Speaker 1: I always like to reiterate that I'm California sober and
Speaker 1: people often comment about, you know, my usage of cannabis
Speaker 1: products as a sober man, and you know, that really
Speaker 1: takes me off because I really view it medicinally.
Speaker 2: But anyway, Lava for Good and Stand Together in Music
Speaker 2: Present The War on Drugs Podcast, Season two. This season,
Speaker 2: we're diving deeper into the real stories behind the War
Speaker 2: on Drugs, It's impact, it's failures, and the people offering.
Speaker 3: A better path forward.
Speaker 2: Today on the show, Grammy nominated musician, singer, songwriter, guitarist,
Speaker 2: hailed as the next Stevie ray Vaughn and founder of
Speaker 2: the Curfew Foundation, a support system for musicians from all
Speaker 2: walks of life who are battling challenges with mental health
Speaker 2: and addiction. Mister Marcus King, all right, welcome to another
Speaker 2: episode of The War on drug Among.
Speaker 4: We back at it, We back added.
Speaker 5: Season two is running strong and we lean on our
Speaker 5: guests heavy on this season. We always lean on our guests,
Speaker 5: but we really lean on him for their stories.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we got all your comments and reviews from the
Speaker 2: less of us.
Speaker 3: We understand that's what they said.
Speaker 4: That's what they say, But you know, what like, it's
Speaker 4: not about us. It's true. It's about the issue.
Speaker 3: It's true.
Speaker 4: It's about the people. So you need to hear from.
Speaker 2: It if our feeling is going to hurt in the process.
Speaker 4: But without us, you wouldn't. You wouldn't have heard these stories.
Speaker 3: That's true.
Speaker 4: You might have heard a story.
Speaker 2: Yeah, don't kill the messenger the messenger exactly exactly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I like where your heads. I really do like
Speaker 3: where your heads out there, Clayton.
Speaker 4: Where we had to day? This one you did solo?
Speaker 3: I did solo.
Speaker 4: This one was awesome.
Speaker 2: It combines a concert that I got to go to.
Speaker 3: He's performing in DC, Marcus King.
Speaker 5: I wanted to hate on you doing it solo, but
Speaker 5: I can't. You took your wife to the concert, went
Speaker 5: to the concert you enjoyed.
Speaker 4: I couldn't. I couldn't.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 5: I wouldn't want you to take me to the concert.
Speaker 5: I mean, yeah, not with your wife at home. Yeah,
Speaker 5: that's a lot more explaining.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was an interesting time.
Speaker 2: It was like an old opera theater and then it
Speaker 2: was like southern rock play and it was it was
Speaker 2: like it was like it was very it was cool
Speaker 2: and she brought a dog to the interview, which was awesome. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Duck was here and that was amazing. That was the
Speaker 2: best part of the whole thing. So stop by in
Speaker 2: between he was in between doing like dress rehearsals and
Speaker 2: all that, Mike checks and he was able to cop
Speaker 2: by and kind of talk to us about, you know,
Speaker 2: what his lifestyle is.
Speaker 3: He's dealt with addiction, he's dealt.
Speaker 2: With, you know, problems with alcohol and other drugs and
Speaker 2: everything and what he's kind of settled on what's working
Speaker 2: for him right now as he's touring. This the first
Speaker 2: time he's ever toured sober.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: But it's California Sober Okay, So he still uses cannabis
Speaker 2: and he talks about that. You're familiar at home, but
Speaker 2: I'm familiar with California.
Speaker 5: Yeah, California Sober as much like a California King Bed.
Speaker 4: It's a little bigger, it's.
Speaker 2: A little bigger, nearer though I found out it's Nearrow.
Speaker 4: It's just longer it is.
Speaker 5: But no, California Sober is where you just smoke weed,
Speaker 5: you don't drink, you don't do any other substances.
Speaker 2: And Yeah, it's good to hear from someone that is
Speaker 2: at the top of his game, rocking his ass off,
Speaker 2: being able to talk about like, yeah, I lived that
Speaker 2: rock and roll lifestyle, but hey, this is kind of
Speaker 2: working for me. And I didn't want to go full sober,
Speaker 2: but if someone wants to, God bless you, you know,
Speaker 2: it's just showing just a different story and aside, and
Speaker 2: I like.
Speaker 5: The California and sober because I think it kind of
Speaker 5: undoes the idea that people have of we being a gateway,
Speaker 5: right you know, yeah, is the gateway out too?
Speaker 4: If it's a gateway, it's got to swing both ways. Yeah.
Speaker 5: And also, just I commend any artists that decides to
Speaker 5: stop using substances because a lot of times, just from
Speaker 5: my experience being an artist and things, you worry, Hey,
Speaker 5: am I going to lose a step? Is the alcohol
Speaker 5: was making me loose enough to do the show?
Speaker 4: Is it the.
Speaker 5: Pills or whatever that's keeping me up so I could
Speaker 5: do the back to back shows?
Speaker 4: Is it?
Speaker 5: And so a lot of times people it's such a
Speaker 5: crutch and you rely on it because of the uncertainty,
Speaker 5: not knowing am.
Speaker 4: I going to be able to do it without?
Speaker 5: So yeah, you have to know that your talent is
Speaker 5: beyond any state that you're in or any state that
Speaker 5: you put yourself in. And I think that could be
Speaker 5: scary for artists to step out there like yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 5: I commend him. Yeah, No, it's great.
Speaker 2: No, And he touches on that, and I think it's
Speaker 2: really important to show that, you know, maybe you're not
Speaker 2: a rockster, but there's all these levels of these types
Speaker 2: of things and pressures, and it's just cool to hear
Speaker 2: someone be like, no, I'm good and yeah, just different
Speaker 2: ways to do it.
Speaker 5: It's more than one path to redemption, or it's more
Speaker 5: than one path to get out of addiction.
Speaker 4: And California sober.
Speaker 5: I think for so many people that's not looked at
Speaker 5: as being so you're trading one drug for another. Oh,
Speaker 5: well you're not really sober, you're not. But I'm able
Speaker 5: to function for what I'm doing. It works for me.
Speaker 5: And I think that one size fits all thing has
Speaker 5: been the thing that's been holding us back the whole time.
Speaker 2: I kind of think of it like, I remember that
Speaker 2: Tom Brady book came out with like his diet and regiment.
Speaker 3: Right, and it was like, what if this was the.
Speaker 2: Only way that you could lose weight or be successful?
Speaker 2: People read it, we're like, well, fuck this right, I
Speaker 2: don't care. You know something with addiction that we see
Speaker 2: timetime getting like you're going to fail, and a lot
Speaker 2: of people do. And a criminal justice system and kind
Speaker 2: of the war that we've created doesn't allow for those
Speaker 2: failures to build and to be ultimately a success that
Speaker 2: we are able to see because time and time again,
Speaker 2: these people that are our amazing stets in their careers,
Speaker 2: they're struggling with all these things and if they were
Speaker 2: in this box, this would have been an automatic fail.
Speaker 2: But they're allowed to work and be human and then
Speaker 2: succeed after this, after these barriers are broken for them.
Speaker 3: So I think that's just something to really keep in
Speaker 3: mind when it comes.
Speaker 4: To what addition is and is it Yeah, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2: So you know, without further ado, let's hear this interview
Speaker 2: with Marcus King. Really excited for re able to hear it,
Speaker 2: and uh yeah, Mark King and last night at.
Speaker 4: Least duck, don't forget the dog. Don't ju't hear the
Speaker 4: dog yet?
Speaker 5: Hey that me and Greg, our guests and sponsors may
Speaker 5: sound smart, we may even make some good points, but
Speaker 5: at the end of the day, we're not medical professional Okay,
Speaker 5: Please don't get your medical advice from a podcast. Anything
Speaker 5: we say on here does not constitute official medical advice. Relax,
Speaker 5: consult your doctor before you start any new treatment plans.
Speaker 4: Got it, all right?
Speaker 2: So we're here, Marcus King new albums, mood Swings, Tours,
Speaker 2: mood Swings. You're torn right now as we talk. Welcome
Speaker 2: to the War on Drugs podcast. And I think first
Speaker 2: of all, we got to talk about if you hear
Speaker 2: the slobbering and the slapping, that is not me or Marcus,
Speaker 2: that is who are.
Speaker 3: Really here for? Duck Duck the old boy.
Speaker 1: Well, it might be me in some in some instances,
Speaker 1: but this is Duck. He's my emotional support lab and uh,
Speaker 1: he provides emotional support to everybody on the tour. He'll
Speaker 1: be two years old this year, almost three by the
Speaker 1: time this comes out of Yeah, but he's just very
Speaker 1: handsome and he's a handsome, good boy. He's my best friend.
Speaker 3: I don't blame you. I got two back home.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I was saying before we were talking, like
Speaker 2: this is great, Like I missed the heck out of
Speaker 2: him when I when I leave. So yeah, So mood Swings,
Speaker 2: I've listened to the album a bunch sometimes, you know,
Speaker 2: we got to do research and it's a lot of
Speaker 2: articles and videos and you know, on on stuff. But listen,
Speaker 2: listen some good Southern rock is never a bad thing.
Speaker 2: So I really enjoyed it and love your music. I've
Speaker 2: been a fan for quite some time now, so it's
Speaker 2: been awesome. So I know, this is the first time
Speaker 2: you've toured you know, Sober and kind of a lot
Speaker 2: of the writing and things like that. How has that changed,
Speaker 2: you know, the way you've toured your music. A lot
Speaker 2: of the themes that are in Mood Swings maybe not
Speaker 2: as compared to some of the other albums, Like just
Speaker 2: kind of talk about that journey a little bit. How
Speaker 2: that's changed your your music so much in the touring aspect.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you know, the even all the way back
Speaker 1: to the writing portion of the record. Everything kind of
Speaker 1: associated with this album and and this release has been
Speaker 1: kind of a duality between like sober and you know,
Speaker 1: completely like beinge alcoholism, and it's really in line with
Speaker 1: like the uh, the upward swings and the downward swings
Speaker 1: that are associated with Mood Swings, because that's the whole
Speaker 1: record is about. And I kind of wanted with the
Speaker 1: secreencing of the album to uh portray like a day
Speaker 1: in a life of somebody with would like borderline or
Speaker 1: bipolar disorder and kind of give you that you know,
Speaker 1: kind of ride that I take every day, especially when
Speaker 1: the meds are not in flux. And you know, I
Speaker 1: always had to reiterate that I'm California sober. Like even
Speaker 1: on like social media, I see people who have their
Speaker 1: I mean, people are always going to have their commentary.
Speaker 1: People are just real horses asses on social media.
Speaker 3: They know everyone's journey.
Speaker 1: No repercussions on there. And people often comment about, you know,
Speaker 1: my usage of cannabis products as a sober man, and
Speaker 1: you know that really takes me off because I really
Speaker 1: view it medicinally. But anyway, touring sober, you know, the
Speaker 1: beginning of that journey was really difficult for me. And
Speaker 1: I remember my first sober gig. It was in Wichita, Kansas,
Speaker 1: and it was you know borol phrase. It was really
Speaker 1: sobering experience and I haven't turned back.
Speaker 3: That's awesome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And I think that's a part of what
Speaker 2: you were kind of talking about, like people on social
Speaker 2: media and experts and kind of the social stigma around
Speaker 2: those types of things. You know, we had Jesse Gould
Speaker 2: on our season last year of the War on Drugs
Speaker 2: and he was a former military did multiple tours in
Speaker 2: Iraq and Afghanistan, and when he went to the VA,
Speaker 2: when he was struggling, he was drinking a lot. He
Speaker 2: couldn't cope with, like kind of going back through real world.
Speaker 2: They gave him a lot of pills and it made
Speaker 2: things worse for him. And it's crazy how like society
Speaker 2: would look at you almost in a better light in
Speaker 2: a lot of ways if it was just a lot
Speaker 2: of medications and alcohol rather than things that may be
Speaker 2: working better for you. So like everyone's you know, Journey's
Speaker 2: kind of that and kind of the struggle and failure
Speaker 2: of sobriety and going back and forth.
Speaker 3: I think you're exactly right and you feel that with
Speaker 3: your album. But yeah, that that.
Speaker 2: Stigma aspect I wanted to kind of talk about with
Speaker 2: that because you're very open about you know, your mental
Speaker 2: your mental health, your your drug usage, your alcohol usage,
Speaker 2: and kind of going through that was that tough in
Speaker 2: and of itself. Kind of opening up more about that
Speaker 2: because a guy in his twenties like discussing those types
Speaker 2: of things. It's not something we do a but lot, Like,
Speaker 2: was that difficult for you as well? And like did
Speaker 2: that kind of go with the fluctuations too?
Speaker 1: I think that's a great question. It was something I
Speaker 1: was always really open about with my family and my
Speaker 1: friends because it was just, you know, part of my identity.
Speaker 1: To me, there's always something I used as a as
Speaker 1: a writing partner. And you know, I assumed that the
Speaker 1: public knew too. I kind of had this this feeling
Speaker 1: it's just like, oh, well, everybody knows. It's kind of
Speaker 1: like there's a great quote from Jamie Johnson about who's
Speaker 1: another sober pal. He's like, when I grew up, I
Speaker 1: thought everybody was from Alabama, because that's kind of the
Speaker 1: mindset I had about, you know, just being open about
Speaker 1: my mental health struggles and sobriety because my family, we
Speaker 1: were open about it. But at any rate, you know,
Speaker 1: even now I have to explain, like Goodbye Carolina, it's
Speaker 1: not about leaving Greenville. It's about a friend of mine
Speaker 1: who committed suicide because he was, you know, in a
Speaker 1: really bad place and it didn't feel like he could
Speaker 1: speak openly about it. I realized when I started speaking
Speaker 1: about it. People would come up and and thank me
Speaker 1: for being open about it, which to me, I'm like,
Speaker 1: well that's just common sense. We got to talk about
Speaker 1: it or nothing gets done. So now I kind of
Speaker 1: have to overcompensate because I don't I don't generally talk
Speaker 1: a lot, you know, reserves, but I really this is
Speaker 1: something passionate about. I like to talk about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, that's great.
Speaker 2: Yeah, kind of like discussing a little bit more on
Speaker 2: that social stigma and you know, your journey through California
Speaker 2: sober and how people's sobriety looks different for each person.
Speaker 3: Can you kind of talk a little bit through that
Speaker 3: and in your journey?
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, it is a journey, and that is the
Speaker 1: you know, defining word right there. And the whole stigma
Speaker 1: is everybody's journey is different, and it's just like when
Speaker 1: you're you know, struggling with you know, mental handicaps like
Speaker 1: my polar disorder, depression. Everybody's biochemistry is different and that's
Speaker 1: why they give you all these different drugs and you
Speaker 1: can't really figure out how an SSNR or an MSNR
Speaker 1: is going to affect you until about two weeks of
Speaker 1: taking it, and then you're like, well, this makes me
Speaker 1: feel dull, I feel like a zombie. You try something
Speaker 1: else and then you go through this whole program. Is
Speaker 1: because everybody's biochemistry is different, right, It's the same way
Speaker 1: with sobriety. Like I went to AA and like, you know,
Speaker 1: they really frowned upon, like even the usage of like
Speaker 1: prescription medication, which I was like, well, I mean I
Speaker 1: can't really function without a lot of that, So I
Speaker 1: can't really prescribe to that, or you know, the idea
Speaker 1: that you need to completely remove yourself from people who
Speaker 1: engage in the behaviors that you were really drawn towards,
Speaker 1: and I can't really do that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can't do that in any position.
Speaker 1: I'm doing that five or six nights a week. I'm
Speaker 1: in a barroom or a club. And that's why it's
Speaker 1: really great that Stand Together and one million strong. They've
Speaker 1: created these sober spaces and they've brought them out to
Speaker 1: a lot of our shows and festivals we've played, and
Speaker 1: it's great. You know, we had the Mood Swing's mocktail,
Speaker 1: but you know, everybody's journey is a little bit different.
Speaker 1: And for me, California sobriety has been the most effective
Speaker 1: and you know, it's it's something that's of the earth.
Speaker 1: It grows on the earth. And I mean, I know
Speaker 1: I sound like a real cliche saying all these things,
Speaker 1: but you know, I just need my dog. I need
Speaker 1: a little bit of my uh you know, herbal medicine,
Speaker 1: and I'm pretty happy now.
Speaker 2: And yeah, like working in the criminal justice world, we
Speaker 2: see how that failure actually like leads you more into
Speaker 2: your problems because like one time you fail drug tests
Speaker 2: and you're out or something like that, and so it
Speaker 2: really harms people. And so do you have any like
Speaker 2: experiences that you know, like either yourself in the criminal
Speaker 2: just system or anything else where you've seen that where
Speaker 2: people actually are struggling trying to get help, and you know,
Speaker 2: the things that are in place to try to help
Speaker 2: us out just aren't there. Like not treating addiction and
Speaker 2: struggle as like a health issue, we've treated kind of
Speaker 2: as a criminal justice issue.
Speaker 3: And have you had any shared experience with that?
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I mean I think that's that's such a
Speaker 1: heavy topic and one that's not brought up very often.
Speaker 1: But you know, I was kind of in that school
Speaker 1: to prison pipeline right as far as people just you know,
Speaker 1: administrators and the like kind of categorizing you as a
Speaker 1: problem and just kind of putting you on the path
Speaker 1: that they think you should be on. And you know,
Speaker 1: growing up and being along hair in the South and
Speaker 1: smoking pot and all that, and a lot of my
Speaker 1: family members and to an extended family, I'd see them
Speaker 1: go in and out of pre and in and out
Speaker 1: of the system, and a lot of times it would
Speaker 1: be because of a failed drug test or you know,
Speaker 1: what have you. And I just I just feel like
Speaker 1: it shouldn't be a blanketed thing, right, kind of like
Speaker 1: what you're saying, I.
Speaker 3: Wanted to go back a little bit.
Speaker 2: You were talking about a friend who had committed suicide
Speaker 2: and from that though, you found this opportunity. Can you
Speaker 2: kind of talk about your foundation, the Curfew Fellowship Foundation
Speaker 2: and kind of what you're doing there and where that
Speaker 2: came out of.
Speaker 1: Sure? Yeah, around like the Winner of twenty seventeen going
Speaker 1: into twenty eighteen, that's around the time our friend Matt
Speaker 1: Reynolds he committed suicide. And before that we had lost
Speaker 1: Jeff Austin, and and not long after that we lost
Speaker 1: like Neil Cassol, who was a good friend, played guitar
Speaker 1: and we just started to see that there was a
Speaker 1: lot of folks in the arts community that you know,
Speaker 1: we're STU and we didn't really know it. A lot
Speaker 1: of people who were on top of their game, on
Speaker 1: top of their craft, they would you know, lose the
Speaker 1: battle with depression because they'd get to the point they
Speaker 1: were trying to get to and realize that they still felt, yeah,
Speaker 1: that horrible loneliness. And that's something that I grapple with,
Speaker 1: you know, constantly, is just everything's when everything's going right,
Speaker 1: it's sometimes when I feel the lowest, and it's really
Speaker 1: it's really hard. And the more I talk about it,
Speaker 1: the more I can, you know, persevere and get through it.
Speaker 1: Depression is a lot like a cancer, and once it's
Speaker 1: in your system, you could be in remission from it,
Speaker 1: but you can't ever really fully get rid of it.
Speaker 1: I feel like, and you know, my friend Matt lost
Speaker 1: that battle. And he was a tour manager, singer, songwriter,
Speaker 1: and he was a tour manager for Colonel Bruce Hampton,
Speaker 1: who was a real, you know, a wild man, and
Speaker 1: he was just part of that Southern music culture and
Speaker 1: just a really he was really more of like a
Speaker 1: philosopher in a lot of ways, and he just he
Speaker 1: just had like a beautiful mind. But he gave Matt
Speaker 1: the nickname Curfew. So my friend Charles Hpath and I
Speaker 1: started this foundation and his name his honor, and we're
Speaker 1: really excited to see what it, you know, develops into.
Speaker 1: Right now, it's just it's just providing advocacy and raising
Speaker 1: awareness for those in the arts community. I think it's
Speaker 1: something like seventy three percent of musicians struggle with some
Speaker 1: form of mental health one way or another, and it's
Speaker 1: just something that we should be able to speak about
Speaker 1: openly because we all write about it and we all
Speaker 1: use it as a writing partner. But you know, I
Speaker 1: try to make efforts to speak about it without the
Speaker 1: usage of metaphor, like songs like Bipolar Love. Me and
Speaker 1: my producer Rick Rubin, we just we wanted to really
Speaker 1: strip everything away down to the primer and just speak,
Speaker 1: you know, completely, matter of factly and no use of metaphor.
Speaker 4: Together.
Speaker 2: That's all resonated with me a lot, actually, like the
Speaker 2: idea of like the hotter you're, the hotter you are,
Speaker 2: the colder I kind of become and this flip flopping
Speaker 2: and just feeling these emotions. Yeah, like the happy When
Speaker 2: you're happy, that's when you almost feel the loneliness or
Speaker 2: like you almost feel ashamed or embarrassed to be happier
Speaker 2: in a good spot.
Speaker 3: I feel I get you, Yeah now, I get that.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 1: See me personally, I kind of kept a small circle.
Speaker 1: Anyone that was close to me was either someone I
Speaker 1: worked with musically, I just I didn't and I still
Speaker 1: have problem with it just trusting people in general. So
Speaker 1: my circle has always been really small, and I think
Speaker 1: one of the contributors to that is, like, you know,
Speaker 1: seeing people getting strung out either on you know, uh,
Speaker 1: prescription medication and phone victim to the opioid crisis, and
Speaker 1: I'd see that all around me, even in my own
Speaker 1: household and extended family. Oftentimes, a lot of these folks
Speaker 1: would be completely institutionalized at the young age of like
Speaker 1: twenty two, and you know, they'd run out of a
Speaker 1: place to stay, so they go hit up the liquor
Speaker 1: store and they go in and they liked it in there,
Speaker 1: you know, so they completely institutionalized because nobody expected anything
Speaker 1: more from them, right, And that always kind of broke
Speaker 1: my heart and resonated with me because I felt that
Speaker 1: way a lot of the times, you know, and there's
Speaker 1: a lot of teachers I'd love to go back and
Speaker 1: speak to because they told me, you know, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: amount the shit and that I would end up in
Speaker 1: prison or dead. And they didn't have any any faith
Speaker 1: in me. So why would I have any school spirit?
Speaker 1: I'd say probably the majority of the time, I felt
Speaker 1: like I was, you know, a burden and anyway, I mean,
Speaker 1: I had a couple teachers or administrators who could see
Speaker 1: something special in me, and they would encourage my you know,
Speaker 1: artistic you know journey, like Miss Boudreaux, my ninth grade
Speaker 1: English teacher, tenth grade English teacher, she was always really
Speaker 1: sweet to me. But I mean, and Miss Scott was
Speaker 1: my administrator in eleventh grade. It was really the only
Speaker 1: two that come to mind.
Speaker 2: Yeah you know now that yeah, that part of like expectation,
Speaker 2: like there was no expectation, frankwins, So who gives a
Speaker 2: damn And you might as well just keep going down
Speaker 2: that path like it doesn't matter. Yeah, it's like the
Speaker 2: devalueing of like your life, Like that's how yeah, that
Speaker 2: a lot of people go through.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, you know, I had I had a
Speaker 1: lot of struggle in grade school because they they have
Speaker 1: my sister and I on a on a truancy Like
Speaker 1: basically what it was was like a pledge, a written
Speaker 1: pledge that we had to sign. And this was when
Speaker 1: I was in like eighth grade, and it was it
Speaker 1: was again like it was a blanketed law towards like
Speaker 1: all students in the household. My sister was truant. She
Speaker 1: skipped like eighty one consecutive days, which, yes, that's a problem.
Speaker 1: I hadn't missed any days, you know, my dad dropped
Speaker 1: me off. I'd go to school, I come home, so
Speaker 1: I didn't have any issues with truancy. But because I
Speaker 1: was a student in the household, I had to also
Speaker 1: fill out this story. So this carried over me like
Speaker 1: a dark cloud for my entire you know, academic career,
Speaker 1: I guess, however you want to put it. Until I
Speaker 1: was in eleventh grade and they were like pressuring me
Speaker 1: so much, just like to not be late or you know,
Speaker 1: all these other kids would you know, I don't know.
Speaker 1: It just felt really like they were really trying.
Speaker 3: To pressure like any Yeah, you're.
Speaker 1: Just constantly on probation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's always great for someone with anxiety and yeah.
Speaker 5: It was.
Speaker 1: It was just yeah, man, I mean I still have like,
Speaker 1: you know, panicked dreams about it, and like, you know,
Speaker 1: they were trying to put me into like a reform
Speaker 1: school and they wanted to shave my head and I
Speaker 1: was like, man, I was five minutes late. Yeah for
Speaker 1: the bell, I don't really you know, it was really
Speaker 1: you know, they were really nasty with me until I
Speaker 1: was like, I can't do this anymore. I'm gonna drop out.
Speaker 1: And I dropped out of high school. And when I
Speaker 1: made the decision to drop out, they said, you're gonna
Speaker 1: end up in prison. You know, you're a drug addict.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm not, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: But if you won't see me show my ass, I will.
Speaker 1: Then I went out and I did. I showed my
Speaker 1: ass for a long time because that's what they expected
Speaker 1: of me. Why would I let them down?
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: So I think a lot of people go through that,
Speaker 2: and we see that in the criminal just system, where
Speaker 2: that mark like carries with you and you get a
Speaker 2: minor drug conviction or something else and now you can't
Speaker 2: get food stamps or you can't get housing. You know,
Speaker 2: do you know of anyone took in the music industry,
Speaker 2: you know, if you're so in cannabis, like the laws
Speaker 2: are different, like potentially you know there's risks with that.
Speaker 2: Do you know of anyone yourself, like those types of
Speaker 2: run ins doing that and like how that's impacted careers
Speaker 2: and other things out in the music instrie or just
Speaker 2: bodies of yours.
Speaker 1: Well, I'd say, like, you know, the music community has
Speaker 1: always kind of been a safe haven, yeah, for those
Speaker 1: who are outside thinkers, and it's always inspiring to see
Speaker 1: folks like yourself get invested in and something that we've
Speaker 1: always kind of seen to be is an issue, things
Speaker 1: like like what you were mentioned trying to give food
Speaker 1: stamps or get affordable housing, and I mean it really
Speaker 1: is an issue.
Speaker 3: You know, it's a huge thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, kind of going back into music a little bit,
Speaker 2: like how much of that do you take of?
Speaker 3: Like you're not in prison, you're not dead, thank god, you.
Speaker 2: You know, have something like that, like how do you
Speaker 2: if someone's not a musician doesn't see that kind of
Speaker 2: path of like there's a guitar, there's about you know,
Speaker 2: there's microphone or something like that. Like you at ten,
Speaker 2: like how do you how do you how do you
Speaker 2: get someone to like feel that creativity or stuff like that.
Speaker 1: I mean, there isn't innate nature to it. I see
Speaker 1: it like with my nephews, and like, you know, I
Speaker 1: feel like as we progress as a culture, you know,
Speaker 1: there's more distractions to get you away from this. Like
Speaker 1: completely truly analog outlook that I had growing up. That's
Speaker 1: all I had. I didn't have any friends or devices
Speaker 1: to occupy my time. And you know, we were I
Speaker 1: guess what you would call now latchkey kids. You know,
Speaker 1: so I was just alone, or I was with my
Speaker 1: grandparents and you know, they would just be hanging. You know,
Speaker 1: there wasn't much going on, so I just just play
Speaker 1: guitar all day. I had a good bit of trauma
Speaker 1: that you know, contributed to the creative process as well.
Speaker 1: But everybody's got, you know, the ability to channel their
Speaker 1: energy and their trauma and all that into a creative outlet.
Speaker 1: And that's why I say, I mean, if you could
Speaker 1: channel all that pain and strife into a creative outlet,
Speaker 1: then you're less likely to go postal.
Speaker 2: I feel like, you know, the environment of music for
Speaker 2: a lot of people going to festivals and going to
Speaker 2: rocksha is like, that's a trigger for them to do
Speaker 2: things that they probably shouldn't.
Speaker 3: Like, how do you still enjoy those things?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 1: Well? For me, yeah, I mean you're You're absolutely right.
Speaker 1: All the things I enjoy tend to be bad for me,
Speaker 1: so I try to I try to incorporate healthy activities
Speaker 1: into my life, and that could be really challenging in
Speaker 1: the line of work that I do. So you know,
Speaker 1: eating late night it's no good, so I try to
Speaker 1: stop eating at five o'clock. I don't drink anymore, so,
Speaker 1: you know, after the gig, I'm like, God, I could
Speaker 1: eat a whole pizza. I could drink about eighteen beers,
Speaker 1: you know, polish off half a leader of liquor with
Speaker 1: my boys, and I have a great time, you know.
Speaker 1: But I mean, even even before I quit drinking entirely,
Speaker 1: I quit drinking before shows because I feel like I
Speaker 1: owe it to my audience and and to myself because
Speaker 1: it is such a release. Like playing you know, fucked
Speaker 1: up was never something that was rewarding to me. It
Speaker 1: was something I did when I was and I was
Speaker 1: really good at it, you know, but it was because
Speaker 1: I was in a really broken state. But you know
Speaker 1: now sometimes it is it is challenging to just feel
Speaker 1: like I get off the stage, I'm like, you might
Speaker 1: as well just put me in a road case because
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do anything next show. I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: go sit on the bus and have my diet coke
Speaker 1: and you know, watch a movie. I'm not doing anything crazy.
Speaker 1: And you know, I've tried to like go out because
Speaker 1: like the temptations not enough to make me break. I've
Speaker 1: got a really strong whellpower. That's a blessing and that's
Speaker 1: something that's you know, just innate with my family, and
Speaker 1: you know, even going out like it's just there's no
Speaker 1: desire to do it because you got people clamoring on you,
Speaker 1: and you find that your tolerance for for drunk individuals
Speaker 1: goes really.
Speaker 3: Fun, probably goes down the roof. Yeah, when you're not
Speaker 3: the drunk individual too. Yeah, I could see that. How
Speaker 3: long you've been married, I've been.
Speaker 1: Married going on two years two years now.
Speaker 3: How is that kind of impacted?
Speaker 2: Has that kind of helped like having that stability kind
Speaker 2: of in your life? Like how how has that kind
Speaker 2: of change everything and helped you along the ride or
Speaker 2: made it different? How is like your relationship with her
Speaker 2: like pouring right now, Like how has that changed, like
Speaker 2: when you're calling back, when she's coming on the road
Speaker 2: with you or anything else.
Speaker 1: So I met my wife a day after I stop
Speaker 1: doing cocaine actually, so I was in you know, some
Speaker 1: pretty rough shape, but I was still drinking heavily. And
Speaker 1: I was really nervous to meet her because I met her,
Speaker 1: you know, I was I was really fucked up at
Speaker 1: five in the morning and she had been at my
Speaker 1: show and.
Speaker 2: Charlotte Marcus just reciting his wedding vows right now, by
Speaker 2: the way, Yeah, he just pulled out started going yes.
Speaker 1: Laws, the in laws know, you know, my plight. So anyway,
Speaker 1: she came to the next show in Raleigh, and she
Speaker 1: came back to say hello. And when I met her,
Speaker 1: I just what I sell on her was you know,
Speaker 1: a young, bright, determined, you know, educated woman who actually
Speaker 1: saw something in me. And I felt for the first
Speaker 1: time like I wanted to be better not only for myself,
Speaker 1: but for for someone else. And that really kind of
Speaker 1: pulled me out of this like, uh journey that when
Speaker 1: I was on that was really just you know, to
Speaker 1: go out and over indulge in all the vices that
Speaker 1: I saw a fit, including music, including you know, drugs, women, alcohol,
Speaker 1: all of it just over indulgent in every way until
Speaker 1: it just killed me before I was even thirty.
Speaker 2: That was my goal in Moose Swings, you talk about
Speaker 2: I I have something to live for for the first time.
Speaker 2: We always try to you know, end on a like
Speaker 2: an action item or things to do. One of the
Speaker 2: things that you've seen, you know, kind of work not
Speaker 2: work in that world and kind of gets you down
Speaker 2: the wrong path.
Speaker 1: I think community is one of the biggest things that
Speaker 1: we have as a resource, as a free resource to us,
Speaker 1: and in music is just such a fine way to
Speaker 1: bring people together. And that's that's kind of how we
Speaker 1: view our shows. And I don't like to stand up
Speaker 1: there and just preach it to folks. Like I said,
Speaker 1: I don't like to talk very much at all, but
Speaker 1: you know, just being vocal and just finding a group
Speaker 1: of individuals. I mean, it could be church, it could
Speaker 1: be you know, but for me, it's music and just
Speaker 1: getting together and and and being in a square and
Speaker 1: talking about it all openly, and just the general idea
Speaker 1: destigmatizing all of these subjects that we're talking about.
Speaker 2: What are some of those things that you wish you
Speaker 2: kind of had in your social network as you were
Speaker 2: growing up and kind of dealing with a lot of
Speaker 2: this stuff when teacher was telling you to shut your
Speaker 2: damn mouth and you're going nowhere, Like, what do you
Speaker 2: wish you had that could to help you out?
Speaker 1: Well, something that I did have A tremendous resource that
Speaker 1: I had growing up was the Fine Arts Center in
Speaker 1: Greenville and my my instructors there. Steve Watson was my
Speaker 1: jazz theory instructor and a tremendous guitarist, and doctor Roy
Speaker 1: Floor was the it was the head administrator there all
Speaker 1: that time. I don't think principle was the correct term,
Speaker 1: but they really saw something in me and they believed
Speaker 1: in me. And I was an a student there. You know,
Speaker 1: I wasn't top of my class by any means because
Speaker 1: everyone there had to work really hard to be there,
Speaker 1: and it was really just vocational, vocational school for the
Speaker 1: artistic children. And I was able to go there for
Speaker 1: two years and the only regret I have about dropping
Speaker 1: out of high school was not getting a third year
Speaker 1: of education there. But it was something where they, you know,
Speaker 1: they encouraged my abilities and you know, they actually cared
Speaker 1: for their students and I like molded them into these
Speaker 1: you know, artistic beings. It was really moving. It was
Speaker 1: the first time I'd ever experienced having school spirit or
Speaker 1: seeing students care for their administrators. You know, It's not
Speaker 1: something I had ever felt before. So, you know, I
Speaker 1: know there's a lot of after school programs. There's the
Speaker 1: School of Rock Soil around the country that are great.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of programs just like the
Speaker 1: Fine Arts Center all over the country. I would just
Speaker 1: encourage parents to, uh to find these resources that are
Speaker 1: you know, that are free to parents a lot of
Speaker 1: times if it's part of the school, you know, uh,
Speaker 1: the school district. Just find whatever you can to try
Speaker 1: to you know, channel your kids, whether it be like
Speaker 1: you know, hyperactive ways or whatever it is, or depression,
Speaker 1: Like find ways to channel these things into something artistic
Speaker 1: or you know, expressive.
Speaker 2: Right, how many times I've seen, either with schools or
Speaker 2: the criminal justice system, they say one person told me, hey,
Speaker 2: you're pretty funny, you're pretty witty, or your musical talent,
Speaker 2: like some guy in prison he's like, now I want
Speaker 2: to do something more because they're in a program or
Speaker 2: something like that, and a lot.
Speaker 1: I mean, we go back to these these academic moments
Speaker 1: because that's when we're the most pliable, you know, as individuals,
Speaker 1: and just having someone of authority have confidence you and
Speaker 1: give you the idea that you're not a burden and
Speaker 1: that you're you know, you're out burst, or your your
Speaker 1: artistic inclinations and you know the things that you're into
Speaker 1: aren't stupid. The sandals you wear don't make you look unkempt,
Speaker 1: or your long hair or your tired I shirts. People
Speaker 1: encouraging you to be outside of the status quo instead
Speaker 1: of telling you that you're an outlier and making you
Speaker 1: feel like you're an issue or a burden or a problem,
Speaker 1: or being a progressive thinker even you know, just one
Speaker 1: or two teachers is all it takes, really.
Speaker 2: True, Marcus, I've I've really appreciated your time here, man.
Speaker 2: I know, I know you got chows and everything for
Speaker 2: you to take the time out and come out to
Speaker 2: talk about.
Speaker 3: This and being some open and honest.
Speaker 2: And where can people go to find you? See you
Speaker 2: support the foundation anything else like that?
Speaker 1: Oh well, you can go to Marcus kingofficial dot com
Speaker 1: and you'll find a link for the Curfew Foundation. There
Speaker 1: and you can support us that way.
Speaker 3: Perfect.
Speaker 2: All right, Curfew Foundation, Marcus King, thank you so much
Speaker 2: for being on the War on drugs.
Speaker 3: All right, we are back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought I did okay on my own.
Speaker 4: Thanks. You know, great, you didn't. You didn't let the
Speaker 4: dog totally upstage you.
Speaker 3: It's true, a little distracted quite a bit. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: so this is gonna happen.
Speaker 2: But uh, you know, it's just like another story, another
Speaker 2: thing of a different path for people. And since I
Speaker 2: work in criminal justice policy, all I think I was
Speaker 2: thinking about a lot was, man, all these different people
Speaker 2: we've talked to, how many of them would have been
Speaker 2: seen at some point during their path as a failure
Speaker 2: and going back.
Speaker 3: And so even a.
Speaker 2: Place where you have, you know, a drug court where
Speaker 2: you're trying to divert people from the criminal justice system,
Speaker 2: you put someone on probation where you say, all right,
Speaker 2: this happened. If you get treatment or you go through this,
Speaker 2: you know, will help you off. And the second they
Speaker 2: have one dirty drug test, the second they kind of falter,
Speaker 2: it's back to prison for you. And it's just it's
Speaker 2: really hard to kind of you know, hear these stories
Speaker 2: and it just shows again like how little we know
Speaker 2: about like addiction, how much money we've spent on trying
Speaker 2: to treat addiction through this war on drugs, and how
Speaker 2: much we've failed, Like have.
Speaker 3: The drugs gotten stronger?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Check out our fenel Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it's crazy
Speaker 2: and so everything. And you know, I think this is
Speaker 2: the first time in the last five six years that
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty three the overdose desks were under one
Speaker 2: hundred thousand, and.
Speaker 3: It was seen as some rousing success.
Speaker 2: And you know, I'm sure there are things going on
Speaker 2: that we've seen that have been you know, successful, but
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know how much of a
Speaker 2: you know, Victory.
Speaker 4: Lawn were still dying. Can you really count that as.
Speaker 3: Su Yes, we still have so far to go.
Speaker 2: And it shows how again our approach this war has
Speaker 2: morphed it into just a complete disaster of what actually works.
Speaker 3: And what doesn't when it comes to addiction.
Speaker 2: Yeah, these are things for everyone, and even those people
Speaker 2: that may not have those types of just like outstanding
Speaker 2: you know, marketable.
Speaker 3: Talents like I don't have any of those talents.
Speaker 2: So like it's just not you know, someone just being like, hey,
Speaker 2: you're funny, like it's for everyone. It's not just for
Speaker 2: the success story of the one in the million.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and for somebody who is not making the best grades,
Speaker 5: who's in and out of trouble, it may mean a
Speaker 5: lot more to them here and that they never heard
Speaker 5: it before. Yeah, this isn't this isn't all you are
Speaker 5: and you can you can do more if you if
Speaker 5: you want.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and claiming you you said something earlier, like it
Speaker 2: doesn't cost that teacher anything to just say that one
Speaker 2: little note to someone you know, talk to people. We
Speaker 2: can't lose our communication. So many people are lost because
Speaker 2: they don't talk. And like that verbal confirmation I think
Speaker 2: is so critical sometimes just to hear's some sort of
Speaker 2: affirmation that you're not some weirdo isolated person in a
Speaker 2: CPA hit.
Speaker 4: Just yeah, and it doesn't cost anything.
Speaker 5: But the flip side is, look at the cost that
Speaker 5: the punishment and being punitive and beating these people down,
Speaker 5: and look at the cost that that costs people. So yeah,
Speaker 5: I just think people got to think about the cost
Speaker 5: of building somebody up versus the cost of tearing somebody down.
Speaker 2: I totally agree. No, and again, thank you so much
Speaker 2: Marcus for your time. Thank you Duck.
Speaker 5: Next episode, West Coast to the West Coast, West Coast Man,
Speaker 5: Los Angeles would be real. Yeah, So I can't wait
Speaker 5: for y'all to see that.
Speaker 4: Man.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we have a fun story getting out there and
Speaker 2: everything that we can't we tell y'all.
Speaker 3: So yeah, until next time, it's the War on Drugs.
Speaker 4: Let's go.
Speaker 2: The War on Drugs is a production of Lava for
Speaker 2: Good and Stand Together Music and association with Signal Company
Speaker 2: Number one. Stand Together Music unites musicians and their teams
Speaker 2: with proven change makers to co create solutions to some
Speaker 2: of the most pressing issues in our country, including criminal justice,
Speaker 2: for foreign addiction recovery, mental health, education, free speech, and
Speaker 2: ending the War on drugs. Learn more at Standogether Music
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