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Speaker 1: And you're here.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for choosing the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost Day

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Speaker 2: and Paranormal Podcast Network. Your quest for podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural,

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Speaker 2: and the unexplained ends here. They invite you to enjoy

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Speaker 2: all our shows we have on this network, and right now,

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Speaker 2: let's start with Chase of the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and

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Speaker 1: opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions

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Speaker 1: only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast, AM employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors

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Speaker 1: and associates. We would like to encourage you to do

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Speaker 1: your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself. Hi.

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Speaker 1: I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been

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Speaker 1: on a journey to prove the existence of life after death.

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Speaker 1: Each episode will discuss the reasons.

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Speaker 3: We now know that our loved ones.

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Speaker 1: Have survived physical death and so will we. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: Shades of the Afterlife. We often think of doctors as

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Speaker 1: the ultimate skeptics. They are the guardians of biology, trained

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Speaker 1: to see the body as a machine. To a medical doctor,

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Speaker 1: death is usually the enemy. It is a failure of

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Speaker 1: the system, a stopping of a clock. We expect them

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Speaker 1: to be the ones who say lights out, that's it,

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Speaker 1: game is over. But what happens when the people trained

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Speaker 1: to save lives become the ones who prove that life

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Speaker 1: does not end. Today's episode is dedicated to the men

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Speaker 1: and women of science who have peaked behind the curtain.

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Speaker 1: Later in the show, you're going to hear from doctor

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Speaker 1: Adam Risby, a critical care physician who kept a secret

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Speaker 1: death journal of over five hundred passing moments the intensive

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Speaker 1: care unit. But before we get to him, I want

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Speaker 1: to share three incredible stories involving doctors that prove that

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Speaker 1: the afterlife is not a matter of faith, it is

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Speaker 1: a matter of fact. The first story comes from a

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Speaker 1: famous cardiac surgeon, doctor Lloyd Rudy. Doctor Rudy was a

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Speaker 1: dean at the University of Georgia School of Medicine and

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Speaker 1: a member of the first heart transplant team at Stanford.

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Speaker 1: He was a man of precision and facts. On Christmas Day,

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Speaker 1: doctor Rudy and his team were performing an emergency valve

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Speaker 1: replacement on a patient who had a severe infection. The

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Speaker 1: surgery was just brutal. Despite their best efforts, the patient's

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Speaker 1: heart simply would not start again. They couldn't get him

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Speaker 1: off the bypass machine. Every time they tried they failed. Finally,

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Speaker 1: after hours of struggle, they had to make the call.

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Speaker 1: They pronounced the patient dead. The anesthesiologist turned off his machine,

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Speaker 1: The bellows that breathed for the patient went silent, and

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Speaker 1: he left the room to get a sandwich. The surgical

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Speaker 1: assistants began cleaning up the tools. The room went quiet

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Speaker 1: for at least twenty minutes. The patient was dead, no heartbeat,

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Speaker 1: no blood pressure, The monitors were flat. Doctor Rudy and

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Speaker 1: his assistant surgeon took off their gowns and stood in

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Speaker 1: the doorway of the operating room, standing there in their

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Speaker 1: short sleeved shirts, arms folded, just talking about what they

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Speaker 1: could have done differently. And then a miracle happened without

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Speaker 1: any medical intervention. The machines flickered, electrical activity returned. A

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Speaker 1: heartbeat started slowly at first, then stronger and stronger. Doctor

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Speaker 1: Rudy started yelling, get anesthesia back in here. They saved him.

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Speaker 1: But the real story happened a few days later. When

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Speaker 1: the patient woke up. He didn't just thank them for

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Speaker 1: saving his life. He told them exactly what had happened

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Speaker 1: while he was dead. He described floating above the operating room.

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Speaker 1: He said, I saw you and doctor Catanio standing in

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Speaker 1: the doorway with your arms folded talking. I saw the

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Speaker 1: anesthesiologist come running back in. But then he said something

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Speaker 1: that made doctor Rudy's blood run cold. He said, I

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Speaker 1: saw all these post it notes sitting on the TV monitor.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Rudy was confused, but the patient explained that every

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Speaker 1: time a phone call came in for the doctor during

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Speaker 1: that surgery, the nurse had written the message on a

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Speaker 1: post it note and stuck it to the monitor screen.

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Speaker 1: Eventually there was a whole string of post It notes

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Speaker 1: stuck to the glass. There was absolutely no way the

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Speaker 1: patient could have seen those notes from the operating table,

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Speaker 1: and certainly not while he was clinically dead with his

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Speaker 1: eyes taped shut. That is what we call veritical perception,

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Speaker 1: verified proof that his consciousness was out of his body

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Speaker 1: watching the scene from above. But sometimes the doctor isn't

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Speaker 1: the witness. Sometimes the doctor is the traveler. Take the

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Speaker 1: story of doctor John, an army doctor during World War II.

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Speaker 1: He was traveling in a jeep that was hit by

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Speaker 1: mortar fire. He suffered massive trauma and was rushed to

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Speaker 1: the very hospital where he worked. His next conscious memory

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Speaker 1: was floating near the ceiling of the operating room. He

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Speaker 1: looked down and saw his own colleagues working frantically on

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Speaker 1: a body. He heard the surgeon scream and frustration, I

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Speaker 1: can't find the damn bleeder. Keep the blood coming. He

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Speaker 1: saw the panic in their eyes. Doctor John watched his

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Speaker 1: own heart rate slow down. On the moment he heard

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Speaker 1: the surgeon cursing, yelling that they were losing him, and

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Speaker 1: doctor John had one thought, I must be dying. But

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Speaker 1: then the scene changed. He was suddenly wrapped in a

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Speaker 1: soft shroud of mist, with tiny points of light blinking

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Speaker 1: all around him. The pain of the mortarshell was gone.

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Speaker 1: He felt completely weightless. He described the feeling of love

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Speaker 1: as intense, almost unbearable in its beauty. He was floating

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Speaker 1: in a bright place of total peace, and for the

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Speaker 1: first time he realized that time had no meaning. As

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Speaker 1: he was just settling into this bliss, he heard a distinct,

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Speaker 1: commanding voice. It said firmly, you can't stay John, It's

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Speaker 1: not your time to die. He didn't argue. He felt

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Speaker 1: himself descending. The mist cleared, and suddenly he was back

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Speaker 1: in the heavy, pain filled body, hearing the banging of

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Speaker 1: the eye operating room again. He watched the weak pulse

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Speaker 1: on the monitor slowly gain strength as the surgical team

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Speaker 1: brought him back. And finally, I want to tell you

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Speaker 1: the story of doctor Bob Magrisso. He was forty eight

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Speaker 1: years old, a doctor working in the er. One day,

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Speaker 1: after a workout, he felt chest pain. He tried to

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Speaker 1: brush it off, but his son insisted on calling nine

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Speaker 1: to one one. He ended up as a patient in

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Speaker 1: his own hospital. His heart went into a lethal rhythm

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Speaker 1: called ventricular fibrillation. He lay unconscious for fifteen minutes while

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Speaker 1: his coworkers tried to save him. Doctor Magrisso describes leaving

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Speaker 1: his body and hearing a strange sound like the buzzing

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Speaker 1: of cicadas. He entered a state of incredible well being

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Speaker 1: and lightness. He said, it's not like a dream. It's

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Speaker 1: like the world we're living in here is the dream,

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Speaker 1: and we are waking up from that. In that place

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Speaker 1: where time doesn't exist, he saw three illuminative figures waiting

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Speaker 1: for him like a welcoming committee. He identified them as

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Speaker 1: his father, a close friend, and a young man he knew,

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Speaker 1: all three of whom had died less than four years earlier.

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Speaker 1: Doctor magrisso came back, but he came back changed. He said.

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Speaker 1: The greatest gift he received from dying was realizing that

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Speaker 1: we are part of something so much bigger. He said.

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Speaker 1: His goal now is simply to get out of this

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Speaker 1: self centered state of mind. These stories remind us that

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Speaker 1: the white coat and the stethoscope don't make someone immune

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Speaker 1: to the spiritual reality. In fact, sometimes they are the

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Speaker 1: ones who give us the best evidence. And that's the

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Speaker 1: perfect introduction to our guests today. You are about to

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Speaker 1: meet a man who has stood at the bedside of

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Speaker 1: over five hundred dying patients who recorded the miracle he

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Speaker 1: saw in their final moments of life. I'd like to

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Speaker 1: introduce you now to critical care physician and neurologist, doctor

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Speaker 1: Adam Risbe, author of the new book Love Does Not

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Speaker 1: Know Death.

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Speaker 4: I think I went into medicine already having a sense

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Speaker 4: there was something more to life. I was fairly spiritual

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Speaker 4: as a kid. My mother was raised Catholic, my father

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Speaker 4: was raised Muslim. So I was in this place of well,

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Speaker 4: there's got to be some core truth that unites both traditions,

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Speaker 4: and that took me into comparative religion in college, and

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Speaker 4: I thought, okay, this is interesting. There are so many

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Speaker 4: different ways to look at life. And there was a

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Speaker 4: class that I took called Death, Dying, and Beyond at

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Speaker 4: the University of Rochester, which was my first exposure to

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Speaker 4: the concept that facing death, or really embracing death death

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Speaker 4: is a path to spiritual awakening. And we could probably

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Speaker 4: even just drop the term spiritual or awakening, but just

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Speaker 4: being a better human being, being a more grounded, more

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Speaker 4: caring human being, being kinder. These are sort of like

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Speaker 4: the fundamental things that happen if we truly contemplate death.

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Speaker 4: So then I ended up going to medical school residency

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Speaker 4: and then fellowship, and I recall it started in late

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Speaker 4: residency I had my first few deaths in the hospital.

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Speaker 4: In medicine, we see death, but going into critical care

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Speaker 4: and I see you. I ended up seeing death a

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Speaker 4: lot more often, and I had this feeling, you know what,

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Speaker 4: let me just write this down.

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Speaker 3: When I had my first death.

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Speaker 4: It was kind of scary because a couple of things

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Speaker 4: happened when you're so intimately involved with a patient and

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Speaker 4: their family, and you're meeting with them every day as

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Speaker 4: a physician, you start to build a bit of a bond.

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Speaker 4: And naturally, I think, not just a physician, but any nurse,

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Speaker 4: any caregiver wants the patient to get better. You want

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Speaker 4: to see them walk out the door and go back home.

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Speaker 4: And then when they don't and they die, it sort

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Speaker 4: of hits you right here. And for me at first,

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Speaker 4: it was, oh, man, did I do anything wrong? Could

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Speaker 4: I have done something different? Could I have said something different.

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Speaker 4: A way to process the grief, A way to process

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Speaker 4: some of the guilt that I was feeling, was to

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Speaker 4: write down their story, and that was the first entry.

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Speaker 3: In my death journal.

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Speaker 4: I ended up keeping a journal where I recorded every

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Speaker 4: single death that I was physically present for, the story

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Speaker 4: of what led to their death, how they died, what

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Speaker 4: I experienced, what other people experienced. And then I would

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Speaker 4: use those pages as a sort of prayer, a well

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Speaker 4: wish for them and for their soul. And it was

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Speaker 4: just my heartfelt way of writing down this feeling like

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Speaker 4: I hope they're well, I hope everything goes well, that

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Speaker 4: their family is loved and cared for and just at peace.

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Speaker 4: And I ended up accumulating all of these stories. I

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Speaker 4: have over five hundred now in that death journal, five

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Speaker 4: hundred plus stories of people I've physically touched and held

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Speaker 4: and been present with when they made their transition. And

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Speaker 4: at first it started off as something for me, something

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Speaker 4: I could do to process what was going on, But

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Speaker 4: then it started to become away for me to honor them.

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Speaker 4: And then what started to happen was just an accumulation

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Speaker 4: of really wild stories and very strange, fascinating things that

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Speaker 4: happened at this transition point between life as we know

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Speaker 4: it and something else, whatever happens beyond. And the more

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Speaker 4: time went by, the more stories accumulated that I found

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Speaker 4: myself sharing some of the things that happened with other people,

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Speaker 4: and I found that they got a lot out of it.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break and we'll be right back.

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Speaker 1: You were listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the

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Speaker 1: iHeart Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.

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Speaker 1: Let's continue with doctor Adam Risbie.

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Speaker 4: I thought, let me share with others the transformation that

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Speaker 4: I'm seeing happen at the bedside not only for the

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Speaker 4: patient and their loved ones, but for me.

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Speaker 3: I grew a lot from each death.

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Speaker 4: I became a different person and learned a bit more

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Speaker 4: about myself and the ways that I maybe held back grievances,

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Speaker 4: the ways that I judge myself and others.

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Speaker 3: It's funny.

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Speaker 4: Death has a way of making the things that we

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Speaker 4: used to think mattered completely irrelevant and what does matter?

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Speaker 4: What really matters? That comes to the foreground, and that

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Speaker 4: happened over and over again with every death that I had,

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Speaker 4: so it helped me live life in a more authentic way.

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Speaker 4: I'll tell you a story from yesterday. I just came

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Speaker 4: off of a night shift in the ICU and.

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Speaker 3: We had a patient.

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Speaker 4: This gentleman had esophageal cancer and had a very complex course.

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Speaker 3: This happens quite often.

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Speaker 4: But you have this profound underlying disease that's sort of

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Speaker 4: destroying your body slowly. You do everything you can you

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Speaker 4: bring to bear the might of western medicine, and still

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Speaker 4: nothing happen.

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Speaker 3: Happens.

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Speaker 4: Those are the times that you need to stop and say, Okay,

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Speaker 4: it looks like we're going in a particular direction that

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Speaker 4: isn't what we had hoped. We have to be ready

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Speaker 4: for this, and what ends up happening and the way

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Speaker 4: you know you're going there is.

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Speaker 3: One problem pops up.

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Speaker 4: Maybe something's happening with the heart, and then we focus

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Speaker 4: on fixing the heart problem, and then something happens with

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Speaker 4: the lungs. Okay, let's fix the lungs. Oh gosh, the

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Speaker 4: kidneys are going okay, let's fix the kidneys. And it

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Speaker 4: becomes a game of whack a mole. You just keep

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Speaker 4: trying to fix the problems that come up. But each

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Speaker 4: of those problems are indicative of the global dysfunction that's

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Speaker 4: happening with the body. And it's so easy as a

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Speaker 4: family member, as a patient, you don't want to acknowledge

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Speaker 4: your dying. No one does. It's terrifying, it's scary. And

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Speaker 4: so what ends up happening is for this one gentleman.

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Speaker 4: He was with us for quite a while in the hospital.

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Speaker 4: Every morning would be this time, so and so, how

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Speaker 4: you're doing. Did you get some sleep last night?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 4: No, it was I had a lot of pain. I

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Speaker 4: couldn't breathe. My chest hurts. Okay, great, we'll give you

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Speaker 4: some pain meds. And then he would ask, well, how

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Speaker 4: are my kidneys?

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Speaker 3: Doing well.

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Speaker 4: They're not doing so great. We might need to consider dialysis. Okay, great, well,

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Speaker 4: let's do a dialysis. If we can fix the kidneys,

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Speaker 4: I'll get better. Right a couple days later, Oh, now

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Speaker 4: the lungs are much worse. Okay, well, let's pull off

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Speaker 4: some fluid. If we can just fix the lungs, I'll

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Speaker 4: get better. And it's this sort of holding on to

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Speaker 4: smaller things without seeing the big picture that happens so often.

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Speaker 4: So often, family members when a doctor comes in, will

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Speaker 4: want to know every specific lab value, but they don't

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Speaker 4: want you to tell them that their loved one is

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Speaker 4: dying or I've gotten doctor. Why are you being so negative?

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Speaker 4: Why can't you be positive to tell us good news?

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Speaker 4: And I have to say what I want to, but

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Speaker 4: I also don't want to shoot things. I want to

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Speaker 4: tell you what's actually happening. And sometimes patients will flat

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Speaker 4: out say I.

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Speaker 1: Don't want to know.

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Speaker 4: You talk to my family members, I don't want to know.

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Speaker 4: But in the case of this gentleman, we ended up

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Speaker 4: having two to three pretty intense conversations of you know,

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Speaker 4: I don't think you're going to be able to pull

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Speaker 4: through this.

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Speaker 3: Your body is shutting down.

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Speaker 4: I legitimately feel like you may not be able to

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Speaker 4: go home, and I think you need to call your

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Speaker 4: family members. I knew he got it when he started

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Speaker 4: crying and his family started crying, because that tells me

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Speaker 4: he's broken through denial. He's not holding on to false hope.

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Speaker 3: He got it.

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Speaker 4: He finally got it, and so he wanted his son

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Speaker 4: to come in. And his son was in another state

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Speaker 4: and got the gravity of the situation and decided to

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Speaker 4: fly in. Now, his son flew in and he was

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Speaker 4: declining fast, his heart rate was dropping, and we asked him,

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Speaker 4: do you want morphine, because you know when cancer spreads

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Speaker 4: through the body, it can be very painful, and he

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Speaker 4: said no, I want to stay awake. I'm waiting for

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Speaker 4: my son. And just for context, your blood pressure has

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Speaker 4: a top number it's called systolic, and a bottom number

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Speaker 4: it's called diastolic. We want that top number to be

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Speaker 4: above ninety because above ninety generally means you have enough

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Speaker 4: blood to float to the brain. If it goes below sixty,

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Speaker 4: that's generally not compatible with life. You generally start to

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Speaker 4: lose your pulses. This gentleman's son was just an hour way.

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Speaker 4: He had landed, and now he was in a rental

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Speaker 4: car driving to the hospital coming from LA and his

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Speaker 4: blood pressure was forty over thirty. That's like you're on

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Speaker 4: death's doorstep and it's generally not enough blood to allow

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Speaker 4: you to stay awake. But he was holding a conversation

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Speaker 4: which was blowing my mind, and the nurse who were

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Speaker 4: both talking to him and saying yeah, okay, and looking

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Speaker 4: at the blood pressure monitor.

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Speaker 3: And be like, wow, gosh, he's forty systolic. How is

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Speaker 3: this possible.

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Speaker 4: So he's having this conversation, we're watching his heart rate

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Speaker 4: slow down. His heart rate's going from sixty to fifty

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Speaker 4: to forty to thirty, and he just sort of gets sleepy,

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Speaker 4: and the nurse and I were both ready, okay, he's

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Speaker 4: going to pass. And his son walks in, gets to

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Speaker 4: the doorway of the room. They lock eyes and it's amazing.

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Speaker 4: You can just see him look at his son, his

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Speaker 4: son looks at him. He flat lines right then and there.

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Speaker 4: That's all he needed. He just needed to look at

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Speaker 4: his son and then he went. And those stories to

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Speaker 4: me tell me that there is some degree of conscious

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Speaker 4: control over death. It's like people hold on if they

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Speaker 4: were waiting for something. I've seen that many, many times,

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Speaker 4: and interestingly, not just with this gentleman. I've seen cases

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Speaker 4: where patients who are completely comatose, intubated on life support

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Speaker 4: with sedation, meaning they're not even consciously present. Their body

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Speaker 4: is holding on barely, and then the family member that

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Speaker 4: they're waiting for arrives, holds their hands, says I love

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Speaker 4: you mom, dad, brother, sister, and then the heart stops.

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Speaker 4: It's wild to watch because it sort of begs the question, like,

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Speaker 4: what's happening here? What part of them is aware that

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Speaker 4: their loved one has finally arrived and now they can

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Speaker 4: let go. There's an alternate side. There's a corollary to that.

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Speaker 4: I've seen this quite often, a patient who's intubated, comatose,

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Speaker 4: you know, the sedation, all of that, meaning they're not

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Speaker 4: consciously aware. This actually happened two weeks ago. Large Hispanic family,

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Speaker 4: twenty plus people in the room. They're alternating. It's huge.

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Speaker 4: No one wants to leave her bedside, this elderly lady

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Speaker 4: who's dying. It's three or four am and there's only

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Speaker 4: a small group of maybe three or four of them.

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Speaker 4: One of them decides to go use the bathroom. And

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Speaker 4: the other three decide to go downstairs and get soda

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Speaker 4: from the vetting machine. That's it, just a five minute

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Speaker 4: walk to the veting machine and they'll be back. It

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Speaker 4: just took five minutes. This lady had been hanging on

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Speaker 4: for days, days and with no indication that she would go.

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Speaker 4: It just looked like her heart was going to continue

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Speaker 4: ticking on without stop. They walk out just for five

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Speaker 4: minutes to get soda.

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Speaker 3: And she dies right there.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 4: It also begs the question, like what's happening there? That's interesting.

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Speaker 4: It's almost like some souls, some lives, they just want

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Speaker 4: to go alone. They want to go when everything's quiet

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Speaker 4: and peaceful, and they've said their goodbyes and their family

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Speaker 4: has left and they make their transition. Those are some

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Speaker 4: of the very interesting stories I've seen at the deathbedd

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Speaker 4: in Ice.

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Speaker 1: You. I've heard those kind of stories before, and recently

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Speaker 1: someone had said that our consciousness is like a television signal, right,

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Speaker 1: and the closer we get to death, the more it broadens.

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Speaker 1: And our body is like the receiver. So we got

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Speaker 1: the consciousness being the television signal. Our body is just

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Speaker 1: the receiver. So just because the body goes doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: the signal disappears. And there's so many cases of terminal

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Speaker 1: lucidity when people are in a coma or their brain

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Speaker 1: is filled, whether it's Alzheimer's dementia, but just moments before

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Speaker 1: they die, they're alert, awake, having conversations. They know everything

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Speaker 1: that's going on, they know stories from the past. People

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Speaker 1: think the loved ones are getting better and then they

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Speaker 1: lean back down and they pass away.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I think our consciousness is so much more than

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Speaker 1: just what we store in the body. Men. This fellow

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Speaker 1: was talking before he passed. Have you had people that

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Speaker 1: see their loved ones come in before they pass their

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Speaker 1: deceased loved ones.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: I've seen situations where someone is actively dying and they

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Speaker 4: get up and they start having conversations with people and

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Speaker 4: there's no one there.

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Speaker 3: There's no one there.

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Speaker 4: I should add a caveat because it's a real thing

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Speaker 4: to have ic delirium, which is to say, you get

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Speaker 4: delirious when you're in an unfamiliar environment. There are sounds

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Speaker 4: you don't recognize. People do legitimately get confused and they

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Speaker 4: start talking gibberish, they say things that they don't mean.

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Speaker 4: That's not what I'm talking about I'm talking about someone

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Speaker 4: who is crystally clear. They're having a lucid, sane conversation.

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Speaker 4: But it just happens to be with someone or something

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Speaker 4: that isn't actually there. And when you ask them who

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Speaker 4: are you're talking to, which that happens, often they say, oh,

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Speaker 4: it's Grandma, Nina or whatever. You know, like clearly someone

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Speaker 4: who hasn't been a life for quite some time.

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Speaker 3: And that's quite interesting.

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Speaker 4: The comment you made about consciousness, Yeah, I feel like

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Speaker 4: that's likely what's happening western medicine. I think most doctors

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Speaker 4: will argue that consciousness is a byproduct of the neurons

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Speaker 4: firing in your brain, and it arises from the physical matter.

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Speaker 4: But I've had personal experiences myself and been privy to

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Speaker 4: patients described near death experiences where the physical matter of

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Speaker 4: the brain had stopped. We were doing egs, for example

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Speaker 4: on one guy, and the EEG showed no cortical activity,

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Speaker 4: meaning no brain wave activity. The term we use is isoelectric,

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Speaker 4: meaning that the electric signal.

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Speaker 3: Was not there.

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Speaker 4: And yet upon waking, he would describe stories of places

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Speaker 4: he'd been to and people he'd seen. And every time

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Speaker 4: you have an experience, whether you see something with your

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Speaker 4: eyes or you're hearing something, there's a correlate in your

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Speaker 4: brain in terms of the activities.

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Speaker 3: Me looking at you right now, if someone were to.

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Speaker 4: Measure the brainwave activity of my brain, they would see

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Speaker 4: the occipital lobes, which are the visual cortex, light up

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Speaker 4: because I have visual stimulus. But if this patient is

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Speaker 4: saying he saw something, I should be seeing some sort

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Speaker 4: of cortical activity in the visual area. But we didn't,

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Speaker 4: which tells me experience can occur independent of a functioning brain.

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Speaker 4: So I agree with you. It seems like there's something

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Speaker 4: more happening.

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Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more stories and some important

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Speaker 1: advice from doctor Adam Risby. You're listening to Shades of

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Speaker 1: the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and cost to cost Am

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Speaker 1: Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife.

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Speaker 1: I'm Sandra Champlain. We're here with doctor Adam Risby, author

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Speaker 1: of Love Does Not Know Death, Stories of Death Dying,

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Speaker 1: and the Miracles of true Forgiveness.

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Speaker 4: What I find most important, though, is not the fact

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Speaker 4: that there's evidence that we do in fact go on

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Speaker 4: after death personally.

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Speaker 3: I think the evidence for that is overwhelming.

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Speaker 4: If you actually compile all the near death experiences, all

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Speaker 4: the anecdotal stories of people experiencing terminal lucidity and other things,

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Speaker 4: it's overwhelming. It's just that it hasn't penetrated or broken

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Speaker 4: through the dogma of materialistic frameworks. But what I I

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Speaker 4: think is most important is what happens emotionally and psychologically

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Speaker 4: when we see that our loved one's about to die

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Speaker 4: or that we're going to die. And that to me,

436
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 4: after all those deaths that I've seen, it almost doesn't

437
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 4: matter what happens after death. What matters is what are

438
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:24,000
Speaker 4: you doing right now to embrace life? And I don't

439
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,919
Speaker 4: mean to make this sound cliche, like, Okay, you're going

440
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 4: to die soon, so karpe dim you know, let'll share

441
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 4: a story. In Tucson, this gentleman was dying eighties, late eighties.

442
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,920
Speaker 4: He had two daughters. They had been estranged from him

443
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:44,680
Speaker 4: for years, and he was from China. He wanted them

444
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 4: to take over his business because in China it's sort

445
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 4: of expected, you know, the family takes over the family business.

446
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:55,159
Speaker 4: In China with the one child policy, to have a

447
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 4: daughter is a big deal because if you were only

448
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 4: allowed one child, you wanted it to be a male.

449
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,240
Speaker 4: So there was a lot of stories of infanticide where

450
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:09,399
Speaker 4: parents would kill their child if it was a female.

451
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 4: So the fact that he had two daughters and didn't

452
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 4: do anything about that and love them says something about

453
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 4: him and how much he cherished them. But he was

454
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 4: a rough, old school Chinese man and wanted them to

455
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 4: take over the business. They said no when they were

456
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 4: in their twenties, and actually it became such a point

457
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 4: of contention that they left and never wanted to see

458
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:36,160
Speaker 4: him again. They went to the United States and he

459
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 4: and his daughters didn't talk for the next twenty thirty years.

460
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,360
Speaker 4: His wife died and he was alone, and he shut

461
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 4: down the business and he retired and it was just

462
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,800
Speaker 4: him alone at home, and he really missed them.

463
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:49,880
Speaker 3: He missed them.

464
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 4: So he decided he's going to let bygones be bygones,

465
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 4: drop the grievance, and he's just going to fly to Arizona,

466
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,800
Speaker 4: where his daughters were. They still didn't want to see him,

467
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 4: and they said, we don't care.

468
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 3: Do whatever you want to do. Dad, We're not going.

469
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 4: To forgive you for trying to force a life onto

470
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 4: us that we didn't want. And so they lived in

471
00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 4: Phoenix and he found himself in Tucson, where I was practicing.

472
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:20,560
Speaker 4: He ended up at our doorstep because of end stage COPD,

473
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 4: which is a pulmonary process, and came in.

474
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:25,800
Speaker 3: Short of breath.

475
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,480
Speaker 4: We did a blood gas when he was with us

476
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 4: in the emergency room. This is a sample of the

477
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,120
Speaker 4: blood that tells you how the blood is doing. And

478
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 4: his carbon dioxide levels were through the roof and they

479
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 4: were at levels where it's a clear green light you

480
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 4: have to put the patient on life support, and you

481
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 4: got to put a breathing tube and put them on

482
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 4: life support in order to save their life. But the

483
00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 4: X rays and the CT scans of his chest told

484
00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 4: me this was end stage, that if we put a

485
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 4: breathing tube in him, we weren't going to be able

486
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 4: to take it out. That this was it, This was

487
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,120
Speaker 4: it for him, And so I told him that. I

488
00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 4: was like, you, like, we won't be able to get

489
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 4: extabated if we intubate you, and he's like, I don't

490
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 4: want to be intubated. I just want to see my daughters.

491
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 4: And he had this face mask on and everything he

492
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 4: said was punctuated by silence. He's like, I just want,

493
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 4: you know, like because he couldn't breathe. So our case

494
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 4: manager did an amazing job. She looked them up. She

495
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 4: found them. She was able to get ahold of their

496
00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 4: phone numbers and said, listen, your father is dying. He's

497
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 4: in Tucson. Phoenix is two hours away. He's probably going

498
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 4: to go in a couple of hours. You should come.

499
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 4: And to their credit, they dropped what they were doing.

500
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 4: They got in a car and they drove over. They

501
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 4: came in. I remember they were walking through the emergency

502
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 4: the trauma bay doors and they were coming to the

503
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:50,160
Speaker 4: room that he was staying at and it was me

504
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:54,960
Speaker 4: and the respiratory therapist and the nurse, and he had

505
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 4: this mask on. He looked like he was dead, but

506
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 4: his vitals were still barely live. And his daughters came

507
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 4: in and they'd started bawling. That's just seeing their dad

508
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:11,160
Speaker 4: like this after thirty years with the mask, and who

509
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,520
Speaker 4: knows what he looked like now to them compared to

510
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,240
Speaker 4: what they remembered. You know, they both rush and they're

511
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 4: like they're on their knees. They're holding him, and you

512
00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 4: can just see the years of anguish and resentment just

513
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 4: wash away. It just came like a torrential downpour, and

514
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 4: they started saying, I'm sorry, Dad, we miss you, and

515
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,440
Speaker 4: they started showing pictures of their children to him, and

516
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 4: he was smiling and nodding and saying a few things,

517
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 4: and you could see that like decades of hurt was

518
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 4: being healed in just moments together. And after several minutes

519
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 4: of just really intense catching up, you could see he

520
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 4: was just a little bit more relaxed now, and sort

521
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,640
Speaker 4: of peace came over him, and then they quieted down,

522
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 4: and for a few seconds it was just quiet, and

523
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 4: then his oxygen levels got lower, was ninety than eighty percent,

524
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:10,440
Speaker 4: then seventy and sixty, and then the daughters stood up,

525
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 4: and eventually we all kind of turned up, and we

526
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:17,680
Speaker 4: saw the two levels drop down to twenty and ten,

527
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 4: and then the heart right slowed down and then there's

528
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 4: this big red zero and that was that was it.

529
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 4: He went and his daughters again, as this Chinese custom,

530
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 4: his daughters bowed very deeply to him, and I and

531
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 4: the nurse and the respiratory therapist, it just felt natural

532
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 4: for us to all bow two. So here we were

533
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 4: all five of us bowing in a semi circle at

534
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,200
Speaker 4: this man. Who had just passed, and it was just

535
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 4: this overwhelming feeling of gratitude for him, what he gave

536
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:00,320
Speaker 4: us to be able to honor him, to see this

537
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,600
Speaker 4: healing that happened. And the feeling that I got was

538
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 4: he lived, He played his part well. It's like the

539
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,600
Speaker 4: end of a play when all the actors come on

540
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:13,320
Speaker 4: stage and they bow and then the audience is clapping.

541
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 4: It sort of felt like we're honoring this man for

542
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 4: the amazing role.

543
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 3: That he played.

544
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 4: He played his role well, he lived an amazing life.

545
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 4: He was committed to healing that rift between his daughters,

546
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 4: and it happened in those last few moments.

547
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:28,920
Speaker 3: His story and many others.

548
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 4: Like that, remind me we don't need to wait. We

549
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 4: don't need to wait till someone's dying or you're dying.

550
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 4: If it's something else that I have to share on

551
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 4: this show, it's this. You don't have to wait for

552
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,160
Speaker 4: death to come knocking on your door to forgive, to

553
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 4: let go, to drop pass grievances. Don't wait.

554
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 3: That's my message.

555
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing that. I know research has shown

556
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: one in three people there's family members not talking, and

557
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 1: it's hit my family as well. After my dad fifteen

558
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 1: years ago. So this is just a very tender conversation

559
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:11,239
Speaker 1: for me and I one hundred percent agree, whether it's

560
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:15,840
Speaker 1: somebody's ego or making the other person wrong. I believe Adam.

561
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 1: As human beings, we do the best we can, and

562
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:20,799
Speaker 1: we do Chinese father did what he knew to do.

563
00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 1: That daughters did what they knew to do. Unless we

564
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,000
Speaker 1: walk in somebody else's shoes, we don't know that. And

565
00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: for thirty years to pass, you know, I'm sure those

566
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,439
Speaker 1: girls still had an image of dad in their mind

567
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 1: from thirty years past their parents' age. And it's important

568
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 1: to have that conversation that forgiveness, whatever that is, So

569
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 1: thank you for sharing that.

570
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:46,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, And one of the things that's important is how

571
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,600
Speaker 4: to forgive? How do we forgive? And this is also

572
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 4: very critical because it's one thing to say we'll just

573
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 4: forgive them forgiveness as I see it, I'm just going

574
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,919
Speaker 4: to share two potential types forgiveness.

575
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 3: The old school way of.

576
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,920
Speaker 4: Viewing forgiveness is this, I'm the better man. You did

577
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 4: something wrong, you don't really deserve my forgiveness, but I'm

578
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 4: going to give it to you anyway because I'm better

579
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:17,319
Speaker 4: than you. And It's sort of like this false charity, right,

580
00:35:17,360 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 4: It's like I will bestow upon you my grace. You

581
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:23,320
Speaker 4: don't deserve it, but I'll do it anyway.

582
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 3: You know.

583
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:27,240
Speaker 4: It's like you don't forget where the hatchet was buried.

584
00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 4: You legitimately believe in their guilt and your innocence. Now

585
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 4: that I feel is not true forgiveness because nothing was

586
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 4: healed there. It's a superficial type of forgiveness. Now, the

587
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 4: reason why I put in my subtitle love does not

588
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:53,640
Speaker 4: know death stories of true forgiveness, because true forgiveness is

589
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 4: an internal shift in perception where you do not see

590
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:03,840
Speaker 4: the other person as guilty anymore. Now a couple of things.

591
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:09,840
Speaker 4: That does not condone bad behavior. It does not condone

592
00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:14,800
Speaker 4: abusive behavior. If you're an abusive relationship, forgiving someone doesn't

593
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 4: mean you stay in the relationship.

594
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:16,680
Speaker 3: You leave.

595
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 4: You protect yourself, you protect others, You do what's right.

596
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 4: If someone truly is doing something unprofessional or illegal, you

597
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 4: take action, You file the restraining order, you call the cops.

598
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:34,319
Speaker 4: That sometimes love looks like that love is doing what

599
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 4: needs to be done, But internally you cut through the

600
00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:44,160
Speaker 4: appearance of their guilt and you remember exactly what you said.

601
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 4: Everyone's doing the best that they can with what they know,

602
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 4: with how they were raised. Who knows their childhood trauma,

603
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 4: Who knows how they were raised, what sort of things

604
00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 4: they're going through?

605
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:55,839
Speaker 3: We don't know.

606
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 4: And the more you're able to see that, to see

607
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 4: the inner child and someone, to see the innocence in them,

608
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 4: I truly believe it. And now, I mean your listeners

609
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 4: might be open to this. I don't think we're separate

610
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:15,440
Speaker 4: from each other. This consciousness thing that we talk about,

611
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:18,839
Speaker 4: I think there's only one of it. There's only one

612
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 4: consciousness out there. It appears to be in Sandra's body

613
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 4: and Adam's body and different people. But it's the same

614
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:29,520
Speaker 4: consciousness that's in Sandra is the same that's in Adam.

615
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:31,000
Speaker 3: It's the same thing.

616
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 4: We're literally made of the same stuff, not in a

617
00:37:33,920 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 4: physical sense, but in terms of a consciousness that transcends

618
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 4: space and time. Now, because of that, when you judge someone,

619
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,359
Speaker 4: you're sending a signal. You're sending a message to your

620
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 4: mind that if you say that person doesn't deserve to

621
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 4: be loved, you're also telling yourself that you don't deserve

622
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 4: to be loved. Because a part of our mind knows

623
00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 4: that there's only one of us here. A part of

624
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 4: our mind knows that we're deeply connected and that we're one.

625
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:05,319
Speaker 4: Which this speaks to the non dual aspect of some

626
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:07,200
Speaker 4: of the things that I like to talk about. But

627
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 4: that's kind of an important message. As you see him,

628
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 4: you will see yourself. So it behooves us to recognize

629
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 4: how are we viewing another person. You're not condoning the behavior,

630
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:23,160
Speaker 4: but you are choosing to cut through appearances and to

631
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:27,440
Speaker 4: see their innocence at their core. And because of that,

632
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:30,320
Speaker 4: you see your own and you're much more kinder to yourself.

633
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 4: You're kinder to others. That for me is true forgiveness.

634
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,360
Speaker 4: It's forgiven us on a deep level that brings about healing.

635
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more of doctor Adam Risvee.

636
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 1: You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio

637
00:38:43,440 --> 00:39:06,400
Speaker 1: and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network. Welcome back

638
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 1: to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain and we

639
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:14,880
Speaker 1: have doctor Adam risve critical care physician with us today.

640
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 1: In this next segment, I ask Adam about his book

641
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 1: and his podcast, but also in the ICU when someone passes,

642
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:27,760
Speaker 1: has he ever seen any interesting activity like a glow

643
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:29,320
Speaker 1: emanating from the body.

644
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.

645
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:35,760
Speaker 4: If we accept the fact that we are not our bodies,

646
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 4: then it seems to be the case that when death happens,

647
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,480
Speaker 4: something leaves the body. And I have seen a couple

648
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:48,200
Speaker 4: of cases where patients die and it's me and the

649
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 4: family member. A couple of things that I've seen. I

650
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,880
Speaker 4: have seen a ball of light leave out of a

651
00:39:53,960 --> 00:40:00,880
Speaker 4: patient's forehead. I have seen the room dim even though

652
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 4: the lights are non dimmable. There's a feeling that things

653
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 4: got dark. Now I don't know what that means, but

654
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:10,839
Speaker 4: I've noticed that, and I've seen the opposite of that too,

655
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:13,880
Speaker 4: And actually, more often than not, it feels like someone's

656
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,880
Speaker 4: turning on the dimmer switch and it's getting brighter and

657
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:20,319
Speaker 4: brighter in the room. The one particular case where the

658
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,640
Speaker 4: room got dark, I had a feeling that the patient

659
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 4: was struggling emotionally leading.

660
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:27,720
Speaker 3: Up to his death.

661
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:30,920
Speaker 4: It was just a sense for me that there was

662
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:35,880
Speaker 4: a tension in the room. But shortly after that, I

663
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:39,080
Speaker 4: got this intuitive feeling that whatever he was holding on too,

664
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:43,280
Speaker 4: he let go this particular patient. And when the feeling

665
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 4: of letting go occurred. That's when I noticed the lights

666
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:50,080
Speaker 4: seemed to get brighter. The other thing that I've noticed,

667
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:54,799
Speaker 4: you know, when you're entering into a party and you

668
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:58,719
Speaker 4: can just feel that there are one hundred people in

669
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:00,920
Speaker 4: the room. You know that feeling of like entering a

670
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 4: really crowded room or going onto the train station, and

671
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:06,279
Speaker 4: all of a sudden you enter this hall where there's

672
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:07,839
Speaker 4: a ton of people and a lot going on.

673
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:08,919
Speaker 3: You can kind of.

674
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:10,800
Speaker 4: Feel it, like you get the vibe of the space.

675
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,799
Speaker 4: And I've had nurses corroborate this with me too, of

676
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 4: being in a room where it's just me, the nurse,

677
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 4: and the patient, but all of a sudden, it feels

678
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,760
Speaker 4: like the room's packed. It feels like standing room only

679
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 4: you know has this weird feeling. I've had that feeling now,

680
00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 4: to be fair, Other than occasional changes in the light

681
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 4: switch and.

682
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 3: Maybe a ball of light or two, I don't see things.

683
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 4: I know some people say they see auras and they

684
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 4: can see that's not me. I've never really had that gift,

685
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 4: but I get feelings, and that's one of the feelings

686
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,719
Speaker 4: I noticed on several occasions is feeling like, Wow, the

687
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 4: room just got really packed, like there are way more

688
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:53,000
Speaker 4: people here than I can see.

689
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:55,920
Speaker 3: That's what it feels like. At least there's a book.

690
00:41:56,520 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 1: Oh and I can't remember his name at the top

691
00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 1: of my head, but it's about crowded rooms doctor that

692
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 1: wrote it, and it's that feeling of the loved ones.

693
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,120
Speaker 1: And then I'm also reminded that doctor Christopher Kerr, a

694
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 1: hospice doctor, studied sixteen or seventeen hundred of his patients

695
00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:15,480
Speaker 1: before they passed with those end of life visions, and

696
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:19,440
Speaker 1: they're talking to people that had passed and they're looking

697
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 1: down healthy and they're just as clear as you and me.

698
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:26,520
Speaker 1: I got the bonus being born into being Sandra and

699
00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 1: being inquisitive in this. So I've heard so many great

700
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:33,440
Speaker 1: stories even from physicians about, like I said, terminal lucidity,

701
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:39,320
Speaker 1: but also the near death experiences the biritical are verifiable ones.

702
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 3: Yeah.

703
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, the guy who they put his dentures quickly in

704
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:46,879
Speaker 1: a bottom drawer and some cabinet with wheels, and when

705
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 1: he came to there's no way he could know this,

706
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 1: but he actually read the serial number on the cabinet

707
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 1: and knew what drawer because he was looking for his

708
00:42:55,200 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 1: teeth Wow, stories are out there and there we hear.

709
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,320
Speaker 1: That's why I really appreciate you is I do believe

710
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 1: we can have a tipping point that this becomes mainstream.

711
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:09,880
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of people believe in the afterlife,

712
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 1: They believe we go on, but for some reason, we

713
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: think if we talk about those, people are going to

714
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 1: think we're crazy, so we stay quiet. But most people do.

715
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: I think most people believe.

716
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 3: I think so too.

717
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:22,879
Speaker 4: Actually, I don't know the stats on this, but I'm

718
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 4: sure if you look it up, out of everyone on

719
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 4: planet Earth, there's actually a minority that believe that we

720
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:34,280
Speaker 4: are just physical, biased machines that die when the body dies.

721
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 4: I don't think that's the majority of humanity. I think

722
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 4: the majority of humanity believes life does in fact go on.

723
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:43,399
Speaker 4: And in light of that, the thing is, you could

724
00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:46,440
Speaker 4: still believe that life goes on after death and still

725
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:50,279
Speaker 4: be mean to one another and still be unkind. And

726
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:54,879
Speaker 4: that's why I feel death is such a powerful equalizer.

727
00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 4: If you really embrace that.

728
00:43:57,239 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 3: Life will end as you know.

729
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,560
Speaker 4: It, it tends to do something. It tends to call

730
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 4: you to be kinder. There's this great quote. I don't

731
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,160
Speaker 4: exactly know who said it, but it's be kind for

732
00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:12,600
Speaker 4: everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. I really

733
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:16,160
Speaker 4: really like that. It's a call for kindness because it's true.

734
00:44:16,200 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 4: We're all struggling, we're all going through something unique in

735
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:21,160
Speaker 4: our lives, so we should be kind with each other.

736
00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:26,720
Speaker 4: And one last thought, people think that context of life,

737
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 4: the point of life is to be happy, or the

738
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 4: point of life is to be wealthy. You know, there

739
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 4: are different versions of the big context.

740
00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 3: The why.

741
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 4: My context, My big why is we're here to remember

742
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:43,080
Speaker 4: who we really are. We're here to wake up to

743
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:47,920
Speaker 4: our true nature, which is love. In my opinion, it's

744
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 4: something which transcends time, it transcends limits. Love is the

745
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,799
Speaker 4: thing that doesn't die. Love is that which keeps going on.

746
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,880
Speaker 4: But we cover that up with all sorts of stories

747
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:02,399
Speaker 4: of this happened to me, and this person did that,

748
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:04,440
Speaker 4: and I did this, and I can't forgive myself, Like

749
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 4: there's all these stories that are layered.

750
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:08,200
Speaker 3: On for me.

751
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:11,840
Speaker 4: The context is healing that, waking up to our whole

752
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:15,200
Speaker 4: nature as love by peeling away these stories that aren't

753
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:19,600
Speaker 4: really who we are. And to me, forgiveness is how

754
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 4: we do that.

755
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 1: Beautiful tell us about the book, the podcast, what we

756
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 1: can find on your website. And then I've got one

757
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:27,520
Speaker 1: more question for you.

758
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:29,920
Speaker 3: The book is Love Does Not Know Death.

759
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:34,960
Speaker 4: It's stories of all the patients I've seen, what I've learned,

760
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:38,280
Speaker 4: and how I grew from it. The podcast is letters

761
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:42,360
Speaker 4: to TheSky dot com my buddy Stephen and I. Prior

762
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:44,840
Speaker 4: to me being a doctor, I was a comparative religion

763
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 4: scholar and the fascination of how we can be better,

764
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,160
Speaker 4: kinder human beings, no matter what spiritual tradition we come from,

765
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:56,440
Speaker 4: has always stayed with me, and so Steven and I

766
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 4: talk about that. We talk about stories of many saints,

767
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 4: from men, many traditions, the different ways that people perceive truth,

768
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:07,960
Speaker 4: all fundamentally for the express purpose of being kinder, gentler

769
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 4: human beings with each other.

770
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:10,720
Speaker 3: That's what the podcast is about.

771
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 4: If you want to follow some of the things that

772
00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 4: I publish stories about the things I learned in the

773
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:20,640
Speaker 4: ICU and in the hospital regularly on substack Adam Risbee

774
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:23,560
Speaker 4: dot substack dot com or the title of it is

775
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 4: Adventures in Kindness and you can follow me there.

776
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:32,360
Speaker 1: In my recent travels, I have been studying religion again.

777
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:36,919
Speaker 1: Grew up Catholic as well time it in with near

778
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:43,279
Speaker 1: death experiences, the commonalities and religions, and I like to

779
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:47,239
Speaker 1: think that different religions are like different lamp shades, but

780
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:52,000
Speaker 1: there's one light. So that holds true to me. And

781
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:58,319
Speaker 1: then also studying near death experiences, many people when they

782
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 1: come back, they give up their traditional religion, agree with

783
00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:08,760
Speaker 1: the light, and they say the whole point is being loving,

784
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 1: being kind, being of service, and forgiveness. So to me,

785
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,480
Speaker 1: that gives me goosebumps. That resonates with our consciousness, and

786
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,600
Speaker 1: I love that we are connected right now, especially with

787
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:23,759
Speaker 1: everybody listening. Well, So I just wanted to mention that

788
00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:27,719
Speaker 1: because that holds true to me. And so I look

789
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:30,040
Speaker 1: forward to checking out your podcast and I'll say you're

790
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:30,680
Speaker 1: a substack.

791
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you, yeah, thank you so much for

792
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:35,520
Speaker 4: having me on the show and for all your listeners.

793
00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:37,640
Speaker 4: I think every single one of us who takes that

794
00:47:37,719 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 4: action like a mister Lee. I didn't actually say his name,

795
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:43,560
Speaker 4: but I wrote the story in my book, and so

796
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 4: I use that name. He's a Chinese gentleman who had

797
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:48,880
Speaker 4: the two daughters. If each one of us takes that

798
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 4: little small step to reconciling with someone that maybe we

799
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,759
Speaker 4: haven't spoken to for a while, or forgiving someone that

800
00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:59,479
Speaker 4: maybe we didn't think deserved it. That's one more step

801
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 4: towards a more loving world.

802
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:04,439
Speaker 1: Thank you. One last question. We have some people new

803
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:07,480
Speaker 1: to our show here in there here because a loved

804
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:11,160
Speaker 1: one has recently passed. You're experiencing the depths of grief.

805
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 1: What words would you give them?

806
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 4: I would say, just be with what is Grief is

807
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:26,080
Speaker 4: not something to be forced away or pushed away or oppressed.

808
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:28,719
Speaker 4: Let it come in waves. I was very close to

809
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 4: my dad when he died, and I remember the grief

810
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 4: would come in like a tsunami and it'd be overwhelming,

811
00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 4: and then after that I'd be okay. I'd be okay,

812
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 4: and then it would hit me again and it was

813
00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:45,040
Speaker 4: like another wave. So I would say, just let those

814
00:48:45,080 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 4: waves come and crash, and then eventually that pain won't

815
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 4: be as intense, and just trust that that will get quieter,

816
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:59,880
Speaker 4: and eventually, when the loudness of the grief starts to

817
00:48:59,880 --> 00:49:02,880
Speaker 4: go away, you'll start to hear love's quiet voice again

818
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:05,840
Speaker 4: and you'll connect with your loved one.

819
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:07,239
Speaker 3: I started to have many.

820
00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 4: Many dreams with my father, and I do sincerely feel that,

821
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:13,839
Speaker 4: as my book title shows, love does not know death,

822
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,440
Speaker 4: and I do believe that that love that we have

823
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 4: for our loved ones connects us with each other. And

824
00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 4: just because they don't have a body with vocal cords anymore,

825
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:27,720
Speaker 4: does not mean you can't still communicate with them. That's

826
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:30,960
Speaker 4: been my honest, true experience. So when the grief starts

827
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,040
Speaker 4: to fade away, you'll realize what was left is love

828
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 4: and that's been the only truth thing all along.

829
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:39,000
Speaker 1: And if we didn't make it to somebody's bedside before

830
00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: they passed, we can still forgive absolutely.

831
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:46,360
Speaker 4: Thank you for saying that that's one hundred percent true.

832
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:49,480
Speaker 1: Well, doctor Adam, thank you so much for being our

833
00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:50,400
Speaker 1: guest today.

834
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,239
Speaker 3: Thank you for having me Sandrew to you.

835
00:49:53,360 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 1: Just love doctor Adam, I sure do you know. He's

836
00:49:57,080 --> 00:49:59,960
Speaker 1: not the first physician that I've spoken with, but he's

837
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:03,440
Speaker 1: the first that I've spoken with with the underlying message

838
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:07,880
Speaker 1: of how important this life is, how important forgiveness is,

839
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:12,360
Speaker 1: and to see so many people pass and realize in

840
00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:15,680
Speaker 1: those final moments all there is is love and that

841
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:20,760
Speaker 1: need to be connected. If you enjoy hearing physicians stories,

842
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 1: you might want to go back to episode one thirty

843
00:50:23,719 --> 00:50:28,200
Speaker 1: six with doctor Scott Colebaba, who's the author of Physicians

844
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:32,720
Speaker 1: Untold Stories, All kinds of incredible things that have happened

845
00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:37,040
Speaker 1: in emergency rooms regarding the afterlife. Don't forget to come

846
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 1: visit me atwdotdie dot com at the bottom of the page.

847
00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:43,120
Speaker 1: If you want to enter your name and your email address,

848
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:46,200
Speaker 1: you get a copy of my book, some other goodies,

849
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 1: and every Sunday two pm New York time on zoom

850
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 1: I offer a free Sunday gathering inspirational service with medium

851
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:58,319
Speaker 1: demonstration included. So come meet me. It's pretty fun. More

852
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,560
Speaker 1: great things there at we Don't Die. So in closing,

853
00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:06,160
Speaker 1: I'm Sandra Champlain. Remember make each moment count because we

854
00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:08,879
Speaker 1: never know how many of them we have left. Thank

855
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:12,000
Speaker 1: you for listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the

856
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:17,040
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Paranormal podcast Network.

857
00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:25,319
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

858
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 2: a paranormal podcast network. Make sure and check out all

859
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:31,759
Speaker 2: our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going to

860
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:38,120
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio dot com.