Speaker 1: I am Yamla, your host for this journey. I was
Speaker 1: a hopeless love aholic but just could not get my
Speaker 1: love to work. Then, after a series of heartbreaks and
Speaker 1: deep heartache, I finally got clear about what love is
Speaker 1: and what it is not. I want to share some
Speaker 1: of what I've learned about love a holism. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the r Spot, a production of shandaland Audio in partnership
Speaker 1: with iHeartRadio. I used to think that one of the
Speaker 1: most precious, sacred, and challenging relationships was the relationship between
Speaker 1: a mother and a daughter, because so very often the
Speaker 1: mother sees and the daughter things that she doesn't like
Speaker 1: about herself, and the daughter sees in the mother things
Speaker 1: that she never wants to be, and she ends up
Speaker 1: being that way. I mean, I could tell you stories
Speaker 1: about the beauty, the power, the value, the hardships, the challenges,
Speaker 1: the difficulties of the relationship between a mother and a daughter. Woo,
Speaker 1: but baby, let me tell you something. In my wisdom years,
Speaker 1: I have discovered that one of the most precious, fragile,
Speaker 1: and difficult relationships on the planet is the relationship between
Speaker 1: a mother and a son. If you want a first
Speaker 1: class ticket to heartbreak, and crazy. Take a look at
Speaker 1: the relationship between the mother and the son. Because a
Speaker 1: man is who his mother makes him. The king is
Speaker 1: the king not because he sits in the throne, but
Speaker 1: because his mother prepared him, fed him the food, called
Speaker 1: in the right people, let him go, pulled him in,
Speaker 1: did all of the things that prepares him to sit
Speaker 1: in the throne as the king. The mother becomes the
Speaker 1: template that a man uses in his relationships with women.
Speaker 1: And if that template is solid and clear, if it's
Speaker 1: laid with loving care and concern, that man is going
Speaker 1: to have good relationships with women and himself. But when
Speaker 1: there are cracks and tears and fragments in the template
Speaker 1: that a mother uses to grow her son up, baby
Speaker 1: is gonna be rough. And the challenge is that a
Speaker 1: mother's intentions, her best intentions, and her way of being
Speaker 1: is not translated with accuracy into the child's experience. The
Speaker 1: mother will set up parameters and dynamics and situations that
Speaker 1: she thinks will give the child, the son what he needs,
Speaker 1: and he experiences it in a very different way. Why
Speaker 1: because she's feminine and he's masculine. It can be a
Speaker 1: hot mess. And then we think it gets easier. But
Speaker 1: what happens is when that boy child becomes a man,
Speaker 1: the mother has to learn how to parent an adult man.
Speaker 1: And if she's got any issues with men, baby Ah,
Speaker 1: this is the stuff that therapy is made of. So
Speaker 1: there are some things that a mother must consider when
Speaker 1: she's paring her son who is an adult. I mean
Speaker 1: there are issues and challenges with all parents who forget
Speaker 1: that this child has now grown up and become an adult.
Speaker 1: But when it comes to a mother parenting and adult son,
Speaker 1: there are just certain things that have to be taken
Speaker 1: into consideration. I am so grateful for my caller today
Speaker 1: because she's providing us with an opportunity to look at
Speaker 1: some of those things. Here's our call. Greetings beloved, welcome
Speaker 1: to the R spot. And what is your situation, your
Speaker 1: relationship situation that we can talk about, nibbylon and explore today.
Speaker 2: Good morning, is an honor to speak with you, ironic
Speaker 2: with you and I both share the same birthday.
Speaker 1: Oh well, how wonderful That means that we're crazy?
Speaker 2: Please I hope not.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we are so don't even hope that a
Speaker 1: Virgo mother. A Virgo mother is a perfectionist, highly critical, judgmental,
Speaker 1: and I say that because I know these things to
Speaker 1: be true about myself. That's not our intention.
Speaker 2: Oh that I accept everything he just said. I completely
Speaker 2: accept that. So you are one hundred percent right. So
Speaker 2: I have a son twenty one years old, adopted. I
Speaker 2: was married at the time, adopted him right before he
Speaker 2: turned three. You know, he was aware of his birth mother,
Speaker 2: so he was no secret. We had pictures, YadA, YadA, YadA.
Speaker 2: His dad and I got separated and divorced in twenty twelve,
Speaker 2: and right after that occurred, his dad immediately moved out
Speaker 2: of state, so that was pretty traumatic for him. But
Speaker 2: I did make sure that they had a relationship where
Speaker 2: I even paid for my son's flights to see his
Speaker 2: father every summer. So again, I did all that I
Speaker 2: could do to keep him tied to his dad. Right now,
Speaker 2: we're in a very very gainful place, and I just
Speaker 2: don't know how to process it having just this one child.
Speaker 2: He's twenty one. I did get remarried about two and
Speaker 2: a half years ago. The gentleman and I dated for
Speaker 2: about six seven years. We did not move in together
Speaker 2: because I wanted to make sure that my son knew
Speaker 2: that he had my attention, but we did date and
Speaker 2: my son was a part of that. The guy would
Speaker 2: come over, we would do things together. My current husband
Speaker 2: has two older sons, a little bit older than my son,
Speaker 2: and we did do things as a group. He went
Speaker 2: to all my son's games, He took my son to practice,
Speaker 2: so he was a pretty active part of my son's life.
Speaker 2: Once he moved in, things did kind of go south.
Speaker 2: He moved in a year before we got married. We
Speaker 2: moved into a brand play so he did not move
Speaker 2: into my son's home. We moved into a brand new
Speaker 2: place and from there it went downwards where my son
Speaker 2: I think he just had trouble accepting this person in
Speaker 2: our homes. He did have the type of father that
Speaker 2: was very negative. Don't listen to this man. He's not
Speaker 2: your father. So I think that played into my son's
Speaker 2: mental capacity. And now we're at a place where he's
Speaker 2: almost I shouldn't say almost, he's abusive toward me. I've
Speaker 2: reached out my hand. He doesn't come over. I haven't
Speaker 2: seen him in a year. Holidays come and go, Mother's Day.
Speaker 2: I get the calls and the text of hey Mom, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna come and see you. Yeah, you know I'll
Speaker 2: come and see you. He completely goes ghost on me,
Speaker 2: and his texts to go from zero to one hundred
Speaker 2: real quick. And I'm just at the point now where
Speaker 2: it's like when his name pops up, I get tense,
Speaker 2: my stomach goes flip flop, and I just need to
Speaker 2: figure out how do I, for lack of a better term,
Speaker 2: I have to cut him off, just for my peace.
Speaker 1: Talk to me about your sadness.
Speaker 2: Mom. Oh, the sadness is immense because you know, in
Speaker 2: this world of social media, you see all of your
Speaker 2: friends have kids that are older and they're able to
Speaker 2: do things. You know, Holidays are wrenching for me because,
Speaker 2: like I said, I've got a great husband that has
Speaker 2: two older kids, both in grad school. They call their
Speaker 2: dad constantly. They make the time, they'll text him and say, hey,
Speaker 2: we want to come and see we haven't seen you.
Speaker 2: So it's as a mom having one child and holidays
Speaker 2: are so painful. But you have to keep it in
Speaker 2: because you don't want to seem like you're hating on
Speaker 2: those that have the blessing of a kid that wants
Speaker 2: to be around them.
Speaker 1: Well not. You have to keep it in. I have
Speaker 1: to keep it in own your pain.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have to keep it in because I don't
Speaker 2: want to bring others down.
Speaker 1: Well, that's not your responsibility, but we'll talk about that later.
Speaker 1: Talk to me about the guilt.
Speaker 2: It's just the guilt of you. Always mothers are always
Speaker 2: told that you've got to be just. I always have
Speaker 2: felt that moms are supposed to always be there for
Speaker 2: their kids no matter what. So it's just a sense
Speaker 2: of guilt of how do I balance protecting myself from him, because,
Speaker 2: like I said, his tech and his words are very nasty,
Speaker 2: to the point of him calling me names every day.
Speaker 2: He called me the inward, Inward, don't talk to me
Speaker 2: that way, and it's it's just mind blowing that a
Speaker 2: young man would talk to his mom that way. And
Speaker 2: so the guilt I have is really wanting to not
Speaker 2: have anything to do with him at this time. But
Speaker 2: it's just I feel the guilt of as a mom,
Speaker 2: you're not supposed to do that. You're supposed to just
Speaker 2: be in there and fight for your kids.
Speaker 1: You know. There's an ancient African proverb that says a
Speaker 1: mother will never eat her child. She would starve to
Speaker 1: death before she raised her hand to harm or hurt
Speaker 1: or eat her child. And I don't mean eat as
Speaker 1: in you know, chewing and swallowing, but a child, if
Speaker 1: they're hungry enough, will eat the mother. Wow. And the
Speaker 1: way we see that play out sometimes is the child
Speaker 1: will put on the mother, take from the mother, ask
Speaker 1: of the mother, and it's almost as if you have
Speaker 1: to continue loving me, no matter how badly I behave.
Speaker 1: So the mother will never eat the child, but if
Speaker 1: pushed to hunger, the child will eat the mother. So
Speaker 1: that sounds like what we have going on here.
Speaker 2: I was like, here's a for instance. You know, we
Speaker 2: have this really bad back and forth, but as the mom,
Speaker 2: you keep I keep trying. So for instance, a couple
Speaker 2: of weeks ago, Mom, I need twenty dollars. So of
Speaker 2: course I am always trying to prove myself that I
Speaker 2: am a good mom, I am worthy. So I responded
Speaker 2: to his text and said, you know, okay, I'll send it.
Speaker 2: And he said, you know, I get paid tomorrow and
Speaker 2: i'll give it back. And I said, okay, you know,
Speaker 2: you need to keep your word, even though I know
Speaker 2: I knowelled that he won't, but in my mind I
Speaker 2: have that glimmer of hope I send him the money
Speaker 2: and then he goes dark on me. I don't hear
Speaker 2: from him nothing, and it just it eats you up
Speaker 2: because you knew what was going to happen, but in
Speaker 2: the back of your mind you keep it.
Speaker 1: Eats me up. It eats me up. It eats me up.
Speaker 1: Don't externalize it, take it in. It eats me up.
Speaker 2: It eats me up. Yes, that I knew that that
Speaker 2: was going to happen, and that I still did it.
Speaker 2: And then weeks later, when we're conversating on something else,
Speaker 2: he throws it back in my faith and you're sweating
Speaker 2: me for that little twenty dollars and I'm thinking you
Speaker 2: didn't have it, you came to me for it, and
Speaker 2: now you throw it back in my face that I'm
Speaker 2: sweating you to get my little twenty dollars. It's those
Speaker 2: type of mental games that are wearing on me. And
Speaker 2: that's why I reached out to you, because I need
Speaker 2: to figure out what to do with what I know.
Speaker 1: Well, this is a classic classic eraror that moms make okay,
Speaker 1: and then you're a virgo mom, so you make it
Speaker 1: to the tenth degree. Let me just point out a
Speaker 1: few things for you. He's twenty one. He's living on
Speaker 1: his own. He's acting like a man. Yeah, yes, well,
Speaker 1: one of the hallmarks of manhood is that a man
Speaker 1: keeps his word. But when he calls you acting like
Speaker 1: a child, MA, I need twenty dollars, you give it
Speaker 1: to him with the expectation that he won't give it back.
Speaker 1: And then when he doesn't give it back and he
Speaker 1: acts out like a child, you get upset because he's
Speaker 1: not behaving like a man. Here's another possibility. When he
Speaker 1: calls and asks you for twenty dollars, you simply say,
Speaker 1: boo boo, I don't know what his name is. You've
Speaker 1: ruined your credit with me. But see, because you're afraid
Speaker 1: to upset him, You're afraid to let him go. You're
Speaker 1: afraid that he'll get upset with you. You keep engaging him
Speaker 1: like a child and expecting him to respond like a man.
Speaker 2: One hundred percent, you're right. It's just like you said,
Speaker 2: I keep holding on to this hope that I'm going
Speaker 2: to have this magical moment where all of a sudden
Speaker 2: he's going to be who I want him to be.
Speaker 2: And you're right, that's not going to happen.
Speaker 1: If he's a man. Does he call you and say, Mom,
Speaker 1: I'm getting laid tonight. Does he call you and say
Speaker 1: that no. Does he call you and say, Mom, buying
Speaker 1: a bottle of wine or I'm smoking some happy flowers.
Speaker 1: Does he call you and say that No, but he'll
Speaker 1: call you for twenty dollars. That's called he's eating you.
Speaker 1: He's gonna play. Listen, children know their parents triggers and
Speaker 1: weak spots. They know he knows how to play you,
Speaker 1: So he plays you like a fiddle. That's what's called
Speaker 1: the child will eat the parent. The child will eat
Speaker 1: the mother. See him as a man, Hold him as
Speaker 1: a man, Expect him as a man, because you're giving
Speaker 1: him the twenty dollars, not expecting him to give it
Speaker 1: back to you, and then you want to challenge him
Speaker 1: to give it back to you. Yes, the twenty dollars
Speaker 1: to fifty whatever it is. No, No, you're a man.
Speaker 1: You living on your own, cover your basics.
Speaker 2: No, I'm going to say, but you know what I
Speaker 2: think a lot of it is. And I can be
Speaker 2: completely honest with you, and I'm going to use the eyeword.
Speaker 2: I'm living in fear of him because he talks very aggressive, like,
Speaker 2: for instance, when we were talking about the money and
Speaker 2: that type of thing. His text to me was, I'm
Speaker 2: not to let you talk crazy to me. I will
Speaker 2: pull up at any time. Don't forget that.
Speaker 1: Say he's really really angry, I have a fear. No, no,
Speaker 1: don't fear him. Take that, well, let me not say
Speaker 1: that out loud in the public. He need to fear you.
Speaker 1: Something happened. Something happened. I don't know where you overcompensated
Speaker 1: or where you failed to create boundaries. My son is
Speaker 1: fifty four and he's still scared of me because he
Speaker 1: knows I will pull up on him at any moment
Speaker 1: and it won't be pretty.
Speaker 2: But can I accept he's never had that fear that
Speaker 2: I still have what my mom rests, you know, she's
Speaker 2: not living, But he never had that, And that was one.
Speaker 3: Of the things.
Speaker 1: You didn't create boundaries. You didn't create boundaries. You overcompensated.
Speaker 1: And it probably goes back to why you adopted him
Speaker 1: in the first place. Why did you adopt as a
Speaker 1: to having natural children?
Speaker 2: Right, it's the natural way. It didn't work, And I
Speaker 2: think in the back of my mind adoption was always
Speaker 2: something that I had wanted to do but did try
Speaker 2: the old fashioned way before adoption was tried.
Speaker 1: So as a woman, hear me. This is not a
Speaker 1: judgment or criticism. I want to help you get to
Speaker 1: the root and the core, and you are probably not
Speaker 1: going to like it. Are you ready? Okay, okay, we'll
Speaker 1: do it right after this break, welcome back to the
Speaker 1: r spot. Let's pick up where we left off. As
Speaker 1: a woman, there was some failure, inadequacy, something I don't know.
Speaker 1: You have to give it the word because you couldn't
Speaker 1: have your own children. Adoption wasn't your first choice, although
Speaker 1: you made that choice, but the underlying, the underbelly in there,
Speaker 1: it's like I gotta prove, I gotta prove. So maybe
Speaker 1: perhaps I'm willing to be wrong that unconscious thought of
Speaker 1: failure or unworthiness or inadequacy. You over indulged this child someplace.
Speaker 1: You over indulged him. Tell me what you hear me saying.
Speaker 2: That I potentially created the monster that I have right now?
Speaker 1: Ah? Yeah, A man is who is mother makes them.
Speaker 1: I don't care who he is.
Speaker 2: I was a strict mom, but not to the point
Speaker 2: of like how my parents were where I never could
Speaker 2: go to the dance of the party, but I always
Speaker 2: did compare to his friend's parents who had no boundaries
Speaker 2: and they could go wherever they wanted. And I was
Speaker 2: one of those old school moms that whose house are
Speaker 2: you going to? What time will you be home? So
Speaker 2: he did have boundaries and that was one of the
Speaker 2: things he hated because he was surrounded by young men
Speaker 2: that had zero boundaries.
Speaker 1: Okay, you call them boundaries. He calls them restriction and control.
Speaker 1: But that's not what he's angry with you about. Absolutely not.
Speaker 1: He's not angry with you about that. The things you
Speaker 1: have to look at because if his texts are coming
Speaker 1: to you like that, there's something that you did or
Speaker 1: did not do at some point. And maybe it's because,
Speaker 1: you know, again over compensation. You didn't want him to feel,
Speaker 1: you know, any less. Because he was adopted someplace, he
Speaker 1: was taught, trained, led to believe that he could talk
Speaker 1: to you like that. Maybe around sixteen seventeen you argued
Speaker 1: with him or allowed him to argue with you. Usually
Speaker 1: it happens in that frame because with thinking, I got
Speaker 1: to give him a chance to express himself. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: here's a line, cross this and I'm gonna pop you
Speaker 1: in your mouth.
Speaker 4: Right, But guess what happened though, So okay, what you
Speaker 4: just said, I have done and said, and you know,
Speaker 4: as a black mom, I'm going to own this.
Speaker 2: He has been popped. But guess what he called, I'll
Speaker 2: protect their circuces on me place. And I had to
Speaker 2: go through all that Rick and Moreau, you know, them
Speaker 2: coming over being interviewed. You know this was not This
Speaker 2: was when he was a little bit younger, like theay
Speaker 2: twelve thirteen.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmm mm hm and right around the time you
Speaker 1: and your husband divorced, right, and.
Speaker 2: We did do therapy. We did I have therapy for him.
Speaker 2: We tried joint the people. As he got older. When
Speaker 2: people tend to tell him what he doesn't want to hear,
Speaker 2: that's when he goes ghosts like he's still doing to
Speaker 2: this day. You cannot tell him anything that he does
Speaker 2: not agree with.
Speaker 1: Is he a leo?
Speaker 2: No, he is a lead bruh. His birthday is October
Speaker 2: lib Bra, October twelfth.
Speaker 1: Couple of things, mom, And this is going to be
Speaker 1: hard to hear. I want to acknowledge you because I
Speaker 1: don't hear you talking about him as your adopted son,
Speaker 1: but as your son. That's number one, which is great.
Speaker 1: I'm glad he knows who that he has a natural
Speaker 1: birth mother. And with all that you've done and all
Speaker 1: that you've given, and I know as a Virgo mother,
Speaker 1: all that you've done and all that you've given. Like
Speaker 1: I said, in many cases overcompensating, you are a usual suspect.
Speaker 1: One of the reasons he takes his anger out on
Speaker 1: you is because he knows you're gonna love him no
Speaker 1: matter what. So in some instances, I want you to
Speaker 1: hear this, It ain't personal. He just knows that you're
Speaker 1: gonna love him no matter what. Here's the hard part.
Speaker 1: You gotta be willing to let him go. You've got
Speaker 1: to be willing to let him go his anger. I
Speaker 1: don't care who the child is. There comes a moment
Speaker 1: when they're gonna look for the womb that they came from.
Speaker 1: So while he may not voice it, he may not
Speaker 1: acknowledge it, he may not think about it, he may
Speaker 1: not say it. He's really angry at his mother, but
Speaker 1: he takes it out on you because you're his mom.
Speaker 1: Does that make sense to.
Speaker 2: You, Yes? Yes.
Speaker 1: We also don't know what he marinated in. We don't
Speaker 1: know the condition of the womb that he lived in.
Speaker 1: This may be his mom's anger. It may be his
Speaker 1: dad's anger. It may be the environment that she was in.
Speaker 1: Some of this is etched into his soul, so it
Speaker 1: may not be his anger, but he gets to act
Speaker 1: it out and at twenty one, and that's a whole
Speaker 1: new breed of people. Them young ones, they are a
Speaker 1: hot mess anyway, they really are. It's universal. Ye, it's universally.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right, you're right.
Speaker 1: Yeah. They have a sense of entitlement, they have a
Speaker 1: disrespect for authority. They wanted everything their way. So some
Speaker 1: of that is just in the planetary placement of this
Speaker 1: new generation. What they're actually doing is they're rebelling against
Speaker 1: the hypocrisy of the older generations. But because they don't
Speaker 1: have a new template yet about how to be in,
Speaker 1: what to do, and how to do it, it comes
Speaker 1: out as disrespect and it comes out as rebellion and defiance.
Speaker 1: That's generational. Seventeen to about twenty five, twenty six, that's
Speaker 1: just generational. They are rebelling against the obsolete society of
Speaker 1: the older generations, and they are it's obsolete, and they
Speaker 1: are challenging our hypocrisy. So that's universal. He's got some
Speaker 1: of that going on, and then the anger he may
Speaker 1: have picked up in the womb, and the anger that
Speaker 1: he feels about what the hell is wrong with me?
Speaker 1: That my mother didn't want me? What's wrong with me?
Speaker 1: So here you come the virgo by nature, critical, judgmental, overbearing.
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that to you personally. I'm talking
Speaker 1: about myself.
Speaker 2: I know, I understand.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's angry in general. And then here you come,
Speaker 1: like I said, the judge critical because we're perfectionists. We
Speaker 1: want everything, the corners of the sheets and the washcloths
Speaker 1: in the cabinet and the sweeping of the floor. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm the kind of virgo mother. I used to fold
Speaker 1: my dirty clothes. That's how neurotic I was. Okay, no,
Speaker 1: don't put no unfolded clothes in the clothes hemp, fold
Speaker 1: them clothes up so that I can shake him out
Speaker 1: and put him in the washing machine. But how he
Speaker 1: hears that again, because we don't know the condition of
Speaker 1: the womb, we don't know the consciousness of the birth mother,
Speaker 1: he hears that as critical, judgmental and controlling. And then
Speaker 1: a couple of pops in the mouth, pops on the behind,
Speaker 1: taking away of privileges that his generation thinks they're entitled to.
Speaker 1: So you're just an ogre. I don't like you and
Speaker 1: I don't even know you, right, yeah, can you hear me?
Speaker 1: So some of some of this, mom, he's just gonna
Speaker 1: have to work out. He will work it out, and
Speaker 1: it probably won't happen until he's about twenty seven twenty eight,
Speaker 1: if my assessment and my observations are accurate. But what
Speaker 1: you have to do is you have to hold the line.
Speaker 1: First of all, as a man. He can't disrespect no
Speaker 1: woman by talking about he gonna pull up on it.
Speaker 1: No woman, but certainly not his mother. He done lost
Speaker 1: his rabbit behind mine? Something wrong with him?
Speaker 2: Call me the inWORD? I mean, I got a text
Speaker 2: last week where he called me the inward his mom.
Speaker 1: And what did you say in response? I don't what
Speaker 1: did you say?
Speaker 2: I can't ever remember, but I'm trying to look to
Speaker 2: see if I can find it.
Speaker 1: But I mean, well, please find it because I want
Speaker 1: to know what you said in response. We'll talk more
Speaker 1: about it when we come back. Welcome to the spot.
Speaker 1: Let's get back to the conversation.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, I did find it. His response to me
Speaker 2: was we were talking about a joint account that we
Speaker 2: have that I told him I wanted him to close
Speaker 2: because I cannot remove my name from it, so the
Speaker 2: account has to be closed. So there was a lot
Speaker 2: of vacu and forth, and his response to me was,
Speaker 2: you could have easily said, hey, I want to close
Speaker 2: that account, which is, by the way, that's what I
Speaker 2: told him. And he said, look what you Look what
Speaker 2: you said? You just a rude inward, I hate you,
Speaker 2: and then he said inward, that's not what you said.
Speaker 2: Are you slow? I took a pause. I took a moment,
Speaker 2: and I responded back, and I said, is everything okay?
Speaker 2: What's wrong? Calling me names is not going to help you.
Speaker 1: Criticism that's what he heard, criticism. Here's another possibility, again
Speaker 1: drawed the line. Stop thinking of him as a little boy.
Speaker 1: He's a grown man, and you have to stop parenting
Speaker 1: a child and start dealing with a man. Another classic
Speaker 1: problem for mothers. We don't know how to parent adults,
Speaker 1: so we hold our children to the parameters of them
Speaker 1: being children. He's a grown man. I would have here's
Speaker 1: another possibility. I'm going to end this communication now because
Speaker 1: I have not given you permission to talk to me
Speaker 1: in that way, and it's unacceptable. Done you don't accept that.
Speaker 1: I don't care who he is. He can't talk to
Speaker 1: you like that. First of all, he shouldn't be texting you.
Speaker 1: Pick up the phone and call your mother. I know
Speaker 1: we're in the twenty first century. He doesn't do well.
Speaker 1: That's how they get away with it. He doesn't have
Speaker 1: to take responsibility for his behavior because he's anonymous on
Speaker 1: the text, right.
Speaker 2: And then after all this, one day I did block him.
Speaker 2: And then of course he went to the other people
Speaker 2: in the village and they came at me. He went
Speaker 2: to he called his dad. Mom blocked me. Can you
Speaker 2: believe it? So of course his dad called me, and
Speaker 2: then he called My husband's mother is his grandmother. She's
Speaker 2: basically been calling him grandson since she met him, and
Speaker 2: he called her. So then she called me. So then
Speaker 2: I have the village attacking me saying he loves you.
Speaker 1: No, no, you tell them no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: they don't have to attack you. You tell the village. Y'all
Speaker 1: need to get him straight, because he can't call me
Speaker 1: the inward. He can't threaten me. He's a grown man
Speaker 1: and I'm a woman. Let's teach him some respect. That's
Speaker 1: what you tell the village. They can't attack you. You
Speaker 1: have to draw the line. He's a grown man. Stop
Speaker 1: looking at him as a child. Who are told him
Speaker 1: to the same level of responsibility, accountability and integrity you
Speaker 1: would hold it. Could any man in the street roll
Speaker 1: up on you and call you the inward? What would
Speaker 1: you do if you were at the gas station and
Speaker 1: somebody rolled up on you and called you the inward
Speaker 1: and told you that they would roll up on you?
Speaker 1: What would you do?
Speaker 2: They would hear it for me, and I'd probably get
Speaker 2: somebody else involved.
Speaker 1: Law enforcements, my husband, somebody. You got a husband, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you got two stepsons. He needs to know that they
Speaker 1: are protecting and guarding you as a woman, because he's
Speaker 1: not coming at you as a mother. He's coming at
Speaker 1: you as any hoody on the street because he's angry.
Speaker 1: And that's fine, But as twenty one, it's his responsibility
Speaker 1: to handle his anger, and I would let him know
Speaker 1: how do I.
Speaker 2: Everything you're seeing has been scrolling around in my head.
Speaker 2: So at this point, going into the rest of this
Speaker 2: year and these holidays are about to come up, the
Speaker 2: Mother's Day with you know. I just have to kind
Speaker 2: of know that they're not going to be what I
Speaker 2: had hoped they would be. How do I pivot moving
Speaker 2: forward so that this is not for disruptive to my
Speaker 2: daily life of Oh my god, is he going to
Speaker 2: text today and it's going to blow up.
Speaker 1: First of all, go ahead and let your heart break
Speaker 1: that your son is not the man that you wanted
Speaker 1: him to be. Just let your heart break about that.
Speaker 1: But he's twenty one, he's got a long way to go.
Speaker 1: This usually happens around sixteen seventeen eighteen before they go
Speaker 1: off to college, and sometime that first year of college.
Speaker 1: This usually happens then. So he's got some arrested development,
Speaker 1: probably because of the anger and your overcompensation. Let your
Speaker 1: heart break, ma Oh, it's broke, but hold him higher,
Speaker 1: see him higher. He's just working out whatever he needs
Speaker 1: to work out right now to get himself to the
Speaker 1: place he needs to be. Once you let your heart
Speaker 1: break the sadness of it, and don't hide that from people.
Speaker 1: Your pain needs a witness because everybody, your husband, his dad,
Speaker 1: or his father, his mother, all of them, all of
Speaker 1: them played a role in this. All of them play
Speaker 1: the role in this. So don't you let them know.
Speaker 1: I'm really really sad and this really really hurts me.
Speaker 2: And I don't do that. You're right, I don't do it.
Speaker 2: You're right, I need to let it out. I don't.
Speaker 1: I did classic neurotic virgo behavior. Ask me how I know,
Speaker 1: Ask me how I know? Go ahead, ask me how
Speaker 1: I know?
Speaker 2: How do you know?
Speaker 3: None of your business the virgo mask of perfection and
Speaker 3: let people see the ugly sain I feel right now.
Speaker 1: Ah, and that's when you'll get start getting in touch
Speaker 1: with what he what he sees in you. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: when you'll see that.
Speaker 2: How will he how will he see it? Though he
Speaker 2: won't see it.
Speaker 1: But don't worry about him, because what's going to solidify
Speaker 1: your relationship with him is which is probably what he's
Speaker 1: going through right now. He's in the stage of developing
Speaker 1: intimacy into me C versus isolation. So if there's anything
Speaker 1: in him that he thinks is less than unworthy, weak,
Speaker 1: whatever as a man, he's going to isolate. He's going
Speaker 1: to isolate, and he's not going to be able to
Speaker 1: develop intimacy into me C. And the the first person
Speaker 1: who sees into you is your mother. So if he's
Speaker 1: angry with you, or if he doesn't trust you, or
Speaker 1: if he doesn't feel safe with you, he's not going
Speaker 1: to let you see into him, and he'll cover that
Speaker 1: up with anger or depression or isolation or those kinds
Speaker 1: of things. So how you see yourself and your intentions
Speaker 1: in your mother ring, that's not what he sees. He
Speaker 1: sees the hypocrisy, he sees the control, he sees the manipulation.
Speaker 1: He sees those things, or your best intentions, his thwarted
Speaker 1: childhood mind turns him into something else where you're trying
Speaker 1: to keep him safe and give him, you know, good character.
Speaker 1: He sees that as control and manipulation.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yep.
Speaker 1: So at this point, let your heart break so that
Speaker 1: you feel the sadness and b let go of the fear,
Speaker 1: the fear that he's gonna go off and you'll never
Speaker 1: see him again, or he's gonna hate you forever or whatever.
Speaker 1: At this point, Mom, that's his business. That's not your business.
Speaker 1: You gave him the best that you had, and surely,
Speaker 1: like all of us, you've made mistakes. But he has
Speaker 1: to be a man enough to talk about the mistakes
Speaker 1: and how he feels about them. But see you as
Speaker 1: who you are. Now. He's probably holding you and mad
Speaker 1: at you about something you did at thirteen when he
Speaker 1: got his first pubic hair, because once they get a
Speaker 1: pubic hair, they lose they durned mind. It ain't personal, No,
Speaker 1: it's not.
Speaker 2: But I try to be so different because, like I said,
Speaker 2: you know, with my parents, you know that other generation,
Speaker 2: they did what they did and there are no, you know,
Speaker 2: no apologies. And with me, I tried to be different
Speaker 2: than him. I've even tried to apologize. You know, I
Speaker 2: told him, I know I wasn't a perfect mom, but
Speaker 2: I told him I was a damn.
Speaker 1: Good mone according to your standards. But this generation of
Speaker 1: entitlement and permissiveness, breaking the rules and the boundaries, rebelling
Speaker 1: against the hypocrisy. In your mind, you were a good mom.
Speaker 1: In his mind, you were pain in his butt that
Speaker 1: didn't give him what he wanted and let him do
Speaker 1: what he wanted. That's how he sees.
Speaker 2: That's look at it. You're right, you're right, you're right.
Speaker 1: And why did he end up with you when his
Speaker 1: birth mom didn't want him. That's a deep pain. That's
Speaker 1: a deep pain. I've worked with a lot of adopted
Speaker 1: people adopted adults, and it's not conscious, it's unconscious. And
Speaker 1: the ones who do their personal work, their development work,
Speaker 1: they get to that and they're able to move through it.
Speaker 1: Obviously he has not, but he's got time. So express
Speaker 1: the sadness, deal with the fear of losing him, be
Speaker 1: willing to let him go, just be willing not to
Speaker 1: see him, speak to him, have any interaction with him.
Speaker 1: If it takes five, ten, fifteen years until he's willing
Speaker 1: to treat you with decency and respect, first as a woman,
Speaker 1: because how he treats you developed determines how he's going
Speaker 1: to treat women in his life. But you've got to
Speaker 1: stop dealing with him as a child and deal with
Speaker 1: him as an adult man. You have to let him
Speaker 1: know you don't have permission to speak to me in
Speaker 1: that manner. And if that's how you want to speak
Speaker 1: to me, we don't have to speak. You've got to
Speaker 1: say that, and then you have to draw that line
Speaker 1: and hold that line, so you block him. He calls
Speaker 1: your father, you tell his father don't call me about him.
Speaker 1: He will not disrespect me as a woman or as
Speaker 1: his mother. And when his grandma calls grandma, I respect
Speaker 1: you I love you, but I cannot allow him to
Speaker 1: call me out of my name and make demands upon me.
Speaker 1: That's unreasonable. Let him know that. Click and look at
Speaker 1: where you judge, where you criticize, where you try to
Speaker 1: control and see. Virgos don't like change. We don't like change.
Speaker 1: We like things orderly and normal, and we know where
Speaker 1: every penny is and every crumb.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, ask me how I know. No, it's none
Speaker 2: of my business.
Speaker 1: That's right. So tell me something you know now that
Speaker 1: you didn't know when you call Tell me something? What
Speaker 1: is it that you know now?
Speaker 2: I have learned today that I need to change how
Speaker 2: I see him. That I need to grasp that he
Speaker 2: is a man and he's not a boy. That's something
Speaker 2: that I have never thought about it that way. So
Speaker 2: I need to remember that fact. I need to allow
Speaker 2: myself and other people close to me to really understand
Speaker 2: how the skills and to stop hiding it and smiling
Speaker 2: and acting like it's okay. That's the biggest thing I
Speaker 2: learned today. I need to let it out and I
Speaker 2: need to share it with others so they know how
Speaker 2: it's hurting me. And then I think the biggest thing
Speaker 2: I learned is it's okay to grieve him. He has
Speaker 2: a loss because it's not going to be like I thought.
Speaker 2: But I need to accept it that it's not going
Speaker 2: to be right now like I thought it was going
Speaker 2: to be.
Speaker 1: And he's only twenty one, he's not married, he don't
Speaker 1: have kids. We don't know what that's going to look like.
Speaker 1: And pray for him, Pray that the light comes on,
Speaker 1: Pray that he sees you, that he honors himself enough
Speaker 1: to honor his mother. You know, I always say to moms,
Speaker 1: you know, even if you gave your kid's garbage, if
Speaker 1: you fed them garbage, I know that as a mother,
Speaker 1: you walked uptown and get found the best bunk garbage
Speaker 1: you could find. You walk three miles uptown, dug in
Speaker 1: the rich people's garbage can, and walk three miles back.
Speaker 1: So even if you gave him garbage, you gave him
Speaker 1: the best garbage you can find. And he needs to
Speaker 1: learn to appreciate that you can't do it for him
Speaker 1: right right. And you said one line that I want
Speaker 1: to challenge you on. You said, trying to prove I'm
Speaker 1: a good mom. Stop it. You raise somebody else's child,
Speaker 1: What is there for you? To prove.
Speaker 2: Wow, I never thought about that.
Speaker 1: Well that's why you called me.
Speaker 3: I never thought, Yeah, you're right at hers.
Speaker 2: I need to stop. I need to stop that. I
Speaker 2: need to stop trying to prove to him that I
Speaker 2: am ready.
Speaker 1: And prove to yourself that you're worthy. Because you couldn't
Speaker 1: have your own children. I'm telling you that's the underbelly.
Speaker 1: You haven't even tapped into that yet.
Speaker 2: That's a whole nother call.
Speaker 1: This is an important relationship in your life. You value
Speaker 1: this relationship, you value him, and you still have the
Speaker 1: right to create boundaries and establish how you want to
Speaker 1: be treated in this relationship. Just be willing to let
Speaker 1: him go. Be willing, and don't make his bad behavior
Speaker 1: about anything you did or didn't do. It's about his
Speaker 1: experience and he has to navigate that you don't.
Speaker 2: He has to I don't. Oh, this was really needed,
Speaker 2: and this has been Like I said, I'm gonna when
Speaker 2: I get off with you, I'm just gonna take someone's
Speaker 2: to just sit in everything that we've talked.
Speaker 1: About good and as you're listening, any feelings that come up,
Speaker 1: any challenges, well, no, what about this? What about that?
Speaker 1: Write that down? Work through that. Yeah, that'll be good
Speaker 1: for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I am. This is a lesson. This is going
Speaker 2: to be a lesson for me to just like I said,
Speaker 2: to replay it, just to listen, to be an active
Speaker 2: listener after the fact, and just take it all in
Speaker 2: what you're saying. So I appreciate you and all that
Speaker 2: you do. I appreciate today's time. I'm glad that I
Speaker 2: woke up early and called because I'm on the West coast,
Speaker 2: so I'm glad that I got through. Oh good, this
Speaker 2: is a blessing. So thank you, Thank you, Thank you
Speaker 2: for all that you do for everybody, not just me,
Speaker 2: but this has been fantastic, and thank you.
Speaker 1: And I want to thank you because what I know
Speaker 1: to be true about us as women, you called and
Speaker 1: asked this question, presented this situationship. But you were the
Speaker 1: tool the universe used to speak to hundreds of thousands
Speaker 1: of mothers of sons who are exactly where you are.
Speaker 1: You are not alone. I want you to know that,
Speaker 1: and I want you to give yourself credit for the
Speaker 1: courage it took for you to come and expose yourself
Speaker 1: in this way. And as sister women, we all thank you.
Speaker 2: Oh well, blessing, Thank you, so much.
Speaker 1: Okay, my love, let me know how you make out. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: bye bye, Mothers and sons. It can be a rough
Speaker 1: road to travel. We have to remember that our children
Speaker 1: are not our children. They are the sons and the
Speaker 1: daughters of life, owning themselves. They come to us, but
Speaker 1: they are not from us. Although they are with us,
Speaker 1: they belong not to us. So as mothers of sons,
Speaker 1: we have to give them the permission, the space to
Speaker 1: grow into who it is they've come to be, and
Speaker 1: that may not be who we want them to be.
Speaker 1: But every soul has its assignment and as moms, we
Speaker 1: just have to take the bitter with the sweet, and
Speaker 1: sometimes it's more bitter than sweet. That's our show for today.
Speaker 1: Thank you for tuning in, and I want to leave
Speaker 1: you with this. No matter what it looks like, Mom,
Speaker 1: no matter how ugly your son is behaving, stay in
Speaker 1: peace and not in pieces. See you next time. I
Speaker 1: hope this has been helpful to someone, And if you
Speaker 1: have a question about this or any other relationship issue,
Speaker 1: you can call me live at seven seven five three
Speaker 1: zero seven seven seven sixty eight. Now be sure to
Speaker 1: follow me on social media for all of the calling Times.
Speaker 1: The R Spot is a production of Shondaland Audio in
Speaker 1: partnership with iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.