1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,119 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh 3 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: and there's Chuck and Jerry's here too, So it's a 4 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: good old fashioned hooting and holler and how down of 5 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 1: a Stuff you Should Know episode. Yeehaw. Uh, this is 6 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 1: your pick the tar Otah, I'm sorry, that's okay. Uh. 7 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: You know who's into this a little bit? Uh? Fortune tellers, 8 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:39,200 Speaker 1: wealth tarrot specifically who my wife? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. 9 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:41,520 Speaker 1: Emily has gotten into it a little bit, and she's 10 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,640 Speaker 1: definitely of the of the state of mind of like, listen, 11 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:48,600 Speaker 1: this is something I do in the morning to sort 12 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: of have a little quiet time. And I don't think 13 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 1: she thinks that it like guides her life or has 14 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: any sort of magic qualities. I think it's a little 15 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: more one of those things like I'm gonna see what 16 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 1: my cards say and just sort of ruminate on that 17 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:04,400 Speaker 1: stuff and maybe it'll open up some new ideas and 18 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 1: thoughts about life. I was reading a Vogue article that 19 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: was pretty in depth about it, and that seems to 20 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:15,919 Speaker 1: be the general usage of tarot these days, and it's huge. 21 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:21,120 Speaker 1: It's gotten really big lately, apparently in a billion dollars 22 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: worth of tarot cards were sold around the world. Yeah, 23 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: and they're expecting it to go up by another quarter 24 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:30,520 Speaker 1: billion in the next three years. So it's definitely a thing. 25 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 1: For sure, it's having a moment, But um, it is 26 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 1: kind of reassuring that it's not like following like the 27 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:41,320 Speaker 1: crystals are essential oil healing tract and instead people are like, 28 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:44,199 Speaker 1: I'm just using this to reflect on my my life. Yeah. 29 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: And I think she also likes just thinks the cards 30 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: are beautiful and cool looking and appreciates the art and 31 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: that kind of thing, which they They are very and 32 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:57,960 Speaker 1: they can be expensive and super beautiful. Yeah. Do you 33 00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: do you know what deck she has them? Sure, it's 34 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 1: probably just the standard shopping ball tech from Spencer's Gifts. 35 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: The the Green Day Tarot Day? Is there really a 36 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: green Day? I know some bands have their own, I 37 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 1: don't think so it's possible. Who knows that Billy Billy 38 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 1: Joe Armstrong is. He's very innovative little guy. So, um, 39 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: we are talking about tarot cards today. I think we 40 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 1: let the cat out of the bag already. Um, and 41 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: they are not as old as you would think. And 42 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 1: then their use of um for divination purposes is even 43 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: younger than that. And there was a really long standing 44 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 1: myth that I thought was correct up until yesterday. The 45 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: day before that, playing cards evolved out of tarot cards 46 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:54,640 Speaker 1: in in an effort to conceal them at a time 47 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 1: when people had to like watch out with their mysticism, 48 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: their esoteric knowledge the occult, else they might be persecuted, 49 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 1: so they developed them into playing cards like we have today. 50 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:07,880 Speaker 1: That is absolutely false, and in fact, playing cards were 51 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:13,800 Speaker 1: around centuries before the tarot deck came along. Yeah, that's true. Uh. 52 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,920 Speaker 1: And people generally think it seems like so many things 53 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 1: go back to ancient China, but a lot of people 54 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:24,400 Speaker 1: agree that they were invented in China in the thirteenth 55 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: century and then sort of spread their roots from there. 56 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 1: But like you said that, regular playing cards were around 57 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 1: before this and the tarot we're twenty two different designs 58 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: that were eventually added to a deck. And this was 59 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: for playing games like card games. Uh. And it became 60 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 1: like a much larger deck and all of a sudden 61 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: you could play, you know, with more cards that are different. 62 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 1: You can play more complex than interesting games. Right, So 63 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 1: you have China inventing playing cards apparently, it's spreading to Egypt, 64 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: which I had not heard of this UM group. Had 65 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: you before the mom Luke Empire? I had not mom 66 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 1: Luke without an a in the middle. It's not a 67 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 1: Mama Luke right now, just that mom Luke. They were. 68 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 1: They were Muslims who controlled Egypt for about three hundred years, 69 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,600 Speaker 1: from like I think the to the sixteenth centuries maybe, 70 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: and they UM somehow got their hands on the playing 71 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:29,479 Speaker 1: cards that China had invented, and they kind of made 72 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: their own flourishes to it. UM. The suits were kind 73 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 1: of familiar UM like you might UM you might see today, 74 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:39,839 Speaker 1: kind of especially in the Tarot deck. But one of 75 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: the big differences was polo sticks. That was one of 76 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:45,440 Speaker 1: the suits because apparently the UM, the people who were 77 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: running the show really liked playing polo. But polo was 78 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,480 Speaker 1: invented in Iran. If I'm not mistaken, is that correct? 79 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 1: I didn't know that it was the word clue the 80 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 1: other day, very nice, which which cross Chicago Tribune, New 81 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 1: York Times. Is there any other No, there really isn't. UM. 82 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 1: I'm sorry a person who writes the Chicago Tribune cross word, 83 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: you do a very good job. It's not fair um So, 84 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 1: the mom Luke Empire spread out from Egypt. They they 85 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 1: they had conquests and I think maybe even trade with 86 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:19,360 Speaker 1: other places around the Mediterranean. One of the things they 87 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:22,360 Speaker 1: did was they went to Italy and they brought with 88 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:26,159 Speaker 1: them their cards, and it seems like in Italy that's 89 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: where Tarot was first created. And it wasn't again, not 90 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 1: created for divination. It was created to make games much 91 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: more interesting. Yeah, I found it really interesting how many 92 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:42,840 Speaker 1: cultural things were spread through either war, uh in the military, 93 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: or you know, I guess you know, oftentimes trade as well. 94 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 1: But it seems like we talk a lot on the 95 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 1: show about like someone went to war with something else 96 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: and the people that they were fighting he loved this 97 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,760 Speaker 1: food or this game or this whatever and took it home. Yeah, 98 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:02,720 Speaker 1: that's how Lincoln Logs came about. Really, I don't think 99 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: it sounds like I don't know about this Lincoln guy, 100 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 1: but these logs, right, people are crazy for them, So 101 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 1: that's they exported. I guess in that sense. Yes, that's 102 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:17,039 Speaker 1: how Lincoln Logs got over there. So, um I think 103 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:20,039 Speaker 1: we're gonna cut that last little lame addition to the 104 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 1: joke out later. Um So, when it arrived in in uh, Italy, Chuck, 105 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 1: it was known as try no Fee, which is another 106 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: term for the Italian carnival festivals that you see with 107 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:36,719 Speaker 1: the masks and everything. But then shortly after that it 108 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: changed the names to taroak, which apparently means foolish, stupid, simple, 109 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: something like that. And they think that that the name 110 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:51,479 Speaker 1: change happened when they introduced the fool and they by 111 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:54,160 Speaker 1: introducing the fool card, which is a very well known 112 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: um tarot card as we'll talk about later. Uh, it 113 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 1: signified like a huge change. They took regular playing cards, 114 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 1: added twenty two more to them, made them all trump cards, 115 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,119 Speaker 1: and now you had so much more complicated complex games. 116 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:10,760 Speaker 1: And as a matter of fact, they think this is 117 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: where trick taking games came from. Yeah, I mean you 118 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 1: mentioned trump taking cards. That's what I mean. If you've 119 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: never played any trick taking games, do yourself a favor 120 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: and learn spades or hearts or something. Sure, j Yeah, Jen, 121 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:30,000 Speaker 1: Remy counts. I guess, Uh no, it totally counts. I guess. 122 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:33,560 Speaker 1: I always think of spades. Really, um, I had I 123 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 1: went through a spades phase when I was kind of 124 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: in college. It was kind of early on for some reason. 125 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 1: And oh and then what's the one in the Midwest 126 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: that my wife's family always plays, Get us out of here. 127 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:55,400 Speaker 1: That's very funny, uh Yuker Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, my 128 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: parents played too. Of course, idea how it's played, no clue. Well, 129 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 1: I'm fame us in our family for forgetting every single 130 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: year how to play uk and then every Christmas they 131 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: would then, you know, re explain the game. But long 132 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 1: way of saying, these are all like trick taking games 133 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: where you have, um, you're laying down hands and then 134 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:15,520 Speaker 1: someone will lay down like a trump card and you 135 00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: can like take all those tricks that are on the board. 136 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: And there are all kinds of variations of trick taking games. 137 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:25,360 Speaker 1: But they're basically saying that, I mean, was Tarrocco the 138 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: original the o G I think so? Yeah. I think 139 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 1: it originated in Italy and the north of Italy. Um, 140 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 1: and then after that, uh, it's spread to France and 141 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: they took the same name Tarok, which in French is 142 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: Tarot with the A U X. Obviously we evolved into 143 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:48,000 Speaker 1: tarot t a R O T from there, right, So 144 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 1: that's what they think the progression was. But this was 145 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:56,160 Speaker 1: just for making trick taking games, um interesting or creating 146 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,160 Speaker 1: trick taking games as a matter of fact, and the 147 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 1: people are parent you still play it. In Europe. I 148 00:09:01,640 --> 00:09:04,200 Speaker 1: think it's super hipster. I'll bet if you're a euro 149 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 1: hipster you probably play the original Arrak or Tarrok show, 150 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:14,160 Speaker 1: especially in northern Italy. But um, I think also if 151 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: you're just kind of like a normal person too, you 152 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:19,680 Speaker 1: might you might find it attractive. So it's still being played. 153 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:22,440 Speaker 1: So there's two kinds of taro out there in the world, 154 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: and I say we kind of move on to the 155 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 1: one that everybody knows over here. Um after an ad break. Hey, 156 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: that sounds like a great plan alright. So I think 157 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,680 Speaker 1: when people click on an episode called hall Terror Works, 158 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:55,240 Speaker 1: they're not really interested in hearing about the early origins 159 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:58,439 Speaker 1: of just another like spades light game. Uh. They want 160 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: to talk about it's spreading cards on the table and 161 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 1: having someone sit across from them and tell them how 162 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 1: their day or week or life is going to go. 163 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 1: And that's the divination aspect. Divination has been around a 164 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: long long time. People have been using cards for a 165 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:19,640 Speaker 1: long long time. It's called cartomancy, and I think the 166 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:25,959 Speaker 1: French basically invented this and like the seventeen hundreds or so, right, Yeah, 167 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: and um it was originally they used playing cards. They 168 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 1: didn't even use the Saro deck. And people still do 169 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:38,200 Speaker 1: cartomancy using regular playing cards. Yeah. Um, so I guess 170 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: to kind of differentiate it, if you're doing taro, that 171 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:44,640 Speaker 1: would be called tarot ology, and then cartomancy is using 172 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: I guess probably any other kind of cards. And so, 173 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 1: um you think like, okay, taro is kind of presented 174 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 1: as like this ancient esoteric knowledge. It's frequently connected to 175 00:10:56,320 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: ancient Egypt or ancient Greece. Um that like there's oracles involved, 176 00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:04,960 Speaker 1: and that it's just kind of um evidence of a 177 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: longstanding tradition of mysticism and fortune telling, and that is 178 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 1: made up. Uh it is. And you had a tone 179 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:18,440 Speaker 1: in your voice like you're about to yank the rug 180 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:22,680 Speaker 1: out from us, you know, uh, and yank we are 181 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: because we actually know for sure where this all came from. 182 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 1: It was invented by a couple of guys, a couple 183 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:33,200 Speaker 1: of French guys, one couple of dudes, just a couple 184 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 1: of dudes or whatever dude in French might be. Uh. 185 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: One gentleman was named Antoine court Day. How would you 186 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 1: say that, Gibeline, Yeah, I think that's great, all right. Uh. 187 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: He was born in seventeen twenty five. He was a writer, 188 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 1: he's a freemason. He was super as was not a 189 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: lot of people, but some people back then interested in 190 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:02,199 Speaker 1: the occult and esoteric ideas and things like that. And 191 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: when he was I guess and his uh what would 192 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:09,840 Speaker 1: that be like forties or fifties, Tara was not super 193 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 1: popular at the time, And as the story goes, he 194 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 1: saw some woman that we're playing it, and he looked 195 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:20,199 Speaker 1: down and, UM, I'm paraphrasing here, but basically said he 196 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: glanced down and recognized that the allegory of these pictures 197 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: on the cards, uh he found were relative to all 198 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 1: of life, and there were unlimited numbers of combinations to 199 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: combine these cards, and that was sort of the inspiration 200 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:40,959 Speaker 1: of inventing this divination process. Yeah, like he said, oh, 201 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 1: I've discovered these cards and it's clear that I've uncovered 202 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:50,000 Speaker 1: something here. So Gebelin was a very annoying person. Um, 203 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:54,079 Speaker 1: and he he took a Um, he took that inspiration 204 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: and then went back and reversed engineered everything to support 205 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:01,120 Speaker 1: the inspiration that he just had, and he did so 206 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: again by just making up a lot of stuff. Um, 207 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: he wrote this thing that was it came out multiple volumes. 208 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 1: I get the impression it was a little bit like 209 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: maybe the Paris Quarterly or something like that, or the 210 00:13:12,679 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 1: Paris Review Quarterly legitimizes it more than I was thinking. 211 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: But this, okay, how about the Hoboken Quarterly. But it's 212 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 1: true though, you know. Um, So he called it the 213 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: primeval World Comma Analyzed and compared to the modern world, 214 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:36,000 Speaker 1: which seems pretty straightforward. It's fine with me. The thing 215 00:13:36,120 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: is is each volume he just started talking about esoteric stuff. 216 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,480 Speaker 1: He wrote essays about whatever was on his mind, and 217 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 1: he was trying to kind of build up this compendium 218 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:50,960 Speaker 1: of ancient knowledge that again, this guy was just pulling 219 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: out of thin air. And it wasn't like he was 220 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: the guy who pointed to ancient Egypt and said their 221 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: mystery lies. There's there's an esoteric mystery tradition there. He 222 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 1: wasn't even the original with that. He was just kind 223 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 1: of playing off of some stuff that was popular at 224 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: the time and really going to town with it. Yeah, 225 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:15,160 Speaker 1: I mean I think, um, the franchise did a lot 226 00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: of people saw Egypt as this sort of um mystical, 227 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: magical place, uh with you know, for a lot of reasons. 228 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 1: But he's the one that sort of again didn't invent it, 229 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 1: but borrowed on that idea. In one of these volumes, 230 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:34,760 Speaker 1: he wrote an essay Ontario connecting to Egypt. Uh. And 231 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: then he had his friend, uh Louis Raphael uh Lucresse 232 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:45,880 Speaker 1: de Fael, Count of Mela. That was beautiful. I'm not 233 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 1: sure how much of that is right, but um, they 234 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:51,720 Speaker 1: got together as a team, and he was also a 235 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 1: dude that was interested in the occult and stuff like that. 236 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 1: They tended to hang they tended to hang around together, 237 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,400 Speaker 1: and so they got together and sort of of made 238 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: up these description of the game and the Tarot deck 239 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 1: were not the game, but I guess the practice and 240 00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: the Tarot deck connecting it to Egypt. Yeah. What was 241 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: pretty cool was that they they, um, they said, you 242 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 1: know what the tarot deck is, these seventy eight cards. Um, 243 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: I don't know if we said and if we didn't, sorry. 244 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 1: When they added the tarot trump cards to the existing 245 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 1: deck of cards, it it made seventy eight cards. They 246 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:30,800 Speaker 1: had fifty six cards and then playing cards um deck 247 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: before added twenty two tarot cards as trump cards, so 248 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 1: you had a deck of seventy eight. So what um 249 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:44,960 Speaker 1: uh did Gibelin and defoy yell I like you um 250 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:50,600 Speaker 1: said was that these things were actually existing disguised pages 251 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 1: from the Book of Thoth. And it's actually really cool 252 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: if you stop and think about, like along the lines 253 00:15:57,360 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 1: of like ghostbuster UM like like sumer Um kind of 254 00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 1: mysticism cool and both if I'm I hope I'm pronouncing 255 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 1: it correctly. He was a god of ancient Egypt, a 256 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:14,560 Speaker 1: real one. He was known for um balance in the universe. 257 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 1: He was credited with um creating, if not all knowledge 258 00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:25,080 Speaker 1: on Earth, at the very least certain knowledge like law, magic, philosophy, religion, science, writing. 259 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: So he's a good guy. And he also was known 260 00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 1: as an infallible judge. I saw it put somewhere Um. 261 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: So he would be perfect to be the one who 262 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: you could use the Book of Thoth to kind of 263 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: predetermine the future, because you were basically tapping into thowth 264 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,760 Speaker 1: to say, um, hey, buddy, can you help me out here? 265 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: I need to know the future. Can I sidebar for 266 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: a moment? Yes, please, or what do we call it? 267 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 1: What approach when we talk about tangents? Yeah, yeah, can 268 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 1: I tangent approach? Uh? You mentioned Ghostbusters. I just wanted 269 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 1: to point out very fast that we showed my daughter 270 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:06,440 Speaker 1: the original Ghostbusters for the first time UH last week 271 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 1: and it was surprisingly like okay for a seven year old. 272 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:13,960 Speaker 1: The jokes that weren't super appropriate as usual kind of 273 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,239 Speaker 1: go over her head and she loved it. And so 274 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:23,680 Speaker 1: the next night we watched the recent UH sequel. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, 275 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:27,240 Speaker 1: I saw that, and that movie I think is very 276 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:31,760 Speaker 1: unfairly piled upon. I don't care. It's not good, and 277 00:17:31,800 --> 00:17:33,600 Speaker 1: maybe it has something to do with watching it with 278 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,920 Speaker 1: my daughter and watching them two days in a row. 279 00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: But I thought it was quite fun and super super enjoyable. Yeah, 280 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,040 Speaker 1: I would say it's p t. Anderson's like deepest movie. 281 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:48,199 Speaker 1: At the very least, it's most entertaining. I didn't think 282 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 1: it was perfect, and I don't know it was a 283 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:51,600 Speaker 1: big nostalgia play, but I bought in and we just 284 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 1: had a great time watching it. So I like a 285 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,600 Speaker 1: lot of fun. It was a little weird that, like 286 00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 1: Egan at the end was like, mmmm, I'm not gonna 287 00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:01,880 Speaker 1: say anything, but I'll give you some head nods kind 288 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:03,720 Speaker 1: of thing. I think that they really could have worked 289 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 1: shop that a little more. Um, sorry for spoiling it 290 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: for everybody, but um that. Other than that, I thought 291 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,359 Speaker 1: it was really engrossing, really cool. I liked all the 292 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:16,000 Speaker 1: characters because Paul Road, of course, is amazing, so I said, 293 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,560 Speaker 1: go see it too. I think they kept him from 294 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:20,120 Speaker 1: talking a lot at the end because they didn't want 295 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:25,600 Speaker 1: to overdo a sort of dodgy uh you know, resurrection 296 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:28,399 Speaker 1: totally like it could have gone off the rails if 297 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: he was like, hey everybody, no, completely for sure, they 298 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,480 Speaker 1: featured they gave him too much screen time then okay, 299 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 1: so then cut back a little more even totally see that. 300 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 1: That's my take on it. Anyway, back to tarot Um, 301 00:18:43,280 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 1: I'm all about the new Ghostbusters though, and we're going 302 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:47,680 Speaker 1: to show her the reboot with that Kristen Wiggan the 303 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: Gang too? What about chew Ghostbusters too? You can't skip 304 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 1: over that? Yeah, sure you can with Jano Hello, Where's 305 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 1: the Baby? It had its moments, but I don't know, 306 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,959 Speaker 1: even even Bill Murray in the whole cast, we're kind 307 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: of like that was a garbage movie. What. Yeah, Ghostbusters 308 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: do was they were not very proud of it. I'm 309 00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: gonna have to go back and watch it because I 310 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 1: liked it. Right, Well, maybe we will. Um where were we? 311 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:17,399 Speaker 1: We were talking about how these guys, the Geblin and 312 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:21,440 Speaker 1: um his buddy defoy yell um had just basically made 313 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 1: all this stuff up. And I think we left off 314 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:25,200 Speaker 1: with how it was actually kind of cool that they 315 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 1: linked it to lost pages from the Book of Both Sure, 316 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 1: so they have now described this uh divination process, and 317 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:37,080 Speaker 1: it wasn't like it was a huge deal all of 318 00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 1: a sudden and like the latest fad that you know, 319 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:43,680 Speaker 1: caught like wildfire all over the world. Um, it did 320 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:45,439 Speaker 1: catch on in a pretty big way, but that came 321 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: a little bit later. But what is clear is that 322 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: all of these sort of stories that you hear about 323 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: Tarot was um of like the origins of it. And 324 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 1: then there's some pretty fanciful stories written up about you know, 325 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:03,240 Speaker 1: uh punks that created this game and these decks were 326 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:06,200 Speaker 1: found in ruined temples and stuff like that. Like all 327 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,720 Speaker 1: of that just seems to literally have been made up 328 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 1: to create kind of a fun back story. Yeah, And 329 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 1: I mean you can kind of get the idea like 330 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:15,879 Speaker 1: this is pretty cool stuff, and like a bunch of 331 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 1: people took a crack at it. Um eliphas Levi, who 332 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:23,640 Speaker 1: created Baffa met Our buddy Um, he contributed to it, said, 333 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 1: this is actually has to do with Kabbala, the Jewish mysticism. 334 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 1: Paul christian Um, who I can't remember what his original 335 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:33,960 Speaker 1: name was, he added to it too, but he was 336 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:37,479 Speaker 1: a very famous mystic um or occult person, and like 337 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:41,480 Speaker 1: that whole spiritualism. Remember we did a whole episode on that. 338 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 1: Those same people interested in in mediumship and the occult 339 00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 1: and all that just basically added to this. They'd be like, 340 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,280 Speaker 1: also this and also that it was just a lot 341 00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: of people who are out of their minds contributing to 342 00:20:54,640 --> 00:21:01,360 Speaker 1: this really neat totally made up mythology rounding tarot cards. 343 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 1: And then finally Chuck, we arrive at Alistair Crowley. Yeah, 344 00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 1: all roads point till old a c. I guess if 345 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 1: you listen to that episode and and got through my 346 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 1: sort of sneering through the whole thing, you will remember 347 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: the gold the Temple of the Hermetic Order of the 348 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,879 Speaker 1: Golden Dawn, which was in London, and this was a 349 00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 1: group that Crowley was was he the leader of or 350 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:31,280 Speaker 1: just a he staged a coup if I'm not mistaken, 351 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 1: and they ended up breaking up UM rather than just 352 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:36,959 Speaker 1: let him lead, all right, that that sounds familiar. So 353 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 1: the breakup led to different factions in different groups sort 354 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:45,280 Speaker 1: of splintering off, and one of which was led by 355 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:49,200 Speaker 1: someone named A. E. Waite. Uh. And this is where 356 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,639 Speaker 1: the story UM kind of takes Taro to the uh 357 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:56,399 Speaker 1: to the forefront of popularity. UM. In nineteen ten eight 358 00:21:56,440 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: e Waite published the pictorial Key to the Tarot and Uh, 359 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,760 Speaker 1: this is where the most famous deck, like the deck 360 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,000 Speaker 1: that you would probably buy today in the shopping mall, 361 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 1: comes from A. E. Wait Uh getting together with Pamela 362 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,920 Speaker 1: Coleman Smith, who I believe was the artist, and this, 363 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:18,600 Speaker 1: you know, kind of change to the deck up and 364 00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:21,160 Speaker 1: this is this became sort of the most popular one, 365 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:25,120 Speaker 1: I believe in early nineteen hundred, nineteen o nine or so, 366 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: and it's still the most popular, Yeah, I mean far 367 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: and away, especially in the United States, called the um 368 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: Wait Smith deck or the Ritter Weight because I think 369 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:39,120 Speaker 1: Ritter published it, and it's it's if you saw you'd 370 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:40,920 Speaker 1: be like, oh, yeah, that's that's a tarot deck. That's 371 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: what I think of it as it's this beautiful art 372 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 1: deco UM illustrations. UM that like if you, if you again, 373 00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 1: if you just think of a tarot card, like they're 374 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:56,200 Speaker 1: probably imagining a um Waite Smith tarot card because Pamela 375 00:22:56,240 --> 00:22:59,199 Speaker 1: Coleman Smith just nailed it. I mean, this is nineteen 376 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: o nine and there's a lot of different decks that 377 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: have the same thing, but they're just drawing differently or whatever. 378 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:09,120 Speaker 1: They're still publishing this um a hundred years plus later. 379 00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:11,800 Speaker 1: It was just that well done. Yeah, and I think 380 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 1: they also, um, I don't know if it was to 381 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:15,919 Speaker 1: make it more popular or not, but there was a 382 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 1: lot of Christian imagery on previous decks and they kind 383 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,280 Speaker 1: of toned those down a little bit for this deck, 384 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:23,920 Speaker 1: Like they said, hey, why don't we get the pope 385 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 1: off of their and include some cool like ancient Grecian 386 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: priest instead. Uh. Maybe it was just to make it 387 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 1: a little more sort of mysterious. I think so for sure, 388 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:39,040 Speaker 1: but also not they didn't want to scare off the occultists, 389 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,719 Speaker 1: you know, they didn't want it to poppy, right. They 390 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: also there was a papist to papists um, she became 391 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 1: the high priestess Um. But and it also followed a 392 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,639 Speaker 1: lot of tradition to I think the moon card um 393 00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 1: has been generally unchanged for like five hundred years. It's 394 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 1: still still contains the same baffling imagery that it always did. 395 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: The moon card means um. It means illusion and deception 396 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:09,119 Speaker 1: and that things are not as they appear, and so, 397 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,240 Speaker 1: of course, to demonstrate that and get it across, the 398 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: moon card has a moon um. It also has a 399 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:17,359 Speaker 1: path that leads off into the distance. Animal on either 400 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: side of the card to represent two sides of human nature. 401 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,399 Speaker 1: I guess good and evil kind of thing. Yeah, I 402 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 1: got that part. Here's what it really takes a weird turn. 403 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,639 Speaker 1: There's towers in the in the background. Odd, and then 404 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 1: there's a crawfish crawling out of the water. Yeah. I 405 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,880 Speaker 1: mean that's got to symbolize some sort of evolution, right, 406 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: I don't know. I have no idea what the crawfish means, 407 00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,119 Speaker 1: and I don't really want to know. It's just so 408 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:45,880 Speaker 1: odd that that I would rather that be some sort 409 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,119 Speaker 1: of hermatic mystery for me forever. Well, don't write in 410 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:53,400 Speaker 1: about that then, yeah, please don't tell me dear listener. Uh, 411 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 1: let's take a break. Yeah, let's take a break, and 412 00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:57,679 Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit about the deck itself, because like, 413 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:19,120 Speaker 1: what's even on these cards? Right? Yeah? Okay, Chuck. Where 414 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 1: we left off, Basically, a man discovered a deck of 415 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:27,480 Speaker 1: cards and decided that they were mystical in much the 416 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 1: same way that if somebody discovered a World of Warcraft 417 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:33,200 Speaker 1: deck two years from now and decided that you could 418 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:36,280 Speaker 1: use them to tell the future. Exact same thing, but 419 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,760 Speaker 1: he made such a cool mythology around it that it 420 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: it just called on. Yeah, so we're gonna talk a 421 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 1: little bit about the deck there, not the most in 422 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 1: depth thing. We can't get into every card, but just 423 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,119 Speaker 1: sort of an overview. We mentioned that there are seventy 424 00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:55,360 Speaker 1: eight cards, fifty six of these, or what's known as 425 00:25:55,760 --> 00:26:00,199 Speaker 1: the minor Arcana, and they are the number car and 426 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: they're divided into four different suits, which are wands, swords, pinacles, 427 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:11,320 Speaker 1: and cups um, which sort of explains the Terrence Malick 428 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: film Night of Cups was in reference to the Tarot. 429 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,639 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I saw there's a compilation of tarot and 430 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:21,159 Speaker 1: films on Vimeo that it just made of Yeah, just 431 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 1: imagery from the tarot that that shows up in films 432 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,800 Speaker 1: without you know, making a big deal out of it, 433 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: kind of subtly. But was that one of those like 434 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:32,719 Speaker 1: look it's everywhere kind of things a little bit, but 435 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:34,879 Speaker 1: I mean they didn't hammer at home. They really just 436 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: showed you, like, yeah, there's some pretty cool stuff. And 437 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 1: that the end it said, see it's everywhere, she told you. 438 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,359 Speaker 1: All right. So the pinacles, the cups, the wands, and 439 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:49,080 Speaker 1: the swords are the four suits, and uh there are 440 00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 1: also face cards in these suits, the page, the Night, 441 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:55,440 Speaker 1: the Queen, the King, and the ace, right yeah, And 442 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:57,719 Speaker 1: I mean just like a regular deck of playing cards, 443 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 1: there's one through ten cards and in the face cards, 444 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 1: and then on top of that there's the twenty two 445 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 1: tarot cards that you think of like like the fool 446 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:11,439 Speaker 1: that we mentioned or the hero font we mentioned earlier, um, 447 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 1: and there I think the minor arcana or arcana um 448 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,120 Speaker 1: those are like the one through ten, Jack, Queen, King, 449 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,679 Speaker 1: um kind of thing. And then the major arcana or 450 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,919 Speaker 1: arcana the twenty two um those are the ones that 451 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: are like the money divin divination cards, but you can 452 00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,879 Speaker 1: also divine the future based on some of the lesser 453 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 1: cards too, and I think people have kind of added 454 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:41,480 Speaker 1: to that over time, and that was one of the 455 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,640 Speaker 1: reasons I think that the um the Waite Smith deck 456 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,199 Speaker 1: was so interesting is that they really took some of 457 00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:51,560 Speaker 1: the formerly just kind of disused cards and really dressed 458 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:53,399 Speaker 1: them up with new imagery. And I think that was 459 00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:55,680 Speaker 1: one of the reasons that became so popular. Should we 460 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,359 Speaker 1: talk about some of the big daddy cards. Yeah, let's 461 00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:01,440 Speaker 1: see that. All right, there's the hour card and this 462 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: is not a card that you want, and we'll talk 463 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:06,040 Speaker 1: about readings and how those go in a minute. But generally, 464 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:07,840 Speaker 1: you know, you sit across from someone or you do 465 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:10,880 Speaker 1: it yourself, and you spread a certain number of cards out, 466 00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 1: depending on what kind of spread you're gonna use. Uh. 467 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,000 Speaker 1: If you get that Tower card, it's it's not a 468 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: great card. It's probably the worst card you can get. Um. 469 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:23,280 Speaker 1: It indicates all sorts of bad things. Uh Uh, something 470 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: that might happen to you that really has a negative 471 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:31,159 Speaker 1: impact on your life, destruction, chaos. Uh, sort of like 472 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 1: the rug getting pulled out from under your feet. Um, 473 00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 1: it's just no good. So you don't want to you 474 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: don't want to get that Tower card. No, you definitely 475 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: don't and then just kind of as a nod to 476 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 1: what I was just saying about some of the minor 477 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,520 Speaker 1: Arcanic cards also being fairly potent. I've seen um and 478 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:51,080 Speaker 1: also thanks to to the Tarot Guide and I Publishing 479 00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: for some of this info. UM that the Ten of 480 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: Swords again, they'd be like the Ten of Spades and 481 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: like a regular deck. That it is actually one of 482 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 1: the the worst cards, that it's a runner up to 483 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,000 Speaker 1: like the worst cards you can get, and it's more 484 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 1: about like being bad mouth behind your back or betrayed, um, 485 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 1: the the end of a relationship or a situation hitting 486 00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 1: rock bottom. Nobody likes that. But we should say at 487 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:20,480 Speaker 1: this point that when the card is pulled, it can 488 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:24,600 Speaker 1: be pulled upside down. And there's a couple of interpretations 489 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 1: with that. One is that it means the opposite of 490 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 1: what it normally means, right side up or basically bizarro taro. 491 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: Or it also means um that the effect that it 492 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,400 Speaker 1: means right side up is just gonna have like it's 493 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: gonna be weaker than it would have been had the 494 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,440 Speaker 1: card been right side up. Yeah, I mean the direction 495 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 1: certainly matters with how the card is drawn and laid 496 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: and spread. Uh, and it seems to matter even more 497 00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: maybe when there if you're not just doing sort of 498 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 1: a standard one card thing or like the three card spread, 499 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: which is very common is uh, past present, future, But 500 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: it seems like the more cards. What's the Celtic Cross, 501 00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:11,680 Speaker 1: that's the sort of the most common complex one, and 502 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 1: that one really it really matters which way these cards 503 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 1: are pointing in relation to one another. Yeah. And also 504 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: each spot on the Celtic Cross spread represents a specific thing. 505 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 1: So the card, the card you draw for that spot 506 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: is how that whatever that card says, like say chaos 507 00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:35,640 Speaker 1: or something like that, Um, how it relates to that 508 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 1: part of your life, um, like work like say um. 509 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,080 Speaker 1: And then you've got not just the interplay between the 510 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,000 Speaker 1: card and its position, but also that card and its 511 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 1: position and the other cards and their position. So it's 512 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: really complicated and complex very quickly. But I mean it's 513 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: kind of like a really like a full astrology reading, 514 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: like you can you can really go to town and 515 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 1: come up with some really in depth readings for people. Well, 516 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:04,320 Speaker 1: starting with the Celtic Cross for sure. Yeah. Absolutely. Um. 517 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:06,600 Speaker 1: You've also got the fool card, which we mentioned earlier, 518 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: just to follow up on that. That is the first 519 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 1: card of the major arcana, and that is that's a 520 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,960 Speaker 1: good card. Generally speaking. It's a positive thing a lot 521 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,120 Speaker 1: of times, and it can indicate like a fresh start, 522 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:22,479 Speaker 1: a new beginning. Um, if you're gonna go on some 523 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: exciting new adventure, you might uh draw the fool card 524 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 1: if you believe in that kind of thing. It's a 525 00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: cute card. There's especially in the um um Wait Smith's deck. 526 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 1: It's like a youth who's got like a little bindle 527 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 1: over his shoulder, cute little white dog jumping up barking 528 00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 1: at him like, hey, you're about to step off of 529 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: a cliff. I think he's got a flower that he's smelling, 530 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,680 Speaker 1: and just kind of like a happy transfixed look. You know, 531 00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:52,720 Speaker 1: the fool is usually a pretty happy person, and that's 532 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 1: a that's like a good example, though like you would 533 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:57,960 Speaker 1: not necessarily think the fool is a good card. Same 534 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 1: with the death card. Um Ibviously, anytime somebody gets the 535 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 1: death card, they are a little flipped out until the 536 00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:08,640 Speaker 1: reader tells them, actually, don't worry. The death card doesn't 537 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:12,160 Speaker 1: actually mean death. You'd be way closer to being worried 538 00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 1: about dying with the tower card. The death card is 539 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 1: much more um associated with change, transition, new beginnings, ends 540 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:24,320 Speaker 1: of old things. It doesn't it doesn't mean you're gonna 541 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: die unless it does. In case, it does not help 542 00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:30,200 Speaker 1: though that when they draw that card, they say, and 543 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:34,040 Speaker 1: the kind of death is it on your head? That 544 00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: was so good? That was such a great to geblin 545 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: Or maybe we should get meagle to Uh I can't. 546 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 1: I can't, right well, I think, yeah, I need to. 547 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: I need to sort of parse that out. I can't 548 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 1: over meagle you. I can't. I just miss him so much. 549 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 1: He'll be back. Don't worry his taff it is sweaty 550 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 1: right now though. Uh So those are you know, some 551 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 1: of them major Arcanada that are sort of the money 552 00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: cards that you might see if you go to a 553 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 1: terror reading and get told by some you know a 554 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,200 Speaker 1: little old lady, what's going to happen in your life? Yeah? 555 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 1: Or a young lady or a young man or an 556 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:19,360 Speaker 1: old man, and you know, buinary non binary person, all 557 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 1: sorts of different people. And that's the point. Any single 558 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 1: person can be a tarot card reader. And one of 559 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 1: the things that I saw, suggested Chuck, was to do 560 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,680 Speaker 1: what Emily does, like every morning, take a card and 561 00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:33,800 Speaker 1: just think about it for the rest of the day. 562 00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:36,160 Speaker 1: What does that card mean to you? How does it 563 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 1: tie into your life right now? And by doing that, 564 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 1: you know, over and over again on a daily basis, 565 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:45,280 Speaker 1: you're just kind of wading into the world of Tarot cards, 566 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 1: and you're also just absorbing what each card means and 567 00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 1: how it can possibly relate to somebody's life. So I 568 00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 1: saw that in Vogue UM as a really great way 569 00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,320 Speaker 1: to kind of start and get into Tarot. And that's 570 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,400 Speaker 1: um that again, it's evidence that anybody who's interested can 571 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:04,479 Speaker 1: become a terror reader. Again, I just want to stress 572 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,160 Speaker 1: there's nothing magic about Tara. There's nothing magic about terror readers, um. 573 00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:11,560 Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that they're not accomplished. Some of 574 00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,799 Speaker 1: the terror readers out there are really really talented at 575 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,759 Speaker 1: what they do. They're just not performing anything magical, and 576 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 1: any reasonable Tara reader will tell you the exact same thing, 577 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: right And for listeners, I was desperately trying to think 578 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 1: of an InVogue joke, and all I can think of 579 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,719 Speaker 1: something about you're never going to get it, but never 580 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: gonna get it, never gonna get it. The time came 581 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 1: and went. But I know we're all thinking the same thing. Yeah, 582 00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:38,280 Speaker 1: but I mean, I'm with you. It's clunky, but sometimes 583 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,680 Speaker 1: you just have to go back and like cite a joke, 584 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:42,600 Speaker 1: even if you don't pull it off right, then I 585 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,320 Speaker 1: do that too. I'm with you. Okay. So I guess 586 00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:47,920 Speaker 1: you know, we we said that there's a spread that happens, 587 00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,360 Speaker 1: and you know, there's different ways of doing it and 588 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,319 Speaker 1: obviously different ways of reading and interpreting the cards, but 589 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 1: generally you will have someone or yourself will do whatever 590 00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,040 Speaker 1: spread you've decided upon. And if you're giving, so what 591 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 1: else are reading? There are some people that that think 592 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 1: that that person being read should, like as the cards 593 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:09,520 Speaker 1: are being shuffled and such, should talk out loud sort 594 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 1: of about the questions that they might have. Uh. Some 595 00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:14,839 Speaker 1: people think that they should actually cut the deck so 596 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:17,799 Speaker 1: they physically interacted with it, while others say no, they 597 00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:20,840 Speaker 1: shouldn't touch the deck hands off. So there's sort of 598 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: different ways of going about it, depending on your methods. 599 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 1: I guess yeah, um, and I also saw that the 600 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,640 Speaker 1: there your tarot deck is supposed to have been gifted 601 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,399 Speaker 1: to you. You're not supposed to buy your own Tarot deck. 602 00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:35,239 Speaker 1: But again, there's no hardened fast rules in tarot, and 603 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:38,480 Speaker 1: anybody who's like stressing you to to adhere to hardened 604 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:40,759 Speaker 1: fast rules does not get tarot. So they just need 605 00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 1: to be quiet. That's your mouth. So UM. One of 606 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,400 Speaker 1: the one of the ways that this pops up is 607 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,160 Speaker 1: that tarot is actually sometimes used by psychotherapists and it 608 00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 1: actually has a kind of a lengthy tradition in psychotherapy 609 00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: dating back to Carl Jung, who starting in the twenties 610 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 1: or thirties, became interested in tarot among some other divination 611 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:06,560 Speaker 1: tools like the aging astrology. UM was trying to find 612 00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:11,319 Speaker 1: these archetypes that are universal the human consciousness that you 613 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,839 Speaker 1: believed tarot kind of reflected, whether on purpose or not, 614 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,160 Speaker 1: and that you could use that as a way to 615 00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:21,239 Speaker 1: kind of unlock that part of yourself that or that 616 00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:25,880 Speaker 1: part of the universal consciousness that was in yourself. Carl 617 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:28,359 Speaker 1: Young was maybe a little off the mark with that, 618 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:32,719 Speaker 1: but there's this idea that you can use this terror 619 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:35,680 Speaker 1: reading to really stop and reflect and think about your life, 620 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,880 Speaker 1: and that's a really great tool when you're in psychotherapy 621 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:43,320 Speaker 1: UM or counseling or any kind of therapy. UM anything 622 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,040 Speaker 1: that can kind of get you to stop and think 623 00:36:45,080 --> 00:36:49,880 Speaker 1: about chaos at work or your love life or whatever 624 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,319 Speaker 1: in a certain way. Um, that's kind of guided by 625 00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 1: the card that you draw. Um, that's that's helpful, that's useful, 626 00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,200 Speaker 1: and there's there's nothing wrong with that at all. Yuh. 627 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:03,120 Speaker 1: I agree, I think uh. And I don't think there 628 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:05,239 Speaker 1: are a lot of psychotherapists out there that are saying like, 629 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 1: let this be the guide to your life or anything 630 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,239 Speaker 1: like that. No, run if your psychothapal. I think it's 631 00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:13,320 Speaker 1: more along the lines of like if they if the 632 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 1: if it helps the patient, and if they get something 633 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: out of it as far as delving deeper into their 634 00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:22,040 Speaker 1: own psyche, and as long as the psychotherapist gets money too, 635 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:25,880 Speaker 1: that's all good. Sure. I mean that fifteen o'clock is 636 00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:30,800 Speaker 1: going to run. It's right, you get fifty lucky attree 637 00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:36,040 Speaker 1: forty three? Is that real? Okay, I'm kidding. I can 638 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:37,920 Speaker 1: see forty five. But this is like what do they 639 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:42,920 Speaker 1: break for commercials? Right? Okay? What if, um, you go 640 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:47,240 Speaker 1: to a tarot reader and they just nail it, especially 641 00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:49,359 Speaker 1: if it's presented to you is like m you can 642 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:51,640 Speaker 1: kind of see a little bit of future with these cards. 643 00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,359 Speaker 1: I'm not supposed to say that, but it's true, and 644 00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:57,279 Speaker 1: they nail the reading like it just speaks to you. 645 00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 1: And there are plenty of people out there who have 646 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 1: that have had that experience. But luckily science can swoop 647 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:05,279 Speaker 1: in and say, calm down, calm down. There's actually a 648 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,320 Speaker 1: really good explanation to this. And there are two sides 649 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: of the same coin. One is cold readings. The other 650 00:38:11,719 --> 00:38:14,680 Speaker 1: is what's called the Forer effect. Yeah, and we you know, 651 00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: we talked about cold readings and uh, she's I feel 652 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:19,640 Speaker 1: like we've done a few episodes where we kind of 653 00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,839 Speaker 1: touched on that. But that's the idea that when you 654 00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:26,960 Speaker 1: sit down in front of a a reader or it 655 00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:29,640 Speaker 1: could be whatever, if they have the crystal ball or 656 00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:32,759 Speaker 1: the tero or they're reading lines on your hand and 657 00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:36,319 Speaker 1: stuff like that, uh, that they are really um, if 658 00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 1: they're good and they stay in business, then they're probably 659 00:38:38,760 --> 00:38:41,799 Speaker 1: really good at cold reading, which is sort of just 660 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:46,400 Speaker 1: picking up on either obvious clues that you may not 661 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,799 Speaker 1: realize that you've even said out loud, or even sort 662 00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:53,120 Speaker 1: of subconscious clues that they pick up on. And how 663 00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: you carry your life or maybe how you walked in 664 00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,080 Speaker 1: the room or what kind of car you arrived in, 665 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: and just sort of picking up on all ease blatant 666 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:04,680 Speaker 1: or non blatant clues that a person might unconsciously or 667 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:10,720 Speaker 1: consciously give. Right. Um, So uh, that's where the reader 668 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,320 Speaker 1: is doing the work. There's also another way where the read, 669 00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:18,040 Speaker 1: the person getting the reading, actually does the work, and 670 00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:21,359 Speaker 1: that is that for effect I mentioned, which is uh. 671 00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:23,640 Speaker 1: It's named after a psychologist who coined it. It's also 672 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: called the Barnum effect, based on P. T. Barnum's famous 673 00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:30,040 Speaker 1: uh saying there's a sucker born every minute. It's people's 674 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:36,080 Speaker 1: willingness to accept very generic, very generalized information as tailored 675 00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:39,520 Speaker 1: exclusively to them, which is something that can happen into 676 00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:42,320 Speaker 1: terror reading. And in that case, it's not the reader 677 00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:44,439 Speaker 1: doing the work. It's you, the read who's like, oh, 678 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,040 Speaker 1: that makes a hundred percent sense. I totally see how 679 00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:50,279 Speaker 1: that that jibes with my life. Obviously, these tarot cards 680 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,759 Speaker 1: are perfect and showing me the future. Yeah, I mean 681 00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:55,880 Speaker 1: it's kind of a confirmation bias in a way, because 682 00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:00,360 Speaker 1: you'll you'll remember the things that work infirm and you 683 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,439 Speaker 1: kind of don't really think about the other like six 684 00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:07,799 Speaker 1: or seven things that didn't come true, right exactly? Yeah, 685 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:10,239 Speaker 1: for sure. One other thing that they could read our 686 00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:15,600 Speaker 1: strangers in a cup of tea or beverage that can 687 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:18,520 Speaker 1: be read as well cold read too. Thank you. You 688 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:23,279 Speaker 1: got anything more about tarot? Nah? Neither. I think that 689 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:26,319 Speaker 1: that's the end of this episode then, And since Chuck 690 00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,640 Speaker 1: said nah, I said me either. Obviously, every one's time 691 00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:34,360 Speaker 1: for listener mail. I'm going to call this a correction. 692 00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:37,400 Speaker 1: And um, we got we heard from a few people 693 00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,799 Speaker 1: on this. This email was a little bit of a 694 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:45,239 Speaker 1: spanking about the condition of John Denver upon his death. 695 00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:50,040 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, sorry, John Denver's family of John Denver, it 696 00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,600 Speaker 1: was very disappointed to hear Josh make the false claim 697 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:57,120 Speaker 1: that John Denver at cocaine in his system at the 698 00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,239 Speaker 1: time it was plane crash. Toxicology test were neg for 699 00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:05,240 Speaker 1: all drugs including ethanol. The following pertinent paragraph was taken 700 00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:09,759 Speaker 1: from the NTSB investigation. I'm not gonna bother reading it, 701 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,799 Speaker 1: but it basically says what this guy says, which was 702 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:15,799 Speaker 1: tests were negative for all screen drugs. Uh. If you'd 703 00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:18,239 Speaker 1: like to review the whole report, you can find it here. Um. 704 00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:21,719 Speaker 1: While Mr Denver was no altar boy, drugs played no 705 00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:24,279 Speaker 1: role in the crash that killed him. Uh, And it's 706 00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:26,440 Speaker 1: a sad disservice to say otherwise to his memory and 707 00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:30,560 Speaker 1: his family. Very disappointing, you guys, And that's from John. 708 00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: Maybe it's the ghost of John Denver good he and 709 00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:39,439 Speaker 1: uh George Burns are hanging out, that's right. Um, so yeah, 710 00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:42,799 Speaker 1: I'm sorry John Denver and John Denver's family. That's I 711 00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:46,000 Speaker 1: don't know how I felt for that, but I totally did. 712 00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:47,919 Speaker 1: I knew that like years and years and years ago, 713 00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:50,279 Speaker 1: and I guess I just never bothered to look it up. 714 00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:53,360 Speaker 1: So my apologies for that one, and I take it back. 715 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:56,360 Speaker 1: We should do a short stuff one day on the 716 00:41:56,400 --> 00:42:02,000 Speaker 1: West Virginia controversy and country roads. Oh yeah, yeah, there's 717 00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,000 Speaker 1: two sides that have long been fighting, and I think 718 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:08,080 Speaker 1: they each think it's settled of whether or not Almost 719 00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: Heaven was the state of West Virginia or the western 720 00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:14,400 Speaker 1: part of the state of Virginia. Oh, that is a 721 00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:16,879 Speaker 1: that's a feud. I don't know if we should wage 722 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:20,360 Speaker 1: into that hornet's nest. Chuck, You're probably right, And also 723 00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:22,680 Speaker 1: I think John I'd like John John Denver by the 724 00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,239 Speaker 1: way I've said it before. I think he wrote one 725 00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:29,080 Speaker 1: of the best songs about Toledo ever, made Saturday Night 726 00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: in Toledo, Ohio, where he talks about how you can 727 00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:34,200 Speaker 1: go to the park and watch the grass dye because 728 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:38,760 Speaker 1: it's so boring. I love other good stuff. So hats 729 00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:41,240 Speaker 1: off to John, hats off to John Denver, and hats 730 00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:44,960 Speaker 1: off to us for being big people, especially me and 731 00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,640 Speaker 1: admitting our mistake. If you want to get in touch 732 00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:49,879 Speaker 1: with us and let us know about another mistake we made, 733 00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:53,200 Speaker 1: doors wide Open, you can send it in an email 734 00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:59,560 Speaker 1: to Stuff Podcasts at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you 735 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:02,080 Speaker 1: Should Know is a production of I Heart Radio. For 736 00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:05,160 Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 737 00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:08,280 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 738 00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:11,160 Speaker 1: H