Speaker 1: Hi, my name is Amanda Lasher and I was a
Speaker 1: coep on Gossip Growl. Welcome back, listeners to your one
Speaker 1: and only source into all things Gossip grow You know
Speaker 1: you love it. XO x O. Hello, Hello, I'm Jessica's
Speaker 1: Or and this is XO XO. Today's rewatch is season two,
Speaker 1: episode eight, preapoor j. This episode is all about the
Speaker 1: monologue from Jenny quitting Eleanor's to Chuck calling things off
Speaker 1: with Blair. And nobody does a breakup speech better than
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl. So to help me dive into all of this,
Speaker 1: we've got the writer herself, Amanda Lasher. Amanda not only
Speaker 1: wrote today's episode, she was a writer and executive producer
Speaker 1: on Gossip Girl for pretty much the entire show. And
Speaker 1: she's produced shows like Sweet Fishes, The Bold Type, and Riverdale,
Speaker 1: so she's definitely an expert on drama. Oh and for
Speaker 1: all unate fans, she wrote the scene with him shirtless
Speaker 1: on purpose, and she says, you're welcome. Okay, now let's
Speaker 1: get started. Hi, how are you? I'm good? How are
Speaker 1: you I'm good? Do you know what I find really
Speaker 1: kind of funny? Are ironic about this? Well? First off,
Speaker 1: We're so excited to have you. We've been talking about
Speaker 1: you for so long while doing this podcast. The writer's
Speaker 1: room was always in l A. And we were filming
Speaker 1: in New York, so it's kind of weird. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure if you're in l A right now. I'm in Arizona,
Speaker 1: but we're still like working, you know, with technology about
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl, so I kind of feel like it's the
Speaker 1: same but different. It's all on it's all on brand. Um. Yeah, No,
Speaker 1: I am in l A. And that's where I was
Speaker 1: for the writing of the show. Yeah, okay, Well, let's
Speaker 1: just do an introduction to you, because obviously you deserve
Speaker 1: that and we respect your work you as a person,
Speaker 1: as a writer, as a producer of this show. I'm
Speaker 1: so honored that you're here. This is Amanda Lasher, who
Speaker 1: was a writer for almost all of the show to
Speaker 1: two thousand eight to two thou twelve. That sounds right.
Speaker 1: It's been so long, but I got the majority of
Speaker 1: the show and also produced the show, and now we
Speaker 1: have her to you know, do a rewatch with us
Speaker 1: for season two, episode eight to Port Jay. What a
Speaker 1: great episode. Thank you. I was really excited when I
Speaker 1: saw that that's what you guys wanted to talk about.
Speaker 1: Because I had this moment where I got the email
Speaker 1: and I was like, yeah, that'd be fun. And I
Speaker 1: was like, but what is the what? You know, what
Speaker 1: the topic? And then when I saw that it was
Speaker 1: about pedopor j I was like, oh, no, I actually
Speaker 1: have things to say. Yeah, I can't wait. And so
Speaker 1: this the title refers to pret to porte Yes, the
Speaker 1: satire about fashion Week with Julia Roberts and Cephila Wren
Speaker 1: and Kimbationer like amazing and a quick question on that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Norman Buckley and we were just talking about this how
Speaker 1: it's a play on words. But a lot of the
Speaker 1: titles don't have anything to do really with the episode.
Speaker 1: So do you did you like write the episode and
Speaker 1: then put the title to it after or it comes
Speaker 1: up when it comes up and feels organic, like oh
Speaker 1: that's there's a movie and we can use this. Like
Speaker 1: was it different every time? That's a great question. I
Speaker 1: think it was different every time. It would be like
Speaker 1: we would like kind of kick around titles in the
Speaker 1: room and stuff like that and sort of try and
Speaker 1: find something that felt right. But then sometimes it was
Speaker 1: just like getting something that was a good pun or
Speaker 1: a good play, because there's great ones. This is one
Speaker 1: of my everyones. How about the next episode there might
Speaker 1: be blood that I was like, I think we've crossed
Speaker 1: the line here, we're going in here. It's so yeah,
Speaker 1: so good. Okay, So do you want to give us
Speaker 1: a little backstory of kind of where you're from and
Speaker 1: how you knew you wanted to be a writer, and
Speaker 1: how it came about to be a writer with Josh
Speaker 1: and Stephanie and with the amazing writing team that we had,
Speaker 1: and also just how it was to write in on
Speaker 1: the other side of the country, because a lot of
Speaker 1: times when you're on a show, and I know, everything
Speaker 1: changes as years go on, like but at that time,
Speaker 1: a lot of times you were in the same city
Speaker 1: as your writers at least or even on the same lot,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, in studio, so you know,
Speaker 1: and then it's a different time zone. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 1: It was the first time that I had ever had
Speaker 1: that experience because so I, um, just backstory of me.
Speaker 1: I'm from Los Angeles and um, my parents actually are
Speaker 1: literary agents and when I said that I wanted to
Speaker 1: be a writer, they were like, over my dead body yes,
Speaker 1: not happening. Not happening, like like that's not the life
Speaker 1: for you. And so I tried to be uh an executive,
Speaker 1: Like I worked and I worked in a Mirrormax, and
Speaker 1: I worked in like film and all that stuff, and
Speaker 1: then I tried all these different jobs and then ultimately
Speaker 1: I was just like, this is what I want to do.
Speaker 1: And I managed to get a job as a writer's
Speaker 1: assistant on a comedy called The Oblongs, and it was
Speaker 1: just an amazing experience and sort of like confirmed everything
Speaker 1: that I sort of thought about what I wanted to
Speaker 1: do with my career. And once I kind of got
Speaker 1: that job, I realized that the only way to actually
Speaker 1: get into a writer's room is to just keep writing.
Speaker 1: And so I spent like weekends going to the Beverly
Speaker 1: Hills Library and you know, writing spec scripts and writing writing, writing,
Speaker 1: and eventually I got on a show where they offered
Speaker 1: me the opportunity to write an episode and they read
Speaker 1: my samples and they promoted me to being a writer.
Speaker 1: And now my parents are like, it's amazing that you're
Speaker 1: a writer. Were sad, so great, Well, you know, on
Speaker 1: the on the on the flip side of that, like
Speaker 1: when you're in something and know how difficult it can be,
Speaker 1: or the grind. Sometimes as a new mom, you're kind
Speaker 1: of like, you know, you want to protect your kids,
Speaker 1: but at the same time them telling you not to
Speaker 1: might have also lit a little bit of a fire.
Speaker 1: But obviously you're so talented and had that in you,
Speaker 1: so maybe then it's just a part of your family,
Speaker 1: a part of your blood. Yeah, no, it's I mean
Speaker 1: I was not the best rebel, so it was like
Speaker 1: scary for me to do something they told me not
Speaker 1: to do. I was like, even in my twenties, I
Speaker 1: was like, I don't think I should go against what
Speaker 1: my parents want, but it just was sort of like
Speaker 1: nothing else felt right. But no, they Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: they came from a place of love. I'm an only child,
Speaker 1: and they I think they wanted me to have a
Speaker 1: job that had a lot of security, and but the
Speaker 1: reality is that like no jobs do anymore. Do you
Speaker 1: know we learned that recently, didn't we all? Um? And
Speaker 1: so ultimately, you know, they saw that I was able
Speaker 1: to sort of like living in also just that like
Speaker 1: I genuinely like it's what I really genuinely wanted to do,
Speaker 1: and they were very, very yeah, I love to do
Speaker 1: and they were super supportive and it was great even
Speaker 1: when I was, you know, spending every weekend at the
Speaker 1: Beverly Hills Library and like I homeless guy asked me
Speaker 1: if I wanted to be as assistant. I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, let me write that down. Actually I'm gonna
Speaker 1: use that one day. So how did Gossip Girl come about? Then?
Speaker 1: I had been working in comedies and sitcoms and I
Speaker 1: was sort of becoming disenchanted with it. It just sort
Speaker 1: of felt like the writing was I feel very constrained
Speaker 1: by it. It was all about sort of like the
Speaker 1: setup and the joke, and when I was off writing scripts,
Speaker 1: I just I don't know, I just felt like I
Speaker 1: wasn't having fun in that medium and so and I
Speaker 1: was realizing that the shows that I was watching were
Speaker 1: more hour long. So I made a decision to sort of, Um,
Speaker 1: I wrote a spec Gray's Anatomy, which at the time
Speaker 1: you could write a sample script of a show that
Speaker 1: was on the air and that's how you would get work.
Speaker 1: And now it's changed and writers coming up tend to
Speaker 1: have to write pilots and original pieces, which is really hard.
Speaker 1: Like I'm so grateful that I came up at a
Speaker 1: time where you could write samples of other shows, because
Speaker 1: when you're learning, like when you're finding your footing as
Speaker 1: a writer, it's hard. It's really hard. Like I've been
Speaker 1: doing it for a long time now, and pilots and
Speaker 1: original pieces are still like their challenging. And so I
Speaker 1: wrote A Gray's Anatomy and um sent it around and
Speaker 1: trying to remember. But basically I made a concerted effort
Speaker 1: to switch over from comedy to drama, which was sort
Speaker 1: of like a tricky thing at that time. And I
Speaker 1: did a season on a show called Lipstick Jungle and
Speaker 1: do you remember that show? Yes, Yes, that's right, she was.
Speaker 1: And then I got then I got hired on a
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl, and I was so excited because the first
Speaker 1: season had already come out and I had seen it
Speaker 1: and I was like just a huge fan of the show,
Speaker 1: and so getting that GID was like very exciting and
Speaker 1: a really happy time in my life because I had
Speaker 1: had just had my daughter, and so she was like
Speaker 1: eight or nine months old, and the writer strike had happened,
Speaker 1: and so because of the writer strike, I had sort
Speaker 1: of like forced maternity leave, like I couldn't work even
Speaker 1: if I wanted to, And it was just this sort
Speaker 1: of like I took that as the gift that it was.
Speaker 1: And really, even though it's not like the strike was
Speaker 1: brutal and not fun for anybody, it was nice to
Speaker 1: have that time with my daughter. And then by the
Speaker 1: time Gossip Girl around, I was ready to get back
Speaker 1: to work. And wow, that's such a lovely story though,
Speaker 1: Like and then also because getting to be home with
Speaker 1: your daughter at that time and it kept going longer
Speaker 1: than anyone thought, your brain was probably still like in
Speaker 1: mom mode, but still excited to get back to the
Speaker 1: show that we were hoping we were going to come
Speaker 1: back to. Because that was a weird time. We keep
Speaker 1: talking about that writer or strike situation, and yeah, well
Speaker 1: but I think it like ultimately kind of served helped
Speaker 1: us because it's like that first season, like word of
Speaker 1: mouth really spread and also like there wasn't content coming
Speaker 1: out and so people were watching and finding in stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Josh and Stephanie talked about it. Norman touched on it. Michelle,
Speaker 1: So when we were going back, were you finding it
Speaker 1: challenging because the show was season one hit in a
Speaker 1: way and people were so excited for season two. Did
Speaker 1: you feel like the expectations to like bring heat and
Speaker 1: bring a vibe was like through the roof or where
Speaker 1: you like, I'm here, I'm game, and I'm gonna just
Speaker 1: do my thing. I well, because I wasn't on first
Speaker 1: season and I was just a fan. I just literally
Speaker 1: came into that room as a fan girl. Like I
Speaker 1: was super excited. I was like, what was happening with
Speaker 1: like Juck and Blair, Like I was very very excited.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I just remember being very happy to be
Speaker 1: there and excited to like dive into those stories. And
Speaker 1: also I remember I was the only person I think
Speaker 1: on staff who had a kid at that point, and
Speaker 1: I was like very nervous about revealing it was like
Speaker 1: my deep dark secret, like because the girls gonna be
Speaker 1: like spotted breastfeeding after hours, pumping in the corner. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because just at that time, like I just didn't have
Speaker 1: as many friends who were in rooms who had maybe
Speaker 1: you know, things have changed a lot um, So I
Speaker 1: was a little nervous about that, Like there was that
Speaker 1: piece of it, but I was just mostly excited to
Speaker 1: dive in. Yeah, that's awesome. Okay, so let's get into
Speaker 1: this But here's there's a fan question that I want
Speaker 1: to ask, which is a great question. Who writes the
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl quotes? Is it the same writer every time?
Speaker 1: I'm obviously I'm sure it's not. But just the like
Speaker 1: the tone of it, and the wittiness and the snarkiness
Speaker 1: and the cleverness and all the things that Kristen brings
Speaker 1: to the writing that you all did for her for
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl is just brilliant. But is that is that
Speaker 1: an effort with everyone in the room or because it
Speaker 1: was your episode, you're gonna do the Gossip Girl quotes. Yeah,
Speaker 1: everybody did their own Gossip Girl quotes for their episode,
Speaker 1: and they were hard, Like they were really really hard
Speaker 1: to do, and so yeah, they were always very challenging.
Speaker 1: In fact, I would be like pacing the house, like
Speaker 1: being like so like every like narrating everything. You know,
Speaker 1: they were really hard. I can only imagine because listening
Speaker 1: back and watching and when I am reading them after
Speaker 1: the fact, it's there's show clever and cuts to each
Speaker 1: storyline and the music with it. It's so amazing. But
Speaker 1: I just didn't know if that was like everyone sat
Speaker 1: at the table in the writer's room and it was
Speaker 1: like let's all put our heads together, or everyone just
Speaker 1: was left you there left round devices. But that said,
Speaker 1: I mean, there would certainly be moments where like I
Speaker 1: remember being like going into Josh's room and being like, okay,
Speaker 1: like I have the first part of this and like,
Speaker 1: you know, like trying to like and he'd be like,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to write my old Gossip Girls get out
Speaker 1: and so figure out those But I mean, part of
Speaker 1: the fun and the challenge of the show is that
Speaker 1: it did the voices were so specific and so crisp,
Speaker 1: and like, it was such a fun show to write,
Speaker 1: like always and so and I remember when I started,
Speaker 1: like Stephanie sort of well because there were a couple
Speaker 1: of new writers being like and this character speaks a
Speaker 1: little more slowly, and this person, you know, like she
Speaker 1: sort of talked to us a little bit about the rhythms.
Speaker 1: But I also what I did was I listened to
Speaker 1: the show in my car as I would drive to work,
Speaker 1: because I wanted to get the like rhythms of all
Speaker 1: of your voices in my head and so that I
Speaker 1: could kind of drop into it faster when I was
Speaker 1: writing the show, which helped me a lot. You know, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's awesome there. Okay, so we're going to get into
Speaker 1: where we left off, but real quick. Before Amanda Lasher,
Speaker 1: we had a character that came in and had like
Speaker 1: a flirtation with Dan was like doing like a secret
Speaker 1: side job with Chuck. And her name was Amanda Lasher.
Speaker 1: And I had a question for you when when you're
Speaker 1: casting someone that's named after you, like if I was
Speaker 1: casting someone named Jessica's or when they walk in, I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm already gonna be like, oh, I don't know,
Speaker 1: like look wise or this, Like I have so much
Speaker 1: in my head already. How was that casting her? And
Speaker 1: she did a great job playing Amanda, and that storyline
Speaker 1: was wonderful, like the Nair Martini all of that was nuts.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it was great. I mean that was I
Speaker 1: mean to be told. That was the first week I
Speaker 1: was there and they were like, I know, we're going
Speaker 1: to name this character Amanda Lasher. It was like WHOA
Speaker 1: welcoming me. But I would never again, I would not
Speaker 1: recommend having a character with your first and last name
Speaker 1: because it has led to like total confusion sometimes where
Speaker 1: like it's like I think there was something where like
Speaker 1: like I've been like quoted in interviews, but they it's
Speaker 1: actually the actor who played me. Like it's led to
Speaker 1: a lot of confusion, Yeah, character in the show, which
Speaker 1: would be a little bit scary from Gossip Girl. You
Speaker 1: never know who's saying what. Yeah, I'm coming to someone's
Speaker 1: coming to near my hair. Um. But I had just
Speaker 1: started at that point and I was not involved in
Speaker 1: the casting and the producing as much, and so that
Speaker 1: sort of built up as I was there over time,
Speaker 1: so she was I had nothing to do with the casting.
Speaker 1: But I'm just trying to remember if I even saw
Speaker 1: an advancing of it. No, I just was like flatter,
Speaker 1: here's I thought it was funny, and I was flattered that.
Speaker 1: I was kind of surprised my name got all the
Speaker 1: way through. I think that's a and Lasher is kind
Speaker 1: of a fun last name. So it's been like it's
Speaker 1: an Anne Rice character's name Lasher, And I think there's
Speaker 1: actually a series coming out like called Lasher. But it's
Speaker 1: been used in other things like people like the name
Speaker 1: and so, but it's the first time it was a
Speaker 1: Mande Lasher. But throughout this series, like when I always
Speaker 1: put my friends names in the show, like who were
Speaker 1: some of your friends names characterized well. Jonathan Um Eric's boyfriend,
Speaker 1: Jonathan is named after one of my best friends, and
Speaker 1: he had the experience which I think you talked about
Speaker 1: it because I listened to the episode where people like
Speaker 1: came up to him he said his daughter a club once. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was like no. It was like, oh, yeah, that
Speaker 1: character John is named after me, and John would be
Speaker 1: like no, which is so random that people would even
Speaker 1: like say that, But it happened like two times. And
Speaker 1: then in predibor J they were like, I put like
Speaker 1: little East dregs, like when they're like, oh those two
Speaker 1: stylist Sasky and Trish, those are like two of my
Speaker 1: close friends from New York. So I would just like
Speaker 1: put in little winks like I will see. So it
Speaker 1: happens a lot more than people are aware of. Like
Speaker 1: I know, in the in the pilot or very beginning
Speaker 1: of season one where Eric goes to rehab was named
Speaker 1: after one of the writers, or maybe it was even Cicily,
Speaker 1: the creator. I'd have to go back and look. But
Speaker 1: there's a lot more that pop up that are like
Speaker 1: personal to people attached to the show than than I think,
Speaker 1: you know, the fans or viewers realized you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, But I think that's really cool and fun.
Speaker 1: I like that little that little fun fact. Okay, so
Speaker 1: let's get into pret to Port Jay. Where we left
Speaker 1: off is Chuck told Blair that it's her turn to
Speaker 1: chase him. Nate is staying with the Humphries, and Jenny
Speaker 1: has left Constants with Rufus's blessing to work full time
Speaker 1: for Eleanor. And here's the log line for this episode.
Speaker 1: Season two, episode eight, Jenny be friends a young model
Speaker 1: who encourages Jenny not to only explore her why outside,
Speaker 1: but also confront her boss, Eleanor Waldorf, who is attempting
Speaker 1: to borrow Jenny's designs. Serena meets an artist Aaron Rose
Speaker 1: and realizes they have an instant chemistry. Lara attempts to
Speaker 1: seduce Chuck, but it proves tougher than she imagined. Okay, So,
Speaker 1: speaking of Chuck and Blair in this episode, right off
Speaker 1: the bat, they're getting hot and heavy. It looks to
Speaker 1: be in the back of the limo and we're in
Speaker 1: Blair's head. Well, Jessica, you'd be referring to my proudest
Speaker 1: moment as a writer, would be my female masturbation scene
Speaker 1: that I put in my first episode of Gossip Girl,
Speaker 1: which is still one of my proudest moments as a writer.
Speaker 1: My goods. No, I was like, no, Blair is going
Speaker 1: to masturbate. I was like, that's what's going to happen
Speaker 1: because she is thinking about him and that's what she
Speaker 1: would be doing. And I remember when I put it in,
Speaker 1: like you know, I mean, I pitched it in the
Speaker 1: room in people signed off on it. That's why it
Speaker 1: went in. Like Stephanie was on board, everyone's on board.
Speaker 1: But I remember being really really nervous when we got
Speaker 1: notes from the studio, both on the aline and on
Speaker 1: the script, and I remember sitting because what would happen is,
Speaker 1: you know, I would write the outline. I would give
Speaker 1: it to Josh Saffron and um John Stevens. It was
Speaker 1: running room and so they would like look at it
Speaker 1: and read it and give notes, and Stephanie would look
Speaker 1: at it and give notes, and then you would make
Speaker 1: those revisions and then it would go to the studio
Speaker 1: and the network and we would get their notes and right,
Speaker 1: but I remember sitting in Stephanie's office and waiting for
Speaker 1: the first pay. They'd say Okay, we're gonna start start
Speaker 1: the note, you know, a couple overall thoughts. We feel
Speaker 1: like you can pick up the pace here, what are this?
Speaker 1: You know? They give sort of like general overall thoughts
Speaker 1: and then they'd start on page notes and they'd be like, okay,
Speaker 1: so page starting on page whatever. And I remember as
Speaker 1: a studio executive. I forget who it was at the time,
Speaker 1: but like hunching into the page notes, they were like
Speaker 1: starting on page eight and test Stephanie. Yes. So they
Speaker 1: just skipped right past it. They just give right past it.
Speaker 1: Oh my god. And I just kept waiting for them
Speaker 1: to give me pushback on it, and they didn't, and
Speaker 1: I was very happy. So this is in Blair's dream
Speaker 1: where they're in the back of the limount and then
Speaker 1: Deroda comes in and it's like, you know, God's always
Speaker 1: watching you, like all of the I wish that Derode
Speaker 1: had been work accepting. I wish the Derode had been
Speaker 1: liked this a beautiful way to start your day. Yeah,
Speaker 1: go ahead, do your thing. I see you. Gosh, I
Speaker 1: love it. How do you write a sex scene like that?
Speaker 1: I know it's not just the physical thing of like, Okay,
Speaker 1: he's going to go, you know, lick her arm and
Speaker 1: go down, and you know, because something even just saying
Speaker 1: that right now, it doesn't sound or feel as sex
Speaker 1: as when you watch something, or sometimes it doesn't feel
Speaker 1: as sexy when doing it because it's so you know, technical.
Speaker 1: But how is writing a sex scene and is it
Speaker 1: more fun writing a sex scene for characters like that
Speaker 1: just because like they just give so much and people
Speaker 1: love it. I mean writing again, like not to be
Speaker 1: boring about, but just writing for the characters was always
Speaker 1: just super fun and obviously with them because there was
Speaker 1: such like playfulness in it and also just like wickedness
Speaker 1: like that you could kind of you cross lines and
Speaker 1: you could go places that were just really fun because
Speaker 1: it was true to their characters. In terms of writing
Speaker 1: a sex scene, sometimes it's like super fun and you
Speaker 1: know you can kind of like really get into what
Speaker 1: you wanted to be, and then other times it does
Speaker 1: become kind of technical depending on how you shoot it.
Speaker 1: And what's interesting is it's really changed now because I
Speaker 1: actually just had to write one first show that I
Speaker 1: was on and before like when I wrote that one,
Speaker 1: like I'm trying to remember, but there would be like
Speaker 1: playfulness in the writing, and there would be sort of
Speaker 1: like a little bit of um freedom with for the
Speaker 1: director in terms of how far we wanted to take it,
Speaker 1: But it would depend on what the sex scene is,
Speaker 1: because sometimes like the sex scene is just about like
Speaker 1: they're off kissing and you know, they fall to the
Speaker 1: bed and we know what's going to happen. But other times,
Speaker 1: like you are telling a story that where the sex
Speaker 1: goes to or the tenor of it is obviously very important,
Speaker 1: and so then you need to you need to make
Speaker 1: sure that that's in the writing and then that's really clear.
Speaker 1: But now to make actors feel more comfortable and to
Speaker 1: like make the lines very clear for you guys when
Speaker 1: you're on set. The sex scene that I wrote most recently,
Speaker 1: like we literally wrote like he puts his hand on
Speaker 1: her thigh, Like we literally like choreographic so that when
Speaker 1: the actors reading it, like you guys know actually what
Speaker 1: to expect and you're not walking into a situation that's
Speaker 1: a gray area. And writing that was definitely more awkward
Speaker 1: and also like just kind of mortifying, right, it's interesting
Speaker 1: to sort of unpack that and how we get to
Speaker 1: that decision. You know, it's almost like doing a whole
Speaker 1: another adding a whole another piece to it because it
Speaker 1: just wasn't done like that before. However, it was written
Speaker 1: in this opening scene in the back of the car
Speaker 1: and Blair's head, which we don't know at first. Yeah,
Speaker 1: also too right away, I was like, wait, now that
Speaker 1: did they just let everything go and they're just gonna
Speaker 1: get back and like get to it like perfect, because
Speaker 1: that's what we're all waiting for anyway, right. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: that's going on, and then we have Nate living with
Speaker 1: the Humphries the best, which I love. Who doesn't want
Speaker 1: Nate like, you know, writing in your bathroom? Yeah? Okay,
Speaker 1: so going into that where he's like living with the Humphries.
Speaker 1: Did you know going into this episode, was it on
Speaker 1: like a storyboard somewhere that there may be a flirtation
Speaker 1: with Nate and Jenny or did that come up when
Speaker 1: you're like, we have to do something because it's Gossip
Speaker 1: Girl and there's two hot people on a roof and yeah,
Speaker 1: let's do this. Yeah. I'm trying to remember sure of exactly,
Speaker 1: but we would at the beginning of the season, like
Speaker 1: one of the most fun things is we would talk about,
Speaker 1: you know, with Gossip Wil there were so many episodes,
Speaker 1: so we would break it up, you know, in talking
Speaker 1: about it, but we would talk about like maybe the
Speaker 1: first twelve episodes and like how we wanted to ark
Speaker 1: that and where we wanted to build two at the
Speaker 1: end of the season, and so we would have like
Speaker 1: a rough sense of Okay, we want to put these
Speaker 1: characters together and we want to try this, and yeah,
Speaker 1: because I don't I don't feel like there was any
Speaker 1: kind of like little treats or easter eggs telling that
Speaker 1: like when that happened when he came out of the
Speaker 1: bathroom with no shirt, which, by the way, didn't did
Speaker 1: you choose to have Chase with no shirt Nate with
Speaker 1: no shirt on? Because most girls at home are like,
Speaker 1: we'd like to see Nate with no shirt? Um, what's
Speaker 1: I think? I was there that day and I don't remember,
Speaker 1: but obviously we would want to give the audience the
Speaker 1: best experience possible. Open Jenny opens the door and you're
Speaker 1: like hello, I mean yeah, And that's what we wanted.
Speaker 1: That moment, like that visceral moment of like what do
Speaker 1: you do when you are a fifteen year old girl
Speaker 1: and you open up your bathroom door and Nate Archibald
Speaker 1: right there, like holy shit, and he's like your hair
Speaker 1: did you change something? It's like, oh, you know this
Speaker 1: that's completely different hair style. It's totally new character that
Speaker 1: I am. Oh my god, I love it. Okay, So
Speaker 1: he's living there and I too. For a moment when
Speaker 1: like Jenny and Nate like they have this thing, I'm like, wait,
Speaker 1: is he going to go there? Because I I'm the
Speaker 1: oldest of five kids, and a lot of my friends
Speaker 1: had thought my brother, who was four years younger than us,
Speaker 1: was like the cutest, hottest thing. And then when we
Speaker 1: got into high school and he was a freshman and he,
Speaker 1: you know, we were seniors. One of my friends was like,
Speaker 1: I kind of like want to make up with your brother,
Speaker 1: and like, first of all, don't be weird, but like
Speaker 1: I'm also not going to be like, you know, cock
Speaker 1: blocking my brother here. I just always know. And then
Speaker 1: I had friends that had older brothers in high school
Speaker 1: and it was an absolute no no, like nope, there's
Speaker 1: no flirtation, there's no you guys can't even sit in
Speaker 1: the back, you know, in the back seat together on
Speaker 1: the way to the football game. Like but you're just
Speaker 1: making it more forbidden and there for more exciting, right right,
Speaker 1: So here's this moment where it kind of like clicked
Speaker 1: in my like it took me back to high school
Speaker 1: with my friends, with my brother, and I'm like, wait,
Speaker 1: is Nate going to like go there because anything can
Speaker 1: happen in gospel or is this just gonna be one
Speaker 1: like moment where he's living there? You know? So did
Speaker 1: you know from jump that you guys were going to
Speaker 1: explore that? Yeah? Yeah, no, we definitely were like, let's
Speaker 1: play with this because it is first of all, it
Speaker 1: was fun to think about like how each characters would
Speaker 1: like play off of each other, and like the kinds
Speaker 1: of things that Jenny wanted and the kinds of things
Speaker 1: that Nate wanted, and like, it was just always fun
Speaker 1: to sort of think about the different combinations and then
Speaker 1: also just playing into that fun fantasy of like being
Speaker 1: a teenage girl and Nate Archibald likes you, and like
Speaker 1: who doesn't like? For sure, I think people can get
Speaker 1: behind that. Yes, I don't know if Dan would so much.
Speaker 1: But and then we have Dan, who was you know,
Speaker 1: at school with Serena and Blair is like going through
Speaker 1: this whole kind of devastating moment because she just wants
Speaker 1: to be with Chuck, but like it's so stubborn both
Speaker 1: gets in her own way. So this moment where Dan
Speaker 1: is kind of advising Blair was like so wild to
Speaker 1: me because I'm like she is like so bothered by
Speaker 1: him or like just doesn't even It's like Dan hump
Speaker 1: from gross and now she's making trips to like Brooklyn
Speaker 1: to like get advice from him. I was writing with
Speaker 1: with for Dan and Blair because of just their characters
Speaker 1: dynamic of of Blair she doesn't care get up in
Speaker 1: the dictionary, Like you'll see her face and you know, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: he thought she was full on garbage. Yeah, and she
Speaker 1: thought he was garbage. Well again, Like it was really
Speaker 1: fun because they did loathe each other so much, you know,
Speaker 1: when we decided to get them together in later seasons,
Speaker 1: it came from this place of like, well, they loathe
Speaker 1: each other so much, but they're both like intellectual matches
Speaker 1: for each other. And that was the thing that we
Speaker 1: were always very aware of is that like Dan and
Speaker 1: Blair actually had a lot in common in that sense
Speaker 1: that they were both like super super smart and knew
Speaker 1: how to funk with each other. Even though Dan was
Speaker 1: like pure of heart allegedly. Um. But but those those
Speaker 1: scenes were fun to write because they did hate each
Speaker 1: other and they could just like openly insult each other
Speaker 1: and they did. They did. Yeah, and it had its
Speaker 1: own spark, you know, it has its own spark. It
Speaker 1: has its own And it was also just fun to
Speaker 1: see her just like reluctantly having to take dance advice.
Speaker 1: And yeah, and also any you know, I mean, Layton
Speaker 1: was so good at just playing vulnerability where she even
Speaker 1: in those moments where she was a monster, like that
Speaker 1: vulnerability always peeked through and you'd forgive or anything for it,
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah. It was a really I like their
Speaker 1: dynamic in this and and there was a moment where
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, there's they're not going to hook up.
Speaker 1: They can't. That's so funny they can't. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: we we really did like dance around I remember like
Speaker 1: we danced around it for a long time because we
Speaker 1: were like, oh, like, do can we believe that they
Speaker 1: would hook up? Can we believe that they would hook up?
Speaker 1: And in the beginning we were just like no. But
Speaker 1: then like the more we wrote them and the more
Speaker 1: that they sort of like their characters evolved and humanize.
Speaker 1: You know, we did start to feel like, no, this
Speaker 1: actually could happen and it was interesting. Well, you guys
Speaker 1: did such a good job because it has everyone's heads
Speaker 1: like spinning like wait what yeh. And then this whole
Speaker 1: thing with Jenny, Like I like this layer with Nate
Speaker 1: in this episode where this opens that door on top
Speaker 1: of like the whole situation at work with Eleanor, like
Speaker 1: she really is so talented, but she is young, And
Speaker 1: there's like a part of me that feels like there
Speaker 1: was something in this storyline where it's like, just because
Speaker 1: you're young and you can be talented and have so
Speaker 1: much to offer, doesn't mean because someone else is older
Speaker 1: or more has more on their plate or more to offer,
Speaker 1: more successful, that they should be able to like kind
Speaker 1: of take advantage of you. I keep getting that from
Speaker 1: these last couple of episodes, and really heavily in this one.
Speaker 1: And I kind of like that Jenny had like this backbone,
Speaker 1: and I love Eleanor Waldorf. I don't think it's like intentional,
Speaker 1: I just don't. I think this kind of came out
Speaker 1: of like I didn't expect this young Jenny Humphrey, whose
Speaker 1: family I've known throughout the years to come in and
Speaker 1: bring all these you know, wonderful designs and open my
Speaker 1: eyes to certain things. So I think there's definitely like
Speaker 1: a lot for Eleanor to learn in that. I think
Speaker 1: what's really interesting about the Jenny Eleanor thing is like,
Speaker 1: first of all, you're seeing both the best and worst
Speaker 1: of that generation's strengths and weaknesses, do you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? Like, and I feel like Jenny standing up
Speaker 1: for herself is very gratifying. But then of course with Jenny,
Speaker 1: like she tips it over into like being like taking
Speaker 1: it too far and being like too entitled in a way,
Speaker 1: and then at the same time, like Eleanor takes advantage
Speaker 1: of her too much. And with Eleanor, it's like you
Speaker 1: could always buy that, you know, we were always able
Speaker 1: to buy that callousness, and you believe that she would
Speaker 1: do something shitty like that, and then there was always
Speaker 1: those moments where she would kind of like walk it
Speaker 1: back a little bit also, and after who was like
Speaker 1: really good at like walking that line of just being
Speaker 1: just so super shitty but then realizing maybe that they
Speaker 1: were being shitty, but then also of stay doubling down
Speaker 1: on it. Yeah, but they were both right in those moments.
Speaker 1: You know, like Jenny is absolutely right that she was
Speaker 1: taking advantage and Eleanor was absolutely right and that Jenny
Speaker 1: was acting so crazy and titled in certain moments, but
Speaker 1: she was Margaret taking advantage of her. And that moment
Speaker 1: when Nate walks in the office, I'm like, here we go.
Speaker 1: They have opened that door. He's bringing her her like binder,
Speaker 1: like her works works out. It was so cute. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean the idea of like being at work and
Speaker 1: Nate Archibald showing up with your square. It's again, it's
Speaker 1: like you're welcome. Yes, Oh my goodness. So when Blair
Speaker 1: ends up then taking the advice from Dan and chucking
Speaker 1: her together, and he's just like you smell of desperation
Speaker 1: and wants to leave because she's trying all these things
Speaker 1: when that room was lit and he walks in when
Speaker 1: she's at Serena's house for the sleepover. But I'm like
Speaker 1: Blair's and Flair's genius, like yeah, I'll get them. And
Speaker 1: then once that when that buzz and it's Serena and
Speaker 1: he finds out and she's got to leave, I honestly thought,
Speaker 1: which is probably what your intention was is that they
Speaker 1: were gonna was gonna happen. Yeah, she had him Rember
Speaker 1: what she wanted she had, And the fact that he
Speaker 1: stopped because he realized he was being played and that
Speaker 1: he knew when he was like when the phone's buzzing
Speaker 1: and they're both looking at it and they like know
Speaker 1: each other so well. Although like I remember when they
Speaker 1: were in the bar and there's the thing where she
Speaker 1: spills vodka on him and he's like, this isn't going anywhere,
Speaker 1: and like and you ruin my pants, Like he delivered
Speaker 1: that line and you ruined my pants. Like the actual
Speaker 1: that he like stuck the landing with that line was
Speaker 1: so that. Yeah, Like that was another thing that was
Speaker 1: like super fun about being on the show is that,
Speaker 1: you know, seeing what you guys would do with the writing,
Speaker 1: Like you just always you guys made things come alive
Speaker 1: and it was always really really fun to see that happen. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and also probably different surprises when you would watch them.
Speaker 1: So if you weren't on set in New York while writing,
Speaker 1: you would just get the dailies every day to kind
Speaker 1: of make sure that things were going and feeling the
Speaker 1: way that you kind of like or give suggestions or yeah,
Speaker 1: we would go to you know, it started, it evolved
Speaker 1: as I was there. I think for predapor J. I
Speaker 1: think it was there like on set for something like
Speaker 1: three or four days. It wasn't very long, and you
Speaker 1: know it was it was tricky because I think that
Speaker 1: we felt the writers, we would come to set and
Speaker 1: it was so exciting to like, first of all, it
Speaker 1: made us better writers because we could like be on
Speaker 1: the sets and we could feel It's like there's just
Speaker 1: nothing like that experience of just like being in the
Speaker 1: space and understanding it more and writing to that. And
Speaker 1: you know, we were would be like tourists on the
Speaker 1: set like it was. It was because we only we
Speaker 1: didn't have time to like build those relationships with you
Speaker 1: guys and you know, and the crew as much. And
Speaker 1: so I rememb number when I would go out, I
Speaker 1: would really just like just trying to make an effort
Speaker 1: to kind of get to know everybody better so that
Speaker 1: a when I like if there was an issue where
Speaker 1: we needed to I don't know, like I'm trying to
Speaker 1: think of an example of it, but just the more
Speaker 1: of a relationship you have with the crew and the actors,
Speaker 1: the better it is, and so we would try and
Speaker 1: sort of like integrate as best we could, and we
Speaker 1: always got a lot out of it. And then as
Speaker 1: the seasons went on, we would be out there for longer.
Speaker 1: I think by the end, like I would be out
Speaker 1: there for two weeks, and I was able to sort
Speaker 1: of like get in there more. You know, also like
Speaker 1: so that you guys felt like you could trust us
Speaker 1: when there was like a line that wasn't working or
Speaker 1: something like a scene wasn't working, that we could have
Speaker 1: that conversation that there was a history and that there
Speaker 1: was a rapport there right on that when writing and
Speaker 1: then doing a transformation like Jenny's character, which was kind
Speaker 1: of really starting around this time, Yeah, how was how
Speaker 1: was doing that? Because it was it was really a
Speaker 1: big change. I mean a lot of that, if I
Speaker 1: remember quickly, was driven by her, right, I mean I
Speaker 1: feel like it went like when you're watching it, it
Speaker 1: felt real, It felt right. Maybe it's the age of Jenny.
Speaker 1: And obviously Taylor's just such a great actor and carried
Speaker 1: everything well both looks and the storylines and everything that
Speaker 1: was going on. But yeah, when I was watching it
Speaker 1: and Nate said that, like, do you do your hair.
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, here's kind of the start of like
Speaker 1: this whole like change nugent. And I know it was
Speaker 1: she talks about it, Josh and Stephanie did like it
Speaker 1: was kind of driven by her. But on the other
Speaker 1: flip side, how was that. I mean, she was a worker.
Speaker 1: I mean it totally worked for the show, and it
Speaker 1: was this other person, this other character who would cross
Speaker 1: lines and who would test things in a way that
Speaker 1: just like made great story and it was really fun,
Speaker 1: and she pulled it off. And Taylor's a good actress,
Speaker 1: Like she totally pulled it off. But yeah, I remember
Speaker 1: being in you know, lining up with Taylor's own sort
Speaker 1: of desires to you know, leading more into her music
Speaker 1: career and not wanting to be so defined by Jenny Humphrey,
Speaker 1: which I think is a real it's a tribute to
Speaker 1: sort of everybody involved with Stephanie and Josh and Taylor
Speaker 1: that they kind of honored the fact that this was
Speaker 1: a teenage kid who was trying to like figure out
Speaker 1: who she was in her real life and kind of
Speaker 1: like letting that play, like letting the character play with
Speaker 1: that too, I thought was really interesting and kind of
Speaker 1: you know hopefully gave Taylor more of what she needed.
Speaker 1: And then also it did work for Jenny, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think so, yeah, absolutely, and that you know, her badass
Speaker 1: like monologue quitting situation with Eleanor. How was writing that
Speaker 1: coming from a space of like, here's this girl that
Speaker 1: was given the opportunity, her dad's giving her the blessing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, well, it was tricky in the sense that
Speaker 1: it's that thing that we're talking about where it's like,
Speaker 1: on one level, she's just being so super entitled. And
Speaker 1: I mean for me like comeing up like to speak
Speaker 1: to a boss like that, I would never in a
Speaker 1: million years do that, and her doing it, You're just like,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, You're getting this huge opportunity, like just
Speaker 1: what are you doing? Take it? But it's so funny
Speaker 1: because it's kind of like more in line with how
Speaker 1: people are now, you know. And I don't mean that
Speaker 1: in a disparaging way, but I mean like the part
Speaker 1: of advocating for yourself and like not being taken advantage of.
Speaker 1: But it was tricky because she was both right and wrong.
Speaker 1: But her sort of standing up for herself with Eleanor
Speaker 1: was really fun. But you were also like, oh, girl
Speaker 1: like no, no, no, yeah, we're like almost yes if
Speaker 1: you need to say something. But then you're like, sometimes
Speaker 1: it's not like what you say, it's how you say it,
Speaker 1: and maybe you shouldn't have said it that way. But
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you like are sticking up for yourself
Speaker 1: in a way. Yeah, like stick off for yourself. But
Speaker 1: maybe don't burn down all the bridges, like maybe leave
Speaker 1: one bridge just like standing like instead of torching it
Speaker 1: all for sure. But but but also Eleanor was like,
Speaker 1: I'm signed with child Labor and like if you used
Speaker 1: to be a full night like such just life. Yeah,
Speaker 1: those shots when they're all out and they're like black
Speaker 1: and white and they're clicking and coming on and off
Speaker 1: and the photographers taking pictures of them out and about
Speaker 1: that looked so cool and so rad. Now did you
Speaker 1: put that in the writing? Yes, So that particular was
Speaker 1: really intentional because when we were talking about the Agnes
Speaker 1: character in the room, I remember pretty clearly because it
Speaker 1: was sort of a it was a real like clicking
Speaker 1: moment for me creatively, because I remember we were talking
Speaker 1: about at the time there was this photographer I think
Speaker 1: they're still around, called like Cobra snake who would like
Speaker 1: put up all these pictures from parties and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: And this was before it was before Instagram, but it
Speaker 1: was more like you would like see these And then
Speaker 1: also like a Erican apparel was happening, and there were
Speaker 1: all of these sort of partying images that were out there.
Speaker 1: And then I remember like living in New York and
Speaker 1: knowing girls like Agnes who were just like fuck it
Speaker 1: and who were so bold and we're really really fun.
Speaker 1: And I remember being in the room with Stephanie was
Speaker 1: there and we were talking about this character and we
Speaker 1: were just talking about this whole scene, and we started
Speaker 1: to sort of looking at all these different pictures from
Speaker 1: like advertising campaigns that sort of felt like that and
Speaker 1: party pictures and that character Cobra Snake or that photographer
Speaker 1: copor Snake and that whole world, and it was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I was able to really drop into what that was
Speaker 1: and built out that downtown New York like party scene
Speaker 1: that I remember from when I was living there, and
Speaker 1: that is so like has such a texture and a
Speaker 1: visual that's different from the Upper east Side, that's different
Speaker 1: from Brooklyn, and it you felt that watching it, like
Speaker 1: or I felt that like I was like I felt
Speaker 1: like I was like, yeah, in the Lower East Side
Speaker 1: at a cool vibe fashion e like these kids all
Speaker 1: grew up in New York because it's just a different,
Speaker 1: different scene, a different scene, and the song was good
Speaker 1: on it. I mean it was so so on point yeah,
Speaker 1: And it was fun doing the picture, like I remember shooting,
Speaker 1: like we definitely intentionally did the like having stills and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, which was also part of the thing
Speaker 1: of like again like predating Instagram, of that feeling of
Speaker 1: like wanting to document your evening and have people see
Speaker 1: it and share it, and then also a story that
Speaker 1: like I feel like so many so funked up, like
Speaker 1: so many of my friends had from like their teenage
Speaker 1: in their in their twenties, especially in New York because
Speaker 1: I grew up in l A. But because my parents
Speaker 1: weren't publishing, we were in New York and my best
Speaker 1: friend lived in New York, Like I knew that whole
Speaker 1: world and I lived there where it's like it's fun
Speaker 1: and then it's like it starts to get creepy around
Speaker 1: young girls and you're just like, oh wait, like not yeah,
Speaker 1: and sort of like shining a light on how that
Speaker 1: sort of moment can tip and that Jenny, who feels
Speaker 1: so mature like and who feels like she's an adult
Speaker 1: and can handle this world, is suddenly in a situation
Speaker 1: that has shifted you know, Yeah, okay, you had. There
Speaker 1: was just so many fun things in this episode, like
Speaker 1: the art exhibit and having to write in place a
Speaker 1: scene in like an art exhibit gallery, like that is
Speaker 1: like a character in itself. On top of like Serena
Speaker 1: meeting this artist Aaron, like everything else that's going on
Speaker 1: brings you like into this other world obviously, and I
Speaker 1: know that's the point of the show, but I'm like
Speaker 1: sitting there watching it and I'm like, I never went
Speaker 1: to an art gallery until I left Milwaukee, do you
Speaker 1: know what I mean? And not that there wasn't one there,
Speaker 1: but being in New York it made me want to
Speaker 1: go to all these different art galleries and in Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: And the idea of that is like a social scene,
Speaker 1: like as a social scene that you would like go
Speaker 1: to a net at all and all ages would go
Speaker 1: to it, and that that there is an intergeneral I mean,
Speaker 1: like the show is intergenerational, and sometimes that was organic
Speaker 1: and sometimes not, But like an art gallery as a
Speaker 1: show is a place where it's so specific to that experience. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and I just loved what you what you did with
Speaker 1: it and all the all of the things, even the
Speaker 1: like cecil the caterpillar that's a British children's rhyme and
Speaker 1: did you how did you come up with that? Yeah? Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, a shout out to like just the
Speaker 1: production team on Gossip Girl, like who I forget how
Speaker 1: they because there was like an art consultant as well,
Speaker 1: and like Stephanie also like really had a lot to
Speaker 1: do with the art on the show because she has
Speaker 1: such a good eye and always had. But again back
Speaker 1: to that sort of like visual component for Agnes, like
Speaker 1: working with Stephanie and seeing how she used visuals. When
Speaker 1: I was in sitcoms, it just wasn't as much of
Speaker 1: it saying and it really clicked in a lot more
Speaker 1: for me on Gossip Ral on this now just like
Speaker 1: a huge driver and a lot of my work like
Speaker 1: to get that vibe with things and with art. Stephanie
Speaker 1: was always really just like clued in on stuff, and
Speaker 1: so I want to say it was Lauren Weeks who
Speaker 1: did the art, but like when you see those art
Speaker 1: gallery shows that they get they would get artists to
Speaker 1: do certain pieces, obviously, but I always was so blown
Speaker 1: away by what they were able to pull off on
Speaker 1: that show with the sets and the set design and
Speaker 1: the locations and absolutely we talked about that a lot.
Speaker 1: And Norman's like just so yeah, Norman, so wonderful, what
Speaker 1: a what a man, what a lovely I know, look,
Speaker 1: we're both like smiling. He really talented gentlemen. Yeah, such
Speaker 1: a vision too. But he we got into that, like
Speaker 1: just how much of having a set like that really
Speaker 1: is helps bring a piece of that to the characters
Speaker 1: and what they're doing for the scene and for the
Speaker 1: storyline and for the moment. Like there's just so much. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and they were so gay aame like and you know,
Speaker 1: like it was I remember I think there was one
Speaker 1: episode where like we shot in Dylan's candy shop and
Speaker 1: was just like, what if we could shoot in Dylan's
Speaker 1: candy And it's like yes, yeah. But in terms of
Speaker 1: season of the Caterpillar and all that stuff, another thing
Speaker 1: that was like fun about writing for the show is like,
Speaker 1: well you see, it really into doing the research about
Speaker 1: that kind of world, you know what I mean. So
Speaker 1: I don't remember exactly how we got to that, but
Speaker 1: it was like, okay, so if she had met him before, like,
Speaker 1: where's it like a super Serena Andrew Woodson place to
Speaker 1: meet somebody when she's six and you know, and what
Speaker 1: would be like a fun Serena story they got married, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that they had an organest licorice ring in the camp.
Speaker 1: But like it's not like whatever camp in upstate New York,
Speaker 1: Like no, like hers is in Switzerland and it's French,
Speaker 1: and like it's like so fancy and those places exist.
Speaker 1: And it was always like really fun to just like
Speaker 1: so all of a sudden like do these deep dives
Speaker 1: on those worlds and then get into the specifics of it.
Speaker 1: And I really loved doing that. And you know, like
Speaker 1: any time there was like a throwaway reference to some
Speaker 1: sort of like designer or food thing that was happening
Speaker 1: in New York or whatever, it was like we really
Speaker 1: we would either just like with our friends were living
Speaker 1: in New York and Josh Staffron always had like one
Speaker 1: foot in New York, like very firmly planted, and whatever
Speaker 1: it was, we did try to keep it connected, keep
Speaker 1: it connected, and it was in the characters are so specific,
Speaker 1: like you could like Vanessa's references were just like totally
Speaker 1: different than the Serena's references, and they were totally drilled
Speaker 1: down into like what her back story was and the
Speaker 1: things that she thought were cool, and so it would
Speaker 1: be fun to like research that stuff and get into
Speaker 1: it for sure. And it makes it just like makes
Speaker 1: you like when she did say where the camp was
Speaker 1: and telling the whole story, You're very like right away,
Speaker 1: You're like, that's so Serena. Of course that's where they met.
Speaker 1: Like it was so on point. So here we were
Speaker 1: talking about this earlier. Blair to get more advice from
Speaker 1: Dan and comes all the way to Brooklyn, and there's
Speaker 1: like a world in which I'm like, wow, I like
Speaker 1: that Blair kind of needs Dan a little bit. I
Speaker 1: like that. Yeah. But she gets there and unannounced to
Speaker 1: Dan Chuck and Blair just like pulled one over on Vanessa,
Speaker 1: was super rude and ridiculous to her. Poor vanessas not
Speaker 1: poor j Poor v I know, so open hearted. I
Speaker 1: know it was like a couple of episodes ago and
Speaker 1: with the whole thing with the Lord and she goes
Speaker 1: and ends up, you know, telling Catherine's husband about the
Speaker 1: whole situation. It was like, she's not she was not
Speaker 1: trying to like to do this. It was literally like,
Speaker 1: let me just try to do the right thing for Nate,
Speaker 1: whereas like when you get Chuck and Blair, there's like
Speaker 1: ten to fifteen different things of why we gotta do
Speaker 1: this for Nate, for for Serena, for the Lord, for
Speaker 1: the family, which is also a testament to the writing
Speaker 1: with how you guys tie that all together. It was
Speaker 1: it was mind melting just so you know, it was
Speaker 1: really hard, Like I literally remember that there were times
Speaker 1: where I was like, I don't know my rams healthy
Speaker 1: enough to keep all these beats in my head. But also,
Speaker 1: you know, and there was a lot of because of
Speaker 1: the O M F g AD campaign and that they
Speaker 1: was so successful and people were so addicted to them,
Speaker 1: there was always this pressure, but it was what the
Speaker 1: show was to like have these moments in these twists,
Speaker 1: and so it was always like looking for opportunities to
Speaker 1: do it, and it kind of like a puzzle and
Speaker 1: you can kind of you get really into it. I'm
Speaker 1: finding that as I'm rewatching these, so I can't imagine
Speaker 1: in your shoes or in your chair how that was
Speaker 1: for all of the writers and producers and stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean some of the stuff is definitely like oh,
Speaker 1: we know we're going to build to this and like
Speaker 1: I can't wait, Like that's super exciting. And then there
Speaker 1: were other times we were like, Okay, what can make
Speaker 1: this moment turn? What can scare what's the scariest thing
Speaker 1: to Serena? What's the most powerful weapon Blair has at
Speaker 1: this moment? And it was alway tricky but fun. It's
Speaker 1: just it's wild. It's like crazy. I'm like their brain
Speaker 1: turn off at home or they constantly trying to put
Speaker 1: this puzzle together for anyway, So we're here where Blair
Speaker 1: shows up in Brooklyn and wants to get more advice
Speaker 1: from Dan or talks talks to him. Then Dan is
Speaker 1: talking with Vanessa. She drops that chuck and Blair just
Speaker 1: used her as a chess piece and now here Dan
Speaker 1: turns and it's like, Okay, you're not gonna mess with
Speaker 1: my best friend Vanessa, which always like made my heart smile.
Speaker 1: I'm like that's nice. That was like a moment that
Speaker 1: like a Serena or Blair would do for each other,
Speaker 1: like go Dan, Yeah, he like he had her back
Speaker 1: and yeah, and always had her back unless Vanessa would
Speaker 1: like getting with Serena and then he was like okay,
Speaker 1: by So Dan kind of goes from good guy to
Speaker 1: bad guy with with Blair like pretty quickly. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I always I thought it was interesting the way
Speaker 1: Dan knew exactly what to say to Funk with Blair,
Speaker 1: do you know what I mean? Like it shows that
Speaker 1: he again like that intelligence, that he has that side,
Speaker 1: and like he knew in that moment what to say
Speaker 1: to sort of unravel at all and understood their psychology
Speaker 1: and had no problem like stepping into that moment, you know.
Speaker 1: So sort of seeing how he can change when Blair
Speaker 1: comes into the picture, like it can bring out another
Speaker 1: side of him was fun um and I thought an
Speaker 1: interesting color on him in that moment. And then, uh,
Speaker 1: Jenny at this point has the choice between Agnes or Nate,
Speaker 1: And I think Nate is always trying to do the
Speaker 1: best thing too. I I really I do with him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I just feel like he was always looking up for
Speaker 1: Jenny even before, like be careful with Blair, be careful
Speaker 1: with that whole click. So when he shows up to
Speaker 1: like kind of like make sure she's okay, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's very nice. But don't hook up with her then, yeah,
Speaker 1: or do what I don't know, Yeah, I mean with Nate,
Speaker 1: and I mean he's got such a good heart. He's
Speaker 1: just like, you know, this puppy dog who wants to
Speaker 1: protect Jenny but also obviously wants to kiss her. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just fun to like again, like seeing Nate Archibald
Speaker 1: like be worried about Jenny, be protective of her, and
Speaker 1: also that he is like a good kid who had
Speaker 1: parents who like didn't do the right thing and parents
Speaker 1: who have sucked him over. And he sees that Rufus
Speaker 1: is like a good dad and like genuinely cares and
Speaker 1: like Jenny has a dad who cares about him and
Speaker 1: is trying to protect him, and like feeling that that
Speaker 1: is influencing him as well. Yeah, it's it's such an
Speaker 1: interesting dynamic because because of what he missed and his family,
Speaker 1: like that dynamic with his parents and and all the
Speaker 1: things they were hiding and going through, and then he
Speaker 1: does see with Rufus is it's it's pretty special, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Like his childhood was so painful, like I know, living
Speaker 1: when he's like when he's what is it like he's
Speaker 1: um squatting and wanting in his own home and Dan
Speaker 1: walks in like yeah, and then we go to um
Speaker 1: Laren Chuck on the roof where now at this point,
Speaker 1: she's taken the advice from Dan that she doesn't know
Speaker 1: was because she messed with Vanessa, so she's kind of
Speaker 1: going And here's like something I find very interesting because
Speaker 1: Chuck and Blair go back and forth so much. But
Speaker 1: the way they do it and the way you wrote
Speaker 1: for it in this episode or in a lot of
Speaker 1: the episodes, just the way they bring it to life
Speaker 1: makes you not tired of it. Yeah, you're also I
Speaker 1: think everyone just wants them to get together, so you're
Speaker 1: just like, okay, is this the time? Okay, it'll be
Speaker 1: the next time. Okay, it'll be the next time, or
Speaker 1: when you're going to give in or do this? But
Speaker 1: could you talk about like writing for that and building
Speaker 1: that up over the Season's like when do you say
Speaker 1: okay enough enough? Yeah? I mean, when you ever you
Speaker 1: have a couple like that where you're playing with the
Speaker 1: will they won't they? And you know or or will again?
Speaker 1: The teas is the fun, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like that's the ride for the audience, and you know
Speaker 1: that there's that moment where they are going to get together,
Speaker 1: and you're building to that and you're sort of like,
Speaker 1: that's the fun of it and that people are on
Speaker 1: that ride and that there's fun and playing with the
Speaker 1: audience and that and with the characters, and like, how
Speaker 1: can you kind of like bring that to its most
Speaker 1: heightened state so that when they do finally give in,
Speaker 1: it's the most gratifying, you know, And so we talked
Speaker 1: about that a lot and sort of like how do
Speaker 1: you deliver that in the most exciting fun way? And
Speaker 1: you know, with Chuck and Blair, because they're not earnest,
Speaker 1: because they have this sort of devilish side of them,
Speaker 1: it allowed for a lot of leeway in that world.
Speaker 1: And because they would do all they were so broken
Speaker 1: and sucked up that they would do dumb ship and
Speaker 1: they would get in their own way and you would
Speaker 1: see it. And again with both and Layton, they had
Speaker 1: a way of using that vulnerability that they could play
Speaker 1: that you would just forgive them so much and so
Speaker 1: and then also we would tease the audience with the
Speaker 1: things like the fantasy is like when you actually about
Speaker 1: writing that sex scene, like we you know, we were
Speaker 1: aware that it was a fantasy and it was heightened,
Speaker 1: so you want to make it feel like a little
Speaker 1: bit off maybe, you know, but also tricked the audience.
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of us in the writer's room,
Speaker 1: Jessica Queller, and I mean I think that Lila was
Speaker 1: there at that point. I'm not quite I'm bad with
Speaker 1: like timelines and stuff, but like we all loved like yearning,
Speaker 1: and like we all were just like yearning, yearning, yearning,
Speaker 1: and like more of that, and like we loved that stuff,
Speaker 1: and I think all of us didn't, so it was
Speaker 1: easy to sort of lean into it and it was fun. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's so fun. That's also another character. Yeah, so there
Speaker 1: was Headmistress Queller, who was named after Jessica Queller, who
Speaker 1: had been on Gossip. Were all for a long time.
Speaker 1: I didn't realize how many we were using a lot,
Speaker 1: I know. Great. So, yeah, they go up there to
Speaker 1: talk on the room and they did. They just can't
Speaker 1: say the words to each other. They just can't do it.
Speaker 1: They're going to keep this going. And now we're back
Speaker 1: at the gallery layers getting there, Serena finds out that
Speaker 1: Dan did this one thing. I do have to give
Speaker 1: Dan credit for he'll kind of just like when he's
Speaker 1: in the wrong, he'll apologize and say, yeah, I actually
Speaker 1: did say that, or he goes right to Chuck to
Speaker 1: tell him, listen, that was on me. He owns up
Speaker 1: to it, he really will. He doesn't try to like
Speaker 1: lie or cover it up or beat around the bush.
Speaker 1: He'll kind of just like take it on, which I respect.
Speaker 1: And it's also like the Dan and Chuck scenes were
Speaker 1: always also really fun because they couldn't stand each other,
Speaker 1: but then there would be these like little grudging moments
Speaker 1: of respect that we're fun. Yeah, even in that stairwell
Speaker 1: where Chuck's going down and he stops him and says, listen,
Speaker 1: she did mean it and she does love you, and
Speaker 1: that you see like Chuck taking it in and you know,
Speaker 1: wanting to be there. Yeah, they're they're dynamic. Is They
Speaker 1: did a great job with that as well. Yeah. So now, okay,
Speaker 1: so Dan and Serena are walking and she gets the
Speaker 1: riddle in her mind as she's sitting there and tells
Speaker 1: it to Dan and you kind of see Dan's like heartbreak.
Speaker 1: Kind of yeah, it's heartbreak, Like here's the thing. He
Speaker 1: there's obviously still feelings there and you want to like
Speaker 1: be happy for the person that you're no longer with,
Speaker 1: but respect, and that's what I feel like he respects Serena.
Speaker 1: But sometimes you're not like Okay, I'm ready to just
Speaker 1: like watch you like prants off with this like artist
Speaker 1: good looking artist guy. Either. No, he totally still loves her.
Speaker 1: They stn't love each other always, and she figures out
Speaker 1: this riddle goals and he's like, well, of course that's
Speaker 1: he's the ex husband. I'm just the ex boyfriend. And
Speaker 1: the heartbreak of like seeing him like how hard that
Speaker 1: is for him to like let her go, but that
Speaker 1: he's not going to stand in her way and like yeah,
Speaker 1: which is also sometimes the true love, right do, Like
Speaker 1: he knows who he loves. He loves Rinda ander Woodson
Speaker 1: and like her life is just always going to be
Speaker 1: big and wild and you know for sure like to
Speaker 1: even when he heard her laugh through the art exhibit,
Speaker 1: I felt I thought that was such a nice little touch, like,
Speaker 1: oh that's Serena's laugh. Also, Serena's laugh was so contagious
Speaker 1: in general, so it was like lovely. I'm like, yes,
Speaker 1: now Aaron's gonna fall in love with her as well.
Speaker 1: She's like a literal goddess, like a voice from like
Speaker 1: a disembodied voice, like coming through the speakers totally. And
Speaker 1: then she gets there and she sees Aaron getting on
Speaker 1: this motorcycle. By the way, that was a shocking moment.
Speaker 1: You'm like, here's gonna be a fun little night or
Speaker 1: fun little storyline. And then boom, another girl gets on
Speaker 1: the motorcycle with him, and now we have like Serena's
Speaker 1: upset because of Aaron, Dan's upset because of Serena. Does
Speaker 1: Serena just go home there? Do you call Dan then
Speaker 1: and say, hey, he left with another girl? I mean,
Speaker 1: I think the old Serena would have like gone downtown
Speaker 1: to a club and like found somebody to entertain her.
Speaker 1: I think that, you know, trying to be different, Serena
Speaker 1: goes home and thinks about what she's done. I know,
Speaker 1: but you know it's fun about screen is like everything
Speaker 1: with her could be so extra. So you know that
Speaker 1: when she's the guy who does her with her is
Speaker 1: the guy from the boarding school where they got married,
Speaker 1: you know, in the south of France or Switzerland wherever
Speaker 1: it was. And then like I think she becomes his
Speaker 1: muse and like being able to like go to those
Speaker 1: like crazy extra places with her was yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I keep saying, it's just fun. It's just fun, just
Speaker 1: always really fun. It was fun to it's fun to
Speaker 1: watch and like living out fantasies of like what that
Speaker 1: is Like It's like, you can what would it be
Speaker 1: to be like in high school and be an artist's
Speaker 1: muse Like sure, sure, right, yeah, of course exactly. Of
Speaker 1: course that's it's not like, let's do that. When Chuck
Speaker 1: and Blair have the conversation where he's just like, what
Speaker 1: do you see do you see Blair and Tuck going
Speaker 1: to the movies? But Blair and Chuck holding hands and
Speaker 1: She's like, well, they don't have to do that, and
Speaker 1: his moment of basically being like the only reason why
Speaker 1: this has been fun for us is because we both
Speaker 1: like the not saying I love you and not doing
Speaker 1: the things that are you know what you kind of
Speaker 1: doing a relationship, like hanging out and walking down the
Speaker 1: street holding hands. And there was a moment when Chuck's
Speaker 1: like looking at her as she's sitting there looking stunning
Speaker 1: like Layton Lair. I mean, come on, I'm like her skin,
Speaker 1: her hair, she was just looking flawless which she does
Speaker 1: all the time. But you know, and the fact that
Speaker 1: she's like a natural blonde, Like I'm always like, no,
Speaker 1: like that's not like she's brown hair. She has brown here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And just at that moment he's breaking up with Blair,
Speaker 1: I mean, and that really felt like, Okay, this is
Speaker 1: just not going to work with them now they're here's
Speaker 1: where it kind of ends for for now. I mean,
Speaker 1: obviously we know it's a show and things can go,
Speaker 1: but it just felt so real to the point it
Speaker 1: felt so what he was saying made sense. I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 1: you are right, you guys, this is the only reason
Speaker 1: it's working is because you guys like this like tugg
Speaker 1: a war and it's like cat and mouse game. So
Speaker 1: like I'm sitting there like, damn it, but i don't
Speaker 1: want this to end. Yeah, you know. My memory of that,
Speaker 1: honestly is that that sort of came out of our
Speaker 1: experience as writers and writing for the characters, which is
Speaker 1: like we would talk about, like you're saying, like when
Speaker 1: do you choose to get a character where and do
Speaker 1: you choose to put characters together? And we turned through
Speaker 1: stories so fast on that show that like it was
Speaker 1: always hard to like draw things out, and with Chuck
Speaker 1: and Blair, I think that we struggled with, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: if we do get them together, then what are we
Speaker 1: going to do put them on dates where they go hold?
Speaker 1: Like what does that look like? And I think that
Speaker 1: in our sort of like struggle with that question, we
Speaker 1: sort of found the answer to that moment, which is like,
Speaker 1: this is the truth of what it is like. And
Speaker 1: so we we kind of leaned into that in sort
Speaker 1: of telling that story in that moment because that was
Speaker 1: too that and I do remember that there was a moment.
Speaker 1: My memory of it is that Robbie Hall came up
Speaker 1: with the idea of like that game about saying I
Speaker 1: love View and when he said that, for all of us,
Speaker 1: it just kind of like very much clicked that that
Speaker 1: was the thesis of their relationship, that there was always
Speaker 1: going to be a power struggle and that these two
Speaker 1: were just like so protective and they both did have
Speaker 1: these like very vulnerable sides of them that they were
Speaker 1: just like going to protect at all costs, and it
Speaker 1: was always going to get in their way and it
Speaker 1: was always going to have this to wild cats playing
Speaker 1: who could like if they're not careful could like really
Speaker 1: hurt each other. And so it's just like kind of
Speaker 1: once we locked into that idea, the more we sort
Speaker 1: of dug into the truth of it, it kind of
Speaker 1: carried itself because it was it was true to who
Speaker 1: they were, right, which is so interesting as as the
Speaker 1: show goes on, But or where could lead I don't
Speaker 1: even know because I haven't I don't even remember what
Speaker 1: I've seen coming up still, like it's been so long.
Speaker 1: When I rewatched it, I was like, oh, yeah, right.
Speaker 1: What I mean by that though, is even if they
Speaker 1: decide right now that they're going to be done, there's
Speaker 1: something because there is like a true connection and feeling
Speaker 1: there for each other that it's almost like even if
Speaker 1: they know deep down like we can't do this, they're
Speaker 1: never really going to be fully over each other either though,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, which is part of the
Speaker 1: whole thing, which is why it's brilliant. Yeah, Like what
Speaker 1: happens when you meet your match and you're in high school,
Speaker 1: like you know, it's like it's too young, it's too
Speaker 1: young to meet that person. Okay, So let's like get
Speaker 1: towards the end where like now here's where the music
Speaker 1: drops and the gossip rold quote is coming in and
Speaker 1: that how soon is now by tattoo t a tu
Speaker 1: and this um. I jumped ahead a little bit before
Speaker 1: about when Nate showed up to get Jenny, that whole
Speaker 1: night and evening of him watching her go from the gallery.
Speaker 1: But here's where when she showed up and she's like
Speaker 1: in her broad dancing, there was a moment in which
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, is Jenny going to hook
Speaker 1: up with her model friend and the photographer like someone
Speaker 1: needs to come and get her because she's like the
Speaker 1: kids vulnerable and young and a kid. And then long
Speaker 1: behold it's Nate Archibald. And then he's like, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: you shouldn't be in this situation. You should be in
Speaker 1: this situation with me. Yeah, I mean definitely. When you
Speaker 1: go back and look at some of the Gossip Girl stuff,
Speaker 1: it's problematic through a lot. You're just like, oh, I
Speaker 1: mean not so good, but so entertaining. I mean yeah,
Speaker 1: and well, and then and the Nate thing with Jenny, Yeah,
Speaker 1: why do you think, what's what's his attraction to her?
Speaker 1: You know? I think that he likes her spirit and
Speaker 1: that she is just sort of this like unexpected surprising person.
Speaker 1: And I feel like I have so many memories of
Speaker 1: like Nate looking at women with just like awe and
Speaker 1: that he just like kind of captured her his imagination. Um.
Speaker 1: And I also feel like he was even though he
Speaker 1: like judged the Humphreser, was like this part of him
Speaker 1: that was like a little bit in love with the
Speaker 1: idea of this family that was like together and there
Speaker 1: for each other, and it was kind of like a piece.
Speaker 1: But yeah, he just sees how fierce Jenny is. And
Speaker 1: also I'm sure there's a part of them is like
Speaker 1: I'm I rescued to you, so before something, I kiss you.
Speaker 1: And then they both in this episode saw each other
Speaker 1: with their shirts off with it until we're just talking
Speaker 1: to I didn't really like quite realize which is cute.
Speaker 1: Cute for them yeah, even the score. Um. So they
Speaker 1: go out into the streets of New York and that
Speaker 1: was like a wow moment for me because I had
Speaker 1: not seen the episode, and I'm like, Okay, so now
Speaker 1: what's day. I'm gonna say, what's Rufe is gonna say,
Speaker 1: you better not break Jenny's heart, Nate, Yeah, or Vanessa
Speaker 1: will come after you. But I liked that turn at
Speaker 1: the end too, and then it just it leaves you
Speaker 1: there and and you're like, you know, just another ending
Speaker 1: to a Gossip l episode with so much just thrown
Speaker 1: at you. Yeah, and just like I mean, we were
Speaker 1: always looking for opportunities for just putting people into situations
Speaker 1: that were impossible. So it's like if you're gonna have
Speaker 1: Nate Archibald saying at the Humphreez and like of course
Speaker 1: there's going to be a secret romance with Jenny, it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, the more we can just kind of like
Speaker 1: have that sort of backing characters into a corner and
Speaker 1: having to get out of it, and also just the
Speaker 1: fun of like sneaking around and all of that sort
Speaker 1: of deliciousness that you get in high school with those
Speaker 1: like you know, those hookups, I think the more it
Speaker 1: was just more fun at it. Yeah, And we would
Speaker 1: just like we would look for those moments, you know, Right,
Speaker 1: it was such a good episode. But here's the closing
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl quote. The problem with fairy tales is that
Speaker 1: they set a girl up for disappointment in real life,
Speaker 1: the prince goes off with the wrong princess, or the
Speaker 1: spell wears off, and two lovers realize they're better off
Speaker 1: as well, whatever they are. But I'll confess, every once
Speaker 1: in a while a girl craves her fairy tale ending
Speaker 1: sleep tight kitties. It seems like little Jay got her
Speaker 1: happily ever after. XL XL gossip Girl. Yeah, it's a
Speaker 1: great gossip Girl quote. Well, and again my secret agenda
Speaker 1: of like dismantling fairy tales where it was at that
Speaker 1: time my daughter, you know, she was little and I
Speaker 1: was reading her. I wasn't really into princesses growing up,
Speaker 1: but she was. I mean, people gave me these books
Speaker 1: and I was reading all these fairy tales, and the
Speaker 1: whole thing was like and then they kissed and they
Speaker 1: got married and they lived happily ever after. And I
Speaker 1: started to just get like so bothered by that. So
Speaker 1: I started changing the endings of fairy tales when I
Speaker 1: was reading them to my daughter to be like. And
Speaker 1: then they spent a year getting to know each other,
Speaker 1: and they traveled and they would have fights, but they
Speaker 1: would work it out, and they you know, there were
Speaker 1: good times and bad times, but the good times far
Speaker 1: outway the bad times, and they came together in mutual
Speaker 1: respect and understanding and then they got married, right. I
Speaker 1: love that Mathema Cinderella and Prince Charming. That So I
Speaker 1: was always like in my mind, like thinking about I
Speaker 1: was seeing about fairy tales a lot at the time,
Speaker 1: and obviously, like in writing and in themes and what
Speaker 1: the show was like, there is this like fairy tale
Speaker 1: element to it. But I was just constantly like, I
Speaker 1: that has been something that I've wanted to do and
Speaker 1: the idea of subverting the idea of fairy tales, and
Speaker 1: and it was also just a fun gossip girl thing
Speaker 1: to write and it was great. Yeah, I loved it. Uh,
Speaker 1: this was so fun. I want to like do another
Speaker 1: like rewatch with you because hearing from on your end,
Speaker 1: just some of the things that go into it, we
Speaker 1: just don't know, like we get the script sometimes, you know,
Speaker 1: get the script and show up and it was just yeah,
Speaker 1: I remember. The one thing I always was like, wow,
Speaker 1: I don't know how they do it was just being
Speaker 1: so far away from the sets. The fact that you
Speaker 1: guys were able to feel as connected as we did
Speaker 1: to you, and as we did to the writing and
Speaker 1: to the sets and all the things when you guys
Speaker 1: were literally in l A and we were in New
Speaker 1: York and you know, if we were getting up in
Speaker 1: my call, Tom was six am. I mean that's in
Speaker 1: the middle of the night for you guys. So it's
Speaker 1: like just a whole different thing. And I always really
Speaker 1: respected that we I never felt like a disk thank
Speaker 1: you that. I really appreciate that. I mean, as the writers,
Speaker 1: like we felt, you know, it was hard to be
Speaker 1: away from set sometimes just because there is that fun
Speaker 1: of you know that we're all on the same team.
Speaker 1: And also like Gossip Girl was like it was such
Speaker 1: an exciting time, Like it was so cool seeing like
Speaker 1: I remember there would be in Vulture. Were you guys
Speaker 1: aware of this that there would be the Vulture recaps
Speaker 1: every week of the episodes? And I don't know if
Speaker 1: I remember that. I just remember what that was. Like, Yeah,
Speaker 1: they would do like things called like the Reality Index,
Speaker 1: or after each episode they would like write like what
Speaker 1: was like real New York and what was fake and
Speaker 1: they would kind of like do a breakdown of the episode,
Speaker 1: and like that was like that was before that ever happened,
Speaker 1: Like it was you would write it, you know, like
Speaker 1: I wrote episodes of TV, and like the feedback from
Speaker 1: just wasn't there and you know, there were ratings that
Speaker 1: or you know, people would be fans that you'd meet
Speaker 1: sometimes like with us a girl, Like the interaction with
Speaker 1: the fans and the media was so m heightened and
Speaker 1: immediate and it was exciting and it was cool to
Speaker 1: see people respond and react and like and it was
Speaker 1: such a moment that was happening that we were all
Speaker 1: part of and experiencing in these different ways. And so
Speaker 1: I think in some level, like it was on some
Speaker 1: level it was hard to be far away. Um. Also
Speaker 1: just because the more, like I said before, like the
Speaker 1: more time we all interact, the better it is. But
Speaker 1: I feel like we were able to achieve a lot
Speaker 1: and like that, Like Stephanie did a really good job
Speaker 1: of doing that, And when we would make those trips
Speaker 1: out to New York, we got so much out of it,
Speaker 1: and um, and it was also just like super fun, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, my family's in Los Angeles, like I live
Speaker 1: in l A. But I would I lived in New
Speaker 1: York in my twenties and I would get to go
Speaker 1: to New York and go to set and work. But
Speaker 1: then that night I could go out to places that
Speaker 1: we were going to write about in the next episode.
Speaker 1: Or you know, it was just fun to like plunge
Speaker 1: into life for in that way. Yeah, I know, so great.
Speaker 1: It makes me sometimes like right now I'm getting all
Speaker 1: these feelings of like like going back and like being
Speaker 1: in the middle of season two and like, well, because
Speaker 1: that's when it Season two was, like it was when
Speaker 1: it really hit. Like I think we did twenty six episodes, Yeah,
Speaker 1: there was. It was like more than twenty two, and
Speaker 1: it was real. It was really long. Yeah, it was very,
Speaker 1: very long. And and that was when sort of the
Speaker 1: fans kind of really found the show. And I remember
Speaker 1: it going from being sort of just like a couple
Speaker 1: of fans showing up and then all of a sudden
Speaker 1: just like having security and people finding out where it
Speaker 1: was and and then people bustole scripts. Did you know
Speaker 1: about this about how they used to We had to,
Speaker 1: like by the end of the show, we had to
Speaker 1: have like these codes forgetting for going onto our computers
Speaker 1: because like some of the writer's computers got hacked in
Speaker 1: scripts got stolen. We talked about this a couple of times,
Speaker 1: because there was a time in which we would get
Speaker 1: the scripts or lines, but they would be exed out.
Speaker 1: So if it was like Vanessa saying, Hey, Dan, I
Speaker 1: gotta talk to you about Serena. It would just say Vanessa,
Speaker 1: and then that whole line would be ex's little exits,
Speaker 1: but the whole scene would be that. So I would
Speaker 1: literally be like, I don't even know what my dialogue
Speaker 1: the morning. And you can see how long they would be,
Speaker 1: how many exes would be there, like if it was
Speaker 1: a full paragraph or if it was two lines. So
Speaker 1: sometimes if it was a three page scene and they
Speaker 1: were full paragraphs, I would be like really nervous of
Speaker 1: like not being able to get that down because you
Speaker 1: also know, as how TV works, you're on a time
Speaker 1: crunch too, so it's like, like, how did they expect
Speaker 1: us to like learn these lines at six a m.
Speaker 1: In the morning when I'm like getting my hair curled,
Speaker 1: And that's crazy. I didn't know that you guys weren't
Speaker 1: getting it, Like that's note. I mean there was. It
Speaker 1: didn't happen very long or than they got it. Then
Speaker 1: thinks they figured out a way to do it where
Speaker 1: we'd maybe get it the night before. But there was
Speaker 1: like I remember couple of times where I showed up
Speaker 1: and I was learning my lines on the day. That's wild. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's not And it could have been where I wasn't
Speaker 1: first up and had a couple of hours or whatever.
Speaker 1: I just remember it was like, I don't know, if
Speaker 1: someone went in a garbage can and took something out
Speaker 1: and put it online. There was like something major that
Speaker 1: I think some extras got got sides or got their
Speaker 1: hands on something, but no, but then some actual like
Speaker 1: some of the writers or computers literally were hacked, which
Speaker 1: I'm just like really like, I okay, but yeah, I
Speaker 1: got a little wild there for a while. Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: There was a lot going off behind the scenes and
Speaker 1: that in those kind of situations with the security, with
Speaker 1: the hacking and that, like, and then we were like
Speaker 1: bringing a show to life that was like drama Feld.
Speaker 1: So it was it was kind of like parallel, like yeah,
Speaker 1: you're paranoid. It's like, yes, you are being watched. Actually yeah,
Speaker 1: here we actually are. You're on a show about people
Speaker 1: literally putting you on blast, but they're actually in life
Speaker 1: putting you on black. Yeah. I remember I used to
Speaker 1: get my car repaired at this place in Hollywood and
Speaker 1: the mechanic was this guy Rafael, and he was lovely
Speaker 1: and he was a huge fan of the show, and
Speaker 1: so whenever I would like drop my car off, he
Speaker 1: would like ask me questions and we would and we
Speaker 1: would talk about the show. I remember once I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: there are scripts in the back of the car. I'm like,
Speaker 1: do I have to worry about Rafael like like, no, no,
Speaker 1: it's fun. We're good. He's pretty focused on his family
Speaker 1: and getting the cars. But like that, it literally got
Speaker 1: to that point where you you did get a little paranoid. Certain, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: And I think part of it is writing it and
Speaker 1: being it and like everybody is watching and then those
Speaker 1: little moments happening. It was It's funny. Yeah, it was. Yeah,
Speaker 1: a lot going on, but so fun and I'm so
Speaker 1: glad you got to come on and do this. What
Speaker 1: a fun rewatch and like breaking it down like you
Speaker 1: have a lot of fun facts. Well, thank It was
Speaker 1: really it was great revisiting it and rewatching it and
Speaker 1: remembering it, and it was you know, that was my
Speaker 1: first time that I wrote a script for a show
Speaker 1: where I was just like, oh, this is just so
Speaker 1: joyful and I really loved doing it, and it changed
Speaker 1: the course of my career because I was just like,
Speaker 1: this is the kind of thing I want to do
Speaker 1: where it's like you have the dramedy, but there's a
Speaker 1: comedic element to it, and there's a strong visual and
Speaker 1: all the things. It was just like it really like
Speaker 1: hit for me, and also Stephanie and Josh like giving
Speaker 1: the writers the opportunity to producer episodes and you know,
Speaker 1: go into the editing bay and be there for the
Speaker 1: music spotting sessions and all of that allowed me to
Speaker 1: learn how to do what I do now and be
Speaker 1: able to run my show. And so I really just
Speaker 1: knew that I was on the right path when I
Speaker 1: came to Gossip Girl and loved it. I sure were,
Speaker 1: and we felt that too. For anyone that are watching
Speaker 1: the episodes that you wrote and produced feel the same way.
Speaker 1: I mean it's I was a total dork, no, but
Speaker 1: like who we'll take it anyway if we're gonna give
Speaker 1: us episodes like that, you know what I mean? Well,
Speaker 1: I remember you're turning in that episode. John Stevens left
Speaker 1: of voicemail for me, like telling me I had done
Speaker 1: a good job, and like I've literally saved that voicemail
Speaker 1: for years, Like I was like still like I did it.
Speaker 1: I did it, as like here's my letting video, and
Speaker 1: here's my voicemail from John Stephen. I love that. It
Speaker 1: was a good feeling. So I was very happy when
Speaker 1: you asked about this episode. So thank you for inviting me.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, we are so pleased to have you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and do you want to talk about what you're
Speaker 1: working on now? I'm sure everyone, after knowing like how
Speaker 1: talented and amazing you are, would love to go and
Speaker 1: watch what you're doing, if they're not already. I just
Speaker 1: finished up working on a show called with Love on
Speaker 1: Amazon and it's so fun and wonderful. People should check
Speaker 1: it out. Season one is actually already on Amazon right now.
Speaker 1: And I was on season two. Um, and then I
Speaker 1: actually just sold a show to Amazon that I'm going
Speaker 1: to be jumping into really soon. Yeah. I loved having
Speaker 1: you on. It was good to see your face. It
Speaker 1: was great to see your face. It was so much fun.
Speaker 1: How old is your daughter now? She's fourteen? Okay, I
Speaker 1: was trying to do the math. Okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 1: She was eight months and yeah, she was fourteen. And
Speaker 1: we've started watching the shows and she loves them and
Speaker 1: it's really fun and it's uh yeah, it's really nice
Speaker 1: too to revisit it with her too, even though I'm
Speaker 1: just like, I can't believe I'm watching this to you,
Speaker 1: but it's also great. But that's awesome that you get
Speaker 1: to do that with her and be like, I'm also
Speaker 1: a part of why this show is here for you
Speaker 1: right now. Yeah, in a world where you're just like
Speaker 1: trying to get a little credibility with your teenager. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was just filming a show. Bowie was six months old,
Speaker 1: so you know the vibe and it's it's a lot,
Speaker 1: it's intense. Yeah, congratulations, by the way, thank you. It's
Speaker 1: really the best thing in the whole world. But yeah,
Speaker 1: and Kelly and I talked about it. Oh yeah, because Kelly,
Speaker 1: you know, she had the baby. We kept having to
Speaker 1: give her giant shopping bags to cover her belly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like she really went to Gucci. She's there, she
Speaker 1: got their extra extra large. Well, thank you so much,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure like we'll be rewatching a lot more
Speaker 1: of your stuff and I'll let you know. Thank you.
Speaker 1: It was really fun. It was it was great doing
Speaker 1: at Jessica. Thank you for inviting me, Amanda. What an
Speaker 1: episode you really brought it, And thank you so much
Speaker 1: for joining us today to share your wisdom and for
Speaker 1: bringing Gossip Girl to life for everyone else. Catch Amanda's
Speaker 1: latest show with Love on Amazon and be sure to
Speaker 1: subscribe to this show wherever you get your podcasts. We'll
Speaker 1: see you back here next week. Don't miss out. X
Speaker 1: O x O x O XO is produced by Propagate
Speaker 1: Content and Met Jessica's Or. Our show is executive produced
Speaker 1: by Langley. Our producers are Diego Tapia, Christin Vermilia, Emily Carr,
Speaker 1: and Hannah Harris. Original music by Moxie and Lund, and
Speaker 1: the episode was mixed by seth ol Landsky.