Speaker 1: You're listening to Comedy Central. Hey, it's Jaisi Lighted correspondent
Speaker 1: for The Daily Show. Up next is a preview of
Speaker 1: a new Daily Show podcast with my buddy contributor Jordan Clepper.
Speaker 1: Jordan Clepper fingers the Conspiracy. Have to listen and be
Speaker 1: sure to look for the series to him more wherever
Speaker 1: you get your podcast. John F. Kennedy Jr. Was the
Speaker 1: son of John F. Kennedy, President of the United States. Tragically,
Speaker 1: jfk Jr. Was killed in a plane crash in or
Speaker 1: was he? Yes, he was, of course he was. But
Speaker 1: what if he wasn't? What if he were about to
Speaker 1: re emerge as the vice president of Donald Trump, who,
Speaker 1: by the way, is still the president. Sounds crazy, it is.
Speaker 1: In fact, it's one of the wilder conspiracies I've heard
Speaker 1: in my seven years converting Trump rallies. You're probably familiar
Speaker 1: with my Daily Show segments. Jordan Clapper fingers the Pulse
Speaker 1: em we nominated twice, lost twice, where I chat with
Speaker 1: Trump supporters at rallies. We are not a call, it's
Speaker 1: an American ideal that we treat women with respect. You
Speaker 1: gotta give me the back of that shot one more time.
Speaker 1: That's too much fun. Trump dad, bitch, we don't even
Speaker 1: see the irony of it. And if you're into conspiracy
Speaker 1: theories and there's nothing that comes close to a Trump rally,
Speaker 1: what's on your back? Q flag? One of those crazy
Speaker 1: people are and communlaw are not legitimate. What's a cute
Speaker 1: whole thing that Trump would be reinstated at? President never looked?
Speaker 1: If you go online, there's a whole list of pedophile symbols. Really, yes,
Speaker 1: it's like Woodstock, except everyone there thinks Jimmy Hendrix is
Speaker 1: a holograph. Normally, when one of these conspiracy theories comes up,
Speaker 1: I have to respond then moved past it because we're
Speaker 1: shooting a piece for TV and we have to say
Speaker 1: somewhat focused. But this is a podcast, we don't have
Speaker 1: to stay focused at all. So I'm finally diving into
Speaker 1: some of the most incredible conspiracy theories that have been
Speaker 1: pitched to me at Trump rallies by America's most imaginative minds.
Speaker 1: This is Jordan clapper Fingers, the Conspiracy and all new
Speaker 1: limited series podcast from the Daily Show. So, folks, come
Speaker 1: on down from your grassy knolls and let's dig in.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about John F. Kennedy Jr. But to help
Speaker 1: me do that, I want to bring in our first guest,
Speaker 1: Will Summer Wills, of politics reporter for The Daily Beast.
Speaker 1: He's got a book coming out in February called Trust,
Speaker 1: The Plan, The Rise of Q and On and the
Speaker 1: Conspiracy that Unhinged America. Well, welcome to Jordan Clapper Fingers
Speaker 1: the Conspiracy. I'm excited to have you on. You are
Speaker 1: here to help me walk through and understand what is
Speaker 1: going on in this world of John F. Kennedy Jr.
Speaker 1: And I will say this. I I go out on
Speaker 1: the road and I start hearing people talking about JFK Jr.
Speaker 1: And initially I'm thinking, you know, they're talking about JFK.
Speaker 1: There's a long history of conspiracies with JFK. And then
Speaker 1: I'm putting together that is JFK Jr. And then I
Speaker 1: start to see signs up. I started to see bumper
Speaker 1: stickers that have him as vice presidential candidate to Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: And then a month or so back, I go to
Speaker 1: a rally in the Midwest and I'm hearing sweet old
Speaker 1: grandmother's talk about John F. Kennedy Jr. And I can't
Speaker 1: make head or tails of it can you can you
Speaker 1: set out a little bit of where this began? What
Speaker 1: do we need to know? Sure? So, I mean this
Speaker 1: is really bizarre, as you noted. I mean the origins
Speaker 1: of this are within Q and on um. Of course,
Speaker 1: there was the this figure Q who was giving these
Speaker 1: anonymous clues and then at one point in eighteen Q
Speaker 1: sort of vanished for a month on the forums where
Speaker 1: the clues came out, and then someone named Are shows
Speaker 1: up and start saying, you know, all of this is
Speaker 1: really about JFK Jr. And so that's kind of where
Speaker 1: the where it begins. And eventually Q comes back and
Speaker 1: kind of says like this, JFK JUNI yourself's garbage. You
Speaker 1: know what have You've been tricking all my people? Um,
Speaker 1: But the JFK junrself really start. It's there with this
Speaker 1: idea that JFK Jr faked his death to take on
Speaker 1: the deep state and help Donald Trump sort of bring
Speaker 1: about this sort of Q and on Utopia. There's a conspiracy.
Speaker 1: Inside the conspiracy, it's a it's a it's a conspiracy
Speaker 1: tour ducan right now exactly. It's sort of a splinter faction,
Speaker 1: and you get this situation where like the kind of
Speaker 1: the mainline Q and on. People will often be like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, like, you know, I believe all this
Speaker 1: Pizza Gate stuff, I believe this about Hillary Clinton, but
Speaker 1: these JFK Junior people are embarrassing us. They just believe
Speaker 1: totally stupid stuff. That's the dynamic you want there, and
Speaker 1: we're like, oh my god, can we just go back
Speaker 1: to serious things like talking about how the Democrats drink
Speaker 1: baby's blood and all this JFK junior stuff. We're losing credibility.
Speaker 1: People were losing credibility. Put your tidfoil heads back on
Speaker 1: and let's march. Yeah. I mean basically they're saying, you know,
Speaker 1: these JFK Junior people are almost like a government meant
Speaker 1: to embarrass Q and on. But really, this belief has
Speaker 1: in JFK Jr. Has persisted ever since. So so what
Speaker 1: was ours intention in this situation? Like initially that JFK
Speaker 1: Jr one is alive, so perhaps he faked his death.
Speaker 1: And two he's aligning himself with Donald Trump. It feels
Speaker 1: like there's four steps there that I'm even a hard
Speaker 1: time connecting. Why JFK Jr. And let's start with why
Speaker 1: he's alive? And why that should matter. Sure, So the
Speaker 1: arc that is presented by R, and I want to
Speaker 1: point out here that R is the letter after Q.
Speaker 1: And so that's sort of the explanation for this. Is
Speaker 1: it or is it will? Your mainstream elitist alphabet says
Speaker 1: it's the letter after Q, but I have I only
Speaker 1: if you're moving forward through time. But that's a whole
Speaker 1: another podcast exactly. So, so the the sort of the
Speaker 1: story that's laid out is that John F. Kennedy, the
Speaker 1: father is killed by the deep state, you know, in
Speaker 1: ninety three. JFK Jr. Sees this and says, oh, man,
Speaker 1: the Deep State might come for me, and I want
Speaker 1: to get revenge on them for murdering my father. And
Speaker 1: so for years he builds up this relationship with Donald Trump,
Speaker 1: you know, because they were both sort of these New
Speaker 1: York socialite figures. There are pictures of them together, and
Speaker 1: so this is used to suggest that they were like
Speaker 1: best buddies. Then in this storyline, JFK Jr. Fax his
Speaker 1: death in this plane crash to sort of go undercover
Speaker 1: and sort of lay the groundwork for the Q and
Speaker 1: On journey and eventually emerge. For a while they thought
Speaker 1: he was going to replace Mike Pence in on the ticket,
Speaker 1: and that he would sort of kind of help Trump
Speaker 1: and sort of get this final revenge on the deep state.
Speaker 1: So in this world they see JFK Jr. Is faking
Speaker 1: his own death to exist undercover and wait for the
Speaker 1: right time, still maintaining a relationship with Donald Trump throughout
Speaker 1: all of this. Or did or did Donald Trump just
Speaker 1: come about and become sort of an avatar for JFK
Speaker 1: Jr's ascension. Yeah, that that's a great question. I mean
Speaker 1: a lot of it is a little contradictory and not
Speaker 1: super thought out. Uh you know, that might surprise you
Speaker 1: right now. But but basically, the the idea is that,
Speaker 1: you know, back in the nineties or the eighties, they
Speaker 1: kind of cut this deal and they said Donald Trump said, man,
Speaker 1: this stuff is really messed up, you know, And then
Speaker 1: and jfkj you said, tell me about it. You know,
Speaker 1: they shot my dad, and so then they sort of
Speaker 1: teamed up and JFK Jr. Winning to hide it. Tell
Speaker 1: me about it they shot my dad. Oh wow, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're right, this is messed up. Let me let me
Speaker 1: run for president a few decades from now and make
Speaker 1: this thing happen. You're helping me connect that circle. If
Speaker 1: it's a circle. What I'm confused about. I go out
Speaker 1: there JFK famously not a Republican UM John F. Kennedy Jr.
Speaker 1: At least from my perspective, New York elite, not political,
Speaker 1: but somebody who is a magazine magnate and Seinfeld character
Speaker 1: uh doesn't exactly match up as the type of person
Speaker 1: that this often far right group would would align themselves with.
Speaker 1: What why Why did they see this potential in in
Speaker 1: somebody who's so outside of the norm, you know, I
Speaker 1: think that's a great question. And what is the emotional
Speaker 1: residence of JFK Jr? Why is why is the JFK Jr.
Speaker 1: They fixate on rather than another celebrity who died in
Speaker 1: the nineties. So the I think the answer to it
Speaker 1: is that when we think about the Q and on believer,
Speaker 1: and I think in particularly the people who go for
Speaker 1: the JFK Junior stuff, they're usually baby boomers, and I
Speaker 1: think the JFK assassination had a huge sort of emotional
Speaker 1: impact on them. And I think also JFK Jr. Was
Speaker 1: sort of seeing those this very like prominent baby boomer
Speaker 1: UM sort of an avatar of his generation, and so
Speaker 1: that way, I think there is this kind of this
Speaker 1: very emotional connection to him in a way that there
Speaker 1: that there wouldn't be with another celebrity. I think also
Speaker 1: the idea of JFK as like the last good Democrat
Speaker 1: is something that has persisted among Republicans even before Q
Speaker 1: and on, this idea of kind of this popular martyred
Speaker 1: president um and oh, isn't it terrible that, you know,
Speaker 1: LBJ in the in the sixties took being a democrat
Speaker 1: into such an awful direction. So I think JFK himself
Speaker 1: still has a lot of residents with Republicans and Q
Speaker 1: and on believers. So I think there's a lot of
Speaker 1: kind of like emotions tied up in all that. When
Speaker 1: you look back on JFK conspiracies, does it seem quaint?
Speaker 1: Does it seems sort of like the initial modern conspiracy
Speaker 1: theory that Americans have sort of built a mythos around.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think obviously we've had conspiracy theories throughout
Speaker 1: American history, but the Kennedy assassination is such a sort
Speaker 1: of an ethical one that I think gets a lot
Speaker 1: of people into conspiracy theories, and it is certainly I
Speaker 1: think the biggest and the richest one to dive into
Speaker 1: in modern history. It also sort of brings everything full
Speaker 1: circle incorporating Kennedy, Q and On is this, um it's
Speaker 1: sort of a super conspiracy theory or a mega conspiracy
Speaker 1: theory that where you can sort of get whatever you
Speaker 1: want out of it, and so we see a lot
Speaker 1: of Kennedy conspiracy theorists drawn into it. I talked to
Speaker 1: a guy who is a really big Q and On leader,
Speaker 1: and he had for decades been just like a JFK crank.
Speaker 1: I mean, he was going to all these conventions stuff
Speaker 1: like that, and then Q and On arrives and he says, oh,
Speaker 1: you know, I can sort of incorporate my Kennedy beliefs
Speaker 1: into Q and On and sort of broad in my
Speaker 1: worldview and see more of the world explained to me
Speaker 1: in that way. Um. So I do think that's an
Speaker 1: aspect of it as well. It's it's interesting. I think
Speaker 1: what a lot of people miss is just how fun
Speaker 1: conspiracies are. They They are engaging, especially if you're on
Speaker 1: a computer. One of the most fun things you can
Speaker 1: do is go down that rabbit hole and and also
Speaker 1: come away with something that empowers you because you feel
Speaker 1: like you know something somebody else doesn't. I I did
Speaker 1: a job down in Dallas a decade ago, and I
Speaker 1: was walking through the Grassy Knoll multiple times right there
Speaker 1: there in Delely Plaza, and people would approach you and
Speaker 1: they would tell you things that you should know and
Speaker 1: shouldn't know. And so there was it was like a
Speaker 1: cottage industry for conspiracy theorists to give small little tours,
Speaker 1: take you to places that they tell you what what
Speaker 1: happened and what they're not telling you. And it's easy
Speaker 1: to get wrapped up in that. And you see the
Speaker 1: people starting to develop um uh, you know, not only
Speaker 1: mindsets out of it, but it gives them importance. It
Speaker 1: gives them in some cases a job, but it makes
Speaker 1: them important in that little place. And I start to
Speaker 1: see that pop up at some of these Trump rallies
Speaker 1: that I go to, seeing people who now own part
Speaker 1: of these little conspiracies and they become many celebrities at
Speaker 1: these rallies that we see in looking at this JFK Jr.
Speaker 1: Coming back as part of UH. There's been discussions of
Speaker 1: his reappearance and there's been groups, one group called Negative
Speaker 1: forty eight, who has staged events waiting for his um return.
Speaker 1: Can you tell us a little bit about negative forty eight? Sure? Yeah,
Speaker 1: So Negative forty eight is a group that is is
Speaker 1: very convinced that JFK, not only JFK Jr. But but
Speaker 1: Kennedy at JFK himself, uh and all sorts of sort
Speaker 1: of a bevy of other beloved deceased celebrities are are.
Speaker 1: It's not that they're gonna come back to life, but
Speaker 1: they've sort of been in in inclusion, they've been in hiding,
Speaker 1: and that they're gonna come back and and sort of
Speaker 1: usher in this Q and on world. The reason they're
Speaker 1: called negative forty eight is because they this is kind
Speaker 1: of hard to explain, dude, to someone who's not really
Speaker 1: deeven it, but essentially they believe in this thing called
Speaker 1: Jamatria where they assign numerical values to letters and then
Speaker 1: they derive meaning from that A equals one, B equals
Speaker 1: too and so on. But essentially they would say, like
Speaker 1: Jordan Klepper, trust the plan twenty uh, make America great
Speaker 1: again twenty five and they just sort of speak in
Speaker 1: this language that doesn't really make sense to anyone outside
Speaker 1: of it, but they they see importance in these numbers
Speaker 1: and in these these coincidences, and so from there they
Speaker 1: essentially kind of whipped themselves up into believing these things
Speaker 1: like JFK Jr. Is coming back. I I found out
Speaker 1: what Jamatria was real quick. One are the rallies I
Speaker 1: went to when a woman kind of walked me through this.
Speaker 1: She brought out a Jamatria calculator and started typing in
Speaker 1: my name, typing in Trump's name, and connecting all sorts
Speaker 1: of numbers. It was. It was wild, it was real fun.
Speaker 1: You can kind of make anything makes sense. They're type
Speaker 1: it in the calculator. You get these numbers. And so
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson's last concert was this is it comes to
Speaker 1: you know what that means? Do you? I don't know
Speaker 1: what that means. So one through thirteen means and not true.
Speaker 1: So Michael Jackson that wasn't his last concert, and he's
Speaker 1: a lie. It's not necessarily conspiratorial thing, although it's used
Speaker 1: in that sense. It's correct me if I'm wrong. It's
Speaker 1: essentially a mathematical way of turning letters into numbers, and
Speaker 1: religions have been using this for centuries just to try
Speaker 1: to find and try to derive meeting, trying to look
Speaker 1: deeper into biblical texts and what have you. And I
Speaker 1: thought that was a key component when I talked to
Speaker 1: this woman, because the way she talked about jim Atrium,
Speaker 1: it was beyond, this is a conspiracy, it's fun. I
Speaker 1: have power because I have knowledge. It was also I'm
Speaker 1: serving a biblical character. There's religion attached to this, And
Speaker 1: I think that's where the real danger comes here, where
Speaker 1: you have people who are serving UH, serving religion and
Speaker 1: serving God through this fun, little weird game that they play,
Speaker 1: and then deciding that Aaliyah is going to appear alongside
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson and perhaps UH and jfk Jr. All at
Speaker 1: once Obama clarify who's still alive. Jfk Jr Is still alive.
Speaker 1: Jfk Jr Still alive. So I think jfk Jr. Is
Speaker 1: gonna try and expose globalist because they killed his father.
Speaker 1: We're talking about Tupac's coming back, Robin Williams is coming
Speaker 1: back Aliyah, as you mentioned, sort of pick your favorite
Speaker 1: dead celebrity. And so what happened was these folks descended
Speaker 1: on Dallas, where they thought there was going to be
Speaker 1: sort of the dead celebrities parade, and they're milling around
Speaker 1: and they're seeing like a homeless guy and they're like,
Speaker 1: I think that's Robin Williams. And then everyone's, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's Robin Williams and so on, and a lot of
Speaker 1: these guys. I mean, look, I'm not sure these guys
Speaker 1: are super up on, like Tupac for example, and there
Speaker 1: there's I think that's Tupac. You all these guys, I
Speaker 1: think that's Biggie. Uh And and it's sort of this.
Speaker 1: You can see they're sort of going into this world
Speaker 1: where like nothing bad ever happens. No no one ever
Speaker 1: dies of a drug overdose or a suicide. Um. The
Speaker 1: other thing I would add is that they think a
Speaker 1: lot of dead celebrities were murdered uh or went into
Speaker 1: hiding like JFK Jr. Fake their deaths because they were
Speaker 1: gonna blow the lid off the cabal. So like the
Speaker 1: the late dj of Echi, you know, he faked his death.
Speaker 1: All these kind of people, uh, just you know, Whitney Houston. Oh,
Speaker 1: but they're all coming back at the big moment, and
Speaker 1: you can see these people who have just particularly in
Speaker 1: this when they were kind of million around Dallas for months,
Speaker 1: just the amount of their own lives and their own
Speaker 1: hearts that they've invested into into it. You know, they're
Speaker 1: just you know, headed for a brick wall when eventually
Speaker 1: they realize not if it's happening, it's just predominantly white
Speaker 1: people who live in a bubble walking around Dallas thinking
Speaker 1: they see Tupac everywhere it. I mean, it's really like, sufuck,
Speaker 1: do you really know who Tupac is? And you think
Speaker 1: that guy's Tupac and Biggie they are. These are diametrically
Speaker 1: opposed on many levels, but I bet you're seeing it
Speaker 1: as the same person who's going into a subway. Well,
Speaker 1: they would do these live streams where they would say, like,
Speaker 1: didn't y'all see that dead rapper? Like they wouldn't know
Speaker 1: any names, you know, and they kind of have this
Speaker 1: game and telephone to figure it out. I'm not going
Speaker 1: to be a conspiracist or anything like that, but I
Speaker 1: just watched a movie last week with Robin Williams in it.
Speaker 1: It was called Man of Man of the Year. And
Speaker 1: guess what they had election fraud back then. The machines
Speaker 1: that are switching to doing electronic lee and they were
Speaker 1: counting wrong because it's a documentary. No, it's just a movie.
Speaker 1: Are there any lessons we can take from Morcan Mindy? No,
Speaker 1: but it should be pointed out they they pointed to
Speaker 1: people specifically JFK Jr. As there's been a man who's
Speaker 1: gone to multiple rallies, stands behind Donald Trump, and that's
Speaker 1: JFK Jr. I went to see pack and I saw
Speaker 1: him there as well, and he's taken selfies because he's
Speaker 1: also JFK Junior. So some people aren't just abstract apparitions.
Speaker 1: They are actually humans that they point to and say, no,
Speaker 1: this is who you are. Yeah, I'm actually I was
Speaker 1: just texting with him. So, so his name is is
Speaker 1: Vincent Fuska, and he is this like Trump super fan.
Speaker 1: In the lead up to in the election, he had
Speaker 1: this van kind of festooned with Trump paraphernalia, and so
Speaker 1: he kind of ends up becoming because he's a big
Speaker 1: Trump fan. He's behind him at a lot of rallies.
Speaker 1: When the JFK Junior stuff starts happening. And this guy,
Speaker 1: I should say, looks nothing like JFK Jr. He dresses, uh,
Speaker 1: he wears like a big fedora he's very scruffy guy.
Speaker 1: He it's like like a big suit coat. And so,
Speaker 1: to be clear, JFK Jr. Was a stylish man, and
Speaker 1: it could only be assumed that that style, mixed with
Speaker 1: privilege and wealth, would have led him into the modern era.
Speaker 1: Not choosing to wear a fedora. Yes, yes, thank you.
Speaker 1: Yeah maybe in the nineties, you know, but but now no,
Speaker 1: I don't think so. And so yeah, early early swing day, big,
Speaker 1: big bad voodoo daddy, he would have had a fedora.
Speaker 1: There would have been a lot of college kids who
Speaker 1: wanted to look like JFK Jr. Who could pull off
Speaker 1: a fedora. But modern JFK Junior. No, no freaking way,
Speaker 1: no way. And so so he's standing behind Trump, and
Speaker 1: when the JFK Junior stuff starts happening, people go, oh,
Speaker 1: my gosh, I think that's JFK Jr. Behind Trump. And
Speaker 1: then there was like a blonde woman nearby, and they said,
Speaker 1: I think that's JFK Jr's wife, and so they, I mean,
Speaker 1: they kind of get going. But the wild thing to
Speaker 1: me about it is this guy doesn't come out and say, hey, guys,
Speaker 1: I'm not JFK Junior. Leave me alone. He goes, oh,
Speaker 1: who's to say? And so I've seen this guy maybe
Speaker 1: seven or eight times, and he'll be out a rally
Speaker 1: or something and people go, oh, j K Jr. You know,
Speaker 1: we want pictures. And then I say to him, Hey,
Speaker 1: you want to tell me about how everyone thinks you're
Speaker 1: JFK Jr. You're obviously not. And he goes, oh, I'd
Speaker 1: love to talk to you later. How about in an
Speaker 1: hour let me catch up. I'm just so busy today,
Speaker 1: but I'm in town. You know, yeah, my number, let's
Speaker 1: talk later. Obviously never gets back to me. I talked
Speaker 1: to this one woman who was like, oh, posing for
Speaker 1: all these selfies with him? And I said, you know
Speaker 1: that's not JFK Jr. Right, And she's like, haven't you
Speaker 1: ever heard of Hollywood? Haven't you heard visual Effects? Haven't
Speaker 1: you ever heard of Medea? You know it's you know
Speaker 1: they I mean they're really deep and Tyler Perry as
Speaker 1: evidence it's a it's a smart move. And I give
Speaker 1: Vincent props. I tell you, if somebody stops me on
Speaker 1: the street and says Joel McHale, I love you in community,
Speaker 1: I don't correct him. Nope, that's let them think that
Speaker 1: let them live their own reality. As Americans, we have
Speaker 1: every right to live our own reality. I think it's
Speaker 1: in the Constitution somewhere somewhere deep. Now, there's there's a
Speaker 1: dark side to some of this, because I will say what.
Speaker 1: I talked to the woman who was into Jamatrium, and
Speaker 1: she was a part of this Negative forty eight group.
Speaker 1: They show up in Dallas, they wait in Dallas for
Speaker 1: JFK Jr. To arrive, and then they stay there for
Speaker 1: months and months on end, and their stories of families
Speaker 1: who are losing loved ones to this conspiracy mindset, and
Speaker 1: people are sending money to these The leader pratsman I believe, um, Like,
Speaker 1: what are some of the dark sides of believing in
Speaker 1: these weird fantasies? Yeah? I mean, so you know, Q
Speaker 1: and I have talked to so many people who have
Speaker 1: lost family and friends to Q and on. And when
Speaker 1: you talk about something as extreme as Negative forty A
Speaker 1: to sort of that faction, I mean you're talking about
Speaker 1: people who have essentially given up their lives at this point.
Speaker 1: I mean it's like they've joined kind of like a
Speaker 1: traveling commune or something. I mean, you know they're saying
Speaker 1: in this hotel room for months at a time, which
Speaker 1: is not cheap. They're kind of pooling all their funds.
Speaker 1: At one point, you know, there were a bunch of
Speaker 1: like little toddlers, little kids involved, which you know, it's
Speaker 1: not great for them to be roaming around looking for
Speaker 1: Tupac or whatever. Um. And you know, I talked to
Speaker 1: one guy who whose wife had He thought he had
Speaker 1: a you know, totally fine, normal marriage, and then she
Speaker 1: just says, oh, yeah, I'm gonna go to this Trump rally. Well,
Speaker 1: as it turned out, she was going to join Negative
Speaker 1: forty eight and then just vanishes. And you know he's
Speaker 1: seeing her in these videos and stuff, and he's like,
Speaker 1: what is happening in my family? There's no evidence she's
Speaker 1: ever coming back. You know, all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: I mean, it is really really grim stuff. This is
Speaker 1: a poor guy. You just you see about homing like
Speaker 1: my wife she left me. K Jr. It's I get.
Speaker 1: It's what a successful man and he's been through a lot.
Speaker 1: You know, he's died, he's come back, he's living as
Speaker 1: this man vincent. He's trying to pull off Fedora's in
Speaker 1: modern times. It's it's difficult. It's a bold decision. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I pad he's found love, but she's left me alone.
Speaker 1: We're gonna pause it right there, We'll be right back.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to Jordan's clapper Fingers the conspiracy. I want
Speaker 1: to bring in Professor Joe Usinski, political scientists and conspiracy
Speaker 1: theory expert at the University of Miami who followed the
Speaker 1: JFK Junior gathering in Dallas. Joe, welcome, Thanks for having me. So, Joe,
Speaker 1: we got Will Summer here. We've been going down this
Speaker 1: JFK JR. Wormhole, rabbit hole, whatever hole you want to
Speaker 1: call it. We're in it. Um, You've you've looked at
Speaker 1: what's happening and what continues to happen in Dallas from
Speaker 1: your perspective, what's going on down there? So you have
Speaker 1: people that probably have a bunch of psychological issues. Maybe
Speaker 1: they're prone to delusions, they're prone to believing things in
Speaker 1: spite of evidence, and that's what got them to this point.
Speaker 1: And this is fanciful. It's fun for them. They're probably
Speaker 1: enjoying it. But it doesn't shock me to hear the
Speaker 1: things that Will is talking about. I mean, there are families,
Speaker 1: and I get emails from these families once in a while,
Speaker 1: you know, the sun disappeared, or you know, one family
Speaker 1: member you know, got into a conspiracy theory. Now they
Speaker 1: can't even talk to the person. And there isn't much
Speaker 1: I can say to these families other than I'm not
Speaker 1: that kind of doctor. I mean, there's nothing I can
Speaker 1: do for this sort of stuff. And I sympathize and
Speaker 1: empathize with them, but um, there isn't much you can do.
Speaker 1: What makes people predisposed to believe conspiracy theories in the
Speaker 1: first place? Why why do they go and seek them out? Well,
Speaker 1: the answer is going to be a little bit unsatisfying,
Speaker 1: but this is where we are, and that is that
Speaker 1: some people, more than others, have a worldview in which,
Speaker 1: you know, they go over to the window when they
Speaker 1: wake up in the morning, they look out and they
Speaker 1: see stuff and they say, oh, that must be caused
Speaker 1: by a conspiracy, you know, being driven by people who
Speaker 1: I already don't like. And the question becomes, well, where
Speaker 1: does that come from? And the answer is, we don't
Speaker 1: know yet. We just know that it exists, and we
Speaker 1: know that, Um, some people are just really prone to it.
Speaker 1: So it's not the beliefs themselves, it's not the ideas.
Speaker 1: It's that it's people that have a very thick set
Speaker 1: of lenses, so when they come into contact with these ideas,
Speaker 1: it's just easy for them to say, yeah, that must
Speaker 1: be true. You know, America, it's not a new thing
Speaker 1: to believe in conspiracy theories. It's not a new thing
Speaker 1: to have perhaps a warped sense of reality. We are
Speaker 1: the country that gave you the Salem witch Trials, were
Speaker 1: always looking for weird ways of which to perceive what's
Speaker 1: happening around us. Um, how serious is the situation we're
Speaker 1: living in now? Is this is this an aberration? Is
Speaker 1: this is this something that social media has one created
Speaker 1: or two is just reflecting what's already been happening out there,
Speaker 1: and we're blown it into Uh, we're it's it's overblown
Speaker 1: our perspective on it. Yeah, you know, I mean, look,
Speaker 1: as you said, I mean, conspiracy theories have been with
Speaker 1: us throughout American history, as going back to the witch Trials.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's really rich history of it's sort of
Speaker 1: each kind of big pivot moment in the United States
Speaker 1: of a conspiracy theory is really abounding. Um. At the
Speaker 1: same time, I think what's unique about the moment we're
Speaker 1: in is number one. Uh, social media, as you mentioned,
Speaker 1: which I think helps people with this kind of conspiratorial
Speaker 1: mindset connect with one another. The way I think of
Speaker 1: it is if you think of like the Kennedy assassination,
Speaker 1: in order to find, like I did, people, you would
Speaker 1: have to maybe print a zine, sent letters, go to
Speaker 1: a convention, stuff like that, and then everyone on your
Speaker 1: block would be saying like you're a nut or whatever. Um.
Speaker 1: Whereas now these people can just go online and and
Speaker 1: find like minded people, reinforce their beliefs, and find new
Speaker 1: recruits really really easily. Uh. The other thing I would
Speaker 1: say is we've at least I think in modern history,
Speaker 1: we haven't seen this kind of conspiratorial thinking embraced by
Speaker 1: so many politicians, to the point where we have members
Speaker 1: of Congress who believe in Q and on and have
Speaker 1: supported it. Recently, Donald Trump is posting really explicit pro
Speaker 1: q and on videos. So in that way, I think
Speaker 1: it really helps mainstream these conspiracy theories in a way
Speaker 1: that we haven't had before. I love thinking that in
Speaker 1: the old days, you at least had to learn how
Speaker 1: to produce a zine, Like there's something to the stereotype
Speaker 1: of like, well you had to cut out letters and
Speaker 1: you actually had to build a board and connect it
Speaker 1: with straightened here and there, and it's like no, literally,
Speaker 1: there's a certain buy in that that buys you. Now
Speaker 1: you can do that's all online. You don't even have
Speaker 1: to go to hobby lobby to buy the ship. You
Speaker 1: can do it on internet. The buy and it's so low. Uh, Joe,
Speaker 1: I wonder where do you see the threat level of
Speaker 1: something like this. It's it's it's with politicians. So to me,
Speaker 1: I don't think people have changed all that much over time.
Speaker 1: If anything, we're believing conspiracy theories as much as we
Speaker 1: did ten twenty thirty years ago. Um, what's different now
Speaker 1: is not just Trump, but particularly Trump and other people
Speaker 1: who want to do what Trump has done. So when
Speaker 1: you have people who can act on conspiracy theories with
Speaker 1: a monopoly of authoritative force, when you have people who
Speaker 1: already have large audiences because they're politicians transmitting these things, um,
Speaker 1: that's going to reach a lot of people, and it's
Speaker 1: going to influence a lot of people. Like any of
Speaker 1: us could go on to social media and spurred out
Speaker 1: whatever stupid conspiracy theory we want doesn't mean anyone's gonna
Speaker 1: pay attention, right, It doesn't mean anyone's gonna care or
Speaker 1: even look at it. But if Trump doesn't, that's a
Speaker 1: very different ballgame, right. And when you have people who
Speaker 1: have political power engaging in this, that's incredibly dangerous. And
Speaker 1: if you look back through history the times where we have,
Speaker 1: you know, the worst episodes of conspiracy theorizing, it's usually
Speaker 1: because of politicians getting involved in acting on it in
Speaker 1: some way. Is it possible to put these ideas back
Speaker 1: in the box? Can you roll this back? You know,
Speaker 1: I recently was out talking to people about you know,
Speaker 1: the election and election deniers, and so much is based
Speaker 1: on this idea of as soon as you have doubt
Speaker 1: and you see it through a lens of doubt and
Speaker 1: mistrust everywhere, it almost doesn't matter what's going to happen
Speaker 1: in the next election, you're going to see it. It's
Speaker 1: going to be there. Are we already hardwired these brains
Speaker 1: to see and distrust so many things that there will
Speaker 1: not be a turning back that even though somebody like
Speaker 1: Donald Trump might wield so much power and be able
Speaker 1: to direct it in certain ways, that we've sort of
Speaker 1: already infected a generation with this mindset. Well, there's already
Speaker 1: people who who think that no matter what. Right after
Speaker 1: any election, there's about pent of the country who think
Speaker 1: it was rigged. Why because they lost? Right, So as
Speaker 1: in politics is and sports, who complains after the football game?
Speaker 1: Now it's the losing team, right, So that's sort of
Speaker 1: normal after every election. What's abnormal right now is that
Speaker 1: you have the losing candidates saying it was rigged. I
Speaker 1: was cheated, and going on and on and on about it,
Speaker 1: and pulling in the whole of the conservative media and
Speaker 1: lots of allies in Congress. So now you have sort
Speaker 1: of a full court press of people saying it's rigged,
Speaker 1: it's rigged, it's rigged. So that's why you have between
Speaker 1: sixty eight of Republicans saying was rigged against them, rather
Speaker 1: than the normal that might have otherwise said it was
Speaker 1: rigged just for the fact that they lost. How close
Speaker 1: are we to having six year and eight percent of
Speaker 1: the GOP believe JFK Jr. Is coming back? Is that
Speaker 1: is that weeks or months away? I think that would
Speaker 1: be a tougher one to pull off. I mean, Trump
Speaker 1: has a lot of influence, so if he got behind
Speaker 1: a conspiracy theory repeatedly for a long period of time,
Speaker 1: he could make people buy in. And if it's something
Speaker 1: like election fraud, he can pull that off because those
Speaker 1: ideas are always around. But sometimes you'll come out with
Speaker 1: conspiracy theories that just don't influence anyone. I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: not aware of a lot of Ted Cruz, Dad Kill JFK.
Speaker 1: Truthers out there, even though he pushed that, you know,
Speaker 1: six or seven years ago. I mean, it just didn't
Speaker 1: take off. But I think if you go after ideas
Speaker 1: that people are sort of already inclined towards, I mean,
Speaker 1: he can do a lot of damage that way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I think we are all inclined to the
Speaker 1: idea of wanting Aaliyah to be back in our lives again.
Speaker 1: We want another classic album, We want that redemption. I
Speaker 1: think that's on the cosp if if he if he
Speaker 1: even nudges us in that direction, I think we all
Speaker 1: buy tickets immediately to the next concert, whether or not
Speaker 1: she appears or not. I mean, we think that Q
Speaker 1: and On stuff is wacky and crazy and where do
Speaker 1: people come up with these ideas? But I mean, we
Speaker 1: lived through the eighties I mean there was massive Satanic
Speaker 1: panics during that time. Satan was everywhere, and even Oliver
Speaker 1: Stone's JFK movie, which was, you know, a popular movie,
Speaker 1: was about the pedophile deep state going after the president
Speaker 1: the United States. I mean, Joe Pesci played the defrac
Speaker 1: pedophile priest. So even the basic idea behind Q and
Speaker 1: on is not new. I mean, all of this stuff
Speaker 1: is recycled and rehashed, and it's largely the same people
Speaker 1: believing the same stuff, sort of a choose your own
Speaker 1: adventure mad lived book that they're that that they're just
Speaker 1: replaying over and over again. I think Q and On
Speaker 1: has a political valance to it as well. Do you
Speaker 1: look at the pictures in January six, the people, all
Speaker 1: the people who were there who were convinced that this
Speaker 1: was going to be kind of this big, like kind
Speaker 1: of fascist moment where the dreams were gonna come true. Um,
Speaker 1: And certainly, I mean think it's unique in that it
Speaker 1: has achieved such mainstream prevalence within the Republican Party. I mean,
Speaker 1: we're talking about election denial stuff like that. And in
Speaker 1: many ways, I think Q and On is kind of
Speaker 1: an easy thing to talk about because you can kind
Speaker 1: of get a handle on it. It's people holding cues
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. But a lot of these ideas
Speaker 1: that are core to Q and on have become are
Speaker 1: kind of swirling around the GOP and have become much
Speaker 1: more successful without the Q label attached. So we think about,
Speaker 1: for example, this idea that you know, talking about gay
Speaker 1: people existing in a school is part of a pedophile
Speaker 1: groomer plot. And so we can see these things really
Speaker 1: being weaponized into policy in uh, you know, I think
Speaker 1: a really ominous way. I want to talk about how
Speaker 1: this is covered. What you know, obviously there are elements
Speaker 1: of conspiracy theories that belong in the news that become news.
Speaker 1: Um what think the role of roles should be for
Speaker 1: journalists and coming some of these fringe beliefs. Is it
Speaker 1: giving too much air uh to to to follow some
Speaker 1: of these JFK JR ideas uh and and put them
Speaker 1: up on a pedestal so people can see those ideas
Speaker 1: and have that air out or or what you're talking
Speaker 1: about right now? Because this is affecting our culture, do
Speaker 1: they need to be more vigilant and bring this to
Speaker 1: the forefront so we can engage with them, we can
Speaker 1: knock them down or at least be aware that they're
Speaker 1: out there. Sure. I mean I think it's a complicated
Speaker 1: one for me. You know, you certainly don't want to
Speaker 1: just go find a couple of nuts online and say like, oh,
Speaker 1: these guys are so crazy. For me, it's when it
Speaker 1: starts crossing over into the real world. I mean, we've
Speaker 1: had q and On believers murdering people. We had a
Speaker 1: Q and On guy murder his wife in Q and
Speaker 1: On guy shut down a bridge near the Hoover Damn,
Speaker 1: he had a bunch of guns. That was at the
Speaker 1: point where I was like, this is not just an
Speaker 1: online thing anymore. This is something where I have to
Speaker 1: trust my readers enough, both as an audience and as
Speaker 1: you know, citizens, that they deserve to know what's going
Speaker 1: on in the world. And you know, I do think
Speaker 1: that idea of amplication is a relevant one. But at
Speaker 1: the point where you have Donald Trump saying like check
Speaker 1: out this que stuff, you know, I I think the
Speaker 1: cow is out of the barn. And I would add,
Speaker 1: in the case of JFK Jr, I mean one of
Speaker 1: these maybe he's kind of the evil JFK Jr impersonator.
Speaker 1: There's another guy who's put together a coalition that is
Speaker 1: going that has people running to control elections in battleground states.
Speaker 1: Who's the JFK jior imprisonator. They're the Republican nominee. So really,
Speaker 1: I mean, this is stuff that is going to have really,
Speaker 1: I think, really concrete impact on our lives. Unfortunately, that
Speaker 1: was one of the details when I talked to the
Speaker 1: Jamatria woman. You know what, what the talk of the
Speaker 1: rally at that point was not that this was just
Speaker 1: a person who believed this wild thing, but there was
Speaker 1: a person who was in Dallas who had a strong
Speaker 1: following in places like telegram Um, and the talk was
Speaker 1: that they had a relationship with the Trump campaign, that
Speaker 1: a lot of these people from Negative forty eight were
Speaker 1: also uh setting up chairs, uh and in you know,
Speaker 1: the fact that they would show up and try to
Speaker 1: help the campaign get set up at the rallies, they
Speaker 1: would get certain v I P passes. And this is
Speaker 1: not just a fringe thing that exists outside some of
Speaker 1: the campaigns in some ways that also working and coordinating
Speaker 1: within them. It's it's becoming folded into it. There is
Speaker 1: sort of this tension with the Trump campaign where they
Speaker 1: seem to see these people as what they are, which
Speaker 1: is huge Trump super fans, and Trump is kind of
Speaker 1: constantly signaling Q and On believers, But at the same
Speaker 1: time they don't want the average person to see a
Speaker 1: bunch of Q stuff at the rallies. So we see
Speaker 1: the negative forty eight people doing the Q and ON
Speaker 1: symbols and stuff at the rallies, and they're being told,
Speaker 1: you know, don't do that, what have you. But there's
Speaker 1: kind of this pull, this back and forth, and Trump
Speaker 1: doesn't understand it. It's so complicated, it's it's so above him.
Speaker 1: There was some Onion headline that I think nailed it
Speaker 1: that was essentially Trump half asking his support of Q
Speaker 1: and like, yeah, I guess the Democrats eat babies or
Speaker 1: whatever the hell it is. You guys think like you
Speaker 1: can you can feel it, like I if this makes
Speaker 1: you like me more sure, But I can't even begin
Speaker 1: to wrap my head around what you guys think is
Speaker 1: going on. Joe, I wonder what you think the proper
Speaker 1: response from the media would be in covering these types
Speaker 1: of stories. That's a really tough question. I'll I'll tell
Speaker 1: you what. I started studying the topic about fifteen years ago.
Speaker 1: There was barely any coverage of conspiracy theories in the
Speaker 1: mainstream news. So I started a Google alert back then,
Speaker 1: so every night I would get all the articles that
Speaker 1: had the term conspiracy theory in it. And back then
Speaker 1: I was getting four or five articles a day and
Speaker 1: none on the weekends. And at the end of twenty
Speaker 1: fifteen that had jumped to a hundred a day every day,
Speaker 1: and just just this is anecdotal, but just for myself,
Speaker 1: I think I took close to three hundred interviews in alone,
Speaker 1: so almost every journalist was calling me when they were
Speaker 1: writing about it, and they were all writing it about
Speaker 1: it quite a bit. And then I think what happened
Speaker 1: shortly after six is that a lot of major news
Speaker 1: outlets started getting their own misinformation conspiracy theory social media newsdesk,
Speaker 1: so they now have dedicated reporters just just covering this topic.
Speaker 1: So it's going to continue to get a lot of attention.
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, what the what the effect
Speaker 1: of the coverage is. I mean, I think that some
Speaker 1: things went wrong in twenty I think there were a
Speaker 1: lot of journalists that had sort of a panic over
Speaker 1: CONSI RC theories of misinformation, and the headlines sort of
Speaker 1: gotten to their own echo chamber, was like Q was
Speaker 1: taking over the world and it's the biggest thing ever.
Speaker 1: And you know, as I was pulling on it, I
Speaker 1: was like, I'm just not getting these these massive numbers.
Speaker 1: It's there, it exists, and they have a presence online. Um.
Speaker 1: But I think Will was one of the few people
Speaker 1: who was in journalism who was saying, you know, maybe
Speaker 1: it's not as big as some of the fantastic headlines
Speaker 1: are saying it is. So I I think in some ways,
Speaker 1: you know, some of the sensationalistic report and got ahead
Speaker 1: of itself. We'll be right back. Will give us a
Speaker 1: little perspective. You're not only on the que and on
Speaker 1: movement as to where it is now, but even looking
Speaker 1: at something like this JFK JR theory, the negative forty
Speaker 1: eight group, you know, how big is it actually and
Speaker 1: how much of an effect doesn't have on the conversation. Yeah. Sure,
Speaker 1: So I've actually got I've got some polls right in
Speaker 1: front of me for for just this moment um. So yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: So and now these polls are a little out of date,
Speaker 1: and Joe does some great polling on this, and I
Speaker 1: think he has newer numbers so, but the difficulty of
Speaker 1: nailing down Q and on belief is there's a couple
Speaker 1: of things. Number One, a lot of times people are
Speaker 1: gonna say they may believe some of the tenets of it,
Speaker 1: but they're not like on the forum saying you know
Speaker 1: where we go and we go all stuff like that.
Speaker 1: At the same time, we have to realize that at
Speaker 1: the end of Cute basically told the fans the brand
Speaker 1: had become too damaged and to stop to saying Q
Speaker 1: Q Q and just to sort of use the talking points.
Speaker 1: And so there is going to be an amount I
Speaker 1: think of people who are kind of downplaying it. There's
Speaker 1: a March poll five thousand people that's found that fifteen
Speaker 1: percent of them believe Satan. Satan worshiping pedophiles run a
Speaker 1: global child sex operation. We got two thousand people in
Speaker 1: January one that found fifteen percent believe that Trump was
Speaker 1: at war with these Hollywood pedophiles. And now when you
Speaker 1: started asking about Q and on the numbers get a
Speaker 1: little lower. You're talking to think three to seven percent.
Speaker 1: Still we're talking about millions of people. That's more popular
Speaker 1: in some religions, uh in the United States. So you
Speaker 1: know it don't ship on the Quakers. Why do you
Speaker 1: gotta ship on the Quakers. I know what you're getting
Speaker 1: at there. I can read between the lines. They're a good,
Speaker 1: peaceful group of people. Stop shifting on the Quakers. Don't
Speaker 1: come on my podcast and make all this anti Quaker attacks.
Speaker 1: I know they had a hard time getting people into
Speaker 1: the whatever they call it, community room, but they're working
Speaker 1: hard on this. Okay, exactly, retinue believe the Quakers out
Speaker 1: of your mouth, just getting wrecked by Q and on here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're they're getting blown out. So so yeah, when we
Speaker 1: start talking about that at the same time, I mean
Speaker 1: the JFK JR people are kind of a faction of that.
Speaker 1: And then we get down to the negative forty eight group,
Speaker 1: which is smaller than that, so I would say negative
Speaker 1: forty eight. I think UM has tens of thousands of
Speaker 1: telegram subscribers. I think when we think about hardcore fans,
Speaker 1: we're probably talking a couple of thousands. Mhm uh. It's
Speaker 1: actually interesting to see, Joe, where do you see they're
Speaker 1: the hardcore fans, the people who show up at the events,
Speaker 1: who are posting most of that information. But there's that
Speaker 1: secondary element too, of when it just becomes a brand.
Speaker 1: I go to some of these events and I see
Speaker 1: people where in cue paraphernalia, queues back and there's cup everywhere. Yes,
Speaker 1: the online conspiracy following a mysterious character known as Q
Speaker 1: was more popular than ever. Is that a cue? Are
Speaker 1: you a cute supporter? Some people I taught you, they're
Speaker 1: worry that just because they understand that it's a it's
Speaker 1: trolling behavior, that it's a brand that they can put
Speaker 1: on their body. It's going to piss off the media,
Speaker 1: it's going to get attention from the people they want
Speaker 1: to get attention with. And they may not even know
Speaker 1: the tenets of what Q is, but they do know
Speaker 1: that it's something that they support in theory because in
Speaker 1: their mind the support is just trolling. Is that dangerous?
Speaker 1: Is that sort of a is it? Is it the
Speaker 1: evolution of a conspiracy theory that when it just becomes
Speaker 1: pepsi that we're we're in for a world to hurt?
Speaker 1: Where do you see that? Well, we're sort of calling
Speaker 1: everything Q and on now right? And and if you
Speaker 1: go back to the idea that Q and On adopted
Speaker 1: a lot of ideas that pre existed. Q and On
Speaker 1: then it's not quite as disturbing. So between more recently,
Speaker 1: we're depending on how you ask the question. If you
Speaker 1: if you're just doing direct questions, are you a believer
Speaker 1: in Q and On? Do you follow Q and On?
Speaker 1: We're getting between five and twelve, which makes it one
Speaker 1: of the least believed and followed things that I pull on.
Speaker 1: I mean to put that in perspective, and we just say,
Speaker 1: do you think there was a conspiracy to kill Kennedy
Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty three? We're getting between fifty and six.
Speaker 1: So Q and On isn't isn't all that huge? But
Speaker 1: when will is exactly right? When we ask on these
Speaker 1: more general ideas, like our teachers grooming kids to become
Speaker 1: trans are there satanic cults doing massive Satanic rituals across
Speaker 1: the country, are elites running sex trafficking rings? Um, we're
Speaker 1: getting between twenty and thirty five. Now, I wouldn't call
Speaker 1: those ideas Q ideas. I mean Q and On adopts them,
Speaker 1: but they could have existed decades ago. And some of
Speaker 1: those ideas sort of have their origin that thousands of
Speaker 1: years ago. Um, So they've been around and I just
Speaker 1: don't want to attribute them to Q, because then it
Speaker 1: says like, oh, this guy was able to convince thirty
Speaker 1: of the country that elites are running sex trafficking rings,
Speaker 1: when in fact those ideas you know, might have been
Speaker 1: around well before that. It's just we weren't paying attention.
Speaker 1: You know, even back during the Satanic Panic of the eighties,
Speaker 1: there were very few poles taken of how many people
Speaker 1: were buying in to this idea of Satanic cults running around.
Speaker 1: And I've only found one pole and it was of Texas,
Speaker 1: So you have to you have to keep that in mind.
Speaker 1: But it was of people at the end of the
Speaker 1: eighties thought that, you know, one of the major problems
Speaker 1: in the country was Satanic cults going around abusing people.
Speaker 1: So I don't know how well that might have been
Speaker 1: believed in you know, some other state um at the time.
Speaker 1: But but right now we're trying to poll on all
Speaker 1: these things, and it's just we don't have good comparisons
Speaker 1: to the past. You know. One thing I would note
Speaker 1: there is that there's something unique about out Q and
Speaker 1: on in comparison to some of these other conspiracy theories.
Speaker 1: If you're talking about, uh, like the thing of the
Speaker 1: Kennedy assassination, was it was it was a conspiracy theory
Speaker 1: or the moon landing was fake. Well, there's kind of
Speaker 1: not a lot you can personally do about it. In
Speaker 1: the case of Q and on, there's kind of this
Speaker 1: there's sort of a fascist utopia at the core of it,
Speaker 1: and that there are places that we are going to
Speaker 1: go terrorize these satanic pedophiles. So there is kind of
Speaker 1: like a way that people can participate about in it
Speaker 1: that I think it makes it more dangerous than you know,
Speaker 1: believing that again the moon landing was fake or something
Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, I mean, it's a game. There's a
Speaker 1: group identity, right, So a lot of people believe Kennedy
Speaker 1: was killed by a conspiracy, but they're not friends. They
Speaker 1: don't consider themselves to be part of a group or
Speaker 1: a movement, right. But Q and on a lot of
Speaker 1: those people do like they are doing something together. They're
Speaker 1: following along, they're solving the clues, they're expecting an outcome
Speaker 1: in a shared way. And that's something that most conspiracy
Speaker 1: theories don't really have. And that's why Q and on
Speaker 1: has always been very hard to define, right, because it's
Speaker 1: sort of cult dish but not really a cult it's
Speaker 1: a group, but sort of decentralized. Um. It's got a
Speaker 1: lot of conspiracy theories in it, so it's not just
Speaker 1: a conspiracy theory, and it's got sort of activities that
Speaker 1: people can do to sort of be a part of
Speaker 1: it and play along that other conspiracy theories just don't have.
Speaker 1: I do love thinking of it like activities. It's like,
Speaker 1: we get to get together, we get to solve white
Speaker 1: Tom Anks is drinking baby blood. It's it's like just
Speaker 1: a bunch of little Encyclopedia Browns running around America. It's
Speaker 1: funny you say that. I mean, they had a rally
Speaker 1: in d C and they said, you know, we're going
Speaker 1: to kind of go on this excursion if you're interested
Speaker 1: to go protests a common ping pong. So they have
Speaker 1: the whole itineraries well before I let you go. Part
Speaker 1: of the reason this podcast is one for me to
Speaker 1: wrap my head around some of the stuff that I'm
Speaker 1: seeing out there on the road. But to help me
Speaker 1: what am I going to see out there on the
Speaker 1: road a couple of months from now. One in regards
Speaker 1: to the JFK Junior conspiracy, how does that morph? And too?
Speaker 1: Am I going to get a new Robin Williams movie.
Speaker 1: Out of all this, Uh yeah, you know, I I
Speaker 1: think the JFK Junior stuff is going to continue. I
Speaker 1: mean I saw and in particular, I think if Trump
Speaker 1: keeps engaging more with Q and on, I think we're
Speaker 1: gonna see more people getting into Q and on and
Speaker 1: kind of see some fresh energy behind that. Um. I
Speaker 1: once went to the kind of the Trumpian July fourth event,
Speaker 1: and all these women at the Trump Hotel were wearing
Speaker 1: like JFK J in your shirts and this lady had
Speaker 1: a JFK J in your mask on her face and
Speaker 1: I said to her, uh, you know what's that about?
Speaker 1: And she goes, He's alive and she kind of flipped
Speaker 1: flitters away. So I mean, I don't think that energy
Speaker 1: is going anywhere. UM. And you know, I think we
Speaker 1: get we get new conspiracy theories all the time, and
Speaker 1: so I think, you know, you got the big one.
Speaker 1: I I'm seeing a lot of movement on this idea
Speaker 1: that the elites want to make us all eat bugs.
Speaker 1: Jordan's so like you, you might want to be on
Speaker 1: the lookout for that. I think there's gonna be a
Speaker 1: lot of like what they say is I will not
Speaker 1: eat the bugs. And so I think you might get
Speaker 1: someone you know a cost to you about that. So,
Speaker 1: so don't don't make do it. I hate this. I
Speaker 1: hate this job so much. Dear Lord, dear Lord Jordan,
Speaker 1: you might want to be on the lookout. I guess
Speaker 1: there's this thing about elite trying to make you eat bugs.
Speaker 1: Bug ghazzi, is that what it is? It's uh, Joe,
Speaker 1: what do I have to look out for? So worse
Speaker 1: than that, I think the same reporter who was writing
Speaker 1: about the bug eating was also writing about forced anal swabbing.
Speaker 1: It's not just about testing for COVID, it's about humiliating
Speaker 1: you in public. So if you walk down the street
Speaker 1: and they have like a government tent set up where
Speaker 1: they're sticking people with Q tips up the ass, that's
Speaker 1: gonna be. Um, that's gonna be something come true, somebody's
Speaker 1: dark dream apparently. So this is how I'm writing it
Speaker 1: down right now. I need to be aware of bug
Speaker 1: Ghazzi and bum Ghazzi. There they're on the horizon. Uh,
Speaker 1: thank you, gentlemen. Well, well Joe, thanks for coming on
Speaker 1: the podcast. Um, I'm gonna go down to a trump
Speaker 1: rail A and a few do you guys want to
Speaker 1: come along? Is that it might be a little intense
Speaker 1: for me. Bear enough, Bear enough. We'll thank you guys
Speaker 1: for joining me and helped me figure this conspiracy. Thanks
Speaker 1: for having Thank you. Listen to Jordan clapper Fingers The
Speaker 1: Conspiracy on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. This has been a Comedy
Speaker 1: Central podcast.