1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hart Hunger. 3 00:00:10,480 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 1: On the side, we are two working parents who love 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,320 Speaker 1: our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds. 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: out long term career goals. We want you to get 9 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 1: the most out of life. Welcome to best of both worlds. 10 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 1: This is Laura. This is episode one hundred and eighty four, 11 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: which is airing in early to mid February. Sarah will 12 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: be interviewing our guest Marlee Pierre Wright, who will be 13 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: talking about starting a family during medical school. Certainly a 14 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,120 Speaker 1: challenging thing to do, but we'll be excited to hear 15 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 1: about her tips and how she has survived that. Speaking 16 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: of surviving things, Sarah, you're your winter is not a winter. 17 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 1: I'm surviving winter here. You're enjoying life in Miami and Florida. Right. Yes. No. 18 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:07,120 Speaker 1: I specifically this question had to do with I'm you 19 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: know you you had a viral blog post about the 20 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 1: Norwegian secret to enjoying winter, and we are certainly for 21 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: you and for many of our Northern Hemisphere listeners. Kind 22 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 1: of in the doldrum sphase I guess of winter because 23 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: the end is not really that near, but there's really 24 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,520 Speaker 1: nothing fun left in winter. I guess Valentine's Day is 25 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,680 Speaker 1: coming up. That's kind of fun. But I was curious 26 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,039 Speaker 1: how your embrace of winter has gone this year. I 27 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: have nothing to add, because our winter is our summer 28 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 1: is your winter. Well, you know, I'm just trying to 29 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: get outside. Sorry for the background noise here. If anyone's 30 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: wondering about this, we repair them in here. I get 31 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: outside every day. I try to run outside. If I 32 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 1: haven't run outside, I go for a walk outside, but 33 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 1: something to enjoy a little bit of daylight, because of 34 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,560 Speaker 1: course it's dark in addition to being cold, and you know, 35 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:54,920 Speaker 1: just trying to plan in fun things, adventures on the weekend. 36 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,560 Speaker 1: You know, go to art museums, botanical gardens that have greenhouses, 37 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: coming up with some fun indoor activities like puzzles and legos, 38 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: and you know, just generally recognizing that it can be 39 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: enjoyed now and it doesn't last forever. I mean pretty 40 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:11,320 Speaker 1: soon the flowers are going to start to come up, 41 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 1: and you know that's that can be a thing to 42 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 1: watch and enjoy as the days get a little bit 43 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:19,640 Speaker 1: longer and a little bit warmer, and we're in a 44 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:23,400 Speaker 1: positive trajectory, I guess that's what I have to say. No, 45 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 1: that makes sense, that makes sense well for you, But yes, exactly. 46 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 1: And we've both been exploring a new running program. Have 47 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 1: you been enjoying having a training plan set for you? 48 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 1: Has that graded against your more independent nature when it 49 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:40,880 Speaker 1: comes to exercising. I've liked it, but I've had to 50 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: modify it because I've you know, I had gotten into 51 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,120 Speaker 1: like lifting fairly heavy weights, and that's not like naturally 52 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:48,800 Speaker 1: incorporated into their plans. So I'm still trying to figure out, 53 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 1: like what days can I blow off what they have 54 00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 1: as signed so I can do my my weight stuff. 55 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:56,400 Speaker 1: So but I'm enjoying it. I like having a prescribed run. 56 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: I think that makes it for me just a little 57 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: more exciting and fun somehow, well, I feel perfectly fine 58 00:03:02,919 --> 00:03:05,840 Speaker 1: picking and choosing from anything like so it doesn't bother 59 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 1: me that I'm not doing all their workouts. I have 60 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: done their their speed work and their hill work, and 61 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 1: so that has been a nice addition to my training 62 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,320 Speaker 1: that once a week I will do the prescribed speed run, 63 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 1: which they call us the square workout. You do three 64 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 1: you know, some minutes easy, same number of minutes moderate, 65 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:25,080 Speaker 1: same number of minutes easy, same number of minutes hard, 66 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 1: So you know, it could be like four minutes on 67 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: the treadmill at five miles per hour, four minutes at 68 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 1: six miles per hour, four minutes at five miles per 69 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 1: hour forur minutes, it's seven miles, that kind of thing. 70 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: And so I've been doing that once a week and 71 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: that's great. I've been doing hill repeats on this hill 72 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: near the house. It's a fun you know, well not 73 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:43,800 Speaker 1: fun necessarily, but it's a nice little outside run I 74 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 1: can do. I run to the hill, I run up 75 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 1: and down the hill four times, and then I run home. 76 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: And that can actually fit in half an hour. And 77 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 1: so that's a nice kind of eight to eight thirty 78 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: sort of thing before I need to take the kids 79 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: to school. So yeah, I'm fine with it. I haven't 80 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: done any of their strength workouts because I am just 81 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 1: doing my everyday little strength training thing. I'm sure I 82 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: could do one of them, but I haven't felt the 83 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:10,120 Speaker 1: need to so far. I would just you would laugh 84 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:12,000 Speaker 1: when you saw the hill that I call a hill 85 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: because we don't really have hills. So it's like I 86 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: run to like where there's like a little bridge, and 87 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: it's like the hill's supposed to be like thirty to 88 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:20,919 Speaker 1: sixty seconds on like mineus eight seconds because that's like 89 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:25,440 Speaker 1: the only But that's okay, it's still fun. It's still 90 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:27,880 Speaker 1: better than we have a lot of hills. Yeh yes, 91 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: great hills. All right, well, let's get into our interview section. 92 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,559 Speaker 1: I am so excited to introduce to everyone Marlice Pierre Wright. 93 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 1: She is a third year medical student at Northwestern University 94 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: School of Medicine, and she submitted to Laura just the 95 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: idea that perhaps she could provide some representation of someone 96 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 1: who has gone through medical school and has chosen to 97 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: pursue having a family during that time. And we loved 98 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 1: her story, and I also I'm going to link in 99 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 1: the show notes. She wrote an excellent art on things 100 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 1: that you should be aware of and think about when 101 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 1: you're planning this, so hopefully she'll be able to share 102 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: some of that with you as well. All Right, Marleics. 103 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: Can you introduce yourself? Yeah, thank you. Yes, I am 104 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 1: a third year medical student. I decided to go to 105 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 1: medical school in my mid twenties, which is pretty late 106 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: in the sense that I didn't have any of my 107 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: prerec requirements or anything like that. So I started medical 108 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 1: school my late twenties having been married for about I 109 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 1: think we were married for five years when I started 110 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: medical school, and we wanted a family and it looked 111 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: and given how long training is, we knew at some 112 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 1: point we were going to have to think about having 113 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 1: a family during training. And that's something that a lot 114 00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:44,719 Speaker 1: of people would bring up to me when I thought 115 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,440 Speaker 1: about going to medical school, like are you how are 116 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,599 Speaker 1: you going to have kids? Like I thought, Actually, you're 117 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: going to be saying that you're getting pregnant and now 118 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 1: you're talking about pursuing medical school. What's going on? And 119 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 1: so I have a lot of thoughts and talk to 120 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: a lot of people about how to do that. And 121 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,719 Speaker 1: I just wanted to provide a resource for people who 122 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 1: are also considering having children in medical school. Yes, can 123 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 1: I read a tiny excerpt from your article because I 124 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: loved it and I just wanted to share the part 125 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: where you said, we want to be moms, and we 126 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 1: have the right to pursue more than just medicine. So 127 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 1: let us flip the script in our mind our mindset 128 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: should not be a question can I have a baby 129 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: during my training? Instead, let us decide I will have 130 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: a baby during my training. And this is how own it. 131 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,160 Speaker 1: Do not apologize for it. Just as we bend our 132 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:32,800 Speaker 1: lives to fit this goal, medicine must also bend itself 133 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:35,480 Speaker 1: to fit our goals. Our child bearing years are short, 134 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: yet our careers are long. It would be wise for 135 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,599 Speaker 1: medicine to work around these years to secure the talent 136 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:43,159 Speaker 1: of its female trainees for the long term. It was 137 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 1: just so well said, and I get it, Like you 138 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: tell me a little bit about like did you face 139 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,120 Speaker 1: any resistance, like on the academic side of things, So 140 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 1: it sounds like family was sort of pressure you, oh, 141 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 1: you're going to go to med school, but about having 142 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: a baby. But how about on the other end, is 143 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: that what prompted you right about this or more just 144 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 1: the journey in general? You know? Actually, I was very 145 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 1: pleasantly surprised that when I applied to medical school there 146 00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: were no questions about like, oh, are you gonna be 147 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 1: pursuing a family in medical school, or don't know how 148 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 1: we feel about this. They knew I was married, they 149 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:18,800 Speaker 1: knew I was older, but it was actually an asset. 150 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 1: I think a lot of medical schools want non traditional students. 151 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: They liked that I had worked for several years in 152 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: public policy, I'd worked in the federal government before, and 153 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: I think they're very acceptive to that, like that bringing 154 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 1: that perspective to medical school. So in that sense, I 155 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 1: didn't feel, at least the schools I applied to that 156 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: there's any kind of like hesitation on their end about 157 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: like whether or not I would pursue kids during medical school. 158 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: I mean, I didn't bring it up, but at the 159 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: same time, they weren't like asking about that or kind 160 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: of questioning whether I could do it. I think it 161 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 1: was more on the like family side or people I 162 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: would talk to in passing, because they were just very 163 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: much like thought that you can't do both, like it's 164 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 1: either medical school or having a family. And when I 165 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: actually started medical school, I was very pleasantly surprised at 166 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 1: my med school that they my deans would bring it 167 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 1: up to me. They're like, you know, if you do 168 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: want to have a family, like I had kids during training, 169 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: or these are the things that we can do to 170 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: support you. So I feel like there's kind of this 171 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 1: disconnect between like what medical schools and medical training the 172 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,239 Speaker 1: direction that's going in versus like what the public thinks about, 173 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: like whether or not you can have kids during training. 174 00:08:25,160 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 1: Oh that's so interesting. Well, I'm very happy to hear 175 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: that you felt supported throughout the process. Tell me some 176 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: of the things that you and your partner did when 177 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 1: you were a weighing the pros and cons and then 178 00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: b when you decided to go for it, like some 179 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 1: of the things you did in planning. Yes, Okay, So 180 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,640 Speaker 1: that's basically what my whole article is about, is about 181 00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:47,679 Speaker 1: like planning for this, because I think that's probably the part, 182 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:49,960 Speaker 1: like you can't control a lot, but you can control 183 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 1: kind of like how you think through how it's going 184 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:56,679 Speaker 1: to work. And so we had multiple different timelines in mind. 185 00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:00,120 Speaker 1: A lot of people think about having a fourth year baby, 186 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 1: and so that's kind of fourth ye medical school is 187 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,120 Speaker 1: seen as kind of like the more relaxed year, and 188 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: so that's kind of what people would tell me about 189 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: when to have a child. But I kind of felt 190 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:13,560 Speaker 1: more ready, like I kind of felt like I wanted 191 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 1: to think about having a kid a little bit earlier 192 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 1: than that. So other timelines are like the summer between 193 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: like your first and second year, and then also your 194 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 1: third year, which is seen sometimes as the worst time 195 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,240 Speaker 1: to have a baby. And when I talked to my 196 00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: dean about it, she gave me different timelines as well, 197 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 1: and she said, you know, yeah, you could do it 198 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 1: between your second and third year, but that's gonna be 199 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 1: really hard. But we felt really ready. And I also 200 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 1: liked the idea of like if I were like not 201 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 1: feeling well or nauseous or things like that, i'd be 202 00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:44,679 Speaker 1: like more in the classroom setting when I was pregnant, 203 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 1: so i'd be I was pregnant my second year of 204 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: med school, and so I kind of like the idea 205 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 1: that like I wouldn't be on the floors, I wouldn't 206 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: be like in the Haama hospital force, which is what 207 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 1: we do third year, and I would have a little 208 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: bit more wiggle room with that. And then also because 209 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 1: I would start third year, I could take off a 210 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:06,680 Speaker 1: couple quote unquote blocks, which are like your rotations, to 211 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: like have a maternity leave and then kind of restart. 212 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 1: That's something that my dean said was possible. Every med 213 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 1: school is different, so always talk to your dean first 214 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:19,679 Speaker 1: as you're planning. So we decided to pursue that option, 215 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:24,160 Speaker 1: and then COVID hit, so everything kind of changed, and 216 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,120 Speaker 1: it actually ended up being a wonderful time to have 217 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: a kid in like a lot of different ways because 218 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:32,679 Speaker 1: of just how much more flexible things have gotten because 219 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:36,320 Speaker 1: of COVID. No, I totally appreciate that. Like I have 220 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: a colleague who had a baby during COVID and she 221 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:40,680 Speaker 1: was saying she was so happy to be able to 222 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 1: you know, we never really did tell a health before 223 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,480 Speaker 1: and now she's actually able to stay home and see 224 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:46,720 Speaker 1: patients and not have to pump and it makes her 225 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: very happy. So yes, there are some silver linings I 226 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 1: guess to having a baby during this crazy time. But 227 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 1: you did the calculation and you decided I don't want 228 00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:58,160 Speaker 1: to be pregnant walking around the wards and third year 229 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 1: if possible, So that totally makes sense. So you planned 230 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:02,719 Speaker 1: it to have the baby during third year. And then 231 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: you talk a little bit in your article about how 232 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 1: you could have the choice to try to like take 233 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,320 Speaker 1: your maternity leaven carve it out, or to take a 234 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 1: full year. Did you ever consider taking the year? You know, 235 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 1: I think that's one of the most important parts points 236 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: I wanted to make my article. I think a lot 237 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 1: of different women who are thinking about having babies in 238 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:23,680 Speaker 1: medical school will just like Google, like how to have 239 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: a baby in medical school? Like how does this work? 240 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:29,280 Speaker 1: Like different forums trying to figure out what this looks like. 241 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: And so I feel like on the internet, a lot 242 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: of people talked about taking a year off, and they 243 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 1: kind of I mean, it's a personal choice, but I 244 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: felt like it was something that seemed like what most 245 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: people assumed you would do if you had a baby 246 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:47,280 Speaker 1: in medical school. But I didn't feel like I'd want 247 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 1: a full year off. I was already I'm ready older, 248 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: I have a lot of training left in terms of 249 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: residency and followship and things like that, and I felt like, 250 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 1: you know, if I could swing it and graduate on time, 251 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 1: I'd prefer that than to take a whole year off. 252 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:04,560 Speaker 1: And everyone's different, but I wanted an option where I 253 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 1: took twelve weeks. I was very intense about like the 254 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 1: twelve weeks like standard mattorney leave, and I like still 255 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 1: graduated on time, and so that took a little bit 256 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 1: of like thought in terms of like thinking through Okay, 257 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: yes there's vacation time fourth year, can I move it 258 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 1: to third year and take that and then yes, like 259 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:26,319 Speaker 1: when I do interviews, like that's for a residency and 260 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:28,599 Speaker 1: fourth year that might mean that I'm doing maybe a 261 00:12:28,640 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 1: light of rotation, taking some time off or doing research 262 00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: and working my research as research director to like figure 263 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:35,960 Speaker 1: out if I can take some days off and like 264 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 1: work on weekends and things like that. But I think 265 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:41,160 Speaker 1: the most important thing is to decide what you want. 266 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:43,680 Speaker 1: And for me, it was to not take a year off, 267 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: and I worked with the school to figure out what 268 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:48,959 Speaker 1: that looked like for me. Everyone's different, So some people 269 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,520 Speaker 1: might want to take a full year off and they 270 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 1: can kind of talk to school about how that works. 271 00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: And I think that's probably the easiest option. It's pretty 272 00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: easy to take a year off, but even within that year, 273 00:12:57,559 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: like are you doing research, are you like fully taking 274 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: the year off? Those considerations about how your financial aid 275 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: looks like during that year if you take a whole 276 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:06,839 Speaker 1: year off, So there's still things you have to think through. 277 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 1: So I think it's really important to kind of like 278 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:12,680 Speaker 1: weigh your options and see what you prefer definitely no 279 00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: one size fits all. The cool thing is that now 280 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 1: some people googling will hopefully find your article in addition 281 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: to some others. So that I put a baby on 282 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,960 Speaker 1: the article title, that will be a huge help. So 283 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: you also talked about planning from the financial side, and 284 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:33,040 Speaker 1: that struck a chord with me. We had trouble having 285 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 1: kids and it took a long time, but like the 286 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 1: one silver lining of that was that we were like, 287 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: while we were trying, we'll just like put a few 288 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: hundred dollars like in our daycare fund. And that meant 289 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 1: that when she was born and we were still fellows 290 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: and we didn't like have you know, easier than med 291 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 1: school but still not like lots of disposable income, we 292 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 1: were like, oh, we can draw from that little pile. 293 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 1: And you talked about doing something similar. Yes, okay, so 294 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 1: that's another thing. I think you have to decide what 295 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:02,719 Speaker 1: your values are and what you ideally want. So we 296 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:04,679 Speaker 1: as a couple decided it was really important that my 297 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 1: husband took paternity leave and a full paternity leave. It 298 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:11,079 Speaker 1: I think it sets a good example and it's also 299 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:15,679 Speaker 1: good for bonding. Yeah, and so we thought we kind 300 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:17,599 Speaker 1: of looked at how much money we would need to 301 00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: make that happen and started kind of saving that. And 302 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 1: one way that we did it was like, we're thinking, Okay, 303 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 1: like daycare costs like X amount of money a month, 304 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: so we're going to have to learn how to live 305 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 1: on that amount of money after we have this baby. 306 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: So let's put aside that amount of money every month 307 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:36,680 Speaker 1: for two years, the first two years of med school 308 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 1: and while I was pregnant. So that way, like we 309 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 1: were kind of being like, okay, can we even swing daycare? 310 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 1: And then also like having this cushion so that it 311 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 1: made it easier to swing it in case something happened, 312 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: and also allowed for my husband to take paternity leave. 313 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 1: So I think that I think it's really important to 314 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: kind of like plan out like what's really important and 315 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: then kind of like start feeling like seeing how you 316 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 1: can reach those goals. And now not everyone can have 317 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 1: like a working spouse, so like some people are like 318 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 1: both in grad school things like that. So I would 319 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: start by having a conversation with the financial aid director 320 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:12,160 Speaker 1: because you can increase what loan amount you can take 321 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: in order to pay for childcare. And then there's also 322 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: kind of like these subsidized daycares that a lot of 323 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: schools now have. My school has a subsidized daycare. So 324 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: just kind of starting to understand like what resources you 325 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 1: can draw on in order to make that having a 326 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:33,520 Speaker 1: family possible. That is so impressive and I feel like 327 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: only someone who's spent time well not only but it's 328 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,080 Speaker 1: probably in part because of your maturity and the fact 329 00:15:39,080 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 1: that you would already spend time in the working world, 330 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: that you would have been like, oh, I need to 331 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,760 Speaker 1: set this budget. Like what a wonderful idea. I don't 332 00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 1: think I would is mature enough to do that in 333 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,239 Speaker 1: the kind of pre kid years. But that's really really impressive. 334 00:15:50,280 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: That's really cool. And so what did you end up 335 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: just you ended up deciding to do a home daycare? 336 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 1: Is that was that correct? From your article? We're really 337 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: lucky to get in. I think that's another thing is 338 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 1: COVID made it so that a lot of the weightless 339 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 1: that I didn't think we'd get off of, we were 340 00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: able to get off of since people are keeping their 341 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:22,960 Speaker 1: kids home. But yes, there was a home daycare that 342 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: was two blocks away for us. We really loved it. 343 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,960 Speaker 1: There's only ten kids. We liked the idea of like 344 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 1: having this like home feel, and also just the logistics 345 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:35,360 Speaker 1: of it being only two blocks is amazing. And one 346 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 1: thing that I realized is be persistent. So it's a 347 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:42,320 Speaker 1: home daycare. I called her like every two weeks, I 348 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 1: like updated her when she the baby was born, just 349 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,520 Speaker 1: like called her, asked how she's doing, whether or not 350 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 1: how the weightless Locals was looking like. So homedacre is 351 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,440 Speaker 1: a little odd in the sense that like it's so 352 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 1: because it's so small, you kind of have to be 353 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: like very persistent. Another option we had, which is a 354 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 1: fantastic was my school has a in the hospital have 355 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:06,880 Speaker 1: a daycare that's open from six to six, which is amazing. 356 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 1: So in terms of like hours and when you look 357 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 1: at it breaking down hourly, it's like a really great deal. 358 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 1: And they also subsidized that, so that was kind of 359 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,399 Speaker 1: like our backup. But it's still kind of a drive 360 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,639 Speaker 1: and like you know, it's not far drive. But we 361 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:22,120 Speaker 1: just were weighing it and we thought either option would work, 362 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:24,119 Speaker 1: and we also kind of made sure we're on that 363 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,600 Speaker 1: wait list. I think we got on waitlist the minute 364 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 1: I found that I was pregnant, So just make sure 365 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 1: that you're kind of researching those daycarees before you get 366 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,800 Speaker 1: pregnant and then the minute you're ready to go, just 367 00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:38,960 Speaker 1: like getting on those weight lists. Yes, that's so funny. 368 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: I feel like we did the exact same thing, and 369 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:44,119 Speaker 1: we did go with the subsidized like hospital daycare, and 370 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:47,879 Speaker 1: it was it was wonderful. So both sound like awesome options. 371 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 1: So oh, that's so cool, And what are you doing now? 372 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:53,119 Speaker 1: So how old is your baby and how have things 373 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 1: been going? So she six months. I went back when 374 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: she was twelve weeks and my husband kind of took 375 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 1: go over from there and was home with her until 376 00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:06,359 Speaker 1: she was about five and a half months. So she 377 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:10,040 Speaker 1: started daycare like three weeks ago. It's been going really 378 00:18:10,359 --> 00:18:12,560 Speaker 1: really well, better than I thought it would go. One 379 00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: thing I want to point out to people is that 380 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:17,679 Speaker 1: one thing I thought that I'd have to sacrifice was 381 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:20,600 Speaker 1: my ability to do well at school. I thought like 382 00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,359 Speaker 1: I would be like doing okay, but I have this baby, 383 00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:26,439 Speaker 1: and like it wouldn't go well in that sense, But 384 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,720 Speaker 1: I felt like I wanted to pursue a family either way, 385 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:31,399 Speaker 1: like that was still more of a value to me 386 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:34,719 Speaker 1: than like being the best medical student. But I've been 387 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:37,159 Speaker 1: pleasantly surprised that actually being a mom has made me 388 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 1: a better medical student. I've done much better on meriitations 389 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,200 Speaker 1: than I thought I would, because there's just a sway 390 00:18:43,280 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 1: that you can naturally connect after having a baby with people. 391 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: Like if someone's like, oh, I just have I have 392 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 1: a five month I'm like, I have a five month old, 393 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 1: Like let's talk about like how that's going, or if 394 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:55,399 Speaker 1: they have grandkids, or I just it's interesting how like 395 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:58,440 Speaker 1: just kind of joining that club. I really do feel 396 00:18:58,440 --> 00:19:00,600 Speaker 1: like it's like a parent club just makes you kind 397 00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:03,960 Speaker 1: of like you're more able to relate with patients, You're 398 00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 1: much more efficient with your time. I feel like I 399 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,920 Speaker 1: actually had to I started saying for step one when 400 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:12,240 Speaker 1: I was pregnant, and then I had to kind of 401 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:15,439 Speaker 1: backtrack because of COVID. It kind of messed up how 402 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,919 Speaker 1: we were able to take the exam, delayed it, and 403 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:21,479 Speaker 1: so I just sat and took it last week. And 404 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:24,919 Speaker 1: so I had these kind of two dedicated periods of studying, 405 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: one when I was pregnant and one when I had 406 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 1: a baby, and so I could kind of compare kind 407 00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: of what that looked like, and I was so much 408 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: more efficient with having Camille, we didn't have childcare for 409 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: the first three weeks of step one studying, so I 410 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 1: woke up really early, studied for like four hours, worked 411 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 1: in between your nap time, and my scores are just 412 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,679 Speaker 1: like so much higher in comparison. So I feel like 413 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:49,800 Speaker 1: there's this kind of idea that it's either or, but 414 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: I really do think that both things can combine so 415 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:55,080 Speaker 1: that you're like a much stronger kind of person in 416 00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:58,160 Speaker 1: medical school. That makes sense, Oh my gosh, it does. 417 00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:01,400 Speaker 1: And I feel like as I've gone on and as 418 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 1: my time has become squeezed because I have multiple kids, 419 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: just like you have a baby, which is like all consuming. 420 00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 1: Sometimes time privileged backfires and when you are squeezed, you're 421 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 1: like you're like laser focus and wow, you are like 422 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,439 Speaker 1: a full on testament to that. That is amazing. In 423 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:20,679 Speaker 1: congrats on the excellent boards scores. And it doesn't oh 424 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: go ahead, Oh sorry, I just say I also don't 425 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 1: feel like it gets easier. So that's one thing too. 426 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:27,719 Speaker 1: It's like I think a lot of people delay and 427 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 1: they wait even though they want children. I think it's 428 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 1: very different. If you like aren't ready, that's very different. 429 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:35,440 Speaker 1: But if they are ready, they kind of like keep 430 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:38,200 Speaker 1: pushing it until they're like a follow or an attending, 431 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:40,880 Speaker 1: and it's like you're always in me busy in medicine, 432 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:44,720 Speaker 1: and it doesn't necessarily get easier. So it's just almost like, 433 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,520 Speaker 1: might as well just do it whenever and just kind 434 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 1: of learn how to like balance those things rather than 435 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 1: waiting for something that you really want. Well, especially comparing 436 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:56,880 Speaker 1: if you think about it, like medical school and residency 437 00:20:57,359 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 1: in a way, especially if you want multiple kids and 438 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 1: you're gonna have more in residency, better to do it 439 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:03,880 Speaker 1: as a seasoned momb like in a way, you might 440 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 1: find that easier because you've like already been through it. 441 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 1: You know what to expect. So that's like, yeah, I 442 00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:12,199 Speaker 1: fully support that, like don't wait, and you also just 443 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: never know what's going to happen with your body, and 444 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 1: so if you feel ready and that's what's in your heart, 445 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 1: you want a baby, like you make you do it. 446 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,760 Speaker 1: So I love I love that, and I'm very happy 447 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 1: to hear that your like medical school was supportive, and 448 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:27,119 Speaker 1: I'm sure as you go through residency hopefully you'll have 449 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: very supportive people on that side of things as well. 450 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,680 Speaker 1: Should you choose to expand. One thing I wanted to 451 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 1: point out too, is like, even if your medical school 452 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 1: is quotquote not supportive, you have rights as a student. 453 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:41,280 Speaker 1: Your school has to support you under Title nine. So 454 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,360 Speaker 1: I think that's something I didn't realize until I talked 455 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:46,200 Speaker 1: to someone who we have like this Work Life Division 456 00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:48,640 Speaker 1: of Northwestern. I talk to someone about kind of planning 457 00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:51,760 Speaker 1: for having a baby and like the daycarees and things 458 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:53,760 Speaker 1: like that, and she's like, look, you have rights, like 459 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 1: they have to comminate your pumping. You're a student. Like, 460 00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:58,399 Speaker 1: so I think like, even if your school is like 461 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:00,760 Speaker 1: on surface not accommodating, you can say, like, look like 462 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 1: you have to support me in this. So I wouldn't 463 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 1: let your school dictate how or when you have children too. Yes, yes, yes, 464 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: And residency are protected as well. There's like very clear 465 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 1: rules in the acg ME guidelines about space for pumping, 466 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 1: time for pumping, all that, accommodations and such. I feel like, oh, 467 00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:20,400 Speaker 1: what do you think you might want to go into. 468 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,640 Speaker 1: I'm curious And you can say you plead the fifth 469 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: if you don't want that to be publicly comshit forever. 470 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 1: You know. I am open, but I think I'm leaning 471 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: towards child neurology or maybe peeds like you two, just 472 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: general pedes. But I still have a lot of rotations 473 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 1: to go through, so we'll see. So keeping an open mind. Okay, well, 474 00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:42,919 Speaker 1: that's exciting. Sorry, I always have to ask that I 475 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 1: should I could have asked you offline, but I don't know. 476 00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: It's just such an exciting moment when you hear people 477 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:49,640 Speaker 1: like deciding what they want to do, and same in 478 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 1: my residence if they decide on primary care versus fellowship, Like, 479 00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,040 Speaker 1: it's always very exciting. Okay, So you have your five 480 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:58,199 Speaker 1: month old now and you feel like you're back in 481 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 1: the groove. I don't know what's what's been the hardest 482 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 1: for you. It sounds like a lot of things have 483 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 1: worked really really well. Can you think of anything that 484 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:08,800 Speaker 1: you would have done differently or that you didn't anticipate. 485 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,440 Speaker 1: I think the hardest was coming back. I think that 486 00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 1: I'm very happy it worked out this way. But I 487 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 1: started on a selective which was like past fail kind 488 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 1: of readjusting to being in the hospital and with COVID. 489 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 1: I hadn't been in the hospital for a very very 490 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:27,160 Speaker 1: long time between the attorney leave and like we were 491 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:30,080 Speaker 1: pulled off of rotations and things like that. I mean, 492 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:32,760 Speaker 1: I like forgot my ceciloscope the first day, Like it 493 00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:36,760 Speaker 1: was really bad, Like I was very disoriented, and I 494 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: think that I think I was listening to your podcast 495 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,920 Speaker 1: where you were talking to someone who's like trying to 496 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:43,919 Speaker 1: said whether to go back, and it was really stressful 497 00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:45,880 Speaker 1: and you like, just wait a little bit and see 498 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 1: how you feel. I one hundred percent agree with that, 499 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,480 Speaker 1: like give it two weeks, Like I really feel like 500 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:54,159 Speaker 1: I felt very overwhelmed, very much like I don't know 501 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:56,920 Speaker 1: how gon to do this, And I think by like 502 00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,439 Speaker 1: the third fourth week, when you get a rhythm, it 503 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:01,960 Speaker 1: gets a lot better. So I do think that, like 504 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: you just have to let yourself adjust. And the funny 505 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:06,640 Speaker 1: thing too, is a lot of my friends when they 506 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:08,160 Speaker 1: asked me how I was doing, like, oh, I felt 507 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:10,920 Speaker 1: that way too, Like just generally starting thirty year is 508 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: really hard. So I think that sometimes like it could 509 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,360 Speaker 1: be the baby, it could be thirty year, or maybe 510 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 1: it's both, but like giving yourself that space to like 511 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,720 Speaker 1: really like see how you feel, and if you really 512 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:23,920 Speaker 1: feel like it's not the right time, you can always 513 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:26,159 Speaker 1: just take a year off, which I love about med school, right, Like, 514 00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:28,439 Speaker 1: where else can you kind of just be like, okay, 515 00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: like let me try it out. If I don't, let 516 00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 1: me just like take some time off. I don't know 517 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 1: if you can do that in fellowship and residency. So 518 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 1: it's just another plug for having a baby in medical school. 519 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: I think usually you can. But you're right, there's no 520 00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:43,399 Speaker 1: like there's there's not like an easy rule that you 521 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 1: can just refer to and say that it would be definite. 522 00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:47,360 Speaker 1: But I think most programs would support that if that's 523 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,879 Speaker 1: what somebody wanted to do. Oh that's so cool. Oh. 524 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,160 Speaker 1: I have one more question related to because you mentioned 525 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 1: Laura's book actually in your article and how it kind 526 00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: of like helped you shape your concept of time. So 527 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 1: I just want to to know if you could comment 528 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,280 Speaker 1: on that a little bit for our listeners. Yes. And 529 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: actually a lot of my friends who read the article, 530 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: both medicine anonymous, and they like love that section because 531 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 1: a lot of people don't think of time the way 532 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 1: that Laura broke it down. So when I was on 533 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 1: Matney leave, I read her book, her book about like 534 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 1: I know how she does it. I know how she 535 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: does it yet Yeah, and one thing I talked about 536 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:24,120 Speaker 1: that I really liked is like thinking about time holistically. 537 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,359 Speaker 1: So for example, I've been home unddicated studying for the 538 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: past month, so I've seen Camille a lot more than 539 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: I'm going to see her when I start medicine next week. 540 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:35,920 Speaker 1: And so there are times where I'm just I see 541 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:37,439 Speaker 1: her a lot more than some people who have like 542 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:39,879 Speaker 1: intense jobs, and there's times when I see her like 543 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:43,920 Speaker 1: for fewer hours. But in the grand scheme of things, 544 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,479 Speaker 1: I had her ten years earlier than if I waited 545 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,360 Speaker 1: till I wasn't attending to have her, so I get 546 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 1: kind of those ten years of like graduations and grandkids 547 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 1: and things like that, so like it's still for me, 548 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 1: is worth it to have had her in medical school, 549 00:25:57,680 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: even though there's some things that I'm going to miss 550 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 1: out on, but it's like a priorities thing because i 551 00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,439 Speaker 1: want kind of those like back end years too. And 552 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 1: then there's also like so many months where I'm going 553 00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: to have that flexibility. On top of that, I also 554 00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: make it a priority to try to put her to 555 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:15,640 Speaker 1: bed every night, So there's like moments where like I 556 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:18,840 Speaker 1: try to protect like okay, like seven thirty, I'm usually 557 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 1: home by then, there's only maybe like some weeks where 558 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 1: I'm not but trying to like make sure that there's 559 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:25,920 Speaker 1: sometimes where I feel very like focused time with her. 560 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,120 Speaker 1: So I think thinking about, like, Okay, if I have 561 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:33,160 Speaker 1: like these two hours every night after rotations where I'm 562 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 1: spending time with Camille, that those hours count. I think 563 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,160 Speaker 1: people sometimes think like, oh, I'm never going to see 564 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:40,879 Speaker 1: my kid, like I'm not ever going to like be 565 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,760 Speaker 1: able to if I have the medical school or trading, 566 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 1: like I won't be around. But there are like a 567 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:47,600 Speaker 1: lot of hours in the day, a lot of hours 568 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:49,879 Speaker 1: in the week, and I think people underestimate the amount 569 00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,159 Speaker 1: of time they're spending and they kind of think of 570 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:54,880 Speaker 1: the time that they're not spending with their kid. Yeah, 571 00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,359 Speaker 1: and especially as you've said, it was focused time, so 572 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 1: it's like it feels very meaningful. And nobody's going to 573 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,720 Speaker 1: emerge from childhood and be like, well, it was only 574 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,880 Speaker 1: seven and two hundred hours and I needed seven two 575 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 1: hundred and one, so you've failed. So No, that's that's beautiful. 576 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: Holistic and appreciating the time that you do have and 577 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: also capitalizing on it during those more flexible times which 578 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:19,520 Speaker 1: you're gonna have to like well, at least if you 579 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,760 Speaker 1: go into peeds, you're totally gonna have some months that 580 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:23,880 Speaker 1: are really hard and some months that are not that hard. 581 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,560 Speaker 1: We're not going to get more kid time, which is great. 582 00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 1: All right. Well, we always end our show with a 583 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,800 Speaker 1: love of the week, and I don't know, do you 584 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 1: have one in mind. I'll be excited to hear being 585 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,800 Speaker 1: done with step one. That is my love the week. 586 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: I know it's not a thing or anything, but I 587 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,399 Speaker 1: just it just was such a looming exam in my 588 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,480 Speaker 1: mind for so many months, and so I'm just so 589 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:51,919 Speaker 1: happy that I'm done. I'm in the post step world. 590 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 1: That is what. That is a huge, huge burden off 591 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: of your back. I guess you still have step two. 592 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:00,880 Speaker 1: But step two gon be past fail for you. Are 593 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:02,760 Speaker 1: you in that group? No, I'm not in any past 594 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 1: fail world, any pass fail Okay, everything. Oh that's the 595 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 1: upcoming Step one. Sorry, that's going to be past fail. 596 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 1: I think twenty twenty three. Yeah, I should know these things, 597 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,160 Speaker 1: but I just knew it's not now, So I'm like, Okay, 598 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,520 Speaker 1: that's coming in the future. Sorry, we're getting in the weeds. 599 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,119 Speaker 1: But the steps are the big board exams that medical 600 00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 1: students take to get into residency and to finish medical school, 601 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,159 Speaker 1: and at some point one of them is going to 602 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,040 Speaker 1: go from a very delineated points system to pass fail, 603 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 1: which is just going to change a few things on 604 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,000 Speaker 1: pressure on mens students and admissions. But we'll see how 605 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: that goes. But no, those changes are not impacting you, 606 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,119 Speaker 1: all right. Maybe I'm procrastinating a little bit because I'm 607 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,200 Speaker 1: trying to come up with my love of the week. Ooh, okay, 608 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 1: I may have had this one before. That's okay, I'm 609 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 1: really into it. In the winter. My favorite skincare right 610 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:49,600 Speaker 1: now is my Pharmacy Firming Night Bomb because it feels 611 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 1: like a veil of I don't know, humectant over my 612 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:54,960 Speaker 1: skin at night, and I you know, like when it's 613 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 1: cold and you put on some creams and it evaporates 614 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 1: it like makes you colder. This doesn't do that, and 615 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:01,480 Speaker 1: so it see anything, I'll tolerate right now, even though 616 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,680 Speaker 1: our version of cold is like not actually yeah, an 617 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: say is it even cold? I mean it was like 618 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: forty something this morning, so to us that I recognie, 619 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 1: you're in Chicago this so it doesn't coming next week, 620 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 1: So I guess answer your question, it is cold to us, 621 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 1: but not really. Oh my goodness. Oh well, this was 622 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,000 Speaker 1: such a pleasure talking to you, as I knew it 623 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:30,680 Speaker 1: would be. I'm so excited for your upcoming adventures because 624 00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: you're going to have exciting years ahead of you. Tell 625 00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,400 Speaker 1: our listeners where they can find you in addition to 626 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:37,479 Speaker 1: the piece, which we will link to in our in 627 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 1: our notes in our post. Yeah, I think just you 628 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: can feel free to look at the piece. I'm also 629 00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 1: on LinkedIn and yeah, feel free to reach out. Awesome, Well, 630 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 1: thank you so much and have a wonderful rest of 631 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 1: your day. All right, Well that was great. We had 632 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 1: a great question also come to us via email, very detailed, 633 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 1: but I thought that all parts were kind of interesting 634 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,479 Speaker 1: to discuss, so maybe we could do this one in hearts. 635 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 1: So this comes from a scientist who is just beginning 636 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: their position as an assistant professor at a college, and 637 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 1: the way it works is that their teaching covers nine 638 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: months of the salary and over the summer the funding 639 00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 1: is from research grants. She's having her first in April, 640 00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 1: first baby, and is trying to prepare as much as 641 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 1: possible for the big event. So her first question is, 642 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 1: since I started in this position for less than a year. 643 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: I do not have FMLA access. FMLA is the program 644 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 1: which gives you kind of protected time, not necessarily paid time, 645 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 1: but protected time off or medical events like this. So 646 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: she says she doesn't have that yet and will have 647 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,719 Speaker 1: accumulated only eight days of paid leave by April. How 648 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: much additional non paid leave do you think I'll have 649 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:41,960 Speaker 1: to take before going back to work? And then she 650 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:44,080 Speaker 1: said she didn't know how long she'd need to recover, 651 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 1: but she suspected that one week might not be enough. 652 00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,640 Speaker 1: So I'll give you my answer because it might be 653 00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:53,760 Speaker 1: different than Laura's. Actually, you know, I think that planning 654 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 1: for at least six weeks and knowing that you might 655 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: have to add on to that depending on what's going 656 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:02,760 Speaker 1: on is read unless there's some way of going back 657 00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 1: in very very flexible like part time fashion And I 658 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,480 Speaker 1: don't know as a professor if that's potentially or a 659 00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 1: scientist that's potentially an option. Like are you able to 660 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:12,160 Speaker 1: kind of just do your own appendent work for a 661 00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: few hours a day and be working in the beginning, 662 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:16,800 Speaker 1: or do you have like a full teaching load and 663 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: you know, would be doing essentially full time work. I mean, 664 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 1: the truth is, if you're doing April, probably you're going 665 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:24,400 Speaker 1: to be out for the rest of kind of the 666 00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:27,560 Speaker 1: teaching semester, and then hopefully you could maybe resume slowly 667 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:30,800 Speaker 1: over the summer in a more scaled back fashion. But 668 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: I would not have been thrilled to go back to 669 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:35,520 Speaker 1: work like and actually see people and go somewhere before 670 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 1: six weeks. I could have done it, but I wouldn't 671 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 1: have liked it. And really I felt ready by around 672 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: ten eleven weeks and I've never had a c section. 673 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: So always remember that there's, you know, possibility that things 674 00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 1: could go differently than you plan with your first or 675 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 1: any baby. Yeah, I mean it depends what sort of 676 00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 1: work you're doing. I mean, can you answer email? Sure, 677 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: can you write a grant proposal? Can you write up 678 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 1: results for a journal? I mean sure? Newborns sleep a lot, 679 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 1: and so you know, you could just feed the baby, 680 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 1: put the baby in the little carrier, knock out a 681 00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,600 Speaker 1: intro to your journal article, and then go from there. 682 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:15,680 Speaker 1: If you have to actually do things at a specific time, 683 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,920 Speaker 1: or if you have to meet other people or go somewhere, 684 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: that's going to be a lot harder to pull off. 685 00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:25,600 Speaker 1: So can you work, Yes, but it's better if it's 686 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:28,440 Speaker 1: at your house and work that can be done at 687 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,680 Speaker 1: any point, so you can kind of work it around, 688 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:32,840 Speaker 1: like if I need to nap, you know, like it's 689 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:34,760 Speaker 1: very frustrating if you set like a phone call for 690 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:36,440 Speaker 1: two o'clock and then you finally get the baby down 691 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:37,959 Speaker 1: and you really need to nap and it's two o'clock, 692 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: and it's like, Okay, you don't want to necessarily create 693 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:44,720 Speaker 1: that sort of stress for yourself, But can you do anything? Sure? 694 00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,720 Speaker 1: So I don't know that you want to go into 695 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: a lab, but if you could, you could write up 696 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,280 Speaker 1: lab results, like if you've got graduate students who are 697 00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 1: doing some of the work and you're shepherding the results 698 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: through the journal process. My guess is you probably would 699 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:59,200 Speaker 1: be able to do that sort of thing. That makes sense. 700 00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 1: And the timing of April might actually be great because 701 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:03,400 Speaker 1: it would give you the ability to kind of phase 702 00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 1: back in slowly. So I love the second questions very 703 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:08,920 Speaker 1: best of both worlds. So I need to include this. 704 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:12,360 Speaker 1: Since I have a nine month appointment, summer is considered 705 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 1: a holiday at the university. However, that's the time I 706 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: am paid to build my lab in advance my research. 707 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 1: I'm having a hard time explaining to my partner that 708 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,760 Speaker 1: summer is not a real quote unquote holiday and that 709 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:25,000 Speaker 1: I can't stay home taking care of the baby full time. 710 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,200 Speaker 1: We are looking into home daycare, but he is worried 711 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:29,440 Speaker 1: that the baby will be too young to go to daycare. 712 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:31,880 Speaker 1: I guess I'll just share that I put my baby 713 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:35,040 Speaker 1: in daycare at three months and it was great. Most universities, 714 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 1: and you are at a university, have amazing daycares because 715 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,120 Speaker 1: they have faculty who have kids, who really care about 716 00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,840 Speaker 1: the quality of their daycare. And most likely your child 717 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,240 Speaker 1: would be going to daycare alongside you know, doctor's kids 718 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:49,800 Speaker 1: and other professor's kids and other community members' kids, of course. 719 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:54,240 Speaker 1: So I think that perhaps maybe your partner could visit 720 00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,320 Speaker 1: a daycare and see what it looked like. And I 721 00:33:56,320 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 1: know you mentioned a home daycare, but sometimes it's actually 722 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 1: the bigger, professionally run daycares that might have really very 723 00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:09,280 Speaker 1: specific care for really young infants with really low caregiver 724 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 1: ratios and just great setups for those age groups. I 725 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 1: had a good experience again beginning it around three months, 726 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,799 Speaker 1: and it doesn't have to be all or nothing. I mean, 727 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,320 Speaker 1: you can enroll your child in some sort of daycare 728 00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:22,799 Speaker 1: or hire somebody, but it doesn't have to be full time. 729 00:34:22,880 --> 00:34:24,960 Speaker 1: So if his idea, if his concern is like, you know, 730 00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 1: there won't be adequate bonding or you know, something dangerous 731 00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: would happen, maybe your child could be in the daycare 732 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:32,680 Speaker 1: a couple of days a week, or for partner of 733 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,040 Speaker 1: the day if that works for you. But to me, 734 00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 1: the way you describe your job, it sounds like you 735 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,960 Speaker 1: would need childcare by that point, and that blowing off 736 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,279 Speaker 1: the entire first summer. I mean, it's a choice you 737 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: could make if you wanted to make it, but it 738 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 1: doesn't sound like you want to make that choice. So 739 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 1: I would probably explore the options a little bit more 740 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,600 Speaker 1: in depth with your partner. I would also suggest looking 741 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:58,719 Speaker 1: into hiring a part time setter for the summer, that 742 00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:01,880 Speaker 1: this could be a middle groand that if your partner 743 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:05,520 Speaker 1: is concerned about an institutional daycare setting, I don't know. 744 00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:08,080 Speaker 1: Some people grow up calling these things baby prison, which 745 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:10,719 Speaker 1: is its own fun little thing. But if he grew 746 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 1: up in a situation where family members were referring to 747 00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:15,839 Speaker 1: daycare as baby prison, then that's probably why he's thinking 748 00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:18,600 Speaker 1: it's a bad idea, but you know it isn't wouldn't 749 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: it be wonderful if our prisons were this good, nobody 750 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:22,520 Speaker 1: would ever commit any more crimes coming out of them. 751 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 1: But a part time sitter could also have the flexibility 752 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 1: you guys might need. And just I would throw out 753 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:31,840 Speaker 1: there that my experience with daycare is that there are 754 00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,600 Speaker 1: a lot of illnesses. I mean, maybe less so in summer, 755 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:37,480 Speaker 1: but you know, if you have a room that's like 756 00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,880 Speaker 1: three months to fifteen months, like some of the kids 757 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:43,520 Speaker 1: are mobile in there, and so they're going to be 758 00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:46,680 Speaker 1: touching your baby and there's going to be germs going 759 00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:49,400 Speaker 1: around because that's just what happens in a communal setting. 760 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 1: So you might wish to hire a sitter for just 761 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:56,239 Speaker 1: a couple months, like you said, and then you know, 762 00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: start the baby maybe full time when he or she 763 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:01,319 Speaker 1: is five six months old, because that way you can 764 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: get a couple hours a day to do your work, 765 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:05,960 Speaker 1: but you're not going to be dealing with the illnesses 766 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,520 Speaker 1: that can cause you know, last minute that you don't 767 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 1: have care for a day and like you planned your 768 00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:12,000 Speaker 1: experiment that day, like how's that going to work? You know, 769 00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:14,719 Speaker 1: somebody's gonna have to stay home, and so that might 770 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,319 Speaker 1: just be something to look into. Another possibility, there will 771 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:19,920 Speaker 1: be illnesses, That is true. Did you know there is 772 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:21,880 Speaker 1: actually data that shows that if your child goes to 773 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 1: day here, they will have less illnesses later compared to 774 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,920 Speaker 1: kids who So I believe it because you're gonna get 775 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:29,640 Speaker 1: ill at some point. But the question are you getting 776 00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: ill at five months? Are you getting ill at five years? 777 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:33,960 Speaker 1: I mean, once you start going into some sort of 778 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:38,760 Speaker 1: communal setting, you will get illnesses, communicable diseases, because that's 779 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:42,040 Speaker 1: what happens when human beings are around each other, as 780 00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 1: we are now well aware with the pandemic. But choosing 781 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 1: when you wish to take that is again it's a 782 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,440 Speaker 1: choice of family. And of course you know a very 783 00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 1: sick three month old can be a lot scarier than 784 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 1: a very snotty like two year old, So there's that 785 00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: to consider as well. Her last part of the question 786 00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:03,840 Speaker 1: was is the university is family friendly? But she can't 787 00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:07,480 Speaker 1: help but feel like she's surprised her new institution by 788 00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:10,120 Speaker 1: getting pregnant, and she feels guilty about it. So, Sarah, 789 00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: what would you say with that? Well, what I wrote 790 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,280 Speaker 1: was they'll get over it. As long as you continue 791 00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,480 Speaker 1: to do great work, which I'm sure you will. They're 792 00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:20,239 Speaker 1: not going to dwell on this two years from now, 793 00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 1: because you'll have been productive. And yes, they may be 794 00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 1: just surprised just because like wow, that's oh my gosh, 795 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 1: you're here and you're pregnant, but that's the kind of 796 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,040 Speaker 1: very short term view. And if you zoom out and 797 00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:32,799 Speaker 1: you're doing great work for them, they're certainly not going 798 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,000 Speaker 1: to mind. Now. You'll even get pregnant again. Yeah, I 799 00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,400 Speaker 1: get pregnant again. Why not two more times? Three more times? No? 800 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:41,760 Speaker 1: I mean, if you hire people who are in their twenties, thirlies, 801 00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:44,680 Speaker 1: thirties and early forties, that's I mean inevitable that people 802 00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 1: are going to be growing their families during this time. 803 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:49,200 Speaker 1: So you are certainly not the only professor at your 804 00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:51,719 Speaker 1: university to have had a baby. They've gotten their heads 805 00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,040 Speaker 1: around that in the past. Probably no one's really thinking 806 00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: about it that much. So get rid of the guilt. 807 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,520 Speaker 1: It's allowed. Humans are allowed to have babies. People will 808 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,440 Speaker 1: get over enjoy it and enjoy it exactly all right. 809 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 1: This has been the best of both worlds. Sarah has 810 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,759 Speaker 1: been interviewing Marles pire Wright about building a family during 811 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 1: medical school, so you know, similar to building a family 812 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,520 Speaker 1: during your first years at a in a job as well. 813 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,840 Speaker 1: Always challenging, but you know, rewarding too. So we'll be 814 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:17,919 Speaker 1: back next week with more on making work and life 815 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:22,880 Speaker 1: fit together. Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah 816 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:26,840 Speaker 1: at the shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox 817 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,640 Speaker 1: on Instagram, and you can find me Laura at Laura 818 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,959 Speaker 1: vandercam dot com. This has been the best of both 819 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 1: worlds podcasts. Please join us next time for more on 820 00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: making work and life work together.