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Speaker 1: We'll look to see a black tech green money. So

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Speaker 1: good to be with you guys for another episode. I

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Speaker 1: got a rock star a couple on this episode, and

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Speaker 1: I'm super happy about this one. Jackie, I know this

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Speaker 1: some more are both life partners and co founders of

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Speaker 1: Forever Mood. Dennis an investment bank here, and also Jackie

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Speaker 1: is also a beauty creator with millions of followers on

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Speaker 1: ig TikTok and all over the place. Wherever she goes,

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Speaker 1: people just follow, They just follow. So good to be

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Speaker 1: with you guys today.

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Speaker 2: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Likewise, absolutely absolutely so I want to start here with

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Speaker 1: like finding a market opportunity for Forever Mood, Like, there

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Speaker 1: are so many things you could have done, why did

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Speaker 1: you choose to do this?

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Speaker 2: So I will I will leave with that and definitely

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Speaker 2: give Dennis opportunity to weigh into. But this was, honestly,

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Speaker 2: Forever Mood was my first time really betting on me

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Speaker 2: for the first time because most of my audience knew

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Speaker 2: me from makeup and I love makeup. But I think

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Speaker 2: sometimes especially when it comes to being a woman, when

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Speaker 2: it comes to be an entrepreneur, when people know you

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Speaker 2: for one thing, they tend to be very rigid and

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Speaker 2: firm in that, and there's rarely ever opportunities for you

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Speaker 2: to pivot or rebrand or try something new. And at

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Speaker 2: my core, before I ever picked up a makeup brush,

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Speaker 2: I was a fragrance girl, And so I knew at

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Speaker 2: some point throughout my career, even well before it took

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Speaker 2: off and I made this my day job, that I've

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Speaker 2: always wanted to do something with fragrance, even if it

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Speaker 2: was just like Passion Project. Now that I have a brand,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, what the hell does the Passion Project even mean?

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Speaker 2: They're all it's all work, right, But this was really

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Speaker 2: something that in my heart of hearts, that I truly

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Speaker 2: was not only passionate about. But the more I started

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Speaker 2: to explore fragrance as a consumer and as a customer

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Speaker 2: and as a content creator, I started to realize what

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Speaker 2: the holes were. So one of the most obvious things

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Speaker 2: for me is that black people are like obsessed with

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Speaker 2: smelling good in general. But it's so weird that we're

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Speaker 2: rarely ever at the forefront of conversations in terms of

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Speaker 2: fragrance and campaigns and just even perfumers, like it's still

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Speaker 2: a largely the fragrance industry is still such a largely

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Speaker 2: gate kept industry. So I didn't realize how much of

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Speaker 2: that existed until I actually started creating Fragrance, and I

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Speaker 2: was like, wow, this is really an issue, Like visibility

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Speaker 2: is really an issue for a lot of black founders,

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Speaker 2: black creators, and just black visionaries in the Fragrance space.

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Speaker 2: I was the first thing. Also, I noticed that like

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Speaker 2: everything was either really low end or really high end,

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Speaker 2: and from a price point perspective, there was like nothing

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Speaker 2: in between, very very few things that were in between.

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Speaker 2: And the things that were in between were either and

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Speaker 2: I don't want to offend anybody, but like everything was

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Speaker 2: either too kitchy or too masculine and too bougie and

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Speaker 2: too on a table, right, And I'm like, where's the

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Speaker 2: aspirational brands that may not be like big box accessible,

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Speaker 2: but are not necessarily three hundred dollars a candle booty expensive, right,

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Speaker 2: Like we need something that's like right in the middle,

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Speaker 2: right in that sweet spot. So those were some of

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Speaker 2: the things that I felt, even as a consumer before

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Speaker 2: we even started working on the brand, that I noticed

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Speaker 2: were missing. And so as I started to talk about,

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Speaker 2: like from an olfactive perspective, what I wanted to see

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Speaker 2: and smell more of the other pain points that I

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Speaker 2: were very obviously missing to me and that we wanted

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Speaker 2: to Dennis and I both strategized on like what we

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Speaker 2: needed to hone in on and really focus more on

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Speaker 2: as we started to create Forever Mood.

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Speaker 3: There's your chiman liiz.

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Speaker 4: No, No, she hit on the NOL. Yeah, that's like

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Speaker 4: I would say, Look, the vision for prival mood is

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Speaker 4: Jackie like that. She has the passion for fragrance and

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Speaker 4: she had a condition called hyperhydrosis which was a sweating

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Speaker 4: condition as well, so she used to wear fravance to

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Speaker 4: you know, then cover the scent and the smell and

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Speaker 4: also give it gave her confidence. So like the vision

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Speaker 4: as solely to Jackie, So that's for her.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Jackie says something about, you know, people knew you from

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Speaker 1: makeup and they knew you from this and you know,

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Speaker 1: but you decided to you know, expand how they knew you.

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Speaker 3: And I hear that.

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Speaker 1: I hear you know that you have a strong brand

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Speaker 1: and community. And what I love about building a strong

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Speaker 1: brand community is as long as you stay authentic, people

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Speaker 1: will follow you anywhere. And so I wonder how you

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Speaker 1: think about the community you've built that has accepted forever moved,

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Speaker 1: and the brand you've built that has allowed people to

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Speaker 1: trust you to go into this new vertical.

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Speaker 2: Well, to be quite honest with you, I would have

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Speaker 2: no confidence in this brand if that community aspect wasn't there.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that's what I live for personally. It's a

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Speaker 2: big part of what makes Fragrance so enjoyable. Like the

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Speaker 2: community aspect is non negotiable in my opinion, because it

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Speaker 2: not only makes the creation part so fun and innovative

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Speaker 2: and exciting for me, but it allowed me like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: like I want to be able to say I knew

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Speaker 2: I had this vision and I knew the brand was

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Speaker 2: going to take off, but I had no idea. I

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Speaker 2: genuinely thought we were going to be starting really small.

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Speaker 2: And it was truly the people who support me and

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Speaker 2: both of us really that pulled up and were like, no, no, no,

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Speaker 2: whatever you put your name on, we're going to be

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Speaker 2: open to even exploring. And that's an honor and a

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Speaker 2: privilege that people don't owe you at all, the regardless

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Speaker 2: of whether you have two followers or ten million, and

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Speaker 2: so that's not lost on me. So it allows both

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Speaker 2: of us as co founders to really navigate that level

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Speaker 2: of trust and that level of integrity very carefully because

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Speaker 2: it's important and also like it's why, you know, why

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Speaker 2: wouldn't you want to lean into that community, because that's

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Speaker 2: what that's what makes the innovative part of being a

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Speaker 2: brand founder is so important and so fun.

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Speaker 4: Just to add to that, I think that that gave

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Speaker 4: us a brand advantage in a sense because Jackie put

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Speaker 4: in the work for a decade, and more so naturally,

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Speaker 4: when we were ready to launch a brand, they already

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Speaker 4: trusted her. They didn't really need that much convincing. They

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Speaker 4: didn't really have to, you know what I mean, prove that, Okay,

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Speaker 4: this is going to be a great product. Jackie actually

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Speaker 4: uses her product. She's just not going to put her

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Speaker 4: name on something that she doesn't actually live by and

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Speaker 4: breathe by. And it was funny because during the time

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Speaker 4: we launched, it was during the pandemic COVID. It was

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Speaker 4: in twenty twenty, and people were actually at home and

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Speaker 4: people couldn't actually go anywhere, and with candles, which is

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Speaker 4: what we launched to begin with, people couldn't actually smell it.

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Speaker 4: So people were life heavily on this storytelling, and it

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Speaker 4: just shows how much impact Jackie had done for the

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Speaker 4: community because people bought it irrespect of them having to

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Speaker 4: smell the products. So that is just a testament to

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Speaker 4: the work that she's done beforehand.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, to Dennis's point, oh, I'm sorry, And another to

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Speaker 2: Dennis's point, I think without realizing in that over a

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Speaker 2: decade of time period, I was also laying the groundwork

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Speaker 2: to show my audience that like every time I opened

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Speaker 2: a lipstick or an ah, like, I was always interacting

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Speaker 2: with scent. And but the thing is is, like, you know,

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Speaker 2: we all love perfume talk now, which really kind of

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Speaker 2: took off in twenty twenty. I'm not sure if you're

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Speaker 2: familiar with perfume talk, but it's like fragrance on TikTok

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Speaker 2: is okay, so you know how there's like nurse talk,

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Speaker 2: and then there's like like there's different corners of TikTok,

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Speaker 2: right and so okay, So there's there's there's perfume talk,

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Speaker 2: But really, perfume content before twenty twenty just did not

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Speaker 2: perform well at all. So I'd always wanted to open

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Speaker 2: up that side of myself in my content, but there

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Speaker 2: was just never like the view The viewership just wasn't there,

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Speaker 2: and so there were other ways that I was interacting

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Speaker 2: with scent and fragrance in my videos for all of

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Speaker 2: that timeframe. So when we started for a movie, people

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Speaker 2: were like, oh this, oh okay, it actually makes sense.

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Speaker 2: They're like, wait, this trans jack is always sniffing something

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Speaker 2: or interacting with something. So the groundborg had been laying

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Speaker 2: there kind of silently in the background. But once we

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Speaker 2: just pulled the lid off, people were like, all right,

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Speaker 2: let's do it. Let's get into it.

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Speaker 1: Nah, that makes so much sense, you know, And Dennis,

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Speaker 1: I want to start with you on this, but I

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Speaker 1: want both of you chime in if you feel so inclined.

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Speaker 1: Jackie like, there's there's so many people who have large

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Speaker 1: followings and then put out a product and can't sell anything,

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Speaker 1: And so I wonder, like, walk us through, why what

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Speaker 1: about this brand that you've built? And you know, Jackie's

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Speaker 1: persona that you have allows people to say, you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm not only interested in her latest release of a

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Speaker 1: video or latest photo or etc. But also I'm going

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Speaker 1: to pull out my credit card or I'm going to

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Speaker 1: tap the pay Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I think there's multiple layers one being Jackie that if

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Speaker 4: you remember, Jackie is the first one to tell people

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Speaker 4: don't buy something. She's not going to throw a product

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Speaker 4: in your face. So it's just that authenticity where it's like, okay,

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Speaker 4: I've told you times where when even when it comes

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Speaker 4: to working with a brand that can jeopardize a relationship,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to tell you, don't buy this is something

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Speaker 4: I don't use. This doesn't work for me. So that

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Speaker 4: authenticity is number one. Number two, our products are don't

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Speaker 4: we really put in a lot of time in developing

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Speaker 4: an amazing products. It smells great Jackie. As I said,

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Speaker 4: Jackie is obviously the lead product product girl in terms

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Speaker 4: of like any product comes out there, she's tested, she's

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Speaker 4: lived it, and she loves it, so it's easy for

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Speaker 4: her to speak to it. And I think when you

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Speaker 4: see brands that have a creator space, sometimes they stick

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Speaker 4: their name on it even actually even used it, they

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Speaker 4: can't really speak to it authentically. So I think that's

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Speaker 4: also very important. And then three, I think the storytelling.

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Speaker 4: I think that's very important with a brand, the storytelling

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Speaker 4: why us, Why should you buy this product? Because there's

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Speaker 4: so many different products out there, and something that Jackie

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Speaker 4: was talking about that there were so many luxury products

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Speaker 4: out there, but it wasn't accessible, It wasn't approachable, And

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Speaker 4: I think that's something that our brand did in terms

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Speaker 4: of brand DNA is like, yes, there's other candles, but

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Speaker 4: our products, the way we spoke to our consumers, and

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Speaker 4: also when it comes to the black consumers, there wasn't

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Speaker 4: that many things that were for us in terms that

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Speaker 4: we wasn't part of the marketing. We wasn't part of

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Speaker 4: the conversation. So that was something that we wanted to

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Speaker 4: bring at the forefront with our brand.

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Speaker 3: What would you say on that, Jake.

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Speaker 2: I feel like Dennis pretty much hit all of what

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Speaker 2: I would say, and I just want to hone in

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Speaker 2: on what he said about like necessity, like are you

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Speaker 2: and you got to also remember my job is to

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Speaker 2: review products, so I talk about the good, the bad,

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Speaker 2: and the ugly, and people generally know me for kind

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Speaker 2: of like not holding back. So and to be honest

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Speaker 2: with you, I think being a successful founder or successful

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Speaker 2: at anything is to also have some self awareness. So

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Speaker 2: before you create something, ask yourself like do people need this?

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Speaker 2: Does this already exist? Why do people need this? What

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Speaker 2: is going to be your point of difference. What is

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Speaker 2: going to be the difference between this same product, because

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Speaker 2: like nothing is new in the market, right, Like even

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Speaker 2: especially in beauty and fragrance, nothing is new. But what

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Speaker 2: would be the reason that people will come to you

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Speaker 2: versus another heritage brand that has existed for decades before you,

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Speaker 2: that has the bandwidth to reach more people, to market

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Speaker 2: their product better, more effective and more frequently, Why would

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Speaker 2: they come support you? So it really takes like one

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Speaker 2: a lot of self awareness. Some people don't care about you,

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Speaker 2: Like some people don't care that you have ten million followers.

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Speaker 2: They want to know, at the end of the day,

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Speaker 2: is the product good? And so Dennis and I really

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Speaker 2: focused on like I almost have to kind of like

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Speaker 2: remove myself out of it, Like what if somebody had

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Speaker 2: no idea I existed, they had no idea this was

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Speaker 2: my brand? Why would they care about that product? And

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Speaker 2: when they keep buying that product? Those are the kinds

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Speaker 2: of things that I ask and that we both discuss

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Speaker 2: as like as a team, when we create something, when

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Speaker 2: we formulate something, Because I don't want people to just

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Speaker 2: rely on me. It's not sustainable to just rely on

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Speaker 2: me and my face and my brand or my voice,

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Speaker 2: I should say, people need to pull up and genuinely

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Speaker 2: care about that product, and so far they really are.

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Speaker 2: And that's something that like I love when someone finds

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Speaker 2: me and they're like, oh my go, I had no

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Speaker 2: idea you own Forever mode on my period target demographic

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Speaker 2: reads like it's actually music from my ears because it's

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Speaker 2: like you genuinely were enamored with the product. And I

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Speaker 2: love that just let the products be for itself. And

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Speaker 2: I think sometimes people get so caught up and like

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Speaker 2: I can start that because I have access to it,

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Speaker 2: or like someone can help me. You know, when you're

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Speaker 2: when you're a creator, you're around a lot of people

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Speaker 2: who can make the wheels turn and make things happen.

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Speaker 2: But just because you can it don't mean you should.

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Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, you know.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about, you know, the dynamic here

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Speaker 1: because what I've found in couples that work together is

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Speaker 1: like there are usually like defined things you do, define

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Speaker 1: things I do.

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Speaker 3: That way we ain't stepping on each other's stuff. So

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Speaker 3: it's like you go to work.

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Speaker 1: Together and then you going home together, And so I wonder, like,

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Speaker 1: how have you found that works for you? Like how

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Speaker 1: have you divided the roles and responsibilities. He's responsible for this,

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Speaker 1: You're responsible for that, so that you can make sure

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Speaker 1: that it all works.

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Speaker 3: Then as we start with you on this group, you

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Speaker 3: need it.

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Speaker 2: For me, you need it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So for me and Jackie, I think the reason why

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Speaker 4: it works so well is that we know both know

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Speaker 4: what our strengths and weaknesses are, and we technically allow

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Speaker 4: each other to, you know what I mean, flourish within

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Speaker 4: our role. So Jackie like she's the creative, even though

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Speaker 4: I think I'm great with creative and I do have

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Speaker 4: ideas and stuff and I do share and put it

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Speaker 4: to the table, but naturally I'm always when it comes

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Speaker 4: down to the final decision when it comes to creating.

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Speaker 4: If Jackie like believes in this, I'm going to just

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Speaker 4: lean on her whether I think it's right or wrong.

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Speaker 4: And that's where that trust and believe comes from, because

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Speaker 4: I've seen approve it time and time again. Is like,

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Speaker 4: if someone's done it and they've got a track record,

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Speaker 4: why try and have a debate or try and find

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Speaker 4: that unless I really strongly I'm going to fight and

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Speaker 4: fight my case and I do. Sometimes I'm like, please

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Speaker 4: trust me, just believe me on this month and it

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Speaker 4: works out, So that's great. And then and with Jackie,

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Speaker 4: she's allowed me to you know, I mean operate the business,

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Speaker 4: to run through the day to day the operation. She

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Speaker 4: she trusts that, you know, I mean, she doesn't have

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Speaker 4: to worry about that. And I think that was also

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Speaker 4: important because look, Jackie's also got another job in her

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Speaker 4: day to day content creation, and I never want to

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Speaker 4: admiral Birding or most stressed to her, so I'd taken

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Speaker 4: a lot of the you know what I mean, the

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Speaker 4: stuff that we just don't behind the scenes, the boring

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Speaker 4: stuff and the stuff that I don't want her. So really,

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Speaker 4: I really want to protect her creativity and her mind

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Speaker 4: by allowing her to just do what she's great at.

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Speaker 4: And the reason why also it works is because even

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Speaker 4: her day to day content, it's organic, it actually works

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Speaker 4: with what we do. It's not like she has to

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Speaker 4: over think or have to you know what I mean.

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Speaker 4: We just do content and content is aligned with her

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Speaker 4: data today livestock, so it's perfect to her. So it's

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Speaker 4: what the boy had sex.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm asked just to you a different way Jackie

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Speaker 1: is because you know, he just says something that you know,

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Speaker 1: makes a light bulb go off for me and he's like,

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Speaker 1: you know, she has another job, and that's content creation.

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Speaker 1: And I remember I was interviewing Marsha Robinson a couple

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Speaker 1: of episodes ago, and she was talking about, like, you

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Speaker 1: got to go to work if you're going to be

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Speaker 1: trying to grow on social media, treat it like a job.

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Speaker 1: And I wonder, like, how you think about Like, you know,

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Speaker 1: there were I'm assuming years where nobody was following, and

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Speaker 1: the people followed what happened.

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Speaker 3: In your strategy and like what happened that? People said, Yo,

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Speaker 3: y'all see Jackie. I am like she got something going

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Speaker 3: on over here, Like what happened that is it's already

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Speaker 3: hitting the inflection point.

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Speaker 2: So this is actually probably one of my favorite things

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Speaker 2: to talk about, because sometimes we get really discouraged as

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Speaker 2: founders and as entrepreneurs and as content creators because when

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Speaker 2: you're a creator, essentially you're our business, so you have

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Speaker 2: to treat it like a business. And I think sometimes

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Speaker 2: we get so caught up in the phenomenon of like

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Speaker 2: blowing up immediately right like we're all chasing virality. We're

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Speaker 2: all like even back when I started, because I started

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Speaker 2: in two thousand and nine, So even the concept of

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Speaker 2: doing this as a job didn't really exist the way

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Speaker 2: that it does now. But that's the advantage that I

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Speaker 2: had all of the years that I was six love

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Speaker 2: sixteen years. And I love mentioning my sixteen years because

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Speaker 2: I'm like, you don't understand, Like you don't understand what

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Speaker 2: you can do with sixteen years, you don't have to

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Speaker 2: understand what you can do with five years. And I

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Speaker 2: love honing in on this idea that like, while you

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Speaker 2: think it's quiet, you're experimenting, you're making mistakes, Like that's

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Speaker 2: your advantage, that's how you learn what works and what

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Speaker 2: doesn't work. I'm telling you something that a lot of

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Speaker 2: people who blow up too quickly what they don't don't have.

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Speaker 2: They don't have the hindsight of understanding what their audience

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Speaker 2: likes or dislikes. When you blow up just because maybe

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Speaker 2: you struck while the iron is hot, or maybe you

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Speaker 2: just got really lucky one year, where like the algorithm

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Speaker 2: was pushing one particular type of content or creator and

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Speaker 2: you just happen to be there at the right place

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Speaker 2: at the right time. You don't always have the advantage

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Speaker 2: of understanding why people follow you, what works what doesn't

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Speaker 2: when people's attention span dropped off on a certain piece

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Speaker 2: of content. And so it was five years. It was

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Speaker 2: half a decade when I actually started consistently getting virality

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Speaker 2: and content to where it's like, Okay, I think I

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Speaker 2: actually have something here, and so.

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Speaker 3: That it helps you lean into it.

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Speaker 2: Again, I always go back to you need to be

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Speaker 2: self aware. So after five years, because I'm a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a like sometimes it takes me a minute

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Speaker 2: to catch on to things. After five years, I'm like,

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Speaker 2: all right, I love creating content, but like people are

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Speaker 2: not watching and I need to figure out why. And

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Speaker 2: so what I was realizing is that I was this

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Speaker 2: is back before like I had an editor, I was

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Speaker 2: editing my own content. What I was realizing is like

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Speaker 2: I was creating content and then editing it and putting

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Speaker 2: it on YouTube and not really engaging or interacting with

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Speaker 2: Like I would engage with people in comments, I would

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Speaker 2: respond to comments, but I wouldn't even watch my own content.

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Speaker 2: So if I'm not even watching my own content, then

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Speaker 2: I'm like, why would I expect other people don't know

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Speaker 2: own content? So then I'm asking myself, Okay, why are

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Speaker 2: you not even joining your own content and I'm looking

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Speaker 2: at it and I'm like, well, I kind of feel

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Speaker 2: like it's boring, Like I don't really feel like I'm

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Speaker 2: being myself. That was the aha moment that I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: I'm in my own head. I still feel like I'm

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Speaker 2: carrying this weight of is my family watching, are my

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Speaker 2: friends watching? Are my colleagues watching? And I'm Nigerians, So

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Speaker 2: you know, Nigerians seem to be very like we hold

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Speaker 2: our reputations with very high regard. I'll say that you

381
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Speaker 2: don't want to be online acting crazy, And so I

382
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Speaker 2: was in my own head about really actually showing up

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Speaker 2: authentically as myself, and I told myself, I think I

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Speaker 2: need to just look past that, like why not, Like

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Speaker 2: if nobody's really watching, then okay, if you act a

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Speaker 2: fool like you normally do offline the stuff that you

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Speaker 2: edit out of your videos, if you keep that stuff in,

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Speaker 2: they're already not watching you, So what do you have

389
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Speaker 2: to lose? So finally I just woke up and day

390
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Speaker 2: and decided I'm just gonna like actually be myself, like

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Speaker 2: actually be my actual stelf on camera. And literally the

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Speaker 2: moment that I did that, yeah, it was when I

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Speaker 2: had my first real piece of viral content, and I

394
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Speaker 2: quite literally never looked back all my videos like it

395
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Speaker 2: was just like video. They all started hitting and people

396
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Speaker 2: were like, oh my god, where you've been this whole time?

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, all I had to do is be myself.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I mean, I'm gonna have one more question

399
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Speaker 5: on this line, and I have one for Dinnis as

400
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Speaker 5: you know all you like, you know, I'm one of

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Speaker 5: those people who are like, you know, trying to grow

402
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Speaker 5: my personal on YouTube, and you're like, you record one day,

403
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Speaker 5: then you record the next month, and.

404
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Speaker 3: Then you're like, I'm gonna give right to that to it.

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Speaker 3: I really want to do it.

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Speaker 1: But then you got all these things and then you

407
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Speaker 1: got the little voice in your head that's like, you know.

408
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Speaker 3: All the things.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure you appreciate that, and I'm sure ninety percentage

410
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Speaker 1: audience can appreciate all the things that keep you from recording,

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Speaker 1: not even just recorded, from publishing because you might have

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Speaker 1: to record it, but you ain't putting that out for

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Speaker 1: whatever reason. So my question is, there's certain styles I imagine,

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Speaker 1: and I want you to correct me if I'm wrong.

415
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Speaker 1: There are certain styles of videos that tend to work

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Speaker 1: better now than might have ten years ago, Like the

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Speaker 1: Casey Knights that like that you know, type of vlog

418
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Speaker 1: I imagine had this season.

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Speaker 3: Maybe it's still does I don't know.

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Speaker 1: So my question is, what are you finding are the

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Speaker 1: styles not necessarily the content and the body of work, Like,

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Speaker 1: what is the styles that people should pay attention to,

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Speaker 1: because like the regular day in the life may not

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Speaker 1: be what people want to watch, may not be.

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Speaker 3: So that's what your thoughts on this.

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Speaker 2: It's such an interesting question because what is what is

427
00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,520
Speaker 2: successful now is not necessarily always going to be what

428
00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:18,640
Speaker 2: you're passionate about, and that's okay as well. So for example,

429
00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:22,720
Speaker 2: these attention spans on TikTok, like everything is just quick, quick,

430
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Speaker 2: click punchy. They almost kind of want you to be

431
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 2: way more clickbaity, Like I come from the clickbait era

432
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Speaker 2: on YouTube, but you still can create the illusion of

433
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Speaker 2: like slow burning the content itself, like you can clickbait

434
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Speaker 2: with the thumbnail, but the continent itself does not have

435
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,800
Speaker 2: to be fast paced, whereas a lot of these shirt

436
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:43,959
Speaker 2: done platforms, it's like I gotta cut out everything and

437
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 2: that's not necessarily the style that I want to or

438
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,920
Speaker 2: even just like the type of storytelling that I'm invested in.

439
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,000
Speaker 2: So it's like a fine line of like finding that

440
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 2: balance of like what you know will work, but also

441
00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,040
Speaker 2: what actually fulfills you and it's true and authentic to you.

442
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,520
Speaker 2: And so I think I think that the answers to

443
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 2: that probably looks different for everybody. I don't know if

444
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:06,080
Speaker 2: that's a helpful way to answer that, but I know

445
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:10,200
Speaker 2: for me, what I like may not always necessarily be relevant.

446
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,879
Speaker 2: But also that's okay because I've lived through that. And

447
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 2: then by the time it was relevant, like, for example,

448
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 2: talking about black issues in the beauty community was not

449
00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 2: always relevant, but I did it anyway because it was

450
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 2: just authentic to me. So then by the time it

451
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,360
Speaker 2: sadly I hate to say them as quotes, but when

452
00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:29,520
Speaker 2: it became a trend, it shouldn't be a trend, because

453
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 2: like my existence should not be a trend, and me

454
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:34,720
Speaker 2: being visible should not be a trend. But by the

455
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 2: time it became like popping to include black people, I'd

456
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,640
Speaker 2: already had years of work to show, Hey, we've been

457
00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:44,359
Speaker 2: doing this, and it wasn't just me, it was several

458
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 2: creators that were doing that too, So I don't know

459
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,199
Speaker 2: if that's helpful, but you really got to find a

460
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:54,639
Speaker 2: balance because what you actually like creating may not always

461
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,760
Speaker 2: be relevant or trendy. But I'll tell you right now,

462
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 2: the quicker everything move so fast, and I'm like, we

463
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 2: got so down guys, like yeah, every day.

464
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 1: And so if I'm hearing you correctly, because you started

465
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: off talking about what are you passionate about? And so

466
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 1: I truly believe, like I want to see more blogs

467
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:17,639
Speaker 1: and so like I remember people used to blog, but

468
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,080
Speaker 1: not everything's so one hundred and forty characters, et cetera,

469
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,160
Speaker 1: Like you don't get a full thought from anybody anymore.

470
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: But there was a day when blogs were the thing,

471
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: and I feel like there may be opportunities for people

472
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 1: to do that again with substack and you know, use

473
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 1: a medium and all these things. And so but if

474
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 1: I'm hearing you correctly, you like cut out them, like

475
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 1: what do you care about?

476
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:37,160
Speaker 3: Do that?

477
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's still a job. So we have

478
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,440
Speaker 2: to be honest enough to understand if you're going to

479
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:48,040
Speaker 2: invest in this, you are going to have to find

480
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,719
Speaker 2: a balance of like what is going to get visibility

481
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:52,960
Speaker 2: and what do you like? And that balance looks different

482
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 2: for everybody. But yeah, and even I'm glad that you

483
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 2: mentioned platforms like substack because you're right, like I do

484
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,280
Speaker 2: miss the days of like a fully fleshed out thought

485
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 2: or like a deep dive. That's actually why I still

486
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,040
Speaker 2: love YouTube. And Dennis can probably chime in as well,

487
00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 2: because I know he's a podcast person, like especially when

488
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 2: it comes to brand found ownership and stuff like I

489
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:18,120
Speaker 2: want the meat and potatoes. I want the beginning, the middle,

490
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 2: and end. You don't always get that in TikTok.

491
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, and this I'm going to te yourself and this too.

492
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 1: I appreciate that you did that because I was I

493
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:27,920
Speaker 1: wanted to ask Dennis about this is because you guys

494
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,120
Speaker 1: have been very transparent about the.

495
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,360
Speaker 3: Struggles and growing you know a business.

496
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,480
Speaker 1: You talked about you know you were doing this, you know,

497
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:38,199
Speaker 1: starting during COVID, during the pandemic, and it's in you

498
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,399
Speaker 1: know you. I even saw this quote you talked about

499
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 1: you know you made and that's been on this big

500
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,679
Speaker 1: warehouse and the goal as planned and how do you

501
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:52,240
Speaker 1: how do you consider growing in public and learning in public.

502
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,480
Speaker 4: It's actually funny because I've been thinking about being more

503
00:25:56,680 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 4: open and candid with Mike community. I don't really post

504
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 4: someone more behind the scene, but I've been thinking about,

505
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 4: you know, entering the space and doing content around the

506
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 4: mistakes and the challenges that a founder may face, because

507
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 4: every day there's always something going on. One day, something

508
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:20,160
Speaker 4: unexpectedly happened and you have to find a solution for it.

509
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,119
Speaker 4: And I feel like people could learn so much because

510
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 4: I feel like in this space, we live in a

511
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,440
Speaker 4: world where you only see the end result to finished product.

512
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 4: Oh my god, you sold your business for X amount.

513
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 4: Oh I made X amount of millions? But what does

514
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:34,879
Speaker 4: that mean? And I could learned very early on what

515
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,400
Speaker 4: I remember one of my first goals was like, oh yeah,

516
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 4: I can't wait to make millions of the business. And

517
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 4: when you do that, but then you ask yourself, okay,

518
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 4: that's not actually the important question. Okay, what was your profit?

519
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 4: And it's just appreciated and really understanding what it actually means.

520
00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 4: And sometimes it can be very misleading to the community

521
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 4: and what the information you're giving and actually it sounds

522
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:57,119
Speaker 4: like you're doing great, but you're not. And it's okay

523
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,360
Speaker 4: to be open and candid with your community, say looking

524
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 4: now top times at the moment, it's hard and it

525
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,200
Speaker 4: is top time, especially in this economy. So that's something

526
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 4: that I've been thinking about, lady.

527
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, So this question is for both of you, guys,

528
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,199
Speaker 1: Jackie and Dennis. So I have this thing I've been

529
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,399
Speaker 1: doing called the E d C the every day Carry,

530
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 1: and so I'm gonna starting with you Dennis, obviously, aside

531
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,359
Speaker 1: from forevery moody. What is the thing that you not

532
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 1: just like a morning routine. What the things you carry

533
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:29,360
Speaker 1: every day? I just help you be effective, feel comfortable.

534
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 3: You know, enjoy your day. So it can be your phone,

535
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:35,400
Speaker 3: it won't be.

536
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 2: Carry that last.

537
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, like what's in Dinner's every day carry?

538
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 4: Okay. Well, recently I've got this new ring the Aura

539
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,840
Speaker 4: and yeah and ordering, and it's been really impactful learning

540
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:57,640
Speaker 4: and studying my sleep by stress levels, by productivity. So

541
00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 4: this is something that I would say now is something

542
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 4: I would carry every day because it really tells me

543
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 4: how productive I am and I can actually act on it,

544
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 4: so like I might be sitting down for too long

545
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 4: and say stand up. That is the small hints and

546
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 4: reminders really make a difference.

547
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:22,199
Speaker 3: Every day care just lady, yes, but now yeah, it's

548
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:22,640
Speaker 3: a good one.

549
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:24,400
Speaker 2: Now if you if you have one, it's a good one.

550
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 2: I got one to.

551
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:28,679
Speaker 3: Carry.

552
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:32,679
Speaker 2: So I'm not gonna mention for every mood. But truthfully,

553
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:33,840
Speaker 2: my everyday.

554
00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 3: Carry I like you, but I'm gonna be.

555
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be real. I do even if it's not

556
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,680
Speaker 2: forever mood. I do absolutely carry fragrance with me every day,

557
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 2: like I really do, even if I don't set foot.

558
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 2: I mean, I have the advantage of working from home,

559
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 2: and so what like, how can I replicate some sense

560
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 2: of sensuality in my day to day or comfort in

561
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 2: my day to day? Like we as humans, I think

562
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 2: we really underestimate how much. And this is another reason

563
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 2: why for every mood exists, like how much scent makes

564
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 2: a difference and how just and how frequently we interact

565
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 2: with it. It can be comforting, it can be nostalgic,

566
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 2: it can be productive, it can be sin can even

567
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 2: be aggressive. Like I was working out and I wore Nda,

568
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 2: and Nda has tobacco, and I was like, you know what,

569
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 2: maybe I should stick to something a little bit more chilled.

570
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 2: I don't work out with tobacco, Like tobacco is a

571
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 2: little bit when I'm trying to like seduce my man,

572
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 2: And yeah, it's great, but I carry fragrance with me

573
00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 2: every day. It's just a reminder of like what I

574
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 2: get to create, what I get to do, how I

575
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 2: want to weigh someone's impression of me when I walk

576
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 2: into a room, if I want to if I want

577
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 2: to disarm a room, or if I want to excite

578
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 2: a room, I carry I do that by conveying a fragrance.

579
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:55,960
Speaker 1: Give me one more me, whether it's like a water

580
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 1: bottle or a backpack or phone.

581
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 2: Oh for sure, Stanley down, I don't ever, this is

582
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 2: probably glued to me more than my phone is my water. Yeah,

583
00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 2: I keep that thing on me, for sure.

584
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 3: I get that Bay, I got a couple more.

585
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,960
Speaker 1: It's like when you are on the business side, like

586
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,239
Speaker 1: when you're looking at indicators because you know, obviously there

587
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 1: are people who come to the side put it in

588
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 1: the car and don't and don't purchase in that moment,

589
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: because that's like an indicator. What indicators are you paying

590
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 1: attention to that say, you know what we're in the

591
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: right direction, whether it's views on social media, whether it's

592
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 1: cards you know, being held on the website, Like, what

593
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: are the things that you pay most attention to?

594
00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 4: That's a great question. For me, it's the reviews. It's

595
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 4: the customer reviews. So can you not help me? By

596
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 4: the way, Yeah, you know, we get I get a

597
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 4: weekly digest of reviews coming in customers leave on our website,

598
00:30:55,160 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 4: and it's really become my self care good or bad,

599
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 4: because it really tells you what's going really well, because like,

600
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,640
Speaker 4: for example, I may be like overthinking and thinking, oh,

601
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:09,560
Speaker 4: we need to improve this and do this, and then

602
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 4: when you see customers reactions and the reviews are like wow,

603
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 4: they love it, and it's like, Okay, we're doing something

604
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 4: right and that means a lot. Or whenever you know,

605
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 4: I mean, they say Okay, this could be improved this way,

606
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 4: I'm like, okay, great, okay, let's get back into the

607
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,920
Speaker 4: kitchen and improve that. So for me, those are my

608
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:30,520
Speaker 4: indicators and I lean on that because ultimately, these are

609
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 4: the people that are buying the product and using it

610
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 4: every day they are.

611
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 1: And last one, I'm gonna give it to both of

612
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:37,960
Speaker 1: you guys so much. You both the chiming on this

613
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 1: is I want to talk about ownership, you know, because

614
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 1: Instagram and TikTok, you know, all these they could do

615
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,959
Speaker 1: something tomorrow, and this is like, you know, it just disappears,

616
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: you know, God forbid, you know, But I wonder how

617
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 1: you think about no matter what happens out there, we're

618
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 1: building something we own. How do you encourage other people

619
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: who are trying to grow on social media or YouTube

620
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,520
Speaker 1: or any of these other platforms to consider, you know,

621
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 1: the real strategy, which is ownership of both your content,

622
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 1: your intellectual property, your contribution and a theme.

623
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:17,600
Speaker 3: Sorry with you, Jackie.

624
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 2: Actually I really love this question, and I don't necessarily

625
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 2: want to talk about owners because I know, like I'm

626
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 2: hearing two different ways to answer this. It's really controversial

627
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 2: when like founders sell their brands, So I'm not referring

628
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 2: to ownership and that I expect that's a whole different conversation.

629
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 2: But this is probably a big, another big reason why

630
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 2: forever Mood's existence was really important to me, because again,

631
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 2: it was the first time I really got to bet

632
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: on myself in the ten years at the time it's

633
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 2: now year sixteen for me, but in the ten years

634
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 2: that I was a creator when we started forever Mood,

635
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 2: I had made millions for brands that I've collaborated with,

636
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 2: brands that I've posted about, brands that I've advertised in

637
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 2: my platform, I made brands millions and that's something I

638
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,640
Speaker 2: would never take back, Like, I love the fact that

639
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,960
Speaker 2: I built an audience that could trust my recommendations, Like

640
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 2: that's really important to me. However, there's something that can

641
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 2: be said about like, but I want to build something too.

642
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 2: If I'm capable of doing that for them, why not

643
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,680
Speaker 2: bet on me and do that for myself. And I'm

644
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,560
Speaker 2: going to be very honest with you, I would not

645
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 2: have even had the gall to starfevor Who without Dennis,

646
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 2: because he was the one who actually made it real

647
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 2: and tangible by way of creating the business plan, like

648
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 2: outlining financially what it would require from us. But before

649
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 2: it just seemed like a dream, and it just seemed

650
00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 2: like a one day one day. But Dennis really was

651
00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 2: the person who sat me down and was like, no,

652
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 2: right now, and here's how. And that's when I was like, Okay,

653
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 2: I'm gonna I'm like, let's just let's just go for it.

654
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 2: Let's just go all in. And so we did. And

655
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:11,360
Speaker 2: I'm so proud because one thing I thought I understood.

656
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 2: I thought like I thought I had some understanding of

657
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:17,439
Speaker 2: what it requires to handle a brandy by working with them,

658
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 2: but I had no idea what it required, and so

659
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:24,479
Speaker 2: I actually started one and even through good bad upstowns bad,

660
00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:28,640
Speaker 2: Like all of the above, I would do it all

661
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:34,239
Speaker 2: over again. If it means betting on us, betting on

662
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 2: something that we actually own, something that we create, we

663
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 2: have full control over. That's something I'm incredibly, incredibly proud of.

664
00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 3: There is ownership talk to me.

665
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's just like Jackie, A bunch of things came

666
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 4: to my mind as you said that, I would speak

667
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 4: on a different angle. I think ownerships and poton, but

668
00:34:56,520 --> 00:35:00,879
Speaker 4: I also don't want people to take it lit and

669
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,759
Speaker 4: what I mean by that, I think sometimes we can

670
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 4: get accustomed to say it. I want one hundred percent

671
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 4: of everything, and sometimes it's okay to have fifty percent.

672
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 4: It's likely to have ten percent. It all depends on

673
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 4: the opportunity and also understanding how you can find the

674
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 4: right partners to you know what I mean, come together

675
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:25,239
Speaker 4: to do something great. Because I know people that have

676
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:27,840
Speaker 4: ownership of as I said, minority ownership of things, and

677
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:30,000
Speaker 4: they're doing really well and it's worth millions of dollars

678
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,279
Speaker 4: versus having one hundre percent or something, and it's not

679
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:36,200
Speaker 4: really worth anything. So I think if we should not

680
00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 4: get caught up in this whole thing of I have

681
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 4: to have ownership and I don't want anyone involved and

682
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 4: it is all mine, so I want to be very

683
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 4: mindful of that. So I say that to say that honestly,

684
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 4: it is important, but make sure you understand why you're

685
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 4: doing it or why is why is ownership important to you?

686
00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 4: And more importantly, Okay, if you want one hundred percent

687
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:02,719
Speaker 4: of think do you realize what it's going to take

688
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,200
Speaker 4: to get to your goal? So let's just say you

689
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,320
Speaker 4: want to turn it into one hundred million dollar brand.

690
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,479
Speaker 4: Do you think you, by yourself taking on one hundred

691
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 4: percent ownership is capable without bringing the necessary resources and

692
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:17,799
Speaker 4: partners to help you achieve that goal. If you don't

693
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 4: think that it's possible, then you need to bring the

694
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 4: right people and really understand how to value that. And

695
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 4: I think that's where the disconnect is how do you

696
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:26,919
Speaker 4: value ownership and how do you determine it? And there's

697
00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 4: no right or wrong answer, but that's something you're going

698
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:29,919
Speaker 4: to learn along the way.

699
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:34,520
Speaker 2: That's exactly what I was alluding to earlier, because I

700
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:39,239
Speaker 2: know sometimes my people there's a lot of misconceptions of

701
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:42,399
Speaker 2: what it means to like have an investor, and it's

702
00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 2: okay to like not really know. There's still so much

703
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 2: I'm going to learn about being a brand founder and

704
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,640
Speaker 2: operating all of this as I continue to grow. But

705
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:55,879
Speaker 2: I think there's a lot of misconceptions about like what

706
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,239
Speaker 2: does one hundred owning one hundred percent of your business?

707
00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:00,200
Speaker 2: What does that look like? What does that all so

708
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 2: allow you to be capable of? And so when I

709
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 2: see founders bring them investors or like sell and they

710
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:07,600
Speaker 2: are criticized for that, I'm like, oh my god, Like

711
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:10,239
Speaker 2: sometimes they get ripped apart, and like, I do think

712
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 2: sometimes there's a lot of valid concerns, like nobody likes

713
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,640
Speaker 2: formula changes, right, but then again, nobody likes an inaccessible product,

714
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 2: and so sometimes a formula change is what is going

715
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:24,759
Speaker 2: to make the product accessible. So you gotta you know,

716
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:26,640
Speaker 2: you got to give or take. But I didn't want

717
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 2: to get inside too much. I'm just co signing what

718
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 2: Dennis is referring to, and that I forget.

719
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:32,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, super yeah.

720
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: We've had these kinds of conversations on the episode because

721
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 1: you know, not getting not to get too deep into it,

722
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: but there are other episodes like Mayel we talked about

723
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:42,799
Speaker 1: this particular thing, and so I want people to like,

724
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: you know, largely the point of business is to build

725
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:48,239
Speaker 1: something that you have an asset. It's an asset that

726
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,719
Speaker 1: you can hopefully monetize exactly.

727
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:53,759
Speaker 2: You can't always do that if you own a hundred

728
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 2: percent of that. It's just it's just the reality. You

729
00:37:56,840 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: can't always do that. You don't have, you don't always

730
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 2: necessarily have. Like if we just care more about being

731
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:05,600
Speaker 2: able to pass down something, that's one thing, but understand

732
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:08,880
Speaker 2: that that might not always generate actual generational wealth. Like

733
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 2: that's just the truth. And I think sometimes there's a

734
00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 2: misconception on like what building wealth is going to look like.

735
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:19,879
Speaker 4: Two facts, and just to expand on that, I would

736
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 4: like to add one thing as well. When you think

737
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:27,440
Speaker 4: about sometimes having to give a percentage of your company

738
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,320
Speaker 4: to someone, it's to actually help your business and actually

739
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 4: make it more accessible to your consumers and your customers.

740
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 4: It is actually to help them because you realize that

741
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 4: you know what you love your products. You want to scale,

742
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 4: you want to go into other markets, you want to

743
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 4: expand into other product categories, but you can't do that

744
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:43,680
Speaker 4: on your own, you just don't have the capacity, you

745
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 4: don't have the capital exactly, and this is where you

746
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 4: need the right partners to help you achieve that. And

747
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,520
Speaker 4: this is the thing I've learned to not get upset

748
00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:57,359
Speaker 4: with people that don't understand it's because they haven't been

749
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 4: through it. And that's just one thing when you and

750
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 4: you haven't gone through some because you have an educated yourself,

751
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 4: it's not really that hope they don't know any You

752
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 4: don't know what you don't know. So hopefully these conversations

753
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 4: will help, you know, bring the conversation to a better

754
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,040
Speaker 4: place where we will understand case why is it that

755
00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 4: these founders are doing it and why we see in

756
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 4: this cycle. It's not because we're selling out. It's nothing

757
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 4: to do selling out. It's because there is a bigger

758
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:21,239
Speaker 4: reason as to why we're doing it.

759
00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 1: Black Tech Green Money is a production of Blavity Afro

760
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:27,439
Speaker 1: Tech on the Black Effect podcast Networking Night Hire Media.

761
00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:30,799
Speaker 1: It's produced by Morgan Debonne and me Well Lucas, with

762
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 1: the additional production support by Kate McDonald, Sayah Ergan and

763
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:36,959
Speaker 1: Jaden McGee. Special thank you to Michael Davis in Love Beach.

764
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: Learn more about my guessing other tech. This shop is

765
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 1: an innovatives afrotech dot com. The video version of this

766
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 1: episode will drop to Black Tech Green Money on YouTube,

767
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,359
Speaker 1: so tap in. Enjoy your Black Tech Green Money, share

768
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:50,720
Speaker 1: us to somebody, Go get your money.

769
00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:51,959
Speaker 3: Peace and love,