1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,680 Speaker 1: Just a heads up. This episode talks about school shootings, harassment, 2 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: and violence. When we failed to create the expectation of 3 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: safety for women and girls on social media, and when 4 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: we failed to meaningfully listen to them when they speak 5 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 1: up about what they're experiencing online, we make everyone, all 6 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:22,800 Speaker 1: of us less safe and more at risk. There are 7 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:24,479 Speaker 1: No Girls on the Internet. As a production of I 8 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 1: Heart Radio and Unbossed Creative, I'm Bridget Todd, and this 9 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: is there Are No Girls on the Internet. So this 10 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:38,159 Speaker 1: is gonna be a little bit of a different kind 11 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 1: of episode because frankly, I am in a little bit 12 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 1: of a different kind of headspace here in the United States. 13 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:46,879 Speaker 1: We have had a last few weeks of news that 14 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: was just brutal. You know, we were just processing a 15 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 1: pretty intense series of racially motivated shootings in Buffalo in California, 16 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 1: and last week another shooting, this time in Texas, where 17 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: twenty one people, mostly kids at an elementary school, were shot. 18 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:07,199 Speaker 1: And you know, I had a situation where I thought 19 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: I wasn't going to talk about this shooting on the 20 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:11,639 Speaker 1: podcast because it was just too much and too dark, 21 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: and frankly, I just really felt like I couldn't. But 22 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: over the weekend, news broke that really shed some light 23 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:22,240 Speaker 1: into the online behavior of the perpetrator of this shooting. 24 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:25,759 Speaker 1: And I think it is critically important to just talk 25 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:30,000 Speaker 1: to y'all because it really underscores the drum I have 26 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: been beating on this podcast for a very long time, 27 00:01:32,680 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 1: and that is we are ignoring women and girls when 28 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:39,200 Speaker 1: they speak up and share experiences of harassment and violent 29 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 1: threats online. We are telling them it doesn't matter. We're 30 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 1: acting like it doesn't matter, and we're all becoming less 31 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 1: safe because of it. So some of y'all might not 32 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: know this, but I first got the idea for there 33 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 1: are no Girls on the Internet while covering the Marjorie 34 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 1: Douglas school shooting. For this podcasts be called stuff, but 35 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: I've never told you back. So, in that shooting, the gunman, 36 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,880 Speaker 1: who was then nineteen year old Nicholas Cruise, shot and 37 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 1: killed seventeen of his classmates, and according to people who 38 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 1: knew him, nobody was surprised to find this out, Like 39 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 1: he was the kind of student where nobody was surprised 40 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: that he would do this kind of thing, And he 41 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:19,399 Speaker 1: actually left a digital paper trail full of online abuse violence, racism, 42 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:22,799 Speaker 1: and harassment. According to see an n on social media, 43 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 1: he hurled racial slurs at black folks, Muslims, and according 44 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: to the Anti Defamation League, he had ties to white 45 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 1: supremacists and he said pretty openly online that he planned 46 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:35,600 Speaker 1: to shoot people with an a R fifteen. He also 47 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 1: harassed young women and girls in his life digitally. The 48 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:42,079 Speaker 1: Miami Herald reported that Nicholas Cruz harassed a young girl 49 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:45,400 Speaker 1: who lived near his work, obsessively texting her and calling 50 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: her NonStop in the week leading up to the shooting. 51 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,240 Speaker 1: The girl was also referenced in a video that he 52 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: made on his phone right before the shooting. He said 53 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: my love for you will never go away, topping off 54 00:02:56,760 --> 00:03:00,520 Speaker 1: a droning speach about loneliness, anger and isolation, saying I 55 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:03,800 Speaker 1: hope to see you in the afterlife now. This girl 56 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: reported that she was afraid of him and did not 57 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 1: reciprocate those feelings. So, you know, I got to thinking 58 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 1: that oftentimes we have these big national instances of mass violence, 59 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: and they have things like misogyny at the heart of them, 60 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:21,960 Speaker 1: and it is really important that that not go overlooked. 61 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: And I remember researching the shooting and thinking what would 62 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 1: it look like if we had a culture that actually 63 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,440 Speaker 1: takes the kinds of online harassment against women and girls 64 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: like this seriously? What would it look like if it 65 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: wasn't just treated as you know, boys being boys online 66 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 1: or jokes or something like that, but rather what if 67 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: we treated this kind of thing as a serious red 68 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 1: flag that everybody should be concerned about, because it is 69 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: a red flag. So the data is super clear that 70 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 1: perpetrators of mass shootings in modern America overwhelmingly have a 71 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 1: history of domestic abuse or misogynistic behavior. And we see 72 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: this again and again and again. You know, for instance, 73 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:04,600 Speaker 1: men like Gerard Ramos, who repeatedly threatened his former school 74 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: classmates over both email and social media, to the point 75 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 1: where one of his targets actually moved because she felt 76 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 1: so unsafe. He would also use Twitter to attack journalists 77 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,719 Speaker 1: at the Capital Gazette over an article that they wrote 78 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:20,279 Speaker 1: covering criminal proceedings against him, as well as the judge 79 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,680 Speaker 1: presiding over that case. And this campaign of online harassment 80 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:26,919 Speaker 1: eventually led to a deadly shooting in Annapolis, Maryland that 81 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: left five people at the Capital Gazette dead. Or men 82 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: like Elliott Roger who uploaded several YouTube videos of railing 83 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,600 Speaker 1: against women and girls before an attack that would leave 84 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: six people dead. And according to the International Center of 85 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,520 Speaker 1: Research on Women, while we know that many perpetrators of 86 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: mass violence have a history of violence against women, it 87 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:48,479 Speaker 1: is also becoming increasingly clear that online gender based violence 88 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:52,720 Speaker 1: specifically is a precursor to violence carried out offline. And 89 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 1: that's really the problem. Having a culture that doesn't treat 90 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 1: online harassment and violence and threat against women and girls 91 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: as serious and not actually listening to us and we 92 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 1: speak up is dangerous, and especially as all of us, 93 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: especially younger people, are showing up more and more on 94 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: online spaces, what happens in those spaces really matters, both 95 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 1: online and off I am so sick of women and 96 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: girls being a canary in the coal mine about violent acts. 97 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:20,159 Speaker 1: And I'm sick of hearing this story again and again 98 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,119 Speaker 1: and again, where if only somebody had listened to women 99 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:27,040 Speaker 1: or taken the online harassment and threats against them seriously, 100 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:32,279 Speaker 1: maybe things would be different. Sources ABC News. The gunman 101 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: was inside the school for seventy seven gut wrenching minutes 102 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 1: before a tactical team defied local authorities and entered the school. 103 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:44,160 Speaker 1: So by now you've heard of the latest tragedy in Uvaldi, Texas, 104 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: where Salvador Promotes entered an elementary school and went on 105 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 1: a rampage that left twenty one people dead. So we 106 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: are rightly having a big conversation about the police response 107 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: to this shooting. You know, why they didn't enter the 108 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:58,599 Speaker 1: school and stop him sooner, and why they didn't respond 109 00:05:58,640 --> 00:06:02,280 Speaker 1: as these children begged for help. But another emerging narrative 110 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:06,280 Speaker 1: also asked a compelling question, why didn't anybody respond when 111 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 1: people on social media reported the shooters violent, harassing, misogynistic 112 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: and dangerous social media posts before the shooting. Why were 113 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 1: they not taken seriously? And what might be different if 114 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 1: they had been now? In new reporting from the Washington Post, 115 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 1: women and girls report that Remote repeatedly threatened and harassed 116 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 1: them on social media. For these women rarely reported him 117 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: because the threats seemed really vague. But one team who 118 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:33,920 Speaker 1: reported Remote on the social media app you bow said 119 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 1: that even after he reported him, nothing happened. A sixteen 120 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 1: year old boy in Austin said that he regularly saw 121 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: Remote on panels on the social networking app you bow, 122 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:45,799 Speaker 1: and he said that he frequently made aggressive sexual comments 123 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 1: to young women and sent him a death threat in January. 124 00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:51,920 Speaker 1: Here's what he had to say. I witnessed him harassed 125 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 1: girls and threatened them with sexual assault like rape and kidnapping. 126 00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:58,159 Speaker 1: It was not like a single occurrence, it was frequent. 127 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 1: He said. He and his friends were corded in the 128 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:02,720 Speaker 1: most account to you but for bullying and other infractions 129 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 1: dozens of times, and he says he never heard back 130 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 1: and his account remained active. But it's also worth pointing 131 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,320 Speaker 1: out that it really seems like the threats that he 132 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: made online didn't really stand out as anything notable or 133 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: out of the ordinary, because it's kind of just how 134 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 1: people expect the internet to be for women and girls, 135 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:23,440 Speaker 1: and this reveals a real danger and how our culture 136 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 1: minimizes what happens to women and girls on social media platforms. Basically, 137 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: we're told that this is just how it is on 138 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 1: the Internet. Let's take a quick break out our back. 139 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: We have completely normalized online violence and threats and harassment 140 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: to the point of it just being the cost of 141 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 1: being a woman on the internet. Women and girls are 142 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: not able to show up online with the expect page 143 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: of safety, care and respect. So the Washington Post goes 144 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: on to say that many suspected that this was just 145 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 1: how teen boys talked on the internet these days, a 146 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 1: blend of rage and misogyny so predictable they could barely 147 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 1: tell each one apart. One girl the Post reports, discussing 148 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: moments where remote had been creepy and threatening to her, 149 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: said quote, this is just how online is, and it 150 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 1: breaks my heart to say that that is kind of accurate. 151 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: Research Center study found that experiences like harassment, violent threats, 152 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 1: and the like are really common for young people, with 153 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 1: about two thirds of adults under thirty reporting that they've 154 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 1: experienced that kind of harassment of women under say they've 155 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 1: been sexually harassed online. They spoke to Daniel K. Citrone, 156 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: a law professor at the University of Virginia, who said 157 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:51,680 Speaker 1: that women and girls often don't report threats of rape 158 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: to law enforcement or trusted adults because they've just been 159 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:57,040 Speaker 1: socialized to feel that they do not deserve safety and 160 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 1: privacy online, or if they do report it, they don't 161 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,880 Speaker 1: feel that anything will be done because people don't take 162 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:07,200 Speaker 1: it seriously. And I really get that, you know, what 163 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:08,920 Speaker 1: will be the point about talking about this kind of 164 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: thing or reporting it if people are just going to 165 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 1: ignore you or not take it seriously, or you've just 166 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 1: been socialized that receiving violent harassment and threats is a 167 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:21,680 Speaker 1: normal part of you going online because you're a woman 168 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,400 Speaker 1: or a girl, and that shouldn't you just get used 169 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: to it. So I know a little bit about this firsthand. 170 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:29,480 Speaker 1: Quite a few years ago, I was on the receiving 171 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 1: end of some pretty nasty online harassment, and you know, 172 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:37,440 Speaker 1: I had that same kind of mentality that this is 173 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:39,600 Speaker 1: just the cost for being a woman who shows up 174 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 1: online to express herself and express for opinion. And I 175 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 1: really compartmentalized it. I didn't report it. I just sort 176 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,959 Speaker 1: of moved on with my life and I just thought 177 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:50,559 Speaker 1: this was how I had to show up. I had 178 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: to get used to this. If I was going to 179 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:54,679 Speaker 1: show up online as a woman was something to say. 180 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:58,240 Speaker 1: And it wasn't until the threats got really specific and 181 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:02,320 Speaker 1: scary that this changed me. So. I used to live 182 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: right next door to a bar in my city in 183 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 1: d C, and this was kind of my hangout spot, 184 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:09,360 Speaker 1: and I posted a lot on social media about how 185 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:12,200 Speaker 1: I was always at this bar and how I was 186 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: so lucky to live so close to it, and one day, 187 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: this person who had been harassing me for weeks set 188 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: me a screenshot from Google Maps showing my apartment next 189 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:26,880 Speaker 1: to this bar. He obviously used the information that I 190 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: put out to do to do this um telling me 191 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 1: he was coming for me. And this really was a 192 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,559 Speaker 1: little bit different for me. Right. I had gone from 193 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:37,920 Speaker 1: all of these unspecific, kind of vague threats that I 194 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:40,840 Speaker 1: could kind of compartmentalize and file the way and not 195 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:42,840 Speaker 1: think of them as a direct threat. But here was 196 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,520 Speaker 1: someone making a show of telling me that he knew 197 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:48,280 Speaker 1: exactly where I lived, right essentially a screenshot of my 198 00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 1: bedroom window, And it was really scary. This was a 199 00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:55,559 Speaker 1: new thing. So I contacted law enforcement, and a law 200 00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:58,360 Speaker 1: enforcement official came to my home and we talked about it, 201 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:01,480 Speaker 1: and essentially the advice that he gave me was that 202 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 1: I should delete my social media profiles and that I 203 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:08,320 Speaker 1: should not go online, and that then the harassment would stop. 204 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:10,720 Speaker 1: There was no need to take any kind of action 205 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:13,200 Speaker 1: in real life, that this was just an online thing 206 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,480 Speaker 1: that could be solved by shutting my laptop. And you know, 207 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: I found that response to be so frustrating for a 208 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: lot of reasons. First of all, telling me that I 209 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 1: should delete my social media profiles and just not show 210 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: up online at that point in my career and in 211 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 1: my life, was essentially telling me to get a new career. 212 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:32,719 Speaker 1: You know, at the time, I was trying to be 213 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 1: a journalist, a reporter, somebody who had a public opinion 214 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 1: the same way that I do on my podcast now, 215 00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: and so telling me that I just needed to shut 216 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 1: all of that down if I wanted these these threats 217 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:44,959 Speaker 1: to stop, was essentially telling me that I need to 218 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:47,719 Speaker 1: get a new career. And that didn't seem fair, right. 219 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:50,600 Speaker 1: It made it seem like that was just the cost 220 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:53,160 Speaker 1: of being a woman online and if I didn't like it, 221 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:57,480 Speaker 1: I could log off. And it also underscored this really 222 00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:00,320 Speaker 1: kind of backward way of thinking that suggests that what 223 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,840 Speaker 1: happens to us online has nothing to do with what 224 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:05,400 Speaker 1: happens to us in the real world. You know that 225 00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 1: all I had to do was shut my laptop and 226 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 1: my problem will be solved. And we know that's not true. 227 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: We know that what happens online bleeds into what happens 228 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: offline and vice versa. You know, these worlds that used 229 00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:20,960 Speaker 1: to think of as a buyin area are increasingly blurred, 230 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: especially for younger people. And this fifty year old white 231 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 1: man who was investigating this threat against me barely understood that, 232 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:31,280 Speaker 1: let alone took it seriously. And I'm actually glad that 233 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 1: we're in a place where I think we're starting to 234 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: have a shared understanding that the real world and the 235 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:39,440 Speaker 1: online world are one and the same, because that's the 236 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:42,959 Speaker 1: way it is, and that should really come with normalizing 237 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: safer experiences for all of us online, because when we 238 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: fail to create the expectation of safety for women and 239 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 1: girls on social media, and when we failed to meaningfully 240 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: listen to them when they speak up about what they're 241 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:57,839 Speaker 1: experiencing online, we make everyone, all of us less safe 242 00:12:57,880 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: and more at risk. You know, we create us at 243 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,160 Speaker 1: suation where red flags go missed and perpetrators like Elliott 244 00:13:03,240 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: Roger and Salvador are remots are left to do more harm. 245 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:08,839 Speaker 1: And this does not just have to be the way 246 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:12,319 Speaker 1: it is for women and girls online. We deserve to 247 00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:15,679 Speaker 1: show up with safety and respect online, and we deserve 248 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 1: for that to be a normalized cultural expectation, because when 249 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:31,439 Speaker 1: it isn't, we are all at risk. Last weekend, protesters 250 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,480 Speaker 1: pleaded with President Biden to do something about guns in 251 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 1: this country, and it is so frustrating that we have 252 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: to scream and plead for our safety and the safety 253 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:43,559 Speaker 1: of our children. I want meaningful action to address the 254 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: bread that guns post to our kids in this country. 255 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:47,880 Speaker 1: And I also want to create a culture where our 256 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: kids can expect better, where they know what they speak 257 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 1: up about facing violent threats online, someone will listen and 258 00:13:54,440 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 1: take it seriously because our safety depends on it. Got 259 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 1: a story about an interesting thing in tech, or just 260 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: want to say hi. You can reach us at Hello 261 00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 1: at tang godi dot com. You can also find transcripts 262 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: for today's episode at tang godi dot com. There Are 263 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: No Girls on the Internet was created by me Bridget Tod. 264 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:17,840 Speaker 1: It's a production of iHeart Radio and Unboss creative Jonathan 265 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 1: Strickland as our executive producer. Terry Harrison is our producer 266 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:24,400 Speaker 1: and sound engineer. Michael Amato is our contributing producer. I'm 267 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: your host, Bridget Todd. If you want to help us grow, 268 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,640 Speaker 1: rate and review us on Apple Podcasts. For more podcasts 269 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: from iHeart Radio, check out the iHeart Radio app, Apple 270 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:34,800 Speaker 1: podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.