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Speaker 1: This is Masters in Business with Barry Ridholts on Bloomberg Radio.

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Speaker 1: This week on the podcast, I have an extra special guest.

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Speaker 1: His name is Bruce van so On. He is the

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Speaker 1: chairman and CEO of Citizens Financial Group. They are a

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Speaker 1: hundred and sixty five billion dollar bank, the twelfth largest

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Speaker 1: in the United States. If you are at all interested

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Speaker 1: in banking, financing, middle market, private equity, just a whole

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Speaker 1: run of different um aspects of the financial services world,

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Speaker 1: you're going to find this conversation to be quite interesting. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Bruce is really a very knowledgeable and articulate UM spokesman

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Speaker 1: on not only behalf of his bank, but the banking

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Speaker 1: industry in general. He has a really good insight as

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Speaker 1: to what's going on in both the industry and the economy.

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Speaker 1: So I I found this conversation to be fascinating and

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Speaker 1: I think you will also. With no further ado, my

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Speaker 1: interview with Bruce van Soon. This is Masters in Business

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Speaker 1: with Barry Ridholts on Bloomberg Radio. My special guest this

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Speaker 1: week is Bruce van Soon. He is the chairman and

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Speaker 1: chief executive officer of Citizens Financial Group. UH. They were

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Speaker 1: spun out from RBS back in where Van so On

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Speaker 1: led a successful initial public offering. Previously, he had been

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Speaker 1: executive director on the RBS board for the prior four

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Speaker 1: or five years. Before that, he was vice chairman and

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Speaker 1: CFO at the Bank of New York Nellan. His previous

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Speaker 1: career stints include Deutsche Bank, Washerstein, Perella, and Kidder Peabody.

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Speaker 1: Bruce van Son, Welcome to Bloomberg. Thanks my pleasure to

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Speaker 1: be here, Barry. Let's start at the Bank of New

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Speaker 1: York and Bank of New York Mellon. Where were you

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Speaker 1: during the financial crisis, which what was the name at

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Speaker 1: the time. Well, I had left by then, so I

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Speaker 1: joined Bank in New York. In the biggest crisis I

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Speaker 1: experienced there was when eleven hit and we were basically

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Speaker 1: out of business there for a few days, and we

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Speaker 1: had to scramble to get the bank back on its feet.

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Speaker 1: But how you downtown One Wall Street was the headquarters

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Speaker 1: building and the Barclays was Street was the operations center,

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Speaker 1: and so we were kind of straddling the World Trade

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Speaker 1: Center buildings, and when you couldn't have access to downtown,

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Speaker 1: we had to work out of other offices that we

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Speaker 1: scrambled to secure, and then we had to stand up

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Speaker 1: a new data center with IBM's help in Sterling Forest,

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Speaker 1: So that was an exciting period. How long did it

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Speaker 1: take for you guys to get back up and running, Well,

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Speaker 1: it was it was a couple of days, uh, and

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Speaker 1: then we had a lot of pressure to basically start

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Speaker 1: moving money and move securities and clear out the backlog

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Speaker 1: that had piled up for a couple of days. So

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Speaker 1: you had backup facilities you weren't just that wasn't the

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Speaker 1: sole location. It was relatively easy to turn but we

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Speaker 1: didn't have the same kind of resiliency that banks have today.

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Speaker 1: So after in the wake of that, Bank in York

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Speaker 1: went out and built a brand new spanking data center

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Speaker 1: out in Tennessee, UM and so we're constantly ready to

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Speaker 1: flip over, but we weren't at that level of resiliency

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Speaker 1: at that time. The cloud has changed everything for banks

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Speaker 1: and financial instation. I think the cloud is part of that.

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Speaker 1: So part of it was just making the investment and

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Speaker 1: recognizing the need for a higher level of resiliency. But

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Speaker 1: now moving things to the cloud and running your infrastructure

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Speaker 1: in the cloud I think offers some great promise to

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Speaker 1: lower costs and also increased security and you were at

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Speaker 1: RBS then in o eight oh nine is the yes,

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Speaker 1: so so uh the reason I missed the crisis we

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Speaker 1: had merged with Melon and uh I stayed through the transition.

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Speaker 1: We had appointed a new CEO, so I wanted to

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Speaker 1: go do something else, and I was out by July

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Speaker 1: of oh eight. The crisis was in the fall of

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Speaker 1: oh eight, so it was nice not to be in

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Speaker 1: the hot seat during that. I was working in private

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Speaker 1: equity for about a year trying to put deals together,

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Speaker 1: and then RBS came a calling. They had wanted to

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Speaker 1: put a new management team in place to help right

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Speaker 1: the ship after RBS took a tumble in the crisis

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Speaker 1: and needed a government bailout, so I joined Stephen Hester.

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Speaker 1: There I was the CFO, and uh we had a

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Speaker 1: lot of surgery do in terms of shrinking the bank

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Speaker 1: and getting it back to safety. So you mentioned private equity.

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Speaker 1: Citizens Financial is sort of a can I call them

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Speaker 1: a middleware sort of bank does a lot of work

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Speaker 1: with um not the giant entities out there, but a

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Speaker 1: lot of very other large entities that I think are

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Speaker 1: a little below the reader of the public. Is that

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Speaker 1: A yeah, So here's the you know, the kind of

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Speaker 1: Laya the land in terms of our commercial business, so h,

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Speaker 1: we focus on middle market companies, which are maybe twenty

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Speaker 1: five million to five million in revenues, and then also

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Speaker 1: the mid corporate segment, which is five hundred million to

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Speaker 1: about three billion in revenues. Over time since I've joined Citizens,

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Speaker 1: we've taken the middle market customer a count from about

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Speaker 1: two thousand up to about three thousand, and mid corporates

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Speaker 1: we've taken from about five hundred up to about a thousand.

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Speaker 1: So uh, we've grown faster at the bigger company end. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And what you need there to be competitive is you

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Speaker 1: need bankers with industry expertise. So we had to go

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Speaker 1: out and recruit in some bankers for technology or healthcare, energy, uh,

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Speaker 1: so they could really serve those customers well, and they

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Speaker 1: could bring previous relationships from their last bank over to Citizens.

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Speaker 1: And so we've had some some really nice growth. Uh.

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Speaker 1: But we're not focusing on the household name. Fortune five

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Speaker 1: companies were staying a little bit below that radar, and

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Speaker 1: we can compete very effectively against the mega banks. There's

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Speaker 1: oftentimes we're leading deals and we'll have jp more going

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Speaker 1: to be of a on our right or we're winning

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Speaker 1: a swap transaction against the megabanks. So we have really

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Speaker 1: good cape abilities, but we stay focused on an area

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Speaker 1: that that we know and we can compete effectively. So

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Speaker 1: I've noticed on Wall Street UM, hedge funds and venture

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Speaker 1: capital seems to be going through a bit of a

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Speaker 1: rough batch. But private equity just is a house of fire.

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Speaker 1: It just expands rapidly. How does that? Well, private equity

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Speaker 1: is is a good customer segment for us in the

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Speaker 1: commercial bank, and we have focused over time on say

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Speaker 1: fifty to sixty sponsors that we know well, uh, that

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Speaker 1: we think they're good operators. Uh. They invest wisely, uh,

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Speaker 1: and they're good to their banks and when they need

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Speaker 1: to put equity back into a deal to right the

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Speaker 1: ship if something is a little stressed, uh, they do that.

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Speaker 1: So uh, that's where we've stayed focused. We haven't tried

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Speaker 1: to move and compete for all the business that's taking

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Speaker 1: place there. And I think clients selection has been really critical.

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Speaker 1: So those firms know us well, they give us the

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Speaker 1: swings at the bat, they let us lead trans actions

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Speaker 1: and then also provide more services to their investee companies.

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Speaker 1: So that's been a really good strategy for us, I

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Speaker 1: would say, Uh, similarly with commercial real estate, Uh, the

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Speaker 1: developers we focus on, we've known for a long time.

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Speaker 1: We think they're good operators, and so again we build

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Speaker 1: those strong relationships and we get good swings at the

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Speaker 1: bat when they're doing things, and I like to include

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Speaker 1: us in the deals that they do, and then they

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Speaker 1: give us a chance to get more of their wallet

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Speaker 1: because they know we have the capabilities. That sounds quite

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Speaker 1: quite interesting. So let's start with a really broad topic.

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Speaker 1: Since the crisis ended in O nine, there have been

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Speaker 1: just enormous changes in banking and regulation even the entire economy.

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Speaker 1: How has the role of a CEO running a bank

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Speaker 1: changed over this period? How has banking changed over the period.

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Speaker 1: It's a very broad question, U. I'll break that down. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, after the crisis, it was clear that there

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Speaker 1: needed to be some reforms first around, i'd say the

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Speaker 1: prudential regulation about how banks, uh, did they have enough capital,

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Speaker 1: did they have the right funding and liquidity structures and

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Speaker 1: so um, where they're managing risk the right way. So

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Speaker 1: we had a whole framework that was put in place

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Speaker 1: that was agreed globally basically around capital, liquidity, funding, running

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Speaker 1: stress tests, uh and I think that was really positive.

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Speaker 1: So we learned a lot from the crisis and we

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Speaker 1: put those lessons to use. Uh So a big part

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Speaker 1: of our efforts early days was to make sure that

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Speaker 1: we were keeping up with those increasing demands around the

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Speaker 1: prudent regulation. The second element of regulation was around really

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Speaker 1: conducting culture, and so banks I think weren't always that

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Speaker 1: transparent with their fees, and sometimes they were working against

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Speaker 1: their customers that are working for their customers, so they're

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Speaker 1: needed to be changed there as well. And so that

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Speaker 1: whole agenda came in in the second wave after the

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Speaker 1: credential agenda, and I think that's also been very positive

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Speaker 1: in terms of creating the right mindset and culture inside banks,

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Speaker 1: in terms of, you know, we have to be the

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Speaker 1: trusted advisor. We have to be working for the benefit

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Speaker 1: of our customers, giving them good advice, being simple, being

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Speaker 1: transparent on our fees. Have we come full circles when

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Speaker 1: we come a long way, you know. The one kind

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Speaker 1: of bump in the road, unfortunately, was the Wells Fargo

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Speaker 1: selling scandal, which kind of made folks think, well, maybe

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Speaker 1: there hasn't been any change here in banks, when in fact,

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Speaker 1: I think most of the banks had come through and

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Speaker 1: made the appropriate changes, so that yeah, I think that

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Speaker 1: was it. That was a black eye for the industry,

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Speaker 1: and they're paying the piper for that. They now have

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Speaker 1: a new CEO and they're working hard on their regulatory

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Speaker 1: equation and it's been a great bank for deck generations

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Speaker 1: and will continue to be. I think they'll get back

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Speaker 1: on track. But that was that was unfortunate for the industry,

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Speaker 1: I think. Uh, so the regulatory agenda was a big

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Speaker 1: thing to keep up with. The second thing that's changed

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Speaker 1: a lot is uh. You know, technology has moved in

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Speaker 1: warp speed to kind of dimensions nobody thought possible. So

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Speaker 1: moving infrastructure to the cloud, UH, new ways of development

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Speaker 1: around an agile framework which speeds things up. UH. Going

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Speaker 1: to digital first business models, UH, using data to personalize

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Speaker 1: offers to your customers so they don't waste their time. Uh.

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Speaker 1: You know, you see what's happening in other industries, and

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Speaker 1: customer expectations for change and for a level of service

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Speaker 1: have really increased given what they see elsewhere, and so

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Speaker 1: banks have had to make the investments and go through

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Speaker 1: significant change in the business model to to to meet

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Speaker 1: those expectations. So it's really kept it very interesting to

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Speaker 1: to keep up with all the change that we've had

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Speaker 1: to over over the last few years. You know, when

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Speaker 1: the new CEO of Vanguard came in the his answer

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Speaker 1: to a question I found most fascinating, what what keeps

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Speaker 1: you up? In his answer was security and hackers? How

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Speaker 1: big a deal is that? And is technology helping us

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Speaker 1: in this space or or making it worse? Well, um,

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Speaker 1: to be in arms. I think it is a big deal.

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Speaker 1: And I think most CEOs of financial institutions trusted with

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Speaker 1: keeping customers assets and data safe have to have that

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Speaker 1: as the top issue on the priority list, top risk

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Speaker 1: that we face. Uh. Fortunately, UM, there are advances in

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Speaker 1: technology and new tools to actually help protect all of

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Speaker 1: those those assets and that data. Uh. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it also requires hiring top talent. UM. We

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Speaker 1: feel really good at Citizens. We've hired a leading expert

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Speaker 1: in cybersecurity, has had some big jobs elsewhere, who um,

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Speaker 1: I think, knows what good looks like and has moved

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Speaker 1: us into the future very very quickly, has good followership,

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Speaker 1: has brought a aditional good people into the organization, and

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Speaker 1: then we've prioritized the tools that she needs to really

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Speaker 1: keep the banks safe. So that kind of goes right

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Speaker 1: to the top of the capital expenditure list, and I

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Speaker 1: think that will continue to be the case because there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of bad guys out there. They don't come

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Speaker 1: into branches with a stocking over their head and a

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Speaker 1: water pistol and pass a note to the teller anymore.

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Speaker 1: That's less and less the way that Yeah, it's it's

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Speaker 1: you know, much more sophisticated. Now they're sitting in a

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Speaker 1: you know, in a cafe, hacking away, buying you know,

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Speaker 1: data off the black market, and trying to figure out

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Speaker 1: ways to to steal people's assets. Unbelievable. So you lead

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Speaker 1: the I p O in what was that process like

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Speaker 1: going public? And how happy are you that you're not,

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Speaker 1: you know, a tech unicorn having to face what companies

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Speaker 1: like Uber and well, look, I think citizens had that

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Speaker 1: great foundation serving a good part of the country. Because

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Speaker 1: of the troubles of the parents, there was a lot

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Speaker 1: of work to do. So the balance sheet had shrunk

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Speaker 1: dramatically and hadn't kept pace in some ways investing in

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Speaker 1: technology and in our fee based businesses, and so there

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Speaker 1: was work to do when we had the deadline in

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Speaker 1: terms of taking in public. The best I could do

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Speaker 1: really was assemble a strong team and board, uh, put

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Speaker 1: together a really good plan and have a vision where

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Speaker 1: we could take the company. But it was you know,

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Speaker 1: we had to do it within a year, and so

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Speaker 1: we were still operating at relatively poor profitability levels and

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Speaker 1: we still had a lot of gaps, but we had

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Speaker 1: a good story to tell. So actually just getting the

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Speaker 1: deal done and getting investors to kind of buy the promise. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and by our experience and our vision felt really good.

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Speaker 1: So that was that was important to get that done

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Speaker 1: and launch that. UM. I would say, you know the

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Speaker 1: experience of going public really helped facilitate our turnaround because uh,

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Speaker 1: usually UH divestitures banks get sold, they don't get I

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Speaker 1: p oed. So this was opportunity for me to assemble

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Speaker 1: a management team and say, look, we're in a unique

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Speaker 1: situation where we get the keys to the car and

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Speaker 1: we have the steering wheel and we can take this

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Speaker 1: bank where we want to. So we can build a

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Speaker 1: great bank over time, and you're gonna be a key

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Speaker 1: player in doing that. So that allowed us to I

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Speaker 1: think attract the levels of talent that had citizens stayed

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Speaker 1: a part of our BS we would not have been

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Speaker 1: able to do. And ultimately, in any organization, you win

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Speaker 1: with great people when you win with talent. Uh So

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Speaker 1: that was that was really positive. I think the other

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Speaker 1: thing also is that it kind of shook up the

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Speaker 1: culture at citizens that as a sub of a foreign

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Speaker 1: entity that has its own troubles, you could get comfortable

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Speaker 1: and a bit complacent. And so now we had public

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Speaker 1: shareholders who wanted to hear about the long term vision,

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Speaker 1: but they wanted to see good execution in the near

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Speaker 1: term to towards that path. Uh And so we had

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Speaker 1: a higher level accountability that we embedded into the culture.

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Speaker 1: Uh So we're accountable to shareholders and we're accountable others

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Speaker 1: to serve our customers better and to run the bank better.

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Speaker 1: So you sit on the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston

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Speaker 1: board representing other banks, what is what is that experience? Like? Oh,

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Speaker 1: that's great? Uh So? Uh if you if you flash

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Speaker 1: back to the last two years, I was on the

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Speaker 1: Federal Advisory Council. So I was representing the the Boston

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Speaker 1: Fed District in meeting with the FED Board of Governors

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Speaker 1: and talking about issues and making uh you know, giving

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Speaker 1: color on economic conditions and offering advice on certain financial matters.

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Speaker 1: So that was good. And then I rolled onto the

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Speaker 1: to the Boston Fed and so we talked about the

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Speaker 1: economic conditions in the New England region. Uh, we talk

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Speaker 1: about the macro economic dynamics and where interest rates are

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Speaker 1: and where they where they should go because uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: the Boston Fed president gets a vote in terms of

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Speaker 1: what to do with interest rates, so you're an influencer

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Speaker 1: of him, but not a voting member obviously, yeah, obviously. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So quite interesting. And you're on the board of Moodies

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Speaker 1: for a couple of years. This is post crisis. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what is that experience? Well, you know, you missed all

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Speaker 1: the fun. Well what's interesting is, uh, you know, most

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Speaker 1: ceo s can have one outside board slot. Um and

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Speaker 1: even when I was a CFO for many years, I

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Speaker 1: always had an outside board slot. When I was in

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Speaker 1: the UK, I was on Lloyd's of London's board. That's

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Speaker 1: quite the entity. And I found that, uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: would complement what I was doing as an executive because

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Speaker 1: their specialists and risk management, that's our principal responsibilities to

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Speaker 1: make sure we're running a safe and sound institution. And

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Speaker 1: so when I came back from the UK and came

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Speaker 1: into the US. I was looking for a job that

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Speaker 1: would also be complementary where I could continue to uh

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Speaker 1: stay in tune with the latest developments in risk management

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Speaker 1: and kind of seeing the lay of the land about

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Speaker 1: how Moodies thought about global risks. And so that was

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Speaker 1: just a natural thing to for me to go from

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Speaker 1: Lloyd's of London go onto the board of Moodies. So

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Speaker 1: I've been a critic over the years of the rating agencies,

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Speaker 1: primarily S and P. When you look at the fines

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Speaker 1: post crisis, I think Moody's paid a million dollar fine.

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Speaker 1: SMP paid billions and billions in finals, and it wasn't

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Speaker 1: quite that much of a spread. I think SMP billion

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Speaker 1: settlement with the with the d J was about a

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Speaker 1: billion three and Moodies was about eight. That they were

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Speaker 1: ultimately but they but they pretty much seemed to have

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Speaker 1: gotten much less blame in the popular press than SMPA.

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Speaker 1: I I don't know why that is, but uh, you're

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Speaker 1: you're this predated you by yeah. I mean we had

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Speaker 1: that we that we settled while I was there on

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Speaker 1: the board, so we got involved in looking at the

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Speaker 1: facts and looking at the allegations, but I do think

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Speaker 1: Moody's fact pattern generally was was in pretty good shape.

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Speaker 1: But still there was some some culpability. Weren't going to

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Speaker 1: escape without some culpability. And I don't know you very well,

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Speaker 1: but I suspect from everything I've learned about you preparing

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Speaker 1: for this, I suspect you're the sort of guy who

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Speaker 1: comes in and says, let's get this resolved, let's move on.

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Speaker 1: We have a business to run. This happened before, it

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Speaker 1: predates my involvement. Let's write that check and get on

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Speaker 1: with all. Well, I'm just I'm just one board member.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, we had those types of conversations. I can

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Speaker 1: imagine that the market is really focused on the future.

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Speaker 1: They don't like to have these overhangs on the past,

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Speaker 1: and so you just gotta put them behind you. Let's

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Speaker 1: talk a little bit about Apple. You know, when when

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Speaker 1: I first started um reading about citizens Financial, my initial

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Speaker 1: response was why is that name so familiar? And I

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Speaker 1: just punched it into the search of my computer. It's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: they finance are our iPhones? UM, tell us a little

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Speaker 1: bit about how did that come about? What? How I

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Speaker 1: know that's a relatively minor UM thing in the overall

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Speaker 1: revenues of the bank. But it's kind of interesting because

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Speaker 1: it is a name brand, and you guys are pretty

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Speaker 1: much very public with To be to be a partner

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Speaker 1: for the most iconic company on the planet, in my view,

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Speaker 1: really is a lot of credibility for us. So we're

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Speaker 1: quite pleased that we hold that position. Uh. You know,

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Speaker 1: we had worked with Apple early days when we were

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Speaker 1: building up our student loan business, uh, potentially with a

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Speaker 1: notion that we could help them finance the purchases of

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Speaker 1: their equipment in student book stores in college, and that

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Speaker 1: program didn't really fulfill its potential. Um, But I think

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Speaker 1: we got to know them well and they liked our

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Speaker 1: focus on the customer and really obsession around the customer

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Speaker 1: experience because that's really defines Apple. So when they were

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Speaker 1: thinking about the upgrade program and how to sell more

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Speaker 1: phones through their stores, we helped work with them on

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Speaker 1: that program and design the financing for that program. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And I think we built a very effective platform to

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Speaker 1: process those transactions. So there's a very small window of

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Speaker 1: time that as you know, since you've in it twelve months, well,

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Speaker 1: but you go into the store, you pick your phone,

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Speaker 1: and then you, we have a little window to make

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Speaker 1: a decision do we want to finance you in the

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Speaker 1: program or not, and without getting a lot of information.

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Speaker 1: So we've built a very good credit decision ing model

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Speaker 1: and then a very good processing capability behind the scenes

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Speaker 1: that leads to a very good customer experience, a very

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Speaker 1: highly rated NPS within the Apple store experience. So, uh, anyways,

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Speaker 1: pretty instantaneous. Yeah, it's it's gone exceptionally well. On on

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Speaker 1: the days when they launch a new uh phone. Uh,

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Speaker 1: we get massive volume that we have to process, and

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Speaker 1: we've always been able to flawlessly execute all that volume.

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Speaker 1: So so I think it's been a good partnership. And Uh,

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Speaker 1: the nice thing is the technology platform that we built

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Speaker 1: for Apple, we can move and offer it to other

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Speaker 1: merchants and adapted to to the needs of other merchants.

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Speaker 1: And so today we also have a d T and

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Speaker 1: vivin to smart alarm. Companies are running similar programs, and

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Speaker 1: we have a number of other big household names in

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Speaker 1: the queue. And so I kind of tease investors, I say,

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Speaker 1: stay tuned, watched this space, because we're gonna announce a

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Speaker 1: rollout to some other very highly regarded companies. So I'm

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Speaker 1: curious as to how this works because when the first

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Speaker 1: time we went to an Apple store too, and I'm

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Speaker 1: always complaining I'm a power user phones and after a

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Speaker 1: year the battery life starts to die. The last phone,

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Speaker 1: I replaced the battery at month fourteen, and I said, wait,

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Speaker 1: twelve months, new phone? What do I sign up for that?

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Speaker 1: It was a pretty surprisingly quit. You punch a bunch

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Speaker 1: of things in data birth so, security, name, address, and

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Speaker 1: it's like eight seconds later you get approval. I assume

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Speaker 1: you're looking at things like credit score, payment history, etcetera.

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Speaker 1: What what how many data points go into that that

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Speaker 1: it could be that's a number of data points. We

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Speaker 1: don't want to give away the full secret, Sauceberry, but

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Speaker 1: you know, I think we feel quite confident of our

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Speaker 1: ability to make good decisions. And I think we now

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Speaker 1: have been at the program now for a number of years,

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Speaker 1: and so we've seen the performance of all the different vintages, uh,

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Speaker 1: and they've performed at or above expectations. Do you tweak

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Speaker 1: this on an ongoing basis? It's always how do we

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Speaker 1: make it a little better and a little that's that's

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Speaker 1: that's kind of interesting. So I have to think this

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Speaker 1: new iPhone eleven the week it comes out, what is

401
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Speaker 1: that like? Is this just a giant fire hose of

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Speaker 1: data or there's there's a big swell of volume. Uh

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Speaker 1: and uh. It's great for Apple. I think they're pleased

404
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Speaker 1: with how the eleven is being received in the marketplace,

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Speaker 1: and it's gotten great reviews. And despite the price, it's

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Speaker 1: pretty expensive. Well, they've had had a two tier price,

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Speaker 1: so I think, and you could get the eight for

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Speaker 1: a very cheap. They've now covered the full spectrum of

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Speaker 1: prices as opposed to just being right. So I think

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Speaker 1: they've thought it through in terms of features and pricing

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Speaker 1: and alternatives. And it's meeting a good reception, which is

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Speaker 1: good for us. That means there's gonna be good demand

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Speaker 1: for the phone. People continue to participate in the upgrade program,

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Speaker 1: and so we continue to grow the balances onto the program.

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Speaker 1: I'm an ideal client for you, guys. We walk in,

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Speaker 1: what's the biggest phone, what's the top of line? Give

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Speaker 1: me extra storage? Wait it's fifty bucks a month, Okay, great,

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Speaker 1: we'll take two. It really is a very simple thing,

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Speaker 1: and the only problem is you want to upgrade after

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Speaker 1: a year, and sometimes you're waiting a couple of months

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Speaker 1: for new phone, so you end up holding onto it.

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Speaker 1: But then but you're never really obsoletely, you're always getting

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Speaker 1: the latest and greatest, which after the very appealing. Well,

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Speaker 1: some people don't care, other people want whatever. The most

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Speaker 1: buzzworthy thing is I am an early adopter, even though

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Speaker 1: it can occasionally be painful when you buy things before

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00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 1: they're really ready for prime time. UM, thankfully I passed

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Speaker 1: on the Google Glass. But any time I have an

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Speaker 1: opportunity to upgrade the phone, I'm I'm, I'm there right away. Good.

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Speaker 1: I have to think that where you sit in the economy,

431
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:17,480
Speaker 1: looking at consumers, looking at other um businesses and entrepreneurs,

432
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:22,320
Speaker 1: you have to get a really early read on any

433
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 1: changes in the economy. Is that a fair statement or

434
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 1: am I overstating it? Yeah? No, Look, we're kind of

435
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 1: cover three regions of the country. So we have New England,

436
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:36,920
Speaker 1: mid Atlantic and Upper Midwest within our footprint, three very

437
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 1: different economies economies, and we cover, as I said earlier,

438
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 1: the mid mid corporate middle market all the way down

439
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: to small business, and then we have a very big

440
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 1: consumer business. So the balance of our businesses is roughly

441
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:54,320
Speaker 1: fifty fifty between uh corporate and and also uh the consumer.

442
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:56,880
Speaker 1: Uh so we get it. We got quite a good

443
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 1: read on uh, you know, both data in terms of,

444
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:04,280
Speaker 1: you know how how are borrowing patterns, how our charge

445
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 1: card usage, etcetera. Uh, and then also anecdotes just what

446
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 1: are we hearing from customers? What's the businessman doing? Are

447
00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,959
Speaker 1: they buying that next piece of capital equipment? Are they

448
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,679
Speaker 1: holding back because of the trade tension? Uh? So, I

449
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 1: think we get a well informed view of what's likely

450
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,359
Speaker 1: to come up in the economy. If there's a recession

451
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: somewhere out on the horizon, where would you see it first?

452
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 1: Is it in spending patterns? Is it in payment patterns? Where?

453
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:36,640
Speaker 1: Where does the what line of business is most sensitive? Yeah? So,

454
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 1: I you know, I think the thing that you really

455
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,399
Speaker 1: want to keep your eye on is credit deterioration. So

456
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 1: in the consumer side, are you seeing migrations into delinquency

457
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,359
Speaker 1: buckets that people are starting to stretch and have difficulty

458
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:55,840
Speaker 1: keeping up with obligations. Same thing on the corporate side

459
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,679
Speaker 1: of their particular segments of the economy that are starting

460
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,200
Speaker 1: to dress a little bit. And so to me, that's

461
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: a key early warning sign. Are you seeing any of

462
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 1: that today, We're not. So. There was a Wall Street

463
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:13,879
Speaker 1: Journal article about middle class consumers moving towards a seven

464
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 1: year versus the old five year UH loan for automobiles,

465
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: and that could be a sign of of something I don't.

466
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: I think people maybe you're holding their cars longer. That's

467
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,199
Speaker 1: a little more affordable to stretch the payment out over

468
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:28,879
Speaker 1: a longer time. So and these cars now less pretty much,

469
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 1: they do, they do, so you're not seeing a lot

470
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: of people have been nervous about I s M and

471
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 1: I've been nervous about residential sales. And you know, the

472
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: recession easts have been forecasting a recession next year for

473
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: the past five years. They you know, eventually they'll be right.

474
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 1: But it doesn't mean we don't. We don't see it. Uh,

475
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: you know, I I'd say, uh, there's some recent data

476
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:56,199
Speaker 1: that UH manufacturing sector is a little soft. But you

477
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 1: have to remember in the context of the US economy,

478
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:03,719
Speaker 1: economy's power s by consumers, and consumers are in great times.

479
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:07,119
Speaker 1: Unemployments low, people can find jobs, real wage growth, So

480
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 1: you've got UH wages growing at three point two, inflations

481
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 1: down at one and a half. So people are having

482
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 1: expanding uh net pay over inflation, which is great. So

483
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,200
Speaker 1: that I think the consumer is watching some of the

484
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,199
Speaker 1: current events. They're watching the trade and they're watching the

485
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:27,399
Speaker 1: impeachment proceedings, but I think they're almost inured to to that.

486
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 1: It's been around for a long time and it hasn't

487
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: really caused anything, and so people are aware of it,

488
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: but it's not holding folks back. Where it is holding

489
00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 1: people back a little bit is the kind of middle

490
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 1: market companies sitting there saying, how is the trade tension

491
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 1: and the tariffs going to impact me? And it's going

492
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:51,159
Speaker 1: to impect impact different sectors differently. Again, the service economy

493
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: is not that impacted by it, but the manufacturing sector is.

494
00:27:55,800 --> 00:28:00,080
Speaker 1: And fortunately for us, the service sector dominates our to

495
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 1: me so, but you guys have have offices in the Midwest.

496
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 1: You're seeing stresses starting to perform on at least on

497
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: a small basis. I think. I think a lot of

498
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:12,240
Speaker 1: companies are thinking about their supply chains and how to

499
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 1: adjust their supply chains to try to minimize the impact

500
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:19,920
Speaker 1: from the tariffs. And you know what it forces everybody

501
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 1: to do, including the banks, is how do you get

502
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: more efficient if you're going to have these costs that

503
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: come in from external from uh some of the administration policies.

504
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 1: Then how do we protect our growth and our earnings, etcetera.

505
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 1: And so deploying artificial intelligence, deploying robotics, finding ways to

506
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:43,080
Speaker 1: keep streamlining how business gets done becomes an imperative. When

507
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,880
Speaker 1: we think of traditional banks, we tend to think of

508
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:50,360
Speaker 1: the yield curve as being a determiner of their profitability.

509
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: When the yield curve is steep, hey, there's a lot

510
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 1: of spread to be captured, and they make money. When

511
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,960
Speaker 1: it's flat or as we've seen the past quarter, inverted,

512
00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 1: very challenging for those banks. How does that affect a

513
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 1: middle market bank like yourselves. Yeah, well, it's uh, certainly

514
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,480
Speaker 1: move something that's been a tailwind for the last two years.

515
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: Its rates were going up. Most banks are what's referred

516
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,520
Speaker 1: to as assets sensitive, so their loans are repricing faster

517
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: than deposits and spreads are widening. When you have the

518
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 1: flip and rates start to move down, then your loans

519
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: are repricing downward faster than you can reprice your deposits.

520
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 1: So it puts a little pressure on your net interest margin. Uh. Certainly,

521
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 1: you try to hedge that to some extent, but you

522
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 1: are going to have an impact, uh, and NIM will

523
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:42,120
Speaker 1: be contracting somewhat. How do you combat that? I mentioned

524
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: earlier the expenses focused on expenses, we had launched a

525
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 1: very big transformational cost program. We kind of saw the

526
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 1: the tea leaves about the FED going to either pause

527
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 1: or maybe start to cut rates, and so we got

528
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: on this back in December and we launched a big

529
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: program in July. We're also over the time, we've been

530
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 1: investing in our fee based businesses and we've done a

531
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: couple of very smart fee based acquisitions. What are those

532
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 1: fee based businesses? Well, in the commercial side, we we've

533
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,239
Speaker 1: purchased two M and A boutiques to broaden out what

534
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 1: we can do for our customers, and there's still been

535
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,320
Speaker 1: a good flow of M and A opportunities occurring in

536
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 1: the middle market. We bought a mortgage business, which timing

537
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 1: was great on that because as rates go down, as

538
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 1: the FEDS cutting rates, it maybe crimps your NIM a

539
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,120
Speaker 1: little bit. But NIM standing for that interest margin, the

540
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: spread that you're making on your balance sheet. But there's

541
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:41,719
Speaker 1: a refi boom like we haven't seen in years, taking

542
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:45,360
Speaker 1: places have you re financial mortgage. I literally was there

543
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 1: Friday doing the paperwork and the numbers are just insane.

544
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 1: So so to eight on a ten one mortgage and

545
00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 1: I'll have my mortgage paid off in ten years. I

546
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 1: don't ever have I know, I can't recall having heard

547
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,400
Speaker 1: of rates that low. I I want to say, a

548
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 1: thirty year fixed was three five or three three and

549
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: a half. Yeah, these are just these are These are

550
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 1: great opportunities for consumers to put more money in their

551
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 1: pocket and lock in lower carrying costs on their debt,

552
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 1: and so we make fees when that happens. So fortunately

553
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 1: this quarter we're going to have a really strong third

554
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 1: quarter UH on the feet side, which will offset any

555
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: of the leakage that we see on the balance sheet

556
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 1: income side. UM. And then the last acquisition that we

557
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: did was we bought a high end wealth advisor because

558
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 1: what we found is in the corporate side, the business

559
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 1: owner the fourth generation UH family that is very wealthy

560
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 1: and occasionally takes out large dividends from their company and

561
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: puts that back on the company. We weren't getting the

562
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 1: swings at the bat to manage those assets or to

563
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 1: do the estate planning for the company, So the folks

564
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: out of US as their bank, but they would take

565
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 1: that business elsewhere, and so we said, look, we should

566
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 1: be doing that for those customers. We went out and

567
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:10,600
Speaker 1: bought a company called Clarfeld Asset Management, which is a

568
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 1: highly respected wealth advisor and based in Terrytown, New York.

569
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 1: And so we're now able to offer those services. So, uh,

570
00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:21,640
Speaker 1: really not trying to do anything too big, but just

571
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: hitting the sweet spots with kind of rifle shot acquisition

572
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: program which has really been positive. So it sounds like

573
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: your business lines are pretty diversified, yes, so that that

574
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: that's a good thing, is um? So you you mentioned

575
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 1: the FED pausing and starting to reverse itself. Obviously mortgages

576
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:45,479
Speaker 1: rates make it a big difference. How how did Quewie

577
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 1: affect the rest of your business and and how does

578
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 1: all the noise which seems to have faded along with

579
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 1: the summer about the President and the FED doing battle,

580
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 1: how does that impact what you guys do? Well? Um,

581
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 1: Obviously the actions the Fed takes has a direct influence

582
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:06,960
Speaker 1: on the economy and on the money supply and the

583
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 1: cost of funding, and so it's going to impact banks

584
00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: in a material way. Uh. Quantitative easing I think was

585
00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: a stimulative measure which basically the FED was building up

586
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: their balance sheets, so taking on securities and buying those

587
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 1: with cash and putting cash back into the system. So

588
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 1: it helped promote liquidity and deposit growth and promote lending.

589
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,640
Speaker 1: Rates came down as they were buying those, uh, the

590
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 1: long end securities. UH. So you know, we just have

591
00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 1: to be in tune for where the FED is going. Uh.

592
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: And when we do our forecasting, we do our business planning,

593
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 1: we run a bunch of different scenarios. Is that you

594
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 1: know what happens. If this is happening in the economy,

595
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 1: then what is the FED likely to do? Uh? But uh,

596
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 1: in any case, we we just need to be flexible

597
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: and adapt to the circumstances that we see. So I

598
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: mentioned diversification, and you mentioned are in the southeast, Northeast,

599
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 1: and midwest, so Boston, Philly, Pittsburgh, Providence, Detroit. Um any

600
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 1: thoughts about expanding elsewhere are you eventually gonna Well, there's

601
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: a couple of things. So on the on the corporate side, Uh,

602
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 1: as we moved to the mid corporate space, which are

603
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 1: slightly bigger companies five undred three billion, we need to

604
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:24,240
Speaker 1: be national in those industry verticals, and so we've planted

605
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:26,800
Speaker 1: a flag down in Atlanta, so we have about twenty

606
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:29,359
Speaker 1: five folks down there at this point. Brought a guy

607
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,359
Speaker 1: out of sun Trust and he's built a nice team

608
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 1: down there. We've expanded now into Texas, which is another

609
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,280
Speaker 1: big state economy. We always had an energy practice in Houston,

610
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: but we put some more commercial bankers in Dallas and

611
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 1: in Houston. We just hired a fellow to UH pull

612
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:47,320
Speaker 1: together our team out in California, So he's going to

613
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 1: be based in l A. And so UH, you know,

614
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 1: we'll be on from a corporate bank standpoint more of

615
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 1: a national player. And I think you're seeing that as

616
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 1: a trend for all of the super regional banks. On

617
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 1: the conser sumer side, we've attacked that our consumer lending

618
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:08,920
Speaker 1: operations are national, but UH in really direct interaction with

619
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 1: consumers around deposits. We were the first super regional bank

620
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 1: last year to launch a national digital bank called Citizens

621
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:24,959
Speaker 1: Access Online online only focused on savings products. After a year,

622
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 1: we now have five and a half billion of deposits

623
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,799
Speaker 1: UH and so it's been highly successful. And so what

624
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 1: we're thinking about now is we've gotten good at that.

625
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 1: If you say that's a deposit mining operation, we're abul

626
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,760
Speaker 1: tract deposits. But what else can we do for those customers?

627
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 1: And what else can we do for many of the

628
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 1: customers we've now assembled through our lending products who might

629
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 1: be thin relationship customers. They may know us like you

630
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,799
Speaker 1: may know us because your Apple loan is with us.

631
00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: But could I come to you very digitally and offer

632
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 1: some things in a bundle to say, hey, that mortgage

633
00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 1: refinancing do it with us? Or uh, other needs that

634
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: you might have, how to how to manage your your

635
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:07,400
Speaker 1: wealth portfolio. We have digital tools that would allow you

636
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: to do that and be pretty true to how you

637
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:11,960
Speaker 1: do it. So uh, that's kind of the next phase

638
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,880
Speaker 1: for us is we probably don't want to have branches

639
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 1: outside of our traditional footprint, but we can I think

640
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 1: attack the national market digitally. What you're seeing that's very interesting.

641
00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 1: There's a lot of experimentation going on. So the megabanks

642
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:28,560
Speaker 1: like JP, Morgan and ba A are saying we're going

643
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 1: into all these new cities. They're actually not increasing their

644
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 1: branch count, their thinning branches where they're thick and they're

645
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 1: putting them if Chase has a big customer base around

646
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 1: their Sapphire card in a city. Okay, we should have

647
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:43,800
Speaker 1: branches there too, so we can do more with those customers.

648
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 1: You've seen some super regional competitors like PNC. They now

649
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 1: have a digital bank up and running, and they're putting

650
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: thin offices. They've got three in Kansas City, they're putting

651
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,839
Speaker 1: ten or twelve in Dallas, and so everybody's attacking this

652
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,879
Speaker 1: a little differently. We want to get our brand out there.

653
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 1: We want to be more national in scope. Do we

654
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:03,760
Speaker 1: need the branches or do we not need the branches.

655
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 1: That's one of the key questions that will kind of

656
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 1: in the peatree dish right now, we'll see how it

657
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 1: plays out. You mentioned super regionals. We seem to go

658
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:16,440
Speaker 1: through these cycles where suddenly the majors are acquiring super

659
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 1: regionals left and right, and then we enter a lull

660
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 1: for a couple of years. What do you see? I know,

661
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: I obviously can ask you about your bank, but in general,

662
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:28,919
Speaker 1: looking at the industry, what do you see for the

663
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 1: m and a um landscape for the mega banks and

664
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,759
Speaker 1: the superregionals. Are we done with rolling up for now

665
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:38,239
Speaker 1: or how does that change? I think I think the

666
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: mega banks, most of them are at the deposit cap,

667
00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:43,400
Speaker 1: the national deposit cap, so they're really not players that

668
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: can't play. You did see in the superregional space murder

669
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 1: of equal between bb and T and sun Trust, which

670
00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 1: I think was fairly unique. It created a Southeast champion

671
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,800
Speaker 1: uh and I don't think the other superregionals feel compelled

672
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:00,839
Speaker 1: to act in the wake of that. I think right

673
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,880
Speaker 1: now there's so much change taking place in kind of

674
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:07,720
Speaker 1: moving your technology ecosystem to the future, that a merger

675
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:10,200
Speaker 1: could be a distraction. So if we can be flexible

676
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:12,400
Speaker 1: and nimble and good and make the right decisions, I

677
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 1: think we can still compete effectively at our size. So

678
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 1: I'm not sure you'll see much more in the super

679
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: regional space this year. But I think the smaller banks,

680
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: who really have to contend with all of the cost

681
00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 1: of that new technology and some of the costs of regulation,

682
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,040
Speaker 1: even though the regulators are trying to give them cut

683
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 1: them a little slack. I think there's an impetus to

684
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:36,359
Speaker 1: see the smaller end of the market continue to consolidate.

685
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,160
Speaker 1: We had an issue post crisis, or at least compared

686
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:44,200
Speaker 1: to pre crisis, a lot more mega banks a lot

687
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:48,960
Speaker 1: less competition, more of the national assets held by fewer banks.

688
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 1: Is that an attempt to sort of resolve that issue?

689
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:55,320
Speaker 1: Or or am I reaching too much here? Yeah? I

690
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:57,480
Speaker 1: think you're reaching a bit. I think if you just

691
00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 1: look at the trend. Twenty years ago, there were fourteen

692
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,160
Speaker 1: hous and depository institutions in the US. Five years ago

693
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 1: it was seven. Today it's like five, and so you're

694
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:11,359
Speaker 1: just seeing that inevitable consolidation because we still have, I think,

695
00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:16,239
Speaker 1: much more fractured banking landscape than any other country. We

696
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: have been speaking with Bruce van Son. He is CEO

697
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:23,680
Speaker 1: of Citizens Financial Group. If you enjoyed this conversation, we'll

698
00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: be sure and come back for the podcast extras, where

699
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,640
Speaker 1: we keep the tape rolling and continue discussing all things

700
00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:34,120
Speaker 1: banking related. You can find that wherever your finer podcasts

701
00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:39,200
Speaker 1: are sold iTunes, Google, Stitcher, Spotify. We love your comments,

702
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 1: feedback in suggestions right to us at m IB podcast

703
00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:46,280
Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot net. Give us a review on Apple iTunes.

704
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:49,480
Speaker 1: Be sure to check out my weekly column on Bloomberg

705
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,560
Speaker 1: dot com. Sign up for my daily reads at Ridholts

706
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 1: dot com. I'm Barry Ridholts you're listening to Masters in

707
00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: Business on Bloomberg Radio. Welcome to the podcast. Bruce, Thank

708
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 1: you so much for doing this. I um, it's always

709
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:08,640
Speaker 1: funny when I see different names. I have this pet

710
00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 1: theory that there are thousands and thousands and thousands of

711
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 1: people working who have a giant impact on everybody's day

712
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 1: to day life, and nobody knows who they are. Everybody

713
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: knows who Steve Jobs was not, everybody knows who Bruce

714
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,879
Speaker 1: van so On is. And yet you're impacting what what

715
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 1: people do. So I was I was looking forward to this.

716
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: There were a couple of questions I did not get

717
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 1: to that. I'm going to try and run through now

718
00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: and then we'll we'll do our favorite questions and we'll

719
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,080
Speaker 1: get you over to TV on time. UM. Oh, so

720
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:48,839
Speaker 1: you guys went public in I've, I've. We have all

721
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:51,640
Speaker 1: heard lots of folks complain about the I P O

722
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 1: process and how difficult it is being a public company.

723
00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:58,759
Speaker 1: How does that square up with your experiences running a

724
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: private company and then taking it public. Yeah, so you know,

725
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:08,440
Speaker 1: I actually, um, I think it's been very positive for citizens.

726
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 1: Part of it is where we came from. Uh, we

727
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 1: had to turn around the bank and so having UH

728
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 1: an interested investor community and twenty two cell side analysts

729
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,759
Speaker 1: focused on us and prodding on our long term strategy

730
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,640
Speaker 1: and putting estimates as to how fast we could turn

731
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,880
Speaker 1: around the bank. UH. It's certainly raised the level of

732
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: accountability and I think our ability to execute improved. UM.

733
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,720
Speaker 1: You know, when I when I think about the trade offs,

734
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:42,840
Speaker 1: people say, well, private companies can can quote unquote go

735
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:45,400
Speaker 1: long they can think long term and make the investments

736
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 1: for the long term, and they're not kind of hemmed

737
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 1: in by the need to deliver quarterly results. UM. I

738
00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:56,360
Speaker 1: actually think that if you communicate effectively what you're trying

739
00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:59,279
Speaker 1: to do for the long term, and you say I'm

740
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 1: gonna need to invest some money in this and this

741
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:03,800
Speaker 1: is why I'm doing it, and this is how fast

742
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:06,839
Speaker 1: I think I'll get the payback, there are long term

743
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:10,760
Speaker 1: investors out there who who appreciate that, who want to

744
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:13,440
Speaker 1: invest with a growth story with the management team that's

745
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 1: trying to grow the franchise and not just really focus

746
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 1: on cost cut and the delivering for the next quarter

747
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:23,640
Speaker 1: and buying back shares. And so we've tried to balance that.

748
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 1: We've tried to make sure that we're executing well and

749
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 1: putting points on the board and showing a good trajectory

750
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 1: in the short term. But we're also doing significant reinvesting

751
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:35,719
Speaker 1: UH and trying to grow the bank so that we

752
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:38,399
Speaker 1: make it stronger five years from now and ten years

753
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:43,919
Speaker 1: from now. So all the complaints about how um onerous

754
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 1: being a public company is and the threats from activist investors,

755
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:51,839
Speaker 1: is that all overstated? Or what do you think? Look

756
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 1: if you if you run the company well and you

757
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:58,920
Speaker 1: actually think through an activist agenda, Like what am I

758
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 1: missing in terms of my own plans? Are there? If

759
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 1: an activist was involved in this company, what would they do?

760
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 1: Would they take capital away from these lending portfolios and

761
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 1: move it to this lending portfolio? Actually, you can proactively

762
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:17,520
Speaker 1: anticipate where they would where they would make suggestions, and

763
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 1: just get ahead of it. And and you know, it's

764
00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:23,319
Speaker 1: helpful to to kind of keep that mindset. It insulates

765
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 1: you from attack if you're beating them to the punch. Yeah. Interesting,

766
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:33,160
Speaker 1: I mentioned you're on the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston

767
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 1: as well as the board of directors at Moody's. There

768
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,400
Speaker 1: were two other things I want to mention because I

769
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: think they're both interesting. You're a board member for the

770
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 1: Bank Policy Institute. What does the bank policies to do?

771
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: What are you? What is your involvement? Uh, tell us

772
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:51,760
Speaker 1: a little bit about that institution. So the Bank Policy

773
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 1: Institute is a relatively new creation with a long history

774
00:43:57,120 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 1: and legacy organization before it, which was originally the Banker's

775
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,799
Speaker 1: Round Table, which became the Financial Services Round Table. I think, Uh,

776
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:09,680
Speaker 1: what's the correlation between this and the fincial. So now

777
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 1: bp I has effectively succeeded the Financial Services Round Table,

778
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 1: And I think there was a desire at one point

779
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 1: to put different industry groups in financial institutions under one roof.

780
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 1: So when it was the Banker's Roundtable, it was just bankers.

781
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: Then it was financial services and so asset managers and

782
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 1: insurers all got together and we would have meetings and interact,

783
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:36,400
Speaker 1: you know, on policy and talk to folks down on

784
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:38,400
Speaker 1: the hill. A lot of the meetings would be in Washington.

785
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 1: But you know, over time, I think the agendas of

786
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:47,360
Speaker 1: the different subsectors were different. So under Brian moynihan's leadership,

787
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:50,360
Speaker 1: who runs b of A, was determined that the banks

788
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:53,399
Speaker 1: should split off and keep a kind of larger bank

789
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:57,840
Speaker 1: profile minimums asset size twenty five billion would throw into

790
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:02,240
Speaker 1: this Bank Policy Institute H and effectively work on policy

791
00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:04,920
Speaker 1: matters and things that impact the economy and have an

792
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,359
Speaker 1: ability to you know, effectively operate like a think tank,

793
00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:11,319
Speaker 1: put out papers and monitor what the FETE is doing,

794
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 1: and respond to request for proposals from the regulatory agencies,

795
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 1: and have an ongoing dialogue with members of Congress. So

796
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 1: they were informed on financial issues that impact the real economy.

797
00:45:22,840 --> 00:45:26,240
Speaker 1: Quite interesting. And then you are also a board member

798
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,440
Speaker 1: of the Partnership for Rhode Island and Jobs from Massachusetts.

799
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: What are these two groups do well? Those are efforts

800
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:37,759
Speaker 1: to stimulate the local economy and get business people to

801
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 1: work together to help the governors of those uh states. UH,

802
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:46,719
Speaker 1: you know drive pro business and and pro growth and

803
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:51,080
Speaker 1: pro jobs agendas. UH. And so the one that uh

804
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:55,120
Speaker 1: uh we've had some really good traction, in particular with

805
00:45:55,160 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 1: Partnership for Rhode Island, where we've focused on education UH

806
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:06,319
Speaker 1: and and uh also business attraction and transportation, which are

807
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:10,640
Speaker 1: important to improving the Rhode Island economy. UH. One thing

808
00:46:10,680 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: we did recently is we funded the Johns Hopkins Review

809
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:16,880
Speaker 1: of the Providence school system, which I don't know if

810
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:19,000
Speaker 1: you've seen that. It caught a lot of national press,

811
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,680
Speaker 1: but basically was pretty damning of the state of the

812
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 1: school system. And uh, now can you say that in

813
00:46:26,040 --> 00:46:30,080
Speaker 1: pretty much any school system, but some are better. This

814
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 1: was this was really kind of pretty low down the

815
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:35,880
Speaker 1: totem pole and there needs to be changed. And so

816
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 1: the state's going to take over the administration of that

817
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 1: school district and I think make the changes that will

818
00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: make sure those kids in that community really have a

819
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:47,960
Speaker 1: chance to prosper when they come of age and are

820
00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:52,040
Speaker 1: entering the job market. So, uh, those things feel good. Um,

821
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 1: you know, working in collaboration with governors and with the

822
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 1: government to to you know, bring business, uh influence and

823
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,440
Speaker 1: money behind things that are going to improve local economies.

824
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: One of the things I've noticed with some of the

825
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:11,080
Speaker 1: business development groups has been a sort of and we

826
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:14,120
Speaker 1: saw a little bit of this with the Amazon headquarter

827
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:19,319
Speaker 1: bake off, but we've seen this sort of tendency to

828
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: give the store away in order to attract specific companies

829
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:28,400
Speaker 1: as opposed to just creating an environment that is helpful

830
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,359
Speaker 1: and easy to operate in for businesses. What do you

831
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,400
Speaker 1: think of those It's almost like a race to the bottom.

832
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:38,680
Speaker 1: Ester a big proponent of that. And uh, you know,

833
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 1: we had an opportunity. Um. A couple of years ago,

834
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:45,600
Speaker 1: we had a fork in the road. We had a

835
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:50,880
Speaker 1: very large least facility in the Greater Providence area and

836
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:56,720
Speaker 1: a couple other smaller leases. That meant people were uh

837
00:47:56,760 --> 00:47:58,760
Speaker 1: you know, kind of going to roll off their current

838
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:02,200
Speaker 1: occupancy and we can either renew or do something different.

839
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 1: We decided to break ground and build our own campus

840
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:08,279
Speaker 1: in a town called Johnston, Rhode Island, which is a

841
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:13,160
Speaker 1: little west of Providence. We've got people there, four square

842
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:17,879
Speaker 1: feet uh beautiful campus with sports fields that we share

843
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:21,200
Speaker 1: with the local community, walking trails through the woods. Uh.

844
00:48:21,239 --> 00:48:23,920
Speaker 1: And we didn't take any funding. We didn't try to

845
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 1: hold up Rhode Island and say I want you to

846
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:29,200
Speaker 1: compete against Massachusetts. We just said, this is where we

847
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 1: want to be, this is where our history has had us,

848
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 1: and we have a great uh colleague base here. Uh.

849
00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:38,560
Speaker 1: And so you know that I think the government was

850
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 1: helpful in getting things we needed, like an exit ramp

851
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 1: off of the highway into our campus, for example. So

852
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 1: the work isn't that what the state or the local

853
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:50,320
Speaker 1: city is supposed to be doing as opposed to tax

854
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:52,920
Speaker 1: give away right, so that we we split the cost

855
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:55,000
Speaker 1: with the state, so we paid half and they paid

856
00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 1: half for that exit ramp for example. And you know

857
00:48:57,600 --> 00:49:00,560
Speaker 1: some of the some of the locals are alreadis put

858
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:03,040
Speaker 1: sewer lines in and on an expedited basis so we

859
00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:05,759
Speaker 1: could get the campus up and running. So uh yeah,

860
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 1: I think it was it was the right thing to do,

861
00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:10,279
Speaker 1: and we didn't have our hand out. I have some

862
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:13,920
Speaker 1: NFL team owners I'd like to introduce you to. Maybe

863
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:18,279
Speaker 1: you convince them to stop being socialists and actually embrace capitalism.

864
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 1: You own a football team, build your own damn stadium.

865
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:24,319
Speaker 1: I know that doesn't win me any friends, but it

866
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:28,040
Speaker 1: just seems like a reasonable thing to do. Um. I

867
00:49:28,120 --> 00:49:32,080
Speaker 1: just was reading, uh the Cleveland Cavaliers. Their stadium needs

868
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,799
Speaker 1: an upgrade, and they're asking the taxpayers to pay a

869
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:39,760
Speaker 1: couple hundred million dollars. You're a billionaire, fix your own stadium.

870
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:43,600
Speaker 1: Leave us out of it it. Uh. I can't. Obviously,

871
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:45,880
Speaker 1: I'm not going to talk about anything in Boston sports

872
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 1: as a New Yorker. I I just don't even want

873
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:52,120
Speaker 1: to go there. Um. Let's see if there's any other

874
00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 1: questions I missed that I wanted to get to. We

875
00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:58,600
Speaker 1: talked about that. We talked about that, all right, So

876
00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:03,840
Speaker 1: let's jump to our favorite questions that we ask our guests.

877
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:06,279
Speaker 1: These are the ten questions that are supposed to be

878
00:50:06,680 --> 00:50:09,600
Speaker 1: revealing of who you are and how you got that way.

879
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:11,919
Speaker 1: Tell us the first car you ever own, year making

880
00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:20,799
Speaker 1: model uh Ford Mustang to four. I was still a

881
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:23,920
Speaker 1: year away from my license, but I had worked summer

882
00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 1: jobs and my dad said, I'll pay two thousand dollars

883
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:29,320
Speaker 1: to any car. You've got to come up with a difference.

884
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: We paid for that car, and so when I got

885
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,319
Speaker 1: my license, I was driving a brand new car. So wait,

886
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: you bought that car before you actually had it was

887
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: the model year was letting out or something, so my

888
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 1: father thought he could get a deal on it. So

889
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 1: but I pick it up at the end of the year,

890
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:47,759
Speaker 1: had from working summer jobs, so I put up my

891
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:53,040
Speaker 1: share that that's great. Um, what's the most important thing

892
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 1: people don't know about? Bruce Van so on? Um, I

893
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:03,240
Speaker 1: you know, one of my early jobs was as a landscaper,

894
00:51:03,600 --> 00:51:06,800
Speaker 1: summer jobs to make that money for the car. Uh

895
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,399
Speaker 1: and I still love to garden to this day. So

896
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:14,400
Speaker 1: I take great pride in designing a nice landscape and

897
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:17,880
Speaker 1: then maintaining it. Uh. Tell us about your early mentors

898
00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 1: who helped guide your career well? Um, I I always

899
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:24,920
Speaker 1: mentioned my parents because I think they gave me a

900
00:51:24,960 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 1: great foundation and moral compass. But uh, you know, as

901
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:33,520
Speaker 1: you as you grow up, it's your teachers and favorite

902
00:51:33,520 --> 00:51:36,239
Speaker 1: sports coaches and so that all goes into making you

903
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:38,719
Speaker 1: who you are. Uh. And then I had some great

904
00:51:38,719 --> 00:51:41,800
Speaker 1: people that I worked for. UM. I had a fellow

905
00:51:41,840 --> 00:51:44,439
Speaker 1: at General Mills, my first job out of college, who

906
00:51:44,719 --> 00:51:48,360
Speaker 1: was tall, lanky, athletic guy like me, but really smart.

907
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:50,960
Speaker 1: Had worked at General Motors, learned a lot from him.

908
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:54,560
Speaker 1: He was very decisive, worked for Bruce Wasserstein, one of

909
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:57,960
Speaker 1: the smartest shows on the planet. Uh. He had There

910
00:51:57,960 --> 00:51:59,560
Speaker 1: were a lot of Bruce is ms that I picked

911
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 1: up in a out of wisdom. And so I always

912
00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:05,880
Speaker 1: found that if you want to you know, move ahead

913
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:08,720
Speaker 1: in a career that your you should look for great

914
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 1: people to work for that you can learn from. So

915
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 1: when they're interviewing you, you should also be interviewing them

916
00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:15,600
Speaker 1: to make sure that these are people that really are

917
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 1: going to have an impact on you what about bankers

918
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,360
Speaker 1: that influence the way you look at the business of banking?

919
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:27,879
Speaker 1: Who who affected your uh to bankers that I would

920
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:31,479
Speaker 1: call out? Tom Rennie was my boss at the bank

921
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:34,360
Speaker 1: in New York for many years, and I think Tom

922
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:39,160
Speaker 1: had a had a just great stoicism to to hand

923
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:43,479
Speaker 1: be inflappable under all kinds of scenarios. Um and uh

924
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:47,200
Speaker 1: kind of it's never it's always darkest just before the dawn,

925
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:48,960
Speaker 1: that kind of mentality, it's not as good as you

926
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:51,759
Speaker 1: think it is when it's when it's going really well,

927
00:52:51,800 --> 00:52:54,439
Speaker 1: and just kind of keep that even keel. And then

928
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:57,200
Speaker 1: the second one was Stephen Hester when I worked over

929
00:52:57,239 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 1: at RBS UM who was under a mense pressure to

930
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:07,279
Speaker 1: get RBS righted, but uh just was so unflappable under

931
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 1: all that pressure. Um and again keeping that even keel,

932
00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 1: um and uh just super super smart, really good thoughts

933
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 1: about how to go about that turnaround, which some of

934
00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:20,320
Speaker 1: those things I've I've applied to citizens on a smaller

935
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:23,880
Speaker 1: scale obviously than URBS. What about books? Tell us about

936
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:26,400
Speaker 1: your favorite books. What do you enjoy to read? I

937
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:30,239
Speaker 1: read a wide uh range of books, read a lot

938
00:53:30,239 --> 00:53:33,760
Speaker 1: of business books. Uh, I read uh you know, Tom Clancy,

939
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:37,680
Speaker 1: Harlan Coben, those kind of books. Probably the the book

940
00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:40,080
Speaker 1: that's had the biggest impact me my whole life was

941
00:53:40,120 --> 00:53:43,200
Speaker 1: The Power Positive Thinking by Norman Vincent Peale. Uh So,

942
00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:46,480
Speaker 1: I was a giant that really positive attitude, which I

943
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:49,600
Speaker 1: read probably when I was in my early twenties. Uh So.

944
00:53:49,880 --> 00:53:53,880
Speaker 1: I totally enjoy reading. Unfortunately, I have I have so

945
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 1: much reading to do for work in such an extensive

946
00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:00,200
Speaker 1: seven have work agenda that I don't read as much

947
00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:02,320
Speaker 1: as I could. But I've still probably read a dozen

948
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:04,800
Speaker 1: books a year. I would say, give give us another title,

949
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:07,440
Speaker 1: one other that you really enjoyed. I would, you know,

950
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:12,360
Speaker 1: I just I just read a very interesting book. Um,

951
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:14,360
Speaker 1: I can't I don't remember the title, but it was

952
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 1: about an elephant trainer who basically lead these elephants in

953
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:24,799
Speaker 1: World War two and the kind of Burmese jungle, which

954
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,640
Speaker 1: to me was really fascinating. Let's see if I can

955
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:31,359
Speaker 1: find how Burmese elephants helped defeat Japanese in World War two.

956
00:54:31,760 --> 00:54:36,319
Speaker 1: Elephant Company there is let me get let me see

957
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 1: if I can read the exact name. That's wild by

958
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:46,040
Speaker 1: Vicky Croake. Elephant Company the inspiring story of an unlikely

959
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:48,640
Speaker 1: hero in the animals who helped save him lives in

960
00:54:48,680 --> 00:54:52,279
Speaker 1: World War two. Wow, that's quite quite fascinating. Tell us

961
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:55,040
Speaker 1: about a time you failed and what you learned from

962
00:54:55,040 --> 00:55:00,400
Speaker 1: the experience. But by the way, a thousand nine views,

963
00:55:00,560 --> 00:55:03,319
Speaker 1: five stars, that's pretty that's pretty impressive. That was a

964
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:05,359
Speaker 1: good book. So you might want to put that one

965
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:07,360
Speaker 1: on your list. Yeah, I definitely will um tell us

966
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:09,839
Speaker 1: about a time you failed and what you learned from

967
00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:13,640
Speaker 1: the experience. Uh, you know, I I'd say getting cut

968
00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:16,640
Speaker 1: from a sports team was kind of a big moment

969
00:55:16,719 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: for me. I was a tall sport. Did you play basketball?

970
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:21,360
Speaker 1: I played baseball, basketball, and a little bit of football

971
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,680
Speaker 1: for a couple of years. But I got cut from

972
00:55:23,719 --> 00:55:27,399
Speaker 1: the varsity team as a sophomore in high school. Uh,

973
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:30,239
Speaker 1: and I really I was angry. You went through all

974
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 1: the emotions that go with that. But I picked myself

975
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:35,000
Speaker 1: up and we went A bunch of us went and

976
00:55:35,080 --> 00:55:39,480
Speaker 1: joined a travel basketball team and we played. You know,

977
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:41,520
Speaker 1: we had so much fun. And then we got to

978
00:55:41,520 --> 00:55:44,160
Speaker 1: play the high school team in a kind of just

979
00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 1: a braggadocio game. I'll bet you were better than you

980
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 1: and we beat the high school team when we got

981
00:55:50,040 --> 00:55:53,000
Speaker 1: that's great revenge. That's a little bit of Michael Jordan's

982
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:56,320
Speaker 1: didn't make He was a freshman, he got cut h

983
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:58,880
Speaker 1: and he used it as motivation as well. What do

984
00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:01,080
Speaker 1: you do for fun? What are you still playing hoops

985
00:56:01,160 --> 00:56:03,920
Speaker 1: or no more? Nah, It's it's a little risky at

986
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:08,640
Speaker 1: this stage. But you know I still enjoy sports, so golf, tennis, swimming. Uh.

987
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,759
Speaker 1: Like to go to the beach. Uh. You mentioned your

988
00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 1: sail Yeah. I was a commodore at our at our

989
00:56:14,920 --> 00:56:19,600
Speaker 1: sailing club, so I love the water. Um. And you know,

990
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 1: like good dining, going out, having a good time with

991
00:56:23,600 --> 00:56:27,320
Speaker 1: the family and friends. Um, well you got plenty of

992
00:56:27,400 --> 00:56:31,840
Speaker 1: choices for restaurants restaurants here. Yeah. So in the banking

993
00:56:32,040 --> 00:56:35,640
Speaker 1: industry today, what are you most optimistic about and what

994
00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:41,279
Speaker 1: are you most pessimistic about? Well, I'd say, um, you know,

995
00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:44,320
Speaker 1: when I look at at this country, the US, that

996
00:56:44,320 --> 00:56:47,440
Speaker 1: that we serve, that citizens serves, I think it's the

997
00:56:47,480 --> 00:56:51,000
Speaker 1: greatest country on the planet. Um. And uh, you know,

998
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:54,080
Speaker 1: we have our troubles, we have our challenges, were not perfect,

999
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:58,399
Speaker 1: but over time we've continued just to I think get

1000
00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:01,600
Speaker 1: it right. Uh. And we're we have an innovative society.

1001
00:57:01,640 --> 00:57:03,960
Speaker 1: We've got the big tech companies. We're trying to improve

1002
00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:06,840
Speaker 1: people's lives, and so I just think about how the

1003
00:57:06,920 --> 00:57:09,560
Speaker 1: quality of life in the country is so much better

1004
00:57:09,560 --> 00:57:13,359
Speaker 1: than it was in nineteen fifty nine thousand. Just think

1005
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:16,640
Speaker 1: where it's going to be going forward. So I'm optimistic

1006
00:57:16,680 --> 00:57:20,480
Speaker 1: about that. Um, I'd say the things that I'm disappointed

1007
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:23,760
Speaker 1: in are pessimistic about, is that people don't feel good

1008
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:26,280
Speaker 1: about it. So the flip side of that is, we

1009
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:28,240
Speaker 1: have so much to be thankful for and so much

1010
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 1: to to count our blessings for, but everybody seems to

1011
00:57:31,800 --> 00:57:34,520
Speaker 1: be grumpy and angry and not step back and say, gosh,

1012
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:38,120
Speaker 1: look look what we have. Uh So, anyway, I think

1013
00:57:38,120 --> 00:57:40,960
Speaker 1: we've lost our soul a little bit. We've lost our spirituality,

1014
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:43,560
Speaker 1: which I'd love to see that rejuvenate at some point.

1015
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:47,960
Speaker 1: It does seem that people are a little more divided,

1016
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:51,640
Speaker 1: a little more angry. It's it's some of its social media,

1017
00:57:51,680 --> 00:57:54,120
Speaker 1: but some of it is just you know, this the

1018
00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:58,480
Speaker 1: post crisis state of affairs. People never really fully recovered

1019
00:57:58,480 --> 00:58:01,520
Speaker 1: their optimism after that. It took a long time after

1020
00:58:01,560 --> 00:58:04,280
Speaker 1: the Great Depression before that and A and a world

1021
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:08,240
Speaker 1: war before people seem to resurrect that can do American spirit.

1022
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:12,600
Speaker 1: Um So a millennial or I'm gonna say that again

1023
00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:15,680
Speaker 1: because I have to drop millennial because they're too old now.

1024
00:58:16,640 --> 00:58:20,000
Speaker 1: Ah So, a recent college grad comes to you and

1025
00:58:20,040 --> 00:58:23,400
Speaker 1: says they're interested in banking. What sort of career advice

1026
00:58:23,440 --> 00:58:25,480
Speaker 1: would you give that. I tell them it's a great career,

1027
00:58:25,760 --> 00:58:29,360
Speaker 1: and uh, you know what I love about it? I

1028
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:32,200
Speaker 1: think it's a noble profession. So I tell people, Look,

1029
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:40,160
Speaker 1: you get to positively impact people, individuals, uh, communities, local

1030
00:58:40,200 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 1: economies by what you do in your day job working

1031
00:58:43,600 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 1: as a banker. But then we also have a platform

1032
00:58:47,200 --> 00:58:51,320
Speaker 1: that you can volunteer off that platform and further that

1033
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:55,959
Speaker 1: impact on local communities. And so for example, Citizens Bank,

1034
00:58:56,400 --> 00:58:59,080
Speaker 1: when I joined six years ago, we were volunteering about

1035
00:58:59,080 --> 00:59:02,920
Speaker 1: fifty ours. We really had to focus on upping that

1036
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:05,520
Speaker 1: and today this year we're gonna hit about a hundred

1037
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:10,040
Speaker 1: and fifty thou volunteer hours. We have seven people serving

1038
00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:14,720
Speaker 1: on local boards around our footprint. And so, uh, if

1039
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:18,120
Speaker 1: you want to have a career where you can learn

1040
00:59:18,280 --> 00:59:22,520
Speaker 1: be challenged constantly evolving landscape that you have to contend with,

1041
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:29,320
Speaker 1: but Importantly, you can positively benefit the people that you

1042
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:32,440
Speaker 1: live with and the local communities and economies that you

1043
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:36,800
Speaker 1: live in. Banking is a great career. So normally I

1044
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:39,640
Speaker 1: don't ask follow up questions in this segment, but you

1045
00:59:39,800 --> 00:59:42,880
Speaker 1: just made me think of something. Not too long ago,

1046
00:59:43,000 --> 00:59:49,600
Speaker 1: the Business Round Table change their perspective on UM. The

1047
00:59:49,720 --> 00:59:53,760
Speaker 1: end goal of the corporation is maximizing shareholder profits. They

1048
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:57,760
Speaker 1: now look at it as there are many different constituencs

1049
00:59:58,480 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 1: UM and that that' seems to have been a pretty

1050
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:04,320
Speaker 1: large sea change. What did you think of what? It

1051
01:00:04,400 --> 01:00:07,080
Speaker 1: sounds like you've already adopted that. What did you think

1052
01:00:07,080 --> 01:00:09,520
Speaker 1: of this? Well, if we we, I think it's been

1053
01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 1: a little controversial because ultimately you're working for your shareholders.

1054
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: You know, management is an agent for the shareholders of

1055
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:22,360
Speaker 1: the bank. I think all those uh different stakeholders work together, UM.

1056
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:27,080
Speaker 1: And so you're trying to deliver for customers, for communities, uh,

1057
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:30,400
Speaker 1: for your colleagues, the three c's. If you're regulated, you

1058
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 1: gotta run a business the right way for the regulators.

1059
01:00:33,320 --> 01:00:35,760
Speaker 1: You've got to deliver for the shareholders. You want to

1060
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:38,480
Speaker 1: get that flywheel working. But to me, it comes back

1061
01:00:38,520 --> 01:00:41,720
Speaker 1: to the shareholder. If you're running the bank well, you'll

1062
01:00:41,720 --> 01:00:45,959
Speaker 1: have the resources to keep investing in all the deliverables

1063
01:00:45,960 --> 01:00:49,400
Speaker 1: for those other stakeholders. So I'm you know, I like

1064
01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:52,560
Speaker 1: the concept of broadening it out and making sure that

1065
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:55,120
Speaker 1: people are thinking it's not all about the bottom line.

1066
01:00:55,160 --> 01:00:57,480
Speaker 1: But still I think the shareholder is the one that

1067
01:00:57,600 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 1: you have to please first and foremost. They're the ones

1068
01:01:00,880 --> 01:01:04,040
Speaker 1: with the acts. If if you're not pleasing, you can't

1069
01:01:04,040 --> 01:01:06,680
Speaker 1: go pursue your own agenda and make the other stuff

1070
01:01:06,720 --> 01:01:09,400
Speaker 1: more important and then see the stock not performed well,

1071
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:13,000
Speaker 1: in the bottom line not performed well. It should work together.

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01:01:13,640 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 1: And our final question, what is it that you know

1073
01:01:15,920 --> 01:01:18,680
Speaker 1: about the world of banking today that you wish you

1074
01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:27,320
Speaker 1: might have known thirty years ago? Um I. I think

1075
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:30,520
Speaker 1: it's just a cumulative process where you go through life

1076
01:01:30,520 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 1: and you learn things. UM I don't. I don't have

1077
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:37,000
Speaker 1: any ah ha moments. I just have gained a lot

1078
01:01:37,040 --> 01:01:40,600
Speaker 1: of wisdom by working in different companies. And I think

1079
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:45,240
Speaker 1: you know just that that that banks have a big

1080
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 1: role to play in the economy. They have to be

1081
01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:50,920
Speaker 1: run well in a safe and sound fashion. They have

1082
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:55,600
Speaker 1: to be focused on delivering for customers. Um and you know.

1083
01:01:55,640 --> 01:01:58,160
Speaker 1: I think you've you've come to that knowledge over time.

1084
01:01:58,240 --> 01:02:00,320
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know if there's an aha thing

1085
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:02,920
Speaker 1: that I said, God, I would have run my career

1086
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:05,560
Speaker 1: differently if I knew it back then. I think I've just,

1087
01:02:05,840 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 1: you know, evolved with the changes in the industry, and

1088
01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:11,480
Speaker 1: I think I have a pretty good concept of what

1089
01:02:11,560 --> 01:02:14,400
Speaker 1: banking is all about at this point. Fair enough, Bruce,

1090
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:17,080
Speaker 1: thank you so much for being so generous with your time.

1091
01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:20,080
Speaker 1: We have been speaking with Bruce van so On. He

1092
01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:24,160
Speaker 1: is the chairman and CEO of Citizens Financial Group. If

1093
01:02:24,200 --> 01:02:27,040
Speaker 1: you enjoyed this conversation, well look up an intri down

1094
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:29,800
Speaker 1: an inch on Apple iTunes and you could see any

1095
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,919
Speaker 1: of the previous two hundred and seventy five or so

1096
01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:35,840
Speaker 1: such conversations that we've had over the past five and

1097
01:02:35,840 --> 01:02:40,360
Speaker 1: a half years. We love your comments, feedback and suggestions

1098
01:02:40,640 --> 01:02:44,439
Speaker 1: right to us at m IB podcast at Bloomberg dot net.

1099
01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,480
Speaker 1: Be sure and give us a lovely review on Apple iTunes.

1100
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:50,240
Speaker 1: I would be remiss if I did not mention the

1101
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:54,040
Speaker 1: crack staff that helps put together these conversations each week.

1102
01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:59,440
Speaker 1: Karen O'Brien is my audio engineer. Michael Boyle is my

1103
01:02:59,560 --> 01:03:03,040
Speaker 1: produce your slash booker. Michael Batnick is my head of research.

1104
01:03:03,400 --> 01:03:06,640
Speaker 1: I'm Barry Retolts. You've been listening to Masters in Business

1105
01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:13,640
Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. H