Speaker 1: When you've got that voice telling you you're no good.
Speaker 1: Who do you think you are? And you're not pretty
Speaker 1: and people are going to make fun of you, you
Speaker 1: start to really listen to that voice. When you voice
Speaker 1: your fear, the fear actually ends up being less. Why
Speaker 1: is it that if you name something, you feel.
Speaker 2: Better about it, Because most of.
Speaker 1: Us we want to stop feeling the ego. We want
Speaker 1: to pretend it doesn't exist, we want to villainize it.
Speaker 2: But what if it be freaking superpower?
Speaker 3: I'm Radley d Wlukiah and on my podcast A Really
Speaker 3: Good Cry, we embrace the messy and the beautiful, providing
Speaker 3: a space for raw, unfiltered conversations that celebrate vulnerability and
Speaker 3: allow you to tune in to learn, connect and find
Speaker 3: comfort together.
Speaker 4: Okay, Hi, Lisa?
Speaker 2: What I holpi?
Speaker 3: Lisa Billiu is in the building people, and before we
Speaker 3: get started, I need to tell you the story of
Speaker 3: one how we met and two what she represents for
Speaker 3: me in my life.
Speaker 4: First of all, thank you for being here, Thanks for
Speaker 4: having me so grateful.
Speaker 3: Lisa is the person who well, let me just start
Speaker 3: off by saying she has a book out called Radical
Speaker 3: Confidence and the reason I'm mentioning this first off is
Speaker 3: because she is somebody who I don't know whether you
Speaker 3: know this. I think I've told this day in the past,
Speaker 3: but inspired and pushed me to actually become more confident
Speaker 3: in my life from the moment that I met her,
Speaker 3: And it was.
Speaker 4: The first podcast. Her podcast was the first podcast.
Speaker 3: I ever went on. It's called Women of Impact. And
Speaker 3: when she first asked me to be on it, we
Speaker 3: had become friends. We were meeting up regularly, hanging out,
Speaker 3: and she asked me to come on the podcast. And
Speaker 3: I was like, why would I come on your podcast?
Speaker 4: Like for what reason?
Speaker 3: What would I talk about? What would we talk about?
Speaker 3: And you said, you know, it's going to be conversational.
Speaker 3: We're just going to have a conversation, just like we're
Speaker 3: having now while we're having coffee. And I remember the
Speaker 3: day of I was honestly going to call her and
Speaker 3: be like, I cannot come. I'm ill, there's something wrong
Speaker 3: with me. There's no way I'm making it to your podcast.
Speaker 3: But you have been from the moment I met you
Speaker 3: such an incredible hype woman, and like you exude did
Speaker 3: so much confidence from the moment I met you that
Speaker 3: it you know how they say, the energy that you.
Speaker 4: Carry you can pour into other people.
Speaker 3: You did that to me, and so somehow from all
Speaker 3: the words of encouragement you gave me, I ended up
Speaker 3: coming onto that podcast. And let me tell you, that
Speaker 3: podcast not only did it open up so much in
Speaker 3: me and gave me the confidence to realize what I
Speaker 3: had within me, the amount of people still to this
Speaker 3: day that come up to me and tell me that
Speaker 3: they cried with me in the podcast, that it helped
Speaker 3: them go through so much of what they were going
Speaker 3: through and gave them hope for the future, purely because
Speaker 3: Lisa believed in me before I believed in myself and
Speaker 3: gave me the platform an opportunity to prove to myself
Speaker 3: that I could do something that I wasn't comfortable doing.
Speaker 4: So thank you for that.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. I mean, here's the thing. I just
Speaker 2: saw you. I know I saw you, and when.
Speaker 1: You're not in that person's head, I don't carry the
Speaker 1: insecurities you carry. So I just see this very bubbly, sweet,
Speaker 1: kind in intellectual, driven, ambitious like friend, and so I
Speaker 1: didn't carry all the insecurities that you carry.
Speaker 2: So when I asked you to come on my show,
Speaker 2: I was like, of.
Speaker 1: Course you should come wat. You need to teach you
Speaker 1: other women how you think. And then I saw that
Speaker 1: was when I then saw your insecurities because I didn't
Speaker 1: actually even see it, and you were ming and you
Speaker 1: were r ring and you were asking me a thousand questions,
Speaker 1: and I was like, wow, I didn't expect it because
Speaker 1: I just see the shine that you bring into every
Speaker 1: fricking room. And I think, and as a friend, I
Speaker 1: think that that's the important part, is that it is
Speaker 1: our jobs to highlight the beauty that we see, to
Speaker 1: help that person or our friends out of their negative
Speaker 1: loop that maybe they have an internal loop that they're
Speaker 1: telling themselves then they're going right. So whatever loop you
Speaker 1: were on me just telling you exactly how I felt, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it just like breaks that cycle and then hopefully allows
Speaker 1: you to then rewire. And then obviously you saw the
Speaker 1: knock on effect that other people were receiving your message
Speaker 1: so well, and then hopefully that then became the stepping
Speaker 1: stones to then you building your own confidence.
Speaker 3: It really was, And even just having that conversation, it
Speaker 3: wasn't even the knock on effect other people. It was
Speaker 3: the effect that it had of me even opening up
Speaker 3: and having that conversation with you, to have someone who
Speaker 3: was like actively asking me questions that I hadn't even
Speaker 3: thought about my life well, actively listening and you were
Speaker 3: asking me questions within the questions, and I was like, gosh,
Speaker 3: I haven't thought about any of this, but I'm having
Speaker 3: to think of it in this moment and unwrap it
Speaker 3: in this moment. So it was it was basically like
Speaker 3: a therapy session for me. You gave me a free
Speaker 3: therapy session, Thank you. But you have this book out
Speaker 3: called Radical Confidence, and I want to ask start off
Speaker 3: by asking you what do you feel radical confidence means?
Speaker 4: Like what is radical confidence on a day to day basis?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So people used to say that I was confident
Speaker 1: or think that I was confident, and it's like going
Speaker 1: back to that negative voice in your head. It's like
Speaker 1: when you've got that voice telling you you're no good
Speaker 1: and who do you think you are? And you're not
Speaker 1: pretty and people are going to make fun of you,
Speaker 1: Like you start to really listen to that voice. And
Speaker 1: so when people saying I was confident, I was like,
Speaker 1: I don't understand what you mean because I don't feel it.
Speaker 1: And what I realized was people saw that I had
Speaker 1: radical confidence, which means that I feel utterly insecure. I
Speaker 1: don't know what I'm doing, I don't believe in myself.
Speaker 1: I have a negative voice, but I still take steps
Speaker 1: forward into action, and it's the action piece that turns
Speaker 1: into me getting good and me getting good and competent.
Speaker 1: Is then what leads to me being confident. And what
Speaker 1: I thought was though in just telling people, oh, you
Speaker 1: don't feel confident, I'll do it anyway, that is the
Speaker 1: worst advice right, Like, it winds me up because when
Speaker 1: people say just do it anyway, you know it's not
Speaker 1: easy just to do it anyway. So for me, it's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I know I need to move forward. I can't stay
Speaker 1: still otherwise I'm not going to build my confidence like
Speaker 1: a muscle. So how do I take action? How do
Speaker 1: I get started? And so to me, it's about a blueprint.
Speaker 1: It's about putting steps together before you even start something
Speaker 1: so that when you get started, you don't fail. You
Speaker 1: don't let that negative voice this persuade you to do
Speaker 1: something else.
Speaker 4: Is putting on your armor before you go on the battlefield.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: Or I just imagine, let's take your podcast for example,
Speaker 1: I bet you.
Speaker 2: I know you well enough. It was like, do I
Speaker 2: do it? Do I not? Oh my god? But if
Speaker 2: I get started now, I'm going to be held to it.
Speaker 3: Well, if I signed this contract, does that mean I
Speaker 3: have to commit to like the weekly things?
Speaker 4: What happens if I have nothing to say that week?
Speaker 2: Right? Or what if I feel about I don't know
Speaker 2: what to do?
Speaker 1: The second though, you go, Okay, there is this fear,
Speaker 1: but what.
Speaker 2: Am I going to call it? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yes, you don't hire a team yet, you haven't even
Speaker 1: told anyone, but you're like, what am I going to
Speaker 1: call it?
Speaker 4: If it was to do it, what would I call it?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And then the step second step, what would the
Speaker 2: set look like?
Speaker 1: So what you're doing is you're starting to put these
Speaker 1: tiny little steps in in making decisions whether the bigger
Speaker 1: picture isn't so overwhelmed you don't get started in the
Speaker 1: first place, because if I was to sit here and
Speaker 1: go all right, rady, you're going to do and build
Speaker 1: the biggest postcasts in the world, get started right now,
Speaker 1: and you'd be like, oh god, you would freeze.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But if I said to you just today on a Monday,
Speaker 2: let's say, what name would.
Speaker 1: You call it, Yeah, and then not you Tuesday, what
Speaker 1: would you just set look like? And then on a Wednesday,
Speaker 1: who would your first guest be? All of that now
Speaker 1: doesn't become overwhelming. Now, that is how you gain radical
Speaker 1: confidence in order to become confident at the end.
Speaker 4: That's so true. I was just thinking of the way
Speaker 4: that you're saying it.
Speaker 3: And they do say little steps at a time, but
Speaker 3: the way that you've just described, I'm like, yeah, you're
Speaker 3: almost creating it in your imagination before it's happening. Yes,
Speaker 3: you're almost experiencing it before it's happened, and therefore your
Speaker 3: body and your mind become a little more like you're
Speaker 3: dabbling your toes in it. You're like, Okay, let me
Speaker 3: just test the waters, see how I feel if I
Speaker 3: was to do it. Let me hypothetically create this scenario.
Speaker 3: And then your mind kind of realizes that, oh, I've
Speaker 3: created this scenario and I actually don't feel too weird
Speaker 3: about it, and this name actually feels really great, and
Speaker 3: said that I've created, I actually we like it and
Speaker 3: create excitement rather than the fear. Exactly, it takes over
Speaker 3: the fear that you're feeling.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I interviewed this neurosurgeon, and it basically is neuroplasticity.
Speaker 1: And so what you're doing is your when you voice
Speaker 1: your fear, when you like picture your fear, the fear
Speaker 1: actually ends up being less.
Speaker 2: Now I really like to understand why.
Speaker 1: Yes, right, because I really want to be able to
Speaker 1: impact myself in order to achieve or to set a
Speaker 1: goal and then achieve it.
Speaker 2: So why is it that if.
Speaker 1: You name something you feel better about it, because most
Speaker 1: of us in the fear don't bloody want to talk
Speaker 1: about it, right, So what she explained to me was, look,
Speaker 1: when you label something as fearful and you try to
Speaker 1: forget about you try not to look at it. The
Speaker 1: second happens, all of your anxiety comes to the surface.
Speaker 1: But if you name something, what you're doing is you're
Speaker 1: telling and framing it in your mind like it's normal.
Speaker 1: And so this is why things like manifestation really works,
Speaker 1: because if you don't manifest let's say, for instance, you're
Speaker 1: just like, all of a sudden, someone comes to you
Speaker 1: and they're like, I'm going to offer you a podcast
Speaker 1: the fear of Oh my God. A podcast who's gonna
Speaker 1: listen to?
Speaker 4: It?
Speaker 2: Will all come rushing forward.
Speaker 1: Now, if you've manifested, if you've been thinking about it,
Speaker 1: you're telling your body, this isn't fearful.
Speaker 4: You're ready, it's ready. You will correct exactly.
Speaker 1: You've prepped yourself for it so that the second then,
Speaker 1: if you've been doing the work, when you eventually then
Speaker 1: get your podcast, the fear on day one won't be
Speaker 1: as extreme because you've done all that neuroplasticity and frame
Speaker 1: rebuilding your mind into not seeing that as something fearful
Speaker 1: but seeing it is something exciting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember hearing this code, and I don't think
Speaker 3: I'm saying it exactly, but it says the sword of
Speaker 3: knowledge can cut through fear.
Speaker 4: And so what that.
Speaker 3: Means is like, it's exactly what you're saying. When you
Speaker 3: are able to identify it doesn't mean that you know everything,
Speaker 3: but when your body and your mind sees it as
Speaker 3: being familiar, like anything unknown, we create fear around So
Speaker 3: how do we get how do we get around that? Well,
Speaker 3: if it's unf familiar, make it familiar, and then you
Speaker 3: don't you don't feel the fear anymore. And so creating
Speaker 3: the labels or creating that visual in your mind, or
Speaker 3: making something feel more familiar reduce it, or understanding it
Speaker 3: better reduces the fear that you feel from it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, and you can take this too, from
Speaker 1: you know, building a podcast to even like religion. Let's say,
Speaker 1: it's like, I think that the power of religion really
Speaker 1: does almost make you think about death in a lighthearted way.
Speaker 1: And so if you believe that, okay, this isn't just
Speaker 1: one life, that there actually are multiple lives or I
Speaker 1: interviewed this woman that was one hundred and three years old,
Speaker 1: gladdess that I was telling.
Speaker 3: You about amazing.
Speaker 1: I said to her, she has a ten year plan
Speaker 1: and she's one hundred and three, and so I didn't
Speaker 1: want to be disrespectful, but I wanted to know the truth.
Speaker 1: I was like, in all honesty, how do you have
Speaker 1: a ten year plan? And she was like, well, maybe
Speaker 1: I make it make but I don't. But at least
Speaker 1: I know what I'm always working towards. And then she says,
Speaker 1: and then when I die, she's like all the people
Speaker 1: that died before me. Because her children, some of her
Speaker 1: children have died, because she's one hundred and three, She's like,
Speaker 1: I don't grieve them not being here because I just
Speaker 1: know that when I die, it's a do you believe so
Speaker 1: she's going to she believes she's gonna have a party.
Speaker 1: On the other side because you know her daughter who
Speaker 1: passed away, her brothers, and so there's no fear. So
Speaker 1: when you just have acknowledged it, you look at it,
Speaker 1: you see the positive side of it instead of the
Speaker 1: negative side. You now literally can eliminate that fear. And
Speaker 1: when you know that, now you can almost use that
Speaker 1: framework in anything you want.
Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, I think about that with death as well.
Speaker 3: I feel like when I started understanding different spiritual practices
Speaker 3: and what connected to me the most was the soul
Speaker 3: is eternal, and so that changed my whole perception and
Speaker 3: view of fear in this lifetime, of what this physical
Speaker 3: body means, of what it means to live in this body,
Speaker 3: what fear actually means to my body versus my heart
Speaker 3: or my soul. And so whether people believe it or not,
Speaker 3: for me, that reduced the amount of fear that I
Speaker 3: was even feeling about my day to day life, about
Speaker 3: my family, about everything around me, that I was creating
Speaker 3: so much anxiety and fear around me.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you've heard this recently.
Speaker 1: I just discovered it, and I love talking to you
Speaker 1: about new studies and stuff. So I've been having problems
Speaker 1: with my health. You know, I've been struggling for a
Speaker 1: long time. But recently we've identified that it could be
Speaker 1: my liver. Wow, Okay, And what I heard recently is
Speaker 1: the liver is the organ of anger, and that you
Speaker 1: have organs that are related to every emotion.
Speaker 2: Yeah, tell me, I had no idea.
Speaker 4: Yes, every emotion.
Speaker 3: And there's this incredible chart, and I think in my
Speaker 3: first episode I talk about this where there's this incredible
Speaker 3: chart where they did heat senses of the body of
Speaker 3: what emotion light what part of your body lights up
Speaker 3: with different emotions. And so I've heard that the liver
Speaker 3: is the organ for anger, but there's also like when
Speaker 3: you feel angry, you know how they say hot headed.
Speaker 3: So apparently the heat rises in the body up till
Speaker 3: the head. So when someone's feeling angry, they did like
Speaker 3: heat senses on people, and the head is the place
Speaker 3: that gets like the hottest during anger. And so in
Speaker 3: different parts of the body, like for women when they're
Speaker 3: feeling really emotional and sad, it's in the pelvis area
Speaker 3: or the hips area. And that's why even in yoga
Speaker 3: when I do my yoga teacher training. The key exercises
Speaker 3: that are recommended for women for emotional release are hip openness,
Speaker 3: because we hold so much and which makes sense because
Speaker 3: you know a lot of women's for women especially, our
Speaker 3: body is prone, especially by a certain age, start to
Speaker 3: start creating certain hormones for giving birth, for menopause, for
Speaker 3: whatever it is.
Speaker 4: And so all of our hormones lie.
Speaker 3: Within the area, and so apparently our emotional release all
Speaker 3: lies in our hip flexes. And so there's so many
Speaker 3: different parts of our body that one whole different emotions,
Speaker 3: but two whole different types of different types of our traumas,
Speaker 3: and the different energy that we hold in our body
Speaker 3: from every past experience that we have.
Speaker 1: It is fascinating. And I'm reading the book. I read
Speaker 1: it a long time ago, but the body keeps the score.
Speaker 3: I've been recommended that I just restarted it today, in fact,
Speaker 3: because I want to understand this, because again, how do
Speaker 3: we connect the body with our mind and the mind
Speaker 3: with the body.
Speaker 1: And for me, you know, I joke, but I'm actually
Speaker 1: really serious. I want to live till I'm over one hundred.
Speaker 1: But women is something like even though women live longer
Speaker 1: than men, we end up living in worse health twenty
Speaker 1: percent of our lives.
Speaker 2: More than men.
Speaker 1: So even though we live longer, we actually live in
Speaker 1: more poorer health in our life than men do.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 1: So married men live longer than single men because they've
Speaker 1: got a woman to tell them, don't text and drive,
Speaker 1: go to the doctor when you've got.
Speaker 2: A headache, things like that.
Speaker 1: But married women live less as not as long as
Speaker 1: single women because we're take caretakers. That is so interesting, actually,
Speaker 1: I stat from doctor Amon himself.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So when I think about our lifespan, when I
Speaker 1: think about how we show up every day, when I
Speaker 1: think about what we're doing people pleasing, what that's doing. Internally,
Speaker 1: I'm really starting to pay attention. I'm starting to really
Speaker 1: understand like the organs and things like that, and I think, like,
Speaker 1: if you have lung issues, it's a sign of fear
Speaker 1: because again, like your lungs is the thing that.
Speaker 3: Ys like rung titan, like, it's the it's where the
Speaker 3: fight or flight responsib really lies in your breath and
Speaker 3: if you're yeah, it's it's so fascinating. I I was
Speaker 3: thinking about the fact that we were talking about armor earlier,
Speaker 3: and I remember the first time I saw you, I
Speaker 3: was just so like enamored by.
Speaker 4: How badazzled you were, Like you were like you were.
Speaker 3: Decked out, you had the change, you had, all the bling,
Speaker 3: you had your.
Speaker 4: Watches and as she has today. But it also like.
Speaker 3: After I met you, I was like this, there was
Speaker 3: something about you that stood out and it was the jewels.
Speaker 3: And it wasn't like what you were in, yes, that
Speaker 3: obviously stands out, but it was like how you were
Speaker 3: carrying yourself with that. And I thought about armor that
Speaker 3: we just spoke about now, and how I felt like,
Speaker 3: you know, I know you always wear Superwoman somewhere wonder
Speaker 3: a wonder Woman, wonder Woman got we and I think
Speaker 3: you had that from when I first met.
Speaker 2: Oh this necklace, yeah, I've had for like seven years.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And so I remember seeing that and I was like, gosh,
Speaker 3: she really does have this wonder Woman presence about her,
Speaker 3: Like you walk in the way that you carry yourself,
Speaker 3: what you're wearing, like you've always been very mindful about
Speaker 3: the way that you dress and what you put on
Speaker 3: your body and it and it being a symbol of
Speaker 3: who you are. And so I wanted to ask how
Speaker 3: you've how that's evolved in your life, and whether it's
Speaker 3: like a tooling technique for creating this confidence and how
Speaker 3: how how they marry together.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's super deliberate. So I set a goal and
Speaker 1: I think, how do I actually get to it? Now?
Speaker 2: Flashing back to me being from North London.
Speaker 1: Greed girl, like at the age of ten, I was
Speaker 1: bully for my looks. I had the unibrow, I had
Speaker 1: the braces that went all the way around the head.
Speaker 1: And how many of us carry the bullying the idea
Speaker 1: of who we are with us for the rest of
Speaker 1: our lives. And I realized as I started to get
Speaker 1: into my twenties and my early thirties that the way
Speaker 1: that I was showing up was absolutely dictating the results
Speaker 1: that I was getting in life. And so when I
Speaker 1: wasn't achieving something, when I was so fearful over something,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't go after it. And so I said, okay, Lisa,
Speaker 1: just ask yourself what do you actually want? And at
Speaker 1: the time, I was a stay at home wife, right,
Speaker 1: I was supporting Tom, I was cooking for him, I
Speaker 1: was cleaning for him, and I wasn't happy. And at
Speaker 1: the time, I was like, I just want to have
Speaker 1: the courage to tell my husband I'm not happy because
Speaker 1: it's not his fault.
Speaker 2: I didn't tell him. So how do we build our
Speaker 2: courage in order to say the hard thing?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: So when you say, Okay, this is what I'm struggling in,
Speaker 1: this is the goal. I just need confidence. At the time,
Speaker 1: I just used the word confidence. I just need confident
Speaker 1: to be able to tell him how the hell am
Speaker 1: I going to do it? And so I start to
Speaker 1: just read books about tactics and techniques, and what I
Speaker 1: realized is how you show up will actually absolutely make
Speaker 1: a difference to how you feel. So if you show
Speaker 1: up in your pajamas, you're gonna probably show up soft
Speaker 1: and sweet and puttly right. But if you in fact,
Speaker 1: i've seen your your dress sense, hold me your freaking bocanet.
Speaker 2: I'm so impressed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I've definitely been trying.
Speaker 2: You really have.
Speaker 1: Now when you put on those beautiful, stunning dresses, what
Speaker 1: does that do to your brain?
Speaker 4: So different?
Speaker 3: Like I remember, and I was going to ask you this,
Speaker 3: when you were in that period of your life, were
Speaker 3: you dressing to hide or were you dressing to be seen?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: Great question. I used to dress to hide. I then
Speaker 1: started to dress so that I could start to see
Speaker 1: myself because I didn't think of myself as a pretty person.
Speaker 1: I didn't think of myself as valuable. I didn't think
Speaker 1: of myself as worthy. I didn't think you know, basically
Speaker 1: fill in the blank. Yeah, And so I started to go, Okay,
Speaker 1: the way that you think about yourself isn't serving what
Speaker 1: you want in life. So with compassion and grace, how
Speaker 1: do I start to actively change the belief I have
Speaker 1: about myself? And so I just was like, Okay, you're
Speaker 1: going to try one hundred things and probably ninety nine
Speaker 1: percent of them aren't going to work. So I had
Speaker 1: to give myself the space to fail in a bunch
Speaker 1: of things so that I wouldn't quit. And then I
Speaker 1: just started to realize, Okay, well when I dress, if
Speaker 1: I wear pajamas, I actually feel really soft. I don't
Speaker 1: feel powerful. When I put on my knee high boots,
Speaker 1: I kind of feel like a bad ass. So that
Speaker 1: became the catalyst to the idea of dressing. Then I
Speaker 1: just understood habits. Habits take thirty sixty ninety days to adopt,
Speaker 1: So I'm not going to wake up tomorrow and think
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, I'm a bad ass. It's going
Speaker 1: to take time. So go all right, Lisa, I have
Speaker 1: to build the habit. How do I build the habit?
Speaker 1: So I keep almost I call it first principles. I
Speaker 1: just keep going back to first print supports. So first
Speaker 1: principle is if I know a habit takes time, If
Speaker 1: I know that I need to use I can use clothes.
Speaker 1: If I know that mirroring, right, you look yourself in
Speaker 1: the mirror. If you look at yourself and insult yourself, yeah,
Speaker 1: what happens?
Speaker 2: You feel worse?
Speaker 1: So I thought, okay, I'm naturally look in a mirror
Speaker 1: and insult myself all the time. What happens if I
Speaker 1: looked in the mirror and gave myself a compliment? What
Speaker 1: if that's the habit I build? Okay, now I've broken
Speaker 1: it down. And the final piece of first principle is
Speaker 1: what's the activation? What's going to activate switching me from
Speaker 1: negative to positive? So what's the activation that's going to
Speaker 1: take me from negative to positive?
Speaker 3: That as activation because usually your default would be most
Speaker 3: of our default is that negative. And so it's activating
Speaker 3: like reactivating yourself, restimulating yourself to realize not to be
Speaker 3: on your default every day. What's that word for it, autopilot? Yeah, autopilot.
Speaker 3: You're reactivating your exactly.
Speaker 1: So I'm so used to going on autopilot and insulting myself.
Speaker 2: I had over twenty years of it, So why am
Speaker 2: I going to think.
Speaker 1: That I'm automatically going to change just because I've read
Speaker 1: the book a podcast. I just know that I know
Speaker 1: now I want to change, but I now need to
Speaker 1: actively show up to change it. So I go, Okay,
Speaker 1: I know I need a habit. I know that mirroring's
Speaker 1: very real, and I know clothes work. How do I
Speaker 1: now use all of this to have a tactic? And
Speaker 1: that's where I was like, let me go online and
Speaker 1: see if there's just like a Wonder Woman logo?
Speaker 2: What's something like that?
Speaker 1: And I found this Wonder Woman necklace and I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, what if? And it sounds silly, but it worked.
Speaker 2: What if I put it.
Speaker 1: On and I look in the mirror and every day
Speaker 1: until it becomes habit, I tell myself that I'm a
Speaker 1: badass like Wonder Woman. And I just kept repeating it
Speaker 1: day after day after day, and you.
Speaker 2: Do it for ninety days you do it for one
Speaker 2: hundred days, like you eventually start to go I'm a freaking.
Speaker 1: Bad like one, Yeah, I really am, you know, and
Speaker 1: then that belief then makes you show up differently. Showing
Speaker 1: up differently makes other people see you differently. Are the
Speaker 1: people seeing you differently? Then reflects back to oh huh.
Speaker 2: Interesting.
Speaker 1: People used to think I was a total talk and
Speaker 1: like an idiot, and now people.
Speaker 2: Are saying, you're really confident. Yes, And then that starts
Speaker 2: to then rewire your entire brain.
Speaker 4: And reaffirm what you're doing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, And now someone else reaffirming what you're doing
Speaker 1: then reaffirms it in and of itself, and now you
Speaker 1: inevitably become confident.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, you really described that process so well,
Speaker 3: so thank you for doing And I think the only
Speaker 3: way you could really describe it is by being someone
Speaker 3: who's gone through it and has actually lived it. I
Speaker 3: had this visual when we were talking, when you were
Speaker 3: talking about you back in the day, thinking how you
Speaker 3: can be abaud us. I was thinking, one, that has
Speaker 3: to be the name of an expert us and two
Speaker 3: it was like a comic book in my mind where
Speaker 3: by the way, Lisa is an incredible artist, what like
Speaker 3: I can't even describe how incredible her are is.
Speaker 4: But I had this vision of you, like writing in your.
Speaker 3: Scrap book how to be a bad Our Step one, And.
Speaker 1: That's literally why I wrote the book Radical Confidence, because
Speaker 1: your confidence won't happen by accident. It has to be
Speaker 1: a deliberate, conscious effort every single day. And the thing is,
Speaker 1: I don't bs myself and I call myself on the
Speaker 1: reality of things, and between those two it's allowed me
Speaker 1: to say, does this technique works? And look, this technique
Speaker 1: even though I'm relaying to you, I tried a hundred
Speaker 1: different ones before that that completely failed, but I never
Speaker 1: gave up because I had the eye on that goal
Speaker 1: and then I retroactively work backwards.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like you know, even when you were
Speaker 3: talking about changing the way that you were dressing as
Speaker 3: we just were, I was thinking for so many whenever
Speaker 3: I walk into a room and me and Jay really
Speaker 3: different on this, and I still am working to like
Speaker 3: change my mindset around it. But I'll be like, I
Speaker 3: don't want to be overdressed, and just like, why don't
Speaker 3: you want to be over something? I do not want
Speaker 3: to be overdressed. I'd rather be underdressed and overdressed. That's
Speaker 3: always been my mindset. I would rather be underdressed and
Speaker 3: overdress because I don't want to show up looking like
Speaker 3: I've tried too hard or like I have put in
Speaker 3: so much effort and then I'm like showing up more
Speaker 3: than everybody else. And so my mindset has forever been
Speaker 3: don't ever don't be too overdressed. It's better to be
Speaker 3: underdressed and overdress. His is it's better to be overdressed
Speaker 3: and underdressed, so I look like I'm prepared and I'm
Speaker 3: ready and I've come like having thought about it. And
Speaker 3: I was really thinking about that while you were talking,
Speaker 3: because I was saying, why do I feel like that?
Speaker 3: Like why do I always want prefer that? And I
Speaker 3: realized it's probably that feeling of if you're underdressed, people
Speaker 3: won't pay as much attention like you being underdressed, there's
Speaker 3: always gonna be more people overdressed, which means people are
Speaker 3: going to be looking at them more. So if you're underdressed,
Speaker 3: you kind of just blend in and you don't stick out.
Speaker 4: And I was thinking about it with you.
Speaker 3: It's like you really had to change the way that
Speaker 3: you carried yourself and what you were wearing, so that
Speaker 3: even if you weren't ready to stick out, you can
Speaker 3: help us stick out.
Speaker 1: Oh can we talk about this for a second, because
Speaker 1: this is fascinating. We both have insecurities, and yeah, our
Speaker 1: tactics are very different because I'm like Jay out of insecurity.
Speaker 1: I want to be like, Okay, just in case, even
Speaker 1: if I'm gonna wear the heels and the thing and
Speaker 1: the thing, because I don't want people to think, oh God,
Speaker 1: look at the state of Lisa. And so yours is
Speaker 1: to not get the attention, and mind's to not get
Speaker 1: the negative attention.
Speaker 3: So we've got the same mindset going in, but our
Speaker 3: tactics are different. And so I'd rather like, if I
Speaker 3: don't feel good about myself, I'll be like, no, I'll
Speaker 3: just wear like the baggy shirt and the bags and
Speaker 3: things I feel the most comfortable in.
Speaker 4: And yours is let me.
Speaker 3: Show up in the things that I maybe don't feel
Speaker 3: comfortable in, but that make me show up as the
Speaker 3: person that I wanted to be.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna try your technique.
Speaker 2: I'll try yours. We'll report back.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and so what we're gonna.
Speaker 1: Go ahead I'm not just gonna say, but isn't that
Speaker 1: interesting even for anyone, especially women listening right now, of
Speaker 1: how we'll look at our friends, or we look at
Speaker 1: people around us, and we have a whole story in
Speaker 1: our head about how that person feels because I've seen you,
Speaker 1: We've been too many things together, and I've seen you
Speaker 1: really casual, and you know what I tell myself, Wow,
Speaker 1: I wish I was that confident to be able to
Speaker 1: just roll up in a big baggy sweater and not
Speaker 1: give a shit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So when my friends are like, gosh, I can't
Speaker 3: believe you showed up with like hardly any makeup on,
Speaker 3: or you don't get and I'm like, yeah, that's because
Speaker 3: I don't want to show up like I've shown up.
Speaker 3: And it's but I also now you saying that I've
Speaker 3: changed the way that I'm.
Speaker 4: Like dressing and stuff.
Speaker 3: I realize how much it makes me feel good about
Speaker 3: myself when I'm putting an effort to myself, Like when
Speaker 3: I'm putting an effort on myself, when I'm thinking about
Speaker 3: what I can dress myself in and and the way
Speaker 3: that I can change the way that I'm looking in
Speaker 3: certain you know, when I'm going out when I'm going
Speaker 3: to parties, whatever it is, it actually is showing more
Speaker 3: care and attention to myself and so it's actually so
Speaker 3: much less about what other people are thinking or seeing
Speaker 3: you as. But it's like, Oh, I'm finally decided that
Speaker 3: I want to pay more attention to myself and that
Speaker 3: I want to be particular and attention to detail about
Speaker 3: the way that I'm looking after myself. And so I've
Speaker 3: now recognize it as a reflection of myself. I'm like,
Speaker 3: why am I gonna Why is my sweat drawer and
Speaker 3: my sweat area in my cupboard the largest area in
Speaker 3: my thing and hasn't changed since the pandemic, Like something
Speaker 3: has to change.
Speaker 4: And my.
Speaker 3: Assistant Lise bet I told her that at the beginning
Speaker 3: of the hours, I really want to like up level
Speaker 3: the way that I'm dressing, like it's not making me happy.
Speaker 3: And so every time I get into sweats and I
Speaker 3: decide to film a video, she's like, I'm just reminding you.
Speaker 3: You told me that you wanted to level up, and
Speaker 3: I'm just letting you know.
Speaker 4: You're in sweats and I'm okay, fine, I'll go and change.
Speaker 3: But it really does take a change of pattern because
Speaker 3: you get into comfort zone doesn't necessarily and I talk
Speaker 3: about this a lot lately because I've noticed it in myself.
Speaker 3: Being in your comfort zone doesn't necessarily mean you're happy.
Speaker 3: And we know that right, Like comfort zone is sometimes
Speaker 3: a very dangerous place to be in and it can
Speaker 3: actually keep you stagnant, unhappy, but it feels comfortable, and
Speaker 3: so yeah, I've started buying new things, trying out new hairstyles,
Speaker 3: trying out new different ways of dressing, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: I actually really like it.
Speaker 4: And it does make you feel so different.
Speaker 1: And now you're telling yourself right that you're worthy enough
Speaker 1: to put yourself first and.
Speaker 3: That in an effort is a good thing. It's not h oh,
Speaker 3: you're being too much or you're showing up. It's a
Speaker 3: weird it's a weird mindset to have, but yeah, that's
Speaker 3: what it was. Like, I don't want to seem like
Speaker 3: I've put in too much effort.
Speaker 1: Now, think about what even just equating that with clothing,
Speaker 1: and like, we don't want to be perceived in a
Speaker 1: certain way, but if we don't really kind of take
Speaker 1: care of ourselves, that we're telling our bodies and ourselves
Speaker 1: that we're not priority.
Speaker 2: Now, imagine what people pleasing is doing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you're always trying to please other people and
Speaker 1: you put yourself last. It's like, well, no, wonder we're
Speaker 1: having all these health issues because we've just been taught
Speaker 1: that you've got to keep showing up.
Speaker 2: And it's selfish.
Speaker 1: If you cook yourself food and don't cook your partner
Speaker 1: food or something like that, you know.
Speaker 3: It tells you what you were to eat versus what
Speaker 3: what's good for your health versus what they want to have.
Speaker 3: On that note, we've had this conversation before, and I
Speaker 3: think sometimes, especially for women, there's this really blared line
Speaker 3: between confidence and arrogance and ego and how do you
Speaker 3: differentiate that not in other people, but in yourself when
Speaker 3: you are checking yourself, Because sometimes ego does take over
Speaker 3: and sometimes we can get a little bit arrogant in
Speaker 3: maybe our skills, our appearance, our whatever everybody tells us
Speaker 3: we are good at. Sometimes arrogance can creep in. How
Speaker 3: do you create that difference and how do you ensure
Speaker 3: that it is your confidence and it's not your ego.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great question, and I think for me,
Speaker 1: arrogance and confidence is really when you're willing to show up,
Speaker 1: or you can show up and feel good about yourself.
Speaker 1: Arrogance is that you're trying to make other people smaller
Speaker 1: in order to feel good about yourself.
Speaker 4: Great differentiation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so when you're trying to put other people down
Speaker 1: so that you feel great, that's freaking arrogance, right, Like
Speaker 1: I know more than you do things like that.
Speaker 2: But now with ego.
Speaker 1: So for me, the funny thing is my ego and
Speaker 1: confidence are actually completely polar opposites.
Speaker 2: And so take band on that.
Speaker 1: Okay, So take my show Women of impat Right, I'm
Speaker 1: about to go on camera, and I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: want to get on camera, Like I'm bullied, I was
Speaker 1: teased for my looks. Why would I ever go on camera?
Speaker 1: And so I was like, I wanted to do a podcast.
Speaker 1: I really wanted to help women. That was like my
Speaker 1: mission statement. So I said to my husband Tom, I
Speaker 1: was like, Babe, I'm just going to do a podcast,
Speaker 1: but I'm just going to do it on zoom and
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna do it with my friends. And it
Speaker 1: was all because I was completely insecure, so I didn't
Speaker 1: want to like stretch myself back to the comfort zone. Thing,
Speaker 1: and so my wonderful husband. We've got a commitment to
Speaker 1: each other. We will always repeat back to each other
Speaker 1: what our goals and dreams are, especially moments where we're
Speaker 1: not acting in accordance. And so Tom said to me, Baby,
Speaker 1: I love you, and here's the hard truth. You've told
Speaker 1: me you really want to help women.
Speaker 2: I was like, what I do?
Speaker 1: And he's like, okay, you've just told me that you
Speaker 1: want to do a podcasts because you want to help women.
Speaker 2: I was like, well I do. And he's like, but
Speaker 2: you don't want to go on set.
Speaker 1: We already have a set bill, We've got six cameras
Speaker 1: because Tom already had his own show, And he's like,
Speaker 1: if you really want to help women, that you would
Speaker 1: do on camera. And I was like, oh, okay, well
Speaker 1: why am I not going on camera? And I was
Speaker 1: like it's because of my ego. M my ego wants
Speaker 1: to protect me. And I think is that we've villainized
Speaker 1: egos and I've actually repivoted how I see my ego.
Speaker 1: I see my ego as my best friend. She is
Speaker 1: there to tell me the truth. Hey, if you get
Speaker 1: on camera, you're gonna mess up.
Speaker 4: Yeah, if you get on camera, someone may say something
Speaker 4: about you.
Speaker 2: Yes, now here's the thing.
Speaker 1: We think that is a bad thing, But the truth is,
Speaker 1: you get on camera, someone's.
Speaker 2: Gonna say something bad about you.
Speaker 1: You get in front of the camera, you're probably gonna
Speaker 1: mess up if you've never been on camera before. So
Speaker 1: I realized she was actually instead of thinking of her
Speaker 1: as like this critic, she's actually my coach and she's
Speaker 1: here to help guide me. So a that was one
Speaker 1: way eliminated the negative voice. But then I was just
Speaker 1: very truthful in saying I actually don't have the confidence
Speaker 1: to get on camera, and that's why my ego is
Speaker 1: shouting at me, don't do it. Yes, but in that moment,
Speaker 1: how do you show up? And I asked myself, Okay, well,
Speaker 1: what's like. I want everyone right now to actually ask
Speaker 1: themselves when they've got a goal and they don't want
Speaker 1: to do it with compassion, ask yourself what's more important,
Speaker 1: your mission or your ego, Because in that moment, I
Speaker 1: didn't have the confidence to go on camera. My ego
Speaker 1: didn't want me to go on camera. But my mission
Speaker 1: statement is to help women. So you can see how
Speaker 1: I was utterly in conflict, and so I just had
Speaker 1: to be honest with myself. And the second I said
Speaker 1: my mission is more important than my ego, I realized
Speaker 1: I had to get in front of the camera. That's
Speaker 1: when I reimagined that my ego, instead of being the critic,
Speaker 1: was my coach. She was helping me get in front
Speaker 1: of the camera. And that's how I ended up, you know,
Speaker 1: really starting my show. But it was the fact that
Speaker 1: I didn't have the confidence. My ego desperately didn't want
Speaker 1: me to get on camera or you know, fill it
Speaker 1: whatever someone wants to do. And it's just like, we
Speaker 1: want to beat that out of ourselves. We want to
Speaker 1: stop feeling the ego. We want to pretend it doesn't exist,
Speaker 1: we want to villainize it. But what if it be
Speaker 1: your freaking superpower? Yeah, and that idea has changed my life.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And actually, if you think about it, sometimes most of
Speaker 3: the time when we think about insecurities, people see it
Speaker 3: as as almost humility, like, oh, that person doesn't want
Speaker 3: to do this and doesn't want to do that, and
Speaker 3: that must mean that they.
Speaker 4: Have so much humility.
Speaker 3: But actually often people don't link ego and insecurity together,
Speaker 3: and actually it's so much. Those two are so so
Speaker 3: tied together because our ego creates these ideas in our head.
Speaker 3: And as soon as you think you're going to be
Speaker 3: put in a position where you could be ridiculed, where
Speaker 3: you could be told that you're not as good looking
Speaker 3: as you think you are, that you aren't as intelligent
Speaker 3: as you thought you were, or all the things that
Speaker 3: you may even think about yourself may come to light
Speaker 3: with other people. That is pure ego. And so actually
Speaker 3: showing up for you was counteracting your ego, not showing
Speaker 3: up in a way that shows your egoact.
Speaker 1: Fact, yeah, one thousand percent. And the word ego actually
Speaker 1: comes from the Greek word erron, which means me.
Speaker 4: Oh wow.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, And I interviewed this psychologist and she
Speaker 1: broke down that when you're a child, and let's say
Speaker 1: your parents are either abusive or arguing alcoholics, Like listen,
Speaker 1: just assume bad upbringing as a kid, you don't look
Speaker 1: at your parents to go they're they're having a hormonal issue.
Speaker 1: They're having issues. They should get divorced. Like you don't
Speaker 1: have logic. You cannot as a child point to your
Speaker 1: parents as the enemy because now, as a child, you
Speaker 1: don't have a roof over your head and you don't
Speaker 1: have food to eat. So as a self protecting mechanism,
Speaker 1: what do children do. They turn on themselves and they
Speaker 1: make it about them, which is why you hear so
Speaker 1: many kids say think that the divorce, the parents getting
Speaker 1: divorced is because of them, because it is actually safer
Speaker 1: for you to say it's your fault than to blame
Speaker 1: your parents, because if your parents aren't there to help you,
Speaker 1: you die. So the ego started as a protective mechanism
Speaker 1: for you to survive. So now that I know that,
Speaker 1: I don't I like like I said, I just welcome
Speaker 1: it because it is there to help us. And if
Speaker 1: we reframe that, could you imagine the stuff that we
Speaker 1: could do.
Speaker 3: Actually, don't me talking about the wanting to look dressfully
Speaker 3: simple and then seem really simple. I realize actually now
Speaker 3: thinking about what you're saying, it actually probably does come
Speaker 3: from so much of a place of ego, in the
Speaker 3: sense that I think having the life, having my life
Speaker 3: having changed so much, like my life has changed so
Speaker 3: much since I lived in Watford, since I was in
Speaker 3: the UK, since I lived in my parents' house, and
Speaker 3: so I think I was very used to and at
Speaker 3: that time in life I was a lot simpler. I
Speaker 3: didn't really want to. I hadn't come into contact with
Speaker 3: people we're wearing like that as much makeup or like
Speaker 3: dressing in certain ways. And as I've adapted, as I've
Speaker 3: been exposed to more things, as we all do, the
Speaker 3: idea of dressing up or like, you know, dressing in
Speaker 3: a certain way, it makes me think people are going
Speaker 3: to think, oh, maybe she's not as simple anymore, or
Speaker 3: maybe she doesn't like she's you know, the idea of
Speaker 3: people thinking when you change your lifestyle, you change with it,
Speaker 3: but of course you change with it. But I think,
Speaker 3: and now, after reflecting, I'm like, oh, it's probably because
Speaker 3: I don't want people to think I've changed, because now
Speaker 3: I live in la and I do all these things
Speaker 3: and I and so I'm like, oh, wow, it actually
Speaker 3: is link The insecurity is somewhat linked to ego. And
Speaker 3: I've been masking it as being like a, oh, it's
Speaker 3: because I don't want to be seen, but actually it's
Speaker 3: because I don't want to be seen in a specific way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So how are you navigating that now?
Speaker 1: Because it's interesting that you said, like, it's not that
Speaker 1: I want to change, but you do want to change.
Speaker 4: No, I do want to change.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And what it actually is now the way that
Speaker 3: I'm dealing with is that I have to be honest
Speaker 3: with the way that I actually do want to dress
Speaker 3: and show up and look. And actually showing up in
Speaker 3: the sweats wasn't making me happy, or showing up in
Speaker 3: like my my outfits that I actually felt were very
Speaker 3: simple or the person that I was three years ago
Speaker 3: or five years ago or even yesterday one making me happy.
Speaker 3: And so it's either showing up in a way not
Speaker 3: to be seen but being unhappy as me or being okay,
Speaker 3: like we said, whether you're on camera, whether it's people
Speaker 3: from your past or whether it's whatever, saying that you've
Speaker 3: changed and seeing it as like, yeah, I haven't. It's
Speaker 3: a positive thing because I want to be this, this
Speaker 3: is who I am now. And so I think it's
Speaker 3: one accepting who you are now, which is what I
Speaker 3: have to do, and two being okay with people misunderstanding
Speaker 3: you and being okay with if they're not ready for FU
Speaker 3: to change doesn't mean you shouldn't change.
Speaker 1: How are you okay that with that? Because I know
Speaker 1: that you're such a people pleasing.
Speaker 3: How am I okay with that because I don't want
Speaker 3: to live my life not feeling happy in myself every
Speaker 3: single day. And I've come to terms with the fact
Speaker 3: that you're just constantly misunderstood because people don't know your
Speaker 3: heart and how can they? And I'm like, it's not
Speaker 3: actually their fault, because you only how you bet sometimes
Speaker 3: don't even know the heart of the people you're closest
Speaker 3: to if they don't open up to it. So how
Speaker 3: can I expect strangers to know my like the inside
Speaker 3: of my heart?
Speaker 4: How can people?
Speaker 3: How can I expect other people to know my deep
Speaker 3: intentions with why I'm doing something? I can't expect them
Speaker 3: to unless I'm sitting there explaining to them every single day.
Speaker 3: And so it's not about whether you're on camera or
Speaker 3: off camera. It's like people will never know your truest,
Speaker 3: deep intentions. You can either spend your life explaining it
Speaker 3: to them or trying to and even then they won't
Speaker 3: understand it. Or you try and refine your intentions, try
Speaker 3: and purify them, try and keep them as good as possible,
Speaker 3: and then how you show up is at least authentic,
Speaker 3: and how people receive you is then not your problem.
Speaker 3: And so I think I've constantly been putting that through
Speaker 3: my mind because it's like, I can either show up
Speaker 3: how I think other people want to see me, and
Speaker 3: I'll be upset and they'll still probably be disappointed because
Speaker 3: I will never make them happy. Or I can start
Speaker 3: just being honest with myself, which means I can be
Speaker 3: a little bit more authentic in the way that I
Speaker 3: am to myself and show up to other people, because
Speaker 3: you can always feel when people's energy doesn't match their
Speaker 3: intention or the way that they show up doesn't actually
Speaker 3: match who they are, and so I can either be
Speaker 3: that person where things just quite onn't aligning for myself
Speaker 3: or those other people, or I can just be like,
Speaker 3: you know what, this is who I am. It's a
Speaker 3: bit rough, it's a bit un I don't know what's happening,
Speaker 3: but at least I'm being honest about it, and I'm
Speaker 3: shifting and changing as things are changing and shifting within me.
Speaker 1: I love that, and it made me realize and think
Speaker 1: about something I don't think I've told you this. Last
Speaker 1: time we hung out, you broke down integrity to me. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I can't remember why we were talking about it,
Speaker 1: but it stuck.
Speaker 2: With me to that day.
Speaker 4: Or something rather than that.
Speaker 3: Sami said to me, Yeah, integrity is when your words,
Speaker 3: your actions, your words, your actions, and your thoughts are
Speaker 3: in complete alignment.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And because I'm such a visual person, right, I kind
Speaker 1: of picture it like, Okay, it starts with your thoughts,
Speaker 1: your words, your words go to your hands.
Speaker 2: Your hands create the action.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So, but so it's really helped me now in the
Speaker 1: people please inside of things, because every time someone wants something,
Speaker 1: I really want to make them happy.
Speaker 2: I really want to make them happy.
Speaker 1: Or we all know if you get the text of
Speaker 1: like hey, you want to go out, and you're like,
Speaker 1: I really don't want to go out, but sometimes you're like,
Speaker 1: all right, I'll force myself. I don't want to let
Speaker 1: be left out. I go, okay, do I want to
Speaker 1: go out?
Speaker 4: Yes?
Speaker 2: Or no?
Speaker 4: No?
Speaker 1: Okay, don't lie and be like I'm sorry, just like
Speaker 1: be honest about why, you know what, I'm really tired.
Speaker 1: And then the action is I sit down and I'm resting.
Speaker 1: And that alignment has helped so much, Like it's such
Speaker 1: a simple equation, if you will, but it's really helped
Speaker 1: me make sure and since then, I've had tough conversations
Speaker 1: with people that I really don't want to have because
Speaker 1: normally I'd be like, it's fine, I don't yeah, but
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. But I'm like, well, no, I keep
Speaker 1: thinking about it, I keep not saying in alignment with
Speaker 1: what I'm thinking, And so how do I start to,
Speaker 1: you know, act in accordance. And that has either really
Speaker 1: made it much better, like better relationships, closer relationships, or
Speaker 1: it's actually somewhat made things more difficult with people, But
Speaker 1: it's the truth, and I think that that's more peace
Speaker 1: worthy then just trying to say a lie.
Speaker 2: To keep the peace.
Speaker 3: I go back to that statement over and over again too,
Speaker 3: because I either have a people pleasing nature to make
Speaker 3: sure other people that are still okay with me and
Speaker 3: don't get upset with me, or I have it because
Speaker 3: it makes me feel good about myself of feeling like
Speaker 3: I'm doing something for somebody else and it creates value.
Speaker 3: And so I've had to really differentiate between the two, like,
Speaker 3: am I doing it because I want to be liked?
Speaker 4: That's not a good reason.
Speaker 3: Am I doing it because it makes me feel valuable
Speaker 3: in their life also not a good reason? Or am
Speaker 3: I doing it because it's genuinely what I want to do,
Speaker 3: And I always say, like, you always know when you're
Speaker 3: overextending yourself, when you feel resentment or depletion or the
Speaker 3: need for someone to reciprocate with you, and you're constantly
Speaker 3: thinking about those one of those three. After you give
Speaker 3: too much, you always know you've gone past your ability
Speaker 3: to give and your limits of people pleasing when you
Speaker 3: have a negative, a negative feeling after it, Because if
Speaker 3: you actually give from a when you actually deeply want
Speaker 3: to give, you're never thinking, I wonder when that person's
Speaker 3: gonna give back to me, I wonder where, like I
Speaker 3: wonder when this will be repaid in my life. I
Speaker 3: give that a person a packet of Chris, I wonder
Speaker 3: when they're going to give me that packet of Chris
Speaker 3: back or chips. You know, that's such a small, small example.
Speaker 3: But when you're not requiring that reciprocation and you're not
Speaker 3: requiring that and you're not feeling those negative or resentful feelings,
Speaker 3: that's when you know you've given to the capacity that
Speaker 3: you have and you haven't given it inauthentically, because giving
Speaker 3: it authentically then it's like why am I giving anyway?
Speaker 3: Because I'm actually not giving? Am I actually giving a
Speaker 3: negative part of me.
Speaker 1: And what's worse is when you give and you're like,
Speaker 1: you pride yourself on the self sacrifice.
Speaker 3: Exactly, that's what exactly, Well, oh I've been this is
Speaker 3: me being a really good person even though it's really
Speaker 3: pain even though they don't deserve it.
Speaker 1: Well, but that then goes like it makes you feel
Speaker 1: even prouder. But that's really dangerous again going to your feeding. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you're telling yourself as well that again you're not
Speaker 1: as worthy or you're not as valuable. And so then
Speaker 1: the other part actually that you were saying about the
Speaker 1: resentment is there was this whole study by done by
Speaker 1: the Gotman Institute that I'm obsessed with. And do you
Speaker 1: know the study, Well, the Gotmans are amazing. So they
Speaker 1: bring in these couples and they switch the sound off
Speaker 1: in the rooms so they can't hear what the couples
Speaker 1: are saying, and they have someone sit with the couples
Speaker 1: in the room and they ask them questions and they said,
Speaker 1: with ninety nine zero percent accuracy, just by the way
Speaker 1: that they were acting towards each other, the physical movements,
Speaker 1: they could predic with ninety percent accuracy whether they were
Speaker 1: going to get divorced within the seven years. Yes, And
Speaker 1: you know the thing, they were looking out for contempt
Speaker 1: and resentment. And they said, the second you start to
Speaker 1: resent or have contempt for your partner, you're ninety percent
Speaker 1: chance of getting divorced. And they saw contempt and resentment
Speaker 1: in body language. It was the rolling of the eyes,
Speaker 1: it was the and they would ask the couples like
Speaker 1: the opening question was, tell me about how you first
Speaker 1: met wow, because you'd either go, well, yeah, he chatted me,
Speaker 1: he chatted me up at a bar.
Speaker 2: No, I didn't you chatted me up? Right, you get that.
Speaker 1: Story, or you'd be like, oh my god, let me
Speaker 1: tell you he was so sweet. Right, And just by
Speaker 1: people telling their stories will show whether they have contempt.
Speaker 1: Whether they've got contempt will then lead to ninety percent accuracy.
Speaker 1: So you can now imagine obviously that's relationship. But now
Speaker 1: think about it with friends, think about it with family members.
Speaker 1: How you're starting to feel when you start to build
Speaker 1: this contempt or resentment towards them.
Speaker 3: Totally it changes your everyday interactions with people. Let's say
Speaker 3: someone comes to you today and they're like, tell me
Speaker 3: what the first step is? What should I do right
Speaker 3: now today to I'm at the lowest point of though,
Speaker 3: I don't know how to build up my confidence. What
Speaker 3: can I start with today? Like, do you have like
Speaker 3: a step one in your book of where to start.
Speaker 2: So it all has.
Speaker 1: To be with the planning before you even do an action.
Speaker 1: So really you have to understand that confidence is the
Speaker 1: byproduct of taking action. So you cannot get confidence before
Speaker 1: you start.
Speaker 2: Okay, you just can't. Yeah, confidence is built, So now
Speaker 2: think of it.
Speaker 1: So now imagine I because the analogy is important for
Speaker 1: you to understand, so then know the actions. So for instance,
Speaker 1: if I would say to you RADI go to the
Speaker 1: gym and I'm going to give you six weeks to
Speaker 1: curl twenty pounds, you may go up, Okay, cool, I'm
Speaker 1: going to go in. I'm gonna curl every single day,
Speaker 1: I'm going to eat this food blah blah blah. And
Speaker 1: you're gonna have a plan put together. And then at
Speaker 1: the end of the six weeks, hopefully you're going to
Speaker 1: be able to maybe get even close to that. But
Speaker 1: now imagine I go, okay, cool, you've done that. Now
Speaker 1: I want you to go in and bedlift. You have
Speaker 1: to start from scratch again. But people think if you've
Speaker 1: got confidence in one area, it means you've got confidence
Speaker 1: in every area. If you think of it like a muscle.
Speaker 1: Now hopefully you can understand that. You just have to
Speaker 1: identify firstly, what type of confidence muscle you need to
Speaker 1: start building. So when someone comes, it's like, I don't
Speaker 1: know what I'm doing. I don't want to get started.
Speaker 1: I need to build my confidence.
Speaker 2: What do I do? It's like, you have to understand
Speaker 2: what you want confidence in.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so if you say, okay, I want confidence in
Speaker 1: public speaking, Okay, now we at least have the framework.
Speaker 2: You know your end goal, you know exactly what you're
Speaker 2: trying to get to.
Speaker 1: So what I then like to do is I like
Speaker 1: to use equations again because I can get in my
Speaker 1: own way with emotion. So I put everything into like
Speaker 1: mathematical equations, things that I can't. So I go, okay,
Speaker 1: if I want to get on stage, put a goal
Speaker 1: in place that you are then working towards every single day.
Speaker 1: So what does a goal look like? It's a what
Speaker 1: and how much and by when. That's the equation that
Speaker 1: makes up a goal. So what I want to be
Speaker 1: able to go on stand on stage and do a speech.
Speaker 2: Right, Okay, how many? I just want to do one.
Speaker 2: I just want one by when by the end of
Speaker 2: the year.
Speaker 1: Okay, Now you refined when you say I want confidence,
Speaker 1: What does that mean? You've refined it down to something
Speaker 1: very specific.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that makes so much sense.
Speaker 1: So now you say, by the end of the year,
Speaker 1: I want to do a public speaking gig and I
Speaker 1: want to be on stage.
Speaker 4: Great.
Speaker 1: Now what you do is you take the time when
Speaker 1: you're you're you know, comfortable, maybe you're with your friends,
Speaker 1: and you write out a blueprint a plan. Okay, if
Speaker 1: I've never public spoken before, what step one? Gain the knowledge?
Speaker 1: So step one maybe ask all of your friends who
Speaker 1: maybe have done public speaking, ask them a thousand questions,
Speaker 1: sit with them, sit by their feet, and be the student. Yes,
Speaker 1: once you've done that, what's step two? Maybe you prepare
Speaker 1: your own speech. Okay, you write it out. Step three
Speaker 1: is you film it? Step four is you rewatch it?
Speaker 1: Step five is you rewrite your speech. Now you can
Speaker 1: see I do every freaking tiny little step for the
Speaker 1: micro moment micro moments, because if you told me go
Speaker 1: on stage and speak to a thousand people, I would
Speaker 1: have a heart attack. But what I do is when
Speaker 1: I wake up in the morning, I look at my
Speaker 1: cheek sheet and I go, what did I tell myself
Speaker 1: I was going to do today today? I just said
Speaker 1: that I was going to write the speech. I didn't
Speaker 1: say I was going to perform it. I didn't say
Speaker 1: I was going to film it. I didn't say I
Speaker 1: was going to do anything with it. All I said
Speaker 1: was I was going to write it. And if you
Speaker 1: do that every single day, that then becomes the way
Speaker 1: that you do. You build your confidence, and then you
Speaker 1: get your confidence.
Speaker 3: I cannot tell you how deeply I resonate with that,
Speaker 3: because I had this moment of actually going up on
Speaker 3: stage and actually have, like I said yes to doing
Speaker 3: a keynote that I had never done before that I
Speaker 3: had the most amount of fear of.
Speaker 4: And every step that you.
Speaker 3: Just said, and I just want to say how much
Speaker 3: this works, because every single step that you just said
Speaker 3: is what I did. I started over a month before
Speaker 3: I was going to do it, maybe two months ide eighteen,
Speaker 3: trying to figure out what I wanted to speak about.
Speaker 3: First of all, I asked Jay, because he's such an
Speaker 3: expert at public speaking, I asked him, what are your tips? Like,
Speaker 3: how do you even form the speech that? I'm like,
Speaker 3: how do I even form a keynot?
Speaker 4: I didn't even know where to start.
Speaker 3: He gave me his framework, and so I sat down
Speaker 3: and I started writing it, and then I was saying
Speaker 3: it to myself over and over again, and then I
Speaker 3: decided to do it to the team that was here.
Speaker 3: And I'll be honest, I cried while I was giving
Speaker 3: that job. But because because the discomfort of speaking in
Speaker 3: front of people may like I cry and discomfort like
Speaker 3: that's the way that my body deals with it. It's
Speaker 3: suddenly the feeling of such discomfort makes me cry. And
Speaker 3: so I remember sitting in my lounge, my living room,
Speaker 3: and I was sat in front of them saying the thing,
Speaker 3: and I even had my little notes. I was like,
Speaker 3: I don't feel comfortable doing it without my notes. So
Speaker 3: I was doing my notes and I literally broke down
Speaker 3: halfway into tears because I was like the anxiety that
Speaker 3: had build up built up in me to actually say
Speaker 3: it to anybody, to take it from being by myself
Speaker 3: to somebody else was huge. But I made it to
Speaker 3: the stage. And what I will say is, I was thinking,
Speaker 3: while you were saying that all these little things that
Speaker 3: I ended up saying yes to. And I remember thinking,
Speaker 3: I've been wanting to build confidence for a long time
Speaker 3: in different areas.
Speaker 4: But You're right.
Speaker 3: Whenever I would say I want to be more confident,
Speaker 3: but be like, what does that mean? Like when you're
Speaker 3: giving yourself such a large goal, It's like, how do
Speaker 3: I know what being confident even means? What does it
Speaker 3: even look like? And now as you're saying that, I'm
Speaker 3: reflecting back and I'm like, oh my gosh. I said
Speaker 3: yes and did this process in so many different areas
Speaker 3: of my life, whether it's the podcast and deciding to
Speaker 3: do that, showing up in something that I'm not for
Speaker 3: me with the speaking, writing the book, all of these
Speaker 3: things have been very different things in different areas, and
Speaker 3: I've gone through the process one step at a time
Speaker 3: at time to completion, and I realized those small completions
Speaker 3: has slowly built the confidence to say yes to the
Speaker 3: next thing, even if it's not the same thing at all.
Speaker 3: It has built the confidence to say yes. So saying
Speaker 3: yes to your podcast that how many years ago, what
Speaker 3: three years ago? Years ago, five years ago? I said
Speaker 3: yes to your podcast, And then I said yes to
Speaker 3: more podcasts, and then I said yes to writing the
Speaker 3: book and all of those small moments. It wasn't at
Speaker 3: the time that I thought, oh, this is building my confidence.
Speaker 3: It was me saying I'm going to complete this thing.
Speaker 3: And now I realized all those completions have been little
Speaker 3: steps towards saying an easier yes to so many other things.
Speaker 2: Yeah, now look at you got your own podcast GOP.
Speaker 1: I know, but that is so important for people to
Speaker 1: hear because it is definitely the pyramid and not the
Speaker 1: pyramid the yes.
Speaker 2: So people see you on stage, that's the tip. They're like, oh,
Speaker 2: look at the iceberg, I see it.
Speaker 1: All that work you've done on Underground is exactly what's
Speaker 1: allowed you to then have that peak.
Speaker 3: I'd all say, it doesn't get easier, Like every day
Speaker 3: before I'm coming on, before I'm doing a podcast, I'm like,
Speaker 3: at least, but my like my team was as robby, like,
Speaker 3: you've done this before. I know, but I'm still really
Speaker 3: anxious and I don't know whether I'm asking the right questions.
Speaker 4: And is this is this? Uh? Is this okay?
Speaker 3: The way that I'm saying this, Have I worded it
Speaker 3: in the right way? And so you still will analyze
Speaker 3: yourself in a way that you may not feel the
Speaker 3: most confident, but the fact that you're still showing up
Speaker 3: and the fact that you're still making the effort to
Speaker 3: go through the motions like that is in my eyes,
Speaker 3: Like now I think about it, I'm like, that is
Speaker 3: the confidence. It's not actually about how other people are
Speaker 3: seeing me. It's not actually about how other people are
Speaker 3: perceiving what I'm doing, being successful or not successful, because
Speaker 3: every day I'm still in it and being like.
Speaker 4: Am I doing this okay? Is this right? Is this okay?
Speaker 3: And so it's actually so much more about how you
Speaker 3: are feeling about yourself and what you're saying yes to
Speaker 3: And as soon as you say yes, it actually tells
Speaker 3: yourself that, oh, I actually believe even if you think
Speaker 3: you don't believe it. Just by saying yes, you're saying
Speaker 3: to yourself, oh, this must mean that you believe in me.
Speaker 3: You believe in me that I can even possibly do it.
Speaker 3: And so the yes makes a difference, even if you
Speaker 3: end up failing, the fact that you even tried and
Speaker 3: you thought you could do it builds confidence in yourself.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And that's the thing though, I think people think that
Speaker 1: if you fail that you are a failure, and it's
Speaker 1: hard to get back up because it actually is right,
Speaker 1: Like everything that we're talking about is like go.
Speaker 2: For it, like build your confidence build.
Speaker 1: Okay, now imagine you've done all the work and you
Speaker 1: get on stage like you were amazing.
Speaker 4: Like cad that.
Speaker 1: But now imagine you actually mess up. Yeah, not like
Speaker 1: let the worst right actually trip and four that would
Speaker 1: be horrifying. But listen, you just mess up your speech completely.
Speaker 2: You say the one.
Speaker 3: Word panel and I did that. I went on a panel,
Speaker 3: I answered one question and I didn't say anything the
Speaker 3: rest of the time because I compare, letly froze and
Speaker 3: they didn't wvite me back ever again that panel.
Speaker 1: But you didn't let that hold you back, right, But
Speaker 1: a lot of us do because we're like, that was
Speaker 1: my one chance, and so we seek perfection otherwise we're
Speaker 1: not going to get started. And actually, people don't want
Speaker 1: to see you being perfect. And there was this whole
Speaker 1: like study they did where I can't remember what university,
Speaker 1: but they hire these two actors or sorry, this one
Speaker 1: actor and she goes into a grocery store, and you know,
Speaker 1: in the grocery stores they have those samples. So they're
Speaker 1: doing this sample of a blender, and so they do
Speaker 1: this one test. They have this blender and this woman
Speaker 1: is like putting food in it and like showing how
Speaker 1: to use it.
Speaker 2: She's look very pretty.
Speaker 1: She does it perfectly, and the blender and the drink
Speaker 1: is amazing, and she serves it to people watching. The
Speaker 1: very next day, the same actress comes back and she's
Speaker 1: doing exactly the same setup, except as she's doing the blender,
Speaker 1: she forgets to put forgets right. This is obviously an act.
Speaker 1: She forgets to put the lid on the blender and
Speaker 1: she presses the on button and so it splashes all
Speaker 1: over her. Now she's doing this demo. Who do you
Speaker 1: think sold more blenders she did?
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: So knowing even that study means that people don't want
Speaker 1: you to be perfect. And there's actually something called like
Speaker 1: the shoe drop syndrome or something where it's when you
Speaker 1: meet someone for the first time, you're always waiting for
Speaker 1: the shoe to drop, always because no one is perfect.
Speaker 1: So whether you're going for a job interview or a date,
Speaker 1: and what they said is the best thing you can
Speaker 1: do is drop the shoe in the first five minutes
Speaker 1: of the conversation, because what it actually does is it
Speaker 1: makes you look trustworthy because now people are like, oh,
Speaker 1: you're not trying to hide that you're imperfect when we
Speaker 1: all secretly know you, of course are imperfect. Yes, So
Speaker 1: like just knowing all of that makes me go okay,
Speaker 1: So if I mess up on stage people actually don't care.
Speaker 1: It will actually show that I'm vulnerable and I'm very real.
Speaker 1: So I'm now going to tell myself that if I
Speaker 1: mess up, it's actually okay. And then what am I
Speaker 1: going to do when I mess up? Because I don't
Speaker 1: seek perfection, I seek progress, So now what's that progression? Okay,
Speaker 1: if I mess up on stage? My plan was just
Speaker 1: laugh yeah, yes, And I did mess up, and I
Speaker 1: just laughed at myself and everyone else laughed and I
Speaker 1: moved on. But that's one of those moments knowing thyself
Speaker 1: and knowing that if I fail, I may never go back.
Speaker 1: I can't afford to never go back. I can't afford
Speaker 1: to never not get back up.
Speaker 4: And they're not going back.
Speaker 3: Reminding yourself that they're not going back is purely because
Speaker 3: your ego doesn't want you to fail and like doesn't
Speaker 3: like the feeling of not being this great, perfect self
Speaker 3: that you've imagined yourself to be. Last question I want
Speaker 3: to ask. I know that there was this part in
Speaker 3: your book where you were talking about us expecting people
Speaker 3: to save us, like this idea of this idea of
Speaker 3: constantly waiting to be saved or somebody to save you.
Speaker 3: So for somebody who has who has this idea, nobody
Speaker 3: believes in them, nobody thinks they're going to succeed. The
Speaker 3: whole of their external world doesn't believe in them.
Speaker 4: How one, as.
Speaker 3: An individual who actually does believe in themselves, how do
Speaker 3: you stop the other people's opinions and voices getting into
Speaker 3: your head and into your own belief? And two, for
Speaker 3: people who like me when I was younger, were constantly
Speaker 3: used to people saving them and doing the work for them,
Speaker 3: what's your advice for them?
Speaker 1: So I'm always project your life out if nothing ever changed, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and get a piece of paper. And I always say
Speaker 1: like nobs like, don't trick yourself.
Speaker 2: We always trick ourselves. Yeah, don't trick yourself.
Speaker 1: Right out if nothing changes, what your life will look
Speaker 1: like in a year, woe look like in five years?
Speaker 2: Woa look like in ten years? And I'm forty four.
Speaker 1: Now, So you imagine I play all this game, all
Speaker 1: the way up until I'm one hundred yea, and I
Speaker 1: just go, now what And it's like, wow, Okay, if
Speaker 1: I and if I can be very honest, because I
Speaker 1: always like to being very honest with myself. So if
Speaker 1: I play like, okay, if I always just let my
Speaker 1: husband take care of me, my mom, my dad, my
Speaker 1: older siblings, what happens? Okay, Well, the chances are they
Speaker 1: going to die before me? Like the statistically I don't
Speaker 1: want to think about it, but statistically, so do I
Speaker 1: want to find myself eight years old and completely helpless
Speaker 1: because I've relied on everybody else.
Speaker 2: And here's the thing. Only you can answer those questions.
Speaker 2: It is your life.
Speaker 1: So do not let me dictate, do not anyone else dictate,
Speaker 1: but just really play that out, or play out a
Speaker 1: scenario where you're in your car and just stuck on
Speaker 1: a freeway and you're seventy years old and you don't
Speaker 1: know how to take care of yourself. Yeah, like do
Speaker 1: you want that? And if the answer is no, then amazing.
Speaker 1: Now you just know that you need to build your
Speaker 1: skill sets and that just takes one thing at a
Speaker 1: time and unwiring or letting go of the things that
Speaker 1: people can do to help you. And for me with
Speaker 1: my health, I was looking to my husband to help me,
Speaker 1: to literally save me. I had massive gut issues. You know,
Speaker 1: you know that I could barely eat anything I was on.
Speaker 1: I was eating five ingredients. Ingredients. Yeah, the first time
Speaker 1: I met you had to go to a special restaurant
Speaker 1: because I could barely eat. And so knowing that I
Speaker 1: can only eat five ingredients, knowing that I was just
Speaker 1: very weak, I was turning to Tom for everything. But
Speaker 1: what happens when he's had a bad day, what happens
Speaker 1: when he's stuck in a meeting?
Speaker 2: And that happened one day.
Speaker 1: I was in a photo shoot and I have massive
Speaker 1: gut like I could barely breathe.
Speaker 2: I was in so much pain.
Speaker 1: So I excuse myself and I was like, I'm just
Speaker 1: going to go to the restaurant, because of course, you
Speaker 1: don't tell people you're in pain.
Speaker 2: Because there's a woman, God forbid.
Speaker 1: I make other people uncomfortable, which now I would just
Speaker 1: tell people, but back then I didn't want to be
Speaker 1: judged for having pain, So that even sounds ridiculous. I
Speaker 1: don't want to be judged for having pain. That's ridiculous.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: So I go upstairs and I fall to the floor,
Speaker 1: like literally, I'm clutching my stomach, I fall to the floor.
Speaker 2: I can barely breathe.
Speaker 1: And in that moment, I'm saying to myself and I
Speaker 1: need my husband. I need my husband. I need him
Speaker 1: to come save me. So I call him and not
Speaker 1: answering his phone, So what do I do? I literally
Speaker 1: was like, well, so what do you do, Lisa? You
Speaker 1: want to spend the rest of your time on the cold, dirty,
Speaker 1: you know, floor, or do you want to be basically
Speaker 1: be the hero of your own life and get back up?
Speaker 1: And that's what I told myself, is like, oh, I
Speaker 1: actually don't need my husband. I want him, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: just really want him to come and help, and that's fine, but.
Speaker 2: I don't need him.
Speaker 1: I can get up on my own. And that analogy,
Speaker 1: I actually got back up on my own. I took
Speaker 1: deep breaths, and I went back to the photo shoot.
Speaker 1: Was really the first sign that I think we dismissed
Speaker 1: the power that we actually carry. And when I realized
Speaker 1: what that was doing to my mindset in every avenue
Speaker 1: of my life, I realized, oh.
Speaker 2: I do turn to people to quote unquote save me.
Speaker 4: Or give your power away?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I give my power away exactly.
Speaker 1: And so now how do I change that? What do
Speaker 1: I do so I can become the hero of my
Speaker 1: own life? And that's where my tagline came from. It's like,
Speaker 1: be the hero of your own life? Is because I
Speaker 1: realized I was looking outward. I was looking for everyone
Speaker 1: else to save me. And the truth is, when you're
Speaker 1: in a moment where you're on the cold floor and
Speaker 1: there's no one else to save you, what do you do?
Speaker 3: You know, when you said save, I thought, I always
Speaker 3: think about it as giving parts of you away. Whenever
Speaker 3: you do that, because you don't give yourself the opportunity.
Speaker 3: Just how good you feel when you save someone else
Speaker 3: is how good you feel when you save yourself. And
Speaker 3: so like whenever I you know, I noticed myself constantly
Speaker 3: giving these little powers away to people that I didn't
Speaker 3: have the confidence to keep for myself or didn't didn't
Speaker 3: know how to utilize. And so I'd be like, oh, no,
Speaker 3: you do that for me. Oh no, you're better at
Speaker 3: this than I am, or you explain this, or I
Speaker 3: don't know how to say this in the right way
Speaker 3: about myself. You tell people what I do, the little
Speaker 3: things that I would do, I would just constantly give
Speaker 3: or give that power away to the point where you
Speaker 3: keep giving everything away and you've got nothing left because
Speaker 3: you've you've constantly just been telling other people that, telling
Speaker 3: yourself that other people are better at it than you are.
Speaker 3: I had to start taking that back, not because they
Speaker 3: were asking, I was freely giving it away. And so
Speaker 3: you have to realize that when you're saving other people,
Speaker 3: it feels good, but saving yourself feels it's like nothing else.
Speaker 3: Constantly doing little things where you are helping yourself, you think.
Speaker 4: That it feels good.
Speaker 3: You know, we always think, oh, I wish I was
Speaker 3: a baby again where someone was doing everything for me.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 4: I feel like we always have that feeling of.
Speaker 3: Oh, you know, get carried around, you know, you get
Speaker 3: people make food for you. But actually there's no self,
Speaker 3: there's no choice in that. You actually get tired of
Speaker 3: other having to rely on other people. And I've been
Speaker 3: that person where, like you know, friends or I've helped
Speaker 3: people out in situations where they end up being dependent
Speaker 3: on me in that way, and I've realized that actually
Speaker 3: doesn't make them feel good. They don't want to have
Speaker 3: to ask me if it's for bailing them out of something,
Speaker 3: if it's for money, if it's for whatever it is. Like,
Speaker 3: no one wants to actually be saved. They want to
Speaker 3: save themselves. But when you end up asking someone else
Speaker 3: to save you, you actually you don't feel great. It doesn't
Speaker 3: make you feel good about yourself. You think it's nice
Speaker 3: having someone looking after you until you realize what it
Speaker 3: actually means. If that's happening over and over again, and
Speaker 3: you just feel helpless and you never want to feel helpless,
Speaker 3: that's so true.
Speaker 1: I love the analogy of like, when you help someone,
Speaker 1: how do you feel? Now, imagine how you're making yourself
Speaker 1: feel that's really powerful, and then just thinking through how
Speaker 1: it starts to spread in areas that we don't realize
Speaker 1: right because right now, the example I gave was looking
Speaker 1: to my husband, But the real thing that I ended
Speaker 1: up realizing was I was turning to the doctors to
Speaker 1: save me. I literally was like, give me a pill
Speaker 1: like you give yourself. And that's when I realized you
Speaker 1: can't outsource your health.
Speaker 4: You can't outsource someone else understanding you better than you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what you need.
Speaker 1: Yes, I literally was turning to doctors being like, what's
Speaker 1: wrong with my body instead of sitting still and asking myself,
Speaker 1: where do I feel pain?
Speaker 2: Yeah? What do I need? Like hands on my heart?
Speaker 2: Compassion and what can I give you right now?
Speaker 1: And sometimes the answer was like just sit still, yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: you know, And it's nothing about yeah, stop like you know,
Speaker 1: being busy, Like just sit still and then being around
Speaker 1: people that you can open your heart to to listen
Speaker 1: to things and then see what's right for you, because
Speaker 1: you know, are you going to get a thousand people
Speaker 1: giving you advice, whether it's about your career, about a relationship,
Speaker 1: about your health. Those are probably the three things that
Speaker 1: people always feel like they've got an opinion definitely in
Speaker 1: your life and a vote, And those are the things
Speaker 1: that I'm like, no, I need to just get still
Speaker 1: enough to figure out what's right with me. And like
Speaker 1: Tom was the same my dad when he met Tom.
Speaker 1: Because I'm Greek Orthodox and Tom isn't and he's American
Speaker 1: and things like that, my dad was like, no, how
Speaker 1: is he going to support you?
Speaker 2: How is he going you know?
Speaker 1: And so it was my dad that was trying to
Speaker 1: make the decision for me, and I had to realize, like, no,
Speaker 1: it's my decision to make, and I'm the one that
Speaker 1: has to live with the consequences on you know whatever
Speaker 1: that looks like, either good or bad.
Speaker 2: But it has to be my decision.
Speaker 1: I can't let someone else make the decision for me,
Speaker 1: because then to your point, just going back to you're
Speaker 1: giving your power away and then what happens when it
Speaker 1: doesn't work?
Speaker 2: You blame them?
Speaker 4: No, No, it's so true.
Speaker 3: Now, this book, like Radical Confidence, how long did it
Speaker 3: take you to write Holley, Yeah, it's.
Speaker 4: Been a year.
Speaker 3: It's filled with so much, but essentially it feels like
Speaker 3: it's ten incredible steps to get you from a place
Speaker 3: of not feeling so confident and then feeling like your
Speaker 3: beast self, like feeling like you're wonder woman.
Speaker 4: Wonder woman is right, yeah, a wonder woman.
Speaker 3: And honestly, guys, like I feel like this podcast has
Speaker 3: helped me so much, you mean, just unreflecting and reflecting
Speaker 3: on myself but also understanding areas that I want to
Speaker 3: work on and build confidence. So thank you so much
Speaker 3: for that. Everyone go out and get this boat, because
Speaker 3: it honestly is it's an incredible incredible book, and just
Speaker 3: hearing you speak over the past years on your podcast
Speaker 3: has been really helpful and you've helped me so much
Speaker 3: in my life, so thank you for that.
Speaker 4: I have last a final few questions I ask you. Okay,
Speaker 4: we's like rapid fire, Yeah, a little.
Speaker 2: I'm not very good at rapid fire though I wasn't either.
Speaker 2: I I think I heard you on Jay's or something.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I can't decide what books are you currently reading
Speaker 4: or well?
Speaker 2: I just started The Body Keeps the Score.
Speaker 3: Great, that sounds like a good book. Actually, I need
Speaker 3: to go get that. When was the last time you cried?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: Okay, so I went for like twenty years without crying.
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, twenty years.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: It stems from a memory of fifteen year old me.
Speaker 1: I'm the youngest in the family. I went to a
Speaker 1: funeral and every single person in the church was crying.
Speaker 1: And I remember that moment where I said, well, if
Speaker 1: everyone else is crying, who's going to be strong for them? Yes,
Speaker 1: And that was the moment that I told myself, Okay,
Speaker 1: you can't cry because you'll make other people feel badly.
Speaker 1: So but in my evolution now I'm actually really working
Speaker 1: on like can open that freaking damn. And so the
Speaker 1: last time I cried it was oh god. It literally
Speaker 1: was very recently. Give me a second. I was interviewing
Speaker 1: Mindy Pell's the health doctor, and we were doing an
Speaker 1: IG live Togein and she's helping me with my hormones
Speaker 1: as I'm like changing and aging and my gut and everything.
Speaker 1: And on the IG live she turned around and she said, hey,
Speaker 1: you know you've got problems with your liver. Liver is
Speaker 1: a sign of anger. And so she's like, who you
Speaker 1: have to think about? Who you have to forgive or
Speaker 1: who you need to forgive? And I was like, huh,
Speaker 1: who do I need to forgive? And she goes and Lisa,
Speaker 1: I think it's yourself.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, and I just fucking broke. I just broke.
Speaker 1: And I was like I didn't see it coming. I
Speaker 1: didn't think about it. And I was like, wow, how
Speaker 1: much how many of us need to actually the things
Speaker 1: that we've done?
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you for sharing that. What's a question you like?
Speaker 3: What's a question you don't like being asked?
Speaker 1: I don't think I have anything because I am so
Speaker 1: aligned with my purpose that if someone asks me a question,
Speaker 1: I truly believe it's because they need to know.
Speaker 2: The answer to help themselves.
Speaker 4: That's a good answer. Oh, what we're talking about insecurities
Speaker 4: in this.
Speaker 3: You don't have to share this, but how have you
Speaker 3: found your insecurities have changed from what was your insecurity
Speaker 3: when you were fifteen? And what would you say? Your
Speaker 3: biggest insecurity right now is okay.
Speaker 1: My insecurity when I was fifteen is I'm completely ugly,
Speaker 1: no one's ever going to like me or love me.
Speaker 1: And my insecurity now is I'm aging and the symptoms
Speaker 1: of aging and perimenopause are becoming very real. So I'm
Speaker 1: becoming forgetful. I'm forgetting words like I am. My brain
Speaker 1: function isn't as optimized as it usually is, and because
Speaker 1: I pride myself on my brain, it's like it's really
Speaker 1: denting my confidence. But I'm reminding myself that it is
Speaker 1: a natural thing that every woman goes through. So I'm
Speaker 1: actively working on it because I will never stop at
Speaker 1: I don't have confidence and so therefore I won't do it.
Speaker 4: Yes, thank you, thank you for all those answers. Thank
Speaker 4: you for being here. It was so great and can't
Speaker 4: wait to have you on again.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I am so proud and excited and
Speaker 1: honored to be on your show.
Speaker 2: And I really.
Speaker 1: Think people need to see your entire life and how
Speaker 1: you've gotten to this point, because they wouldn't believe that
Speaker 1: it was possible, And if they can see you do it,
Speaker 1: then I hopefully it can change their lives and they.
Speaker 4: Can do it too. Oh.
Speaker 3: You know one thing I wanted to add, Actually I
Speaker 3: was going to ask this earlier, but one symptom that
Speaker 3: I've noticed of confidence, which I felt in you, is
Speaker 3: the ability to hype other women up and to be
Speaker 3: able to compliment others so so openly and easily, like
Speaker 3: compliments just flow out of you. And I actually noticed
Speaker 3: like as I was trying to be more confident in myself,
Speaker 3: I felt I was able to do that way like
Speaker 3: much more more easily and actually feel genuine felt like
Speaker 3: I wanted to genuinely compliment others when I was feeling
Speaker 3: more confident in myself. And so I'd say I definitely
Speaker 3: saw that in you when I first met you. You
Speaker 3: hype people up so much, and I think confidence, true
Speaker 3: confidence is your ability to be able to flow out
Speaker 3: compliments of others.
Speaker 4: And truly feel it and mean it. So I just
Speaker 4: want to add that because I really think you do
Speaker 4: that so well.
Speaker 2: I love you so much.
Speaker 4: You