WEBVTT - David Rosenblatt, CEO of 1stDibs: Only in New York

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Office Hours, where we sit down with the

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<v Speaker 1>chief executives shaping the world and into your most pressing

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<v Speaker 1>questions about leadership, careers, and life. I'm Mike steib and

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<v Speaker 1>today we are with my very good friend David Rosenblatt.

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<v Speaker 1>David is CEO of First Dibbs, a marketplace for the

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<v Speaker 1>world's most beautiful things including antiques, furniture, jewelry, art and more. Previously,

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<v Speaker 1>he was CEO of double Click, and he orchestrated it's

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<v Speaker 1>three point one billion dollar sale to Google in two

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<v Speaker 1>thousand and eight. He sits on the boards of IAC

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<v Speaker 1>and far Fetch. He is a pillar of the New

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<v Speaker 1>York tech community, and he's my occasional tennis partner. David,

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<v Speaker 1>I've been looking forward to this. Welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you, Mike. Likewise happy to be here.

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<v Speaker 1>So what everyone should know is when I was thinking

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<v Speaker 1>about coming to Artsy, the company I currently lead, it's

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<v Speaker 1>a company that has a lot in common with David's company,

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<v Speaker 1>First Dibbs. And David, you were the first person I

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<v Speaker 1>came to see to ask for advice. You said, do it.

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<v Speaker 1>I did it. I've had a blast for four years.

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<v Speaker 1>So you're not only my friend, I are you a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of gratitude for the advice.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm flattered.

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<v Speaker 1>A bunch of other folks have called in I want

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<v Speaker 1>your advice today too. So we've got questions on luxury marketplaces,

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<v Speaker 1>New York Tech, your career journey. So sorry with you,

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<v Speaker 1>We'll just we'll get right into it, okay, all right.

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<v Speaker 1>First one is a call we got from Emily in Dallas, Texas,

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<v Speaker 1>who says you.

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<v Speaker 2>Each came from outside of art and luxury to run

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<v Speaker 2>the leading marketplaces in your industries. How did you find

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<v Speaker 2>your way to these rules? My career arc has been

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<v Speaker 2>relatively straightforward. I did a tour of duty. First of all,

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<v Speaker 2>I majored in East As studies and Chinese language, so

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<v Speaker 2>not very helpful for the career good so not very

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<v Speaker 2>helpful for a commercial career here in the US. But

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<v Speaker 2>I spent a couple of years in Asia. After I graduated,

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<v Speaker 2>I did a tour of duty on Wall Street in

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<v Speaker 2>investment banking. Decided I was neither very good nor very

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<v Speaker 2>excited about it.

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<v Speaker 1>We've heard that a lot on the show.

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<v Speaker 2>Is that right?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, There's been a lot of Crigerons that started in

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<v Speaker 1>Wall Street consulting or NBA.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, stuff. Yeah, I wonder how much of that

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<v Speaker 2>reflects the fact that we're sitting here in New York City.

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<v Speaker 1>There's some selection.

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<v Speaker 2>And you know, my honorable discharge from investment banking was

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<v Speaker 2>to go to business school, and I happened to be

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<v Speaker 2>at Stanford exactly at the sort of inception point or

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<v Speaker 2>ground zero of the commercial web. And you know, along

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<v Speaker 2>with many other people, I kind of got the bug

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<v Speaker 2>and and wanted to focus after I graduated on early

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<v Speaker 2>stage tech companies. So I moved to New York, which

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<v Speaker 2>was probably not the smartest way to approach your career

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<v Speaker 2>in early stage tech, but I did it because my

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<v Speaker 2>now wife and girlfriend was here, and also because I

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<v Speaker 2>wanted to live here, and I lived all over the world,

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<v Speaker 2>and you know, I was excited by the city streets here.

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<v Speaker 2>So I came. I connected very quickly with Kevin O'Connor,

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<v Speaker 2>who had previously who had had recently founded for a

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<v Speaker 2>double click, and he brought me on board as one

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<v Speaker 2>of the early product managers. And it cut a long

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<v Speaker 2>story short, it was a real roller coaster of an experience.

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<v Speaker 2>You know. When I joined, we were.

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<v Speaker 1>Doing double clock, was inventing internet.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, we basically created display the display advertising industry online,

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<v Speaker 2>and you know, it was it was thrilling and exciting.

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<v Speaker 2>Everything we did became sort of, you know, definitional to

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<v Speaker 2>the industry that we were operating in. It was also

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<v Speaker 2>a real roller coaster. I mean when I started, we

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<v Speaker 2>were very small. We went public in nineteen ninety eight.

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<v Speaker 2>By two thousand, we had a market cap of fifteen

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<v Speaker 2>billion dollars. A couple of years later, we had a

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<v Speaker 2>negative enterprise value, meaning our the value of the company

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<v Speaker 2>was significantly less than the amount of cash that we had,

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<v Speaker 2>meaning investors. That was probably sort of two to three. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>right after the bust. But I stuck with it, and

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<v Speaker 2>you know, we did have the benefit at that point

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<v Speaker 2>of having a lot of cash. We used that cash

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<v Speaker 2>in retrospect to do the opposite of what we should

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<v Speaker 2>have done. What we should have done is retain confidence

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<v Speaker 2>in our market and double down on the display advertising industry. Instead,

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<v Speaker 2>what we did is we took that cash and we

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<v Speaker 2>diversified into related industries where we thought the things that

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<v Speaker 2>we were good at by virtue of having done display advertising,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, would apply. And that turned out not to

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<v Speaker 2>be a great idea because what happened was the display advertising,

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<v Speaker 2>contrary to most kind of projections of a few years earlier,

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<v Speaker 2>did come back, but we didn't come back with it

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<v Speaker 2>because by that point we were no longer the sort

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<v Speaker 2>of you know, proxy on that industry that we had

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<v Speaker 2>been going into the market correction. And so what we

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<v Speaker 2>did is we decided the board decided to take the

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<v Speaker 2>company private, and we ran an auction and ultimately did

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<v Speaker 2>take the company private with home and and Freeman. I

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<v Speaker 2>became CEO in conjunction with that take private deal. And

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<v Speaker 2>essentially what we did over the following four years is

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<v Speaker 2>we reversed the diversification process that we had undertaken previously,

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<v Speaker 2>doubled down on display advertising, and you know, and that

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<v Speaker 2>ended up working, and so I sold the company in

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<v Speaker 2>two thousand and eight. As you mentioned a Google spent

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<v Speaker 2>a year at Google kind of helping with the integration

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<v Speaker 2>and the adoption of.

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<v Speaker 1>Its resting investing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I was trying to be productive, not not always successfully,

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<v Speaker 2>as you know from having been there at the time.

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<v Speaker 2>And so a year after that I left and joined

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<v Speaker 2>a few boards, one of which was Twitter. Through Twitter,

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<v Speaker 2>I met Benchmark. Benchmark had been an early investor in Twitter.

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<v Speaker 2>A couple of years after that, they invested in first

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<v Speaker 2>St Dibbs, and you know, I got the call from

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<v Speaker 2>them to see if I was interested. What was appealing

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<v Speaker 2>to me about first Stibbs was the same thing that

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<v Speaker 2>appealed to me about Double Click, which was, even though

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<v Speaker 2>it was a completely different industry, both companies were kind

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<v Speaker 2>of reinventing what had been a very old industry for

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<v Speaker 2>a digital age.

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<v Speaker 1>Mae Ling, who is in San Francisco, texted this one

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<v Speaker 1>into me. She said, how has tech changed luxury buying?

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<v Speaker 1>And what about building a luxury marketplace is different than

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<v Speaker 1>other marketplaces.

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<v Speaker 2>Listen the tex change.

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<v Speaker 1>You can now buy luxury online, so in one way

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<v Speaker 1>it's changed it quite a bit.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean listen, the internet changes everything it touches, right,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean listen. The degree of difficulty, as you know, Mike,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, of running a luxury business online, and particularly

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<v Speaker 2>one in the in the sort of in the arts

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<v Speaker 2>broadly speaking, arts industry, the degree of difficulty is higher

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<v Speaker 2>than any other company I've.

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<v Speaker 3>Ever been around.

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<v Speaker 1>You're dealing with unique objects, You're dealing.

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<v Speaker 2>With unique options, one of the kind objects. You know.

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<v Speaker 2>The sale of those objects requires trust, which is hard

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<v Speaker 2>to achieve online. The sale is very complex, both logistically

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<v Speaker 2>and also kind of psychologically. It's highly fragmented because you know,

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<v Speaker 2>the item that a given buyer is in the market

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<v Speaker 2>for might be eight thousand miles away, or it might

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<v Speaker 2>be eight hundred yards away, right, and one doesn't know

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<v Speaker 2>going into it. And again, the order itself is very complicated, right.

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<v Speaker 2>Shipping is complicated, Insurance is complicated, Crossing borders is always complicated.

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<v Speaker 2>The communication required between buyers.

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<v Speaker 1>Because it's a longer consideration.

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<v Speaker 2>Sometimes it's not like buying a razor, right. I think

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<v Speaker 2>in our case, the kind of initial value that we

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<v Speaker 2>created for buyers was simply aggregating all of sort of

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<v Speaker 2>relevant pieces in one place on one website, you know.

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<v Speaker 2>And I remember, by the way, I just sort of

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<v Speaker 2>back to the sort of the difficulty the degree of

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<v Speaker 2>difficulty question. I remember when I was doing my own

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<v Speaker 2>diligence on first DIBs, one of the you know, one

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<v Speaker 2>of the moments that the difference between this market and

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<v Speaker 2>every other market I'd ever been exposed to was sort

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<v Speaker 2>of made concrete to me. Was I interviewed I don't know,

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<v Speaker 2>nine or ten sellers on first STIPs to understand kind

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<v Speaker 2>of how they thought about the company and the market

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<v Speaker 2>and their business. And one of the really simple question

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<v Speaker 2>I questions I asked them was what do you do

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<v Speaker 2>when a piece of yours doesn't sell? And you know what,

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<v Speaker 2>almost all of them said, raise the price. Oh and

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<v Speaker 2>it's sort of the light bulb went off, like this

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<v Speaker 2>is a different thing, you know, that's a different kind

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<v Speaker 2>of things, a different kind of thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, in art, the if you buy a thirty six

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<v Speaker 1>by forty eight painting, the raw materials probably cost thirty dollars, right,

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<v Speaker 1>but is the work of the artists that made it

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<v Speaker 1>a value that could be tens of thousands or hundreds

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<v Speaker 1>of thousands or millions of dollars in value. So it's

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<v Speaker 1>you're buying, you're buying aesthetic and cultural appreciation, and you're

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<v Speaker 1>buying you're buying a tiny and you're buying a tiny

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<v Speaker 1>slice of our of our culture. And it's that is

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<v Speaker 1>very different than booking a room in Miami and a flight.

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<v Speaker 1>It's very very different than we.

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<v Speaker 2>Tea you know, I do consider First DIBs to be

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<v Speaker 2>a mission driven company. I think, you know, part of

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<v Speaker 2>the mission that motivates me, and I think many of

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<v Speaker 2>our employees is what you say, which is, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>in less companies like first DIBs and like Artsy succeed

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<v Speaker 2>and scale, then you know, the market for a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of what defines our culture disappears.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, and the people who sell these objects,

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<v Speaker 1>whether they run art galleries or whether they are an

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<v Speaker 1>antiques dealer, they're very special people. They follow their hard

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<v Speaker 1>and do a thing that they love. And the business

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<v Speaker 1>of selling art is not easy. Business of being an

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<v Speaker 1>antiques dealer is not easy. When we can bring more

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<v Speaker 1>demand to those entrepreneurs and help their artists succeed, it's

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<v Speaker 1>it's really rewarding, and it's and to your point, it's.

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<v Speaker 2>Really important, that's right. So in addition to all the

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<v Speaker 2>challenges that are specific to working in the arts and

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<v Speaker 2>kind of running an arts business as a commercial entity,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, they're also small businesses and it's difficult for

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<v Speaker 2>them to do things like, for example, figure out how

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<v Speaker 2>to work with Google and search engines, figure out how

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<v Speaker 2>to ship cross border, right, I mean all of those

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<v Speaker 2>sorts of things.

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<v Speaker 1>How many dealers could create their own appeah part of

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<v Speaker 1>the app ecosystem and all of that stuff exactly, So

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<v Speaker 1>you touch on something in the introot. You followed your

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<v Speaker 1>you followed your heart to New York, and you ended

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<v Speaker 1>up being an important part of the New York tech community.

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<v Speaker 1>Connor and New York City asked the New York tech

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<v Speaker 1>scene has boomed over the last twenty years, and first

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<v Speaker 1>DIBs and Artsy our two leading examples of New York

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<v Speaker 1>founded companies. How is starting and running a tech company

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<v Speaker 1>in New York different than Silicon Valley for other places? Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>so it's been so you came here for the love,

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<v Speaker 1>you stayed for the.

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<v Speaker 2>Tech, stayed for the food.

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<v Speaker 1>And by the way, was the same situation for me.

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<v Speaker 1>My wife was an investment banker, and that means that's

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<v Speaker 1>a New York job. And so you know, we're not

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<v Speaker 1>the first people on this podcast to say we sort

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<v Speaker 1>of are in our city because we did it for

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<v Speaker 1>love and then and then you wrap your career around it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's true. I think you know what's interesting, and

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<v Speaker 2>I've been at it for a quarter century in New

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<v Speaker 2>York tech, so you know, I, in a funny kind

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<v Speaker 2>of way, the challenges between New York or the sort

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<v Speaker 2>of difference between running a tech business in the Valley

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<v Speaker 2>versus New York are almost sort of inverted in the

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<v Speaker 2>sense that you know, early on when we were scaling

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<v Speaker 2>Double Click, the biggest challenge was just finding engineers and

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<v Speaker 2>also separately finding non engineers who understood what it was

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<v Speaker 2>like to work in a kind of tech driven business.

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<v Speaker 2>And we, of course had no shortage of people that

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<v Speaker 2>kind of knew the industry that we operated in. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>the Valley was the opposite, right. There were you know,

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<v Speaker 2>great engineers growing on trees. There were very few people

0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:46.880
<v Speaker 2>who who had experience with the underlying industries. And you know,

0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:51.320
<v Speaker 2>I think the two kind of coasts have converged in

0:12:51.320 --> 0:12:53.640
<v Speaker 2>that sense. Right There are now plenty of engineers here

0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:57.040
<v Speaker 2>and there are now many more people than understand kind

0:12:57.040 --> 0:13:00.600
<v Speaker 2>of non tech industries in the valley, And so in

0:13:00.640 --> 0:13:04.880
<v Speaker 2>that sense, actually the difference between the two is much

0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:08.760
<v Speaker 2>much smaller today than it was before. Those that remain

0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:11.920
<v Speaker 2>really have to do with just scale, right. I mean, yes,

0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:14.160
<v Speaker 2>there's venture capital in New York. There's a lot more

0:13:14.200 --> 0:13:17.360
<v Speaker 2>of it out there. Yes, you know, there's a there

0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:20.640
<v Speaker 2>is a developer community here. It's much bigger out there, and.

0:13:20.640 --> 0:13:22.680
<v Speaker 1>I think the numbers are like it's roughly thirty percent

0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:26.400
<v Speaker 1>now of sort of US venture starts in Silicon Valley,

0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:29.080
<v Speaker 1>and like twelve or thirteen percent is New York City,

0:13:29.120 --> 0:13:31.120
<v Speaker 1>so closer, but.

0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:33.240
<v Speaker 2>Still civil service. It's still still different.

0:13:33.400 --> 0:13:34.600
<v Speaker 1>One of the things I found different. I don't know

0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:36.960
<v Speaker 1>if you have as well, but if you're especially by

0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.640
<v Speaker 1>you know from our friends who who live in the valley,

0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:41.960
<v Speaker 1>it's if you go to the soccer game, you're a

0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:44.439
<v Speaker 1>drop off for your kids. All of the talk is tech.

0:13:44.520 --> 0:13:47.360
<v Speaker 1>It is definitely a tech town. I remember our kids.

0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:49.280
<v Speaker 1>Each of our kids are teenagers now, but I remember

0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:52.120
<v Speaker 1>when we were applying my son for preschool and they

0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:54.240
<v Speaker 1>asked where I worked, and I said I worked at Google.

0:13:54.640 --> 0:13:56.840
<v Speaker 1>And one of the ladies in admissions at the school

0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:58.480
<v Speaker 1>gave me your phone and asked me to ask me

0:13:58.520 --> 0:14:01.520
<v Speaker 1>to fix it because they hadn't met someone in tech

0:14:02.400 --> 0:14:06.480
<v Speaker 1>during the entire process of meeting the parents of the

0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:09.439
<v Speaker 1>incoming preschool class. So New York, you have diversity in

0:14:09.480 --> 0:14:12.800
<v Speaker 1>New York. And for companies like ours, which are these

0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:16.920
<v Speaker 1>sort of culturally rich marketplaces, being adjacent to New York

0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:20.040
<v Speaker 1>City culture, I think is a huge advantage. Huge advantage.

0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:22.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I don't think this. I don't think either of

0:14:22.040 --> 0:14:28.080
<v Speaker 2>our companies could operate successfully from you know, San Francisco, potentially.

0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:31.000
<v Speaker 1>Especially in the early stages of it, Especially in the stages.

0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:32.040
<v Speaker 1>I think that's right.

0:14:33.640 --> 0:14:35.000
<v Speaker 2>By the way, if I had a dollar for the

0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:37.600
<v Speaker 2>number of times people asked me to fix their computers,

0:14:38.080 --> 0:14:39.960
<v Speaker 2>you know, in the in the early days, once they

0:14:40.040 --> 0:14:41.760
<v Speaker 2>learned I worked on you know, at a tech company

0:14:42.280 --> 0:14:45.000
<v Speaker 2>in similar experience, I think we all had that right.

0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:59.400
<v Speaker 1>The next one is from rajesh In, also in New

0:14:59.480 --> 0:15:04.160
<v Speaker 1>York City. He asked, online advertising has grown to hundreds

0:15:04.200 --> 0:15:06.680
<v Speaker 1>of billions of dollars a year and is the business

0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:10.000
<v Speaker 1>model of countless Internet companies. Double Click and Google were

0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.560
<v Speaker 1>the pioneers in the space. Can you talk about the

0:15:12.600 --> 0:15:15.680
<v Speaker 1>evolution of advertising and what lessons you see for other

0:15:16.760 --> 0:15:19.000
<v Speaker 1>newer Internet industries.

0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:22.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think, you know, the big change in the

0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:27.120
<v Speaker 2>digital at least the display ad industry was the shift

0:15:27.280 --> 0:15:31.680
<v Speaker 2>from a kind of what I guess you could call

0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:36.720
<v Speaker 2>a kind of cut and paste application of the historical

0:15:36.720 --> 0:15:40.800
<v Speaker 2>ad model to the Internet, meaning, you know, there were publishers, publishers,

0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:45.920
<v Speaker 2>higher salesforces. Salesforces went out and sold ads agency. Yes,

0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:48.080
<v Speaker 2>it took a little bit more technology, but kind of

0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:50.840
<v Speaker 2>basically it was the same thing. The big change in

0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.880
<v Speaker 2>the industry was the evolution from that in favor of

0:15:54.280 --> 0:16:00.320
<v Speaker 2>AD exchanges and aggregators, so very large AD networks changes

0:16:00.400 --> 0:16:03.800
<v Speaker 2>like Googles and double clicks and so on, that had

0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:10.440
<v Speaker 2>the impact of divorcing audience from context, right, meaning if

0:16:10.480 --> 0:16:12.800
<v Speaker 2>you wanted to buy an in more access to an

0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:17.080
<v Speaker 2>in market car, you know, auto buyer. Previous to that,

0:16:17.400 --> 0:16:20.120
<v Speaker 2>you bought car and driver. Whether you bought the print

0:16:20.240 --> 0:16:22.720
<v Speaker 2>or you bought digital, it didn't really matter, you know.

0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:28.160
<v Speaker 2>Once the ad exchanges and aggregators emerged, those two things

0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:31.560
<v Speaker 2>could be separated and you could buy an in market

0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:35.600
<v Speaker 2>auto buyer irrespective of where he or she is, right,

0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:40.040
<v Speaker 2>And that led to all sorts of arbitrage models and

0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:43.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, things like that, So that sort of you

0:16:43.360 --> 0:16:45.840
<v Speaker 2>know that What was the reason I mentioned that is

0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:50.560
<v Speaker 2>that is a I think every industry waits for its

0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:57.760
<v Speaker 2>moment where it is reinvented, employing kind of attributes or

0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:02.680
<v Speaker 2>technologies that only the has that's unique to digital. It

0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:07.160
<v Speaker 2>doesn't exist offline to some degree, you know, I think

0:17:07.280 --> 0:17:11.840
<v Speaker 2>first Stibbs, at least in our industry, has created a

0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:16.520
<v Speaker 2>version of that, right simply by aggregating all the inventory

0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:21.000
<v Speaker 2>in our market that otherwise had been super fragmented, and

0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:24.480
<v Speaker 2>then also making it possible to buy that product online

0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:28.920
<v Speaker 2>and receive some of the benefits of online of e commerce,

0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:30.600
<v Speaker 2>right and being able to talk to the too many

0:17:30.640 --> 0:17:32.560
<v Speaker 2>sellers at the same time and all in one place

0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:36.520
<v Speaker 2>and compare prices and you know, arrange shipping and so on,

0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:39.600
<v Speaker 2>and to do all that without having to pick up

0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:41.200
<v Speaker 2>the phone and talk to somebody, which you know a

0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:43.960
<v Speaker 2>lot of people don't like, you know. But at the

0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:46.480
<v Speaker 2>same time, I don't think we're one hundred percent of

0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:49.440
<v Speaker 2>the way there yet. It feels like there's another kind

0:17:49.480 --> 0:17:52.240
<v Speaker 2>of chapter in this and you know, part of what

0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:56.679
<v Speaker 2>is sort of you know, helps me remain very excite

0:17:56.680 --> 0:18:00.679
<v Speaker 2>and engage about working in this industry is that I

0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:03.119
<v Speaker 2>don't quite feel that we're one hundred percent of the

0:18:03.119 --> 0:18:06.720
<v Speaker 2>way there yet. Sure, even though we've made a lot

0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:07.560
<v Speaker 2>of progress.

0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:11.080
<v Speaker 1>An interesting thing that happened in internet advertising is according

0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:14.320
<v Speaker 1>to the Department of Justice, Google one and the and

0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:16.399
<v Speaker 1>the double click being a part of Google is a

0:18:16.400 --> 0:18:18.840
<v Speaker 1>big part of how they're looking now at Google having

0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:21.399
<v Speaker 1>won the space. Do you think is that pattern going

0:18:21.400 --> 0:18:22.879
<v Speaker 1>to be repeated as we look at sort of what

0:18:22.920 --> 0:18:24.840
<v Speaker 1>comes next and what comes next sort of one of

0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:28.240
<v Speaker 1>the things everyone's saying is that the Adobe of the

0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:31.280
<v Speaker 1>AI world, for example, is going to be Adobe. That

0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:33.520
<v Speaker 1>a lot of the technologies that are merging now are

0:18:33.520 --> 0:18:36.800
<v Speaker 1>going to benefit more than anyone else the biggest players

0:18:36.800 --> 0:18:38.920
<v Speaker 1>in the space get Do you get that sense?

0:18:39.040 --> 0:18:44.639
<v Speaker 2>I do think that will happen, primarily because you know

0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:50.040
<v Speaker 2>what the Internet is good at is connecting fragmented sort

0:18:50.080 --> 0:18:53.880
<v Speaker 2>of nodes in an industry, right in sellers, buyers, whatever,

0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:59.800
<v Speaker 2>And you know that that creates a network effect, and

0:19:01.240 --> 0:19:06.200
<v Speaker 2>network effect industries favor scale players, right, And so it's

0:19:06.240 --> 0:19:09.679
<v Speaker 2>not just the case that the bigger a company gets,

0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:12.359
<v Speaker 2>you know, the sort of more powerful they become. But

0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:15.680
<v Speaker 2>the bigger they get, the better the experience for sellers

0:19:15.680 --> 0:19:18.720
<v Speaker 2>and buyers, which of course leads to even more scale.

0:19:18.800 --> 0:19:21.320
<v Speaker 2>And it's the sort of, depending on how you think

0:19:21.320 --> 0:19:25.280
<v Speaker 2>about it, either a vicious or virtuous cycle which ultimately

0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:29.560
<v Speaker 2>culminates in the largest companies being the most powerful and

0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:32.639
<v Speaker 2>actually having the best products and services. And so I

0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:36.800
<v Speaker 2>don't think I'm saying anything that's you know, path breaking necessarily,

0:19:37.200 --> 0:19:40.800
<v Speaker 2>but I don't see why that pattern wouldn't repeat itself

0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:43.360
<v Speaker 2>in almost every industry online.

0:19:43.160 --> 0:19:45.720
<v Speaker 1>Right For years, read Hastings was saying, we have to

0:19:45.800 --> 0:19:49.080
<v Speaker 1>become HBO faster than HBO can become Netflix.

0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:50.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, bingal exactly.

0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:53.200
<v Speaker 1>They did, good job, guys, Yeah exactly.

0:19:54.720 --> 0:19:57.119
<v Speaker 2>But now that's become sort of part of the received

0:19:57.160 --> 0:19:59.880
<v Speaker 2>wisdom of running a tech company, and I think it's

0:20:00.119 --> 0:20:01.840
<v Speaker 2>to be harder to be a disruptor for that reason.

0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:07.439
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, all right. The next one is from Malik in Detroit. David,

0:20:07.640 --> 0:20:10.040
<v Speaker 1>you sat on the Twitter board during its most formative years.

0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:12.000
<v Speaker 1>What do you think of all the changes of Twitter?

0:20:12.560 --> 0:20:14.720
<v Speaker 1>Presumably your nbas have all burned off and everything you

0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:15.040
<v Speaker 1>can tell you.

0:20:15.760 --> 0:20:18.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, listen, they have. I mean, I will say this,

0:20:18.960 --> 0:20:21.959
<v Speaker 2>I'm not as close to it anymore, just because I

0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:27.080
<v Speaker 2>haven't been involved since since the change of control, and.

0:20:25.880 --> 0:20:27.920
<v Speaker 1>I know, and people barely talk about it in the news.

0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:29.200
<v Speaker 1>I mean, you probably haven't even heard.

0:20:29.200 --> 0:20:32.160
<v Speaker 2>What's it's true? Yeah, I don't read the news.

0:20:32.200 --> 0:20:32.600
<v Speaker 1>Just kidding.

0:20:33.840 --> 0:20:36.560
<v Speaker 2>I mean, listen, I think you know there are there

0:20:36.560 --> 0:20:39.240
<v Speaker 2>are a lot of different ways to think about that

0:20:39.320 --> 0:20:43.080
<v Speaker 2>company and the impact of new ownership on it. From

0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:47.840
<v Speaker 2>my perspective, one of the questions that I think is

0:20:48.400 --> 0:20:51.320
<v Speaker 2>among the most interesting, which is sort of a commercial

0:20:51.680 --> 0:20:57.560
<v Speaker 2>kind of geeky tech one is you know, one of

0:20:57.600 --> 0:21:01.000
<v Speaker 2>the one of the attributes of Twitter that was always

0:21:01.160 --> 0:21:04.679
<v Speaker 2>the most compelling from my perspective was its network effect, right,

0:21:04.760 --> 0:21:09.080
<v Speaker 2>the fact that it had aggregated, you know, all of

0:21:09.119 --> 0:21:14.920
<v Speaker 2>these content providers offered them a unique way to publish

0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:18.600
<v Speaker 2>their content and a unique way for consumers of the

0:21:18.600 --> 0:21:22.360
<v Speaker 2>content to understand it and read it in the sort

0:21:22.400 --> 0:21:24.520
<v Speaker 2>of interaction of those two things. Creator and a network effect,

0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:26.400
<v Speaker 2>which is part of the reason why you know, there

0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:29.959
<v Speaker 2>is no real and has been no real competition to Twitter.

0:21:31.000 --> 0:21:34.760
<v Speaker 2>Some of the changes that the current management are making,

0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:38.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, I would think might undo some of that

0:21:38.040 --> 0:21:42.480
<v Speaker 2>network effect. Charging for the market is the biggest one,

0:21:42.560 --> 0:21:45.800
<v Speaker 2>right so you know, So the question for me that

0:21:46.080 --> 0:21:49.760
<v Speaker 2>I'm most interested in, or as interested in as all

0:21:49.840 --> 0:21:52.600
<v Speaker 2>the others, but which I haven't really heard anyone talk about,

0:21:52.680 --> 0:21:57.240
<v Speaker 2>is what's more powerful the network effect that Twitter brings

0:21:57.320 --> 0:21:59.840
<v Speaker 2>into this, you know, by virtue of having been around

0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:04.680
<v Speaker 2>or seventeen years or so, you know, or the sort

0:22:04.720 --> 0:22:07.600
<v Speaker 2>of negative impact on the network effect of some of

0:22:07.640 --> 0:22:10.679
<v Speaker 2>these changes that the current management is thaking, like, you know,

0:22:10.720 --> 0:22:13.640
<v Speaker 2>making a blue check mark available for sale. So far,

0:22:13.920 --> 0:22:17.120
<v Speaker 2>the network effect is winning, right, So in spite of

0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:19.400
<v Speaker 2>all of the changes, so not just the blue check mark,

0:22:19.440 --> 0:22:22.040
<v Speaker 2>but also the relaxation of a lot of the content

0:22:22.119 --> 0:22:27.360
<v Speaker 2>moderation investment, you know, the seemingly the seeming favoring of

0:22:27.720 --> 0:22:30.560
<v Speaker 2>you know, some some tweeters over others and so on,

0:22:31.119 --> 0:22:34.080
<v Speaker 2>none of that has undone the network effects. So that's

0:22:34.080 --> 0:22:35.600
<v Speaker 2>what I'm going to be looking at over the next

0:22:35.600 --> 0:22:37.679
<v Speaker 2>couple of years. And one of those things that I

0:22:37.760 --> 0:22:39.399
<v Speaker 2>one of the aspects of this that I think is

0:22:39.800 --> 0:22:41.840
<v Speaker 2>underserved but kind of fascinating.

0:22:42.119 --> 0:22:46.440
<v Speaker 1>Next to a really good one from Alejandra in Albuquerque,

0:22:46.520 --> 0:22:47.040
<v Speaker 1>New Mexico.

0:22:47.680 --> 0:22:50.320
<v Speaker 2>You've both a lot of multiple companies. What is one

0:22:50.359 --> 0:22:53.119
<v Speaker 2>way in which your leadership approach has changed the most?

0:22:53.359 --> 0:22:56.719
<v Speaker 1>What is your advice to new leaders change one? It's

0:22:56.760 --> 0:22:57.240
<v Speaker 1>a no question.

0:22:57.560 --> 0:22:58.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, it's a good ques. It is a

0:22:58.920 --> 0:23:04.679
<v Speaker 2>good question necessarily. You know, I do my job differently.

0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:07.879
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure you do years differently at age fifty five

0:23:08.240 --> 0:23:10.600
<v Speaker 2>than I did at age thirty six, which is how

0:23:10.640 --> 0:23:12.560
<v Speaker 2>well I was when I became CEO of Double Click.

0:23:13.480 --> 0:23:16.080
<v Speaker 2>I have more things in my life, you know, both

0:23:16.080 --> 0:23:21.680
<v Speaker 2>personal and professional and it's my hope that first Ebb's

0:23:22.080 --> 0:23:25.600
<v Speaker 2>benefits is it sort of comes out positive on that trade, right,

0:23:25.680 --> 0:23:29.000
<v Speaker 2>Like I can't I don't have the ability as I

0:23:29.000 --> 0:23:32.000
<v Speaker 2>did when I was thirty six to put every single

0:23:32.080 --> 0:23:33.360
<v Speaker 2>waking minute of my life.

0:23:33.400 --> 0:23:35.600
<v Speaker 1>Well, could we had twenty six possibly have had time

0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:37.840
<v Speaker 1>to sit on two boards, that would have been unthinkable.

0:23:38.320 --> 0:23:41.679
<v Speaker 2>I didn't have time to Yah, everybody cared it was

0:23:42.119 --> 0:23:42.440
<v Speaker 2>the minutes.

0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:43.480
<v Speaker 1>We didn't have the minutes.

0:23:43.760 --> 0:23:45.600
<v Speaker 2>And also it would have been hard. Yeah, I mean, so,

0:23:46.440 --> 0:23:49.919
<v Speaker 2>you know, on one hand, it just at you know,

0:23:51.240 --> 0:23:53.840
<v Speaker 2>at my advanced age. You know, it's it's it's just

0:23:53.920 --> 0:23:57.280
<v Speaker 2>hard to put to sort of make any one company

0:23:57.320 --> 0:24:00.520
<v Speaker 2>one hundred percent of your time my time. And my

0:24:00.640 --> 0:24:03.960
<v Speaker 2>hope is that the company benefits from the pattern recognition

0:24:04.040 --> 0:24:05.960
<v Speaker 2>I have and the experience.

0:24:05.440 --> 0:24:07.240
<v Speaker 1>That I have, thee those.

0:24:07.640 --> 0:24:11.320
<v Speaker 2>Network and all that that the benefits of that outweigh

0:24:11.640 --> 0:24:15.320
<v Speaker 2>the fact that I'm not able to spend as I

0:24:15.359 --> 0:24:18.240
<v Speaker 2>did at Double Click at age thirty six, every single

0:24:18.280 --> 0:24:20.359
<v Speaker 2>waking minute on the company.

0:24:20.400 --> 0:24:22.600
<v Speaker 1>I've come to appreciate over the last ten or fifteen

0:24:22.680 --> 0:24:27.080
<v Speaker 1>years how much my job is getting everyone on the

0:24:27.119 --> 0:24:31.240
<v Speaker 1>team to cooperate as effectively as possible. I think everywhere

0:24:31.240 --> 0:24:32.760
<v Speaker 1>I've worked as long as I can remember. Now we've

0:24:32.800 --> 0:24:36.600
<v Speaker 1>read the Patrick Lencioni's Five Dysfunctions of a Team. I'm

0:24:36.640 --> 0:24:39.240
<v Speaker 1>sure you guys David's nodding here on the podcast is

0:24:39.240 --> 0:24:41.320
<v Speaker 1>a book everyone should read. But one of the core

0:24:41.320 --> 0:24:43.280
<v Speaker 1>principles of it is everyone on the team is part

0:24:43.280 --> 0:24:46.679
<v Speaker 1>of that's their first team, like your executive team, is

0:24:46.720 --> 0:24:48.600
<v Speaker 1>one team that runs the company, rather than a group

0:24:48.600 --> 0:24:51.480
<v Speaker 1>of people who run silos. And I have seen in

0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:54.679
<v Speaker 1>my career a lot of teams where the leader thinks

0:24:54.720 --> 0:24:58.240
<v Speaker 1>of the direct reports as sort of extensions of his

0:24:58.359 --> 0:25:02.080
<v Speaker 1>or her greatness other than the team is a unit

0:25:02.280 --> 0:25:06.200
<v Speaker 1>that the CEO or the general manager helps to cooperate,

0:25:06.800 --> 0:25:09.680
<v Speaker 1>and that is It's something I'm it is a constant

0:25:09.680 --> 0:25:11.320
<v Speaker 1>area of development, I think for every leader. But that

0:25:11.440 --> 0:25:13.919
<v Speaker 1>is definitely what's changed for me over the long arc

0:25:14.000 --> 0:25:16.919
<v Speaker 1>of my career is realizing that that's my role. My

0:25:17.040 --> 0:25:19.520
<v Speaker 1>role is to be the My role is to get

0:25:19.560 --> 0:25:21.320
<v Speaker 1>the best. Yeah, I'm the conductor. My role is to

0:25:21.320 --> 0:25:22.399
<v Speaker 1>get the best out of that team.

0:25:22.560 --> 0:25:24.600
<v Speaker 2>Right, you don't make the music, you are the conductor.

0:25:25.480 --> 0:25:28.040
<v Speaker 2>It's you need to have the best cellist and the

0:25:28.040 --> 0:25:31.240
<v Speaker 2>best violinist, and your job is to get them, not

0:25:31.600 --> 0:25:34.200
<v Speaker 2>just to make sure that the company has the best

0:25:34.200 --> 0:25:38.320
<v Speaker 2>of each, but that they obviously make beautiful music together.

0:25:38.760 --> 0:25:41.520
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you nailed the metaphor.

0:25:41.720 --> 0:25:43.440
<v Speaker 1>You may have named the episode. I think we've got it.

0:25:43.440 --> 0:25:54.520
<v Speaker 3>I think we've got it down, all right.

0:25:54.520 --> 0:25:56.960
<v Speaker 1>It's the last one so from you and I have

0:25:57.040 --> 0:25:59.240
<v Speaker 1>talked about this casually a number of times. I think

0:25:59.280 --> 0:26:03.760
<v Speaker 1>every person with a knowledge worker job is talking about

0:26:03.760 --> 0:26:08.600
<v Speaker 1>this these days. So Fatima in Jersey City texted this

0:26:08.640 --> 0:26:11.879
<v Speaker 1>one into us, she said. In a recent Resume Builder survey,

0:26:12.600 --> 0:26:15.680
<v Speaker 1>seventy five percent of companies said that they are mandating

0:26:15.720 --> 0:26:18.240
<v Speaker 1>some form of in office work in twenty twenty four.

0:26:18.720 --> 0:26:20.879
<v Speaker 1>What are your views on remote work and how have

0:26:20.920 --> 0:26:22.720
<v Speaker 1>those views evolved?

0:26:23.600 --> 0:26:26.159
<v Speaker 2>So, look, my own personal view of remote work is

0:26:26.200 --> 0:26:26.800
<v Speaker 2>that I hate it.

0:26:27.320 --> 0:26:28.760
<v Speaker 1>For me, you hate doing it.

0:26:28.880 --> 0:26:32.880
<v Speaker 2>I hate I hate I hate work personally, I don't

0:26:32.960 --> 0:26:36.320
<v Speaker 2>like working remotely, and you're an extrovert. I to be

0:26:36.640 --> 0:26:39.760
<v Speaker 2>good for companies for employees to work remotely. I mean,

0:26:40.119 --> 0:26:44.720
<v Speaker 2>you know, part of what makes any group special, whether

0:26:44.760 --> 0:26:48.119
<v Speaker 2>it's a team or a class or a company, is

0:26:48.800 --> 0:26:53.600
<v Speaker 2>the kind of results from the connectivity that's created by

0:26:54.119 --> 0:26:57.479
<v Speaker 2>people working together, and you know, the better you know people,

0:26:58.040 --> 0:27:02.360
<v Speaker 2>and you know, the more sort of intimate that connectivity is,

0:27:02.800 --> 0:27:06.800
<v Speaker 2>the better the Helpput, there's no question about it. On

0:27:06.880 --> 0:27:10.280
<v Speaker 2>the other hand, you know, I have to recognize that's

0:27:10.280 --> 0:27:13.160
<v Speaker 2>not the world we live in anymore. I think it's

0:27:13.880 --> 0:27:16.680
<v Speaker 2>I think it's you know, regardless of all of the

0:27:16.880 --> 0:27:19.680
<v Speaker 2>sort of movement in favor back to work. My own

0:27:19.720 --> 0:27:21.840
<v Speaker 2>point of view is that we're at the beginning of

0:27:21.880 --> 0:27:26.920
<v Speaker 2>a very long process of fragmentation where because of technology primarily,

0:27:27.320 --> 0:27:29.919
<v Speaker 2>and the lack of friction and the ability of people

0:27:30.000 --> 0:27:33.320
<v Speaker 2>to work together even if it's not ideal, and for

0:27:33.440 --> 0:27:38.080
<v Speaker 2>companies to find the best available talent anywhere. I think

0:27:38.119 --> 0:27:41.040
<v Speaker 2>that we're sort of what's the opposite of what is?

0:27:41.040 --> 0:27:43.800
<v Speaker 2>Is it centripetal or centrifugal. There's like this sort of

0:27:44.240 --> 0:27:46.240
<v Speaker 2>force right that we're all a part of it, like

0:27:46.280 --> 0:27:49.800
<v Speaker 2>the expanding universe as a sort of you know, image,

0:27:49.840 --> 0:27:52.880
<v Speaker 2>It's always in my mind, and so I think that's

0:27:52.920 --> 0:27:55.080
<v Speaker 2>the world we live in, and I just think because

0:27:55.080 --> 0:27:57.159
<v Speaker 2>of that we have to figure it out. I'm a

0:27:57.200 --> 0:28:01.360
<v Speaker 2>little surprised that the technology has been so slow to evolve.

0:28:01.440 --> 0:28:03.640
<v Speaker 1>I mean, still we've gotten two new features on Zoom.

0:28:03.720 --> 0:28:07.359
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly, right, exactly and no, exactly and so no

0:28:07.520 --> 0:28:10.920
<v Speaker 2>new product in Zoom itself hasn't changed that much.

0:28:10.920 --> 0:28:12.240
<v Speaker 1>And well, but this is to your earlier point on

0:28:12.280 --> 0:28:14.920
<v Speaker 1>the network effects, because everybody else I talk to externally

0:28:14.960 --> 0:28:17.199
<v Speaker 1>has Zoom already installed, so to show up with the

0:28:17.200 --> 0:28:20.320
<v Speaker 1>new startup it's too large. Video conferencing software is a

0:28:20.359 --> 0:28:21.280
<v Speaker 1>pain exactly.

0:28:21.440 --> 0:28:24.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, it's you know, teams Microsoft, you think

0:28:24.840 --> 0:28:27.119
<v Speaker 2>would do more, at Google would do more? You know,

0:28:27.280 --> 0:28:30.800
<v Speaker 2>I don't. Again, I don't. I'm not smart enough to

0:28:30.840 --> 0:28:33.360
<v Speaker 2>know what the answer is. But I am surprised that

0:28:34.240 --> 0:28:37.160
<v Speaker 2>none of these there isn't, none of these platforms has

0:28:37.160 --> 0:28:39.960
<v Speaker 2>been able to really change the way we work remotely.

0:28:40.520 --> 0:28:43.120
<v Speaker 2>I think it'll happen. I think that technology will catch up.

0:28:43.640 --> 0:28:47.120
<v Speaker 2>I think our role as managers is to kind of

0:28:47.120 --> 0:28:50.720
<v Speaker 2>supply the non technology parts to this and figure out

0:28:51.040 --> 0:28:56.000
<v Speaker 2>how do we achieve connectivity to complement the technology that

0:28:56.200 --> 0:28:59.080
<v Speaker 2>likely will emerge over time, even if it hasn't yet.

0:28:59.200 --> 0:29:01.560
<v Speaker 2>So the bottom line is, I don't like it. I

0:29:01.600 --> 0:29:06.280
<v Speaker 2>think it erodes what makes companies special and you know

0:29:06.360 --> 0:29:08.200
<v Speaker 2>what provides a lot of this sort of fun and

0:29:08.320 --> 0:29:11.520
<v Speaker 2>joy in life, even for those of us who aren't extroverts.

0:29:12.960 --> 0:29:15.120
<v Speaker 2>But at the same time, it's the world we live in.

0:29:15.200 --> 0:29:16.840
<v Speaker 2>I don't think we're going back to the old one,

0:29:16.920 --> 0:29:18.320
<v Speaker 2>and so we got to figure it out.

0:29:18.480 --> 0:29:21.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, And for our company, we're Arts is a global company,

0:29:22.080 --> 0:29:24.760
<v Speaker 1>and we have business partners in every time zone, and

0:29:24.800 --> 0:29:27.840
<v Speaker 1>we have people and many time zones, and so already

0:29:27.880 --> 0:29:30.160
<v Speaker 1>we had to deal with the challenge of being in

0:29:30.200 --> 0:29:33.440
<v Speaker 1>separate locations, and in hindsight, we didn't deal with it

0:29:33.560 --> 0:29:36.080
<v Speaker 1>very well. I would stand up and do an all

0:29:36.080 --> 0:29:38.360
<v Speaker 1>hands in New York and half the company was there

0:29:38.400 --> 0:29:40.160
<v Speaker 1>in the room and the other half of the company

0:29:40.200 --> 0:29:41.959
<v Speaker 1>was watching on a little window where they didn't They

0:29:41.960 --> 0:29:44.120
<v Speaker 1>felt like they were not a part of it. And

0:29:44.160 --> 0:29:47.840
<v Speaker 1>so now we've augmented our practices so that we do

0:29:48.400 --> 0:29:52.280
<v Speaker 1>we largely come into the office half the time, I'd

0:29:52.320 --> 0:29:54.240
<v Speaker 1>say sort of most of the company, the large cern

0:29:54.280 --> 0:29:56.200
<v Speaker 1>of the company half the time, some of the company

0:29:56.240 --> 0:29:58.600
<v Speaker 1>all the time. It's a mix. But even when we're

0:29:58.600 --> 0:30:02.320
<v Speaker 1>in we do a better job with hybrid or remote

0:30:02.360 --> 0:30:05.200
<v Speaker 1>practices so that everybody feels included.

0:30:05.520 --> 0:30:09.320
<v Speaker 2>And I think this transition that's important. And there are

0:30:09.320 --> 0:30:11.480
<v Speaker 2>many you know, there are many upsides, right, I mean

0:30:12.000 --> 0:30:17.000
<v Speaker 2>finding great talent, in allowing that talent to express itself

0:30:17.000 --> 0:30:21.280
<v Speaker 2>and realize it's potential wherever they are is really powerful, right,

0:30:21.640 --> 0:30:25.160
<v Speaker 2>And so there are many benefits to remote work. But

0:30:25.200 --> 0:30:28.320
<v Speaker 2>at the same time, what I miss the most is

0:30:28.360 --> 0:30:34.040
<v Speaker 2>the sort of serendipitous or unplanned conversations yep, right, and

0:30:34.280 --> 0:30:37.280
<v Speaker 2>just you know, yes, you know, you can invite whoever

0:30:37.320 --> 0:30:38.840
<v Speaker 2>you want to a meeting. The meeting could be run

0:30:39.000 --> 0:30:44.600
<v Speaker 2>efficiently and well. Tools will evolve to improve in you know,

0:30:44.720 --> 0:30:48.200
<v Speaker 2>feelings of inclusiveness and the ability to communicate and so on.

0:30:48.680 --> 0:30:50.560
<v Speaker 2>But what you miss is you know, the meeting's over

0:30:51.160 --> 0:30:54.959
<v Speaker 2>and somebody walks in early for their next meeting, and

0:30:55.600 --> 0:30:57.760
<v Speaker 2>you talk to somebody you wouldn't have talked to otherwise, right,

0:30:57.800 --> 0:30:59.960
<v Speaker 2>And so if you don't plan it, it doesn't have

0:31:00.040 --> 0:31:01.960
<v Speaker 2>happened in this world, and I think we lose a

0:31:01.960 --> 0:31:02.400
<v Speaker 2>lot from that.

0:31:02.600 --> 0:31:04.760
<v Speaker 1>I'm now stacking up my calendar for the in persons

0:31:05.080 --> 0:31:07.600
<v Speaker 1>certain days a week, and then the video conferences certain

0:31:07.680 --> 0:31:09.520
<v Speaker 1>days a week, and it's it's starting to click in.

0:31:09.600 --> 0:31:12.360
<v Speaker 1>But who could have imagined five years ago?

0:31:12.560 --> 0:31:14.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I will say one other thing on this, which

0:31:14.440 --> 0:31:16.840
<v Speaker 2>is the part of all this That is most amazing

0:31:16.840 --> 0:31:19.560
<v Speaker 2>to me is that, you know, whatever it was on

0:31:19.720 --> 0:31:23.200
<v Speaker 2>you know, March ninth, tenth, eleventh of two, that twenty twenty.

0:31:23.600 --> 0:31:27.280
<v Speaker 2>You know, there's no way that anyone could have imagined,

0:31:28.440 --> 0:31:30.760
<v Speaker 2>you know, the world that we're in today, and yet

0:31:30.840 --> 0:31:33.360
<v Speaker 2>it happened overnight, and now that we're in it, it's

0:31:33.400 --> 0:31:36.360
<v Speaker 2>difficult to remember what it was like before. It's just

0:31:36.720 --> 0:31:41.040
<v Speaker 2>the sort of adaptivity and the plasticity of the human

0:31:41.280 --> 0:31:43.800
<v Speaker 2>mind is really just kind of awesome.

0:31:43.960 --> 0:31:45.400
<v Speaker 1>Whatever we do now, that's what we do.

0:31:45.440 --> 0:31:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly, And it's sort of like you assimilate to

0:31:47.680 --> 0:31:50.680
<v Speaker 2>this new reality. And then again, not only is it

0:31:50.720 --> 0:31:53.400
<v Speaker 2>impossible to imagine going back to the old one, but

0:31:53.800 --> 0:31:55.600
<v Speaker 2>it's hard for many of us to even remember what

0:31:55.640 --> 0:31:56.120
<v Speaker 2>it was like.

0:31:56.320 --> 0:31:59.960
<v Speaker 1>Right, So, what will be that thing in five years?

0:32:00.080 --> 0:32:02.920
<v Speaker 1>So tune back in. We'll we'll know soon enough. We'll

0:32:02.960 --> 0:32:05.920
<v Speaker 1>know soon enough. David, this was super fun. Thanks for

0:32:06.080 --> 0:32:09.120
<v Speaker 1>common entity, sharing your wisdom, and it's always a pleasure.

0:32:08.880 --> 0:32:10.520
<v Speaker 2>To see you man Likewise, thanks for having me.

0:32:16.920 --> 0:32:19.560
<v Speaker 1>Well, my friends. Today we talked with someone who's been

0:32:19.600 --> 0:32:24.640
<v Speaker 1>a pioneer in multiple industries and with tremendous success, and

0:32:24.680 --> 0:32:28.360
<v Speaker 1>one of the things that I really appreciate about David

0:32:28.480 --> 0:32:33.920
<v Speaker 1>is how interesting and interested, how curious he is across

0:32:33.960 --> 0:32:39.120
<v Speaker 1>disciplines and across industries. And because David, I think, has

0:32:39.840 --> 0:32:44.959
<v Speaker 1>has worked across a number of different formats, he brings

0:32:45.000 --> 0:32:50.480
<v Speaker 1>that energy of he brings that approach of asking first

0:32:50.480 --> 0:32:55.040
<v Speaker 1>principles questions about the business that he's building and about

0:32:55.040 --> 0:32:58.640
<v Speaker 1>the industry he's trying to improve. And anytime we've talked

0:32:58.640 --> 0:33:05.840
<v Speaker 1>to an interesting entrepreneur, a successful executive on this podcast

0:33:06.000 --> 0:33:09.160
<v Speaker 1>who's done big things in her or his career, it's

0:33:09.200 --> 0:33:12.760
<v Speaker 1>been by looking at their business, at their industry, at

0:33:12.800 --> 0:33:16.880
<v Speaker 1>the needs of their consumers from a different angle, from

0:33:16.880 --> 0:33:20.640
<v Speaker 1>an angle of first principles, rather than saying, how do

0:33:20.680 --> 0:33:22.320
<v Speaker 1>we usually do it? Here? Can I do it just

0:33:22.520 --> 0:33:23.440
<v Speaker 1>a little bit better?

0:33:23.600 --> 0:33:24.720
<v Speaker 3>Let's you go about your.

0:33:24.600 --> 0:33:27.560
<v Speaker 1>Week this week, I'd encourage you to look for the

0:33:27.560 --> 0:33:30.920
<v Speaker 1>opportunities to take a first principle's approach to your problems,

0:33:31.640 --> 0:33:35.760
<v Speaker 1>to take a first principle's approach to better serving your customers,

0:33:35.760 --> 0:33:38.520
<v Speaker 1>to being a better teammate, to scaling up your business.

0:33:39.080 --> 0:33:41.200
<v Speaker 1>Assume that there's a different and a better way, And

0:33:41.240 --> 0:33:44.400
<v Speaker 1>the more curious you are in more aspects of your vertical,

0:33:44.440 --> 0:33:47.440
<v Speaker 1>but also others. The better job you'll do, that's a gang.

0:33:47.440 --> 0:33:50.120
<v Speaker 1>We've got some amazing guests coming up the next few weeks,

0:33:50.600 --> 0:33:54.080
<v Speaker 1>including a CEO who's helping to cure cancer. Text or

0:33:54.080 --> 0:33:56.160
<v Speaker 1>call in your questions at two point three four one

0:33:56.360 --> 0:33:58.640
<v Speaker 1>nine oh five nine six, or just hit me up

0:33:58.680 --> 0:34:02.080
<v Speaker 1>on LinkedIn Instagram. It's set up at Mike Steibe. I

0:34:02.120 --> 0:34:05.320
<v Speaker 1>want to thank David and of course Jen, Meg, Jada,

0:34:05.400 --> 0:34:07.080
<v Speaker 1>Matt and the whole team at Blue Duck Media for

0:34:07.120 --> 0:34:11.280
<v Speaker 1>pulling this all together, Dylan and Sasha Gay and Nathan

0:34:11.320 --> 0:34:14.840
<v Speaker 1>and Christine at iHeart Ben and the team at William

0:34:14.880 --> 0:34:17.560
<v Speaker 1>Morris Endeavor for all their support, and of course Byheed

0:34:17.600 --> 0:34:20.520
<v Speaker 1>here in the studio on the ones and twos. Office

0:34:20.520 --> 0:34:22.880
<v Speaker 1>Hours is a production of Blue Duck Media and distributed

0:34:22.920 --> 0:34:26.480
<v Speaker 1>by iHeartRadio. Thanks for tuning in again this week. Everybody,

0:34:26.640 --> 0:34:27.840
<v Speaker 1>make sure you stay on your grind