1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff you should know front House Stuff Works 2 00:00:04,320 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: There's Charles w. Chuck Bryant. Jerry's over there too, So 4 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:23,600 Speaker 1: this is you should know. How you doing come fine? 5 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: How are you doing good? You know this one? Um, 6 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: we did a podcast in June twelve, Should we have 7 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: a fat tax? Sure? I remember that was now that 8 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 1: I look at the timeline of uh and I'm sure 9 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:42,160 Speaker 1: we'll cover this now about Mayor Bloomberg in New York 10 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:45,559 Speaker 1: in twelve. That was in May when he wanted to 11 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,440 Speaker 1: ban the sale of soft drinks over sixteen ounces in 12 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: New York City. Uh. And we released in June twelve, 13 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: So that had to have been the impetus, right, Uh, baby, 14 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: it was probably something to do with it. But the 15 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: difference with his two thousand and twelve push was that, um, 16 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 1: he was just trying to ban it. There was no tax. 17 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: It was correct. You can't have this tubs, you know, Yeah, 18 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 1: like you're drinking yourself to an early death with the sodas. 19 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 1: There's that very famous commercial that he had where like 20 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 1: this this uh, very large man is drinking like a 21 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:27,399 Speaker 1: big gulp and Michael Bloomberg steps into the frame, smacks 22 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: it out of the guy's hand, shoves him, turns to 23 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: the camera and smiles, and he's missing a front tooth. 24 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:40,399 Speaker 1: What I'm just kidding. It's pretty believable, though. I was 25 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 1: with you until the tooth part, and then it was like, 26 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:44,320 Speaker 1: what kind of monster would be missing in front tooth 27 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: at h uh? Yeah, so, um Bloomberg did try to 28 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 1: ban that, which, like you said, is different than a 29 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 1: than a syntax. But um, yeah, by the way, we're 30 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 1: not saying s Y and T a X. It's high 31 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 1: end space T A X. That's right. And this article paints, uh, 32 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 1: one of the broadest political brushes I've seen from our 33 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: articles in a long time with this sentence. Syntaxes are 34 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: often considered a favorite tool of liberals out to impose 35 00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: a nanny state on freethinking individuals. Conservatives often to post 36 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:22,840 Speaker 1: syntaxes on the grounds that they amount to greater government 37 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:26,679 Speaker 1: intervention in people's lives. Now, let's all read some iron 38 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: ran It's it was just a pretty like it wasn't nuanced. No, 39 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: it's pretty pretty unnuanced. Remember those big plastic bats that 40 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 1: you would get with the whiffleball when you're like two, 41 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: so you're learning to practice baseball. It's like being hit 42 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:47,240 Speaker 1: with one of those. Yeah, there's no mistaking it. It's 43 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 1: just weird one of our articles because I think that's 44 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: sort of the the old party line that people believe. 45 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 1: It's just like all liberals just want to do is 46 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 1: control your life. Well, I think the author very clearly 47 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:01,839 Speaker 1: sees it that way and slipped it in. I guess yeah, 48 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,079 Speaker 1: But he also slipped in, but not all liberals think 49 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: this way because John Stewart thought it was ridiculous. Than that, 50 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: it's kind of funny. I don't remember John Stewart doing that. 51 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: Um do you do you remember him coming out against it? 52 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 1: I don't remember, but that doesn't surprise me. He said 53 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 1: it was draconian and would not have the proper outcome. 54 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: And John Stewart's pretty smart guy. Well yeah, if he 55 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: thinks that, then I do so he's probably one too, 56 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: and we'll talk a lot about this. But syntax is 57 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: uh to me. The proposed outcome isn't necessarily like what 58 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: um ends up happening A and maybe not even what 59 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: they're after in the long run. Jerry's still out on 60 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: that you know, like you talked to some people and say, oh, no, 61 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:52,320 Speaker 1: they're effective. Other people say no, they're not effective, and 62 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: some people say sometimes they're effective. I think the third 63 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: group is probably right. Yeah, sometimes, so we should probably 64 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: tell people which talking about with a syntax. Syntax is 65 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 1: a type of text that is levied against a usually 66 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:10,800 Speaker 1: a good of some sort that society in general says, 67 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: we don't really think you should have too much of that. 68 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, we'd all be happier if 69 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:20,480 Speaker 1: you would not use that. So we're going to have 70 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:27,159 Speaker 1: our government, or go along with our government levying a text. Yes, 71 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: the next size text, which is a sales tax on 72 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:33,880 Speaker 1: one specific type of good. Um. For example, with a 73 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: syntax something like tobacco or liquor or gambling, something that 74 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 1: society tends to think of as advice. Yeah, and so 75 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:44,760 Speaker 1: they're saying, there's a couple of things that are being said. 76 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 1: With the syntax, it's saying, well, we want you to stop, 77 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: so we're gonna hit you in your pocketbook. Yeah, that's 78 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:57,520 Speaker 1: a good argument. You can argue both ways. Um. And 79 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 1: then secondly, and I think this one's a little more legitimate. Um, 80 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: that is costing the rest of us money in the 81 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 1: form of higher insurance rates, Like you're abusing your body, 82 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:17,919 Speaker 1: we're having to pay for community hospitals. That cost of society. Yeah, 83 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 1: there's a cost of society. So if you want to 84 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:22,479 Speaker 1: do this to yourself, you're gonna have to pay more 85 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:25,279 Speaker 1: for it, so that we can use that money for 86 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 1: things like health care systems to fund UM, to fund this, 87 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 1: to offset the social cost that you are creating. Yeah, 88 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: And a lot of times there is something specifically earmarked 89 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:41,359 Speaker 1: for a specific syntax, like we're gonna take the money 90 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:43,640 Speaker 1: in our state from this new cigarette tax and put 91 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 1: it toward this healthcare measure. UM. And I think that 92 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 1: they like to do that more because people might get 93 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:54,960 Speaker 1: behind it more if they're not, just like it'll just 94 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,560 Speaker 1: go in the government coffers And uh, I don't know 95 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: how much faith there is the public at large that 96 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 1: the government spends the money wisely. Well, that's that's I mean, 97 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:07,039 Speaker 1: that's a big part of it. Like if you are 98 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:12,040 Speaker 1: not taking the money from a syntax and directly using 99 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: it to offset the social cost of whatever that vices 100 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 1: or whatever, if there is one, UM, then you're scamming 101 00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: the general populace and you're using your shaming like a 102 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 1: segment of your populace for that, for that to that 103 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: end to scam everybody. Yeah, or which is not cool. 104 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:36,119 Speaker 1: Let's let's say you're not, um, want to drink soda much, 105 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 1: but every once in a while you like to get 106 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 1: out there and have a big, tall, giant, big gulp. 107 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 1: Then you're paying that tax. And some people might say, well, 108 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,480 Speaker 1: that's not really fair because you're not contributing to any 109 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:52,760 Speaker 1: social epidemics. Right. Um, we're gonna get into all this, 110 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:57,440 Speaker 1: but we should point out that Bloomberg, um, he lost 111 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: that war. He uh, the soda industry they you know, 112 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: they're not just gonna say that sounds like a great idea, mayor. 113 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:07,919 Speaker 1: They fought hard. They mounted a campaign and ad campaign, 114 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: they mounted a legal challenge, and the Court of Appeals 115 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 1: eventually struck it down in June. So later that year 116 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 1: he said, all right, New Yorkers, you don't like to 117 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 1: be pushed around, Let's go to Berkeley, California. Yeah. Well, okay, 118 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 1: So Bloomberg is a billionaire, right sure, And he's a 119 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 1: billionaire who is exceedingly liberal. He's a very liberal billionaire. Um, 120 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 1: and he his foundation in two thousand and ten and 121 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 1: said we're going after soda. We've not just we the 122 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:44,040 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Group, but the World Health Organization said soda texas 123 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 1: probably the most effective strategy of government can undertake for 124 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 1: improving the diet of the general population. UM, there's mounting 125 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: evidence that what are called ss D s sb's sugar 126 00:07:56,160 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 1: sweetened beverages are they lead to increased weight gain and 127 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 1: other um co morbid health outcomes like diabetes and are 128 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 1: basically they're they're becoming the central focus of a lot 129 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: of um negative publicity. A lot of people are saying 130 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: these things are are around the nexus of a lot 131 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 1: of really bad chronic health conditions. It's these sodas right, 132 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: and so much so that there was this really great 133 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 1: Guardian article that was written by Tina Rosenberg and she 134 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: puts it, soda is on the verge of becoming the 135 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:43,359 Speaker 1: liquid cigarette. And in part because of Bloomberg and his 136 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: his foundation, what would that make the East cigarette? East 137 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: cigarette is the new cigar? Uh? Yeah, soda is one 138 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: that it's easy to go after because UM, childhood obesity 139 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: and kids that you about stories about kids like going 140 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: through like a leader or a two leader of sugary 141 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 1: sweet soda a day in these you know, just ridiculous 142 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 1: amounts of sugar intake that any reasonable person would say, like, 143 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 1: you can't drink that much sugar right well and expect 144 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:20,520 Speaker 1: to like not have like huge consequences. The UK has 145 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: a sugar text on the books that's proposed to take 146 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:28,080 Speaker 1: effect next year, and I was reading a BBC article 147 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: on it and they had like this little pole thing 148 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: comparison thirty five grams of sugar and a can of 149 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:39,680 Speaker 1: Coca cola. Thirty grams is the maximum that the UK 150 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:43,680 Speaker 1: suggests it's children or people eleven years or older have 151 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: a day. And so if you drink one cannon coke, 152 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 1: you're automatically having more then you're supposed to have in 153 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: one day as far as like a normal diets concerned 154 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:56,200 Speaker 1: and who just drinks one can of coke? You know, Well, 155 00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 1: so what we're do you really Well, I don't even 156 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 1: drink and we've talked about this before. I rarely ever 157 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 1: drink soda, that's true. You're drinking water right now, yeah, 158 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:08,320 Speaker 1: And it's just it's not an effort to not drink 159 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:11,319 Speaker 1: sugar water. It's just sort of the way I was raised. 160 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: We didn't have a lot of sodas in the house, 161 00:10:13,160 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 1: drank a lot of water. I still love water. It's 162 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 1: good stuff, that's right, it is. And as a sweater too, 163 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:23,840 Speaker 1: that's what I need water. Yeah, so I can sweat more. 164 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 1: It's just a system. It's called the closed loop. He's swallowing. Yeah. 165 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:32,560 Speaker 1: Uh so, I feel like about eight minutes ago, I 166 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 1: said something about going to Berkeley. Um. So Bloomberg went 167 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:40,040 Speaker 1: to Berkeley later in fourteen after he was rebuffed in 168 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,280 Speaker 1: New York and said, New Yorkers don't like to be 169 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 1: shoved around. Let's go out west where all these Berkeley 170 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:48,839 Speaker 1: hippies will surely be down with this kind of thing. 171 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:51,640 Speaker 1: And let's uh, instead of trying to ban it, let's 172 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: try and get a syntax an exercise tax i pose 173 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 1: and uh. He was very successful there. There was um. Obviously, 174 00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: the the uh soda industry they're tried to fight back 175 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 1: as well, to the tune of about close to two 176 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 1: million bucks uh in a campaign against it, But voters said, yes, 177 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: we like the syntax uh, to the tune of how 178 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 1: much is it a penny? An an ounce ye that 179 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: could be substantial. Coke used to be what like a dollar. 180 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: I don't even know now, it would be a dollar twenty, 181 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: that's right, you know, I mean, yeah, that could be substantial, 182 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 1: especially if you're talking two leader, three leader. It's getting 183 00:11:29,559 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: into the area where you would start to see an 184 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,319 Speaker 1: impact from it. Yeah, that's the way to do it. Though, 185 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 1: I gotta say, instead of just like you know, a 186 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:42,240 Speaker 1: flat tax across the board, they're literally saying, like, the 187 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 1: more you drink of this stuff, the more you will pay. Right, 188 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: It's a negative. It's a disincentive to buy that product, 189 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: which again society or the government or somebody has deemed unhealthy. Right, 190 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 1: And in that case, uh, in Berkeley at least, you 191 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:00,680 Speaker 1: know that what they need to do is look at 192 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 1: this stuff long term. But in the short term, um, 193 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 1: over five months after the tax, they saw that, um 194 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 1: this is the American Journal of Public Health. They found 195 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 1: that low income and minority residents of Berkeley drink less 196 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: soda than before, but in San Francisco nearby consumption went 197 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 1: up by four percent. That's a pretty significant study. Yeah, 198 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,240 Speaker 1: five months though, Like, well, that's the problem. Like, look 199 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:31,680 Speaker 1: at it long term, I think is what the because 200 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:34,680 Speaker 1: maybe initially people will stop and then they'll go back 201 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:37,040 Speaker 1: to it. Maybe right, But why did San Francisco's go 202 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 1: up for people like leaving Berkeley to go get their 203 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 1: soda thicks? Maybe, I mean, that's entirely possible. I don't know. 204 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:45,560 Speaker 1: I don't think you would. The money you would spend 205 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: going back and forth to San Francisco is unless you 206 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 1: just went and bought like a truckload of cases of soda. Yeah. 207 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: If that's the case, then you got you know, there 208 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: are other issues in your life. Consider like even just 209 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,439 Speaker 1: the people who live near the border close enough. Yeah, 210 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: where on the way home they're stopping or during their 211 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 1: day they're stopping in San Francisco, just on the border 212 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:09,520 Speaker 1: getting a coke. That would raise consumption in San Francisco. Uh, 213 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 1: Coke and the other companies might say, hey, um, we 214 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 1: need to divert all the stock that was gonna go 215 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:19,439 Speaker 1: to Berkeley over to San Francisco and maybe spend a 216 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 1: little more on advertising there. I could raise consumption. I 217 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:25,959 Speaker 1: guess so. But you make a very valid point. I'm 218 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:29,200 Speaker 1: not disagreeing with you. That jury is very much still 219 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 1: out on whether soda taxes actually do work in the 220 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 1: long term, And then even more is we'll see whether 221 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:39,840 Speaker 1: they have the impact and effects that are supposedly desired. Yeah, well, 222 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: let's take a little breather and we will go uh huddle, 223 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:50,800 Speaker 1: not puddle, huddle, huddle, pittle from all all the water 224 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: we've been thinking. Uh, people say that about their dogs, 225 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 1: like he pittled. I think that's just a cute way 226 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: of saying he beat it right, takes a stay out 227 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 1: of it a bit a little. But also I think 228 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,600 Speaker 1: the peddle. I think a pile is just a little squirt. Yes, 229 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: but it's usually also a company with like a I'm 230 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,920 Speaker 1: nervous or I'm scared or something, so I'm peddling. Well 231 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 1: that's a weird segue. So we'll go uh pittle and 232 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 1: talk about a little history of this when we get back. 233 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:50,200 Speaker 1: All Right, we both got excited the book Pittle piddle 234 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: a little bit. Jerry mopped it up, piddled it a little. Yeah, 235 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: she was so um scornful though. Yeah, that's all right. Uh, alright, 236 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:02,160 Speaker 1: so history WI, this is nothing new, And this is 237 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: a stat that I didn't know for about fifty years 238 00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 1: in the late eighteen hundreds to early nineteen hundreds, until 239 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: n of our revenue in the United States came from 240 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: taxing booze and beer, smokes wine. I feel like we 241 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 1: talked about then in the customs episode tariffs episode. Did 242 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: we do a tariff episode? We talked about tariffs in customs. Yeah. Yeah, 243 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that it's a large share of your 244 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: taxes though, coming from syntax, right. And as a matter 245 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: of fact, the first tax on a domestic product levied 246 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 1: by the United States was on It was a syntax. 247 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 1: It was a tax on whiskey or on distilled liquor, 248 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: the famous whiskey tax that led to the even famous 249 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:53,240 Speaker 1: for whiskey rebellion, which led even famous her to the 250 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: Whiskey Hangover Whiskey Rebellion hangover. Uh So, in nineteen thirteen, 251 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: that all change when the United States said, you know 252 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: what we should do. We should people are making money now, 253 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: we should tax their income because the more they make, 254 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:10,680 Speaker 1: the more successful they are, the more that we can 255 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 1: get until they get to a point where they can 256 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: get away from paying taxes. Sure they're so rich, and people, wait, 257 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: how does that work? They went, Oh, you wait, they said, 258 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: forget the supply side, We'll go to the demand side 259 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:26,720 Speaker 1: to tax. And from that moment on, the United States 260 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 1: never collected a scent in Texas from another company. Again 261 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: the end so um. But the point is syntaxas are 262 00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: most major source of government revenue up until right, which 263 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: is a little ironic, I guess considering our history as 264 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 1: a country. Yeah, it is. But what's weird is it's 265 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 1: it's the syntax actually goes back really far. There's a 266 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: lot of governments and throughout history that have collected syntaxes um, 267 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:06,399 Speaker 1: for all sorts of different reasons. Um. And then they 268 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:10,240 Speaker 1: also used to take the form of something called sumptuary laws. Yes, 269 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 1: so sumptuary laws were basically rather than taxing. It was 270 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,520 Speaker 1: kind of like what Bloomberg was trying to do by 271 00:17:18,560 --> 00:17:21,959 Speaker 1: just outlowing outlowing so it all together, but rather than 272 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,760 Speaker 1: necessarily being a moral thing, usually sumptuary laws were meant 273 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:30,280 Speaker 1: to keep class distinctions intact. Yeah, like you know, the 274 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:37,000 Speaker 1: word sumptuous expensive looking. It was a way to restrain extravagance. Um. 275 00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:39,440 Speaker 1: And like you said, uh, And they use Elizabeth the 276 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:42,040 Speaker 1: First in this article, which was a good example because 277 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:45,239 Speaker 1: she was big on those. And you know, it's kind 278 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 1: of like I don't want how am I going to 279 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 1: tell the difference between my subjects if they're dressing all 280 00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:53,160 Speaker 1: fancy now and thinking they're all that. Yeah, I don't 281 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 1: want to accidentally talk to a commoner pretty much. Uh, 282 00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 1: And I looked into these a little bit. Apparently they 283 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:02,199 Speaker 1: were not very ready enforced. Um. If they were, it 284 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 1: was usually because of a specific complaint that someone would 285 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 1: bring against, like their neighbor or something. They're wearing fancy shoes. Yeah, 286 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,800 Speaker 1: pretty much. It wasn't like super police. But they made 287 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Hey, that's 288 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: just good old fashioned ingenuity. Um. When you open it, it 289 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: it moves. But apparently that when these young men would 290 00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 1: enter London, they would sometimes their swords would be measured, 291 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 1: and if their swords were too long, they would break 292 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:35,359 Speaker 1: them because that was a sign of extravagance. If you 293 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:39,199 Speaker 1: had some big, flashy sword. It's not a euphemism, right, 294 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 1: you're talking about a sword. I don't think, so weird 295 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 1: and gross. So even in this country, the sumptuary laws 296 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:55,399 Speaker 1: um almost made an appearance. I think in the puritan 297 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: Um codes there may have been some sumptory laws, but 298 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 1: in the Ated States itself, George Mason during the Constitutional 299 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:07,239 Speaker 1: Convention said, hey, let's get some sumptuary laws. They've been 300 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 1: done for centuries already, they work. Let's just keep it going. 301 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: But Mason's aim wasn't to um keep class distinctions. He 302 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: wanted to basically say, hey, here's how you guys conduct 303 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:23,920 Speaker 1: yourselves the way we say where the US government. Don't 304 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:28,000 Speaker 1: flashy because don't be flashy, don't be um, don't waste 305 00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:31,720 Speaker 1: your money, don't drink too much. So so rather than 306 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 1: saying like we're going to tax your whiskey, you who 307 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:39,960 Speaker 1: produced whiskey, We'll just go and say you, you know, you, 308 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 1: member of the public, you can only have like a 309 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 1: pine of whiskey a day, and anything beyond that you 310 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,440 Speaker 1: will throw you in jail for That would be a 311 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:52,920 Speaker 1: sumptuary law. But the the other guys in the Constitutional 312 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,159 Speaker 1: Convention said no, no, no, no. I think one of 313 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: them very famously said, um, the law of necessity is 314 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 1: the greatest sumptuary law. Meaning if you tax people, they're 315 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:05,880 Speaker 1: not going to be able to afford it anyway. Plus you, 316 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 1: the government, get the money, So why be a jerk 317 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: and just outlaw it. Just throw a big old tax 318 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,879 Speaker 1: on it, and everybody wins except for the poor loser 319 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:17,439 Speaker 1: he's having to cough up this much more stuff to 320 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: to kill himself. Yeah, forget laws up with taxes which 321 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:25,680 Speaker 1: had been you know, like we talked about a long 322 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,480 Speaker 1: history and in the seventeen sixty four we uh, we're 323 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 1: subject to a sugar tax, which kind of had a 324 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,840 Speaker 1: twofold purpose. One was, Hey, anything that we can do 325 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:41,080 Speaker 1: to make the king richer great, uh and be you know, 326 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: we know what you're doing with that sugar. You're making 327 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 1: rum and you're getting too drunk, and we don't like 328 00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:51,400 Speaker 1: that either. So instead of a sumptuary law there, let 329 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,399 Speaker 1: me just tax your sugar. And do you remember we 330 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 1: talked about swilling the planters with bumbo? Yeah, like that 331 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:02,199 Speaker 1: was just election day. People used to drink in the 332 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 1: United States. Yeah, not like now, No, not like now. 333 00:21:07,119 --> 00:21:09,080 Speaker 1: I know I was being facetious, but that is true. 334 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: People like everyone was drunk back then. Yeah, there was 335 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,639 Speaker 1: written no reason not to be. No, it was a 336 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 1: hard life for everybody. You weren't driving around, no, you 337 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: were you were in like weird pants. Yeah, there's a 338 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:25,800 Speaker 1: lot to You had a lot of reason to drink. Yeah, 339 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:27,360 Speaker 1: you could just get on your horse, and your horse 340 00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 1: knows where to go, skipper, skipper knows where to go 341 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:38,719 Speaker 1: it was a weird neighbor hors. So do these syntaxis 342 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 1: actually work? Is the question? Well, yeah, that is the 343 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: big question. So um, oh we don't know, you. I mean, 344 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: it can work for sure. We actually with with this 345 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 1: is I thought this was a very Um this article 346 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:57,520 Speaker 1: confused me here there because it seemed to be making 347 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: its own argument rather than reporting the arguments, which I 348 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: found like hard to follow. And then secondly it just 349 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 1: kind of wove all over the place right as far 350 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: as that argument went. But I think what I'm getting 351 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 1: is with the soda tax, that specific kind of syntax, 352 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:22,959 Speaker 1: which is the syntax doujure of the century right now. Um, 353 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,840 Speaker 1: and I've just said the syntax of the day of 354 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:31,040 Speaker 1: the century, which is a little weird. Um, the jury 355 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:33,919 Speaker 1: is very much still out like a few countries of 356 00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,800 Speaker 1: tax soda, but they also tax like mineral water and 357 00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:40,159 Speaker 1: diet soda. So there's no way to study whether that 358 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,400 Speaker 1: actually works. As far as like health outcomes and things. Yeah, 359 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:45,160 Speaker 1: I mean there's a few different ways to say whether 360 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 1: or not it works, because there's threefold It's like, can 361 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 1: we improve health outcome, can we raise money? Yes, in 362 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: that case it always works. Right, and UM and C 363 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:00,919 Speaker 1: or three started with three p o um man, this 364 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,919 Speaker 1: is falling off the rail. Uh and see does it 365 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 1: help the public at large? UM. In the case of Mexico, 366 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 1: they a couple of years ago imposed to soda tax 367 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:18,199 Speaker 1: um because Bloomberg spending ten million dollars. That surprised me, 368 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:22,399 Speaker 1: but that was a good place to do it because apparently, UM, 369 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:28,680 Speaker 1: Mexico was nuts for sugar sweetened beverages. Yeah, and sort 370 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,360 Speaker 1: of junkie food and sugary beverages. I think it has 371 00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 1: a reputation for sure as being a problem. And I 372 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 1: think in two thousand and six there was like a 373 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,879 Speaker 1: nationwide health report basically like a study of Mexico and 374 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: they were finding like it was on its way to 375 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: becoming like the fattest country in the world. And UM 376 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,600 Speaker 1: they were like, well this, this is definitely opening our eyes. 377 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:51,679 Speaker 1: And that kind of planted the seed for Bloomberg's a 378 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 1: group to come in and a few years later and 379 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: spend ten million on a campaign against soda. I've seen 380 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,919 Speaker 1: I mean, have you been to Mexico. I've seen it, 381 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 1: you know, in person, Like it was a notice. It 382 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,719 Speaker 1: was noticeable to me the amount of people drinking soda 383 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,320 Speaker 1: just right out there in front of people. They weren't 384 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: even trying to hide it. I'm kidding of course. Um 385 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 1: so is when I guess Bloomberg was successful there, they 386 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 1: had to pay so per leader tax and an eight 387 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:23,640 Speaker 1: percent tax on junk food and apparently both of those 388 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:28,560 Speaker 1: consumption of both went down a lot because of that tax. Um. 389 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:31,120 Speaker 1: But like I said, so wait, there's one there's one 390 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 1: thing that consumption can decrease as a result. Right, What 391 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:38,960 Speaker 1: they don't know is the long term health outcome, because 392 00:24:39,800 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 1: that's just one thing that can lead to poor health 393 00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: in your future, is a sugary drink. Well, so that 394 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:52,359 Speaker 1: to me smacks of like soda industry like obfuscation, well 395 00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 1: in a way, but it's true. It is true. But 396 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 1: apparently in Mexico, the battle that's being fought by the 397 00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:04,760 Speaker 1: soda industry is, um, hey man, don't don't don't text us. 398 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 1: That's that you got it all wrong. Text the cheeseburger people, 399 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:12,240 Speaker 1: get them. Uh, and the cheeseburger people like what we're 400 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:15,919 Speaker 1: standing over here being quiet the pork rind people right. 401 00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:19,120 Speaker 1: Um No, they were saying, teach kids to like get 402 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,880 Speaker 1: out and exercise more it's calorie and calorie out right, 403 00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:26,120 Speaker 1: So who cares if our drinks have high calorie Tell 404 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,960 Speaker 1: these little kids to get off their duffs and get 405 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: out there and start playing the hopscots or something. The 406 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:38,440 Speaker 1: thing is is, um diet is more responsible for obesity 407 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,040 Speaker 1: than exercises. You can exercise with your heart's content, and 408 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:42,720 Speaker 1: if you don't change your diet, you're never gonna lose 409 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 1: any weight. It's diet that that leads to a change 410 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,680 Speaker 1: in obesity. And again, obesity is kind of the central 411 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 1: focus of this whole cluster of co more big chronic 412 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 1: illnesses that include things like UM insulin resistance and type 413 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 1: two diabetes UM. And if you can change the diet, 414 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: then you can conceivably cut down on these chronic illnesses. 415 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:09,639 Speaker 1: And again the World Health Organization said, so to text 416 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,400 Speaker 1: is the best way to change the diet. So that's 417 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: just being fought in Mexico right now, and and it's 418 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,879 Speaker 1: actually it's having an effect at least on a reduction 419 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 1: and consumptions. Now, what you're saying is we have to 420 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:25,159 Speaker 1: wait and see whether that reduction and consumption has a 421 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,479 Speaker 1: reduction in things like obesity and has a positive impact 422 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,240 Speaker 1: on health outcomes, and if that's the case, then Mexico 423 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: will probably change, will lead the way for the rest 424 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: of the world because everybody's gonna start following suit after that. Well, 425 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,639 Speaker 1: here's the thing, though, let's look at uh. Let's look 426 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:45,120 Speaker 1: at alcohol. For instance, we've long text cigarettes and alcohol 427 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:50,120 Speaker 1: in this country to great effect or great revenues at least. Uh. 428 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:53,480 Speaker 1: In two thousand nine, Illinois, the state of Illinois said 429 00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:58,040 Speaker 1: all the beer is gonna be one cent more per bottle, 430 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 1: and each serving of liquor is going to be five 431 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: cents more, Which I don't know what that means. Uh, 432 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,080 Speaker 1: like ounce and a half. I think an ounce and 433 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 1: a half is a serving a liquor. So is that 434 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:11,640 Speaker 1: just for a drink? You're getting a bar showy, they're 435 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 1: not slapping that on a bottle that you buy. I 436 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,239 Speaker 1: don't know'd be a lot of dough. I don't know. 437 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know. I don't know that either. Well, 438 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,479 Speaker 1: let's think about it's a fifth. The fifth is like, um, 439 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:30,439 Speaker 1: instead be like a dollar twenty extra for a fifth 440 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:37,720 Speaker 1: because it's a leaders about thirty two ounces, So three 441 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: quarters of thirty two would be twenty four right, I'm 442 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 1: pretty sure it is all right, sons, and maybe it 443 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:48,800 Speaker 1: wasn't that much then. Um. But what they found out 444 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:53,400 Speaker 1: was that deaths and this is where the hanky reporting 445 00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: comes in, UM, deaths associated with drunken driving stop by 446 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 1: and the general population in thirty seven, it for young 447 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:05,880 Speaker 1: people and also went down for uh, people who drink 448 00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: a lot supposedly Yeah, heavy drinkers. Yeah, a population that 449 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:13,200 Speaker 1: that Everyone was like, that's the what you can tax 450 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,760 Speaker 1: it till the cows come home and they're still gonna drink. 451 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,600 Speaker 1: So that was drunk driving accidents. And UM, if you're 452 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:24,160 Speaker 1: someone like mathematics professor Rebecca Golden, UM, you will look 453 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:28,399 Speaker 1: at that and say that doesn't prove anything. That's correlation 454 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 1: at best, and you can't prove that that caused the 455 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: drop in drunken driving accidents. Well, she actually said also 456 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 1: that there was a larger trend of um, drinking less. 457 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 1: You know that it had to do with the Great 458 00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,560 Speaker 1: Recession of two eight. People had less money to spend 459 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 1: on drinking, so we're getting drunk less, so we're dying 460 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,640 Speaker 1: in drunk driving accidents less. She said it didn't have 461 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 1: anything to do with this tax, But if you want 462 00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:56,560 Speaker 1: to support the tax, you can cherry pick a study 463 00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: like this and say, well, look people, because this is 464 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: the third part of that equation, the public at large benefit, 465 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:07,120 Speaker 1: which is fewer drunk driving accidents, um, less domestic abuse 466 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: in the case of smoking, less second hand smoke issues. Um. 467 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 1: That's when people are like, wait a minute, I'm the 468 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: one smoking, doesn't affect anyone else, Well, yeah, second hand smoke, 469 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,360 Speaker 1: or I'm the one drinking. Plus let me destroy my 470 00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 1: own body. Everybody likes a pretty smile, not meth mouth. 471 00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 1: That's the number one problem with meth. But the problem 472 00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 1: with that, I don't know if it's the study or 473 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 1: the tax or what, but that Illinois tax on alcohol 474 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: leading to fewer drunk driving deaths. That doesn't mean that 475 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,200 Speaker 1: it couldn't work. I think I said somewhere that like 476 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:47,960 Speaker 1: is about the minimum that you want to slap a 477 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,440 Speaker 1: syntax on before it starts to have, um, the outcomes 478 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,120 Speaker 1: that you're looking for. That's just nothing. Half a cent 479 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,280 Speaker 1: on a beer. No one's even gonna notice that, you know, 480 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,720 Speaker 1: five cents on a shot. No is going to notice 481 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 1: that it just couldn't possibly have the kind of outcomes 482 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: that that study concluded it had. Right, But that's not 483 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 1: to say that it couldn't if the text were raised, right. 484 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 1: And the thing is is there's a there's a sweet spot. 485 00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 1: There's a window where too low of attacks isn't gonna 486 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 1: do anything, but too high of attack can have really 487 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 1: negative outcomes too, And we'll talk about those right after 488 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 1: this break, all right. So you tease the fact that 489 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,920 Speaker 1: there is a point in time when you're raising these 490 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 1: taxes to try and get more and more people to say, 491 00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:07,280 Speaker 1: all right, enough is enough. I'm not paying five dollars 492 00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 1: and eighty five cents and taxes taxes on a pack 493 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: of smokes. Yeah, and that's I think how much they 494 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 1: pay in New York these days, New York State if 495 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,720 Speaker 1: you buy a pack of smokes. I'm not sure how 496 00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:22,280 Speaker 1: updated that is, but it's got to be around there, yeah, 497 00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:26,160 Speaker 1: Because I mean cigarettes are like twelve bucks there. Yeah, 498 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 1: they're like twelve dollars a pack. Wow, I know that's insane. 499 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,720 Speaker 1: I remember friends saying like, I'll never like, I'll quit 500 00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:37,480 Speaker 1: smoking once they hit five dollars a pack? Did he? 501 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: Because some people say that and they don't know other 502 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: people do. Yeah, And like even if it's a two 503 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,640 Speaker 1: percent of smokers who say that actually do two percent 504 00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:53,080 Speaker 1: reduction in smoking across the country. That's the size of 505 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:57,040 Speaker 1: the United States. That's significant. No agreed, But like I 506 00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:00,600 Speaker 1: was saying them, there's that breaking point. And Canada saw 507 00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 1: it for real backfire wise in the early nineties, they 508 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,520 Speaker 1: were um increasing the taxes on cigarettes. It finally got 509 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,520 Speaker 1: to a point where it spawned a black market, and 510 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:14,160 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, people, I think it from the 511 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 1: black market was one percent of sales, and just five 512 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,960 Speaker 1: years later it jumped up to And not only are 513 00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 1: they is it defeating itself, but they're not. They're not 514 00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:29,640 Speaker 1: raising They're getting less money on taxes than they would 515 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:31,880 Speaker 1: have if they would have kept it more reasonable. Right, 516 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: Like I think Arkansas ran into the exact same problem 517 00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:43,760 Speaker 1: they had. Um they up the tax on cigarettes in 518 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:47,640 Speaker 1: two thou nine. They doubled their tax. Suddenly it was 519 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:51,200 Speaker 1: a dollar fifteen a pack, which was enough that they 520 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,120 Speaker 1: were expecting something like um eighties six million dollars in 521 00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,040 Speaker 1: revenue from tobacco. And they had an earmarked for a 522 00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:02,400 Speaker 1: specific health UH initiative, which is good but also bad 523 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:04,960 Speaker 1: when you're like, hey, we're gonna project this much money 524 00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:08,480 Speaker 1: for this thing. Yeah. Not only did they um not 525 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:11,280 Speaker 1: make the eighties six million dollars that they were expecting to. 526 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 1: They actually collected ten million less than they had the 527 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:19,440 Speaker 1: year before. Yeah, ta trombone, right right. And the reason 528 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 1: why is because they jack the attacks up too much 529 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: and they made it um in the interest of the 530 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 1: smokers to go elsewhere, like just across state lines to 531 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,480 Speaker 1: buy their cigarettes, and a black market developed. So there 532 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 1: is a window where syntax can work. But you can't 533 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 1: go too low, and you can't go too high or 534 00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:42,720 Speaker 1: else it's gonna not have the intended effects. Yeah, here's 535 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,720 Speaker 1: a few stats, um in the United States, apparently a 536 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:50,160 Speaker 1: couple of years ago, Uh, Rhode Island, Nevada, West Virginia, 537 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:54,320 Speaker 1: New Hampshire, and Delaware. We're led the nation in syntaxas 538 00:33:55,240 --> 00:34:00,320 Speaker 1: um tobacco at seventeen billion for the country. I'll cohol 539 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: six billion casinos five and a half billion Russinos, which 540 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: I had never heard of. Made sense though, Russian sina 541 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:15,680 Speaker 1: Russian casina racinos, I guess it would be called because uh, 542 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:19,600 Speaker 1: you know, horse races are doll races with a casino 543 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:23,319 Speaker 1: right were you're you're betting on them, right, Yeah, but 544 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 1: it also has a casino attached Oh is that what 545 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:27,520 Speaker 1: it is? I guess, like, we know you like to 546 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,200 Speaker 1: bet on the ponies, but why not throw some black 547 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 1: check over here? Have you ever tried electronic binga uh? 548 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:40,239 Speaker 1: And then video gaming paramutual betting seven hundred million? So, uh, 549 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 1: the United States brings in a lot of dough from 550 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 1: these taxes. And one of the big arguments, um, that 551 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,960 Speaker 1: you're gonna hear politically is that or I guess not 552 00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:55,360 Speaker 1: even politically is that, Uh it's a regressive tax, meaning 553 00:34:55,360 --> 00:35:00,120 Speaker 1: attacks that uh infects a proportionately unfair segment of the 554 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:05,160 Speaker 1: poor population, right, which makes total sense because uh, syntax 555 00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:08,000 Speaker 1: is an excise tax, and an excise taxes a sales tax, 556 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:13,280 Speaker 1: and sales taxes almost two to a single one affect 557 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:17,080 Speaker 1: the poor more than they affect the wealthy. Just because 558 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,279 Speaker 1: this matters more. Yeah, it's a er share of their 559 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 1: income exactly, you know. Right, Well, we also should point 560 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:29,200 Speaker 1: out to there are texas like luxury taxes on it's 561 00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:33,320 Speaker 1: sort of a syntax for the rich, a luxury tex Yeah, 562 00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:37,000 Speaker 1: because you're like you text yachts at a higher rate 563 00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:39,800 Speaker 1: or something like that. Sure, yeah, this is a different 564 00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:44,640 Speaker 1: type of excise tax with the syntax you're especially with 565 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:49,640 Speaker 1: say like tobacco. Uh, studies show that poor people tend 566 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 1: to smoke more cigarettes than the wealthy. So when you 567 00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 1: have an excise tax a syntax on tobacco, yeah, you're 568 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:05,399 Speaker 1: definitely instituting a regressive tax because it's being shouldered by 569 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:10,960 Speaker 1: the poor disproportionately in that they have less income, but 570 00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:14,720 Speaker 1: also because they smoke more. So some people say tada, 571 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 1: syntaxes are regressive. Other people would say, well, actually, let's 572 00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:22,239 Speaker 1: take another look at this. You could say that that's 573 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:26,040 Speaker 1: a progressive tax because it's having exactly the kind of 574 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:30,759 Speaker 1: outcome you want to have by basically making it so 575 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,440 Speaker 1: that the people who smoked the most can afford it 576 00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,960 Speaker 1: the least. So therefore people are going to stop smoking 577 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:41,560 Speaker 1: as much now though we have traped very clearly, and 578 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 1: syntaxes are always in this realm anyway, but now we 579 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:48,840 Speaker 1: can't avoid it any longer. What you're talking about is 580 00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:52,480 Speaker 1: the government deciding what what is good for you and 581 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,920 Speaker 1: what you should or shouldn't do, and they're doing it 582 00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:58,360 Speaker 1: in a sneaky way, like we talked about in the 583 00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:02,839 Speaker 1: PR episode when we release from Chicago. UM that kind 584 00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:08,799 Speaker 1: of um paternal liberalism where the government's like, oh, you 585 00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:12,359 Speaker 1: just listen to us, we'll we'll take care of you. 586 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: We're not going to tell you what to do. We're 587 00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:17,720 Speaker 1: just gonna make it so that you can't really afford 588 00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:21,480 Speaker 1: to do what we don't want you to do any longer. Right, 589 00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:23,560 Speaker 1: But as this article points out, it's sort of a 590 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 1: kind of talking out both sides of their mouth because 591 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,360 Speaker 1: they bring in the US government brings in ninety billion dollars. 592 00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:34,080 Speaker 1: I think that's the the US and states together. Okay, 593 00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:38,520 Speaker 1: so federally in state wise billion dollars from syntaxes each year. 594 00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:44,520 Speaker 1: That they use that money and UH kind of need it. 595 00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:48,680 Speaker 1: Yeah I almost said need but it didn't depend on 596 00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:53,640 Speaker 1: it about that sure, UM. And you know they they 597 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:55,239 Speaker 1: say like, we don't want you to do these things. 598 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 1: We want you to smoke and drink less, but well 599 00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,120 Speaker 1: just not completely though, because we still want to collect 600 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 1: these taxes. Yeah. So that's why I like UM. I 601 00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:09,520 Speaker 1: know the UK had a big, a big issue with 602 00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 1: UM some of their proposed UH syntaxes on alcohol. They 603 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:16,160 Speaker 1: had one that was a syntax and they also had 604 00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,600 Speaker 1: a proposal I'm not sure where this went yet, but 605 00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:27,480 Speaker 1: UM on minimum alcohol pricing and uh, they flat out said, um, 606 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:29,440 Speaker 1: or you know, most of the public flat out said, like, 607 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,880 Speaker 1: there's no way you can have that minimum pricing because 608 00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 1: that's clearly gonna affect poor people who drink drink cheap 609 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:39,799 Speaker 1: liquor and go to the store and get you know, 610 00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:45,760 Speaker 1: Mr Boston Vodka and that Boston vodka and cheap anymore 611 00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:48,400 Speaker 1: because there's a minimum pricing on it, and it's not 612 00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:50,360 Speaker 1: gonna affect the fat cat who wants to go in 613 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: there and get his uh, what's a nice vodka? Uh vodka? 614 00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:01,440 Speaker 1: Hold on, grey Goose, it's not bad, Grey Goose. Sure, Belvedere, Exactly, 615 00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:03,520 Speaker 1: they're not walking in their sweating some minimum price on 616 00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:07,880 Speaker 1: vodka or probably the tax because they want their martini, 617 00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:10,960 Speaker 1: right exactly, No, that's exactly right. So I read this 618 00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:14,440 Speaker 1: article from it's called the Wages of Syntaxes from the 619 00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:19,960 Speaker 1: Adam Smith Institute, Oh of all places, the capitalism, and 620 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,960 Speaker 1: they said, you know, they come out very obviously, very 621 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:26,759 Speaker 1: much on the side of saying syntaxes are ineffective, they 622 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:31,239 Speaker 1: don't produce the outcome you want, they're regressive, and um, 623 00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:34,080 Speaker 1: anyone who's saying anything else is just fooling themselves. What 624 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:39,440 Speaker 1: they're doing is trying to collect revenue. Yeah, where are 625 00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:42,680 Speaker 1: you following this? I'm very curious. I'm not gonna weigh 626 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,360 Speaker 1: in on it. Okay, I'm just staying neutral. I'm saying 627 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:47,520 Speaker 1: some people say this, some people say that, good for you. 628 00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:52,440 Speaker 1: Jack Chuck just stays at home, Yeah, with his Tetos vodka. 629 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:54,320 Speaker 1: Actually I don't even drink vodka, but I do have 630 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,000 Speaker 1: Tito's in the house because you know, you want to 631 00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:59,799 Speaker 1: offer it to your friends. It's American, that's right. Sure, 632 00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:02,320 Speaker 1: Oh bloody marry I mean now and then oh yeah, 633 00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:06,440 Speaker 1: although you got to drink that with Jenner tequila so 634 00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:09,360 Speaker 1: much better than a vodka. Have you tried it? Yeah? 635 00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:12,480 Speaker 1: And you prefer vodka? Is still huh absolutely really yep. 636 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:16,960 Speaker 1: I'm surprised to hear you say that. Yeah, Titos, uh 637 00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 1: Mr Boston not Mr make a blend of both two 638 00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:26,120 Speaker 1: thirds Tito's, one third Mr Boston and then spit my friend. Well, 639 00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,640 Speaker 1: I do have that famous bloody Mary recipe from years ago, 640 00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:32,200 Speaker 1: the Caesar. But I've also been called out for not 641 00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:37,000 Speaker 1: talking specifically about my red neck crabbed up. People are 642 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,680 Speaker 1: writing in saying you can't just say that they want 643 00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,359 Speaker 1: the recipe. You can't say crack dip and not give 644 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,680 Speaker 1: us a recipe. So are you going to Well, I 645 00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,360 Speaker 1: don't remember, Like I don't go I don't do recipes 646 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:49,440 Speaker 1: because I like to just cook by the seat of 647 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:53,319 Speaker 1: my pants. But I know it's got the k rab 648 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:59,439 Speaker 1: chopped up lemon juice, it's got mayonnaise, it's got Worcestershire 649 00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:04,480 Speaker 1: little salt, pepper and paprika and that maybe it. I 650 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:07,480 Speaker 1: just don't remember the exact proportions. And you made you 651 00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:11,759 Speaker 1: can monkey with it sure like like mayo, Yeah you do. 652 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:13,399 Speaker 1: You can go lighter on the mayo if you want, 653 00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:16,759 Speaker 1: if you want to be a comie, um, Worcestershire. I 654 00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,799 Speaker 1: don't remember putting a ton in there. Just yeah, a 655 00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: couple of couple of dashes or no tapoon. Well, I 656 00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:24,520 Speaker 1: mean it depends on how much you're making. You know, 657 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:27,040 Speaker 1: if you make a big tub for a party, you're 658 00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:29,040 Speaker 1: gonna want more than a couple of dashes, probably like 659 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:34,120 Speaker 1: you know, a quarter cup or something. Who um yeah right, yeah, uh, 660 00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:37,160 Speaker 1: wake you up. And I think that's everything. Just as 661 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,319 Speaker 1: I say, monkey around with it, get creative, and then 662 00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:43,520 Speaker 1: next week maybe I'll talk about my Bloody Caesar recipe. 663 00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:45,359 Speaker 1: I think you should that. I didn't even know it's 664 00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:48,080 Speaker 1: called the Bloody Caesar until recently. Again, I think it 665 00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:51,400 Speaker 1: was the Bars episode. Yeah, because it became clamato and 666 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:55,759 Speaker 1: stead of tomato, that's the difference, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 667 00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:58,640 Speaker 1: the clam makes all the differ. Do you like red 668 00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:00,520 Speaker 1: beer or Jerry? What's at there? And called that? You 669 00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:04,759 Speaker 1: had your michelada Michelada, love him? We call him red 670 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,560 Speaker 1: beer and yuma? Oh really? Yeah, that's funny because you 671 00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:12,759 Speaker 1: was closer to Mexico than New York. You know, you 672 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,600 Speaker 1: think if anywhere they call him a Michelada. In fact, 673 00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:18,600 Speaker 1: it's so close to Mexico you can walk there. Oh 674 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:20,560 Speaker 1: is it that g I didn't know humans on the border? 675 00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:22,520 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean it's it's right on the border 676 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,960 Speaker 1: of Arizona in California and uh in Mexico. It's like 677 00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:30,400 Speaker 1: right in that bottom corner. Yeah. You know. The worst 678 00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:34,279 Speaker 1: is um if you ever order a Michelloda somewhere and 679 00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:37,200 Speaker 1: they don't they have the gall to not bring you 680 00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:40,080 Speaker 1: the can of beer as well, Like you just made 681 00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:43,359 Speaker 1: you a Michelada eight dollars please, and it's like there's 682 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: a shot of beer, not even that because it's still 683 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,880 Speaker 1: kind of foamy, and they just try to pretend like 684 00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:52,360 Speaker 1: they don't owe you that the rest of that beer, 685 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,640 Speaker 1: that that didn't get into the glass. At the same time, 686 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:59,440 Speaker 1: what kind of weirdness is this? It's not okay, So 687 00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:02,000 Speaker 1: hold on, I'm of time. If you order a Michellodda 688 00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:04,279 Speaker 1: and they don't bring you the can, you tell them 689 00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 1: to bring you the can, and then you throw that 690 00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:10,520 Speaker 1: can back in their face. That's a little at the topic. Yeah, 691 00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:12,640 Speaker 1: I guess you could, especially if you chug the rest 692 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:15,640 Speaker 1: all at once. Jerry did not care for her Michelloda 693 00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:20,719 Speaker 1: that because it was um we saw the woman make it. 694 00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:23,680 Speaker 1: It didn't have tomato juice. It was just made with 695 00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:26,000 Speaker 1: like hot sauce. It's not supposed to have tomato juice, 696 00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,319 Speaker 1: all right, So Jerry just weighed in. We took the 697 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,480 Speaker 1: tape off her mouth, right, and she said that in 698 00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:35,440 Speaker 1: Guatemala they make the Michellodda with clamato. Well, that's what 699 00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:37,400 Speaker 1: they did in Huma. That was a red beer, basically 700 00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:41,320 Speaker 1: bloody mary with beer. So that is not that's different 701 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:46,880 Speaker 1: from Michellodda in my in my experience at the what's 702 00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:50,320 Speaker 1: the Triple Crown horse race in Maryland. I don't know. 703 00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:55,600 Speaker 1: So there's the Kentucky Derby, Yes, the Preakness. At the Preakness, 704 00:43:55,760 --> 00:44:00,200 Speaker 1: they make something like Jerry was just describing where it's like, um, 705 00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:03,480 Speaker 1: bloody Mary with beer. They didn't call it a michellotta 706 00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:06,200 Speaker 1: what they call it. I don't remember what they called it. 707 00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,960 Speaker 1: Kevin like it is good. I'll give you that. But 708 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:15,040 Speaker 1: my experience Mitchellott is lime juice, beer and hot sauce. 709 00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:18,040 Speaker 1: Well that's what she got and you didn't like it, huh. Alright, 710 00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:22,120 Speaker 1: so Josh says Jerry, she liked it. She said it 711 00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:28,279 Speaker 1: was awful. The proportions were not correct, and she did 712 00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:30,839 Speaker 1: we get charged for that. We did get charged for that, 713 00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:34,319 Speaker 1: even though she didn't drink any of it. So I'm 714 00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,160 Speaker 1: not going to name the restaurant in New York. You're 715 00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:39,360 Speaker 1: not gonna shame him publicly, huh. I will say the 716 00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:42,680 Speaker 1: lobster tacos were good. I'm sorry, the lobster roll was good. 717 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,359 Speaker 1: So that could be anywhere in New York. Was their 718 00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:50,960 Speaker 1: crownut there as well? That'll be a slight hint, slight hint. Yeah, 719 00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:54,080 Speaker 1: so you narrowed it down to three thousand places to 720 00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:58,200 Speaker 1: the west village. Okay, alright, so that narrows it down. Okay. 721 00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:02,000 Speaker 1: Uh so, Syn Texas, you got anything else? Uh? No, 722 00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,040 Speaker 1: he said you didn't want to weigh in on it. 723 00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:06,480 Speaker 1: I understand. I respect that. No, because you know, to 724 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:08,400 Speaker 1: be honest, not only do a not one a way 725 00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:12,480 Speaker 1: in just because I'm trying not to do that. But um, 726 00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:15,120 Speaker 1: you're turning over a new leaf. No. Just for things 727 00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:17,800 Speaker 1: that I feel really passionately about, I will, but I 728 00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,120 Speaker 1: don't feel super passionately about this. I'm being torn every 729 00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:23,200 Speaker 1: which way by this. Well, that's what my deal is is. 730 00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:25,319 Speaker 1: I don't I can't really speak to it because it's 731 00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:28,800 Speaker 1: sometimes it seems like a regressive tax, sometimes it doesn't. 732 00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:31,080 Speaker 1: Sometimes it seems like it might work, sometimes it seems 733 00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:33,080 Speaker 1: like it might not. Right, So I think that's where 734 00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:36,440 Speaker 1: I lie is ambivalent and confused. Yeah, I'm interested to 735 00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:38,600 Speaker 1: see how this how this comes out, you know, with 736 00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:43,759 Speaker 1: UM Berkeley, with Mexico, the Navajo Nation, UM instituted, they 737 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,880 Speaker 1: instituted a two percent junk food tax and then simultaneously 738 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,360 Speaker 1: repeal the five percent tax on fresh fruit and vegetables 739 00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:54,400 Speaker 1: and their grocery stores. Yep. So there's a lot of 740 00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:57,239 Speaker 1: like natural experiments going on right now that I'm very 741 00:45:57,239 --> 00:45:59,600 Speaker 1: interested to see what the outcomes are. People are going 742 00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:01,960 Speaker 1: to be audeing the heck out of those places. Well, 743 00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:03,759 Speaker 1: there's a lot of natural experiments going on in my 744 00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:08,840 Speaker 1: house to buddy. So if you if you want to 745 00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:10,919 Speaker 1: know more about this kind of stuff, go and listen 746 00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:12,960 Speaker 1: to our fat tax episode. We did want to high 747 00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:17,000 Speaker 1: fruit toast corn syrup. There's a great article about syntax 748 00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:20,000 Speaker 1: is that we used, called The Wages of Syntax as 749 00:46:20,080 --> 00:46:22,120 Speaker 1: it was in the Atlantic by a guy named Band 750 00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:25,080 Speaker 1: new Kirk. So go read that too. Brush up on 751 00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,239 Speaker 1: the syntax tip. And since I said brush up, time 752 00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:34,439 Speaker 1: for listener, Matt, I'm gonna call this Josh's choice. Every 753 00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:37,279 Speaker 1: one boy, all right. Every once in a while Josh 754 00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:39,640 Speaker 1: will send an email and saying, hey, I know this 755 00:46:39,719 --> 00:46:41,680 Speaker 1: is your bag, that would you mind reading this one? 756 00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:45,120 Speaker 1: And that is exactly what I wrote. Yeah, So this 757 00:46:45,200 --> 00:46:49,399 Speaker 1: is uh from Ada, And I don't remember where Ada 758 00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:52,440 Speaker 1: is from, but Ada is in high school, oh from Canada. 759 00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:56,359 Speaker 1: So that immediately means that Ada is probably smarter than 760 00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:59,680 Speaker 1: we are. She well, I mean the course she took 761 00:46:59,719 --> 00:47:02,719 Speaker 1: in school is pretty impressive it is. I didn't run 762 00:47:02,719 --> 00:47:05,919 Speaker 1: into those until well into college. All right, Hey guys, 763 00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:08,160 Speaker 1: I'm seventeen year old from Canada, and somebody caught my 764 00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:10,279 Speaker 1: attention to your Polar Bears episode when Josh is talking 765 00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:13,359 Speaker 1: about hunting. Uh. He said that people will say, well, 766 00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:15,520 Speaker 1: the food you're eating came from the store that was 767 00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:18,920 Speaker 1: killed unethically as a counter argument, and Josh found it 768 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,480 Speaker 1: kind of fallacious, but didn't know how to describe it. Luckily, 769 00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:25,880 Speaker 1: I'm taking the English class and we just finished finished 770 00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:29,960 Speaker 1: a unit on fallacies, and I can confirm it is fallacious. 771 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,960 Speaker 1: So it would be qualified as a straw man argument 772 00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:36,600 Speaker 1: because the counter argument isn't really arguing against your point 773 00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:39,760 Speaker 1: that hunting is wrong, but it's arguing a slightly different 774 00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:42,319 Speaker 1: and weaker point that food bought in grocery stores could 775 00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:45,160 Speaker 1: be unethically killed, which takes your attention away from the 776 00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:48,919 Speaker 1: point that you're arguing nice. It could also be an 777 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:54,760 Speaker 1: ad hominen to quoke sure that right? If my Latin 778 00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:58,120 Speaker 1: not as rusty as I thought, to quoke q you 779 00:47:58,239 --> 00:48:03,719 Speaker 1: o q u e u quake quoke quick quick, I 780 00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:08,320 Speaker 1: didn't take Latin. I didn't need or you two y 781 00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:11,960 Speaker 1: o U T O O not the band um. If 782 00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:14,920 Speaker 1: you say that hunting is unethical killing, and then the 783 00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:18,719 Speaker 1: person is saying, well, you participate in the unethical killing 784 00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:21,640 Speaker 1: of animals by grocery shopping. Another example of this kind 785 00:48:21,640 --> 00:48:24,960 Speaker 1: of argument be one person telling another that they shouldn't smoke, 786 00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,000 Speaker 1: but the person says, well, you smoke. Just because the 787 00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:30,080 Speaker 1: other person doesn't practice what they preach, it doesn't change 788 00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:33,560 Speaker 1: the fact that it is wrong and good stuff. The 789 00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:36,160 Speaker 1: reason that you might not have been able to identify 790 00:48:36,239 --> 00:48:40,120 Speaker 1: this is because fallacies like this are used so much 791 00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:43,120 Speaker 1: in media today and they're not accepted widely as fair 792 00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:47,719 Speaker 1: arguments because they're really not. Hope this helped, Yes, yes 793 00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:51,320 Speaker 1: it did. You were delighted keep calling out these fallacious arguments, 794 00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:53,600 Speaker 1: and that is from Ada. Thank you Ada. That was 795 00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:57,120 Speaker 1: de bravo. Although I have to say we did get 796 00:48:57,160 --> 00:49:01,640 Speaker 1: some some good fallacious arguments on the other side. They 797 00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:04,200 Speaker 1: had nothing to do with what I was saying necessarily, 798 00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:07,759 Speaker 1: but they did explain hunting a little more, which I 799 00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:10,600 Speaker 1: thought was pretty great, including one that you read. But 800 00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:12,520 Speaker 1: we've gotten some other ones since then as well. There 801 00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,759 Speaker 1: I'm just like, wow, I want to go hunting, like 802 00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:18,040 Speaker 1: slap my own face. It was funny. I was at 803 00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:21,040 Speaker 1: the park yesterday with my daughter and there were these 804 00:49:22,200 --> 00:49:24,560 Speaker 1: really cool kids, his brother and sister that were probably 805 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:28,160 Speaker 1: ten and eight ish, and they were kind of hanging out. 806 00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:30,400 Speaker 1: They had a dog that um that Ruby was playing with, 807 00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,400 Speaker 1: and they were just being nice sounds talking to them, 808 00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:35,560 Speaker 1: and then this other kid came up later and they 809 00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:38,240 Speaker 1: were talking to these kids and they're talking about sports. 810 00:49:38,239 --> 00:49:40,440 Speaker 1: This kid was saying he played baseball, the cool kid. 811 00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:43,960 Speaker 1: I'm not saying your kid wasn't cool. And the other 812 00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:45,919 Speaker 1: kids said, you know, I don't do any sports except 813 00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:49,799 Speaker 1: for hunting and fishing. And this this other kid looked 814 00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:52,640 Speaker 1: at him like he was from Mars. You could just 815 00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:55,600 Speaker 1: see the difference in their two upbringing. And this kid 816 00:49:55,680 --> 00:49:58,359 Speaker 1: was just like what. He's like, what do you hunt for? 817 00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:00,120 Speaker 1: The kid was like deer, and he was like, you 818 00:50:00,160 --> 00:50:03,239 Speaker 1: shoot deer? And he was still young enough in in 819 00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:06,839 Speaker 1: that you know environment that his family is raising him 820 00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:08,880 Speaker 1: in where he was just like, why would you shoot 821 00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:12,600 Speaker 1: a deer? Right? Yeah, they're awesome. Yeah, And this gips like, yeah, man, 822 00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:16,000 Speaker 1: that's pretty cool. It was an interesting interaction to watch 823 00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:18,200 Speaker 1: as an adult. I would have liked to have seen that. Yeah, 824 00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:21,000 Speaker 1: because I mean, and you have that conversation as an 825 00:50:21,040 --> 00:50:25,480 Speaker 1: adult doesn't usually go that way. It'll go it's pretty interesting. Yeah, 826 00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:28,880 Speaker 1: I've been listening in on kids convers just don't do 827 00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:30,920 Speaker 1: it in a creepy way, you know, you know, they 828 00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,600 Speaker 1: say everything you needed to know you learned in kindergarten. Yeah, 829 00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:37,920 Speaker 1: I believe it. Uh Ada, Thank you again for that. 830 00:50:37,920 --> 00:50:40,520 Speaker 1: That was a great email. Thank you too, Chuck for 831 00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:44,080 Speaker 1: the additional anecdote. Sure beautiful. Uh If you want to 832 00:50:44,120 --> 00:50:47,560 Speaker 1: send in an anecdote or explain something that we put 833 00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:49,920 Speaker 1: a call out for whatever, you can tweet to us 834 00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:53,320 Speaker 1: at josh um Clark and s y s K podcast, 835 00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:56,840 Speaker 1: two different ones. You can hang out with Charles W. 836 00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,759 Speaker 1: Chuck Bryant on Facebook and or you can go to 837 00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,239 Speaker 1: face but dot com slash Stuff you Should Know. You 838 00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:04,319 Speaker 1: can send us an email to Stuff Podcasts at how 839 00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:06,400 Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com and has always joined us at 840 00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:08,359 Speaker 1: our home on the web, Stuff you Should Know dot 841 00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:15,760 Speaker 1: com for more on this and thousands of other topics. 842 00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:25,520 Speaker 1: Does it how Stuff Works dot com