080 Speaker 1: It seems that from her earliest years, Mabel was a 60 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,800 Speaker 1: natural activist. When she was just sixteen. She was a 61 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: prominent figure on the New York suffragists scene. That year, 62 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: which was nineteen twelve, New York's Suffragist group staged two 63 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: parades in the city. The first took place on May fourth. 64 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 1: The parade route started in Greenwich Village on Fifth Avenue 65 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 1: at Washington Square, and from there the participants made their 66 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: way up the avenue to the south end of Central 67 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 1: Park at fifty ninth Street, and then turned west towards 68 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: Seventh Avenue. The parade turns south for two blocks, ending 69 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: at Carnegie Hall. The parade started at five pm and 70 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 1: an estimated ten thousand people marched in it. This took 71 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: a year of planning to pull it off, and it 72 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: was covered extensively in the press, and some of that 73 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 1: press was specifically about Mabel Lee. She only got a 74 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:20,799 Speaker 1: brief mention in the New York Times right up about 75 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,320 Speaker 1: the parade, which included her as an example of the 76 00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: diversity of the participants, writing quote, there was one of 77 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:32,479 Speaker 1: the enfranchised Chinese women on horseback, Miss Mabel Lee. Ah, 78 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 1: I'm just having thoughts about the diversity of the movement 79 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 1: at that point, which in a lot of rice really 80 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 1: wasn't right. But to to the New York Times, it 81 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 1: looked very diverse. From these there were diverse participants, and 82 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:50,360 Speaker 1: we'll talk about that, but they did not all benefit 83 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:55,039 Speaker 1: from it. The movement really benefited white women. Yeah. This 84 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 1: has been a theme of our episodes about the suffrage 85 00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 1: movement in the United States in particular, but elsewhere also. Anyway, 86 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:06,560 Speaker 1: even before the parade, Mabel was featured in the press 87 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 1: for her work and her expected appearance in the parade, 88 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 1: and a syndicated article that ran in several newspapers on 89 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 1: May sewod she was mentioned among several other participants who 90 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: were singled out by name. Quote ms. Lee is a 91 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 1: daughter of Mrs Lee Toe, who is also a suffragist 92 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 1: and a Columbia University student. Yeah, that that phrasing makes 93 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: it sound like her mother is a suffragist and Columbia 94 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:34,279 Speaker 1: University student. But that is just a bad copy. And 95 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:38,160 Speaker 1: they were talking about Mabel Um several weeks before that. Though. 96 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 1: On April thirt so, a couple of weeks before the parade, 97 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:46,040 Speaker 1: there was an entire article devoted entirely to Mabel Lee's 98 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: story in the New York Tribune under the headline Chinese 99 00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:54,159 Speaker 1: girl wants vote, and it included a large portrait photograph 100 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:58,280 Speaker 1: of Lee. This article opens with quote regarding her as 101 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 1: the symbol of the new era, when all their women 102 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:05,160 Speaker 1: will be free and unhampered. All of Chinatown is proud 103 00:06:05,360 --> 00:06:09,039 Speaker 1: of little miss Mabel Lee, daughter of the mission pastor 104 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:13,240 Speaker 1: Dr Lee Too, and her brilliant accomplishments. So the choice 105 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:16,839 Speaker 1: of the word little probably seems infantalizing here, and the 106 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 1: article goes on to speak about Mabel's strong mind and 107 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 1: how her convictions have led her to the suffrage movement. 108 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:26,919 Speaker 1: There's this really odd and exoticized description of her mother, 109 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 1: though that was no doubt included to elicit some shock 110 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 1: and to remind readers that Lee was still inherently foreign. 111 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: Keep in mind also that the journalist involved probably didn't 112 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:41,039 Speaker 1: really know all that much about Chinese culture. So this 113 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 1: passage reads quote, Miss Lee's mother is the link that 114 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: holds her and her missionary father bound to the old era. 115 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 1: Mrs Lee To has feet about two inches long, encased 116 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: in red slippers, and she seldom goes out of the house. 117 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:58,760 Speaker 1: She would have to descend four flights of stairs to 118 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 1: do so, but it is not a question of comfort 119 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,919 Speaker 1: only she is high cast, and it would not be 120 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 1: seemly for her to walk in the streets observed by men, 121 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 1: so Mrs Lee's feet were bound. And perhaps the journalist 122 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: was hoping to offer kind of a contrast between Mabel's 123 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: life and her mother's through including this detail, But it's 124 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 1: also a little jarring in the context of the article, 125 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:25,320 Speaker 1: which goes from describing plans for the upcoming parade to 126 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 1: this part of her mother's life. Yeah, it's a very 127 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:32,240 Speaker 1: strange transition. And then the article once again makes a 128 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: pretty abrupt transition because it returns to just talking about 129 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: Mabel and her life goals, mentioning that she hopes to 130 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:41,640 Speaker 1: return to China after she has finished with school and 131 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: teach women there. But then it veers once again, noting 132 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: that her education is for the benefit of her future husband. 133 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: There is a quote from Mabel included, stating quote, how 134 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: can a marriage be happy unless the wife is educated 135 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: enough to understand and sympathize with her husband in his 136 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: business and intellectual interests. This seems to be the great 137 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: difference between the American and the Chinese ideals of education. 138 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,320 Speaker 1: The Chinese ideal is to make the girl a comfort 139 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: and delight to her parents and later to her husband. 140 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: The American ideal is to help the girl toward her 141 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 1: own improvement for her own pleasure. It seems to me 142 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: that each nation has something to learn from the other. 143 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 1: One of the reasons that Mabel was so high profile 144 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 1: was because of what had been happening in China and 145 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 1: the years leading up to the New York Parade that 146 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 1: made her quite famous. In nineteen eleven, when the Chan 147 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: dynasty was deposed, women in China gained the right to vote. 148 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 1: So this made somebody like Mabel a source of fascination 149 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: for US suffragists, even though she had been a little 150 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 1: girl when she moved to New York. Because she was 151 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 1: already active in the women's movement, she spoke a lot 152 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 1: about this step forward for Chinese women when she was 153 00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 1: talking to women's groups in the New York area. It's 154 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: probably but that there was a desire to use China's 155 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:06,680 Speaker 1: newly established women's voting rights to try to prod American legislators. 156 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: It played on their inherent belief that the United States 157 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 1: was more advanced and its thinking than other countries were, 158 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 1: and pointed out that the United States had fallen behind 159 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:19,439 Speaker 1: on this issue. Yeah, it almost seems a little like 160 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 1: the white leaders of this movement were kind of using 161 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 1: Mabel's Chinese identity is a little bit of a tool here, 162 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:32,320 Speaker 1: and it's unclear whether she was cognizant of that or not. 163 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 1: Um she was certainly very outspoken about it, though. On 164 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,760 Speaker 1: the day of the parade itself, Mabel rode on horseback 165 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:42,280 Speaker 1: at the front of the procession, and this is often 166 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: described in a way that makes it seem like she 167 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 1: was this lone horseback rider that led the parade, and uh, 168 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: that was not the case. There was actually an entire 169 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 1: contingent of suffragists riding horses in the first group. Mabel 170 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: was not even the leader of that group. Mabel's horse 171 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 1: was white, which provided a sharp contrast to her black 172 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 1: tricorn hat. That hat was worn by all of the 173 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: women on horseback. We will pause here for a quick 174 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:11,160 Speaker 1: sponsor break, and then when we returned, we'll talk about 175 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: Mabel's time in college. In nineteen twelve, the same year 176 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: as that parade, Mabel enrolled at Bernard College in New 177 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: York City. Bernard had been founded as an all women's 178 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:36,080 Speaker 1: school associated with Columbia University because Columbia would not admit women. 179 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: Mabel became active in the Chinese Student Association and contributed 180 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 1: to the associated periodical Chinese Students Monthly. These essays that 181 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 1: she was writing really continued her feminist activism. In nineteen fourteen, 182 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:54,440 Speaker 1: she wrote a particularly popular essay titled The Meaning of 183 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: Woman's Suffrage, and in her opening paragraph she shows her 184 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,319 Speaker 1: disdain for the way that the women's suffrage movement had 185 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: become something of a joke in some circles, writing quote, 186 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:06,679 Speaker 1: it is a fact that no matter where we go, 187 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: we cannot escape hearing about woman's suffrage. Yet there is 188 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:15,080 Speaker 1: hardly a question more misunderstood, or that has more misapplications. 189 00:11:15,679 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: So manifold are its misconceptions that it has come to 190 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: be a byword suitable for every occasion. For instance, if 191 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 1: when in company, one should wish to scramble out of 192 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: an embarrassing situation, or his more fortunate brother should wish 193 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 1: to be considered witty, all that either would have to 194 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 1: do would be to mention woman's suffrage, and they may 195 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 1: be sure of laughter and merriment in response. That essay 196 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: is definitely a product of its time. While Lee was 197 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:47,479 Speaker 1: incredibly progressive and a lot of ways She also insisted 198 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 1: that equality had to include Christianity, and that, of course, 199 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:55,319 Speaker 1: is very outdated by today's standards. But her larger message, 200 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:59,440 Speaker 1: which she would reiterate throughout her activism, was that excluding 201 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 1: women in from positions of equality was cutting off a 202 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:07,520 Speaker 1: resource that would benefit everyone. Quote I cannot too strongly 203 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 1: impress upon the reader the importance of this consideration for 204 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: the feministic movement is not one for privileges to women, 205 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:18,960 Speaker 1: but one for the requirement of women to be worthy 206 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 1: citizens and contribute their share to the steady progress of 207 00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:28,439 Speaker 1: our country toward prosperity and national greatness. In nineteen fifteen, 208 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,080 Speaker 1: maybel Lee wrote a speech which is also one of 209 00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 1: her famous works that's titled The Submerged Half. And this 210 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: was a plea to China for better education for girls 211 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 1: and for women to have a greater role in civic issues, 212 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: because even though many of them had the right to vote, 213 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 1: they still weren't considered equal. And this speech opened with quote, 214 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 1: I plead for a wider sphere of usefulness for the 215 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 1: long submerged women of China. I ask for our girls 216 00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 1: the open door to the treasury of knowledge, the same 217 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:02,240 Speaker 1: opportunities for physical develop mint as boys, and the same 218 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:06,080 Speaker 1: rights of participation in all human activities of which they 219 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,960 Speaker 1: are individually capable. She makes the case in her speech 220 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 1: that women have long been significant contributors to China's history. 221 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:18,640 Speaker 1: Quote any picture showing the condition of Chinese women throughout 222 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:22,240 Speaker 1: the bygone past, though dark in the main, must be 223 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 1: a moving picture to be strictly truthful. Glimpses of light 224 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 1: run through every scene. Women of learning, women versed in statecraft, 225 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: women of commanding intellect, and heroines and every walk of 226 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 1: life emerged from cramping surroundings and played their parts in 227 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: the long drama of Chinese history. She definitely had a 228 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:46,440 Speaker 1: way with words, and I especially love that passage. Um. 229 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 1: I love her discussion of contrasting of light and dark. 230 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: There and as that speech ends, Lee summarizes her position, 231 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: stating that keeping the country's women from education and opportunity 232 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: is going to hamper its development and its Asian in 233 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 1: the world, writing quote, the welfare of China, and possibly 234 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:08,040 Speaker 1: it's very existence as an independent nation, depends on rendering 235 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: tardy justice to its womankind. For no nation can ever 236 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: make real and lasting progress in civilization unless it's women 237 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:19,480 Speaker 1: are following close to its men, if not actually abreast 238 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 1: with them in the fierce struggle for existence among the nations, 239 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: that nation is badly handicapped, which leaves undeveloped one half 240 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 1: of its intellectual and moral resources. In nineteen sixteen, Mabel 241 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: Lee sought the presidency of the Chinese Students Association. This 242 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: was a case where she was campaigning against a male student, 243 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: since the c s A was an organization that included 244 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:48,400 Speaker 1: both women from Barnard and men from Colombia. Mabel didn't win, 245 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 1: though there was some concern that her victorious opponent TV 246 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 1: Sung may have manipulated the ballots. Yeah, we don't know 247 00:14:57,160 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 1: for sure, and at this point any evidence of that 248 00:14:59,880 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 1: is long gone, but it's definitely something that comes up 249 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 1: in examinations of this period of her life. And speaking 250 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: of ballots, in nineteen seventeen, New York had a constitutional 251 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: amendment on its ballot for the November sixth election that, 252 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,720 Speaker 1: if passed, would grant women the right to vote in 253 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 1: the state constitution. Votes in favor of the amendment one 254 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 1: with fifty three point nine two percent of the vote, 255 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: and this made New York the first state to secure 256 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: the vote for women, and it was a key part 257 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 1: of the strategy of the National American Woman's Suffrage Association. 258 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: They were essentially counting on New York to jump start 259 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: this movement and hoping it would roll through other states. Also, 260 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:44,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventeen, Mabel received a Boxer Indemnity Scholarship to 261 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 1: continue her studies. So for some quick background on what 262 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: that was and the multiple factors in play there. The 263 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: Chinese Exclusion Act of eighteen eighty two had been extended 264 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: by the Geary Act of eighteen ninety two, and then 265 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:03,080 Speaker 1: that extension was made permanent in nineteen o two, when 266 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,080 Speaker 1: the US and seven other nations had sent troops to 267 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 1: China to put an end to the Boxer rebellion in 268 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 1: nineteen hundred. Their terms included that China had to pay 269 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:16,440 Speaker 1: out an indemnity to each nation over the course of 270 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 1: the next several decades. It turned out that the United 271 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 1: States was actually overpaid in this deal, so the United 272 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 1: States and China started negotiating. This is a tricky situation. 273 00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: The US was dealing with the economic consequences of ongoing 274 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 1: tensions with China. In May of nine eight, after a 275 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 1: long period of discussion, the US Congress passed a bill 276 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 1: that enabled China to set up a scholarship fund with 277 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:48,120 Speaker 1: that overpayment that became the Boxer Indemnity Scholarship, and then 278 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: under this program, Chinese students could attend schools in the 279 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: United States. That is the most broad strokes way I 280 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 1: could kind of put that together in this outline. There 281 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 1: of course a million news and subtleties and aspects of it, 282 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 1: and long discussions of Theodore Roosevelt and his behavior and 283 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,160 Speaker 1: all of it that are tied to this. But that's 284 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 1: just to give you a little setup on what this 285 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 1: scholarship was, because it gets reference in relation to Maybe 286 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,440 Speaker 1: Lee a lot, and there's not always a good explanation 287 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: of exactly what it was. But the inclusion in this 288 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: scholarship program is a detail about Mabel Lee's life that 289 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 1: often gets a little bit confusing when you read various 290 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: different biographies, because some of them get it wrong. You'll 291 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:36,280 Speaker 1: sometimes see it reported that she received the scholarship as 292 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: part of her move with her mother to the United States. 293 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 1: That's not the case. She was still a child then, 294 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: and this was a scholarship for higher learnings, so that 295 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 1: doesn't make any sense. Additionally, that scholarship did not exist 296 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: yet in nine five when she moved to New York. 297 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:55,480 Speaker 1: She had been allowed to move from China because there 298 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:59,520 Speaker 1: were provisions within the Chinese Exclusion Act that allowed teachers, 299 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 1: more Chints, diplomats, and missionaries to travel to the US 300 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 1: to live, so she was here under that. It was 301 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: not until she went to graduate studies that she got 302 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: the Boxer Indemnity scholarship. There was, though to be clear 303 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:14,680 Speaker 1: for her and her mother to move here with her father. 304 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: A lot of paperwork involved in securing that permission, but 305 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: it was not tied to the scholarship at all. With 306 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 1: her funding in place, Mabel enrolled at Columbia University to 307 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 1: study economics. She was the first Chinese woman to earn 308 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:32,480 Speaker 1: her pH d in economics there. Then she published The 309 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: Economic History of China in nine one. As she was 310 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:39,679 Speaker 1: in the middle of her graduate studies, women won the 311 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 1: right to vote in the United States through the nineteenth 312 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 1: Amendment to the U s Constitution, which was passed by 313 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:48,480 Speaker 1: Congress on June four, nine, nineteen, and then ratified on 314 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 1: August eighth. N Yeah, we have talked about that man 315 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 1: so many times. Uh. This was of course a huge victory. 316 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 1: But it's important to note that throughout all of this. 317 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: None of that work that Mabel Lee did for the 318 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: suffrage movement was going to enable her to vote in 319 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: the US. She couldn't even become a citizen at that 320 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:10,439 Speaker 1: point because of the Chinese Exclusion Act, and she was 321 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: not the only Chinese woman who advocated for the rights 322 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 1: of women to vote in the US, but she did 323 00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 1: become one of the most visible in New York. It's 324 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 1: worth noting that the Chinese Exclusion Act remained in place 325 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 1: until nineteen forty three. She was also planning to return 326 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 1: to China, so she may not have been especially interested 327 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,959 Speaker 1: in getting US citizenship. Her dream was to open a 328 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 1: school for girls in the country of her birth. As 329 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:40,000 Speaker 1: we mentioned regarding voting rights. In nineteen eleven, imperial rule 330 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 1: in China ended when the Chang dynasty was overthrown. That 331 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,800 Speaker 1: shift had been part of her impetus to develop a 332 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:49,720 Speaker 1: plan to become educated herself, and then she wanted to 333 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,240 Speaker 1: share that education with Chinese women. She had seen how 334 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:56,560 Speaker 1: the so called old ways had prevented her mother from 335 00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,320 Speaker 1: getting an education, and she wanted to offer a different 336 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:03,119 Speaker 1: life path after the next generation. But then a tragedy 337 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: in her family really changed the trajectory of her life, 338 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:09,879 Speaker 1: and we'll talk about that. But even before the event 339 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 1: they really cemented Mabel Wei's life in New York took place. 340 00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:17,199 Speaker 1: Something else happened that seemed to shift her intention away 341 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: from education, at least for a little while. She had, 342 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,720 Speaker 1: according to a Metropolitan Baptist bulletin that was released in ninet, 343 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 1: gone to China to meet with leadership at the University 344 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 1: of Amoy today known as Yaoman University. That meeting took 345 00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:38,840 Speaker 1: place sometime in ninety four. Her trip to China started 346 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:40,800 Speaker 1: in twenty three and ended in twenty four, and it's 347 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,359 Speaker 1: not clear what her schedule was like in terms of 348 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: this meeting. But according to that right up, which I 349 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,919 Speaker 1: will note I did not access directly, I am working 350 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 1: from footnotes in a paper about Lee, she was offered 351 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,720 Speaker 1: a job as dean of women at the university, but 352 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: she turned that job down. It's not totally clear why 353 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 1: she would do. This was essentially exactly what she had 354 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:06,399 Speaker 1: been working towards. However, as we have discussed on the 355 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 1: show before, China was in the midst of a lot 356 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 1: of upheaval during this time due to famine as well 357 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 1: as political and social unrest. All of which is kind 358 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:19,200 Speaker 1: of interlocking and related. The decision to decline that offer 359 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: may have been as simple as just avoiding risk. So 360 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,760 Speaker 1: she returned to New York and she appears to have 361 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: started working with an export business that was based in 362 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:31,359 Speaker 1: Hong Kong. It is entirely possible that her intent was 363 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: to spend some period of time back in the States 364 00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 1: earning money. Remember, she had a PhD at this point, 365 00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,960 Speaker 1: so she was able to command a pretty good salary, uh, 366 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,240 Speaker 1: and then do that for a while before returning to 367 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:45,639 Speaker 1: China full time at some point in the future. But 368 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:48,320 Speaker 1: that's all still pretty speculative. We don't really have any 369 00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:51,399 Speaker 1: of her personal thoughts on the matter. Yeah, and in 370 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:55,640 Speaker 1: ninety four, Mabel's father, Leto, died suddenly after a heart 371 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:58,640 Speaker 1: attack or a stroke, and as death has its own 372 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 1: more surrounding it. Since his early days working in Chinatown, 373 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:05,640 Speaker 1: Mabel's father had worked really hard to try to reduce 374 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 1: the crime in the neighborhood. There was violence among the 375 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:12,520 Speaker 1: loring Tongs in the city was trying to deal with that, 376 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:15,880 Speaker 1: and according to several accounts, on the night of November twenty, 377 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:21,200 Speaker 1: Reverend Lee had invited the leaders of two of these 378 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: rival groups to dinner to try to facilitate negotiations with them, 379 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:30,480 Speaker 1: but this discussion became increasingly contentious, and Mabel's father died 380 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:35,879 Speaker 1: on the spot. Yeah the prevailing opinion is that he 381 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:39,320 Speaker 1: became so upset that it it catalyzed whatever this event 382 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:43,400 Speaker 1: was that killed him. Mabel immediately stepped into the roles 383 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,880 Speaker 1: that he had left vacant in his death, first as 384 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:50,320 Speaker 1: her mother's caretaker and also as leader of his church. 385 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 1: She was not officially recognized as her father's successor until 386 00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 1: five weeks later, when the American Baptist Home Mission Society 387 00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: and the New York City Baptist Missions Society appointed her 388 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 1: as mission director. So Lee's life may have switched paths 389 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 1: at this point, but her activism remained, just with a 390 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:13,360 Speaker 1: different focus. When she inherited her father's work, she immediately 391 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,199 Speaker 1: started to look at how she could move the mission 392 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,240 Speaker 1: and its community forward. Her father had, as his work 393 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 1: with various groups and conflict indicates, done a lot of 394 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: work to galvanize Chinatown. He was deeply respected for it. 395 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: He had amassed a lot of trust in the community, 396 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,160 Speaker 1: and he had also become really influential, and Mabel Lee 397 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 1: was not about to squander that hard earned family reputation. 398 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: One of the biggest problems that she saw immediately upon 399 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: assuming her father's work was that there was a little 400 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,120 Speaker 1: bit of a transient aspect to his mission. The Chinatown 401 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:50,639 Speaker 1: Mission had always rented space. It did not have a 402 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 1: permanent address of its own, so she started to create 403 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 1: a plan to change that. Mabel worked closely with the 404 00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 1: executive secretary of the New York City Baptist Mission Society. 405 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: That was Dr Charles H. Sears, who studied and wrote 406 00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 1: extensively during his lifetime about the benefits of community churches 407 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 1: in cities, and together Sears in Lee launched a fundraising 408 00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 1: campaign that was able to raise enough money for the 409 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 1: mission to purchase its own building. It appears that Mabel 410 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:22,440 Speaker 1: initially envisioned this project as something she could do as 411 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:26,199 Speaker 1: a transitional leader for the church. Unlike her father, she 412 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 1: hadn't gone to theology school. She didn't see herself as 413 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:33,119 Speaker 1: a minister. She saw herself really as a social activist, 414 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,160 Speaker 1: which had been the draw of a real estate project. 415 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:38,320 Speaker 1: She felt that in giving the mission a permanent home, 416 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:41,400 Speaker 1: she was creating not just a religious center, but also 417 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,600 Speaker 1: a place where the church could offer social services and 418 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,719 Speaker 1: help the community in a variety of ways. She had 419 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,120 Speaker 1: a three year plan to serve in her role as 420 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 1: director through fundraising, purchase, groundbreaking, and opening of the building, 421 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:57,359 Speaker 1: and then she thought she would go back to China 422 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:00,919 Speaker 1: and have a career in women's education. Coming up, we 423 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:05,000 Speaker 1: will discuss Maybe Lee's efforts to retain the church congregation's 424 00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:09,120 Speaker 1: Chinese identity while actually still trying to extricate herself from 425 00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 1: a life that she had not anticipated, And we will 426 00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 1: cover all of that after we hear from the sponsors 427 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:26,120 Speaker 1: that keep stuff you missed in history class going. Because 428 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 1: the mission was part of Chinatown, the members of the 429 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: church were still very concerned about the events that were 430 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 1: taking place in China, and Maybe Lee shared her thoughts 431 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,399 Speaker 1: on the matter with the congregation through her most comfortable 432 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 1: means of communication, her writing. She wrote newsletters that circulated 433 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 1: to the membership discussing current events as Chinatown watched the 434 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: anti imperialist movement in China from across the globe. To Mabel, 435 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,960 Speaker 1: this really seemed like a chance for Christianity to become 436 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: the way forward for China, and the newsletter she released 437 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 1: six months into her time at the Chinatown mission. She 438 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 1: spread plenty of blame around for the situation that China 439 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: was facing. She attributed the issues of the country to 440 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,280 Speaker 1: Western nations and to the old regime for clinging to 441 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,720 Speaker 1: power through any means necessary, as well as to Chinese 442 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:17,800 Speaker 1: citizens who had lost sight of caring for one another 443 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 1: in favor of pursuing wealth. She believed very strongly that 444 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 1: Christian faith was the best way to heal the country, 445 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,560 Speaker 1: and the fault couldn't be placed in any one spot. 446 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,159 Speaker 1: The people of China had to be willing to acknowledge 447 00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 1: their own problems. She wrote, quote, it is not the 448 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:36,880 Speaker 1: nationality which counts. Not all Chinese are to be trusted, 449 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,879 Speaker 1: and not all foreigners are anxious to crush us. We 450 00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 1: have many foreign friends who are very anxious to help 451 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 1: us win our rights. The difference lies in the fact 452 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 1: that they have Christianity in their hearts. Christianity is the 453 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,119 Speaker 1: salvation of China and the salvation of the whole world. 454 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:55,000 Speaker 1: She definitely had a very narrow view of how the 455 00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,679 Speaker 1: future should look. Um Though Maybee may have intended to 456 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,680 Speaker 1: one day move back to China, Kina, that was still 457 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 1: not going to be how things played out. She stayed 458 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:06,120 Speaker 1: in New York when the building that housed the first 459 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 1: Chinese Baptist Church of New York City was completed. Although 460 00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 1: we don't have an entirely clear sense of what led 461 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,399 Speaker 1: to that decision, but there were plenty of things that 462 00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 1: would have contributed. We already mentioned the upheaval going on 463 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:22,080 Speaker 1: in China, and that was ongoing, and in the US 464 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,960 Speaker 1: there was also a degree of backlash to the success 465 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 1: of the movement to gain the right to vote for women. 466 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,919 Speaker 1: So even though Mabel Lee was not directly benefiting from 467 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:34,080 Speaker 1: the nineteenth Amendment, she did still get the same negative 468 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: response from detractors as anyone else who had fought for 469 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,760 Speaker 1: the cause, particularly considering that she had been one of 470 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,200 Speaker 1: the figureheads in the press. Trying to find a job 471 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:45,679 Speaker 1: in the US was going to be incredibly difficult for 472 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: a Chinese woman, no matter how accomplished and educated she was. 473 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 1: Aside from the fact that she was associated with a 474 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 1: movement that not everybody liked, she was also a foreigner 475 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: and racism was a factor. So maybe Lee's decision to 476 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,240 Speaker 1: stay at the mission may have kind of boiled down 477 00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:04,560 Speaker 1: to just seeing it is perhaps the only way she 478 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:07,159 Speaker 1: could continue to earn a living in a job that 479 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 1: was meaningful to her. But even getting to the point 480 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: where the new building was up and running had been 481 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 1: a long and arduous path that had gotten Mabel even 482 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,400 Speaker 1: more deeply rooted in New York. For one, the initial 483 00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:23,439 Speaker 1: fundraising campaign had enabled the purchase of a building at 484 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:25,879 Speaker 1: twenty one Pell Street, but there were a lot of 485 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: problems with the space. Was going to cost a lot 486 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: more to get it renovated to the point that it 487 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:35,400 Speaker 1: could be usable, and that meant finding another place. That 488 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:37,960 Speaker 1: led to the purchase of a second property, which was 489 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 1: a Chinese restaurant on Mott Street. There's actually a story 490 00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:43,920 Speaker 1: there that that is actually the restaurant where her father died. 491 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 1: Mabel actually found a patron through her connections who could 492 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,600 Speaker 1: give enough money to make this financial move. That also 493 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 1: meant that a stock company had to be set up, 494 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 1: something Mabel also did. The stock company purchased the restaurant, 495 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 1: which was believed to be a better building for setting 496 00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:04,360 Speaker 1: up the church, But then the Great Depression hit before 497 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 1: the Pell Street location had been sold, so then there 498 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:11,640 Speaker 1: were two properties that were losing value. Mabel Lee, who 499 00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:15,479 Speaker 1: had family money and assets, seized this opportunity and offered 500 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 1: to buy the Pell Street location from the Baptist City 501 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 1: Mission Society with the intent that the title would be 502 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,680 Speaker 1: transferred to the Chinese church. This actually took a really 503 00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 1: long time because the city's Baptist organization went back on 504 00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:32,480 Speaker 1: the deal. Lee kept working on the properties needed upgrades, 505 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:35,560 Speaker 1: and it was finally settled as a Chinese Baptist church 506 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty six, though the New York City Baptist 507 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: Mission Society still technically owned it and would continue to 508 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: own it until Mabel was finally able to have the 509 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 1: title fully transferred to the church, and didn't happen until 510 00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty four. But even by the early nineteen thirties, 511 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 1: so much of Mabel Lee's life and finances were tied 512 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,840 Speaker 1: to the church that it's really not surprising that she stayed, 513 00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:03,320 Speaker 1: although she did em conflicted about it. Yeah. She famously 514 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:06,800 Speaker 1: one of her friends, who was a well known intellectual 515 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 1: at the time, kind of made some comments about like, 516 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: is this what you're going to do with your life? Um, 517 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 1: and she really did struggle. The following year, n seven, 518 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,920 Speaker 1: Mabel went to China on a third and last trip 519 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,240 Speaker 1: back that she made as an adult. She might have 520 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 1: once again been considering taking a job there. According to 521 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: travel documents, she returned to the US, entering through port 522 00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 1: at Seattle on June seven, less than two weeks before 523 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: Japan invaded China and set off the Second Sino Japanese War. 524 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:43,320 Speaker 1: If Mabel had been considering a return to Asia before 525 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: that event, any thoughts were surely cut short at that point, 526 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,880 Speaker 1: and from then on she remained entirely dedicated to the church, 527 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:54,160 Speaker 1: almost to the exclusion of everything else in her life. 528 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,080 Speaker 1: This is a good time to note that Lee certainly 529 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 1: had admirers over the years, but she never married, and 530 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 1: accounts of her life don't really even mention any serious relationships. 531 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 1: This is interesting, and that in her teen years she 532 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,920 Speaker 1: had spoken really publicly about the importance of education for 533 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,840 Speaker 1: girls as part of preparing them to be good wives, 534 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 1: but she didn't choose to become a wife herself. We 535 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: don't know if she consciously came to the conclusion that 536 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 1: it wasn't in line with her goals for herself, or 537 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,480 Speaker 1: if she just didn't care for any of the prospective 538 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 1: suitors who presented themselves to her. Mystery, we don't really 539 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:33,400 Speaker 1: know her years as the church's minister, though we're not 540 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:37,480 Speaker 1: exactly easy for may Belee. Although she saw things very 541 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: clearly in terms of what she thought was best, there 542 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:43,040 Speaker 1: were plenty of Chinese residents of New York who did 543 00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,479 Speaker 1: not want to convert to Christianity, and they did not 544 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:50,280 Speaker 1: see Christianity as a solution to anything. Additionally, she was 545 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 1: living in a country that, while largely Christian, had its 546 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: own disagreements between factions of the Christian faith, and Mabel 547 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,960 Speaker 1: worried that Chinese Christians were pretty too dependent on White 548 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 1: Christianity for leadership, as evidenced by that issue of property titles. 549 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 1: She wanted to see a new Chinese Christianity which would 550 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: not be beholden to the New York City Baptist Missionary Society, 551 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 1: one that could self govern with an understanding of the 552 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:21,720 Speaker 1: ways in which Chinatown and its residents were unique. But 553 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:25,120 Speaker 1: this ideology led to its own problems. For one, it 554 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 1: meant that its mission was on its own. It was 555 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 1: unwilling to combine or unify with the other churches of 556 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:34,320 Speaker 1: the city. Then, for younger members of the church who 557 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:36,840 Speaker 1: had been born in New York and felt like that 558 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: was a large part of their identity, a church so 559 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: dedicated to the identity of first generation immigrants didn't seem 560 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 1: like the right fit. The congregation started to shrink by 561 00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: the early nineteen forties. Some people saw mabel Leah's stubborn 562 00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,920 Speaker 1: to the detriment of her own cause, and according to 563 00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 1: letters exchanged between Baptist leaders in New York at the time, 564 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,960 Speaker 1: quote nothing could ever persuade doctor Lee to enter into 565 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:07,160 Speaker 1: cooperation with anybody. The congregation numbers kept diminishing, with some 566 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:10,240 Speaker 1: members of the congregation moving away to other cities, and 567 00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 1: then in World War Two, young men from first Chinese 568 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: Baptist left for the war effort. Throughout all of this, 569 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 1: maybe Lee had continued her social programs through the church, 570 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 1: going all the way back to the nineteen twenties. She 571 00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:24,800 Speaker 1: and her mother had fundraised together to send aid to 572 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: the people of China who had been most impacted by 573 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:31,280 Speaker 1: the famine. She worked on youth program She sent students 574 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:34,520 Speaker 1: to college. She worked on various projects to support the 575 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:38,479 Speaker 1: neighborhood and its residence. She had founded the Chinese Christian 576 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,480 Speaker 1: Center in the church building on Pell Street, and through 577 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 1: that she was able to provide a health clinic and 578 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 1: a kindergarten to Chinatown's residents. As well as English language instruction. 579 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 1: But though she had put a lot of effort into 580 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,240 Speaker 1: the church, particularly getting it to a point of independence. 581 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 1: Once she had achieved that milestone, her congregation had largely dissipated. 582 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 1: Maybe Lee remained and kept the church going though for 583 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,080 Speaker 1: the remainder of her life. Mabel Lee died in New 584 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 1: York in nineteen sixty six. It's not clear if she 585 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:12,200 Speaker 1: ever became a US citizen or whether she ever voted 586 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:17,840 Speaker 1: in the US. On December two, Manhattan's Chinatown post office, 587 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 1: located at six Doyers Street, was named the Maybe Lee 588 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:25,719 Speaker 1: Memorial Post Office. At the dedication ceremony, Senior Associate Dean 589 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,480 Speaker 1: of Students at Barnard Christian Kansu said of Maybe Lee quote, 590 00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,040 Speaker 1: she was fearless and selfless in her efforts as a 591 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,719 Speaker 1: suffragette advocating for women's voting rights, even though those very 592 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:39,840 Speaker 1: rights would exclude her as a Chinese immigrant. She understood 593 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,239 Speaker 1: that equality of opportunity was essential and that someday that 594 00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:47,120 Speaker 1: opportunity would extend to the Chinese American community as well. 595 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,319 Speaker 1: I really was excited to talk about her because she 596 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,160 Speaker 1: is an example. Whether you align with all of her 597 00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 1: beliefs or not of a person who was not about 598 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 1: herself her advocacy, like it didn't need to impact her 599 00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:05,480 Speaker 1: for her to see something as important and worth doing 600 00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 1: if it helps somebody else, which something that's a little 601 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:11,799 Speaker 1: harder to come by sometimes. Uh, And I think we 602 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 1: should all be reminded that that is an important value 603 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:21,040 Speaker 1: in our It's hard, I understand, but she's great for 604 00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 1: that reason. Do you have a listener mail before we 605 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: close out? I have a couple of pieces, um. One 606 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:30,200 Speaker 1: is one that you brought to my attention from Facebook. 607 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:33,279 Speaker 1: It is about theta Bara from our listener Heather, who 608 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 1: said love the pot in the episode, but curious as 609 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:39,200 Speaker 1: to why there was no mention of Barra being Jewish. 610 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: I have the easy answer, sort of, which is that 611 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:46,880 Speaker 1: she was Jewish, she never really practiced, and in the 612 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:50,800 Speaker 1: biographies I read that's kind of what they said, um, 613 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 1: which felt a little like anemic to include episode well, 614 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,600 Speaker 1: and some aspects of her life seem like they have 615 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,800 Speaker 1: a different read with that piece of the context, like 616 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,160 Speaker 1: like the name changes. Uh, if that was a factor 617 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 1: trying to move away from a name that might be 618 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 1: more like that plays a part right, but still some 619 00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 1: question marks. Yeah, I mean, one of the one of 620 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:23,560 Speaker 1: the big biographies that's very popular about her literally says this, 621 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:28,520 Speaker 1: she did have her butt mitzvah uh, and it says 622 00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: the and the never very religious, was always proud of 623 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,959 Speaker 1: her heritage, but it never seemed to come up again ever. 624 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,680 Speaker 1: So I was like, how so I don't have the answer. 625 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:41,640 Speaker 1: The other thing that was really interesting and kind of 626 00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 1: led me to be like, I don't know of a 627 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:45,200 Speaker 1: way to say this that does it just sound like 628 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 1: lip service to acknowledging it is that in the National 629 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:53,240 Speaker 1: Jewish Women's Archive biography of her, they don't mention her 630 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:58,040 Speaker 1: religion at all. She's just included. Um So it got 631 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:00,120 Speaker 1: to be a little bit tricky, But I apologize as 632 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:02,280 Speaker 1: if to anybody that felt like we were down playing 633 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:06,279 Speaker 1: that as a moment of representation for Jewish identity on 634 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,879 Speaker 1: the show. It just it seemed so secondary to her 635 00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:11,480 Speaker 1: life that I felt like it was shoehorning it to 636 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:14,120 Speaker 1: put it in because she never seemed to say much 637 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 1: about it or well so that's why, um I did 638 00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:21,320 Speaker 1: also want a point. We got so much good great 639 00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 1: Theda Bara Male, one of which is just two photographs, 640 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 1: and I feel like such a ding Dong for never 641 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:31,880 Speaker 1: having made this connection. Uh. This is from our listener, Am, 642 00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:35,480 Speaker 1: and the only thing she wrote was male Fantasies Unchanged 643 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:37,720 Speaker 1: in sixty years. And it is a picture of Theda 644 00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:42,880 Speaker 1: Barra in Cleopatra where she is wearing this metal I 645 00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:45,759 Speaker 1: wouldn't even call it a bikini because it's just like 646 00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: a cover for her breasts. And then it's a picture 647 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,040 Speaker 1: of Princess Leia in the Hut Slayer outfit, which looks 648 00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:58,960 Speaker 1: almost exactly like it. Ye, I Star Wars dork. Extraordinary 649 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,839 Speaker 1: that I am have ever made that connection, even though 650 00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:06,000 Speaker 1: I love Theda Bara and I like Star Wars never once, 651 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:08,640 Speaker 1: never once, And you have opened my eyes in a 652 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:15,440 Speaker 1: brand new way, um, for which totally grateful. I feel 653 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:20,399 Speaker 1: so foolish for never having noticed h But now it's 654 00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:26,319 Speaker 1: all I'm going to see. Um. And just to be 655 00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:30,120 Speaker 1: on theme, we'll talk about another reference to Theda Bara 656 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:33,680 Speaker 1: in my world, although I have an excuse for this 657 00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:37,040 Speaker 1: one that I never knew about. This is from our 658 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:41,200 Speaker 1: listener John, who writes, Hello, Theda Bara has an unusual 659 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,560 Speaker 1: legacy and that she is the namesake for one of 660 00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:48,240 Speaker 1: the bears in Disney's Country Bear Jamboree at the Magic Kingdom. 661 00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,600 Speaker 1: The bear that descends from the ceiling on a swing 662 00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:54,040 Speaker 1: and sings is named Teddy bearra. I knew that Teddy's 663 00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:56,880 Speaker 1: name was a pun referencing a long ago actress, but 664 00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:59,080 Speaker 1: I didn't know anything about Theda until I listened to 665 00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,839 Speaker 1: the podcast. Country Bear Jamboree was one of the last 666 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:05,160 Speaker 1: projects while Disney was involved in before his death. Maybe 667 00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:07,279 Speaker 1: he or one of the imagineers was a fan of 668 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:15,120 Speaker 1: thet is um. John also includes pictures of his non 669 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:17,759 Speaker 1: human family members, Pee could Be, the cat who was 670 00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:21,239 Speaker 1: no longer with us but was adorable, and the very 671 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:26,400 Speaker 1: much alive Skittles, the Chihuahua toy poodle makes wholely moses, 672 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:30,200 Speaker 1: that's cute dog. Okay uh, He writes, I usually listen 673 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,520 Speaker 1: to the podcast while walking Skittles early in the morning. 674 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:35,040 Speaker 1: Thanks for always having interesting and varied content. I've been 675 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,120 Speaker 1: listening for many years. I always assume. Now I will 676 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:40,400 Speaker 1: say two things. I always assumed that Teddy bearrow was 677 00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:42,840 Speaker 1: just because that bear is supposed to be sort of 678 00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:45,400 Speaker 1: cute and sweet and cuddly. But it makes more sense 679 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:48,480 Speaker 1: that it is a reference to Theda. Bara. Actually also, 680 00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 1: I don't love the Country Bearsamber. I find those bears 681 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,799 Speaker 1: slightly frightening. So I have only been a partaker of 682 00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,600 Speaker 1: that particular entertainment maybe three times in my life, So 683 00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm gonna beg out with that one. But now we 684 00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:07,319 Speaker 1: have two evidences of me being a dangling and not 685 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:11,279 Speaker 1: recognizing connections, which is great. If you would like to 686 00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:13,640 Speaker 1: write to us and tell me another thing I've missed 687 00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:16,319 Speaker 1: that's connected to Disney or Star Wars knock yourself out, 688 00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:19,240 Speaker 1: you can do that at History podcast at iHeart radio 689 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,720 Speaker 1: dot com. You can also find us on social media 690 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:23,920 Speaker 1: as a missed in History and if you have not 691 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,200 Speaker 1: yet subscribed to the show that is easiest Pie you 692 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:28,880 Speaker 1: can do it on the i heeart radio app or 693 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:36,879 Speaker 1: anywhere you listen to your favorite shows. Stuff you Missed 694 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:39,360 Speaker 1: in History Class is a production of I heart Radio. 695 00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,279 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from I heart Radio, visit the i 696 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:45,560 Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to 697 00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:46,440 Speaker 1: your favorite shows.