1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,720 Speaker 1: What if everything you thought you knew about autism and 2 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:07,200 Speaker 1: mental health wasn't the full story. Today's conversation might change 3 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 1: the way you see it. This is why not me 4 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: embracing autism and mental health world, Why real conversations about autism, 5 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:17,800 Speaker 1: mental health and the stories that shape our lives. I'm 6 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 1: Tony Mantor. This is where understanding begins. If this kind 7 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:24,680 Speaker 1: of conversation matters to you, follow the show so you 8 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 1: don't miss what comes next. Joining us today is John Rowls. 9 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 1: He's here to share the story behind a powerful and 10 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 1: inclusive event he hosts at the Gremlin Club, one that 11 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 1: creates a truly special night for all, especially within the 12 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: special needs community. 13 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,280 Speaker 2: Welcome to the show, John, Tony's nice to see you 14 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 2: as always. 15 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: Oh yes, it's my pleasure to have you on. So 16 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 1: give us a little information on what you're doing with 17 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:48,520 Speaker 1: the Gremlin Club now. 18 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 2: The Gremlin Club is a small social club down here 19 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 2: in West Wales, in Commarvin. They were really looking forward 20 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,880 Speaker 2: to having some entertainment on a Sunday night. The rest 21 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 2: of the week is all filed. They didn't have anything 22 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 2: on a Sunday, so they approached a company called Welsh 23 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 2: Factor which was a talent competition down here. 24 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 3: I think they covered up most of South Wales. 25 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:12,720 Speaker 2: And the idea was basically to have a night where 26 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 2: the contestants could practice the song's practice performances, practice all 27 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 2: the year round, so that when they get to the 28 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 2: Welsh Factor competition then they were a bit more rehearsed 29 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 2: and a bit more polished. The lady who was hosting 30 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 2: it was a Lease I think you've met at Lease before, 31 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:32,919 Speaker 2: a larger than life cabaret singer as well. She knew 32 00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 2: her trade, so that was the idea behind it. And then, 33 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,840 Speaker 2: of course because it's in an open pub, then on 34 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:43,120 Speaker 2: top of these very accomplished singers which gave it a standard, 35 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,959 Speaker 2: you then had all these other pub singers who wanted 36 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 2: to come in and have a go. Now they were 37 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:51,400 Speaker 2: not karaoke singers, they were people who genuinely wanted to 38 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 2: join in and sing. 39 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: How did you find that to work out? With everything 40 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 1: he was doing? Moving forward? 41 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 2: What we found is that people who were on the 42 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 2: circuit or on the Saturday night trade were coming on 43 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 2: a Sunday use the club and again practice songs, try 44 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:10,560 Speaker 2: them out, see if they're going to be crowd pleasers. 45 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 2: Sometimes you have a song and you think this is great, 46 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 2: the crowd's going to love this, and it just dies 47 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 2: a death for some reason. And then other times when 48 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 2: you're sitting around in a group and somebody gets up 49 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:22,440 Speaker 2: and sings a song and everybody's up and singing and 50 00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 2: the crowds are dancing, and you think, why is that 51 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:26,639 Speaker 2: in my set list? So there was a bit of 52 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 2: a learning curve for proper singers. 53 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: So while you were seeing this, what was your input 54 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: and what did you see coming out of it? 55 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 2: At the time, I was just sitting back watching my song, 56 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 2: was joining in singing. I could see these newcomers. Some 57 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 2: of them had huge confidence issues. I remember one girl 58 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 2: she would walk off the stage crying because she got 59 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 2: her words wrung. Everybody was so supportive and cheering everybody 60 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:52,840 Speaker 2: or oh, don't get off the stage, go and have 61 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 2: another girl, We'd be fine. And then of course then 62 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 2: she would get back on when she finished. Then the 63 00:02:57,680 --> 00:02:59,920 Speaker 2: biggest round replowse of the night. So I saw it 64 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 2: building confidence. I'd suddenly realized that this was far more 65 00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 2: of a karaoke night. It was more community building event. 66 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 2: I was seeing people get in more than just singing 67 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 2: from what they were getting. It was a way people 68 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 2: could leave their troubles at the door, come in, enjoy 69 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 2: some singing, enjoy a bit of fun, and then go 70 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:21,440 Speaker 2: home slightly better than they came in. As time has 71 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 2: gone on, the Welsh factor folded and at least parted 72 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 2: company with Welsh factor. Now the only target that we've 73 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:31,960 Speaker 2: got to hit because we haven't got to train people 74 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:34,720 Speaker 2: up to go into this competition. The only goal now 75 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 2: is can we give people as much fun as possible? 76 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 2: So now it's a fun night that people could just 77 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 2: come in sing with friends. Everybody's equal, even we have 78 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 2: good singers, we have very very bad singers sometimes, but 79 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 2: they have the same stage time, they have the same attention. 80 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 2: Everybody is equal, and that's what I love about it. 81 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: How have you seen it evolve since you have taken 82 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 1: over and put it in the direction that you saw 83 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: it going. 84 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, I should, I should talk about that, but if 85 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 2: I can, I just changed the subject for one second. 86 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:14,520 Speaker 2: Alice managed to get a diagnosis that she had bowel cancer. 87 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 3: She was going to retire. 88 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 2: There was nobody to take over, and I thought, well, 89 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 2: I can't let this just fold. So from the back 90 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 2: of the ranks and from basically from being insignificant in 91 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 2: the corner, I said, well, I've got DJing experience. 92 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 3: Can I carry on running it? 93 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 2: Suddenly then everybody took like five steps back, and I 94 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 2: was the only one standing. 95 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:34,600 Speaker 3: Like you see in the Juggle book. 96 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,719 Speaker 2: There I was with the spotlight on me, and they said, yeah, 97 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 2: as from Sunday night you're taking over. 98 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: Wow, that's great. So moving forward, how did it work 99 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 1: for you? 100 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 3: What I've seen? 101 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: I think because now we don't have the Welsh factor, 102 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 2: I love the world factor because we don't have that 103 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 2: those targets to meet. We're not trying to get people 104 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:59,200 Speaker 2: into the music industry. We're not trying to get them 105 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,080 Speaker 2: into winning common petitions. I'm finding now a lot more 106 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,479 Speaker 2: people want to come in and have a go. There's 107 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 2: a lot of people know I've seen. We've got a 108 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 2: young lady just joined us about a month ago, fourteen 109 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 2: years old, plays the guitar, very very nervous, no stage 110 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 2: experience whatsoever. But when she finishes a song, the smile 111 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 2: on her face and the applause that goes around the room, 112 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:24,320 Speaker 2: I mean she gets a bigger reception than many of 113 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 2: our really accomplished singers. That's just because it's not sympathy vote. 114 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 2: It's the way the crowd are. 115 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 3: They are just. 116 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 2: Naturally supportive and really keen to give everybody that shot. 117 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,240 Speaker 1: Now, I know that you are a huge supporter of 118 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:41,159 Speaker 1: artism and special needs. Yes, have you seen some from 119 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: the artistic community come out and support what you're doing 120 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: and participate? 121 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:48,479 Speaker 2: Absolutely? I joke about it. I say we are a 122 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 2: drop in center for dropouts. This is because many of 123 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:56,479 Speaker 2: our audience and singers are let me just get my 124 00:05:56,520 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 2: braining gear there. They may have social disadvantages, they may 125 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:04,000 Speaker 2: have some kind of mental health issues. I know we've 126 00:06:04,000 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 2: got one guy who's an absolutely amazing singer, but he 127 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 2: has schizophrenia and bipolar and somehow that doesn't affect him. 128 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:15,039 Speaker 2: When he's on stage. He may be having the worst 129 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 2: day possible, but once he comes in the club, gets 130 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 2: up singing, he gives this amazing performance. We have one 131 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 2: young lady who is one hundred percent blind. She's been 132 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 2: blind from birth. Of course, it's much harder for her 133 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:29,599 Speaker 2: because like a karaoke night, we have the lyrics on 134 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 2: a screen. She gon't read that, so she has to 135 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 2: learn everything and perform it by heart. But somehow nobody 136 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,679 Speaker 2: really notices. Does that make sense? 137 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, and it's great to hear. 138 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 2: We we had one night when we didn't have the 139 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:47,359 Speaker 2: words on screen and somebody printed them off. We go 140 00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 2: around with sheets of paper like for community singing, and 141 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 2: he gives this one to this young lady and she. 142 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 3: Just laughed at civil. That's no good to me. 143 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:56,559 Speaker 2: So do you see his face and think, oh, my gosh, 144 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 2: I wasn't thinking. I hope I haven't offended you. But 145 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 2: that's just the way this She is just one of us, 146 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,960 Speaker 2: and the disadvantages and disabilities really don't exist. We see 147 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 2: past that, and whatever your ability, your needs, your religion, 148 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 2: your color, your creed, your beliefs, it's all flatlined and 149 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 2: everybody's equal, and everybody comes in with no preconceived reputations. 150 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 2: So some people come in and we've heard about them 151 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 2: when we think, oh, these people are going to be 152 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 2: trouble again, they start at a zero, same as everybody else, 153 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 2: give them exactly the same stage time, and then everybody 154 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 2: kind of earns their stripes. So whatever you've got outside 155 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 2: the club, that's a whole different issue. When you're in 156 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 2: the club and when you're singing everybody's equal. 157 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: That's such a great way to look at it. 158 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 2: I think I think that's one way that we have 159 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 2: to look at our attitude towards discrimination. I'm not a 160 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 2: fan of positive discrimination. I'm not a fan of quotas. 161 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 2: We've got one girl from Vietnam who's just a bundle 162 00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 2: of energy. We love it when she comes in. 163 00:07:58,960 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 3: Everybody's equal. 164 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 2: If if the club ends up one hundred percent Chinese 165 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 2: one night, or one hundred percent Asian or one hundred 166 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 2: percent Welsh, that's the audience that we've got and welcome 167 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 2: one and all the same with ability. If we have 168 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 2: a busload of autistic people, they will be treated exactly 169 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:17,880 Speaker 2: the same way as our regular segments. Obviously, there are 170 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 2: people who have to have special treatment. For example, if 171 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,320 Speaker 2: somebody's in a wheelchair, they need to be helped onto 172 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 2: the stage. When I say everybody's equal, it's the attitude is. 173 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 2: The attitude is we treat you equally. But we do 174 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 2: realize that people have to have a bit of extra 175 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:35,840 Speaker 2: attention to make that equality. 176 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: Now that you've got it to this point and it 177 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 1: seems to be really going, well, what's your plans for 178 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: the future with it? What do you see it evolving 179 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: to eventually. 180 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 2: Honestly, I'm just having fun and that's what we really 181 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 2: want out of it. We're not trying to go anywhere, 182 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 2: We're not trying to do anything. We just want as 183 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 2: many people to come in, have fun and enjoy the night. 184 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,480 Speaker 2: One thing I'd like to do is attract a bigger audience. 185 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:04,439 Speaker 2: For that reason, we don't brand it as a karaoke night, 186 00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 2: because people don't go to karaokes to listen. People got 187 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 2: a karaoke to get on stage and sing typical songs 188 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 2: very very badly. As a former karaoke host, I know 189 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 2: that the first thing you've got to do is get 190 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:19,440 Speaker 2: somebody very bad on stage to start the night, because 191 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:22,080 Speaker 2: suddenly then everybody wants to have a go. Whereas what 192 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 2: we're doing is the exact opposite of that. We want 193 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 2: to put on a show and have a handful of 194 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 2: really good singers or really entertaining singers. I think the 195 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,520 Speaker 2: entertainment factor is more important. We have several people who 196 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 2: are less accomplished singers. We say, but oh they're great 197 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,600 Speaker 2: fun to watch, and getting that entertainment out there and 198 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 2: letting the audience see these people having fun and again 199 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 2: to encourage everybody to just leave your troubles and get 200 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 2: up here and sing with us. 201 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: Now that this space has evolved beyond a training ground, 202 00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:59,120 Speaker 1: how has that changed your mindset? Are you leaning more 203 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 1: into creativity, taking risks, and giving yourself permission to explore 204 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:07,360 Speaker 1: without expectations. By doing this, it seems like this shift 205 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: can create space not just for creativity, but for people 206 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 1: to discover what they're truly capable of. Have you tried 207 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 1: anything different? 208 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 2: I tend to have at least three or four group 209 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 2: songs on the stage. I look around and think, oh, 210 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 2: let's put together maybe a five piece girl band, and 211 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 2: they all come up on stage and they'll sing together, 212 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:29,679 Speaker 2: and that's sponding that people make friends that way. Again, 213 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:33,080 Speaker 2: if this new person comes in, maybe a bit timid, 214 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:35,000 Speaker 2: it's a great way to get them on the stage 215 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,480 Speaker 2: for the first time, and suddenly they feel part of 216 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 2: a small family. After they've been on the stage and 217 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 2: they know what it's like to standing there on the 218 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,680 Speaker 2: spotlights on their faces, it's much easier to make the 219 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:48,679 Speaker 2: second attempt, which will be a solo performance. That's really 220 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 2: what I want from it. I want to see people 221 00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:55,600 Speaker 2: enjoying themselves. I want to see people progress and turn 222 00:10:55,679 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 2: into more confident versions of themselves. If I'm a tread 223 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 2: to achieve that goal, and I see people come and 224 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 2: then they become more confident, and then they leave, and 225 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:07,720 Speaker 2: then we see other people coming in, and we do 226 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 2: it all again, I'm quite happy with that. The smile 227 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:12,839 Speaker 2: on people's faces is exactly why I do it. 228 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 1: Since you're in video production, do you film this? 229 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:19,960 Speaker 2: We do not for any particular reason. Sometimes it's nice 230 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:23,840 Speaker 2: to have it recorded in case there's a particularly good performance, 231 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 2: or in case somebody says something funny, or if I 232 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 2: say something funny in the odd occasion, then it's worth 233 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 2: having it filmed. I do tend to put a couple 234 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 2: of performances up on Facebook every now and then to 235 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 2: let new audiences see what goes on. Also, then, because 236 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 2: we filmed it, I let people have copies of them 237 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 2: so they can go back and analyze their performances, see 238 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,040 Speaker 2: what went right and what went wrong. Trouble with filming 239 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:51,080 Speaker 2: things is it never sounds as good unless you use 240 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 2: studio quality recording equipment. You're only basically used on a telephone. 241 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 2: The microphones tend to be fairly poor, so I always 242 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 2: say to people. When you listen back, Remember you've got 243 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 2: acoustics of the room, you've got bodies, your people talking, 244 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 2: you got background noise. You'll listen to a very sterile 245 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 2: performance on your phone. You can overanalyze that sometimes, but 246 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 2: they recorded mostly for nostalgia rather than for anything professional. 247 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 1: So with it doing so well, how are you promoting 248 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: it so that people know that they can come and 249 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: hear all this badly? 250 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 3: It's the answer. Most of it is just word of mouth. 251 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:28,439 Speaker 3: We tend to. 252 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 2: Have a lot of free bees with our logo on 253 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:32,440 Speaker 2: it that we kind of pass around, and if people 254 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: got a fridge magnet with the Gremlin open Mic logo 255 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 2: on it, then it becomes a topic of conversation. We've 256 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 2: got our Facebook page, there's nobody with any social media experience, 257 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,480 Speaker 2: so it just organically grows every now and then, and 258 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 2: the club tend to promote it on their other nights, 259 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 2: so we get a mention on a Saturday night, which 260 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:54,000 Speaker 2: is their live events. But apart from that, we really 261 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 2: very very bad at promoting things. I hear there's a 262 00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:59,920 Speaker 2: guy out in Nashville called Tony Mantor who I'm going 263 00:12:59,920 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 2: to see if I can have a word with him 264 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 2: and see if he'd help us from promote one't they? 265 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, we'll promote it any way we can. Now, 266 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 1: you mentioned that you have had some autistic people attend, 267 00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:13,679 Speaker 1: and have you seen that change the way people look 268 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 1: at neudiversity? Now if you go into the real world 269 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: that just happens to be outside the club. Unfortunately, people 270 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:24,960 Speaker 1: still do not understand autism or mental illness. Unfortunately they 271 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 1: have no clue what it is. If they can see 272 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:31,080 Speaker 1: those that are autistic and deal with mental illness that 273 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: are inside that club, hopefully they can get a different perception. 274 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:39,440 Speaker 1: Have you seen that change in any way help the 275 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:42,439 Speaker 1: perception even just a little bit in what you're doing. 276 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 2: Definitely, I've seen people become a lot more accepted as 277 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 2: a result of getting up on stage and singing in 278 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 2: the way that the audience accepts newcomers and the audience 279 00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:57,360 Speaker 2: accept really good singers. When somebody gets up and they've 280 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 2: got autism, and again I won't mention names, but there 281 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,680 Speaker 2: is one lady who is heavily autistic. She can't speak 282 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 2: very well, but oh boy can she sing. And when 283 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:10,720 Speaker 2: she gets up and bells her tune out. Then I 284 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 2: mean everybody they set their goals and their expectations lower 285 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 2: because of her autism, and as a result, she's just 286 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 2: a hero. She's one of the stars of the night. 287 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 2: Not necessarily the best singer, not necessarily the best performer, 288 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 2: but the audience really really kind of get behind her 289 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,000 Speaker 2: and encourage her to go on. 290 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 3: I nearly said her name, then go on, then go 291 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 3: for it. 292 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 2: And then when she comes off the stage, her smile 293 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:39,360 Speaker 2: is infectious. The audiences smile is infectious, and yes, the 294 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 2: audience have accepted her as part of our gremlin family. 295 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:46,960 Speaker 2: That's just incredible to watch. Somehow, people with autism tend 296 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 2: to have a lot more confidence than the rest of us, 297 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 2: and they're going to get on that stage whether we 298 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 2: like it or not, and they often steal it. Again, 299 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 2: the audience reaction to that is always so warm. As 300 00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 2: you say, if they met outside the club in one 301 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 2: of the supermarkets or department stores, they may have just 302 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 2: sort of walked down the other aisle, whereas now it's 303 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 2: all kind of accept. 304 00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 1: So you've mentioned that they come off feeling good about themselves. 305 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: So this is a real confidence builder for them. Have 306 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: you seen I know you've seen this, but how can 307 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 1: you do you have a story about how someone went 308 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: on and they were really timid, they were really afraid, 309 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 1: and then once they saw that they was accepted, they 310 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 1: came off that stage with more confidence than you thought 311 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: they would ever have. 312 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 2: There is one lady again forgiven me if I don't 313 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 2: mention her name. When I first went there, which would 314 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 2: have been twenty seventeen something like that, and obviously we 315 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 2: had all the Welsh factors SA guess who were semi 316 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:51,520 Speaker 2: pro and then this one young lady who was quite large. 317 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 2: I would always regard her as the friend. She wasn't 318 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 2: incredibly good singer, and I would have probably overlooked her 319 00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 2: if it hadn't been for the format of the night, 320 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 2: because when she got up and sang, she had this. 321 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 3: Incredible low register in her voice. 322 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 2: I could hear there was something different about her voice 323 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 2: gets sing songs like Yazoo said that kind of Alice. 324 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 3: And Moyer richness of it. 325 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 2: Another music mogul who was happened to be there one 326 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 2: night he said, I'm going to pay for you to 327 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 2: have some singing lessons with Elease, and which they didn't 328 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 2: do because she didn't need it. But she just kept 329 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 2: coming every Sunday, and her confidence grew and grew and grew. 330 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 2: She's still coming now and she is one of the 331 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 2: best singers that we've ever had. Her voice is really 332 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:41,240 Speaker 2: exceptional and she's often now asked to come and guest 333 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 2: perform at various charity functions fates. You'll often see her 334 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 2: headlining or I know over for Saint David's Day, which 335 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 2: is our Welsh patron. The local Welsh Male Voice Choir 336 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 2: put on a concert to raise money for charity and 337 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 2: they asked this young lady to come along and be 338 00:16:58,920 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 2: a guest singer. 339 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 3: They all gave her flowers. 340 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 2: I found out on Sunday she did eleven songs, so 341 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 2: it was far more than being a guest. She was 342 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 2: really fronting this whole male voice choir, which has had 343 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,600 Speaker 2: about forty people behind the forty men with a big 344 00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 2: wolve zone. A few years ago, she would have never 345 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 2: had the conference to do that. Again, she's gone from 346 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 2: being quite a timid character right in the background to 347 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 2: fronting some fairly big shows. 348 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: Wow, that's awesome. Now, how many people help you put 349 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:28,600 Speaker 1: this together? 350 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 2: The actual running of it is just a small family event. 351 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 2: Now it's just myself and my son actually do the 352 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 2: running of it. My wife is always behind me and 353 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,360 Speaker 2: everything I do, so even though she's not formally involved, 354 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:43,640 Speaker 2: she's there putting out the beer mats. 355 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 3: With our logos and things on. 356 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:47,919 Speaker 2: And we really need to mention the committee of the 357 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:50,720 Speaker 2: club because they do an amazing job of promoting the 358 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 2: night with the various posters announcements. They have to pay 359 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 2: our expenses obviously because I live about forty miles away, 360 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:00,880 Speaker 2: so transport and things like that to get us up there, 361 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 2: so their support as well. But even though they're not 362 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 2: directly involved in the running of it, there's a lot 363 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 2: of people behind it who are making it happen. Ultimately, 364 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 2: on the front line, it's just me and Dan really. 365 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 1: Now, since you started this, you've got it up and 366 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 1: running and it seems to be doing very well. How 367 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 1: does it feel that you've taken something that was a 368 00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 1: completely totally different animal, So how does it feel that 369 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: what you started now and what you've created is actually 370 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: making a difference. 371 00:18:30,680 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 3: It feels fantastic. 372 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:36,640 Speaker 2: I can't say anything else apart from that it's changed 373 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:39,920 Speaker 2: because well, partly because of my beliefs. 374 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 3: But also it was evolution. 375 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 2: At least had to run it the way she did 376 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,480 Speaker 2: because she was funded by the Welsh Factor, so she 377 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 2: was quite constrained it had to be a very, very 378 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 2: high quality performance. Whereas when I came in I was 379 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:56,720 Speaker 2: really lucky because I didn't have that noose er on 380 00:18:56,840 --> 00:18:57,200 Speaker 2: my neck. 381 00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 3: Suddenly I then had. 382 00:18:58,440 --> 00:19:01,640 Speaker 2: The ability to involve everybody in the room because I 383 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 2: was then financed by the club. My ultimate goal, as 384 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:07,919 Speaker 2: much as we like to think it's all about singing, 385 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 2: my ultimate goal is to get money behind the till. 386 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 2: So yeah, my goal was really to attract people in. 387 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:17,240 Speaker 2: I had different targets in the way and the way 388 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 2: we get people in there is, as I've mentioned before, 389 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:25,520 Speaker 2: building this community and building up this everybody's equal attitude, 390 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,160 Speaker 2: where everybody can come along and sing, everybody can sit 391 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 2: in the audience and enjoy the night, sit in the 392 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 2: audience and sing along. The other thing I think is 393 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,840 Speaker 2: quite important. I think when you go to a certain 394 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 2: karaoke knights, you sit in the corner and you think, oh, 395 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 2: I hope they don't call me up, and you sit 396 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 2: there all like worrying. Whereas I make a point of saying, look, 397 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 2: if you don't want to come up, fine, don't put 398 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 2: your name down. 399 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 3: We've got more than enough singers. 400 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 2: If you haven't put your name down, sit back, relax, 401 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,119 Speaker 2: enjoy your drink, enjoy the music, and you know, maybe 402 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:54,440 Speaker 2: just sing along from where you are. So it's been 403 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,840 Speaker 2: in a kind of an evolution, but the core elements 404 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 2: of encouragement and building confidence and accepting everybody for who 405 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 2: they are, not what they are, has gone all the 406 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 2: way through. And I think the shell may have changed, 407 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:11,680 Speaker 2: but the core is still very much the same and 408 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:12,920 Speaker 2: that's not going to change. 409 00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: This is based on community, and from what I see, 410 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:20,600 Speaker 1: it's a community within a community. Yes, how have you 411 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:24,920 Speaker 1: seen the community bond together? Has that community gone out 412 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: and expanded by telling more people about what's going on 413 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:32,280 Speaker 1: and what you're doing, this could evolve into something even 414 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: bigger than you ever anticipated. 415 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 2: I don't see that part, to be perfectly honest. I 416 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 2: know very often people do go out and they say, oh, 417 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:43,200 Speaker 2: we had a great night on Sunday again. We talked 418 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 2: about that male voice choir, and one of the choir 419 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 2: performers is one of our regular singers, so very often 420 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,160 Speaker 2: he'll go out to me, you must be talking. 421 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 3: About our nights when they're at choir practice. 422 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 2: Because we've had four or five other members of the 423 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,520 Speaker 2: choir coming in occasionally to take part, must be going 424 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:02,600 Speaker 2: out and talking about it and saying, well, a good 425 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:04,840 Speaker 2: night they had. So I suppose in a way we 426 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,960 Speaker 2: are kind of infiltrating our way into people's conversations. But 427 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,880 Speaker 2: that's just something that's happened organically rather than my attention. 428 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 2: My intention was just to give them a bit of 429 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,240 Speaker 2: fun on a Sunday night. 430 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:21,159 Speaker 1: Well, that's how organic promotion happens. It just works just 431 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: that way. So if you would tell everybody where it's 432 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 1: at so that they can come out and see you 433 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,879 Speaker 1: and hopefully support you as well. Oh yes, one last question, 434 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: do you live stream? 435 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:34,360 Speaker 2: It's not live streamed, And again that's a conscious decision 436 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:37,679 Speaker 2: because I want people to get up on stage and 437 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:39,959 Speaker 2: be able to try out something new and it can 438 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 2: be a complete car crash, and if it is a 439 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 2: car crash, well then everybody's going to whoop and share. Anyway, Again, 440 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,720 Speaker 2: we've got some very accomplished singers, but they will always 441 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 2: try out something new. If they do try something new 442 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,399 Speaker 2: and it goes badly, I will then get out one 443 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 2: of the more popular songs that they've done well, so 444 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,439 Speaker 2: that at least when they walk off. Everybody's heard them 445 00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 2: singing a good song and for that reason we don't 446 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 2: want it to go out across to the internet. I 447 00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 2: want people to have the confidence that they can get 448 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 2: up and try things. New singers probably wouldn't want to 449 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 2: get up. They had an audience of twenty thousand. With 450 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 2: an audience of fifty sixty maybe one hundred people who 451 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 2: are cheering for you, it's much easier, so it's not 452 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 2: live stream. 453 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:20,920 Speaker 3: The only way you. 454 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 2: Can come in and see the mayhem and enjoy the 455 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 2: camaraderie and the chaos because it is organized chaos and 456 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 2: that's part the magic of it. Is to come along 457 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 2: to a town in Wales called Carmarvin, which is in 458 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 2: West Wales, and the club is called the Gremlin Club, 459 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:40,119 Speaker 2: which is right in the town center. 460 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 3: It's a small. 461 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,639 Speaker 2: Social club which if you know the social clubs that 462 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,720 Speaker 2: Peter Kay has sent up in his Phoenix Nights, it's 463 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:52,200 Speaker 2: exactly like one of that great fun, great people, cheap 464 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,879 Speaker 2: alcohol that's always a winner. And it happens every Sunday 465 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 2: from eight through to eleven. And you can find more 466 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:02,639 Speaker 2: information on our Facebook page which is the Gremlin Open 467 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:03,880 Speaker 2: Mic Sunday. 468 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:07,480 Speaker 1: Well this has been a pleasure. I've genuinely enjoyed this conversation, 469 00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:09,720 Speaker 1: and more than that, I've learned a lot about what 470 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 1: you're doing today, and I know our listeners have too, 471 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:14,440 Speaker 1: So I really appreciate you taking the time to join 472 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 1: us today. 473 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:16,720 Speaker 3: Tony's been a joy. 474 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:18,399 Speaker 2: It's always a joy to come and talk to you, 475 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 2: and I never did an excuse to talk about myself. 476 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:27,199 Speaker 1: Oh that's great. Well, thanks again, A sincere thank you 477 00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 1: to our guests for sharing their journey. If today's conversation 478 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 1: helped you see the world a little differently, then we're 479 00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 1: doing exactly what we hope to do. Until next time, 480 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 1: keep believing, keep learning, and most importantly, keep asking yourself, 481 00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 1: why not me?