1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,279 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,720 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,080 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V. Wilson and I'm Holly Fry. In our 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:21,279 Speaker 1: recent episode on the Coconut Grove fire, we mentioned that 5 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 1: blood banking was really a brand new innovation when the 6 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: fire happened, and that you could expect an episode on 7 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:33,520 Speaker 1: that which was at that moment in the works. That's 8 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 1: what we are talking about today, and we're going to 9 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,640 Speaker 1: focus on one particular person who was a big part 10 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,520 Speaker 1: of the development of blood banks. That was Dr Charles Drew. 11 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: His friend and colleague William Montague Cobb, who we covered 12 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 1: on the podcast in February, described Dr Drew as quote 13 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: one of the most constructively active figures in the medical profession. 14 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: Charles Richard Drew was born in Washington, d c. On 15 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,040 Speaker 1: June third, nine four. He was the oldest child of 16 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:11,040 Speaker 1: Richard and Nora Burrow Drew. Richard Drew was a carpet layer, 17 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: and he was the only black member of the otherwise 18 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 1: whites only Carpet, Linoleum and Soft Tile Layers Union, also 19 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,800 Speaker 1: serving as the financial secretary of the union's DC local. 20 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: Nora had a teaching degree from Howard University, and she 21 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: did some volunteer work, but was primarily a full time 22 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 1: wife and mother. Charles went by Charlie and his younger 23 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: siblings were Joseph, Elsie, Nora, and Eva. The Drews were 24 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,920 Speaker 1: really close knit, middle class family. They were members of 25 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: nineteen Street Baptist Church and the children attended Washington, d c. 26 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 1: Segregated schools for black children. They also had access to 27 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:53,160 Speaker 1: a segregated swimming pool where Charlie learned to swim and 28 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: quickly proved that he was a talented athlete. He earned 29 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 1: his first swimming medal at the age of eight. Charlie 30 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: was also described as clever, hardworking, and reliable. He started 31 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: selling newspapers to earn extra money at the age of twelve, 32 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 1: and he quickly developed this into a whole enterprise in 33 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: which he managed six other newspaper boys, like William Montague 34 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: Cob Charlie attended Paul Lawrence Dunbar High School. Dunbar was 35 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: the first public high school for black students in the US, 36 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: and it had become one of the best college preparatory 37 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: schools in the country. But Charlie's best performance at Dunbar 38 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 1: was As an athlete. He lettered in four sports, and 39 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: in his junior and senior years he was awarded the 40 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:44,279 Speaker 1: James E. Walker Memorial Medal for all around athletic performance. 41 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 1: Charlie also served as captain of the high school Cadet Corps, 42 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 1: and he was very well liked among his peers. In 43 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:56,120 Speaker 1: the yearbook, they named him best Athlete, most popular student, 44 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: and student who has done the most for the school. 45 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:04,640 Speaker 1: After graduating from Dunbar, both Charles Drew and William Montague 46 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: Cob went to Amherst College in Massachusetts. Many Dunbar graduates 47 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 1: went on to college there, and most of Amherst Black 48 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: students had graduated from Dunbar. When Drew and Cobb were there, 49 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 1: the college had about six hundred students, and thirteen of 50 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 1: them were black. Drew hoped to become an engineer, even 51 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: though at this point there were almost no black engineers 52 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 1: in the United States. Drew continued to truly excel as 53 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: an athlete while at Amherst, but he and his black 54 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 1: teammates also faced discrimination, both at Amherst and while on 55 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: the road for games. This included everything from being denied 56 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 1: seating at restaurants to being targeted and harassed by players 57 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: on opposing teams, and based on his athletic performance, Drew 58 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 1: should have been named captain of both the football and 59 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: track teams his senior year, but a white player was 60 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: elected captain of the football team instead. The same thing 61 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 1: had happened on both the cross country and track teams 62 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 1: when Drew was a junior, so this definitely looked like 63 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 1: a pattern of racism. Drew seems to have tried to 64 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:18,599 Speaker 1: avoid controversy, supporting the elected captain and later being unanimously 65 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 1: elected captain of the track team. He earned multiple medals 66 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: and awards for his athletic performance during his time at Amherst, 67 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 1: including the Howard Hill Mossman Trophy, which went to the 68 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: student who had brought the greatest honor to athletics during 69 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:36,720 Speaker 1: their time at the college. Drew also had some experiences 70 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 1: while at Amherst that shifted his focus from engineering some medicine. 71 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 1: He had never been a particularly exceptional student. William Montague 72 00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 1: Cobb described him as never earning a grade above a sea, 73 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 1: but biology professor Otto Glazer got him interested in science. 74 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 1: Drew also had a sports injury that required surgery and 75 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: that led him to start thinking about medicine and surgery 76 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 1: as a field, and in May of nineteen twenty, his sister, 77 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,720 Speaker 1: Elsie died. In a med school application, he wrote, quote, 78 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 1: my first real urgent desire to study medicine came when 79 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 1: my sister died with an attack of influenza. In the 80 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:21,279 Speaker 1: great epidemic here in nineteen twenty. No one seemed to 81 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: be able to stop it, and people died by the 82 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 1: hundreds every week. I have studied the sciences diligently since 83 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 1: that time, so this would have been at the very 84 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:33,919 Speaker 1: very end of the nineteen eighteen flu pandemic, and it 85 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: really illustrates how even though we usually talk about that 86 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:41,200 Speaker 1: pandemic in terms of nineteen eighteen and nineteen nineteen, there 87 00:05:41,240 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 1: were still significant outbreaks happening into nineteen twenty, and the 88 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: people living through it felt like this was all part 89 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: of one pandemic. It was all part of the same thing. 90 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: I can't imagine what that's like. Charles True graduated from 91 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:58,680 Speaker 1: Amherst College in nineteen twenty six, but he didn't have 92 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,920 Speaker 1: money for medical school. He got a job at Morgan 93 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: College in Baltimore, Maryland, where he was athletic director and 94 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: instructor of biology and chemistry. Much as he had excelled 95 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 1: as an athlete, he excelled as a coach, and he 96 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 1: was credited with really turning around some of the school's teams, 97 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:19,919 Speaker 1: especially in football and basketball. Yeah, this is all he 98 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: He applied all of this to his later work in medicines, 99 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:26,480 Speaker 1: the things he had learned as an athlete and as 100 00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 1: a coach. After saving money for two years, Drew thought 101 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: he was financially ready for medical school, but actually finding 102 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 1: a medical school to go to was a challenge. Most 103 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: medical schools at this point did not accept black students 104 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 1: at all, or if they did, they only accepted a 105 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 1: very limited number. This was also in the post Flexner 106 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 1: Report era. We did an episode about the flex Inner 107 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 1: Report on the show in July of This was a 108 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:01,000 Speaker 1: report on the state of medical education in the United States, 109 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 1: and its author, Abraham Flexner, described most of the medical 110 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: schools for black students as subpar. In the wake of 111 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: this report, every black medical school that Flexner had described 112 00:07:14,160 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: as lacking closed, So when Drew started applying to medical 113 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:24,360 Speaker 1: school in there were only two schools for black students left. 114 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: They were a Harry Medical College in Nashville, Tennessee, and 115 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 1: Howard University College of Medicine in Washington, d C. Drew 116 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 1: applied at Howard and at Harvard Medical School, which, unlike 117 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: most of the rest of Harvard, is in Boston rather 118 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: than Cambridge. Harvard had admitted its first black students in 119 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 1: eighteen fifty, but its medical students were still overwhelmingly white. 120 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 1: He was accepted at Harvard, although he had submitted his 121 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 1: application late and was asked to defer his enrollment by 122 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 1: a year because the incoming class was already full, But 123 00:07:56,720 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: his application at Howard was denied on the grounds that 124 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: he did have enough credits in English. Howard instead offered 125 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 1: him a faculty position as a coach, which Drew found 126 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 1: incredibly frustrating. It seemed bizarre that the school thought his 127 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 1: English education was good enough to teach, but not to 128 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: be a student. I admit that does seem very strange. 129 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: Drew didn't want to wait another year to start medical school, 130 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 1: so rather than going to Harvard, he made one more application. 131 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 1: That was to McGill University College of Medicine in Montreal, Canada, 132 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 1: which was racially integrated and had a reputation for being 133 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 1: at least somewhat more welcoming to black students. We will 134 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: get to his time in Montreal and what happened after 135 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 1: that after we take a quick sponsor break. At McGill 136 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 1: University College of Medicine, Charles Drew made a name for 137 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:03,880 Speaker 1: himself as both a students and an athlete. He became 138 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:07,520 Speaker 1: captain of the track team and was the champion in hurdles, 139 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:10,679 Speaker 1: the high jump, and the broad jump. He was also 140 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:14,840 Speaker 1: inducted into the Alpha Omega Alpha Medical Honor Society, and 141 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 1: he took first prize at an annual competition in neuro anatomy. 142 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,880 Speaker 1: In his final year, he was awarded the Williams Prize, 143 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:26,600 Speaker 1: which was based on a competitive exam. At the same time, 144 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 1: these were difficult years, especially financially. The university was in 145 00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:34,600 Speaker 1: an expensive area, so his housing and dated a living 146 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 1: expenses were well beyond what he was used to. The 147 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 1: Great Depression started about a year after he enrolled, which 148 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 1: made things harder. He almost ran out of money with 149 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 1: only a year left to go, but then he was 150 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:51,400 Speaker 1: awarded a one thousand dollar Rosenwald Fellowship. Without that he 151 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:55,440 Speaker 1: probably would have had to drop out. Drew graduated second 152 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: in his class in nine three with a Doctor of Medicine, 153 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 1: and Master of Surgery degree. From there, he spent two 154 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:06,080 Speaker 1: years at Montreal General Hospital, first as an intern and 155 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: then as a resident and internal medicine. While he was there, 156 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:13,000 Speaker 1: he worked with a bacteriology professor John Beatty on the 157 00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: human body's fluid balance and ways to use fluids to 158 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 1: treat shock. During Drew's residency, several patients were badly burned 159 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,520 Speaker 1: during a fire at the hospital. Drew was one of 160 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: the doctors on duty, and during the crisis he used 161 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:32,440 Speaker 1: transfusions to treat multiple patients for shock. This may have 162 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 1: been an inspiration for his later work on blood banking. 163 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: Not much was known about how to safely store blood 164 00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: for later use, and many transfusions involved a human donor 165 00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:46,479 Speaker 1: in the room with the patient connected arm to arm. 166 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 1: It was clear that medical facilities needed better ways to 167 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:52,760 Speaker 1: store things like blood and plasma. You know, we'll be 168 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:57,080 Speaker 1: talking a bit more about the state of transfusion history 169 00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 1: and just a little bit. In December of nineteen thirty four, 170 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: as he was finishing his residency in Montreal, Drew started 171 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:09,320 Speaker 1: trying to find a surgical residency in the United States, 172 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 1: specifically at the Mayo Clinic, but his application was denied 173 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: At this point, most black doctors did their residencies at 174 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 1: one of six black hospitals, but there were almost no 175 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: residency opportunities for black doctors and specialties like surgery. Like 176 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 1: most of the people who are doing residencies are doing 177 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 1: internal medicine, general medicine, family practice type of work. Even 178 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:39,319 Speaker 1: if a predominantly white medical school did accept black students, 179 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: the affiliated teaching hospitals often did not allow black people 180 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: in roles that involved patient care. They were basically prioritizing 181 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: the feelings of racist doctors and patients who might not 182 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:55,079 Speaker 1: want to work with a black person. In the face 183 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 1: of all of this, Drew wrote a letter to William Montayucab, 184 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 1: who was working at Howard, asking what the setup was 185 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: like at the university. In spite of Howard having previously 186 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 1: rejected his med school application, Drew thought there might be 187 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 1: some way to continue his training there. Just after this, 188 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: Drew also needed to return to Washington, d C. For 189 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: personal reasons. His father died in January of nineteen thirty five, 190 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 1: and his family needed his help. Beyond needing to be 191 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,040 Speaker 1: back in Washington, d C. It turned out that this 192 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:28,720 Speaker 1: was the right time for Drew to take another look 193 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: at Howard. Howard University was established in eighteen sixty seven, 194 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: and it's College of Medicine had its first classes a 195 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:41,640 Speaker 1: year later. Although Howard is a historically black university, its founder, 196 00:12:41,640 --> 00:12:45,120 Speaker 1: Oliver Otis Howard, was white, and for decades after it 197 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:50,079 Speaker 1: was established, the faculty and the administration were also overwhelmingly white. 198 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:54,560 Speaker 1: That started to change in the nineteen twenties. Mordechai Johnson 199 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 1: became Howard's first black president, and the university started actively 200 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:02,560 Speaker 1: trying to recruit black professors and to generally improve the 201 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:06,320 Speaker 1: quality of all of its departments and schools. When it 202 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: came to the School of Medicine, this was tricky. Howard 203 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,000 Speaker 1: had been training black doctors for decades, but almost none 204 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: of them had any opportunity for specialized training or advanced 205 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 1: postgraduate education in medicine. That meant that graduates from the 206 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: medical school were qualified to practice medicine, but not necessarily 207 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: to teach, especially to teach any kind of medical specialty. 208 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:33,200 Speaker 1: Changing that pattern meant recruiting black doctors and helping them 209 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 1: continue their education, with the goal that they would then 210 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 1: become part of the faculty at Howard. This also came 211 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:42,439 Speaker 1: up in our episode on William Montague Cobb, who went 212 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 1: on to advance study in anatomy and physical anthropology. As 213 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:49,600 Speaker 1: part of this same effort, Drew wrote a letter to 214 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 1: one of his old coaches at Dunbar High about this 215 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 1: and about the opportunity he was now seeing. Quote seventy 216 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 1: years there has been a Howard med School, but there 217 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,520 Speaker 1: is still no tradition. No able surgeon has ever been 218 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:07,559 Speaker 1: trained there, No school of thought has been born there. 219 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,439 Speaker 1: Few of their stars have ever hit the headlines in 220 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: American surgery. There are no Negro representatives in so far 221 00:14:16,280 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 1: as the men who count now. All Negro doctors are 222 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 1: just country practitioners, capable of sitting with the poor and 223 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 1: the sick of their race, but not given to too 224 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: much intellectual activity, and not particularly interested in advancing medicine. 225 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 1: This attitude I should like to change. It should be 226 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:41,400 Speaker 1: great sport. Drew took a position at Howard University College 227 00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: of Medicine and became chief resident at Freedman's Hospital. In 228 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 1: that same year, Edward Lee Howse was hired as chief 229 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: of Surgery. House was white, but his hiring was part 230 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 1: of a five year plan in which he would run 231 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 1: the surgical program while a black surgeon was trained as 232 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:02,080 Speaker 1: his successor. Funding for this came from a grant from 233 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:07,080 Speaker 1: the Rockefeller Foundation. Soon Charles Drew was pursuing a doctorate 234 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 1: of medical science at Columbia University and a fellowship at 235 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: Presbyterian Hospital. Drew was Columbia's first black resident, and Presbyterian 236 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: Hospital had been established to serve quote the poor of 237 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 1: New York without regard to race, creed, or color. But 238 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 1: even so, everybody at the university and the hospital seemed 239 00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:30,760 Speaker 1: to assume that Drew was going to be working in 240 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 1: a lab, not with patients. This included surgical department head 241 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 1: Alan O. Whipple, whose name you might recognize if you've 242 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:44,240 Speaker 1: ever had particular surgeries or watched medical TV shows. So 243 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: at first, Drew worked mainly with Assistant Professor of Clinical Surgery, 244 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 1: John Scudder, whose team was working on research related to 245 00:15:52,840 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: the body's fluid, balanced blood chemistry and blood transfusions. So 246 00:15:57,240 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 1: this did build on some of Drew's earlier work with 247 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:03,280 Speaker 1: John Beaty at McGill, and it included trying to develop 248 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: blood tests to detect signs of shock. Scudder was immediately 249 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:11,000 Speaker 1: impressed by Drew, and as Drew gained his support. He 250 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: eventually got Whipple to let him move into patient care 251 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 1: as well. A lot of the credit for this goes 252 00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: to Drew's knowledge, skill, dedication, and personality. He had always 253 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,720 Speaker 1: been extremely well liked anywhere he had studied and worked. 254 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 1: Colleagues described him as lighting up everyone around him when 255 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: he arrived on the ward, even if that was at 256 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,080 Speaker 1: two a m. But there's also some speculation that his 257 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 1: approval to do patient care was also tied to his appearance. 258 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 1: Drew and his family all had very light skin, so 259 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 1: patients might think he was white. Drew apparently mentioned his 260 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:50,520 Speaker 1: race when introducing himself to people because it was important 261 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: to him that they knew that he was black. I'm 262 00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 1: really curious about exactly what that introduction sounded like like 263 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 1: that that aspect of it wasn't mentioned in the in 264 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:06,560 Speaker 1: the biography that made that note, but I wonder. A 265 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 1: big part of Drew's work continued to be related to 266 00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:13,320 Speaker 1: blood and plasma transfusions. So we've talked a little bit 267 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:16,159 Speaker 1: about the history of blood transfusions on the show before, 268 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 1: including in a two parter on Jean Baptiste Deny that 269 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:23,919 Speaker 1: came out in January of one Denise work took place 270 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:27,919 Speaker 1: in the seventeenth century, and it involved transfusions from animals 271 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: to humans. The first human to human blood transfusions took 272 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:35,400 Speaker 1: place about a hundred and fifty years later. American physician 273 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 1: Philip seeing Physics reportedly performed one in seventeen, but didn't 274 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:44,920 Speaker 1: publish on his work. James Blundell successfully performed a human 275 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:49,400 Speaker 1: to human transfusion on a patient who was experiencing postpartum bleeding, 276 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: and that one was documented in eighteen eighteen. These first 277 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:58,240 Speaker 1: transfusions saved the lives of some patients, but others experienced 278 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 1: severe reactions, and it first actors didn't know the cause. 279 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,399 Speaker 1: In the early twentieth century, Carl Landsteiner made a series 280 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:07,960 Speaker 1: of discoveries that came to be known as the A 281 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:11,479 Speaker 1: BO blood types, which come from antigens in a person's 282 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 1: red blood cells. Making sure that both the donor and 283 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: the recipient had the same blood type prevented most of 284 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: these reactions, although aspects of this were yet to be discovered. 285 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 1: Land Steiner was awarded the Nobel Prize in Medicine for this. 286 00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 1: In n blood coagulates very quickly after being removed from 287 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:35,520 Speaker 1: the body, so the first blood transfusions went directly from 288 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:39,560 Speaker 1: one person's body into another's, either by drawing the donor's 289 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 1: blood into a surrender and injecting it into the recipient 290 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 1: right away, or by connecting each of them to an 291 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: apparatus that carried the blood through tubes from the donor 292 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:53,840 Speaker 1: to the recipient. So instead of blood banks, at first, 293 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 1: hospitals maintained lists of people who were willing to be 294 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:02,159 Speaker 1: contacted on short notice to come in and donate blood 295 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 1: when it was needed. My grandfather was one of these 296 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 1: people because he had OH negative blood. In nineteen fourteen, 297 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: researchers discovered that sodium citrate could be used as an anticoagulant, 298 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 1: but most transfusions continued to be direct transfusions, with the 299 00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:20,920 Speaker 1: donor and recipient being in the room together, because even 300 00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 1: if the blood wasn't coagulating, it still broke down very quickly. 301 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,359 Speaker 1: But during World War One, multiple doctors worked out ways 302 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 1: to keep blood cold, allowing them to store it for 303 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: a short time before administering it to a recipient. One 304 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 1: was Oswald Hope Robertson of the U. S. Army Medical Corps, 305 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:41,920 Speaker 1: who established so called blood depots where donated blood was 306 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:46,200 Speaker 1: kept on ice. Also during World War One, Gordon Are 307 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:51,040 Speaker 1: Awards started researching the use of plasma rather than whole blood. 308 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:56,440 Speaker 1: Plasma is the liquid part of the blood which contains water, proteins, 309 00:19:56,560 --> 00:20:00,600 Speaker 1: mineral salts, and other substances, but not the red bood cells, 310 00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 1: white blood cells, or platelets. Plasma had a much longer 311 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,639 Speaker 1: shelf life than whole blood, and it was less likely 312 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 1: to transmit some blood borne diseases since it didn't contain 313 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,440 Speaker 1: those red blood cells. It could also be used regardless 314 00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:18,639 Speaker 1: of a person's blood type. It couldn't be used for 315 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:21,679 Speaker 1: every single application that whole blood could, but in a 316 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:25,640 Speaker 1: lot of cases it worked really well. By the nineteen thirties, 317 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:30,080 Speaker 1: multiple physicians and research institutes were working on ways to use, preserve, 318 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 1: and store whole blood and plasma, as well as ways 319 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: to fraction out different plasma components to use for different purposes, 320 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 1: and researchers in the Soviet Union we're also making discoveries 321 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,480 Speaker 1: about how to preserve, store, and use blood based on 322 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: work that they were doing with cadaver blood. Bringing all 323 00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:53,160 Speaker 1: of this knowledge together, Bernard Fantas, director of Cook County 324 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 1: Hospital in Chicago, as credited with opening the first blood 325 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:02,080 Speaker 1: bank on March fifteenth, nineteen thirties. Even He's also credited 326 00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:05,600 Speaker 1: with coining the word blood bank, which he hoped would 327 00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 1: make lay people comfortable with the idea of donating blood 328 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:13,160 Speaker 1: and receiving donated blood. He was able to keep donated 329 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:17,159 Speaker 1: blood usable for about ten days. Soon, other blood banks 330 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: followed to return to Charles Drew. In August of nineteen 331 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:25,000 Speaker 1: thirty nine, he and John Scudder set up an experimental 332 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 1: blood bank at Presbyterian Hospital. Work at the blood bank 333 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 1: formed the basis of Drew's dissertation Banked Blood, A Study 334 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: and Blood Preservation. In This dissertation was more than three 335 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:41,199 Speaker 1: hundred fifty pages long, summarizing the history that had led 336 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:43,920 Speaker 1: up to the development of blood banks, along with what 337 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:47,639 Speaker 1: was known about cadaver blood, placental blood, changes to blood 338 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,560 Speaker 1: caused by preservation, different methods of preservation and their pros 339 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,520 Speaker 1: and cons and the research that he and Scudder had 340 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:59,160 Speaker 1: conducted at the experimental blood bank at Presbyterian Hospital. Scudder 341 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,719 Speaker 1: called it quote one of the most distinguished essays ever written, 342 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,879 Speaker 1: both in form and content. We'll talk about how Charles 343 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 1: Drew's career unfolded after finishing this work. After we take 344 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:24,160 Speaker 1: a quick sponsor break. In April of ninety nine, while 345 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,920 Speaker 1: Charles Drew was in his last year at Columbia University, 346 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,480 Speaker 1: he went to the annual meeting of the John A. 347 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 1: Andrew Clinical Society at Tuskegee University in Alabama. This was 348 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 1: both a free clinic and a teaching and learning opportunity. 349 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,639 Speaker 1: On the way there, he stopped in Atlanta, where he 350 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 1: saw many Lenore Robins known as Lenore at the dining 351 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,359 Speaker 1: hall at Spellman College, where she was a professor of 352 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:53,199 Speaker 1: home economics. Charles was interested in her and some of 353 00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:56,120 Speaker 1: their friends through a party and invited her to it. 354 00:22:56,720 --> 00:23:00,679 Speaker 1: He fell in love immediately, and he stopped in Atlanta 355 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:03,680 Speaker 1: again on the way home from the conference to propose 356 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 1: to her. He described this as the only rash, unplanned, 357 00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 1: unpremeditated thing he had done in years. Charles and Lenore 358 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 1: got married a few months later on September. Not long after, 359 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 1: in n Charles Drew became the first black person to 360 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:25,919 Speaker 1: earn a medical doctorate from Columbia University. Later that year, 361 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:28,800 Speaker 1: Charles and Lenore had their first child, a daughter named 362 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:32,399 Speaker 1: BB like b B for blood bank. They would go 363 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 1: on to have three more children, Charlene Raya and Charles Jr. 364 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,880 Speaker 1: After finishing at Columbia, Drew went back to Howard as planned, 365 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: he became an assistant professor of surgery and a surgeon 366 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 1: at Freedman's Hospital. He expected to spend the rest of 367 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 1: his career training Black surgeons. That is really what he 368 00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:57,360 Speaker 1: considered to be his life's work. But then World War 369 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,679 Speaker 1: two intervened and Drew was asked to going the Blood 370 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 1: for Britain project. This was an effort to collect and 371 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 1: package massive amounts of blood plasma in the United States 372 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 1: and send it overseas to the UK, where it was 373 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:17,520 Speaker 1: desperately needed during the Blitz. Other researchers involved included John 374 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:21,159 Speaker 1: Scudder and E. H. L. Corwin. Drawing from what they 375 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:25,439 Speaker 1: learned at the experimental blood Bank at Presbyterian Hospital, drew thesis, 376 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 1: and other research, they put together a plan to recruit 377 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 1: blood donors, separate out the plasma under sterile conditions, add 378 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:36,280 Speaker 1: an anti microbial agent, test it, and package it in 379 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:41,240 Speaker 1: glass bottles diluted with sterile saleine. Uh as somebody who 380 00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 1: donates blood. The fact that they were using glass bottles 381 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,119 Speaker 1: just threw me for a second, and then I was 382 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: like of course, they they didn't have the kind of 383 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: plastic that we used today at that point. At first, 384 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,320 Speaker 1: Drew worked on this project while still keeping up his 385 00:24:56,400 --> 00:25:00,240 Speaker 1: duties at Howard, but in September he was us to 386 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,280 Speaker 1: join the Blood for Britain project full time as its 387 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: medical director, so he took a leave of absence between then. 388 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,760 Speaker 1: In January of nineteen forty one, the Blood for Britain 389 00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:15,680 Speaker 1: Project collected fourteen thousand, five hundred fifty six blood donations 390 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:20,119 Speaker 1: and shipped more than five thousand liters of plasma to Britain. 391 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:25,280 Speaker 1: This was a massive undertaking. It was on a scale 392 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:28,879 Speaker 1: far beyond any of the blood banking efforts that existed 393 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 1: before this point. After the Blood for Britain Project ended, 394 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,440 Speaker 1: Drew was asked to help establish a national blood bank 395 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:39,880 Speaker 1: program through the American Red Cross, with technical aspects managed 396 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:43,639 Speaker 1: by the National Research Council. While the Blood for Britain 397 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,480 Speaker 1: program had used liquid plasma, the Red Cross program focused 398 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: primarily on dried plasma. Drew was medical director of a 399 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 1: pilot program that could become a template for large scale 400 00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:58,240 Speaker 1: efforts to collect and stockpile blood and blood plasma for 401 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:02,840 Speaker 1: both civilian and military use. Drew again worked to develop 402 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: a standardized procedure that can be put into place at 403 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:10,119 Speaker 1: donation centers all across the country and ensure that donated 404 00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: blood was safe and stable. As part of this, he 405 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:19,040 Speaker 1: helped develop mobile refrigerated blood donation centers, also known as 406 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:23,600 Speaker 1: blood mobiles. Using systems and protocols that Drew developed, the 407 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:27,399 Speaker 1: Red Cross collected thirteen million bottles of blood between nineteen 408 00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:31,480 Speaker 1: forty one and nineteen forty five. People started calling Drew 409 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:34,199 Speaker 1: the father of the Blood Bank, although he insisted that 410 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,560 Speaker 1: he should not get the soul credit for any of this. 411 00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: He was really competitive throughout his life, but he also 412 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 1: carried his experience as an athlete who was a part 413 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:46,920 Speaker 1: of a team into his work in medicine. He knew 414 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,160 Speaker 1: that he did not do any of this by himself, 415 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:51,040 Speaker 1: and that he was building on the work of many 416 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 1: other people. Drew was expected to stay on as medical 417 00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:58,360 Speaker 1: director at the Red Cross until the end of April 418 00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:00,919 Speaker 1: nineteen forty one, which was when is leave at Howard 419 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 1: was going to end, but for unclear reasons, he resigned 420 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:08,439 Speaker 1: on April one. Letters that he sent to family and 421 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: friends around this time suggests that he was finding the 422 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,879 Speaker 1: work stressful and difficult was maybe having some conflicts with 423 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 1: some of the people he was working with. He also 424 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: had a wife and a new baby at home, being 425 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,760 Speaker 1: separated from them was hard for everyone involved. On top 426 00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,119 Speaker 1: of all of this, I mean, he was doing an 427 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:34,480 Speaker 1: incredibly important, demanding wartime job, separated from his family, and 428 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: also trying to study for his American Board of Surgery exams. 429 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 1: Not a full plate at all. It's a lot a 430 00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: lot of accounts of Drew's life give another reason, which 431 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,920 Speaker 1: was the Red Cross's decision not to accept blood from 432 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 1: black donors. The Red Cross really did do this, but 433 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 1: timing doesn't line up with Drew's departure. This was tied 434 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 1: to a War Department policy which read quote, for reasons 435 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:03,760 Speaker 1: which are not biologically convincing, but which are commonly recognized 436 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 1: as psychologically important. In America, it is not deemed advisable 437 00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,679 Speaker 1: to collect and mix Caucasian and Negro blood indiscriminately for 438 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 1: later administration two members of the military forces. The Red 439 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,240 Speaker 1: Cross announced that it would exclude black donors to align 440 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,520 Speaker 1: with the War departments policy in November of nineteen forty one, 441 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:27,440 Speaker 1: so that was months after Drew left. Drew did, however, 442 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,479 Speaker 1: speak out against this policy once it was in place, 443 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 1: as did many other physicians and civil rights organizations, including 444 00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,560 Speaker 1: the n double a CP. On January twenty one, nineteen 445 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,720 Speaker 1: forty two, the Red Cross announced a change in policy, quote, 446 00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: the American Red Cross, in agreement with the Army and Navy, 447 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:51,480 Speaker 1: is prepared hereafter to accept blood donations from colored as 448 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:54,760 Speaker 1: well as white persons, and deference to the wishes of 449 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,680 Speaker 1: those for whom the plasma is being provided, the blood 450 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:02,000 Speaker 1: will be processed separately, so that those receiving transfusions may 451 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 1: be given plasma from blood of their own race. I 452 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,520 Speaker 1: have so many feelings this, of course, was still discriminatory, 453 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,600 Speaker 1: and the idea that blood donations needed to be separated 454 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: by race was scientifically unfounded. Drew said of this quote, 455 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,800 Speaker 1: I feel that the ruling of the United States Army 456 00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 1: and Navy regarding the refusal of colored blood donors is 457 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: an indefensible one from any point of view. There is 458 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: no scientific basis for the separation of the blood of 459 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 1: different races, except on the basis of the individual blood 460 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: types or groups. He also gave interviews on the subject 461 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 1: and wrote letters to officials condemning the policy of segregating 462 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 1: blood donation by race. Yeah, he clearly was justifiably outraged 463 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 1: by this policy, It does not appear to have been 464 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,760 Speaker 1: the reason that it he left the Red Cross, though 465 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 1: the timeline just does not intersect in that way. To 466 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 1: return to Drew his career, though he did pass his 467 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: board exam ms in April of nineteen forty one. By October, 468 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: he had become the head of the Department of Surgery 469 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:10,440 Speaker 1: at Howard and chief surgeon at Freedman's Hospital, as well 470 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,480 Speaker 1: as becoming an examiner for the American Board of Surgery. 471 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:18,480 Speaker 1: While training black doctors and surgeons, he also advocated for 472 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:23,040 Speaker 1: their medical careers and their inclusion in major medical societies, 473 00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 1: many of which either excluded black members entirely or left 474 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 1: the membership requirements up to local chapters, with many of 475 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 1: those chapters excluding black people. Often this made black doctors 476 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:41,280 Speaker 1: ineligible for jobs that required membership in an organization like 477 00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 1: the a m A. Drew repeatedly advocated for the inclusion 478 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 1: of black members and the American Medical Association and the 479 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:52,680 Speaker 1: American College of Surgeons. Drew continued to advance in his 480 00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 1: own career as well. In nineteen forty four, he became 481 00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 1: chair of the Surgical Section of the National Medical Association, 482 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:03,880 Speaker 1: a national organization for black doctors. He became chief of 483 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 1: staff at Freedman's Hospital, and he was also awarded then 484 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 1: double a CP Spring arm Metal for achievement in recognition 485 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: of his work in blood banking. During his acceptance speech, 486 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,480 Speaker 1: he said, quote, it is fundamentally wrong for any great 487 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:21,120 Speaker 1: nation to willfully discriminate against such a large group of 488 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 1: its people. One can say quite truthfully that on the battlefield, 489 00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:28,120 Speaker 1: nobody is very interested in where the plasma comes from 490 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:32,120 Speaker 1: when they are hurt. Later, in that same speech, he said, quote, 491 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,800 Speaker 1: the blood is being sent from all parts of the world. 492 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:38,400 Speaker 1: It is unfortunate that such a worthwhile and scientific bit 493 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:42,160 Speaker 1: of work should have been hampered by such stupidity. The 494 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: Federal Labor Standards Association thought Drew's opinion on the issue 495 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:51,480 Speaker 1: of segregating blood donations in and in response to them, 496 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,120 Speaker 1: he said, quote, I think the Army made a grievous mistake, 497 00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:58,840 Speaker 1: a stupid error, in first issuing an order to the 498 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:02,400 Speaker 1: effect that blood for army should not be received from negroes. 499 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 1: It was a bad mistake for three reasons. One, no 500 00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:10,840 Speaker 1: official department of the federal government should willfully humiliate its 501 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 1: citizens too, there is no scientific basis for the order, 502 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:20,280 Speaker 1: and three, they need the blood. The Red Cross finally 503 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:24,760 Speaker 1: ended its policy of segregating blood in nineteen fifty. In 504 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,760 Speaker 1: nineteen five, Charles Drew was awarded an honorary doctorate from 505 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:32,680 Speaker 1: Virginia State College, and Amber's College recognized him with an 506 00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:37,360 Speaker 1: honorary doctorate two years later. He also became Freedman's Hospitals 507 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: medical director in nineteen forty six, and that year he 508 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:44,640 Speaker 1: was also elected to the International College of Surgeons. In 509 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:48,360 Speaker 1: nineteen forty eight, Drew's first class of residents took their 510 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: Board of Surgery exams, and he was really worried about it. 511 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,560 Speaker 1: He was confident in the education that they were getting 512 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 1: at Howard, but he also knew that most of the 513 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 1: other people taking the exams were from schools that were 514 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:05,080 Speaker 1: a lot richer and a lot more prestigious. His wife 515 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,600 Speaker 1: later relayed a story about getting a call from Howard 516 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:12,480 Speaker 1: President Mordechai Johnson after the board exams were over, telling 517 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:15,600 Speaker 1: her to tell Drew that one of his students had 518 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:20,400 Speaker 1: come in second place. Charlie was obviously totally over the 519 00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 1: moon about this, and then Leonora passed on the rest 520 00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:25,440 Speaker 1: of the message, which was that one of his other 521 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 1: students had come in first. I'm also crying, Holly and 522 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: I are both crying the sweetest thing. Okay, let me 523 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:40,040 Speaker 1: collect myself for one moment. Drew had wanted to travel 524 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: to the UK during the Blood for Britain program to 525 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:45,640 Speaker 1: see how things were going once the plasma arrived, but 526 00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 1: the State Department refused to issue him a passport on 527 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:50,960 Speaker 1: the grounds that his work was too important to put 528 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,520 Speaker 1: his life at risk in that way. But he did 529 00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 1: go overseas in as a consultant to the surge in 530 00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: General of the U. S. Army, touring hospitals in our 531 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:05,600 Speaker 1: pupied Europe. On March thirty one, fifty Charles Drew left Washington, 532 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:09,360 Speaker 1: d C. With three residents from Howard John R. Ford, 533 00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:13,799 Speaker 1: Walter R. Johnson, and Samuel Bullock. They were headed for 534 00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 1: the annual meeting of the Johnny Andrew Clinical Society in Tuskegee, Alabama. 535 00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,719 Speaker 1: They had planned to take turns driving through the night, 536 00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,560 Speaker 1: stopping as little as possible since so many places were 537 00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:31,920 Speaker 1: unsafe for black motorists. Today, Interstates and eighty five connect Washington, 538 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: d C. To Tuskegee, but the Interstate Highway system hadn't 539 00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,360 Speaker 1: been built yet, so they were really driving mostly along 540 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:42,919 Speaker 1: state and federal highways through rural areas. Drew had worked 541 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,400 Speaker 1: a long day at the hospital, spoken at a student 542 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,439 Speaker 1: council banquet, and done one last set of rounds before 543 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,799 Speaker 1: leaving Washington. A little before eight in the morning on 544 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,840 Speaker 1: April one, outside of Burlington, North Carolina, he fell asleep 545 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,640 Speaker 1: at the wheel. One of the other men called out 546 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,840 Speaker 1: to wake him up, and he overcorrected and lost control 547 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:06,320 Speaker 1: of the vehicle. Seat belts had been invented long before, 548 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,239 Speaker 1: but they were not standard in automobiles yet. Drew was 549 00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: thrown from the car, which rolled over him. Walter and 550 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:17,200 Speaker 1: Samuel were mostly unhurt, but john Ford was also thrown 551 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 1: from the car and had a broken arm and other injuries. 552 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 1: The four men were taken to Elament's General Hospital by 553 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,920 Speaker 1: an ambulance and in a car that was driven by 554 00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:31,879 Speaker 1: a passer by. Multiple people on staff recognized Charles Drew, 555 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:35,640 Speaker 1: and soonwards spread through the hospital that doctor Drew from 556 00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 1: the blood bank had been badly hurt. Four surgeons were 557 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:43,680 Speaker 1: all part of Drew's care in the emergency room, George Carrington, 558 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:48,320 Speaker 1: Harald Coronodal S, his younger brother Charles Coronodal, and Ralph Brooks. 559 00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:52,080 Speaker 1: Their treatments included giving Drew fluids and plasma, as the 560 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:56,160 Speaker 1: hospital didn't have a bank for whole blood. Meanwhile, Drew's 561 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 1: colleagues started calling family and other doctors they knew in 562 00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:02,280 Speaker 1: the area to tell them what had happened. See Mason 563 00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 1: Quick and remember Malloy, who had both trained at Howard 564 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: drove in from Winston Salem, where they were practicing. But 565 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:11,640 Speaker 1: it was clear from the start that Drew was not 566 00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:15,279 Speaker 1: likely to survive. His torso had been crushed and he 567 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,160 Speaker 1: had a serious brain injury. He died at ten ten 568 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:20,840 Speaker 1: a m. On April first, nineteen fifty, at the age 569 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,240 Speaker 1: of forty five, about an hour and a half after 570 00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,279 Speaker 1: arriving at the emergency room. His cause of death was 571 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:32,920 Speaker 1: listed as one brain injury to internal hemorrhage, lungs three 572 00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:39,319 Speaker 1: multiple extremities injuries. Almost immediately, rumors started to spread that 573 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:42,800 Speaker 1: Charles Drew had died not because his injuries were too severe, 574 00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:46,360 Speaker 1: but because he had been denied care or refused blood 575 00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: because of his race. Within a couple of years, this 576 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,920 Speaker 1: belief was widespread. It came up again and again in 577 00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:57,160 Speaker 1: everything from profiles of doctor Drew, to news reporting about 578 00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 1: developments in blood banking technology, even to a ninety three 579 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 1: episode of the TV show Mash. It is an innately 580 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:09,480 Speaker 1: believable story, not just because of the bitter irony of 581 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:12,840 Speaker 1: a doctor who developed blood banking dying because he was 582 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: refused blood, but also because black people really did die 583 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:20,360 Speaker 1: after being refused care at whites only hospitals, or turned 584 00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:22,719 Speaker 1: away because all the beds that a hospital had set 585 00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 1: aside for black patients were often full. Multiple black doctors 586 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:31,080 Speaker 1: who were there at the hospital when Charles Drew died 587 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:36,200 Speaker 1: actively tried to dispel this rumor. They recognized that it 588 00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:40,240 Speaker 1: reflected the realities of being a black person seeking medical 589 00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,480 Speaker 1: treatment in the United States, but they also found it 590 00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,040 Speaker 1: to be disrespectful to the doctors who had tried to 591 00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:50,320 Speaker 1: save Drew's life and damaging to the medical system. Especially 592 00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: in the South, people cited it as a reason not 593 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,040 Speaker 1: to donate blood, like why do it if they're not 594 00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,200 Speaker 1: going to give it to black patients. This room were 595 00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 1: also made it harder to recruit black doctors to practice 596 00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:06,960 Speaker 1: in North Carolina, something that was already challenging, giving the 597 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:10,520 Speaker 1: racism and racist violence that a black doctor could expect 598 00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:14,759 Speaker 1: to encounter while practicing there See Mason Quick said of 599 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: all this quote, I'm a black man and this is 600 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:20,319 Speaker 1: my state. I know you can indict North Carolina for 601 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,560 Speaker 1: a number of things, but you can't indict her for this. 602 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,480 Speaker 1: Although Charles Drew is most remembered for his role in 603 00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:30,360 Speaker 1: the development of blood banking, as we said earlier, he 604 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: really considered the training of black surgeons to be his 605 00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:37,160 Speaker 1: life's work. He trained more than half of the black 606 00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:40,600 Speaker 1: surgeons who were certified in the US between nineteen forty 607 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:44,600 Speaker 1: one and his death in nineteen fifty. Many more who 608 00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 1: were certified after his death had been through part of 609 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:51,480 Speaker 1: their training under his guidance. Today, there are multiple schools 610 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,200 Speaker 1: named after Charles Drew, including the Charles AR Drew University 611 00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,920 Speaker 1: of Medicine and Science in Los Angeles, which is a 612 00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:01,400 Speaker 1: historically black university that was found did In nineteen sixty six, 613 00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,719 Speaker 1: a memorial marker was installed at the site of his 614 00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:09,080 Speaker 1: car crash in and in he was inducted into the 615 00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:13,080 Speaker 1: National Inventor's Hall of Fame. His death was enormously tragic. 616 00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 1: His children, we're all little still at that point, and 617 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:22,400 Speaker 1: there's it was just a huge loss for the medical 618 00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: community in general, and the black medical community, especially especially 619 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:31,320 Speaker 1: at Howard. I also feel like there will be folks, 620 00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,480 Speaker 1: including myself, who see a parallel between the Red Crosses 621 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:40,360 Speaker 1: exclusion of black donors during World War Two and the 622 00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:45,080 Speaker 1: exclusion of of men who have sex with men today, 623 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:49,800 Speaker 1: with a key difference which that there was originally a 624 00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:52,920 Speaker 1: reason to do that, which is, in the early days 625 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:56,719 Speaker 1: of the AIDS crisis, there was no test, like there 626 00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:59,759 Speaker 1: wasn't a way to test the blood, and so with 627 00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:05,440 Speaker 1: the knowledge that HIV was disproportionately spreading among men who 628 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:08,040 Speaker 1: have sex with men and no way to test the blood, 629 00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,560 Speaker 1: like that policy made sense. It is not a Red 630 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:13,919 Speaker 1: a Red Cross policy, like I feel like the Red 631 00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 1: Cross gets a lot of criticism for it, but it's 632 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 1: an FDA rule. The situation now, though, is totally different 633 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 1: from what it was in the nineteen eighties. There are 634 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: still a lot of different groups who see disproportionately higher 635 00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:31,680 Speaker 1: risks for blood born illnesses. But we do have reliable 636 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,560 Speaker 1: tests now, we have had them for many, many, many years, 637 00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:40,400 Speaker 1: and so this blanket exclusion is really discriminatory. At this point, 638 00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,319 Speaker 1: and it's something that should have been really reassessed a 639 00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 1: long time ago, and there is currently a study that's 640 00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:50,759 Speaker 1: going on right now to try to figure out a 641 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:55,719 Speaker 1: better way to assess an individual person's actual risk for 642 00:40:55,800 --> 00:41:00,160 Speaker 1: blood born diseases, rather than having this blanket exclusion of 643 00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:01,920 Speaker 1: men who have sex with men, which I think at 644 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:05,359 Speaker 1: this point is like a three month deferral, not a 645 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:09,160 Speaker 1: lifetime ban as it was originally back in the eighties 646 00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,600 Speaker 1: when it was instituted. Well, you might talk more about 647 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:15,640 Speaker 1: that on Friday. Yeah, I wanted to note it now 648 00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:19,480 Speaker 1: just because I know there will be folks who were like, Hey, this, 649 00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:23,120 Speaker 1: Why didn't they mention it? That seems big? Uh? Do 650 00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:26,120 Speaker 1: you also have listener mail for us? I do? I 651 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:30,880 Speaker 1: actually have a very quick comment from Facebook from sharene 652 00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:34,799 Speaker 1: I hope I have said that correctly. Who said great episode. 653 00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:38,640 Speaker 1: Regarding our penicillin episode, it reminded me of my great 654 00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:41,280 Speaker 1: aunt's story from World War Two. She was a nurse 655 00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:44,359 Speaker 1: serving in the U. S. Army in England. One day 656 00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:47,440 Speaker 1: a serviceman came into the hospital with a sexually transmitted 657 00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,880 Speaker 1: disease and he thought he was going to die. The 658 00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:53,600 Speaker 1: nurses hooked him up to a large bag of penicillin. 659 00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:56,400 Speaker 1: He survived his ordeal, and after the war wrote to 660 00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:59,360 Speaker 1: the nurses that cared for him, thanking them and sharing 661 00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 1: that he had been I'm a priest. Then there's a 662 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:05,839 Speaker 1: smiley emoji. My great aunt always said penicillin was a 663 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,439 Speaker 1: miracle drug and was so grateful for its use during 664 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:12,040 Speaker 1: the war and after thanks for sharing the history. Thank 665 00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:15,560 Speaker 1: you so much for leaving us this comment UM, mostly 666 00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:17,799 Speaker 1: because we said in that episode that there was a 667 00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:22,520 Speaker 1: whole sort of debate about um about when best to 668 00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:27,320 Speaker 1: use penicillin during the war, whether it was better to 669 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:30,719 Speaker 1: get people who had a minor illness or sexually transmitted 670 00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:35,080 Speaker 1: infection back two duty for people who were more grievously 671 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:37,040 Speaker 1: injured and wanted to be going home into having a 672 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:40,800 Speaker 1: somebody had a personal connection to that thought. That's interesting. 673 00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,520 Speaker 1: So if you would like to send us a note. 674 00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,440 Speaker 1: Where a history podcast that I Heart radio dot com. 675 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:49,680 Speaker 1: We're also all over social media ad miss in History, 676 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,040 Speaker 1: which is where you'll find our Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, in Instagram, 677 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:56,040 Speaker 1: and you can subscribe to our show on the I 678 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app and wherever else you like to get 679 00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:05,400 Speaker 1: podcasts m stuff. You Missed in History Class is a 680 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:08,600 Speaker 1: production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from I 681 00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:11,919 Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 682 00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. H