1
00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:06,960
Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two Podcasts with Evan

2
00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:08,680
Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex Barth.

3
00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:13,200
Speaker 2: And Lazarre. Hello, everybody nailed it? Joined us always buy

4
00:00:13,360 --> 00:00:14,120
Speaker 2: our bark.

5
00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:20,560
Speaker 1: Here is Evan Lazar and Alex bars Do you know

6
00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:22,239
Speaker 1: how many wide receivers are currently projected to go in

7
00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:24,040
Speaker 1: the first round? You don't need to say them, no,

8
00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:26,040
Speaker 1: but you met the number to point.

9
00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:30,800
Speaker 2: We gotta move on eight. We got to move on that.

10
00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:34,000
Speaker 2: That that's that should just be the show tagline Marine

11
00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,160
Speaker 2: is just we've been ranting about this for forty five minutes.

12
00:00:37,200 --> 00:00:39,319
Speaker 2: We got to move on, all right, we gotta move on.

13
00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:44,240
Speaker 2: Evan Lazar, Alex Barth, Patriots Catch twenty two. Uh, Alex

14
00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:46,879
Speaker 2: is catching up on a on a bombshell here from

15
00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:49,680
Speaker 2: the Herald that just came out from Andrew Callahan and

16
00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:53,080
Speaker 2: Doug Kayde over there about the Patriots offense and things

17
00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:56,560
Speaker 2: like that. If you've read it, if you've seen it,

18
00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:58,760
Speaker 2: we'll talk about it maybe a little bit here if

19
00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:01,160
Speaker 2: you want to call in and ask about it. I

20
00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:02,960
Speaker 2: understand that this is going to be a pretty big,

21
00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:05,920
Speaker 2: big story here today, but I think some of the

22
00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,600
Speaker 2: things that were written for people that didn't read the

23
00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:10,880
Speaker 2: article just really quickly, because this is just top of

24
00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:14,520
Speaker 2: mind for me right now. Alex, Yeah, I think some

25
00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:17,839
Speaker 2: of the bigger things that came out of this Herald article,

26
00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:22,320
Speaker 2: And remember Andrew and Karen Grigian wrote a very similar

27
00:01:22,440 --> 00:01:25,760
Speaker 2: piece last year, just kind of an autopsy of the

28
00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:29,360
Speaker 2: Patriots offense and what went wrong with Matt Patricia and

29
00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:32,040
Speaker 2: Joe Judge, and so this is kind of a similar idea.

30
00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:35,160
Speaker 2: I think the biggest thing that came out of it

31
00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:40,080
Speaker 2: is the handling of the offensive coaching staff by Bill

32
00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:44,520
Speaker 2: Belichick and Bill O'Brien. And one of the biggest points

33
00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:47,039
Speaker 2: I think that's made in there is that Bill O'Brien

34
00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:50,360
Speaker 2: wanted to basically clean house on the offensive side of

35
00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:53,800
Speaker 2: the ball and build his entire new own staff on that.

36
00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:55,840
Speaker 1: Side, which is something we talked about at the time.

37
00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:58,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they didn't do that. They kind of have

38
00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:04,559
Speaker 2: this this you know, combination of old coaches that were

39
00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:07,920
Speaker 2: holdover coaches like a Troy Brown and a Vinnie sincereri

40
00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:13,600
Speaker 2: one O'Brien higher and in Will Lawing the tight ends

41
00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:16,240
Speaker 2: coach Evan Rosstin's kind of in the middle, right, he

42
00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:18,959
Speaker 2: was a Patricia guy originally and then kind of stage,

43
00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:21,640
Speaker 2: so I guess he's technically a holdover coach as well.

44
00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:24,919
Speaker 2: And then of course the hiring of Adrian Clem. And

45
00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:29,560
Speaker 2: I've been very sensitive about the Adrian Clem situation because

46
00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:33,440
Speaker 2: it's his absence has been deemed by the teams as

47
00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:36,800
Speaker 2: health related and you don't want to touch that, like

48
00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:40,160
Speaker 2: you just don't know what that means, right, it's very vague. Obviously,

49
00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,480
Speaker 2: messing with people's health is you don't want to come

50
00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:45,919
Speaker 2: in here and say that that it's anything that.

51
00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:48,000
Speaker 1: You don't know, Like, these guys are competitors. I'm sure

52
00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:49,800
Speaker 1: if he'd be if he could be here, he'd be here.

53
00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:51,760
Speaker 1: And the fact he's not here tells you it's probably

54
00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,160
Speaker 1: something pretty serious. And you can't like things happen. You

55
00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,440
Speaker 1: can't fault the guy for that, right, But it's it's

56
00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:58,600
Speaker 1: the bigger picture thing. And to your point, you know,

57
00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:01,280
Speaker 1: Callahan rights that Bill wanted to keep going with last

58
00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:02,919
Speaker 1: year's staff. He didn't want to make any changes. He

59
00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:05,280
Speaker 1: wanted to keep Matt Patricia. And when you talk about

60
00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:09,000
Speaker 1: what that looked like for a guy, and we'll probably

61
00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:10,600
Speaker 1: talk about it today Evan a little bit, and we'll

62
00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:12,919
Speaker 1: talk about a lot in the coming weeks that here

63
00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,480
Speaker 1: we are again, you know, three hundred probably fifty days

64
00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:18,480
Speaker 1: since the last time Andrew Callahan wrote one of these.

65
00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:22,440
Speaker 1: There needs to be major overhaul. And we spent a

66
00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:25,480
Speaker 1: lot of time talking last week about is there a

67
00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:28,160
Speaker 1: path for Bill to stay if he's willing to be

68
00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:30,720
Speaker 1: flexible and he's willing to change his approach and change

69
00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:33,960
Speaker 1: some of his philosophies. The fact that last year he

70
00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:36,840
Speaker 1: didn't even think he needed to change his offensive coordinator,

71
00:03:37,200 --> 00:03:38,119
Speaker 1: I then tells you a lot.

72
00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,560
Speaker 2: I would push back on that part of the story

73
00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:44,160
Speaker 2: a little bit. I don't necessarily think that that is

74
00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:48,640
Speaker 2: entirely true personally. I'm just I'm not trying to attack

75
00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:51,840
Speaker 2: Andrew A Doug. They do great job, they do good reporting.

76
00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:55,760
Speaker 2: I'm just telling you I don't think that it's entirely

77
00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:57,880
Speaker 2: true that they thought that, oh, we're just going to

78
00:03:57,960 --> 00:03:59,920
Speaker 2: run this back on the offensive side of the ball.

79
00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:01,840
Speaker 1: I'm not saying they wouldn't make changes. But do you

80
00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:03,560
Speaker 1: think it's true that he wanted to give Matt Patricia

81
00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:05,680
Speaker 1: another shot?

82
00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,760
Speaker 2: Because I do No, I don't, Okay, I don't I

83
00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:16,000
Speaker 2: think that it's true that maybe he wanted didn't necessarily

84
00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:19,520
Speaker 2: feel like they needed Bill O'Brien right and like a

85
00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:23,280
Speaker 2: completely new start on that side of the ball. But

86
00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:26,480
Speaker 2: I don't think that they thought that they were coached

87
00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:27,880
Speaker 2: well on offense last year.

88
00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:33,000
Speaker 1: No, Okay, so you think not O'Brien, not Patricia.

89
00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:36,160
Speaker 2: I just don't. I can't sit here and tell you

90
00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,280
Speaker 2: that they definitely were, and like Bill was cool with

91
00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,440
Speaker 2: get with basically firing Matt Patricia, you know, and he

92
00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:44,840
Speaker 2: goes to Philadelphia and it's over right. Like I I

93
00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:47,960
Speaker 2: don't know about if they would go that far with it,

94
00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:50,359
Speaker 2: but I I don't think that they looked at the

95
00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:51,680
Speaker 2: end of I.

96
00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:53,919
Speaker 1: Just they clearly thought it wasn't that bad. As my point,

97
00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:57,320
Speaker 1: they I guess I pushed back on that a little. Okay,

98
00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:00,320
Speaker 1: I think they knew it was bad. Well, I'm saying,

99
00:05:00,360 --> 00:05:01,920
Speaker 1: like Bill, I think other people knew was that bad?

100
00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,120
Speaker 2: Now, I think Bill knew it was Bill too. But

101
00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:07,400
Speaker 2: I just the biggest thing to me out of all

102
00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,840
Speaker 2: of this is the handling of the coaching staff and

103
00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:13,560
Speaker 2: how this all went about. Obviously they've mentioned a lot

104
00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:17,159
Speaker 2: of things with the personnel as well, but in terms

105
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:19,720
Speaker 2: of the coaching staff, for a second, this is something

106
00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:24,120
Speaker 2: that I've been on for a while, Adrian Clem and

107
00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:28,039
Speaker 2: that higher and how they've handled the offensive line, and

108
00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,040
Speaker 2: then also how they've handled the wide receivers are two

109
00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:34,080
Speaker 2: big time question marks about this coaching staff that I've

110
00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,039
Speaker 2: had for a couple of years now. Their offensive line

111
00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:39,840
Speaker 2: has been poorly coached. Since Carmen Brisilla left with Josh

112
00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:42,960
Speaker 2: McDaniels to Las Vegas, right like, they have not been

113
00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,640
Speaker 2: a well coached offensive line. They continue to be a

114
00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:49,600
Speaker 2: poorly coached offensive line. Just things like line movement by

115
00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:52,440
Speaker 2: the defense, you know, stunts, picks, things like that up front.

116
00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:55,520
Speaker 2: They don't pick them up well, they don't diagnose them well,

117
00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:58,719
Speaker 2: they don't communicate them well. They don't have good eyes,

118
00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,960
Speaker 2: active eyes where they're seeing things post snap. They don't

119
00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,920
Speaker 2: pass it off well on the interior, especially And we're

120
00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:06,760
Speaker 2: gonna get the three up, three down in a second.

121
00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:11,360
Speaker 2: But I had eleven quarterback pressures coming up the middle

122
00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:13,320
Speaker 2: of the pocket in this game, right Like, they just

123
00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,839
Speaker 2: don't handle those things well. And I get that there's

124
00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:18,680
Speaker 2: young players in there, but those young players, you know,

125
00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:21,320
Speaker 2: a guy like City So, a guy like Antonio Maffi,

126
00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:23,840
Speaker 2: those guys have been playing a little bit now, right,

127
00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,600
Speaker 2: So over time you would expect that stuff to get

128
00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:31,920
Speaker 2: a little bit better, and it just it hasn't. And receiver,

129
00:06:32,520 --> 00:06:34,760
Speaker 2: I think we've been on receiver, you know, coaching for

130
00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,480
Speaker 2: receivers since before I even started here. Yeah, Like, the

131
00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,680
Speaker 2: bottom line is is that we all love Troy Brown

132
00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:45,200
Speaker 2: as a Patriot. He's an all time great Patriot, red jacket,

133
00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:47,919
Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff. I'm sure that there's a

134
00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:51,120
Speaker 2: lot of loyalty from Bill Belichick's side in terms of

135
00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,200
Speaker 2: Troy Brown and because of what he did as a

136
00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:56,120
Speaker 2: player and all that kind of stuff. And there's no

137
00:06:56,240 --> 00:07:00,600
Speaker 2: doubt that that complicates things when you have a guy

138
00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:03,920
Speaker 2: that was a really, really good player for you, a

139
00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,719
Speaker 2: really good soldier for you for twenty years and now

140
00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:09,760
Speaker 2: he's not doing his job well enough to retain it.

141
00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:12,360
Speaker 2: But the point is is that they have been a

142
00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:16,520
Speaker 2: poorly coached group at receiver for multiple years now as well.

143
00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:19,440
Speaker 2: They have not developed many guys, especially guys at the

144
00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:22,200
Speaker 2: top of the draft, you know, a Nikhil Harry, a

145
00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,000
Speaker 2: Taekwon Thorton. You can sit here and say that those

146
00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,160
Speaker 2: guys just don't have talent and they were never going

147
00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:29,360
Speaker 2: to be good and maybe there's some truth to that

148
00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,120
Speaker 2: in terms of the evaluation of the players in the draft,

149
00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:34,800
Speaker 2: but the bottom line is is that they've gotten absolutely

150
00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:37,280
Speaker 2: nothing out of Taekwon Thorton, who's a guy that does

151
00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,120
Speaker 2: have some skill. He has flaws as a player that

152
00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:42,360
Speaker 2: we knew, but he's got speed and he's got an

153
00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:47,040
Speaker 2: ability to stretch the field, and his details have not developed.

154
00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:49,600
Speaker 2: His ability at the top of the route, his you know,

155
00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,440
Speaker 2: ability to adjust routes on the fly, like those types

156
00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:54,680
Speaker 2: of things have not developed. And then you also just

157
00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:59,720
Speaker 2: look at spacing and route conversions and technique and all

158
00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:02,560
Speaker 2: that stuff. It just hasn't been good enough at that position.

159
00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:05,480
Speaker 2: So I think one of the frustrating things, and we

160
00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:07,920
Speaker 2: can talk about it, I'm sure we will, like if

161
00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:11,800
Speaker 2: Bill O'Brien deserves blame and Bill O'Brien deserves to retain

162
00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:15,520
Speaker 2: his job as offensive coordinator moving forward, But it's almost

163
00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,559
Speaker 2: like into some of the things that we've talked about

164
00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,960
Speaker 2: with Mac or with the quarterbacks, like you can't expect

165
00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:25,960
Speaker 2: Bill O'Brien to fix everything when he's saddled with coaches

166
00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:27,360
Speaker 2: that aren't good at.

167
00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,720
Speaker 1: Their jobs and in turn players who can't do what

168
00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:31,960
Speaker 1: needs to be done to Turner.

169
00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:35,480
Speaker 2: Right, and so like you have, I think this was

170
00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,360
Speaker 2: a big problem that was probably under talked about until

171
00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:41,359
Speaker 2: right now. So I give the Harold credit for uncovering

172
00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:46,080
Speaker 2: all this. Bill O'Brien should have been given more power

173
00:08:46,120 --> 00:08:49,000
Speaker 2: to hire his own guys on the offensive staff, and

174
00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:52,800
Speaker 2: some of these guys, like at Troy Brown, there's a

175
00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:56,120
Speaker 2: rightful reason to think that that guy is not doing

176
00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:57,839
Speaker 2: a great a good job, like this has been a

177
00:08:57,880 --> 00:08:59,880
Speaker 2: couple of years now, and you don't have to fire

178
00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,319
Speaker 2: Troy Brown. You just simply move him back to returners, right,

179
00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:06,600
Speaker 2: like you're now a returners coach or a special teams coach.

180
00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:08,440
Speaker 1: Or honestly, slot receivers coach.

181
00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe slot receivers coach. Yeah, I mean he's done

182
00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:12,560
Speaker 2: okay with like a guy like Jacobe.

183
00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:15,079
Speaker 1: You saw the Kobe pop Douglas. Looks like they've done

184
00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:18,319
Speaker 1: stuff like that before, like an inside linebackers coach and

185
00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:20,960
Speaker 1: outside linebackers coach. They don't need more. They did at

186
00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:23,080
Speaker 1: one point that was Steven Gerard. We're split now they're

187
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:26,000
Speaker 1: along that right now. They're both linebackers coaches. But slot

188
00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,560
Speaker 1: receivers coach fine, yeah, like but yeah, you're right in

189
00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:31,320
Speaker 1: that regards something needs to be different, all right.

190
00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:34,080
Speaker 2: So you know, it was just we were talking about

191
00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:35,560
Speaker 2: it before the show start. I know a lot of

192
00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:38,280
Speaker 2: people probably haven't even read it, so I'll let you

193
00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:40,080
Speaker 2: guys catch up on that. But I just I thought

194
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,080
Speaker 2: those were some of the interesting things to me, were

195
00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,079
Speaker 2: just about the handling of the offensive staff and how

196
00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,840
Speaker 2: there was I think we could probably conjecture that there

197
00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:53,000
Speaker 2: was a divide between O'Brien and Belichick a little bit

198
00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:56,360
Speaker 2: that I'm sure O'Brien wanted to hire more of his guys, right,

199
00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,160
Speaker 2: And I think didn't you go back to something I

200
00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:00,839
Speaker 2: don't remember if we talk about in the offseason, but

201
00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:02,720
Speaker 2: I remember talking about it with Felgrin Maz about the

202
00:10:02,760 --> 00:10:05,400
Speaker 2: Patriots needing essentially a head coach of the offense, not

203
00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,840
Speaker 2: an offensive coordinator, but a head coach of the offense.

204
00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:10,120
Speaker 2: And the idea was Bill O'Brien was going to be

205
00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:12,800
Speaker 2: a guy that had the cachet, had the experience to

206
00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,120
Speaker 2: have that kind of autonomy, and he still just didn't

207
00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:17,960
Speaker 2: get it. Yeah, yeah, I think that's that's fair. And

208
00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:20,440
Speaker 2: I look at this Adrian Clem situation, and now that

209
00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:22,560
Speaker 2: it's unearthed. I think, you know, I can kind of

210
00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,679
Speaker 2: tell you that. You know, I've been telling you not

211
00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:27,959
Speaker 2: to like toot my own horn, but I've just been

212
00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:30,120
Speaker 2: saying to you off the air a little bit, Alex

213
00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,800
Speaker 2: about James Farrence's role in all of this type of stuff,

214
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:37,520
Speaker 2: and how James Ferrence is basically elevated to like assistant

215
00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,440
Speaker 2: offensive line coach. And of course he has like his yeah,

216
00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,040
Speaker 2: you know, family is all coaches. His dad, his brother,

217
00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:45,000
Speaker 2: you know, stuff like that, so he's got it in

218
00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:48,840
Speaker 2: his blood. He's been helping a lot with the offensive

219
00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:53,320
Speaker 2: line as a player coach essentially all season long. And

220
00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:57,680
Speaker 2: this Adrian Clem health related absence. Again, I want to

221
00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,480
Speaker 2: be super super sensitive about what's going going on with

222
00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:04,960
Speaker 2: him health wise, but I don't think before the health

223
00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:08,280
Speaker 2: related absence, I don't think that it was all sunshines

224
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:13,000
Speaker 2: and rainbows between Bill O'Brien and Adrian Clem mac rowe.

225
00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,480
Speaker 2: According to Harold and Adrian Clem. I don't think that

226
00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:18,040
Speaker 2: that was a peachy relation.

227
00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:21,280
Speaker 1: Even they even say at the end that even though

228
00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:23,560
Speaker 1: Clem's contract continues, he's not expected to be back.

229
00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:28,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's that situation went south, you know, there's

230
00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:31,720
Speaker 2: there were a lot of There were a lot of

231
00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:35,760
Speaker 2: of there's a lot of tension between Bill O'Brien and

232
00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:37,880
Speaker 2: and Adrian Clem. Let me just put it to you

233
00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:39,880
Speaker 2: that way. I'm trying not to get myself in trouble here.

234
00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,880
Speaker 2: There's a lot of tension between those two guys. Yeah,

235
00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,840
Speaker 2: and I think that there was a lot of that,

236
00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,280
Speaker 2: as the article kind of outlines, as the report from

237
00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:52,079
Speaker 2: the Herald outlines. A lot of that I think had

238
00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:55,600
Speaker 2: to do with the fact that Adrian Clem wanted to

239
00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:58,480
Speaker 2: do things a little bit differently. You know, Trent Brown's

240
00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:02,160
Speaker 2: quoted in there saying maybe a little bit more new agey, right,

241
00:12:02,280 --> 00:12:05,320
Speaker 2: a little bit more modern in how they approach it.

242
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:07,400
Speaker 2: I don't know exactly what that means in terms of

243
00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:11,079
Speaker 2: coaching tactics, like he's not going to ride the guys

244
00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:13,880
Speaker 2: as hard or something like that, or maybe it means

245
00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:17,160
Speaker 2: in terms of technique. I don't know, But basically what

246
00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:21,120
Speaker 2: happened was is that once Adrian Clem took this leave

247
00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:24,960
Speaker 2: of absence, they went ahead and went back to Dante

248
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:30,320
Speaker 2: Scarnekia's system. And actually Bill Belichick has been sitting in

249
00:12:30,360 --> 00:12:33,040
Speaker 2: on offensive line meetings a lot more in the second

250
00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:36,400
Speaker 2: half of the season since Adrian Clem left. So a

251
00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:39,120
Speaker 2: lot of that I think has been a big problem

252
00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:40,840
Speaker 2: with the line. We've seen it with the line, and

253
00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:43,440
Speaker 2: I think a lot of the things we've talked about

254
00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,200
Speaker 2: or are personnel driven, you know, they're handling of the

255
00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:49,599
Speaker 2: tackle position, which came up again yesterday when Belichick was

256
00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:53,559
Speaker 2: asked about it, things like that. But the coaching has

257
00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,600
Speaker 2: been a big issue for them for two years now

258
00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:57,120
Speaker 2: along the offensive line as well.

259
00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:00,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you can't. I mean, replacing Dante Scarneki was

260
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:01,680
Speaker 1: never going to be easy.

261
00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:04,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, but they did a good car and Briscilla was

262
00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:05,040
Speaker 2: a good.

263
00:13:04,840 --> 00:13:08,200
Speaker 1: Coach well, so they did a good job keeping continuity,

264
00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:10,640
Speaker 1: but you were never going to keep that forever because

265
00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:12,440
Speaker 1: you had guys that coached under Scar. But then it's

266
00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:14,920
Speaker 1: guys who coached under guys who coached under Scar and

267
00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:17,840
Speaker 1: it turns into this game at telephone, right, And they

268
00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:19,480
Speaker 1: kind of talked about in the Herald article that I

269
00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:22,240
Speaker 1: think part of the idea behind hiring Adrian Clem was

270
00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:25,240
Speaker 1: this guy played for Dante Scarnekia He's going to replicate

271
00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:27,120
Speaker 1: some of that stuff. But the reality is, since playing

272
00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:30,800
Speaker 1: Dante scar for Dante Scarnecia twenty years ago. Adrian Clem

273
00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:34,600
Speaker 1: played for another NFL team, coached for a third NFL team,

274
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:38,360
Speaker 1: also coach to three colleges. So his approach and I'm

275
00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,160
Speaker 1: sure there were still some core philosophies he got from

276
00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,599
Speaker 1: Scarnekia within that, but he was not going to be

277
00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:45,280
Speaker 1: a Dante Scarneki at clone. He had a lot of

278
00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:49,640
Speaker 1: other experiences, and other experiences doesn't mean bad things. He

279
00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:51,560
Speaker 1: had a lot of other experiences that he could bring

280
00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:53,000
Speaker 1: to the table, and it sounds like they didn't want

281
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:54,880
Speaker 1: any of that. They just wanted him to go back

282
00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:57,120
Speaker 1: to what Dante Scarneki was coaching him on when he

283
00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:58,800
Speaker 1: was a rookie coming here back in two thousand.

284
00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:02,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. I find this fascinating because it does sound like

285
00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:05,640
Speaker 2: I didn't read that part of the Herald I article.

286
00:14:05,720 --> 00:14:08,079
Speaker 2: I I might have tapped out like a sentence or

287
00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:08,720
Speaker 2: two too early.

288
00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,280
Speaker 1: Was it the beginning?

289
00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:12,600
Speaker 2: Oh maybe I just skimmed over that. I was looking

290
00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:14,920
Speaker 2: for the source. I was looking for the juicy stuff,

291
00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,160
Speaker 2: you know. I was looking for the the you never

292
00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:21,720
Speaker 2: chick chicken and beer stories and stuff like that. But

293
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:26,000
Speaker 2: regardless I the fact that that they're reporting that Adrian

294
00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:27,960
Speaker 2: Clem is probably not going to be back next year

295
00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:30,120
Speaker 2: is not expected. That part was at the end, Okay,

296
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,840
Speaker 2: So that the part that I find fascinating about that

297
00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:36,800
Speaker 2: is that means now the Patriots are going to have

298
00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,320
Speaker 2: their third offensive line coach in three years.

299
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:42,600
Speaker 1: Multiple league sources do not expect Clem to return, though

300
00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,360
Speaker 1: his deal extends past this season, as does O'Brien's.

301
00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:49,760
Speaker 2: So that part of it I find really interesting because

302
00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:54,800
Speaker 2: now we get into a position of if it is

303
00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:57,400
Speaker 2: Bill Belichick back as the head coach, if it is

304
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,000
Speaker 2: Bill O'Brien back as the offensive coordinator, Let's say it's

305
00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:03,440
Speaker 2: Drod Mayo, right or something like that, who is now

306
00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:06,840
Speaker 2: hiring the offensive line coach? Right? Like, now, if we're

307
00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:09,160
Speaker 2: going to have another one, Like, how are we getting

308
00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:13,320
Speaker 2: that position phil and doing it properly? And my question

309
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:15,200
Speaker 2: is that I think maybe this is where you're going

310
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:20,320
Speaker 2: with it. Yeah, why why not call up Carl Brisillo? Right?

311
00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:22,480
Speaker 1: Well, they already drafted one of his guys, Yeah, in

312
00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:24,040
Speaker 1: Detroit like Jake Andrews.

313
00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,120
Speaker 2: Carn Barsillo did a really good job with the Patriots

314
00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:29,800
Speaker 2: under Josh McDaniels in twenty and twenty one.

315
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:32,760
Speaker 1: Or sorry, No, they drafted Cole Popovich's guy. Yeah, but

316
00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:35,800
Speaker 1: another guy they could call yeah, that one I don't

317
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:36,440
Speaker 1: know because the way he.

318
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:38,400
Speaker 2: Left on that ship is probably right.

319
00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:42,880
Speaker 1: The other part on clemb by the way Clement played

320
00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:45,480
Speaker 1: for this is from the Herald here on services a

321
00:15:45,520 --> 00:15:48,920
Speaker 1: sensible Reunion. Clem had played and learned under legendary Patriots

322
00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:51,320
Speaker 1: offensive line coach Dontey Scarnekia from two thousand to two

323
00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:53,560
Speaker 1: thousand and four. However, his fit in the year twenty

324
00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:56,720
Speaker 1: twenty three struck some of the organizations questionable. Clem's techniques

325
00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,880
Speaker 1: in philosophy had evolved since his playing days under Scarnakia moulded.

326
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:03,320
Speaker 1: I stops at smu u CLA Oregon in in Pittsburgh

327
00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:04,200
Speaker 1: with the Steelers.

328
00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:09,240
Speaker 2: So this is the bottom line to me is which

329
00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:12,920
Speaker 2: I find again, I find this really interesting, is that

330
00:16:13,680 --> 00:16:16,840
Speaker 2: every single move that Bill Belichick has made on the

331
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:20,120
Speaker 2: offensive side of the ball when he's turned left when

332
00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:23,120
Speaker 2: there's a possibility to turn right left, has been into

333
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:25,840
Speaker 2: a ditch right right. And Adrian klem is right there

334
00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:28,440
Speaker 2: with it. Because the other guy that they interviewed for

335
00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:32,320
Speaker 2: this position was Ryan Windell, who's was a former Patriot,

336
00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:34,920
Speaker 2: played with the Patriots for years. He's now the offensive

337
00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:37,320
Speaker 2: line coach for the Rams that he got the job

338
00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:40,120
Speaker 2: in LA, and he's been doing a great job with

339
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,360
Speaker 2: that line and with the Rams. So like Jacoby Myers

340
00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:46,680
Speaker 2: goes to Villiez instead of Juju Smith Schuster, Jacoby has

341
00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,600
Speaker 2: a great season for the Raiders and Juju Smith Schuster

342
00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:51,960
Speaker 2: has two hundred yards and ends up on injured reserve.

343
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:55,680
Speaker 2: Ryan Windell has a great year coaching the Rams offensive line.

344
00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:57,920
Speaker 2: Bill Adrian Klem is gonna be one and done in

345
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,160
Speaker 2: New England. I mean, these mistakes could be possible, but

346
00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:01,560
Speaker 2: I think some of.

347
00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:05,439
Speaker 1: The problems would Ryan Wendell, whatever program it is he

348
00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:08,440
Speaker 1: instituted in LA, would he have been able to institute

349
00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,399
Speaker 1: that program here, would he have had the freedom to

350
00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:12,920
Speaker 1: institute that program here, or would he have instituted the

351
00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:14,760
Speaker 1: program that they gave him the institute.

352
00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:17,720
Speaker 2: That's fair. I just he's done a really good job.

353
00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:22,320
Speaker 1: No, he has. But but but it's you know again,

354
00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:25,040
Speaker 1: you read that it's like the Patriots hired these guys

355
00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:28,040
Speaker 1: to run their program. They didn't hire these guys to

356
00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:29,080
Speaker 1: necessarily have them come.

357
00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:29,840
Speaker 2: In and do the right thing.

358
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,320
Speaker 1: And so when you point and I'm not saying that,

359
00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:34,639
Speaker 1: you know, oh, Clem was still a better higher than

360
00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:36,879
Speaker 1: Windell or anything like that. I'm just saying, is the

361
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:39,040
Speaker 1: problem that they're not hiring the right coaches, or is

362
00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,320
Speaker 1: the problem that they're not giving the coaches they hire

363
00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:44,040
Speaker 1: the opportunity to coach the way they want to coach?

364
00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:46,680
Speaker 1: And in reality, it could it can be some of both,

365
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:48,880
Speaker 1: it can totally be some of both. It's not necessarily

366
00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:52,399
Speaker 1: one entirely or the other. But that's where you go

367
00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:55,879
Speaker 1: to again, this ultimate looming decision of does the change

368
00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:58,359
Speaker 1: need to be made at a higher level than positional coaches?

369
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:03,280
Speaker 2: Yeah? No, that that's a really fair point of is Bill?

370
00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:06,600
Speaker 2: I think, especially on offense, because I actually this was

371
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:08,480
Speaker 2: not how I wanted to start the show, obviously, because

372
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:11,480
Speaker 2: I didn't know that this was coming out. Uh is

373
00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:14,560
Speaker 2: Bill on offense like two stuck in his ways of

374
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:15,200
Speaker 2: doing it?

375
00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:21,280
Speaker 1: The Charlie Wise Josh McDaniels, Bill O'Brien right, And obviously

376
00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:24,399
Speaker 1: with the line Dante scarneki away, maybe the Backs are

377
00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,760
Speaker 1: doing the Ivan Fears way. He's always here And look,

378
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:30,440
Speaker 1: let me just say this, those guys are great coaches.

379
00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:32,280
Speaker 1: This is not us saying you know doing it the

380
00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:33,320
Speaker 1: Dante Scarnecki is.

381
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:38,280
Speaker 2: Right, asking Mac Jones to be Tom Brady, Right.

382
00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,320
Speaker 1: That's exactly what I was gonna say. We've talked about

383
00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:42,719
Speaker 1: asking Mac Jones to run the top Tom Brady offense,

384
00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:46,240
Speaker 1: like Dante Scarnecki is so great because if everybody could

385
00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:50,639
Speaker 1: coach the way Dante Scarnecia coached, Dante Scarnecki wouldn't be special. Right.

386
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:52,840
Speaker 1: That's why he's special, because he's one of one and

387
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:55,200
Speaker 1: trying to replicate it, you may be able to get close,

388
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,760
Speaker 1: but if if you have a ninety nine percent down,

389
00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:01,080
Speaker 1: but it's that one percent that is really making the difference,

390
00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:03,560
Speaker 1: and that's what you can't replicate, what good is it?

391
00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:07,240
Speaker 2: Yeah? No, totally agree with that. All being said, if

392
00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:09,560
Speaker 2: you want to call in and ask us about specifics

393
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:12,400
Speaker 2: about the story, we already got one email. As we

394
00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:14,359
Speaker 2: were talking about this on the show, we got an

395
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,240
Speaker 2: email asking us if we were going to talk about

396
00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:19,199
Speaker 2: the report, which is kind of funny. But if you

397
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:21,120
Speaker 2: want to call in a five to five PATS five

398
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,960
Speaker 2: hundred web radio at Patriots dot com is the email address.

399
00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:26,119
Speaker 2: We're happy to keep talking about that. I know it's

400
00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:27,560
Speaker 2: going to be a big story here today, But I

401
00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:30,399
Speaker 2: want to go back to what I originally planned on

402
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:33,240
Speaker 2: opening the show with. And I think this does relate

403
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:38,679
Speaker 2: because watching this film back against Buffalo and just thinking

404
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:41,720
Speaker 2: about this end of the season and how this is

405
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:43,719
Speaker 2: all going to go down the next couple of weeks.

406
00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,199
Speaker 2: One of the things that I don't necessarily know if

407
00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,200
Speaker 2: it's like a pro Bill argument. I know it's probably

408
00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:51,280
Speaker 2: going to be taken it that way by some people.

409
00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:53,800
Speaker 2: But one thing that has really been on my mind

410
00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:58,280
Speaker 2: lately is how much they lose on the defensive side

411
00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 2: of the ball if Bill Belichi walks out the door,

412
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:05,159
Speaker 2: and is it possible kind of like, are you know

413
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:11,840
Speaker 2: Dante Scarnekia comparison, Is it possible for a Girodmeo, DeMarcus Covington,

414
00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:17,359
Speaker 2: Mike Pellegrino and those guys to continue the Belichick way

415
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:22,159
Speaker 2: on defense? Because the bottom line is is all the

416
00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:25,760
Speaker 2: issues that we talk about them offensively, the fact that

417
00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:28,960
Speaker 2: they are outdated on that side of the ball schematically,

418
00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,119
Speaker 2: the fact that they don't have an eye for talent

419
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,040
Speaker 2: on that side of the football, the opposite is all

420
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,280
Speaker 2: true on the defensive side of the ball. They have

421
00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:40,359
Speaker 2: modernized on defense they have adapted on defense. I would

422
00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,359
Speaker 2: say that Bill Belichick for all of his wards in

423
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:45,360
Speaker 2: terms of all the things we just talked about, which

424
00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:46,840
Speaker 2: is all on him. At the end of the day,

425
00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,359
Speaker 2: Bill Belichick is still one of the best innovators on

426
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:51,440
Speaker 2: the defensive side of the ball.

427
00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:53,919
Speaker 1: And they wrote about that in the NFL in the

428
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,840
Speaker 1: Herald thing. Yeah, talked about his hands on coaching, and

429
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,879
Speaker 1: that's totally for a point, like it's not going to

430
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,400
Speaker 1: be exactly the same without Bill. But did you catch

431
00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:05,400
Speaker 1: after the game when Dietrich Wise was asked about to plan, Well,

432
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,639
Speaker 1: this is Josh Allen, who did he credit?

433
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 2: Yeah? I asked the question, and this is why I

434
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,680
Speaker 2: kind of started the sad question. Yeah, this is why

435
00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:16,600
Speaker 2: I started thinking about it more is is this is

436
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:20,840
Speaker 2: it possible to segue this right? Like is it possible

437
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 2: to continue this on? Because I look at the way

438
00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,160
Speaker 2: that they and I wrote something about this for tomorrow

439
00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:29,800
Speaker 2: to kind of for people to really visualize it. So

440
00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:33,399
Speaker 2: a couple of key points to what I'm publishing. One

441
00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,560
Speaker 2: is that they have now played a lot more dime defense.

442
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,080
Speaker 2: They're playing a lot more sixth defensive back. They're third

443
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,880
Speaker 2: in the league in dime defense. Now we were screaming

444
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 2: for it, right And so the way that they're playing

445
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,680
Speaker 2: that dime defense is because they have the Kyle Duggars,

446
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,960
Speaker 2: the Jabriel Peppers is the Marty Mapu's. So all these

447
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,760
Speaker 2: guys that we have been clamoring more speed at the

448
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,119
Speaker 2: second level, more guys that can play in space and

449
00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 2: play in coverage, they've done that on the defensive side

450
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:04,159
Speaker 2: of the ball. So they have adapted. So like for

451
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:06,440
Speaker 2: all the people that sit there and say that they

452
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:10,720
Speaker 2: employ a devon Godchaw, Jawan Bentley, Lawrence guy, those you

453
00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:13,120
Speaker 2: know all what are KaiC, Like two hundred and fifty

454
00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:17,280
Speaker 2: pound linebackers are KaiC. Well in reality, when you start

455
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:20,200
Speaker 2: to actually break down their tendencies and they're in their

456
00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:25,080
Speaker 2: personnel groupings, they very rarely are in positions where Juwan

457
00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:29,240
Speaker 2: Bentley and Jilani Tavai and their big linebackers and run

458
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 2: stuffers are on the field in situations they shouldn't be

459
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 2: on the field, right, Like they might play those guys

460
00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:37,639
Speaker 2: on like first and ten in a nickel package to

461
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 2: stop the run, but those guys on third down are

462
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,000
Speaker 2: not on the field, you know, Like that's when they

463
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:46,480
Speaker 2: take Mac Wilson and Josh Uca and in the front.

464
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,200
Speaker 2: And then they also, you know, they play a lot

465
00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:50,160
Speaker 2: of dime now in the back end. They play six

466
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 2: defensive back and so they've done that. They right now

467
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 2: are still second in the league in unblocked pressures right,

468
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 2: unblocked pressure rate, which means that Bill Belichick is still

469
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:06,320
Speaker 2: really good at effing with your pass protect rate. Okay,

470
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 2: so it's the Patriots, it's the Kansas City Chiefs right now,

471
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,159
Speaker 2: it's Steve Spagnola is like one of the best in

472
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:14,560
Speaker 2: the game. Right, those two guys are nobody is better

473
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 2: right now than scheming up pressure. So what does that mean?

474
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 2: They're not just doing it by blitzing, like by sending

475
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,719
Speaker 2: the house. They run a lot of scheme pressures. They

476
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 2: run a lot of creeper pressure, particularly where they're gonna

477
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,280
Speaker 2: drop guys off the line of scrimmage that you would

478
00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:34,400
Speaker 2: expect to rush and then they're gonna blitz defensive backs. Right,

479
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 2: So a lot of guys, you know, Kyle Dugger, Miles Bryant,

480
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,560
Speaker 2: Jabriel Peppers, those guys have a lot of pressures this year,

481
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 2: and so they do a lot of spin the dial

482
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:45,919
Speaker 2: stuff with their front as well. As the back end.

483
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,159
Speaker 2: All that that I just described to you, getting lighter

484
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 2: on defense, being innovative with how they rush the quarterback.

485
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,760
Speaker 2: They play a lot of cover zero. They're third highest

486
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:57,120
Speaker 2: in the league and cover zero.

487
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:01,160
Speaker 1: Rate, And with these corners, that is something.

488
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 2: All and they have. I think what's so cool about

489
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,280
Speaker 2: their system is they have a bunch of wrinkles to

490
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 2: protect those corners within their man coverage calls. So like

491
00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 2: they play cover zero, but they play man match cover zero. Now,

492
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 2: so if a guy's gonna run across or down in

493
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:18,680
Speaker 2: the middle of the field off of cover zero, they

494
00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:21,040
Speaker 2: end up actually passing that off in almost like a

495
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 2: zone instead of a man to man coverage. So they

496
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 2: have all these wrinkles and all these different things within

497
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,120
Speaker 2: their man coverages. Like so that was another thing when

498
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,880
Speaker 2: I was doing this deep time, is how is Alex Austin,

499
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 2: Sean Wade, Miles Bryant, Jonathan Jones. How are those guys

500
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,280
Speaker 2: holding up? Like how is that? You know, Jonathan Jones

501
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 2: a really good cornerback, but the rest of that group

502
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,000
Speaker 2: has flows, Yeah, and like how does that? How does

503
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 2: that group hold up? Well? They hold up because they

504
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 2: have so many built in wrinkles to their typical man

505
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:51,280
Speaker 2: schemes where it's not just like take your guy on

506
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,920
Speaker 2: an island and you're on your own type of thing, right,

507
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,640
Speaker 2: they have a lot of different things that they do,

508
00:24:56,119 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 2: so as archaic as they are on off and they

509
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 2: are archaic and their eye for talent on offense is

510
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,560
Speaker 2: why we're in this position at four and twelve. In general,

511
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 2: they are very modern on the defensive side of the ball.

512
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,880
Speaker 2: They are very innovative on the defensive side of the ball.

513
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 2: They play good defense. They're ninth in the league in

514
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 2: DVOA right now on defense despite major injuries on that

515
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 2: side of the ball. And they're young players. You know,

516
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 2: a key On White, a Mardy mop who those guys

517
00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:31,119
Speaker 2: are starting, Christian Barmore. Those guys are starting to get better,

518
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 2: like those guys are developing on that side of the ball.

519
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:37,880
Speaker 2: Those guys are making strides. And lastly, just to tie

520
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 2: a bow on it, they're they're catching up to Josh

521
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,840
Speaker 2: Allen like they they've they've closed the gap against Josh Allen.

522
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:46,120
Speaker 2: And I know that there's.

523
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:49,439
Speaker 1: White literally catching up to Josh Allen running them down

524
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 1: at six six andy pounds.

525
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 2: I know that there's Josh Allen missed a lot of

526
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,320
Speaker 2: throws in this game, and much to your your your.

527
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: Happiness, well, he tends to do that. He's Josh Allen.

528
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:00,520
Speaker 2: He missed a lot of throws in this game. But

529
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 2: I thought, looking back on it, that he missed a

530
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 2: lot of throws for two reasons. One because the Patriots

531
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 2: were making them make throws that isn't really in his bag, right,

532
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 2: you know, Second and third read in the progression from

533
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 2: the pocket. Sit there and just be pinpoint right. That's

534
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,680
Speaker 2: not Josh Allen's game. And secondly, he started this game

535
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 2: like two for ten or something like that, and they

536
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 2: completely got a matter rhythm because of what they were

537
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 2: doing schematically. So I give them a ton of credit

538
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 2: on the defensive side of the football, and I still

539
00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 2: think they coach their butts off on that side of

540
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,439
Speaker 2: the ball. And you do have to worry if you

541
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 2: let Bill Belichick walk, is that going to continue? So

542
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:41,679
Speaker 2: I guess my big takeaway from all this, or my

543
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:43,919
Speaker 2: big take on it, is no matter what they do

544
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:47,160
Speaker 2: at head coach, because all the reasons why the Herald outlined,

545
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 2: all the reasons we've outlined on this show, it's totally

546
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 2: understandable if they move on from Bill Belichick. They have

547
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,360
Speaker 2: all the justification in the world to do that. They

548
00:26:55,440 --> 00:27:00,479
Speaker 2: have to have to maintain their defensive structure. The system

549
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:04,639
Speaker 2: on defense is not broken, it's not old, it's not outdated.

550
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 2: They need to continue to run that system on defense,

551
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 2: whether that's Girod Mayo running it, whether that's hiring Brian

552
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 2: Flores and he comes back and has his own version

553
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 2: of it, or whatever the case may be. I want

554
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:19,680
Speaker 2: them running the Belichick defense for the next ten years.

555
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 1: Old what I would say, And you're not wrong. You're

556
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: gonna lose something when Bill Belichick leaves. If Bill Belichick leaves, obviously,

557
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: but to your point, Bill's been more involved in offensive meetings.

558
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 1: You have players crediting Drawed Mayo for the scheme. Yep,

559
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:36,719
Speaker 1: how much of it's Bill and how much of it

560
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 1: is Drawed? And and why would Bill Belichick be so

561
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 1: eager to modernize one side of the ball and not

562
00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:47,680
Speaker 1: the other. And maybe they're maybe some of that modernization

563
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 1: stuff is coming from Girod or even you know, Steve

564
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 1: or Mike Pelligreeno to Marcus Covington as opposed to Bill himself.

565
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's totally fair because I think DeMarcus Covington has

566
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:02,160
Speaker 2: done an excellent job with the defensive line. Like if

567
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,200
Speaker 2: it was like an award for assistant Coach of the Year,

568
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 2: I'm giving it to well, I just mean, like for

569
00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 2: the Patriots stat ok, I'm giving it to the Marcus Covington.

570
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 2: And I also think that Mike Pellegrino is an underrated

571
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 2: coach as well, because he takes a guy like Alex

572
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,919
Speaker 2: Austin mid season signing that was out on the you know,

573
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,600
Speaker 2: on the street, on his couch somewhere. He takes him,

574
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 2: and now Alex Austin has an interception on Josh Allen

575
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,840
Speaker 2: in a big game late in the year. I think

576
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:31,199
Speaker 2: that there are a lot of really good coaches on

577
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:32,639
Speaker 2: that side of the ball. So as much as we

578
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:35,920
Speaker 2: can pick on Adrian Clem and Billy Yates and Troy

579
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 2: Brown and Ross Douglas. You know, he saw the ship sinking,

580
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 2: so he jumped ship to Syracuse what a month ago

581
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 2: or whatever that was, I think that the defense a

582
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 2: deserves just the flowers Like, I think they deserve some

583
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 2: praise for what they've done on that side of the ball.

584
00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 2: But I also think that it's important that they continue

585
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 2: the continuity and continue what they've quietly built of really

586
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 2: good defense. And they have young players on that side

587
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 2: of the ball, and they have some guys that are

588
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 2: are in their primes on that side of the ball

589
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 2: as well as the younger guys that are starting to emerge.

590
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:08,959
Speaker 2: And I think that that's a good side of the football.

591
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 2: Let's do a three up, three down. And I know

592
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 2: a lot of people are waiting for our draft takes

593
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 2: on Pennix and your guy Felger. My goodness, like pants

594
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 2: off on Penix yesterday, Jesus. So we'll get to all

595
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 2: that in the second. But I want to I want

596
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 2: to bring up three up, three down. Since we're on

597
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 2: the Bills, I guess I'll start my number one up

598
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 2: in this game. I gotta find it there we go.

599
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, my number one up in this game is

600
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 2: Anthrony Jennings. Again, I thought he had a great game

601
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 2: in this game. Five stuffs against the run. The Bills

602
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 2: came into this game Alex really running the ball very well.

603
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 2: Like that was the whole thing with Joe Brady. They

604
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 2: changed their approach and they ran the ball really well.

605
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 2: The last couple of weeks, James Cook has been he's

606
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 2: a pro bowler. He's been on fire this season in general.

607
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 2: And the Patriots held them under four yards to carry

608
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 2: on designed runs like not scram you know, taking out

609
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:04,520
Speaker 2: the scrambles by Allen right, just straight bringing the ball

610
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 2: off type runs, and the Bills run are really modern

611
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 2: again to kind of speak to how they've evolved. On

612
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 2: the defensive side of the ball, the Bills run a

613
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 2: lot of option you know, Reid option plays, motion like.

614
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 2: They're not a just like turn the turn around and

615
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 2: hand the ball off type of team. They have a

616
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,840
Speaker 2: running quarterback that use his legs as a threat. I

617
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 2: thought Anthony Jennings on the strong side of the formation,

618
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 2: holding up at the point of attack, dealing with those

619
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 2: Reid option plays and setting the edge on that side

620
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 2: of the football. I thought that that was key to

621
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 2: how the Patriots made them one dimensional. I thought he

622
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 2: was excellent in this game.

623
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, he was really good. I mean the whole

624
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 1: defensive front. My number went up, honestly, was was key

625
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: on White?

626
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 2: Yeah he was.

627
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 1: I mean, this is the guy you thought, you know

628
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 1: when they drafted him. He talked about what kind of

629
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:53,400
Speaker 1: player are they really getting? An athletic freak with great

630
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: size who was going to contend with these bigger running quarterbacks.

631
00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 1: And it didn't show up in the stat sheet three

632
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 1: tackles one quarterback, but there were plays where he's helping

633
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 1: and it was similar to what we saw them do

634
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 1: at times to Jalen Hurts and the opener where it

635
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: was don't over pursue him, but just kind of corral

636
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:12,239
Speaker 1: him to the sideline right and then get it. Make

637
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:14,000
Speaker 1: him either throw the ball away or try to run it.

638
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: He's not gonna get a big gain or to take

639
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: the sack. You had six foot six, two hundred and

640
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 1: ninety pound Keon White going step firs step with Josh

641
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,920
Speaker 1: Allen and there's another play where Alan kind of gets

642
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 1: him in the open field and tries to, you know,

643
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 1: shoulder shake him, juke um and Keon White just stays

644
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 1: with him. And that kind of balance and that kind

645
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 1: of body control from a guy with that size. You

646
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: saw the raw power show up a little bit too

647
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:37,280
Speaker 1: in the run game. Ke On White, I think I've

648
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: had him as an up now two or three weeks

649
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,320
Speaker 1: in a row. He's played very well since coming back

650
00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 1: from that concussion, and he's a guy as you look

651
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: ahead to next year, I think you can get really

652
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 1: excited about and a guy who should have a bigger

653
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 1: role next year.

654
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:54,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's definitely one of those players that typical Belichick

655
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,880
Speaker 2: trajectory of the second half, you know, is this ascension

656
00:31:57,920 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 2: for a rookie, right so at first half is a

657
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 2: little bit quiet. He had that, really he had a

658
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 2: big opener if you remember against Philly, but then he

659
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 2: had the concussion, he had something.

660
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:09,239
Speaker 1: I think the concussion kind of derailed him because he's

661
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: playing well up until then. I just think it took

662
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 1: he only missed one game technically, but it felt like

663
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 1: it took him some time to get back into rhythm.

664
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, his reactionary athleticism, like his ability to change directions unbelievable,

665
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 2: is really good for a guy that size. I wonder

666
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:29,120
Speaker 2: where his most natural position is. I think he's a

667
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 2: hand in the dirt end. Isn't there some value in

668
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 2: moving a guy like that around though a little bit,

669
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 2: But I just I don't know in this defense like

670
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 2: they're gonna run, if they're gonna run, like their their

671
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 2: typical two gap on front defense. He's not big enough

672
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 2: or you know, kind of strong enough right now at

673
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 2: the point of attack to be like a Christian Barmoor

674
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 2: Lawrence guy like playside in.

675
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 1: No, I think he's more kind of like Dietrich wise

676
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 1: kind of guy, but more athletic.

677
00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:58,719
Speaker 2: That's possible. I wonder where his best position in this

678
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 2: defense is. Not that that's like get to make or

679
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 2: break his projection moving forward.

680
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: I just well, you want to put him where he's

681
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: gonna make the biggest impact. Yeah, that's legitimate question, and

682
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:10,520
Speaker 1: that we talked about when they drafted him. You know,

683
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: he's raw, and what does he actually end up doing.

684
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:15,440
Speaker 1: He's a little bit of between her and where do

685
00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 1: they actually end up developing him?

686
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, because once his block anticipation and sort of his

687
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,640
Speaker 2: just instincts for the game improve, and maybe like a

688
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 2: pass rush plan too, I think would help him a lot.

689
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 1: You know, we'll remember like that he's only been playing

690
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 1: defensive line for like three years now, right, He's a

691
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: converted He converted from tight end in college, So that

692
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 1: stuff's gonna come. And you knew that that was part

693
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 1: of the project when you drafted him. But you're right,

694
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 1: once he becomes a more natural defensive end like that,

695
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 1: he's going to get better exponentially.

696
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I had him as well as as Christian Barmore,

697
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,720
Speaker 2: who I thought on rewatch was was more impactful than

698
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 2: initially I thought watching.

699
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 1: I mean, teams are just taking him out now.

700
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, he had some double teams in this game,

701
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:57,479
Speaker 2: for sure, but even still, I you know, had him

702
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:59,600
Speaker 2: with a couple of quarterback pressures, a couple of stuffs

703
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,520
Speaker 2: like he was a lot better on rewatch, And I

704
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 2: think that his ability to take on double teams now

705
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 2: is just so much better than it was a couple

706
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 2: of years ago or last year, that that part of

707
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 2: his game has just elevated so much that it's now

708
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 2: he's becoming that game wrecord because if you do double

709
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 2: team him, he's not getting blown off the ball by

710
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 2: six yards. He's holding up at the point of attack.

711
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 2: He had a great stuff on a double team in

712
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,240
Speaker 2: this game. So those things for bar More and White,

713
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:31,439
Speaker 2: as you can see a theme here, all defensive front

714
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 2: players so far. So I had those two guys as

715
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 2: my next up too, So I'll just skip to the

716
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 2: third one. I had to Mario Douglas as an up.

717
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:40,640
Speaker 2: I thought, looking back on the film, I thought he

718
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 2: could add a much bigger game in this game. If

719
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:46,640
Speaker 2: the quarterback play was a little bit better. He had

720
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 2: the couple catches right, but the fifteen yarder that he

721
00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:52,359
Speaker 2: had coming over the middle, if he's if the ball

722
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 2: doesn't take him to the ground there, if that ball

723
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: is up a little bit and he can catch it

724
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 2: in stride, he has an opportunity to turn up field

725
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 2: and score a touchdown on that play. The ball is low,

726
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 2: he's got to go down and get it. And then

727
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 2: he also had a couple of opportunities to score later

728
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:08,280
Speaker 2: on or I just you know, to make big plays

729
00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 2: later on. There's one that they blitzed Zappi and I

730
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:13,279
Speaker 2: don't know if it was a hyight thing that he

731
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:15,839
Speaker 2: couldn't see over the line, But tomorrow Douglas wide open

732
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: on a slant over the middle with a ton of

733
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 2: space to run. I thought he got interfered with on

734
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 2: the fade before the half. Of course, he's not going

735
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,319
Speaker 2: to get that call yet, you know, maybe later down

736
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 2: the road when he gets a more favorable whistle. So

737
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,839
Speaker 2: that would have been like what a forty thirty five

738
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,919
Speaker 2: forty yard DPI penalty On top of that, I thought

739
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 2: he was open a ton in this game and they

740
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,960
Speaker 2: just couldn't necessarily feed him the rock the way that

741
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 2: they wanted to because of the pressure and the quarterback plays.

742
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:44,920
Speaker 2: So in general, though, I think what you're seeing with

743
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: him is just continued progress as a separator. Like he's

744
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,920
Speaker 2: a guy that gets open. A ton of games you

745
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 2: play man to man coverage against him, he's going to

746
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 2: get open. I'm really optimistic about him moving forward and

747
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 2: put him with a better quarter back, get him maybe

748
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 2: somebody else to play alongside him in this passing game, right,

749
00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 2: Like if you go into next year and it's him

750
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 2: in like Xavier Worthy or him and you know one

751
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:12,600
Speaker 2: of those other guys, now all of a sudden, there's

752
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 2: somebody else drawing some attention. Like if t Higgins comes

753
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:17,719
Speaker 2: here and is the guy on the outside and he's

754
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,200
Speaker 2: getting you know, top matchups at the X spot on

755
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,840
Speaker 2: the outside, now all of a sudden, life becomes easier

756
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 2: in the middle of the field for Tomario Douglas. So

757
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,279
Speaker 2: the fact that he's put up these stats, I think

758
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 2: maybe a little bit you could say, you know, good stats,

759
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,839
Speaker 2: bad team, kind of the NBA thing right where it's

760
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 2: like somebody's got a score, right, right, he's the guy scoring.

761
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 2: But I actually think in this case, it almost works

762
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 2: against him because now he's a focal point for defenses.

763
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 2: The middle of the field's a focal point for defenses,

764
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:48,400
Speaker 2: and he's still making plays.

765
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 1: And so I agree with you on everything on Douglas.

766
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: I actually felt kind of similarly when you talk about,

767
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 1: you know, there were more plays to be made, maybe

768
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 1: in the quarterback play limited. I thought Jalen Rager got

769
00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 1: opened a couple times in this game, and I thought

770
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: he and obviously he's one half of that third interception,

771
00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:04,600
Speaker 1: which I think they're probably both at fault, both him

772
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 1: and Zappi. There's a lot of finger pointing on that

773
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 1: one after the game. Yeah, but yeah, I thought, And

774
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 1: it's not to say Douglas wasn't enough for me, but

775
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:13,840
Speaker 1: it's just funny when you said that, Like I wrote

776
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:15,520
Speaker 1: some of that about you obviously had the kick return,

777
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,320
Speaker 1: so he's enough for that, and that was a really

778
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 1: all eleven guys were outstanding, you know, the blocks at

779
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,120
Speaker 1: the point of attack. Rager makes a couple guys miss

780
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 1: my favorite player on that play, though Evan and I

781
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: noticed it first on the dots. I would have missed

782
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 1: it on the film, but I saw it on the dots.

783
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 1: As soon as Rager gets by Tyler Bass, Pharaoh Brown

784
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 1: just takes off for the Patriots sideline celebrated like it's

785
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,480
Speaker 1: I've talked about how much I love watching Farah Brown

786
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 1: because I know he loves playing football. Yeah, it was

787
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 1: one of those moments where he's like, all right, he's gone,

788
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,360
Speaker 1: let's go celebrate. Like I thought that was fun. But

789
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 1: I thought Rager got got opened a couple of times

790
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,240
Speaker 1: in this game too, and and you know Zapi couldn't

791
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 1: get him the ball and a bit. You'll notice a

792
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 1: big theme for me as we talk about this game

793
00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 1: and as we get in the Jets game, is you

794
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 1: know who's proving they deserve to be back next year.

795
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 1: I'm not saying bring Braker, bring Rager back next year

796
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:04,440
Speaker 1: to solve all your wide receiver problems. He won't, but

797
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,480
Speaker 1: to compete for the fifth wide receiver spot and be

798
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 1: your kick returner. And like there's a role for him

799
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,560
Speaker 1: in camp to compete for role on the roster, and

800
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:14,800
Speaker 1: I think he's showing to be a little bit of

801
00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 1: a better receiver than maybe we expected. And that's not

802
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: to say is great, but if he can give you

803
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:22,480
Speaker 1: something and then also be your kick returner. Yeah, that's

804
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: a rosterable player. And right and when when they signed him,

805
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: we you know, we were talking about, oh here we go

806
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 1: again with you know, Corey Coleman and all these guy

807
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 1: Lakwan Treadwell and all these guys they've brought through the

808
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,840
Speaker 1: practice quard. He's been more than that. And I know

809
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: your roller, Oh great, they have their fifth receiver. The

810
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,120
Speaker 1: to do list this offseason is long. The more things

811
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 1: you can check off, even if they're lower down on

812
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:45,919
Speaker 1: the list, the better because they need to be able

813
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: to focus and allocate resources in certain spots. And if

814
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 1: you know you can get Jalen Rager back on a

815
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 1: minimum contract, that's one less thing you have to actually

816
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: deal with. It's one less draft pick you have to use,

817
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 1: or one less guy you have to go to the

818
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 1: bidding table for once you know, free agency actually opens

819
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:00,279
Speaker 1: things like that.

820
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:02,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a good point. And I thought that, you know,

821
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 2: on the thirty nine yard or that he caught, it

822
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,359
Speaker 2: was a really good adjustment on the ball, Like that's

823
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 2: not an adjustment that he's made his entire career. Obviously

824
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 2: he's had issues with drops and ball tracking. We obviously

825
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 2: saw that against Washington earlier this year, for example. So

826
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:18,240
Speaker 2: the fact that he was able to make that catch

827
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,800
Speaker 2: over the shoulder I thought was a pretty good catch

828
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:23,120
Speaker 2: as well. And there was a play late in the

829
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,239
Speaker 2: game when they were backed up in their own end

830
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:27,799
Speaker 2: zone where I thought of ZAPPI had just thrown with

831
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 2: a little bit of anticipation on a little stop route

832
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:34,719
Speaker 2: comeback route along the sideline. Rager was open again for

833
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:36,799
Speaker 2: a nice chunk to get them out of you know,

834
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:38,959
Speaker 2: their own end zone and maybe go on a little

835
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 2: drive there, a little drive starter, I should say there

836
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:44,480
Speaker 2: on first down. So yeah, I thought that there were

837
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:46,440
Speaker 2: some good moments from Rager in this game as well.

838
00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 2: I almost had him as an up like just for

839
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:52,160
Speaker 2: the kickoff return touchdown on its own. But yeah, that's

840
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:52,560
Speaker 2: a good shot.

841
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:54,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the catch was really good too. I should

842
00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:56,439
Speaker 1: mention the catch of the shoulder one more, and again

843
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:58,279
Speaker 1: it's like a minor thing, and this is more about

844
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:00,759
Speaker 1: one play, but it's kind of looking for word. That

845
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:04,360
Speaker 1: Alex Austin interception was very impressive, and I know a

846
00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 1: lot of people or Bill compared it to the Jalen

847
00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:11,800
Speaker 1: Rager pick im j Jalen Ramsey. I'm not saying that

848
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:13,560
Speaker 1: I'm going to compare it to the first thought I

849
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:15,399
Speaker 1: had when I saw that overhead angle of him turning

850
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 1: the hips. I'm not saying it's the same play. I'm

851
00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:20,160
Speaker 1: not saying it's the same player, but it aesthetically looked

852
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: the same.

853
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:22,000
Speaker 2: The speed turn was impressive.

854
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:24,359
Speaker 1: Well, so you know the clip from the NFL one

855
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 1: hundred where Bill's talking about Ed Reid and the pick.

856
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 1: He makes a payment like it's not the same play,

857
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 1: but for him to but no, it's not. But my

858
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: point is, like the coaching staff is basically like, here's

859
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: a look, be ready for it. And this goes to

860
00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 1: your point about like how high level the coaching is,

861
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 1: because he said after Gett we drilled that play all week.

862
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,319
Speaker 1: Here's the look, be ready for it. They found a

863
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:45,640
Speaker 1: player that could execute the technique against the look. He

864
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:47,760
Speaker 1: goes to the middle of the field, Josh Allen bites

865
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 1: on it, and he cuts back. He has the athleticism to

866
00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 1: get back over there. Again, he's not Ed Reid, but

867
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:54,839
Speaker 1: that's a high level play. That's a high level play

868
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:55,680
Speaker 1: by Alex Austin.

869
00:40:55,719 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 2: And we were pants off when Christian Gonzalez made that

870
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:00,399
Speaker 2: play right too, So we should be fair and give

871
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 2: Alex Austin the credit for making it this week. I'm excited,

872
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 2: excited too much. I'm intrigued by Allan and.

873
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:09,479
Speaker 1: That's what I would say. So again to the point,

874
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:12,120
Speaker 1: to the point I made about Rager right where all right,

875
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:14,080
Speaker 1: at the very least I've seen from him the last

876
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:15,600
Speaker 1: couple of weeks. Bring him back in camp next year.

877
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:18,280
Speaker 1: Let's get alonger look at him. Let's see Alex Austin

878
00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 1: to me, and he is actually a free agent. He's

879
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 1: an EERFA, so they can get him back for no money.

880
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 1: But we've talked a lot about that third boundary corner,

881
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,319
Speaker 1: that Jason mccordy role. Right, you're gonna have Jonathan Jones

882
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 1: on one side, Christian Zaz on the other. Who's your

883
00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 1: third rotational guy. I want to see Alex Austen in

884
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:35,000
Speaker 1: that competition because I think he's a guy that is

885
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:38,200
Speaker 1: a shot at it and plays like that or why.

886
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 1: I think he's showing that he should be back next

887
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 1: year competing for that role. I think you have him,

888
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 1: maybe Marco Wilson still under contract. You bring in a

889
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 1: veteran in maybe a Day three pick, and that's a

890
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 1: really you know, healthy deep group. You have competing for

891
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:52,680
Speaker 1: that spot, you should be able to find a guy

892
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:55,279
Speaker 1: out of that. But I've seen enough from Alex and

893
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:57,600
Speaker 1: he's at you know, there's been some growing pains, but

894
00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: there's been enough moments where he's flashed over the last

895
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 1: couple of weeks where I look at Alex Austin and

896
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 1: I say, yeah, I want to see this guy back

897
00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:05,840
Speaker 1: here in camp next year. I think there is a

898
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,360
Speaker 1: role for him on Like obviously there's a role for

899
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,120
Speaker 1: him on their fifty three man roster right now, but

900
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:12,440
Speaker 1: when you have guys back from injury and you're actually

901
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:15,399
Speaker 1: building towards something, I still think he's potentially a guy

902
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: you could keep on a fifty three man roster and

903
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 1: he can make some plays, and he's shown that with

904
00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 1: his play over the last couple of weeks. And for

905
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: guys people who maybe don't watch it as nitty gritty

906
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 1: as we do away from the ball, I'm glad he

907
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 1: had this interception because it gets it allows him to

908
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:32,359
Speaker 1: be recognized by some of the people who maybe don't

909
00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:33,040
Speaker 1: watch as closely.

910
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, look, he he has some athleticism, there's no

911
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:38,360
Speaker 2: doubt about that. Like to make that speed turn and

912
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:41,040
Speaker 2: flip your hips like that and change directions and then burst.

913
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,360
Speaker 2: That's not an easy movement to make, and that's like

914
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 2: an NFL cornerback movement, right. And then the other thing

915
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 2: is is that he's got some size and he's got

916
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,919
Speaker 2: some length, which I think is something they desperately yeah

917
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:56,720
Speaker 2: in that room. Right, So we're not talking about another

918
00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 2: not to like pick on Miles Brian or Jonathan Jones

919
00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 2: or Markus Jones. But we're not talking about another one

920
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 2: of those guys that's undersize. It's really better suited to

921
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:05,800
Speaker 2: play in the slot.

922
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 1: This is a boundary, a real like boundary corner six.

923
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:13,920
Speaker 1: Like he's going to compete with the bigger receivers physically, right.

924
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:17,239
Speaker 2: And you already compared him to Ed Reid, So I'll

925
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 2: just go ahead and continue to pile on here. When

926
00:43:21,719 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 2: you look at guys like this, and like you think

927
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 2: about how the Patriots find these guys and why they

928
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 2: find these guys, his measurables are extremely similar to Stefan Gilmore's, right,

929
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:34,440
Speaker 2: And so like you start talking about the guys that

930
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 2: they like and like the body type that they look for.

931
00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:39,320
Speaker 2: I'm not saying it's saying he's Stefan Gilmour just like

932
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 2: you're not saying he's ed reed, right, but the body

933
00:43:41,719 --> 00:43:46,400
Speaker 2: type that they're looking for six one one ninety, good speed,

934
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:49,600
Speaker 2: good length, that that's that's how they found a guy

935
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:52,840
Speaker 2: like like Alex Austin, And that's why they paid a

936
00:43:52,840 --> 00:43:55,799
Speaker 2: guy like Stefan Gilmour bag is because they he had

937
00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:57,600
Speaker 2: all those types of length and trades.

938
00:43:57,680 --> 00:43:58,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

939
00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 2: So yeah, he's an intriguing player and I'm looking forward

940
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 2: to seeing him next year.

941
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:04,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just hope he gets to see and every

942
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:04,760
Speaker 1: week he gets.

943
00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 2: A little bit more comfortable, right. You know, I thought

944
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:08,800
Speaker 2: the first when he had to start for j. C.

945
00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 2: Jackson because jac Jackson went off the reservation, Like there

946
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,560
Speaker 2: was a lot of mental issues in that game, right,

947
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:17,160
Speaker 2: Like there's a lot of coverage, busts and just like

948
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:19,280
Speaker 2: things that you could just tell that he just wasn't

949
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:21,719
Speaker 2: he didn't know what to do on the play. Right

950
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:24,160
Speaker 2: now those things are starting to be less and less

951
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:25,600
Speaker 2: and he's starting to play a little bit.

952
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 1: I think this year will ultimately be very helpful for

953
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:33,120
Speaker 1: him because of what you just said, Like he's getting

954
00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:36,280
Speaker 1: that all out now, he's getting a look. It's essentially

955
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:39,360
Speaker 1: like preseason games against starting caliber players. He's seeing what

956
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:40,879
Speaker 1: the NFL because he is a rookie. Got to remember,

957
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 1: they didn't sign this guy who's been bouncing around the league.

958
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:44,799
Speaker 1: He's been on three teams, but this is his rookie year.

959
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 1: He's seeing the speed of the NFL game, NFL talent,

960
00:44:48,719 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 1: NFL strength in games that. Yeah, and this is this

961
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:53,600
Speaker 1: is the point where we're hammering back in October Evan

962
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:56,839
Speaker 1: about playing the kids, and sometimes he sees those things

963
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:57,759
Speaker 1: and they're too much for him.

964
00:44:57,960 --> 00:44:58,400
Speaker 2: Yeah.

965
00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:00,440
Speaker 1: I'd rather him learn that now than learn it next

966
00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: year when hopefully they're chasing a playoff spot. Okay, to

967
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 1: the downs, to the down, to the downs, to the downs.

968
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 2: I have a bone to pick, and I picked this

969
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,240
Speaker 2: bone already with with uh, with some of the guys

970
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 2: over at PFF for telling.

971
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:16,720
Speaker 1: Me, oh, you're calling out your boys.

972
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:19,800
Speaker 2: I am, I'm calling out my boys. UH for telling

973
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:23,400
Speaker 2: me that Bailey Zappi had zero turnover worthy plays in

974
00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 2: this They said what they said, he had zero turnover

975
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:30,080
Speaker 2: worthy plays in this game. And uh, see, I didn't

976
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 2: expect that kind of reaction. I mean, I knew he'd

977
00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 2: be mad, but I didn't realize it was gonna be that,

978
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:35,239
Speaker 2: just to.

979
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:38,359
Speaker 1: Be clear that it's not an anti Zappy thing. This

980
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:40,759
Speaker 1: is my issue with PFF. It's all subjective. And when

981
00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 1: the guy turns the ball over three times, oh jeezus.

982
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 2: What are you doing? What are you? What are you doing?

983
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:49,160
Speaker 2: He's breaking stuff like unbelievable.

984
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 1: It's fixed. I got it. Sorry, it's got so good.

985
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: It's so good?

986
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:55,960
Speaker 2: Is it? Eighteen?

987
00:45:56,200 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 1: I was I was not expecting you to say they

988
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,920
Speaker 1: said he had zero turnover worthy plays. I didn't even

989
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:03,799
Speaker 1: bother to check the number because I figured he turned

990
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 1: the ball over three times. Okay, that they would have

991
00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 1: that down.

992
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 2: So Bailey Zappi is my number one down in case

993
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,279
Speaker 2: he didn't realize by now, Bailey Zappi is my number

994
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:17,799
Speaker 2: one down. Let's talk through the interceptions, okay, because I

995
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 2: think that just as an aside, Yeah, really quickly, because

996
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:25,480
Speaker 2: this is what I do. If we're gonna roast Mac

997
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 2: Jones for every single mistake that he means, it's only

998
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,799
Speaker 2: fair that we do the same thing for Bailey's Apps, Right,

999
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:36,160
Speaker 2: So we can't sit here and say that Mac Jones

1000
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 2: was terrible in this game, that game, this situation, that

1001
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 2: situation and then just say, well, DeVante Parker ran a

1002
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:49,160
Speaker 2: terrible roun, Like, no, you can't just do that, right,

1003
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 2: Like you have to call a spade of spade. If

1004
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 2: mac Jones throws that interception the same play.

1005
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:59,480
Speaker 1: People would have filed chargers against them, right.

1006
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:03,680
Speaker 2: So let's be fair. So the first interception, Yeah, it's

1007
00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:07,800
Speaker 2: a quick game concept, right, it's curl flat and Zappi

1008
00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:11,280
Speaker 2: is reading the nickel and where that player is gonna

1009
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,760
Speaker 2: go and well it's it's really the will, but regardless,

1010
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:18,279
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter. He's reading that. It's a line the

1011
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,800
Speaker 2: linebacker type. Yeah, it's like one of their like hybrid players,

1012
00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 2: twenty five. I can't remember his name, but I know

1013
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:23,920
Speaker 2: his number is twenty five.

1014
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 1: I don't know. I thought it was been hard.

1015
00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:28,799
Speaker 2: So he is reading that player. And as soon as

1016
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:32,360
Speaker 2: that player widens Tyrrell Dodson, Yeah, as soon as that

1017
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 2: player widens into the flat in his own structure, that

1018
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 2: should immediately trigger that. It's that he's throwing the curl right,

1019
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 2: because that's opening the passing window to Mike is Sicki.

1020
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:45,400
Speaker 2: And instead he he hesitates, he holds the ball right,

1021
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,520
Speaker 2: He's late, he's late to the throw.

1022
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 1: And that that's that's why it's picked off if he

1023
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: throws that quicker. Yeah, the defense and look it's a

1024
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:55,480
Speaker 1: great play by zed Oliver, right who picked it off. Yes,

1025
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,000
Speaker 1: it's a great play by ed Oliver, but you shouldn't

1026
00:47:58,000 --> 00:47:59,640
Speaker 1: have the ball getting knocked up in the air, right.

1027
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 2: So it was explained to me by PFF that the

1028
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 2: reason why that was not deemed to turn over worthy

1029
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 2: play is because at Oliver makes an incredible interception. Now,

1030
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:14,200
Speaker 2: the reason why we got to that chain reaction is

1031
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 2: a separate conversation. But to them, that should just be

1032
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 2: a normal pass breakup nine times out of ten and

1033
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:25,600
Speaker 2: this one time he got unlucky and at Oliver makes

1034
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:28,239
Speaker 2: like an incredible play to pick the pass off, right,

1035
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:32,279
Speaker 2: So that's their explanation. But regardless, the reason why the

1036
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 2: ball was even contested was because Bailey Zappi's late to

1037
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:38,399
Speaker 2: the right, and he said as much after the game, right,

1038
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:41,040
Speaker 2: he said, I was late. So that's that I'm not

1039
00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:46,560
Speaker 2: killing him just to kill him. Second interception is a PPO.

1040
00:48:46,800 --> 00:48:50,040
Speaker 2: It's a pass pass option, right, So he's got instead

1041
00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 2: of like a progression read where everybody's an option on

1042
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 2: the play, he's really just reading one side of the

1043
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 2: field based off of the numbers right, So he's got

1044
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:00,479
Speaker 2: a screen to Pop Douglas on the right hand side,

1045
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 2: and he's got the ISO slant to Devonte Parker on

1046
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:06,880
Speaker 2: the left hand side. So if he's got the numbers

1047
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:09,160
Speaker 2: to the screen, he's gonna throw the screen. If he's

1048
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:11,359
Speaker 2: got one on one to the backside, he's gonna throw

1049
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:15,440
Speaker 2: the slant. The problem is is that pre snap. I

1050
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 2: understand why he made the read. There were four over

1051
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 2: four on the right hand side on the screen. Post snap,

1052
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 2: they blitzed from that side. So looking at it post snap,

1053
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:28,959
Speaker 2: it's awful because they have it three on three now

1054
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:31,360
Speaker 2: and they have it blocked. We were really four on

1055
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:33,920
Speaker 2: three and they count pop so they have it blocked

1056
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:37,000
Speaker 2: completely into a blitz on a screen. It's like the

1057
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 2: perfect call, right, But I understand his process is it's

1058
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 2: a pre snap read, so you can't just anticipate the

1059
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:45,719
Speaker 2: blitz is coming necessarily.

1060
00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 1: But he's had trouble with that and you're not gonna

1061
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 1: anticipate it every time. But it's become a pattern now

1062
00:49:51,080 --> 00:49:56,000
Speaker 1: where he's getting blind not literally, but like there's big

1063
00:49:56,040 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: blitzes coming that he just misses. It happened in the

1064
00:49:58,120 --> 00:50:00,120
Speaker 1: Chiefs game. It happened last week and I hear and

1065
00:50:00,160 --> 00:50:00,879
Speaker 1: this is another one.

1066
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:04,319
Speaker 2: So they had it. They had Kasiki and Pharaoh Brown

1067
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 2: were on that side of the field. They had those

1068
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:09,920
Speaker 2: two guys to kick out the initial defenders, then the

1069
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:12,720
Speaker 2: corner that's playing off the line of scrimmage. They actually

1070
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:14,839
Speaker 2: it was a really well designed play. They actually had

1071
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:17,560
Speaker 2: Kevin Harris to lead up through the hole as like

1072
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:19,759
Speaker 2: a lead blocker, so they would have been three on

1073
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:21,799
Speaker 2: three on the defenders and then Pop would have had

1074
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:24,600
Speaker 2: the ball with nobody to tackle him. Right, So he

1075
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 2: I don't.

1076
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna say he would score because it would

1077
00:50:27,120 --> 00:50:28,640
Speaker 1: have been like a ninety yard touchdown.

1078
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:31,279
Speaker 2: But that's a game. It's gonna be a big game. Yeah,

1079
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:33,240
Speaker 2: it's gonna be a ten plus yard game for sure.

1080
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 2: And instead he throws the ISO slant. He he stares

1081
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:43,000
Speaker 2: down Devonte Parker and he sees that Rasul Douglas is

1082
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 2: playing inside leverage on Devonte Parker and is jumping the slant,

1083
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:49,239
Speaker 2: and he throws the ball anyway, And I'll get to

1084
00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:50,480
Speaker 2: Devonte Parker in a second.

1085
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:52,920
Speaker 1: Right, the route is horrible, there's in We'll get to

1086
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:56,520
Speaker 1: that in a second. But yeah, that interception. I don't

1087
00:50:56,520 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 1: care if you want to call it like fifty to

1088
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:01,200
Speaker 1: fifty or what ever. I know a lot of people

1089
00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:04,359
Speaker 1: are killing DeVante Parker for the route, the decision, and

1090
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 1: the and the throw in the process by Bailey ZAPPI

1091
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 1: also stopped. So wait, what and why wasn't it a

1092
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:10,560
Speaker 1: turnover where they play that one?

1093
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,359
Speaker 2: I don't they They just thought it was a really

1094
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:18,359
Speaker 2: good play by Rusult Douglas through it right too, all right,

1095
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:20,400
Speaker 2: they said it was a really good play by Rusolt

1096
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:23,439
Speaker 2: Douglas and that DeVante Parker ran a terrible route.

1097
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:28,239
Speaker 1: Well, look and on Parker had the slant route particularly Yeah,

1098
00:51:28,280 --> 00:51:31,160
Speaker 1: I mean there was a play I couldn't remember the game,

1099
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:32,360
Speaker 1: and I went back and I tried to find it.

1100
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:35,040
Speaker 1: I couldn't find it. But Mac Jones it was a

1101
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,040
Speaker 1: I don't know if it was the same Ppo setup,

1102
00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:39,719
Speaker 1: but where Parker ran a slant but he ran it

1103
00:51:39,800 --> 00:51:41,920
Speaker 1: kind of lazy and he broke it off at like

1104
00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:44,279
Speaker 1: I think six yards instead of four yards and Mac

1105
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:46,160
Speaker 1: threw it like a four yard slant. It wasn't picked.

1106
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:49,520
Speaker 1: It was dropped, like dropped by the defender. But yeah,

1107
00:51:49,520 --> 00:51:52,240
Speaker 1: how many interceptions is here? Both quarterbacks have been Devonte

1108
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:55,440
Speaker 1: Parker either. I almost wonder at this point if they're

1109
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:57,919
Speaker 1: having him running deep slants because he's run too many

1110
00:51:57,920 --> 00:51:59,520
Speaker 1: of them, like deep.

1111
00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:03,680
Speaker 2: That he prefers to run. I would like more of

1112
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:05,680
Speaker 2: like a skinny than.

1113
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:07,719
Speaker 1: A run a truth, but like, how do the quarterbacks

1114
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:10,600
Speaker 1: it don't have the quarterbacks not picked up on that

1115
00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:13,000
Speaker 1: at this point, Yeah, because there's been too many times

1116
00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:15,919
Speaker 1: where there's been a throw where it's like did he

1117
00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:18,399
Speaker 1: just underthrow him or was the route run like three

1118
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:19,040
Speaker 1: yards to day?

1119
00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:21,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, So he runs more of like a glance or

1120
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:23,279
Speaker 2: like a five step slant. Yeah. And I think a

1121
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 2: big reason why is because he's not necessarily quick off

1122
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,799
Speaker 2: the line, so he's trying to get vertical and then

1123
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:32,879
Speaker 2: break it instead of just you know, breaking it right

1124
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:35,399
Speaker 2: on a dime like Pop Douglas could, right, So he's

1125
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:37,200
Speaker 2: running it a little bit more to set up the

1126
00:52:37,239 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 2: fade and then I'm going to break off. So it's

1127
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:41,080
Speaker 2: more of like a glance route, which is like a

1128
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:43,799
Speaker 2: five step slant or a skinny. You know, some people

1129
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:46,360
Speaker 2: would call it five step slant. Either way, it was

1130
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:48,359
Speaker 2: a bad route, but it's you still have to put

1131
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:51,640
Speaker 2: some of the blame for Bailey Zappi a reading the

1132
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:56,840
Speaker 2: wrong side of the option play and then be staring

1133
00:52:56,880 --> 00:52:59,640
Speaker 2: down the throw like there's still some things that that

1134
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:03,520
Speaker 2: are zap on that the third interception, I give seventy

1135
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:05,840
Speaker 2: five percent of it to Jalen Rager, Like you have

1136
00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:07,880
Speaker 2: to sighted just there and you have to change the route.

1137
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 2: But it's still one of those throws where you can't

1138
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 2: just fling it out there right, Like you can't just

1139
00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 2: throw it out there on a whim without any real uh,

1140
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:19,719
Speaker 2: you know, without seeing that Jalen Rager is on the

1141
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 2: same page.

1142
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:23,960
Speaker 1: That was the Mac Jones' throw. He made like, if

1143
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:26,480
Speaker 1: we're gonna compare it to the Jones picks, because there's

1144
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:28,759
Speaker 1: too many times with Mac shit. This is what ultimately did.

1145
00:53:28,960 --> 00:53:30,279
Speaker 1: I know people can say, oh, there's a lot of

1146
00:53:30,360 --> 00:53:30,719
Speaker 1: dum done.

1147
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:31,120
Speaker 2: He looks.

1148
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 1: The biggest problem with Mac Jones was he got to

1149
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:37,080
Speaker 1: a point where he was so preoccupied with the pressure

1150
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 1: that he would just blindly throw the ball to a

1151
00:53:39,600 --> 00:53:42,640
Speaker 1: spot and expect somebody to be there without checking to

1152
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: see if they were there. And that's exactly what Bailey

1153
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:47,520
Speaker 1: Zappi did. He saw the blitz, he saw the pressure,

1154
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:49,399
Speaker 1: and he said all right, it's just oh, I gotta

1155
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 1: get rid of this. Yeah, Jalen's supposed to be there,

1156
00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:53,680
Speaker 1: just throw it without looking And it was Douglas again

1157
00:53:53,760 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 1: right on that one is right there.

1158
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:59,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, pick six. So I had Bailey Zapi with

1159
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:02,319
Speaker 2: up in minus plays in the first half.

1160
00:54:02,360 --> 00:54:04,879
Speaker 1: How many turnover worth it's two and a half.

1161
00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:07,040
Speaker 2: Like, I don't know, like I cut the baby, split

1162
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:09,359
Speaker 2: the baby with the Jalen Rager one, like I I

1163
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,839
Speaker 2: that it's it's it's what you.

1164
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:14,359
Speaker 1: Make of the postgame comments from them on.

1165
00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 2: That it wasn't. I guess technically it was a miscommunication, right, like,

1166
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 2: if that's what you want to chalk it up to.

1167
00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:26,600
Speaker 1: Well, Rager. Rager seems to put it on ZAPPI. What so,

1168
00:54:26,719 --> 00:54:29,800
Speaker 1: Rager said, I thought I had the exactly the exactly

1169
00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:34,799
Speaker 1: for some reason. Rager said, keep talking, I'm gonna find it.

1170
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:37,720
Speaker 1: Oh here, Nope. Yeah, Rager said, it was just something

1171
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:39,680
Speaker 1: between me and Bailey, and I'll leave it at that.

1172
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:42,799
Speaker 1: Zappi said, we'll get back and fix it. Make sure

1173
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:43,799
Speaker 1: we're both on the same page.

1174
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:45,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, so they're on different pages.

1175
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:47,719
Speaker 1: I don't know. We'll leave it at that or I'll

1176
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:49,880
Speaker 1: leave it at that. Sounds pretty pointed to me. You

1177
00:54:49,920 --> 00:54:52,600
Speaker 1: think I think you just like when do you say

1178
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:55,239
Speaker 1: something just dementary and then say I'll leave it at that.

1179
00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:56,359
Speaker 2: Okay, I guess that's fair.

1180
00:54:56,560 --> 00:54:59,560
Speaker 1: I don't know or not complimentary, but like there's the

1181
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:02,480
Speaker 1: failed a little little throwing under the bushun Yeah, So

1182
00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 1: to be fair to Zabi because I know everybody Evan's

1183
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:08,560
Speaker 1: dragging on Zappi, Max's guy, I've actually heard you're a

1184
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:09,759
Speaker 1: huge Bailey's Yeah.

1185
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:12,520
Speaker 2: God, like in the fact that some people think I'm

1186
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:14,560
Speaker 2: a huge Bailey Zappi fan and some people think I'm

1187
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:16,440
Speaker 2: a Mac Jones. Guy tells me that I'm right down

1188
00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:16,840
Speaker 2: the middle.

1189
00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:19,480
Speaker 1: I say that all the time, Like I I feel

1190
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:21,520
Speaker 1: like I'm I'm correct because both sides hate me.

1191
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:24,279
Speaker 2: Yeah. So he had a couple of good throws in

1192
00:55:24,320 --> 00:55:27,440
Speaker 2: this game. Hit DeVante Parker on a cross or that

1193
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 2: I thought was a good throw. Obviously, the the third

1194
00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:32,840
Speaker 2: down play to Gasiki where he extended the play and

1195
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:35,399
Speaker 2: got out of the pocket was a really good play. Uh.

1196
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,640
Speaker 2: The Jalen Rager deep ball. I didn't count that as

1197
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:41,400
Speaker 2: a plus, but it was a catchable. Yeah, it was

1198
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:45,600
Speaker 2: a good It's a cat, it's a good enough throw. Yeah,

1199
00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:48,759
Speaker 2: And then obviously I thought the the scramble touchdown to

1200
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:51,200
Speaker 2: Sasne nice playing. I stayed to get out of the

1201
00:55:51,239 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 2: pocket and see that, you know, everybody's on one side

1202
00:55:54,080 --> 00:55:56,400
Speaker 2: of the field, and and run it in. So it

1203
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:59,400
Speaker 2: wasn't all terrible from Bailey Zappy, but I thought that

1204
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:02,399
Speaker 2: he summed it up on his own perfectly, so I'm

1205
00:56:02,400 --> 00:56:04,320
Speaker 2: not gonna have no reason to have to use his words.

1206
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:06,920
Speaker 2: You can't win football games and the quarterback turns the

1207
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:10,080
Speaker 2: ball over three times like you, it's not winning football.

1208
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:12,480
Speaker 2: And that's where they're at with the quarterback position. I

1209
00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:14,360
Speaker 2: went on this whole thing about the defense the beginning

1210
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:18,120
Speaker 2: of the show. They are getting such poor quarterback play

1211
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:20,960
Speaker 2: at times that they can't win games even when the

1212
00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:23,719
Speaker 2: defense is playing well, right, Like they just even if

1213
00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 2: they just had a quarterback that was protecting the ball

1214
00:56:26,320 --> 00:56:29,000
Speaker 2: and managing games, they would be in such better shape.

1215
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,560
Speaker 2: And that says a lot about the state of their quarterbacks.

1216
00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:36,600
Speaker 2: Bailey Zappi as a starter, now his QBR is thirty eight.

1217
00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:40,239
Speaker 2: Mac Jones was about thirty six point six, So we're

1218
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 2: really just talking about the same guy here. Maybe they

1219
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:44,920
Speaker 2: are a little bit different in how they play. Their

1220
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:47,360
Speaker 2: styles are a little bit different. I think the biggest

1221
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:49,440
Speaker 2: thing with Bailey Zappi is though, and this is my

1222
00:56:49,880 --> 00:56:54,600
Speaker 2: concern about it after the Denver game, is that in structure,

1223
00:56:54,920 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 2: like throwing on time in rhythm with accuracy, that is

1224
00:56:59,600 --> 00:57:02,880
Speaker 2: not a part of his game he does consistently, which.

1225
00:57:02,680 --> 00:57:04,319
Speaker 1: Is crazy because that's what he was so good at

1226
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:05,200
Speaker 1: at Western Kentucky.

1227
00:57:05,320 --> 00:57:09,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, so if he can't improve in that area, then

1228
00:57:09,600 --> 00:57:12,680
Speaker 2: it's they're not gonna have sustained offense. So they might

1229
00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:15,960
Speaker 2: have a drive where they hit an explosive to Jalen Rager,

1230
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:18,640
Speaker 2: or a drive where they get a short field and

1231
00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:20,120
Speaker 2: they make a couple of plays to get in the

1232
00:57:20,200 --> 00:57:23,320
Speaker 2: end zone. But in order to strenk together four or

1233
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:25,560
Speaker 2: five scoring drives in the game, which is what you

1234
00:57:25,600 --> 00:57:28,520
Speaker 2: need to do against the good teams, they he's not

1235
00:57:28,680 --> 00:57:32,400
Speaker 2: consistent enough within the structure of the offense to be

1236
00:57:32,480 --> 00:57:35,000
Speaker 2: able to do that. And there's hesitation to his game

1237
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:37,400
Speaker 2: that he's late to things. He doesn't see things pre

1238
00:57:37,520 --> 00:57:41,120
Speaker 2: snap quick enough and that's why he doesn't play as

1239
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:46,560
Speaker 2: well in rhythm. And in this matchup, the Bills they're

1240
00:57:46,600 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 2: a zone defense. They play zone like eighty percent of

1241
00:57:49,160 --> 00:57:52,560
Speaker 2: the time. Right, they're very zone heavy defense. And Mac

1242
00:57:52,680 --> 00:57:55,000
Speaker 2: Jones was able to beat the Bills earlier this year

1243
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 2: with efficiency, just get the ball out, dink and dunk.

1244
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:01,480
Speaker 2: You know, two point one to nine second time to release.

1245
00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:07,000
Speaker 2: Mac almost averaged a second more in terms of average

1246
00:58:07,040 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 2: time to throw. Bailey Zappi was three point zero three

1247
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,560
Speaker 2: seconds in this game. Average time to throw Mac was

1248
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 2: two point one nine And.

1249
00:58:13,680 --> 00:58:15,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, over three seconds is too long.

1250
00:58:15,480 --> 00:58:18,600
Speaker 2: You can't hold the ball for three seconds with against

1251
00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:22,880
Speaker 2: this Bill's defense, the way that they play structurally, the

1252
00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:26,000
Speaker 2: offensive line being in the state that it's in, that

1253
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:28,160
Speaker 2: I thought invited a lot of the pressure rate in

1254
00:58:28,160 --> 00:58:31,520
Speaker 2: this game. Alex is fifty eight, which is terrible, But

1255
00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:33,720
Speaker 2: I thought that Bailey Zappi invited a lot of that

1256
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:34,560
Speaker 2: pressure in this game.

1257
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,080
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, he by holding the ball so and

1258
00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:38,960
Speaker 1: that's not just this game like he does that.

1259
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:42,960
Speaker 2: That's it that he's the biggest of downs. Bailey Zappi.

1260
00:58:43,040 --> 00:58:44,400
Speaker 2: Who do you have in this game?

1261
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:49,640
Speaker 1: So yeah, I had Bailey Zappi number one. I had well,

1262
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:51,400
Speaker 1: I don't think I had him as number two, but

1263
00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:53,800
Speaker 1: Chad Ryland.

1264
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fair.

1265
00:58:54,800 --> 00:58:57,680
Speaker 1: I said that whole thing last week about hey, maybe

1266
00:58:57,720 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 1: you know he hits this kick and it gets some

1267
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 1: mentally and he builds off that.

1268
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:06,120
Speaker 2: Nope, there's nothing like setting up running a concept on

1269
00:59:06,200 --> 00:59:09,200
Speaker 2: third down to get yourself into field goal range just

1270
00:59:09,200 --> 00:59:11,360
Speaker 2: to have your kicker miss the kick right like so

1271
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:15,520
Speaker 2: they ran it was third and ten from around midfield.

1272
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:18,200
Speaker 2: They ran like a quick game concept to gaziki to

1273
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:20,000
Speaker 2: make it a forty seven yard field goal to get

1274
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:24,440
Speaker 2: it inside fifty for Chad Ryland. Missus the kick? Yeah, brutal.

1275
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:27,520
Speaker 1: What did you think of will record? Who Alabamas kicker?

1276
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:28,920
Speaker 2: Oh?

1277
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:28,480
Speaker 1: Uh?

1278
00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 2: You know I didn't watch it.

1279
00:59:31,040 --> 00:59:33,040
Speaker 1: I know you did. I know I'm not even gonna

1280
00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:35,360
Speaker 1: I'm not even gonna try to have a take right.

1281
00:59:35,440 --> 00:59:37,800
Speaker 1: Who else you got? You know? I gotta do it?

1282
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:38,680
Speaker 1: What Josh hal?

1283
00:59:39,800 --> 00:59:42,240
Speaker 2: Okay, we'll get to that in okay, because I we

1284
00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:43,800
Speaker 2: we have we both have opinions on this.

1285
00:59:43,960 --> 00:59:45,520
Speaker 1: So I get to that and do your last one.

1286
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:50,960
Speaker 2: My last one was I I don't know it's it's

1287
00:59:51,320 --> 00:59:54,200
Speaker 2: it's Antonio Maffi and David Andrews. But I don't know

1288
00:59:54,200 --> 00:59:57,560
Speaker 2: how much of it on David Andrews is because of Antonio.

1289
00:59:57,560 --> 01:00:00,440
Speaker 1: Mon, don't you always say that, Like you said this

1290
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:01,959
Speaker 1: to me once when we were talking about I forget

1291
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:03,440
Speaker 1: some play where like a block was missed and you

1292
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:05,400
Speaker 1: were like, went, in doubt, David Andrews did the right thing.

1293
01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:07,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, So normally I would think that, but I think

1294
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:09,400
Speaker 2: there was a lot of plays in this game where

1295
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:11,080
Speaker 2: I feel like I had to put the pressure on

1296
01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:13,200
Speaker 2: David Andrews, Like I just didn't have a choice. I

1297
01:00:13,240 --> 01:00:16,520
Speaker 2: was like, it's a game, right, It's like a three

1298
01:00:16,520 --> 01:00:19,760
Speaker 2: man stunt, and David Andrews gets like bull rushed by the.

1299
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:21,680
Speaker 1: Rat He did get spun around a few times in

1300
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: this game.

1301
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 2: I'm just like, I had to put it on him.

1302
01:00:24,080 --> 01:00:26,920
Speaker 2: So between the two of them, however you want to

1303
01:00:26,920 --> 01:00:29,400
Speaker 2: divvy them up, is up to you. Between the two

1304
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:33,160
Speaker 2: of them, they allowed two sacks and eleven quarterback pressures

1305
01:00:33,560 --> 01:00:36,280
Speaker 2: between those two players. The rest of the line was

1306
01:00:36,280 --> 01:00:39,080
Speaker 2: actually okay in this game for the most part. Not great,

1307
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:43,880
Speaker 2: but okay. Vederian Lowe's been quietly fine at left tackle.

1308
01:00:44,520 --> 01:00:46,960
Speaker 2: I said, fine, don't come at me. I didn't say

1309
01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:49,240
Speaker 2: he was Joe Thomas. I said he was fine, all right.

1310
01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:53,120
Speaker 2: Mike onn Wnu was okay in this game until the end,

1311
01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:56,040
Speaker 2: he gave up some pressure on that final drive that

1312
01:00:56,120 --> 01:00:58,440
Speaker 2: they needed him to be better in that big spot

1313
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:01,200
Speaker 2: and he wasn't, which I think is disappointing. And then

1314
01:01:01,240 --> 01:01:03,800
Speaker 2: I thought Citiso was probably their best all around lineman

1315
01:01:03,840 --> 01:01:05,880
Speaker 2: in this game. I think that he's put together some

1316
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 2: good film. What I wonder in this week eight team

1317
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:12,720
Speaker 2: game against the Jets, do the Patriots give Jake Andrews

1318
01:01:13,120 --> 01:01:16,000
Speaker 2: an extended look at left guard over Mafy because I

1319
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:18,840
Speaker 2: thought he was pretty solid in his thirteen snaps in

1320
01:01:18,880 --> 01:01:25,120
Speaker 2: this game. He's got just a better just technique, like

1321
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,200
Speaker 2: center of gravity, Like he's a lower player. You know,

1322
01:01:28,200 --> 01:01:30,560
Speaker 2: he doesn't play as high as Mafi does. He's a

1323
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,880
Speaker 2: little bit more foot speed to move side to side.

1324
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:37,080
Speaker 2: And you also just like see the wrestling background. You know,

1325
01:01:37,120 --> 01:01:40,560
Speaker 2: he grapples with guys, He torques guys to the ground

1326
01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:42,600
Speaker 2: like he does those types of things that you can

1327
01:01:42,640 --> 01:01:44,640
Speaker 2: see from the wrestler background. So I liked what I

1328
01:01:44,640 --> 01:01:47,360
Speaker 2: saw from Jake Andrews, which I wonder if maybe they

1329
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:48,960
Speaker 2: give him a little bit more run in this game

1330
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:51,240
Speaker 2: to see what they have with an extended look on

1331
01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:56,600
Speaker 2: the film Mafi is. I am going from like, oh,

1332
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:00,280
Speaker 2: you know, he could be something to project player to.

1333
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:02,760
Speaker 2: Now I'm concerned whether or not he's an NFL offensive

1334
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:07,280
Speaker 2: line His foot speed is a major major issue. Okay,

1335
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:10,320
Speaker 2: unless he loses some weight and gets faster and lighter

1336
01:02:10,360 --> 01:02:12,520
Speaker 2: on his feet, he's not going to start in the league.

1337
01:02:12,560 --> 01:02:14,760
Speaker 2: Maybe he's a backup guard, you know, in the league

1338
01:02:14,800 --> 01:02:18,720
Speaker 2: and makes a name, you know, career for himself that way.

1339
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:22,360
Speaker 2: But I worry about him in general in terms of

1340
01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:26,120
Speaker 2: what's his future and where can what's his ceiling? You know,

1341
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,560
Speaker 2: what do we realistically expect from him? Do you have

1342
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:29,920
Speaker 2: any more downs on there?

1343
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:30,280
Speaker 3: No?

1344
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 2: It's it all right. So do you want to talk

1345
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:34,200
Speaker 2: about Josh Allen? Do you want to go on your

1346
01:02:34,280 --> 01:02:34,840
Speaker 2: victory lass?

1347
01:02:34,840 --> 01:02:36,840
Speaker 1: He wasn't good in this game? He was he got

1348
01:02:36,880 --> 01:02:39,520
Speaker 1: sped up early. He was sailing the ball like in

1349
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:41,400
Speaker 1: fifteen twenty yards over receivers heads.

1350
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:41,960
Speaker 2: I agree with that.

1351
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 1: Struggled to be a factor in the run game. I thought,

1352
01:02:44,720 --> 01:02:48,720
Speaker 1: outside of the quarterback sneaks on the goal line. I'll

1353
01:02:48,760 --> 01:02:52,680
Speaker 1: give you two stat lines. So Josh Allen finished fifteen

1354
01:02:52,680 --> 01:02:54,760
Speaker 1: of thirty for one hundred and sixty nine yards, two

1355
01:02:54,760 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 1: touchdowns and a pick. There's another Josh Allen game where

1356
01:02:57,600 --> 01:02:59,520
Speaker 1: he finished fifteen of thirty for one hundred and forty

1357
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:01,160
Speaker 1: five yards. Do you know what game that was?

1358
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:01,479
Speaker 2: What?

1359
01:03:01,600 --> 01:03:02,760
Speaker 1: The Snow the win game?

1360
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:03,360
Speaker 2: The win game.

1361
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:05,360
Speaker 1: Josh Allen had the same stat line in that game

1362
01:03:05,360 --> 01:03:07,560
Speaker 1: that he did in the win game. He's now gotten

1363
01:03:07,600 --> 01:03:09,160
Speaker 1: beat by the Patriots twice in a row. This team

1364
01:03:09,240 --> 01:03:11,720
Speaker 1: have a plan for him. Other teams seem to have

1365
01:03:11,760 --> 01:03:15,080
Speaker 1: a plan for me. He struggled against the Chargers last week. Yeah,

1366
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:18,200
Speaker 1: he looks banged up. This is every single year with

1367
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:20,480
Speaker 1: Josh Allen. It's not sustainable. I try to tell you

1368
01:03:20,520 --> 01:03:22,760
Speaker 1: people that there's too much of his game is about

1369
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:26,000
Speaker 1: taking contact that he can't like play at that level

1370
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:27,840
Speaker 1: for a full season and it ultimately doesn't end.

1371
01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:29,960
Speaker 2: So I don't know if it's necessarily that for me

1372
01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:32,600
Speaker 2: I I am. If I was a Bills fan, I

1373
01:03:32,600 --> 01:03:35,040
Speaker 2: would be a little bit concerned about Josh Allen. Not

1374
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:37,800
Speaker 2: that like the Bills are gonna be a winning team

1375
01:03:37,840 --> 01:03:39,440
Speaker 2: with him as their quarterback because he's.

1376
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:41,600
Speaker 1: Good enough to do that, but are they gonna win anything.

1377
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:43,200
Speaker 2: That that piece of it? I would be a little

1378
01:03:43,200 --> 01:03:43,920
Speaker 2: bit more concerned too.

1379
01:03:43,960 --> 01:03:48,680
Speaker 1: Who Josh Allen is. Joel empie without an MVP really

1380
01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:51,440
Speaker 1: does some really impressive stuff. But you get into the

1381
01:03:51,440 --> 01:03:54,080
Speaker 1: playoffs and he's banged up because you're asking to do

1382
01:03:54,160 --> 01:03:56,640
Speaker 1: too much and his game just doesn't translate to the postseason.

1383
01:03:56,640 --> 01:03:59,360
Speaker 2: It's not a bad comp I what I see with

1384
01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:03,000
Speaker 2: Josh Allen now is regression, Like he's regressed back to

1385
01:04:03,080 --> 01:04:07,040
Speaker 2: being a wild player. Yeah, he is accuracy, his mechanics

1386
01:04:07,080 --> 01:04:10,280
Speaker 2: aren't tuned up anymore. He's wild with his ball placement,

1387
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:13,840
Speaker 2: his accuracy, he's wild with his decision making. Again, this

1388
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:16,960
Speaker 2: is like, so you're I'm trying to think of the

1389
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:19,760
Speaker 2: years for him. This is like year three, Josh Allen.

1390
01:04:19,880 --> 01:04:22,840
Speaker 2: I want to say where it was. You were starting

1391
01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:27,080
Speaker 2: to see some of the high end stuff, right, but

1392
01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:29,880
Speaker 2: it wasn't all the whole package wasn't together yet, Like

1393
01:04:29,960 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 2: year two, year three, Yeah, you're one. He was a

1394
01:04:32,160 --> 01:04:34,200
Speaker 2: disaster as a rookie. He he as a project right

1395
01:04:34,480 --> 01:04:36,760
Speaker 2: year two, year three, you're starting to see, Okay, this

1396
01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:40,960
Speaker 2: guy has the elements of a franchise quarterback, but he's

1397
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:43,560
Speaker 2: still trying to put it all together. Now we get

1398
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:47,160
Speaker 2: to this point and from like twenty to twenty one,

1399
01:04:47,200 --> 01:04:50,080
Speaker 2: he's an MVP candidate. Right, he's one of the top

1400
01:04:50,160 --> 01:04:53,040
Speaker 2: five quarterbacks in the NFL. Now, I feel like he's

1401
01:04:53,080 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 2: gone back down to He has those moments, those flashes,

1402
01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:01,080
Speaker 2: but it's not ever consistent and nothing feels right about

1403
01:05:01,080 --> 01:05:04,480
Speaker 2: his play. He has looked antsy, sped up, whatever you

1404
01:05:04,520 --> 01:05:06,400
Speaker 2: want to call it. In both games. I feel like

1405
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:08,640
Speaker 2: against the Patriots he made more plays the first time

1406
01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:11,440
Speaker 2: around than in this game. I felt like, But in general,

1407
01:05:11,720 --> 01:05:14,960
Speaker 2: I think that he's been flustered against the Patriots this year.

1408
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:17,400
Speaker 1: It was never sustainable. It was never going to be

1409
01:05:17,880 --> 01:05:19,440
Speaker 1: put it. I put a lot of it on coaching.

1410
01:05:19,840 --> 01:05:22,320
Speaker 1: I do well, but that's that's part of it. You've

1411
01:05:22,360 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 1: got the good quarterbacks, you lose your offensive coordinator, you

1412
01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:25,560
Speaker 1: keep going.

1413
01:05:25,880 --> 01:05:28,320
Speaker 2: If I'm the Bills, and if I'm a Patriots fan,

1414
01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:30,520
Speaker 2: I hope the Bills don't do this. But if I'm

1415
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:34,080
Speaker 2: the Bills, I'm firing Sean McDermott and I'm hiring Ben

1416
01:05:34,120 --> 01:05:35,000
Speaker 2: Johnson tomorrow.

1417
01:05:35,160 --> 01:05:36,840
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this, what if Brian Daball gets

1418
01:05:36,880 --> 01:05:37,200
Speaker 1: let go in.

1419
01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:40,360
Speaker 2: New York, if he wants to come back as their OC, no.

1420
01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:42,439
Speaker 1: Is there like as a head coach? No, I would

1421
01:05:42,520 --> 01:05:44,120
Speaker 1: make him the head coach obviously you bring him back

1422
01:05:44,160 --> 01:05:45,800
Speaker 1: as the OC. I would do anything to get Brian

1423
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:46,760
Speaker 1: Dayball back in the building.

1424
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:51,760
Speaker 2: I just feel like Josh Allen needs see Ben Johnson

1425
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:54,200
Speaker 2: would like put him in the system like he has

1426
01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:56,480
Speaker 2: done with Jared Goff, and he would get him to

1427
01:05:56,520 --> 01:05:58,520
Speaker 2: play under control, and he would get him to play

1428
01:05:58,520 --> 01:05:59,240
Speaker 2: within the framework.

1429
01:05:59,760 --> 01:06:03,840
Speaker 1: Like but he's not gonna be as that's not Josh Allen.

1430
01:06:03,880 --> 01:06:05,400
Speaker 1: You're asking Josh a Josh Allen.

1431
01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:07,840
Speaker 2: But Brian Dable was able to like walk the tight

1432
01:06:07,960 --> 01:06:11,160
Speaker 2: row right of allowing him to loosen the reins at

1433
01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:15,200
Speaker 2: times when they needed him to. But their their actual

1434
01:06:15,360 --> 01:06:18,920
Speaker 2: base offense was still Josh Allen running instruction.

1435
01:06:19,040 --> 01:06:21,920
Speaker 1: Can I give you a really weird one who I

1436
01:06:21,920 --> 01:06:25,640
Speaker 1: think would be great with Josh Allen. Yeah, Josh McDaniels.

1437
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:27,840
Speaker 1: And here's why. Yeah, maybe I've talked about this before.

1438
01:06:27,920 --> 01:06:30,120
Speaker 1: There's one big reason. One thing I think McDaniels as

1439
01:06:30,160 --> 01:06:33,280
Speaker 1: well for all of the mess the twenty twenty Patriots

1440
01:06:33,320 --> 01:06:36,240
Speaker 1: offense was the Cam Newton offense, right. Yeah, One thing

1441
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:41,520
Speaker 1: I think they did really well was balance was incorporate

1442
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:45,640
Speaker 1: Cam Newton running into the offense without making that the

1443
01:06:45,800 --> 01:06:48,040
Speaker 1: entire offense. YEA and they had a real running game

1444
01:06:48,080 --> 01:06:51,160
Speaker 1: behind it, and they were still maybe like they didn't

1445
01:06:51,160 --> 01:06:53,120
Speaker 1: have the talent to execute some of the concepts, but

1446
01:06:53,160 --> 01:06:55,960
Speaker 1: the concepts all made sense. I've said this before with

1447
01:06:56,040 --> 01:06:58,640
Speaker 1: Josh Allen. I think one of the big things that

1448
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:01,600
Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of people don't understand is

1449
01:07:02,680 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 1: there's this if you run him too much, as electric

1450
01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:06,960
Speaker 1: as he is as a runner, and I think that's

1451
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:09,080
Speaker 1: where he's at his most dangerous. If you run him

1452
01:07:09,120 --> 01:07:11,720
Speaker 1: too much, he takes these hits, he gets banged up,

1453
01:07:11,720 --> 01:07:15,360
Speaker 1: and he just he can't sustain it. If you have

1454
01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:18,320
Speaker 1: him not run as much and throw too much, he's

1455
01:07:18,360 --> 01:07:21,120
Speaker 1: just not that good of a passer where he can

1456
01:07:21,160 --> 01:07:22,920
Speaker 1: rely on only throwing the ball because he makes too

1457
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:26,120
Speaker 1: many mistakes. And for three or four years now, I

1458
01:07:26,120 --> 01:07:28,760
Speaker 1: feel like Bill's fans and Josh Allen fans have been

1459
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:31,720
Speaker 1: kind of expecting somebody to just find this equilibrium. The

1460
01:07:32,000 --> 01:07:33,400
Speaker 1: equilibrium may not exist.

1461
01:07:33,520 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 2: No, the equilibrium Brian Dable found it.

1462
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:37,000
Speaker 1: I think he got close to it. He didn't find

1463
01:07:37,000 --> 01:07:38,959
Speaker 1: it because they didn't win anything. Okay, but but here's

1464
01:07:39,400 --> 01:07:42,680
Speaker 1: points against Kansas City. I think if there are ten

1465
01:07:42,720 --> 01:07:45,800
Speaker 1: seconds away, if anybody could find that equilibrium. I think

1466
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:48,280
Speaker 1: Josh McDaniels is the kind of guy that has his

1467
01:07:48,320 --> 01:07:50,120
Speaker 1: finger on that kind of so I.

1468
01:07:50,080 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 2: Think in twenty one, especially twenty towards the end, and

1469
01:07:53,800 --> 01:07:58,080
Speaker 2: then obviously in twenty one Josh Allen seventy five percent

1470
01:07:58,120 --> 01:08:01,600
Speaker 2: of Josh Allen's like, just let's call it passing yards, right,

1471
01:08:01,920 --> 01:08:05,640
Speaker 2: we're still in structure. In rhythm throws, he was making

1472
01:08:05,640 --> 01:08:08,960
Speaker 2: throws from the pocket. Yeah, Then when they needed him

1473
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:12,720
Speaker 2: to be Superman in the extended play playground stuff, he

1474
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:15,600
Speaker 2: did that. But he did it he picked his spots

1475
01:08:15,640 --> 01:08:17,639
Speaker 2: with it, right, and that was I think the difference.

1476
01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:22,800
Speaker 2: Now now he is not making the rhythm throws as

1477
01:08:22,840 --> 01:08:27,080
Speaker 2: consistently as he was, and he's just relying a lot

1478
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:30,080
Speaker 2: more on the extended play stuff, which is getting him

1479
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:32,040
Speaker 2: to play like out of control because he thinks he

1480
01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:32,920
Speaker 2: has to do everything on it.

1481
01:08:33,120 --> 01:08:34,880
Speaker 1: You know what. The other part of the problem is

1482
01:08:34,880 --> 01:08:36,400
Speaker 1: Stefan dis good anymore.

1483
01:08:36,640 --> 01:08:37,519
Speaker 2: That could be part of it.

1484
01:08:37,560 --> 01:08:39,880
Speaker 1: I've said for a while now that he is actually

1485
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:41,960
Speaker 1: he was the best player in that offense. He was

1486
01:08:41,960 --> 01:08:43,479
Speaker 1: the player that was really making that offense.

1487
01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:46,160
Speaker 2: Also, I just have to like, just because you know,

1488
01:08:46,240 --> 01:08:49,360
Speaker 2: I'm a Josh Allen fan. He does have He does

1489
01:08:49,439 --> 01:08:52,360
Speaker 2: have forty two total touchdowns this year, like we're talking

1490
01:08:52,360 --> 01:08:55,160
Speaker 2: about him like he's Mac Jones. He does have forty

1491
01:08:55,200 --> 01:08:56,439
Speaker 2: two total touchdowns this year.

1492
01:08:56,479 --> 01:08:58,880
Speaker 1: But what's it. There's a lot of empty scoring in there.

1493
01:08:59,200 --> 01:09:01,479
Speaker 2: I don't think there is, like forty two touchdowns, has

1494
01:09:01,520 --> 01:09:03,680
Speaker 2: forty two touchdowns. No matter which way you slice it,

1495
01:09:04,280 --> 01:09:06,800
Speaker 2: he's still near the top of the league in most

1496
01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:12,320
Speaker 2: efficiency metrics. He just is all or nothing. It's peaks

1497
01:09:12,320 --> 01:09:15,760
Speaker 2: and valleys, and Brian Dable was able to put him

1498
01:09:15,800 --> 01:09:17,280
Speaker 2: in a system. I think they ran a lot more

1499
01:09:17,439 --> 01:09:20,960
Speaker 2: RPO on early down with Brian Dable too, where he

1500
01:09:21,200 --> 01:09:24,559
Speaker 2: was making throws from the pocket on first and second

1501
01:09:24,560 --> 01:09:26,800
Speaker 2: down in rhythm and that was like the basis of

1502
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:29,960
Speaker 2: their offense. And then third down was where him and

1503
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:31,960
Speaker 2: Diggs would go to work, right Like that's when they

1504
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:34,320
Speaker 2: would allow him to just kind of do what he

1505
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:36,639
Speaker 2: needed to do to pick up the first downs. Now,

1506
01:09:36,720 --> 01:09:39,959
Speaker 2: that's like their whole offense is just Josh Allen being Superman,

1507
01:09:40,280 --> 01:09:43,200
Speaker 2: and he can't sustain that element of it. I'm not

1508
01:09:43,200 --> 01:09:46,160
Speaker 2: sure if it's necessarily as much about the running as

1509
01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:49,280
Speaker 2: it is that he's being asked to do a lot

1510
01:09:49,439 --> 01:09:52,280
Speaker 2: because the scheme is not propping him up enough. And

1511
01:09:52,479 --> 01:09:54,680
Speaker 2: I think that that's why if you put him in

1512
01:09:55,000 --> 01:10:01,200
Speaker 2: Brian Johnson's offense or Ben Johnson excuse me, McDaniel's terrible idea, yeah,

1513
01:10:01,360 --> 01:10:04,559
Speaker 2: table coming back like one of those offensive minded coaches

1514
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:07,600
Speaker 2: that can build a structure around him, I think he

1515
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:08,800
Speaker 2: would be much better off.

1516
01:10:08,840 --> 01:10:10,759
Speaker 1: But also just and to bring it back to the Patriots,

1517
01:10:10,800 --> 01:10:12,519
Speaker 1: this is why. And we talked about this a couple

1518
01:10:12,560 --> 01:10:15,200
Speaker 1: weeks ago, but I want to go back to it.

1519
01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:18,559
Speaker 1: It is so dangerous, not dangerous, but like the whole

1520
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:20,800
Speaker 1: game we were playing. All right, Well, look you look

1521
01:10:20,840 --> 01:10:24,040
Speaker 1: in the AFC, and there's there's Josh Allen, and there's

1522
01:10:24,040 --> 01:10:26,320
Speaker 1: Patrick Mahomes. You know, there's the Bills, and there's the Chiefs,

1523
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:28,919
Speaker 1: and there's the Bengals with Burrow, and there's the Jaguars

1524
01:10:28,920 --> 01:10:30,760
Speaker 1: with Trevor Lawrence. Like there's all these great teams. The

1525
01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:33,160
Speaker 1: Patriots are never gonna be able to compete again the

1526
01:10:33,280 --> 01:10:35,760
Speaker 1: NFL for like ten years. The NFL does not work

1527
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:38,040
Speaker 1: like that is a year two year business. And outside

1528
01:10:38,040 --> 01:10:41,439
Speaker 1: of the Ravens, all of those teams we talked about

1529
01:10:41,600 --> 01:10:45,559
Speaker 1: is you know, not being viable options fell apart, you can.

1530
01:10:45,840 --> 01:10:48,000
Speaker 1: And meanwhile, you have teams like the Cleveland Browns with

1531
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:51,280
Speaker 1: Joe Flacco, who are kind of a wagon right now.

1532
01:10:52,120 --> 01:10:54,880
Speaker 1: So to try to play that game ahead, and as

1533
01:10:54,920 --> 01:10:56,920
Speaker 1: it relates to this team, people saying, oh, well, the

1534
01:10:56,920 --> 01:10:58,960
Speaker 1: Patriots should go for the long term rebuild and really

1535
01:10:59,040 --> 01:11:00,400
Speaker 1: draw it out, because they're not to be able to

1536
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:03,680
Speaker 1: compete for a while anyway. You draft the right quarterback,

1537
01:11:04,200 --> 01:11:07,040
Speaker 1: you hit on a receiver, you bring this defense back.

1538
01:11:08,720 --> 01:11:10,960
Speaker 1: You gotta figure out the offense line. That's not all easy.

1539
01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:12,720
Speaker 1: You can do that in a year or two. Now

1540
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:14,400
Speaker 1: you're cooking. You don't know who's gonna fall off in

1541
01:11:14,439 --> 01:11:15,600
Speaker 1: a year or two. You don't know who's still going

1542
01:11:15,680 --> 01:11:17,599
Speaker 1: to be around, who's not gonna be around, the guys getting.

1543
01:11:18,280 --> 01:11:21,040
Speaker 2: Let's let's call it as it is. As much as

1544
01:11:21,040 --> 01:11:23,719
Speaker 2: I would much rather the Patriots just get really good again.

1545
01:11:24,400 --> 01:11:27,040
Speaker 2: The Bills falling apart is good for the Patriots. Oh yeah,

1546
01:11:27,080 --> 01:11:30,960
Speaker 2: it's good for them. If if Josh I hate this,

1547
01:11:31,080 --> 01:11:33,320
Speaker 2: I just mean I wish the Patriots like just beat them.

1548
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:35,720
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, you know, like I wish it was like

1549
01:11:36,120 --> 01:11:39,960
Speaker 2: it's like the Colts, like back in the day.

1550
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:42,080
Speaker 1: I just you want to beat the best.

1551
01:11:42,160 --> 01:11:44,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just wanted the Patriots. I'd much rather the

1552
01:11:44,840 --> 01:11:47,080
Speaker 2: Patriots be so good that the Bills just can't beat them,

1553
01:11:47,360 --> 01:11:49,439
Speaker 2: And the Bills had to fall apart for the Patriots

1554
01:11:49,439 --> 01:11:53,680
Speaker 2: to get back to relevancy, the Bills falling apart. And

1555
01:11:53,720 --> 01:11:56,800
Speaker 2: I don't know if they're truly falling apart, but I

1556
01:11:56,840 --> 01:12:00,760
Speaker 2: think Sean McDermott if I was the Bill, because you're

1557
01:12:00,800 --> 01:12:04,519
Speaker 2: you're you're married to Josh Allen. Like Josh Allen's gonna

1558
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:07,600
Speaker 2: be your quarterback. You're not starting over at quarterback. That's ridiculous.

1559
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:10,640
Speaker 2: Like Josh Allen's your guy. So everything that you do

1560
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:12,639
Speaker 2: as an organization has to be to get the best

1561
01:12:12,640 --> 01:12:15,280
Speaker 2: out of Josh Allen and win with Josh Allen.

1562
01:12:15,640 --> 01:12:17,439
Speaker 1: And I just don't we said that about Mac Jones

1563
01:12:17,479 --> 01:12:19,400
Speaker 1: were being Mac Jones apul y. I just don't know

1564
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:21,640
Speaker 1: if if McDermott it's the right guy for that job. No,

1565
01:12:21,720 --> 01:12:23,479
Speaker 1: he's not, it's been clear he's not. But they gave

1566
01:12:23,560 --> 01:12:25,200
Speaker 1: an extension last year, so he's gonna be there for

1567
01:12:25,200 --> 01:12:26,040
Speaker 1: at least one more year.

1568
01:12:26,120 --> 01:12:30,120
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe I think that they I made this comparison

1569
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:33,880
Speaker 2: yesterday he's Mark Jackson right, like he got them this far.

1570
01:12:34,479 --> 01:12:37,400
Speaker 2: He got them through the developmental stage as being a

1571
01:12:37,439 --> 01:12:40,840
Speaker 2: young quarterback with Josh Allen. Now they need Steve Kerr.

1572
01:12:40,880 --> 01:12:42,719
Speaker 2: They need the guy to put them over the top.

1573
01:12:43,120 --> 01:12:46,120
Speaker 2: If I was a Patriots fan, I would be more

1574
01:12:46,160 --> 01:12:49,439
Speaker 2: afraid of hearing that they fired Sean McDermott than that

1575
01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:52,240
Speaker 2: he's staying oh yeah, absolutely, Like because the first two

1576
01:12:52,240 --> 01:12:54,280
Speaker 2: guys they should call here, Gerd Mayo, and then if

1577
01:12:54,280 --> 01:12:57,400
Speaker 2: he's not here anymore, Bill Belichick. Yeah, well, they should

1578
01:12:57,400 --> 01:13:00,519
Speaker 2: call an offensive coach. They should call they.

1579
01:13:00,800 --> 01:13:01,559
Speaker 1: Bill could figure it out.

1580
01:13:01,560 --> 01:13:02,599
Speaker 2: They should hire Ben Jonson.

1581
01:13:02,600 --> 01:13:03,320
Speaker 1: Bill could figure out.

1582
01:13:03,400 --> 01:13:05,599
Speaker 2: Now Bill, Bill would have Josh Allen running the ball

1583
01:13:05,640 --> 01:13:06,760
Speaker 2: fifty times. It wouldn't make.

1584
01:13:06,760 --> 01:13:10,799
Speaker 1: Sense, no, because he'd who would he hires his offense coordinator? Maybe,

1585
01:13:10,840 --> 01:13:11,880
Speaker 1: but Josh McDaniels.

1586
01:13:12,080 --> 01:13:14,559
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know. Bill is Bill is?

1587
01:13:14,640 --> 01:13:15,800
Speaker 1: Bill's not that far gone?

1588
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,800
Speaker 2: Come on now, Offensively, Bill would have no idea what

1589
01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:19,559
Speaker 2: to do with Josh Allen.

1590
01:13:19,720 --> 01:13:22,280
Speaker 1: He'd have Josh McDaniels back, though, I guess.

1591
01:13:22,040 --> 01:13:23,599
Speaker 2: I don't know. All Right, let's get to the phones

1592
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:25,880
Speaker 2: and we'll talk a lot of questions pouring in Alex

1593
01:13:25,920 --> 01:13:29,479
Speaker 2: about Pennix. Yeah, so let's see if I Kendall in

1594
01:13:29,520 --> 01:13:31,280
Speaker 2: North Carolina is still there. Left him on hole for

1595
01:13:31,280 --> 01:13:38,519
Speaker 2: a while. What's up, Kendall? Kendall going once? All right?

1596
01:13:38,720 --> 01:13:40,360
Speaker 2: Call us back, Kendall. We'll get you on the air.

1597
01:13:40,520 --> 01:13:42,240
Speaker 2: Chris is in Texas. What's up, Chris?

1598
01:13:43,680 --> 01:13:46,640
Speaker 4: How's it going, guys? I got a quick question for you, guys,

1599
01:13:47,479 --> 01:13:51,439
Speaker 4: assuming that Williams, May Daniels and Marmara Harrison Junior taking

1600
01:13:51,479 --> 01:13:54,799
Speaker 4: with the fourth. With the first four picks, I'm assuming

1601
01:13:54,840 --> 01:13:57,240
Speaker 4: get the fifth. We're gonna beat the Jets. We always do, honestly,

1602
01:13:57,840 --> 01:14:00,439
Speaker 4: and I think Washington's going to lose. So I'm gona

1603
01:14:00,439 --> 01:14:03,120
Speaker 4: assume you get the fifth. Would you draft Panics with

1604
01:14:03,160 --> 01:14:06,520
Speaker 4: a fifth overall pick, assuming that the medicals like check out?

1605
01:14:07,000 --> 01:14:10,760
Speaker 4: Or would you draft the tackle or trade down the

1606
01:14:10,800 --> 01:14:12,840
Speaker 4: PX wold be taken with a sixth overall pick and

1607
01:14:12,920 --> 01:14:13,479
Speaker 4: we'll be left.

1608
01:14:15,240 --> 01:14:16,600
Speaker 2: Thanks for the call, Chris. So I guess that's a

1609
01:14:16,600 --> 01:14:18,720
Speaker 2: good segue because I wanted to talk about Penix next.

1610
01:14:18,920 --> 01:14:19,040
Speaker 1: Ye.

1611
01:14:20,240 --> 01:14:22,160
Speaker 2: Do we want to go scenarios first or do we

1612
01:14:22,200 --> 01:14:24,519
Speaker 2: want to like just break down the game and how

1613
01:14:24,520 --> 01:14:26,479
Speaker 2: he played. I don't know which way to take it.

1614
01:14:26,600 --> 01:14:29,040
Speaker 1: So well, let me say this first about the Jets.

1615
01:14:29,240 --> 01:14:31,240
Speaker 1: And everybody says, oh, the Patriots gonna beat the Jets.

1616
01:14:31,280 --> 01:14:32,360
Speaker 1: They beat them fifteen times.

1617
01:14:32,200 --> 01:14:33,719
Speaker 2: In a row, They're gonna beat the Jets.

1618
01:14:33,960 --> 01:14:36,080
Speaker 1: Let me just throw something out here for you. It

1619
01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:39,640
Speaker 1: would be so so that streak, by the way, is

1620
01:14:39,680 --> 01:14:43,680
Speaker 1: a major thing for Jets fans. They can't stand that

1621
01:14:44,080 --> 01:14:48,400
Speaker 1: when when Aaron Rodgers signed, one of the first things

1622
01:14:48,439 --> 01:14:51,240
Speaker 1: that Jets fans started talking about was the streak against

1623
01:14:51,280 --> 01:14:53,640
Speaker 1: the Patriots is finally over and all of that. It

1624
01:14:53,680 --> 01:14:55,160
Speaker 1: would be and I know you think they're gonna beat

1625
01:14:55,160 --> 01:14:55,439
Speaker 1: the Jets.

1626
01:14:55,439 --> 01:14:57,120
Speaker 2: Bit let me just I don't think they're just gonna

1627
01:14:57,120 --> 01:14:57,599
Speaker 2: beat the Jets.

1628
01:14:57,600 --> 01:14:59,559
Speaker 1: Okay, but just listen to me and I I they're

1629
01:14:59,560 --> 01:15:01,240
Speaker 1: playing for and all that. But yeah, would it not

1630
01:15:01,320 --> 01:15:04,000
Speaker 1: be the most Jets thing ever to have this streak

1631
01:15:04,240 --> 01:15:06,680
Speaker 1: that they just absolutely cannot wait to get rid of

1632
01:15:06,920 --> 01:15:09,160
Speaker 1: and they finally end it by beating the Patriots in

1633
01:15:09,200 --> 01:15:11,880
Speaker 1: a meaningless game that actually helps the Patriots get a

1634
01:15:11,880 --> 01:15:15,160
Speaker 1: franchise quarterback. Would that not be the most Jets thing ever?

1635
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:20,719
Speaker 2: A little bit? That's fair. So with Penix to start,

1636
01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:23,320
Speaker 2: I guess with this with the play itself, because I

1637
01:15:23,320 --> 01:15:26,200
Speaker 2: think scenarios. I appreciate the call, Chris, but like, we

1638
01:15:26,200 --> 01:15:27,840
Speaker 2: could do this all day long. Of like if the

1639
01:15:27,840 --> 01:15:30,040
Speaker 2: Patriots are picking fifth and these four guys are off

1640
01:15:30,080 --> 01:15:32,760
Speaker 2: the board, like what do you do? And we will

1641
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:34,679
Speaker 2: do that all day long for the next six months.

1642
01:15:34,720 --> 01:15:38,479
Speaker 2: I'm sure six months, like three and a half, four four? Yeah,

1643
01:15:38,479 --> 01:15:42,880
Speaker 2: whatever it is with Pennix's play, I skimmed through this

1644
01:15:42,960 --> 01:15:47,240
Speaker 2: morning the all twenty two of that game against against Texas.

1645
01:15:47,280 --> 01:15:49,439
Speaker 2: I obviously want we both watch it live, but I

1646
01:15:49,479 --> 01:15:51,400
Speaker 2: did want to check it out. I think the things

1647
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:56,160
Speaker 2: that stand out with Pennix, first of all, arm talent

1648
01:15:56,360 --> 01:15:57,759
Speaker 2: is check the box.

1649
01:15:57,800 --> 01:16:00,880
Speaker 1: There is not a better thrower of the football. He

1650
01:16:00,960 --> 01:16:03,040
Speaker 1: is the best thrower of the football in at least

1651
01:16:03,120 --> 01:16:04,480
Speaker 1: the last three drafts.

1652
01:16:04,800 --> 01:16:06,400
Speaker 2: Oh, I wouldn't go that far, but all.

1653
01:16:06,320 --> 01:16:07,639
Speaker 1: Right, well what do you have who's better?

1654
01:16:08,320 --> 01:16:10,000
Speaker 2: I mean, I have to go back and really think

1655
01:16:10,000 --> 01:16:10,360
Speaker 2: about it.

1656
01:16:10,400 --> 01:16:12,400
Speaker 1: But I mean, nobody from the twenty two draft is

1657
01:16:12,479 --> 01:16:14,599
Speaker 1: that's a lot of praise. Nobody from the twenty two

1658
01:16:14,640 --> 01:16:15,920
Speaker 1: draft is can he Pickett?

1659
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:19,439
Speaker 2: Oh? Well, yeah, that was right. That was a bad draft.

1660
01:16:19,479 --> 01:16:22,000
Speaker 2: And then twenty I mean twenty one had had.

1661
01:16:22,320 --> 01:16:24,240
Speaker 1: No, I'm saying twenty I'm saying twenty two and on sorry,

1662
01:16:24,240 --> 01:16:26,799
Speaker 1: twenty two and on the last three. Well I'm including

1663
01:16:26,800 --> 01:16:27,080
Speaker 1: this one.

1664
01:16:27,160 --> 01:16:30,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Okay, I mean I think Caleb Williams is

1665
01:16:30,280 --> 01:16:31,679
Speaker 2: a really good thrower of the football.

1666
01:16:31,720 --> 01:16:33,000
Speaker 1: Not this is different.

1667
01:16:33,280 --> 01:16:36,080
Speaker 2: How's it different, Pennix? How's it different?

1668
01:16:36,120 --> 01:16:38,840
Speaker 1: The ball explodes out of his hand and it's on

1669
01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:40,840
Speaker 1: the receivers every single time.

1670
01:16:41,439 --> 01:16:44,040
Speaker 2: He's his All right, here's the Peedix take.

1671
01:16:44,080 --> 01:16:46,240
Speaker 1: All right, I'm saying I'm not saying best quarterback. I'm

1672
01:16:46,280 --> 01:16:48,520
Speaker 1: saying thrower of the football.

1673
01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:53,040
Speaker 2: He certainly has. He has the arm, talent box checked,

1674
01:16:53,080 --> 01:16:55,479
Speaker 2: and I think to throw. There's two throws that really

1675
01:16:55,520 --> 01:16:58,400
Speaker 2: stood out to me on on rewatch he Pev had

1676
01:16:58,479 --> 01:17:01,080
Speaker 2: him with six big time throw in this game, which

1677
01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:04,280
Speaker 2: is what is and that I mean that's a lot.

1678
01:17:04,320 --> 01:17:04,960
Speaker 1: It feels low.

1679
01:17:05,120 --> 01:17:09,800
Speaker 2: No, that's like an incredibly look like like six is

1680
01:17:09,840 --> 01:17:11,479
Speaker 2: like gotta be like the most in the game by

1681
01:17:11,520 --> 01:17:12,680
Speaker 2: a college quarterback this year.

1682
01:17:13,160 --> 01:17:14,720
Speaker 1: Okay, likes a ton.

1683
01:17:15,200 --> 01:17:18,080
Speaker 2: It's not low. Trust me, it's a lot. Uh. The

1684
01:17:18,400 --> 01:17:21,240
Speaker 2: two throws that stood out to me, uh that first

1685
01:17:21,280 --> 01:17:23,600
Speaker 2: post corner route or he just drops it on in

1686
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:24,120
Speaker 2: the park.

1687
01:17:25,560 --> 01:17:25,720
Speaker 3: Off.

1688
01:17:25,880 --> 01:17:29,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that one. The coverage there is a

1689
01:17:29,200 --> 01:17:32,439
Speaker 2: lot tighter than it looks, right, And that was just

1690
01:17:32,439 --> 01:17:34,599
Speaker 2: a hell of a throw. And then the other one

1691
01:17:34,600 --> 01:17:36,760
Speaker 2: that really stood out was that bluff screen that they

1692
01:17:36,880 --> 01:17:40,240
Speaker 2: ran because they they ran a bluff screen, you know,

1693
01:17:40,240 --> 01:17:43,800
Speaker 2: they faked the screen and their receivers release upfield. They

1694
01:17:43,880 --> 01:17:47,000
Speaker 2: ran the bluff screen into the field like from the

1695
01:17:47,120 --> 01:17:49,400
Speaker 2: far hash right, so they didn't run it into the

1696
01:17:49,400 --> 01:17:51,320
Speaker 2: short side of the field. They ran it into the

1697
01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:55,240
Speaker 2: big side of the field, and the Texan the Texas

1698
01:17:55,280 --> 01:17:58,280
Speaker 2: actually covered it pretty well and he was still able

1699
01:17:58,600 --> 01:18:01,160
Speaker 2: to fit it into a tight win back shoulder it

1700
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:02,920
Speaker 2: to the tight end or full back, whatever you want

1701
01:18:02,920 --> 01:18:06,080
Speaker 2: to call it a tight end, Yeah, and he still

1702
01:18:06,120 --> 01:18:10,040
Speaker 2: fits it in there. That throw is when you start

1703
01:18:10,160 --> 01:18:13,519
Speaker 2: start talking about driving the ball down the field, and

1704
01:18:13,560 --> 01:18:16,280
Speaker 2: can this guy zip it down the field, not deep ball,

1705
01:18:16,400 --> 01:18:18,439
Speaker 2: not put an air under it and dropping it in

1706
01:18:18,479 --> 01:18:22,120
Speaker 2: the bucket, but actually on a line driving the ball

1707
01:18:22,160 --> 01:18:25,040
Speaker 2: down the field. That's the throw that we're going to

1708
01:18:25,120 --> 01:18:26,959
Speaker 2: highlight over and over again for Michael.

1709
01:18:27,160 --> 01:18:29,280
Speaker 1: I don't even know that that was his best drive throw. Honestly,

1710
01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:31,160
Speaker 1: what about the one who he splits the two safeties

1711
01:18:31,200 --> 01:18:33,760
Speaker 1: for the touchdown. No, you didn't like that one.

1712
01:18:33,800 --> 01:18:36,200
Speaker 2: It was fine. No, Like it's a good throw, but

1713
01:18:38,120 --> 01:18:41,280
Speaker 2: well they split the safeties like they miscommunicate, they'd split.

1714
01:18:41,280 --> 01:18:42,639
Speaker 2: The whole thing's wide open.

1715
01:18:43,120 --> 01:18:44,160
Speaker 1: That's not a big window.

1716
01:18:44,360 --> 01:18:46,240
Speaker 2: It's not a big window in terms of like the

1717
01:18:46,280 --> 01:18:49,400
Speaker 2: safety's crack, like the timing of it, but that's more

1718
01:18:49,560 --> 01:18:51,800
Speaker 2: in my opinion, that was more of like seeing it

1719
01:18:51,920 --> 01:18:54,599
Speaker 2: quickly than like actually having like steam on the ball.

1720
01:18:54,720 --> 01:18:56,479
Speaker 2: Not that he didn't have steam on it, but like

1721
01:18:56,520 --> 01:18:59,439
Speaker 2: that was more about like a recognition sort of thing.

1722
01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:02,719
Speaker 2: But both good throws, and there was other good throws,

1723
01:19:03,240 --> 01:19:06,040
Speaker 2: and then the third one that that stands really stood

1724
01:19:06,080 --> 01:19:09,080
Speaker 2: out late in the game to a Dounsa on the

1725
01:19:09,080 --> 01:19:12,080
Speaker 2: go ball like it's like third down, it's third in

1726
01:19:12,160 --> 01:19:15,960
Speaker 2: the championship basically, and he just throws an absolute dot

1727
01:19:16,080 --> 01:19:18,799
Speaker 2: to a Dunezay who's got like a guy like draped

1728
01:19:18,840 --> 01:19:22,800
Speaker 2: all over him. So those throws. The arm talent, the

1729
01:19:22,840 --> 01:19:25,479
Speaker 2: ability to move around the pocket is exceptional, like his

1730
01:19:25,560 --> 01:19:27,720
Speaker 2: ability to move around and then throw from different arm

1731
01:19:27,760 --> 01:19:30,760
Speaker 2: angles and off platform. He can generate velo from any

1732
01:19:31,120 --> 01:19:34,599
Speaker 2: anything like whether his feet are set not set, arm angles, whatever,

1733
01:19:35,040 --> 01:19:38,240
Speaker 2: all of that is fantastic. The arm talent is fantastic.

1734
01:19:38,479 --> 01:19:41,280
Speaker 2: The recognition in the in the processing of the game

1735
01:19:41,360 --> 01:19:44,519
Speaker 2: is at a high level right now, other than the

1736
01:19:44,560 --> 01:19:45,960
Speaker 2: injuries because we know that.

1737
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:48,120
Speaker 1: We're even I just add quick. He even ran around

1738
01:19:48,120 --> 01:19:49,840
Speaker 1: a little bit, which I've been telling people he's not

1739
01:19:49,880 --> 01:19:52,000
Speaker 1: at Mobile. He just chooses not to run. Yeah, they

1740
01:19:52,320 --> 01:19:54,000
Speaker 1: locked him a little bit right well, and it makes

1741
01:19:54,000 --> 01:19:55,519
Speaker 1: sense you break it out right there. I think he'll

1742
01:19:55,520 --> 01:19:58,040
Speaker 1: do more of it against Michigan. Like he's not I

1743
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:02,000
Speaker 1: can't hammer that point enough. He's not immobile. It's a choice.

1744
01:20:02,080 --> 01:20:04,559
Speaker 1: It's not a lack of athletic ability anyway you're saying, so.

1745
01:20:04,800 --> 01:20:06,840
Speaker 2: The injuries are going to be with the injuries, the injuries,

1746
01:20:06,880 --> 01:20:08,559
Speaker 2: the injuries, We're going to be saying it till we're

1747
01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:13,120
Speaker 2: blue in the which is what all the report reporting

1748
01:20:13,160 --> 01:20:14,960
Speaker 2: that comes out at the combine and stuff of how

1749
01:20:15,000 --> 01:20:18,080
Speaker 2: teams are testing. Jim Nagy mentioned that he might be

1750
01:20:18,120 --> 01:20:20,280
Speaker 2: going to the Senior Bowl if he wins the Natty.

1751
01:20:20,320 --> 01:20:22,000
Speaker 2: I don't know really why he would go to Mobile,

1752
01:20:22,880 --> 01:20:26,080
Speaker 2: but he might go interview and might you know, get

1753
01:20:26,160 --> 01:20:28,559
Speaker 2: checked out medically by some teams because that's the biggest question,

1754
01:20:28,640 --> 01:20:31,160
Speaker 2: no doubt about it. The other concern that I would

1755
01:20:31,200 --> 01:20:35,960
Speaker 2: have with him just watching him, uh, is just the

1756
01:20:35,960 --> 01:20:38,240
Speaker 2: middle of the field's not great, Like he doesn't throw

1757
01:20:38,320 --> 01:20:40,920
Speaker 2: the ball with great accuracy consistently to the middle of

1758
01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:43,400
Speaker 2: the field, and the numbers bear that out. And the

1759
01:20:43,439 --> 01:20:47,599
Speaker 2: other thing is there's a lot of throws on this

1760
01:20:47,840 --> 01:20:52,320
Speaker 2: on his film where let's just face it, the receivers

1761
01:20:52,320 --> 01:20:54,920
Speaker 2: are making great plays on the ball. They just are

1762
01:20:55,560 --> 01:20:59,519
Speaker 2: And it's maybe it's a it's Mac Jones pts T. Yeah,

1763
01:20:59,760 --> 01:21:04,160
Speaker 2: because if you look at big time throw rate Mac

1764
01:21:04,240 --> 01:21:07,559
Speaker 2: Jones in college seven point five, Michael PENNOCKX this year

1765
01:21:07,600 --> 01:21:10,680
Speaker 2: in college seven point seven, it's right there. And what

1766
01:21:10,800 --> 01:21:14,920
Speaker 2: we found out I think with Mac is that a

1767
01:21:14,960 --> 01:21:18,559
Speaker 2: lot of those tight window big time throws were actually

1768
01:21:18,680 --> 01:21:22,240
Speaker 2: just DeVante Smith mossing people right. And so how much

1769
01:21:22,760 --> 01:21:25,519
Speaker 2: do we count that against him? Not that it's not

1770
01:21:25,600 --> 01:21:28,519
Speaker 2: a conversation with other guys, because it is. I understand that.

1771
01:21:28,960 --> 01:21:32,519
Speaker 2: But at the same time, he is not going to

1772
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:35,760
Speaker 2: be playing with receivers like Roma Dunza and Polk and

1773
01:21:35,800 --> 01:21:38,840
Speaker 2: Mitchell and those guys that are so much better than

1774
01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:41,479
Speaker 2: their competition in the NFL, because the competition is going

1775
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:44,000
Speaker 2: to be a lot more. Even so, I do wonder

1776
01:21:44,040 --> 01:21:47,920
Speaker 2: about that element of it. Again, it's probably just because

1777
01:21:47,960 --> 01:21:50,759
Speaker 2: of Mac Jones, and like I've already drafted a quarterback

1778
01:21:50,760 --> 01:21:53,280
Speaker 2: from a loaded offense and it didn't work out. So

1779
01:21:53,400 --> 01:21:56,280
Speaker 2: maybe that's piece of it. But when you watch it,

1780
01:21:56,360 --> 01:21:59,160
Speaker 2: just based off the eye test, he's clearly a more

1781
01:21:59,200 --> 01:22:01,280
Speaker 2: physically talented quarterback than mac Jones.

1782
01:22:01,320 --> 01:22:05,120
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm just saying the way the ball explodes

1783
01:22:05,160 --> 01:22:07,559
Speaker 1: out of his hand, I mean it's it's different. Yeah,

1784
01:22:08,000 --> 01:22:10,639
Speaker 1: excuse me. A couple things to your last point there one.

1785
01:22:11,360 --> 01:22:13,400
Speaker 1: And I've said this before. If you don't want to

1786
01:22:13,479 --> 01:22:15,479
Speaker 1: draft a quarterback who's not from a loaded offense're either

1787
01:22:15,520 --> 01:22:17,639
Speaker 1: taking Drake may or you're not taking a quarterback. That's

1788
01:22:17,680 --> 01:22:20,439
Speaker 1: just they're all an il era. They're all playing with

1789
01:22:20,479 --> 01:22:21,000
Speaker 1: a ton of talent.

1790
01:22:21,080 --> 01:22:22,720
Speaker 2: They're not all playing like a dune. Say is going

1791
01:22:22,760 --> 01:22:24,880
Speaker 2: to be a top ten pick. It's Polk right there,

1792
01:22:25,120 --> 01:22:25,920
Speaker 2: the receiver.

1793
01:22:25,640 --> 01:22:28,439
Speaker 1: He's going to be a top fifty pick maybe, and

1794
01:22:28,439 --> 01:22:32,240
Speaker 1: then goes Mitchell. Mitchell's an underclassman, right, Yeah. The third

1795
01:22:32,240 --> 01:22:35,320
Speaker 1: guy is McMillan, Jalen McMillian mill It's just like a Burner.

1796
01:22:35,360 --> 01:22:37,280
Speaker 1: He's just a fast guy. Yeah, there'll be a top

1797
01:22:37,280 --> 01:22:39,680
Speaker 1: one hundred pick, but it'll be next year though. No,

1798
01:22:39,880 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 1: he's this year. They're all this year. If they all

1799
01:22:42,000 --> 01:22:43,479
Speaker 1: come out, McMillan, mich go back to school.

1800
01:22:43,520 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 2: I think think Millan is going to go back.

1801
01:22:45,040 --> 01:22:47,280
Speaker 1: Okay, what what I would say?

1802
01:22:47,680 --> 01:22:47,880
Speaker 2: Part?

1803
01:22:47,920 --> 01:22:51,600
Speaker 1: So that's part of it. The other part is I

1804
01:22:51,640 --> 01:22:54,760
Speaker 1: don't think any of them are Davonte Smith, you know

1805
01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:58,240
Speaker 1: that offense. I think that they're not quite that level

1806
01:22:58,240 --> 01:23:01,800
Speaker 1: of prospect. There's there's also plays where, like you mentioned

1807
01:23:01,840 --> 01:23:05,640
Speaker 1: the Odoonsay one where a Donsay doesn't not only does

1808
01:23:05,680 --> 01:23:08,200
Speaker 1: he not have to break stride, he doesn't have to

1809
01:23:08,200 --> 01:23:10,840
Speaker 1: move his hands. Yeah, Michael Pennix puts the ball where

1810
01:23:10,880 --> 01:23:12,400
Speaker 1: his hands are in his natural running.

1811
01:23:12,240 --> 01:23:15,960
Speaker 2: Most Yeah, I mean the ball playsment. I said this

1812
01:23:16,000 --> 01:23:17,679
Speaker 2: earlier about him, when we did this like a couple

1813
01:23:17,680 --> 01:23:20,759
Speaker 2: of months ago. There's nobody that throws more perfect passes

1814
01:23:20,800 --> 01:23:22,280
Speaker 2: in this draft than Michael Penk's.

1815
01:23:22,080 --> 01:23:23,960
Speaker 1: And that's kind of my point. That's where it's different

1816
01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:25,960
Speaker 1: from Mac Jones. You talk about those big time throws,

1817
01:23:26,000 --> 01:23:28,599
Speaker 1: how many of those big time throws were the receiver

1818
01:23:28,720 --> 01:23:31,040
Speaker 1: having to go outside of his frame to catch the football.

1819
01:23:31,320 --> 01:23:34,360
Speaker 1: You don't. Oh Donsay does a little bit of that,

1820
01:23:34,760 --> 01:23:38,800
Speaker 1: but they look it's like designed back shoulder stuff. Right,

1821
01:23:39,479 --> 01:23:43,360
Speaker 1: there's the receivers are making some good catches, but there's

1822
01:23:43,400 --> 01:23:46,880
Speaker 1: not it's catches through contact like Michael Pennock's that is

1823
01:23:46,920 --> 01:23:49,240
Speaker 1: putting the ball where it needs to be. Point Well,

1824
01:23:49,280 --> 01:23:51,080
Speaker 1: so here's my third point when you talk about it

1825
01:23:51,120 --> 01:23:56,479
Speaker 1: with Mac Jones. Ideally, hopefully you're gonna get Michael Pennock's

1826
01:23:56,479 --> 01:23:59,240
Speaker 1: better talent around him than he got Mac Johnson. Right,

1827
01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:01,320
Speaker 1: you know who would be really good with a guy

1828
01:24:01,360 --> 01:24:04,920
Speaker 1: like Michael Pennix, T Higgins, Yeah, right, where he's gonna

1829
01:24:04,920 --> 01:24:06,320
Speaker 1: be able to put the ball up where only t

1830
01:24:06,520 --> 01:24:08,519
Speaker 1: Higgins can high point it, and he's gonna go up

1831
01:24:08,520 --> 01:24:10,599
Speaker 1: and high point it and get it. You're not giving

1832
01:24:11,280 --> 01:24:14,760
Speaker 1: You're not giving Michael Penix, Nikhil Harry and Jujus Schuster. Right,

1833
01:24:14,840 --> 01:24:18,040
Speaker 1: So let's we need to go exp and I don't

1834
01:24:18,040 --> 01:24:19,360
Speaker 1: mean to pick on you, but like I've seen people

1835
01:24:19,400 --> 01:24:21,280
Speaker 1: say this, well, oh, how good is Peni's gonna be

1836
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:24,360
Speaker 1: when he's throwing to the current Patriots receivers And it's

1837
01:24:24,360 --> 01:24:25,960
Speaker 1: bad to something I said with Mac Jones.

1838
01:24:26,040 --> 01:24:28,160
Speaker 2: Right, it's less a concern about throwing to the current

1839
01:24:28,200 --> 01:24:31,439
Speaker 2: Patriots receivers than it is to be thrown like when

1840
01:24:31,640 --> 01:24:32,960
Speaker 2: the competition is level.

1841
01:24:33,040 --> 01:24:35,760
Speaker 1: Right, But I guess it's it's more like, can we

1842
01:24:36,520 --> 01:24:38,720
Speaker 1: go beyond the idea that they that this team just

1843
01:24:38,800 --> 01:24:43,080
Speaker 1: won't add plus players, true playmakers at the receiver position,

1844
01:24:43,120 --> 01:24:46,080
Speaker 1: because if you get Michael Pennock's playmakers, he's gonna be

1845
01:24:46,120 --> 01:24:47,639
Speaker 1: able to make plays. If you go out and get

1846
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:49,439
Speaker 1: him a guy like t Higgins, if you go out

1847
01:24:49,439 --> 01:24:51,320
Speaker 1: and get him a guy like Xavier Worthy. Maybe you

1848
01:24:51,479 --> 01:24:53,960
Speaker 1: draft Jalen polk Er, Jalen McMillan in the second round

1849
01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:57,800
Speaker 1: or in the third round. Yeah, we need I got

1850
01:24:57,800 --> 01:24:59,600
Speaker 1: red in the face with this with Mac Jones, and

1851
01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:00,880
Speaker 1: just to be fair, I'm gonna get red in the

1852
01:25:00,880 --> 01:25:03,320
Speaker 1: face with whichever guy they draft. We need to stop

1853
01:25:03,360 --> 01:25:06,120
Speaker 1: assuming that whatever quarterback they draft is gonna permanently be

1854
01:25:06,160 --> 01:25:08,719
Speaker 1: in this horrible situation that he's gonna have to elevate.

1855
01:25:08,840 --> 01:25:10,760
Speaker 1: Do you want him to elevate the team? Yes, But

1856
01:25:11,560 --> 01:25:14,920
Speaker 1: you can't just say, oh, well, this guy won't make

1857
01:25:14,960 --> 01:25:17,479
Speaker 1: it work when everything around him is terrible. So you

1858
01:25:17,520 --> 01:25:20,160
Speaker 1: can't take them one. No, player can do that. Two,

1859
01:25:20,560 --> 01:25:23,400
Speaker 1: you shouldn't be drafting a guy with the expectation that, Okay,

1860
01:25:23,400 --> 01:25:25,400
Speaker 1: we're gonna draft him and then we're never gonna address

1861
01:25:25,400 --> 01:25:27,639
Speaker 1: offense again and he has to fix everything. If that's

1862
01:25:27,680 --> 01:25:30,240
Speaker 1: the approach, then somebody else needs to be making the

1863
01:25:30,240 --> 01:25:34,799
Speaker 1: decision because you can't expect that from any quarterback. Any quarterback.

1864
01:25:34,800 --> 01:25:36,880
Speaker 1: It's not in, Oh, Tom Brady did it, You're not

1865
01:25:36,960 --> 01:25:38,679
Speaker 1: getting Tom Brady. It's not gonna happen.

1866
01:25:39,800 --> 01:25:42,880
Speaker 2: That's totally fair. I wish that I could be like

1867
01:25:43,040 --> 01:25:45,800
Speaker 2: confident in saying that they're gonna get that talent around him.

1868
01:25:45,840 --> 01:25:48,000
Speaker 2: I'm not yet, but like because I have to wait

1869
01:25:48,040 --> 01:25:50,240
Speaker 2: and see if they actually do it right. But yeah, sure,

1870
01:25:50,280 --> 01:25:52,280
Speaker 2: that's that's totally fair, I guess.

1871
01:25:52,920 --> 01:25:55,280
Speaker 1: But it's not even that, it's not even counting on it.

1872
01:25:55,360 --> 01:25:57,080
Speaker 1: Let's say it is the current regime. Let's say they

1873
01:25:57,080 --> 01:25:59,479
Speaker 1: stay and they draft a quarterback, whoever it is. They

1874
01:26:00,160 --> 01:26:02,960
Speaker 1: just because they haven't done it doesn't mean they shouldn't

1875
01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:05,839
Speaker 1: be held to the expectation that you need to develop

1876
01:26:05,880 --> 01:26:08,720
Speaker 1: this quarterback the way it's done properly. You need to

1877
01:26:08,760 --> 01:26:10,560
Speaker 1: go out and get him star receivers. You need to

1878
01:26:10,600 --> 01:26:13,160
Speaker 1: build an offensive line. If that means you don't have,

1879
01:26:13,520 --> 01:26:16,320
Speaker 1: you know, your defensive defensive depth chart loaded down to

1880
01:26:16,320 --> 01:26:18,200
Speaker 1: the third spot, so be it.

1881
01:26:18,600 --> 01:26:21,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I I feel you. I do. I just think

1882
01:26:21,880 --> 01:26:26,160
Speaker 2: when when it comes to the competition thing, the problem

1883
01:26:26,280 --> 01:26:29,719
Speaker 2: that I see with it is more so the fact

1884
01:26:29,760 --> 01:26:34,720
Speaker 2: that how much better is Roma Dunza and Polk and

1885
01:26:35,360 --> 01:26:36,720
Speaker 2: the other guy I can't.

1886
01:26:36,439 --> 01:26:38,320
Speaker 1: Marshal whatever his name is, Jalen McMillan.

1887
01:26:38,400 --> 01:26:43,439
Speaker 2: McMillan shure. Uh, then the guy lined up across, how

1888
01:26:43,520 --> 01:26:46,400
Speaker 2: much better is T Higgins gonna be than Sas Gardner?

1889
01:26:46,479 --> 01:26:48,479
Speaker 2: Or how much better is T Higgins going to be

1890
01:26:48,760 --> 01:26:50,320
Speaker 2: than Jalen Ramsey?

1891
01:26:50,439 --> 01:26:50,559
Speaker 1: Right?

1892
01:26:50,560 --> 01:26:52,800
Speaker 2: Like these are guys in the division against the Patriots. Yeah,

1893
01:26:53,080 --> 01:26:56,479
Speaker 2: that's the question. But in general, I like, I just

1894
01:26:56,520 --> 01:27:02,000
Speaker 2: want to make the point that one more thing. I

1895
01:27:02,080 --> 01:27:03,800
Speaker 2: think a lot of people are also going to sit

1896
01:27:03,840 --> 01:27:09,719
Speaker 2: there and ask, how could you rank Drake May higher

1897
01:27:09,760 --> 01:27:12,120
Speaker 2: than Michael Penix, like based off of what we've seen.

1898
01:27:12,920 --> 01:27:16,400
Speaker 2: But that's not what the draft is about, because it's

1899
01:27:16,439 --> 01:27:20,200
Speaker 2: not apples to oranges. Like Drake May is not playing

1900
01:27:20,360 --> 01:27:24,080
Speaker 2: in Washington's offense. So if you put Drake May in

1901
01:27:24,360 --> 01:27:27,360
Speaker 2: Washington and not and then Michael Pennis in U n C.

1902
01:27:28,080 --> 01:27:30,080
Speaker 2: It's probably gonna look similar. Right.

1903
01:27:30,439 --> 01:27:34,400
Speaker 1: But so if you go back and watch Penis in Indiana,

1904
01:27:34,400 --> 01:27:36,400
Speaker 1: which that was a terrible program.

1905
01:27:36,400 --> 01:27:41,360
Speaker 2: I understand, but he's your guy, I know, But just

1906
01:27:41,400 --> 01:27:45,439
Speaker 2: think about like I have. So my point is is

1907
01:27:45,479 --> 01:27:51,599
Speaker 2: that you're not You don't drafts based off of college production. Okay,

1908
01:27:51,760 --> 01:27:55,280
Speaker 2: So because Michael Penis has a higher completion percentage because

1909
01:27:55,320 --> 01:27:57,600
Speaker 2: he threw for more yards and he threw for more touchdowns.

1910
01:27:58,000 --> 01:28:02,360
Speaker 2: His film this year, if you grade the film on

1911
01:28:02,479 --> 01:28:06,599
Speaker 2: like a on a no curve right for his film

1912
01:28:06,680 --> 01:28:08,479
Speaker 2: is the best film in the class this year? Who

1913
01:28:08,720 --> 01:28:11,519
Speaker 2: Michael pennicks it's the best film in the class. But

1914
01:28:12,320 --> 01:28:16,040
Speaker 2: when you draft players, it's about traits, right, Like it's

1915
01:28:16,040 --> 01:28:19,880
Speaker 2: about traits, it's about upside, it's about talent, right, It's

1916
01:28:19,920 --> 01:28:22,320
Speaker 2: about fit, It's about all those types of things. And

1917
01:28:22,320 --> 01:28:26,080
Speaker 2: that's why you can still say Michael Penis had the

1918
01:28:26,120 --> 01:28:27,240
Speaker 2: best season.

1919
01:28:27,439 --> 01:28:27,759
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1920
01:28:27,880 --> 01:28:31,400
Speaker 2: Maybe I know that Daniels won the Heisman, but I

1921
01:28:31,439 --> 01:28:33,960
Speaker 2: think that Michael Pennix, especially if he wins the Natty,

1922
01:28:34,160 --> 01:28:36,679
Speaker 2: is going to have the best season in college football

1923
01:28:36,680 --> 01:28:39,559
Speaker 2: this year for a quarterback. Yeah, that doesn't necessarily mean

1924
01:28:39,560 --> 01:28:41,040
Speaker 2: that he's going to be the best NFL plab.

1925
01:28:41,080 --> 01:28:46,400
Speaker 1: I that's a complicated way of saying to me. NFL

1926
01:28:46,520 --> 01:28:50,000
Speaker 1: teams look at first round draft picks like long term investments, right,

1927
01:28:50,000 --> 01:28:52,439
Speaker 1: who's the better long term investment? And I know you

1928
01:28:52,600 --> 01:28:55,880
Speaker 1: hate the age thing, but NFL teams are going to

1929
01:28:55,920 --> 01:28:58,679
Speaker 1: see a healthy twenty one year old or a twenty

1930
01:28:58,720 --> 01:29:01,360
Speaker 1: four year old with two bad knees, and that is

1931
01:29:02,640 --> 01:29:04,639
Speaker 1: Michael Pennix, like you said, has been a better quarterback

1932
01:29:04,680 --> 01:29:09,400
Speaker 1: than Drake May, but who has more long term sustainable upside.

1933
01:29:09,760 --> 01:29:12,720
Speaker 1: There is concern about Michael Pennocks basically not being sustainable,

1934
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:14,760
Speaker 1: and there is concern that he's going to get to

1935
01:29:14,800 --> 01:29:19,280
Speaker 1: the league and even if he's playing very well, you know,

1936
01:29:19,320 --> 01:29:21,759
Speaker 1: gets hurt and he's not on the field. And everybody

1937
01:29:21,760 --> 01:29:23,800
Speaker 1: knows how I feel about quarterbacks that can't stay on

1938
01:29:23,840 --> 01:29:26,840
Speaker 1: the field. My takes on Jimmy Garoppolo are very well established.

1939
01:29:27,280 --> 01:29:29,840
Speaker 1: That is the big concern with Michael Pennix. I think

1940
01:29:29,880 --> 01:29:33,000
Speaker 1: it's a testament to how talented he is that he

1941
01:29:33,120 --> 01:29:36,240
Speaker 1: has the injury history he has and he's still considered

1942
01:29:36,280 --> 01:29:38,840
Speaker 1: a first round pick because normally I would write that

1943
01:29:38,920 --> 01:29:44,120
Speaker 1: guy off entirely. But he's so good that you basically,

1944
01:29:44,920 --> 01:29:47,040
Speaker 1: and I've said this so much leading up to the

1945
01:29:47,040 --> 01:29:49,960
Speaker 1: playoff and to your point about you know the talent,

1946
01:29:50,040 --> 01:29:52,479
Speaker 1: and where's the talent at compared to the guys he's playing.

1947
01:29:53,479 --> 01:29:56,519
Speaker 1: Michigan has an NFL defense, Michigan has an NFL secondary.

1948
01:29:56,760 --> 01:29:58,679
Speaker 1: We are going to learn a lot about Michael Pennock

1949
01:29:58,720 --> 01:29:59,120
Speaker 1: next week.

1950
01:29:59,360 --> 01:30:02,519
Speaker 2: I wish i'd say because of the scheme, right, naturally,

1951
01:30:02,760 --> 01:30:03,880
Speaker 2: but it's fine.

1952
01:30:03,640 --> 01:30:07,240
Speaker 1: But the point, the point being, if he goes out

1953
01:30:07,280 --> 01:30:08,640
Speaker 1: and tears up Michigan.

1954
01:30:08,400 --> 01:30:11,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, then it's it's it's I know yourself.

1955
01:30:11,680 --> 01:30:13,160
Speaker 1: I know he has two I know he has two

1956
01:30:13,240 --> 01:30:16,200
Speaker 1: knee injuries, two shoulder injuries, all fourard season ending. And yes,

1957
01:30:16,240 --> 01:30:18,719
Speaker 1: he'll be thirty years old when he signs a second contract.

1958
01:30:19,120 --> 01:30:21,840
Speaker 1: But at what point is he just so talented that

1959
01:30:21,880 --> 01:30:25,760
Speaker 1: none of it matters? Because if he has and I

1960
01:30:25,760 --> 01:30:27,560
Speaker 1: do think the age thing is overblown, but this is

1961
01:30:27,600 --> 01:30:29,479
Speaker 1: the way NFL teams look at it. You're looking at

1962
01:30:29,720 --> 01:30:31,840
Speaker 1: an eight to ten year window versus hopefully a twelve

1963
01:30:31,880 --> 01:30:33,840
Speaker 1: to fifteen year window of both guys max out right

1964
01:30:33,960 --> 01:30:37,240
Speaker 1: and versus May. If May's a ten to fifteen year

1965
01:30:37,280 --> 01:30:40,120
Speaker 1: window right, and Pennox is eight to ten if he

1966
01:30:40,160 --> 01:30:42,920
Speaker 1: stays healthy. But you have a better chance to win

1967
01:30:42,920 --> 01:30:44,880
Speaker 1: a super Bowl in those eight to ten years than

1968
01:30:44,920 --> 01:30:47,479
Speaker 1: you do in the ten to fifteen because Pennox is

1969
01:30:47,479 --> 01:30:50,120
Speaker 1: showing he's just that good and that ready. That's kind

1970
01:30:50,120 --> 01:30:52,240
Speaker 1: of the argument you're gonna have to make for Michael Penox,

1971
01:30:52,400 --> 01:30:54,200
Speaker 1: And that's the argument he's making, I think when he

1972
01:30:54,240 --> 01:30:56,599
Speaker 1: faces Michigan is yeah, I have two bad knees. Yeah,

1973
01:30:56,640 --> 01:30:58,360
Speaker 1: I have two bad shoulders, and I just beat up

1974
01:30:58,360 --> 01:30:59,920
Speaker 1: the best defense in the nation. And I've been doing

1975
01:31:00,080 --> 01:31:02,040
Speaker 1: this for two years now, and what more do I

1976
01:31:02,040 --> 01:31:04,000
Speaker 1: need to show you that I'm a super Bowl quarterback.

1977
01:31:04,240 --> 01:31:07,080
Speaker 2: The reason why I don't like the age thing is.

1978
01:31:07,520 --> 01:31:09,240
Speaker 1: You don't like it, but NFL teams are gonna care.

1979
01:31:10,000 --> 01:31:12,519
Speaker 2: I don't think that NFL. The reason why I don't

1980
01:31:12,560 --> 01:31:14,800
Speaker 2: like the age thing is because your argument for the

1981
01:31:14,800 --> 01:31:18,240
Speaker 2: age thing about his window right? How long is he

1982
01:31:18,280 --> 01:31:19,599
Speaker 2: going to be an NFL quarterback?

1983
01:31:19,680 --> 01:31:19,720
Speaker 3: For?

1984
01:31:21,040 --> 01:31:23,439
Speaker 2: I hear that more. The issue that I have with

1985
01:31:23,479 --> 01:31:26,439
Speaker 2: the age thing is that and this is a lot.

1986
01:31:26,640 --> 01:31:29,920
Speaker 2: This is actually a breakout. Age has been becoming a

1987
01:31:30,000 --> 01:31:33,400
Speaker 2: popular sort of metric. If you want to call it

1988
01:31:33,439 --> 01:31:36,960
Speaker 2: that in the fantasy football community. That's like where it

1989
01:31:37,040 --> 01:31:40,960
Speaker 2: really started. And the reason why I hate breakout age

1990
01:31:41,640 --> 01:31:44,800
Speaker 2: is because so breakout age basically says the younger you

1991
01:31:44,840 --> 01:31:47,559
Speaker 2: break out in college, the better player you are. Right,

1992
01:31:47,640 --> 01:31:50,200
Speaker 2: Because Felger was talking about this yesterday when I was

1993
01:31:50,240 --> 01:31:52,880
Speaker 2: listening to his whole thing about how much pants off

1994
01:31:52,920 --> 01:31:55,960
Speaker 2: about I mean, he's right, But when you have a

1995
01:31:56,040 --> 01:31:59,080
Speaker 2: twenty four year old tearing up college football versus a

1996
01:31:59,160 --> 01:32:01,920
Speaker 2: nineteen year old airing up college football, it's just like

1997
01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:03,840
Speaker 2: in you sports when you have that kid that was

1998
01:32:03,880 --> 01:32:08,000
Speaker 2: held back two grades and he's fourteen and everybody else's twelve. Right.

1999
01:32:08,080 --> 01:32:09,760
Speaker 2: We see in the Little League World Series all the

2000
01:32:09,760 --> 01:32:12,840
Speaker 2: time where this kid that's like six feet and he's

2001
01:32:12,840 --> 01:32:15,160
Speaker 2: twelve years old, and you're like, what the hell? Right

2002
01:32:15,479 --> 01:32:21,799
Speaker 2: that that matters. But with Pennix, I think the difference

2003
01:32:21,880 --> 01:32:25,559
Speaker 2: is is that the reason why he's older is because

2004
01:32:25,600 --> 01:32:28,240
Speaker 2: of the injuries. Right, Like if he so he if

2005
01:32:28,280 --> 01:32:34,400
Speaker 2: he stays healthy, he was already on Like I can

2006
01:32:34,439 --> 01:32:38,839
Speaker 2: tell you he was already on NFL NFL team's radars

2007
01:32:38,840 --> 01:32:39,520
Speaker 2: at Indiana.

2008
01:32:40,080 --> 01:32:40,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the thing.

2009
01:32:41,080 --> 01:32:41,800
Speaker 2: Three years ago.

2010
01:32:41,920 --> 01:32:44,559
Speaker 1: He broke out a long time ago. But people didn't

2011
01:32:44,560 --> 01:32:46,040
Speaker 1: know because one it was during the pandemic.

2012
01:32:46,240 --> 01:32:46,519
Speaker 2: Yeah.

2013
01:32:46,800 --> 01:32:49,559
Speaker 1: Two he was at Indiana in three he didn't play

2014
01:32:49,560 --> 01:32:52,080
Speaker 1: full seasons because he got hurt. In twenty twenty seven,

2015
01:32:52,840 --> 01:32:54,599
Speaker 1: he beat Penn State. He didn't have a great game,

2016
01:32:54,760 --> 01:32:56,600
Speaker 1: nineteen or thirty six hundred and seventy yards in a

2017
01:32:56,640 --> 01:33:01,320
Speaker 1: touchdown plus another rushing against Penn State. Against Michigan Jim

2018
01:33:01,320 --> 01:33:05,120
Speaker 1: Harbaugh thirty for fifty three hundred and forty two yards,

2019
01:33:05,160 --> 01:33:09,120
Speaker 1: three touchdowns, no picks against Ohio State. Ohio State was

2020
01:33:09,160 --> 01:33:11,479
Speaker 1: a wagon that year. Remember Ohio State went to College

2021
01:33:11,479 --> 01:33:15,040
Speaker 1: Football PLAYFF. I think they played national championship. Now Indiana

2022
01:33:15,120 --> 01:33:17,679
Speaker 1: lost because it's Indiana. They didn't have a defense. Michael

2023
01:33:17,680 --> 01:33:20,000
Speaker 1: pennocks against Ohio State in twenty twenty. So this is

2024
01:33:20,720 --> 01:33:23,120
Speaker 1: was he now twenty three in twenty three, So this

2025
01:33:23,160 --> 01:33:25,880
Speaker 1: is a twenty year old, twenty one year old twenty

2026
01:33:25,880 --> 01:33:28,759
Speaker 1: seven to fifty one, four hundred and ninety one yards,

2027
01:33:28,800 --> 01:33:33,240
Speaker 1: five touchdowns against Ohio State three years ago. He broke

2028
01:33:33,240 --> 01:33:36,719
Speaker 1: out already. He just at Indiana. He couldn't stay healthy

2029
01:33:36,920 --> 01:33:39,960
Speaker 1: and he didn't get his chance. If he finished that

2030
01:33:40,200 --> 01:33:43,160
Speaker 1: twenty twenty season and didn't get hurt, he was going

2031
01:33:43,240 --> 01:33:44,320
Speaker 1: to go to the draft and he was going to

2032
01:33:44,360 --> 01:33:45,599
Speaker 1: be a top fifty pick, right.

2033
01:33:45,680 --> 01:33:49,360
Speaker 2: That's like, it's why my pushback on breakout ages is

2034
01:33:49,360 --> 01:33:52,640
Speaker 2: because you have to each situation is different, right, you

2035
01:33:52,800 --> 01:33:55,200
Speaker 2: have to put it into context of the situation that

2036
01:33:55,240 --> 01:33:58,760
Speaker 2: the player was in. His situation is very unique. And

2037
01:33:58,800 --> 01:34:00,680
Speaker 2: one of the things that I really like about the

2038
01:34:00,680 --> 01:34:03,760
Speaker 2: fact that he did go through this talk about the

2039
01:34:03,840 --> 01:34:05,160
Speaker 2: mental toughness.

2040
01:34:05,880 --> 01:34:08,080
Speaker 1: I feel about him, about his mental makeup.

2041
01:34:08,200 --> 01:34:14,000
Speaker 2: I think that last thing here on penis my my

2042
01:34:14,120 --> 01:34:16,439
Speaker 2: other take on this that I think is gonna it

2043
01:34:16,520 --> 01:34:20,679
Speaker 2: kind of goes to Chris's original question. I am still

2044
01:34:20,760 --> 01:34:25,360
Speaker 2: not and I overdraft is the wrong word. I'm still

2045
01:34:25,400 --> 01:34:29,960
Speaker 2: not drafting Michael Pennis higher than the consensus, even if

2046
01:34:30,000 --> 01:34:31,280
Speaker 2: I'm convinced that he's the guy.

2047
01:34:31,439 --> 01:34:35,360
Speaker 1: Why no, no, no, I'm not doing that. No no, no.

2048
01:34:35,200 --> 01:34:38,120
Speaker 2: I'm not doing that. If I somebody's going to if

2049
01:34:38,160 --> 01:34:42,000
Speaker 2: I'm the Patriots. This is part of the job. Part

2050
01:34:42,000 --> 01:34:45,439
Speaker 2: of the job is as a GM, part of the

2051
01:34:45,560 --> 01:34:52,280
Speaker 2: job is gathering intel and understanding the board. Knowing the board,

2052
01:34:52,840 --> 01:34:56,160
Speaker 2: that's part of the job. Part of the job is

2053
01:34:56,640 --> 01:34:58,960
Speaker 2: knowing what all the other thirty one teams are thinking

2054
01:34:59,320 --> 01:35:02,760
Speaker 2: where guy are gonna go, where guys are supposed to

2055
01:35:02,800 --> 01:35:05,960
Speaker 2: fall in the draft. That is part of the gig.

2056
01:35:06,160 --> 01:35:08,360
Speaker 2: And if the rest of the league because of it's

2057
01:35:08,400 --> 01:35:10,120
Speaker 2: gonna be because of his injuries, it's not gonna be

2058
01:35:10,120 --> 01:35:12,519
Speaker 2: because of his film or his talent. If the rest

2059
01:35:12,520 --> 01:35:14,439
Speaker 2: of the league is saying Michael Pennix is like a

2060
01:35:14,520 --> 01:35:17,360
Speaker 2: high second rounder because we're not sure about the injuries,

2061
01:35:17,880 --> 01:35:21,240
Speaker 2: drafting him at five overall is not good business. It's

2062
01:35:21,320 --> 01:35:21,600
Speaker 2: just not.

2063
01:35:22,120 --> 01:35:26,000
Speaker 1: It's that's true at every position except quarterback. I think,

2064
01:35:26,360 --> 01:35:29,120
Speaker 1: do you know the last time Evan a team traded

2065
01:35:29,200 --> 01:35:31,519
Speaker 1: down in the top ten and still took a quarterback?

2066
01:35:32,479 --> 01:35:35,240
Speaker 1: Traded down then, because that's what you're saying. If you're

2067
01:35:35,240 --> 01:35:36,920
Speaker 1: gonna take Michael Penercy and trade down, take him.

2068
01:35:36,960 --> 01:35:40,599
Speaker 2: So what I would rather do, And the reason why

2069
01:35:40,600 --> 01:35:43,880
Speaker 2: I wouldn't do this is because I'm looking at it

2070
01:35:43,960 --> 01:35:48,120
Speaker 2: and saying, well, is there a way that I can

2071
01:35:48,160 --> 01:35:51,759
Speaker 2: come out of this draft with Joe Alt and Michael Pennix?

2072
01:35:52,080 --> 01:35:52,920
Speaker 1: No, I don't think there is.

2073
01:35:53,280 --> 01:35:53,880
Speaker 2: I think there is.

2074
01:35:53,920 --> 01:35:57,800
Speaker 1: I don't think there is. You take but you can't

2075
01:35:57,840 --> 01:36:01,280
Speaker 1: say that without knowing his medicals. So if he but okay,

2076
01:36:01,280 --> 01:36:03,839
Speaker 1: so here's where I'm at. If he clears his medicals,

2077
01:36:03,880 --> 01:36:06,200
Speaker 1: if he goes to combine and he gets the green

2078
01:36:06,200 --> 01:36:07,000
Speaker 1: dot thumbs.

2079
01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:10,120
Speaker 2: Up, it's different conversation. He's not going to Okay that

2080
01:36:10,320 --> 01:36:13,120
Speaker 2: there's gonna be there's no way that all thirty two

2081
01:36:13,160 --> 01:36:15,479
Speaker 2: teams are gonna give you are gonna get medical thumbs up.

2082
01:36:15,600 --> 01:36:18,400
Speaker 1: But it doesn't take thirty two teams. That's my point.

2083
01:36:18,600 --> 01:36:20,800
Speaker 1: It doesn't take thirty two teams getting the green SOD.

2084
01:36:21,479 --> 01:36:24,920
Speaker 2: I personally don't see a way that at this point

2085
01:36:25,600 --> 01:36:28,360
Speaker 2: that he falls out of the teams because I think

2086
01:36:28,560 --> 01:36:30,040
Speaker 2: that's what I'm saying. I think in the teams it's

2087
01:36:30,040 --> 01:36:32,120
Speaker 2: still worth it. It's it's already becoming worth the risk.

2088
01:36:32,240 --> 01:36:34,400
Speaker 1: Here's here's my point. And I agree with you on that.

2089
01:36:34,600 --> 01:36:37,479
Speaker 1: All it takes is I call it the cold Strange effect.

2090
01:36:37,880 --> 01:36:40,320
Speaker 1: If one team thinks of players the first round talent,

2091
01:36:40,840 --> 01:36:42,000
Speaker 1: then he's a first round pick.

2092
01:36:42,280 --> 01:36:44,800
Speaker 2: I hear you, Alex. But they need to that's part

2093
01:36:44,840 --> 01:36:46,880
Speaker 2: of the job, Okay. But and here's what I'm doing.

2094
01:36:46,960 --> 01:36:50,400
Speaker 2: The intel Like, for example, last year, all of the

2095
01:36:50,439 --> 01:36:54,080
Speaker 2: media end up, all of us thought Will Levis was

2096
01:36:54,120 --> 01:36:56,320
Speaker 2: going to be a top ten pick, and identity Okay, Well,

2097
01:36:56,960 --> 01:36:59,960
Speaker 2: the point is is that that's where he was project

2098
01:37:00,160 --> 01:37:03,240
Speaker 2: to go right wrong. Oh my god, really, that's what

2099
01:37:03,240 --> 01:37:04,280
Speaker 2: you're gonna do like that?

2100
01:37:04,360 --> 01:37:06,080
Speaker 1: Do you remember how annoyed I got by the Will

2101
01:37:06,120 --> 01:37:08,360
Speaker 1: levistalk you compared him to Carson Wentz like it was

2102
01:37:08,400 --> 01:37:09,160
Speaker 1: some kind of compliment.

2103
01:37:09,360 --> 01:37:12,880
Speaker 2: I'm telling you that that's where the consensus had him.

2104
01:37:13,000 --> 01:37:14,840
Speaker 2: Whether you want to go on your victory lap or not,

2105
01:37:15,080 --> 01:37:17,600
Speaker 2: the consensus had him as the first round pick. He

2106
01:37:17,760 --> 01:37:20,040
Speaker 2: was sitting there in the green room until the second round.

2107
01:37:20,520 --> 01:37:24,200
Speaker 2: If that happens with Michael Pennix, they are so much

2108
01:37:24,240 --> 01:37:27,839
Speaker 2: better off with Joe Alt at five and Michael Pennix

2109
01:37:27,920 --> 01:37:30,759
Speaker 2: at thirty five, then they are with reaching on Penick.

2110
01:37:31,240 --> 01:37:34,880
Speaker 1: So here's my point. If Pennix's medicals look so bad

2111
01:37:34,960 --> 01:37:36,719
Speaker 1: that no teams willing to touch him the first round,

2112
01:37:37,160 --> 01:37:38,639
Speaker 1: he's off my board. I don't want him.

2113
01:37:38,720 --> 01:37:39,479
Speaker 2: Oh I'm not with that.

2114
01:37:40,000 --> 01:37:42,439
Speaker 1: I I would still like if you want to take

2115
01:37:42,520 --> 01:37:44,240
Speaker 1: him in like the fourth round, if you want to

2116
01:37:44,240 --> 01:37:45,439
Speaker 1: do the thing you.

2117
01:37:45,439 --> 01:37:47,200
Speaker 2: Know, And I think it was Parlo that made this

2118
01:37:47,200 --> 01:37:51,040
Speaker 2: comparison yesterday. He's Rob Gronkowski at that point, right, and

2119
01:37:51,280 --> 01:37:53,559
Speaker 2: in the second round that's worth it. That's where the

2120
01:37:53,600 --> 01:37:56,760
Speaker 2: second round is where the first round talents. Yeah, fall

2121
01:37:56,800 --> 01:37:59,560
Speaker 2: into the second round because of red flag issues with it.

2122
01:37:59,680 --> 01:38:02,519
Speaker 2: I just field medical whatever. That's why Christian Barmore made

2123
01:38:02,520 --> 01:38:03,400
Speaker 2: it the second.

2124
01:38:03,200 --> 01:38:06,320
Speaker 1: Round at the quarterback position. I just think it's too

2125
01:38:06,360 --> 01:38:10,200
Speaker 1: dangerous to play that game because they's not like they

2126
01:38:10,280 --> 01:38:13,240
Speaker 1: drafted you know, they they had other tight end plans

2127
01:38:13,240 --> 01:38:16,080
Speaker 1: in additional Rod Gronkowski. You're not gonna have. Yeah, that

2128
01:38:16,160 --> 01:38:20,719
Speaker 1: other tight end was a great play. Well the Patriots

2129
01:38:20,720 --> 01:38:23,960
Speaker 1: dot com? Are you going to have that equivalent at quarterback?

2130
01:38:24,000 --> 01:38:26,920
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, so here here, here's hear me out. Here's

2131
01:38:26,920 --> 01:38:32,160
Speaker 2: my other yea thing. I still go stick to it. Yeah,

2132
01:38:32,240 --> 01:38:35,479
Speaker 2: I'm not over drafting Michael Pennix. I'm not. I'm not

2133
01:38:35,560 --> 01:38:36,320
Speaker 2: over drafting him.

2134
01:38:36,360 --> 01:38:38,360
Speaker 1: I think based on his talent you can't overdraft.

2135
01:38:38,560 --> 01:38:41,640
Speaker 2: I'm not over drafting him. So with that in mind, yeah,

2136
01:38:42,000 --> 01:38:43,400
Speaker 2: move around the freaking board.

2137
01:38:43,960 --> 01:38:46,519
Speaker 1: So this is where I say it's a very risky

2138
01:38:46,560 --> 01:38:48,519
Speaker 1: game to move down for quarterback. I asked you that

2139
01:38:48,600 --> 01:38:51,400
Speaker 1: question before. The last time a team moved down from

2140
01:38:51,400 --> 01:38:53,280
Speaker 1: the top ten and still took a quarterback with like

2141
01:38:53,280 --> 01:38:54,840
Speaker 1: the pick they moved down to in the first round.

2142
01:38:54,880 --> 01:38:56,439
Speaker 1: Do you know how long it's been Sin's NFL team

2143
01:38:56,479 --> 01:38:59,120
Speaker 1: did that? Probably a long time nineteen ninety five.

2144
01:38:59,520 --> 01:39:01,000
Speaker 2: Okay, But what's the problem.

2145
01:39:01,080 --> 01:39:03,040
Speaker 1: And by the way, the Panthers move from one to

2146
01:39:03,120 --> 01:39:06,400
Speaker 1: five to take Kerry Collins. Steve McNair went third. It's

2147
01:39:06,439 --> 01:39:08,920
Speaker 1: a dangerous game when you start moving down for quarterbacks

2148
01:39:09,040 --> 01:39:10,599
Speaker 1: because of how hot a commodity they are.

2149
01:39:10,840 --> 01:39:13,840
Speaker 2: What is to prevent them though? And this is I

2150
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:18,720
Speaker 2: think in this right now, where this organization stands, they

2151
01:39:18,960 --> 01:39:22,920
Speaker 2: need to be thinking super aggressive on the offensive side

2152
01:39:22,960 --> 01:39:25,880
Speaker 2: of the ball, like they need to attack this in

2153
01:39:25,920 --> 01:39:30,160
Speaker 2: the offseason. So what's to prevent them from, whether it's

2154
01:39:30,720 --> 01:39:33,840
Speaker 2: trading down and then taking Pennix at eight and then

2155
01:39:33,880 --> 01:39:36,920
Speaker 2: adding another pick, or trading let's say they have the

2156
01:39:36,960 --> 01:39:41,160
Speaker 2: thirty sixth pick in the second round of the draft, go.

2157
01:39:41,280 --> 01:39:44,840
Speaker 1: Up, so up the move is. So here's what I

2158
01:39:44,840 --> 01:39:46,800
Speaker 1: would say prevents them from trading down to eight and

2159
01:39:46,800 --> 01:39:50,680
Speaker 1: taking Michael Pennox. It's the Titans at seven, it's the

2160
01:39:50,720 --> 01:39:54,240
Speaker 1: Giants at five. It's another team sitting like Atlanta at nine,

2161
01:39:54,320 --> 01:39:56,559
Speaker 1: or Las Vegas at eleven or Minnesota twelve, moving up

2162
01:39:56,560 --> 01:39:59,400
Speaker 1: and jumping them. If you think Michael Pennix can win

2163
01:39:59,439 --> 01:40:01,479
Speaker 1: you a super Bowl if you believe he's a super

2164
01:40:01,520 --> 01:40:06,080
Speaker 1: Bowl winning quarterback. There's no price worth risking another team

2165
01:40:06,160 --> 01:40:07,920
Speaker 1: jumping you to get him. Okay, And I would say

2166
01:40:07,920 --> 01:40:10,120
Speaker 1: that about Jane Daniels, I would say that about Drake May.

2167
01:40:10,320 --> 01:40:13,320
Speaker 2: There's no price. Where's my pushback on all this? Yeah,

2168
01:40:13,880 --> 01:40:16,040
Speaker 2: at the end of the day, we have no freaking idea.

2169
01:40:16,240 --> 01:40:19,360
Speaker 2: So so like to sit here and say, like, my worst

2170
01:40:19,479 --> 01:40:22,280
Speaker 2: nightmare for the Patriots is that they in a year

2171
01:40:22,320 --> 01:40:25,000
Speaker 2: from now are the Carolina Panthers where they drafted a

2172
01:40:25,080 --> 01:40:27,960
Speaker 2: quarterback and they trained up at King's Ransom to get

2173
01:40:28,040 --> 01:40:30,520
Speaker 2: him and he'd fix nothing right.

2174
01:40:29,840 --> 01:40:35,240
Speaker 1: But it's it's this is why I held on. And

2175
01:40:35,280 --> 01:40:37,559
Speaker 1: I'm not saying go back to mac Jones, but this

2176
01:40:37,720 --> 01:40:39,800
Speaker 1: is why I held on so long, saying you need

2177
01:40:39,840 --> 01:40:42,760
Speaker 1: to need to need to know definitively if Mac Jones

2178
01:40:42,800 --> 01:40:45,960
Speaker 1: is the guy or not, because the quarterback carousel is terrifying.

2179
01:40:46,160 --> 01:40:50,200
Speaker 1: It's freaking terrifying. There's one hundred different doors you can open.

2180
01:40:50,479 --> 01:40:53,800
Speaker 1: In ninety nine of them, there's just empty, void and

2181
01:40:54,000 --> 01:40:56,800
Speaker 1: nothingness in despair on the other side, and you have

2182
01:40:56,880 --> 01:41:00,400
Speaker 1: no idea. But if you believe. It is there job

2183
01:41:00,520 --> 01:41:02,800
Speaker 1: very dark it is. It is it is their job

2184
01:41:02,880 --> 01:41:04,760
Speaker 1: to find a guy in believe in a guy. And

2185
01:41:04,800 --> 01:41:08,080
Speaker 1: if you believe in the guy, you have to commit

2186
01:41:08,120 --> 01:41:10,479
Speaker 1: to that. The move to make evan to your point,

2187
01:41:11,560 --> 01:41:14,120
Speaker 1: you cannot move down into and if it works for them, great,

2188
01:41:14,160 --> 01:41:14,479
Speaker 1: and all.

2189
01:41:14,920 --> 01:41:16,960
Speaker 2: The move is to move up. The move is not

2190
01:41:17,000 --> 01:41:18,200
Speaker 2: and I don't mean in the first round.

2191
01:41:18,240 --> 01:41:20,519
Speaker 1: No, no, the move is to move up from thirty

2192
01:41:20,560 --> 01:41:22,880
Speaker 1: four to the back end of the first round. And

2193
01:41:22,960 --> 01:41:25,320
Speaker 1: that's where you take a tackle or maybe a receiver.

2194
01:41:25,400 --> 01:41:28,679
Speaker 1: Maybe you grab like a guy like say quarterback. No, no,

2195
01:41:28,800 --> 01:41:31,920
Speaker 1: you take the quarterback. The quarterbacks that are gonna be there.

2196
01:41:33,200 --> 01:41:34,920
Speaker 1: Enjoy JJ McCarthy then enjoyed.

2197
01:41:35,400 --> 01:41:37,439
Speaker 2: Why why does it have to be J Boenix or

2198
01:41:37,479 --> 01:41:39,920
Speaker 2: JJ McCarthy, because you're telling me that all four of

2199
01:41:39,920 --> 01:41:41,040
Speaker 2: these guys are going.

2200
01:41:40,840 --> 01:41:44,800
Speaker 1: At top fifteen. Yeah, Pex clears.

2201
01:41:44,640 --> 01:41:47,000
Speaker 2: Which doesn't it never happen? Penix clears.

2202
01:41:47,200 --> 01:41:51,800
Speaker 1: If Pennix clears, remember, oh, you can get mac Jones

2203
01:41:51,840 --> 01:41:53,439
Speaker 1: a twenty five. You can trade down and get Mack.

2204
01:41:53,560 --> 01:41:55,479
Speaker 1: They got him at fifteen. Some people thought he was

2205
01:41:55,479 --> 01:41:57,880
Speaker 1: gonna go to the Niners at three. He made it.

2206
01:41:57,920 --> 01:42:00,240
Speaker 1: Always at this point in the process. At this point

2207
01:42:00,240 --> 01:42:03,120
Speaker 1: in the process, Mac, Like where we're sitting now in

2208
01:42:03,840 --> 01:42:07,679
Speaker 1: early January. You think Mac Jones was a second round pick.

2209
01:42:07,800 --> 01:42:10,639
Speaker 2: Okay, but you Caleb Williams and Drake may are going

2210
01:42:10,680 --> 01:42:13,479
Speaker 2: top three, top five, whatever, Right, those guys are probably

2211
01:42:13,520 --> 01:42:14,160
Speaker 2: gonna be one too.

2212
01:42:14,240 --> 01:42:15,479
Speaker 1: Jane Daniels getting on the tough.

2213
01:42:15,400 --> 01:42:18,439
Speaker 2: One depending on when the draft, you know, the trades

2214
01:42:18,479 --> 01:42:22,320
Speaker 2: and all that stuff. You're telling me that both Jaydeen

2215
01:42:22,400 --> 01:42:25,120
Speaker 2: Daniels and Michael Pennix are going to be off the

2216
01:42:25,120 --> 01:42:27,080
Speaker 2: board by the time the Patriots could trade up from

2217
01:42:27,080 --> 01:42:28,599
Speaker 2: the second round to get one of those guys.

2218
01:42:28,960 --> 01:42:32,000
Speaker 1: I mean, unless they want to go crazy crazy, like

2219
01:42:32,040 --> 01:42:33,240
Speaker 1: you can trade off as high as you want. You

2220
01:42:33,240 --> 01:42:35,880
Speaker 1: can give up whatever you want, but like a realistic

2221
01:42:35,920 --> 01:42:38,800
Speaker 1: trade where you don't blow out all your future assets. Yes,

2222
01:42:39,200 --> 01:42:40,200
Speaker 1: I think that.

2223
01:42:41,400 --> 01:42:45,600
Speaker 2: I look at this is where I start to like

2224
01:42:46,640 --> 01:42:49,360
Speaker 2: the tires start to spin on all this the ways

2225
01:42:49,400 --> 01:42:51,599
Speaker 2: that so that Bill would think about this, because in

2226
01:42:51,640 --> 01:42:53,600
Speaker 2: my mind, I know he might not be here. But

2227
01:42:53,800 --> 01:42:56,640
Speaker 2: the point is is that the right thing to do

2228
01:42:56,720 --> 01:43:00,960
Speaker 2: in my mind is to trade down. Yeah, okay, take

2229
01:43:01,000 --> 01:43:04,439
Speaker 2: the player position player you're gonna want in this draft.

2230
01:43:04,640 --> 01:43:09,320
Speaker 2: Fashanu Alt, you know, trading down and getting Joel who's

2231
01:43:09,720 --> 01:43:11,160
Speaker 2: not everybody can go in the top five.

2232
01:43:11,520 --> 01:43:15,439
Speaker 1: Somebody's got to fall three quarterbacks, Alt Harrison, that's your

2233
01:43:15,479 --> 01:43:16,000
Speaker 1: top one.

2234
01:43:15,840 --> 01:43:20,479
Speaker 2: Okay, So then the Fshanhu then okay. I want to

2235
01:43:20,479 --> 01:43:25,960
Speaker 2: come out of this draft with a franchise left tackle potential,

2236
01:43:26,040 --> 01:43:28,960
Speaker 2: right like, no one's the lock to be a franchise anything.

2237
01:43:29,360 --> 01:43:33,240
Speaker 2: Franchise left tackle potential, franchise quarterback potential. And I don't

2238
01:43:33,240 --> 01:43:35,360
Speaker 2: think that either. That's totally out of the realm.

2239
01:43:35,720 --> 01:43:38,240
Speaker 1: I don't think it is either. But you're okay, so

2240
01:43:38,520 --> 01:43:40,960
Speaker 1: a couple things. There is one way maybe this works,

2241
01:43:41,280 --> 01:43:43,440
Speaker 1: but the draft order has to fall a certain way.

2242
01:43:43,520 --> 01:43:46,519
Speaker 1: If the Cardinals first pick, remember they have two, they

2243
01:43:46,520 --> 01:43:49,680
Speaker 1: have the Texans. If the Cardinals first pick comes just

2244
01:43:49,720 --> 01:43:51,680
Speaker 1: behind the Patriots right now, the Patriots would be three,

2245
01:43:51,720 --> 01:43:54,439
Speaker 1: the Cardinals would be four. Maybe you move from three

2246
01:43:54,479 --> 01:43:57,920
Speaker 1: to four and you get the Texans pick in addition,

2247
01:43:58,200 --> 01:44:00,160
Speaker 1: and you have to give up some other assets. That's

2248
01:44:00,200 --> 01:44:01,800
Speaker 1: maybe the only way you can do it, but you're

2249
01:44:01,800 --> 01:44:02,719
Speaker 1: moving down one spot.

2250
01:44:02,840 --> 01:44:05,879
Speaker 2: My perint is if you can trade down a little bit, yeah,

2251
01:44:05,920 --> 01:44:08,320
Speaker 2: and then you use those assets to move up from

2252
01:44:08,400 --> 01:44:10,840
Speaker 2: thirty five. You know, like you have to you have

2253
01:44:10,920 --> 01:44:11,719
Speaker 2: to build the package.

2254
01:44:11,760 --> 01:44:13,960
Speaker 1: Yes, but here here's what I would tell you, Evan.

2255
01:44:14,479 --> 01:44:16,280
Speaker 1: The reason I don't think Michael Penix gets to where

2256
01:44:16,280 --> 01:44:18,320
Speaker 1: they can do that as the draft order stands right

2257
01:44:18,360 --> 01:44:22,439
Speaker 1: now at Lanta. So we agree that the quarterback teams

2258
01:44:22,439 --> 01:44:24,880
Speaker 1: at the top. Let's say the Patriots aren't, Washington's a

2259
01:44:24,960 --> 01:44:27,639
Speaker 1: quarterback team. You think the Giants are a quarterback team,

2260
01:44:28,240 --> 01:44:28,880
Speaker 1: and then I don't.

2261
01:44:28,720 --> 01:44:31,559
Speaker 2: Think the Giants yet the Giants still oh Daniel Jones

2262
01:44:31,600 --> 01:44:32,240
Speaker 2: for next year.

2263
01:44:32,320 --> 01:44:34,200
Speaker 1: We had this argument the other way around it. Okay,

2264
01:44:34,240 --> 01:44:36,800
Speaker 1: the point being like they're a quarter like they should

2265
01:44:36,840 --> 01:44:39,040
Speaker 1: be a quarterback team. They don't have a quarterback, but

2266
01:44:39,439 --> 01:44:42,719
Speaker 1: right now you have nine to fourteen. If the draft

2267
01:44:42,800 --> 01:44:50,240
Speaker 1: was today, Atlanta, Chicago's not, but Atlanta, Vegas, Minnesota, New Orleans, Denver.

2268
01:44:51,479 --> 01:44:53,280
Speaker 1: There's a quarterback going somewhere in there.

2269
01:44:53,439 --> 01:44:56,679
Speaker 2: Maybe two. So the point is is that Pennix Penis

2270
01:44:56,720 --> 01:44:59,320
Speaker 2: is the top ten pick on talent, Talent on film,

2271
01:45:00,080 --> 01:45:01,840
Speaker 2: tell you is they're gonna be He has a medical

2272
01:45:01,960 --> 01:45:04,320
Speaker 2: Just let me yes, he has the medical issue. Right

2273
01:45:04,680 --> 01:45:06,639
Speaker 2: Teams to get scared off about that kind of stuff

2274
01:45:06,640 --> 01:45:10,800
Speaker 2: all the time, Secondly, Jaden Daniels, I don't know how

2275
01:45:10,880 --> 01:45:13,559
Speaker 2: much the league has evolved yet. I don't know. And

2276
01:45:13,600 --> 01:45:16,519
Speaker 2: I'm not like trying to like it's not like a

2277
01:45:16,600 --> 01:45:19,760
Speaker 2: racial thing. Don't make it that. I just don't necessarily know.

2278
01:45:20,240 --> 01:45:24,040
Speaker 2: Lamar Jackson five years ago went thirty second over. Yeah, Ja,

2279
01:45:24,120 --> 01:45:26,880
Speaker 2: he's gonna win MVP this year and right, and Jaden

2280
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:30,120
Speaker 2: Daniels is best pro comp is Lamar Jackson.

2281
01:45:30,240 --> 01:45:32,800
Speaker 1: It's a copycat league, and enough teams are you're making

2282
01:45:32,840 --> 01:45:34,880
Speaker 1: the case for him going high. I think because I

2283
01:45:34,920 --> 01:45:37,800
Speaker 1: think it not I don't know, are gonna look I

2284
01:45:37,800 --> 01:45:39,519
Speaker 1: think it's a copycat league because.

2285
01:45:39,320 --> 01:45:41,000
Speaker 2: They're gonna look at him as a runner. They're gonna

2286
01:45:41,040 --> 01:45:43,400
Speaker 2: say he's a runner. First, So a couple things.

2287
01:45:43,960 --> 01:45:47,040
Speaker 1: One, I think teams are gonna look at and say, Okay,

2288
01:45:47,120 --> 01:45:49,080
Speaker 1: Lamar Jackson just won the MVP. How do we get

2289
01:45:49,080 --> 01:45:53,280
Speaker 1: our Lamar Jackson? And that is gonna fuel things. Second,

2290
01:45:53,560 --> 01:45:57,080
Speaker 1: and this may sound arbitrary, but I promise you it matters.

2291
01:45:58,240 --> 01:46:05,360
Speaker 1: Jade and Daniels bio essentially sec quarterback transfer quarterback played

2292
01:46:05,400 --> 01:46:07,840
Speaker 1: for a former NFL head coach. And then wait, sorry,

2293
01:46:07,840 --> 01:46:12,720
Speaker 1: there's one more way. There's one more Heisman winner the

2294
01:46:12,960 --> 01:46:17,439
Speaker 1: last Heisman winner in his draft year, so not like

2295
01:46:17,520 --> 01:46:19,360
Speaker 1: Lamar wanted as a freshman and got drafted two years

2296
01:46:19,439 --> 01:46:23,840
Speaker 1: later their sophomore. The last Heisman to win it quarterback

2297
01:46:23,880 --> 01:46:25,519
Speaker 1: to win it in his draft year and not go

2298
01:46:25,640 --> 01:46:28,960
Speaker 1: one to one was Marcus Mariota ten years ago. He

2299
01:46:29,000 --> 01:46:33,320
Speaker 1: went second. The last Heisman winner to not go one

2300
01:46:33,400 --> 01:46:36,800
Speaker 1: or two his Heisman year was Troy Smith. That was

2301
01:46:36,800 --> 01:46:39,479
Speaker 1: in two thousand and seven. But Robert, you're talking about

2302
01:46:39,479 --> 01:46:41,759
Speaker 1: the league has the margin on the runner. Robert Griffin,

2303
01:46:41,800 --> 01:46:44,080
Speaker 1: the third went second. Evan that was over a decade ago.

2304
01:46:44,240 --> 01:46:47,200
Speaker 2: Lamar Jackson five years ago, goes thirty second overall. Right,

2305
01:46:47,240 --> 01:46:49,639
Speaker 2: two was in eighteen five years ago, goes thirty second overall.

2306
01:46:50,040 --> 01:46:54,840
Speaker 2: Justin Fields. Justin Fields went behind Zach Wilson and Trey

2307
01:46:54,920 --> 01:47:01,240
Speaker 2: Lance tenth overall because of stereoti hype bullshit, right, like

2308
01:47:01,280 --> 01:47:03,840
Speaker 2: he can't read a field, he doesn't have the attitude,

2309
01:47:04,120 --> 01:47:06,599
Speaker 2: like all this crap that they say about these guys,

2310
01:47:06,880 --> 01:47:07,719
Speaker 2: and it's ridiculous.

2311
01:47:07,720 --> 01:47:09,920
Speaker 1: Well, I think some of it was also Ohio State.

2312
01:47:10,120 --> 01:47:13,840
Speaker 1: In the history of quarterbacks, whatever, Jane Daniels, Joe Burrow,

2313
01:47:13,880 --> 01:47:17,759
Speaker 1: anybody that watched watched anything that that year in twenty

2314
01:47:17,800 --> 01:47:20,400
Speaker 1: twenty one, that thought that Zach Wilson was a better

2315
01:47:20,439 --> 01:47:23,400
Speaker 1: prospect than Justin Fields is an idiot. Oh yeah, Okay,

2316
01:47:23,400 --> 01:47:24,840
Speaker 1: they get teams get it wrong all the time.

2317
01:47:24,960 --> 01:47:27,559
Speaker 2: But the point is is that that just happened like

2318
01:47:27,640 --> 01:47:31,080
Speaker 2: three years ago, and maybe Jaden Daniels falls to like ten,

2319
01:47:31,400 --> 01:47:33,080
Speaker 2: you know, like maybe he goes right around the same

2320
01:47:33,120 --> 01:47:35,600
Speaker 2: range that Justin Fields went in. But I'm just not

2321
01:47:35,720 --> 01:47:38,120
Speaker 2: convinced that teams are gonna view him as like a

2322
01:47:38,160 --> 01:47:40,720
Speaker 2: top five talent in this like a top five pick.

2323
01:47:41,000 --> 01:47:43,439
Speaker 2: I think that there's still gonna be some of that

2324
01:47:44,000 --> 01:47:47,280
Speaker 2: like can he process it, can he see it? Can

2325
01:47:47,320 --> 01:47:50,000
Speaker 2: he you know? Is he accurate enough? Like all the

2326
01:47:50,160 --> 01:47:51,880
Speaker 2: dope bullshit I Fason Fields.

2327
01:47:52,439 --> 01:47:55,559
Speaker 1: A lot of teams will view it that way, more

2328
01:47:55,600 --> 01:48:00,760
Speaker 1: teams than not. But that doesn't matter because all it

2329
01:48:00,880 --> 01:48:05,800
Speaker 1: takes is one and Jayde Daniels experience his statistics again,

2330
01:48:05,840 --> 01:48:09,360
Speaker 1: the Heisman thing, the physical makeup. There's going to be

2331
01:48:09,400 --> 01:48:11,920
Speaker 1: a handful of teams that are very high on Jayane

2332
01:48:11,960 --> 01:48:13,920
Speaker 1: Daniels and most of the league might look at them

2333
01:48:13,960 --> 01:48:15,680
Speaker 1: like most of the league looked at the Jets with

2334
01:48:15,760 --> 01:48:18,120
Speaker 1: Zach Wilson, and say, what the hell are you doing

2335
01:48:18,320 --> 01:48:21,040
Speaker 1: taking this kid second? Overall? But there is going to

2336
01:48:21,040 --> 01:48:23,639
Speaker 1: be a contingent of teams that looks at Jane Daniels

2337
01:48:23,680 --> 01:48:25,960
Speaker 1: a top five pick, and one of those teams is

2338
01:48:26,000 --> 01:48:28,040
Speaker 1: gonna move up to get jayde Daniels if he starts

2339
01:48:28,040 --> 01:48:30,439
Speaker 1: to fall. The SAME's gonna happen with Michael PENNOCKX. I

2340
01:48:30,840 --> 01:48:33,080
Speaker 1: really believe they are gonna be a handful of teams

2341
01:48:33,120 --> 01:48:36,120
Speaker 1: that say, this guy's a top ten talent, We're gonna

2342
01:48:36,120 --> 01:48:38,200
Speaker 1: go up and get them. We don't care about the injury.

2343
01:48:38,200 --> 01:48:40,639
Speaker 2: I don't necessarily, I hear you and that.

2344
01:48:41,960 --> 01:48:43,880
Speaker 1: Which is why it be and maybe it doesn't happen.

2345
01:48:43,920 --> 01:48:46,799
Speaker 1: But are you willing to bet if you think Michael

2346
01:48:46,800 --> 01:48:48,599
Speaker 1: Pennis is a super Bowl winning quarterback?

2347
01:48:48,840 --> 01:48:49,760
Speaker 2: I don't know that.

2348
01:48:50,040 --> 01:48:52,240
Speaker 1: I can't like That's the thing is like we always talk, okay,

2349
01:48:52,280 --> 01:48:53,679
Speaker 1: but you don't know any of these guys. But here's

2350
01:48:53,680 --> 01:48:54,040
Speaker 1: my point.

2351
01:48:54,160 --> 01:48:56,320
Speaker 2: We can't like That's that was the problem. That's the

2352
01:48:56,360 --> 01:48:59,280
Speaker 2: mistake that Panthers mate, right, that you can't like that.

2353
01:48:59,400 --> 01:49:02,080
Speaker 2: You can't the Panthers. But but but you can't be

2354
01:49:02,280 --> 01:49:04,400
Speaker 2: so convicted if if if.

2355
01:49:04,360 --> 01:49:06,640
Speaker 1: You're scared off by the fact that a quarterback can

2356
01:49:06,680 --> 01:49:09,719
Speaker 1: be a bust. You're never going to draft a quarterback.

2357
01:49:09,800 --> 01:49:12,880
Speaker 2: I'm not saying to rock a bust. You just can't

2358
01:49:12,920 --> 01:49:16,400
Speaker 2: invest everything in the pick like you can't, like you can't.

2359
01:49:16,640 --> 01:49:18,479
Speaker 1: But but I'm saying about him where you are on

2360
01:49:18,479 --> 01:49:19,880
Speaker 1: the board. I'm not saying move up. I'm saying picking

2361
01:49:19,960 --> 01:49:21,719
Speaker 1: where you are on the board. That's not investing everything.

2362
01:49:22,000 --> 01:49:25,000
Speaker 1: That's using your pick. It's still a top five pick

2363
01:49:25,040 --> 01:49:27,720
Speaker 1: in the draft. Like, this is how you have to

2364
01:49:27,840 --> 01:49:29,080
Speaker 1: use that pick on somebody.

2365
01:49:29,160 --> 01:49:32,520
Speaker 2: I realized that. But this is how teams make mistakes.

2366
01:49:32,800 --> 01:49:35,040
Speaker 2: This is how they make the mistake. But but they

2367
01:49:35,439 --> 01:49:37,880
Speaker 2: This is how the Jets get Zach Wilson, This is

2368
01:49:37,920 --> 01:49:40,200
Speaker 2: how the Panthers draft.

2369
01:49:40,600 --> 01:49:42,720
Speaker 1: This is more about the organization. This is more about

2370
01:49:42,720 --> 01:49:45,639
Speaker 1: the organization correctly identifying it or not. I'm saying, if

2371
01:49:45,640 --> 01:49:50,040
Speaker 1: they believe he's the guy, it's going to if they're

2372
01:49:50,080 --> 01:49:53,160
Speaker 1: willing to trade down, then they truly don't believe he's

2373
01:49:53,200 --> 01:49:54,519
Speaker 1: the guy, at which point I don't want him.

2374
01:49:54,560 --> 01:49:58,680
Speaker 2: I don't want I don't want to win really love

2375
01:49:58,760 --> 01:50:00,240
Speaker 2: Christian Gonzalez because.

2376
01:50:00,240 --> 01:50:03,800
Speaker 1: No, Evan, this all only applies to quarterback. This it's

2377
01:50:03,800 --> 01:50:06,000
Speaker 1: a different and you you don't tell me that's a

2378
01:50:06,040 --> 01:50:09,280
Speaker 1: cop out. Quarterback is there's two drafts. There's the quarterback

2379
01:50:09,360 --> 01:50:12,840
Speaker 1: draft and there's all the other players, and they happen simultaneously.

2380
01:50:13,080 --> 01:50:16,200
Speaker 2: You reach on the quarterback you're gonna be You don't.

2381
01:50:16,240 --> 01:50:19,000
Speaker 2: But if you if you believe the guy, because you already.

2382
01:50:18,720 --> 01:50:21,200
Speaker 1: Score a couple of times. If you believe in the guy,

2383
01:50:22,160 --> 01:50:25,760
Speaker 1: if you believe in the guy, if you believe in

2384
01:50:25,760 --> 01:50:29,599
Speaker 1: the guy, you don't risk losing him. If you don't

2385
01:50:29,600 --> 01:50:33,200
Speaker 1: believe in the guy, I hope, I hope that somebody

2386
01:50:33,479 --> 01:50:35,559
Speaker 1: believes in the guy as much as you're making it

2387
01:50:35,600 --> 01:50:37,960
Speaker 1: sound like like you how you can't?

2388
01:50:38,400 --> 01:50:40,479
Speaker 2: I know for a fact. And look, it's gotten them

2389
01:50:40,479 --> 01:50:43,400
Speaker 2: into some trouble. It's gotten them into some trouble, no

2390
01:50:43,520 --> 01:50:47,240
Speaker 2: doubt about that. But one of the things that Belichick

2391
01:50:47,320 --> 01:50:51,840
Speaker 2: really adheres to is that there's no perfect prospect. Yes,

2392
01:50:51,960 --> 01:50:54,800
Speaker 2: so to be so convicted that this is the guy,

2393
01:50:55,640 --> 01:50:58,080
Speaker 2: it's relative, but but no, but it's relative. I'm not

2394
01:50:58,120 --> 01:51:00,200
Speaker 2: saying you're like, Okay, this guy is gonna be this guy.

2395
01:51:00,200 --> 01:51:02,120
Speaker 2: We're sure he's gonna be an MVP, blah blah blah whatever.

2396
01:51:02,160 --> 01:51:05,040
Speaker 2: But I'm saying to be as sure about him as

2397
01:51:05,040 --> 01:51:06,760
Speaker 2: you can be at a prospect. Evan, if you don't

2398
01:51:06,800 --> 01:51:09,960
Speaker 2: want to play the game about you know, having to

2399
01:51:10,439 --> 01:51:13,080
Speaker 2: bank on your evaluation of a college quarterback, you know

2400
01:51:13,120 --> 01:51:15,959
Speaker 2: what you do to avoid that. You developed the quarterback

2401
01:51:16,000 --> 01:51:18,559
Speaker 2: you drafted three years ago. You don't let Tom Brady

2402
01:51:18,600 --> 01:51:21,400
Speaker 2: walk out the door without a backup plan. This was

2403
01:51:21,439 --> 01:51:24,040
Speaker 2: my whole thing I was screaming about for months about

2404
01:51:24,040 --> 01:51:24,840
Speaker 2: you don't want to go back in the.

2405
01:51:24,880 --> 01:51:27,120
Speaker 1: Quarterback cares out because you're right, it is scary. It

2406
01:51:27,200 --> 01:51:29,320
Speaker 1: is scary taking a quarterback in the top ten because

2407
01:51:29,360 --> 01:51:30,479
Speaker 1: you ultimately, I'm.

2408
01:51:30,360 --> 01:51:33,840
Speaker 2: Not scared about it. If I'm not scared about taking

2409
01:51:33,840 --> 01:51:37,800
Speaker 2: the quarterback in the top ten. If the quarterback, if

2410
01:51:37,800 --> 01:51:40,640
Speaker 2: that's like how he should where he should go, Like

2411
01:51:40,920 --> 01:51:43,280
Speaker 2: Zach Wilson went too high, like I think, and Zach

2412
01:51:43,360 --> 01:51:45,040
Speaker 2: keep on picking on Zach Wilson, but there's no he

2413
01:51:45,560 --> 01:51:47,880
Speaker 2: on Zach Wills. There's a million examples.

2414
01:51:47,360 --> 01:51:50,240
Speaker 1: Like Okay, the point that the Panthers traded up to

2415
01:51:50,240 --> 01:51:51,960
Speaker 1: the first overall pick the draft, I just.

2416
01:51:51,920 --> 01:51:53,280
Speaker 2: Think they drafted the wrong guy.

2417
01:51:53,320 --> 01:51:54,920
Speaker 1: I just think the right guy went number two. I

2418
01:51:54,960 --> 01:51:58,120
Speaker 1: just think you're crazy to think that Michael Pennock shouldn't

2419
01:51:58,120 --> 01:51:58,960
Speaker 1: go in the top ten.

2420
01:51:59,680 --> 01:52:02,559
Speaker 2: If it's just based off of talent. I'm not saying

2421
01:52:02,600 --> 01:52:03,240
Speaker 2: he shouldn't.

2422
01:52:03,520 --> 01:52:05,920
Speaker 1: There are gonna be there. There will be enough teams

2423
01:52:05,920 --> 01:52:08,920
Speaker 1: that don't care about the man if he's not going.

2424
01:52:09,320 --> 01:52:11,360
Speaker 1: But here's my point. If the medicals are that bad

2425
01:52:11,640 --> 01:52:13,880
Speaker 1: that every team is out on him, then I have

2426
01:52:13,920 --> 01:52:15,679
Speaker 1: non What do you why do you want?

2427
01:52:15,800 --> 01:52:16,320
Speaker 2: Not? Not?

2428
01:52:16,680 --> 01:52:16,800
Speaker 1: Is not?

2429
01:52:17,200 --> 01:52:19,599
Speaker 2: No? But that's the thing. It's not every team being

2430
01:52:19,640 --> 01:52:22,559
Speaker 2: out on him. It's just not every team needs a quarterback. Okay,

2431
01:52:22,560 --> 01:52:26,440
Speaker 2: but here's my point. All it takes is one team.

2432
01:52:26,880 --> 01:52:30,040
Speaker 2: Let's say you trade down from three to six, right,

2433
01:52:30,200 --> 01:52:32,240
Speaker 2: know the board. Let's say you trade.

2434
01:52:32,040 --> 01:52:34,519
Speaker 1: Down, do your homework and know the board. But you

2435
01:52:34,520 --> 01:52:38,080
Speaker 1: you can't know it for sure. You can't. Who had

2436
01:52:38,320 --> 01:52:41,599
Speaker 1: Houston moving up to three after picking second.

2437
01:52:42,200 --> 01:52:44,920
Speaker 2: Nobody but everybody had will Anderson going in the top

2438
01:52:44,960 --> 01:52:45,519
Speaker 2: I'm saying.

2439
01:52:45,520 --> 01:52:47,880
Speaker 1: But if if you have, if you have this plan

2440
01:52:48,320 --> 01:52:51,519
Speaker 1: where you think, all right, we're gonna trade back to eight,

2441
01:52:51,520 --> 01:52:53,519
Speaker 1: we're gonna take Michael Pennox there and they're gonna move back.

2442
01:52:53,520 --> 01:52:56,240
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tackle and then all of a sudden, out

2443
01:52:56,280 --> 01:52:59,360
Speaker 1: of nowhere, you know, somebody trades up to six and

2444
01:52:59,400 --> 01:53:03,040
Speaker 1: takes Pennis. Maybe there's a team you thought needed a quarterback,

2445
01:53:03,080 --> 01:53:04,599
Speaker 1: but you thought they were lower and you didn't think

2446
01:53:04,600 --> 01:53:06,120
Speaker 1: they'd trade up, and then they do. And now what

2447
01:53:06,240 --> 01:53:08,920
Speaker 1: your whole offseason shot? Because the fourth quarterbacks on the

2448
01:53:08,920 --> 01:53:11,639
Speaker 1: board and now you're you're doing Michael Pratt or Joe Milton.

2449
01:53:12,040 --> 01:53:13,519
Speaker 1: You can't risk that.

2450
01:53:13,560 --> 01:53:14,679
Speaker 2: Did Jayden Daniels die?

2451
01:53:15,240 --> 01:53:16,680
Speaker 1: Jaydeon Daniels, I told you I think he's a top

2452
01:53:16,720 --> 01:53:17,040
Speaker 1: five pack.

2453
01:53:17,080 --> 01:53:19,000
Speaker 2: Oh he's not going top five. I think this league

2454
01:53:19,080 --> 01:53:21,080
Speaker 2: is not taking a running quarterback top five.

2455
01:53:21,640 --> 01:53:23,360
Speaker 1: You underrate him as a passer.

2456
01:53:23,680 --> 01:53:26,960
Speaker 2: I don't underrate him as a passer. They do.

2457
01:53:27,160 --> 01:53:29,040
Speaker 1: I already know that they will. You don't think one

2458
01:53:29,120 --> 01:53:31,240
Speaker 1: or two teams are gonna figure that out?

2459
01:53:31,600 --> 01:53:36,320
Speaker 2: No, they did. I'm sorry. I am still I am

2460
01:53:36,400 --> 01:53:41,600
Speaker 2: still burned by Lamar Jackson. Okay, because I was a

2461
01:53:42,040 --> 01:53:44,400
Speaker 2: young and back then, but I knew a little thing,

2462
01:53:44,640 --> 01:53:46,719
Speaker 2: and I knew that that guy was gonna be freaking

2463
01:53:46,760 --> 01:53:47,639
Speaker 2: awesome in the league.

2464
01:53:48,000 --> 01:53:51,120
Speaker 1: And they right about Lamar, were right about Lamar. It's

2465
01:53:51,120 --> 01:53:53,759
Speaker 1: not even just about taking a victory lap on Lamar.

2466
01:53:54,040 --> 01:53:56,439
Speaker 1: I'm gonna dis point it as it is right now.

2467
01:53:56,720 --> 01:53:59,759
Speaker 1: The league five years ago was racist towards Lamar Jackson.

2468
01:53:59,800 --> 01:54:00,640
Speaker 1: That's what it was.

2469
01:54:01,000 --> 01:54:03,519
Speaker 2: They looked at him and they didn't think that he

2470
01:54:03,600 --> 01:54:06,880
Speaker 2: had the mental acumen to handle playing quarterback in the NFL.

2471
01:54:07,040 --> 01:54:10,799
Speaker 2: And he might win two MVPs in the league, okay,

2472
01:54:11,040 --> 01:54:13,200
Speaker 2: And I am not convinced that the people making the

2473
01:54:13,240 --> 01:54:16,080
Speaker 2: decisions aren't gonna think the same thing about Jadon Daniels. Yet,

2474
01:54:16,320 --> 01:54:19,639
Speaker 2: maybe they will, and I hope they do, because he

2475
01:54:20,240 --> 01:54:23,000
Speaker 2: definitely is a good thrower. He might be even a

2476
01:54:23,000 --> 01:54:26,280
Speaker 2: better pop prospect as a passer than Lamar was, I think.

2477
01:54:26,920 --> 01:54:30,200
Speaker 2: But the point is is that though these teams look

2478
01:54:30,240 --> 01:54:32,960
Speaker 2: at it that way, that's how they view it, and

2479
01:54:33,200 --> 01:54:35,400
Speaker 2: and I I know it's the same way as how

2480
01:54:35,440 --> 01:54:38,640
Speaker 2: they view the medical side of things too. They get

2481
01:54:38,680 --> 01:54:39,520
Speaker 2: afraid of those.

2482
01:54:39,480 --> 01:54:43,760
Speaker 1: So let me Anthony Richardson last year went top five. Yeah,

2483
01:54:44,680 --> 01:54:46,600
Speaker 1: Jane Daniels better prospect Anthony Richardson.

2484
01:54:47,640 --> 01:54:51,240
Speaker 2: In some ways, Anthony Richardson is a is a freaking tank,

2485
01:54:51,840 --> 01:54:53,320
Speaker 2: I'm and he's already.

2486
01:54:53,280 --> 01:54:55,600
Speaker 1: He's more va. I would say he's more a running

2487
01:54:55,680 --> 01:54:56,880
Speaker 1: quarterback than Jane Daniels.

2488
01:54:56,880 --> 01:54:59,360
Speaker 2: Maybe, so maybe they have evolved, maybe That's.

2489
01:54:59,240 --> 01:55:01,440
Speaker 1: What I'm and especially in the year where Lamar is

2490
01:55:01,440 --> 01:55:04,360
Speaker 1: gonna win m v P. And that's remember after Josh

2491
01:55:04,440 --> 01:55:07,120
Speaker 1: Allen broke out, everybody you know why Zach Wilson went second,

2492
01:55:07,280 --> 01:55:09,960
Speaker 1: because Josh Allen broke out and everybody wanted the next

2493
01:55:10,040 --> 01:55:12,720
Speaker 1: Josh Allen, right, and it was it was excuse me nothing.

2494
01:55:12,840 --> 01:55:15,320
Speaker 1: Remember do you remember what his nickname was? Remember? Or

2495
01:55:15,360 --> 01:55:16,840
Speaker 1: you know who else broke out? They were trying to

2496
01:55:16,880 --> 01:55:19,200
Speaker 1: get b Yu Baker. He was no. Do you remember

2497
01:55:19,240 --> 01:55:20,840
Speaker 1: what his nickname was when he came out. It's not

2498
01:55:20,880 --> 01:55:24,160
Speaker 1: Allan either, Mormon mahomes No. Everybody was calling him more

2499
01:55:24,240 --> 01:55:27,920
Speaker 1: and I said, Mormon mansil. But here's yes. But it's

2500
01:55:27,920 --> 01:55:32,040
Speaker 1: a Copycatley I I. I'm not saying that the racial

2501
01:55:32,080 --> 01:55:35,920
Speaker 1: stuff isn't true, but I I you're not giving the

2502
01:55:36,000 --> 01:55:38,120
Speaker 1: league enough credit for recognizing what Jane Daniels can do.

2503
01:55:38,280 --> 01:55:43,800
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know Brendan's and Quincy. What's up Brendan, Brendan?

2504
01:55:44,960 --> 01:55:46,840
Speaker 1: How good?

2505
01:55:48,160 --> 01:55:50,480
Speaker 3: Great stuff? You guys kind of touched on one I

2506
01:55:50,480 --> 01:55:55,240
Speaker 3: was gonna ask about, But first thing I wanted to ask, really,

2507
01:55:55,240 --> 01:55:56,920
Speaker 3: I wanted to talk about Bill O'Brien a little bit.

2508
01:55:58,120 --> 01:56:01,560
Speaker 3: Obviously we know how the offenses this year, we know

2509
01:56:01,600 --> 01:56:05,320
Speaker 3: where they rank, but I wanted to get your thoughts

2510
01:56:05,360 --> 01:56:08,480
Speaker 3: on just you know, how would you kind of grade

2511
01:56:08,480 --> 01:56:13,600
Speaker 3: his overall performance, you know, first year back as the OC. Obviously,

2512
01:56:14,520 --> 01:56:17,720
Speaker 3: quarterback play has been terrible. Obviously a lot of turnovers,

2513
01:56:17,720 --> 01:56:19,680
Speaker 3: and we know where the roster is talent was, but

2514
01:56:20,400 --> 01:56:22,400
Speaker 3: wanted to see I mean, I know your big fan is,

2515
01:56:22,480 --> 01:56:24,800
Speaker 3: so I wanted to see how you would evaluate him

2516
01:56:24,840 --> 01:56:27,280
Speaker 3: just based off of you know, how he's you know,

2517
01:56:27,360 --> 01:56:30,880
Speaker 3: game planning for defenses and things like that. Obviously you

2518
01:56:30,920 --> 01:56:32,960
Speaker 3: know the talent is where it is, but just wanted

2519
01:56:33,000 --> 01:56:34,600
Speaker 3: to see where they you know, what you thought of

2520
01:56:34,680 --> 01:56:39,600
Speaker 3: him in that sense, because I you know, overall, I thought,

2521
01:56:40,200 --> 01:56:42,600
Speaker 3: you know, given the talent is where it is, I

2522
01:56:42,680 --> 01:56:46,480
Speaker 3: kind of like, you know, some of the design and

2523
01:56:46,520 --> 01:56:49,960
Speaker 3: things like that going on, but curious to see, you know,

2524
01:56:50,040 --> 01:56:52,000
Speaker 3: what you guys think of that. And then secondly, and

2525
01:56:52,040 --> 01:56:55,600
Speaker 3: then forgive me, I wasn't listening before I called in.

2526
01:56:55,640 --> 01:56:57,200
Speaker 3: I know you guys were just getting into the quarterbacks

2527
01:56:57,200 --> 01:56:59,840
Speaker 3: coming out, but you know, say O'Brien is back and

2528
01:57:00,040 --> 01:57:02,480
Speaker 3: are kind of running the same system going in the

2529
01:57:02,560 --> 01:57:05,360
Speaker 3: next year, which guy coming out do you think would

2530
01:57:05,360 --> 01:57:08,839
Speaker 3: be the best fit for what they're trying to do. Personally,

2531
01:57:08,920 --> 01:57:12,360
Speaker 3: I really like Drake May hopefully he's you know, in

2532
01:57:12,440 --> 01:57:14,720
Speaker 3: the striking distance if you know, they're sitting at three.

2533
01:57:14,760 --> 01:57:16,800
Speaker 3: But I know you guys were just talking about James

2534
01:57:16,840 --> 01:57:20,960
Speaker 3: Daniels also intrigued with him given the dual threadibility. You know,

2535
01:57:20,960 --> 01:57:25,120
Speaker 3: obviously O'Brien has history with Deshaun Watson and Houston. Similar

2536
01:57:25,200 --> 01:57:27,560
Speaker 3: type of guy, you know, with that dual threadability. So

2537
01:57:28,080 --> 01:57:30,640
Speaker 3: I just wanted to get your guys thoughts and yeah, thanks,

2538
01:57:30,680 --> 01:57:31,520
Speaker 3: as always.

2539
01:57:31,320 --> 01:57:35,360
Speaker 2: No problem. So that's two very long whended not his fault,

2540
01:57:35,400 --> 01:57:37,040
Speaker 2: but like we don't have enough time. I don't think

2541
01:57:37,040 --> 01:57:40,160
Speaker 2: we unpack all of that, So just really quickly with

2542
01:57:40,200 --> 01:57:43,920
Speaker 2: Bill O'Brien, I really liked the idea of what he

2543
01:57:44,000 --> 01:57:47,520
Speaker 2: was trying to do here. Uh the execution of that

2544
01:57:47,680 --> 01:57:52,160
Speaker 2: idea was obviously not good enough. And now maybe that

2545
01:57:52,400 --> 01:57:55,360
Speaker 2: was twofold. I think, you know, it's not all his fault,

2546
01:57:55,400 --> 01:57:57,600
Speaker 2: I guess is a better way to put that. You know,

2547
01:57:57,680 --> 01:57:59,920
Speaker 2: this Harold stuff with the assistant coaching staff, I think

2548
01:58:00,120 --> 01:58:01,640
Speaker 2: a big part of it, the personnel is a big

2549
01:58:01,680 --> 01:58:05,600
Speaker 2: part of it. They had a really good install. I

2550
01:58:05,640 --> 01:58:07,360
Speaker 2: think they had a really good idea of what they

2551
01:58:07,400 --> 01:58:10,800
Speaker 2: wanted to do with Alabama, fying the Patriots offense for

2552
01:58:10,920 --> 01:58:13,880
Speaker 2: mac Jones and adding some elements of Alabama while keeping

2553
01:58:13,920 --> 01:58:16,600
Speaker 2: some of the old stuff. It just they didn't execute

2554
01:58:16,600 --> 01:58:19,360
Speaker 2: it well. And at the end of the day that

2555
01:58:19,360 --> 01:58:22,280
Speaker 2: that's the coach's job too, right. It's not just about

2556
01:58:23,480 --> 01:58:26,600
Speaker 2: philosophy big picture, you know, bird's eye view. You have

2557
01:58:26,640 --> 01:58:28,640
Speaker 2: to be able to actually go out there and coach

2558
01:58:28,680 --> 01:58:31,480
Speaker 2: it and teach it and execute it on Sundays. And

2559
01:58:31,480 --> 01:58:34,080
Speaker 2: they weren't able to do that. So I will unpack

2560
01:58:34,120 --> 01:58:37,680
Speaker 2: the question about the quarterback and like the OC pairings

2561
01:58:37,680 --> 01:58:39,840
Speaker 2: and stuff like that. Let's take this see if we

2562
01:58:39,840 --> 01:58:42,080
Speaker 2: can sneak in this last call because Aaron's been waiting

2563
01:58:42,080 --> 01:58:46,920
Speaker 2: in Kentucky. What's up, Aaron? What's up?

2564
01:58:49,320 --> 01:58:51,480
Speaker 5: Don't have time to get into everything I was wanting

2565
01:58:51,480 --> 01:58:54,440
Speaker 5: to get into. But I was just saying, what you

2566
01:58:54,440 --> 01:58:56,520
Speaker 5: guys will think about this game thing for the off season,

2567
01:58:58,200 --> 01:59:01,320
Speaker 5: go out and grab like a t Hegans and then

2568
01:59:03,240 --> 01:59:05,960
Speaker 5: first round of the draft, grab a tackle and being

2569
01:59:06,000 --> 01:59:08,000
Speaker 5: in the second and get like a Brian Thomas junior

2570
01:59:08,080 --> 01:59:12,640
Speaker 5: froomlu if like I personally don't think the Zappi is

2571
01:59:12,640 --> 01:59:15,760
Speaker 5: the guy. But if we wasn't able to get a quarterback,

2572
01:59:16,200 --> 01:59:18,720
Speaker 5: I can talk myself into an off season like that.

2573
01:59:19,720 --> 01:59:21,440
Speaker 2: Okay, and thanks, sorry to let you go, but we

2574
01:59:21,480 --> 01:59:24,200
Speaker 2: gotta we gotta wrap this all these off season. It's

2575
01:59:24,240 --> 01:59:25,280
Speaker 2: a good way to end it.

2576
01:59:25,560 --> 01:59:27,360
Speaker 1: All these off seasons.

2577
01:59:27,360 --> 01:59:29,160
Speaker 2: This is the last regular season show. We didn't even

2578
01:59:29,160 --> 01:59:31,080
Speaker 2: talk a second about the game on Sunday.

2579
01:59:30,800 --> 01:59:32,200
Speaker 1: No, we did. I said that it would be the

2580
01:59:32,200 --> 01:59:33,560
Speaker 1: most Jets thing ever for them to win.

2581
01:59:33,760 --> 01:59:37,800
Speaker 2: So all these offsos all that we're gonna map out

2582
01:59:38,200 --> 01:59:41,880
Speaker 2: next week like our ideal dream plans, and then you

2583
01:59:41,880 --> 01:59:44,200
Speaker 2: guys can all call in and email in and talk

2584
01:59:44,240 --> 01:59:47,160
Speaker 2: about all these different crazy scenarios that we're gonna be

2585
01:59:47,160 --> 01:59:48,800
Speaker 2: talking about for the next four months. It's gonna be

2586
01:59:48,800 --> 01:59:50,920
Speaker 2: a lot of fun. Alex and I will be back

2587
01:59:50,960 --> 01:59:54,720
Speaker 2: next week on Uh, We're still probably gonna do Thursday's time.

2588
01:59:54,840 --> 01:59:57,040
Speaker 2: You know, bear with us might change here and there,

2589
01:59:57,600 --> 02:00:00,600
Speaker 2: but Thursday next week and we'll see you then use next.

2590
02:00:03,040 --> 02:00:06,920
Speaker 1: Thank you for downloading this podcast. Subscribe on Apple, google Play,

2591
02:00:06,960 --> 02:00:10,000
Speaker 1: and everywhere else you listen. Like the show, Please rate

2592
02:00:10,040 --> 02:00:13,200
Speaker 1: and review us listener comments and ratings help keep us

2593
02:00:13,240 --> 02:00:16,400
Speaker 1: high on the podcast rankings, so new listeners can find us.

2594
02:00:16,560 --> 02:00:19,640
Speaker 1: Be sure to check patriots dot com for more news

2595
02:00:19,640 --> 02:00:20,960
Speaker 1: and more podcasts.