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Speaker 1: This is Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty. Hi, everyone,

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Speaker 1: welcome to another episode of Let's Be Clear with Shannon Doherty.

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Speaker 1: And I have a very special surprise for everyone, which

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Speaker 1: is the lovely Kevin Smith.

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Speaker 2: This episode is Let's be Marats.

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Speaker 1: Let's be Marats.

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Speaker 2: How are you?

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Speaker 3: I'm good?

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Speaker 2: Let me paint the picture for the kids at home.

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Speaker 2: Like you know, I've been around now I've been doing

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Speaker 2: this is a January of twenty twenty four marks thirty

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Speaker 2: years that I have been in the business, So thirty

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Speaker 2: years from the moment Clerks played at Sundance. Look, it

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Speaker 2: only took me forty five seconds to say Clerks, I

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Speaker 2: have been around. That's I only say that just so

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Speaker 2: I can tell you like I have experience not just

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Speaker 2: this business, but in this town and specifically in the

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Speaker 2: dwellings of those who work within our industry. That is

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Speaker 2: to say, I have been in some really nice houses

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Speaker 2: in my day. This is a staggering palace to oneself,

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Speaker 2: a shrine to the hard work put in by a

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Speaker 2: little girl who I remember seeing in Ron Howard's movie

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Speaker 2: Night Shift. Mugger.

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Speaker 3: Mugger.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, from the little girl who worked with Wilford Brimley.

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Speaker 4: If Wilford Brimley could see where you how you live,

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Speaker 4: oh my god, he would be like, I should ask

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Speaker 4: for a lot more money from them diabetes commercials or

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Speaker 4: or whatever it was.

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Speaker 2: That's right. This place is staggering. This is just go.

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Speaker 2: Are you allowed to curse on your product? Fucking gorgeous?

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Speaker 2: You should see this kitchen. You might see it behind

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Speaker 2: her and you're not. It's not even doing a justice.

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Speaker 2: I pulled in and I was like, holy shit, this

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Speaker 2: is what I need to know. Is this nine O

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Speaker 2: two one oh money or charmed money? Because I know

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Speaker 2: it as.

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Speaker 3: Money it was.

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Speaker 4: If this was Marat's money, I too would live in

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Speaker 4: the taj Mahal. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I think this was charmed money.

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Speaker 2: This charm money.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a combination of nine two and oh

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Speaker 3: and charmed money.

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Speaker 2: Let's talk about that, because you like had a show

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Speaker 2: two shows in an era when like residuals were like

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Speaker 2: a thing.

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Speaker 1: No, when residuals were terrible even they were bad then,

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Speaker 1: because yeah terrible now yeah, so nine O two and

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Speaker 1: oh it wasn't like a full fledged.

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Speaker 3: Network yet Fox.

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Speaker 2: It was the beginning.

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Speaker 1: It was the beginning. So our residuals were always extremely low.

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Speaker 1: I mean, now I think it's like, you know, for

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Speaker 1: an entire season, they'll send me a residual for like

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Speaker 1: seventeen dollars. Are you kidding?

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Speaker 2: That's that's what happened to nine oh two and oh kids.

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Speaker 2: I was there for nine oh two and oh. I

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Speaker 2: watched nine oh two one oh in quick stop behind

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Speaker 2: the counter before we made Clerks, while we were making

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Speaker 2: clerks and whatnot, so much so that when I make

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Speaker 2: my second movie and Shannon's in it, like that was

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Speaker 2: an absolute sign that I'd made it. Like I watched

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Speaker 2: this person like a year ago, I was watching you

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Speaker 2: on TV at my job, and a year later my

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Speaker 2: job was to hang out with you in a fucking mall.

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Speaker 2: I was like, this rules so that I was there

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Speaker 2: when that show broke and to say, to try to

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Speaker 2: explain to people how big that phenomenon is, you would

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Speaker 2: have to point to like the Swifties and shit like

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Speaker 2: that at this point, and maybe people are you're over

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Speaker 2: saying it bullshit. This nine O two one oh was

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Speaker 2: like literally everywhere, and Shannon was like everywhere as well.

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Speaker 2: They hunted you, they did like constantly, Like Shannon was

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Speaker 2: in every piece of media. If there was an internet,

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Speaker 2: you would have broken it multiple times. Yeah, I'm not

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Speaker 2: even speaking out of school. You could probably go on

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Speaker 2: the internet and fucking go back and see. But Shannon

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Speaker 2: was like the first person like the proto influencer, but

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Speaker 2: wasn't an influencer. She actually is an actress and had

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Speaker 2: a career and shood. But the person that they focused

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Speaker 2: on your personal life almost more than your performances.

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Speaker 1: Not even almost one hundred percent, focused more on my

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Speaker 1: personal life than and look, you know, to be fair,

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Speaker 1: I gave them a lot to focus on.

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Speaker 2: Was also fun back in those days. And as much

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Speaker 2: as headline after headline was like Doherty punches out motherfucker

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Speaker 2: with camera Doherty and Judd Nelson and that was like

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Speaker 2: a dream pairing because it's like, oh my god, the

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Speaker 2: girl from Heather's and the boy from Breakfast Club, like

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Speaker 2: just as an outsider from that, from that world and

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Speaker 2: then entering the world and working with you as a

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Speaker 2: good temporary was just so like that. That to me

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Speaker 2: was the first syndication like, oh my god, I've I've

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Speaker 2: made it. My question is this and we'll get back

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Speaker 2: to this fucking majestic estate that apparently Charmed pay for it,

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Speaker 2: So it wasn't Charmed residuals. It was like the Charmed

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Speaker 2: per episode.

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Speaker 1: It was I mean, listen, it was a combination of

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Speaker 1: stuff because.

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Speaker 2: There were residuals on Charms.

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Speaker 3: Yes, that's where the money profit participation.

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Speaker 2: So is that does that still exist? Yeah? So whenever

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Speaker 2: they sell Charm you get a piece. Yes, you're lucky.

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Speaker 3: Yeah yeah.

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Speaker 2: So wait, how deep is that you attached to every

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Speaker 2: season of Charmed or just the ones you're in.

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Speaker 1: Supposed to be every season, so that you definitely got.

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Speaker 2: Paid for the ones you're oh for sure, and they

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Speaker 2: sold that fucker everywhere.

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Speaker 1: And it continues to like you know, the thing about Charmed.

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Speaker 1: It's what's interesting is that I think, uh, if you

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Speaker 1: if you put them together right in the same time frame,

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Speaker 1: I think nine was still the bigger show.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, I would agree with that. Charm definitely had

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Speaker 2: a charm well, and it also seems like it's had

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Speaker 2: a longer shelf life. Maybe I'm wrong.

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Speaker 1: Our I think our fans are probably the most loyal,

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Speaker 1: dedicated Sam.

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Speaker 2: You know number one is right. So here I follow

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Speaker 2: you from like your early career like up till mal

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Speaker 2: Rats and then I'm busy making movies. But the guy

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Speaker 2: who's not as busy making movies and there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of time to watch TV and has literally watched Charmed

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Speaker 2: No Bullshit from fucking season one to the end and

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Speaker 2: then starts again and loops back no less than twenty

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Speaker 2: five times the course of the last ten years A

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Speaker 2: long Jason mues.

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Speaker 1: Are you serious.

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Speaker 2: Such a fucking man, I'm not overstating it. By being

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Speaker 2: in front of you. You could go listen to him

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Speaker 2: talk anywhere in public. He doesn't know the Smith's song

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Speaker 2: how soon is now? He just knows the theme Charmed,

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Speaker 2: so when it comes on, He's like, fucking charm bitch,

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, well, yes, but it pre exists Charmed

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Speaker 2: as well. But he like lived and still to this day. Now,

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Speaker 2: you you lived in a maybe twenty four to forty

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Speaker 2: eight hour news cycle. If you did something at fucking

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Speaker 2: the China Club or whatever fuck or what was that place,

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Speaker 2: the formosa, you had about twenty four hours forty eight

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Speaker 2: hours for the rest of the world might find out

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Speaker 2: you lived in a pre TMZ world. Yes, who covered you?

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Speaker 2: Who was your nemesis? Who was the outfit?

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Speaker 3: The National Inquirer that was the one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so wild because they don't I mean, correct me

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Speaker 2: if I'm wrong. I don't want to pick any fights.

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Speaker 2: But they just don't seem to have a presence or

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Speaker 2: an existence now like they used to.

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Speaker 1: Right, they used to be huge. They were like it

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Speaker 1: was Star magazine and National Acquirer.

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Speaker 2: So they were the predators. They were the ones where

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Speaker 2: it's just like, get me a fucking photograph of her

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Speaker 2: punching you, and holy shit, will run it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: But the great thing about that time, to a certain degree,

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Speaker 1: was that you were able to sort of say to yourself,

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Speaker 1: you know, okay, great, so fine, it's in the press,

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Speaker 1: and that sucks. It's in a newspaper, but that newspaper

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Speaker 1: you knew was going to be, you know, lining a

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Speaker 1: cat litter box and forgotten. Now you google my name

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Speaker 1: and it all lives there forever.

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Speaker 2: At this point is any of it? Are you ever? Like, well,

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Speaker 2: I'm fucking glad because it adds to the mythology. No,

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Speaker 2: you were like you were like, if I go back

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Speaker 2: in time out of race, yeah shit, would you?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: I would?

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Speaker 4: You know?

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Speaker 2: Like that's to me as part of like the DNA

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Speaker 2: of who you are. You have the unpleasant, you know,

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Speaker 2: business of having to grow up in front of people,

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Speaker 2: like have an adolescence in front of the world and

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Speaker 2: do shit that everybody does, but like, fucking they put

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Speaker 2: a camera on it and they were like, how dare

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Speaker 2: she do it? And shit like that. But that being said,

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Speaker 2: at your DNA, at the core of your DNA has

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Speaker 2: always been a fighter. That's why when the cancer stuff

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Speaker 2: kicked in, I was like, naturally, like, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: my heart's breaking. But at the same time, I'm like,

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Speaker 2: anybody's gonna fucking fight it. It's fucking dodo is she?

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Speaker 2: She fought less and for less, like this is so

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Speaker 2: much more so, you know, I'm no doctor and shit.

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Speaker 2: But I was like, well, it may have met its match.

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Speaker 2: And having noted her as all as that, I hope.

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Speaker 2: So do you know how you how we even come

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Speaker 2: into each other's world? I do. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So it was after nine o two one zero and

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Speaker 1: my agent at the time, where were you?

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Speaker 3: What agency? It might have been? William Morris and.

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Speaker 2: Shannon couldn't be more famous kids at this point. Like, honestly,

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Speaker 2: Shannon was probably one of the most famous people in

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Speaker 2: the world period. She was absolutely hands down, I'm not

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Speaker 2: oversteading it because I'm in her fucking palace, one of

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Speaker 2: the most famous people in the world who was written.

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Speaker 3: About, who had to audition for you. Yes, I had

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Speaker 3: auditioned for you, like.

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Speaker 2: That was the whole I trust me.

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Speaker 1: They were like, you know, there's this movie, but you

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Speaker 1: have to audition, and I I was like, okay.

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Speaker 3: Let me read it.

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Speaker 1: And then I read it and they're like it's Kevin

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Speaker 1: Smith and he did Clerks and I'm like, okay, let

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Speaker 1: me watch that. And I was like, yeah, okay, I'll

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Speaker 1: audition and I did. And I remember that audition with

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Speaker 1: you because you guys did not give anybody auditioning from

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Speaker 1: my part easy material to audition with. No. It was

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Speaker 1: like the monologue and I was like, oh my god.

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Speaker 1: And I was the girl who I don't know if

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Speaker 1: you remember, I don't ever want to read off of,

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Speaker 1: you know, sides off of a piece of paper, so

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Speaker 1: I had to memorize it all.

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Speaker 2: But it was like a page long monelogue. She would

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Speaker 2: have to like memorize.

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Speaker 1: It was crazy, but I did it and you were like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's great, do it faster, and I was that was.

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Speaker 2: My direction to you for all of the mall rats for.

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Speaker 1: All of the mall rats, You're like faster, faster, faster

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Speaker 1: because you have.

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Speaker 2: The ability to write it tet like you could. The

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Speaker 2: original intention was kind of like, you know, I want

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Speaker 2: to make a John Hughes John Landis movie. But at

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Speaker 2: its root, Jim jacks the late Jim Jackson, who was

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Speaker 2: our producer, was like, you know, from the early draft,

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Speaker 2: it was like, it's kind of like a screwball comedy

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Speaker 2: as well. He's going he got that pace going on.

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Speaker 2: And Shannon was like the first professional that I worked

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Speaker 2: with who could ratitat the dialogue in a very Howard

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Speaker 2: Hawks his Girl Friday kind of way. And so if

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Speaker 2: you watch the elevator scene between her and like Jason

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Speaker 2: Lee where she's like, I'm a girl, damn it, it's

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Speaker 2: it's so it's so fucking fast.

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Speaker 1: The kids some of the absolute best dialogue. I always

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Speaker 1: say this when people.

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Speaker 3: As it is, but you some of.

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Speaker 1: The best dialogue I've ever gotten to say. And you

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Speaker 1: know what, you can be as humble as you want

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Speaker 1: right now.

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Speaker 2: You got to put it beneath the damn waters heather stuff.

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Speaker 1: For me personally, that was maybe it was the pace,

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Speaker 1: you know, but it was also just how you wrote

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Speaker 1: for Renee was so impressive to me because you're a

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Speaker 1: dude writing exactly what a girl was thinking.

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Speaker 2: The women, I was always kind of drawing to have

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Speaker 2: a very strong mother figure in my life, my mom literally,

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Speaker 2: so naturally, every like woman I gravitate toward is a pretty,

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Speaker 2: you know, a strong figure and very well spoken and

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Speaker 2: usually the smartest person in the room. So all that

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Speaker 2: went into the dna of like all the female characters

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Speaker 2: that I wrote, and when I wrote them at the time,

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Speaker 2: like people were like, oh, he can really write female characters.

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Speaker 2: I wrote a thing with my kid. I got a daughter,

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Speaker 2: Harley Quinn. She's like twenty four, and we had this

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Speaker 2: writing gig and we wrote the script together and in

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Speaker 2: it it's like two generations of characters, so there were

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Speaker 2: from the young people and older people, like so she

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Speaker 2: would have the voice of the youth and I definitely

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Speaker 2: have one of the other side. So you know, I

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Speaker 2: was waiting for the right one scene. I was like, fuck,

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Speaker 2: I'll take a crack at it. And so I wrote

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Speaker 2: the scene and I was like, hey, kiddo, I took

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Speaker 2: a run at the car scene with kids, like, let

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Speaker 2: me know what you think, and she wrote back, She's like, Dad, no, no,

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Speaker 2: twenty something talks like this. Oh. And I was like,

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Speaker 2: what are you talking about. I was like, I'm fucking

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Speaker 2: like the king of gen X dialogue, like literally, like

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Speaker 2: that's my bread and butter and fucking in the world.

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Speaker 2: And she was like, yes, dead in the nineties. And

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Speaker 2: it was like, I know, it was a dagger in

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Speaker 2: my fucking heart. I was like, but I was. She

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Speaker 2: wasn't wrong. I'm like, yeah, I guess I am in

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Speaker 2: my fucking fifties and that era. You know, I could

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Speaker 2: sell have a good ear for dialogue, but like being

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Speaker 2: the person who knows the voice of youth, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's like when I turn on Euphoria and get scared

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Speaker 2: because I'm like, oh, that's youth culture, right, I don't

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Speaker 2: it's you know, I don't understand teens anymore. So generally speaking,

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Speaker 2: when we go back in time, Shannon, we had the

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Speaker 2: merity to ask her to to audition.

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Speaker 3: That was Phillips twice.

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Speaker 1: You went in twice, I went, so, yeah, So I

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Speaker 1: auditioned and then and then.

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Speaker 5: One of the most famous people in the world whose

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Speaker 5: work we were like familiar with, like it wasn't like

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Speaker 5: I don't know what she's capable of, right the Shannon,

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Speaker 5: She's like, you know, we've seen her for a couple

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Speaker 5: of seasons on IO two.

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Speaker 2: No, she was in fucking others. She's been working for

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Speaker 2: a while. So it was like, we all know what

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Speaker 2: Shannon could do. Why they kept making you audition? And

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Speaker 2: I'm not trying to throw anyone under the bus, but

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Speaker 2: like you know me, I'm like, fucking, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: she's famous as cast. I mean like I've watched her

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Speaker 2: movies and she's legit. She wants to be in it.

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Speaker 2: Fuck like quick say yes. But for some reason they

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Speaker 2: were like Don Phillips is like all right, we're gonna

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Speaker 2: have her come back in and I'm like, why she's

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Speaker 2: the one?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I mean then also, by the way, like the Key

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Speaker 2: to a green Light on that movie as well, like

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Speaker 2: that movie, Yes, that movie was That's how And again

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Speaker 2: I'm not like blowing smoke of brass, but like that's

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Speaker 2: how fucking popular Shannon was. Universal was like, oh, Shannon

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Speaker 2: Door is interested, well, now you have a blinking green light.

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Speaker 2: That's what they literally said. I thought, like that's an

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Speaker 2: expression in Hollywood, and it was that nobody used it anymore,

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Speaker 2: but the idea is, like, you're halfway there. They wanted

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Speaker 2: one more like TV star. Later on, we were able

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Speaker 2: to convince him that Jeremy London, who had done one

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Speaker 2: season of a TV show called I'll Fly Away, which

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Speaker 2: was very critically acclaimed, had Sam Waterson in it, like

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Speaker 2: he's on a TV show. Look their ads and shit

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Speaker 2: like that, and they're like, hey, all right, there's two

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Speaker 2: TV people. Let's go. But Shannon was the one that

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Speaker 2: got them. You know that Shannon was the viagra for Universal,

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Speaker 2: for them to be like, oh, we're suddenly very interested

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Speaker 2: and it's only a matter of time before we closed steal.

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Speaker 1: By the way, that's that's literally all I want people

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Speaker 1: to say from now on.

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Speaker 3: Shannon was the biakra.

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Speaker 2: Like if that's.

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Speaker 1: Anyone ever like goes away with anything from this podcast,

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Speaker 1: it's exactly that right there.

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Speaker 3: So I did.

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Speaker 1: You guys did want me to come back for a

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Speaker 1: second audition, and you guys called it a pizza party,

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Speaker 1: which is something that.

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Speaker 2: Pizza party, which was a formality. You were getting the

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Speaker 2: part at that point.

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Speaker 1: And they told me I was getting the part, and

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Speaker 1: so the second audition wasn't really an audition.

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Speaker 2: Scandals story about the Pizza Party. So Pizza Party kids,

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Speaker 2: as Shannon was about to explain, and then I started

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Speaker 2: man explaining it for in her own fucking house, but guessed,

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Speaker 2: I am, but the Pizza Party was. Don Phillips was

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Speaker 2: our casting direct Yes, Don Phillips was super fucking well

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Speaker 2: known in the cast.

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Speaker 3: Like Fast Times at Richmond High.

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Speaker 2: The lady knows her, Yeah, Times Richmond High now cast it,

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Speaker 2: but single handedly discovered Sean Penn. Right then he cast

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Speaker 2: Richard link Later's Days and Confused and discovered you know,

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Speaker 2: with the help of course Richard link later, Matthew McConaughey.

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Speaker 2: Right then we made a little picture called Marats Together

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Speaker 2: and he discovered an actor named.

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Speaker 3: Jaj Jason Lee.

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Speaker 2: So Don's got a stellar track record and stuff. So

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Speaker 2: Don Phillips had this thing called Pizza Party, where basically

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Speaker 2: it was a I mean, pizza party is such a

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Speaker 2: misleading title, because yes, there was pizza party.

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Speaker 1: Who's eating pizza and then going into like spout dialogue

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Speaker 1: very quickly, the.

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Speaker 2: Lady's right, there was a lot of leftover pizza. Yes,

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Speaker 2: the actors weren't eating it. But it gets worse than that.

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Speaker 2: You're you're bringing in Don Phillips. Pizza Party is bringing

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Speaker 2: in three actors that are up for the same role. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and you see your competition all throughout the day, and

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Speaker 2: then sometimes you were cast opposite your competition in a

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Speaker 2: scene where they're just playing somebody else for the read,

359
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Speaker 2: so you're forced to sit there and watch somebody do

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Speaker 2: the lines that you studied very well. And shit. Now,

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Speaker 2: for me, that was like my first motion picture, right

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Speaker 2: other than Clerks. We made ourselves as the first legit

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Speaker 2: movie and I was like, I guess that's how it's done. Oh,

364
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Speaker 2: I've heard for years since then is like, do you

365
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Speaker 2: know what a horrible experience that was? All? That's Pizza Party.

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Speaker 2: They're like, Pizza Party, it was like that fucking train

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Speaker 2: that looks like a circus, but it is bringing you

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Speaker 2: to a death camp. They're like, it's so fucking horrible.

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Speaker 2: We all got there and just found out that, like

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Speaker 2: we had to compete against each other and around Robin

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Speaker 2: style and knock each other off one by one. So

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Speaker 2: nobody ate. Pizza and Amanda Pete came out of New

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Speaker 2: York and even though we knew that it was you

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Speaker 2: playing the part, Universa was like, well, you have to

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Speaker 2: bring out two other people for Renee as well. So

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Speaker 2: there was one other person I forget. But the other

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Speaker 2: person was a man of Pete, and Amanda Pete was

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Speaker 2: in New York and she had to come to West Coast,

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Speaker 2: so they flew her like they paid for a fly.

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Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, she's what they

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Speaker 2: called out a straw man, stalking horse or whatever, like

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Speaker 2: unless you came in and took a shit on the table,

383
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Speaker 2: she was never getting the part. It was gonna be

384
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Speaker 2: you because everyone wanted you to have the partner shit.

385
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Speaker 2: So she came out and like, GI, have a wonderful

386
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Speaker 2: audition and whatnot. But she had figured out at a

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Speaker 2: certain point that it was she was never like truly

388
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Speaker 2: in the running. In our minds, it was like, oh,

389
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Speaker 2: maybe she'll take one of the other parts, like Glenn

390
00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,280
Speaker 2: or something like that. And we offered a Gwen and

391
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Speaker 2: she said no afterwards because she felt disrespected by the process.

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Speaker 2: She was mad that we had flown her all the

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Speaker 2: way out there, and she truly had no chance to understandable.

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Speaker 2: But in my young twenty five year old mind, I

395
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Speaker 2: was like, man, that was a free trip to Los Angeles,

396
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Speaker 2: Like I would have been like, I don't giving shit,

397
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Speaker 2: I got to go to Los Angeles. I had a

398
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Speaker 2: different mindset back then. I was still coming in from

399
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Speaker 2: like the real world and stuff. So Shannon, we do

400
00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:03,200
Speaker 2: the second the round Robin, and like Joey Adams hates

401
00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,000
Speaker 2: that day, like Jason Lee is the only one. He

402
00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:08,240
Speaker 2: was like it was hard, and he was like it

403
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,280
Speaker 2: was weird seeing other people that worked for the part.

404
00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:13,480
Speaker 2: But Jason was meant to be a stalking horse or

405
00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:15,560
Speaker 2: a straw man. He was not the guy that we

406
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:17,679
Speaker 2: thought was going to get the part. He was just

407
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,000
Speaker 2: the third guy, and then throughout the day wound up

408
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Speaker 2: being the guy.

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Speaker 1: It was pretty amazing, yeah, because I remember reading with

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Speaker 1: three different guys and there was.

411
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Speaker 2: Another guy who everyone thought was gonna be it.

412
00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:35,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, But towards the end, I think, I think you

413
00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:39,280
Speaker 1: kept bringing Jason and I back in, and you worked

414
00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:40,760
Speaker 1: with both of us a lot.

415
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Speaker 2: And that was more about like, oh shit, let's see

416
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Speaker 2: how we know we want her. Let's see how she

417
00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:49,000
Speaker 2: is with the new guy. Because he was like he

418
00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:53,399
Speaker 2: hadn't done anything. He was in Nvita Loca and Alison

419
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,800
Speaker 2: Andrews movie one shot him and Spike Jones, like buying

420
00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:58,920
Speaker 2: drugs from somebody who like raised the hand to him,

421
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 2: wordless and shit, And that's the closest he'd come to acting.

422
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,760
Speaker 2: He was a professional skateboarder, so everyone was like any

423
00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 2: act like, let's see.

424
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Speaker 3: How he answer.

425
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,760
Speaker 2: He did, he was ready, and boy he grew into

426
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,879
Speaker 2: a wonderful actor. But how it even gets to the

427
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,000
Speaker 2: point where I say to Jim Jackson, you know who

428
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 2: we should go after, the Shannon Doherty Because even though

429
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Speaker 2: I sit there and watch you, and probably because I

430
00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:26,479
Speaker 2: sit there and watch you on TV, and probably because

431
00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,040
Speaker 2: like you were constantly in the news, and probably because

432
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,200
Speaker 2: I saw you in Heathers, you never occurred to me

433
00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:35,119
Speaker 2: to cast because I was like, she's way too fucking

434
00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:37,640
Speaker 2: famous for this movie. Its like gonna be a four

435
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,120
Speaker 2: and a half million dollar movie, Like and she's coming

436
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,640
Speaker 2: off of nine oh two, one oh. She ain't gonna

437
00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 2: spend that fucking cred on a movie like this. So

438
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:49,000
Speaker 2: never entered my mind. I might as well have been like, oh,

439
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,960
Speaker 2: Julia Roberts might want to do mal rats, Like that's

440
00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,399
Speaker 2: exactly you were in the same caliber in my head.

441
00:21:56,520 --> 00:22:00,239
Speaker 2: Malcolm Ingram, who interviews you later on or any use

442
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:03,320
Speaker 2: all of us for mal Renz Canadian Malcolm. I had

443
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 2: just met him at the Toronto Film Festival for the

444
00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:11,400
Speaker 2: Clerk screening and we go out to eat. So while

445
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,679
Speaker 2: we're sitting there, like you know, people are like, so,

446
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 2: what's coming next? What are you gonna do next? And

447
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,440
Speaker 2: I was like, I've been talking to Universal, to the

448
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,360
Speaker 2: guys that made Days Confused, Jim Jackson, Sean Daniels, Alphaville

449
00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:25,840
Speaker 2: about making this movie called mal Reds, and they're like,

450
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:27,400
Speaker 2: what is it. I was like, Clerk's in them all,

451
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:30,200
Speaker 2: and they're like, holy shit. Malcolm goes, well, you gotta

452
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:34,400
Speaker 2: get fucking Doherty and I was like Shannadherty and he goes, yeah,

453
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,359
Speaker 2: I gotta get fucking Dorty. She's a queen. And I

454
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,240
Speaker 2: was like, Shannondorty is super famouss like that's why I

455
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:42,160
Speaker 2: got a fucking get HER's the only chance your movie has.

456
00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:43,959
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I didn't know this.

457
00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 2: Malcolm was the one that was just like fucking Doherty man.

458
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:48,720
Speaker 2: He's like, look, you're gonna go back to the studio

459
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:53,880
Speaker 2: and shit, say Shannadory watched their faces and so when

460
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:56,440
Speaker 2: I went back, you know, Jim Jackson is like talking

461
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,919
Speaker 2: about who could be. Joey Adams was somebody that Jim

462
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,120
Speaker 2: Jack's was leaning toward because he had a friendship with her. Shit,

463
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,919
Speaker 2: And I was like, I'm like, what about Shanon Doherty

464
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,040
Speaker 2: and Jim Jack's like Shannon Doherty, she's like really famous,

465
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:11,639
Speaker 2: And I was like, I know, I know, but like

466
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 2: she is like age appropriate and she's coming off of

467
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,520
Speaker 2: fucking like I know two and oh, like maybe she

468
00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:19,320
Speaker 2: needs something to do, like I don't know, like isn't

469
00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:23,560
Speaker 2: it worth asking? And it begins with Malcolm. So Malcolm

470
00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 2: came out for like the casting process. When I was like, Malcolm,

471
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,879
Speaker 2: like Shannon Doherty's coming in, He's like, oh, fucking coming on, California,

472
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,479
Speaker 2: I gotta see this. Did he come to the audience?

473
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:35,760
Speaker 1: I think he did come to the audition, Yeah, as

474
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 1: I remember him sitting in on the audition.

475
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 2: And that was supposed to be it. But then when

476
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 2: we went to Minnesota to shoot the movie, and Malcolm

477
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:44,680
Speaker 2: was supposed to stay for five days and then stayed

478
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:49,120
Speaker 2: for the whole fucking shit. Right, he was always had

479
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:52,520
Speaker 2: this like fucking sense of product and still to this day,

480
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,200
Speaker 2: like whenever he wants to bring me down, a peg

481
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 2: or whatever. It's just like you didn't fucking think of Doerty.

482
00:23:57,880 --> 00:23:58,399
Speaker 2: I did.

483
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:00,200
Speaker 3: Oh, Malcolm, I love you.

484
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 2: But it was not because I'm like, I'll never think

485
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 2: of Doughty because she's good enough, but I was like,

486
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:07,200
Speaker 2: she too fucking big for us, and shit, and mercifully

487
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:09,960
Speaker 2: you were like, why did you do it?

488
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,680
Speaker 1: I freaking loved the script, to be honest, I really did.

489
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:19,360
Speaker 1: And it was, as I said, for me, coming off

490
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:24,160
Speaker 1: of nine O two one O, your dialogue was so

491
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:29,720
Speaker 1: interesting and Renee was so interesting, and I really I

492
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 1: wanted to work with a young, up and coming director

493
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:36,840
Speaker 1: and you were, you know, you had all of this

494
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,919
Speaker 1: like attention on you from Clerks, Sundance, all of that stuff.

495
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 1: So it was it was kind of like my reps agreed,

496
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: I agreed. It was, yeah, you got to, you know,

497
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,080
Speaker 1: if you wanted. I kind of wanted to shift gears

498
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:52,440
Speaker 1: in my career anyway, because I had gotten so much

499
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:57,000
Speaker 1: hate from playing Brenda, because Brenda, you know, went through

500
00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:59,360
Speaker 1: way too ens drama and angst and.

501
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 2: Which the audience confused with the with.

502
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 1: Me, yeah, and Renee was just not Brenda in any way,

503
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,120
Speaker 1: shape or form, and so it just felt like a

504
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,040
Speaker 1: really good career move, and I freaking like, still to

505
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 1: this day love that dialogue. Somebody recently at a convention

506
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 1: asked me if I would say some of the lines,

507
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 1: and I was like, I really have to prep for that.

508
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,520
Speaker 2: It's been a long time between me and Malrats. I like,

509
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 2: for me, those movies never die, right, Like the casts

510
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 2: go on to other things and whatnot, But like, those

511
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,200
Speaker 2: movies are active and vital in my world all the time,

512
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 2: not just because I fucking sequalize them to death, but

513
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 2: also just because I've had a deep connection with the

514
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,160
Speaker 2: audience and fostered it for years and years. So in

515
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:52,679
Speaker 2: my world, those movies like never end. There's always somebody

516
00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:55,400
Speaker 2: coming in and being like I fucking love Malrats ways

517
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 2: and where I'm like, where were you when we fucking

518
00:25:58,359 --> 00:25:59,240
Speaker 2: put that movie out?

519
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:01,760
Speaker 1: And That's kind of the interesting thing about mal Rats, right,

520
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 1: is that it wasn't a box office success.

521
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:05,119
Speaker 2: It died.

522
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 3: It died, So did my film career.

523
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 2: We took it down and we took chance.

524
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 3: I'm like, that was it?

525
00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 2: What did you did you do a movie after that?

526
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: Uh? No? No, like that was that was it? People

527
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 1: literally thought that like I was carrying the movie. So therefore,

528
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: if it was a box office failure, it was completely

529
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 1: on me. So there was no film career after that,

530
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: which was a little brutal. But at the same time,

531
00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,639
Speaker 1: I I I got to carry that cross now and

532
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: carry that cross.

533
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 2: I never put two and two together.

534
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:46,920
Speaker 3: It's okay, Like I think the fact that it is because.

535
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 2: You really never shoot like another feature film. I mean like,

536
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:52,440
Speaker 2: I mean you did, like I don't know the Reunion

537
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 2: movie and ship, but.

538
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 3: Like TV all TV still like.

539
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 2: Two hours of a movie and it anymore. Man, TV

540
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,400
Speaker 2: and my kid I can't tell you what network her

541
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:03,199
Speaker 2: favorite shows are on.

542
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 3: Wait yeah, now, But back then it was very different.

543
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,160
Speaker 1: There was a very big difference, and I just wasn't

544
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,480
Speaker 1: I didn't necessarily want the grind of a TV show

545
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:15,920
Speaker 1: so soon. So I really thought that like mal Rats

546
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 1: was gonna kick me into that gear.

547
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,280
Speaker 2: Oh man, I mean, here's the thing that might be

548
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 2: aged like fine.

549
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:24,000
Speaker 3: Wine, fine wine.

550
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 2: But in the moment when a movie, when a movie flops, kids,

551
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 2: this is the experience, at least my experience. Like when

552
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 2: a movie ends, it's like fucking love each other, man,

553
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 2: and you sign each other's yearbooks like it's high school

554
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 2: like I'll see you next summer, A fucking bond it

555
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,439
Speaker 2: forever and shit, and then when a movie dies, like

556
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 2: if you know your your biblical stories, like fucking remember

557
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 2: when like Christ gets arrested, like all the apostles scattered

558
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,760
Speaker 2: and they're like, do you know Jesus? Like who Jesus? No,

559
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:56,840
Speaker 2: I know, I know, I know this guy Jeter get Us,

560
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,640
Speaker 2: but Jeebus, maybe I don't. I don't know Jesus. That's

561
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 2: what happen. But everybody goes running from the fucking bomb,

562
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:08,480
Speaker 2: so you scatter, so you know. I quickly pivoted and

563
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,879
Speaker 2: started writing Chasing Amy, which would then go on to

564
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:18,399
Speaker 2: like resuscitate my career and and kind of like I

565
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:20,359
Speaker 2: don't know. It was weird because like I went, I

566
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 2: went to the Independent Spirit Awards the year before Chasing

567
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 2: Amy came out just to present because I had written

568
00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 2: the show that year and so I was one of

569
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 2: the presenters. I was there with Lord Dern and I

570
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 2: went up and before we present, I was like, hey, man,

571
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:35,840
Speaker 2: I just want to take this opportunity to say, like

572
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 2: to apologize from all right. I don't know what I

573
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 2: was thinking as a joke, and we're there in front

574
00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 2: of like a bunch of indie folks under the tet

575
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 2: in Santa Monica and they're all like, h Roger eber

576
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 2: took that seriously. So when he reviewed Chasing Amy, he's like,

577
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 2: Kevin Smith made a movie so bad he apologized for

578
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 2: but like Chasing Amy on the other hand, now, so

579
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 2: I'm just saying this kid's because for some people, you know,

580
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 2: for younger people, it's like what so they're out of

581
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 2: the conversation, sadly. But for the older people, you know

582
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,200
Speaker 2: maybe or the mid range w picked it up and

583
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 2: you know, on home video like in the late nineties,

584
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 2: and shit, this movie came and went in a weekend.

585
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 2: It played on five hundred screens and was off of

586
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 2: all of those screens within yeah, eight we had eight days,

587
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 2: like basically an eight to ten day UND. It was

588
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 2: like like I remember going to a test screening at

589
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 2: San Diego Comic Con long before Hollywood like descended on

590
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 2: comic Con and stuff, and we screened it. Tom Pollock,

591
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 2: who was the head of Universal Studios at that point,

592
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 2: he's there and he's like I was there for the

593
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 2: Animal House test screening and he goes and this is

594
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 2: that he's going this movie's gonna make one hundred million dollars,

595
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 2: and he was off by ninety eight million, but he

596
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:04,120
Speaker 2: was close, you know close, you got round up a

597
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 2: little bit. So when very well, and I mean well

598
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 2: it's screened that that version of its screened very well,

599
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:15,800
Speaker 2: we had by that point we had cut the longer

600
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: beginning which you could see on like the Mall Rats

601
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 2: fifteenth Anniversary DVD or whatever, because we had a test

602
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:25,800
Speaker 2: screen unofficial test screening out in Los Angeles, and what

603
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 2: we learned from the screening was like, if you have

604
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 2: a movie called Mall Rats, you better get to the

605
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 2: mall as quickly as possible. We didn't get to the

606
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 2: mall u till like the hour mark. So we went

607
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 2: in and did some reshaping. Paul Dixon was the editor,

608
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 2: and then we did some reshooting out here in Los Angeles,

609
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 2: and so we were able to dive into the movie quicker.

610
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:46,960
Speaker 2: So those tests were like positive. The studio was high

611
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 2: on the flick. We were a Grammarcy release, which was

612
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 2: a co production between Universal and Polygrin. Grammarcy put out

613
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 2: shit like barbed Wire with Pamela Anderson. They put out

614
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 2: Days Confused, but so it was a small kind of

615
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,760
Speaker 2: boutique label within universal. See it was a universal release

616
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 2: but not a universal release. And she's right, man. It

617
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 2: was like, all right, man, if this works, fucking here

618
00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:16,000
Speaker 2: goes the movie career. Yeah it really did not. I

619
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 2: apologize for that, but now so so in the moment,

620
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 2: kids like dire, like Marats is a career killer. Yeah yeah,

621
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 2: and like you know, a fucking ball in Shane and

622
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:33,040
Speaker 2: Albatross around the neck. Thank god, chasing Amy critically lifts

623
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 2: me above it and stuff, and I kind of go

624
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:39,440
Speaker 2: on to have the career I fucking have. So Marats

625
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:41,960
Speaker 2: comes out and dies this miserable death and then has

626
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 2: this ten year ascension to cult classic, cult classic, and

627
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 2: like kids, you would think if the question is, oh,

628
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 2: you guys know, no, no, because the world told us

629
00:31:57,200 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 2: we were bad, like we got chastised and as you

630
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 2: just hear, got fucking punished. They took away a movie career. Yeah,

631
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 2: so there was no like, ah, one day those kids

632
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 2: are gonna love this movie. It was just like you

633
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 2: did bad, all of you, never do this again. And

634
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 2: then the movie found it's it's audience, like when it

635
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 2: went to home video. Then ten years after mal Rats

636
00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 2: and probably even less. But in my head it was

637
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,479
Speaker 2: like it took it. It was like a ten year journey.

638
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 2: People would be like, I fucking love that movie and

639
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 2: you'd be like, well, where were you that movie flop?

640
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 2: They're like, no, I couldn't have been a flop. I

641
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 2: have that on DVD, And you're like, those two things

642
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 2: don't necessarily conflate, like one thing could be unsuccessful and

643
00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 2: you could still own the dvd, right, But what they're

644
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 2: talking about is how many fucking times they spun it,

645
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 2: like how often they watched that movie. And I've met

646
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 2: everyone professions across the fucking boards to whom like mal

647
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 2: Rats ment I was like for years, I did interviews

648
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,600
Speaker 2: up up for the IMDb folks, and so I met, like,

649
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 2: you know a lot of people that I'll never work with.

650
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 2: What's your name? Wanda Elizabeth Olsen? She comes in for

651
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 2: like that movie with Hawkeye Jeremy Renner, But before like

652
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 2: we even start talking, she was like, oh my god,

653
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 2: she goes, you have no idea how many times I

654
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 2: watched Malrats with my brother and I was like, that's

655
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:24,160
Speaker 2: the one, and she's like that one summer all we

656
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 2: did was watch Malrats together. He loved that movie, and

657
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 2: I love that movie because I love my brother. She's like,

658
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 2: I could still quote that movie, and it was tough

659
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 2: to do that interview without being like crying. That was

660
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 2: before Wanta Vision, you know, after that. I believe me,

661
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 2: I was a big fan of Wanta Vision, and maybe

662
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 2: a little more so because I was like, she likes Malrets.

663
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 2: But I've met so many people like that. There are

664
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 2: people who worked with me later in my career who

665
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 2: do it predicated on fucking malrads. Marats became currency for us.

666
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 2: It bankrupted us at one point, yes, but.

667
00:33:56,000 --> 00:34:00,680
Speaker 1: Now it's very much like we got the cool kid passed. Yes,

668
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, it was like we were not

669
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 1: allowed in a classroom or even at the school we were,

670
00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 1: you know, and now of a sudden, we were like

671
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 1: the kings and queens of the school. We were the

672
00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: prom queen and prom king. Basically, It's funny because I

673
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,719
Speaker 1: do a lot of conventions same and I signed so

674
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:32,680
Speaker 1: many malrats posters and DVDs and my doll from Mall

675
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 1: Rats and like all sorts of things, and it is

676
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:41,480
Speaker 1: those fans are just the coolest. They friggin love mal Rats.

677
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 1: They're so dedicated to it. And they also always ask

678
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 1: me two things. One is when are you and Kevin

679
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 1: going to do a convention together? So we'll figure that out. Yes, Two,

680
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,000
Speaker 1: when are you doing Marats too?

681
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: I'm with them, When are we doing Marats? We've had

682
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 2: a script for quite some time, which later on, if

683
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,319
Speaker 2: your kids are good, I will force in into read

684
00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:01,400
Speaker 2: or a scene.

685
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:02,960
Speaker 3: I mean I have read the script.

686
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:03,760
Speaker 2: That's true.

687
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:05,759
Speaker 3: I have read the script. I've read it like, this

688
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 3: can be.

689
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:08,839
Speaker 2: Edited, so you can easily, Like I can give you

690
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:10,480
Speaker 2: five minutes to look over the dialogue.

691
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, why not?

692
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 2: You're like, look, I auditioned for the movie fuck It

693
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: once before. We'll get to that and a bit.

694
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:20,960
Speaker 3: Look, guys, he's making me audition from all rights to

695
00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:23,000
Speaker 3: right now that.

696
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:24,440
Speaker 2: Part has written for you.

697
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:25,719
Speaker 3: When are we going to do it?

698
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,440
Speaker 2: Look, I'm game. I know they're talking about doing a

699
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,560
Speaker 2: Chronicicon next year, like a real life Chronicon like we

700
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:36,839
Speaker 2: did in Jane sombab reboot. We did this fake con

701
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,280
Speaker 2: called Chronicon, So we're talking about doing that in real life.

702
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:43,000
Speaker 2: Like in February, we're doing our first cruise, Jane Somobob's

703
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 2: cruise eskew uh and then I think at the end

704
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 2: of the year we're doing that. So I know sooner

705
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:50,319
Speaker 2: or later somebody will hit you up and be like,

706
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 2: oh my God, come out for that. But what I'll

707
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 2: hit you up for personally is I bought a movie

708
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:58,920
Speaker 2: theater back in my hometown with my friends and we

709
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,760
Speaker 2: call it Smarckcastle Sen and we have done mall Rats

710
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 2: with Jason and Jeremy because they were both in town

711
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 2: for something. So I was like, fuck, I let's screen it.

712
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:13,000
Speaker 2: We did Chasing Amy two separate screenings, one with Jason Lee,

713
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,919
Speaker 2: one with with Joey Adams and Russo brothers just came

714
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 2: at the top of November and we did like a

715
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 2: big Q and A with them. So you come out

716
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 2: to when's the next time you're.

717
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 3: East, I can go back whenever.

718
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:26,319
Speaker 1: I mean, I'll send you like I have a whole

719
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 1: bunch of cons that I'm doing, so like I have

720
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:29,880
Speaker 1: one in May in Philadelphia.

721
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:32,600
Speaker 2: Oh shit, yeah, that might be perfect. If you're going

722
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 2: to be out in Philly for May, that would be

723
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,799
Speaker 2: a time to double up, unless you're like, bro, I

724
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 2: feel like going to the coldest fucking place in the

725
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:42,759
Speaker 2: world in March.

726
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:46,160
Speaker 3: In March, I'm in Scotland. That's not anywhere close to

727
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 3: do You're.

728
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 2: Going over to Dokan there going back to Mall Rats.

729
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,040
Speaker 2: You know, when we did Mallrats, I didn't have this

730
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 2: like side hustle where like I was professionally Kevin Smith,

731
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,759
Speaker 2: where I stand on stage and fucking tell stories and

732
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 2: shit that came out of Mallrats. Also because after Malurats

733
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:10,880
Speaker 2: came out and died like a couple months later, like

734
00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:12,839
Speaker 2: I was sitting around looking my wounds, going like what

735
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:14,759
Speaker 2: the fuck? Man, Like I was on top and I'm

736
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 2: fucking like I was a flavor of the fucking year.

737
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:20,560
Speaker 2: And so we Uh. I got a call from the

738
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 2: University of Delaware. They were like doing a screening of Mallrats,

739
00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 2: So like you want to come out and like talk afterwards,

740
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 2: And enough time had gone by a couple of months

741
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 2: where I was like yeah, yeah, I guess, And it's

742
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 2: within driving distance, Like it was like less than two

743
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:35,840
Speaker 2: hours to get there. So I drove out and found

744
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 2: this insane healing I heard you talk about, and I

745
00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:44,000
Speaker 2: think you're absolutely right with with Holly. On the episode

746
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 2: you talked about how this is cheaper than therapy, doing

747
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:51,800
Speaker 2: podcasting something I've believed in, you know, since I was podcasting,

748
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 2: I was like, oh my god, there's no need for therapy.

749
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,240
Speaker 2: You just get to talk about all your shit everything

750
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:00,400
Speaker 2: and good things, bad things. But so there I was

751
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five and doing this Q and A after Mornce,

752
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:06,280
Speaker 2: and it's like a packed room full of college kids

753
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 2: with no fucking pretenses about like your second movie flopped,

754
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:14,160
Speaker 2: this pre internet, so it's nothing liking things not tribal yet,

755
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:16,959
Speaker 2: and it was probably a free screening on campus and shit.

756
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,440
Speaker 2: And then here was the filmmaker came out just for

757
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,000
Speaker 2: the fuck of it, and it was such an ego

758
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:24,359
Speaker 2: boost where it was like, oh my god, not only

759
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:26,800
Speaker 2: is the theater packed, which didn't happen when this movie

760
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,080
Speaker 2: was out, all these fucking kids love it. And they're

761
00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 2: also like, hey, you're one of us, because I'm not

762
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,879
Speaker 2: that far removed from them twenty five. These kids are

763
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:39,360
Speaker 2: anywhere between eighteen twenty two at this point and stuff.

764
00:38:40,080 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 2: So I become an aspir to figure where people are like,

765
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 2: holy shit, like that's only a few years away from me.

766
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:46,719
Speaker 2: You just make a movie and shit, and you can

767
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:54,480
Speaker 2: make a movie with like Shannadari. So that begins my therapy.

768
00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 2: There's a chance I could have went south with the

769
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,360
Speaker 2: recess to mallrats, because clerks have been so over praised,

770
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:06,799
Speaker 2: you know, in our business being what it is, there's

771
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 2: plenty of distractions to save your wounds. It could have

772
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:13,520
Speaker 2: been booze, it could have been drugs. But what I

773
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 2: found was people being like, no, this movie's good and

774
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 2: standing up in in front of audience and shit. That

775
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:26,359
Speaker 2: fed me and also created this entire side hustle through

776
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 2: which now I make a majority of whatever I earn

777
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,360
Speaker 2: more as just being Kevin Smith than what Kevin Smith

778
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 2: does for a living, all tied to fucking mallrats. Yeah,

779
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 2: do you what do you remember about shooting at the mall?

780
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:46,520
Speaker 2: The Eden Prairie Mall, you know, which I've revisited many times.

781
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 2: Not only evidence of us because they changed, like the

782
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 2: food court with those weird neon palm trees and shit

783
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 2: like that, which was so weird because we were in Minnesota.

784
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 2: The only evidence of us is in the pot Belly

785
00:39:57,280 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 2: sandwich shop. There's a malrat sposter hanging up.

786
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: Well, at least there's something or acknowledging it. I what

787
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:09,840
Speaker 1: I really remember about shooting was the atmosphere I remember

788
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 1: the hotel, all of us just like I mean, Muse

789
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:17,879
Speaker 1: was skateboarding, so it was Jason like down the hallways. Yes,

790
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,839
Speaker 1: could smells some pot, you know, we were. I think

791
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:24,600
Speaker 1: it was just so it felt like a bunch of

792
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 1: kids who were just in a frat house basically like

793
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:28,280
Speaker 1: hanging out together.

794
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:33,320
Speaker 2: Had you, like when you shot Heathers were you shooting

795
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,760
Speaker 2: in La? Had you ever gone on location to shoot

796
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:36,080
Speaker 2: a movie?

797
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 1: Uh, I'm not I don't. Yes, yes, because I did,

798
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:41,960
Speaker 1: like Robert Kennedy in his times when I was young,

799
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 1: and that was it hyena sport.

800
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 3: So I had been.

801
00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 1: But remember it was like nine o two one zero

802
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 1: was my life for four years. I think you were

803
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,560
Speaker 1: working constantly and in La, you know, riving so to

804
00:40:56,600 --> 00:41:01,360
Speaker 1: be in a location and and also to be working

805
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: with everybody that was just having a good time. Like

806
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 1: nobody took themselves too seriously, and.

807
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:11,000
Speaker 2: I think I did. I think I was like trying

808
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:13,959
Speaker 2: to be the indie film like Icon.

809
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 1: It was a weird tri He was also the captain

810
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:20,120
Speaker 1: of the ship, you know, and you had a studio movie,

811
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,359
Speaker 1: so that you know a lot of pressure on you.

812
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 1: But you know, Claire for Lonnie, her hotel room was

813
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 1: directly across from mine, and so I would hang out

814
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: with her a lot. I remember she just kept on

815
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:35,040
Speaker 1: eating kiwi's and I had never eaten a kiwi before,

816
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 1: and she was like peeling and eating her kiwi while

817
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:39,319
Speaker 1: talking to me, and it was it was like a

818
00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:43,759
Speaker 1: nightly ritual that we had to sort of just decompress

819
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 1: from the day.

820
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

821
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:48,520
Speaker 1: I was excited because I'm like, wow, this is like

822
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 1: a movie movie in this school. And I had Tony

823
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 1: g was my makeup artist at the time, who then

824
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:56,840
Speaker 1: went on to do Angelina Jolie and then became like

825
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 1: a huge prosthetic girl.

826
00:41:59,719 --> 00:42:01,319
Speaker 2: Was that the girl that you hung out with all

827
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:01,760
Speaker 2: the time.

828
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, with the like perfectly toned arms and like the

829
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 1: quirky personality.

830
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 2: Was like your right hand person. Yeah, and you had

831
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:12,279
Speaker 2: the dog. Which dog did you have? It was a

832
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:12,799
Speaker 2: German shop.

833
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:14,840
Speaker 3: I had Elfie Elfie and she was.

834
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:18,080
Speaker 2: Straight out of Germany. She responded to or she responded

835
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 2: to German commits.

836
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:21,280
Speaker 1: She was straight out of Germany. And she was shots

837
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:24,800
Speaker 1: in three, like hardcore trained security.

838
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,760
Speaker 2: Yes, because she Shannon could be like and the motherfucker

839
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:30,399
Speaker 2: would like go choose somebody's throat out.

840
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 1: Yeah shit, yeah, And we taught her also like street

841
00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 1: like street training. When she came here from Germany, we

842
00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:38,440
Speaker 1: had taught her street training, so she didn't go for arms.

843
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 2: She went through for like next the way shepherds do.

844
00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:46,240
Speaker 2: It was like I remember, while we were shooting, Shannon

845
00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 2: would come in and because we shot at an active mall,

846
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:53,239
Speaker 2: The in Prairie Mall was this shopping center, you know,

847
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,359
Speaker 2: in inan Prairie, Minnesota, which is maybe about twenty five

848
00:42:56,480 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 2: thirty minutes away from Minneapolis, but definitely at least twenty

849
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 2: thirty minutes away from the Mall of America, which had

850
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:06,640
Speaker 2: opened the year prior, which I don't know if it

851
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 2: still counts as this, but at that point was the

852
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:12,359
Speaker 2: world's biggest fucking mall, so it had sucked all the

853
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 2: business out of the other local malls. So the Eaton

854
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 2: Prairie Mall was operating at less than fifty percent capacity

855
00:43:19,440 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 2: of stores. So that's why. And we got that mall.

856
00:43:22,120 --> 00:43:23,919
Speaker 2: I mean, I know, it's nineteen ninety five and shit,

857
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 2: so naturally everything's going to sound cheap. But in nineteen

858
00:43:27,160 --> 00:43:29,799
Speaker 2: ninety five, kids, this was cheap. They gave us that

859
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:31,960
Speaker 2: mall for two months for ten thousand dollars.

860
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:32,800
Speaker 3: That's cheap.

861
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,759
Speaker 2: That's even by today's standards. I think people would be

862
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:39,319
Speaker 2: like what it was nuts. And in that mall that

863
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,479
Speaker 2: became our studio, so it.

864
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 3: Was like dressing rooms were stores shut down.

865
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 2: Yes, there were no trailers or anything like that. Like

866
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 2: I'm sure on nine oh two, we know you guys

867
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: had fucking trailers. Yeah. Here the dressing rooms were built,

868
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:58,000
Speaker 2: as Shannon said, inside fucking closed down story. So here's

869
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:00,600
Speaker 2: the gap next to you. The depth just closed down,

870
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:02,760
Speaker 2: and we built a bunch of fucking stalls.

871
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 1: And in the living room, like I think you guys

872
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: gave me like a whole storage just to myself. It

873
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 1: was probably like you know, a Claire's ear ring store

874
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 1: that had gotten did not.

875
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 2: Even exist yet kids where we are we are, and they.

876
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:21,439
Speaker 1: Almost like a shoved couch in there and like one chair,

877
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:23,120
Speaker 1: and it was like, here's your dressing room, and I

878
00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:23,719
Speaker 1: was like cool.

879
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,520
Speaker 2: She would come in through like the front door with

880
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 2: el and like walk up the escalator stairs to like

881
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 2: where the dressing rooms were and stuff like that, and

882
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 2: the people that ran the mall would constantly come into

883
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:40,799
Speaker 2: the office like I look, I know she is who

884
00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:43,319
Speaker 2: she is, but like, can she go through the back door?

885
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:45,359
Speaker 2: If people see her bringing a dog into the mall,

886
00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:47,439
Speaker 2: they'll think they can bring a dog into the mall.

887
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 2: And so we were like, yeah, we'll talk to her, like, Shannon,

888
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 2: you can't bring it through the you go through the

889
00:44:53,880 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 2: back door. And she goes, now I'm gonna go through

890
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:57,719
Speaker 2: the front door, and we're like all right. So we

891
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:00,360
Speaker 2: were like we talked to Shannon as the best we

892
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,160
Speaker 2: could deliver. I A'm gonna tell her to kill her dogs.

893
00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 2: She can't go through the fucking ball. And yet like that, I.

894
00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 3: Don't even remember that it.

895
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 2: Was that the dog was absolutely adorable, but it was necessary.

896
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 2: Like again, I'm not overstating how fucking famous an it was.

897
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 2: And we were now outside of like her natural stomping

898
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,320
Speaker 2: grounds where you could be famous in Los Angeles and

899
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 2: there are other famous people, although she was fucking stalked.

900
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:26,839
Speaker 2: We were in Minnesota where people were like, where your

901
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 2: fame is magnified ten thousand times.

902
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:34,320
Speaker 1: I mean, by the way, Minnesota. The twins were from Minnesota, Minnesota.

903
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 1: It was like, you know and listen, at the end

904
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,800
Speaker 1: of the day, everybody was wonderful. But I think again,

905
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 1: coming off of nine O twoe oh and having that

906
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:46,320
Speaker 1: amount of fame at that age where and you're getting

907
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:50,400
Speaker 1: letters from crazy people saying that you know you're married

908
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 1: to them, and you you know they're going to come

909
00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 1: and get you and bring you back home, and you're like,

910
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:58,360
Speaker 1: oh my god, like this person thinks we're actually married,

911
00:45:58,400 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 1: and what are they going to do to me if

912
00:45:59,600 --> 00:45:59,879
Speaker 1: they ever?

913
00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:05,440
Speaker 2: Did? They? Nowadays, they you know, the kids ship relationships

914
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 2: on TV shows. It's called oh I ship this real hard.

915
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 3: What the hell does that mean?

916
00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 2: It means that they love that particular pairing of couples.

917
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:15,880
Speaker 2: So they're like, oh, I shipped this. I shipped this

918
00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:19,319
Speaker 2: couple so hard. And you were definitely before there was

919
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 2: an internet. Your relationship with Dylan broke that Internet, and

920
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:29,319
Speaker 2: people shipped Brenda and Dylan so fucking hard. Yeah, So

921
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:31,640
Speaker 2: did you get shipped from people who are like you

922
00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:34,399
Speaker 2: can't fucking we how come you're not with Dylan and ship?

923
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, but I think it was more I

924
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:42,400
Speaker 1: don't your mind. Yeah, it was definitely more your mind,

925
00:46:42,920 --> 00:46:48,279
Speaker 1: very scary stuff where you're you know, having to get

926
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:52,640
Speaker 1: the FBI involved, right, And and that was the dog

927
00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: because I didn't like at that point, I didn't really

928
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:57,880
Speaker 1: want a lot of I didn't want like a security

929
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:00,479
Speaker 1: guard that was that would have a.

930
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 2: Fucking bodyguard, which would have made like a hell of

931
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:05,600
Speaker 2: sense at this time, would have but like that we're

932
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:07,960
Speaker 2: really trying to keep it. Yeah, just.

933
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,279
Speaker 1: A bodyguard would have felt to me as if I

934
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:17,640
Speaker 1: believed in my own hype, right, and also invasive because

935
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 1: I'm not someone who wants to hang out with someone

936
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:23,520
Speaker 1: twenty four hours a day. I really enjoyed my my Space,

937
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 1: but as a dog I can hang out with twenty

938
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 1: four hours a day.

939
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 2: Were you a rich kid growing up or no, I was,

940
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:34,719
Speaker 2: were the opposite. Yeah, So I think that also has

941
00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:37,440
Speaker 2: something to do with it, because you know, you've always

942
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:43,240
Speaker 2: had an air of street wise to you that one

943
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 2: wouldn't have if they were born into this world. You

944
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 2: came from a real place, and even you know, though

945
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:53,960
Speaker 2: you started acting at a young age, you were surrounded

946
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: by fucking real people for at least the formative years

947
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:02,840
Speaker 2: of your life. Yeah, enough that you understand reality. So

948
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:06,560
Speaker 2: even when you were super famous, I never felt you

949
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,440
Speaker 2: leaning into that as much as leaning more toward I'm

950
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:14,560
Speaker 2: an individual and I have a life and you're not

951
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:19,399
Speaker 2: entitled to that, But fame was not a thing that

952
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 2: you particularly cared about. In fact, at that point in

953
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:24,800
Speaker 2: your life, it had become a hindrance.

954
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:26,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I hated it.

955
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:30,680
Speaker 2: You always came across, for lack of a better description,

956
00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:34,359
Speaker 2: more normal, somebody who grew up in the normal world

957
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 2: who then found fortune based on her talent. So I

958
00:48:38,719 --> 00:48:44,040
Speaker 2: feel like you not having a bodyguard really tracked because

959
00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:48,880
Speaker 2: that was something that like, yes, people in the business did,

960
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:52,920
Speaker 2: but you were kind of like, I'm not of that world.

961
00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:55,560
Speaker 2: I'm myself and I come from a real place. And

962
00:48:55,960 --> 00:48:58,279
Speaker 2: you could absolutely debunk it, but I think it had

963
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 2: a lot to do with you all are from a

964
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:03,839
Speaker 2: world that's not make believe. You may work and make

965
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:07,440
Speaker 2: believe world, and make believe world made you famous. You

966
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:11,640
Speaker 2: came from family, the street, fucking like people who had

967
00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 2: to work for a living, Yeah, in order to fucking

968
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:25,399
Speaker 2: keep roofs overheads and stuff. What I never asked you, though,

969
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:28,160
Speaker 2: is when did it start? Whose idea was it to be, like,

970
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 2: I want to fucking act.

971
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:31,040
Speaker 3: It was my brother's idea.

972
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:35,360
Speaker 1: Actually, So my brother, who's four years older than me,

973
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:39,840
Speaker 1: he really wanted to be an actor, Sean Sean Doherty,

974
00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,880
Speaker 1: Sean Doherty, Sean Bryant Doherty. The Bryant is named after

975
00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 1: Bear Bryant, who was the coach for Alabama at the time.

976
00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: So we were doing plays at church and what it was.

977
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 1: We were raised Baptist, but we were going to a

978
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:03,920
Speaker 1: Methodist church and somebody saw us and you know it

979
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 1: was like, I have an agent's number. You guys, they

980
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:11,200
Speaker 1: should really, you know, get into the business. And my brother,

981
00:50:12,200 --> 00:50:13,520
Speaker 1: now this was now in LA.

982
00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:14,400
Speaker 2: What were you doing.

983
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:19,200
Speaker 1: So we had moved from Tennessee to like Palsferties area.

984
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: Why for my dad's business. So it was a family business.

985
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:29,319
Speaker 1: My grandfather, my mom's father had a shipping company, like

986
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,839
Speaker 1: truck transportation company, and so my dad was opening up

987
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:35,280
Speaker 1: a West coast version.

988
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:37,759
Speaker 2: So he moved the entire family, which is at this

989
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,960
Speaker 2: point him, your mom, my brother, and myself, so just

990
00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 2: four in the family. Just for in the family. There

991
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:47,440
Speaker 2: was probably a pet, yeah, I mean I know that

992
00:50:47,600 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 2: when we were living. Yeah, there was Curious George who

993
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:53,400
Speaker 2: was like a you know, we got him at a

994
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:59,359
Speaker 2: pound and he was a half Schnauzer half poodle and yeah,

995
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:00,640
Speaker 2: his name was here is George.

996
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:03,759
Speaker 1: So to your parents are working people. My parents were

997
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:07,400
Speaker 1: working people. My dad worked really hard. That's probably like

998
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:09,839
Speaker 1: the one time in my life that we that we

999
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:12,800
Speaker 1: did have money. But then my dad got really sick.

1000
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 1: He had I was I think my mom had an

1001
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 1: aneurysm when I was probably nine or eight, and she

1002
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 1: almost died.

1003
00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:25,720
Speaker 3: And then, you know, that's.

1004
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:27,880
Speaker 2: That's my fears. That's how I'm going to go because

1005
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:30,960
Speaker 2: you can't do anything about that. Yeah, later I almost

1006
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:32,719
Speaker 2: died of a heart attackle six years ago. But the

1007
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:35,320
Speaker 2: thing I've always been afraid of is aneurysm or embolism

1008
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,120
Speaker 2: because it's like taking time bomb you don't necessarily know about,

1009
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 2: keeping very deep in your head, and you're just going

1010
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:41,479
Speaker 2: about your dad, what happened in your mind.

1011
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 1: So I was doing a play called The Mound Builders

1012
00:51:44,719 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: at like the Burbank Playhouse, and.

1013
00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:50,239
Speaker 2: So at this point you're already into acting, yeah, but

1014
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 2: like not really working working.

1015
00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:54,480
Speaker 3: I'm like doing plays and it's fun.

1016
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:56,840
Speaker 1: I think I was like eight or nine and my

1017
00:51:56,920 --> 00:51:59,759
Speaker 1: mom was going with me, and it was during a performance.

1018
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 3: Yes, I was on stage, but she.

1019
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: Started having horrible, horrible, horrible headaches, like so bad. She

1020
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:11,439
Speaker 1: got dizzy. She couldn't stand. She was throwing up. Once

1021
00:52:11,480 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 1: the play was over, the director put her in. He

1022
00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:19,319
Speaker 1: had a Volvo like station wagon volvo, and he put

1023
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:22,880
Speaker 1: the whole back down and I just remember that somebody

1024
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:26,839
Speaker 1: drove us back to the house and they held her

1025
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 1: head very still the entire time we got to the house.

1026
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:34,280
Speaker 1: She took Tyler and all and went to bed very sick,

1027
00:52:34,480 --> 00:52:37,320
Speaker 1: but woke up the next day and she felt a

1028
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:40,959
Speaker 1: little funky, but she was like, I'm buying. My dad

1029
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:43,600
Speaker 1: was like no, no, no, You're going to the doctor and

1030
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 1: they did a scan and they were like, we have

1031
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:47,319
Speaker 1: to take you in the surgery immediately. That was on

1032
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:51,800
Speaker 1: Friday the thirteenth. She went into an eight hour surgery

1033
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 1: on Friday the thirteenth, with the doctor saying ten percent

1034
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 1: chance of living and if she survives, you know, here

1035
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:01,920
Speaker 1: is the best case scenario for her. And it was like,

1036
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:03,719
Speaker 1: she's going to be paralyzed, she's not going to be

1037
00:53:03,719 --> 00:53:07,760
Speaker 1: able to talk. Like it was crazy, Yeah, how old.

1038
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:08,480
Speaker 2: Are you at this point?

1039
00:53:08,840 --> 00:53:09,439
Speaker 3: Eight or nine?

1040
00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:13,040
Speaker 2: A lot of information and heartbreak and trauma to have

1041
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:15,760
Speaker 2: to process and yeah put into place, and so essentially,

1042
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:18,480
Speaker 2: even before she heads into surgery, you're prepared for like

1043
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 2: the worst, something bad is going to happen in my mom. Mind,

1044
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 2: you kids, you can't do microscopic surgery like you can today.

1045
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:29,840
Speaker 2: So batman fucking opening up her cranium.

1046
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:30,719
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, So they went.

1047
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:34,600
Speaker 1: They they opened her up right here, and you know,

1048
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:37,880
Speaker 1: the big thing was like her eyesight, because the aneurysm

1049
00:53:38,080 --> 00:53:43,759
Speaker 1: was sort of behind an eye. But they did it,

1050
00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:47,600
Speaker 1: and and she came into surgery with just one eyebrow paralyzed.

1051
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:49,520
Speaker 2: And I remain that way.

1052
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:55,480
Speaker 1: She would stare at the mirror and work and work.

1053
00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:59,000
Speaker 2: That eye really rehabilitated her eyebrow. I met your mother.

1054
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:01,680
Speaker 2: She's a wonderful woman, but that really fucking edges it

1055
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:05,919
Speaker 2: up a not yeah, willing ones fucking paralyzed eyebrow back

1056
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 2: to work. Yeah, No, wonder you keep her around you

1057
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:09,200
Speaker 2: all the time?

1058
00:54:09,239 --> 00:54:12,560
Speaker 1: I no, wonder I have, you know, the inner strength

1059
00:54:12,600 --> 00:54:13,879
Speaker 1: and the will to work comes.

1060
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1061
00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:19,200
Speaker 1: So, and then my dad obviously had like by the

1062
00:54:19,239 --> 00:54:21,560
Speaker 1: time my dad passed away, he had had something like

1063
00:54:21,640 --> 00:54:25,920
Speaker 1: eleven strokes and like twelve heart attacks and quintuple bypassed

1064
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:27,680
Speaker 1: heart surgery and on dialysis.

1065
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:29,120
Speaker 3: And I think that was it.

1066
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:31,320
Speaker 2: Fat eating or was it bad genetics.

1067
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 3: And diabetes, just like my dad.

1068
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:34,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, she took my dad as well. How old was

1069
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:35,360
Speaker 2: your dad.

1070
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:37,640
Speaker 1: When he passed away? Sixty seven?

1071
00:54:37,719 --> 00:54:42,439
Speaker 2: Maybe truly the same age as my father age sixty seven. Yeah,

1072
00:54:42,560 --> 00:54:44,840
Speaker 2: and it's like, think about now, how old are you

1073
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:48,040
Speaker 2: when he passed away? Was this before nine or two

1074
00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:48,319
Speaker 2: went hour?

1075
00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:48,760
Speaker 3: No?

1076
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:50,759
Speaker 1: No, no, no, it was after to see all that

1077
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 1: he got to see charmed. My dad was my best friend.

1078
00:54:54,640 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 2: So I always tell your mom was your best friend.

1079
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:59,640
Speaker 2: My dad was my best friend, right, yeah, your mom,

1080
00:54:59,680 --> 00:55:00,880
Speaker 2: you's seck best friend, because.

1081
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:02,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean my mom and I were super close.

1082
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:06,879
Speaker 1: But like, my dad was my hero. He was my rock.

1083
00:55:07,040 --> 00:55:10,440
Speaker 1: He was like everything my dad was. Anytime he went

1084
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:13,960
Speaker 1: to the hospital, it was always the most devastating thing

1085
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:16,239
Speaker 1: in the world for me because I was, you know,

1086
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: that fear of losing somebody who means that much to you.

1087
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:21,439
Speaker 1: I honestly didn't think I was going to recover when

1088
00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:22,440
Speaker 1: he passed away.

1089
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 2: Who was the one that took you to auditions and stuff?

1090
00:55:27,560 --> 00:55:29,360
Speaker 2: What did Dad think about the career?

1091
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 3: He was okay with it.

1092
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:35,520
Speaker 1: I mean he would get very mad, mad at the

1093
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:38,080
Speaker 1: press and would always say to me, like I told

1094
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:39,400
Speaker 1: you should have been an attorney.

1095
00:55:39,440 --> 00:55:40,399
Speaker 3: And I was like, I know.

1096
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:43,759
Speaker 2: That that was fucking fixed for it. He's like, you

1097
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 2: should just not be in that horrible business. Nobody writes

1098
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:48,120
Speaker 2: this shit about attorney.

1099
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:50,480
Speaker 3: Yes, he wanted me to go to law school.

1100
00:55:51,560 --> 00:55:55,880
Speaker 2: I mean, look, I've heard you speak over the years

1101
00:55:56,440 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 2: not just how smart you are, the things you know,

1102
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:03,719
Speaker 2: but also your delivery. You could have easily been a.

1103
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:04,840
Speaker 3: Lawyer, thank you.

1104
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:06,520
Speaker 2: I think so a fucking lawyer.

1105
00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:09,719
Speaker 3: Yes, really, really, really had journey.

1106
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:12,520
Speaker 2: I think we all benefited more from you not having

1107
00:56:12,680 --> 00:56:14,879
Speaker 2: a career in law. But yes, I think you could

1108
00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:17,319
Speaker 2: have nailed it. And also it's never too late. That

1109
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:21,080
Speaker 2: being said, he saw Charmed as well.

1110
00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:22,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, did he ever?

1111
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 2: Like my father, my father passed away twenty years ago.

1112
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:27,759
Speaker 2: It just came up on twenty years ago that he

1113
00:56:28,160 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 2: died this year twenty In June of twenty twenty three

1114
00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:36,279
Speaker 2: was twenty years so I loved him to death. He

1115
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:37,960
Speaker 2: was a guy that took me to movies and stuff

1116
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:40,239
Speaker 2: like that. But my father was also the guy who

1117
00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:44,319
Speaker 2: was a bit of the internet before the Internet. So like,

1118
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:47,839
Speaker 2: you know, I'd come in and I'd be like, oh

1119
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:49,840
Speaker 2: my god, did you see what the new York Times

1120
00:56:49,840 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 2: said about the movies, like, yeah, but did you see

1121
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:54,680
Speaker 2: what the Ledger said? Man? And the Ledger was the

1122
00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:57,040
Speaker 2: shitty one, like the shitty review and not the shitty paper,

1123
00:56:57,080 --> 00:56:59,719
Speaker 2: but like the negative review. And I'm like, well, yes,

1124
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,480
Speaker 2: I did see that, and I'm really trying to focus

1125
00:57:02,520 --> 00:57:05,360
Speaker 2: on like the positive one, which also happens to be

1126
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:08,760
Speaker 2: the New York Times, which inarguably, you know, most people

1127
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:11,400
Speaker 2: are more familiar with than the Ledger. I know the

1128
00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:14,200
Speaker 2: Ledger is our paper because we're in New Jersey, but still,

1129
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:18,320
Speaker 2: and my father was kind of that not like remember

1130
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 2: in the movie Jerry Maguire, Google Gooding Junior's character had

1131
00:57:23,200 --> 00:57:25,760
Speaker 2: that brother. His name was TP Yes, and he's always

1132
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:27,320
Speaker 2: like I told him he's too short to be in

1133
00:57:27,320 --> 00:57:30,200
Speaker 2: the NFL stuff, like just always throw them just a little,

1134
00:57:30,520 --> 00:57:34,200
Speaker 2: a little jeb I. Honestly, I know my father adored me.

1135
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:36,160
Speaker 2: I know my father was insanely proud of my career.

1136
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 2: But I think my father was very interested in making

1137
00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:40,520
Speaker 2: sure that I.

1138
00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:43,760
Speaker 1: Didn't you stayed humble become an asshole, like is what

1139
00:57:43,800 --> 00:57:44,520
Speaker 1: it comes down to.

1140
00:57:44,680 --> 00:57:47,440
Speaker 2: So as much as he was proud, he would he

1141
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:50,640
Speaker 2: was the voice of and you know in the Clerk's era.

1142
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:55,040
Speaker 2: That was hard because Clerk's was a beloved fucking film, like,

1143
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:57,000
Speaker 2: and I'm not saying that with any sort of like

1144
00:57:57,040 --> 00:58:00,200
Speaker 2: fuck everybody, but it. If I'd known it was going

1145
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:02,040
Speaker 2: to be so beloved, I would have tried harder. But

1146
00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:04,120
Speaker 2: I think not trying is what made it what it was.

1147
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:08,120
Speaker 2: So the whole world was like, kid, you're a fucking

1148
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:11,000
Speaker 2: wonder kid, genius and ship like that, except for my

1149
00:58:11,040 --> 00:58:14,800
Speaker 2: old was like, yeah, no, doesn't think you're so smart kid.

1150
00:58:15,440 --> 00:58:17,320
Speaker 1: You know that's funny because my dad used to always

1151
00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:20,000
Speaker 1: say to me that, you know, if you read the

1152
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:24,200
Speaker 1: good reviews, you better read the bad as well. Percent

1153
00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:28,560
Speaker 1: keeping they were keeping us humble. They were making sure

1154
00:58:28,600 --> 00:58:31,040
Speaker 1: that we had humility.

1155
00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:33,439
Speaker 2: I could see that as being a dude who would

1156
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:37,880
Speaker 2: want to beat up everybody who wrote about you or

1157
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:39,720
Speaker 2: the people that you ran with. Would you? Did you

1158
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 2: get lectured a lot? Like you shouldn't hang out with

1159
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:42,480
Speaker 2: this one, that one or that one.

1160
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:45,600
Speaker 1: I mean like at some point when I was eighteen,

1161
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:48,480
Speaker 1: there was no lecturing me because I really thought that

1162
00:58:48,520 --> 00:58:49,560
Speaker 1: I knew what I was doing.

1163
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:51,880
Speaker 2: Unlus you had like the job to back it as well.

1164
00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:54,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was hanging out with kind of a bad crowd.

1165
00:58:54,960 --> 00:59:00,080
Speaker 1: And this was I think right in the beginning of

1166
00:59:00,080 --> 00:59:04,240
Speaker 1: it or right before, and you were on in your

1167
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:05,120
Speaker 1: I think I was.

1168
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:08,280
Speaker 3: Like eighteen eighteen nineteen kids, yeah.

1169
00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:10,200
Speaker 2: Fast, like Iro Ensuring was one hundred and eight. I

1170
00:59:10,200 --> 00:59:12,720
Speaker 2: think when he was on he was a grown ass man.

1171
00:59:12,840 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 2: Let's be honest. So was what so was? Weren't they all? Like?

1172
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:18,600
Speaker 2: That was always the joke. These kids are like in

1173
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:20,480
Speaker 2: their fucking mid thirties. But you were young?

1174
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:23,160
Speaker 1: No, not really, I mean Brian was, you know, he

1175
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:24,160
Speaker 1: was the youngest.

1176
00:59:24,240 --> 00:59:25,760
Speaker 2: You know. I bought the house right next to his,

1177
00:59:25,800 --> 00:59:27,919
Speaker 2: which used to be I bought the house. The house

1178
00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:30,040
Speaker 2: was sold to me by Ben Afflecks. His house he

1179
00:59:30,080 --> 00:59:33,440
Speaker 2: lived right next door to Brian Austin Green when he

1180
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:37,280
Speaker 2: was mostly with with Megan Megan, I think, but he

1181
00:59:37,360 --> 00:59:39,720
Speaker 2: had like a studio in the house next door and stuff.

1182
00:59:39,720 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 2: So in the beginning when I first so whild I've

1183
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:43,880
Speaker 2: thought about this in years. When I first moved into

1184
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:46,680
Speaker 2: that house, like every once in a while I would

1185
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:48,760
Speaker 2: see bag you know, out in the earth that's what

1186
00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:49,760
Speaker 2: they called them back day.

1187
00:59:50,800 --> 00:59:52,240
Speaker 3: That's what he's under in my phone.

1188
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:54,360
Speaker 2: I was never close enough to call on that and

1189
00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:56,960
Speaker 2: he probably doesn't even remember living next to me. But like, again,

1190
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:01,040
Speaker 2: you know, I was somebody who watched nine O two

1191
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:03,200
Speaker 2: one o long and not just like, oh, I'm in

1192
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:05,880
Speaker 2: the business and not like that show. I was an

1193
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:08,440
Speaker 2: outsider with no hope of ever being in the business

1194
01:00:08,480 --> 01:00:13,520
Speaker 2: who watched that show. So working with Shannon and then

1195
01:00:13,560 --> 01:00:17,720
Speaker 2: eventually like being like, oh my god, my neighbors is Brian,

1196
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:21,880
Speaker 2: it was like, you know, fucking it was wild. He

1197
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:25,200
Speaker 2: was a wonderful, wild adjustment. But he was always a

1198
01:00:25,240 --> 01:00:25,600
Speaker 2: nice guy.

1199
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:31,440
Speaker 1: Brian is Brian is awesome. He's really I left him

1200
01:00:31,440 --> 01:00:33,360
Speaker 1: to death. And actually, do you talk to any of

1201
01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:33,959
Speaker 1: the other kids?

1202
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:34,640
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1203
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:37,880
Speaker 1: I mean I speak to almost all of them, really

1204
01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:39,840
Speaker 1: and sometimes yep.

1205
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:42,280
Speaker 3: TA to Toy against.

1206
01:00:41,880 --> 01:00:45,360
Speaker 2: Tory in a fucking TBS show that during COVID during

1207
01:00:45,360 --> 01:00:48,600
Speaker 2: the lockdown, TBS did the show called Celebrity Show Off.

1208
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:53,880
Speaker 2: Tory and her family was one of the competing contestants.

1209
01:00:54,080 --> 01:00:55,040
Speaker 3: How did you do on that?

1210
01:00:55,200 --> 01:00:57,480
Speaker 2: It wound up being me and Tory at the end,

1211
01:00:57,680 --> 01:01:01,400
Speaker 2: really and then Toy won. Now he asked me, I

1212
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:03,880
Speaker 2: think we were rob or whatever. You know, it's just

1213
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:06,240
Speaker 2: a pink belt that I really would have cherished and

1214
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:08,680
Speaker 2: ship she won it. But oh my god, bro, like

1215
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:10,400
Speaker 2: that's look one by one. I'm checking the nine O

1216
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:11,360
Speaker 2: two one o kids off.

1217
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 3: I know they live next to.

1218
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:21,240
Speaker 2: I didn't work with Luke, but I met Luke late

1219
01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:22,160
Speaker 2: in life.

1220
01:01:22,360 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 1: I feel like, didn't you meet Luke and Vancouver also

1221
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:27,920
Speaker 1: when you were shooting That's where I met him.

1222
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:33,320
Speaker 2: Later you were flash and he was there for is

1223
01:01:33,320 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 2: how I judge people in this business. If a motherfucker

1224
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:39,240
Speaker 2: is willing to come up to you, that's the motherfucker

1225
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:41,360
Speaker 2: worth talking to you. Because I'm not the person that's

1226
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:42,880
Speaker 2: ever going to go up to somebody because I'm always

1227
01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 2: like I'm a bother. That person he like literally came

1228
01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:49,040
Speaker 2: over and like started this fucking conversation and was so

1229
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:54,000
Speaker 2: goddamn lovely and he couldn't have been fucking lovelier. And

1230
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 2: this is right before he did like the Quentin thing.

1231
01:01:58,120 --> 01:02:00,280
Speaker 2: He did make it into the Quent once. I think

1232
01:02:00,320 --> 01:02:01,400
Speaker 2: that was the last thing that he.

1233
01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 1: Was in and he was so excited. Oh god, yeah,

1234
01:02:07,320 --> 01:02:07,840
Speaker 1: because I.

1235
01:02:07,840 --> 01:02:09,200
Speaker 2: Must have felt legitimized.

1236
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:12,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, way of it was like me getting cast from

1237
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:17,240
Speaker 1: Mall Rats, probably more so because it was Quentin. I'm

1238
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:20,080
Speaker 1: like Marats again, gonna have a big film career, Like

1239
01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:23,200
Speaker 1: I know that for Luke, Like I mean, you know

1240
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:25,360
Speaker 1: who doesn't want to work with Quentin Tarantino first off?

1241
01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:28,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I.

1242
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:33,120
Speaker 1: For him, it was just I remember he called me

1243
01:02:33,160 --> 01:02:35,760
Speaker 1: on the phone and he was like over the moon,

1244
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:38,200
Speaker 1: a static and he was telling me all about his character,

1245
01:02:38,800 --> 01:02:40,280
Speaker 1: things that he was going to do and what he

1246
01:02:40,360 --> 01:02:44,800
Speaker 1: was going to try. So I'm I'm really glad that

1247
01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:46,959
Speaker 1: he got to do that before he passed away.

1248
01:02:47,320 --> 01:02:51,080
Speaker 2: Did you ever do Simpsons? No, he did. I always

1249
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:53,040
Speaker 2: think of him as as when he played side show

1250
01:02:53,120 --> 01:02:55,120
Speaker 2: Luke Perry. They called him on the show he was

1251
01:02:55,120 --> 01:03:03,240
Speaker 2: like Crusty's cousin the He was absolutely well you guys,

1252
01:03:03,800 --> 01:03:05,240
Speaker 2: you guys were tight, and it sounds like you were

1253
01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:06,040
Speaker 2: tight even after.

1254
01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:06,560
Speaker 3: We were tight.

1255
01:03:06,920 --> 01:03:08,919
Speaker 1: We became a lot tighter after the show.

1256
01:03:09,280 --> 01:03:11,640
Speaker 2: Did you like them on the show? Like like them?

1257
01:03:11,680 --> 01:03:11,920
Speaker 1: Like them?

1258
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:13,440
Speaker 2: Do you ever find them attractive? What does it like

1259
01:03:13,480 --> 01:03:13,720
Speaker 2: to kis?

1260
01:03:14,240 --> 01:03:18,360
Speaker 1: We had like a little like minor like fleeing attraction,

1261
01:03:18,520 --> 01:03:19,080
Speaker 1: but it didn't.

1262
01:03:19,280 --> 01:03:22,600
Speaker 2: Like actors are so cool they talk about it like

1263
01:03:22,640 --> 01:03:24,640
Speaker 2: that where it's like we had a little thing, but

1264
01:03:24,680 --> 01:03:28,400
Speaker 2: it didn't. And it's like, that's that's fucking huge, man.

1265
01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:30,240
Speaker 2: Could you imagine anybody else in the world, Like, oh,

1266
01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:33,920
Speaker 2: I had a little thing with fucking looke pair, Like that.

1267
01:03:33,880 --> 01:03:36,600
Speaker 1: Was the thing that defined it was like my second

1268
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:39,080
Speaker 1: and it didn't really you know, go anywhere.

1269
01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:43,040
Speaker 2: Oh my god, bro, just looking at you. It is

1270
01:03:43,080 --> 01:03:46,360
Speaker 2: so crazy because I just remember watching the fucking show.

1271
01:03:46,400 --> 01:03:49,400
Speaker 2: I have a very vivid memory of a show out

1272
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:52,200
Speaker 2: one act break where they were playing there was a

1273
01:03:52,320 --> 01:03:56,400
Speaker 2: very popular song Don't want to Fall in there, and

1274
01:03:56,440 --> 01:03:58,040
Speaker 2: you guys were like at a club and it goes

1275
01:03:58,080 --> 01:04:00,680
Speaker 2: out on you the fade out and shit like that. Like,

1276
01:04:00,720 --> 01:04:04,640
Speaker 2: I have very distinct memories of watching that show is

1277
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:08,360
Speaker 2: culturally very huge and one of the first shows that

1278
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:12,320
Speaker 2: broadcast new episodes in the summer. Yes, we used to

1279
01:04:12,360 --> 01:04:14,320
Speaker 2: be a very seasonal world where it's like you watch

1280
01:04:14,400 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 2: new shows all the way up to time.

1281
01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:17,439
Speaker 1: All of a sudden, we were doing like thirty two

1282
01:04:17,560 --> 01:04:18,480
Speaker 1: thirty six episodes.

1283
01:04:18,640 --> 01:04:21,200
Speaker 2: You guys shooting and much smart because it actually like

1284
01:04:21,240 --> 01:04:23,160
Speaker 2: you guys have brand new ship while everyone else is

1285
01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:23,640
Speaker 2: in rerum.

1286
01:04:23,800 --> 01:04:25,520
Speaker 3: That's how it became popular.

1287
01:04:25,600 --> 01:04:28,080
Speaker 2: That was their Netflix of the day. Like some shows

1288
01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:29,720
Speaker 2: go to Netflix it get popular. You guys.

1289
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:33,000
Speaker 1: The fact that like you could turn on Fox and

1290
01:04:33,040 --> 01:04:36,280
Speaker 1: see brand new episodes of during the summer when everybody

1291
01:04:36,320 --> 01:04:40,160
Speaker 1: else was showing reruns is what blew that show up.

1292
01:04:40,320 --> 01:04:41,720
Speaker 2: And it was all bathing suits shit.

1293
01:04:42,120 --> 01:04:44,240
Speaker 1: And it was at the beach club, so everybody was

1294
01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:45,200
Speaker 1: in bathing suits.

1295
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:48,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, folks can't see. You're not doing video yet. One

1296
01:04:48,040 --> 01:04:49,960
Speaker 2: day you will. But folks are just hearing this, not

1297
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:52,640
Speaker 2: saying this. So what they're not seeing is how like

1298
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:55,160
Speaker 2: fucking insanely great the chann looks good.

1299
01:04:55,200 --> 01:04:57,560
Speaker 1: I love you, thank you so much, and see you

1300
01:04:58,280 --> 01:04:59,720
Speaker 1: for the next episode.