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Speaker 1: Folks, welcome back to the show. We're returning with a

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Speaker 1: classic as we get reacquainted with life on the land.

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Speaker 1: And there was a moment in twenty twenty you'll recall

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Speaker 1: Matt when we were very taken with the darker side

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Speaker 1: of protest.

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Speaker 2: Oh yes, there are a lot of protests happening around

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Speaker 2: this time for a very good reason, and there were

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Speaker 2: a lot of allegations, specifically in the news here in

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Speaker 2: the US, that those protests were turning violent very quickly

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Speaker 2: because of a contingent a group that I'm actually not

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Speaker 2: even going to say right now because I don't want

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Speaker 2: to say it into a microphone.

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Speaker 1: No, wow, yeah, deep or black block protest tactics. The

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Speaker 1: idea here is something called the agent provocateur. It's inherently conspiratorial.

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Speaker 1: We know it's existed in other parts of the world

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Speaker 1: and other protests and other activist movements throughout history. But

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Speaker 1: the concept is this, Let's say you're a tyrant and

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Speaker 1: you've got a ton of people in your local population

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Speaker 1: who are kind of mad at you.

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Speaker 2: Like like seven million of them or something like on

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Speaker 2: a Saturday.

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Speaker 1: Right, right, right, and they are smart enough to know

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Speaker 1: that they want to do peaceful protests. But you need

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Speaker 1: a reason to crack down on these pleabs.

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Speaker 3: Well, like with the National Guard, I dare.

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Speaker 1: Say, well, one of the things is that if you

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Speaker 1: can't encounter the good old organic chaos that would rationalize

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Speaker 1: a crackdown, well you just create it. Why don't you

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Speaker 1: have some kind of agent who could provoke that reaction?

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, we need to get into this.

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Speaker 4: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 4: really with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 4: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 4: production of Iheartrading.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show today. We are recording

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Speaker 2: this on June three, twenty twenty.

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Speaker 3: My name is Matt, my name is Noah.

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Speaker 1: They call me Ben. We are joined as always with

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Speaker 1: our super producer Paul Mission Control decads. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 1: are you. You are here, and that makes this stuff

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Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. As we record today,

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Speaker 1: cities and towns across the United States and the world

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Speaker 1: are the stage and ground for numerous peaceful protests against

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Speaker 1: ongoing police brutality and longstanding discrimination against the Black community

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Speaker 1: of the United States. Escalation has resulted in violence as

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Speaker 1: authorities resort to what are sometimes misleadingly called less than

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Speaker 1: lethal tactics to force these groups to disperse. We are

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Speaker 1: three mostly white dudes, and we stand in solidarity with

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Speaker 1: our fellow black citizens Black lives Matter. Anything said to distract, from, discredit,

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Speaker 1: or dilute that statement goes squarely against the stated principles

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Speaker 1: of this government in its founding documents, and crucially, it

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Speaker 1: goes against what it means to be a human being.

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Speaker 1: We don't have all the answers. It would be false

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Speaker 1: to pretend that we do. The good news is that

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Speaker 1: there are many organizations and activists out there now easy

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Speaker 1: to find, with the resources to help address injustice. And

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Speaker 1: what we can do on this show, as has always been,

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Speaker 1: our aim, is to arm you with information many, including

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Speaker 1: those in power, do not want you to know. With

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Speaker 1: this in mind, to give you and our fellow listeners,

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Speaker 1: crucial information about protest, what they are, how they work,

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Speaker 1: and most importantly, the tactics used by opponents, legal and

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Speaker 1: illegal to sabotage them. So here are the facts.

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Speaker 5: Well, to start off with, the act of protest is

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Speaker 5: in fact your right as a citizen of the United States,

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Speaker 5: regardless of how you might personally feel about these protests

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Speaker 5: or protests in general. It is something that from the

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Speaker 5: very onset the establishment of this country in the US Constitution,

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Speaker 5: has been a primary guiding principle for the United.

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Speaker 3: States as a nation.

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Speaker 5: The right to protest is literally in the first Amendment

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Speaker 5: of the Constitution, stating the obvious here for many. But

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Speaker 5: imagine that lawmakers of the time, the all two imperfect

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Speaker 5: founding fathers, as we refer to them. You know, we're

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Speaker 5: sitting in that back room debating on how to create

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Speaker 5: a living document. And when they wrote the first part

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Speaker 5: of the Constitution, they likely were spitballing back and forth

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Speaker 5: ways to make sure that this could be adaptable to

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Speaker 5: changing circumstances. And when they wrote that very first Amendment,

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Speaker 5: they wrote these.

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Speaker 2: Words, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,

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Speaker 2: or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, or abridging the freedom

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Speaker 2: of speech or of the press, or the right of

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Speaker 2: the people peaceably to assemble and to petition the Government

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Speaker 2: for a redress of grievances.

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Speaker 1: There's definitely some dated language in there, right, and it

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Speaker 1: can be a little bit to unpack, but it's fairly direct, right,

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Speaker 1: it is fairly direct, especially for legal document. In essence,

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Speaker 1: the governments here cannot legally interfere with your religion.

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Speaker 4: One.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's part of why the US is a

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Speaker 1: great place to start a religion. That's a story for

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Speaker 1: another day. It also says that Uncle Sam has to

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Speaker 1: let you and the media say what you want what

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Speaker 1: they want with a massive amount of fine print there

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Speaker 1: that we've covered in some other episodes. And there there's

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Speaker 1: that most important part that you hit Matt for today's show.

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Speaker 1: All people have the right to assemble peaceably or peacefully

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Speaker 1: as we would say. Now, that means this is think

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Speaker 1: about this. That means that literally, if everyone in this

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Speaker 1: country decided to drop what we're doing right now, walk

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Speaker 1: outside to the nearest parks, and we decided to sing

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Speaker 1: the entire catalog of Nickelback, then the constitution is down

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Speaker 1: with that ridiculous decision. And that also means that if

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Speaker 1: you wish, instead of joining some nationwide Nickelback tribute, you

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Speaker 1: can publicly press the government for change.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: I mean, you know, certainly your fellow park attendees might

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Speaker 5: look at you as ants if they're not as into Nickelback.

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Speaker 3: As you are.

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Speaker 5: And there might even be some cops there that would

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Speaker 5: look at you funny, but they certainly wouldn't stop you

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Speaker 5: from doing it. I love the idea of redress of grievances.

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Speaker 5: That's sort of part of that dated language you were mentioning, Ben,

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Speaker 5: But it's really simple. It's the idea of expressing change

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Speaker 5: that you want to see in the status quo and

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Speaker 5: addressing it peacefully in a public setting, and the notion

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Speaker 5: that you should not be interfered with, as long as

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Speaker 5: that peacefully is the keyword there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean on paper, top notch right home, run

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Speaker 1: on paper. This is a series of rights that many, many,

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Speaker 1: many people and many other countries have historically not possessed.

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Speaker 1: And it's a series of rights that many countries do

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Speaker 1: not grant in the modern day. And that's because when

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Speaker 1: everyone in charge of enforcing these laws is in fact

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Speaker 1: obeying the laws that they are supposed to obey, this

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Speaker 1: series of rights is a profoundly powerful thing. But you know,

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Speaker 1: the old adage holds true, right, There's many a slip

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Speaker 1: TwixT the cup and the lip, and the US, again,

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Speaker 1: like many places, has a terrible abominable track record at

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Speaker 1: obeying its own laws.

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Speaker 2: And when a protest is, for one reason or another,

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Speaker 2: something that is not wanted by those in power. There

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Speaker 2: are emergency powers that can be deployed to do all

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Speaker 2: kinds of things, including right now that we're seeing, to

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Speaker 2: enforce curfews, which you know in cities across the United States,

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Speaker 2: there are curfews that are happening tonight, which is in

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Speaker 2: fact an hour earlier than it had been previously tonight. Again,

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Speaker 2: as we record this in Atlanta.

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Speaker 5: Can I say, really really quickly, these curfews are tricky

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Speaker 5: in and of themselves because it's hard to know for

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Speaker 5: folks that are like at work. For example, like a

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Speaker 5: friend of mine was working at a restaurant. They're back

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Speaker 5: at working restaurants waiting tables, and her boss knew about

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Speaker 5: the curfew, but did not share that information with his employees,

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Speaker 5: and they are not allowed to have their phones on

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Speaker 5: them while they're working. So for something like a curfew

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Speaker 5: to be so heavily enforced, heavy handedly enforced, it's really

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Speaker 5: tricky when the information isn't reaching the people who need it.

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Speaker 5: And I've been moving, for example, while all of this

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Speaker 5: has been going on in Atlanta, and a couple of

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Speaker 5: times I didn't get the notification on my phone, and

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Speaker 5: luckily Ben you texted me and made sure I was

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Speaker 5: safe and told me what the curfew was, and I

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Speaker 5: was about fifteen minutes away from missing it. And I've

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Speaker 5: been seeing, you know, a lot of stuff in the

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Speaker 5: news about people very much getting into some difficult situations

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Speaker 5: for missing this curfew, whatever their race might be.

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Speaker 2: And curfews are only one of the tools within the

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Speaker 2: belt of the people's empower and that could be used

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Speaker 2: to quell protesting. And one of the major components to

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Speaker 2: this is that the people who are in power, who

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Speaker 2: are meant to actually enforce the laws to keep law

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Speaker 2: and order, they may have their own agendas. Specifically, they

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Speaker 2: may have an agenda that is in complete opposition to

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Speaker 2: the cause of the protesters.

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Speaker 1: Right right, Remember, back in the days of the nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixties protests, quite a few members of law enforcement were

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Speaker 1: themselves also members of militaristic supremacist organizations, not the right

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Speaker 1: people for the job. In other words, Also, there's trickery

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Speaker 1: in the enforcement of these kind of powers or the

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Speaker 1: deployment the way they're rolled out. The first Atlanta curfew,

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Speaker 1: which was at nine PM, was announced via text at

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Speaker 1: about nine thirteen PM, and protesters were also blocked from egress,

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Speaker 1: so they were going to be subject to violating a

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Speaker 1: curfew that they were physically unable to comply with. These

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Speaker 1: exact problems are why protests matter. These situations themselves prove

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Speaker 1: why protests should remain a fundamental right in this country

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Speaker 1: and why they are so important. They are a direct

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Speaker 1: method of expression that can be used when other channels

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Speaker 1: of expression have become compromised, or when they have failed,

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Speaker 1: when they have collapsed entirely. Look back at history, protests

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Speaker 1: in this country led to voting rights for women. Protests

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Speaker 1: have led to policy change, to the enactment or at

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Speaker 1: least the writing of better laws, and to the repeal

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Speaker 1: of horrific ones. Protests lead to more rights for more people,

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Speaker 1: at least they have the ability to do so. And

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Speaker 1: if you look at the history protests in this country,

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Speaker 1: you will see that they have often been successful. I

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Speaker 1: know that's something that you know, the mainstream media doesn't

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Speaker 1: really talk about when they talk about modern protests. It's

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Speaker 1: safe to pat yourself on the back when you look

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Speaker 1: at history from a distance.

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Speaker 5: Well, and we'll get into this as well, but in

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Speaker 5: the media right now, who are clearly grappling, you know,

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Speaker 5: on how to cover these protests in a measured way.

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Speaker 5: You know, typically journalism is an opinion based so it

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Speaker 5: needs to lean on facts. But the idea of what

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Speaker 5: is a protest, what is a revolt, what is a revolution,

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Speaker 5: what is an uprising? These things are very much front

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Speaker 5: and center in this conversation around what's going on right now,

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Speaker 5: and very quickly a protest can become something more resembling

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Speaker 5: an uprising, and that does typically involve violence and destruction

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Speaker 5: and behavior that can be demonized by those in power

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Speaker 5: and used to discredit a movement.

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Speaker 2: The cold, hard fact is that protests, not always, but

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Speaker 2: generally are against something that is happening within the current

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Speaker 2: power structure, the current system, right, the status quo that exists.

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Speaker 2: And oftentimes, when there are protests, powerful people at the

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Speaker 2: tops of you know, whatever food chain you're thinking of,

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Speaker 2: they won't want to have that change whatever it is

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Speaker 2: that the protester is seeking, because it would mean they

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Speaker 2: would have to change the system itself, would have to

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Speaker 2: change the things that give them, you know, power, and

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Speaker 2: oftentimes money would have to change. I mean, why would

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Speaker 2: someone who is a part of that system, you know,

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Speaker 2: necessarily want to have that done right. I mean, it's

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Speaker 2: kind of a tricky thing to even talk about, but

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Speaker 2: giving away power and money and whatever that thing is,

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Speaker 2: those two would be the probably the highest things. That's

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Speaker 2: not something that happens very often.

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Speaker 5: Willingly no, and really quickly, just to clarify my previous comment,

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Speaker 5: when I was talking about the idea of an uprising

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Speaker 5: versus a protest, so obviously, so much of what we're

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Speaker 5: seeing right now is absolutely peaceful protest. But then you

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Speaker 5: are hearing, like I heard a woman, a black woman

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Speaker 5: on the radio the other day talking about how she

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Speaker 5: wants to just burn it all down because nothing else

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Speaker 5: has worked and the only way to truly enact change

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Speaker 5: is to mess with the power holder's money and to

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Speaker 5: actually do things that will that they will notice, because

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Speaker 5: it's easy to just brush off the idea of a

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Speaker 5: peaceful protest if you're one of those holders of the

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Speaker 5: power that actually can can affect change and you don't

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Speaker 5: want to relinquish that. It's when their money and their

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Speaker 5: property and their infrastructure is threat And this is you know,

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Speaker 5: I'm not trying to get off the subject here because

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Speaker 5: we are talking about something a little different, but that

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Speaker 5: is something that there is, you know, this notion that

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Speaker 5: peaceful protests don't always work, and some of the protests

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Speaker 5: you're talking about them that led to those changes did

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Speaker 5: ultimately turn into something more resembling a revolt or an uprising.

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Speaker 1: And while the times and the circumstances may change, the

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Speaker 1: people in power for a very very long time have

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Speaker 1: commonalities in the tactics that they use to exploit and

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Speaker 1: to exploit a movement to deep power protests and to

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Speaker 1: attempt to essentially hinder the progress of the movements. Associate

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Speaker 1: with those protests, to put them into maybe three broad categories. One,

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Speaker 1: you want to discredit a movement if you're the person

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Speaker 1: in power who feels like, as you said, Matt, you're

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Speaker 1: your status as being one of the halves is threatened.

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Speaker 1: This takes a number of roots. For example, why not

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Speaker 1: associate a movement with something negative, focus media coverage on, say,

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Speaker 1: rioters and looters or property damage rather than the message

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Speaker 1: of that movement. Also launch counter protests, whether astro turfed

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Speaker 1: or whether whipped up by discrediting movements online. All protests

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Speaker 1: now also take place online. That's important to remember and

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Speaker 1: aim those counter protesters, whether they are paid, which is

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Speaker 1: definitely a thing, or however they get there, aim them

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Speaker 1: at the existing protests. All of that happens, and honestly,

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Speaker 1: it is highly unethical, but there are very few laws

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Speaker 1: constraining the use of those tactics. And that's like that

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Speaker 1: does not even count what I what I would say,

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Speaker 1: or the other two officially known and condone tactics like

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Speaker 1: smear tactics.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is a this is a big one

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Speaker 2: that oftentimes isn't even known until years after because this

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Speaker 2: one involves well, really blackmail, specifically finding dirt on you know,

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Speaker 2: leaders within a movement. That is something that really does happen,

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Speaker 2: or you know, using connections within the media or you know,

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Speaker 2: just again with now with the access of social media,

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Speaker 2: you can do it, you know, with a single person

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Speaker 2: and start a rumor to publicly smear or gaslight or

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Speaker 2: you know, like we said.

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Speaker 3: Blackmail some leader of a movement.

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Speaker 2: And we saw this with cointelpro where the government itself

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Speaker 2: was attempting to blackmail doctor Martin Luther King.

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Speaker 5: And it doesn't even take like dirt or blackmail necessarily.

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Speaker 5: It can be just done with rhetoric by reframing a

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Speaker 5: leader of a movement as of radical or as a

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Speaker 5: terrorist or whatever.

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Speaker 3: Like.

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Speaker 5: You know, people in power with a very big megaphone

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Speaker 5: and a very tall bully pulpit can just use their

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Speaker 5: words to reframe someone that has good intentions and has

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Speaker 5: a very just aim and discredit them just using words.

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Speaker 5: And that word gaslighting that you mentioned, I mean, that's

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Speaker 5: what that is is when you're making people who follow

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Speaker 5: them think maybe they're wrong, maybe this person actually is

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Speaker 5: a bad person, and it makes you question your own motivations.

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Speaker 5: And that's a very powerful thing that people in power

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Speaker 5: are able to do just by speaking.

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Speaker 2: Well, no, you're absolutely right, controlling how a protest is

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Speaker 2: viewed by the viewership or listenership within especially television right now,

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Speaker 2: we've seen it where you know, we see words like

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Speaker 2: protest and then also this same group of people doing

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Speaker 2: something described as you know, writers, same group of people

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Speaker 2: described as looters, and oftentimes it's not the same people

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Speaker 2: that are being talked about, but you know, if you

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Speaker 2: look on your screen, it looks the same.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: I guess just what I'm saying is that you can

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Speaker 2: depict the way an end user of media views a

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Speaker 2: group of people specifically in protest by the language you

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Speaker 2: use around those those images.

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Speaker 1: One of the tremendous misconceptions in the modern world today

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Speaker 1: is that there is democratization of media that is not,

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Speaker 1: in fact the case. What is collectively referred to as

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Speaker 1: the media right now has a lot in common with

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Speaker 1: a taco bell menu. I think I've made this comparison before.

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Speaker 1: If you look at, you know, the menu of a

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Speaker 1: drive through a Taco Bell. I'm just picking on them

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Speaker 1: because they're an excellent example. Then you will see what

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Speaker 1: twenty thirty different things on the menu. They all have

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Speaker 1: the same five to ten ingredients. These things are fingers

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Speaker 1: on a hand, and they are meant to appear separate,

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Speaker 1: and that is very much by design. There are the

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Speaker 1: groups who control what you see and what you hear.

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Speaker 1: They are They are far fewer of them then, you know,

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Speaker 1: people would assume that that's something that makes it so

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Speaker 1: easy to do the next category, which is to co

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Speaker 1: opt the movement. It's the next step in controlling the narrative.

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Speaker 1: This is something that you may be hearing reports of

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Speaker 1: in Portland recently. Why the logic is this, and it

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Speaker 1: gets slippery and illegal very quickly. Why bother attacking a

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Speaker 1: leader when you can have an agreement with one, a backdoor,

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Speaker 1: quid pro quo scratching backs kind of deal.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: Furthermore, why make a deal when you can simply create

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Speaker 1: a leader to make the public moves within the protest

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Speaker 1: while also furthering your agenda. Very careful when you know

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Speaker 1: there's someone who who seems new to a community, an

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Speaker 1: activist community, and they have a lot of grand, very

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Speaker 1: extreme ideas, and also have a tendency to tell you

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Speaker 1: if you're a veteran activist what this is really about.

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Speaker 1: The narrative shift is real. I don't want to be alarmist,

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Speaker 1: but it happens. You can also, again, because all of

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Speaker 1: this stuff is occurring online too, you can see the

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Speaker 1: creation of fake accounts meant to push the conversation, just

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Speaker 1: like in the twenty sixteen election and other movements, to

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Speaker 1: try and lead a protest in a direction that people

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Speaker 1: in power wanted to go. Russia has objectively had some

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Speaker 1: great programs with this, and they're very old, like Operation

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Speaker 1: Infection it was called in the US decades and decades

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Speaker 1: and decades ago. It is naive to think that's not

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Speaker 1: happening now.

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Speaker 5: But there's also a massive elephant in the room right now,

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Speaker 5: and it's one that's often ignored by the mainstream media

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Speaker 5: that we're talking about those fingers on the same hand,

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Speaker 5: those taco bell ingredients. But common knowledge to folks who

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Speaker 5: are veterans in the protest game, and that's that whenever

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Speaker 5: there's a peaceful gathering of protesters, that somehow becomes violent,

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Speaker 5: no matter what the scale of the violence is. Again,

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Speaker 5: it's all about those optics and the interpretation of Okay,

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Speaker 5: this is now giving us the cause to push the

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Speaker 5: button to quell said violence. These peacekeeping forces now have

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Speaker 5: a reason to pull the trigger on this idea of okay,

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Speaker 5: this is now no longer a peaceable assembly redressing grievances.

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Speaker 5: Now we are moving into go mode to quell that violence,

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Speaker 5: aka shut down that protest. So the big question today

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Speaker 5: is how and why do peaceful protests in cities across

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Speaker 5: the entire planet, but particularly in the US so often

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Speaker 5: result in these kinds of incidents that involve destruction of

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Speaker 5: property or violence. What is there to gain from this?

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Speaker 5: Why is this happening?

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Speaker 2: And we'll talk about that right after a quick word

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Speaker 2: from our sponsor.

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Speaker 1: Here's where it gets crazy. The first an important point.

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Speaker 4: It is not.

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Speaker 1: It is not our aim to tell anyone how to protest,

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Speaker 1: and it would be offensive to do so. This, however,

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Speaker 1: is again a mission to arm you with information, to

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Speaker 1: arm you with things people in power do not want

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Speaker 1: you to know. And one of the things that people

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Speaker 1: in power do not want you to know about protests

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Speaker 1: is that there are numerous bad actors. There is enormous

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Speaker 1: opportunity for people on the ground to exploit, to exploit

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Speaker 1: the actual cause, the actual motivating force of a protest

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Speaker 1: or a movement, for their own insidious and the farius ends.

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Speaker 1: This is not a conspiracy theory. This is a conspiracy.

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Speaker 1: Everything that you are going to hear in this episode

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Speaker 1: this point on definitely is true and it should alarm you.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about infiltration. Longtime listeners, you already know the

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Speaker 1: elephant in the room here is what is called the

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Speaker 1: agent provocateur. But let's get some background first.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and just quick background on that search term. If

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Speaker 2: you put in agent provocateur without some other terms, you're

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Speaker 2: going to get a lingerie company.

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Speaker 3: So just be aware of that.

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Speaker 2: Not very helpful when researching something like this. For some

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Speaker 2: of this, I kind of want to start it with

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Speaker 2: an article from the in New York Times that was

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Speaker 2: written by Jim Dwyer in two thousand and five, just

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Speaker 2: because it gives some much needed background here and this

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Speaker 2: is a fairly long quote here, but we're going to

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Speaker 2: go with it and then we'll build off of it.

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Speaker 2: Here's the quote. The federal courts have long held that

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Speaker 2: undercover officers can monitor political activities for a quote, legitimate

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Speaker 2: law enforcement purpose. While the police routinely conduct undercover operations

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Speaker 2: in plainly criminal circumstances the illegal sale of weapons, for example,

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Speaker 2: surveillance at political events is laden with ambiguity to retain cover.

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Speaker 2: In those settings, officers might take part in public dialogue, debate,

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Speaker 2: and demonstration at the risk of influencing others to alter

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Speaker 2: opinions or behavior. The authority of the police to conduct

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Speaker 2: surveillance of First Amendment activities has been shaped over the years,

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Speaker 2: not only by the law, but also by the politics

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Speaker 2: of the movement and the perception of public safety needs.

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Speaker 2: In a nineteen seventy one class action lawsuit, New York

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Speaker 2: City acknowledged that the police department had used infiltraders, undercover agents,

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Speaker 2: and fake news reporters to spy on quote yippies, civil

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Speaker 2: rights advocates, anti war activists, labor organizers, and black power groups.

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Speaker 5: But all that was under like the auspices of like,

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Speaker 5: we just want to keep an eye on it in

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Speaker 5: case so that we can maintain law and order. It's

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Speaker 5: not necessarily to shut down protests, you know, on paper,

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Speaker 5: it's not necessarily to discredit any of these organizations on paper.

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Speaker 5: The idea was, we need to be able to, you know,

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Speaker 5: have our finger on the pulse of what's going on

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Speaker 5: with these types of organizations.

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Speaker 2: Right, perhaps, But the important thing here is that law

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Speaker 2: enforcement has infiltrated these groups, perhaps prior to a protest

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Speaker 2: taking place.

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Speaker 1: Just like several years ago, the FBI was caught out

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Speaker 1: because they had sent people to infiltrate Muslim community here

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Speaker 1: in the United States, and these infiltrators were attempting to

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Speaker 1: radicalize people, it's called, right, attempting to say, let's let's

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Speaker 1: start building some bombs, let's start committing you know, these

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Speaker 1: felonious acts. And this disturbed the members of these communities

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Speaker 1: so much that they reported the FBI's own agents to

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Speaker 1: the FBI and said, please arrest these people. Well, it's

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Speaker 1: like entrapment, right, yes, yeah, it's very it's very close.

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Speaker 1: There will be lawyers who disagree, but I would say

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Speaker 1: it's unethical to pretend that it's not. And this is

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Speaker 1: like an agent provocateur. Think of it like genre and subgenre.

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Speaker 1: An agent provocateur is a genre category of this phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: Not every protester is who they purport to be, as

437
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: noted in this earlier video we have which is a

438
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: little dated but still holds up in terms of tactics, and.

439
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:05,679
Speaker 2: You can find it by the way. You have to

440
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:10,119
Speaker 2: search for Dirty Tricks Agent Provocateur and it's on the

441
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 2: Old House Stuff Works YouTube channel, just so everybody knows.

442
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, these these protesters, or these people purporting to

443
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 1: be protesters, have a different underlying agenda, an ulterior motive,

444
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:30,520
Speaker 1: and this is known as the agent provocateur. A couple

445
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:34,439
Speaker 1: examples someone who is not associated with a movement but

446
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: is present to incite these acts of violence to push

447
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: people there. And again, this is not the same thing

448
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,760
Speaker 1: as saying the only good protest is a peaceful one

449
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 1: where we're just presenting the facts. This is the aim

450
00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,560
Speaker 1: of the agent provocateur. They're the people who for some

451
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 1: reason want citizens and law enforcement to clash.

452
00:28:57,240 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 3: And these these.

453
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 1: Agent provocateur have their own categories as well. They are

454
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: not all the same. Some are ideologically motivated, they're unpaid.

455
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: They might be someone like an anarchist, which I think

456
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:14,000
Speaker 1: is of course an umbrella term. I don't want to

457
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 1: paint a broad brush here, but there might be members

458
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,840
Speaker 1: of some anarchist groups or factions of some anarchist groups

459
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 1: who say, I don't care what this protest is about,

460
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: but I do care to dismantle a system right or

461
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 1: to create chaos, to become an agent of chaos. You'll

462
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: also see people who are ideologically camouflaging themselves, like the

463
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 1: alt right Proud Boy groups you know, confirmed in the

464
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: Pacific Northwest, who participated in the recent protest with the

465
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: express cause of inciding violence.

466
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 2: And there's also an immediate example we could point to

467
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 2: that just happened god a few days ago, where an

468
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 2: unknown person holding an umbrella and wearing a gas mask

469
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 2: came up and just began smashing windows when there was

470
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:10,360
Speaker 2: a peaceful assembly occurring, and it just seemed like it

471
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,960
Speaker 2: was for no reason. And you know, there were all

472
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,280
Speaker 2: kinds of rumors on social media and a couple of

473
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 2: videos made of this person where he was purported, you know,

474
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 2: allegedly to be a police officer, then allegedly to be

475
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 2: an anarchist. And it's just at this point, unless you

476
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,520
Speaker 2: guys have other knowledge, this person is unknown. But they

477
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 2: certainly they made it to where a report could go

478
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 2: out to the police then that vandalism had occurred in

479
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 2: this one specific area, which could potentially then send a

480
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 2: police force to that immediate area.

481
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 1: And this tactic is older than police forces. It is

482
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: much much older than you may think. It was something

483
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 1: that the human species figured out in ancient times. This happened,

484
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 1: you know, this is older than the the The reason

485
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 1: the term is French is it comes from modern undercover

486
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: operations that were instituted in France in the early eighteen hundreds.

487
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: But the reason people keep using agent provocateur tactics is

488
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 1: because they work. I mean, you mentioned co intel Pro earlier, Matt,

489
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 1: just to be specific about that. During co Intel Pro,

490
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 1: which has arguably never ended, maybe just changed names, the

491
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 1: way that Blackwater became Academy became X or whatever. During

492
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 1: co intel Pro's activities, FBI agents infiltrated groups, and they

493
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: infiltrated protests. They were supposed to be monitoring these things,

494
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:49,280
Speaker 1: but they also disrupted and sabotaged them. These groups include

495
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 1: things like the ku Klux Klan, the KKK, but they

496
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 1: also include things like the American Indian Movement. They include

497
00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: things like student groups that were considered dangerously left wing

498
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 1: by the people in power. And we know this continues

499
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 1: into the modern day easily.

500
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 5: Yeah. I mean, the ACLU called for an investigation of

501
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 5: possible Denver PD agents attempting to incite violence against police

502
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,880
Speaker 5: during the two thousand and eight Democratic National Convention, and

503
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,240
Speaker 5: someone who's a member of law enforcement or a faction

504
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,719
Speaker 5: of the government could absolutely be considered an agent provocateur.

505
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:37,560
Speaker 5: Undercover officers are often known to use tactics to kind

506
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 5: of escalate these protests, especially in the United States. Officially,

507
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 5: they're there to maintain the peace and protect everyone involved,

508
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 5: but that absolutely changes when someone associated with the law

509
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 5: purposefully tries to spark violence by damaging property or urging

510
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 5: peaceful protesters. To that point you made earlier ben about

511
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 5: the Muslim community trying to kind of entrap or incite.

512
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 5: I guess in trap maybe is too loaded a term.

513
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 5: Peaceful protesters to attack police or damage property.

514
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 2: And We saw an example of this in two thousand

515
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 2: and seven that's included in our video where in Canada

516
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 2: there was a pretty large peaceful protest occurring and three

517
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:24,960
Speaker 2: men who were wearing all black and covering their faces,

518
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 2: and at least one of them was carrying a rock,

519
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 2: and they, you know, appeared to be acting very aggressive

520
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,440
Speaker 2: towards police and they were called out by the peaceful protesters.

521
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:40,560
Speaker 2: And you can watch videos on this right now, you

522
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 2: can check it out, and you can just see how

523
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 2: those men then crossed the police line and were it

524
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 2: looked like they were being arrested perhaps, but they were,

525
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 2: you know, just taken away to somewhere else, probably went

526
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 2: back to their post.

527
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 1: Who knows theatrically arrested, I would say for sure.

528
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 5: And even right now, I mean, there's obviously so much

529
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 5: information and everyone's got a camera, you know, on their phone,

530
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 5: so there's there's a flood of videos and information that's

531
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 5: out there surrounding the protests that they're going on right now.

532
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 5: But I saw a video where it was someone calling

533
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 5: out the police for damaging their own car. It's it's

534
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,000
Speaker 5: a video where you can literally see a police SUV

535
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:26,279
Speaker 5: type vehicle and a gentlemen in police uniforms standing on

536
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 5: top of it and smashing the window themselves and and

537
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 5: damaging the car. You know, it was in the distance.

538
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,880
Speaker 5: Perhaps it's it's easy to misconstrue what's actually going on,

539
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 5: but that certainly was the impression that the person making

540
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 5: the video had. They called them out and said, I

541
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 5: see what you're doing. I see what you're doing.

542
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:49,320
Speaker 1: One common question would be how do piles of bricks

543
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 1: conveniently end up on sidewalks approaching you know, approaching a

544
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 1: protests And you will see people claiming that it is

545
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 1: in fact law enforcement that's doing that. But there's another

546
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: question here too that we need to outline. Should be

547
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: It may be painfully obvious, but we need to outline it.

548
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:11,879
Speaker 1: What is the goal here for an agent provocateur? Who

549
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:17,920
Speaker 1: are these people who are camouflaging themselves physically and ideologically

550
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: in order to perpetrate this counterintelligence, these acts of deceit. Well,

551
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 1: there can be more than one aim. First, the first

552
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:30,880
Speaker 1: aim is, as as you guys mentioned earlier, to somehow

553
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:37,720
Speaker 1: make incredibly violent crackdowns by law enforcement seem not just

554
00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 1: justified but inevitable, to make them seem to be the

555
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: right sort of thing to do. The police in this

556
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: country are and have been heavily militarized in a process that,

557
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 1: by the way, occurred in step with massive defunding of education.

558
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna point that out. And the second goal

559
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 1: would be too discredit a movement because again, like we've said,

560
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 1: we can't see it enough. Watch watch your local news.

561
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 1: And if if one thing happens that would be violent.

562
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 1: If one thing happens that fits the definition of you know,

563
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,880
Speaker 1: that which bleeds is that which leads, then that is

564
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:24,160
Speaker 1: what the media will tend to talk about. And they will, uh,

565
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 1: they will tend to it. Sounds like in pain with

566
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 1: a broadbrush, but there is a common prevalence here of

567
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 1: focusing on that sort of stuff, and then when that happens,

568
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: that is all the news cycle talks about. There's no

569
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 1: more talk of what what the aims of the protest were,

570
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: what kind of what kind of change would the protesters

571
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: like to see? What kind of world do we want

572
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,640
Speaker 1: to live in? It's just a target get robbed.

573
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, It's a very easy way of reframing the narrative

574
00:36:55,400 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 5: and bearing the lead and changing the conversation. It's a

575
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 5: way of hijacking that cause and turning it into demonizing

576
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 5: the byproducts of that cause, which may very well have

577
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 5: been entirely peaceful, but then are completely reframed, Like we

578
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:18,960
Speaker 5: were talking about earlier, how you can discredit a movement

579
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 5: with purely just with rhetoric and the way that you

580
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 5: refer to things, and with the news cycle, and that

581
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 5: starts in positions of power and often filters down to

582
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:29,719
Speaker 5: the news organizations.

583
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 2: I would just say, I'm in a position where I've

584
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 2: been looking at a lot of archival footage of the

585
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 2: civil rights movement in the assassination of doctor Martin Luther King,

586
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 2: and what you're talking about here, guys, is exactly what

587
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 2: you can see in the reporting that immediately follows the

588
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:49,439
Speaker 2: nineteen sixty eight assassination of doctor Martin Luther King, where

589
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 2: there was such anger and fear and unrest that immediately

590
00:37:55,000 --> 00:38:00,839
Speaker 2: followed that assassination that there were massive protests. There was

591
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:06,800
Speaker 2: you know, to an extent, some a bit of I

592
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 2: don't know how you describe it, just there were a

593
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 2: lot of people on the streets, and there was smashing

594
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 2: of windows and breaking into of stores that occurred. But

595
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 2: the framing on this, you know, very dated at this point.

596
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 2: Media and mass media that was coming out and reporting

597
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 2: about it. It's all framed on the you know quote

598
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:30,240
Speaker 2: looting and the very similar way that you're seeing today

599
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 2: looting in riots.

600
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,399
Speaker 5: Well, it's it's a way of saying, oh, if you're

601
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 5: going to behave like this, you don't deserve the change

602
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 5: that you so desperately seek, you know, because look at

603
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,319
Speaker 5: the way you're behaving. You know, if you really deserved

604
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:46,480
Speaker 5: this thing that you want, you would go about it

605
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:50,320
Speaker 5: a different way. That's me speaking like as the voice

606
00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:53,080
Speaker 5: of you know, the powers that be, and that's the

607
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:55,560
Speaker 5: way the conversation is attempted.

608
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 3: To be steered.

609
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 1: And speaking of steering the conversation, I'm going to take

610
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 1: us back to an aim of agent provocateurs that needs

611
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 1: to be said. Okay, and this is something that this

612
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 1: is something that is terrifying, but it is also real

613
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:14,799
Speaker 1: at least in terms of an aim, and that is

614
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 1: the goal of not just strengthening a rationalization for the

615
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:24,399
Speaker 1: actions of the oppositional forces, but to spark a larger conflict.

616
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 1: I'm not talking about, you know, making a situation where

617
00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 1: innocent people are arrested, which agent provocateurs do I'm talking

618
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,080
Speaker 1: about creating something that goes beyond the scope of a

619
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 1: single protest, widespread unrest and violence, a coup, a civil war.

620
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:45,200
Speaker 1: There are groups. There are are groups, now you can

621
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 1: find them. Robert Evans has done some excellent reporting on

622
00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:52,840
Speaker 1: this where where there are groups that are openly advocating

623
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: to push things toward a civil war. I cannot recommend

624
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:01,640
Speaker 1: his podcast, it could happen enough. I do suggest you

625
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 1: check it out as soon as you have the time.

626
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,759
Speaker 1: And these are just a few examples. We have more

627
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 1: specific examples, including first party confessions that said, yes, I

628
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: did this, I did this on purpose. Here's why.

629
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean.

630
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 5: In twenty eleven, The Guardian reported that a gentleman named

631
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 5: Patrick Howley, who was the assistant editor at the American Spectator,

632
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:28,200
Speaker 5: actually admitted to having infiltrated and occupy Wall Street protest

633
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 5: that was held at the Smithsonians National Air and Space Museum,

634
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 5: specifically with the aim of discrediting it. And here's a

635
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 5: quote directly from the man himself. Quote, as far as

636
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,640
Speaker 5: anyone knew, I was part of this cause, a cause

637
00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:44,600
Speaker 5: that I had infiltrated the day before in order to

638
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:48,799
Speaker 5: mock and undermine in the pages of the American Spectator.

639
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:51,880
Speaker 5: And I wasn't giving up before I had my story.

640
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you continue reading on in this article, it

641
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 2: describes how there were guards at the protest, you know,

642
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 2: officers essentially, who used pepper spray on a lot of

643
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 2: the protesters who were attempting to enter into the museum.

644
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 2: And when you look at Halley's account, you know, he

645
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: continues on and condemns the protesters and this is what

646
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 2: he says. Quote, he condemns their lack of nerve to

647
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:24,080
Speaker 2: confront authority, and he he himself wanted to escalate things

648
00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 2: like that was kind of the point he was, was

649
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,680
Speaker 2: fully determined to do that, and he rushed, he rushed

650
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 2: past the security guards into the museum. And it's it's

651
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 2: crazy too if you go back and you try and

652
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 2: find his official accounting of it or the story that

653
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 2: he wrote about it, because I was unable to find

654
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:47,080
Speaker 2: an undoctored version of it. I can only find it

655
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 2: in this or I guess a version of it like

656
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 2: this in the Guardian.

657
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:53,680
Speaker 5: And just really quickly, The American Spectator is a far

658
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:55,320
Speaker 5: right conservative publication.

659
00:41:56,280 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, your pere's the magazine, Uh so altered the story

660
00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:05,800
Speaker 1: right and then pulled it, tried to pull it entirely,

661
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:10,320
Speaker 1: but it had already been reported in papers of note

662
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 1: the Washington Post, had been reported in online sources that

663
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:20,080
Speaker 1: are opposed to far right publications, places like fire Dog, Lake,

664
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:25,160
Speaker 1: Daily Coasts. We mentioned the earlier example of agent provocateur

665
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 1: or undercovers in New York, but there's another specific instance

666
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:34,880
Speaker 1: that resulted in actual criminal charges. This person was convicted,

667
00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 1: they went to prison.

668
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:37,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's true.

669
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:42,799
Speaker 5: An undercover motorcycle officer, an unnamed undercover motorcycle officer was

670
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 5: caught on video breaking into a car window and actually

671
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 5: assaulting the driver of a vehicle that had hit another

672
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 5: motorcycle and in twenty fifteen he was sent to prison

673
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 5: for second degree assault, coercion, riot, and criminal mischief.

674
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 2: And just to continue on here, we haven't finished talking

675
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:06,600
Speaker 2: about the different kinds of Asia provocateurs here. There are

676
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,880
Speaker 2: different versions. In one of them, Ben you already mentioned,

677
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:13,160
Speaker 2: called or a tactic at least called astroturfing.

678
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 1: Astroturfing is when something that appears to be a grassroots

679
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 1: on the ground movement or community is in fact the

680
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:30,759
Speaker 1: creation of, often a front company or political institution that

681
00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 1: is funneling power from the status quo into their so

682
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:42,360
Speaker 1: called protest. Again, it's camouflage. Some people who appear to

683
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 1: protest are paid to do so, where they're being organized

684
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 1: by front groups that are funded by powerful corporations, powerful institutions.

685
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 1: There's an article I quite like and recommend from the

686
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 1: La Times, and this tells the story of this an

687
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:01,880
Speaker 1: old one who this from twenty eighteen. It tells the

688
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:05,040
Speaker 1: story of a firm called Crowds on Demand. Have you

689
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 1: guys heard of these people?

690
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 3: No, Ben, I've never heard of that. What tell me

691
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 3: about it?

692
00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:15,799
Speaker 1: So Crowds on Demand is firm based or was at

693
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:20,160
Speaker 1: the time, a firm based in Beverly Hills that hires protesters.

694
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:22,800
Speaker 1: Back in the day, you could go to its website

695
00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:26,320
Speaker 1: and you would see that it provides its clients quote protests, rallies,

696
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:32,160
Speaker 1: flash mobs, paparazzi events, other inventive pr stunts. We provide everything,

697
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:37,000
Speaker 1: including the people, the materials, and even the ideas. But

698
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 1: what kind of stuff have they been hired to do?

699
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:44,440
Speaker 1: They're hiring actors to do things like lobby the City

700
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:48,440
Speaker 1: Council of New Orleans on behalf of power plants, or

701
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 1: to act like fake fans for life coaches at conferences

702
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:57,560
Speaker 1: in LA. It runs the gamut. There was also someone

703
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:01,279
Speaker 1: who you know, there was a low suit filed that

704
00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 1: said the Crowds on Demand organization does much more shady stuff.

705
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:11,360
Speaker 1: And you know, we can make this an episode of

706
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:14,000
Speaker 1: its own, but it has to be mentioned here.

707
00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:18,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree, this is an entire episode. You have

708
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 2: probably read things online, either rumors or purported facts about

709
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 2: various powerful people using such organizations like Crowds on Demand

710
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:35,600
Speaker 2: to get people either to political rallies or to you know,

711
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 2: stand outside of a building in Washington, DC or something.

712
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,280
Speaker 2: You know, you undoubtedly have seen that stuff going around,

713
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:47,200
Speaker 2: and let's just say we're going to continue to look

714
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:47,600
Speaker 2: into it.

715
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 1: Again. These are facts. This is happening. This is a

716
00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:55,040
Speaker 1: for people who are unconcerned with the ethics. This is

717
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 1: a good business for them to be in. They are

718
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 1: a kind of what is called an opportunists. The people

719
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:05,120
Speaker 1: who start at Crowds on Demand are opportunists. There's a

720
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:09,160
Speaker 1: different thing that I think will qualify as opportunists in

721
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:15,359
Speaker 1: this realm of navigating how protests work and how these

722
00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:18,279
Speaker 1: bad actors work in them bad actors. Then I guess

723
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:21,120
Speaker 1: is a poor choice of words given crowds on demand.

724
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 1: But of course there are opportunists involved. When you see

725
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 1: reports talking specifically to the people who for some reason say,

726
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:39,040
Speaker 1: you know, I don't support this cause because I see

727
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:43,120
Speaker 1: it depicted as you know, associated with acts of violence.

728
00:46:43,960 --> 00:46:48,239
Speaker 1: Opportunists are real. It's part of human nature. And think

729
00:46:48,239 --> 00:46:51,360
Speaker 1: about it. If you want to rob a store, for instance,

730
00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:55,320
Speaker 1: and there is a protest going on, or unrest or

731
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 1: a riot in a neighborhood, right, what better time? What

732
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:05,040
Speaker 1: better time to strike? Law enforcement is distracted, possibly overwhelmed,

733
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: possibly in the midst of harming civilians. Typical response times

734
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 1: are just going to be slower depending on your location.

735
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 1: And if you want to rob a store located in

736
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 1: the same area as a protest, you can potentially get

737
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:20,440
Speaker 1: the power of numbers on your side.

738
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 5: Then there's a lot of videos. I don't know if

739
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:27,040
Speaker 5: opportunitists is the right word here, but of folks that

740
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 5: are doing graffiti, whether it's Black Lives Matter graffiti or

741
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 5: like you know, a cab you know, the term of

742
00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 5: abuse for all cops or bastards and all of this

743
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 5: kind of graffiti that we're seeing now, there's lots of

744
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:44,840
Speaker 5: video circulating where actual peaceful protesters are walking up to

745
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 5: these individuals doing this and saying, why are you doing this?

746
00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:50,400
Speaker 5: We didn't ask you to do this, Like people of

747
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:53,480
Speaker 5: color are walking up to you know, maybe white marchers

748
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:55,839
Speaker 5: or whatever who are doing this and say, who asked

749
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 5: you to do this? This is not helpful. And there's

750
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:01,600
Speaker 5: a lot of these videosating where you know, folks are

751
00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 5: getting in each other's faces because they're saying, oh, well,

752
00:48:04,520 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 5: I did it because I support the cause, and then

753
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,319
Speaker 5: they're basically saying, well, this is not helping us, this

754
00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:11,319
Speaker 5: is not supporting the cause. So I don't know if

755
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:13,759
Speaker 5: you would blump those folks in as opportunitists or if

756
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:17,480
Speaker 5: they're just maybe overstepping I don't know, but it definitely

757
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 5: some folks just want to watch the world burn and

758
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:22,600
Speaker 5: want to get out there and cause trouble. And what

759
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:24,520
Speaker 5: better opportunity to be able to go out there and

760
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:28,240
Speaker 5: do that than, you know, masquerading behind a cause.

761
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:34,000
Speaker 2: So there you have it. There are just numerous examples

762
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:40,280
Speaker 2: of someone, some group, some individual infiltrating a peaceful protest

763
00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:44,200
Speaker 2: movement for one reason or another, for varying you know,

764
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 2: seeking varying outcomes, for doing so. So let's say that

765
00:48:50,040 --> 00:48:53,720
Speaker 2: you find yourself in the midst of a protest, peaceful

766
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:58,240
Speaker 2: or otherwise, what do you need to do to prepare yourself.

767
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about that right after a word

768
00:49:00,800 --> 00:49:02,000
Speaker 2: from our sponsor.

769
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:10,920
Speaker 1: And at the top of this section, it's important to

770
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:14,120
Speaker 1: thank everybody who reached out to us or to the

771
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:21,239
Speaker 1: show to ask about this information. We're going to run

772
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:27,120
Speaker 1: through real quick, some basic things, some basic resources for protests. Again,

773
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:30,840
Speaker 1: this is not in any way meant to tell anyone

774
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:34,880
Speaker 1: anything about how to protest. These are safety tips that

775
00:49:34,920 --> 00:49:40,280
Speaker 1: have been time tested, right, and protests are approved. Organizations

776
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:45,920
Speaker 1: like Amnesty International have these brilliant handy checklists that you

777
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 1: can and should consult before hitting the streets. This is

778
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:54,840
Speaker 1: not the time for improvisation. Here are a few tips.

779
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:58,759
Speaker 1: We've got a physical checklist, right, Some basic things you

780
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:01,640
Speaker 1: should consider when testing clothing, right.

781
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, ideally you want some kind of sturdy booths, some

782
00:50:03,960 --> 00:50:05,160
Speaker 2: shoes they're in.

783
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,240
Speaker 3: A stand up to having to run.

784
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:10,880
Speaker 2: And also be careful not to wear you know, maybe

785
00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:15,440
Speaker 2: military surplus boots that are often worn by undercovered police officers,

786
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 2: because you you don't want to be accused of that

787
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:18,399
Speaker 2: for sure.

788
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:20,280
Speaker 3: Sturdy pants are important.

789
00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:22,880
Speaker 2: Long sleeve top is going to be important, and something

790
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:25,040
Speaker 2: you can use to cover your face of your head

791
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:28,680
Speaker 2: in case tear gas or something else is released that's

792
00:50:28,680 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 2: going to make it difficult for you to breathe.

793
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, and you know this is almost like it reminds

794
00:50:33,520 --> 00:50:35,440
Speaker 5: me of our go bag episode. You know, these are

795
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:38,040
Speaker 5: just very functional tips of things that maybe you wouldn't

796
00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 5: necessarily think of, but that are going to you know,

797
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:42,360
Speaker 5: go a long way for you. Water in a plastic

798
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:45,800
Speaker 5: bottle seems obvious, but a squirt top if possible, because

799
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 5: you may be able to use that to flush out

800
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:51,760
Speaker 5: chemicals from your eyes. That's going to be really important,

801
00:50:51,880 --> 00:50:55,520
Speaker 5: and that giving that stream a little more force is

802
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:58,200
Speaker 5: going to help make that happen and flush out tear

803
00:50:58,200 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 5: gas potentially from your eyes, which, as it turns out,

804
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:04,799
Speaker 5: is like a powder that is that is converted into

805
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,320
Speaker 5: a mist. It's not even a liquid, So it's literally

806
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:10,880
Speaker 5: like washing out you know, solids that have found their

807
00:51:10,920 --> 00:51:12,719
Speaker 5: way into your eyes. So the only way to do

808
00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:15,879
Speaker 5: that is you know, what better alternative to an eye

809
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 5: wash station like in a science lab than a pressure,

810
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:22,239
Speaker 5: you know, propelled stream of water from a from a

811
00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 5: squirt top water bottle. And also a little additive would

812
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 5: be to have some baking soda on hand that you

813
00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 5: can add to that water solution three teaspoons of powder

814
00:51:33,239 --> 00:51:36,120
Speaker 5: for every eight and a half ounces of liquid. And

815
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:38,319
Speaker 5: then you know, just stuff like snacks to keep your

816
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 5: energy up, you know, like like a kind bar, like

817
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,000
Speaker 5: like you know those what are those called cliff bars?

818
00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:48,240
Speaker 5: Things like that, anything that like is very nutrient dense

819
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 5: in a small package.

820
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:54,160
Speaker 1: One quick important note about whether or not you should

821
00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:57,719
Speaker 1: bring your ID or an ID with you to a protest.

822
00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:01,880
Speaker 1: The laws may vary state by state, so be sure

823
00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:05,520
Speaker 1: to check in advance before you hit the streets. We'll

824
00:52:05,560 --> 00:52:08,440
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about this in organization, but the

825
00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:12,319
Speaker 1: one I would say one crucial point to remember is

826
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:17,400
Speaker 1: to physically write a contact number on your arm for

827
00:52:17,719 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 1: legal assistance. Don't make the mistake of thinking that you'll

828
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 1: have a phone or that you'll have your phone working,

829
00:52:25,280 --> 00:52:28,560
Speaker 1: because you may be offered a chance if you're arrested

830
00:52:28,719 --> 00:52:31,960
Speaker 1: entertained to make one phone call, and if you don't

831
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:34,279
Speaker 1: have that number with you, you may not be able to

832
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:35,800
Speaker 1: find it, So write it on yourself.

833
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:39,960
Speaker 2: Definitely bring some kind of money in the United States,

834
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:42,120
Speaker 2: it's going to be paper. You might need this for

835
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:46,759
Speaker 2: some kind of emergency situation, transportation, food, whatever it is.

836
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:49,840
Speaker 2: Just make sure you don't carry a bunch of cash,

837
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:53,160
Speaker 2: because as we said, there are going to be undoubtedly

838
00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 2: some opportunists around, or at least in a lot of cases,

839
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,360
Speaker 2: there will be some who may see that as an

840
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:01,280
Speaker 2: opportunity to take your money.

841
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,960
Speaker 1: And to be clear that that term could apply to

842
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:07,839
Speaker 1: unethical police officers or law enforcement as.

843
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:10,960
Speaker 5: Well, speaking of which, you know, you want to have

844
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 5: a watch, you want to have paper and a pen.

845
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:16,160
Speaker 5: You don't want to necessarily rely on your phone. But

846
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:18,960
Speaker 5: I also saw a really interesting point where you may

847
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 5: want to turn off face recognition unlocking from your phone

848
00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:28,160
Speaker 5: because a bad actor law enforcement agent could just hold

849
00:53:28,160 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 5: it up to your face and then have access to

850
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:35,720
Speaker 5: your entire your your entire contact list, any potential notes

851
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:38,200
Speaker 5: that you have, you know, and could just go through

852
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:41,840
Speaker 5: your whole life on your phone and use that information

853
00:53:41,960 --> 00:53:42,400
Speaker 5: against you.

854
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 2: I would say perhaps a track phone would be a

855
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 2: good idea rather than your actual phone, because you know,

856
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 2: as we've talked about in previous episodes, there is tracking technology.

857
00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 2: When there are a lot of people gathered in something

858
00:53:56,040 --> 00:53:59,560
Speaker 2: like this, especially if it's a political protest where law

859
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,479
Speaker 2: enforcement of one kind or another, maybe tracking to see

860
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:03,200
Speaker 2: who is there.

861
00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:06,640
Speaker 1: An airplane mode doesn't really make a difference, to be

862
00:54:06,680 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 1: honest with you. The only thing that would make a

863
00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:14,280
Speaker 1: big difference it would be physically removing the battery or

864
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:18,640
Speaker 1: placing a phone in a faraday cage, essentially a basic

865
00:54:18,680 --> 00:54:22,000
Speaker 1: first aid kid if you have room. Remember you're there

866
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:26,800
Speaker 1: to support and help your fellow protesters and help your cause,

867
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:32,359
Speaker 1: not there to get some kind of congratulatory selfie. Last thing,

868
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:37,719
Speaker 1: eye protection. Don't wear contacts. These are small, very basic things.

869
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:40,600
Speaker 1: They're there to protect you. What about an organization?

870
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:43,279
Speaker 5: Really quickly, just back to social media. I thought it

871
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:46,680
Speaker 5: was very interesting how there was this blackout Tuesday situation

872
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:50,080
Speaker 5: where people were posting these black squares on Instagram and

873
00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 5: there was very quickly a backlash against that because people

874
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 5: were using the hashtag black lives matter, and it really

875
00:54:57,560 --> 00:55:00,840
Speaker 5: it is so important. These hashtags seems frivolous when you

876
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:02,960
Speaker 5: think about, Oh, social media is all about, you know,

877
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:06,160
Speaker 5: showing out and being seen and you know, kind of

878
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:08,279
Speaker 5: lifestyle stuff. But when it comes to stuff like this,

879
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 5: those kinds of hashtags are how that information is organized.

880
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,280
Speaker 5: So if you co opt a hashtag like black Lives

881
00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:17,640
Speaker 5: Matter for a black square, that's sort of a you know,

882
00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:19,719
Speaker 5: I don't want to call it performative, it's definitely an

883
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:22,799
Speaker 5: act of solidarity. And I did it myself, but very

884
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:27,120
Speaker 5: quickly people started posting, yo, don't use that hashtag because

885
00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:32,200
Speaker 5: you're erasing other people's actually valuable information that is using

886
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:35,440
Speaker 5: that hashtag, and that's organized, you know, ways to search for,

887
00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:38,600
Speaker 5: you know, up to the minute information. So they created

888
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:41,239
Speaker 5: a you know, a hashtag blackout Tuesday. So I just

889
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:44,160
Speaker 5: think that's interesting how important social media is and all.

890
00:55:44,040 --> 00:55:44,760
Speaker 3: Of this kind of stuff.

891
00:55:45,600 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 1: Another another important basic thing to be aware of is organization.

892
00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:51,600
Speaker 1: You know, as you said at the top of this,

893
00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 1: it's not the time for improvisation. When you set off,

894
00:55:55,440 --> 00:55:59,200
Speaker 1: have a timetable, have people who are not at the

895
00:55:59,239 --> 00:56:05,080
Speaker 1: protest aware of your location and where you plan to

896
00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 1: be afterwards. You can also have accountability with your groups

897
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,920
Speaker 1: that you go with. Have a meeting spot that is

898
00:56:14,080 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 1: outside where you think the protest will be, so you

899
00:56:16,600 --> 00:56:21,200
Speaker 1: can confirm everyone's safety, and so you can have a destination.

900
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:21,200
Speaker 3: And a plan.

901
00:56:22,040 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 2: Situational awareness that a protest is highly important. We would

902
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,279
Speaker 2: recommend avoiding drugs or alcohol or anything else that's going

903
00:56:29,320 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 2: to impair you know, your judgment or reaction time, and

904
00:56:32,880 --> 00:56:35,200
Speaker 2: you always have to be able to react to that

905
00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:40,600
Speaker 2: danger immediately and you know, not be held back by

906
00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:42,479
Speaker 2: whatever substance you're doing.

907
00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:46,000
Speaker 5: Not to mention, you don't want to have some contraband

908
00:56:46,040 --> 00:56:48,480
Speaker 5: on you that can be also used against you if

909
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 5: you are searched and then that gives you know, law

910
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:54,040
Speaker 5: enforcement a reason to lock you up.

911
00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:57,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, print out or obtain what's called a bust card.

912
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:02,560
Speaker 1: This is think of like it's like a very small,

913
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:05,120
Speaker 1: easy to carry piece of paper that bullet points out

914
00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:10,680
Speaker 1: your legal rights, some does and don't contact numbers. You know,

915
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:14,320
Speaker 1: you can find many examples of this from different countries

916
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 1: and it's a handy thing to have. Of course, you know,

917
00:57:17,960 --> 00:57:19,360
Speaker 1: the question there is who has a printer?

918
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:19,880
Speaker 3: Right?

919
00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:22,560
Speaker 1: You may be in a situation where you find people

920
00:57:22,640 --> 00:57:24,720
Speaker 1: who are distributing these for.

921
00:57:24,520 --> 00:57:27,480
Speaker 2: Free, and lastly, just at all times to be ready

922
00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 2: to you know, help out someone who's next to you

923
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:33,840
Speaker 2: who is protesting. You can provide support for people in

924
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 2: all sorts of different ways, you know, especially if there's

925
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:40,400
Speaker 2: somebody who you know is getting tired, who has some

926
00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 2: kind of medical condition, who is dehydrated, or has been

927
00:57:44,200 --> 00:57:48,520
Speaker 2: injured for one reason or another. Just remember to you know,

928
00:57:48,600 --> 00:57:51,720
Speaker 2: be there for everyone, and also to not not let

929
00:57:51,840 --> 00:57:53,840
Speaker 2: bad actors go unnoticed.

930
00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:58,880
Speaker 1: Let's talk about something equally important, which is maybe even

931
00:57:58,880 --> 00:58:01,880
Speaker 1: more important, which is what not to do. So in

932
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:03,919
Speaker 1: some of our conversation, you know, it's obvious that people

933
00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: have different opinions and everybody has the same specific answers,

934
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:12,120
Speaker 1: but these things are pretty solid first, and I think

935
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:14,360
Speaker 1: this answers a lot of questions people have about what

936
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 1: they should or shouldn't bring. Don't carry things that you

937
00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:21,720
Speaker 1: cannot afford to lose. Do not assume everyone is there

938
00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:23,080
Speaker 1: for the same reason as you.

939
00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:25,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think we've more than covered. That's sort of

940
00:58:25,800 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 5: the whole point of this episode is that there are

941
00:58:28,480 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 5: many reasons, many agendas that might lead people to come

942
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:34,720
Speaker 5: to these types of events, and a lot of them

943
00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:37,920
Speaker 5: are not in your best interests. People are not aligned

944
00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:41,880
Speaker 5: with what you are there for a lot of the time,

945
00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:45,120
Speaker 5: So just never assume, and don't wear things that can

946
00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:48,360
Speaker 5: easily be grabbed. You know, you might want to put

947
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,000
Speaker 5: your hair up in a tight bun rather than wearing it.

948
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:53,880
Speaker 5: And pigtails or a ponytail, or something that can be

949
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:57,480
Speaker 5: used to drag you to the ground, for example, or

950
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:01,000
Speaker 5: you know pieces of clothing that are very baggy that

951
00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 5: could be grabbed as well. That would be something that

952
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 5: you would want to avoid.

953
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:06,680
Speaker 2: And there are a lot of things you could put

954
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:10,240
Speaker 2: on your body. A lot of them are moisturizers or

955
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:13,360
Speaker 2: would be used as some kind of moisturizer, sometimes sunscreen,

956
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:17,880
Speaker 2: mineral oils or vazolines. These things can actually trap some

957
00:59:17,960 --> 00:59:20,280
Speaker 2: of the chemicals that may be sprayed in your direction

958
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:23,360
Speaker 2: or released and hit you and it will stick to

959
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:28,400
Speaker 2: your skin and you know it will essentially amplify the effects.

960
00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 3: So do not don't do that.

961
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:35,760
Speaker 1: And this is difficult, but do your best to think critically.

962
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 1: Be aware that misinformation as well as active disinformation. Misinformation

963
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:44,640
Speaker 1: is kind of something that's accidentally not true. Disinformation is

964
00:59:44,680 --> 00:59:46,960
Speaker 1: something that's purposely not true. That's the best way to

965
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:51,240
Speaker 1: remember it. Both of these can proliferate at an extremely

966
00:59:51,400 --> 00:59:56,200
Speaker 1: quick rate, especially when we see lines of traditional normal

967
00:59:56,240 --> 01:00:02,080
Speaker 1: communication breaking down. And last, do not go alone if

968
01:00:02,120 --> 01:00:02,720
Speaker 1: you can help it.

969
01:00:03,240 --> 01:00:06,240
Speaker 5: Yeah, I would say that's pretty important at the very

970
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:08,840
Speaker 5: least if you have to go alone, make sure someone's

971
01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:11,439
Speaker 5: got your back remotely and that they know where you are,

972
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:15,160
Speaker 5: and that you can reach somebody to let them know

973
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:17,160
Speaker 5: if things go south.

974
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:24,040
Speaker 1: We hope this information is helpful. Again, there are more resources,

975
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:28,120
Speaker 1: many many organizations that have these bus cards, that have

976
01:00:28,200 --> 01:00:31,920
Speaker 1: these checklists, that have recommendations dos and don't please do

977
01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:37,920
Speaker 1: look into these. And again, there is one main takeaway

978
01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:43,880
Speaker 1: from this episode. The conspiracy to discredit and to escalate

979
01:00:44,320 --> 01:00:48,520
Speaker 1: protests counter to the aims of a protest are real.

980
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:52,680
Speaker 1: This stuff does happen. Agent provocateurs do exist. They're not

981
01:00:52,880 --> 01:00:57,000
Speaker 1: some sort of mythical beast. The real ones can operate

982
01:00:57,080 --> 01:00:59,120
Speaker 1: successfully and they can get away with.

983
01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:01,520
Speaker 5: It and just really quick to sew up a couple

984
01:01:01,520 --> 01:01:03,800
Speaker 5: of things that we sort of foreshadowed, like you know

985
01:01:03,840 --> 01:01:07,000
Speaker 5: there Again, there's a lot of information moving very quickly,

986
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:10,920
Speaker 5: especially right now as things have escalated with our situation

987
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:15,000
Speaker 5: in the United States. But the notion of you know,

988
01:01:15,160 --> 01:01:20,280
Speaker 5: things like piles of bricks showing up and old model

989
01:01:20,320 --> 01:01:24,120
Speaker 5: police cars being put out like as bait or something,

990
01:01:24,360 --> 01:01:27,840
Speaker 5: a lot of that has been largely discredited. That's not

991
01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:30,120
Speaker 5: to say that it's not possible that these things are

992
01:01:30,320 --> 01:01:35,200
Speaker 5: are real. And it's also a slippery slope when you

993
01:01:35,240 --> 01:01:41,640
Speaker 5: talk about blaming a movement or a protest on external

994
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:46,520
Speaker 5: forces that are not you know, germane to that outcry

995
01:01:46,680 --> 01:01:50,040
Speaker 5: that surrounds that particular protest. It's a way of like

996
01:01:50,120 --> 01:01:53,160
Speaker 5: kind of like neutering, you know, the power of that

997
01:01:53,240 --> 01:01:56,320
Speaker 5: movement by saying, oh, it's actually being caused, not by

998
01:01:56,440 --> 01:01:58,840
Speaker 5: the real reason that it's being caused, but by something else.

999
01:01:59,080 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 5: And I think we've done a good job today of

1000
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:04,000
Speaker 5: differentiating those things, but I just want to make you know,

1001
01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:05,800
Speaker 5: make sure that that that's clear.

1002
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:10,760
Speaker 2: And we have to absolutely remember that when we are

1003
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:14,720
Speaker 2: on social media, whatever platform you use, you have to

1004
01:02:14,720 --> 01:02:18,920
Speaker 2: be extremely vigilant when analyzing and sharing stuff. Whatever the

1005
01:02:18,960 --> 01:02:21,520
Speaker 2: post is, no matter how much you agree with it,

1006
01:02:21,560 --> 01:02:24,440
Speaker 2: you just have to be careful and really analyze it.

1007
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:26,800
Speaker 2: Because there have been, as you said, there, you know,

1008
01:02:27,120 --> 01:02:29,720
Speaker 2: a lot of false reports that have come out essentially

1009
01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:33,880
Speaker 2: as rumors that have just spread across social media. And

1010
01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:38,120
Speaker 2: you know, we kind of you mentioned the bricks. There

1011
01:02:38,160 --> 01:02:41,560
Speaker 2: have been several examples posted out there that have been

1012
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:46,040
Speaker 2: proven to not have anything to do with you know,

1013
01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:50,440
Speaker 2: purposeful planting for uses with protesters or during the protests

1014
01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:51,360
Speaker 2: to escalate things.

1015
01:02:52,520 --> 01:02:52,720
Speaker 3: You know.

1016
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:55,040
Speaker 2: I made a note here just to call to call

1017
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,560
Speaker 2: out the one that occurred in Sherman Oaks, California, where

1018
01:02:57,560 --> 01:02:59,280
Speaker 2: there were these metal.

1019
01:02:58,760 --> 01:03:00,000
Speaker 3: Enclosures filled with stone.

1020
01:03:00,000 --> 01:03:03,840
Speaker 2: Ohones, and BuzzFeed News and some other people did some

1021
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:06,200
Speaker 2: you know, looking into this and found out that this

1022
01:03:06,360 --> 01:03:09,760
Speaker 2: was actually a security or these were security structures for

1023
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:13,480
Speaker 2: a Jewish community building in Sherman Oaks, California, and they'd

1024
01:03:13,520 --> 01:03:16,360
Speaker 2: been installed like a year ago, prior to the protests.

1025
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:21,480
Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean that every instance where bricks have

1026
01:03:21,560 --> 01:03:25,320
Speaker 2: been found or some kind of projectile, heavy projectiles have

1027
01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:27,880
Speaker 2: been found stashed near a protest area doesn't mean that

1028
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:30,920
Speaker 2: every one of those is just an innocuous thing. It

1029
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:33,840
Speaker 2: means you have to analyze each one of them individually.

1030
01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:39,520
Speaker 1: Yea, especially because, as I said earlier, protests nowadays occur

1031
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:44,040
Speaker 1: in digital space. Please please please check out the earlier

1032
01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 1: work on the proliferation of bots. Russian and non Russian alike.

1033
01:03:49,400 --> 01:03:53,120
Speaker 1: Foreign and domestic forces are gaming the system, They're muddying

1034
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 1: the waters, they're altering the narrative with great success in

1035
01:03:57,320 --> 01:04:00,040
Speaker 1: the past and the president is no different, and the

1036
01:04:00,080 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 1: future probably won't be either. I have a lighthearted example

1037
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:09,080
Speaker 1: of this. My favorite current example of this phenomenon is

1038
01:04:09,160 --> 01:04:13,880
Speaker 1: the K pop fans online who are flooding far right

1039
01:04:13,920 --> 01:04:19,720
Speaker 1: wing hashtags with some of their favorite Korean pop. That is,

1040
01:04:21,400 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 1: it is fantastic to see. I recommend checking that out

1041
01:04:25,520 --> 01:04:27,840
Speaker 1: if you want a little bit of a pick me

1042
01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:32,280
Speaker 1: up in these these incredibly terrible times. I mean, this

1043
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:36,840
Speaker 1: is these last few months have been the longest year ever.

1044
01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:39,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, it really has been.

1045
01:04:39,440 --> 01:04:42,480
Speaker 2: Whoever controls this whole timeline thing that we're living in

1046
01:04:42,520 --> 01:04:44,880
Speaker 2: this multiverse is really piling on right.

1047
01:04:44,680 --> 01:04:48,400
Speaker 5: Now, cut it out, whoever you are, Geez Louise.

1048
01:04:49,320 --> 01:04:49,560
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1049
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:51,880
Speaker 5: And then just to just you know, for a final note,

1050
01:04:52,120 --> 01:04:53,600
Speaker 5: and this is something that I have a lot of

1051
01:04:53,640 --> 01:04:55,680
Speaker 5: questions around because again we were talking about, like with

1052
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:59,240
Speaker 5: social media, so much information is able to be kind

1053
01:04:59,280 --> 01:05:03,640
Speaker 5: of hijacked and used in a way that's it's very shareable.

1054
01:05:04,160 --> 01:05:07,920
Speaker 5: Therefore it is proliferated, but it could absolutely and often

1055
01:05:08,080 --> 01:05:12,600
Speaker 5: is misinformation. But one final example is, you know a

1056
01:05:12,600 --> 01:05:16,120
Speaker 5: lot of rumors going around, you know, on on social

1057
01:05:16,200 --> 01:05:21,120
Speaker 5: media about groups such as what's referred to collectively as

1058
01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:25,600
Speaker 5: antifa going out to suburban areas or rural areas to

1059
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:27,440
Speaker 5: carry out acts of violence. And I just want to

1060
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:30,680
Speaker 5: take this opportunity to clarify something that I've personally been

1061
01:05:30,720 --> 01:05:33,200
Speaker 5: a little in the dark about. The notion of antifha

1062
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:36,760
Speaker 5: I understand to mean anti fascist, which sounds like a

1063
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:40,840
Speaker 5: positive thing to me, being anti fascist, but it's been

1064
01:05:41,160 --> 01:05:44,600
Speaker 5: kind of commodified as a term of abuse and almost

1065
01:05:44,960 --> 01:05:47,360
Speaker 5: taken on the tone of like, this is a terrorist group,

1066
01:05:47,640 --> 01:05:51,600
Speaker 5: the antifa. But my understanding is that no such group

1067
01:05:51,840 --> 01:05:56,640
Speaker 5: per se exists. It's not a moniker that is associated

1068
01:05:56,680 --> 01:06:00,320
Speaker 5: with like a particular you know, mission, statement or group

1069
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:04,880
Speaker 5: of people. It's just kind of the amorphous collective. So

1070
01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:07,240
Speaker 5: can you just talk a little bit about what antifa

1071
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:09,800
Speaker 5: means and how it's being used, just to give folks

1072
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:10,840
Speaker 5: a little perspective on that.

1073
01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:16,040
Speaker 2: I would, you know, with having limited understanding of this,

1074
01:06:16,120 --> 01:06:18,600
Speaker 2: I would just say that it's been used in the

1075
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:22,240
Speaker 2: media recently, and you know, in the past couple decades

1076
01:06:22,760 --> 01:06:28,600
Speaker 2: to really represent any number of smaller groups that would

1077
01:06:28,640 --> 01:06:33,640
Speaker 2: consider themselves perhaps anarchists or or people who are against

1078
01:06:33,840 --> 01:06:37,440
Speaker 2: the the status quo systems that are set up and

1079
01:06:37,640 --> 01:06:41,400
Speaker 2: just wish to see change there. But you know, it

1080
01:06:41,440 --> 01:06:45,240
Speaker 2: really depends on which organization is reporting at the time

1081
01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:47,400
Speaker 2: or who's talking about them.

1082
01:06:47,640 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 1: I believe that I may have mentioned this earlier. The

1083
01:06:51,880 --> 01:06:56,640
Speaker 1: phrase has a lot in common with the phrase anonymous,

1084
01:06:56,720 --> 01:06:59,360
Speaker 1: an earlier activist group that has recently been back in

1085
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:03,480
Speaker 1: the news. The Achilles heel of this kind of grouping

1086
01:07:03,800 --> 01:07:09,280
Speaker 1: is that there is obviously no official certification to be

1087
01:07:09,360 --> 01:07:13,400
Speaker 1: an anti fascist group, and the key is there is

1088
01:07:13,440 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 1: also no official certification to claim oneself a member of anonymous.

1089
01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:24,160
Speaker 1: I will say, if you want to dehumanize or vilify,

1090
01:07:24,360 --> 01:07:27,200
Speaker 1: or you know, use a thought terminating cliche to get

1091
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:31,880
Speaker 1: past people's critical thinking faculties, then of course you make

1092
01:07:31,920 --> 01:07:34,320
Speaker 1: a term. You make a term that is pretty short,

1093
01:07:34,680 --> 01:07:38,640
Speaker 1: it's easy to understand, and that itself, while being a portmanteau,

1094
01:07:39,040 --> 01:07:42,480
Speaker 1: is not you know, an existing word, or you change

1095
01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:46,520
Speaker 1: it right, And this is a tactic that's employed often.

1096
01:07:47,200 --> 01:07:50,160
Speaker 1: I would like to I would like to note several

1097
01:07:50,200 --> 01:07:53,280
Speaker 1: things that we have not covered in this episode. We've

1098
01:07:53,320 --> 01:07:58,560
Speaker 1: not covered antifa. I think the anti fascism organization, the

1099
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:02,240
Speaker 1: evolution of that term, deserves its own episode, as do

1100
01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:09,560
Speaker 1: specific instances of people attempting to capitalize on a movement

1101
01:08:09,640 --> 01:08:13,160
Speaker 1: or protest for their own ends. Splinter groups, you know,

1102
01:08:13,280 --> 01:08:16,080
Speaker 1: militia are in there. There are a lot of Internet

1103
01:08:16,120 --> 01:08:19,719
Speaker 1: warriors who are talking on a forum and a certain

1104
01:08:19,760 --> 01:08:25,040
Speaker 1: amount of them are going into protests to attempt to

1105
01:08:25,080 --> 01:08:28,000
Speaker 1: push their agenda. These are things that we have to

1106
01:08:28,040 --> 01:08:30,320
Speaker 1: cover in a future episode and we need your help.

1107
01:08:30,840 --> 01:08:33,200
Speaker 5: Yeah, so let us know what you think. You can

1108
01:08:33,240 --> 01:08:37,879
Speaker 5: write to us online in the various social media spots

1109
01:08:38,160 --> 01:08:41,760
Speaker 5: we are Conspiracy stuff or conspiracy Stuff show on the

1110
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:45,960
Speaker 5: usual platforms Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and you can also join

1111
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:49,880
Speaker 5: our Facebook group. Here's where it gets crazy, where there's

1112
01:08:49,920 --> 01:08:52,360
Speaker 5: a lot of real time conversation that goes on around

1113
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 5: every episode we do and beyond.

1114
01:08:54,560 --> 01:08:56,679
Speaker 2: You can give us a phone call if you haven't

1115
01:08:56,680 --> 01:08:59,320
Speaker 2: had your phone with you. Our number is one eight

1116
01:08:59,479 --> 01:09:05,320
Speaker 2: three std WYTK. We would encourage you to call us

1117
01:09:05,320 --> 01:09:09,320
Speaker 2: if possible, to either report on something you're seeing, no

1118
01:09:09,320 --> 01:09:11,680
Speaker 2: matter where you are and what you're doing, or to

1119
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:13,680
Speaker 2: just give us an idea for an episode, or just

1120
01:09:13,760 --> 01:09:16,720
Speaker 2: tell us tell us what you think about all of

1121
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:18,760
Speaker 2: this stuff. And if you don't want to do any

1122
01:09:18,800 --> 01:09:20,640
Speaker 2: of that stuff, but you still want to contact us,

1123
01:09:20,680 --> 01:09:23,160
Speaker 2: you can always send us a good old fashioned email.

1124
01:09:23,320 --> 01:09:45,400
Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1125
01:09:45,560 --> 01:09:47,599
Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know. Is a production

1126
01:09:47,720 --> 01:09:52,280
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1127
01:09:52,360 --> 01:09:55,960
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.