WEBVTT - Power Station Sabotage, with Molly Conger 0:00:05.600 --> 0:00:09.440 It could happen here is a podcast, and it is 0:00:09.520 --> 0:00:13.960 kind of happening here because they're just was just an 0:00:13.960 --> 0:00:17.680 attack on uh, several power substations in the city of 0:00:17.720 --> 0:00:21.400 North or city in the state of North Carolina. UM, 0:00:21.440 --> 0:00:25.800 that left something like forty people without power for several days. 0:00:25.880 --> 0:00:28.240 I believe that at the moment at least one person 0:00:28.320 --> 0:00:30.840 died as a result of this. There have been car crashes. 0:00:30.920 --> 0:00:33.960 It's pretty fucked up, and uh, we are going to 0:00:34.000 --> 0:00:37.400 be talking about that. Obviously. As a result of this 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:40.239 number one, there were a lot of immediate suspicions that 0:00:40.280 --> 0:00:43.720 came out that this was tied towards Drag Queen uh 0:00:43.760 --> 0:00:46.280 story hour type event that was going to be being 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:48.920 held UM on the day that the attack was carried out. 0:00:49.040 --> 0:00:53.559 There's suspicions that this is the result of far right activity. UM, 0:00:53.600 --> 0:00:55.920 and uh yeah, we're gonna talk about that and everything 0:00:56.000 --> 0:01:00.000 around that right now. UM. We have on the episode 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:04.240 for today myself, Garrison Davis, James Stout, and we are 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:10.000 also bringing in friend of the pod researcher and woman 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:13.800 about town. Um, but not this town, a different town 0:01:13.840 --> 0:01:16.520 because we live on opposite sides of the country. Molly 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:19.479 Conger Molly, I've been saying your last name wrong for years, 0:01:19.520 --> 0:01:22.960 even though we've been friends for quite a while. I 0:01:22.959 --> 0:01:24.640 don't know why I never said anything. It's come up 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:28.360 so many times. Yeah, um, so, Garrison, you've kind of 0:01:28.360 --> 0:01:30.360 been taking point on putting together this one, So I'm 0:01:30.360 --> 0:01:32.640 gonna let you kind of take the reins unless you 0:01:32.680 --> 0:01:35.120 want me to uh to to to direct this more. 0:01:35.160 --> 0:01:36.720 But I do think kind of the place to start 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:42.479 is are we watching a gigantic right wing insurgency unfold 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:46.720 or is this a more complex case? And obviously the 0:01:46.760 --> 0:01:49.160 answer is the latter, as it is anytime someone poses 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:50.840 a question like that, no is we're gonna We're gonna 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:55.000 We're gonna pick this the simple, more scary, more inflammatary 0:01:55.040 --> 0:01:59.040 option and leave it at that. Yeah, twet, let's get 0:01:59.400 --> 0:02:03.040 said tweet. No so yes. Um. The aftermath of the 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:05.720 North Carolina attack has kind of it's gotten a lot 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:09.000 of people to learn about infrastructure attacks for the first 0:02:09.040 --> 0:02:12.400 time and get really scared about them and realize that 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:15.800 this is a problem, and then start bringing up past 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:19.440 incidents when this has happened and trying to draw this 0:02:19.600 --> 0:02:24.600 like overall pattern, which isn't entirely incorrect, but the way 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:28.800 they're going about it is not very responsible nor really 0:02:28.800 --> 0:02:31.919 well informed. Yeah. So one of the things we've seen 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:36.560 is like the there have been a lot of attack Like, uh, 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:39.520 it does seem accurate to say that over the course 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:41.359 of the last year or two there have been more 0:02:41.400 --> 0:02:46.280 attacks on power infrastructure. UM. But that doesn't mean we 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:48.840 have we have lots of data on this. It has 0:02:49.040 --> 0:02:52.480 the past five years there has been a pretty strong 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:56.640 increase in the number of attacks on power stations. And 0:02:56.680 --> 0:02:59.320 it's also true that this is a thing the right 0:02:59.400 --> 0:03:02.840 has been, the far right, like the Nazi right in particular, 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:06.120 has been trying to get people to do for longer 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:09.520 than anyone on this podcast has been alive. UM. This 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:13.000 goes back to the Turner Diaries even pre that stuff. 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:15.960 This is in siege, um, and this is you know, 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:18.480 there has been very recently this summer a couple of 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:23.160 pieces of fairly well put together Nazi propaganda that was 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:25.840 advocating for people to carry out attacks like this. And 0:03:25.880 --> 0:03:28.600 the reason is that it's easy and it's high impact. 0:03:28.720 --> 0:03:31.519 It's very easy to funk up a power substation. All 0:03:31.560 --> 0:03:34.960 you need is a gun, um, and it's very easy 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:36.720 to get away with it because most of them have 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:40.640 effectively zero security. Yeah, and it explained how to do 0:03:40.720 --> 0:03:44.440 it as well. Right, sorry, like it it was literally 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.720 a guide to fucking up a substation. Yeah, because they're specific. 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:49.440 We're not going to give you guys a guide to 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:52.480 fucking up power substations on this podcast, but it's not hard. 0:03:53.240 --> 0:03:56.600 Next week, Yeah, that's next week in our three partner 0:03:56.800 --> 0:03:58.920 it's on the Patreon. You've got to be on the Patreon. 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:03.280 That's that's the Patreon special episode, how to Destroy power 0:04:03.360 --> 0:04:06.720 Infrastructure for Fun and Profit. No, but I think too, 0:04:06.760 --> 0:04:10.240 if you're trying to propagandize people to take action, you know, 0:04:10.280 --> 0:04:13.200 we've all seen plenty of manifestoes from people who carried 0:04:13.240 --> 0:04:16.000 out mass shootings trying to propagandize people to take action 0:04:16.000 --> 0:04:19.480 in that effect. Um, but we've also seen the chats 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:21.920 when somebody fails, right, Like, if somebody doesn't get what 0:04:21.960 --> 0:04:23.719 they call it, you know, a high score. If somebody 0:04:23.760 --> 0:04:26.040 carries out a mass shooting that doesn't result in very 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:30.760 many debts, it's embarrassing for them. But this is for 0:04:30.920 --> 0:04:34.240 the perpetrator, relatively low stakes. If you fail, no one 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:37.160 will know. If you miss, no one will know Um, 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:38.479 if you hit the you know, if you hit it 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:40.240 and it just looks like vandalism and the power doesn't 0:04:40.279 --> 0:04:42.240 go out, no one will know that you failed, and 0:04:42.279 --> 0:04:45.599 you can try again later. You don't die. And that's 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:48.120 that's the title of one of the one of the 0:04:48.160 --> 0:04:50.000 pieces of propaganda that I sent to you, right The 0:04:50.000 --> 0:04:53.000 title of it is make It Count, which is an 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:57.960 impredated form of a quote from Siege. I wish it's 0:04:58.000 --> 0:04:59.960 a Nazi and I'm not going to read the film 0:05:00.000 --> 0:05:04.160 annual from general. The general gist of the quote is 0:05:04.200 --> 0:05:07.919 that you know, the price of failure is death. So 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:11.120 whatever you choose to do, make it count. So this 0:05:11.200 --> 0:05:13.520 is a way to relatively low stakes for the perpetrator, 0:05:14.040 --> 0:05:16.240 way to have a very high impact with low risk 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:19.000 of personal failure. And what I did find, and we'll 0:05:19.040 --> 0:05:22.040 get off. We'll move to the broader topic in a second, 0:05:22.040 --> 0:05:24.520 because I think focusing too much on the Nazis right 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:27.240 now is going to frame things the wrong way. But 0:05:27.240 --> 0:05:28.800 one of the things I did find interesting about that 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:31.599 piece of propaganda was the acknowledgement and the introduction that 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:34.520 like carrying out these mass shootings is not going to 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:37.240 accomplish our broader goals in part because people have gotten 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:40.960 and neared to them. Whereas destroying power infrastructure, if you 0:05:41.000 --> 0:05:43.960 can funk up the grid, they believe that's going to 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:47.040 like and I think, obviously this is a silly line 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:49.120 of thought, but they think it's going to like lead 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:50.920 to the I mean, this is always what I think 0:05:50.920 --> 0:05:52.400 it's going to lead to, like the race war that 0:05:52.440 --> 0:05:55.880 they want, right, That's that's the thinking there be. And 0:05:55.880 --> 0:05:57.839 that equation is like a two B two s like 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:02.280 this and question mark mark race war. Yeah, they're Nazis, 0:06:02.320 --> 0:06:04.800 you know, they're Nazis. They're not right about things. But 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:08.400 the fact that all this propaganda is out there, the 0:06:08.400 --> 0:06:10.280 fact that they've been talking about this so long, is 0:06:10.360 --> 0:06:14.000 part of why everyone is convinced that, like there's this 0:06:14.440 --> 0:06:17.360 massive new insurgency that's just broken out and that that's 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:19.960 what all of these attacks are, which doesn't mean that 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:22.560 none of them are. Um. It's also worth noting that 0:06:22.600 --> 0:06:26.200 the year before this happened in the same state in 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:29.200 North Carolina, a group of Nazis were arrested by the 0:06:29.200 --> 0:06:32.440 FEDS for trying to attack power infrastructure, and they also 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:35.039 had plans on the Pacific Northwest, where there have been 0:06:35.120 --> 0:06:39.480 in Washington Portland attacks on some power infrastructure. Um, and 0:06:39.720 --> 0:06:43.080 they also they're also just so happens to be a 0:06:43.120 --> 0:06:46.240 lot of Nazis here. Yeah, the both the Carolinias and 0:06:46.279 --> 0:06:50.080 the Pacific and the Pacific Northwest are home to a 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:53.760 lot of people who self described as like militant neo 0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:57.280 Nazi accelerationists. And what I think we should do now 0:06:57.320 --> 0:06:59.640 before we get too much off this and we can 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:02.280 return to this topic, is talk about the fact that, 0:07:02.320 --> 0:07:04.520 and this is kind of the important context, a lot 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:07.080 of people who aren't Nazis funk up electrical grids all 0:07:07.080 --> 0:07:10.120 the time. It's actually very easy, and people seem to 0:07:10.160 --> 0:07:16.880 just enjoy it americ. I think there's there's there's been 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:20.160 a lot of missteps people have taken in talking about 0:07:20.200 --> 0:07:22.520 this and kind of you know, some people have gotten 0:07:22.720 --> 0:07:26.840 scared and have kind of you know, uh not not 0:07:26.960 --> 0:07:30.360 looked at this uh fully analytically in a way that 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:33.360 is actually really helpful, because there's been a lot of 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:39.600 kind of retrospective misinformation going around on attacks that have 0:07:39.640 --> 0:07:42.320 happened in the in the past few months that I've 0:07:42.480 --> 0:07:45.440 only really gotten reported on. Are noticed in the wake 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:48.120 of the North Carolina attack, which is kind of caused 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:51.600 this narrative to come out that since the North Carolina attack, 0:07:51.800 --> 0:07:55.280 there's been like a bajillion of other other attacks happening 0:07:55.320 --> 0:08:00.520 in quick succession, which actually isn't true. So that's I first, 0:08:00.720 --> 0:08:02.320 I want to talk about the types of stuff that 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:04.880 is that people are generally getting wrong about this because 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:07.480 it's a good a good deal. People are are are 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:11.880 misunderstanding some some of what's going on here. Um. So 0:08:12.280 --> 0:08:15.880 there was this, you know, pretty pretty viral uh story 0:08:16.720 --> 0:08:18.520 made by a new station in Florida that came out 0:08:18.520 --> 0:08:22.360 a few days ago talking about how it's all caps 0:08:22.440 --> 0:08:28.240 substations targeted. Reports shows intrusions had Duke Energy power stations 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:31.120 in Tampa Bay and elsewhere in Florida. So very scary 0:08:31.160 --> 0:08:33.560 obviously because Duke Energy is also the place in North 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:36.480 Carolina that was attacked, founded by the guy who invented 0:08:36.520 --> 0:08:42.920 the modern cigarette. By the way, based based yes, but 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:46.280 if you if you look, if you look at the 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:50.960 actual story, these intrusions that they're talking about happened last September. 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:54.000 They did not. They did not happen a few days ago. 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:57.760 And then also similarly, for the first time, there was 0:08:57.800 --> 0:09:00.160 reporting on a whole bunch of substation attacks in the 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:04.320 Pacific Northwest. Uh, that reporting was dropped after the North 0:09:04.320 --> 0:09:09.480 Carolina attacks in part because a memo was was was 0:09:09.520 --> 0:09:11.400 posted by a few different news sites that they probably 0:09:11.400 --> 0:09:13.760 did open records requests in the wake of the North 0:09:13.800 --> 0:09:16.520 Carolina attack. They found this memo, reported on it, and 0:09:16.559 --> 0:09:19.120 now people have this, you know, have learn learn about 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:22.400 this other thing that happened in November. So, but people 0:09:22.400 --> 0:09:24.679 who don't, who really are only looking at headlines or 0:09:24.720 --> 0:09:28.920 only looking at tweets UM or posts wherever, right, Uh, 0:09:29.240 --> 0:09:31.560 they look at these attacks and they look at you know, 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:35.240 the succession of them becoming public after the North Carolina thing, 0:09:35.240 --> 0:09:37.360 and they're kind of drawing this narrative that these things 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:39.320 have happened one after another and it's part of this 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:43.400 brand new wave of things, and it is part of 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:45.640 a wave of things on like the broad sense, but 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:48.800 it's not all happened within the past two weeks. So 0:09:49.840 --> 0:09:53.360 the first thing is like, when it's super easy for 0:09:53.360 --> 0:09:57.520 a disinformation and misinformation to spread very rampantly in the 0:09:57.559 --> 0:10:01.440 aftermath of these types of attacks, UM, and these types 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:03.679 of incidents, you know, some of these probably are not 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:09.280 attacks UM. And it's really easy to kind of glom 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:11.760 onto an erative that's compelling and scary, and if you 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:13.720 just dig it a little a little bit deeper, deeper, 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:15.959 you'll realize there's a whole bunch of context that you're missing. 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:18.920 So that's always an important first step when when these 0:10:18.920 --> 0:10:22.520 things are happening. Yeah, and it's part of the part 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:24.040 of the story here. I think part of why it's 0:10:24.080 --> 0:10:27.800 important to understand that, like the surgeon, attacks on power 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:30.920 infrastructure is a thing, but it's not necessarily tied to 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:34.600 the fact that Nazis are attacking the power infrastructure is that, 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:37.839 like it's easy to do, it's easy to do casually. 0:10:38.200 --> 0:10:40.200 And this has been known for a while. About a 0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:43.040 decade ago, two thirteen, there was an attack in the 0:10:43.080 --> 0:10:45.000 Bay Area on I think was it was it too 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:51.480 power substations. Um, yeah, the Metcalf sniper and we don't 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:54.560 know how many people were involved, but suspected it's it's 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:58.600 it's it's suspected more than one. Yes, yes, sniper. And 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:02.320 this was a very if if this was a practice attack, 0:11:02.320 --> 0:11:05.040 a training attack, then it was a very effectively carried 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:06.520 out one. Because we still don't know who did it, 0:11:06.640 --> 0:11:10.360 and regardless of the mode of this incidence of has 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:14.200 been mythologized in a lot of extremist circles as like 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:18.480 an example of here's a successful thing that is replicable 0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:21.120 and you can get away with it. This is this 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:25.559 is one of the most highly referenced incidents of infrastructure 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:29.040 attack on you know, across you know, whether you're like 0:11:29.520 --> 0:11:34.160 uh Anti Siev bloodite or whether you're a neo Nazi accelerationist. 0:11:34.240 --> 0:11:38.960 This is, this specific attack is highly referenced. And we'll 0:11:39.000 --> 0:11:41.199 circle back to this towards the end. But because I'm 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:43.960 going to quote from a recent report by the George 0:11:43.960 --> 0:11:48.280 Washington University on power substation attacks. Um, they are, they 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:51.800 are extremely common. They are they are becoming increasingly common 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.200 since white supremacists are not the only ones who do them. 0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:59.160 They were also from from twenty six to nineteen, a 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:05.000 whole bunch of Isis inspired terrorism also hit some substations 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:08.319 across the United States. They are, they are, They're not 0:12:08.559 --> 0:12:14.000 exclusively done by wet supremacists, and there's also sometimes they're 0:12:14.040 --> 0:12:19.080 just shot at by random people with guns. And let's 0:12:19.080 --> 0:12:23.199 be honest. So the Metcalf attack, it's not impossible that 0:12:23.280 --> 0:12:26.640 it was just an usually lucky group of ye who's 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:30.000 who wanted to shoot some power infrastructure. We have no idea. 0:12:30.480 --> 0:12:33.360 I think the number of rounds fired directly in yeah, 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:38.000 I probably make that unlikely. Almost every intelligence agency will 0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:43.040 disagree with you on that, Robert. They didn't catch they 0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:46.400 didn't catch ship. But to Robert's point, I think, I 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:49.400 think there is some value in remembering that a drunk 0:12:49.440 --> 0:12:51.880 guy in the woods might love to fire a gun 0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:54.360 at something that's gonna spark. And he's going to shoot 0:12:54.360 --> 0:12:56.480 a gun, you might as well shoot it a lot. No, 0:12:56.559 --> 0:13:00.280 I I probably wouldn't shoot it two times. It was 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:03.959 very It was It was very anyway, I there is 0:13:04.200 --> 0:13:06.080 we and we talked about this a bit in our planning. 0:13:06.080 --> 0:13:08.679 There was one attack and Molly, you probably could recall 0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:09.880 the year better than I was. But it was a 0:13:09.920 --> 0:13:13.400 couple of years ago where the guy attacked to power substation. 0:13:13.920 --> 0:13:16.960 Because he and he talked about this at length in 0:13:17.040 --> 0:13:19.960 his trial, he thought people were on their phones too much, 0:13:20.679 --> 0:13:22.520 so I said, I sent this one to the other 0:13:24.880 --> 0:13:27.400 I loved. I love to find a court record. I'd 0:13:27.400 --> 0:13:29.560 love to spend all my all my pocket change on 0:13:29.600 --> 0:13:32.160 pacer And they given me access to the law library. 0:13:32.200 --> 0:13:36.280 So I spent all day today, UM, looking for any 0:13:36.320 --> 0:13:39.080 case We're not not just charged, were convicted of any 0:13:39.080 --> 0:13:44.560 case where USC eighteen USC thirteen sixty six was brought up. 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:48.880 So thirteen sixty six is the federal statute for damaging 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:51.920 or conspiring to damage and energy facility. And so energy 0:13:51.920 --> 0:13:56.600 facility means power lines, power substations, coal mines, nuclear facilities, 0:13:56.800 --> 0:13:59.080 any place where power is made, right, so it's a 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:02.400 pretty broad atute. And so I looked up a few 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.280 dozen cases where that was on the table to sort 0:14:05.280 --> 0:14:07.880 of bring the temperature down and say, like, okay, aside 0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:10.240 from Nazis trying to cause a race, war, water, some 0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:13.440 other things that lead to somebody getting charged with this, 0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:18.920 other motivations, other scenarios. UM. In that case was Jason 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:25.080 wood Ring, UM. Jason wood Ring in August, he tried 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.400 to use a this is a quote from some news 0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:31.960 coverage the time, tried to lasso a train with a 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:42.440 cable attached to a high voltage tower. He is still 0:14:42.440 --> 0:14:53.200 in prison righton. Was distracted by their screens, by their phones, 0:14:53.280 --> 0:14:55.920 by their gaming, and he just wanted people to remember 0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:59.440 what's important. So he tried to lack the train high 0:14:59.480 --> 0:15:04.440 voltage wire. Now, I probably yeah, we probably don't need 0:15:04.480 --> 0:15:07.640 to add this. He was a big enthusiast of methamphetamy. 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:12.680 He has some court ordered substance abuse treatment, and we 0:15:12.720 --> 0:15:15.800 wish him nothing but the best, right. I think he's 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:18.440 going to be just fine. But so I found some 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:22.560 other cases where there was an intentional attack with the 0:15:22.840 --> 0:15:25.600 you know, with the stated intention of bringing down the grid, 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:30.960 but for like non Nazi reasons. In the early two thousand's, UM, 0:15:31.000 --> 0:15:33.760 a bunch of E l F activists were charged with 0:15:33.800 --> 0:15:37.920 thirteen sixty six for arsons to energy facilities. UM, this 0:15:38.000 --> 0:15:40.560 is an odd one. In twenty nineteen, a guy named 0:15:40.560 --> 0:15:45.840 Stephen McCrae was sentenced for attacking one substation by shooting 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:48.120 out the cooling fins, and as part of his plea agreement, 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:52.080 he admitted to three other attacks. UM. He got caught 0:15:52.120 --> 0:15:54.000 because he told a friend of his that he'd been 0:15:54.000 --> 0:16:00.600 shooting shipped up. I was concerned and when to the FBI, 0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:06.080 and they had his friend record some of theirs bad friends. Yea, 0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:09.400 and so he said things like he stated motive was 0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:13.600 attacking corporate America so some couldn't be done about global warming. 0:16:13.640 --> 0:16:16.920 He wasn't noted as an environmental activist, but he was 0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:21.280 concerned about the corporations, which I don't know, Alex Jones 0:16:21.800 --> 0:16:30.200 code in language. Globalists come from a couple of different places. Yeah, yeah, 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:33.880 listen people maybe, but he right before his arrest, he 0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:36.600 told his friend that he was planning a brand Daddy 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:39.720 event that would make national news and shut down the 0:16:39.720 --> 0:16:48.720 whole West coast. Okay, Okay, that's maybe. That's sometimes kids. 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:53.680 Don't tell that to your friend. Yeah, anyone, your friend 0:16:53.760 --> 0:16:57.000 is still snitching and that sucks. But like, don't don't 0:16:57.000 --> 0:17:00.760 tell that to your According to the euro of Prisons 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:04.119 innate locator, which is another tool I really enjoy, he 0:17:04.240 --> 0:17:11.000 was released in September. That's yeah. This I think it 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:13.840 helps to make the point that like, this is not 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:17.199 all are mostly Nazis doing this kind of thing, A 0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:20.000 lot of people trying to make about the you know, 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:22.040 these sort of I found a third case that sort 0:17:22.040 --> 0:17:24.240 of fits the same pattern, a guy who shot out 0:17:24.240 --> 0:17:28.320 a transformer for reasons I can't quite discern based on 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:30.800 the court railings. But again, in all three of these cases, 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:33.000 the Miles Maynard case in Alabama in two thousand eight, 0:17:33.080 --> 0:17:37.600 Jason woodreyteen Stephen McCrae in twenty nine. They all had 0:17:37.800 --> 0:17:42.199 court ordered psyche valves, and in McCrae's case, there were 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:45.040 questions about his compency to stand trial. Miles Miles Maynard 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:48.320 died shortly after being released from prison. These are people 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:51.800 who were not well. Yeah, not that not that being 0:17:51.880 --> 0:17:54.879 unwell or having the subs problem makes you shoot a substation. 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:59.080 But these aren't explicitly ideological. These are people who just 0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:02.680 got an idea their head and I didn't control it. Well. Yeah, 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:04.920 And I think part of when you're kind of looking 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:08.080 at just any of these attacks, you're trying to discern 0:18:08.160 --> 0:18:11.080 as stuff pops into the news, is this likely part 0:18:11.160 --> 0:18:15.639 of an insurgent trend? Or is this like some dudes 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:19.320 fucking around? One of them would be like, what was 0:18:19.440 --> 0:18:22.520 the how much like how much effort and planning does 0:18:22.520 --> 0:18:24.720 it look like when into the Metcalf attack looks like 0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:27.240 quite a lot. I would say the most recent Portland's 0:18:27.320 --> 0:18:30.080 Washington attacks, given the extent to which there were breakings, 0:18:30.160 --> 0:18:33.200 looked like it was very A lot of steps had 0:18:33.200 --> 0:18:35.680 to had to go in. So let's have an ad 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:38.360 break and then we'll go into some more actual details 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:40.439 of the North Carolina attack and some of the Pacific 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:44.680 Northwest ones, and then kind of circle back to why 0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:48.280 people are talking about accelerationism so much. Yeah, you know 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:53.600 who loves planning a series of infrastructure attacks. The sponsors 0:18:53.640 --> 0:18:58.040 of this show attacks on the infrastructure of your wallet. 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:11.040 We're bulk And nothing that we said before the break 0:19:11.200 --> 0:19:15.600 can legally be called incitement. Um, it's a joke. It's fine. 0:19:16.280 --> 0:19:18.959 So now we're gonna we're gonna talk a little bit 0:19:18.960 --> 0:19:21.719 more about the details of the North Carolina attack and 0:19:21.800 --> 0:19:25.400 some of the attacks in the Pacific Northwest, and yeah, 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:27.240 just getting get into some more of the actual details 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:29.919 that have been going on with these most recent attacks 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:33.320 that have kind of caused people to speculate on various things. So, 0:19:34.560 --> 0:19:38.119 the agencies involved in investigating the North Carolina More County 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:43.080 attack have disclosed very little information about what's happened. Uh, 0:19:43.119 --> 0:19:46.119 They've they've said that the equipment was hit by gunfire 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:50.360 and that the shooters appeared to know what they were doing. Uh. 0:19:50.400 --> 0:19:53.360 Investigators have found nearly two dozen shell casings from high 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:59.960 power rifles in the area around and people lost power 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:04.159 are and uh that power outage lasted for like at 0:20:04.240 --> 0:20:07.560 least five days as as the company tried to replace 0:20:07.640 --> 0:20:10.760 these very large pieces of equipment, many of which were 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:15.879 damaged beyond repair. So investigators are zoning in on two 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:21.720 threads of possible motives centered around extremist behavior for the 0:20:21.760 --> 0:20:24.400 for the for the attack that happened last last Sunday. 0:20:25.119 --> 0:20:28.760 One of these. One of these is writings by extremists 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:33.600 on online forms encouraging attacks on critical infrastructure, as well 0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:37.040 as a series of recent disruptions of lgbt Q plus 0:20:37.040 --> 0:20:40.959 events across the nation by domestic extremists, according to law 0:20:41.040 --> 0:20:44.080 enforcement sources disclosed to CNN. So these these are the 0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:49.280 two things that people are looking into. Initial uh speculation, 0:20:49.600 --> 0:20:52.920 like of the night of the shooting centered on right 0:20:52.920 --> 0:20:54.960 wing backlash towards a drag show that was set to 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.920 be held that same day at a nearby theater. The 0:20:58.000 --> 0:21:00.720 drug show was shut down as it was going on 0:21:01.200 --> 0:21:04.080 because the power went out UM, and there was a 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:08.760 local a local activist made some cryptic comments on their 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:13.040 Facebook and they then received a police visit the police 0:21:13.680 --> 0:21:18.680 about it. I also like that the this person who 0:21:18.880 --> 0:21:22.800 who made these cryptic posts UM was also an Army 0:21:22.880 --> 0:21:30.840 psychological operations officer, so they literally worked in pop Yeah, 0:21:34.680 --> 0:21:37.639 like her job was psyops. And this was the person 0:21:37.760 --> 0:21:40.720 that that that posted about this big tied to the 0:21:40.760 --> 0:21:44.719 Drag Show. So take that as as you will. Um. 0:21:44.760 --> 0:21:49.199 This person's group earlier that day had had a protest 0:21:49.840 --> 0:21:54.639 UH involving armed individuals in military gear to to you know, 0:21:54.840 --> 0:21:59.240 push back against the h the Drag Show. So but 0:21:59.240 --> 0:22:02.000 but yeah, So those are the two threads investigators are 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:07.239 looking into. Is one accelerationist rhetoric and writings that has 0:22:07.320 --> 0:22:10.800 gotten more popular the past few years. And then two 0:22:10.960 --> 0:22:13.960 maybe connected to this wave of of of like anti 0:22:14.000 --> 0:22:20.400 queer stuff. Let's see, UM. One what what One interesting 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:23.719 kind of thing of note is that three weeks before 0:22:23.760 --> 0:22:28.240 this attack, another substation was deliberately disabled in eastern and 0:22:28.320 --> 0:22:32.800 North Carolina. This this this stack happened on Friday, November eleventh. 0:22:33.520 --> 0:22:37.760 It shut down electricity for about twelve thousand homes and businesses. 0:22:38.160 --> 0:22:40.280 Power was restored in a few hours, though this one, 0:22:40.320 --> 0:22:43.080 this one was easier to fix. UM. In a statement 0:22:43.080 --> 0:22:45.320 posted on the company's website for a few days after 0:22:45.359 --> 0:22:49.800 the incident, UH, they described it as vandalism, and the 0:22:49.840 --> 0:22:52.879 company said that vandals quote damaged transformers, causing them to 0:22:52.920 --> 0:22:57.480 leak coolant oil, but the statement does not explicitly say 0:22:57.560 --> 0:23:00.800 what the method was. And this is a not uncommon 0:23:00.840 --> 0:23:03.200 because you're trying to like find people who might have 0:23:03.400 --> 0:23:05.960 Like that's part of how you can make a case 0:23:05.960 --> 0:23:08.600 against people is if you can prove they know details 0:23:08.640 --> 0:23:10.680 of the case that aren't publicly possible, Like there's a 0:23:10.720 --> 0:23:12.960 reason why they're not going to say what caliber the 0:23:13.000 --> 0:23:15.359 weapon is or whatever. Yeah, they did say it wasn't 0:23:15.400 --> 0:23:19.040 the same as the one used in the Metcalf attack, 0:23:19.080 --> 0:23:22.720 which was seven six too short, So yes, but the 0:23:22.840 --> 0:23:24.879 gun that was used on the December, North Carolina attack 0:23:25.000 --> 0:23:30.640 was different than the case. Things found at at the 0:23:31.520 --> 0:23:34.120 doesn't mean much. That does not mean much at all. 0:23:34.880 --> 0:23:36.840 I know there was a lot of initial sort of 0:23:36.920 --> 0:23:40.359 anger and frustration over the use of the word vandalism 0:23:40.359 --> 0:23:43.600 and the initial reporting. Um, I think it's fine to 0:23:43.680 --> 0:23:46.720 use that word because when you don't know what happened, 0:23:47.280 --> 0:23:50.240 all you can see that happened is that someone damaged property. 0:23:50.280 --> 0:23:52.320 We don't know the motivations behind it. We don't know 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:55.560 that they intended to knock out power because, like we said, 0:23:55.840 --> 0:23:58.120 sometimes people in the woods just shoot it ship because 0:23:58.119 --> 0:24:02.320 it's it's funny. So I think it's fair to not 0:24:02.400 --> 0:24:04.399 want to use that word. But I think in initial reporting, 0:24:04.480 --> 0:24:06.840 especially from authorities, especially from people who could get suit 0:24:06.960 --> 0:24:12.720 reliable later down the line, the word vandalism is not incorrect. No, 0:24:13.040 --> 0:24:16.199 and it's this is like I think, if you're at 0:24:16.320 --> 0:24:18.760 if you want to know, like what would immediately set 0:24:18.800 --> 0:24:21.560 someone someone off that like something is likely not vandalism. Well, 0:24:21.560 --> 0:24:25.479 the Metcalf attack is good because so much was fired 0:24:25.480 --> 0:24:28.680 at the transformer. I would say if like the thing 0:24:28.680 --> 0:24:30.159 that would make me think maybe this is just some 0:24:30.240 --> 0:24:32.800 you who fucking around is if it's thirty rounds are 0:24:32.880 --> 0:24:35.400 less fired and there's no attempt to actually break onto 0:24:35.400 --> 0:24:42.960 the facility kind of a standard capacity magazine. Which the 0:24:42.960 --> 0:24:46.600 reason why because because the North Carolina attack in December 0:24:46.840 --> 0:24:49.720 did not have many rounds. But the reason why it 0:24:49.840 --> 0:24:53.160 isn't we do know it's intentional is two substations were hit, 0:24:54.560 --> 0:24:57.160 like like one person hit one, then travel and went 0:24:57.240 --> 0:24:59.119 to another, and it was like, I just seem like 0:24:59.160 --> 0:25:01.200 a lot of a lot of people's sort of expressing 0:25:01.200 --> 0:25:03.280 this outrage. But you know is we're tying these other 0:25:03.359 --> 0:25:05.399 instance to it, you know, the ones in Florida, the 0:25:05.440 --> 0:25:08.520 ones in Pacific Northwest when we have very little information, 0:25:08.560 --> 0:25:11.800 it's okay to call it vandalism because that's the baseline, 0:25:11.880 --> 0:25:13.320 right that you don't have to If you start using 0:25:13.400 --> 0:25:16.680 terrorism for every minor incident, it it dilutes it. It's 0:25:16.680 --> 0:25:18.960 not helpful, it creates the area. So I just wanted 0:25:19.000 --> 0:25:24.479 to on the table. I mean, like so, even in 0:25:24.520 --> 0:25:29.800 like November, the FBI was issuing warnings of of of 0:25:30.080 --> 0:25:34.240 reported threats to electricity infrastructure by people espousing racially or 0:25:34.280 --> 0:25:39.240 ethnically motivated extreme ideologies to quote create civil disorder and 0:25:39.280 --> 0:25:43.520 inspire further violence. So FBI was sending bulletins to to 0:25:43.880 --> 0:25:48.240 private industry UM multiple times in the past two months. 0:25:48.240 --> 0:25:51.600 There's been a lot of bulletins being sent out, which 0:25:51.600 --> 0:25:54.440 is I think part of why this in the aftermath 0:25:54.480 --> 0:25:56.720 of the attacks, with all these public record requests and 0:25:56.760 --> 0:25:59.360 more reporting on it, where people are realizing how much 0:25:59.359 --> 0:26:02.399 of a thing is actual The is UM I think 0:26:02.440 --> 0:26:06.160 and and and a tax with these on on sub 0:26:06.200 --> 0:26:09.560 stations or other power grain infrastructure are definitely more common 0:26:09.560 --> 0:26:11.560 than what you might think, and do seem to be 0:26:11.600 --> 0:26:14.439 increasing in frequency on in the in the broad sense, 0:26:14.960 --> 0:26:18.960 and some of some of them are certainly have, as 0:26:18.960 --> 0:26:21.480 we know from arrest that have taken place are part 0:26:21.480 --> 0:26:24.840 of decentralized right wing attempts at an insurrection. That's not 0:26:24.960 --> 0:26:29.119 wrong to say, it's just the problem is larger and 0:26:29.160 --> 0:26:32.679 more complicated than that, and to some extent it's a 0:26:32.760 --> 0:26:34.760 problem of like like I I would, I would be 0:26:34.800 --> 0:26:37.119 shocked if part of the explanation for why this is 0:26:37.119 --> 0:26:40.280 happening so much more is not that Americans have a 0:26:40.320 --> 0:26:43.399 shipload of guns and during the pandemic people were bored 0:26:43.400 --> 0:26:47.280 and kind of going crazy, Like you know, people have 0:26:47.359 --> 0:26:50.000 no chill. Yeah, they have no chill. They're stuck at 0:26:50.040 --> 0:26:52.000 home and you're out in the middle of nowhere, and 0:26:52.040 --> 0:26:54.280 it's easy to do and you want to see something spark. 0:26:54.440 --> 0:26:56.919 That's part of the problem, right, yeah, I mean, and 0:26:57.119 --> 0:27:01.680 they have an increasing since there's there were seventy reports 0:27:01.800 --> 0:27:06.840 of emergency every electric incidents and disturbances caused by suspected 0:27:07.040 --> 0:27:12.360 physical attacks, sabotage or vandalism from January to August two UM. 0:27:12.400 --> 0:27:19.639 That figure represents increase around reports in which is the 0:27:19.640 --> 0:27:23.040 first year that there's comparable data for, and it's it's 0:27:23.200 --> 0:27:26.040 also worth really noting that there is and was as 0:27:26.080 --> 0:27:30.760 soon As this happened in metcalf In, suggestions were made 0:27:30.840 --> 0:27:33.280 as to a really easy way to make it harder 0:27:33.320 --> 0:27:36.440 to do this, which would not be wildly expensive, which 0:27:36.480 --> 0:27:39.160 is to put sandbags in front of the coolant systems, 0:27:39.440 --> 0:27:44.080 which will block most conventional rounds. And at that point, yeah, 0:27:44.440 --> 0:27:47.800 not not hard to accomplish, and it would also let 0:27:47.800 --> 0:27:51.600 you know, anyone who is going to get around those 0:27:51.640 --> 0:27:59.080 sandbags ideologically committed, right whatever. The reason why there is 0:27:59.080 --> 0:28:01.840 so many of these attacks is because a lot of 0:28:01.880 --> 0:28:06.080 these very important pieces of infrastructure are highly visible and 0:28:06.119 --> 0:28:08.879 really only protected by a channelingk fence. So in a 0:28:08.960 --> 0:28:11.720 lot of cases an attack can be carried out without 0:28:11.720 --> 0:28:15.240 even entering any kind of restricted grounds. You can point 0:28:15.280 --> 0:28:17.320 a gun through a channel link fence and and do 0:28:17.359 --> 0:28:21.200 the thing. I mean, you can be yeah, hundreds of 0:28:21.240 --> 0:28:24.160 yards away, right, It's very like a three oh eight. 0:28:24.200 --> 0:28:26.760 You could be easily several hundred yards away, out of 0:28:26.760 --> 0:28:28.640 the range of any camera, and you could take enough 0:28:28.680 --> 0:28:30.399 pot shots to destroy it. It It has that kind of 0:28:30.440 --> 0:28:35.560 penetrative power. A thirty at six, you know, yeah, not hunting, right, 0:28:35.560 --> 0:28:39.480 whether your granddad has you know, yeah, anyone who shoots 0:28:39.520 --> 0:28:42.800 elk regularly could do this, you know, without any without 0:28:42.840 --> 0:28:45.360 without any realistic way of catching them if you're out 0:28:45.400 --> 0:28:49.160 in a rural area. I'm kind of shocked that these 0:28:49.160 --> 0:28:52.920 people actually didn't like in terms of like I don't know, like, um, 0:28:53.040 --> 0:28:55.600 there's there's this. We can talk about this later. But 0:28:55.640 --> 0:28:58.360 obviously the area they're in has a very high concentration 0:28:58.400 --> 0:29:01.960 of very heavily trained people an unconventional warfare. But oh 0:29:02.040 --> 0:29:04.120 yes we should that is that is a factor in 0:29:04.160 --> 0:29:07.520 North Carolina that all of this is occurring on the 0:29:07.520 --> 0:29:10.840 outskirts of Fort Bragg and a year ago people who 0:29:10.840 --> 0:29:14.240 were active duty Marines attempted to carry out a similar attack, 0:29:14.360 --> 0:29:17.040 and we're not Do we want to talk about a 0:29:17.080 --> 0:29:21.760 little bit about that, specifically about Robin Sage. Yeah, yeah, 0:29:22.320 --> 0:29:24.520 I think it's relevant certainly. Like the first thing I 0:29:24.600 --> 0:29:27.240 thought when I thought about this area was like, oh, ship, 0:29:27.320 --> 0:29:30.280 that's right by Serthern Pines. I think maybe the show 0:29:30.360 --> 0:29:32.960 was supposed to happen in Seven Pines, which is kind 0:29:32.960 --> 0:29:37.080 of central to the United States Army Special Forces community, 0:29:37.120 --> 0:29:40.880 and a few times a year there people newly qualifying 0:29:41.680 --> 0:29:45.480 to be SF soldiers will do an exercise called Robin Sage. 0:29:45.880 --> 0:29:50.520 It's it's military laping. Yeah, well like them, Yeah, yes, 0:29:50.760 --> 0:29:54.040 it's the military doing lapping, but also not the military, right, 0:29:54.080 --> 0:29:56.960 So like people I'm sure will be familiar, and people 0:29:56.960 --> 0:29:59.240 who enjoy Twitter dot com will be familiar in the 0:29:59.280 --> 0:30:02.520 fact that they the United States have sometimes helped rebel 0:30:02.600 --> 0:30:05.120 movements across the world to overthrow a government. So it's 0:30:05.120 --> 0:30:07.560 the thing that it likes to do. It's yeah, it's 0:30:07.560 --> 0:30:11.120 shocking that the yeah, they every revolution in fact has 0:30:11.120 --> 0:30:13.880 been fermented by the United States and the CIA specifically 0:30:14.240 --> 0:30:18.040 because people can't think for themselves, and so they what 0:30:18.160 --> 0:30:21.120 they do in robin stage is they practice training a 0:30:21.160 --> 0:30:25.400 rebel movement that's comprised to civilians, right or untrained fighters. 0:30:25.440 --> 0:30:28.280 So these people will go out in small teams in 0:30:28.360 --> 0:30:30.960 pil and then they'll meet a bunch of people who 0:30:30.960 --> 0:30:33.560 are not soldiers. They might be former soldiers, they might 0:30:33.600 --> 0:30:37.040 be local volunteers, there might be people from the area, um, 0:30:37.560 --> 0:30:39.600 and they will train them for a few days, right, 0:30:39.720 --> 0:30:41.560 just like they would if they were actually training up 0:30:41.600 --> 0:30:43.720 like a gorilla army. And then they'll do a simulated 0:30:43.760 --> 0:30:48.320 attack which you might recognize us potentially a bad idea 0:30:48.600 --> 0:30:51.360 which which we now might be seeing as an issue 0:30:51.360 --> 0:30:55.080 because someone someone didn't attack. So like you have in 0:30:55.120 --> 0:30:58.920 that area a ton of SF troops, right, and who 0:30:59.200 --> 0:31:03.040 span the artical spectrum, and a ton of randos who 0:31:03.040 --> 0:31:06.479 have been trained by SF troops in guerrilla warfare, right, 0:31:06.520 --> 0:31:09.320 unconventional warfare is what they call it. And if you 0:31:09.360 --> 0:31:12.920 were doing unconventional warfare, this would be a very effective 0:31:12.920 --> 0:31:15.240 thing to do, right. That's why there's been this massive 0:31:15.240 --> 0:31:18.240 panic about cyber attacks on the grid, especially since the 0:31:18.280 --> 0:31:20.840 start of the war in Ukraine. Very funny we panicked 0:31:20.840 --> 0:31:22.720 about cyber attacks from the fact you could just go 0:31:22.800 --> 0:31:25.080 shoot it. You don't need to be that complex. But 0:31:25.440 --> 0:31:28.360 that's right, it's a weak point and and you would 0:31:28.480 --> 0:31:31.840 know that if you've been practicing unconventional warfare, and so 0:31:32.160 --> 0:31:35.600 like this happening in this very specific area kind of 0:31:35.640 --> 0:31:38.800 racing flags from me. It's not super weird that this 0:31:38.880 --> 0:31:41.000 is the second time in the course of a year 0:31:41.080 --> 0:31:44.000 that there's been an attempt or successful attack on North 0:31:44.040 --> 0:31:48.560 Carolina power infrastructure, right, Like, it's not suprised. This is 0:31:50.600 --> 0:31:53.760 at the very least the DHS is not surprised about this. 0:31:53.880 --> 0:31:57.600 Earlier this year, they've they've issued many alerts warning that 0:31:57.640 --> 0:32:00.400 domestic right and extremists are gonna are planning to target 0:32:00.440 --> 0:32:03.600 the power grid. UM. In February three, people like to 0:32:03.640 --> 0:32:07.520 plead guilty, which we already talked about. UM. There was 0:32:07.560 --> 0:32:11.880 those people arrested in Idaho. They were planning attacks on 0:32:11.880 --> 0:32:17.240 on power stations and highlighting, highlighting locations of transformers and 0:32:17.320 --> 0:32:20.960 other substations and other power infrastructure and planning to take 0:32:21.000 --> 0:32:22.680 them out and then using the black oats to go 0:32:22.760 --> 0:32:28.200 do other crimes, including assassinating ideological opponents. So like, there's 0:32:28.400 --> 0:32:30.360 there's been a lot of there's been a lot of 0:32:30.360 --> 0:32:34.000 extra focus on people's plans to do infrastructure attacks and uh, 0:32:34.080 --> 0:32:37.320 you know, plans on like, hey, this seems like a problem, 0:32:37.320 --> 0:32:39.680 and people have been talking about it more because it 0:32:39.720 --> 0:32:42.880 does seem to there isn't at least increasingly high, high 0:32:42.920 --> 0:32:47.360 high profile cases UM and at least in the case 0:32:47.440 --> 0:32:50.120 of this past one in North Carolina, the d the 0:32:50.240 --> 0:32:53.280 DHS is currently saying that it does appear to be 0:32:53.640 --> 0:32:57.680 deliberate UM, and they're they're investigating to see if it's 0:32:58.160 --> 0:33:02.160 if it is tied to ideological motive UM. But again 0:33:02.200 --> 0:33:04.120 it's it is worth emphasizing that not all of these 0:33:04.120 --> 0:33:07.360 things are are these types of incidents. Like an example 0:33:07.400 --> 0:33:10.160 of something that I think has been misreported on is 0:33:10.480 --> 0:33:14.280 this recent attack or it's not an attack, but it's 0:33:14.280 --> 0:33:17.520 been reported as an attack. In South Carolina, UM on 0:33:18.080 --> 0:33:20.520 December seventh, there was an individual in a truck that 0:33:20.560 --> 0:33:25.120 opened fire near a a Dooke Energy facility. UM employees 0:33:25.160 --> 0:33:29.120 witnessed the struck pull up. It was around five thirty pm. UH. 0:33:29.320 --> 0:33:31.640 This guy opened fire and what appeared to be a 0:33:31.640 --> 0:33:34.440 long gun and then sped away. No one was hurt, 0:33:34.600 --> 0:33:37.880 there was no outages, there was no reported property damage. 0:33:38.440 --> 0:33:42.280 UM and currently sheriffs are saying that this was that 0:33:42.360 --> 0:33:45.480 this was a completely random act that was that wasn't 0:33:45.520 --> 0:33:47.920 even targeted at the power station. They said that the 0:33:48.120 --> 0:33:52.160 only connection between this shooting and the power station was 0:33:52.200 --> 0:33:55.120 their proximity. This wasn't an actual attack on a power station. 0:33:55.360 --> 0:33:58.240 This was just a coincidence. But because this was a 0:33:58.240 --> 0:34:00.840 few days after this attack in North Carolina, people can 0:34:00.840 --> 0:34:03.720 read headlines about someone shooting outside of power station in 0:34:03.760 --> 0:34:06.000 South Carolina and get turned into this big thing and 0:34:06.040 --> 0:34:07.840 you're like, that's actually not what's going on. You need 0:34:07.880 --> 0:34:10.760 to look a little bit closer. Similarly with this stuff 0:34:10.760 --> 0:34:14.520 in Florida, UH, you know, there's been a lot of retroactively, 0:34:15.000 --> 0:34:19.480 you know, trying to apply this this this accelerations idea 0:34:19.520 --> 0:34:23.280 onto those onto those instances as well, when there's simply 0:34:23.280 --> 0:34:27.480 not the evidence. Yeah, it's um. One of the things 0:34:27.480 --> 0:34:29.840 you have to, like, as talking about the fat the 0:34:29.880 --> 0:34:33.399 folks who are like insurrection ary, one of the force 0:34:33.520 --> 0:34:36.120 multipliers they have is that the United States has a 0:34:36.160 --> 0:34:41.400 tremendous amount of people who are just assholes and have guns, um, 0:34:41.480 --> 0:34:44.120 and that that's just their own guns, guns they stole 0:34:44.200 --> 0:34:47.280 from the military. That that is also a factor specific 0:34:48.520 --> 0:34:50.640 James's point about the proximity to Fort Bragg though, you 0:34:50.640 --> 0:34:53.880 know for Bragg in Campball June obviously different branch of 0:34:53.880 --> 0:34:55.720 the military, different parts of the state of North Carolina. 0:34:55.760 --> 0:34:57.120 But you know there was that attack last month. It 0:34:57.160 --> 0:34:58.680 was near Camp La June. We have the Camp La 0:34:58.760 --> 0:35:02.400 June sell that was wrapped up. They're actually still awaiting 0:35:02.440 --> 0:35:06.000 trial on the third superseding indictment. And they were stealing guns, right, 0:35:06.040 --> 0:35:09.239 or at least they got cons from the military. The 0:35:09.280 --> 0:35:15.120 initial indictment was for illegal for trafficking any illegal guns. Yeah. Yeah, 0:35:15.239 --> 0:35:17.880 the Marine cort lost a ton of plastic explosive at 0:35:17.920 --> 0:35:22.520 twenty nine palms last year as well, like a very 0:35:22.600 --> 0:35:27.880 large amount, which is is concerning, Yeah, a startling quantity 0:35:27.920 --> 0:35:31.200 of high explosives. Right, And so I was combing comers 0:35:31.239 --> 0:35:34.400 for anything mentioning Fort Bragg looking for other cases related 0:35:34.480 --> 0:35:36.840 to this specific geografo area because the More County is 0:35:37.239 --> 0:35:40.960 literally right outside Fort Brag, which is where the U. S. 0:35:41.040 --> 0:35:45.520 Army Special Horses um are are hanging out. And so 0:35:45.560 --> 0:35:47.400 this would not be the first time we had radicalized 0:35:47.400 --> 0:35:49.319 soldiers out of Fort Bragg. I mean, you go back 0:35:49.440 --> 0:35:51.759 to the eighties, Michael Tubbs, a founding member of the 0:35:51.800 --> 0:35:54.360 League of the South, did his first terrorism when he 0:35:54.440 --> 0:35:58.080 and some other Special Forces buddies committed armed robbery of 0:35:58.200 --> 0:36:01.960 machine guns from the Army for the clan. Yeah, with 0:36:02.040 --> 0:36:05.200 the intention of using them to start a race war. Yeah. 0:36:05.640 --> 0:36:09.240 But then in August of this year, a Special Forces 0:36:09.280 --> 0:36:13.680 soldier named Killian Ryan was indicted for lying on his 0:36:13.760 --> 0:36:18.120 security clearance application. He had already been granted a security clearance. 0:36:18.160 --> 0:36:20.640 Mind you, he had been granted this clearance um, but 0:36:20.719 --> 0:36:23.640 it turns out he was a Nazi. I don't know 0:36:23.640 --> 0:36:26.480 how the security clearance process didn't catch the fact that 0:36:26.560 --> 0:36:31.040 his email address was Nazi ace fourteen eight at gmail 0:36:31.080 --> 0:36:41.560 dot com that he and sometimes sometimes it's sometimes it's 0:36:41.640 --> 0:36:44.000 it's hard to check. You know, there's lots of simple 0:36:44.040 --> 0:36:47.400 mistakes that anyone could make. Anybody can make this kind 0:36:47.400 --> 0:36:48.879 of this thing. So you know, you see, this wasn't 0:36:48.920 --> 0:36:51.560 a surprise to DHS and it shouldn't be. These are 0:36:51.600 --> 0:36:54.680 the mistakes. UM. I also did want to note, as 0:36:54.719 --> 0:36:58.560 we're talking about these Special Forces guys and the potential 0:36:58.640 --> 0:37:03.200 of them being radical, there's also Timothy McVeigh. Well, Timothy 0:37:03.239 --> 0:37:06.800 McVeigh was regular army, Um, but he washed out a 0:37:06.840 --> 0:37:10.799 Special Forces. Yeah, he didn't quite make it. Um. But 0:37:12.239 --> 0:37:17.520 what's his name? Yeah? Um, yeah, there's this is this 0:37:17.600 --> 0:37:21.279 is like not a this is not an uncommon thing. 0:37:21.840 --> 0:37:25.200 Currently writing a story that includes a large section about 0:37:25.239 --> 0:37:31.200 a marine that tried to steal equipment, uh from military 0:37:31.200 --> 0:37:36.800 bases to then go do a mass shooting at a synagogue. Um, 0:37:36.840 --> 0:37:39.759 and this guy has what was a Nazi before he 0:37:39.840 --> 0:37:43.200 joined the Marines, and he shot on the Marines until 0:37:43.200 --> 0:37:45.480 we figured out what's going on. We have got to 0:37:45.520 --> 0:37:48.439 shut this down until we figured out what's going on. 0:37:48.719 --> 0:37:51.799 So um, Yeah, and you've got Eric Rudolph, the guy 0:37:51.800 --> 0:37:55.760 who carried out the Olympic Park bombings in nineties six 0:37:55.960 --> 0:37:58.560 was was with the first Airborne Division. He was an 0:37:58.600 --> 0:38:02.040 air Assault specialist UM and he carried out the bombing 0:38:02.120 --> 0:38:04.359 of the Olympic Park in Atlanta, Georgia, and then went 0:38:04.360 --> 0:38:07.560 on the run for months. I think, yeah, and he 0:38:07.600 --> 0:38:10.120 was a Nazi by the way, Oh it was. He 0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:13.840 was on the run for a long time. He detail 0:38:13.920 --> 0:38:16.839 all the squirrel and nothing he did in the woods. Yes. Uh. 0:38:16.880 --> 0:38:18.640 And by the way, he carried out a number of 0:38:18.680 --> 0:38:21.880 other bombings, including he carried out a bombing of an 0:38:21.880 --> 0:38:25.520 abortion clinic. He carried out the bombing of a lesbian bar. Um. 0:38:25.719 --> 0:38:29.160 We talked about this earlier this year on Yeah. We 0:38:28.800 --> 0:38:32.840 we did part of one of our mini series we 0:38:32.920 --> 0:38:34.960 talked about this guy. We had we had, we had 0:38:34.960 --> 0:38:38.040 a whole episode dedicated to him. I I do want 0:38:38.040 --> 0:38:40.080 to briefly talk about some of the stuff happening in 0:38:40.080 --> 0:38:42.799 the Pacific Northwest as well, and how this ties in 0:38:42.840 --> 0:38:45.279 and how there is as opposed to some of the 0:38:45.280 --> 0:38:48.040 incidents that were like the incident in South Carolina. Stuff 0:38:48.040 --> 0:38:51.399 in the Pacific Northwest, while happening previous to the North 0:38:51.440 --> 0:38:54.680 Carolina attack, does seem to be deliberate, UM and has 0:38:54.880 --> 0:38:57.880 there has been some interesting pieces of information that have 0:38:57.920 --> 0:39:00.840 come out in the past few days. So the electrical 0:39:00.880 --> 0:39:03.680 grid has been physically attacked at least six times in 0:39:03.760 --> 0:39:08.120 Oregon and western Washington since mid November. Attackers used firearms 0:39:08.160 --> 0:39:09.800 and at least some of the incidents in both states, 0:39:10.000 --> 0:39:13.040 and some power customers in Oregon and Washington experienced at 0:39:13.080 --> 0:39:17.760 least brief service disruptions as a result of the attacks. 0:39:17.800 --> 0:39:21.320 Just two days before the North Carolina attacks, the FBI 0:39:21.480 --> 0:39:24.600 and Organs Tighten Fusion Center issued a memo that warned 0:39:24.719 --> 0:39:29.280 utilities about this about both these recent attacks and how 0:39:29.320 --> 0:39:32.320 there could be more of them, UH, saying quote, power 0:39:32.320 --> 0:39:35.319 companies in organ Washington have reported physical attacks on substations 0:39:35.400 --> 0:39:40.960 using hand tools, arson, firearms, and metal chains, possibly in 0:39:41.000 --> 0:39:45.000 response to an online call for attacks on critical infrastructure. 0:39:45.640 --> 0:39:49.800 UH continuing to say that in recent attacks, criminal actors 0:39:49.840 --> 0:39:53.640 by passed security fences by cutting the fence links, lighting 0:39:53.680 --> 0:39:57.160 nearby fires, shooting equipment for my distance, or throwing objects 0:39:57.200 --> 0:40:00.839 over the fence and on too. The equipment and the aim, 0:40:00.880 --> 0:40:05.000 according to memo is quote violent anti government criminal attack, 0:40:05.600 --> 0:40:08.160 which is kind of a catch all term that these 0:40:08.200 --> 0:40:11.799 people use for a whole bunch of kind of white 0:40:11.800 --> 0:40:16.000 supremacists affiliated accelerationist violence. It's kind of a silly term 0:40:16.040 --> 0:40:19.200 because these people really aren't anti government. They just they 0:40:19.239 --> 0:40:24.799 just want they're anti this government because they think this 0:40:24.880 --> 0:40:28.879 government is too liberal. Um. But but yeah, so there 0:40:28.960 --> 0:40:31.200 was there was an attack on a substation in Clackumus 0:40:31.239 --> 0:40:34.680 County on Thanksgiving morning. The power company calls this a 0:40:34.680 --> 0:40:38.120 deliberate physical attack. Um. This is the one where two 0:40:38.160 --> 0:40:41.200 people cut through fences and use firearms to shoot up 0:40:41.480 --> 0:40:45.480 and disabled numerous pieces of equipment. A security specialist for 0:40:45.480 --> 0:40:48.400 the company wrote this kind of brief on it and 0:40:48.400 --> 0:40:52.520 and and has mentioned how that there are local people 0:40:52.600 --> 0:40:55.759 who are affiliated with you know, larger networks of extremist 0:40:55.760 --> 0:40:59.120 groups that have called for such attacks and have provided 0:40:59.160 --> 0:41:02.720 instructions on how to do these types of things, um 0:41:02.800 --> 0:41:05.600 and saying, quote, there's been a significant uptick in incidence 0:41:05.680 --> 0:41:10.040 of break ins related to copper and tool or materials theft, 0:41:10.320 --> 0:41:15.640 but now we are dealing with quickly escalating incidents of sabotage. Um. 0:41:15.760 --> 0:41:17.960 So that's the kind of that that's that's the brief 0:41:18.000 --> 0:41:20.919 from the security security specialist who works at this power 0:41:20.960 --> 0:41:24.120 company UM. Four days after that Thanksgiving morning attack, there 0:41:24.160 --> 0:41:27.040 was another incident at a Portland General Electric substation, also 0:41:27.040 --> 0:41:28.920 in the clack of this area. So these things happened 0:41:28.960 --> 0:41:31.480 pretty close to one another in the same county. Some 0:41:31.520 --> 0:41:33.960 of the same people were affected. A few details on 0:41:34.000 --> 0:41:37.320 this one have been released UM, but the PG and 0:41:37.360 --> 0:41:39.640 E team said that quote, our teams have assessed the 0:41:39.719 --> 0:41:43.720 damage and have begun to repair the impacted facilities. Knocking 0:41:43.760 --> 0:41:46.319 out the lights is it can be an end goal, 0:41:46.440 --> 0:41:49.080 right that everyone it's it's dark, and if everyone's inconvenience, 0:41:49.120 --> 0:41:53.000 and there's an idea that you know, making things worse 0:41:53.320 --> 0:41:56.839 will help fence sitters radicalized towards towards the right and 0:41:57.200 --> 0:42:01.280 become accelerations themselves. But that darkness it's not its own 0:42:01.520 --> 0:42:03.160 end goal for some of these people, you know, in 0:42:03.200 --> 0:42:06.000 the the Campbell of June cell in the Collins case, 0:42:06.440 --> 0:42:09.480 they specifically spelled out in some of their planning discussions 0:42:09.520 --> 0:42:13.319 that the darkness was stepped one once the lights were out, 0:42:13.440 --> 0:42:17.080 Once UM infrastructure was damaged, the police were distracted, communications 0:42:17.080 --> 0:42:19.359 were down, people couldn't use their cell phones. They would 0:42:19.440 --> 0:42:22.000 use that period of chaos to carry out a series 0:42:22.000 --> 0:42:25.880 of targeted assassinations. And that's not a new idea either. UM. 0:42:25.920 --> 0:42:31.000 I found a case from the nineties even UM, this 0:42:31.080 --> 0:42:34.120 case from the late nineties, the North American Militia. It 0:42:34.160 --> 0:42:38.080 was a splinter group from the Michigan Militia Wolverines Randy 0:42:38.120 --> 0:42:41.319 Graham and Ken Carter went down in this case. UM. 0:42:41.400 --> 0:42:45.719 They were reconning targets including power stations, TV stations, and 0:42:45.760 --> 0:42:49.120 military based federal buildings, and their plan was to knock 0:42:49.160 --> 0:42:52.360 out communications and power and use that period of chaos 0:42:52.640 --> 0:42:55.319 to kill several federal judges and politicians. So this is 0:42:55.640 --> 0:42:57.719 a recurring theme. You know that this case was in 0:42:57.719 --> 0:42:59.239 the nineties, and then we have that recent case, the 0:42:59.239 --> 0:43:02.560 Collins case. The Skuyes haven't even been tried yet, UM, 0:43:02.560 --> 0:43:05.000 and the stated intention is to use that period of 0:43:05.040 --> 0:43:09.120 chaos to do additional crimes of terrorism. And I mean 0:43:09.280 --> 0:43:11.880 there has been more incidents that definitely do seem to 0:43:11.880 --> 0:43:14.480 be intentional, Like beyond the ones in Oregon, there was 0:43:14.520 --> 0:43:18.080 also ones in western Washington UM that that included setting 0:43:18.120 --> 0:43:21.440 the control houses on fire force entry and sabotage of 0:43:21.520 --> 0:43:25.760 intricate electrical control systems causing short circuits by tossing chains 0:43:25.760 --> 0:43:29.239 over the overhead bus work and a ballistic attack with 0:43:29.280 --> 0:43:32.400 small caliber firearms, And so that's that's a lot of 0:43:32.400 --> 0:43:36.480 stuff going into uh of like like in terms of 0:43:37.040 --> 0:43:40.440 planning and preparation going into something that's happening. That's a 0:43:40.480 --> 0:43:43.480 perfect example. Yeah, And if you're, as a general rule, 0:43:43.520 --> 0:43:45.920 if you are encountering one of these stories and you're 0:43:45.920 --> 0:43:48.680 trying to determine should I put this in my head 0:43:48.719 --> 0:43:51.880 as something that is maybe part of something bigger or 0:43:51.920 --> 0:43:54.719 something that might be people fucking around? That's the kind 0:43:54.719 --> 0:43:57.000 of stuff to look for, is like how much effort 0:43:57.040 --> 0:43:59.839 went into it, how elaborate was it? Does it seem 0:44:00.120 --> 0:44:02.279 planning was involved? I would say. Another thing is like 0:44:02.719 --> 0:44:06.319 does it seem is it timed for something like Thanksgiving? Right? Like, 0:44:06.440 --> 0:44:09.200 it's not an accident that they picked Thanksgiving to attack 0:44:09.239 --> 0:44:12.359 a substation. Because if you're trying to do something that's 0:44:12.360 --> 0:44:14.160 going to have an impact doing it on a day 0:44:14.160 --> 0:44:16.520 like that where everybody's at home, people are and there's 0:44:16.560 --> 0:44:19.360 also a higher power draw in general, Like, there's a 0:44:19.360 --> 0:44:21.239 lot of reasons why someone would want to do that, 0:44:21.320 --> 0:44:24.200 but it all points towards this is something that's part 0:44:24.239 --> 0:44:28.319 of an organized set of actions. As opposed to the 0:44:28.440 --> 0:44:32.279 normal thing of Americans attacking their own power infrastructure for 0:44:32.320 --> 0:44:37.239 no good reason. Yeah, which we love to do. Do 0:44:37.560 --> 0:44:38.920 you do you know? Do you know what else we 0:44:38.920 --> 0:44:43.399 we love to do? Robert consume goods and services. That's right. 0:44:43.440 --> 0:44:48.000 We love, we loves and our hero based Lasso King 0:44:48.040 --> 0:45:01.520 would say, that's part of the problem. Hey, we're back, 0:45:02.560 --> 0:45:06.000 all right, Garrison, take us take us home, which hopefully 0:45:06.120 --> 0:45:11.120 is not Fort Bragg No, yeah, yeah, okay, but this 0:45:11.160 --> 0:45:16.080 podcast is run by the usual Yeah, hopefully hopefully not 0:45:16.680 --> 0:45:20.280 so so. Yeah. The past year, we've seen federal authorities 0:45:20.360 --> 0:45:23.480 multiple times worn about these types of threats to critical infrastructure. 0:45:23.840 --> 0:45:28.200 There was a local bulletin posted in late November after 0:45:28.239 --> 0:45:31.480 the attacks in Oregon and Washington, UH saying that the 0:45:31.560 --> 0:45:36.399 targets of potential violence includes public gatherings, faith based institutions, 0:45:36.680 --> 0:45:40.800 l g B, t Q plus communities, UM schools, racial 0:45:40.840 --> 0:45:45.520 and religious minorities, government facilities and personnel, and US critical infrastructure. 0:45:45.840 --> 0:45:49.480 So it's it's definitely, it's definitely something that are the 0:45:49.560 --> 0:45:53.520 people are talking about more as incidents have have do 0:45:53.520 --> 0:45:56.520 do seem to be getting more common. Um, now I'm 0:45:56.520 --> 0:46:00.000 gonna I'm gonna gonna use some of the research from 0:46:00.080 --> 0:46:03.400 a not an article, but I guess not quite a 0:46:03.440 --> 0:46:05.880 study like this. Uh, I don't know how to describe 0:46:05.920 --> 0:46:09.240 it in an analysis piece. I guess from George Washington 0:46:09.680 --> 0:46:14.279 University's program on Extremism entitled Mayhem a Murder and Misdirection 0:46:14.560 --> 0:46:18.920 Violent extremist attack plots against critical infrastructure in the United States. 0:46:19.320 --> 0:46:24.840 So since twenty nineteen we spremacist attacks and plots against 0:46:24.880 --> 0:46:29.920 critical infratructure. Uh, you do seem to have distinctly increased 0:46:29.960 --> 0:46:35.320 between two white spermacis plots targeting energy systems dramatically increased 0:46:35.320 --> 0:46:40.319 in their frequency. Thirteen individuals associated with the overall white 0:46:40.360 --> 0:46:43.200 spermacist movement were arrested and charged in federal court with 0:46:43.280 --> 0:46:46.520 planning attacks on the energy sector. Eleven of these attack 0:46:46.560 --> 0:46:51.360 planners were charged after the rise of eccelorationist ideology and 0:46:51.400 --> 0:46:54.680 doctor in during the past decade did likely fuel these 0:46:54.719 --> 0:46:58.719 increased attacks. Um within the white spermacist mill use that 0:46:58.760 --> 0:47:01.800 are targeting critical infratruc sure and and the energy sector 0:47:01.840 --> 0:47:04.640 in particular. So if if you look at the data 0:47:04.640 --> 0:47:08.120 from twenty two, if you look at ninety four cases 0:47:08.160 --> 0:47:11.880 of individuals who are alleged to have planned quote violent 0:47:11.880 --> 0:47:18.000 extremist attacks. UH. Fifty of those people identified as white supremacists, 0:47:18.040 --> 0:47:21.839 and thirty seven percent of those incidents involved some level 0:47:21.880 --> 0:47:27.359 of planning UH, specifically planning attacks on critical infrastructure. Now, 0:47:27.520 --> 0:47:32.960 six of those sixteen white supremacist plotters had discernible tangible 0:47:33.040 --> 0:47:36.920 connections to named groups and organizations like the base Attamwafen 0:47:37.000 --> 0:47:40.920 Division and the National Socialist Movement. And but in fourteen 0:47:41.040 --> 0:47:44.440 out of the sixteen people were known participants in a 0:47:44.520 --> 0:47:49.840 greater kind of online network that connects various like cells 0:47:50.040 --> 0:47:53.680 or even just aesthetic styles common among the neo Nazis 0:47:53.760 --> 0:47:58.319 accelerationist movement. So and one of the more kind of 0:47:58.560 --> 0:48:01.880 interesting data points is the number of white sermacist plots 0:48:01.880 --> 0:48:05.239 that are specifically focused on the energy sector, relating to 0:48:05.400 --> 0:48:09.759 nuclear reactors, materials, um with the waste sector, and of 0:48:09.800 --> 0:48:14.239 course power substations. UH. There's thirteen thirteen cases of individuals 0:48:14.239 --> 0:48:17.560 who reportedly planned to conduct attacks on a variety of 0:48:17.920 --> 0:48:21.000 energy infrastructure, from small assaults on local on local power 0:48:21.040 --> 0:48:24.080 lines to potentially devastating attacks on power grids or even 0:48:24.160 --> 0:48:28.680 nuclear facilities and UH and those represent eight seven percent 0:48:28.760 --> 0:48:31.600 of the white sermacist related cases in which critical infstructure 0:48:31.600 --> 0:48:35.440 was targeted. So most of that is specifically on power grids. 0:48:35.480 --> 0:48:37.920 Like that's that is, that is what these focus on. 0:48:38.440 --> 0:48:41.560 And the first case within this data point range of 0:48:41.560 --> 0:48:46.760 two UH dates back to seventeen when a former Florida 0:48:46.840 --> 0:48:50.840 National Guardsman and the founder of Adam Often Division was 0:48:50.920 --> 0:48:54.280 arrested in Florida and charged with um, you know, unlawful 0:48:54.280 --> 0:48:58.719 possession of FLOSIT advices and FLICA materials. Uh. They one 0:48:58.760 --> 0:49:01.239 of one of one of the guy's roommates, who was 0:49:01.320 --> 0:49:05.839 also a member of Adam Often told told jurors that 0:49:06.000 --> 0:49:08.640 this guy intended to target a number of different locations 0:49:08.640 --> 0:49:12.000 for explosive attacks using this material, including a Jewish synagogue, 0:49:12.000 --> 0:49:16.319 power lines, and a new and a nearby nuclear reactor site. Um. 0:49:16.560 --> 0:49:19.919 And this guy in his apartment had had a propaganda 0:49:20.040 --> 0:49:23.640 and and book materials on the functioning of nuclear reactors 0:49:23.719 --> 0:49:27.000 and other power supply stuff. So like you know, that's 0:49:27.160 --> 0:49:29.759 these types of things that people study on and then 0:49:29.960 --> 0:49:32.440 plan out to do. And what we're seeing more commonly 0:49:32.480 --> 0:49:36.960 now is of very intensive propaganda team putting together kind 0:49:36.960 --> 0:49:39.880 of manuals on how to do these types of things. 0:49:39.920 --> 0:49:42.840 Both both like both for like to inspire you to 0:49:42.880 --> 0:49:45.400 do it, but also like instruction manuals and like here's 0:49:45.400 --> 0:49:48.040 here's where you should shoot. Here's like here's how to 0:49:48.080 --> 0:49:52.680 actually do it, and it's it's there unfortunately designed quite well. 0:49:54.239 --> 0:49:58.720 And that's something that is newer, that is a direct 0:49:58.760 --> 0:50:03.520 product of the types of aesthetically driven UH propaganda that 0:50:03.560 --> 0:50:07.520 has flourished on sites like Telegram, and they're they're getting 0:50:07.840 --> 0:50:10.759 quite good at making propaganda. It's not just it's not 0:50:10.840 --> 0:50:16.000 just you know, random random books strewn upon your apartment anymore. 0:50:16.160 --> 0:50:22.120 It's very well made documents online. So the three, the 0:50:22.160 --> 0:50:24.960 three men who just pleaded guilty in February for their 0:50:25.080 --> 0:50:29.080 their conspiracy to attack power facilities. One of those men, 0:50:29.200 --> 0:50:33.520 Jackson Saywall. In the the original complaint, it says, you know, 0:50:34.239 --> 0:50:37.160 Um Cook had recruited his friends, say Well to join 0:50:37.200 --> 0:50:40.520 the cause. From the outset. Cook believed say walls graphic 0:50:40.600 --> 0:50:43.640 design skills could be an asset to the group's propaganda effort, 0:50:44.080 --> 0:50:46.680 so he was recruited to the cell because he was 0:50:46.719 --> 0:50:49.160 good at graphic design. Now I read these manifestos, I 0:50:49.160 --> 0:50:51.279 would not say the graphic design is good, but it's 0:50:51.320 --> 0:50:53.799 certainly better than sort of a cut and paste scene. Right, 0:50:53.960 --> 0:50:57.160 there's a clear digital design element here, um, and that's 0:50:57.239 --> 0:50:59.719 on purpose and they know that that's how they're going 0:50:59.760 --> 0:51:01.480 to get eyes on this stuff. I mean, Robert, we 0:51:01.520 --> 0:51:04.160 both read all those manifestos in the last couple of days. 0:51:05.000 --> 0:51:07.759 They are certainly a step up. They are what they 0:51:07.760 --> 0:51:10.320 what they make me think of is when I first 0:51:10.400 --> 0:51:13.160 when I first got into reporting on extremism, it was 0:51:13.200 --> 0:51:16.080 because I went through every issue of like ISISS magazine 0:51:16.080 --> 0:51:21.160 debat right after the BOTA clon attacks and it's number one, 0:51:21.360 --> 0:51:23.719 Like there was when that Adam Waffan guy killed his 0:51:23.800 --> 0:51:26.759 roommates and had he had converted to Islam and was 0:51:26.800 --> 0:51:29.920 like very much um into isis There was this like 0:51:30.040 --> 0:51:32.480 surprise from people who don't think a lot about this stuff. 0:51:32.840 --> 0:51:34.400 But a lot of these guys had a lot of 0:51:34.440 --> 0:51:36.480 admiration for the way that ICE has put together their 0:51:36.480 --> 0:51:41.320 propaganda campaign, which included a lot of very detailed guides 0:51:41.360 --> 0:51:43.640 for how to do things like carry out rent vehicles 0:51:43.680 --> 0:51:47.919 and carry out vehicular attacks. Right like this is um, 0:51:48.000 --> 0:51:51.480 you know, we're this is the way terrorism works. And 0:51:51.600 --> 0:51:53.560 these guys are taking a little bit of a different tack. 0:51:53.640 --> 0:51:56.279 But again, not that like as as Molly pointed out, 0:51:56.640 --> 0:51:59.040 there were a number of ISIS inspired attacks on power 0:51:59.080 --> 0:52:02.560 infrastructure just did get a ton of of of play. 0:52:02.640 --> 0:52:04.839 But like, none of this is like, all of this 0:52:04.960 --> 0:52:07.239 is is in line with the trends that we have 0:52:07.360 --> 0:52:11.840 seen globally in the way in which insurgent movements function. 0:52:12.640 --> 0:52:15.600 And I think you know this well produced easily spread 0:52:15.719 --> 0:52:19.440 propaganda and these online networks they created to spread this propaganda. 0:52:19.560 --> 0:52:21.400 I mean that we're not just you know, we have 0:52:21.480 --> 0:52:24.680 these cases of these organized cells that got caught, but 0:52:24.719 --> 0:52:26.840 it's not just organized cells that have the capacity to 0:52:26.840 --> 0:52:29.400 carry out these attacks. Because any idiot in the telegram 0:52:29.400 --> 0:52:33.279 group can open that manifesto with the detailed instructions for 0:52:33.400 --> 0:52:38.640 carrying out an identical attacked disseminates and becomes contagious. There's this. 0:52:38.840 --> 0:52:41.480 There's this. People who talk about a lot online now 0:52:41.520 --> 0:52:44.680 about stochastic terrorism, and some of us here might be 0:52:44.719 --> 0:52:46.719 a little bit to blame to that, but a lot 0:52:46.760 --> 0:52:50.200 of times they're they're getting it wrong. Um, because what's 0:52:50.280 --> 0:52:53.680 what what these Nazis are doing. This is inspirational terrorism, 0:52:53.680 --> 0:52:55.680 which has been a thing for as long as terrorism 0:52:55.680 --> 0:52:58.960 has existed. I mean, that's why they have their calendar 0:52:59.000 --> 0:53:01.160 of Saints, you know, yeah, exactly. And there's a lot 0:53:01.160 --> 0:53:03.520 of debate about, like Whendy you stochastic terrorism, but kind 0:53:03.520 --> 0:53:05.239 of in my mind, when I tend to think it's 0:53:05.239 --> 0:53:08.120 appropriate is when the attempt is to kind of use 0:53:08.200 --> 0:53:11.480 the way algorithms on various sights on the Internet work 0:53:11.560 --> 0:53:15.080 to spread propaganda that's meant to cause that's meant to 0:53:15.120 --> 0:53:19.000 inspire attacks, because that is it's a type of inspirational terrorism. 0:53:19.040 --> 0:53:21.440 But it's it's it's clearly a new evolution of it 0:53:21.800 --> 0:53:24.080 because of its reliance on those networks. But this is 0:53:24.080 --> 0:53:26.040 again we're getting into the weeds. Is there anything else 0:53:26.080 --> 0:53:28.640 you wanted to kind of get into here, Garrison? I 0:53:28.640 --> 0:53:30.239 mean no, I kind of I kind of wanted to 0:53:30.239 --> 0:53:33.000 wrap up by talking about some of the terrogram stuff. 0:53:33.080 --> 0:53:34.440 So I think we we kind of we kind of 0:53:34.520 --> 0:53:36.360 hit on a lot of stuff that I that I 0:53:36.360 --> 0:53:39.279 wanted to mention. I mean, in twenty nineteen, two years 0:53:39.280 --> 0:53:43.080 after that first uh that that that first attack of 0:53:43.080 --> 0:53:48.480 twenty seventeen, two years later, uh Bew Maryman was was 0:53:48.600 --> 0:53:52.239 arrested for planning to blow up power grid substations. He 0:53:52.280 --> 0:53:55.520 was member of Adam offen um, and we already are 0:53:55.600 --> 0:53:57.839 we already talked about We already talked about the two 0:53:57.840 --> 0:54:00.640 other kind of main instance that are well known of 0:54:01.239 --> 0:54:04.560 from and then stuff that is that that just got 0:54:04.640 --> 0:54:08.120 um uh, there was there was court cases as recently 0:54:08.360 --> 0:54:11.759 February two. We also mentioned in terms of the their 0:54:11.880 --> 0:54:14.720 their plans to take out power stations to then carry 0:54:14.719 --> 0:54:17.640 out assassinations. So those are two other insidents that I 0:54:17.680 --> 0:54:22.680 wanted to mention, um, But yeah, I mean it's I 0:54:22.680 --> 0:54:25.600 think the the other kind of aesthetic similarity I think 0:54:25.840 --> 0:54:27.400 is that I think we actually are seeing some of 0:54:27.440 --> 0:54:31.040 the some of the recent telegram stuff also take cues 0:54:31.160 --> 0:54:34.600 from not only like isis and is not terrorism, but 0:54:34.640 --> 0:54:37.600 also some of the types of anarchist writing that have 0:54:37.880 --> 0:54:42.400 that have has gotten more popular since you know, uh, 0:54:42.560 --> 0:54:44.640 the left type stuff Like where I think we're seeing 0:54:45.160 --> 0:54:49.080 some of some of the aesthetic stylings feels very reminiscent 0:54:49.120 --> 0:54:52.480 of like early crime think um, some of it, some 0:54:52.560 --> 0:54:55.719 of it is is similar to things around um the 0:54:55.760 --> 0:54:59.040 types of like eco sabotage manuals that that were that 0:54:59.080 --> 0:55:02.399 were very popular in the nineties and two thousands. Um. 0:55:02.400 --> 0:55:05.440 You know, some of the techniques are very similar because 0:55:05.640 --> 0:55:11.359 both eco terrorists and UH excelration accelerationist nazis both find 0:55:11.440 --> 0:55:15.000 value and attacking things like powers and powers of power 0:55:15.480 --> 0:55:19.400 substations UM or you know, burning down five G towers. 0:55:19.480 --> 0:55:23.040 That's a big emphasis of this recent like almost three 0:55:23.120 --> 0:55:27.440 hundred page manifesto and instruction manuals. They focus a lot 0:55:27.480 --> 0:55:32.360 on how, you know, in early regular people felt inspired 0:55:32.400 --> 0:55:34.799 to burn down five G towers, people who are not 0:55:34.880 --> 0:55:38.480 otherwise extremists, and how how do we get people who 0:55:38.480 --> 0:55:41.799 are regular people to get to that point where they're 0:55:41.800 --> 0:55:45.719 willing to damage public infrastructure? And that's kind of a 0:55:45.760 --> 0:55:48.680 lot what a lot of what that three hundred page 0:55:48.800 --> 0:55:52.200 kind of manifesto slash manual tries to talk about mm 0:55:52.320 --> 0:55:58.839 hm an it's uh, if we want to end on 0:55:58.840 --> 0:56:01.480 on a hopeful note, I have at least sort of 0:56:01.520 --> 0:56:04.239 a small bright spot for us UM. It's in the 0:56:04.280 --> 0:56:08.240 original UM affidavit for the search warrant into Liam Collins, 0:56:08.280 --> 0:56:12.520 the head of the Camp Lejune cell Um so that 0:56:12.680 --> 0:56:15.360 a original affidavit for the search warrant um in his case. 0:56:16.600 --> 0:56:19.240 The FBI agent writing the affidavit says that they first 0:56:19.239 --> 0:56:22.400 started looking into Collins because he was docked in the 0:56:22.440 --> 0:56:25.719 Iron March leagues. So they were we were reading those 0:56:25.800 --> 0:56:28.520 dockses and they said, oh wow, a marine who's a Nazi. 0:56:28.880 --> 0:56:32.279 We should talk to him. So, you know, when doing 0:56:32.320 --> 0:56:34.800 this work in identifying these people from these leagues and 0:56:34.880 --> 0:56:37.759 sort of the slog of picking through, like maybe this 0:56:37.760 --> 0:56:40.239 guy's a fucking nobody, but we will identify them so 0:56:40.280 --> 0:56:42.760 their communities can keep an eye on them. That work matters. 0:56:42.960 --> 0:56:45.759 That work made it into Newsweek, and it made it 0:56:45.800 --> 0:56:49.160 to the FBI. It's a weird filter system, but eventually 0:56:49.280 --> 0:56:52.719 this guy got caught before he committed a massive nationwide 0:56:52.719 --> 0:56:56.480 active terror. So keep doxy Nazis and it works. In 0:56:56.680 --> 0:56:59.480 a similar incident, there was an officer of the Lafayette 0:56:59.480 --> 0:57:03.000 Police depart MINT that joined I believe this this exact 0:57:03.080 --> 0:57:07.640 same terrorist cell that was then he was he was 0:57:07.800 --> 0:57:11.720 he was docked by anti fascists and then he turned 0:57:11.719 --> 0:57:16.800 and snitched on his fellow Nazis. Um So the investigation 0:57:16.880 --> 0:57:19.040 opened because of the docks and they've got a powerful 0:57:19.080 --> 0:57:22.440 cooperating witness because of another docks. It makes them nervous 0:57:22.480 --> 0:57:25.800 if eyes are on them, they can't conduct covert operations. 0:57:25.880 --> 0:57:28.000 So keep docs in your local Nazis like it can 0:57:28.040 --> 0:57:32.240 it can literally be like in terms of these cells 0:57:32.240 --> 0:57:35.520 planning to do assassinations of people, it can actually save 0:57:35.560 --> 0:57:37.920 people's lives if these people are actually serious and are 0:57:37.920 --> 0:57:41.200 willing to carry out their plans that they are you know, 0:57:41.240 --> 0:57:45.320 actively training for actively preparing materials for um. This type 0:57:45.320 --> 0:57:48.240 of work is is some of the most solid anti 0:57:48.240 --> 0:57:51.160 fascist research that people of that people have done. It 0:57:51.200 --> 0:57:54.720 absolutely saved lives, I've no doubt about that, will continue 0:57:54.720 --> 0:57:59.360 to save lives. So docs Nazis, and you know, if 0:58:00.000 --> 0:58:02.160 if you're drunk out in the woods and one of 0:58:02.200 --> 0:58:05.120 your buddies says, hey, why don't we shoot a power substation, 0:58:05.560 --> 0:58:09.920 don't do it. You can just shoot can stop signs. 0:58:09.920 --> 0:58:13.880 It's the America stop signs, expired fire extinguishers. Those are 0:58:13.880 --> 0:58:16.720 fun to shoot. Let me make all of the people 0:58:16.760 --> 0:58:21.120 turn off this podcast in a bit of rage and 0:58:18.920 --> 0:58:25.200 then and then have a mortal crisis. So yeah, uh 0:58:25.240 --> 0:58:27.440 to the anti cit people who have built a radio 0:58:27.520 --> 0:58:34.600 out of sticks, I realized that podcasts don't come out 0:58:34.600 --> 0:58:38.080 through the radio. Tragic anyway, the episode so you think 0:58:42.800 --> 0:58:45.200 it could happen here is a production of cool Zone Media. 0:58:45.400 --> 0:58:48.080 For more podcasts from cool zone Media. Visit our website 0:58:48.120 --> 0:58:50.240 cool zone media dot com, or check us out on 0:58:50.280 --> 0:58:52.800 the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 0:58:52.880 --> 0:58:55.640 listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It could 0:58:55.640 --> 0:58:58.640 happen here, updated monthly at cool zone media dot com. 0:58:58.720 --> 0:59:00.640 Slash sources, then us for listening