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Speaker 1: The volume Collin Coward Podcast presented by FanDuel Sports Book.

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Speaker 1: is Prime Cuts, the best of the Colin Coward Podcast.

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Speaker 1: Another great week. NBA champ the owa's interesting Matt Barnes

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Speaker 1: joined US Insight into his former team, the Warriors, making

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Speaker 1: another run Super Bowl MVP Cooper Cup on the moment

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Speaker 1: he realized Matt Stafford was on a different level. Plus,

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Speaker 1: Jason timp tells me about the one mistake the Lakers

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Speaker 1: absolutely can't afford to make. Check it out. Prime Cuts.

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Speaker 1: All the smoke is the best sports podcast out there,

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Speaker 1: along with the Draymond Green podcast on the volume. I

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Speaker 1: just want to say that right now, it's raw, it's authentic.

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Speaker 1: Mattso has been a real straight shooter. And I think

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Speaker 1: you guys also know that I love Steven Jackson, so

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Speaker 1: it's a real pleasure. He's a busy guy. I didn't

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Speaker 1: have to do this, but I mean, you know this,

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Speaker 1: you know the West, you know the Warriors. That when

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Speaker 1: I was thinking Matt watching this game tonight, I thought

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Speaker 1: the way they cut and move is it a staff thing?

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Speaker 1: Because usually in sports, when something's great, people duplicate it,

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Speaker 1: they rip it off. Nobody looks like the Warriors, Nobody

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Speaker 1: moves like the Warriors, Nobody cuts like the Warriors. And

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Speaker 1: I come back to, well, shit, it just must be staff,

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Speaker 1: or is it I In fact, the only times they

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Speaker 1: have problems is when they stop moving. They had a

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Speaker 1: thirteen nothing Dallas run. When they're moving, it's just impenetrable.

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Speaker 1: It's is it just staff? No? I definitely think it's

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Speaker 1: a team thing. You know, when I was there, it

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Speaker 1: was constant movement and you're so worried about the three

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Speaker 1: point shot that that's how they're so effective in the

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Speaker 1: paint because you always have to you know, hedge on

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Speaker 1: these screens or if Claire step are coming off you

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Speaker 1: know show or double team and they get so many slips.

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Speaker 1: But you know, call us interesting to me in a

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Speaker 1: day and age where you know, dribblings at a premium

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Speaker 1: and everyone wants to go one on one and do

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Speaker 1: what they do, the Warriors are the exact opposite. You know,

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Speaker 1: at the end of the clock. You know, normally if

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Speaker 1: you look at Dallas, you know, you know the ball

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Speaker 1: is going to be in Luca's hands when they call

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Speaker 1: you know, when they call red red is you know

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Speaker 1: one hundred five seconds. You got to go with the

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Speaker 1: Warriors that continue to move and get a good shot,

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Speaker 1: even if it's with like point six on the clock,

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Speaker 1: They'll still get that extra pass to turn down a

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Speaker 1: good shot and get a great shot. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's what makes them so scary. Although Steph can go

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Speaker 1: one on one, other guys in this league do, but

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Speaker 1: I feel like he gets more success off his movement

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Speaker 1: and everyone's ability to kind of continue to move, and

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Speaker 1: it's just almost like pick your poison. Note to think

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Speaker 1: that step was the fifth leading score in the game

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Speaker 1: in a closeout game and they won by double digits.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's not another team they can have their

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Speaker 1: leading score be the fifth score in a closeout game

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Speaker 1: and even be close in the game, and this team

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Speaker 1: wins by double digits with Stepping the fifth leading score

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Speaker 1: in a closeout game in the Western Conference Finals. Coming

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Speaker 1: off an injury is really hard. I never had. The

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Speaker 1: only injury I ever had. I had a motorcycle crash

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Speaker 1: as a kid, and I can remember my parents making

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Speaker 1: me get back on the bike and they're like, you

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Speaker 1: just got to get back on it. And you know,

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Speaker 1: so we in a rehab and you've been in rehab

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Speaker 1: before you come in rehab, and it's not really a

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Speaker 1: physical battle to psychological battle to pivot to turn to.

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Speaker 1: And I almost felt like in the last three games,

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Speaker 1: it's like I visually saw Clay like just that something hit,

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Speaker 1: something clicked again. Maybe it's just because he played so

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Speaker 1: well tonight, but talk a little bit about if you

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Speaker 1: could coming off an injury, rehabbing the psychology of it.

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Speaker 1: I honestly thought in the last in this series, the

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Speaker 1: second half of this series, I'm like, Okay, he's gotten

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Speaker 1: past something upstairs. I mean, the biggest hurdle coming back

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Speaker 1: from any injury is the mental the mental strength to

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Speaker 1: understand that, Okay, if I get enough, my surgeony repaired

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Speaker 1: knee is going to be okay. If I'm all awkwardly

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Speaker 1: or lay an awkwardy or my ankle, my surgey repaired ankle,

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Speaker 1: so and so forth. The hardest thing to do from

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Speaker 1: an injury is come back and really trust that. And

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Speaker 1: then you add that the kid, you know, the guy

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Speaker 1: missed nine hundred and forty days, you know, a basketball

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Speaker 1: so you know he's really been back five months after

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Speaker 1: missing two and a half years of basketball. So you know,

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Speaker 1: that's why I predicted the very beginning of the season

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Speaker 1: depending on what Clay Thompson comes back. You know, Golden

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Speaker 1: State was my pick because I had a feeling that,

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Speaker 1: you know, he's gonna do what he needs to come back.

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Speaker 1: He's not a guy that lives above the rim. He's

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Speaker 1: a very smart player, so like athleticism, you know, he

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Speaker 1: wouldn't really worried about that because he can still get

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Speaker 1: it shot off. But you know, Clay is really, to me,

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Speaker 1: still working his way back into shape in and one

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Speaker 1: thing about this team too, if you think about it,

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Speaker 1: they haven't necessarily played. I think they showed peaks in

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Speaker 1: this Western Conference about how good this team can be.

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Speaker 1: But they've been very up and down throughout the playoffs,

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Speaker 1: and then to think the first two rounds very up

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Speaker 1: and down. You find yourself in the Western Conference finals. Normally,

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Speaker 1: you know, in the NBA, we want to be peaking

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Speaker 1: at the right time. All those you know they lost,

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Speaker 1: excuse me, they won five in a row at the

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Speaker 1: end of the season, but they you know, they were

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Speaker 1: six and four, you know, at the end of the season.

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Speaker 1: So normally teams want to peek at that point going

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Speaker 1: in the playoffs, the crazy parts. I think the Warriors

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Speaker 1: are starting to peak right now, which is like I said,

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Speaker 1: you want to peak going into the past. These guys

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Speaker 1: are peaking going into the finals. That's why I think

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Speaker 1: they're gonna be really hard to beat next round. I'll

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Speaker 1: pivot to Luca. Not much of a defensive effort in

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Speaker 1: the second half. I mean, listen, they attacked him. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I said this the other day on Fox.

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Speaker 1: I said, listen, you can say is Larry Bird. But

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Speaker 1: Larry Bird was feisty defensively, he was competitive. He wasn't great.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes I feel with Luca there's a little mellow thing

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Speaker 1: where he's so gifted offensively that just gets his love

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Speaker 1: and attention. He didn't give you. He doesn't give you

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Speaker 1: a great effort, and I don't know how you change that, man.

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Speaker 1: Like it feels like defense is attitude, Like how do you? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you have to want to play defense because obviously it's

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Speaker 1: not as decorated, you don't get as much money, you

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Speaker 1: don't get talked about on Sports Center necessarily about defense.

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Speaker 1: But what I will say is Luca is so young

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Speaker 1: and he's never really been held accountable on the defensive

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Speaker 1: and I think that's why I think there's still a

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Speaker 1: chance for him to change, because I feel like he's

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Speaker 1: improved this year an a Jason Kidd. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: rare that a coach can publicly call out a superstar

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Speaker 1: and then not blow up in backfire. But I think

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Speaker 1: there's such a high level respect for Jason Kidd there

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Speaker 1: that Luca looked at as a challenge and not a disrespect,

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Speaker 1: which is, you know, there's a thin line between that.

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Speaker 1: So I think Luca can get better at defense. And

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Speaker 1: he realized now going this far in the playoffs, that

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Speaker 1: he was a target on the defensive end, and as

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Speaker 1: a man, he's gonna you know, he's gonna be that

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Speaker 1: pride always steps in. So although he's continuing to be

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Speaker 1: one of the most gifted young offensive scores this game

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Speaker 1: has ever seen, I think where he knows moving forward

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Speaker 1: now is that he's going to start I feel like

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Speaker 1: he's gonna start getting his body although he's never going

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Speaker 1: to be a six pack chiseled guy, but he can obviously,

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Speaker 1: you know, probably trim down the body fat a little

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Speaker 1: bit and get quicker feeding. And then, like you said,

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Speaker 1: defense is a mindset and an attitude, and I think

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Speaker 1: no one's asking him to be first team All Defense

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Speaker 1: or an All defense NBA All Defense. But sometimes it's

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Speaker 1: just effort that I feel lack sometimes as he is

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Speaker 1: doing so much. You saw he didn't really sit out

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Speaker 1: in the second half until you know, Dallas too at

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Speaker 1: the white flag. So this guy is carrying this franchise

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Speaker 1: and this team every possession up and down the court.

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Speaker 1: So that's why kind of not giving them a pass.

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Speaker 1: But understand that being able to play both sides of

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Speaker 1: the ball the entire game is very tough because he

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Speaker 1: is asked to carry such a heavy load on the

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Speaker 1: offensive end well, and the other thing, Matt. If you

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Speaker 1: look at his offensive game, he doesn't blow by guys.

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Speaker 1: He initiates contact. It's a lot like James Harden. It

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Speaker 1: beats the hell out of you. I mean, Harden at

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Speaker 1: the end of the playoff series is shot. And you know,

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Speaker 1: Lucas not jumping over you. He's not John Morant flying

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Speaker 1: pass yet everything is contact. And so when I think

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Speaker 1: about who he should play with, you know, do you

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Speaker 1: put him with another great offensive player and it may

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Speaker 1: not mash or do you put him with kind of

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Speaker 1: a Clay Thompson, a catch and shoot but an elite

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Speaker 1: defender who doesn't have the ego to be a one.

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Speaker 1: Like part of me thinks Donovan Mitchell, but he's a one,

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Speaker 1: won't want to be a two. Like what is the

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Speaker 1: ideal Luca two look like to you? Smon and the

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Speaker 1: Clay Thompson frame where he is an elite score but

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Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily nearly need the ball in his hands to

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Speaker 1: be a score. A great catch and shoot guy, great

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Speaker 1: pinned down guy, a guy that can get the ball,

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Speaker 1: you know, get a bucket off the dribble, and also

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Speaker 1: someone to play defense, but like you said it's it's

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Speaker 1: gonna be an interesting pairing because Luca is so ball dominant,

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Speaker 1: he's so bald on it. But I think when they

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Speaker 1: start putting more and I say this with all due respect,

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Speaker 1: he made it this farm with obviously the and when

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Speaker 1: I say weakest, I don't want because people are crazy

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Speaker 1: with the weakest supporting cast, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: And all those are these guys despression. These guys played

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Speaker 1: really well if you look up and down the roster.

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Speaker 1: He did what he did. It kind of reminded me

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Speaker 1: what Ai did when he took his team to the

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Speaker 1: finals against the Lakers, when it was really just Ai.

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Speaker 1: He had a lot of hard nosed, blue collar hard workers,

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Speaker 1: but it was Ai. So you know, to me, it's

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Speaker 1: gonna be interested me because I feel like there are

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Speaker 1: one player where I love the you know, the breakout

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Speaker 1: season that why am I for your Javan Brunson had

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Speaker 1: is going to be interesting to see if they can

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Speaker 1: keep him because I know some teams are gonna throw

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Speaker 1: money at him, but they're gonna have to find a

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Speaker 1: star that compare with Luca that is okay with not

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Speaker 1: having the ball in his hands all the time. Because

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Speaker 1: a lot of these stars are best when they have

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Speaker 1: the ball in their hands, and that's there's not a

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Speaker 1: better person in the league with the ball in their hands.

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Speaker 1: And Lucas so they're gonna hit, you know, his batman,

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Speaker 1: so to excuse me, his Robin so to speak, is

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Speaker 1: gonna have to be someone who's just as effective without

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Speaker 1: out the ball. But when he has the ball, he

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Speaker 1: can do what he needs to do. Yeah, and Jalen's small,

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Speaker 1: so he's not a great defender. So I really do

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Speaker 1: think you got to go find somebody who can score

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Speaker 1: but defend um. You know. One of the things about

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Speaker 1: the Warriors, it's amazing, like Cavon Looney has now become

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Speaker 1: an elite rebounder. Jordan Pools a Gee league guy. He boy,

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Speaker 1: he beats guys off the dribble like it is. It

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Speaker 1: is fast. They draft and develop. Really the key well key,

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Speaker 1: did you see it there? I mean, what's the secret

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Speaker 1: sauce if you look. I mean it's just like again

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Speaker 1: up top, you know, Bob Myers and those guys that

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Speaker 1: to me, leadership struts to the top. Because I was

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Speaker 1: in Golden State before obviously with the We Believe run

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Speaker 1: and it was just a different energy, a different environment. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we made NBA history, but when I went back this

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Speaker 1: second time, just the energy in that organization is just different,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So obviously being able to

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Speaker 1: draft and make big moves an eye for one, And

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Speaker 1: I apologize maybe four or five months ago I thought

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Speaker 1: that Andrew Wiggins move wasn't a good move because I'm thinking, okay, back,

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Speaker 1: you know, he Wiggins is not a shooter. He's not this,

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Speaker 1: he's not that. But he was exactly what they needed.

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Speaker 1: He was a guy they obviously get it, you know,

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Speaker 1: get it off the dribble with the ball in his hands.

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Speaker 1: He can, he can. He's a good spot up shooter.

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Speaker 1: M but he plays defense, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: So they just see things that other people don't. And

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Speaker 1: you know, if you think about it, their core was

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Speaker 1: all drafted by that team. Jordan Poole was drafted by

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Speaker 1: that team. Steph Clay were drafted by that team. They

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Speaker 1: have such a great eye for talent. Although they're a

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Speaker 1: destination organization still, but they just do such a great

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Speaker 1: job drafting and then kind of developing their guys. They

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Speaker 1: don't give up on their guys. So you know, obviously

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Speaker 1: hats off to manage because they've been able to build

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Speaker 1: some special in a day and age where we're seeing

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Speaker 1: players in particular but stars move so much. They've been

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Speaker 1: able to keep their core together, you know, and obviously

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Speaker 1: being able to bring back under Igudala, even though he

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Speaker 1: hasn't been able to provide anything game wise. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: he's giving these young players on the bench so much

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Speaker 1: knowledge and seeing things obviously because he's been with Discord

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Speaker 1: that not everyone is seeing. So to be able to

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Speaker 1: keep four very high IQ guys around, three guys that

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Speaker 1: are still giving to you, you know, you know, the

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Speaker 1: best they can. This Warrior team is special and that's

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Speaker 1: why at the very beginning to see I was just like,

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Speaker 1: you know, Clay comes back semi healthy, healthy and being

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Speaker 1: able to round themself in health coming into the playoffs

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Speaker 1: that I really don't see a team beating them because

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Speaker 1: they have all these weapons that even though about Jordan Pool,

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Speaker 1: Jordan Pool kind of up on the scene length, but

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Speaker 1: I just knew mentally in chemistry wise, those are two

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Speaker 1: things that I think that are overlooked in sports in general,

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Speaker 1: and those are the two things that they're best at. Well,

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Speaker 1: I mean, Wiggins if they face the Celtics, you can

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Speaker 1: just put them on Jason Tatum and you don't even

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Speaker 1: need his offense. I'll seriously just say, like dude told

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Speaker 1: him to forty two percent shooting, that's a win. I

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Speaker 1: thought he gave Luca trouble throughout it. Length, you know,

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Speaker 1: his length, his speed, and he's strong too. And really,

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Speaker 1: to me, it has off to Wiggins because obviously, you know,

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Speaker 1: everyone looked at him as a number one pick. Oh

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Speaker 1: he's a bus He's not this, but this has been

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Speaker 1: a consistent eighteen to twenty two pointing games for his

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Speaker 1: entire career. Comes to Golden State now where there's zero

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Speaker 1: pressure on him, you know, maybe the fourth option with

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Speaker 1: all due respect, but he's able to really go out

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Speaker 1: there and just be himself and when they need to

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Speaker 1: take over. I think it was a last game where

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Speaker 1: he had a big game. He was a leading score

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Speaker 1: last game. You know, it was just he can give

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Speaker 1: it to you however you'd like it. But but I

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Speaker 1: like this. He's been able to be that guy that

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Speaker 1: Clay was before the injury. If you remember, people don't

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Speaker 1: realize how important Clay was that team, not necessarily because

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Speaker 1: of a shooting Ovelough. He's one of the best shooters ever.

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Speaker 1: He was the guy that always took Kyrie, Dame Lillard,

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Speaker 1: CJ McCombs. So that step didn't you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: So now that Clay is still kind of rounding back

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Speaker 1: in shape, I kind of feel like Clay's defense is

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Speaker 1: the last thing that's coming back. But I have no

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Speaker 1: doubt that he'll get it back. But Wigans have been

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Speaker 1: able to step up at NB grade with his length,

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Speaker 1: his athleticism, his strength, and then his ability to play

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Speaker 1: passing length. You know, he's just been a huge, huge,

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Speaker 1: huge pickup for this team. The playoffs are here. You

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Speaker 1: I know Washington State High school football pretty well. You

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Speaker 1: were a no star recruit, and I was a no

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Speaker 1: star broadcasting recruit that went to Eastern. But I looked

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Speaker 1: back at Eastern and I was a small town kid

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Speaker 1: and I couldn't have handled a big school. I just

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Speaker 1: wasn't ready to go to a Texas you know whatever,

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Speaker 1: you know, Ohio State. I think back on my Eastern

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Speaker 1: days so fondly. I was in a dressler, one of

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Speaker 1: those circular Yeah, yep, I was on a great intramural

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Speaker 1: football team. I remember every player on that team. And

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Speaker 1: I think for a lot of people they look at

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Speaker 1: Eastern out in the middle of nowhere, but it's got

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Speaker 1: great spring, summer, fall weather. It's really good football. And

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Speaker 1: that's where I want to start with you. Like, you

348
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:09,000
Speaker 1: didn't get recruited by anybody, even though you had some

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Speaker 1: lineage in your family. Did you go to Eastern thinking

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Speaker 1: I'm lucky, I'm going to prove people wrong. Do you

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Speaker 1: remember your first month on campus. Yeah, I do. I

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Speaker 1: definitely remember that first time I got up there in June.

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Speaker 1: I got there as soon as I possibly could want

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Speaker 1: to be involved in the summer program and learning the

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Speaker 1: offense and doing all the different stuff. So I got

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Speaker 1: out there real early afterwards, and I definitely I had

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Speaker 1: an act. I was very grateful for the opportunity. You

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Speaker 1: go from this place where you know, I walked off

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Speaker 1: the football field my senior year the last game we

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Speaker 1: get absolutely stomped by a team out there in Spokane,

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Speaker 1: not far away from Eastern Washington, and get get absolutely

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Speaker 1: stomped by them. I walk off that field having just

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Speaker 1: gotten a stomp and having no scholarship offers. I don't

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Speaker 1: my last football game. I had put it all out there.

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Speaker 1: I didn't have anywhere. I didn't know if I was

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Speaker 1: playing college. So for me, it was a I was

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Speaker 1: grateful for the opportunity that Eastern provided. I was also

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Speaker 1: stepping into a place so there were three All American

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Speaker 1: receivers in front of me, so I was also very

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Speaker 1: excited about the opportunity to learn from some guys that

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Speaker 1: had done some really good stuff as well. So, um,

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Speaker 1: I got up there That was really my heart moving

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Speaker 1: up there and moving into that place, moving into Cheny

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Speaker 1: and being a part of that stuff. There's nothing to do.

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Speaker 1: There's not a whole lot to do up there except me.

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Speaker 1: Only you get to play football and be a part

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Speaker 1: of a really good program. Yeah, there was Zips's exactly.

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Speaker 1: There was zips I wasn't old enough to go to Like,

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00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:31,359
Speaker 1: was it Showne's or there was some bar, but I

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00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,680
Speaker 1: couldn't go to it until I was until I was

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Speaker 1: like a senior, and I felt really comfortable there because

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Speaker 1: I came. My high school football team had twenty nine players.

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Speaker 1: I was a quarterback, not very good, but um when

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Speaker 1: so your dad your dad was a quarterback in the

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Speaker 1: NFL Cowboys, Cardinals. Your grandfather was an offensive linemen. So

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Speaker 1: when I read your story, my guess is you were

387
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Speaker 1: a late bloomer, that you were athletic, but you like

388
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,440
Speaker 1: popped put on fifth twenty pounds. That was my guest.

389
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Speaker 1: When was the moment for you that, as a skinny

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00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:08,960
Speaker 1: high school player that you kind of did think for yourself,

391
00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:14,600
Speaker 1: think for yourself. Yeah, I can make some waves in

392
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Speaker 1: this sport and even think maybe Canadian football. I mean seriously,

393
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Speaker 1: like was there a moment. Do you remember thinking I

394
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:24,440
Speaker 1: wonder if I could play professionally? Yeah, I do, and

395
00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:27,119
Speaker 1: actually that that moment, as crazy as it sounds, that

396
00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 1: moment came when I was nine years old and I

397
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Speaker 1: stepped on the football field for the first time put

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Speaker 1: the pads on. I was at my brother's coach pitch

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Speaker 1: baseball game. There was a team practicing out in right field.

400
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:39,720
Speaker 1: I went checked it out and said, I want to

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Speaker 1: do this. Dad. Put the helmet shoulder pads on for

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00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:44,399
Speaker 1: the first time and first time playing. I said, this

403
00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:46,520
Speaker 1: is what I'm going to do. From that moment on,

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00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:49,040
Speaker 1: there was never a doubt in my mind that I

405
00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,159
Speaker 1: was going to play professional football. And I did. I

406
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,480
Speaker 1: waged in my freshman year. I was one hundred and

407
00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 1: fifteen pounds. I was five foot four. I put on

408
00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,520
Speaker 1: fifteen pounds consecutive every offseason, put on fifteen bounds, grew

409
00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:03,040
Speaker 1: a little bit here and there. It wasn't until really

410
00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:06,960
Speaker 1: my freshman sophomore year in college that I really started

411
00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:09,720
Speaker 1: to feel like I came into my body. But the

412
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:12,639
Speaker 1: doubt in terms of my mindset, my mindset never changed.

413
00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:15,480
Speaker 1: I got laughed at all the time, I wore ankle

414
00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:17,680
Speaker 1: weights to school every day because that's just what I

415
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,240
Speaker 1: felt like I needed to do to make the leaps

416
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:22,000
Speaker 1: and bounds that need to happen. But if you asked

417
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Speaker 1: me my freshman year, stepping on that scale, if you

418
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:25,960
Speaker 1: had asked me what I was gonna do, I was

419
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:27,880
Speaker 1: gonna go. I was gonna play running back at USC

420
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Speaker 1: and Paula Reggie Bush, and I was gonna go play

421
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Speaker 1: in the NFL. That was just it was just in

422
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Speaker 1: my mind, in my heart. It was setting something. So

423
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,960
Speaker 1: I have friends in some NFL offices, and I knew

424
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:43,800
Speaker 1: the Rams liked you, but I also knew the Chargers

425
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:48,480
Speaker 1: loved you. And so from two gms I know. They

426
00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:50,440
Speaker 1: asked me, They're like, you're an Eastern kid. Do you

427
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:52,439
Speaker 1: know this kid? And I'm like, listen, they love him.

428
00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:56,040
Speaker 1: He's the hardest working guy on the team, totally focused.

429
00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:00,359
Speaker 1: So the Rams come up on the red field and

430
00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:04,760
Speaker 1: mcvay's up there, And so the day they're flying in,

431
00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:07,879
Speaker 1: are you nervous as all get out knowing you have

432
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,520
Speaker 1: gonna have to perform for Sean McVay. Yeah, So you're

433
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,399
Speaker 1: talking about like going through like pro day and like

434
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:15,680
Speaker 1: when like they came off to the private workouts. Yeah,

435
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,639
Speaker 1: so I got I worked out with Tennessee Titans. Um,

436
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:20,840
Speaker 1: I had private workout with the Titans, and I had

437
00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:24,639
Speaker 1: a private workout with the Rams, and uh, when the

438
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,440
Speaker 1: Rams came out, I was very excited about it. I

439
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 1: don't know, I know, good nerves, A good a good nervous,

440
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:32,040
Speaker 1: but you don't know what. You don't know what they're

441
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:33,399
Speaker 1: gonna throw at you. You know, when I was with

442
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,560
Speaker 1: the Titans came out first, you know, John Robinson playing

443
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,880
Speaker 1: BB on me and I was releasing against the GM

444
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:40,320
Speaker 1: and doing stuff like that, So you never know what

445
00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,080
Speaker 1: they're gonna throw at you. UM, I was excited about

446
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:46,840
Speaker 1: I knew that in my meeting with them at the UM,

447
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,040
Speaker 1: you know, at the Combine stuff. I knew that there

448
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,640
Speaker 1: was a you know, a cerebral nature to the offense

449
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:54,879
Speaker 1: that Sean McVay was running with the Rams that he

450
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:56,879
Speaker 1: was bringing in, and I was excited about that. I

451
00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 1: was excited about me will step in and do some

452
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,760
Speaker 1: of the things that they were asking some of their

453
00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:02,920
Speaker 1: guys to do. So when they came out, I just

454
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 1: wanted to be able to be at my peak. I

455
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:06,800
Speaker 1: want to make sure that I could perform for him.

456
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:08,879
Speaker 1: But I also knew actually had to trust in who

457
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 1: I was and what I was as a player, and

458
00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 1: I knew that I was good enough to play in

459
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,760
Speaker 1: this league. It was just about getting an opportunity. So

460
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:18,439
Speaker 1: you go from Eastern and then you go to your

461
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:23,720
Speaker 1: first camp, and that's a big leap. I mean it's

462
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:25,959
Speaker 1: it's the Carson Wentz has had to make it from

463
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:30,800
Speaker 1: that level. Trey Lance, Now you make that leap. So

464
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,560
Speaker 1: it's hard enough to make the leap from Ohio State

465
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:38,080
Speaker 1: to the NFL. Do you remember your first NFL practice? Yeah, no,

466
00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,359
Speaker 1: I do. I do. Luckily we were able to go

467
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:41,760
Speaker 1: through a little bit of a mini camp first, the

468
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,119
Speaker 1: little rookie mini camp. But I remember coming out here

469
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,680
Speaker 1: that first day and there is an uptick in the

470
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:51,120
Speaker 1: speed and the intensity. Certainly there's not room for there's

471
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:53,960
Speaker 1: not much room for air. And quickly it was the

472
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:57,119
Speaker 1: realization of how important the details are, the details and

473
00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,840
Speaker 1: your technique. We're going to set you free in this league.

474
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,639
Speaker 1: And I love that though. I love the challenge that

475
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,640
Speaker 1: that presented, the opportunity presented for me all to die

476
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 1: in dial into those things. Those are all things that

477
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 1: were under my control technique, being able to be intentional

478
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 1: with how I wanted to run my routes, being able

479
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,719
Speaker 1: to understand the game. Those are all things that are

480
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:17,760
Speaker 1: completely under my control. And I knew I could dive

481
00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 1: into those details and get to the point where I'm

482
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 1: processing things quicker and I'm taking advantage of those of

483
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,920
Speaker 1: those aspects. I knew that my body was gonna follow

484
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:29,359
Speaker 1: along after that. Um So, I love that challenge that

485
00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:31,399
Speaker 1: I was presented from day one. Just the importance of

486
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:33,480
Speaker 1: all those things, and I'm being able to step into

487
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:37,120
Speaker 1: that has has been great. Can you name the six

488
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,520
Speaker 1: receivers drafted before you? I name all, name the six

489
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:44,440
Speaker 1: of them. I'm probably gonna mess up right near the

490
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,480
Speaker 1: end there, but I know you know you had Gen Ross,

491
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,200
Speaker 1: you had Corey Davis, Go, had Mike Williams go. You

492
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 1: had Za Jones went to Buffalo and Zay. I was

493
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: a big fan of Za's coming out. Um d juju.

494
00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:04,360
Speaker 1: Maybe you had Curtis Samuel Boom six for six. You're

495
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,680
Speaker 1: like Brady. He can hit every quarterback that got picked

496
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:12,200
Speaker 1: out of him when in the route tree. One of

497
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,240
Speaker 1: the things I think, and if I'm wrong, tell me,

498
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 1: but one of the things I noticed with you, and

499
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:18,840
Speaker 1: it reminds me a little to Jerry Rice is that

500
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:22,399
Speaker 1: people always talked about it's kind of legendary that Jerry

501
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:25,920
Speaker 1: wasn't a burner. But what Jerry did and you do.

502
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,119
Speaker 1: You don't slow down off your routes like you just

503
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:34,200
Speaker 1: go the same speed. And it's interesting because it seems

504
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,640
Speaker 1: like everybody would do that, but it's not true. Did

505
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 1: you copy emulate? Is it natural that you don't slow

506
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,119
Speaker 1: down off a route? And I think that's harder than

507
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,760
Speaker 1: people think. Where does that come from? Yeah? I really

508
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,359
Speaker 1: think it comes down to this. I was very lucky

509
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,920
Speaker 1: my quarterback coach growing up. The quarterback that has to

510
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 1: this day throw me the most passes I've seen the

511
00:24:56,880 --> 00:25:00,200
Speaker 1: most sign with is my dad, and I had fell

512
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 1: quarterback be my receiver coach from the very beginning. That

513
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 1: that's who I learned to run routes from. You're learning

514
00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,879
Speaker 1: to run routes from a quarterback's perspective. You have no

515
00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 1: other option except to make the quarterback look good because

516
00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: if you don't make a go right notes, look that

517
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 1: he's going to tell you something about it. So you

518
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 1: know everything I did every route that I ran ever

519
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 1: growing up. Everything that I've ever learned from the receiver position,

520
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:23,120
Speaker 1: I learned through the eyes of a quarterback and how

521
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 1: to be friendly, how to be able to give indicator

522
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 1: steps and be friendly to a quarterback, nurse of the

523
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 1: angles that you're coming out with, being a friendly target.

524
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 1: All those things came from the back that I had

525
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,639
Speaker 1: a quarterback teaching how to play the position, and you

526
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:38,040
Speaker 1: know all this. You know, I was very lucky in

527
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 1: that and just at a young, very young age, just

528
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 1: became intrinsically that's just how I understood the position. So

529
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:47,840
Speaker 1: having that as a foundation was a huge blessing for me.

530
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:52,240
Speaker 1: So then you go to Sean McVeigh and you know

531
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:56,680
Speaker 1: McVeigh is he's just he's so intense, like he's like

532
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: a ball of energy, and he says like he loved

533
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:05,320
Speaker 1: coaching Cooper Cup. Has Sean McVeagh ever yell at you,

534
00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I get yelled at all the time. I

535
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,160
Speaker 1: get yelled at all the time. That's a great thing too, though,

536
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 1: you know, there's a he is. He's very hard on

537
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:15,480
Speaker 1: the people around. He's also very hard on the people

538
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,880
Speaker 1: he has great expectations for and so um, certainly there's

539
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: gonna be ways. We see the game in a very

540
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 1: similar way, but there's also things that we see differently.

541
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 1: You know, we as a coach, as a receiver, you

542
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 1: know when I am when he used watching the game

543
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,920
Speaker 1: from a bird's eye view, from his angle, from his perspective,

544
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 1: he might see things differently than I do. And this

545
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 1: is a game, it's a game of of you know,

546
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 1: playing in the gray. That so much of what you

547
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 1: have to do in this position, at what we do

548
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 1: is playing in the gray and making decisions, you know,

549
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 1: real quick processing um and uh. You know, we have

550
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 1: to be decisive and you don't have time to sit

551
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 1: there and think about it. You just have to make

552
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:53,480
Speaker 1: make a decision and go. And so certainly there's times

553
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:55,200
Speaker 1: that we see things differently and have to have a

554
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:57,680
Speaker 1: you know, a spirited discussion about, you know, what the

555
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,240
Speaker 1: right way is to do it. But the greatest thing

556
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 1: here is Sean's humility and his ability to understand that

557
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 1: collaboration is at the end of the day, if we

558
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 1: can collaborate together and hear the voices that need to

559
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 1: be heard and come to a solution, we're going to

560
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: be at the right place. It's not about one person

561
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: making decisions saying we're going this way, so I'm figuring

562
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: out together what's the best for us and then being

563
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 1: able to be as efficient and effective as poss was

564
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:25,639
Speaker 1: an offense. Listen, you were good friends with Jared Goff,

565
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: but it's a business. It happens. Mil Keiper once told

566
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 1: me that Matt Stafford was owned one of the only

567
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 1: quarterbacks he'd ever seen that could have gone high school

568
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 1: to the pros. You could have put him on a roster,

569
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: had him back up, grow up, mature. What was the

570
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: first pass Stafford through to you in practice that you

571
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 1: were like, whoa, I mean, it's Matt Scott, Like he

572
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,200
Speaker 1: could be a starting pitcher in Major League Baseball, Like

573
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: it's rare, it's top four or five in the league.

574
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 1: Could you hear it? They hear the spin? Was there

575
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:01,640
Speaker 1: a moment you were like, this dude's got an arm. Yeah,

576
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:03,800
Speaker 1: you know what's funny, he's bringing us up. I ain't

577
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 1: thought about this, but probably the play that happened during

578
00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,640
Speaker 1: OTA is probably a year ago to a day almost

579
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 1: that it was like the light went on, like, oh

580
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:14,879
Speaker 1: that is what makes this guy great? Is it the

581
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 1: exact same play that we ran that he know looked

582
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 1: in the Super Bowl was honestly the first that that

583
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 1: was the first time where I went back I felt

584
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,399
Speaker 1: what he had done. I I think he might have

585
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 1: just know look that one and I went back and

586
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: watched on film and seeing him manipulate people underneath and

587
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:33,840
Speaker 1: do what he did with his eyes and being will

588
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: throw the ball that he did. It was literally on

589
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: the exact same play that he knows looking the Super Bowl,

590
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 1: you know, when he had that great one on that

591
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 1: last drive. It was literally the exact same play. But yeah,

592
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,840
Speaker 1: that was the moment where it's like, this guy has

593
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 1: something that is different. It's not he's not a quarterback

594
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 1: that's reactive, you know. That's saying take with the defense

595
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 1: gives you a lot of the times that's true. He

596
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,920
Speaker 1: also understands how to say, no, I'm going to dictate

597
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 1: where this ball is going and move the people and

598
00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: make sure that I can make the throw that I

599
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: want to make. That's gonna be the big play that

600
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: that throw against Tampa when I mean Cooper like literally

601
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:17,360
Speaker 1: the boats losing water. Like I'm sitting there watching going guys,

602
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 1: come on, get it together. It's like one of those

603
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 1: NBA runs. Somebody hit a basket. I know, so you

604
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: on that play, was that take me? Was that going

605
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,520
Speaker 1: to be I'm throwing it to you period? Or was

606
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 1: he watching the break? Because that was really that really

607
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 1: was the play of the season for you at that point. Yeah,

608
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,400
Speaker 1: So that play wasn't even called for me. That play

609
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 1: was called for Van Jefferson running a little dagger out.

610
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: I was going to try to occupy the deep safety trap,

611
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: pull out some guys running down the middle of the

612
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:48,240
Speaker 1: field and Van Jefferson's running a little widen dagger in

613
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 1: cut at like twenty yards. I was coming in there

614
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: and the ball is going to be coming to him,

615
00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: and we're gonna try to get up there, spike the

616
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: ball and get one more play and they end up

617
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:02,480
Speaker 1: sliding that zero late, don't quite hit it how they

618
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: want to. I feel a safety slide over and I

619
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 1: just hit it and hope that Matthew Zham Bill to

620
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: get that thing up. And uh, I mean what Matthew did.

621
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: What let's not appreciate on that play. Matthew Bill a

622
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,240
Speaker 1: c zero buy enough time and he put the ball

623
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: up when I was about twelve thirteen yards down the field,

624
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 1: but it wasn't caught until about forty or forty plus

625
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: the yards down the field. You know, for him to

626
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: put the air on it that he needed to to

627
00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 1: allow me to catch that instride as long as I

628
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,960
Speaker 1: was running down the field. It was an incredible throw

629
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: in his bar. You know, it's interesting when OBJ came

630
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: to the Rams, he was really effective in that Super Bowl.

631
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:46,080
Speaker 1: He was also really effective immediately. Do you ever whether

632
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: it's Robert Woods or Obj, do you ever watch other

633
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 1: guys on film coop and you're just like, you know,

634
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 1: I'm gonna borrow that like a footwork an angle? Like

635
00:30:57,040 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: do you still like like Obj? If I said to

636
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,760
Speaker 1: you what you see when you watch Obj as a receiver,

637
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 1: His patience at the top of the routes, his ability

638
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: to no matter what happens if he loses his release,

639
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 1: his ability to be patient enough and trust at the

640
00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 1: depth of his route and the timing and what he's

641
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: going to come open within the progression of wherever the

642
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 1: play is. His ability to understand that and understand that

643
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 1: the patients to the top of the route is going

644
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:24,160
Speaker 1: to allow him to win. Still us my biggest thing

645
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 1: about Odell. He plays with such confidence and such patience. Um,

646
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 1: that's a great thing. That's that's the position. I mean,

647
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 1: it is an art form because it's not about just

648
00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 1: how fast you can run. It's getting open at the

649
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 1: right time as well being in the right place at

650
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: the right time. And you know his ability to get

651
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 1: to the top of routes, and you know understanding how

652
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:43,480
Speaker 1: to use his eyes some nplay guys face freezing guys.

653
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 1: He did an incredible job at that. So and certainly

654
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: I want to grab things from guys as much as

655
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:50,959
Speaker 1: I possibly can. This is I said, Receiver is an

656
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 1: art form. I want to grab as much as I

657
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:54,680
Speaker 1: can from other people. It's not all gonna work. I

658
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: can't do the things that Calvin Johnson did. You know,

659
00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 1: there's some Andrew Hawkings attacks and stuff that he does

660
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: that I couldn't do. But grabbing little pieces from each

661
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 1: guy and being able to say how much how many

662
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 1: tools can add to my utility boat, how many things

663
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 1: can have up you know, a week in and week

664
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:12,520
Speaker 1: out to bell allow me to win. I'm all about that,

665
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: you know, Jason. I understand people who hate the Warriors.

666
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 1: They acquired KD, you know, Steph smugging for the camera.

667
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: They've won a lot, Like I get it. But I

668
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 1: think it's beautiful basketball. The cutting. You know, there are

669
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:38,719
Speaker 1: a lot of teams say they get along. I can

670
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: watch the Warriors until they get along, and I don't

671
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,959
Speaker 1: know if it's Kurr, it's Steph, it's Clay, but there

672
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 1: is a harmony. Jason. You can go to the y

673
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 1: and there are just times you get the right five

674
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 1: guys and they're just they move without the ball. But

675
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 1: I the harmony watching the Warriors play. You can hate them.

676
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 1: They don't even look like the remaining three offenses to me,

677
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:05,320
Speaker 1: I mean, you're a hooper. I love watching them play.

678
00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: I think it's tremendous television. That's might take on Golden State.

679
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 1: They're impossible to replicate, you know, they're the most unique

680
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 1: team in the NBA, and teams have tried, but they failed.

681
00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,520
Speaker 1: Do you remember the Luca Donschitz trade, the one that

682
00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: sent the Atlanta Hawks two first round picks, one for

683
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 1: Trey Young, one for Kevin Herder, And all the talk

684
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 1: surrounding that day was we're trying to replicate the Steph

685
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 1: Clay backcourt. And then they went out to play basketball

686
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:35,600
Speaker 1: and they played just like everyone else because it's such

687
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 1: a unique style and it requires a selflessness and a

688
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: commitment to moving without the basketball being a threat at

689
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,240
Speaker 1: all times, you know, being a part of something bigger

690
00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 1: than yourself. But not only that, but a commitment to

691
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: the defensive end. Steph and Clay pretty much from their

692
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 1: time when they first started playing with Team USA, embraced

693
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 1: the defensive end in a way that so many offensive

694
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,280
Speaker 1: minded guards have not. And when you combine that with

695
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 1: their you know, unique offensive play style, they're extremely difficult

696
00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 1: to replicate to prepare for. I think Dallas. You know,

697
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 1: they're making Dallas look bad. Dallas is not bad. Dallas

698
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,719
Speaker 1: was the second best team in the league since January. First.

699
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: They beat Phoenix for a good reason. You know, they demonstrated,

700
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 1: you know, their ability to completely dissect you know, traditional

701
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 1: basketball teams. The Golden State's not a traditional basketball team.

702
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 1: They're gonna puts you in tough spots and Dallas just

703
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:30,719
Speaker 1: hasn't been able to match it. You Know, I said

704
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: before the series, I thought Phoenix, outside of McHale Bridges,

705
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 1: you know, Booker and Chris Paul just don't match up

706
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,400
Speaker 1: at all with Luca. He's thick. You know, people lament

707
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 1: his cardio shape, but he's he's heavy. I mean, he's

708
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 1: like a he's like a lumbering fullback. He's just a

709
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 1: lot of body on you. But Draymond and Wiggins and

710
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,520
Speaker 1: they didn't play comingo much. But he and I just

711
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 1: found throughout the course of this series is they didn't

712
00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:04,759
Speaker 1: buy his pump fakes. Like Wiggins is so twitchy, he

713
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,440
Speaker 1: doesn't have to he'll block the shot. And I think

714
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 1: there was a real discipline the way Golden State played.

715
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 1: They're like, listen, we're gonna just keep him in front

716
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,560
Speaker 1: of us, don't buy his fakes. If he hits the shots,

717
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 1: he hits the shots. And I thought it's good at

718
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:19,799
Speaker 1: Monty Williams is a good coach, but I didn't think

719
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 1: they were terribly disciplined with Luca got any pump fake

720
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 1: and Phoenix was in the air, and I think Golden

721
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 1: States just said, we're not leaving our feet. I mean

722
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,120
Speaker 1: I can almost hear occur we're not leaving our feet.

723
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: That That's what when I watched them against Luca, whether

724
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,879
Speaker 1: it's a box, a trap, the zone, it's it's all

725
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,719
Speaker 1: the same principles to me. And I think Luca, not

726
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:45,320
Speaker 1: that he's frustrated, but it's it's he gets almost everybody

727
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 1: in the league Jason in the air, and Golden State's

728
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 1: not buying any of it. Yeah, Andrew Wiggins' twitchiness buys

729
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 1: him margin for error on defense. He doesn't have to

730
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 1: beat you to a spot. He can recover that elite

731
00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:02,680
Speaker 1: recovery athleticism basically allows him to play more disciplined on defense.

732
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:04,759
Speaker 1: You know, I thought a huge swing factor in this

733
00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 1: series was, you know, coming into the series, the question was,

734
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: are we going to let Luca play isolation ball and

735
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 1: stay home on shooters, or are we going to send

736
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: help towards Luca and you know, play the gambling game

737
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 1: with the shooting. And throughout this entire series, there's been

738
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 1: one stretch where Dallas has consistently made shots, and it

739
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: was the first half of Game two, and they decided

740
00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: to mail in the defensive end in the second half.

741
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,279
Speaker 1: The thing that young, young, inexperienced teams that haven't built

742
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 1: up the necessary scar tissue, the pain of losing, they

743
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 1: let an opportunity slip there because they rely so heavily

744
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 1: because Golden State was sending so much help to Luca.

745
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,200
Speaker 1: They rely on people knocking down those open shots and

746
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:45,839
Speaker 1: to be clear, they did for two rounds. They were

747
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:49,319
Speaker 1: an amazing, wide open three point shooting team. But they

748
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:51,840
Speaker 1: got into this series and they stopped going down and

749
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:55,280
Speaker 1: they had no second punch and versatility wins in the playoffs.

750
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 1: If you can take away a team's best punch and

751
00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,239
Speaker 1: they don't have a counter that they can go to,

752
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:01,439
Speaker 1: your own is always going to win. In that case,

753
00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:03,880
Speaker 1: Golden State has a bunch of different ways they can go.

754
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,239
Speaker 1: I made this argument the other day. When the Patriots

755
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:10,960
Speaker 1: had their dynasty, they could have won all of them

756
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:12,920
Speaker 1: or lost all of them. I mean they were all.

757
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 1: I mean, people lament the Mario Manningham catch if they're

758
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 1: a Patriot fan or David Tyree. They every single game

759
00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 1: other than maybe the Rams was an absolute peril with

760
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 1: four minutes to go. The Warriors are different. The Warriors

761
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 1: have had bad breaks. They fell apart against Toronto. Literally

762
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 1: all but one starter was hurt. They were a better

763
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: team easily, you know, certainly Kyrie hit maybe the shot

764
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:44,719
Speaker 1: of the decade, but there was a Draymond suspension. I

765
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 1: think Andrew Boget got hurt, like that's right, that's right.

766
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:52,800
Speaker 1: And I look at the Warriors and I think I

767
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,359
Speaker 1: think they're a better dynasty than we think that. That's

768
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 1: my takeaway. Now, I may be a little hyperbolic because

769
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: I love their style. Where do we put them? How

770
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:05,279
Speaker 1: is there there's two versions? Now we're moving to a

771
00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 1: third version. Is it possible they're actually in a sport

772
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:14,319
Speaker 1: that tends to popularize the fun and flashy. They don't

773
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:17,879
Speaker 1: get enough credit. No, they don't get nearly enough credit

774
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 1: that you know. It's it's I think what you're seeing too,

775
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:23,280
Speaker 1: that people are glossing over here is just how insanely

776
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:26,480
Speaker 1: talented the league is. And I think I think Lebron

777
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,280
Speaker 1: gets hurt in this regard as well. People Stephan Lebron,

778
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 1: the Warriors, and Lebron made this look easy when it's not,

779
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:36,480
Speaker 1: when the league is as talented as it is, Like,

780
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:39,359
Speaker 1: this is a very good Dallas team that they are

781
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,680
Speaker 1: dismantling right now. You know that Memphis team was, even

782
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 1: without John Morant, an entirely different beasts that they had

783
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:50,320
Speaker 1: to deal with. But you know, most importantly it speaks

784
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:53,279
Speaker 1: to the consistency. You talked about luck. One of the

785
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:55,200
Speaker 1: easiest ways to counter that is to give yourself a

786
00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:58,640
Speaker 1: bunch of shots at the table. You know, in terms

787
00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 1: of winning a championship, a lot of things do have

788
00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:02,840
Speaker 1: to go your way. But if you put yourself in

789
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:05,440
Speaker 1: position seven times, chances are your win three or four

790
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 1: of them. And that's the that's the advantage of consistent success.

791
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: Sometimes things break your way. It's like the twenty twenty

792
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,399
Speaker 1: titles for the Lakers. You know, a lot of things

793
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: went their way. Stuff got hurt, Kevin Durant got hurt.

794
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:17,560
Speaker 1: You know, you end up playing a Miami Heat team

795
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:20,320
Speaker 1: in the finals. That's very flawed. But again, just you

796
00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 1: get enough cracks at the table that goes your way.

797
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:26,480
Speaker 1: It's the counterbalance to Kyrie getting hurt and Kevin Love

798
00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:28,880
Speaker 1: getting hurt in twenty fifteen. You got to get to

799
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 1: the table enough times so that some things can go

800
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:36,879
Speaker 1: your way. Let me give you one Laker question. When

801
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:39,359
Speaker 1: the Lakers brought into Westbrook, I'm not a Westbrook fan,

802
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,359
Speaker 1: and I you know, my takeaway was an obvious one.

803
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: He can't play off the ball and Lebron is a

804
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 1: de facto point guard and should be. It's it's like

805
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,960
Speaker 1: what Yannis or Luca has become. Like just that's where

806
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: the offense gets the genesis of the offense for the

807
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 1: Bucks is Yannis. I mean, I can see the offense.

808
00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:59,279
Speaker 1: It's the same thing every time down the floor. Here

809
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 1: comes Drew Holiday off the curl, and it's like, okay,

810
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:04,279
Speaker 1: this is what they do. So Lebron's gonna have the

811
00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,879
Speaker 1: ball that every offense that Lebron's on it, they all

812
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 1: looked the same. They're all generated from the same space,

813
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:12,960
Speaker 1: and they should because he's a brilliant ball handler and

814
00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:17,080
Speaker 1: one of the great passers of all time. So but

815
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: I thought that My takeaway was, well, Anthony Davis has

816
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:24,319
Speaker 1: hurt a lot. Lebron gives you probably sixty five games. Now,

817
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:27,400
Speaker 1: somebody's got to score twenty eight. They just don't have

818
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:32,080
Speaker 1: enough scores. And then the toxicity was worse. He was

819
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 1: worse than I thought. And I'm like the least Westbrook

820
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 1: centric guy in the league in the media, I think

821
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 1: you have to move him because it's not just a fit.

822
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:47,920
Speaker 1: He lacks self awareness and you know, Jason, you can

823
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,200
Speaker 1: be a lot of things, but if you don't get it,

824
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 1: and you don't get you don't get it, you're not coachable.

825
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 1: I don't. I think you have to move him, and

826
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:02,560
Speaker 1: I think they're leaking the story that coaches are being

827
00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:07,440
Speaker 1: asked how Westbrook would work because they want teams to

828
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 1: think they're gonna give it another try, But I don't

829
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 1: think they want to. As my take on it, what

830
00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 1: do you think the Lakers look like Game one next year?

831
00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:21,200
Speaker 1: They simply can't bring him back in terms of in

832
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 1: terms of how bad this year was, which is an

833
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 1: all time catastrophe. We're talking about a team that literally

834
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 1: was the second leading favorite in Vegas going into the season.

835
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:35,799
Speaker 1: It's a catastrophe, a catastrophe of all time NBA history proportions,

836
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,000
Speaker 1: and you need to somehow cleanse that. And like, I

837
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:41,040
Speaker 1: don't care what Russ says, which, by the way, his

838
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 1: exit presser was one of the most ridiculous things I've

839
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:46,840
Speaker 1: ever seen in terms of a person deflecting any and

840
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 1: all blame for anything that happened to him during the season.

841
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 1: But if you're gonna reset, you can't bring that guy

842
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 1: back into training camp. I don't care if he makes apologies.

843
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 1: I don't care if he works hard this summer. There's

844
00:41:57,239 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 1: no that would be such a bad gamble on their part.

845
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:03,720
Speaker 1: And what's dangerous here is the pride, because the reality

846
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:05,799
Speaker 1: is is you might have to attach a first round

847
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:07,759
Speaker 1: pick to Russ to get rid of him, But the

848
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 1: front office is concerned to the optics of that, which

849
00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 1: is exactly because we've seen reporting the Lakers don't want

850
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:15,359
Speaker 1: to attach a first round pick to Russ. That's great,

851
00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:17,440
Speaker 1: nobody wants him, So how are you going to get

852
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 1: rid of him unless you're willing to attach an asset

853
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:22,520
Speaker 1: to him? Right and at a certain point that pride

854
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,360
Speaker 1: and just no one in the entire hierarchy of the

855
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:28,600
Speaker 1: Lakers is willing to just admit they made a mistake

856
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:30,560
Speaker 1: and move on. And clinging to that has been the

857
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 1: biggest problem. But the only way I will feel even

858
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:36,040
Speaker 1: remotely optimistic about this is if they can get him out.

859
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,400
Speaker 1: And the advantage here is if you can flip him

860
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:43,839
Speaker 1: for we'll call him overpaid role players, because you're going

861
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 1: to get bad contracts in return, because Russ is a

862
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 1: bad contract. But there are overpaid role players that are

863
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 1: better basketball players in a small role next to Lebron

864
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:54,800
Speaker 1: in ad than they would be elsewhere. Andrew Wiggins is

865
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:58,800
Speaker 1: a fantastic example of this max contract in Minnesota. You

866
00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:01,440
Speaker 1: don't want anything to do with it. Role player alongside

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00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,000
Speaker 1: really good players all of a sudden, he's a functional piece.

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00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 1: So embracing that and understanding that, you know, flipping one

869
00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:10,880
Speaker 1: bad contract that can't play for you for two or

870
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:14,840
Speaker 1: three bad contracts that can immediately play roles alongside Lebron

871
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,320
Speaker 1: James and Anthony Davis. That's a lot better option for you.

872
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:21,480
Speaker 1: So I mean, I will, I will feel horrible for

873
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:23,360
Speaker 1: Laker fans if they bring Rush back. That would be

874
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: such an unbelievable disaster. The volume. Make sure to check

875
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 1: out The dram On Green Show. I brought Draymond Green

876
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:50,720
Speaker 1: into the volume because one of the more entertaining voices

877
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:55,280
Speaker 1: in sports. Unique perspective understands behind the rope, also chops

878
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:58,920
Speaker 1: up with guests like Gary Peyton, Zach Levine, Tracy McGrady.

879
00:43:59,080 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 1: Make sure down mold The Draymond Green Show wherever you

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00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 1: get your podcasts, only on the Volume podcast Network