Speaker 1: Welcome to Playback, a Variety podcast. I'm your host, Variety
Speaker 1: Awards Editor Chris Tapley. On this week's episode, we talked
Speaker 1: about the Golden Globes as well as the PGA nominations
Speaker 1: where Deadpool remains strong this season. A little bit later,
Speaker 1: I'll be talking to Manchester by the C star Casey Affleck.
Speaker 1: So stick around. Welcome back, everyone. I'm here with Janelle.
Speaker 1: Good morning, and you're probably gonna pick up some outside
Speaker 1: chatter because we're in a different spot today. Our coworkers
Speaker 1: are so loud, such loud nuisances. Really I like them.
Speaker 1: I swear they're all gonna be like is that shade?
Speaker 1: I don't know with them now. If they don't listen
Speaker 1: to this, Justin listens to it. Justin Krol was happy
Speaker 1: for his shout out. Actually, I told him at the
Speaker 1: shout out that's probably why he listened that little sit.
Speaker 1: He made an appointment. They're talking about me. That's justin
Speaker 1: crawl limitation. It was a great justic cREL limitation where
Speaker 1: I had the Golden Globes this weekend. Oh tired, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I had an eleven hour day on Saturday with you know,
Speaker 1: I hate to say, like so many parties, but so
Speaker 1: many parties. Yeah, I skipped a lot of you know.
Speaker 1: The only thing I really like to go to is
Speaker 1: the Bath to Tea party, which was fun people though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then I skipped over to the Laula Land party
Speaker 1: for a little bit. And then I've closed out the
Speaker 1: day with the Visual Effects bake Off, which was a
Speaker 1: four hour event. Is that the first time you've been
Speaker 1: in and of itself? Yeah, first time make presentations in cases.
Speaker 1: I was excited to go, but at the end of
Speaker 1: that day, I was just like fading so hard. But
Speaker 1: it's a very interesting event, you know. They make Basically,
Speaker 1: they have a timed spot where they come up one
Speaker 1: of the one of the people come up and they
Speaker 1: talk about the effects, and only one guy went over
Speaker 1: his time and had to be interrupted. That was the
Speaker 1: Fantastic Beasts Christian Man's uh went over his allotted time.
Speaker 1: And then they show a reel and then the entire
Speaker 1: group gets up there and answers a couple of questions
Speaker 1: for like ten minutes. What is the allotted time for
Speaker 1: them to speak overall? I think the first like the
Speaker 1: opening bit seems like it's like five minutes, maybe ten,
Speaker 1: And then the Q and A afterwards feels like it's
Speaker 1: about ten minutes. And how many movies it's a long night.
Speaker 1: It is a long night. Is that how they do
Speaker 1: make up as well? I think they they used to
Speaker 1: do sound effects. Actually, I would love to have bend
Speaker 1: one of those back in the day. And they're open
Speaker 1: to the public. They're open to the public. You can
Speaker 1: just show up. That is so cool. I mean I won't,
Speaker 1: but it's really cool they hear about for the geeks
Speaker 1: in us. It's fun and and uh, it matters if
Speaker 1: you have a really good reel, because the best real
Speaker 1: I thought by far was Deepwater Rising. Oh that's great,
Speaker 1: so elegantly put together, Like a lot of these because
Speaker 1: they're showing different scenes, it's like stop and start, really
Speaker 1: jagged editing. The only movie that seemed to think, hey,
Speaker 1: let's just cut the black for a second before each
Speaker 1: scene was Cubo, which, by the way, I think is
Speaker 1: a dark horse for this because that it made it
Speaker 1: this far as kind of interesting as it is. Don't
Speaker 1: you think this is how we should pick the movies
Speaker 1: to Like, somebody gets up and says, here's my case
Speaker 1: for nocturnal animals. That would be Aaron Taylor Johnson sits
Speaker 1: on a toilet, speaking of speaking of, let's talk about
Speaker 1: the Globes kicking off with a big shocker, and then
Speaker 1: in the bath denominated him as well, you know, hey,
Speaker 1: the thing is, I can't criticize the choice. I think
Speaker 1: Aaron Taylor Johnson is the best he's ever given. He's
Speaker 1: great in the movie. I mentioned the toilet scene because
Speaker 1: somebody was complaining on Twitter, that's that that that, that's
Speaker 1: all anyone talks about, which I actually haven't seen many
Speaker 1: people talking about. I think of the seventeen minutes sequence
Speaker 1: on the road where he terrorizes Yeah, and he's kind
Speaker 1: of unrecognizable too that in a certain way, like the
Speaker 1: way his hair is done, and there's justin welcome by
Speaker 1: right now. He probably knows we're talking about him. He's
Speaker 1: got that sensor. I think he's a legit possibility. At
Speaker 1: this point, we're going to go back to the seventies
Speaker 1: to find a Golden Globe winner in that category that
Speaker 1: didn't get nominated by the Really, oh, I didn't know that. Well,
Speaker 1: I don't think anyone was more surprised than he was.
Speaker 1: And by the way he came backstage, um, because I
Speaker 1: spent my Golden Globes day. Um backstage and the cutest
Speaker 1: thing ever while he was you know, they cut the
Speaker 1: sound to the show while the winners are backstage talking,
Speaker 1: and he made them turn the sound back on so
Speaker 1: he could see Ryan Gosling's acceptance speech. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: the cutest thing seeing Ryan Gosling's sexist except wait, no,
Speaker 1: are you serious? That's what everyone's saying? Who's everyone? I
Speaker 1: have not heard this. I thought it was the entire
Speaker 1: internet next to Meryl Streep. I thought it was the
Speaker 1: best speech of the night. Yeah, I thought it was
Speaker 1: great to look, we're in this age where we talked
Speaker 1: about Steve Martin last week and Ryan Gosling caught ship
Speaker 1: this this time. I literally have not seen or heard
Speaker 1: any of this. Just avoid it. Okay, that's probably a
Speaker 1: good idea. I saw some piece about regarding Meryl streep
Speaker 1: speech where she was turning the handicapped gentleman she was
Speaker 1: talking about into a victim, and I was like, really,
Speaker 1: we are think piecing ourselves to the victim of bullying.
Speaker 1: Maybe just yeah, I don't know how to explain it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is this is why I don't read. This is
Speaker 1: why I sit at home and watch movies. Golden Globes
Speaker 1: was a sweep for a La La Land, which a
Speaker 1: lot of people kind of thought that was gonna happen.
Speaker 1: I they don't do that, So I thought, you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of other shots. I thought our big surprise
Speaker 1: would come in like Best Actor, like maybe Ryan Reynolds
Speaker 1: would sneak in, maybe Hugh Grant, or maybe they'd give songs.
Speaker 1: I was thinking Hugh Grant was gonna win. I was
Speaker 1: thinking Amy Adams was gonna win. It's about who pair
Speaker 1: was as surprised though, forbe Now get the Oscar nomination.
Speaker 1: I think she's in there, but that is a tight
Speaker 1: six horse race, like as tight as it can be.
Speaker 1: And you know, all along, I mean all obviously picked
Speaker 1: up votes with the speaks she's in. And you know,
Speaker 1: I'm the one who's been saying all along that I
Speaker 1: don't think she's in Now I think she is. Who
Speaker 1: gets pushed out here, I mean, I mean the guests
Speaker 1: my you know, Emistone and Alleportman are safe, and then
Speaker 1: my guess is Amy Adams is in Meryl Streep. So
Speaker 1: then you're pushing out a net bending. I've never has
Speaker 1: not been doing anything from the start. I I didn't
Speaker 1: see her making the cut from the start. Come on, yeah, no,
Speaker 1: we've had this discussion. Yeah, you are a parent now
Speaker 1: and your memory is fading. But I have always thought
Speaker 1: it was too subtle a performance to I don't think
Speaker 1: it's that's subtle. I think it's pretty lively. Actually, also
Speaker 1: think it's a supporting performance. Well that's the thing. Like
Speaker 1: at the start, I asked them like, would you push
Speaker 1: that for supporting and they were like no, maybe they
Speaker 1: should have. I mean, look, I'm still holding out hope
Speaker 1: to Roger pi Hanson gets in. I know that that
Speaker 1: could be a pipe dream at this this is this
Speaker 1: is the other thing, Like all these awards, these Guild
Speaker 1: Awards and the Golden Globes have happened in a different timeline. Uh,
Speaker 1: right now is when Academy voters have ballots in hands.
Speaker 1: So Figures is a story right now. It beats Star
Speaker 1: Wars at the box office blah blah blah. So yeah,
Speaker 1: and it came on strong with the PGA, got a nomination.
Speaker 1: As we both think it's picture. I don't think anyone
Speaker 1: in the right mind thinks that Deadpool is going to
Speaker 1: get the Best Picture. Oscar Nomination's the thing about Deadpool,
Speaker 1: I have no problem with it getting a PGA nomination, said, well,
Speaker 1: someone said only someone said to me today, it took
Speaker 1: ten years to make and it was at six million
Speaker 1: dollar movie that made seven and a million dollars. I'm like,
Speaker 1: most movies take a decade to make. You don't get
Speaker 1: a mid budget like fifty million dollars, So that's kind
Speaker 1: of a weird. I had no problem with it gay
Speaker 1: nominated the Globes. My problem with a gay nominated for
Speaker 1: p g A is that there were clearly better movies
Speaker 1: that could have made the cut. There were better superhero movies,
Speaker 1: both Captain American Civil War and Doctor Strange. Dead Pool.
Speaker 1: Right now, I just want to know what I'm missing?
Speaker 1: What do you mean? What you're that one is asking
Speaker 1: me to confirm my age? Oh goodness, I mean is
Speaker 1: that one? Holy crap? Can I watch a dead Pole
Speaker 1: trailer on YouTube? Please? I'm a frank two years. Let's
Speaker 1: watch this trailer together. Watching the Deadpool trailer everyone, you know,
Speaker 1: someone made an excellent point about how minus the superhero stuff,
Speaker 1: it's total oscar bait. He's got cancer, it's a love story.
Speaker 1: I mean, look, this is a fun movie. It's an
Speaker 1: irreverent movie. If it deserves any awards it deserves I
Speaker 1: think marketing awards because they catch the marketing. Uh you know,
Speaker 1: but you know, he quips, he curses. It's an R rated,
Speaker 1: irreverent comedy. Is this what one? You know? What makes
Speaker 1: for really good radio is watching and I think this
Speaker 1: is hilarious. Leave me all alone here with less angry
Speaker 1: Rosey o'donnald All right, that's a funny line. So w
Speaker 1: G A nomination? OKAYL see, I mean not CLC, Salt
Speaker 1: and Peppa I'm all about so yeahmination wonderful marketing. Look,
Speaker 1: I'm happy for Robo I felt. I'm happy for everybody
Speaker 1: involved with the movie. I just think it's a little much.
Speaker 1: We're going we got an ACE nomination, but w G
Speaker 1: A nomination a PGA nomination. See, the ACE nomination is
Speaker 1: the one that makes the most sense. It makes the
Speaker 1: most sense. I think it's a very well edited movie.
Speaker 1: But you know, p g A and I fought Sully
Speaker 1: might get in there. Frank Marshall, that talk about a
Speaker 1: movie that did well, like on a low budget and
Speaker 1: you know for what it is, But that didn't happen.
Speaker 1: And that movie seems to be dead are people do
Speaker 1: they genuinely love it or do they love the narrative
Speaker 1: of like it took you know, so long to get made?
Speaker 1: And I guess everyone I don't want to beat up
Speaker 1: on it, like seems like I don't know, I'm just annoyed.
Speaker 1: I did that when I saw this movie in February.
Speaker 1: I didn't expect to be engaging with it eleven months
Speaker 1: later in the awards season. I guess That's where I'm at.
Speaker 1: So it's happy for the Globe's nomination because I was
Speaker 1: happy they put a comedy in the comedy category, and
Speaker 1: you know, and Ryan Reynolds is great. Um, but yeah,
Speaker 1: the p g A is like, Okay, well there we are.
Speaker 1: I think that No. I think the nine that we're
Speaker 1: not Deadpool. I think those are the movies that are
Speaker 1: contending for Best Picture we might get. You know, there's
Speaker 1: passion votes out there for movies like Nocturnal Animals, which
Speaker 1: was a bath to nominee. Actually nine nominations did really well.
Speaker 1: Passion votes are out there for Silence and for loving
Speaker 1: that's possible you need three hundred people. But if Fox
Speaker 1: wanted to, they could block vote that ship and just
Speaker 1: get like everybody vote for Deadpool and it could happen.
Speaker 1: It could get anything could happen. Takes like three people
Speaker 1: witness Aaron Taylor Johnson and so what else this week? Uh?
Speaker 1: You know what I was thinking about on the way
Speaker 1: over here. This is random. Um, I was listening to
Speaker 1: a Prince c D. I would like them to perform
Speaker 1: Purple Rain on the show and not as part of
Speaker 1: the mmmorium. I just think it would be an awesome moment,
Speaker 1: just unto itself. Why on the Oscars though, well it
Speaker 1: wasn't Oscar any time past way and he in as
Speaker 1: an Oscar winning song, and yeah, I just think that
Speaker 1: would be an awesome moment. Depending on who you got
Speaker 1: to do it. Maybe you could get like a collective
Speaker 1: of people like we are the world doing Purple Rain.
Speaker 1: Maybe it just in Tnimberlake. He would crush it. I
Speaker 1: think Grammy's are coming up to why not do it?
Speaker 1: They're we'll do it. They're fine. But I just think
Speaker 1: as a as a little moment on the Oscars, I
Speaker 1: was thinking, like, what can they do to this show
Speaker 1: to spice it up? Because it's it's not an interesting
Speaker 1: year for movies in my opinion, and like, what are
Speaker 1: they going to do on the show to really liven up?
Speaker 1: I am excited about Jimmy Kimmel hosting um as I
Speaker 1: said I was. I was backstage, so I couldn't read
Speaker 1: the temperature of the room. Uh. How did Jimmy Fallon
Speaker 1: do as Globes host? I mean that's the other thing there.
Speaker 1: Opening number, it was just a Lala Land number, Like
Speaker 1: that's all I could do was get everybody when involved
Speaker 1: in TV and other movies, and let's do a Lala
Speaker 1: Land number. Like you know. It was. It was a
Speaker 1: neat little thing and it kind of set the tone
Speaker 1: like obviously La La Land is a favorite tonight. But
Speaker 1: I thought Fallon was as safe as you expected him
Speaker 1: to be, Like even his one trump joke was like
Speaker 1: he got he got in and out of it really
Speaker 1: fast too, Like I was like, what I Jimmy Jimmy
Speaker 1: Kimmel though, you know, we'll see he's obviously a little
Speaker 1: more biting. Yeah, yeah, I know, he's a great host.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm really looking forward to it. And when this runs,
Speaker 1: by the way, or when this airs, d g A
Speaker 1: will have already Oh really do the announce tomorrow Thursday morning.
Speaker 1: Oh well, let's come back on Thursday morning, and you
Speaker 1: got any predictions. I'm thinking Deneva Leneuv will get in there.
Speaker 1: I think you're probably right. I mean, okay, So Barry Jenkins,
Speaker 1: by the way, I did a Q and A with
Speaker 1: Barry Jenkins last night. Maybe this is common knowledge. Um
Speaker 1: Janelle Monet, you know, she kind of came to his
Speaker 1: attention because she auditioned for Star Trek. About that, So
Speaker 1: did she audition for a horror? I'm not sure that
Speaker 1: was what I assumed, which might be wrong of me,
Speaker 1: but maybe it's for one of the Star Trek sequels
Speaker 1: because it sounded like it was not that long ago.
Speaker 1: And that's how she sort of got on Barry's radar.
Speaker 1: Someone recommended to her, and you know, and she has
Speaker 1: a trained actress something else I didn't realize. She attended,
Speaker 1: you know, dramatic Academy. Like it makes you feel a
Speaker 1: little bit better about the fact she's so damn good
Speaker 1: in these two movies, and you feel like she just
Speaker 1: came out of nowhere to be an amazing actress. She's
Speaker 1: she's awesome, Like she's gonna be a star. I think
Speaker 1: in this realm just listening to her talk and her
Speaker 1: mouth is amazing. Yeah, harries In, I think Denise In
Speaker 1: actually if someone falls out, I love him, But I
Speaker 1: feel like Kenny Lonergan could fall out just because he's safe.
Speaker 1: He's the Tom McCarthy, you know. Quietly, I think he's
Speaker 1: considered more for his writing skills than as a director,
Speaker 1: but I certainly think he deserves to be in there. Obviously,
Speaker 1: Damian's in there. So who's your fifth who is my Oh?
Speaker 1: Mel Gibson, Oh yeah, Mel Gibson. Okay, um. Do you
Speaker 1: think Ted Melphye has a chance for Heading Figures? Maybe
Speaker 1: such a broad group is a big group. So these
Speaker 1: movies like Hidden Figures that everyone loves and wants to
Speaker 1: be the Best Picture nominee can land that kind of
Speaker 1: a nomination some Tom Surprisingly, I'm thinking of when Morton
Speaker 1: Tildom for Orimentation Games kept getting, you know, nominations. People
Speaker 1: didn't know who he was, but they loved that movie
Speaker 1: so much, And people actually do know who Ted Melfi is.
Speaker 1: There's always somebody who doesn't get the Oscar nomination who
Speaker 1: gets d G because the Oscars it's like third fifty
Speaker 1: members of the director's branch, which is why I think
Speaker 1: Martin Scorsese is still alive there. I think so too.
Speaker 1: Oh you wait, do you know think Scorsese gets the
Speaker 1: d g A. No, wow, I don't think they saw it.
Speaker 1: I kind of think it doesn't matter if they saw.
Speaker 1: I don't know. And then there's that this is a
Speaker 1: very specific movie. That's why it works more for a
Speaker 1: smaller branch, like the director's branch of the Academy. You know,
Speaker 1: the Oscars always recognized someone who generally doesn't get recognized
Speaker 1: along the way, like Lenny Abramson for Room. I feel
Speaker 1: like um Bennett Miller the you'r a Fox Catcher didn't
Speaker 1: have a lot of momentum going into because you know,
Speaker 1: directors really sort of picked on the outskirts. So you know,
Speaker 1: I've got my Maybe that's Denny this year, or maybe
Speaker 1: it's Matt Ross for Captain Fantastic. So let me be
Speaker 1: clear that it does not get d g A but
Speaker 1: gets an OSCAR nomination. Yes, okay, Matt Ross. Mmm, I
Speaker 1: don't think so. I'm saying I know you love and
Speaker 1: I love the movie, but I would be very surprised
Speaker 1: by that. Yeah, the knee would make more sense in
Speaker 1: general for like the smaller group to go for him.
Speaker 1: But then I think about Arrival and how it will
Speaker 1: appeal to all the younger members of these guilds. And
Speaker 1: that's why I think it's going to continue to do
Speaker 1: really well in the guilds. And I'm still like, I
Speaker 1: don't know about it for the Best Picture nomination. I
Speaker 1: don't know about it for Amy. Frankly, I think Amy's
Speaker 1: pretty secure. But because we're pushing out, you're pushing out
Speaker 1: a net that makes the most sense at this point.
Speaker 1: But as soon as you say, oh, this this is
Speaker 1: the five that makes sense, something happens, of course, And
Speaker 1: this has been, you know, a more unpredictable year than most.
Speaker 1: I think we had a Twitter question actually asking about
Speaker 1: how the bodies have changed, you know with these new members. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well that's the unknowable. Yeah, there's like six members I
Speaker 1: used to, you know, really have a good predictor for
Speaker 1: the SAG Awards, And in the last couple of years
Speaker 1: since SAG and after merged, I I don't know what's
Speaker 1: gonna happen. Yeah, I mean, you have six hundred new members,
Speaker 1: most of them are international. How how are their tastes
Speaker 1: going to affect these various branches. I think Steve Pond
Speaker 1: did like a little breakdown of how many new members
Speaker 1: are in each branch, and that's where it starts to,
Speaker 1: you know, within the branches is where it starts to
Speaker 1: kind of trickle down. I'm not fine. I'm finding a
Speaker 1: lot of Portuguese reactions to Deadpools PGA nominations in my
Speaker 1: Twitter feed. Stop angering the Portuguese. I'm trying to find
Speaker 1: all these questions. Let me see it. I'm sorry, guys,
Speaker 1: I should have had them ready to go this one.
Speaker 1: This Michael wants to know. Do you think Silence Scorsese
Speaker 1: get a Tree of Life, get in a lah Tree
Speaker 1: of Life, miss almost everywhere, but get in at the end. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, it's possible. I mean again, it's a
Speaker 1: passion movie. I think they're worried about it though. Honestly,
Speaker 1: what's gonna happen with the best Actress? All of these
Speaker 1: questions we've covered, than could Colossus ride the wave into
Speaker 1: a Best Supporting Actor nomination for did Well? Yeah? Definitely
Speaker 1: make it happen. Oh. It was Rodrigo day Oliviera who
Speaker 1: asked the question, what kind of impact will the new
Speaker 1: international members of the Academy have in which films would
Speaker 1: benefit from it. Well, that's actually where Arrival, Yeah, grabs
Speaker 1: some some steam because denis well loved internationally. And you know,
Speaker 1: I think I've just been wrong on predictions this year.
Speaker 1: It is just where I face planet with the globes,
Speaker 1: uh Sam coffee. I just love the way this is
Speaker 1: worded after a shocking globe win and a bath to nod,
Speaker 1: Is Aaron Taylor Johnson thing really happening? Is there room
Speaker 1: as we said earlier? Yeah, I think it is the
Speaker 1: Aeron Taylor Johnson thing. It is a thing. This is
Speaker 1: a funny question. Why do they love that shitty movie?
Speaker 1: I just don't understand Deadpool. Yeah, I wouldn't say it's
Speaker 1: a shitty movie. Come on it it's a on movie.
Speaker 1: Yeah again, I just didn't expect to be talking about
Speaker 1: it a year later, But here we are. That's the
Speaker 1: season Casey affle like this week, Oh fantastic golden Globe.
Speaker 1: Golden Globe got played off the stage by those assholes.
Speaker 1: A nice little shout out to Denzel from the stage.
Speaker 1: I've been thinking Denzel was gonna win the Oscar, but
Speaker 1: it does seem to be lining up for Casey. Honestly,
Speaker 1: so I spoke to Casey this weekend and I don't
Speaker 1: know why. This just charms me. You know, he's the
Speaker 1: biggest fan of Lord of the Rings in the Hobbit.
Speaker 1: Really Yeah, I don't know why that. I wouldn't have
Speaker 1: expected that. Yeah, like a passionate, passionate fan. Well. Interesting.
Speaker 1: We didn't talk about Lord of the Rings, but we
Speaker 1: talked about Manchester by the Sea and a couple of
Speaker 1: other things. So I guess stick around for that. Casey
Speaker 1: aff like after this, if you could take one guy
Speaker 1: to an island with you, and you knew you'd be
Speaker 1: safe because he was the best man. He was gonna
Speaker 1: keep you happy. It was between me and your father,
Speaker 1: who would you take. I didn't think you're wrong about that.
Speaker 1: Let's sleep what happens to my brother? So that's the
Speaker 1: Nichan though. Understand which party you have him trouble? Well,
Speaker 1: I can't be his guardian. Well, your brother provided for
Speaker 1: your nephew's upkeep. I think the idea is that you
Speaker 1: would relocate, relocate if you look. It was my impression
Speaker 1: that you'd spent a lot of time here. I yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm just a backup. Nobody can appreciate what you've been
Speaker 1: through and if you really feel you can't take this on,
Speaker 1: you know that's your right. When are we going to
Speaker 1: the offenite? Shut up, Cannab Your d doesn't tell you
Speaker 1: unlocked the door? What didn't you decide? You can always
Speaker 1: stay with us if he wants to come up weekends.
Speaker 1: Do you want to be his guardian? Well, he doesn't
Speaker 1: want to be my guardian. Try at this point, Hello,
Speaker 1: helloly and I just want to con say I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: How's Patrick too? He doesn't really open up with me.
Speaker 1: Do you actually have sex with these girls? Strictly basement
Speaker 1: business means I'm working on it. You don't want to
Speaker 1: be my Gudea. That's fine with me, hot that it's
Speaker 1: just just's all my friends here. I got two girl
Speaker 1: friends and I'm in a band. You're a Janita and Quincy.
Speaker 1: What the hell do you care where you live? Welcome
Speaker 1: back everyone, I'm here with the Star of Manchester by
Speaker 1: the see Casey affleck Casey Man, thanks for coming by,
Speaker 1: appreciate it my pleasure. Casey. Recently, uh, he was just
Speaker 1: admiring our cover of Variety. We've got a copy here.
Speaker 1: You know you're gonna look back at this year and
Speaker 1: you're gonna see just like a ton of burly Man photos,
Speaker 1: but like premieres, it's gonna be You're like Jeremiah Johnson year.
Speaker 1: I think, Oh, is that a good thing? It's a
Speaker 1: good thing. It's just funny to capture a moment in history.
Speaker 1: What what what are you rock in the main for? Again?
Speaker 1: I forgot I'm about to do a movie playing a
Speaker 1: part of a guy who's been doesn't shave that often,
Speaker 1: so amongst other things, well, you're pulling it off. We
Speaker 1: were talking about Lewis and Clark too. I thought I
Speaker 1: thought that that mini series that you worked on was
Speaker 1: was what this was about. But working with John Karen
Speaker 1: on that, Uh, what do you think of him? I
Speaker 1: was actually a fan of The Painted Veil like ten
Speaker 1: years ago. I really liked the version of that. But
Speaker 1: how do you like working with him so far? You know,
Speaker 1: I don't think that the experience that I had is
Speaker 1: a fair representation of kind of who he is as
Speaker 1: a director. We were trying to shoot six episodes of
Speaker 1: you know, our long tv um telling a story that
Speaker 1: was spanned six or so years. Uh, that took place
Speaker 1: mostly in the wild and and with every day hundreds
Speaker 1: of extras and uh on horses without saddles and hundreds
Speaker 1: of uh you know, like natives and hundreds of and
Speaker 1: with dozens of boats or um made out of uh
Speaker 1: very very hard to move up rivers and uh and
Speaker 1: we were just trekking through the wilderness, and um, it
Speaker 1: was impossible. It was an impossible production. That the scripts
Speaker 1: were a little bit I think, um, it was probably
Speaker 1: too ambitious. And then we ran into a bunch of
Speaker 1: problems just that you will run into when you're trying
Speaker 1: to shoot in the wild. Thunderstorms and shut the production
Speaker 1: every hours and um, the horses getting spooked and scattering
Speaker 1: and you can't get them back until aft to lunch,
Speaker 1: and just a million things went wrong. Um. But that
Speaker 1: that story is is a story that I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I got to know really well because I had done
Speaker 1: so much research on Marieth Lewis and the and the expedition,
Speaker 1: and it's just incredible. Most people only know the kind
Speaker 1: of sixth grade you know, version of it, which you
Speaker 1: can tell in about twenty seconds, and they don't know
Speaker 1: any of the details. Uh. And and they're great. And
Speaker 1: he was an amazing character, very very complicated, brilliant guy.
Speaker 1: Um so Um, I don't think it will ever resume,
Speaker 1: but um, shame, it is a shame. I'd like to
Speaker 1: do it. Sometimes seems like a book could be written
Speaker 1: about the experience of that. It's like a it sounds
Speaker 1: like a hurt Zog production or something. And fitz CAROLDA,
Speaker 1: you are we're talking about Hurtzog and tell your right.
Speaker 1: That reminds me you've got a great hurt Zog impression.
Speaker 1: Both you and Kenny have great Herzog and bron Um.
Speaker 1: He's such a hero up there. I didn't know that.
Speaker 1: I that was my first time. I'd tell you at
Speaker 1: film festival, and first of all, that was a great
Speaker 1: film festival. Um uh. And they have a whole theater
Speaker 1: named after him. He's been going there for years and years. Uh.
Speaker 1: Celebrates his birthday up there every year because his birthday
Speaker 1: is like that week, is right, Yeah, it's Exceptember sixth
Speaker 1: or something like. Yeah. I tried to tell him a
Speaker 1: story my only I ran into him in a restaurant
Speaker 1: and I and I thought he would appreciate the story
Speaker 1: that I had to share with him, which was about
Speaker 1: the one time I had met him. Um. And he
Speaker 1: denied that the whole thing happened, which it's so bizarre.
Speaker 1: I don't even know what to think of it. I
Speaker 1: know that it happened. I was there, Um, I remember it,
Speaker 1: and it's not not like an unflattering story for him.
Speaker 1: I don't know why he would deny it, but he
Speaker 1: denied it, and it's given me now this idea that like,
Speaker 1: if people tell me stories about myself, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: deny them, you know, like for no reason, Like you know,
Speaker 1: I met you here, I'll say no, that never happened,
Speaker 1: just to see like what their reaction was, because my
Speaker 1: reaction I was stumpfounded and I thought it reacted Okay, Well,
Speaker 1: I guess nice to meet you. Then we'll speaking of
Speaker 1: the cover here, a variety and and just covers and
Speaker 1: a lot of attention this year for this role. And
Speaker 1: you've been on the circuits more or less since uh,
Speaker 1: Sun Dance. When you when you have a movie that
Speaker 1: premieres at Sundance and then it's scheduled to release in
Speaker 1: the fall, I mean that's always a long haul for anybody,
Speaker 1: but you've always struck me as somebody not comfortable with
Speaker 1: a lot of attention like that. So how's this year
Speaker 1: for you? So far, Well, it's been okay, it's been
Speaker 1: all right. I guess we have a movie that that UM,
Speaker 1: it's trying to you know, youre trying to sell. You're
Speaker 1: hoping to sell and show it at Sundance. Sometimes it
Speaker 1: means that either you don't sell it, or then you
Speaker 1: sell it and comes out right away and then the
Speaker 1: whole thing's over with. UM. In this case, they sold
Speaker 1: it to Amazon and then Amazon wanted to, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: release it in November at the end of the year
Speaker 1: or so. It just meant that there was a big
Speaker 1: long stretch there and um. And so for a while
Speaker 1: we didn't to do anything. They were just kind of
Speaker 1: sitting on the movie. Now it's about to come out,
Speaker 1: so taking into a bunch of film festivals, um, which
Speaker 1: has been nice. It's I like going to film festivals. Uh.
Speaker 1: I don't always like doing a lot of the other publicity.
Speaker 1: That's part of the job. I do it, but uh,
Speaker 1: it's true. It doesn't make me uncomfortable. And UM, and
Speaker 1: I wonder about sort of what the whole you know,
Speaker 1: a whole I'm digging for myself. UM, but I think
Speaker 1: that uh, in this case, it's a it's a it's
Speaker 1: a movie that people responded to, and I wanted to
Speaker 1: support Kenny, and I like hanging around with all the
Speaker 1: people on the movie. So it's been fun. We've done
Speaker 1: five film festivals. I came back yesterday from Morelia, Mexico,
Speaker 1: where they have the film festival down there that is
Speaker 1: that was really an incredible experience. Um. It's their fourteenth year.
Speaker 1: It's in Mishawak Khan and in a state that is
Speaker 1: having a a real hard time with crime and cartels
Speaker 1: and and uh e beet. They are trying to keep
Speaker 1: this festival going and um. You know, as you would imagine,
Speaker 1: they have a hard time getting people down there bring
Speaker 1: their movies and support it. Um. And they don't have
Speaker 1: a lot of movie goers in the area, so you know,
Speaker 1: we went to the screening and it wasn't It was
Speaker 1: a very strange crowd. It was like families and little
Speaker 1: kids wandering around in the theater and um, babies and
Speaker 1: people who I think would never ever go see this movie. Um,
Speaker 1: yet someone had persuaded them or paid them to come
Speaker 1: and sit in the theater and watch UM. And that
Speaker 1: the area itself was like, uh, you know, no tourists,
Speaker 1: they're um, really old colonial village kind of and um
Speaker 1: it was back to the sixteenth century. And uh, they
Speaker 1: had a screen set up in the plaza. Before the
Speaker 1: screening was kind of wandering around the city a little
Speaker 1: bit and there was this like really it was Saturday afternoon.
Speaker 1: It was a really lively little plaza and uh in
Speaker 1: the kind of old part of Old town, right around
Speaker 1: this cathedral from you know, fifteen sixty or something, and
Speaker 1: they had this outdoor screen set up. Uh. And it
Speaker 1: made me think of like Cinema Paradiso or some like
Speaker 1: the days when people would travel around like showing movies
Speaker 1: that people who have never seen a movie. Obviously, these
Speaker 1: people have seen a movie. On the outskirts of town.
Speaker 1: There's even a kind of multiplex. But I think most
Speaker 1: people I don't see that many movies. They very probably
Speaker 1: never seen movies like Manchester by the Sea, kind of
Speaker 1: smaller American independent movies. Um. And no one was really
Speaker 1: paying too much attention to this like giant white uh
Speaker 1: rectangle on the plaza. You know. Then they were going
Speaker 1: to project the movie on and it was really it was.
Speaker 1: It was kind of great. It was one of the
Speaker 1: best experiences because it wasn't you know, I don't know,
Speaker 1: people looking for autographs or or people who had sort
Speaker 1: of jaded film types and you know, bounce around fifteen
Speaker 1: film festivals they year or um, I'm just looking for
Speaker 1: their their picture, and it was it was there's people who,
Speaker 1: you know, we're asking questions like I did a little
Speaker 1: bit of press there and they wanted to know things like,
Speaker 1: you know, why do you make what is it like
Speaker 1: to make a movie? Or what is ADVI? Is it
Speaker 1: fun to make a movie? Really kind of general questions
Speaker 1: that you don't hear that often, and you probably don't
Speaker 1: think about the answers to those kinds of questions very
Speaker 1: often either. Yeah, it made me. It made me so simple,
Speaker 1: it makes you think about it. That's interesting. Are you
Speaker 1: finding that the movie is connecting in these various different locales.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how it connected yesterday and realiot uh
Speaker 1: if my opening remarks or any indication it might not
Speaker 1: have gone over that well. I tried to speak in Spanish, uh,
Speaker 1: and then I tried to uh, and then I tried
Speaker 1: to speak through the translator, and UM, I don't think
Speaker 1: that the humor was landing. But uh, in other film
Speaker 1: festivals that's gone great, and it's played really well. I
Speaker 1: haven't seen it in any foreign Uh. I haven't seen
Speaker 1: it anywhere where people don't speak English. I haven't seen
Speaker 1: it subtitles or anything. Um, true, yeah, yes, but people
Speaker 1: seem to respond to you know, Kenny is such a
Speaker 1: good writer and at least such a humanist. I think
Speaker 1: that kind of stuffed often translates. You know, there's there's
Speaker 1: something very Americana in some ways about this movie, but
Speaker 1: his work translates, I think because he's such a humanist writer.
Speaker 1: You guys, I loved spending some time with both of
Speaker 1: you until you right, because get these two together and
Speaker 1: like there's a lot of dry humor flying around, and
Speaker 1: you guys just have a great rapport. Uh. Your relationship
Speaker 1: goes back to uh the production of This Is Our Youth? Right?
Speaker 1: When was that two thousand two? Uh at the Garrick
Speaker 1: Theater and the West End of London? Did This Is
Speaker 1: Our Youth? I didn't know Kenny then. I only knew
Speaker 1: him as the writer, as a guy who I wanted to,
Speaker 1: you know, I try to want to do some of
Speaker 1: his plays. Uh, And he never hired me, and then
Speaker 1: um he didn't for that production, and then we became
Speaker 1: really good friends. And then over the years we got closer.
Speaker 1: I did a a little one act of his before
Speaker 1: it became a full play. It was called him Medieval Play. Um.
Speaker 1: That was one of the funniest things I've ever read.
Speaker 1: For sure. It was only about twenty months long. Um,
Speaker 1: and I did it a few times. Wed only did
Speaker 1: about five performances, and one of which I couldn't get
Speaker 1: through on stage because I was I was laughing. I
Speaker 1: was laughing maybe more than the audience was laughing at
Speaker 1: some points. Um. I just think he I love his
Speaker 1: sense of humor and um, and you and and you
Speaker 1: can count on me and in Margaret, Um, they're both
Speaker 1: such emotional movies. Uh, you know, and I can't watch
Speaker 1: them without being being really moved and um uh I
Speaker 1: remember reading them and crying. And but there's also like,
Speaker 1: he's always really funny. You're both about like tragedies and
Speaker 1: people dealing with a lot of pain. Um, but they're
Speaker 1: always really really funny. Yeah. You make a good point
Speaker 1: there about the humor we talked and tell you're right
Speaker 1: about just kind of the general uh sense of melancholy
Speaker 1: in this movie. But I don't want to put too
Speaker 1: much on that because You're right. He does have a
Speaker 1: great sense of humor, and there's a there's a sense
Speaker 1: of humor in Manchester. Certainly it's cool. But uh, this
Speaker 1: and we talked about this, and I just like the
Speaker 1: listeners to hear about it more. The the being in
Speaker 1: that headspace as an actor, because there's so much tragedy
Speaker 1: in the film. There's a lot of just again melancholy.
Speaker 1: Is that difficult to maintain that headspace for an extended
Speaker 1: period of time when you working on this movie? You know,
Speaker 1: Actually it's harder to to go in and out of it.
Speaker 1: I think that probably Michelle had a tougher job because
Speaker 1: she had to sort of come in. She'd work a
Speaker 1: day and go home for a week. Um, she didn't
Speaker 1: have you know, have she had a couple of pretty
Speaker 1: heavy scenes. Um. I think it's it's hard to a
Speaker 1: uh turn it on and off like that. Um. I had,
Speaker 1: you know, every day, I had some scene that for me,
Speaker 1: he was really challenging. That was very emotional in some way.
Speaker 1: And I know that Kenny, you know, what makes his
Speaker 1: movies great is that you really believe that this is
Speaker 1: these are real people and this is all really happening.
Speaker 1: There's nothing no stylization to the writing or the direction
Speaker 1: that leaves puts the audience at a distance. You know,
Speaker 1: I think why they work so well is one of
Speaker 1: the reasons, as far as I can tell, is that
Speaker 1: people are drawn into caring about the characters and and
Speaker 1: um sucked into the story and in a way that
Speaker 1: uh sort of opens them up to feeling kind of
Speaker 1: emotional about them. UM. And so I had to play
Speaker 1: those scenes in a way that was naturalistic, is and
Speaker 1: while also sort of honoring the script that was very
Speaker 1: precisely written. He takes a long time to write a script,
Speaker 1: and he said he spent three years on this, and
Speaker 1: you know, he really wants every word on the page
Speaker 1: in the movie. UM. And when characters are speaking and
Speaker 1: they're overlapping one another, he wants them to overlap, just
Speaker 1: as it's written. So it's kind of you have have
Speaker 1: to be have two minds, one very kind of technical um.
Speaker 1: And there's no point arguing with him because he's right
Speaker 1: and it's it's beautiful writing. And then you have to
Speaker 1: also be sort of able to not think about that
Speaker 1: at all and be and just listening, responding to the
Speaker 1: other person and being um as emotionally truthful as you
Speaker 1: can be. And that's that was kind of my job
Speaker 1: and I and because I had to do some of
Speaker 1: these harder scenes I had to do really like every
Speaker 1: other day was some very very heavy scene in some
Speaker 1: in some ways I kind of just got into it
Speaker 1: and stayed in there, and you know, I I got
Speaker 1: used to it. Um. I sort of I didn't have
Speaker 1: the kind of that anticipatory that dread of like, oh,
Speaker 1: there's this hard scene coming in a week or in
Speaker 1: two weeks, and I'm sort it's always in the back
Speaker 1: of my mind. It was just the next day I
Speaker 1: had to go play some some tough scene, and so
Speaker 1: I got out of my head and just would sort
Speaker 1: of show up in the right emotional state and to
Speaker 1: what was on the page. The cold probably helps a
Speaker 1: little bit, right, The cold, Yeah, just kind of doured somber,
Speaker 1: you know, environment in some ways. You know, snow, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's not happy stuff that you're doing in that weather.
Speaker 1: You know, that's true. That's true. Although you know there's
Speaker 1: there was a few days in there where the characters
Speaker 1: are supposed to be freezing cold. It's kind of like
Speaker 1: what they're talking about in the scene. And of course
Speaker 1: you know, it's fifty five degrees or something. We're right
Speaker 1: at the end of the the winter. And so there
Speaker 1: are a lot of little things like that in this movie. Um,
Speaker 1: it was hard. It was not an easy Things didn't
Speaker 1: always go our way sort of logistically, I didn't have
Speaker 1: enough time. And you know, it was this the not
Speaker 1: that this is important or interesting at all, but there
Speaker 1: was the kind of snowiest winter that Massachusetts has had
Speaker 1: and ten thousand years, and it was it was he
Speaker 1: had over a hundred inches of snow and um, and
Speaker 1: the and the script was had incorporated uh, winter imagery
Speaker 1: into it sort of I thought, beautifully. You know, he
Speaker 1: wrote it in I don't know, over three years obviously,
Speaker 1: as I said, And so he wasn't writing it because
Speaker 1: he thought, Okay, I'm gonna get to shoot it in
Speaker 1: the winter. He was writing because he wanted it to
Speaker 1: be a winter story that then turns into spring. Um
Speaker 1: for whatever reason. And uh, he had in some of
Speaker 1: the action lines in the script were about describing sort
Speaker 1: of parts of the city as frozen, you know in
Speaker 1: certain ways, and and how they thought out and how
Speaker 1: it changes the setting and you know, like the bay
Speaker 1: with all the boats covered and frozen in and nice
Speaker 1: around them and um things like that, and uh really
Speaker 1: I thought I found kind of poignant. And then, um,
Speaker 1: we didn't get things together in time in this production,
Speaker 1: and so it was you know, March or April when
Speaker 1: we started shooting, and it was we we lost a
Speaker 1: lot of that. But I think that he still managed
Speaker 1: to make you feel like, you know, it was a
Speaker 1: winter and moved into spring movie magic, I guess, yeah, totally. Uh,
Speaker 1: let's talk about Lucas Hedges, your co star in this film. Newcomer.
Speaker 1: He's so good, He's say and he it's gotta be
Speaker 1: hard to just be a newcomer and just nail Kenny's
Speaker 1: kind of rhythm and and it's a very naturalistic rhythm.
Speaker 1: But that's kind of a hard thing to do when
Speaker 1: you're confronting the artifice of filmmaking as an actor. So
Speaker 1: what was it like working with this guy? And uh, yeah,
Speaker 1: just how did he striking? Um? I guess Lucas was
Speaker 1: seventeen when we started shooting, and you know, he was
Speaker 1: very focused, professional, mature seventeen year old, way more so
Speaker 1: than I was at seventeen or probably at thirty five.
Speaker 1: He's um he, I guess he grew up around movies.
Speaker 1: His dad was a director and grew up on sets
Speaker 1: and um. You know, his parents are really really very
Speaker 1: conscientious parents and people, and um, they were around a
Speaker 1: bit and I got to know them, and I could
Speaker 1: sort of see how he became the person that he is,
Speaker 1: because they're really beautiful people and so um. You know,
Speaker 1: I never thought, oh, I'm working with a minor. I
Speaker 1: sort of felt like I was working with uh just
Speaker 1: appear he's he was, he was on it. Um. And
Speaker 1: I think that it's a testament to Kenny. You know,
Speaker 1: how he how he cast his kid at the very
Speaker 1: last minute and and got sort of uh was able
Speaker 1: to guide him through a pretty tricky part. And uh.
Speaker 1: And as you point out, the writing isn't always easy.
Speaker 1: On the other hand, you know, reading scenes, the reading
Speaker 1: Kenny's writing, sometimes you can just open it and re
Speaker 1: cold and read it out loud and it sounds great
Speaker 1: and um. And I think that's because such a good
Speaker 1: ear for kind of how people talk, especially how young
Speaker 1: people talk. Um. Uh and this is our youth. You know,
Speaker 1: he really captures that, like how the repetitive nature of
Speaker 1: some of the conversations and kids sitting around and you know, uh,
Speaker 1: sort of seemingly not talking about anything but really sort
Speaker 1: of um um, sharing a lot more than they think
Speaker 1: that they're sharing. Uh. Where do you think he's able
Speaker 1: to pull that from me? Is he's just a king
Speaker 1: of observation and able to just translate that. I guess. So,
Speaker 1: yeahvation good writer, but also like I don't know, he's
Speaker 1: you know, he says that when he sits down to write,
Speaker 1: he is able to he just plays the parts in
Speaker 1: his head. And I think it's also probably would make
Speaker 1: him a good actor. He's been in um, all of
Speaker 1: his movies, perfect in this one. Yeah, he's good in
Speaker 1: this one. Um. I think he just he gets it.
Speaker 1: He's a huge fan of movies from like the twenties, thirties, forties.
Speaker 1: I think his interests kind of Peter Auder in the
Speaker 1: sixties and seventies. But um, so he loves he loves
Speaker 1: that stuff. You know. That's like you can see kind
Speaker 1: of his influence from some of that stuff and in
Speaker 1: his movies. I know it sounds the two sounds so
Speaker 1: like incongruous. That like the way that he captures, you know,
Speaker 1: a seventeen year old Domestchusetts and how he talks now
Speaker 1: with um some movie from nineteen thirty eight about gangsters,
Speaker 1: you know, but I can sometimes see it, you know,
Speaker 1: you know, Uh, he loves you know, Gary Cooper and
Speaker 1: there's It's funny the things that he that he likes.
Speaker 1: But he uh, he has a real um. He loves
Speaker 1: movies and he and uh he loves um. He likes
Speaker 1: to write people who are holding onto a lot um
Speaker 1: and uh, I'm not talking about it that much. He's
Speaker 1: or he likes to or not. He can talk about that,
Speaker 1: but he's really good at writing characters who are carrying
Speaker 1: a lot of pain. Yeah, I wanted to venture out
Speaker 1: a little bit. Next year is going to be the
Speaker 1: tenth anniversary of the assassination of Jesse James by the
Speaker 1: coward Robert Ford. I say this every year. I'm still
Speaker 1: waiting on somebody to make a better movie. I mean
Speaker 1: that it's the best film I've seen since it came out.
Speaker 1: I love the film. I'm a huge Westerns fan. But
Speaker 1: it's just such an iconic, uh piece of work. And
Speaker 1: it's weird because I don't love Andrew Dominic's films nearly
Speaker 1: as much as I love that one. But something about
Speaker 1: that one just is a landmark for me. And uh,
Speaker 1: what do you think when you look back ten years
Speaker 1: from that movie and and that was a big year
Speaker 1: in general for you because you had gone, Baby Gone
Speaker 1: as well. So but you know, looking back at Jesse James,
Speaker 1: that's how we first met, really was working on reviving
Speaker 1: the film and getting it in the repertory art health circuit.
Speaker 1: But talk about that, well, I think that you were, um, um,
Speaker 1: you picked up pretty early on that it was a
Speaker 1: good movie and it wasn't not everyone else sort of
Speaker 1: thought of it that way. It wasn't received, It wasn't
Speaker 1: received that well um at first, and nobody went to
Speaker 1: see it. So by that definition, uh, you know, I
Speaker 1: guess it was just kind of a failure. Uh. And
Speaker 1: then since then people have discovered it and more people
Speaker 1: have liked it, and critics have started to talk about it.
Speaker 1: But I think it maybe at first glance it was
Speaker 1: um true. Why it fell between the you know, fell
Speaker 1: through the cracks, I don't I don't really know. It
Speaker 1: didn't seem to have the best release pattern frankly coming
Speaker 1: out of venice Um. I don't know what they thought
Speaker 1: they were dealing with, But I always thought it was
Speaker 1: a unique way to put out that movie. I don't
Speaker 1: know what they thought what they were dealing with either.
Speaker 1: And I know that there are a lot of disagreements
Speaker 1: between Andrew and between the studio, and that it's sort
Speaker 1: of undercut any momentum that it had. It got a
Speaker 1: sort of got a bad there's some bad word of
Speaker 1: mouth on it just because of that. Because it took
Speaker 1: so long to come out. And I remember read a
Speaker 1: Hayworth and show Shank or the show Shank Redemption was
Speaker 1: just called, and I had loved the story and um
Speaker 1: so much. I was waiting for that movie to come out,
Speaker 1: and it was years and years, and then everyone said,
Speaker 1: oh it's a disaster, it's over three hours. It didn't
Speaker 1: work out, And and when it came out, um, it
Speaker 1: already had that kind of stink on it. And I
Speaker 1: think that Jesse James was the same way. Um. But
Speaker 1: you know, to Andrew's credit, he's really stuck by that movie.
Speaker 1: And when most of other people would have given up,
Speaker 1: because I thought, I don't want my my you know,
Speaker 1: this blemish on my on my career, my reputation, people
Speaker 1: are gonna think of me as a director. It doesn't
Speaker 1: get along with the studio, people are gonna think of
Speaker 1: me this way or that way, and you know, people compromise,
Speaker 1: and he did not compromise. Uh. He made the movie
Speaker 1: that he wanted to make. And he might say in
Speaker 1: the end that there are still some compromises he did
Speaker 1: have to make. You know, I saw a cut that
Speaker 1: was ten minutes longer, thing that was he considers to
Speaker 1: be his cut. Um um. But by and large, and
Speaker 1: he really stood by that movie when everyone else was
Speaker 1: sort of jumping ship and and so I think that
Speaker 1: people were ready to not like the movie. Also, I think,
Speaker 1: you know, from an audience perspective and maybe from the
Speaker 1: studio had perspective there, like why should we what? What
Speaker 1: is what kind of movie is it where Brad Pitt
Speaker 1: is your lead and he dies halfway through or something?
Speaker 1: You know, if that doesn't that's not the kind of
Speaker 1: movie we we thought we were making. Um. But that's
Speaker 1: what the book was, that's what the script was, and
Speaker 1: that was the movie that Andrew wanted to make. Um.
Speaker 1: It's definitely one of the best experiences that in my career.
Speaker 1: And uh, either's something about Andrew. He's really a pure
Speaker 1: director and meaning that you know, he didn't come out
Speaker 1: of doing something else, and you know, he just sort
Speaker 1: of stepped He made his first movie, and uh I
Speaker 1: it was great. I know that, Um and he you know,
Speaker 1: I don't know where he learned how to kind of
Speaker 1: direct actors that that way. Some directors they spend a
Speaker 1: long time in theater, or they even take acting classes,
Speaker 1: or they or they're no good at working with actors. Um,
Speaker 1: Andrew's great at work with actors. And he's also great visually.
Speaker 1: And he's also you know, amazing at sort of production
Speaker 1: design and its sound design, and he's a great writer.
Speaker 1: He's sort of all of those all of those things
Speaker 1: that are required to be the person who is uh
Speaker 1: in charge and making a movie, and that in that way,
Speaker 1: you know, he doesn't really make it by committee. It's
Speaker 1: it's a handmade film by Andrew dominic And and so
Speaker 1: at all at all feels of it's a whole piece.
Speaker 1: And uh, I wish you would make more movies. I
Speaker 1: kind of wish the same thing about Kenny. I wish
Speaker 1: that he would make I wish that our the film
Speaker 1: community would make it easier for guys like that to
Speaker 1: make more movies. Instead of saying we're not going to
Speaker 1: support him because his last movie made X number of
Speaker 1: dollars or um took so many years to be cut.
Speaker 1: You know, she should. Those are the people who keep
Speaker 1: this industry interesting and alive, and um, we should help
Speaker 1: them work more, even if it means just like being
Speaker 1: a little more uh supportive financially totally. And that note
Speaker 1: about just the movie having kind of an identity before
Speaker 1: anyone can even see it, it's so true. I mean
Speaker 1: it's like people can't just let the process work itself out,
Speaker 1: Like movies aren't just like made to order, Like sometimes
Speaker 1: it takes off for the director to get there in
Speaker 1: the editing room or whatever they're trying to do. And
Speaker 1: the obsession with the process and both the media and
Speaker 1: just kind of fandom is uh, it can be hurtful
Speaker 1: sometimes I was kind of cheer. Oh. There's also there's
Speaker 1: a line in that film that cracks me up to
Speaker 1: this day that you deliver I just want to do
Speaker 1: an impression over you real fast. Um. It's right after
Speaker 1: Sam Shepard finishes chewing you out and you go over
Speaker 1: to bread and you're like me and your brother, I
Speaker 1: just had a real nice visit. It kills me every
Speaker 1: time there's there's funny stuff like that in that movie.
Speaker 1: That's another reason I like it. It's kind of a
Speaker 1: complex movie in terms of tone sometimes. Uh. And also,
Speaker 1: you know, I forgot that you were in Almarta's Hamlet,
Speaker 1: so I, um, it's like sixteen years ago though, the
Speaker 1: kind of modern take on Hamlet with Ethan Hawk and
Speaker 1: the role, and uh, I've forgotten all about that. It's
Speaker 1: a fascinating movie. Do you remember it now that you've
Speaker 1: I just think I was there for about thirty minutes.
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't. That was like a movie made
Speaker 1: for nothing, probably shot in a few weeks, and you know,
Speaker 1: I had a few lines, and um, I felt like, well,
Speaker 1: that was a weird experience. I remember ran into Michael
Speaker 1: at the New York Film Festival after the screening of
Speaker 1: Manchester c and he was lovely and I, uh, I
Speaker 1: hadn't seen him in a decade. Uh. He's such an
Speaker 1: interesting guy and interesting filmmaker. I kind of loved that movie.
Speaker 1: It's such a product of its time too. I think
Speaker 1: there's like a more Chiba song in it or something
Speaker 1: like that. Uh. And you know the last question here,
Speaker 1: when you guys were young, when you were living up
Speaker 1: on that Hill Street house in Eagle Rock or was
Speaker 1: this what the dream looked liked? Did it differ from
Speaker 1: the reality and any significant way for you, like when
Speaker 1: you were trying to break in? Is this what you
Speaker 1: were hoping for? Um? You know? When I lived there,
Speaker 1: I after high school, I me and my best friend
Speaker 1: drove out to l A. And uh I never been
Speaker 1: out there. I didn't really know anyone who had any success.
Speaker 1: I didn't have an agent. I didn't know how to
Speaker 1: find an agent. Lived in Eagle Rock. I didn't even
Speaker 1: I don't think I even went into Hollywood. I think
Speaker 1: I knew Hollywood was I thought I was in Hollywood.
Speaker 1: I was an Eagle Rock and uh uh. I I
Speaker 1: liked acting because I like doing it's in high school,
Speaker 1: you know, and and what that is a pretty um
Speaker 1: far cry from what it really is to be like
Speaker 1: an I'm actor who works in movies and TV. Uh
Speaker 1: So when I was out here, I spent most of
Speaker 1: the year trying to find an agent and trying to
Speaker 1: find a job, and I get auditions and I was
Speaker 1: working in some restaurant and really I sort of lost
Speaker 1: interest over the course of the year because it wasn't
Speaker 1: a great experience I didn't like the auditions I was
Speaker 1: getting or anything I was reading. And it wasn't like
Speaker 1: what I remembered of, you know, doing theater and my
Speaker 1: high school, which sort of sounds so naive, but it
Speaker 1: was true. And and uh, I the dream that I
Speaker 1: had was based on that. It was that I just
Speaker 1: liked sort of doing drama in a way that a
Speaker 1: kid does. And and but so no, it doesn't look
Speaker 1: like I didn't know what was in fo I know
Speaker 1: what I was getting this over into. Uh. And I
Speaker 1: I'm incredibly grateful for the career that I have now,
Speaker 1: because I almost I can't. I can't explain the good fortune.
Speaker 1: Um Like, when I did Jesse James, I thought, if
Speaker 1: I could just I read the book and I thought
Speaker 1: I heard they were making it into a movie, and
Speaker 1: I thought, if I could play this part, I'll never
Speaker 1: ask for anything else, you know. And then I did it,
Speaker 1: and I and then I went on to work with
Speaker 1: a handful of other people who whose movies I admired
Speaker 1: and I really wanted to work with and I um
Speaker 1: and each time I thought like, oh man, this has
Speaker 1: got to be the pinnacle of my career. This is
Speaker 1: this is amazing and then I go on get to
Speaker 1: do something else, and I stayed close to so many
Speaker 1: of them, and um, I had to know gus Man
Speaker 1: sand and then he would invite me to go, you know,
Speaker 1: edit on one of his movies and just sort of
Speaker 1: sit around and learn watch him shadow him and Harris
Speaker 1: Vitas is shooting, and I get to be around all
Speaker 1: these people who are just you know, brilliant and I
Speaker 1: um and for whatever reason, they were included me and
Speaker 1: we're nice to me. And so the dream in in
Speaker 1: some way, uh is better than what I thought, you know,
Speaker 1: the the reality was better than is better than what
Speaker 1: I dreamt UM. In other ways, it's uh a lot worse.
Speaker 1: You know. There are things that I didn't know about.
Speaker 1: I was I was gonna have to do, and um,
Speaker 1: I didn't realize like I didn't never thought ahead said
Speaker 1: well someday you're gonna have kids. Now you're the only
Speaker 1: thing that you were able to do to murder Livings
Speaker 1: be an actor, and you're gonna have to go away
Speaker 1: for four months and go do a movie and it's
Speaker 1: gonna be heartbreaking to be with your family along and
Speaker 1: stuff like that. Uh So there's all the kind of
Speaker 1: the challenges that come with it, um, as with any job,
Speaker 1: and just responsibility and getting older and stuff. So the
Speaker 1: reality has been pretty different than than the dream. And um,
Speaker 1: do you think you think you're still chasing that feeling
Speaker 1: you had in high school? Well, I'm chasing the feeling
Speaker 1: that I've had. You know, some I I s get
Speaker 1: a little little glimpses of teeny tiny little doses of
Speaker 1: on some of the movies that I've done. Too. Uh.
Speaker 1: I wish I could do more theater. Um, that's kind
Speaker 1: of the purest version of of what I like to do.
Speaker 1: But I don't live in New York or London. I
Speaker 1: live in l A and it's not that much of it. Also,
Speaker 1: I really love the people who are making movies. It's
Speaker 1: fun to be around them and everybody from like the
Speaker 1: directors to the when it's done talking about them, you know,
Speaker 1: with people who like to talk about them, and we're
Speaker 1: interested and talk about them in smart ways and have
Speaker 1: smart questions, not the other all that other noise that happens. Um.
Speaker 1: I love. I also love making movies, so I'm happy
Speaker 1: to do it. Um. I don't think, Okay, this is
Speaker 1: definitely how I'm gonna spend the rest of my life.
Speaker 1: It might be UH doing something else, either by choice
Speaker 1: or because you know, I'll stop getting work. Um, but
Speaker 1: I can foresee a time when I'm not being an
Speaker 1: actor and and that doesn't scare me too much. UM. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's good, I'd be scared. Uh. In the meantime, go
Speaker 1: see Manchester by the Case. He is phenomenal in it,
Speaker 1: and congratulations in advance for your OSCAR nomination. Not to
Speaker 1: jinx it, but I don't. I think it's a safe bet.
Speaker 1: It's it's an amazing performance. So thanks again for being
Speaker 1: on the show man. I really appreciate my pleasure anytime.
Speaker 1: Thanks dude, m M. Thanks for listening everyone. Remember to
Speaker 1: subscribe and check back next week. You've been listening to
Speaker 1: playback at Variety. M