WEBVTT - 3. The Girl from Hartford

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<v Speaker 1>Last time on SNAPOO pursuing.

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<v Speaker 2>The executive order.

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<v Speaker 3>The Director's Selective Service is going to establish tonight a

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<v Speaker 3>random selection sequence or induction or nineteen.

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<v Speaker 2>Seventy for Bill, dissent was at the heart of democracy.

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<v Speaker 4>How complicated would it be to go into the office.

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<v Speaker 2>If the FBI was spying on people?

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<v Speaker 5>Records of what kinds of the surveillance or disruption?

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<v Speaker 2>He's regarded it as a crime that needed to be solved.

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<v Speaker 2>He just called John and me and asked us, if

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<v Speaker 2>we want to come to a party.

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<v Speaker 6>You got to do what you got to do. You know,

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<v Speaker 6>you have to maintain your own personal integrity.

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<v Speaker 1>That's Keith Forsyth succinctly stating his personal philosophy. When Keith

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<v Speaker 1>entered cap College in Ohio in the fall of nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>sixty nine, he says he wasn't very political. But just

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<v Speaker 1>a year later, when Bill Davidan invited Keith to help

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<v Speaker 1>him burglarize the FBI, Keith said, yes, So what changed? Well,

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<v Speaker 1>it all started with a book and it.

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<v Speaker 6>Was called Piece in Vietnam.

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<v Speaker 1>It was a small paperback published by a pacifist Quaker organization.

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<v Speaker 1>A guy in Keith's dorm loaned it to him, it

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<v Speaker 1>told the history of the Vietnam War from the Vietnamese perspective.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, we went.

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<v Speaker 6>In there and tried to help the French maintain a

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<v Speaker 6>colonial ownership of the Vietnam and enslayed the people there.

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<v Speaker 6>When the French got tired, they got their ass. Kidd

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<v Speaker 6>of the NBN threw we picked up when they left off.

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<v Speaker 6>That book just blew me away. I mean, I can't

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<v Speaker 6>the emotional power that of the effect that had on me.

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<v Speaker 6>It was just really indescribles that was quoting.

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<v Speaker 1>But already knew the American government's justification for the war

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<v Speaker 1>that the Vietnamese people needed to be rescued from the

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<v Speaker 1>ever expanding chokehold of communism. But through extensive research, he

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<v Speaker 1>was learning a very different side of the story. Nothing

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<v Speaker 1>he could find justified America's role in Vietnam. He even

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<v Speaker 1>asked the State Department to make the case for the war,

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<v Speaker 1>but their response was not convincing.

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<v Speaker 6>And I still remember the phrase I was saying to myself,

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<v Speaker 6>this can't be true. This is America. I remember we were.

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<v Speaker 7>In the newsroom of the student newspaper or something, maybe

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<v Speaker 7>a graphic some leafless for in a Cambodian invasion protests,

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<v Speaker 7>and the news of Vatkan State came over the wire,

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<v Speaker 7>and you know, we're.

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<v Speaker 6>Just down a road from Kent State.

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<v Speaker 1>Keith and his peers were horrified by Kent State, and

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<v Speaker 1>he was even more shocked by what happened just two

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<v Speaker 1>weeks later at Jackson State in Mississippi, where local police

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<v Speaker 1>unleashed a barrage of gunfire on a dorm full of

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<v Speaker 1>unarmed black students, killing two young men. Heith heard the

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<v Speaker 1>police's official story, then he heard a tape of what

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<v Speaker 1>actually happened.

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<v Speaker 4>It was ten or.

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<v Speaker 6>Twenty rifles and distals and shotguns all being fired, you

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<v Speaker 6>know once.

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<v Speaker 8>Anyway, the story.

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<v Speaker 6>They circulated later that somebody shot at them and they

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<v Speaker 6>shot back was obviously bullshit. It was just all a sudden,

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<v Speaker 6>all this barrage and it sounded like a machine gun

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<v Speaker 6>wire And.

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<v Speaker 8>That was it for me.

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<v Speaker 6>Was already man, it was already feeling and raised and betrayed,

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<v Speaker 6>and after that it just multiplied.

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<v Speaker 1>Keith had already dropped out of school to protest the

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<v Speaker 1>war full time.

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<v Speaker 6>I felt that Vietnam war was a horrendous moral outrage.

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<v Speaker 6>It's no different than if you were walking down the

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<v Speaker 6>street and you saw somebody walk up to a stranger

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<v Speaker 6>and fill their brains out for no reason whatsoever. I mean,

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<v Speaker 6>you would have a reaction to that.

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<v Speaker 1>Heath headed for the epicenter of America's anti war movement, Philadelphia.

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<v Speaker 1>He got a job driving a cab, and he began

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<v Speaker 1>spending his nights with the local anti war movement burglarizing

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<v Speaker 1>draft boards. He became an expert in picking locks. He

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<v Speaker 1>actually got certified as a locksmith as part of his

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<v Speaker 1>training to burglarized draft boards. So by late nineteen seventy,

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<v Speaker 1>when Bill Davidon decided to break into the FBI.

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<v Speaker 9>He called me and asked me if I was interested

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<v Speaker 9>in going to a party, which was you know code.

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<v Speaker 1>It was the same called John and Bonnie Rains had received.

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<v Speaker 1>Bill was inviting Keith to join an action targeting the FBI,

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<v Speaker 1>and Keith didn't need much convincing.

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<v Speaker 9>When you're twenty years old, you do a lot of

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<v Speaker 9>things that you might think twice about later. I was

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<v Speaker 9>really really really really angry and really really really frustrated,

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<v Speaker 9>and I'm like, if we can up Deannie, let's do it.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Ed Helms and this is Snaffo a show about

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<v Speaker 1>history's greatest screw ups. This is season two Medburg, the

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<v Speaker 1>story of a daring heist and the colossal FBI snaffo

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<v Speaker 1>it exposed this week how to break into the FBI.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's check back in with our professional heist consultant, Steven

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<v Speaker 1>Soderberg in the sort of typical heist film.

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<v Speaker 6>Each person has a specific skill set in a specific role,

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<v Speaker 6>and it's fun to watch them perform that.

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<v Speaker 1>Keith Forsyth, who by the way, looked a little like

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<v Speaker 1>John Lennon in the early seventies, brought his aptitude for

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<v Speaker 1>lock picking.

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<v Speaker 9>It's really not hard and you can get through almost

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<v Speaker 9>any door twenty seconds if you, you know, are any good.

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<v Speaker 1>Also attending the party was Sarah Schumer, a professor and

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<v Speaker 1>colleague of Bill Davidan's. Sarah had been politically active since

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<v Speaker 1>the early days of the civil rights movement, so she

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<v Speaker 1>was no stranger to the inside of a jail cell.

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<v Speaker 10>You just assumed your phone was wiretapped, you know, if

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<v Speaker 10>you were an activist, you assumed you were followed one

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<v Speaker 10>way or another.

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<v Speaker 1>Ralph Daniel was a young graduate student in psychology. He

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<v Speaker 1>protested the war, but initially avoided anything illegal. He worried

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<v Speaker 1>getting arrested would interfere with his studies. Nevertheless, he apparently

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<v Speaker 1>drew the ire of a Philadelphia cop named Lieutenant Fenzil.

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<v Speaker 1>One day, Ralph was standing around not breaking the law

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<v Speaker 1>while some friends illegally chained themselves to the entrance of

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<v Speaker 1>a draft board.

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<v Speaker 11>Office, and Fencil I decided he arrested me, and he said,

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<v Speaker 11>I've seen you at too many demonstrations. I'm busting you

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<v Speaker 11>even though you're not chained.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's arguably Lieutenant Fenzil's fault that Ralph wound up

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<v Speaker 1>accessing his more rebellious, less law abiding side.

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<v Speaker 11>If rules seemed foolish, I typically would not follow them.

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<v Speaker 11>I was also twenty six. I still felt invincible the

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<v Speaker 11>way a lot of young people do.

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<v Speaker 1>And when Bill invited him to the party.

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<v Speaker 11>I said, sign me on. I didn't hesitate at all.

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<v Speaker 1>Next up Bob Williamson, a social worker steeped in the

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<v Speaker 1>non violent teachings of Martin Luther King and Gandhi. Bob

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<v Speaker 1>quickly realized that Philadelphia law enforcement was working against Philadelphians.

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<v Speaker 12>Nobody felt good when they saw a police car driveway.

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<v Speaker 12>They weren't providing any kind of a service to the community.

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<v Speaker 12>It was like an occupying force.

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<v Speaker 1>So Bob dedicated his evenings to following cops with a camera,

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<v Speaker 1>policing the police. Eventually he fell in with the anti

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<v Speaker 1>war crowd and added draft board raids to his resume.

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<v Speaker 1>He also had a fondness for corny jokes that sort

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<v Speaker 1>of became something.

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<v Speaker 12>I was known for having an inappropriate sense of humor.

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<v Speaker 12>At the worst time.

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<v Speaker 1>Bill recruited Bob, and Bob recruited Judy fine Gold. Judy

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<v Speaker 1>was a military counselor at the American Friends Service Committee,

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<v Speaker 1>the same Quaker organization whose book about Vietnam changed Keith's life.

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<v Speaker 10>I was basically living my truth as pure as you

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<v Speaker 10>can live life, and I would go to work as

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<v Speaker 10>a military counselor trying to get people out of the

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<v Speaker 10>military that didn't want to be there anymore.

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<v Speaker 1>Legally, she was just nineteen, but she'd been actively protesting

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<v Speaker 1>the war since age twelve, literally growing up in the movement.

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<v Speaker 10>I just felt like I was living in the heart

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<v Speaker 10>of the dragon and it was just my job to

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<v Speaker 10>stop the fire, and this seemed like a way to

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<v Speaker 10>do it.

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<v Speaker 1>Bill approached two other people who we can't name. One

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<v Speaker 1>turned him down. The other said, yes, but we'll just

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<v Speaker 1>have to call him Burglar number nine.

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<v Speaker 13>Beno.

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<v Speaker 1>Remember that it's going to be important later, But for now,

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<v Speaker 1>Bill had his team. Some were married with children, while

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<v Speaker 1>some were practically still children themselves. Some had years of

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<v Speaker 1>experience conducting illegal anti war actions like draft board raides.

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<v Speaker 1>Others were taking that step for the first time. Some

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<v Speaker 1>of them were immediately identifiable as hippies I'm looking at you,

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<v Speaker 1>Keith and Bob, while others were clean cut professionals. But

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<v Speaker 1>despite these differences, they had a lot in common. They

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<v Speaker 1>hated the war, they cherished free speech. They knew they

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<v Speaker 1>could trust Bill Davidan, and they did not trust ja

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<v Speaker 1>Edgar Hoover.

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<v Speaker 13>What a friend we have in whover freedom has no

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<v Speaker 13>true or for is your thinking left us? He will

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<v Speaker 13>get you in the.

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<v Speaker 1>That's folk singer Tom Paxton singing an ode to Hoover

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<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy. Obviously, he's joking about his admiration for Hoover,

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<v Speaker 1>but the thing about that song is most of mainstream

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<v Speaker 1>America probably agreed with it. Unironically at the time. Hoover

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<v Speaker 1>spent decades cultivating his in the FBI's image, and it worked.

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<v Speaker 1>He was your friend. But more than that, he was

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<v Speaker 1>your protector.

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<v Speaker 5>We are playing disaster if we do not soon take

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<v Speaker 5>some positive action against the growing maldetary nation in this land.

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<v Speaker 1>It is that's Jay Edgar himself, striking a note he'd

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<v Speaker 1>play his entire career. America is on the verge of catastrophe,

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<v Speaker 1>and law and order conservatism is the only thing holding

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<v Speaker 1>us back from the brink.

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<v Speaker 14>He was a serious bureaucrat. He was a heavily anti

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<v Speaker 14>communist conservative.

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<v Speaker 1>That's doctor Daniel Chard, a professor of history at Western

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<v Speaker 1>Washington University. Hoover was born in eighteen ninety five, the

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<v Speaker 1>son of a government pencil pusher.

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<v Speaker 15>And came of age in Jim Crow, Washington, DC and

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<v Speaker 15>of what was then just the dominant cultural values of

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<v Speaker 15>white male authority.

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<v Speaker 1>It's truly impossible to overstate how much this guy loved authority,

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<v Speaker 1>and of course he loved America, or at least his

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<v Speaker 1>version of it. As a kid, Hoover rewrote the classic

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<v Speaker 1>story of George Washington chopping down a cherry tree. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>I cannot tell a lie, but in Little j Edgar's version,

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<v Speaker 1>Washington's cousin Ike was responsible for axing the tree. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>the point of that story isn't about chopping down a tree.

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<v Speaker 1>It's about being honest when it matters. But Hoover wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>concerned about honesty. He preferred his own story, where the

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<v Speaker 1>founder of our country was simply faultless. In the first place,

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<v Speaker 1>he didn't.

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<v Speaker 4>Like the Left. He held racist views.

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<v Speaker 14>He was in a racist fraternity at George Washington University.

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<v Speaker 1>Dan's not just tossing that word around casually. Hoover's fraternity

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<v Speaker 1>had some very close ties to the KKK at the time,

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<v Speaker 1>as in a lot of guys were members of both.

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<v Speaker 1>Like the Klan, they were still mourning the loss of

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<v Speaker 1>the Civil War. Its members deeply revered Confederate General Robert E. Lee,

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<v Speaker 1>whom the fraternity referred to as quote the last gentle

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<v Speaker 1>night to pay for college plus fraternity dues. A young

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<v Speaker 1>Jay Edgar took a job at the Library of Congress.

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<v Speaker 1>There he began a lifelong love affair with organization and

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<v Speaker 1>meticulous filing systems. A racist with a passion for file keeping,

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<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't want to get stuck talking to that guy

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<v Speaker 1>at a party.

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<v Speaker 5>There is nothing mysterious about the meadow which the Federal

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<v Speaker 5>Bureau of Investigation is working formula is a simple one.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh wow, cool, okay.

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<v Speaker 5>Intensive training, casually investigated, Okay, highly efficient pressure they oh okay.

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<v Speaker 5>Plus rigid requirements in regard to conduct intelligence and integrity.

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<v Speaker 1>Listen, I'm just going to go. I'm going to get

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<v Speaker 1>a drink.

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<v Speaker 5>I'll be a special agents. Must be a good marksman. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 5>have the courage to shoot it out with the most

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<v Speaker 5>venomous of public. And you must know how to take fingerprints,

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<v Speaker 5>what to do with the math. Hey, must know that

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<v Speaker 5>no clue.

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<v Speaker 1>Sorry, sorry to cut you off. I just have to

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<v Speaker 1>I just have to go somewhere else now. Somehow, Hoover

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<v Speaker 1>managed to graduate law school without ever taking a class

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<v Speaker 1>in constitutional law. That's like graduating from medical school without

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<v Speaker 1>ever taking a class on bones. The Justice Department didn't

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<v Speaker 1>seem to mind. They hired him anyway. Before long, he

0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:11.679
<v Speaker 1>was rising through the ranks.

0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:14.000
<v Speaker 4>And was involved in what were called the Palmer Raids

0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:14.280
<v Speaker 4>or the.

0:14:14.280 --> 0:14:17.760
<v Speaker 14>First National Red Scare, going after the radical labor movement

0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:19.800
<v Speaker 14>after World War One.

0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:22.520
<v Speaker 1>Hoover was only twenty four years old, and here he

0:14:22.680 --> 0:14:27.520
<v Speaker 1>was engineering the roundups and arrests of communists, socialists, anarchists,

0:14:27.640 --> 0:14:31.880
<v Speaker 1>black political organizers, and anyone who was suspected of being

0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:35.560
<v Speaker 1>any of the above. They were detained without due process,

0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:40.560
<v Speaker 1>and some were even tortured, all under Hoover's supervision. The

0:14:40.640 --> 0:14:43.280
<v Speaker 1>Palmer Raids, as they came to be known, should have

0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:47.800
<v Speaker 1>earned him a reputation for excessive brutality and violating the Constitution,

0:14:48.920 --> 0:14:53.480
<v Speaker 1>but apparently Hoover's superiors liked what they saw. Just shy

0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:57.160
<v Speaker 1>of his thirtieth birthday, the Justice Department named j. Edgar

0:14:57.200 --> 0:15:03.680
<v Speaker 1>Hoover the new head of its Bureau of Instigation. In

0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:06.640
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen thirties, Hoover's g men put the gangster machine

0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:09.760
<v Speaker 1>gun Kelly in prison for life and gunned down Public

0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:14.560
<v Speaker 1>Enemy number one, John Dillinger. Fun fact, Hoover kept Dillinger's

0:15:14.600 --> 0:15:19.560
<v Speaker 1>glasses and death mask in a display case outside his office,

0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:22.840
<v Speaker 1>and if that wasn't creepy enough, he invited agents in

0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:25.720
<v Speaker 1>training to come and make their own castings of the

0:15:25.760 --> 0:15:31.720
<v Speaker 1>death mask. Catching gangsters earned Hoover the appreciation of the

0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:36.400
<v Speaker 1>public and presidents alike. He expanded the bureau's reach, modernized

0:15:36.400 --> 0:15:40.160
<v Speaker 1>its approach to investigations, and hired thousands of new agents.

0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:44.120
<v Speaker 1>He was also particularly keen to pluck new hires out

0:15:44.160 --> 0:15:47.840
<v Speaker 1>of the same KKK adjacent fraternity of which he'd been

0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:51.400
<v Speaker 1>a member. Many of those men formed the foundation of

0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:53.960
<v Speaker 1>Hoover's new intelligence gathering juggernaut.

0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.800
<v Speaker 14>The changes the name in the thirties to the FBI

0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:00.720
<v Speaker 14>rather than just Bureau of Investigation. He build it up

0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:04.560
<v Speaker 14>as a very powerful organization with a lot of autonomy

0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:10.200
<v Speaker 14>from congressional oversight or executive oversight.

0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:13.560
<v Speaker 1>During the Red Scare of the forties and fifties, Hoover

0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.480
<v Speaker 1>did pretty much exactly what you'd expect him to do,

0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:20.920
<v Speaker 1>funneled information on suspected commies to Joe McCarthy and the

0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:24.520
<v Speaker 1>House on American Activities Committee. But even after the Red

0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:25.960
<v Speaker 1>Scare died down.

0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.920
<v Speaker 3>Mister Hoover, some people are saying today that communism is

0:16:29.960 --> 0:16:32.080
<v Speaker 3>no longer a danger to our country.

0:16:32.200 --> 0:16:33.720
<v Speaker 4>What is your opinion about that?

0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:36.720
<v Speaker 3>I think the Communism is as serious amens to the

0:16:36.840 --> 0:16:38.720
<v Speaker 3>United States as it ever was, if not more so,

0:16:39.440 --> 0:16:42.240
<v Speaker 3>because today you have in charge of the Communist Party

0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.160
<v Speaker 3>a hard core, fanatical group of members who are dedicated

0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.560
<v Speaker 3>to the overthrow of our government by FOSSEM and violence.

0:16:57.960 --> 0:17:00.040
<v Speaker 1>As the head of a federal agency, Hoover had to

0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.120
<v Speaker 1>go to Congress once a year to review his department's budget,

0:17:03.680 --> 0:17:08.120
<v Speaker 1>But unlike his peers, Hoover's hearings always happened in closed session,

0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:12.040
<v Speaker 1>no public, no press. Every year he'd give a version

0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:13.000
<v Speaker 1>of the same spiel.

0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:17.320
<v Speaker 16>You thought those rads were scary in nineteen seventy, boy,

0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:21.160
<v Speaker 16>let me tell you what they got planned for seventy one, and.

0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:25.920
<v Speaker 1>Every year Congress bought it, increasing the FBI's budget. Hoover

0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:28.960
<v Speaker 1>had learned to game the system. No one in America's

0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:31.959
<v Speaker 1>history held onto a high ranking position like Hoover's for

0:17:32.000 --> 0:17:35.320
<v Speaker 1>as long as he did. When he first got the job,

0:17:35.600 --> 0:17:40.040
<v Speaker 1>Calvin freaking Coolidge was president, and Hoover stayed in his

0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:45.320
<v Speaker 1>role through eight presidencies. He watched sixteen attorneys general come

0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:48.160
<v Speaker 1>and go. They all had the authority to fire him,

0:17:48.520 --> 0:17:51.639
<v Speaker 1>and some came pretty close, but none of them did.

0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:55.520
<v Speaker 1>It's probably not a coincidence that Hoover was also collecting

0:17:55.600 --> 0:18:00.320
<v Speaker 1>dirt on public officials for decades. Suffice to say, Hoover

0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:03.280
<v Speaker 1>clung to his job like an angry barnacle.

0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:09.360
<v Speaker 4>His office had two layers.

0:18:09.840 --> 0:18:12.959
<v Speaker 14>He had a full office and then an interior office

0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.080
<v Speaker 14>within that, and he had what was called the official

0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:18.359
<v Speaker 14>and confidential files that were so secret he kept them

0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:22.040
<v Speaker 14>in there. It was known that he had intelligence files

0:18:22.080 --> 0:18:24.080
<v Speaker 14>on different congressmen.

0:18:24.320 --> 0:18:26.320
<v Speaker 4>He knew who John F. Kennedy was sleeping with, and

0:18:26.320 --> 0:18:27.040
<v Speaker 4>stuff like that.

0:18:27.640 --> 0:18:30.680
<v Speaker 1>On one level, this was probably pretty childish, a chance

0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:34.679
<v Speaker 1>to giggle at a senator's secret sexual proclivities, but really

0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:38.560
<v Speaker 1>showing off his collection of secrets served as a veiled threat.

0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:43.120
<v Speaker 1>You think that's embarrassing, well, just to imagine what I've

0:18:43.160 --> 0:18:50.159
<v Speaker 1>gone on you you you you threats of blackmail. Notwithstanding,

0:18:50.320 --> 0:18:52.959
<v Speaker 1>Hoover really should have been forced out in nineteen sixty

0:18:53.000 --> 0:18:56.200
<v Speaker 1>five when he reached what was the government's mandatory retirement

0:18:56.280 --> 0:19:00.960
<v Speaker 1>age of seventy. But despite being famously well endowed, google

0:19:01.000 --> 0:19:03.040
<v Speaker 1>it if you don't know what I'm talking about, Lyndon

0:19:03.119 --> 0:19:07.120
<v Speaker 1>Johnson lacked the balls to enforce that rule, so instead

0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:08.240
<v Speaker 1>he did this.

0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:11.359
<v Speaker 8>The nation cannot afford to LUGI, and therefore I have

0:19:11.560 --> 0:19:16.080
<v Speaker 8>just now signed an executive order exempting you from compulsory

0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:19.000
<v Speaker 8>TIMA for an indefinite period of time.

0:19:20.480 --> 0:19:23.800
<v Speaker 1>Hoover outlasted LBJ and was still in office when Nixon

0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:27.240
<v Speaker 1>took over. By that point, his penchant for blackmail was

0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:31.080
<v Speaker 1>something of an open secret, but overall his propaganda had

0:19:31.119 --> 0:19:34.679
<v Speaker 1>paid off. He was a conservative crime fighting hero, and

0:19:34.760 --> 0:19:37.879
<v Speaker 1>even if they didn't revere the guy, most Americans just

0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:43.399
<v Speaker 1>trusted him. He certainly had some strange obsessions. Here's a

0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:46.640
<v Speaker 1>direct quote from a memo Hoover wrote regarding new hires.

0:19:47.000 --> 0:19:50.800
<v Speaker 16>I recently saw a photograph of a favorably recommended clerical applicant.

0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:54.639
<v Speaker 16>This photograph reflected long sign burns and long hair in

0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:57.920
<v Speaker 16>the back, and two full on the sides. Please, when

0:19:57.960 --> 0:20:02.000
<v Speaker 16>interviewing applicants, be alert for long hairs, beards, mustaches, pear

0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:03.960
<v Speaker 16>shaped heads, truck drivers, etc.

0:20:05.480 --> 0:20:07.160
<v Speaker 1>I don't even know what that means, but now I'm

0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:13.800
<v Speaker 1>kind of worried. Honey, do I have a pear shaped head? Oh?

0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:20.080
<v Speaker 1>Thank god? Today. Some of Hoover's idiosyncrasies just sound goofy.

0:20:20.359 --> 0:20:23.800
<v Speaker 1>But to the men of Hoover's FBI, his word was gospel,

0:20:24.320 --> 0:20:27.720
<v Speaker 1>partially because Hoover's FBI tended to hire guys like Hoover,

0:20:28.359 --> 0:20:32.359
<v Speaker 1>meaning they were all guys and they were all white.

0:20:33.280 --> 0:20:36.640
<v Speaker 1>In nineteen sixty two, Attorney General Robert Kennedy publicly called

0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:40.720
<v Speaker 1>Hoover out over this. In response, Hoover promoted his black

0:20:40.800 --> 0:20:43.960
<v Speaker 1>chauffeur to the role of special agent. Of course, that

0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:46.960
<v Speaker 1>special agent kept driving Hoover's car.

0:20:47.720 --> 0:20:50.800
<v Speaker 14>They're all white men exclusively. There's a lot of World

0:20:50.800 --> 0:20:55.200
<v Speaker 14>War Two veterans in the FBI. They're pretty conservative. The

0:20:55.280 --> 0:21:01.639
<v Speaker 14>FBI recruited heavily among Catholics. They saw Catholics as people

0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:06.720
<v Speaker 14>who were kind of a cultured into being part of

0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:10.160
<v Speaker 14>an institution with a hierarchy that they would like listen

0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:10.879
<v Speaker 14>to authority.

0:21:11.920 --> 0:21:14.760
<v Speaker 1>By nineteen seventy, the FBI could be fairly described as

0:21:14.760 --> 0:21:18.480
<v Speaker 1>an army of many Hoovers, straight laced, serious minded white

0:21:18.480 --> 0:21:21.560
<v Speaker 1>men who tucked in their shirts, avoided sideburns like the plague,

0:21:22.080 --> 0:21:25.359
<v Speaker 1>loved God, hated communism, and had some sort of weird

0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:31.359
<v Speaker 1>thing against truck drivers. Apparently, the FBI's official motto was fidelity, bravery,

0:21:31.440 --> 0:21:37.800
<v Speaker 1>and integrity. Get it. Those are wonderful words with wonderful meaning.

0:21:38.400 --> 0:21:41.879
<v Speaker 1>But as the years passed, Hoover increasingly conducted activities that

0:21:42.200 --> 0:21:49.040
<v Speaker 1>did not mesh with those ideals. Back in those days,

0:21:49.080 --> 0:21:52.000
<v Speaker 1>tapping someone's phone involved placing a physical tap on the

0:21:52.080 --> 0:21:55.680
<v Speaker 1>actual phone lines. This meant if somebody was tapping your phone,

0:21:55.720 --> 0:21:57.960
<v Speaker 1>you might hear a telltelle noise.

0:21:58.240 --> 0:22:01.080
<v Speaker 2>You got on the phoney you heard quickly, but you know,

0:22:01.560 --> 0:22:02.320
<v Speaker 2>you knew.

0:22:02.080 --> 0:22:02.960
<v Speaker 4>Something was off.

0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:06.440
<v Speaker 1>So even if they couldn't prove it, Tom Paxton and

0:22:06.520 --> 0:22:09.800
<v Speaker 1>others just kind of knew it was their pal j

0:22:10.080 --> 0:22:11.280
<v Speaker 1>Edgar on the line.

0:22:11.359 --> 0:22:20.480
<v Speaker 13>Does your telephone sound Puney, is some stranger standing by

0:22:21.080 --> 0:22:27.320
<v Speaker 13>standing by? Do not bother your revel.

0:22:28.520 --> 0:22:29.000
<v Speaker 8>Man.

0:22:31.040 --> 0:22:33.640
<v Speaker 5>Take it to the fv.

0:22:49.840 --> 0:22:54.800
<v Speaker 1>H up in Philadelphia. Bonnie Rains, her husband John, and

0:22:54.880 --> 0:22:58.520
<v Speaker 1>seven others had said yes when a quiet physicist named

0:22:58.520 --> 0:23:03.399
<v Speaker 1>Bill Davidon invited him to his quote unquote party. Despite

0:23:03.440 --> 0:23:06.080
<v Speaker 1>the fact that most of them hadn't met before Bill's party,

0:23:06.520 --> 0:23:10.680
<v Speaker 1>they quickly bonded over their shared goal to expose FBI

0:23:10.840 --> 0:23:15.680
<v Speaker 1>surveillance from the outset. The nine would be burglars agreed

0:23:15.720 --> 0:23:18.760
<v Speaker 1>that they would never tell another living soul what they

0:23:18.760 --> 0:23:22.120
<v Speaker 1>were about to do, and they also agreed on a name.

0:23:23.640 --> 0:23:26.480
<v Speaker 1>The citizens commissioned to investigate the FBI.

0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:32.800
<v Speaker 2>We knew we had to identify ourselves in a particular

0:23:32.960 --> 0:23:35.960
<v Speaker 2>kind of way. So it flipped the whole idea of

0:23:36.000 --> 0:23:39.480
<v Speaker 2>a commission that investigates this and a commission that investigates

0:23:39.520 --> 0:23:44.000
<v Speaker 2>that to our responsibility to investigate the FBI.

0:23:44.800 --> 0:23:47.600
<v Speaker 1>It might have been a tad grandiose or sarcastic, like

0:23:47.720 --> 0:23:50.480
<v Speaker 1>referring to your cat as the acting director of vomiting

0:23:50.520 --> 0:23:53.359
<v Speaker 1>on the sofa cushion, but the name also pointed to

0:23:53.400 --> 0:23:56.120
<v Speaker 1>one of the core beliefs that all nine members shared.

0:23:56.840 --> 0:24:00.520
<v Speaker 1>If the government wasn't going to hold itself accountable, duty

0:24:00.560 --> 0:24:05.920
<v Speaker 1>would have to fall to the citizens. Next step, pick

0:24:06.040 --> 0:24:08.160
<v Speaker 1>the target. I know we.

0:24:08.200 --> 0:24:12.000
<v Speaker 9>Discussed the possibility of doing the Philadelphia FBI office because

0:24:12.119 --> 0:24:15.320
<v Speaker 9>I went down and cased it in the daytime. If

0:24:16.040 --> 0:24:19.119
<v Speaker 9>the sign in books for the building still exists, my

0:24:19.280 --> 0:24:24.040
<v Speaker 9>alias is in there. Probably Bill Travis, I'm guessing, was

0:24:24.080 --> 0:24:24.560
<v Speaker 9>probably it.

0:24:25.840 --> 0:24:29.960
<v Speaker 1>The Philadelphia FBI office was an impenetrable citadel smack dab

0:24:30.000 --> 0:24:33.000
<v Speaker 1>in the center of downtown Philly, a stone's throw from

0:24:33.000 --> 0:24:35.560
<v Speaker 1>City Hall, in just a few minutes from police headquarters.

0:24:35.920 --> 0:24:40.200
<v Speaker 1>This office was not an ideal target. So Bill david

0:24:40.280 --> 0:24:42.080
<v Speaker 1>On and his crew looked elsewhere.

0:24:42.920 --> 0:24:45.439
<v Speaker 2>Well, he said, I opened up the phone book, and

0:24:45.480 --> 0:24:50.520
<v Speaker 2>there's an FBI office in Media, which is practically next

0:24:50.520 --> 0:24:54.240
<v Speaker 2>door to Haverford where he lived, a little office in Media,

0:24:54.800 --> 0:24:58.520
<v Speaker 2>and so maybe we could think about the feasibility of that.

0:25:02.680 --> 0:25:05.760
<v Speaker 1>As far as unthinkable heists went, the FBI office in

0:25:05.800 --> 0:25:11.760
<v Speaker 1>the bedroom community of Media, Pennsylvania seemed less unthinkable. Here's

0:25:11.760 --> 0:25:12.560
<v Speaker 1>Bob Williamson.

0:25:12.840 --> 0:25:16.240
<v Speaker 12>It was called a resident agency and there were only

0:25:16.280 --> 0:25:18.879
<v Speaker 12>three or four agents working out of that office for

0:25:18.960 --> 0:25:19.479
<v Speaker 12>the area.

0:25:20.200 --> 0:25:22.800
<v Speaker 1>Resident agency was a fancy term for when the FBI

0:25:22.840 --> 0:25:25.680
<v Speaker 1>is simply rented out office space in a civilian building.

0:25:26.600 --> 0:25:29.399
<v Speaker 1>This particular resident agency was on the second floor of

0:25:29.440 --> 0:25:33.359
<v Speaker 1>an unremarkable apartment building across from the Delaware County Courthouse.

0:25:33.920 --> 0:25:36.359
<v Speaker 1>At first glance, there wasn't much to distinguish this little

0:25:36.440 --> 0:25:39.760
<v Speaker 1>FBI outpost from the office of say, a mid sized

0:25:39.840 --> 0:25:46.440
<v Speaker 1>regional paper company. AnyWho. The burglars had their target one

0:25:46.560 --> 0:25:50.280
<v Speaker 1>Veteran Square, Media, Pennsylvania. For the next few months, the

0:25:50.359 --> 0:25:53.280
<v Speaker 1>crew of nine would gather at their secret hideout, John

0:25:53.320 --> 0:25:56.000
<v Speaker 1>and Bonnie's house and work on their plan.

0:25:56.640 --> 0:25:59.879
<v Speaker 2>It was a big house, big old Victorian house. We

0:26:00.359 --> 0:26:03.159
<v Speaker 2>had one room on the third floor that became the

0:26:03.200 --> 0:26:04.120
<v Speaker 2>planning room.

0:26:04.440 --> 0:26:08.439
<v Speaker 1>And almost perfect headquarters with a few small complications.

0:26:08.640 --> 0:26:11.280
<v Speaker 2>We had to tell our children to not to talk

0:26:11.320 --> 0:26:13.320
<v Speaker 2>about the maps that were up on the wall in

0:26:13.359 --> 0:26:15.680
<v Speaker 2>the room where we were meeting. Don't talk about the.

0:26:15.600 --> 0:26:18.200
<v Speaker 1>Maps now, sweetie, I know you used to be able

0:26:18.200 --> 0:26:20.720
<v Speaker 1>to go into that room on the third floor. But well,

0:26:20.920 --> 0:26:24.639
<v Speaker 1>mommy and daddy have we've gotten really into maps lately,

0:26:24.720 --> 0:26:28.119
<v Speaker 1>and you know, just maps of nearby towns and stuff.

0:26:28.160 --> 0:26:29.320
<v Speaker 1>Nothing you'd be interested in.

0:26:29.920 --> 0:26:32.520
<v Speaker 2>Don't talk about the people who sometimes stay overnight.

0:26:33.320 --> 0:26:36.840
<v Speaker 1>Sometimes mommies and daddies like to share maps with friends.

0:26:37.640 --> 0:26:40.280
<v Speaker 1>What what's with all the questions? Just go to bed.

0:26:41.720 --> 0:26:44.720
<v Speaker 1>Most nights, the Citizens Commission would gather at the Rains House.

0:26:45.040 --> 0:26:47.520
<v Speaker 1>The evenings began with dinner, more often than not, a

0:26:47.600 --> 0:26:49.879
<v Speaker 1>giant pot of spaghetti prepared by Bonnie.

0:26:50.160 --> 0:26:52.760
<v Speaker 2>John and I were kind of the grandparents of this group.

0:26:54.000 --> 0:26:56.359
<v Speaker 1>Then it was off to the scene of their planned crime,

0:26:56.600 --> 0:27:00.280
<v Speaker 1>the apartment building at one Veteran Square. Their mission was

0:27:00.320 --> 0:27:08.080
<v Speaker 1>to study every single detail about the office and its surroundings.

0:27:09.760 --> 0:27:13.960
<v Speaker 11>We cased the place for at least two maybe three months.

0:27:13.960 --> 0:27:19.720
<v Speaker 2>So we would case in pairs, usually male and female pairs,

0:27:20.480 --> 0:27:24.720
<v Speaker 2>because if there was any suspicion about us in the car,

0:27:25.240 --> 0:27:27.720
<v Speaker 2>if the police pulled up next to the car where

0:27:27.760 --> 0:27:30.639
<v Speaker 2>we were, we could pretend to be a couple.

0:27:31.280 --> 0:27:34.280
<v Speaker 9>Are there any beat copses at all in cars? What's

0:27:34.320 --> 0:27:37.479
<v Speaker 9>happening with the courthouse. You know, when are the traffic

0:27:37.560 --> 0:27:39.480
<v Speaker 9>jams in media and where.

0:27:39.520 --> 0:27:43.399
<v Speaker 2>The schedule of the agents in the FBI office, you know,

0:27:43.480 --> 0:27:46.280
<v Speaker 2>did they ever come in late at night back into

0:27:46.320 --> 0:27:49.359
<v Speaker 2>the office or not? And we learned that it was

0:27:49.880 --> 0:27:54.040
<v Speaker 2>they worked nine to five. They locked the door at

0:27:54.040 --> 0:27:58.679
<v Speaker 2>five and go home. Lest we forget, it's still a

0:27:58.760 --> 0:27:59.560
<v Speaker 2>government job.

0:28:00.440 --> 0:28:03.560
<v Speaker 9>Who else is going in and out where the police?

0:28:04.320 --> 0:28:08.600
<v Speaker 2>It was very time consuming and very tedious in some cases,

0:28:08.920 --> 0:28:12.960
<v Speaker 2>but important to see the patterns of.

0:28:13.160 --> 0:28:18.800
<v Speaker 1>Activity picture our perspective. Burglars paired off sitting in parked

0:28:18.800 --> 0:28:22.600
<v Speaker 1>cars in the middle of winter, cataloging everything that happened

0:28:22.640 --> 0:28:26.480
<v Speaker 1>in this sleepy town center night after night after night.

0:28:27.280 --> 0:28:33.960
<v Speaker 1>Two things were inevitable, One boredom and two.

0:28:33.520 --> 0:28:36.880
<v Speaker 10>Well, and Bob and I, you know, like all healthy,

0:28:36.960 --> 0:28:39.760
<v Speaker 10>lusty people, decided this would be a great time to

0:28:39.800 --> 0:28:44.240
<v Speaker 10>start an affair, you know, right in the fiery storm

0:28:44.280 --> 0:28:45.080
<v Speaker 10>of revolution.

0:28:45.440 --> 0:28:50.360
<v Speaker 12>You know, we did some kissing and necking while we

0:28:50.360 --> 0:28:53.520
<v Speaker 12>were kazing. We were just we were just both a

0:28:53.520 --> 0:28:54.560
<v Speaker 12>little horning, I guess.

0:28:58.080 --> 0:29:04.040
<v Speaker 1>Despite the judy, Bob and the others noticed one big problem.

0:29:04.120 --> 0:29:06.480
<v Speaker 1>A security guard was on duty around the clock in

0:29:06.520 --> 0:29:09.840
<v Speaker 1>the courthouse, monitoring the front entrance with a clear view

0:29:09.880 --> 0:29:11.960
<v Speaker 1>of the FBI office.

0:29:12.080 --> 0:29:15.920
<v Speaker 2>Both the courthouse itself was well lighted and this intersection

0:29:16.040 --> 0:29:19.760
<v Speaker 2>where the building was was well lighted. We could have

0:29:19.800 --> 0:29:22.640
<v Speaker 2>been observed, easily been observed going in or out of

0:29:22.680 --> 0:29:23.360
<v Speaker 2>the front door.

0:29:24.200 --> 0:29:27.080
<v Speaker 1>Doing anything to debilitate the guard was out of the question.

0:29:27.400 --> 0:29:31.440
<v Speaker 1>This was, after all, a group dedicated to nonviolence, attempting

0:29:31.520 --> 0:29:34.480
<v Speaker 1>to distract him would carry its own risks. In the

0:29:34.520 --> 0:29:38.200
<v Speaker 1>ideal burglary, nobody would notice anything out of the ordinary

0:29:38.280 --> 0:29:41.720
<v Speaker 1>at all. They determined early on that the doors to

0:29:41.800 --> 0:29:45.600
<v Speaker 1>one veteran Square were never locked, So the Citizens Commission

0:29:45.600 --> 0:29:48.920
<v Speaker 1>decided to look as ordinary as possible and bank on

0:29:49.000 --> 0:29:52.120
<v Speaker 1>playing it so cool that the guard would think nothing

0:29:52.160 --> 0:29:56.240
<v Speaker 1>of them. But the door to the office itself that

0:29:56.680 --> 0:30:00.320
<v Speaker 1>was a whole different story and would require a bit

0:30:00.360 --> 0:30:01.040
<v Speaker 1>of finagling.

0:30:02.720 --> 0:30:04.840
<v Speaker 9>I went to look at the locks fairly early in

0:30:04.880 --> 0:30:08.920
<v Speaker 9>the process, and the main door was just a door,

0:30:09.040 --> 0:30:11.000
<v Speaker 9>like on the front door of your house, same lock,

0:30:11.600 --> 0:30:15.320
<v Speaker 9>So I was like, not a problem. It's always puzzled

0:30:15.360 --> 0:30:18.640
<v Speaker 9>me why criminals don't learn lock picking, because it's really

0:30:18.680 --> 0:30:20.840
<v Speaker 9>not hard, and you can get through almost any door

0:30:20.880 --> 0:30:24.280
<v Speaker 9>in twenty seconds if you you know, are any good.

0:30:25.040 --> 0:30:29.440
<v Speaker 9>When I got my certificate, that would have made it

0:30:29.520 --> 0:30:32.080
<v Speaker 9>legal for me to go to a lock shop and

0:30:32.240 --> 0:30:38.040
<v Speaker 9>buy lock picks. But I was not that stupid. I

0:30:38.120 --> 0:30:41.160
<v Speaker 9>went to the hardware store and bought some spring steel,

0:30:41.200 --> 0:30:44.280
<v Speaker 9>and I already had a grinder and a file, and

0:30:44.360 --> 0:30:47.720
<v Speaker 9>I made my own so that they wouldn't be traceable.

0:30:49.640 --> 0:30:52.520
<v Speaker 1>The crew installed a practice door, a door to nowhere

0:30:52.680 --> 0:30:54.960
<v Speaker 1>up in the mysterious third floor room that was off

0:30:55.000 --> 0:30:56.640
<v Speaker 1>limits to John and Bonnie's children.

0:30:58.600 --> 0:31:01.040
<v Speaker 9>You can't really learn it by reading a book. It's

0:31:01.080 --> 0:31:03.880
<v Speaker 9>like playing a musical instrument. You know, you start very slow,

0:31:04.280 --> 0:31:06.920
<v Speaker 9>and you just do it over and over and over

0:31:07.120 --> 0:31:10.080
<v Speaker 9>and over and over. Take a break, come back the

0:31:10.120 --> 0:31:12.040
<v Speaker 9>next day. You do it over and over and over

0:31:12.080 --> 0:31:14.200
<v Speaker 9>and over again, the next day, the next day, the

0:31:14.240 --> 0:31:19.000
<v Speaker 9>next day, and you know, pretty soon you're in in

0:31:19.120 --> 0:31:20.640
<v Speaker 9>twenty to thirty seconds.

0:31:21.320 --> 0:31:24.040
<v Speaker 1>This went on for roughly two months. Even if you

0:31:24.080 --> 0:31:26.640
<v Speaker 1>spend some of that time making out with your accomplice.

0:31:27.120 --> 0:31:30.520
<v Speaker 1>That's a lot of long, monotonous evenings. But they found

0:31:30.560 --> 0:31:32.000
<v Speaker 1>ways to keep their spirits up.

0:31:33.040 --> 0:31:36.680
<v Speaker 2>Keith always made us laugh, and Bob, Bob Williamson was

0:31:36.720 --> 0:31:40.920
<v Speaker 2>a story. He would tell these ridiculous shaggy dogs, stories

0:31:40.960 --> 0:31:44.600
<v Speaker 2>and terrible jokes and puns, and a couple of them

0:31:44.600 --> 0:31:47.440
<v Speaker 2>were also musicians. So occasionally we take a break and

0:31:47.520 --> 0:31:50.040
<v Speaker 2>somebody bring out their guitar and we'd maybe sing a

0:31:50.040 --> 0:31:52.200
<v Speaker 2>little bit together, but some.

0:31:52.240 --> 0:31:53.520
<v Speaker 1>Joni Mitchell tuns or.

0:31:53.840 --> 0:31:55.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, all those old tunes.

0:31:59.120 --> 0:32:01.280
<v Speaker 1>The group was falling into a comfortable rhythm.

0:32:01.600 --> 0:32:05.160
<v Speaker 2>They would sleep on air mattresses sometimes in our house.

0:32:05.200 --> 0:32:08.600
<v Speaker 2>They would tell bedtime stories to our kids. So I mean,

0:32:08.600 --> 0:32:11.920
<v Speaker 2>we really we formed a sort of cohesion that was

0:32:12.120 --> 0:32:12.920
<v Speaker 2>pretty special.

0:32:13.640 --> 0:32:16.320
<v Speaker 1>When she looks back, Bonnie plays it pretty cool. But

0:32:16.680 --> 0:32:21.400
<v Speaker 1>imagine yourself in her and John's shoes, meticulously planning something

0:32:21.440 --> 0:32:24.360
<v Speaker 1>incredibly dangerous, unable to explain any of it to your

0:32:24.440 --> 0:32:28.600
<v Speaker 1>kids even though they're right there, and knowing the whole

0:32:28.640 --> 0:32:31.600
<v Speaker 1>time that going through with it could mean that you'll

0:32:31.600 --> 0:32:34.960
<v Speaker 1>spend the rest of their childhoods behind bars.

0:32:36.360 --> 0:32:40.280
<v Speaker 9>I remember being amazed. I guess is the best word.

0:32:40.400 --> 0:32:44.000
<v Speaker 9>That you know, John and Bonnie had small children. I'm like,

0:32:45.000 --> 0:32:47.080
<v Speaker 9>this is a whole different level of commitment.

0:32:49.040 --> 0:32:51.120
<v Speaker 10>I mean, that woman was you know, yeah, she was

0:32:51.200 --> 0:32:53.680
<v Speaker 10>part of the action, but she was just mothering the

0:32:53.720 --> 0:32:57.360
<v Speaker 10>hell out of us. And you know, being a young revolutionary.

0:32:57.400 --> 0:33:01.240
<v Speaker 10>I wasn't cooking, so her spaghetti was like a gift

0:33:01.680 --> 0:33:02.240
<v Speaker 10>from heaven.

0:33:04.400 --> 0:33:07.200
<v Speaker 2>Some of the time we were meeting together in our house,

0:33:07.600 --> 0:33:09.840
<v Speaker 2>I felt a little bit like a den mother because

0:33:09.880 --> 0:33:14.840
<v Speaker 2>I was cooking spaghetti and meatballs and basically in kind

0:33:14.840 --> 0:33:20.360
<v Speaker 2>of a supportive role, a secondary role. I definitely felt

0:33:20.360 --> 0:33:23.240
<v Speaker 2>that way, and that was true in the movement generally anyway.

0:33:23.280 --> 0:33:26.880
<v Speaker 2>It was very male dominated, and so I think I

0:33:26.960 --> 0:33:28.760
<v Speaker 2>was a little resentful about that.

0:33:29.680 --> 0:33:32.480
<v Speaker 1>But Bonnie's moment was about to come, because as the

0:33:32.480 --> 0:33:35.680
<v Speaker 1>weeks passed, the team realized that staring at the office

0:33:35.680 --> 0:33:39.120
<v Speaker 1>from the outside could only tell them so much. They

0:33:39.160 --> 0:33:53.640
<v Speaker 1>had to get eyes on the inside. The team had

0:33:53.680 --> 0:33:56.400
<v Speaker 1>been casing the media office for months, but they were

0:33:56.400 --> 0:33:59.200
<v Speaker 1>still missing crucial details like how many ways into the

0:33:59.240 --> 0:34:02.080
<v Speaker 1>office were there, Was there an alarm system, and if so,

0:34:02.160 --> 0:34:05.520
<v Speaker 1>could it be disabled? How many signed photos of JEdgar

0:34:05.520 --> 0:34:09.719
<v Speaker 1>Hoover dotted the office walls, any JEdgar Hoover bobbleheads in there?

0:34:10.560 --> 0:34:13.759
<v Speaker 1>To get answers, someone had to go inside.

0:34:16.600 --> 0:34:21.680
<v Speaker 2>My role emerged at that point, and I could pose

0:34:21.760 --> 0:34:24.440
<v Speaker 2>as a college student to ask for a meeting with

0:34:24.560 --> 0:34:26.239
<v Speaker 2>the head of the office.

0:34:26.480 --> 0:34:29.480
<v Speaker 1>So Bonnie Rains called the FBI and scheduled a meeting.

0:34:29.880 --> 0:34:31.759
<v Speaker 2>When I asked for the interview, I said that I

0:34:31.880 --> 0:34:35.960
<v Speaker 2>was a student doing research on opportunities for women in

0:34:36.000 --> 0:34:39.200
<v Speaker 2>the FBI. I was gratified that I finally had a

0:34:39.280 --> 0:34:43.400
<v Speaker 2>speaking part. Not just a walk in part, but a

0:34:43.440 --> 0:34:44.279
<v Speaker 2>speaking part.

0:34:45.000 --> 0:34:48.680
<v Speaker 1>You're not a background actor anymore. You're in the movie.

0:34:49.600 --> 0:34:52.440
<v Speaker 2>I had long hippie hair, so we knew that we

0:34:52.560 --> 0:34:54.799
<v Speaker 2>had to figure out how to make me look not

0:34:54.920 --> 0:34:59.319
<v Speaker 2>anything like I looked in my regular life. It was February,

0:34:59.480 --> 0:35:02.560
<v Speaker 2>so I tucked my long hair up inside of a

0:35:02.840 --> 0:35:07.320
<v Speaker 2>big winter hat, and I found this kind of nerdy

0:35:07.480 --> 0:35:11.000
<v Speaker 2>winter coat. I looked a little bit like a college

0:35:11.000 --> 0:35:13.080
<v Speaker 2>student who bought her clothes at thrift stores.

0:35:14.239 --> 0:35:17.160
<v Speaker 1>This was the Citizens Commission's only chance to get a

0:35:17.200 --> 0:35:19.800
<v Speaker 1>complete picture of the office they were planning to burgle.

0:35:20.520 --> 0:35:26.360
<v Speaker 1>I love that word burgel. Every detail was important, but

0:35:26.440 --> 0:35:29.120
<v Speaker 1>it was also the riskiest thing they'd ever done. Sitting

0:35:29.160 --> 0:35:32.160
<v Speaker 1>outside an FBI office night after night was definitely kind

0:35:32.160 --> 0:35:35.880
<v Speaker 1>of sketchy. But going right into the belly of the

0:35:35.920 --> 0:35:40.880
<v Speaker 1>beast in disguise, well that's a whole different ballgame.

0:35:42.080 --> 0:35:45.960
<v Speaker 2>John drove me in our station wagon with our little boy, Nathan,

0:35:46.200 --> 0:35:49.160
<v Speaker 2>who was two at the time. They dropped me off

0:35:49.200 --> 0:35:51.759
<v Speaker 2>and then they pulled around the corner to wait for

0:35:51.800 --> 0:35:54.160
<v Speaker 2>me because I had to say that I had come

0:35:54.200 --> 0:35:55.160
<v Speaker 2>on the bus.

0:35:55.920 --> 0:35:58.480
<v Speaker 1>She walked into the cramped entryway of one Veteran Square

0:35:58.520 --> 0:36:01.480
<v Speaker 1>and up the carpeted steps to the second floor. She

0:36:01.600 --> 0:36:03.680
<v Speaker 1>entered the office and her receptionist told her to wait.

0:36:04.480 --> 0:36:07.560
<v Speaker 1>As she waited, she did her best to memorize every

0:36:07.680 --> 0:36:09.120
<v Speaker 1>detail of her surroundings.

0:36:10.400 --> 0:36:13.880
<v Speaker 2>There were no cameras, there were no alarms over the doors.

0:36:15.040 --> 0:36:18.480
<v Speaker 2>I couldn't see any security measures whatsoever.

0:36:20.920 --> 0:36:27.680
<v Speaker 1>Okay, note to self, security cameras deter robbers go on.

0:36:29.000 --> 0:36:33.640
<v Speaker 2>The building manager's office was right below the FBI office,

0:36:33.920 --> 0:36:36.719
<v Speaker 2>so I was glad to see. There was carpeting on the.

0:36:36.680 --> 0:36:41.200
<v Speaker 1>Floor, carpeting, muffles, footsteps.

0:36:40.840 --> 0:36:43.960
<v Speaker 2>Lots of file cabinets. I wore glasses. I don't know

0:36:43.960 --> 0:36:45.920
<v Speaker 2>who lent them to me, but I didn't wear glasses

0:36:45.960 --> 0:36:49.400
<v Speaker 2>at the time, but I had glasses on and I

0:36:49.440 --> 0:36:52.200
<v Speaker 2>couldn't see very well with those glasses on them, but

0:36:52.360 --> 0:36:55.800
<v Speaker 2>that helped disguise my identity pretty well.

0:36:57.040 --> 0:37:01.480
<v Speaker 1>Never trust someone in glasses. Wait a second, I.

0:37:01.400 --> 0:37:02.480
<v Speaker 4>Wear glasses.

0:37:03.840 --> 0:37:06.800
<v Speaker 1>Right where were we Eventually the g man in charge

0:37:06.920 --> 0:37:10.360
<v Speaker 1>ushered this meek, little student reporter into his office.

0:37:11.160 --> 0:37:13.719
<v Speaker 2>He was even a little flirty with me, I remember that,

0:37:15.200 --> 0:37:18.600
<v Speaker 2>and seemed to be flattered that I was really interested

0:37:18.719 --> 0:37:24.360
<v Speaker 2>in in the FBI and interested in that interview. I

0:37:24.520 --> 0:37:29.320
<v Speaker 2>was very chatty, a little bit flirty, and very grateful

0:37:29.400 --> 0:37:32.560
<v Speaker 2>for the information that he gave me, And it was

0:37:32.600 --> 0:37:36.479
<v Speaker 2>all just very friendly, and he never asked my name.

0:37:38.360 --> 0:37:41.280
<v Speaker 1>For Christ's sake, the average dentist's office has a sign

0:37:41.320 --> 0:37:44.520
<v Speaker 1>in sheet. But I guess he was flustered. These guys

0:37:44.520 --> 0:37:47.080
<v Speaker 1>spend most of their time filling out paperwork and triplicate

0:37:47.120 --> 0:37:50.160
<v Speaker 1>to please Hoover. It's not every day a girl comes

0:37:50.160 --> 0:37:52.160
<v Speaker 1>into the office and wants to know about your big

0:37:52.200 --> 0:37:53.000
<v Speaker 1>important job.

0:37:53.719 --> 0:37:55.919
<v Speaker 2>At some point in the chat, he asked me where

0:37:55.920 --> 0:37:59.839
<v Speaker 2>I was from, and I came up with I said heart.

0:38:01.160 --> 0:38:03.680
<v Speaker 2>I don't know why I said Hartford, but I wasn't

0:38:03.680 --> 0:38:06.600
<v Speaker 2>going to say Philadelphia. I'm Hartford.

0:38:07.719 --> 0:38:10.720
<v Speaker 1>Luckily, for Bonnie, nobody really wants to chat about Hartford.

0:38:11.560 --> 0:38:14.400
<v Speaker 2>I asked if I could have an application of sample

0:38:14.440 --> 0:38:18.120
<v Speaker 2>application form for employment, and he went to the file

0:38:18.200 --> 0:38:20.960
<v Speaker 2>cabinet to get it, and I could see that the

0:38:21.000 --> 0:38:23.200
<v Speaker 2>file cabinets were not locked.

0:38:25.480 --> 0:38:27.960
<v Speaker 1>Come on, there had to be something in the FBI

0:38:28.000 --> 0:38:32.239
<v Speaker 1>handbook about locking file cabinets. As Bonnie wondered how these

0:38:32.280 --> 0:38:35.719
<v Speaker 1>agents could be so dumb, John waited outside by the

0:38:35.760 --> 0:38:38.480
<v Speaker 1>car with an increasingly restless.

0:38:38.040 --> 0:38:41.840
<v Speaker 2>Toddler, Nathan, I'm sure was saying, where's mommy, Where's mommy?

0:38:41.840 --> 0:38:46.480
<v Speaker 2>Why is it taking so long? I think an actress

0:38:46.520 --> 0:38:49.600
<v Speaker 2>mode kicked in, and that's the only way I can

0:38:49.600 --> 0:38:53.680
<v Speaker 2>describe it. I just got into the role. I wasn't

0:38:53.800 --> 0:38:56.480
<v Speaker 2>nervous at all. I had an important job to do

0:38:57.280 --> 0:38:59.720
<v Speaker 2>and I really wanted to accomplish it, and they didn't

0:38:59.760 --> 0:39:03.400
<v Speaker 2>do it anything to make me feel nervous either. And

0:39:03.440 --> 0:39:07.160
<v Speaker 2>then there was a third room beyond his office, and

0:39:07.200 --> 0:39:11.800
<v Speaker 2>when I was getting ready to leave, I pretended to

0:39:12.760 --> 0:39:15.920
<v Speaker 2>be confused about the way out, and so that gave

0:39:15.960 --> 0:39:19.520
<v Speaker 2>me a chance to go into the third office, thinking

0:39:19.520 --> 0:39:22.080
<v Speaker 2>that that was the way that I would leave, And

0:39:22.120 --> 0:39:24.919
<v Speaker 2>that gave me the chance to see another door from

0:39:24.960 --> 0:39:28.440
<v Speaker 2>the hallway in that third office, and that the door

0:39:28.560 --> 0:39:32.480
<v Speaker 2>was blocked by this huge metal file cabinet.

0:39:34.280 --> 0:39:38.000
<v Speaker 1>Let's recap. The office consisted of two rooms, no alarm system,

0:39:38.080 --> 0:39:41.440
<v Speaker 1>no cameras, the floor was carpeted and quiet to walk on.

0:39:42.239 --> 0:39:44.720
<v Speaker 1>There were two ways in and out, the main door

0:39:45.120 --> 0:39:47.799
<v Speaker 1>and a second one, which was clearly not in use,

0:39:47.960 --> 0:39:51.640
<v Speaker 1>as it was blocked by a heavy filing cabinet. Later on,

0:39:52.040 --> 0:39:55.840
<v Speaker 1>she'd be very glad she clocked that second door, but

0:39:55.960 --> 0:39:58.839
<v Speaker 1>for now, she dashed around the corner and got into

0:39:58.840 --> 0:40:00.680
<v Speaker 1>the car where John and Nathan and we're waiting.

0:40:02.080 --> 0:40:05.760
<v Speaker 2>I was just so elated that I was able to

0:40:05.800 --> 0:40:08.400
<v Speaker 2>determine the things that we needed to have determined about it.

0:40:08.440 --> 0:40:11.920
<v Speaker 2>I was just I felt very satisfied that this was

0:40:11.960 --> 0:40:16.560
<v Speaker 2>now probably going to enable us to move forward in

0:40:16.600 --> 0:40:19.920
<v Speaker 2>the way that we wanted to. I felt that that

0:40:20.080 --> 0:40:23.640
<v Speaker 2>was our green light. It was a green light for us,

0:40:24.320 --> 0:40:26.400
<v Speaker 2>and the only thing we had to do after that

0:40:26.640 --> 0:40:38.560
<v Speaker 2>was to establish the date for the burglary.

0:40:38.719 --> 0:40:41.360
<v Speaker 1>None of the members of the Citizens Commission to Investigate

0:40:41.400 --> 0:40:44.880
<v Speaker 1>the FBI remember precisely how they settled on the moment

0:40:44.960 --> 0:40:48.239
<v Speaker 1>to strike, but that might be because it was kind

0:40:48.280 --> 0:40:49.160
<v Speaker 1>of a no brainer.

0:40:49.840 --> 0:40:53.319
<v Speaker 9>Somebody wasn't me. Somebody suggested, what about the night of

0:40:53.360 --> 0:40:57.000
<v Speaker 9>the Ali Fraser fight, And it was like a brilliant suggestion.

0:40:57.840 --> 0:41:00.719
<v Speaker 11>We knew that's all they were going to attention to,

0:41:01.960 --> 0:41:05.680
<v Speaker 11>and we timed it. We knew time the fight would start,

0:41:06.680 --> 0:41:08.600
<v Speaker 11>so we timed the entry for.

0:41:08.600 --> 0:41:13.719
<v Speaker 1>That bingo March eighth. Months of casing, endless hours of

0:41:13.800 --> 0:41:17.879
<v Speaker 1>lock picking practice, dozens of makeout sessions, I'm guessing, and

0:41:18.080 --> 0:41:22.359
<v Speaker 1>one acting masterclass from Bonnie Rains. It was all leading

0:41:22.480 --> 0:41:25.560
<v Speaker 1>up to this one night. The team had thought of everything,

0:41:25.880 --> 0:41:28.759
<v Speaker 1>avoided all loose ends, and played their cards close to

0:41:28.800 --> 0:41:33.720
<v Speaker 1>the vest. Everything was perfect, and.

0:41:33.280 --> 0:41:36.080
<v Speaker 2>Then one of the members of the group dropped out.

0:41:40.120 --> 0:41:43.759
<v Speaker 2>We just didn't see it coming because it seemed to

0:41:43.840 --> 0:41:46.359
<v Speaker 2>us that Bill had recruited the nine of us very

0:41:46.440 --> 0:41:49.840
<v Speaker 2>very carefully, and he had a history with the movement.

0:41:50.440 --> 0:41:54.080
<v Speaker 1>Less than a week before March eighth, the ninth burglar bailed.

0:41:54.680 --> 0:41:59.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, that was very, very very disturbing, and he really

0:41:59.520 --> 0:42:01.960
<v Speaker 2>couldn't give us a reason.

0:42:02.719 --> 0:42:05.680
<v Speaker 1>Maybe his ideology shifted, or maybe he just decided he

0:42:05.719 --> 0:42:08.960
<v Speaker 1>didn't want to risk going to prison. Frankly, there are

0:42:09.000 --> 0:42:13.120
<v Speaker 1>plenty of legitimate reasons not to burglarize the FBI, but

0:42:13.719 --> 0:42:17.880
<v Speaker 1>he didn't give one. Was he a plant? Had he flipped?

0:42:18.560 --> 0:42:21.840
<v Speaker 1>The possibilities were terrifying, and so was the prospect of

0:42:21.880 --> 0:42:25.840
<v Speaker 1>carrying on without him. The crew had been obsessively careful

0:42:25.840 --> 0:42:29.440
<v Speaker 1>about keeping their action under wraps. They'd lied to family,

0:42:29.640 --> 0:42:33.040
<v Speaker 1>made excuses to friends, and had cover stories ready to

0:42:33.080 --> 0:42:36.640
<v Speaker 1>go if anyone noticed them casing. But now someone who

0:42:36.719 --> 0:42:44.000
<v Speaker 1>knew their plan in intimate detail was at large. If

0:42:44.040 --> 0:42:46.000
<v Speaker 1>I'd been Bonnie Rain's at that moment, I would have

0:42:46.040 --> 0:42:49.200
<v Speaker 1>just told everyone, Okay, thanks, it's been fun, but it's over.

0:42:49.600 --> 0:42:51.840
<v Speaker 1>Get out of my house, take your maps, your homemade

0:42:51.880 --> 0:42:54.880
<v Speaker 1>lock pecks with you. But she didn't back out, and

0:42:55.000 --> 0:42:58.440
<v Speaker 1>neither did any of the others. As paranoid as they were,

0:42:58.640 --> 0:43:01.680
<v Speaker 1>or in my opinion, should have been, Bonnie says, they

0:43:01.800 --> 0:43:04.880
<v Speaker 1>just accepted it as another inevitable risk of their plan.

0:43:05.400 --> 0:43:10.080
<v Speaker 2>We couldn't control him really once he left the group,

0:43:11.080 --> 0:43:13.320
<v Speaker 2>but we had to hope that there was a loyalty

0:43:13.800 --> 0:43:15.880
<v Speaker 2>to us, that he was not going to say anything

0:43:15.920 --> 0:43:20.040
<v Speaker 2>to anyone about about his involvement in the action. We

0:43:20.040 --> 0:43:21.160
<v Speaker 2>were very worried about that.

0:43:25.320 --> 0:43:29.440
<v Speaker 1>Next on SNAFU, It's go time, A'll leave versus Fraser

0:43:29.719 --> 0:43:33.399
<v Speaker 1>David versus Goliath, the greatest law enforcement agency in the

0:43:33.440 --> 0:43:39.960
<v Speaker 1>world versus nine scratch that, eight amateur burglars with everything

0:43:40.040 --> 0:43:40.560
<v Speaker 1>to lose.

0:43:41.800 --> 0:43:44.239
<v Speaker 9>I'm like, well, that was either the FBI or the

0:43:44.280 --> 0:43:47.680
<v Speaker 9>heating system, and there's only one way to find out which.

0:43:48.800 --> 0:43:52.840
<v Speaker 10>I remember thinking, I'm not breathing, but I've got to

0:43:52.840 --> 0:43:54.520
<v Speaker 10>be breathing because I'm functioning.

0:43:55.600 --> 0:43:56.960
<v Speaker 1>Security imagineers taken.

0:43:57.040 --> 0:43:58.680
<v Speaker 14>The people are coming on the ring.

0:44:00.080 --> 0:44:01.200
<v Speaker 1>Supposed to have them.

0:44:01.520 --> 0:44:03.560
<v Speaker 2>There was no Plan B. I mean, there was just

0:44:03.640 --> 0:44:04.200
<v Speaker 2>no Plan B.

0:44:06.239 --> 0:44:09.840
<v Speaker 1>Snafu is a production of iHeartRadio, Film, Nation Entertainment, and

0:44:09.880 --> 0:44:14.279
<v Speaker 1>Pacific Electric Picture Company in association with Gilded Audio. This

0:44:14.360 --> 0:44:16.839
<v Speaker 1>season of Snaffoo is based on the book The Burglary,

0:44:16.920 --> 0:44:20.399
<v Speaker 1>The Discovery of Jay Edgar Hoover's Secret FBI, written by

0:44:20.400 --> 0:44:25.279
<v Speaker 1>Betty Metzger. It's executive produced by me Ed Helms, Milan Papelka,

0:44:25.520 --> 0:44:29.760
<v Speaker 1>Mike Valbo, Whitney Donaldson, Andy Chug, Dylan Fagan, and Betty Metzger.

0:44:30.400 --> 0:44:34.320
<v Speaker 1>Our lead producers are Sarah Joyner and Alyssa Martino. Producer

0:44:34.400 --> 0:44:37.719
<v Speaker 1>is Stephen Wood. This episode was written by Albert Chen,

0:44:37.840 --> 0:44:40.520
<v Speaker 1>Sarah Joyner and Stephen Wood, with additional writing and story

0:44:40.600 --> 0:44:44.160
<v Speaker 1>editing from Alissa Martino and Ed Helms. Tory Smith is

0:44:44.160 --> 0:44:47.800
<v Speaker 1>our associate producer. Nevin Calla Poly is our production assistant.

0:44:48.320 --> 0:44:52.280
<v Speaker 1>Fact checking by Charles Richter. Our creative executive is Brett Harris.

0:44:52.640 --> 0:44:56.720
<v Speaker 1>Sensitivity console from Olowa Kemi Ala De Sui, editing, sound

0:44:56.719 --> 0:44:59.879
<v Speaker 1>design and original music by Ben Chubg, Engineering and tech

0:45:00.280 --> 0:45:04.240
<v Speaker 1>direction by Nick Dooley. Additional editing from Kelsey Albright, Olivia

0:45:04.320 --> 0:45:08.240
<v Speaker 1>Canny and Jimma Castelli. Foley theme music by Dan Rosatto.

0:45:08.760 --> 0:45:12.240
<v Speaker 1>Special thanks to Alison Cohen, Daniel Welsh and Ben Rzak.

0:45:12.480 --> 0:45:15.520
<v Speaker 1>Additional thanks to director Joanna Hamilton for letting us use

0:45:15.520 --> 0:45:19.120
<v Speaker 1>some of the original interviews from her incredible documentary nineteen

0:45:19.200 --> 0:45:24.040
<v Speaker 1>seventy one. Finally, our deepest gratitude to the courageous Citizens

0:45:24.040 --> 0:45:28.480
<v Speaker 1>Commission to Investigate the FBI, Bill Davidon, Ralph Daniel, Judy

0:45:28.520 --> 0:45:33.160
<v Speaker 1>fine Gold, Keith Forsyth, Bonnie Rains, John Rains, Sarah Schumer

0:45:33.640 --> 0:45:34.839
<v Speaker 1>and Bob Williamson.