1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, A production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio Happy Friday. I'm Tracy V. Wilson and I'm 3 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:18,319 Speaker 1: Holly Frye. This weeep. We talked about the nineteen forty 4 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 1: six Oakland General strike. You sure did. I do want 5 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,479 Speaker 1: to say again, I would love at some point to 6 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 1: do an episode on the women's day off in Iceland 7 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy five. The very basics are around easily 8 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 1: accessible in English. I feel like that episode would be 9 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 1: best if we had a lot more detail about, like 10 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:40,920 Speaker 1: how it was organized and how it was planned, because 11 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:46,160 Speaker 1: it was not a situation where somebody said ladies were 12 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:49,440 Speaker 1: not working this day right then, and then like someone 13 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:52,240 Speaker 1: flipped a switch, the women didn't work that day. Like 14 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 1: there's a whole organizing and planning effort, and the details 15 00:00:55,960 --> 00:01:00,440 Speaker 1: of that I think do exist in icelandic so much 16 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 1: in English, though, at least at this moment when we're recording. 17 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:07,880 Speaker 1: So while this episode was something that I chose in 18 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:10,319 Speaker 1: part because we cannot do this one, I was also 19 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 1: really interested in this on its own merits. To be 20 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 1: very clear, I was really interested in how much of 21 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:23,959 Speaker 1: the focus was on workers in retail trying to organize 22 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: because we still have a lot of workers in retail 23 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: and a lot of workers in food service trying to 24 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: organize today in the world that we're living in. And 25 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:38,400 Speaker 1: then also it being the last really major general strike 26 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: before Taft Hartley, I wanted to tell that story. Also, 27 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 1: something I found frustrating and the research process of this 28 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 1: was I found a lot of quotes from people who 29 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 1: were active or were leaders in the other unions that 30 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 1: went on strike to support the retail work during the 31 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:05,120 Speaker 1: general strike. I really did not find people talking to 32 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 1: those retail workers and their union leaders. I think I 33 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:15,680 Speaker 1: found at most one or two quotes that came up 34 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: in the context of a documentary, and then when I 35 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 1: went back to try to find them to be like, 36 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: can I find out more about this person, I had 37 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 1: lost track of where specifically I had found those couple 38 00:02:29,880 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 1: of quotes, and everything else was primarily quotes from people 39 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:39,640 Speaker 1: in other unions who like that's part of the story too. 40 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 1: But I do wish we had I had I had 41 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:47,839 Speaker 1: been able to find more things from the retail workers 42 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 1: whose strike really started this whole thing. I have a 43 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 1: theory that had a lot more women in that one, 44 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 1: right didn't the retail workers have more women, So it 45 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,760 Speaker 1: was probably like, we want to talk to menfolk, not 46 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 1: the lab Well, so yeah, a lot of the when 47 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 1: I did find like statements from the union, a lot 48 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 1: of times they were statements from the attorney who was 49 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: a man, or they were statements from management from the 50 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: store who were men, or they were statements that were 51 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: sort of a statement from the union that did not 52 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:26,519 Speaker 1: name a specific person as a spokesperson. Right, So yeah, 53 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: I like gender was specifically a part of it, and 54 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 1: the fact that this was a union effort that was 55 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: largely led by women was also something that made this, 56 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 1: you know, really interesting story to me because a lot 57 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: of the stories that we have told about labor rights 58 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: and unionizing and strikes, a lot of those have been 59 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:54,480 Speaker 1: unions that were either primarily or exclusively men at the time. 60 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 1: So we've done a lot of strikes about railroad workers 61 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 1: and auto workers, and we've talked about how all of 62 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 1: those strikes were only possible because of the efforts of women, 63 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: sometimes intentionally organized women's auxiliaries to do things like support 64 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:17,920 Speaker 1: the striking workers, keep everybody fed, keep everybody sheltered and clothed, 65 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: and all of that while the strike was going on. 66 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 1: But we have not had as many episodes that are 67 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:28,000 Speaker 1: like about the women themselves at their workplace organizing. Right. 68 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 1: The one thing I can think of off the top 69 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:33,479 Speaker 1: of my head is the London match Girls strike, which 70 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: we have covered on the show before. Yeah, this is 71 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:43,280 Speaker 1: another one of those where I'm it makes me go, yeah, 72 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: we haven't made any progress. Yeah, Yeah, I'm not laughing 73 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 1: that we haven't made any progress. I'm laughing at the 74 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:58,280 Speaker 1: absurdity of the human condition. You know, We'll keep trying. Yeah, 75 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:03,560 Speaker 1: we'll keep trying. Having been through the whole process of 76 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: organizing a workplace and bargaining our first union contract, sometimes 77 00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 1: when I read about, you know, historical union efforts, sometimes 78 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: I'm like, yep, that feels so familiar. I will say 79 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: that in the this wave of strikes that happened in 80 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 1: the nineteen forties overall did not have as much violence 81 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:32,360 Speaker 1: as some of the earlier strike waves that we have 82 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:35,839 Speaker 1: talked about, Because we've talked a lot about ones in 83 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,919 Speaker 1: which the National Guard or some other force was like 84 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 1: called out to deal with this strike and that it 85 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 1: led to injuries and even deaths. Right, this one did 86 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,719 Speaker 1: not seem to have an escalation of violence, even though 87 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: there were some unfortunate parts of it. Yeah, I read 88 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 1: or I got access to a paper that talked a 89 00:05:57,160 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 1: little bit about why that is, and after reading it, 90 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 1: I was like, I don't feel like I feel like 91 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: this was kind of speculative in some of its reasoning 92 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: about why this particular wave of strikes did not have 93 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: the level of violence that some earlier ones did. So 94 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 1: I did not try to get into that in the 95 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 1: episode itself because I did not feel like I had 96 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:26,480 Speaker 1: a good that becomes like a whole other sociology examination 97 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: of like group behavior and leveraging of power that's not 98 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 1: necessarily about the labor movement anymore, right, Right, There's some 99 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: greater societal patterns involved. So yeah, I am glad that 100 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: I got this one up to the top of my list. 101 00:06:49,960 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 1: Me too. We had our live show from Indiana Comic 102 00:07:02,279 --> 00:07:08,400 Speaker 1: Con about Kurt Vonnaget this week. Yes, yes, oh, Kurt Vonneguet. Yeah, 103 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: you blessing upon us all. Yeah, it was really really 104 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 1: nice to revisit his work. In preparation for this, I 105 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 1: finally got to see Robert White's documentary about him that 106 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 1: he had been working on for decades on and off 107 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 1: as they became close friends, which was very moving. Yeah, 108 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 1: it was lovely. I'm now re listening to all of 109 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 1: his stuff in order on audiobook, so it's just a 110 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 1: I'm in mckurt era apparently again. One of the things 111 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 1: we mentioned going into that show was how a lot 112 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: of people find Kurt Vonnegut as teenagers, right and how 113 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: they really connect to him, And I mentioned it in 114 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: the show when we record this. I haven't heard the 115 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:00,120 Speaker 1: final edit, so I don't know if it's still in 116 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:02,160 Speaker 1: there or not, but I will invoke a completely other 117 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: author in why I think that's the case. Okay, there 118 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: was a great interview with shel Silverstein that I think 119 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:13,720 Speaker 1: ran on NPR a while back where he said someone 120 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: asked him why do kids love your books so much? 121 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:20,080 Speaker 1: And he said, because I don't bs them, sure, like 122 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: I'm straightforward with kids. I don't lie to them ever, 123 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: I think he said bys but in the actual, you know, 124 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 1: setout version, which would include swearing. And I think Kravoniget 125 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: is the same like for teenagers that come to him. 126 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: It feels like an adult in the literary world who 127 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,320 Speaker 1: is very direct and does not mess around and tells 128 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: the truth, even through very fantastical stories. Yeah, which is 129 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: very it's very nice to have to not unpick like, oh, 130 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: the allegory of blah blah blah, which is not to 131 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 1: say any of that is bad in literature, but when 132 00:08:56,400 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 1: you're a teenager to be like, oh, this is a 133 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 1: very decorated literary person and he's just directly telling me 134 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:06,560 Speaker 1: what is going on right on and sharing some very 135 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:11,319 Speaker 1: real truths, it's very refreshing. Yeah, yeah, I loved it. 136 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 1: I did not happen to discover Kurt Vonnegut as a teen, 137 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: and I could not one hundred percent confidently tell you 138 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: whether it was college or immediately post college, like in 139 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 1: very early twenties, very first living on my own land. 140 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 1: But I don't think I was a teen. I don't 141 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 1: remember reading any Vonnegut in high school, but I do 142 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: remember by the early twenties years, like I vividly remember 143 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 1: reading Slaughterhouse five for the first time and just being 144 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: enraptured by what I was reading. Yeah. Yeah, I carried 145 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: around a copy of Kat's Cradle I think for two 146 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 1: years straight in high school. Now I am like it 147 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 1: was always in my per to the point that it 148 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 1: was like a joke because it was one of those 149 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 1: small size, mass market paperbacks, like the famous cover that 150 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,559 Speaker 1: everybody sees that's just the the the orange with the 151 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 1: art on it. And then I also had the similar 152 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 1: series Breakfast Champions, also jangled around in my purser backpack 153 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 1: most of the time, and then Slaughterhouse Five for quite 154 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,320 Speaker 1: a while. One of the things I love about his 155 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 1: work is how he how interconnected A lot of it is. 156 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:33,559 Speaker 1: It's not none of the words that we would associate 157 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 1: with someone who is creating a whole fictional world, like 158 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: a George R. R. Martin or you know, even a 159 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,840 Speaker 1: George Lucas or even a you know, I'm forgetting the 160 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:48,080 Speaker 1: name of the woman who wrote the Twilight books because 161 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 1: those are not my jam But anyway, like that idea 162 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 1: of like world building and like we're putting together this 163 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:56,440 Speaker 1: entire world and everything, and his did that, but nobody 164 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:59,200 Speaker 1: was ever really talking about it, all right, And part 165 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 1: of it was I think also that he self inserted 166 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 1: quite literally, right in some ways, Billy Pilgrim is his 167 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 1: self insert and Slaughterhouse five as he works through the 168 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 1: trauma of having gone through the war. But then there 169 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: are a lot of times where it's like, Hi, it's Kurt. 170 00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 1: I bet you're wondering why I wrote this this way, 171 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: let me tell you, And and I think that is 172 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: wildly charming. Yeah. I had a discussion with someone during 173 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 1: the convention, like over dinner one of my friends, where 174 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 1: we were debating over whether some of the things that 175 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:41,440 Speaker 1: Kurt Vonnaget said in his lifetime come off as sexist 176 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 1: or not. Okay, and I see how many could be 177 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 1: interpreted that way. He would talk a lot about whether 178 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 1: women were pretty or not, blah blah blah, and like 179 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 1: you know how he was secretly in love with almost 180 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:58,479 Speaker 1: every woman he worked with. But it never felt disrespectful 181 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:01,200 Speaker 1: in the way that I associate sexism with. And it 182 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 1: was never super crass, you know what I mean. It 183 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:11,479 Speaker 1: was never like so I feel like no, but but 184 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:13,080 Speaker 1: but I see where people could get that way, and 185 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna you know, yeah, yeah, ever, you know, 186 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:20,080 Speaker 1: tell somebody they're wrong for their interpretation. We did not 187 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 1: talk about in the episode that we recorded it Indiana 188 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 1: Comic Con because you have limited time, you know, even 189 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 1: more so like when we record our show, if we 190 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 1: run long, fine, I cannot run long when you have 191 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 1: more panelists coming into the room. The room, Yeah, I 192 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,559 Speaker 1: get the heck out of there. So we didn't get 193 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,240 Speaker 1: time to talk about Ida Young, which is a pity, 194 00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: and I feel like she just would have merited more 195 00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:48,720 Speaker 1: time than a quick This is a person, but she 196 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: was a person that Kurt vonna Get invoked many times 197 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:58,920 Speaker 1: in interviews as being the person who raised him and 198 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 1: gave him his sense of morality and his ideology about 199 00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 1: always caring about others. And that was a black woman 200 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 1: who was the housekeeper in his family home and the cook. 201 00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: And her name was Ada Young. And she even in 202 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: the Vonnegut Museum and Library, which is in Indianapolis and 203 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: is a really lovely space. There's a whole area that's 204 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,200 Speaker 1: just about Ida's influence on him and how important that was. 205 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 1: And I really love that she gets included in that story. 206 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 1: And like I said, there's not enough time and a 207 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 1: short thing to like go down the rabbit hole of 208 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,280 Speaker 1: who she was and whatnot. So I want to do 209 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: more research on her and see what I can find, 210 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 1: because you know, surely she had a life outside of 211 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:58,440 Speaker 1: the Vonna Get home. I always marvel at how in 212 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 1: interviews he would say all of the horrible things that 213 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: happened to him were fine, they didn't really bother him. 214 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: And I'm like, have you read your own books? Maybe 215 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 1: yes they did, They're on the page. Yeah, there's a 216 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 1: really good interview in that Whitey documentary, which is pretty 217 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:19,600 Speaker 1: easy to get a hold of. I think I found 218 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: it on Amazon Prime, but there are other places you 219 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 1: can find it as well, where he's talking about some 220 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 1: of those experiences and he's saying the words of like 221 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 1: it's fine, it was all fine. It didn't really bother 222 00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: me at the time, but his eyes like tell a 223 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:39,200 Speaker 1: whole other story. He kind of gets the thousand yard 224 00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: stare and he looks very morose for a moment before 225 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 1: he picks up and makes a joke. And I'm marvel 226 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: that he never cared to let on that his whole 227 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: life was kind of like his whole career really was 228 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 1: him dealing with trauma with trauma and the only way 229 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: he knew which was to write about it as like 230 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:05,040 Speaker 1: another person's event, just its own sociological fascination. YEAHR Vonniet, 231 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: I love you. I unlike what happens sometimes when one 232 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,200 Speaker 1: of us has done an interview and the other one 233 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 1: was not there for the interview. This is a case 234 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: where I actually have listened to the episode before coming 235 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 1: in here to record the behind the scenes. I really 236 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 1: enjoyed listening to this. I enjoyed how clearly you and 237 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 1: Brian are both talking about someone who's work you love 238 00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 1: so dearly. Yeah, and we're also interested in, like telling 239 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:35,400 Speaker 1: the truth of his story as a person. I liked 240 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: it a lot. Yeah. I mean, he's a fun one 241 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 1: to talk about because he was such a character and 242 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 1: I certainly would not say he you know, he was 243 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 1: a human, Like I said, there were discussions about whether 244 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: or not the things some of the things he said 245 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: were sexist at the con, but he he was so 246 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: focused on wanting to find ways to teach people the 247 00:15:59,080 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 1: ideas of like loving your fellow man should be your 248 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 1: highest calling. Ever that he's a nice one to talk 249 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:09,920 Speaker 1: about in that regard, Yeah, there's no surprise. Oh and 250 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 1: he actually, you know, was a racist and kicked people like, 251 00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:17,080 Speaker 1: there's none of those So he's a nice you know, 252 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 1: it's always nice when someone that you admire turns out 253 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: to not be a monstrous jerk. I have some issues 254 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: with what happened with him and Jane, sure, but that's 255 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:33,080 Speaker 1: not my marriage to have issues, So I don't know. 256 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: I wasn't there. Yeah, it's fascinating to watch interviews with 257 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 1: his kids, right and have them talk about him, and 258 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 1: how you know they we mentioned it in the show 259 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 1: that like his daughters were like, I had no idea 260 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: what he went through in the war until he published 261 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: Slaughterhouse Five. We just didn't know. He just came home 262 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 1: and there's a mention of him. I think I mentioned 263 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 1: it in the episode as an aside, and one of 264 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: the biog that I read where it was like he 265 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 1: tried to tell someone immediately after he got back from 266 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 1: the war about a man that had been shot for 267 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:11,840 Speaker 1: allegedly I think he took something that he shouldn't have 268 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: or whatever, and he just couldn't and he never talked 269 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,160 Speaker 1: about it with anybody ever again other than through his typewriter, 270 00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 1: which is pretty right fascinating. I spent an unconscionable amount 271 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:28,639 Speaker 1: of money in the Vonnegut Library and Museum gift shop. Yeah, 272 00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:31,920 Speaker 1: he said. I don't know if that made it into 273 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,199 Speaker 1: the final cut of the of the episode or not, 274 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 1: because that I have not heard. I've only heard the 275 00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:38,399 Speaker 1: raw audio of the panel, but I was very I 276 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:41,359 Speaker 1: was like, what all did Holly buy? I bought many 277 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: T shirts. I bought a pint glass that has the 278 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:49,439 Speaker 1: quote about I have a problem with alcohol and the 279 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:54,399 Speaker 1: telephone at night. I bought a really beautiful book that 280 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,719 Speaker 1: his daughter Edith has put together that's the love letters 281 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 1: between him and Jane from the nineteen fouries when they 282 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: were when he was at war and they were very young, 283 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,920 Speaker 1: which is really beautiful. I haven't gotten very far into 284 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 1: it yet. I got a pen, I got a pack 285 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:13,280 Speaker 1: of cards I got. I feel like I bought other 286 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 1: things that I'm not remembering. I was just very grabby, 287 00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:18,520 Speaker 1: handsy because we also I was trying to be conscious 288 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,120 Speaker 1: of time because we did have to get over there 289 00:18:21,119 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 1: in the morning, look around, get back to the convention center, 290 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 1: and you know, we had multiple panels that day that 291 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: we had to do, so I was trying to drag 292 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 1: my feets. But what a delight. I want to go 293 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 1: back and spend more time there because it's lovely and 294 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 1: they have a cute cafe in there. They have like 295 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 1: a little lounge where they do book events sometimes. It's 296 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:45,720 Speaker 1: a very cool space. So highly recommend to anybody that's 297 00:18:46,359 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 1: in the area and is interested in Vonnegut, or even 298 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: if you're not, you're just curious. They do a lot 299 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:55,440 Speaker 1: of fun interactive things there, like prompts that are based 300 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:58,360 Speaker 1: on the writing of Vonnegut, to like get kids involved 301 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:01,399 Speaker 1: in expressing themselves. And it's just a cool space. I 302 00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:03,919 Speaker 1: love it, so kudos to the people that run it. 303 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 1: I think that's it. I've probably waxed rapsotic enough. O. 304 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:12,159 Speaker 1: Dear Kurt Vonnegut, I love you. I hope you know. 305 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 1: I hope if there's an afterlife. I hope if you're 306 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:17,720 Speaker 1: on trel Fammador right now, you feel that people love 307 00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:21,919 Speaker 1: you since you experienced time, apparently in different ways than 308 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:24,800 Speaker 1: the rest of us. I like to think of him 309 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:30,920 Speaker 1: out there somewhere, just not here. If you are headed 310 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:33,920 Speaker 1: into your weekend, I hope that you can take time 311 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 1: to read something that you love, or visit a museum 312 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 1: that might delight you and spark ideas in your mind 313 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: and just make you feel a little more at peace 314 00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:43,320 Speaker 1: with the world if you do not have time off. 315 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: I really hope everyone abides by Vonaget's ideology of training 316 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 1: people kindly. We all need it. Everybody be cool to 317 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:53,160 Speaker 1: one another. It's the only way we're going to get through. 318 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: We will be right back here tomorrow at the classic 319 00:19:56,040 --> 00:20:03,879 Speaker 1: episode and on Monday with something brand new. Stuff you 320 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For 321 00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 322 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:13,720 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.