Speaker 1: Episode four twenty three, How Nica paid off seventy eight
Speaker 1: thousand dollars of debt and got one hundred and thirty
Speaker 1: three thousand dollars forgiven.
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast, where you'll learn to
Speaker 2: save money, embrace simplicity, and live at your life. Here
Speaker 2: your hosts Jen and Jill.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast. My name is Jen,
Speaker 1: my name is Jill, and we are still in debt
Speaker 1: free summer, and today we are sharing the story of
Speaker 1: one of our good good friends. I know that we
Speaker 1: said that these are all listeners, but Nika has listened
Speaker 1: to the show, but mainly she's such a good friend
Speaker 1: and we recorded this when she became debt free, and
Speaker 1: so we would have been remiss to not include her
Speaker 1: in this series of debt free stories because her story
Speaker 1: is amazing. She is wonderful, and she helps so many
Speaker 1: people who are interested in getting their federal student loans forgiven.
Speaker 3: Mika was the last person we interviewed when we did
Speaker 3: this series initially for YouTube. She was the very last
Speaker 3: interview so we were also particularly enthused because we had
Speaker 3: just heard all of these stories and it felt like
Speaker 3: the perfect note to wrap up the series on because
Speaker 3: we had interviewed her on the podcast before and so
Speaker 3: we were kind of tracking her progress along the way
Speaker 3: and then to be a place of celebration to hear
Speaker 3: how she finally did. It was so amazing and we're
Speaker 3: just excited to share it here again.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we would share the episode she was on it,
Speaker 1: but some of the information is outdated, so we would
Speaker 1: just say go to debt free, gonna be on Instagram, TikTok,
Speaker 1: wherever you get your social media, because she is always
Speaker 1: posting the most up to date stuff. And I kid
Speaker 1: you not. This morning I was checking her Instagram and
Speaker 1: lo and behold, Nika's posting a selfie with the president and.
Speaker 4: The vice president.
Speaker 1: Wild Like, I mean, she's just going places and she's
Speaker 1: being recognized for it as just this thought leader in
Speaker 1: student loan forgiveness. So you know, we are honored to
Speaker 1: be in her presence. But first, before we honor you
Speaker 1: with her presence, this episode is brought to you by selfies.
Speaker 1: We love a good selfie, right, I mean, maybe it's
Speaker 1: not with the president, right, Maybe it's maybe it's with
Speaker 1: our besties, Maybe it's with our friends, our family, and
Speaker 1: when we love with those selfies are in cool places too,
Speaker 1: write even though you can't really see the background because
Speaker 1: everyone's face is in there. And actually we could only
Speaker 1: get half of the person's face at the end because
Speaker 1: the person taking it their arm was too short. But
Speaker 1: we still love the idea that the selfie was in
Speaker 1: a very cool place, because where else are you going
Speaker 1: to take selfies at your house? Right? You take it
Speaker 1: in a cool place so that you can just remember
Speaker 1: that you were all there, but not actually see the place.
Speaker 1: So if you want to be able to afford to
Speaker 1: go to more cool places and take selfies there, start
Speaker 1: saving for a vacation and a vacation fund in a
Speaker 1: high yield savings account like the one offered by cit.
Speaker 1: It's got over four percent apy, so the money you
Speaker 1: put in there for your emergency fund can just sit
Speaker 1: and be making you money to go on a vacation
Speaker 1: to take very cool selfies. So seriously put your emergency
Speaker 1: fund in one of these, see how much money it's
Speaker 1: making you every month, and then use that money to
Speaker 1: go on a vacation and take really cool selfies. Frugal
Speaker 1: Friends podcast dot com slash c it.
Speaker 3: If there's no other reason to listen to the Frugal
Speaker 3: Friends podcast. It's to listen to the first couple of
Speaker 3: minutes where we try to tie in something.
Speaker 4: Where we with something else.
Speaker 1: None of them was written down.
Speaker 3: Deeply unrelated, but we will make it related.
Speaker 1: And try to be not unhinged, try to be somewhat hinged.
Speaker 1: But like I said, Nika, she paid off about seventy
Speaker 1: eight eighty thousand dollars of consumer debt on a single income.
Speaker 1: She had over one hundred and thirty three thousand dollars
Speaker 1: in student loans forgiven through Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program PSLF.
Speaker 1: And she doesn't just talk about PSLF on her platform.
Speaker 1: She talks like about all student loan forgiveness. And she
Speaker 1: just has an amazing story about determination. And she didn't
Speaker 1: give up the things she loved most during her debt payoff,
Speaker 1: and you'll hear that in her interview. She loves baseball.
Speaker 1: She kept her season tickets like these. There is a
Speaker 1: place for values based spending while you are meeting your
Speaker 1: financial goals. And that's why we talk about it so passionately,
Speaker 1: is that we don't want you to have that debt
Speaker 1: payoff hangover after you go so hard paying off debt.
Speaker 1: We love to share these stories, specifically that where people
Speaker 1: still spent in alignment with their values. So so excited to
Speaker 1: get you to hear Nika's story.
Speaker 3: Let's do it.
Speaker 4: Let's do it.
Speaker 3: We are so excited to have Nika on. We have
Speaker 3: interviewed her on the podcast, now we're interviewing her on
Speaker 3: the Debt Free Stories. So Nica, welcome, Thank.
Speaker 5: You for having me so again, Nika Anika, I am
Speaker 5: originally from Maryland, but I'm actually a Washingtonian now a
Speaker 5: reside in Washington, and I'm a single pring hole for
Speaker 5: anyone who's.
Speaker 4: Looking and debt free.
Speaker 5: But I started, you know, I, like many people, I've
Speaker 5: got a debt story where I made, you know, maybe
Speaker 5: one or two decisions or bad decisions with money that
Speaker 5: kind of landed.
Speaker 4: Me in debt.
Speaker 5: And for me, it was a lot of credit card
Speaker 5: spending and student loan debt as well as a little
Speaker 5: bit of tax debt too. And so I started my
Speaker 5: debt payoff journey in fall of twenty eighteen with about
Speaker 5: one hundred and eighty nine thousand dollars. About one hundred
Speaker 5: and thirty three thousand of that was my student loans,
Speaker 5: about fifty thousand any credit card debt and roughly five
Speaker 5: thousand dollars left on my car loan. And so to
Speaker 5: be clear though and fully transparent, this wasn't the first
Speaker 5: time I started a debt payoff journey. Like I had
Speaker 5: started and stopped a number of times and wasn't really serious, right,
Speaker 5: I would pay off debt but rack it up over there.
Speaker 4: But finally I just got.
Speaker 5: Really tired of never making real progress, and so I
Speaker 5: said I was going to be serious and I was
Speaker 5: going to fight for the life that I.
Speaker 4: Wanted in twenty eighteen.
Speaker 5: So by about summer of twenty nineteen, though, I had
Speaker 5: paid off about sixteen thousand dollars including.
Speaker 4: My car, and I had.
Speaker 5: Decided to come face to face because I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 5: if you're really serious, you're making progress, You've got to
Speaker 5: like face all of your debt. And that is definitely
Speaker 5: something that I recommend everyone do. Like it's hard, it
Speaker 5: can be overwhelming and intimidating, but you have to face it.
Speaker 4: You have to get all of.
Speaker 5: Your debt like laid out there in front of you
Speaker 5: in black and white, so you can create a plan
Speaker 5: of attack. I had outstanding tax returns to file. I
Speaker 5: had not filed for about two years, both state and federal,
Speaker 5: and I didn't file because I knew I owed. And
Speaker 5: you know, when you are not in control of your money,
Speaker 5: that's what you do. You ignore things. You kind of
Speaker 5: just hide and think it's going to go away. And
Speaker 5: so I said, you know what, if I'm going to
Speaker 5: tackle debt, my debt, I've got to take all tackle
Speaker 5: all of it. And so I hired a professional to
Speaker 5: help me with those tax returns. Let me tell you now,
Speaker 5: remember I paid sixteen thousand dollars off when.
Speaker 4: That tax that came.
Speaker 5: The tax bill came nearly twenty two thousand dollars twenty
Speaker 5: one thousand, nine hundred and forty six thousand and thirty
Speaker 5: five cents to be exact, and so that kind of
Speaker 5: put me back over, not kind of it put me
Speaker 5: back over my original starting debt. Fast forward to twenty
Speaker 5: twenty one, I managed to pay off the remaining outstanding
Speaker 5: tax debt and all of my credit cards, and that
Speaker 5: left my student loans one hundred and thirty three thousand,
Speaker 5: three hundred and seventy five dollars. And in twenty twenty one,
Speaker 5: also the Department of Education had announced a limited waiver,
Speaker 5: which we've talked about before. They had launched a limited
Speaker 5: waiver that would allow retro active credit for you know,
Speaker 5: payments that would have never qualified under the regular rules
Speaker 5: of PSLF.
Speaker 4: They really did relax a lot of the rules.
Speaker 5: And with that waiver, in my time in public service,
Speaker 5: which you know I did not mention, but I have been.
Speaker 4: In public service for twelve years.
Speaker 5: So with that waiver and my time in service, my
Speaker 5: loans were forgiven in December of last year, making me
Speaker 5: debt free.
Speaker 1: Who getting a twenty two thousand dollars debt while you
Speaker 1: are paying off debt after you have paid off sixteen
Speaker 1: thousand dollars like that. That took the wind out of
Speaker 1: my life.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it was a gut punch too.
Speaker 1: I can't imagine how that must have made you feel.
Speaker 1: And I've always I've loved your your tenacity and your
Speaker 1: story and respected you so much because of the perseverance.
Speaker 1: Because a you started, you didn't know how much that
Speaker 1: tax that was, you knew it was there, but you
Speaker 1: you started anyway, which I hope is an encouragement to
Speaker 1: other people who also may be scared to start, that
Speaker 1: you can take the steps and start paying off debt
Speaker 1: and warm up to becoming fully aware of what's going on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then you, you continued, you didn't let that set
Speaker 1: back derail you. So tell us what was the entirety
Speaker 1: of the debt outside of the student loan.
Speaker 5: Yes, a little under eighty thousand, so it was about
Speaker 5: seventy seven ish.
Speaker 4: And that's just what I documented.
Speaker 5: I did a very not so good job early in
Speaker 5: my debt payoff journey of not documenting like exactly what
Speaker 5: I paid an interest.
Speaker 4: I documented the payments, but not.
Speaker 5: Really overall like what I had paid plus with principal
Speaker 5: and Andrews. So I usually rounded it about eighty thousand,
Speaker 5: but documented in seventy seven thousand.
Speaker 3: So you paid off eighty thousand dollars as a single
Speaker 3: woman living in the Washington, DC area.
Speaker 1: Wow, and then got.
Speaker 3: One hundred and thirty plus thousand dollars forgiven through the PSLF.
Speaker 3: So let's talk about some of the nuts and bolts.
Speaker 3: I know a lot of people are going to be
Speaker 3: interested in some of the nitty gritty of how you
Speaker 3: did this as again, a single person living in a
Speaker 3: high cost of living area paying off eighty thousand dollars
Speaker 3: of debt. Can you tell us what that was? Like,
Speaker 3: how did you do it?
Speaker 4: Absolutely? So it took me.
Speaker 5: It took me about three years. And it was not
Speaker 5: just I mean it was me, but not me alone.
Speaker 5: I did have, you know, I did have a couple
Speaker 5: of side hustles. I was doing instacart when I first
Speaker 5: started on this debt payoff journey, and then I started
Speaker 5: working in a boutique indoor cycle studio that I would
Speaker 5: actually patronize.
Speaker 4: I had a membership.
Speaker 5: There and it was just like, hey, either you drop
Speaker 5: the membership or maybe you can see if you can
Speaker 5: you know, if they weren't hiring. There was nothing advertised
Speaker 5: that I just asked the owner like, hey, I can
Speaker 5: do this at your front desk that can run your
Speaker 5: social media for you, you know, which is this something
Speaker 5: that I can do in exchange for you know, pay obviously,
Speaker 5: but also having access to the studio. And so I
Speaker 5: did that for about a year as well, and then
Speaker 5: COVID happened, and so you know, we that that put
Speaker 5: us all inside and to ourselves, and so with that,
Speaker 5: I actually turned to selling my stuff online.
Speaker 4: I was doing a.
Speaker 5: Little bit of it before the pandemic happened, but I
Speaker 5: really leaned into Mercury and Facebook marketplace, and I sold
Speaker 5: a lot of things. I mean, I didn't sell like
Speaker 5: my furniture, Like I'm still I still want to be
Speaker 5: comfortable in my home, you know, I'm not selling every
Speaker 5: everything but the dog. But you know, I sold things
Speaker 5: that that no longer served me, honestly, And it was
Speaker 5: it was more than just getting money for things that
Speaker 5: I paid for that I probably didn't have the money
Speaker 5: for anyway, right, or probably didn't need. But it was
Speaker 5: also really liberating and freeing to kind of remove that
Speaker 5: weight as well, right, So it wasn't just about the
Speaker 5: getting the money for these things to help me, you know,
Speaker 5: tackle my debt. It was also like it's metaphor, right,
Speaker 5: so it's also making room in your life for the
Speaker 5: things that you say that you want. And so those
Speaker 5: were really like making sure I had And yes, I
Speaker 5: could have done it strictly with my full time job
Speaker 5: income and that is primarily what did it. But the
Speaker 5: extra income from the SI hustles helped either to make
Speaker 5: you know, round off an extra debt payment or was
Speaker 5: able you know, I was able to still hang out
Speaker 5: with my friends, you know, in moderate and things like that.
Speaker 5: And that's another thing that I did, Like, I didn't
Speaker 5: cut out everything. I cut back and created boundaries around things.
Speaker 5: I definitely got better at saying no to people and things,
Speaker 5: especially if I realized they were going to take away
Speaker 5: from the progression that I wanted to make and that
Speaker 5: I was making. But you know, I didn't go out
Speaker 5: every week, and if I went out, it was lunch
Speaker 5: or a happy hour. And the good thing is is
Speaker 5: that I had a support network. I had a network
Speaker 5: of friends and family who understood, although they may not
Speaker 5: subscribe to this, I'm gonna work and I'm going to
Speaker 5: pay off all of my debt just yet, right, but
Speaker 5: they understood that I had a goal and that goal
Speaker 5: was tied around money, and they I didn't lose anyone
Speaker 5: in the process of saying not right now, or oh hey,
Speaker 5: I can't do this, but how about we meet for
Speaker 5: coffee in the morning instead, And so, you know, I
Speaker 5: think what really helped me is obviously finding just other
Speaker 5: ways to kind of boost my income and then having
Speaker 5: people who at minimum respected what I was trying to do.
Speaker 5: You know, at the end of the day, I always
Speaker 5: knew when I started this dep payoff journey and I
Speaker 5: was serious about doing it, that I was going to
Speaker 5: do it at a pace that worked for me, especially
Speaker 5: as a single woman, not wanting to sacrifice life because
Speaker 5: it is short.
Speaker 4: But I think that and I'm proof that there is
Speaker 4: a way that.
Speaker 5: You can tackle your debt while still enjoying the people
Speaker 5: and the things that bring you joy.
Speaker 3: So then with that the great that you experienced an
Speaker 3: increase of income, Were there any additional lump sums of income,
Speaker 3: any inheritances that you receive to be able to help
Speaker 3: in paying off this eighty thousand dollars?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Cool, So just like hard work, whoah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, very much so, and cutting back, putting boundaries around things, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3: And any other outstanding debt or are you completely debt free?
Speaker 5: Well, I still have my mortgage, But my mortgage was
Speaker 5: never My mortgage was never factored in my debt payoff journey.
Speaker 5: It was all the consumer debt, the credit cards, the
Speaker 5: student loans, the tax, the car.
Speaker 4: No, my home is it's it's manageable.
Speaker 5: So it's not a focus right now of like, oh,
Speaker 5: now you know I'm gonna pay off the mortgage, I've
Speaker 5: got some other things.
Speaker 4: They've got to beep up. My say my emergency fund.
Speaker 5: I've got to save for a few things, get some
Speaker 5: repairs done in here, and so that's what I'm gonna
Speaker 5: be working on next.
Speaker 1: Nice all right, So what would you tell someone who
Speaker 1: is where you were when you started this journey? Maybe
Speaker 1: they've started and stopped a few times, but they want
Speaker 1: to get serious. What is your What are your words
Speaker 1: of wisdom for them?
Speaker 5: You have to have a very personal reason why you
Speaker 5: want to pay off debt. Don't pay off debt because
Speaker 5: someone told you to. Don't pay off debt because I
Speaker 5: told you to.
Speaker 3: You have to.
Speaker 5: Create a reason that is extremely personal and visceral, to
Speaker 5: the point where you think about it so much you
Speaker 5: start to feel it.
Speaker 4: It might even have a smell for you.
Speaker 5: When you do that, that is going to keep you
Speaker 5: anchored and focused in what you are pursuing. It does
Speaker 5: not mean you won't lose motivation, because let me tell you,
Speaker 5: even before that tax bill came, I was starting to
Speaker 5: be I was starting to feel like, Okay, yeah, you've
Speaker 5: made this process but progress, but oh, you want to
Speaker 5: spend your money over here?
Speaker 4: You know you want to do these other things.
Speaker 5: So it's not to say that you won't lose motivation
Speaker 5: that that waxes and wanes. But when you do, and
Speaker 5: you need to refocus and remember why it is you
Speaker 5: started this in the first place. That reason that you've
Speaker 5: spelled out that you keep visible every day that you
Speaker 5: see every time you know, especially when you get paid
Speaker 5: and you decide you know, of course you're saving too,
Speaker 5: but you decide, oh, you know, with this extra money,
Speaker 5: I'm going to go ahead and tackle this bill or
Speaker 5: tackle this debt. You're going to need to to have
Speaker 5: that to hold you accountable, to keep you moving forward.
Speaker 4: And so above.
Speaker 5: In addition to having this why is what we all
Speaker 5: call it this in this space, go at your own
Speaker 5: pace and don't compare yourself to anyone else. That is
Speaker 5: something that I did a little bit in the beginning
Speaker 5: where it's like, I see, you know these people or
Speaker 5: they're married and coupled, and they've got all of these
Speaker 5: resources that they can pull together and they can come,
Speaker 5: you know, tackle all of this dead while the rest
Speaker 5: of the household bills are still taken care of. Well,
Speaker 5: I didn't have that luxury, right, it was just me,
Speaker 5: And so go at your own pace because you have
Speaker 5: to take care of yourself. I will also say that
Speaker 5: I did along the journey. I did take breaks. I
Speaker 5: did not completely stop, but I took breaks. And it's
Speaker 5: good for your mental health because you can't just be
Speaker 5: intense about it.
Speaker 4: All the time every day.
Speaker 5: You know twenty four to seven you're gonna burn out,
Speaker 5: and so to increase the likelihood that you will stick
Speaker 5: to it, have your why.
Speaker 4: Go at your own pace.
Speaker 5: When you feel like, you know what, I can't do this,
Speaker 5: or I'm losing motivation, Remember why you want? Why you
Speaker 5: said you wanted to do in the first place.
Speaker 3: Oh, this is so helpful to hear, and I think
Speaker 3: being able to find and hold the tension between having
Speaker 3: a really strong why as you've described, that kind of
Speaker 3: visceral and deep level of attachment to why I'm paying
Speaker 3: off the debt, but paired with permission to take your
Speaker 3: time to start and stop. That's a really fine line.
Speaker 3: It sounds like you did it. You're trying to help
Speaker 3: and encourage others to find that. But both an intensive
Speaker 3: why and also the ability to say it's okay if
Speaker 3: this takes a long time, and it's okay if I'm
Speaker 3: not going hard at it for years on end. So
Speaker 3: thank you for that. I also want to talk a
Speaker 3: little bit about PSLF. I know there's so many questions
Speaker 3: around it. People are pursuing this it worked for you,
Speaker 3: which is really incredible and celebratory in and of itself.
Speaker 3: I know there's so much information. We did an entire
Speaker 3: episode on this with you, But can you just give
Speaker 3: one tip if someone is curious to learn more about
Speaker 3: that specific process of the debt free journey, what would
Speaker 3: you say?
Speaker 4: Follow me on Instagram because I talk about all things
Speaker 4: ps LEF no but and no real life, real life. Honestly,
Speaker 4: if you are hesitant, do it anyway.
Speaker 5: One of the things I noticed around talking about the waiver,
Speaker 5: which I almost did every single day, is that people
Speaker 5: were reluctant because either they felt like they didn't qualify
Speaker 5: or it was going to take too long.
Speaker 4: We don't know all the.
Speaker 5: Tricks in the bag that the Department of Education in
Speaker 5: this administration has not to mention. There are going to
Speaker 5: be other changes, more permanent changes coming to PSLFT in
Speaker 5: the summer. Some of this we've seen in the waiver.
Speaker 5: So at least try at least go on to the
Speaker 5: studentaid dot gov website, at least start utilizing the employer
Speaker 5: eligibility tool that's on there. Figuring out if you believe
Speaker 5: you're in public service, start figuring out if your employer qualifies,
Speaker 5: and start getting your employment certified. You want one of
Speaker 5: my favorite things, I don't know where it came from,
Speaker 5: but it's success happens when preparation and opportunity meet. I
Speaker 5: don't know where I got it from, but I love it,
Speaker 5: and so I would much rather. You're not going to
Speaker 5: lose anything but maybe a few minutes of your life.
Speaker 5: But you want to be prepared because in the event
Speaker 5: these changes come in, they do another waiver or even not.
Speaker 4: You just don't know where you're going to be ten
Speaker 4: years from now. I thought I was going to leave
Speaker 4: public service. I said, you know what, this program is trashed.
Speaker 4: They weren't approving people. I hate my job. I'm leaving,
Speaker 4: And look, I stayed and I'm not. I'm not miserable.
Speaker 4: I changed the role, right, I made some changes and
Speaker 4: I stayed and now I am no.
Speaker 5: Longer in six figure crippling student loan debt. So if
Speaker 5: you're hesitant, at least try at least look into it,
Speaker 5: at least determine your eligibility and just you know, apply
Speaker 5: for the program. Because you never know where life is
Speaker 5: going to take you. You may not think you'll be
Speaker 5: you know, let's say you're in for five years now,
Speaker 5: you may not think you're going to be in for
Speaker 5: another five You don't know, and you don't know if
Speaker 5: you'll go to another, you know, another organization that would qualify.
Speaker 5: So I think it's just better to be prepared and
Speaker 5: have that kind of working for you in the background
Speaker 5: while you do other things.
Speaker 4: Did you just never know?
Speaker 1: Absolutely?
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 1: So we've come to the part of the program where
Speaker 1: you've shared. You've shared so much wisdom with us, and
Speaker 1: now we want to celebrate you. It's time to celebrate.
Speaker 1: Eighty thousand dollars of consumer debt paid off through hard work,
Speaker 1: single income, high cost of living area, over one hundred
Speaker 1: and thirty three thousand dollars of student loans forgiven, also
Speaker 1: through hard work and diligence.
Speaker 3: Working in public service in twelve plus years. That's no joke.
Speaker 3: That takes a toll. So you put in the work.
Speaker 1: You put in the work for both, and now it's
Speaker 1: time for you to celebrate you, for us to celebrate you.
Speaker 3: So how you want to do it?
Speaker 1: How you want to do it?
Speaker 4: Girl, I guess I'm going to It's crazy because I
Speaker 4: have been crying every it still doesn't feel real.
Speaker 5: I have the letter sitting right here next to me,
Speaker 5: and it still doesn't feel real.
Speaker 4: But you're det ry.
Speaker 1: Oh wow.
Speaker 3: Thank you Nica forgiving us the honor of celebrating with
Speaker 3: you and trusting us with this story, this journey, this
Speaker 3: hard earned accomplishment, and to utilize this space to share that,
Speaker 3: to cry celebratory, joyful tears, for inspiring and encouraging others,
Speaker 3: giving hope and motivation to others. You have just done
Speaker 3: so much in these last twenty minutes, and we appreciate
Speaker 3: and celebrating.
Speaker 1: Through your whole journe You've done so much for people.
Speaker 1: You have been working for yourself, but you have also
Speaker 1: been motivating and inspiring other people and helping other people
Speaker 1: through your entire journey, and we are we are just
Speaker 1: honored to be part of it. Small in a small way.
Speaker 4: Thank you.
Speaker 5: No, You've been on this journey almost for as long
Speaker 5: as I've been on it.
Speaker 4: We've talked about it a number of.
Speaker 6: Times collabs, podcast you know, podcasts, interviews, and you know,
Speaker 6: it's so nice to be able to This is the
Speaker 6: first time I think I have actually verbalized it, you know,
Speaker 6: I've shared it on Instagram by typing it.
Speaker 4: I've you know, shared it with family, but I've never
Speaker 4: really said those.
Speaker 5: Words in god, how liberating, how freeing anyway, But thank
Speaker 5: you for giving me the platform to be able to
Speaker 5: share my journey, not just now, but you know, like
Speaker 5: I said in the past, and definitely being at this
Speaker 5: place where I'm able to have different.
Speaker 4: News for you in your audience in sharing that I
Speaker 4: am debt free. So thank you.
Speaker 1: I teared up, like when Nico was was screaming, like
Speaker 1: her debt free scream.
Speaker 4: There were tears shed.
Speaker 1: There were tears on both on both ends.
Speaker 3: I think, like I think we said that, yeah, because
Speaker 3: there was so much to be gained here and so
Speaker 3: much sacrifice made in the process as well, that it's
Speaker 3: just so powerful when you do finally get to the
Speaker 3: end of this specific goal with so much money, so
Speaker 3: much work, so much research, and yeah, this is one
Speaker 3: part of a larger journey. It's a very exciting part.
Speaker 3: But I think the tears are because not missing the journey.
Speaker 3: Life has been lived in the journey up until this point,
Speaker 3: and it was difficult and not without questions, of can
Speaker 3: I even do this? Will I ever be able to
Speaker 3: actually pay this off? Which I know many of us
Speaker 3: question at various stages of our debt payoff journey, is
Speaker 3: this even possible? Can I even do this? Even once
Speaker 3: we begin, we hit roadblocks and hiccups and we can
Speaker 3: feel like, what's even the point? And it's really exciting
Speaker 3: when we do get to that point of we didn't
Speaker 3: give up. We might have slowed down at certain points,
Speaker 3: we might have felt like giving up, but we can
Speaker 3: find ourselves on the other side of it years later.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and these Deffree stories are super helpful, like to
Speaker 1: keep going. I was thinking this morning about like, what
Speaker 1: is what's the biggest barrier to people paying off debt?
Speaker 1: And I honestly like, I think it's the second week.
Speaker 1: The first week because paying off debt is involves a
Speaker 1: lot of lifestyle change. Values based spending involves a lot
Speaker 1: of lifestyle change. And the first week is not the
Speaker 1: hard week like the first week. You have you hear
Speaker 1: stories like Nika, and you are very motivated. It's the
Speaker 1: second week when you still are following these you already
Speaker 1: last week follow these self imposed restrictions right and now
Speaker 1: they're coming up again and you have to follow them again,
Speaker 1: but you're also not seeing any progress yet. Is that second, third,
Speaker 1: fourth week. But after three to four months, that's when
Speaker 1: you start. If you stick with it, that's when you
Speaker 1: start seeing the progress. And Nika emphasizes having a strong
Speaker 1: personal reason for paying off debt, and I think that's
Speaker 1: what gets you through those first one, two, three, four
Speaker 1: months before you're seeing progress with your eyes. Is feeling
Speaker 1: that deep internal convict that I deserve better, I deserve
Speaker 1: more than what is in front of me. I deserve
Speaker 1: a better future. And really internalizing that and believing that
Speaker 1: you deserve that is really having that internal motivator. Motivators
Speaker 1: is what I think the biggest mental block to sticking
Speaker 1: with it.
Speaker 3: And a lot of the work that she put in
Speaker 3: was researching, understanding becoming an expert on PSLF. Knowing that
Speaker 3: what she owed in student loan debt and what she
Speaker 3: earned annually, it just the math was not going to
Speaker 3: be mathing, and so how can we look for other
Speaker 3: resources that can help with this? And yeah, it is
Speaker 3: shrouded and a lot of mystery, and it's why she
Speaker 3: has become such such an amazing person in the space
Speaker 3: of PSLF information, but that was hard earned. Yeah, it is.
Speaker 3: It is a little bit of a matter of working
Speaker 3: smarter not harder, which I always appreciate, like rather than
Speaker 3: feeling as though I have to do all of this, Hey,
Speaker 3: I'm in a space working where this can be forgiven
Speaker 3: for me if I also do the legwork and put
Speaker 3: in the time to understand it. So and now she's
Speaker 3: able to turn around and help other people still be
Speaker 3: able to take advantage of PSLF. So that's awesome.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's PSLF. It's something that like you don't want
Speaker 1: to count, you don't want to bank on it, but
Speaker 1: it is really great to utilize, if you know, I
Speaker 1: think the math around how it would work for you.
Speaker 1: Like a lot of my loans were eligible for PSLF,
Speaker 1: but in my lifestyle I didn't want to do the
Speaker 1: kind of public service that required I couldn't even do
Speaker 1: the type of public service with my acupunctured degree that
Speaker 1: would get those loans forgiven. So so much much of
Speaker 1: it has to do with the line of work you
Speaker 1: want to go into, where you want to stay, And
Speaker 1: it is okay that you don't want to be in there.
Speaker 1: It is okay if you do want to be in
Speaker 1: there and get PSLF. Another thing that I think is
Speaker 1: fantastic about Nica is that she didn't let her her
Speaker 1: career limit her in her income. She still worked for
Speaker 1: the government, she still pursued raises, she still pursued more
Speaker 1: within the parameters. And I was also thinking this morning
Speaker 1: of the study you found Jill for the book saying
Speaker 1: that people work better and more creatively and more innovatively
Speaker 1: under parameters versus just having a free for all, no
Speaker 1: budget whatever, and so Nika really took that to heart,
Speaker 1: and she pursued earning more within the parameters that kept
Speaker 1: her eligible for PSLF, and just like went for it
Speaker 1: in there. She didn't just say like, oh, I have
Speaker 1: to make a low income so I stay eligible for this.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I love how she highlighted the ability to take
Speaker 3: breaks along the way still prioritize your mental health. I
Speaker 3: just think there's so much to be gleaned from the
Speaker 3: way Nica walked through this, not just all the information
Speaker 3: she has on BSLF, but also how she actually practiced
Speaker 3: her journey of becoming debt free. I think she represents
Speaker 3: that radical middle that you don't have to bear it
Speaker 3: all on your shoulders alone or forget that you are
Speaker 3: a human with needs. There you can take advantage of resources,
Speaker 3: you can care for yourself in the process, and then
Speaker 3: you can celebrate it when you achieve the thing.
Speaker 1: And we do have an update from Nica. She says,
Speaker 1: since becoming debt free, I've been able to take my
Speaker 1: mom on an all inclusive trip to Mexico, our first
Speaker 1: ever travel experience together. I've increased my contributions to my
Speaker 1: retirement and brokerage accounts. I'm also on track to maxing
Speaker 1: out my health savings account for this second year in
Speaker 1: a row. And I'm just fifteen hundred away from saving
Speaker 1: ten thousands ten thousand toward a newer car. Oh, that's another.
Speaker 3: Thing to celebrate. That's amazing. These are so many updates
Speaker 3: and I think shows how far your money then can
Speaker 3: go once you've practiced becoming debt free. Yes, yeah, you
Speaker 3: can really leverage it in some decent ways.
Speaker 1: And when other things come out, because I think after
Speaker 1: we got this update, you got unfortunately had to go
Speaker 1: to the hospital for a little bit. And once when
Speaker 1: you are debt free, things like that become less of
Speaker 1: a crisis, less of a you can focus fully on
Speaker 1: your health and getting better because you're not also focused
Speaker 1: on how am I going to be able to afford
Speaker 1: this with all my debt payments, Like you can fully
Speaker 1: take care of you and your and your health and
Speaker 1: your mental health and your well being when you have
Speaker 1: the financial side more under control and you feel secure there.
Speaker 1: That's why we say personal finance really does. We are
Speaker 1: whole people, and personal finance touches our whole person hut,
Speaker 1: every part of us. So we don't put money in
Speaker 1: the bank just to have numbers sitting in a bank.
Speaker 1: Those numbers are only there so that we can do
Speaker 1: the things that really matter, like taking our mom on
Speaker 1: a trip and focusing on our health and our mental
Speaker 1: health when it matters. So yay, yay.
Speaker 3: You know what else touches every part of this podcast because.
Speaker 1: We really our whole personhood.
Speaker 3: I feel it time, Yes, the mill of the week.
Speaker 2: That's right, it's time for the best minute of your
Speaker 2: entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name
Speaker 2: is Williams. Maybe you paid off your mortgage, Maybe your
Speaker 2: car died and you're happy to not have to pay
Speaker 2: that bill anymore. Duck bills, Buffalo bills, bill clan.
Speaker 3: This is the bill of the week.
Speaker 7: Hi there, Jen and Jill. It's Jesse here from New Zealand.
Speaker 7: I love your podcast. Thanks for your hard work. My
Speaker 7: bill of the week is that I needed some new
Speaker 7: running shoes and I wanted to get some new balanced
Speaker 7: ones because I had as part of an insurance deal
Speaker 7: that I have, I could get twenty five percent off,
Speaker 7: but I wasn't sure on the sizing, so I went
Speaker 7: into the sports Weir shop and I tried on some
Speaker 7: of the shoes and I found out the right size.
Speaker 7: Then I realized that the ones that I tried on
Speaker 7: were the size that I needed and the color that
Speaker 7: I needed that I liked, and they were two hundred
Speaker 7: and nineteen dollars originally, and I got them for one
Speaker 7: hundred and nineteen dollars because they were half well, there
Speaker 7: was one hundred dollars off and on the EP that
Speaker 7: was going to be using with my twenty five percent discount,
Speaker 7: they would have still been at least one hundred and
Speaker 7: sixty one hundred and eighty two hundred dollars, So I
Speaker 7: was really glad that I didn't rely on the discount,
Speaker 7: but I actually just went into the shop. Yeah, that's
Speaker 7: my bill of the week. Thank you for all you do.
Speaker 1: Bye chassis girl, fellow runner. I get it with the shoes.
Speaker 1: They high shoes. You want to spend money on them,
Speaker 1: right because they are your feet. You only get one
Speaker 1: pair and you should have good running shoes like this
Speaker 1: is something we will spend money on, you know, as runners.
Speaker 1: You got to do it, and that is fantastic. The
Speaker 1: discounts don't always save you money. They are used in
Speaker 1: those insurance apps as advertising. So I'm glad that you
Speaker 1: got the deal. And I okay, I don't want to
Speaker 1: take away from Jesse's story, but I had a similar
Speaker 1: running shoe story.
Speaker 3: WHOA.
Speaker 1: I went in and I know I've I've shared this
Speaker 1: on the show before, but I was downtown with Travis
Speaker 1: and we just like to, you know, we like to
Speaker 1: go into running stores, like wherever we are, we see one,
Speaker 1: and so we were downtown. We went into the running
Speaker 1: store and they had the exact shoes that I run
Speaker 1: in like my Diadora's, and they were half off brand new.
Speaker 1: This was the latest model too, because they were the
Speaker 1: gold edition and it said it was a misprint. It
Speaker 1: said glod instead of hold on it. So they were
Speaker 1: all half off, so I didn't need a pair, but
Speaker 1: I bought them and they're up on my shelf for
Speaker 1: when I hit three hundred and fifty miles on my
Speaker 1: current shoes. Then now I just already have the next
Speaker 1: pair waiting for me.
Speaker 3: To have some glods. Clods, Yeah, so fitting, we don't care.
Speaker 3: If it's gold, we'll take that. I don't care.
Speaker 1: Their gold stars so beautiful too, Like they are the
Speaker 1: gold additions, so everything else is like gold on them,
Speaker 1: not like shiny metallic gold, but like just off white.
Speaker 1: And yeah, they're great and so I'm still waiting to
Speaker 1: use them.
Speaker 3: Look good to you guys just geeking out over your shoes.
Speaker 3: Thanks Jesse from New Zealand for calling in and talking
Speaker 3: about your deal going into the store, and just for
Speaker 3: running around New Zealand. If you find yourself just running
Speaker 3: across the ocean to Florida, hit us up general glod
Speaker 3: with you.
Speaker 1: Let's glood together.
Speaker 3: If you all are listening and you have a bill
Speaker 3: about deals or no deals or glows or gold, visit
Speaker 3: Frugal friendspodcast dot com slash bill leave us your bill.
Speaker 3: We can't wait. And now it's time for the lightning.
Speaker 1: Around pew all right, So today's lightning round Oh, it's
Speaker 1: about it's a mental health one. Do you find did
Speaker 1: you find or discover any particular strategies or activities especially
Speaker 1: helpful for managing stress during your debt payoff journey? So yes,
Speaker 1: for us, we so we went. We were the people
Speaker 1: that went real hard, all in one hundred percent and
Speaker 1: really made the debt payoff our identity.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 1: And it was a method. It was a method people
Speaker 1: can do. So but I was miserable. I was miserable
Speaker 1: for two years. I and it wasn't because I wasn't
Speaker 1: because eventually I found ways to meet my internal needs,
Speaker 1: specifically for spending time with friends. That was the that
Speaker 1: was the one I was really missing. I had fulfilling work,
Speaker 1: I had family at Faith. It was the friendship one
Speaker 1: that I was spending money.
Speaker 3: Which is why you were so open to meeting up
Speaker 3: with us at the beach.
Speaker 1: Yes. Yes, that was.
Speaker 3: In the midst of your debt payoff, shortly before you
Speaker 3: paid it off.
Speaker 4: Yes.
Speaker 1: So so yeah, like we were, we were those people,
Speaker 1: But I was still like the miserable feeling came from
Speaker 1: guilt and shame about being in so much debt. How
Speaker 1: did I let myself get here? And there were all
Speaker 1: very like good reasons that I got there. I went
Speaker 1: to college like it wasn't you know, Like it was
Speaker 1: what I was told to do. And part of a
Speaker 1: very little bit was for a car, you know, and
Speaker 1: so it was very reason. But still I felt all
Speaker 1: this shame about not knowing about money, about not seeking
Speaker 1: it out before I did this, about you know, buying
Speaker 1: all the textbooks instead of you know, at the school,
Speaker 1: instead of looking for all of them. Use like all
Speaker 1: these things that now I'm learning I could do and
Speaker 1: I didn't do. I just felt dumb, you know. And
Speaker 1: then I had somebody on the radio telling other people
Speaker 1: doing the same thing I was doing that they were dumb,
Speaker 1: you know. So I had that reinforced in me. So
Speaker 1: I had a lot of stress trying to pay it
Speaker 1: off that was fueled by that guilt and shame. So
Speaker 1: I think the thing. So it took me years to
Speaker 1: realize that though, like I didn't realize that while I
Speaker 1: was paying off the debt. I didn't realize that until afterwards.
Speaker 1: But what did help while I was paying off debt
Speaker 1: was helping other people, or at least having the idea
Speaker 1: that I helping other people. So I started a blog
Speaker 1: on a free site, and I just started all the
Speaker 1: things I was learning on how to save money, all
Speaker 1: the things I felt guilt for for not having learned
Speaker 1: or not knowing the questions to ask. I started writing
Speaker 1: those things for other people so they would have the
Speaker 1: questions and they would have the knowledge that I didn't.
Speaker 1: And so I just started writing that stuff and posting
Speaker 1: them on my Facebook. And then I had people say,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, thank you for posting this. It helped
Speaker 1: me so much. And so then I took it just
Speaker 1: I kept taking it like further and further to where
Speaker 1: I turned it into a business. But not everybody has to.
Speaker 1: I think you can still help people in whatever medium
Speaker 1: is most life giving to you. Because when you're paying
Speaker 1: off debt and when you're transitioning from spending on whatever
Speaker 1: you want whenever you want to more parameters on your spending,
Speaker 1: it just naturally poses stress. Friction causes some level of stress.
Speaker 1: So do something that gives you life. Writing gives me life.
Speaker 1: I love I love writing, whether it's podcasting, recording and
Speaker 1: talking on a video whatever. Just and don't try to
Speaker 1: make it a business. Just try to help the people
Speaker 1: around you. In the book, in the last chapter. We
Speaker 1: talk a lot about giving permission to others, like we're
Speaker 1: giving you permission to be different, to do different, to
Speaker 1: spend differently, And it's your responsibility after you have the
Speaker 1: information to give permission to the people around you, no
Speaker 1: influencer status needed. And so that most helpful to me
Speaker 1: is helping the people around me learn the lessons that
Speaker 1: I was learning without before the guilt and shame couldn't
Speaker 1: like infect them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's good for me. It was a much longer journey.
Speaker 3: It took us seven years, and that was in part
Speaker 3: because of the level of income we were making. We
Speaker 3: just we couldn't do it faster than that, and so
Speaker 3: I definitely needed an approach that allowed for more time, sustainability,
Speaker 3: longevity in it. It's probably similar to how you would
Speaker 3: train differently. You need different things to do a sprint
Speaker 3: versus a marathon, and it costs you different things as
Speaker 3: the result too. But for me, I think I really
Speaker 3: did have to find a radical middle. On the one hand,
Speaker 3: looking at what I owe and having some sort of
Speaker 3: way of tracking my progress, looking at my goals, knowing
Speaker 3: how much I'm able to put towards debt, how much
Speaker 3: is left. Having that visual was really helpful. I had
Speaker 3: a spreadsheet. Anytime I could throw even twenty bucks at it,
Speaker 3: it excited me to go into my spreadsheet right down,
Speaker 3: I just threw twenty bucks and watched the number drop.
Speaker 3: So that visual was helpful. However, I could also become
Speaker 3: obsessive over it, and in a seven year journey, it's
Speaker 3: too much to always have that at the forefront. So
Speaker 3: I also had to provide some tension to that by
Speaker 3: if I caught myself wanting to get back into the
Speaker 3: spreadsheet more than I needed to, stepping away from the computer,
Speaker 3: my desk, going for a walk. I went on a
Speaker 3: lot of walks during that debt payoff time, and all
Speaker 3: the things that we've talked about before, get still getting
Speaker 3: together with friends, still doing the things that are going
Speaker 3: to care for me, for us, but finding the creative
Speaker 3: ways where it doesn't cost money, where I'm not feeling like,
Speaker 3: oh man, but I could have put that money towards debt.
Speaker 3: But now we did this for free. I still have
Speaker 3: to eat like these types of things, so really holding
Speaker 3: the tension in it. But both were helpful and pandem
Speaker 3: for me. Well, everyone, thanks for listening. We hope that
Speaker 3: you found something that is helpful for you in your
Speaker 3: debt payoff journey, and if you did, please tell us
Speaker 3: about it in a review. We are still lack in
Speaker 3: some room. I mean, we've got some amazing reviews and
Speaker 3: we're about to read you one, but we would also
Speaker 3: love to hear from more of you. We know there's
Speaker 3: more of you out there who have been listening to
Speaker 3: the show for a while who haven't yet done it.
Speaker 3: We'd love to hear from you. Here's an example. This
Speaker 3: one comes from Miss RATCHI. It says new listener or
Speaker 3: even new listener, if you're a new listener and you
Speaker 3: want to give us a five star rating like this one.
Speaker 3: I'm absolutely loving this podcast. Jen and Jill make frugality
Speaker 3: seem possible and they're fun to listen to. I love
Speaker 3: that the show notes are detailed, and I'm excited to
Speaker 3: jump into this podcast and way of life.
Speaker 1: Oh thank you, Miss Rachie. Kind of want to. I
Speaker 1: want to look at you like your Miss Rachel. I'm
Speaker 1: going to picture you like your Miss Rachel. So thank you,
Speaker 1: Miss Rachie. If yeah, if you enjoyed the show, please
Speaker 1: let us know, and it helps people figure out if
Speaker 1: this show is for them know what we're about, what
Speaker 1: we're not about, and if there's something we don't talk
Speaker 1: about and you love that, say say it in a
Speaker 1: review and be like, I love that these girls don't
Speaker 1: talk like this or about this, because it's just it's
Speaker 1: important to identify who the show is for and not for.
Speaker 1: So we're all getting what we need and not wasting
Speaker 1: time on what we don't.
Speaker 3: Thanks for being here, everyone, see you next time. Heye.
Speaker 1: Grugal Friends is produced by Eric Sirianni. All right, so
Speaker 1: I think I can say this. I won't I won't say,
Speaker 1: I won't say where we're at, but I will say
Speaker 1: Jill and Eric have joined our phone family plan family.
Speaker 1: So I thought about sending out when Eric made the
Speaker 1: new group texts this morning, I thought about like creating
Speaker 1: something in can but like our family is growing, like
Speaker 1: one of those announcements, but for Jill and Eric, like
Speaker 1: welcome Jill and Eric. Our family is growing.
Speaker 3: Although now I'm the phone account holder. Now we joined
Speaker 3: you guys and then took over.
Speaker 1: The baby has become the parent. Yeah, which is great.
Speaker 1: The we were the administrators of our account for years
Speaker 1: and now we're like, yes, so much so little responsibility
Speaker 1: we're just going for less and less responsibility. Honestly love that.
Speaker 1: But I when that text group was made, I was like,
Speaker 1: this group text now needs a name because before it
Speaker 1: was just four of us, and now it's six of us,
Speaker 1: and I just think it needs like a group text
Speaker 1: with six people needs a name. Four people does not.
Speaker 3: Like So tell them what you wanted to be, Jen.
Speaker 1: I want it to be called people.
Speaker 3: How funny you are.
Speaker 1: The family, but with a pH because we're on a
Speaker 1: phone family plan. And then I want that little emoji,
Speaker 1: which is like the mafia hand. And I was either
Speaker 1: going for that or a car like Fast and Furious Family,
Speaker 1: But I like the hand.
Speaker 3: I like you too, my brain calm up, fingers together,
Speaker 3: getting your point across the family, listen to.
Speaker 1: Me, the family. Uh so yeah, I just I got
Speaker 1: so excited about that this morning, and I couldn't wait.
Speaker 1: I wanted to tell you in the after show to
Speaker 1: get your honest reaction, and.
Speaker 4: I couldn't wait.
Speaker 3: I couldn't wait. We're excited. I'm here for it. It's
Speaker 3: gonna happen. Man.
Speaker 1: We just keep getting more and more attached to each other.
Speaker 1: We have legal documents and we're in a phone family plan,
Speaker 1: like legal binding documents between us.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we go with launch trips together. You're my What
Speaker 3: are you to me?
Speaker 1: What are you apple buddy? Think about that, Think about
Speaker 1: what I am to you?
Speaker 3: So many things.
Speaker 4: Jen