1 00:00:01,880 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: Do you know what the J stands for? I've always 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:06,359 Speaker 1: been it feels like it's got to be like Jeremond 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: Judas Judas. Is that really what it is? Because that's no. 4 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,479 Speaker 1: I don't, I don't. I have no idea what it is. 5 00:00:12,840 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 1: I've no idea. I guess it's John or something like that. Chuckaboo, 6 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 1: that's what it is. How was your Majesty Edgar Hoover? John? 7 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 1: John would be told, passes n your majesty, your main son, 8 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:56,720 Speaker 1: Edgar Hoover, chips, yours mans, racist astost money, martial stuff. 9 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 1: I can't tell me. Yep, yep, yep. There it is. 10 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 1: There it is. Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to another phenomenal 11 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 1: episode of My Mama Told Me, the podcast where we 12 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: died deep, deep into the pockets of black conspiracy theories 13 00:01:15,880 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 1: and we finally worked to prove that Boris ko Joe 14 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: is the ugliest name for the most handsome man to 15 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 1: ever walk this planet. His parents knew that they had to. 16 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 1: They had to. Even amount they had, they couldn't messle 17 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,839 Speaker 1: around and give this man a name the something beautiful 18 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: like meadow lark. You know what I mean. You gotta 19 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 1: give someone that pretty a name that is also beautiful. 20 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: You give them something beautiful, it's basically gonna cause like 21 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 1: a wormhole to open up and we're all gonna get 22 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:47,960 Speaker 1: sucked into the pits of hell. It's not possible. So 23 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: thank you Mr and Mrs ko Joe for making the 24 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: sacrifice that none of us were brave enough to make. 25 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 1: This is the theory I'm spreading this week. It's pretty 26 00:01:57,680 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: much true. I think it's the most true thing I've 27 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 1: ever said anywhere. Always, I think, yeah, that makes sense. 28 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:07,000 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Thankstein Kern, and I'm rambling weird today. 29 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:10,239 Speaker 1: That's that's the energy I'm hitting you with. I don't know. 30 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 1: Talking's hard, and Buddy, I shouldn't have a podcast, but 31 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: I do. You know who is a good talker who 32 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: doesn't ramble? Funny? And and probably he is. He's got 33 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: all the words. He's a man who's well versed in 34 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 1: words and in both funny and otherwise. He's he's so funny. 35 00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 1: I've known him. I know him for a while. He's 36 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 1: a hilarious dude based out of New York, and he 37 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: has so much cool ship going on. He hasn't amazing. 38 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: He's on a show called Everything's trash on Freeform that's 39 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 1: coming out, and he has an amazing show on AMC 40 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:44,839 Speaker 1: called can we talk about this? So funny? You guys 41 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: are gonna love him. Please get it up for my guests. 42 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:52,919 Speaker 1: Mr Jordan's Carlos thank you. Yeah, all right, Helen. I 43 00:02:53,000 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 1: feel like I'm answering anything. The band thanks us, love 44 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 1: your roots. That other guy that's poor roots just this. 45 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: We only know two of them. And I said, yeah, 46 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 1: I always feel bad when people come out and they're like, 47 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 1: we love the roots, you know, with Quest Love and 48 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 1: uh Black Thought and the Brest. You can stop there. 49 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 1: You're stopping, yo, Man, that's been a minute. I'm proud 50 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: of all that you've done. I'm not happy for you 51 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 1: man doing it black Man successful. The feeling is mutual. 52 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 1: I'm so happy you're here. You've been hysterical for a 53 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: long time and you came to us with what I 54 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 1: think is a very hysterical conspiracy theory. It is it 55 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: is one that is it hysterical, hysterical license or it's 56 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:55,080 Speaker 1: really funny, too serious, dead as supers that one of 57 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: our only you know what I'm saying. It's haunting if true, 58 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 1: but it has it cannot not be funny. You said, 59 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 1: my mama told me Jack Hoover was black. Around my house, 60 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 1: we call him Jay Hoover, J who a little rock side, 61 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:25,279 Speaker 1: But it don't mean the same thing. Jay Hoover. Hoover 62 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 1: was definitely whover, definitely had a thing against black folks. 63 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 1: We know that all of the Lucas brothers do this 64 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 1: in the black masside. We thank him for that. But 65 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 1: I'm a Black History Month quiz Bowl champion. I knew that. 66 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 1: I knew that J. J. Hoover was was dirty to 67 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:46,359 Speaker 1: begin with, and gully and and and just gross disgusting. 68 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 1: But on I mean like he just couldn't sleep at 69 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 1: night thinking that black people were happy he was that 70 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 1: he was that guy. No, he he had a very 71 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:04,599 Speaker 1: h sick vendetta against against a few groups. I don't 72 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 1: want to make it so that black people are are 73 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: the only ones that he was targeting, because I think 74 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:12,599 Speaker 1: it's important that the acknowledge he hated a lot of folds. 75 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:16,640 Speaker 1: But boy, but boy, did he have a special taste 76 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 1: in his mouth. He really wanted nigga blood, and UH 77 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: worked real hard to get it exactly. But the thing 78 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 1: about it was, I mean, yes, a special taste for 79 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 1: it because it ran through his veins. Yes, and so okay, 80 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: hold on, wait a minute, I'm there to listen. Don't 81 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 1: let me ramble. Yeah, no, please please, I have so 82 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 1: many questions. Please go ahead, man, tell me for you 83 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: where where you first became aware of j Edgar Hoover 84 00:05:52,160 --> 00:06:01,840 Speaker 1: and his alleged black history. Just looking at this he 85 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:03,719 Speaker 1: looked like some of the deacons of the deacon board. 86 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,880 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, okay, he got Indian his family, 87 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,720 Speaker 1: you know, like, just looking at him, he's got the 88 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: ponce nez. We all got that one cousin who's got 89 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 1: the ponce nez, you know what I'm saying. And so 90 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: looking at him, the slick back hair, his skin, he 91 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 1: was always dark, right, he was always dark. And I 92 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: was like, let me, let me look it up. So 93 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 1: I said, google ja grew who were young. He looked 94 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: like my dad, you know what I'm saying, or at 95 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: least my grandfather. I mean, when you look at other 96 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 1: people that chose like he was. Okay. So the author 97 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 1: Gore Vidal. Gorvidal wrote books like Aaron Burr really great 98 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 1: author and uh public public intellect, things like that. In 99 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 1: the nineteen six season early nineteen seventy. So gore Vidal 100 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: grew up with Ja grew who Jo and he's in 101 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: d C. And he said, Gorvidal would embellishment. He's not 102 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 1: one to lie. And he said that everybody knew that 103 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,640 Speaker 1: the Hoovers passed for white. Yes, everybody knew it. Everybody 104 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:11,240 Speaker 1: knew it, and that grew up in d C. But 105 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: it's just like that was just like a rumor out there, 106 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, it was hard to make 107 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 1: the accusation because of the power of j Edgar Hoover. Yeah, 108 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: it's it's so funny because I I love that you 109 00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: brought up the the pictures, right that so many of 110 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: his pictures he sort of like looks oddly like a 111 00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:33,600 Speaker 1: a light skinned black person. And one of the things 112 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: that I felt in looking at a lot of his 113 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:39,679 Speaker 1: pictures is how much he benefited from like the black 114 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:44,120 Speaker 1: and white era of photographs, right that, Like, it has 115 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 1: to be intentional that we're not seeing color pictures of 116 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: this dude, because he's gonna be noticeably darker than all 117 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 1: of these other people he's like bossing around at these 118 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,040 Speaker 1: FBI tables, you know what I mean. Colored pictures of 119 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 1: this colored man, you're absolutely right now, you know, that 120 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 1: was my first that was my first inkling. I was like, 121 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: Corvidal knew that about him, and then there's that kind 122 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 1: of to me. I took that. I ran with it. 123 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: I was like, I know what it is to be 124 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: like to get over one's own internalized racism. Hm, you 125 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 1: know say I mean Jay gerber hooever never did. He 126 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: ated himself on a lot of levels. He was never 127 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: living his truth right, So he was closet and gay, right, 128 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: and so like he took it out of gaze and 129 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:28,320 Speaker 1: so he took it out on blacks and like all 130 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: the people that he had a beef with, that was 131 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 1: who he was. So that makes me know that like 132 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: all the more that that's that's what he was about. Man, 133 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So there's there's also no 134 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 1: schools named after Jehovah. There's none named after him, which 135 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:49,840 Speaker 1: tells me definitely black man, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, Yeah, 136 00:08:49,960 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 1: it's so funny because part of the reason I imagine 137 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:55,839 Speaker 1: that people aren't necessarily like eager to put his name 138 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: on things is despite the fact that he obviously was 139 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 1: a dick head, the black people dickheads probably too light 140 00:09:02,120 --> 00:09:05,360 Speaker 1: of a word he was. He was and a silly 141 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 1: billy too to the blacks in the days. But on 142 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,160 Speaker 1: top of that, he he was kind of known as 143 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: a as an asshole to everybody else. Like it wasn't 144 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: as if like everybody was like, yo, you know what 145 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:23,440 Speaker 1: funk with is j Edgar Hoover. You know who are 146 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:26,559 Speaker 1: really just like hanging out with is that motherfucker j 147 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 1: Edgar Hoover. He tells great jokes, I know. I mean 148 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:32,839 Speaker 1: he got rid of like people like John Dillinger, you 149 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, gangsters, the public enemies of the 150 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:37,199 Speaker 1: nineteen twenties and thirties, And it's like, you know what, 151 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,839 Speaker 1: they were fun fucking fun, and you know what, it 152 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 1: was white and black want to see him go away, 153 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:44,640 Speaker 1: but we didn't have the power at the time, you know. 154 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's not like John Dillinger like lining 155 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,760 Speaker 1: up with black folks to make Cooper go away, you know. 156 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 1: But but you know it's there were many people in 157 00:09:56,960 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: the race to that that that that did not like him. 158 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:02,800 Speaker 1: But there were many people in his cross hairs. And 159 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: the thing about it was, I think it just came 160 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 1: from his own lies about himself and the bs about himself. 161 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:12,559 Speaker 1: And he had a particular thing for Marcus Garvey and 162 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: the black show. Right, so he went to a point 163 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: like he made a name for himself in about nineteen 164 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 1: Come with me now you see me just pumped the 165 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:24,839 Speaker 1: glasses right there. You know you know what that is. 166 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: You know what that is. We're gonna go into deep, 167 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:30,679 Speaker 1: big facts, big facts, going into the big facts. Now, 168 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 1: Young j H was like, Okay, I'm here in d C. 169 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:36,280 Speaker 1: Is gonna be some got the yak. There's gonna be 170 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: some black black history real quick. He's trying to make 171 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 1: a name for himself. No problem, He's gonna make a 172 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,959 Speaker 1: name for himself in d C. And and I think 173 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: he was working at the time for you know, there 174 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: wasn't like a the FBI wasn't a thing yet, right, 175 00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 1: so that was not a thing, right, So, but he 176 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: was working in that version of what the historic from 177 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 1: that so so basically he had to make a name. 178 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 1: And so Marcus Garvey had kind of been on the 179 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 1: raidar of the government because he had the audacity, the 180 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: audacity to ship to ship black people from one place 181 00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: to the other, or black owned made products from one 182 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:20,199 Speaker 1: place to the other. It was like he was like, 183 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 1: what if we go back to where we come from? 184 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:26,559 Speaker 1: And white people were like, wait, adamn, We're gonna have 185 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:29,079 Speaker 1: to create a branch of the government to deal with 186 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: this motherfucker because that is not okay. He was an unwieldy, 187 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 1: unruly negro. I mean, Gary Cheft Garvey. I always loved 188 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: that one. Like he's just like he's in the back 189 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: of that car just looking. He was like a rap video, 190 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:48,839 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. He's got like this uniform on. 191 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: Never went war, never went to war, but he's got 192 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 1: like a general's hat on, and he knew what he 193 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: was like, you know what he's doing. You know he's 194 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: so he's stirring them white soup. He's stirring them white 195 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:00,599 Speaker 1: I'm sure some of them like, do we have to 196 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 1: call it black start? He's not a star to me. 197 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:09,920 Speaker 1: So white people got you know, they got shook, the 198 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 1: fragility of it all and so so so then Hoover 199 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: was like, I mean, man, right, he went so far. 200 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: So he had I remember the first agent that he 201 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,480 Speaker 1: employed because he couldn't go himself right totally? Could he could? 202 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 1: He totally could you've seen Dr Daniel Hall Williams. You've 203 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: seen Dr Charles Drew. I remember black his dry mother 204 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: to be like Dr Charles Drew Black History Month icon. 205 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: I'm like him, are you sure, doctors we can pull 206 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:50,840 Speaker 1: showing up the same way. Dr Janiel will is wider 207 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:55,199 Speaker 1: than Vermont dude. But like, you know, it's like so anyway, 208 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: he employed this one black man who's by the way, 209 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 1: his name was his middle name was Worm. Yeah, yeah, 210 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:05,839 Speaker 1: I don't know about Worm. Tell me more about this 211 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 1: Worm character. Nobody came to his funeral. Fun that guy 212 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:15,000 Speaker 1: so so he was so this Worm guy basically was 213 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 1: the first kind of like black FBI agent. He infiltrated 214 00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:24,880 Speaker 1: Garves operation and got them to you know, like basically 215 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: planted the seeds of mistrust within the organization and then 216 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:32,719 Speaker 1: went so far like so Hoover had him even do 217 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 1: things like sabotage, like throwing pieces like a junk and 218 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 1: metal into into the gas tanks of the Black Star 219 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:43,640 Speaker 1: Line ships. They wanted this nigga to fail. I mean, 220 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 1: that's not even Usually it's like observe and reports, right, 221 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:50,199 Speaker 1: that's that's like what the government's job is to do. 222 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 1: But they're like like Hoover was like, that's not enough. 223 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,719 Speaker 1: You're supposed to really use like time travel rules as 224 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: as the government, you know what I mean, Like you 225 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:02,599 Speaker 1: you look at it, but you don't funk with it. 226 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 1: And instead he was like, no, I'm gonna touch that almanac. 227 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna see what what I can build 228 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 1: from from burning down everything that this dude is trying 229 00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:16,520 Speaker 1: to build. Absolutely so he basically got garfy deported back 230 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: to Jamaica, ruined his ruined him and was able to 231 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: like use those closest to him to uh sabotage And 232 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:30,240 Speaker 1: that's what made a name. That's the made a name 233 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 1: for Jahoover, right I mean? And then he like, look, 234 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: you take the values of your take on the values 235 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: of your oppressor to hope for better treatment. You know 236 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 1: what I'm saying, Well, that's what I was gonna ask you, 237 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 1: is is And I'm just curious to hear your thoughts 238 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,440 Speaker 1: because you're clearly very well versed in your boy j Hoover. 239 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 1: Is how much of his behavior do you think was 240 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: like ingrained in him from the beginning that like, as 241 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 1: a family they just decide did we don't like niggas 242 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 1: and we're gonna do everything we can to be mean 243 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:07,080 Speaker 1: to them even though we are them. Or was this like, 244 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: oh you got some affirmation you gotta pat on your 245 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,440 Speaker 1: head from like how hard you went at Garvy and 246 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,400 Speaker 1: so now that's gonna be like your signature move, do 247 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:20,560 Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Most people that like because 248 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:24,960 Speaker 1: j Graver was never elected anything, he was a political 249 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: animal in d C. So he understood how to work things. 250 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 1: He understood like it's not about who knows you, it's 251 00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 1: it's you know who you know or whatever it is 252 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 1: the leaders of power. He understood how to work that. 253 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 1: He knew the game was not a game. But I 254 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 1: feel like what probably started with, like it can't just 255 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 1: be one thing, you know, I'm saying, there's a lot 256 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 1: in that in that gumbo. It's like he probably definitely 257 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: passed or didn't pass the doll test, you know when 258 00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: they give you the bad black doll and like so like, yeah, 259 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: you know it, I don't know that's I mean, are 260 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 1: you don't know that test? I don't think so. Bro, 261 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 1: you got a daughter, right, yeah, you need to be 262 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 1: putting some black dolls in that crib immediately. Oh, she 263 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: can't use their fingers yet, so it doesn't matter by 264 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 1: the time. By the time they are three, the messages 265 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:21,280 Speaker 1: have already they've already got the messages that black is bad. 266 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: So it's like a test where they present a white 267 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: doll and a black doll and then they're like, which 268 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: doll is a bad one? And then usually the person 269 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 1: administering the test is like, right, this one's names pretty naughty, Hoggins, 270 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: what did you say something? Did you say something crash SHANIQUEA. 271 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 1: This doll's cursing, Maybe don't pick that one. But the 272 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 1: worst part of the dolls test is that the kids 273 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:53,520 Speaker 1: make the connection. They're like, okay, so the black children 274 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 1: take the tests, they're like this black doll is is bad. 275 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 1: And then they're like, so, do you mean you're bad? 276 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 1: And then because you're black, and they're like, yeah, I'm bad. 277 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: So it's like by the yeah, man, So it's like, 278 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,880 Speaker 1: I think he didn't pass the doll test and we've 279 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 1: been paying for it ever since. So it was like 280 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 1: and he had this thing about like black people that 281 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:19,920 Speaker 1: were living their best lives he could not stand so 282 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 1: like Dr King, remember he like he was like Dr 283 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:27,680 Speaker 1: King because I mean, listen, Martin Luther the King right 284 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:31,440 Speaker 1: is a god and a great man. But yes he was. 285 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 1: He was loose with the dick and that's you know, 286 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 1: we know that. You know, we know that Jay Whover 287 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,440 Speaker 1: used that against him, you know, and I was like, 288 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:46,439 Speaker 1: that's why he was like king, You're yeah. It's one 289 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:48,520 Speaker 1: of the things that probably is going to be helpful 290 00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 1: for people to put this in context is that Jack 291 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,560 Speaker 1: or Hoover worked as sort of like the head of 292 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:59,200 Speaker 1: the quote unquote FBI then becoming the FBI for forty 293 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 1: seven years, so he spanned he spanned some black men's lifetime, 294 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 1: uh to fucking torment people, which meant that like he 295 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 1: really got his hands and a lot of ship there. 296 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 1: It wasn't just like, oh he had a couple of 297 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 1: big hits. He really was a part of of sort 298 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 1: of like the threat for so many generations of black 299 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: and brown people. Absolutely, so, I mean what he did 300 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 1: was like he just had a special I mean, let's 301 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: say he had a heart on you know what I'm saying. 302 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 1: He had a heart on floor. Any black lead on 303 00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:36,480 Speaker 1: the come up, and he took them all out, even 304 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 1: Sam Cook, like Sam like even took out Sam Cook 305 00:18:40,359 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: so so by like he's kind of the reason why 306 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:48,959 Speaker 1: there's a certain disenchantment or like a certain piece missing 307 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:52,160 Speaker 1: for I think Black people when it comes to like leadership, 308 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 1: were just like they killed a lot of leaders, you know, 309 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 1: they did it all in like five the tenure span, 310 00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:00,159 Speaker 1: and with that, it's just like a giant whole was 311 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:04,320 Speaker 1: left and Jack Hooper's stupid head is in the middle 312 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,879 Speaker 1: of that hole. So it's like, yeah, I feel like 313 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: he was just like grinning, like, yeah, I didn't. I 314 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:13,360 Speaker 1: do think it makes me think that that so much 315 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:16,920 Speaker 1: work could be done. Granted they've they've done horrific things 316 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,640 Speaker 1: for generations, even past Jigor Hoover, but so much work 317 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: could be done if the FBI even just took the 318 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: time to denounce some of the actions that he took 319 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:30,960 Speaker 1: during the time that he was sort of like their 320 00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:33,919 Speaker 1: quote unquote leader. That like if they just came up 321 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 1: and we're like, yo, no, lie, he was bugging are 322 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 1: bad on that one? That wasn't exactly how we run things. 323 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:44,760 Speaker 1: But instead they go, Nope, great man, flawless figure, nothing 324 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:48,200 Speaker 1: to talk about, and we move forward. And it's like, 325 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,360 Speaker 1: oh no, man, you can't write these like every year 326 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 1: the fucking the Twitter for the FBI is like, we 327 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:56,600 Speaker 1: missed you, Martin Luther King, and it's like you don't 328 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,440 Speaker 1: get to do that because you know you won't. You 329 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: won't can say what what actually happened? Well, of course 330 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: they miss him. They used to bug his hotels and 331 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:11,680 Speaker 1: just like they love I mean, listen, the day King died, 332 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:16,920 Speaker 1: he sent Coretta like this insane tape with all like 333 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 1: just like like bedroom noises of King whatever, like that's 334 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 1: what that's how that nigga said. And then right and 335 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 1: then before that, he said in a letter to King 336 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: saying he should kill himself that like obviously Coretta read 337 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,159 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Like he was just like 338 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,200 Speaker 1: I was like, what, don't you have anything else to do? Man? 339 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:42,920 Speaker 1: Are there any other crises in the Country's like no, 340 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 1: the Negro, the Negro, like the black Messiah will come 341 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:50,199 Speaker 1: and just like he'll take us, Hoba. We're only one 342 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: in ten of the people in the United States. But 343 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: what huh you know for him to be sitting there, 344 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:03,520 Speaker 1: He's like, damn, Martin, I hope this let him finds you. Well, 345 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: maybe you should kill yourself. I don't know. Yeah, have 346 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 1: you ever thought about it? It says. It starts King. 347 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:18,439 Speaker 1: It's like King, you are an animal saving your breakfast. 348 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:23,080 Speaker 1: You're like Jesus Christ. I would even say again, I 349 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:25,359 Speaker 1: have I think I have a sixth sense of humor. 350 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,879 Speaker 1: There is a fun there's a part of me that 351 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 1: has so much fun with antiquated racism. Like that people 352 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:36,879 Speaker 1: felt comfortable saying at a certain point that we've now 353 00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:40,920 Speaker 1: like socialized out that they probably so actively believe. But 354 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:44,239 Speaker 1: like you, you don't say it, like calling somebody an 355 00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:49,720 Speaker 1: animal is so fucking funny of being like you, you animal, 356 00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:55,200 Speaker 1: You fucking animals, you fucking savages. And I love it 357 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: so much. And for those reasons, I know he wasn't. 358 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:05,520 Speaker 1: I don't know why. And if you do all the 359 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:09,240 Speaker 1: man you can clearly say, I mean, okay, that's those 360 00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 1: are some trap moves. Though. That's some trap nigger ship. 361 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 1: When you're telling somebody to kill themselves in a battle, Yeah, 362 00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 1: that's some that's some nigorous ship. He behaved in a 363 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:22,639 Speaker 1: way that was too passionate for him not to have 364 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: personal steaks in this fight. Absolutely that it can't be 365 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: just you acting completely for your job. Nobody cares that 366 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 1: much about protecting the produce at target. Do you know 367 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,880 Speaker 1: what I mean? Like you're doing a thing that has 368 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,159 Speaker 1: to be personal for you. And so yeah, it was 369 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:45,399 Speaker 1: also above and beyond. This is how I knew he 370 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 1: was not white, right, So like he when he and 371 00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: like he had this thing was like in the nineteen 372 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 1: thirties excuse my nineteen thirties impression voice, where he's like, hey, 373 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:58,640 Speaker 1: junior g man, today they're gonna be a man man. 374 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 1: He was like, he was like, we get we get 375 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 1: the best in the brightest, Why the tallest, you know, 376 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,719 Speaker 1: the fattest, the tallest, the best, like and they all 377 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 1: it was just over six ft tall. You had to 378 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,359 Speaker 1: be white, over six ft tall, and and have like 379 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 1: a high school grad like a high school degree. But 380 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: they all look like male models. So I was like, 381 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 1: this guy is just doing rose ceremonies. Yeah, he just 382 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:24,400 Speaker 1: wants he wants boys to look at you know, he's 383 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:28,080 Speaker 1: just collecting buff boys to be his his special team 384 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:31,919 Speaker 1: of buff boys. That which is fine, Which is fine 385 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,800 Speaker 1: as long as you're honest about what you're doing. He wasn't, 386 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:38,879 Speaker 1: you know, Like yeah, so like you just saying you 387 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,680 Speaker 1: just saying I'm collecting buff boys. I enjoy buff boys 388 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,119 Speaker 1: and also, if you enjoy killing black leaders, you and 389 00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:48,600 Speaker 1: you can be a part of that and they'll be like, yeah, 390 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:51,200 Speaker 1: it's it's not like people are gonna be like what 391 00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:54,400 Speaker 1: the funk. They'll be like, yeah, that sounds pretty cool 392 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 1: to me. I'll be a buff boy, yo, man, I'm 393 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: gonna tell you something. I actually got to interview a 394 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: guy that worked side by side of Jacker Hoover, whoa 395 00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 1: yeah yeah yeah. So like I was like, was he 396 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,119 Speaker 1: ever late? And he was like, that's strange. He was 397 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:15,320 Speaker 1: five to ten minutes late sometimes at work. Was see 398 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:24,960 Speaker 1: black already thought that that was gonna go somewhere like 399 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:33,240 Speaker 1: super insightful and indeed, nope, black black. He was like, no, 400 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,959 Speaker 1: Hoover was very good to his black employees. He shook 401 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: his hand, the hand of his driver, and it's made. 402 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: And I was like, my man, my man, my man. 403 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:47,800 Speaker 1: Ah yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, you don't know what good is. 404 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: And that's that's the different thing that we got to 405 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:54,919 Speaker 1: work out. Yeah, but I'm convinced, bro, I'm convinced. I'm 406 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 1: just saying I can't be all right, Well, this is 407 00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:59,359 Speaker 1: this is some heavy ship. You've got some girl insight. 408 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 1: We're gonna say a break. We'll be back with more, 409 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 1: Jordan Carlos and more. My mama told me we are 410 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 1: that passes into the man shoots it and boom goes 411 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:25,600 Speaker 1: to dynamite. We're back, Carlos. We're still talking about j 412 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 1: Edgar Hoover and and the possibility, the real possibility that 413 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 1: he was a black man, a black man who hated 414 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,240 Speaker 1: being a black man and and thus punished other black man, 415 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 1: a real, a real six cycle happening, and that Fuco said, Okay, 416 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,120 Speaker 1: let's jump into some of this research because and you've 417 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 1: already covered a fair amount of it is and you've 418 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 1: hit a lot of the important points. But Jagger Hoover, 419 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:57,360 Speaker 1: he's the head of the FBI for forty seven years. 420 00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,040 Speaker 1: He's best known for his efforts to number one and 421 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 1: take down black people, Number two take down the Gaze, 422 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,920 Speaker 1: and number three takedown communists, and he often sort of 423 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:11,720 Speaker 1: leveraged the three of them against each other as a 424 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: way of conflating and capitalizing on whatever he wanted from 425 00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 1: that group. Amongst his greatest hits of ship that he 426 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:26,400 Speaker 1: did Marcus Garvey's Black Star line, which he was able 427 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 1: to sabotage. He also famously launched Cointel pro uh, the 428 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:35,200 Speaker 1: FBI's counter intelligence program where leaders of the civil rights 429 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 1: groups such as the Black Panther Party were gunned down 430 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,159 Speaker 1: with FBI involvement, and most famously and you hit this, 431 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:43,879 Speaker 1: he was the person who greenlit the raids and the 432 00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:49,119 Speaker 1: ultimate assassination of Martin Luther King Jr. Yeah. Yeah, So 433 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: a lot of classics under his belt. You know, great, great, 434 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 1: great guy always invited to the cook out. I feel like, yeah, man, 435 00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: And he also we don't talk about brother Malcolm, but 436 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,800 Speaker 1: he also like so Bumpy Smalls was protecting Malcolm in 437 00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:09,639 Speaker 1: the final days after like Malcolm wild out and said, like, 438 00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,240 Speaker 1: you know, Elijah, remember when he was on TV, said 439 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:19,479 Speaker 1: Elijah Mohammed, babies different women, I love, I love your 440 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:30,760 Speaker 1: soldier boy interpretation. Elijah mommed, well, I know that the 441 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,879 Speaker 1: FBI was like they had an FBI informant in his protection, 442 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,520 Speaker 1: so they'd actually they'd actually infiltrateed so like I mean, like, 443 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,399 Speaker 1: but they were mad at the guy that had infiltrated 444 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,920 Speaker 1: because he tried to save Malcolm's life after he was 445 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 1: shot Mountain. They were like, what are you doing? What 446 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:53,399 Speaker 1: are you doing? Shame? Say what you do? You suck 447 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: to win out of him. Those chess compressions gonna stay 448 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:03,160 Speaker 1: in this man, Are you crazy? Any one of those 449 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:05,880 Speaker 1: forty bullets we pumped in him might have popped out 450 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:10,160 Speaker 1: and he could have kept living. Are you fucking psychopathic? 451 00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:12,920 Speaker 1: He couldn't have helped him. You you killed him good, 452 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:17,160 Speaker 1: You killed him, real good, real good. But yeah, man, 453 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:19,879 Speaker 1: I mean, I just didn't want that hit not not 454 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:24,120 Speaker 1: to go. Uh notice, I think I think that's totally fair. 455 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:26,399 Speaker 1: You're right to have brought it up. And and I 456 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: will say that despite all of that, j Edgar Hoover's 457 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:34,080 Speaker 1: greatest scandal was not so much as racist and at 458 00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:37,120 Speaker 1: least according to white history, but it was actually, as 459 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:42,120 Speaker 1: you mentioned, his closeted homosexuality and cross dressing, that those 460 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 1: were the things that were sort of like most famously 461 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 1: associated with him. And I have to assume that some 462 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:51,560 Speaker 1: of the I don't even know if it's the correct 463 00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: term anymore, but the quote unquote cross dressing may not 464 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:58,400 Speaker 1: have even been a thing that they could as much prove, 465 00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 1: but a thing that they keep us him up because 466 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:05,520 Speaker 1: of his closeted background and just people fucking with his 467 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: his name as it were, Well, yeah, absolutely, I mean 468 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 1: they want to. I mean it's more or less about 469 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:19,080 Speaker 1: like homophobia and and leveraging homophobia at at Jagger Hoover's legacy. 470 00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:22,280 Speaker 1: But in the first place, I mean if he was, 471 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 1: if he was queer, which it looks like he was, 472 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 1: then you know, because he lived with his driver, Clif Tolson, 473 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:30,880 Speaker 1: and CLIs Toulsen was the one that like he left 474 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 1: everything his estate to him. And what I think it 475 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 1: points out is that to be gay at the time 476 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 1: was to be hunted, right and like, but he did 477 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 1: know he could have done so much for people like himself, 478 00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:50,320 Speaker 1: but instead it was like, listen, we're gonna be like 479 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: it's like equality for me, but not for anybody else, 480 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: you know, yes, yes, And so in these kind of 481 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:01,280 Speaker 1: lavender scares of the nineteen fifties where they purged, you know, 482 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 1: purge government of this threat that that basically what it 483 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 1: was was the thought was that queer people could be 484 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 1: leveraged by communists because of their their sexual identity, and 485 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:16,479 Speaker 1: so that they were, they would they would be compromised, right, 486 00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 1: so they would be compromised. And whoever thought that about gays, 487 00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 1: what he thought about black people was they also could 488 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 1: be easily compromised because they worked too smart in the head. 489 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: So that's why people like people like Paul Robeson or W. E. B. 490 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: Two boys like who were actually communists, like he, he 491 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:40,120 Speaker 1: felt that they were. He almost pitied black people because 492 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 1: he thought they could have no original thought on their own. 493 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 1: But they were easily swayed. And we see it today 494 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,360 Speaker 1: where it's like you'll you'll see like, oh, like BLM 495 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:52,760 Speaker 1: is just a Marxist organization. They're they're easily swayed by 496 00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:57,400 Speaker 1: the Marxist people are like, nah, you know a lot 497 00:30:57,440 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 1: of folks in America don't even know what the fund 498 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,920 Speaker 1: Marx is. You know what I'm saying, We're just trying 499 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: to not get shot nigger. When we go to the story, 500 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: how I'm not being swayed, I'm just asking you not 501 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 1: to kill me. I think you're you're mixing those two. 502 00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:17,240 Speaker 1: But yeah, lengthen I'm gonna tell you something wild today 503 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 1: like that. That's that's that's the insanity of the police state. Right. So, 504 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 1: like back in the day violence, I mean, like in 505 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 1: the nineteenth century all the way up to the early 506 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 1: nineteen eighties, like there was kind of more like white 507 00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: mob violence. You know what I'm saying. So it's like 508 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,160 Speaker 1: worried about being in a neighborhood and a white mob 509 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 1: would get you. Now now that it's been we've we've 510 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: taken the time to organize that and that's just the 511 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 1: police's business. So like I remember this morning, I was 512 00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:44,960 Speaker 1: walking my dog and uh, this is crazy. This dude 513 00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,840 Speaker 1: came through. And I live in a nice neighborhood. So like, 514 00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:53,200 Speaker 1: so I was offended, but this guy came It's it's 515 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: the it's the time of the craziest. So he came through. 516 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 1: He had a spear like something a gladiator would have. 517 00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 1: It was a three spear, yeah, with a double edged spear. 518 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 1: And I was like, good morning, haven't had my coffee. 519 00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,520 Speaker 1: And my man is just like kind of walking hard, 520 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 1: trying to break into cars. And I'm with a spear. 521 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,800 Speaker 1: Well he's got the spear, but he's trying cars. He's 522 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:17,760 Speaker 1: just trying. The spear is just his spear that he carries. 523 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 1: His hands are the ones that are Okay, I got you. 524 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: So I'm like with my dog and I'm like, you know, 525 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 1: I'm having a little New York man, and I'm like 526 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 1: should I call this in absolutely so, so like I 527 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:33,920 Speaker 1: call the cops. I'm literally describing myself. So then we 528 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: so I had to hang out in the dog park. 529 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:43,120 Speaker 1: Well they looked for this motherfucker because I'm literally I'm like, yeah, okay, 530 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 1: So he had black hoodieo on. You know what I'm saying, 531 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:50,720 Speaker 1: black jacket. Uh, he had Adda's pants on and some 532 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: like classic Jordan's I'm like, ship Nick, I'm wearing the 533 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,720 Speaker 1: same thing. I love the idea that they that you 534 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:00,480 Speaker 1: had to go as far out of your way as possible, 535 00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:04,800 Speaker 1: do not accidentally call this man a spirit chucker, and 536 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 1: that that to me speaks heroics. Thank you, thank you. 537 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 1: I was it was a little trauma in the morning 538 00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:16,640 Speaker 1: before I had my coffee. But I was like, oh 539 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: my god, oh my god. But I realized, you know, 540 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 1: I can't call the cops. I might as well just 541 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: getting the cruiser myself. So right anyway, that I don't 542 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: know where I was going with that story, well, but 543 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:37,320 Speaker 1: is wild. I do think that that some of what 544 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 1: j Edgar Hoover did is not often sort of like communicated, 545 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:46,560 Speaker 1: in that he helped to create a culture that's bigger 546 00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:50,000 Speaker 1: than the actual like choices that he made. Right that 547 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: like so much of our our understanding of the current 548 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:58,400 Speaker 1: police state. It's the ship he helped cook up in 549 00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:02,840 Speaker 1: his early efforts to sort of like sabotage, to manage 550 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 1: to play these fucking weird mind games with our leaders. 551 00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:09,600 Speaker 1: And so it isn't just limited to like, oh, he 552 00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 1: killed a dude and he was mean to these other ones. 553 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:16,240 Speaker 1: It's truly like now, he created the system that fox 554 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:20,040 Speaker 1: with us today. He absolutely and he created a system 555 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,880 Speaker 1: good guys, bad guys, right, because in the nineteen thirties, 556 00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 1: our heroes were like Bonnie and Clyde, John Dillager, al Capone, Right, 557 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:31,640 Speaker 1: these were anti heroes because people were on their back 558 00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:35,760 Speaker 1: in the Great Depression. But he, you know, he busted 559 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: all these people, and he wanted people to feel that 560 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 1: there was a fight against darkness, was light and dark, 561 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:47,360 Speaker 1: and like that's I think been the kind of like 562 00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: that's been a constant theme throughout our history up up 563 00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 1: until this point. You know, it's like it's those that 564 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:55,800 Speaker 1: are yeah, those that are on one side of the 565 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,319 Speaker 1: gun or the other. That's totally fair. And you talked 566 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,400 Speaker 1: a little bit about like the you obviously Gore Fidal 567 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,720 Speaker 1: talks a ton about how he grew up around the family, 568 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,160 Speaker 1: the Hoover family, and everybody understood them to be quote 569 00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:11,479 Speaker 1: unquote mulatto, which was obviously the term that they used 570 00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:16,160 Speaker 1: at the time. Similarly, author Anthony Samuels he has similar 571 00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:19,360 Speaker 1: claims from families on the East Coast who all believed 572 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,799 Speaker 1: Edgar had black roots and even referred to him as 573 00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:30,920 Speaker 1: soul brother. Soul Brother was apparently JEdgar Hoover's nickname, I assume, 574 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 1: not affectionately. I don't like brother, you got it. It 575 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: was more like a soul brother. And he'd get angry 576 00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,000 Speaker 1: and storm off. Absolutely, they'd be like, so, brother, take 577 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:50,440 Speaker 1: the service. Interests my shoes, I don't show you. Why 578 00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:55,000 Speaker 1: did they talk like that? But there was even one 579 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:57,719 Speaker 1: relative I've ever seen this documentary about Jacob and it 580 00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 1: was like one black relative that was like this woman 581 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:03,759 Speaker 1: that says she was related to JACKO. Hoover, that said 582 00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:06,560 Speaker 1: she wrote a book about it, and she said, we 583 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:11,240 Speaker 1: have a very powerful cousin. Yeah. D c. Millie McGhee, 584 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:16,239 Speaker 1: yeah mcge Llie McGee claims she she grew up in Mississippi, 585 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: and she said in the late nineteen fifties, that's a 586 00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 1: young girl growing up in rural McComb, Mississippi. A story 587 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:25,279 Speaker 1: had been passed down through several generations that the land 588 00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:27,480 Speaker 1: that they lived on was owned by the Hoover family 589 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,719 Speaker 1: and that their grandfather said that they that Edgar was 590 00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 1: his second cousin and was passing for white, and yeah, 591 00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:38,200 Speaker 1: he was this powerful cousin that they had, but they 592 00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,600 Speaker 1: were so afraid to talk about it because he would 593 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 1: potentially seek vengeance and kill them. That that they lived 594 00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:48,920 Speaker 1: under threat of violence because of the possibility of airing 595 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:52,240 Speaker 1: out that he is a black man. See, that wouldn't 596 00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:56,120 Speaker 1: be me. I come up to the scrib In DC, like, 597 00:36:56,239 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 1: what's up? Cause yo at start down the Oh my god, 598 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:12,280 Speaker 1: it's me million all the way from Mississippi. Brother. Brother, 599 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,839 Speaker 1: don't act like you don't know me. Now, don't act 600 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,680 Speaker 1: like you don't know me. Don't act like you don't 601 00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:25,160 Speaker 1: know because it's so funny. But I just feel that way, man, 602 00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:27,320 Speaker 1: because so many people were like that. Like if you 603 00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:30,520 Speaker 1: think about like roy Cohne, who's who was a famous lawyer. 604 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 1: They worked with Senator McCarthy and the McCarthy is um right, 605 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:39,560 Speaker 1: So he roy Cone sent Judith and at the Rosenberg 606 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,680 Speaker 1: to the gas chamber for treason yes, right, so at 607 00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:46,400 Speaker 1: the time, like he did that, but like he also 608 00:37:47,080 --> 00:37:49,959 Speaker 1: exposed people during the Communist scare and the Lavender Scare. 609 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:51,959 Speaker 1: He was big in the lavender scare. But Roy Cohen 610 00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: himself was gay, So he ruined the lives of millions 611 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:59,839 Speaker 1: of Americans who were in like civil service jobs, knowing 612 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 1: full well he was gay, right, right, But he's willing 613 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,759 Speaker 1: to He's in that weird zone where it's like, I mean, 614 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:09,440 Speaker 1: and I hate to slip down this whole, but a 615 00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,719 Speaker 1: lot of people that like you, you know, like in slavery, 616 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,080 Speaker 1: like you you give up your humanity and hopes of 617 00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:18,359 Speaker 1: better like the kind of like the house negro thing, 618 00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:20,800 Speaker 1: you give up your humanity and hopes of better treatment. 619 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,239 Speaker 1: Oh you sick, No, we all sick, boss like and 620 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:26,520 Speaker 1: that kind of thing. That kind of thing. I think 621 00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:29,080 Speaker 1: that makes perfect sense. And I think in a in 622 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,680 Speaker 1: a very you know, if we really wanted to explore 623 00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:35,160 Speaker 1: this in terms of what it actually means, it just 624 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:39,640 Speaker 1: shows the way that white supremacism sort of like seeps 625 00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:45,440 Speaker 1: into every facet of American culture and experience, right that, 626 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:49,880 Speaker 1: like I think that hurting my own kind will be 627 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:54,040 Speaker 1: my salvation. That doesn't make me a hero, but it 628 00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:58,400 Speaker 1: definitely makes it a more complicated, I guess villain than 629 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:00,440 Speaker 1: we would want it to be. This is just this 630 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,759 Speaker 1: person waking up with like deep seated hatred in their heart. 631 00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:08,920 Speaker 1: It truly is them thinking, Okay, if this means my survival, 632 00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,880 Speaker 1: I will learn to hate the people who move and 633 00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:15,040 Speaker 1: look like I do. Absolutely, and that's why I vote 634 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:21,400 Speaker 1: Republican there, you know, to save me, save me, you know, 635 00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:33,640 Speaker 1: That's what Candaswe is my best friends. I always feel 636 00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:35,880 Speaker 1: like because I went to private school and I'm just 637 00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:37,640 Speaker 1: making up for lost time. I'm now on a kind 638 00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,359 Speaker 1: of like a rehabilitation program, just like trusting my own people, 639 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 1: loving my own people, love myself. That's usually what it is. 640 00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:44,640 Speaker 1: Because I went KME through twelve. Then I went to 641 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,000 Speaker 1: private college, and then I was like I was just 642 00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:50,239 Speaker 1: trying to get like jobs, like kind of like trying 643 00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,200 Speaker 1: to be like the token this and that on the show, 644 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:53,880 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. And then I was like, 645 00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,759 Speaker 1: because I was actually what happened was I had deep 646 00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:59,800 Speaker 1: seated racism, and so when I gave that up, so 647 00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:01,680 Speaker 1: are working with people like Larry one more and everything 648 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,839 Speaker 1: like that, everything changed in my life you know, like, yeah, 649 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:07,400 Speaker 1: I still got a white wife. But you know what 650 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 1: I'm saying, Hey, we can't all be perfect, you know perfect. 651 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:14,560 Speaker 1: I mean that that came before. You know what I'm 652 00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:18,480 Speaker 1: but my kids are Dan brown, you know, like it's 653 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:22,320 Speaker 1: it's it's good. I'm doing what I can. Man. I 654 00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,400 Speaker 1: think you talked a little bit about sort of the 655 00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 1: Republicans and it it reminds me that I read an 656 00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:31,080 Speaker 1: article that talked about, you know, jed Ger Hoover has 657 00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:35,480 Speaker 1: his own film. Leo DiCaprio plays Jedger Hoover in the 658 00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:38,480 Speaker 1: Clint Eastwood portrayal of him, and one of the things 659 00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,400 Speaker 1: that the article talked about is that it delves heavily 660 00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:46,960 Speaker 1: this film into his closeted homosexuality, but conveniently skips over 661 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:49,440 Speaker 1: his race. And one of the things that came to 662 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:53,359 Speaker 1: mind as they they sort of addressed that is how 663 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:58,040 Speaker 1: it's probably a lot easier still even today, for white 664 00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:02,759 Speaker 1: people to see him as saying but complex if he's closeted, 665 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,880 Speaker 1: but much more challenging for them to have that same 666 00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:09,600 Speaker 1: sort of sense of his sanity and reasoning if he 667 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:14,759 Speaker 1: is a a person struggling with his racial identity. M 668 00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 1: because I don't think people, not a lot of white 669 00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 1: people understand that, you know what I'm saying, because they don't, 670 00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:20,640 Speaker 1: you know, as they in their own words, they don't 671 00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,759 Speaker 1: have a culture. So look, you know, like they might 672 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 1: not understand what it's like to like they're like black 673 00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:28,920 Speaker 1: people haven't fine in this country, but they would never 674 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,520 Speaker 1: change places with them. And so yeah, so the thought 675 00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:37,120 Speaker 1: is that you know, Hoover was like suffering from that, 676 00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:39,360 Speaker 1: you know, like probably because he was a man of 677 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,960 Speaker 1: secrets too. If your whole life is just like secrets 678 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,240 Speaker 1: and you got shit on everybody, he has shot JFK. 679 00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:53,680 Speaker 1: He knew about like l b J's, b J's, you know, everybody, everybody, 680 00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:56,880 Speaker 1: then you don't trust anybody, sure as hell, don't trust yourself. 681 00:41:57,600 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 1: And it's like I think that kind of toxic cocktail, 682 00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:04,400 Speaker 1: you know, like there's no way he would have ever 683 00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:07,080 Speaker 1: come out as someone like a man of color like 684 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:09,719 Speaker 1: been you know, like really lived his truth and would 685 00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: present it to his dying day that he was white 686 00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:17,080 Speaker 1: and trusted that he knew, he knew his demo in 687 00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,200 Speaker 1: his audience, He knew that his legacy would be like 688 00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:23,279 Speaker 1: if anything okay, then they'll probably say I'm you know, 689 00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:27,560 Speaker 1: gay for for Clive Toulson, and they won't say anything 690 00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,200 Speaker 1: else about me being black because people can't handle that ship. 691 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:34,080 Speaker 1: You know. Yeah, I think that's exactly right. He truly 692 00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:37,120 Speaker 1: was like, and I think we continue to we the 693 00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:40,319 Speaker 1: royal we, the white devil continues to sort of pick 694 00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:44,960 Speaker 1: and choose what is conveniently okay for us to discover 695 00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:48,080 Speaker 1: about people and not. And it reminds me. We did 696 00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:52,400 Speaker 1: a mini episode about all of the various US presidents 697 00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:58,279 Speaker 1: who have been accused and are proven to have come Yeah, 698 00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:05,680 Speaker 1: it makes it you nigger, But they've been they've been 699 00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,120 Speaker 1: sort of like, uh, they've they've been aired out as 700 00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:13,439 Speaker 1: as black and or brown people or secretly having black 701 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:17,560 Speaker 1: brown lineage. And they're six of them outside obviously of Obama, 702 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:19,960 Speaker 1: who you know is the first one who came forward 703 00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:24,360 Speaker 1: and said it. But there's Thomas Jefferson, There's Abraham Lincoln, apparently, 704 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:29,200 Speaker 1: Calvin Coolidge, Warren Harding, Dwight Alas Eisenhower in my personal favorite, 705 00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:36,320 Speaker 1: Andrew Jackson apparently comes definitely. But that's it's it's that 706 00:43:36,800 --> 00:43:39,160 Speaker 1: right where it's like you have all of these people 707 00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:46,760 Speaker 1: who his last name was Jackson, like Samuel l like Samuel, 708 00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:49,960 Speaker 1: you know, come on now, just saying you want to 709 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,799 Speaker 1: see I want to see a portrait of his granddaddy. 710 00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:56,040 Speaker 1: You know. But that's the thing, right, is that, like, truly, 711 00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:59,240 Speaker 1: I think it was that his grandfather was a black 712 00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:03,600 Speaker 1: man and like and they could not deal with that, 713 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:06,080 Speaker 1: and they refused to deal with that to this day. 714 00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:09,640 Speaker 1: And how healing might that be for a lot of 715 00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:13,200 Speaker 1: generations to know that that Andrew Jackson, who spent his 716 00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:18,440 Speaker 1: entire career doing horrible, malicious things to Native Americans and 717 00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:20,720 Speaker 1: black people and all kinds of people in this country, 718 00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:23,480 Speaker 1: was doing it out of a type of self hatred 719 00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:28,319 Speaker 1: and not just like an empowered position as a white 720 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,560 Speaker 1: man doing white man ship in front of all his 721 00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:34,840 Speaker 1: other white friends. Right, he went extra sauce with it. 722 00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:36,880 Speaker 1: So that's what I'm saying. It's like, when you go 723 00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,719 Speaker 1: extra sauce, there's there's a chance that you just might 724 00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:46,359 Speaker 1: be what you hate. So you're saying, when I put 725 00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:51,600 Speaker 1: extra a one sauce on misteak, I might be a one. Absolutely, 726 00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:55,160 Speaker 1: it's gonna hit you right here right here. You wander 727 00:44:55,200 --> 00:45:03,279 Speaker 1: that extra guak you got. I love this, Jordan's this 728 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:06,000 Speaker 1: is great this is this is a great conversation. We 729 00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:07,960 Speaker 1: I think we nailed it. I think we did all 730 00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: the things. Could you tell that you've almost finished your 731 00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,360 Speaker 1: your drink, which is very exciting. Oh, we can always 732 00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,960 Speaker 1: get more. Now, you don't have to get more, not 733 00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:18,719 Speaker 1: on my account. Now, if you want to get drunk 734 00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:21,480 Speaker 1: while your kids are sleeping, that's a personal choice. Don't 735 00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:24,920 Speaker 1: make it my defication. I mean, I'm a great dad. 736 00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:26,840 Speaker 1: Never while they're awake, you know what, I'm sorry, Like, 737 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,800 Speaker 1: just yeah, they just wait till their sleep, then you 738 00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:39,279 Speaker 1: go in their room and yeah, that's a good dad ship. 739 00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:42,200 Speaker 1: You know me too well, sir. Could you tell the 740 00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,600 Speaker 1: people at home where they can find you and what 741 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,799 Speaker 1: you have going on? Absolutely, you can find me at 742 00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:50,520 Speaker 1: Jordan carloson Twitter. You can find me the realer Jordan 743 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:54,040 Speaker 1: Carlos on Instagram, not like those fake ones. You know 744 00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:57,160 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. So those are great. Also, please once 745 00:45:57,239 --> 00:46:01,359 Speaker 1: once again, my show premiers in July, and that's that's 746 00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:04,839 Speaker 1: Everything's trash. It'll be on free Form and Hulu. Really 747 00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:06,920 Speaker 1: excited about that, and then you can catch me on 748 00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:09,719 Speaker 1: AMC Plus. Can we talk about this which is also 749 00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:11,759 Speaker 1: in the sun. That's channel really excited about that and 750 00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:13,640 Speaker 1: LANs you gotta come on and be my guest on that, man, 751 00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:17,040 Speaker 1: I would love that. That sounds amazing. So yeah, please 752 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:19,279 Speaker 1: go check out all of that stuff for Jordan's and 753 00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:21,759 Speaker 1: follow him, and as always, you can follow me at 754 00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:25,000 Speaker 1: lankson Kerman and please subscribe to all the bullshit that 755 00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:28,279 Speaker 1: you're supposed to do the podcast so that we get 756 00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:30,840 Speaker 1: people to hear about this motherfucker. And I'm not just 757 00:46:30,920 --> 00:46:33,680 Speaker 1: speaking into a void. Huh. That wouldn't that be nice 758 00:46:33,719 --> 00:46:37,239 Speaker 1: if we can make this not avoid for everybody's experience. 759 00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:43,600 Speaker 1: I'm sure it's not. Man. Listen, you're beloved. People love you. Man. 760 00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:51,040 Speaker 1: I saw you have sex with that lady on I 761 00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:53,200 Speaker 1: thought you have sex with that lady. You're doing fine 762 00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:59,799 Speaker 1: well man, we didn't this. This was a fun one 763 00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:08,000 Speaker 1: by bitch because of the brons my crop chips in 764 00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:16,840 Speaker 1: your hands, Uncola bears are racist. They also player olsing 765 00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:22,120 Speaker 1: the money rsions and many turney stuff. I can't tell 766 00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:25,640 Speaker 1: me noth