1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 3 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our super producer, 4 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:37,160 Speaker 1: Max Magnavox, Williams. 5 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 2: Boop Max, the expeditioner, Williams thirty three. 6 00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: I believe under his belt. 7 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 3: I think he's the thirty third one. That's true. 8 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: That is mister Noel Brown. They called me Ben Bullen, 9 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 1: and we are unrepentant, unapologetic fans of video games, so 10 00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 1: much so that you can hear our obsession come through 11 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:06,119 Speaker 1: in casual conversation on air. You can also see video 12 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 1: game episodes that we have done on various shows in 13 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:12,800 Speaker 1: the past, like Stuff of Genius, What was the first 14 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 1: video game And of course the legendary podcast project by 15 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,320 Speaker 1: the Williams Brothers Ephemeral. 16 00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, what a classic, already a classic, a 17 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 2: gem of the podcast world. 18 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 3: Guys. 19 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:26,240 Speaker 2: I have been deep in video game nerd dem over 20 00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 2: the past week because a friend of the show, friend 21 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 2: of mine, one of my oldest friends and friend of yours, 22 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:35,319 Speaker 2: Ben Peyton, was visiting from New York and he is 23 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:39,759 Speaker 2: a fellow video game nerd, and he helped me buff 24 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 2: the heck out of two characters in two different games 25 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 2: of mine that I had spect way way way wonkily. 26 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 2: One was Monster Hunter Wild's, which I really love, and 27 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 2: the other was Elden Ring, where I never finished the 28 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 2: dang game. I got stuck and it was apparently because 29 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 2: I was doing a faith based build. Then I had 30 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 2: intelligence way maxed out and it didn't make any sense 31 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:02,400 Speaker 2: of the weapons I had. Some of that stuff is 32 00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 2: even too nerdy for me, but not for dear Peyton, 33 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:06,960 Speaker 2: and he helped me. And now I'm rocking it in 34 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 2: Volcano manner Baby. 35 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: Nice, nice, congratulations man. I think I've mentioned this on 36 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: maybe off air, but maybe on air for stuff they 37 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. I will play just comfort 38 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 1: food video games when I'm doing QA, stuff that I 39 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:26,519 Speaker 1: can play on mute. And I have been putting off 40 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:31,240 Speaker 1: finishing one, a wonderful little game called Ghost of Yo Tie, 41 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 1: a little game. 42 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 3: You said I heard it was massive. How I described that. 43 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 1: Well, I kept putting it off, you guys. And there is, 44 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 1: without spoiling it, there is. It's very cinematic storytelling kind 45 00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 1: of open world stuff. And there is this happens in 46 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 1: so many of these kinds of games where you get 47 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:56,079 Speaker 1: to a point in the game where it tells you 48 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 1: are you sure you want to continue because you can't 49 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:02,679 Speaker 1: go back until this mission is completed and ever since then, 50 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:06,119 Speaker 1: I would look at our queue of qa's that I'm 51 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 1: saying q because that's one of Max's weird words. Uh. 52 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,639 Speaker 1: I would look at our queue of qa's to conduct 53 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 1: to make sure we have our bleeps and bloops in 54 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:17,639 Speaker 1: the right place, and I would go, let me just 55 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 1: keep doing side missions. 56 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 2: I do it all the time, guys, Like I'm doing 57 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,640 Speaker 2: that right now in Borderlands. I'm about to get to 58 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 2: the Timekeepers layer, but rather than going there, I'm just 59 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 2: doing all the little you know, homework assignments from the 60 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 2: mission posts where you basically go grab a gem and 61 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:42,040 Speaker 2: then running around and dodge you know, rippers and robots 62 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:44,240 Speaker 2: and stuff. But I think I'm I think I'm about 63 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 2: ready to rip off the band aid and the scent. 64 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 3: It can be. 65 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: It can be bittersweet. 66 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 4: Man. 67 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 1: My guy in Yo Tai has killed every possible person 68 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: with a bounty, as as all the little fox charms 69 00:03:59,320 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 1: and got really the sumi e. Anyway, we are saying 70 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 1: that to prove our, if not our bona fides, to 71 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 1: prove our enthusiasm for all things video game. 72 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 3: Went also to show how far things have come. 73 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean these games are wild, man, They're huge. 74 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 2: The graphics have gotten to the point where it looks 75 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:24,000 Speaker 2: like a movie sometimes, especially in the cutscenes, and just 76 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: the depth and attention to detail is staggering. 77 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 3: Truly is. 78 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 2: And I think it's evidence too by some of the 79 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:34,360 Speaker 2: excellent video game screen adaptations that we're seeing things like 80 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 2: Fallout and The Last of Us. Like, games truly have 81 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 2: become a cinematic art form, I think more and so 82 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 2: now than ever, But they sure had some humble beginnings. 83 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 3: Speaking of bleeps and bloops. 84 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, I consider video games a proper and legitimate form 85 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: of literature at this point, you know. And we owe 86 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:02,039 Speaker 1: this all to the to the humble beginnings, to the 87 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 1: legendary games and creators of consoles who came before. So 88 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:11,360 Speaker 1: this is going to be our two part series on 89 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: a little thing called Atari. I don't know if you 90 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 1: guys have ever been lucky enough to have the experience 91 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:29,239 Speaker 1: of of like seeing an actual Magnavaux Odyssey or playing 92 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 1: an Atari. 93 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 3: It was weird. 94 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: It was such a nostalgia rush. 95 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:36,359 Speaker 2: There's a really cool toy museum that I think we 96 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:39,480 Speaker 2: went two together ben in Austin, Texas, and they have 97 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 2: a lot of the Mega drives and all these old 98 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,159 Speaker 2: school machines you know, on display, you know, the museum style. 99 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 2: But then they also have a little corner in the 100 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 2: back where you can play weird old PC games. They've 101 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 2: got like an old you know, spect out old PC 102 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 2: back there and some of these systems. So that's really 103 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 2: the only experience I've had with it. I was a 104 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:01,840 Speaker 2: Nintendo baby. That was what was out the Christmas, the 105 00:06:01,839 --> 00:06:04,480 Speaker 2: first Christmas I remember a video game existing. 106 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: I remember playing Super Mario one with my dad, and 107 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:14,520 Speaker 1: we both didn't know that fireballs were unlimited once you 108 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:16,920 Speaker 1: got the flower. We thought you might like run out 109 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 1: after three or ten, which made us play the game 110 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 1: on an entirely different level of difficulty. 111 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 4: You're playing like a Dark Souls game. 112 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:27,160 Speaker 2: Yes, I distinctly remember when I first played a video game. 113 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 2: I would jerk the controller left and right physically with 114 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,040 Speaker 2: my arms because that was just the intuitive thing that 115 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,160 Speaker 2: I felt, and I'll never forget that. I must have 116 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:37,599 Speaker 2: been like, you know, six years old, and I was 117 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 2: just that was what my mind wanted my arms. 118 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 3: Today, I still do that need to some people do 119 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 3: when they play. 120 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 2: For the people who were inexperienced, you'll see land them 121 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 2: a controller and they'll want. 122 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 3: To do the same thing. 123 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:48,839 Speaker 1: So some people do it when they're driving. 124 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 4: Uh yeah, I've been playing near Tamata. I finally picked 125 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 4: that one up. And when you're in intense fight scenes, 126 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 4: I have noticed that I moved way too much and 127 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 4: it does nothing. 128 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 1: Well, it helps you. You know, who are we to judge. 129 00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 1: I'm a big I'm guilty of doing the stand up 130 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 1: and walk around while thing, especially if it's really intense. 131 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 2: We well, not for nothing that the switch startup screen 132 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 2: warns you to fix the little loop around your wrists 133 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 2: in case you fling the damn thing through a plate 134 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 2: glass window. You know, wait, the switch too, it's got 135 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 2: you know that you can remove the controllers. 136 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 3: That still does sort of a kind of things. And 137 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 3: they do have these little wrist. 138 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 2: Straps, and I guess it's more to cover their butts 139 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 2: use someone does something dumb. 140 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:36,480 Speaker 3: But I always crack up when I see that. 141 00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: And this is one of our favorite times of the week. Folks, 142 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: when we get to hang together and record one of 143 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 1: our favorite shows, Ridiculous History. Our research associate for this 144 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: series is none other than Magnavox Williams himself. 145 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:51,560 Speaker 3: Magnific Max. 146 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, so thank you, Max. And what we're seeing here 147 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: is a lot of video game journalism and a lot 148 00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 1: of video game historians share similar experiences to what we 149 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 1: just described. You know about Nintendo, you know about Sega. 150 00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 1: If you were a rich kid, you might have had 151 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: a neo geo no offense, and of course PlayStation. But 152 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 1: there's one word term concept that has sort of dominated 153 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: the history of video games, and that is none other 154 00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: than atari. 155 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 2: And I gotta say before digging into this excellent research 156 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,720 Speaker 2: brief courtesy of Magnavox Max, I didn't know the origin 157 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:32,560 Speaker 2: of that word. And we're going to get into that 158 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 2: and it's it's pretty clever actually. So let us set 159 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 2: our minds back to nineteen hundred and sixty nine, in 160 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 2: the earliest days of Atari, before it was when it 161 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 2: was just you know, a glimmer in the eye of 162 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:51,080 Speaker 2: two guys, Nolan Bushnell and Ted Dabney, who met in 163 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,160 Speaker 2: nineteen sixty nine when they were working for another really 164 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 2: cool company called Ampex in Redwood City, California, and just 165 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 2: to have an audio nerd moment for a second, Ampas 166 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:05,239 Speaker 2: makes has made tape, magnetic tape and reel to reel machines, 167 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 2: and now there are really cool plug in versions of 168 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 2: Ampex tape machines that sort of emulate the different types 169 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 2: of magnetic tape and the different speeds that the reels 170 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,439 Speaker 2: would run at. So Ampex looms large in the world 171 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:19,960 Speaker 2: of pro audio even to this day. 172 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: And these guys, Nolan Bushnell and Ted Dabney, we're following 173 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:30,079 Speaker 1: up on an obsession that Bushnell had had ever since 174 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: his college days as an electrical engineering student in Utah. 175 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 1: This is also coming to us, by the way, courtesy 176 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 1: of great work by Keza MacDonald at IGN dag Spicer 177 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:46,079 Speaker 1: for the Computer History Museum and of course Jamie Lindino 178 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: for PC mac all right, so Bushnell, he's fascinated, you 179 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 1: guys with one of the very first video games, something 180 00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 1: called Space War. 181 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 2: That was an MIT thing, right, didn't that like run 182 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 2: in a lab basically a MIT and P would pop 183 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:02,319 Speaker 2: through to play it and it was about the only 184 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:03,559 Speaker 2: way you could get your hands on it. 185 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 3: It was a huge. 186 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:09,040 Speaker 1: Computer at MIT and that came to us courtesy of 187 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:12,840 Speaker 1: a professor Steve Russell and two of his students. And 188 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:16,760 Speaker 1: this is nineteen sixty two, so very early days. Bushall 189 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:19,800 Speaker 1: would grab one of his frat bros. And instead of 190 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: you know, going out and raising caine and drinking cheap beer, 191 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:25,839 Speaker 1: they would sneak into the Computer. 192 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:29,280 Speaker 2: Labs engineering frat bros Duda party, I guess space. 193 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, no, maybe they had beer while they were doing that. Yeah, 194 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:33,719 Speaker 1: we don't know, we don't know. 195 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:36,880 Speaker 4: They definitely had beer, as we'll get to later to 196 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:37,319 Speaker 4: the story. 197 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 2: Oh that's right, the Lucy goosey office policies of the 198 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:44,960 Speaker 2: Atari company. Whenever we talk about this era of computing, 199 00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: and I'm probably a broken record at this point, but 200 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 2: I always have to recommend the excellent AMC show Halt 201 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 2: and Catch Fire, which is about like the earliest days 202 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 2: of you know, Texas Instruments and what led to the 203 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:03,079 Speaker 2: personal computer. Somewhat fictionalized for sure, but it has to 204 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 2: do with the Silicon Prairie, which was where Texas Instruments 205 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,440 Speaker 2: was created, and then some folks that start get their 206 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 2: start there end up migrating to Silicon Valley and kind 207 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 2: of making that what it is, but excellent needle Drops, 208 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 2: just a fabulous show about the earliest days of computer nerdery. 209 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: And Bushnell was definitely Here's why we want to spend 210 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: some time on his college education because Bushnell was definitely 211 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:30,240 Speaker 1: in the right place at the right time. This is 212 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:36,160 Speaker 1: a very new, nascent, emergent industry. Computer graphics, like the 213 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 1: idea of computer graphics are invented at his alma mater 214 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,960 Speaker 1: at the University of Utah in the nineteen sixties by 215 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:47,199 Speaker 1: a guy named Ivan Sutherland, a pioneer of computer science. 216 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: And if you looked around the world of academia and 217 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 1: Ivory Towers at the time, the University of Utah was 218 00:11:56,000 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 1: one of the primo spots to learn about computer They 219 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: had cutting edge equipment for their era. 220 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 2: State of the art, which by today's standards would probably 221 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 2: be laughable, and you could probably do the same level 222 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 2: of programming on a smart fridge. Today you hear about 223 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:17,079 Speaker 2: people putting doom on smart fridges and stuff like that. 224 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 2: You know, unlike a frickin' what do you call it, 225 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:22,280 Speaker 2: a tamagotchi. It's just it's incredible how much things have 226 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 2: shrunken down in terms of physical size, and just the 227 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,359 Speaker 2: amount of power you can pack into the smallest spaces. 228 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 1: One hundred percent. Yeah, So the stuff that was state 229 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: of the art in the early nineteen sixties, if you 230 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 1: looked at it now, it'd be more like an artistic statement, 231 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:41,760 Speaker 1: but it's it's powerful history. So Space War, one of 232 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 1: the earliest video games, our buddy Bushnell is one of, 233 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 1: is in rarefied air. He's one of the very few 234 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,200 Speaker 1: individuals who can play these kind of games on campus computers. 235 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 1: And at the same time, there's something, there's some parallel 236 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: experiences that inform his career. For sure. 237 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 2: We're talking about the arcade, and when we think of 238 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:06,040 Speaker 2: an arcade today, we think of, you know, that little 239 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: cove at your local mall, especially growing up that had 240 00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 2: like arcade cabinets. The first time I ever saw a 241 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:14,880 Speaker 2: game like Mortal Kombat was at my local mall. 242 00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 3: Arcade. 243 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 1: A game that has four different players, like teenage Routing, 244 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:24,319 Speaker 1: Ninja Turtles X Men had more than four. Those were 245 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: those were great ways to bond with your friends. And 246 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 1: I got to tell you the I can't wait till 247 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,079 Speaker 1: we all go to Japan with each other because the 248 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: arcades there, the arcade culture is very much alive, and 249 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 1: they took what was happening in the United States and 250 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:41,599 Speaker 1: just went hollwild with it. 251 00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 2: For sure, we're super lucky here in Atlanta to have 252 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 2: some pretty incredible Japanese inspired arcades, I believe. At Perimeter Mall, 253 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:54,199 Speaker 2: there's a place that does all these gotchapong machines, and 254 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 2: then they have like all the crazy Japanese rhythm games. 255 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:01,080 Speaker 2: And then at another mall, Comelin Mall, there's a place 256 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:06,319 Speaker 2: called Round One that is incredibly heavy on the Japanese 257 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 2: arcade machine fighters and rhythm game stuff that you would 258 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 2: really only typically see at a con or something or 259 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 2: you know, in Japan. To your point, but bush Nell 260 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 2: is doing a little summer job situation, or maybe a 261 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 2: holiday job, make a little extra money at an arcade 262 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 2: at the time, and we're seeing mainly pinball machines. In 263 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 2: the early days of arcades, bing bing bang bang bong 264 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:33,520 Speaker 2: coin operated pinball machines, and the early days of that 265 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 2: are very beautifully portrayed in the film Licorice Pizza from 266 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,640 Speaker 2: Paul Thomas Sanderson. So just do check that one out 267 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 2: too if you want to get a glimpse into this 268 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,040 Speaker 2: period in time. They were as we said, coin operated 269 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 2: entertainment halls, similar to slot machines or pachinko parlors you 270 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 2: might see over in Japan, games of chance, ways to 271 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:56,720 Speaker 2: win prizes, things like that. 272 00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: And so bush Nell looks around at this, and so 273 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 1: as huh, I wonder if I can combine these two 274 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:10,400 Speaker 1: ideas of computer games and arcades places where people would 275 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:14,360 Speaker 1: gather for recreation. And so he essentially he's coming up 276 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: with this concept of the classic nineteen eighties arcade. Now 277 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 1: you have game cabinets that take a quarter or what 278 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:26,040 Speaker 1: have you, places where the parents can drop the teens 279 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: off all Saturday, you know, and give them a little 280 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: pocket money for the food court. This concept of the 281 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: halcyon days of arcade halls. It probably would have happened 282 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: independently at some point, but the way history shakes out, 283 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:49,440 Speaker 1: it happens because of Bushnell and Atari, and it takes 284 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 1: a while to get there though, because these guys are 285 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:58,040 Speaker 1: him and his associate Ted Dabney. They're making the first 286 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 1: version of this stuff. The guys who say, let's take 287 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: some of these cool computer games that have been hidden 288 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:11,480 Speaker 1: in universities, let's monetize them, let's make them operate based 289 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 1: on coin insertion, and let's make a company that sells 290 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:19,800 Speaker 1: this idea. Now, the etymology may be weird, but the 291 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 1: name of the name of the company that they started 292 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 1: working for when they were envisioning this idea, we don't 293 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 1: know the etymology too well, but it is called Nutting Associates. 294 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 2: Ha ha he he hah, not to be confused with 295 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 2: Coming Georgia, which we love to talk about. The game 296 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 2: that they started was called Computer Space. This was their 297 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 2: first time obviously there still heavily influenced by Space War. 298 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 2: So they work on this game called Computer Space that's 299 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 2: released in nineteen seventy one. It didn't exactly set the 300 00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 2: world on fire and was viewed as something of a 301 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:06,920 Speaker 2: failure by the brass over at Nutting, but it was 302 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 2: a pretty big swing and it still sold fifteen hundred 303 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 2: units and made Bushnell and Dabney Bushnell rather and Dabney 304 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 2: enough cash to kind of go out on their own 305 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 2: and start their own company focusing on coin operated electronic games. 306 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: And it's really cool that they got a slice of 307 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:29,159 Speaker 1: the pie from those sales and that R and D 308 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: because that doesn't always happen in tech companies. 309 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,560 Speaker 2: As we know, so out of thievery and tech and 310 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 2: back in these days too, you know, industrial espionage things 311 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 2: like that I've often talked about. It's a different world, 312 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:47,120 Speaker 2: but similar development process electronic instruments, like by Japanese companies 313 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 2: like Roland. They would cover up the proprietary components on 314 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:56,240 Speaker 2: the circuit boards inside of these things with like different 315 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 2: material so that if anyone were to snap a picture 316 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 2: of the circuit board, they couldn't see the layout of 317 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 2: these like chips that would make the sounds that the 318 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 2: role in said JUNO one, O six would make. And 319 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,320 Speaker 2: also down the line led to some some flaws because 320 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,119 Speaker 2: these coatings would build up moisture underneath, et cetera. But 321 00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 2: they were doing it for real reasons, which was just 322 00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 2: a real cutthroat kind of space race space war for sure. 323 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:26,440 Speaker 1: And we also we also see, you know, across various industries, 324 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 1: we see that employees, often very brilliant talented employees might 325 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 1: not get their work recognized, right. They just get their salary, 326 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,919 Speaker 1: but they don't get a share of the profits from 327 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:44,800 Speaker 1: their amazing ideas. So good on you Nutting for paying 328 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:48,840 Speaker 1: these guys out a little bit extra. They got enough money, 329 00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 1: as we said, to create their own company that they 330 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: originally were going to call Sizogy, which is a real word. 331 00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,639 Speaker 1: It's spelled s yz y g y. 332 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:00,680 Speaker 3: Great word. 333 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 2: It can be a thing referring to alignment between celestial 334 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:07,119 Speaker 2: bodies in opposition, or if you wanted to make a 335 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:11,240 Speaker 2: little more broad, just a pair of connected or corresponding things. 336 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, and it turns out that they would have to 337 00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: change the name. They founded it in nineteen seventy one, 338 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,080 Speaker 1: but then they learned the name was already in use 339 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,960 Speaker 1: out there in California, so they changed the name of 340 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: their company to Atari Incorporated in nineteen seventy two. And 341 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:37,080 Speaker 1: I think we're all very interested in the etymology here 342 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 1: because that is a Japanese word that is used when 343 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,720 Speaker 1: we're talking about the Chinese game Go. Have you guys 344 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:45,399 Speaker 1: ever played Go? 345 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:48,119 Speaker 3: I haven't. My first exposure to it was. 346 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:51,200 Speaker 2: In the movie Pi, And I know that it is 347 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 2: beloved by a lot of computer programmer types and you know, 348 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 2: any other enthusiasts of these types of strategy games. 349 00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 3: But it does have a I think there's. 350 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,520 Speaker 2: Like an unlimited number of moves or it's some kind 351 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:05,360 Speaker 2: of like insane number of combinations of moves and that's 352 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:09,000 Speaker 2: what it's known for. So you can really easily see 353 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:11,119 Speaker 2: how someone that was interested in that board game might 354 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:12,639 Speaker 2: be able to parlay that. 355 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:14,880 Speaker 3: Kind of stuff into a video game. 356 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:18,920 Speaker 1: It's so it's so hard, man, especially when you're playing 357 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:22,159 Speaker 1: with someone who is very familiar with the game or 358 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: invested in it. I always enjoy playing Go, and I 359 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 1: don't think I will ever win against someone who knows 360 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:30,400 Speaker 1: what they're doing. 361 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 2: I've never even attempted it. It just seems a little 362 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:34,879 Speaker 2: over above my pay grade. But I'm fascinated by the 363 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:38,120 Speaker 2: culture surrounding it is. It is widely known as being 364 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 2: a game for brainy types. 365 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 1: So this is okay. So Chinese game Japanese word or 366 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:53,680 Speaker 1: taru taru a taru literally meaning to hit a target ataru, 367 00:20:54,119 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 1: And in this context, the name Atari means something kind 368 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 1: of like I'm about to win clever. Yeah, like a check, right, 369 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:08,680 Speaker 1: like a pre a pre winning declaration. Yes, yeah, like 370 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 1: check and chess. And this is I think it's a 371 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 1: really smart name because it is aspirational too. It's telling 372 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:19,560 Speaker 1: you that you by played an Atari game or yourself 373 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:20,360 Speaker 1: about to win. 374 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:23,919 Speaker 2: It's also good branding because some other options that they 375 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 2: were considering were SENTI sente and Hane, which to me 376 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,640 Speaker 2: on paper would not be immediately clear how to pronounce, 377 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 2: whereas Atari is clear, instantly snappy, and it just I 378 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:36,399 Speaker 2: don't know, it has a nice ring to it. 379 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, Hani, I appreciate that point. This occurred to me 380 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:45,119 Speaker 1: as well. Hotta would be off putting to American consumers. 381 00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:46,360 Speaker 3: Now pronounce it hain. 382 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: Everybody would pronounced like hey because Haynes was a thing. 383 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:55,080 Speaker 1: They would be like video game underwear. So another cool 384 00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 1: thing that Atari had going for them was better technology. Dabney, 385 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: the co founder we mentioned earlier, he invented the early 386 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:08,280 Speaker 1: tech that allowed dots to move on a screen without 387 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: having a room sized computer powering them. 388 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:16,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think we're talking about early versions of microprocessors 389 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 2: and integrated circuits. I think that's kind of Again, I'm 390 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 2: not an expert, but I'm fascinated by this stuff. So 391 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 2: it was called the spot motion circuit, And to your pointment, 392 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:27,920 Speaker 2: at allowed a dot to move up and down, left 393 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,840 Speaker 2: and right on a screen two dimensional space. 394 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 3: And it was very different from the Megamegamega Lab. 395 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:40,000 Speaker 2: You know bound computers that powered space war. Yeah, these 396 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 2: were still quite large though. We were talking about the 397 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:44,520 Speaker 2: early days of arcade cabinets. 398 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:50,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, these are still big, like refrigerator sized pieces of 399 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 1: furniture that can play a game with you, and like 400 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: the later smart fridges. 401 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:55,640 Speaker 3: Isn't it funny? 402 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:55,919 Speaker 1: How now? 403 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 2: Our buddy Matt Frederick from Stuff That I Want You 404 00:22:57,840 --> 00:22:59,879 Speaker 2: to Know has one of these, but they have the 405 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,160 Speaker 2: like sort of nostalgia arcade machines that just look big 406 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 2: on the outside, but inside it's probably all in a 407 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 2: raspberry pie or something like that, like a freaking pinky sized, 408 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:10,399 Speaker 2: you know device. 409 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 1: That's how my emulator is too. It's a I bought 410 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:18,639 Speaker 1: the not the nostalgia one, but the paired down in 411 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 1: form factor pared down console thing like. 412 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:22,439 Speaker 3: A desktop size, right. 413 00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: It looks tight. It looks like the size of a 414 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: small hard drive, I know drive. 415 00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:28,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, which are cool. 416 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, mascot one that straight up sits on the ground 417 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,879 Speaker 2: and looks like it's really really has a lot of 418 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,480 Speaker 2: great fighting games, has insane has like every game on it, 419 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:38,360 Speaker 2: like everyone you could possibly imagine. 420 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:40,200 Speaker 3: So at this point. 421 00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 2: In nineteen seventy two, bush Now went to a demo 422 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 2: of the first ever home video game console to Max's nickname, 423 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:55,520 Speaker 2: the Magna Vox Odyssey, which was a little very seventies 424 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:56,840 Speaker 2: looking brown. 425 00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 3: And based plastic box. 426 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, this thing, it reminds me of wood grain, 427 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 1: but that's just because of the time, which senties very like. 428 00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, it looks like like wood paneling you'd see in 429 00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:11,360 Speaker 2: seventies homes and kitchens. 430 00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:14,920 Speaker 1: You know, we're gonna sit on the papa sad and play. Magnavox. 431 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:16,320 Speaker 1: Might make it to the waterbed. 432 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:19,680 Speaker 3: Yep, yep, curl our toes in the shag carpets. 433 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:26,080 Speaker 1: I love it. Please check out our episode on Stuff 434 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:29,960 Speaker 1: of Genius for more about the Magnavox Odyssey. This thing 435 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:34,239 Speaker 1: did something amazing as an at home console. You were 436 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 1: able to play different games, multiple different games. Now they 437 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 1: were all silence, but you would see things like table 438 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,879 Speaker 1: tennis that probably looks familiar to a lot of people. 439 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: And the Magnavox was pretty successful. It sold around three 440 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 1: hundred and thirty thousand units across North America and Europe 441 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,120 Speaker 1: when it was released. 442 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,720 Speaker 2: For sure, And while it did allow you to play 443 00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,480 Speaker 2: different games, they were, like you said, silent bend games, 444 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:04,480 Speaker 2: including the delightfully charmingly named table tennis or Tennis for two. 445 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:06,560 Speaker 2: Maybe that's different. I think this one was just called 446 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:08,920 Speaker 2: table tennis. We didn't mention Tennis for two. That comes 447 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:11,960 Speaker 2: into Nope, that was the very very very early game. 448 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 2: Tennis for two is in nineteen fifty eight. 449 00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:14,680 Speaker 3: Insane. 450 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 2: Anyway, this machine was limited to what it had inside 451 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 2: of it, like these were hard programmed little carture games. 452 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 3: There were no cartriges yet at this point. 453 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 1: Yes, and there had been those games we mentioned previously, 454 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,240 Speaker 1: Tennis for two and fifty eight, Space War and sixty two, 455 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: and then there have been more commercial games like Computer 456 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:41,639 Speaker 1: Space of course. But the mythical force, the behemoth that 457 00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 1: was to change video games forever, is coming on to 458 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 1: the stage. 459 00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:50,399 Speaker 3: It is Paula No, no, no, no. Oh man, what 460 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,200 Speaker 3: a banger that is. And again it's so quite looking 461 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 3: back on it. 462 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:56,640 Speaker 2: You got these little little white bars on either side 463 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 2: of the screen, and then the little dots that were 464 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 2: able to move up, down, left and right, and it 465 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 2: was all just based on you know, what's the word 466 00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:08,200 Speaker 2: I'm looking for, the trajectory, you know, like physics, kind 467 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,640 Speaker 2: of the most basic of physics, Like the ball would bounce, 468 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 2: you'd move the paddle so it would bounce and then 469 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:14,640 Speaker 2: catch it on the other side. 470 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 1: I love it. There's a live action. That's a weird 471 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:19,600 Speaker 1: way to say it, but there's a live action pulling 472 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: machine that's actually quite popular in Japanese arcades. 473 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,359 Speaker 3: It's the only cattles stand by that sounds intense. How 474 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:27,399 Speaker 3: does that work? It's like literally cool. It's like a 475 00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 3: ball and paddles. 476 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,800 Speaker 1: It's like it's like tron kind of. It's similar to 477 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: air hockey, but there's no hockey. It's all magnet magnetized stuff. 478 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 3: So is it vertical though, or is it like. 479 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,160 Speaker 1: No, it's horizontal. I got you, gott and so you've 480 00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:47,240 Speaker 1: got your little your uh, you've got your little line 481 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,359 Speaker 1: that functions as your paddle, and there's a square that 482 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 1: looks like a live action pixel and it boops and 483 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: bops around and it gets really intense. 484 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:58,280 Speaker 3: I bet yeah. It also reminds me. 485 00:26:58,320 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 2: I mean, it's it's it's not the same, but it's 486 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 2: level similarity to fostball. 487 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:07,439 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, especially with the fact 488 00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 1: that it can be so weirdly competitive. 489 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 2: Guys, I'm just gonna put out right now, we're about 490 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 2: to do a few episodes on the history of kind 491 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 2: of interesting niche sports, and I put forth that we 492 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 2: should maybe add to that down the line and do 493 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 2: one on. 494 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:23,240 Speaker 3: The history of foosball for sure. 495 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I had early ones were hand carved, and 496 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 2: I would love to hear more about them. 497 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:30,119 Speaker 1: All right, let's put on the list. I'm also glad 498 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 1: that those real life Pong machines in Japan are located 499 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:39,320 Speaker 1: in arcades not in bars, because just like foosball plus 500 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,320 Speaker 1: a couple of beers with the buddies, that stuff could 501 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: get intense. 502 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 3: You know, can ever? 503 00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 1: Yeah? 504 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, So Pong was the very first release of this 505 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 2: new company Atari. Yeah, yeah, and it is the first 506 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 2: project of the company. 507 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:00,200 Speaker 1: There's another guy we need to introduce also of a 508 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:06,359 Speaker 1: former Ampex employee, Al Alcorn, cool name Al Already Ampex 509 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:10,920 Speaker 1: is a big name in audio and video recording. This 510 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 1: gives Alcorn the background he needs, the training he needs 511 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: to design the game called Pong, and when he starts, 512 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:23,520 Speaker 1: there are no microprocessors at this time, so he builds 513 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:29,440 Speaker 1: Pong using analog circuitry and very very few people knew 514 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:34,480 Speaker 1: how to design in this new field we're calling digital video. 515 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,320 Speaker 1: So the first prototype for Pong is a wooden cube 516 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 1: covered with yes fox wood grain as screen, two knobs, 517 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 1: and then a coinbox because they're not given up on 518 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 1: the coin idea. 519 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 3: Mm hm, whipping got no gas tank, but it's still 520 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 3: got wood grain. It's true. 521 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,560 Speaker 2: And this is coming from Dag Spicer over at the 522 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 2: Computer History Museum. So let's get down to the display. 523 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 2: We know what the device looks like, but you know, 524 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 2: there weren't like LCD monitors at this point. What are 525 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,520 Speaker 2: we talking here? How would you how would you make 526 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 2: you know, turn those bits into into video. 527 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a good question. Well, it depends on how 528 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:16,040 Speaker 1: much money you're willing to spend at the TV store. 529 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,160 Speaker 3: I guess we're talking about prototype stuff at this point, right, right. 530 00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,600 Speaker 1: Right, So Al is not shelling out for the top 531 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:25,360 Speaker 1: of the line boob Tube. Instead, they buy a cheap 532 00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 1: twelve inch black and white TV set from just a 533 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 1: store up the way, and they use that in place 534 00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,440 Speaker 1: of a standalone display because the standalone display is kind 535 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 1: of expensive at the time, and this is a prototype, right, 536 00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,440 Speaker 1: we just want to prove that it works, then we 537 00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 1: can worry about making it sexy. 538 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,880 Speaker 2: So they have their sort of makeshift headquarters at a 539 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 2: tavern called Andy Caps, which is I believe that was 540 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 2: isn't that guy the guy that has the hot Fries. Yes, 541 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:00,280 Speaker 2: he's a He's also like a you know, A when 542 00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:04,760 Speaker 2: he comic strip fell. This is in Sunnyvale, which I 543 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:09,720 Speaker 2: believe is a suburb of San Francisco. Bushnell's got pals there. 544 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 2: They set it up there as sort of a testing ground, 545 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:13,479 Speaker 2: and it gets pretty popular. 546 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like his his cheers, his local. It's where 547 00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 1: he goes to unlined after work. So of course he 548 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 1: has friends there and he knows management. And a few 549 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:29,800 Speaker 1: days after they install the machine, they realize that it 550 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: is stopped working. This is not uncommon with prototypes. But 551 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: when Al comes in to the bar to check out 552 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 1: what's going on, he says, oh, wait, PAUNG hasn't failed. 553 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,760 Speaker 1: It's just entirely choked up with quarters. 554 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 3: They gorged with coins. 555 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 1: So many people are playing this game that it can't 556 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 1: accept any more quarters, so it's not going to work. 557 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:55,640 Speaker 3: We got to envy out the coin box. 558 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,640 Speaker 2: This is good data, man, because it really proves to 559 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 2: them that this thing might have some legs and the 560 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,160 Speaker 2: ability to be rolled out to a much larger audience. 561 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:11,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. And Bushnell is having one of those watershed moments 562 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 1: because his dreams are being proving correct, right and he says, 563 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,080 Speaker 1: this could be much bigger than just a corner at 564 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,760 Speaker 1: old Andy Capps. We had already noted that the magne 565 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:27,000 Speaker 1: Vox Odyssey likely inspired Bushnell and co. To create polng 566 00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 1: in the first place. And this also was wetting the 567 00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:35,440 Speaker 1: appetite of the consumer market because more and more people 568 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: were familiar with the idea of at home video games. 569 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:44,400 Speaker 1: And this makes Bushnell think, wait, we can wake way 570 00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:48,800 Speaker 1: more money selling directly to somebody's house than we can 571 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,040 Speaker 1: just putting a machine in a bar and waiting for 572 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:52,080 Speaker 1: quarters to roll in. 573 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 2: Right, they're already jumping ahead to the next phase, not 574 00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:57,480 Speaker 2: just like rolling these things out as arcade machines and 575 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,600 Speaker 2: some of those arcades of bush youth. 576 00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:02,640 Speaker 3: Let's just put it right in folks living rooms. 577 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:08,080 Speaker 1: Absolutely, and this is a this is a pretty aggressive 578 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 1: demand to lay on our pal al So we're saying, Okay, 579 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:16,600 Speaker 1: you already did a great job making this thing and 580 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 1: getting the form factor smaller than we could have imagined. Kudos, 581 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: Tally Ho. I need you to make it even smaller 582 00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 1: so we can sell it to kids at home. This 583 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,400 Speaker 1: is where Alkhorn creates kind of a video game Avengers 584 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:34,840 Speaker 1: or Justice League, a hit spot a team in Grass Valley, 585 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:39,080 Speaker 1: which is out in California's historic Gold Country, and they say, okay, 586 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:42,800 Speaker 1: we're as a team. We're going to figure out how 587 00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:48,520 Speaker 1: to implement a custom integrated circuit that allows us to 588 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: hack the economy of scale so we can produce Pong 589 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 1: at a massive level and keep the price competitive, because 590 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:58,480 Speaker 1: you know, it doesn't matter how good it is if 591 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:00,160 Speaker 1: people can't afford to pay for. 592 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 2: It, right, exactly. Those are the ones that you mentioned 593 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 2: that only like the doctor's kids had in your neighborhood. 594 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 1: So why are they in Gold Country. They're doing this 595 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,080 Speaker 1: because they want to get away from the hubbub and 596 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:17,160 Speaker 1: distraction of Atari's main production facilities in Silicon Valley, which 597 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 1: are already you know, cranking out arcade machines. 598 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:23,080 Speaker 2: Right, So from this more solitary kind of atmosphere, they 599 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 2: brought in a few new faces, Bob Brown and Harold Lee, 600 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 2: who were some engineers whose task was to fit this 601 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,720 Speaker 2: entire game onto a single chip. 602 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:35,200 Speaker 3: This is a taller. 603 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's tall milkshake to sip for sure, and they 604 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:44,239 Speaker 1: are able to figure this out. Spoiler right, anybody who 605 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,240 Speaker 1: lives in twenty twenty six knows this. But there is 606 00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 1: an endearing and inspiring startup energy cinematic story to it 607 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: because the wiring is done by Al's wife, Katie. It's 608 00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:59,120 Speaker 1: like a family affair, which I find so endearing. 609 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:01,080 Speaker 2: And this is why keep bringing up Halt and Catch 610 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 2: Fire because it really shows this kind of early punk 611 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,920 Speaker 2: rock spirit of like the earliest computer makers and you know, 612 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,760 Speaker 2: folks doing things in their garage. And I can't recommend 613 00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,920 Speaker 2: that show enough because every time I hear about someone's 614 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 2: wife doing a thing like in the bedroom or whatever, 615 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:17,879 Speaker 2: the using the space and the materials they had, that's 616 00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:22,080 Speaker 2: what my mind jumps to. So this product was able 617 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:25,359 Speaker 2: to be built, and it was an instant success when 618 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:29,840 Speaker 2: the massive retailer Sears decided to take. 619 00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:31,719 Speaker 3: It on as an item that they would. 620 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,919 Speaker 2: Have for So check out our Seiers episode by the way, folks, Yeah, 621 00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,160 Speaker 2: instant houses, well not instant, but you know catalog. 622 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:39,280 Speaker 1: Houses, mail order houses. 623 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:42,640 Speaker 2: Yet you know william s Burrow's house he passed away 624 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,480 Speaker 2: a while ago, but his state manager, whose name is 625 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,879 Speaker 2: escaping me, just passed away last week. And this house 626 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,680 Speaker 2: that this guy maintained william S Burrow's final residence was 627 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:53,600 Speaker 2: in fact a Sears catalog house. 628 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 1: Oh, nice, nice, I believe my parents first house was 629 00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:57,920 Speaker 1: a Sears catalog. 630 00:34:58,560 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 3: That's cool. 631 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:00,440 Speaker 1: Did they I'll have it. 632 00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:06,360 Speaker 3: No, they sold it in the nineties, nineteen nineties, just 633 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:07,040 Speaker 3: to verify it. 634 00:35:07,120 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: Now we know that this can be the deciding factor 635 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,440 Speaker 1: for any startup company's success when a larger company offers 636 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 1: you visibility, promotion, and distribution. So Sears, you know they're 637 00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 1: a big dog. They're not ordering Atari products one at 638 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:28,279 Speaker 1: a time. They order two hundred thousand units as their 639 00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: very first individual order. This is a huge challenge for 640 00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:35,880 Speaker 1: this up and comer Atari because now they have to 641 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:40,120 Speaker 1: make two hundred thousand units in time for the nineteen 642 00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:43,880 Speaker 1: seventy five Christmas season. So they rush to find extra 643 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 1: assembly buildings. They're hiring staff left and right. They do 644 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,040 Speaker 1: get it over the finish line. They make this Sears 645 00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 1: Pong game. It's rebranded as Telgames. Get it like television games, 646 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,200 Speaker 1: and it becomes you know, it's like the Elmo back 647 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,080 Speaker 1: in the day. It's the Muscow Christmas gift t. 648 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 2: HI jingle all the way. Indeed, Yeah, good problem to have, 649 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 2: but certainly required some what they call in the games 650 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 2: industry today crunch. But things aren't all, you know, sunshine 651 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,360 Speaker 2: and daffodils. For the Atari company, they run into pretty 652 00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 2: quickly some legal hurdles. 653 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is not all trumpets and angel farts for 654 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:29,360 Speaker 1: these guys. It's nineteen seventy four and the creator of 655 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 1: the Magnavox Odyssey, Ralph Behar says to his employers. He says, Look, 656 00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 1: these guys are ripping us off with this Atari malarkey, 657 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:44,279 Speaker 1: Atari malarkey. We've got to sue them. And this Bushnell 658 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:49,000 Speaker 1: guy has copied the idea for Paul from entirely from 659 00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:52,360 Speaker 1: that demo of table tennis that he saw in nineteen 660 00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:55,840 Speaker 1: seventy two. We can prove it because he signed the 661 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:56,840 Speaker 1: guest book. 662 00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,360 Speaker 2: Not entirely untrue. But then the question becomes about like 663 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:02,880 Speaker 2: where is the novelty? 664 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:03,960 Speaker 3: You know what I mean? 665 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 2: Like, just because you made a game that mimics a 666 00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:11,440 Speaker 2: sport that already exists, that means no one else can 667 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:13,719 Speaker 2: ever do that again. And then it becomes sort of 668 00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:15,439 Speaker 2: a matter for the courts to the side. 669 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,680 Speaker 1: Just because someone else made a hat, does that mean 670 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:22,080 Speaker 1: no one else could have a hat? Just because somebody 671 00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:24,920 Speaker 1: else played a song on a guitar, does that mean 672 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:27,640 Speaker 1: guitar music is banned for everybody else. 673 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:30,640 Speaker 2: Well, and oftentimes exactly ben And oftentimes, in these types 674 00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,240 Speaker 2: of cases, rather than roll the dice with a trial, 675 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,680 Speaker 2: settlement is recommended as the best option. And that's what happens. 676 00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,720 Speaker 2: Bushnell and Ntari, you know, armed with some successful sales 677 00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 2: and probably a pretty decent legal team, settled out of 678 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,960 Speaker 2: court for around four hundred grand, between four hundred grand 679 00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:49,760 Speaker 2: reportedly and a million bucks. 680 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,879 Speaker 1: That's right, folks. In the US justice system, at least, 681 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,520 Speaker 1: settling out of court is incredibly common. And one of 682 00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:03,680 Speaker 1: the things that some parties like about settling out of 683 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,520 Speaker 1: court is you don't always have to disclose the financial 684 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:11,680 Speaker 1: amount of the settlement or admit wrongdoing or admit wrongdoing. 685 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:16,239 Speaker 1: So we know that Bushnell and Atari eventually settle. We 686 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,759 Speaker 1: don't know the exact sum that they settled for, but 687 00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:23,879 Speaker 1: it did result in them becoming an official licensee for Magnevox, 688 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: and this is good for Atari. It's expensive, but it's 689 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:30,840 Speaker 1: a good way to write the ship because now they 690 00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:35,120 Speaker 1: can continue selling games that may be seen as infringing 691 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,160 Speaker 1: upon Magnevox's patent, which is pretty broad. And this is 692 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,920 Speaker 1: something we still see in the world of tech today, 693 00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 1: like what can and cannot be patented like clicking with 694 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:46,080 Speaker 1: a mouse. 695 00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:50,280 Speaker 2: Right, or podcasts, you know, publishing, you know, serialized audio 696 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:51,720 Speaker 2: content on a feed. 697 00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:53,759 Speaker 3: We know where that one went. 698 00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 2: But there was a time in the early days where 699 00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:58,759 Speaker 2: we were around where there are these patent trolls who 700 00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,120 Speaker 2: were literally trying to sue certain podcasts over the use 701 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:03,240 Speaker 2: of this concept. 702 00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:04,120 Speaker 3: Did jump in here. 703 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 4: This is actually a big problem with video games, which 704 00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:11,759 Speaker 4: a certain very famous video game made by Nintendo and 705 00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:14,840 Speaker 4: Game Freak is suing another game called Pow World right 706 00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:18,680 Speaker 4: now for pen and breach basically saying you cannot catch 707 00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 4: creatures and balls that we own that well, that we 708 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:22,760 Speaker 4: own that mechanic. 709 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,640 Speaker 1: Let's see in this this is a weird sticky thing. 710 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:30,960 Speaker 1: Check out our series on IP and trademarks and patents 711 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:34,120 Speaker 1: as well all the related Gobbly gook there and him 712 00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:38,560 Speaker 1: Biddy hooplah. Well, we know the Magdavox patent. It seems 713 00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:41,279 Speaker 1: really broad today, but it's because they were first to 714 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,319 Speaker 1: market in a new field. Their patent at the time 715 00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:50,400 Speaker 1: covered any television game that could be controlled by a player. 716 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:52,480 Speaker 3: That's super broad. 717 00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 2: Also, if you're interested in that kind of stuff, check 718 00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 2: out our episode on Apple records versus Apple Computers. 719 00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:04,520 Speaker 1: So Magnavox now becomes something like a patent troll themselves. 720 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:07,880 Speaker 1: They are putting in huge amounts of blood, sweat, and 721 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:12,239 Speaker 1: treasure into tracking down and legally prosecuting people that they 722 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:13,960 Speaker 1: think are infringing their patent. 723 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,200 Speaker 2: But Atari seems to have wiggled their way out of 724 00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:20,000 Speaker 2: this and they're able to sort of stay the course 725 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:23,440 Speaker 2: and continue forward and developing new things because they're no 726 00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:27,000 Speaker 2: longer having to worry about Magnavox going after them because 727 00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:30,120 Speaker 2: they're license at this point and Magnevox is too busy 728 00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:31,160 Speaker 2: going after everybody else. 729 00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:34,279 Speaker 1: Yeah, and it turns out, you know, a lot of 730 00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:37,800 Speaker 1: historians will say that Atari probably would have won the 731 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,880 Speaker 1: case if it went to court, but they're going to 732 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:43,560 Speaker 1: argue this settlement turned out to be a better play 733 00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:47,160 Speaker 1: in the long run because now Atari doesn't have to 734 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:52,280 Speaker 1: wage all those legal battles. Magnavox is giving blood dry excellent, 735 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,800 Speaker 1: and they're like functioning as a shield for Atari. 736 00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:59,680 Speaker 3: Yet going after all all the little guys. 737 00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: For sure, after all, the chihuah was right. So this is, 738 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:09,319 Speaker 1: as we said, a two part series. We're gonna spend 739 00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:11,560 Speaker 1: the week on Atari because we love it and there's 740 00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,799 Speaker 1: a lot of ridiculous history to it already. We can't 741 00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,279 Speaker 1: wait for you to join us later in the week 742 00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:21,239 Speaker 1: for Atari Part two. In the meantime, thanks for our 743 00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,719 Speaker 1: super producer and research associate for this episode, mister Max 744 00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:25,920 Speaker 1: Magnavox Williams. 745 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:29,560 Speaker 2: Huge thanks to Alex Williams for composing this bang and 746 00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,600 Speaker 2: bop of a theme that you hear between your ears 747 00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:33,800 Speaker 2: this very moment. 748 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:37,719 Speaker 3: Christopher rasiotis an Jeff Kobe here in spirit mm hm. 749 00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:42,200 Speaker 1: And a half hearted threat of legal action to our 750 00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:45,160 Speaker 1: good friend Jonathan Strickland aka the Quizter. 751 00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:47,480 Speaker 3: Litigation is always on the table with that guy. 752 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:51,000 Speaker 1: You just can't You never know where he's gonna move next. 753 00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:52,720 Speaker 1: You know what I mean, he's tricksy. 754 00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:53,799 Speaker 3: Nope, you sure don't. 755 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:56,279 Speaker 2: Hey, j Mohammad Jacobs the Puzzler and you know. 756 00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:58,760 Speaker 3: The second one to Jonathan Strickland, the Quizzer. 757 00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:04,120 Speaker 1: I reckon Rachel Big Spinach Lance, that's doctor Rachel Big 758 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,800 Speaker 1: Spinach Lance. The rood Dude's a ridiculous crime. If you 759 00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 1: dig us, you'll love them. And Noel, this is a 760 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:12,000 Speaker 1: fun one, man. I'm looking forward to Part two. 761 00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,080 Speaker 3: Ah, same We'll see you next time, folks. 762 00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:24,840 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 763 00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:27,040 Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.