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Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome

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Speaker 1: back to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always

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Speaker 1: so very much for tuning in. This is a very

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Speaker 1: special two part episode. We couldn't be more Over the

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Speaker 1: moon and shout out to our super producer, the one

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Speaker 1: and only Max Williams. I'm ben uh No, you know,

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Speaker 1: we're well. I would say that we're not the worst,

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Speaker 1: worst people when it comes to dating right there. No,

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Speaker 1: we're not. We're not the worst historically because that's what

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Speaker 1: we talked about here. Um. But also I gotta comment

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Speaker 1: be your excitement level. I think it is like two

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Speaker 1: clicks higher than it usually is, and I think it's

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Speaker 1: for a good reason. Yeah. Yeah, well, I'm trying to

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to come in hot because we have we

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Speaker 1: have some special guests on the show today. You and

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Speaker 1: I have talked about our good friends on Ridiculous Romance,

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Speaker 1: which is the next step in what we're calling the

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Speaker 1: Ridiculous Universe. And there you are, you the extended Ridiculous Universe,

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Speaker 1: and we are we are excited today because we're talking

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Speaker 1: about weird courtship rituals, the course of love. It said,

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Speaker 1: never did run smooth, but it got pretty much derailed

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Speaker 1: multiple times, and it can definitely run weird. It doesn't

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Speaker 1: run smooth, but it definitely runs weird. And we are

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Speaker 1: joined today to our mutual delight by Diana and Eli

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Speaker 1: from Ridiculous Romance. Welcome than having us so awesome to

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Speaker 1: be here. Thanks for being here. We've got a max.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for putting in that applause que as well. That

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Speaker 1: was a cute. Yeah. See behind the curtain, we don't

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Speaker 1: hear that now, but it's there as though it was

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Speaker 1: always meant to be. It's sort of like Jack Nicholson

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Speaker 1: and the Overlook. He's always been there the whole time.

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Speaker 1: So I'm just conditioned to hear thunderous plause when I

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Speaker 1: hear my names, so I just hear it anyway. I

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Speaker 1: didn't realize it was coming from the outside. That's a

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Speaker 1: good survival instinct in comedy. I think modesty. Modesty is

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Speaker 1: a very important comedy instant. Elis always telling me, because

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Speaker 1: we've known each other for number of years, he's always said,

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Speaker 1: I am he is the most modest person that will

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Speaker 1: ever meet, And it's probably true. It's one of my

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Speaker 1: greatest traits among many yes yes to the big one.

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Speaker 1: Uh so, so, Diana Eli, could you all tell us

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Speaker 1: a little bit about Ridiculous Romance and what it is,

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Speaker 1: how it came together in some episode you really enjoy. Yeah, absolutely, yeah.

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Speaker 1: Oh well I can start if you want to do it. Well,

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Speaker 1: let's see. So ridiculous Romance was an idea that initially,

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Speaker 1: Ben you came to us with uh in talking about

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Speaker 1: wanting to expand the ridiculous universe, and you said, hey,

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Speaker 1: you guys are a married couple. You've done sketch comedy

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Speaker 1: together for many years. We have work together in creating

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Speaker 1: and comedy and all kind of stuff as long as

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Speaker 1: we've known each other, even longer than a little bit

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Speaker 1: longer than we've been dating. And now we've been a

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Speaker 1: little just a little bit, only a few years and

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Speaker 1: then uh and now we've been married for three almost

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Speaker 1: four before going on five years. Now, Oh my god,

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Speaker 1: is this? Can this marriage last? We've been together for

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Speaker 1: thirteen years, so hopefully it's all just been a big,

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Speaker 1: beautiful blur, that's what it is. So we decided that

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Speaker 1: we should put our comedy stylings in our romantic history

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Speaker 1: to to good use and dig through history and find

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Speaker 1: other bizarre, strange, random, freaky, awesome couples and uh and

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Speaker 1: tell their stories uh in our in our trademark ridiculous way. Well,

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Speaker 1: and at first we were like, well, I don't know

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Speaker 1: this one. Seems like it would be hard to find

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Speaker 1: enough couples to make an episode of making a whole

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Speaker 1: year of episodes. And then we looked it up and

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Speaker 1: we're like, oh, actually no, Oh my god, Wow, people

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Speaker 1: are crazy. So there's been so many great stories so far,

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Speaker 1: and we have so many more to get to. It's

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be awesome. I'm not gonna lie. I'm actually

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Speaker 1: a little jealous because Ben and I arbitrarily placed a

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Speaker 1: rule on Ridiculous History where we only do shows like

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Speaker 1: leading up to apartheid or topics leading up to apartheid,

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Speaker 1: because we had a top the line line. I know,

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Speaker 1: it seems weird, but it was because there was one

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Speaker 1: picular topic about like this guerrilla that that did a thing.

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Speaker 1: He like, I think he caught a criminal in South

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Speaker 1: Africa that was running away from the authorities during apartheid, um,

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Speaker 1: and that was in like ninety three or ninety four,

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Speaker 1: and we both thought it was remarkable that a historical

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Speaker 1: event as epic and meaningful as apartheide happened in the nineties,

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Speaker 1: so we were like, you know what, this is the

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Speaker 1: this is the cut off from us. But y'all go

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Speaker 1: a little more recent than that, because honestly, history is

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Speaker 1: being written as we live. As Ben says, it would

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Speaker 1: be considered us something of a palem test right that.

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Speaker 1: Yet the word I like that, it's Bend's word, trademarked.

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Speaker 1: It's a good one. So I say this all of

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Speaker 1: this to say that your most recent episode is one

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Speaker 1: that I'm excited to listen to about Sid Vicious and

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Speaker 1: Nancy Sponging I've uncovered. Yeah, well, I assure you will

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Speaker 1: have some people writing into you to tell you how

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Speaker 1: you pronounced it incorrectly. But it's, like you say in

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Speaker 1: the description for the show, sort of a weird punk

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Speaker 1: rock Romeo and Juliette story for the Ages that ends

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Speaker 1: very very poorly, uh spoiler alert. But um, it's it's

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Speaker 1: one that I'm excited to listen to. It's a very

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Speaker 1: intense episode that was that was a difficult one to

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Speaker 1: research because they are both such tragically horrible, miserable people.

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Speaker 1: As we did nothing but bad things almost the whole

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Speaker 1: time individually to each other exactly. You're kind of piste

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Speaker 1: out on the whole episode, like what are you doing?

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Speaker 1: Good lord? It's like when you see the woman in

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Speaker 1: the horror movie that keeps running up the stairs. No one,

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Speaker 1: good choice, please, A single one is fine. Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: right up there with the person who hears a noise

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Speaker 1: in a horror movie and goes, what is that? Who's there?

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Speaker 1: That's if we're speaking of poor choices, But you guys

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Speaker 1: have made some really excellent choices in your show and

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Speaker 1: peek behind the curtain. I think we told you all this,

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Speaker 1: but not on air, so we'll go forward with it.

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Speaker 1: Noel and I got together after listening to some of

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Speaker 1: the first episodes and had a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: dark night of the podcast soul. We actually went and

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Speaker 1: we actually went and got some beers together. We're like,

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Speaker 1: is there a show? Are they funnier than us? And

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Speaker 1: we were, we were, we were worried, And then you know,

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Speaker 1: to three beers later, we're like, it'll be fine as

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Speaker 1: long as they don't do an episode on our relationship,

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Speaker 1: and then two or three beers that are like, no, no,

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Speaker 1: we're definitely funny here. It's not a competition, it's not,

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Speaker 1: but it's where it's two different shows. Um, you guys

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Speaker 1: definitely are able to venture maybe into the more raunchy

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Speaker 1: side of things, especially as romance is concerned. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna get into some raunch. It really does, yes,

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Speaker 1: sometimes more than others. Raunchiest episode yet so far. Oh well,

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Speaker 1: I guess it depends on who you are. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: Vanilla ice cream. Yeah, mean we had we did, like um,

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Speaker 1: William Marston and his and Elizabeth and Olive and they

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Speaker 1: kind of had like a polyamorous thing going on with

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Speaker 1: like some bondage action and they invented wonder Woman and

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Speaker 1: all of that is kind of wrapped up in her character.

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Speaker 1: So that was kind of run and yeah, that's true.

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Speaker 1: But Evelyn Nesbit, Harry Thaw, Stanford White one had a

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Speaker 1: lot of nasty sex cult type sex club I guess

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Speaker 1: I should say, rather than a cult, but it's like

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Speaker 1: a yeah, hot sex club action from the turn of

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Speaker 1: the century. So you will learn those stories in full

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Speaker 1: and even when they're heavy topics, you've got the that

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Speaker 1: inn all ridiculous guarantee that you'll still you'll still have fun,

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Speaker 1: you'll still learn something I particularly love the re enactments

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Speaker 1: you all do. Not to not to put you on

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Speaker 1: the spot today, but we uh, we were working on

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Speaker 1: weird ideas, ostensibly weird ideas of courtship throughout human history,

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Speaker 1: and so Nolan I decided that we needed to go

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Speaker 1: to the experts, uh, which which meant that we are

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Speaker 1: We wanted to uh lean on you alls expertise because

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Speaker 1: we know that already you found so many, so many strange,

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Speaker 1: surprising things like you just blew my mind at least

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Speaker 1: about romance in the world of pirates. Uh So we thought,

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Speaker 1: who better to help our fellow ridiculous historians explore the

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Speaker 1: trials and tribulations of dating and marriage or trying to

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Speaker 1: get married, then Diana and Deli, the host of Ridiculous Romance.

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Speaker 1: I wish that we could just publish our group thread

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Speaker 1: for this episode, because nol I think it's fair to

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Speaker 1: say that all four of us were just firing on

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Speaker 1: all pistons with some great ideas. We kept thinking like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: we've got a gotta trim these down. Yeah, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: they were definitely pistons involved. I do have to say

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Speaker 1: researching this was kind of fun because when you Google. Uh,

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Speaker 1: strange courtship rituals. You get a lot of stuff about

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Speaker 1: the animal kingdom. Um, it kind of comes up first

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Speaker 1: and foremost, so we had to dig a little deeper

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Speaker 1: in our googlins. But um, what say you we lead

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Speaker 1: off with Diana. You found a particularly fascinating, ridiculous courtship

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Speaker 1: that we're going to talk about right now. Yeah, I went.

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Speaker 1: I went for the Puritans because you know, they're so prudish.

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Speaker 1: I was kind of like, surely they have some weird,

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Speaker 1: you know, awkward stuff that would be fun people to

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Speaker 1: actually banned Christmas. Banned Christmas. They thought it was pagan

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Speaker 1: well missiles, very pig and well anyway, but they actually,

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Speaker 1: um I was surprised to learn, didn't have anything anything

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Speaker 1: against sex at all. It was just it had to

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Speaker 1: be within marriage. But they really wanted you to be

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Speaker 1: sexually compatible because then you would go forth and multiply

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Speaker 1: and you know, bring forth a lot more Christians and Puritans.

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Speaker 1: And so they were actually had quite a few rituals

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Speaker 1: that kind of allowed you, in their very strict way,

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Speaker 1: to get to know each other and kind of like

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Speaker 1: flirt a little bit and figure out if you actually

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Speaker 1: liked each other. And so there were a couple of

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Speaker 1: these that I thought were so fun. For example, the

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Speaker 1: courtship tube is this sort of a hole in the

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Speaker 1: sheet kind of situation. The kind of it's it's like, say, you,

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Speaker 1: you know, you're very interested in in me, goody Proctor,

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Speaker 1: and you want to come over to my house and

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Speaker 1: and see if maybe we have something to do with

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Speaker 1: each other. And in a Puritan house, it's very small.

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Speaker 1: You have your whole family in the same room with you,

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Speaker 1: and you if you come over to see a girl,

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Speaker 1: Grandma's going to sit in between y'all. So it's not

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know about y'all, but I would

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Speaker 1: be not interested in being sexy. Unlet's that's the thing,

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Speaker 1: you know, we'll describe the grandma. Depends on the grandma,

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Speaker 1: depends on the grandma. Um. So what they would do

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Speaker 1: if they wanted to have a private conversation was bust

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Speaker 1: out the six to eight foot long talking tube. Basically

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Speaker 1: that they could put on each other's ears, even behind

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Speaker 1: Grandma's back, so they could whisper at each other like

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Speaker 1: a tin can phone situation. Right, I was like great

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Speaker 1: COVID protocol. First of all, where where was this last

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Speaker 1: year I could have been I think we call that

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Speaker 1: the internet is what we call right, what is it

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Speaker 1: called the romance tube? I don't know when or the

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Speaker 1: recording stick either way, but it's stick to me. Doesn't

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Speaker 1: seem like it's hollow. Well true, that's a good point. Uh,

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Speaker 1: maybe it is made of bamboo. I doubt it because

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Speaker 1: there was in New England. What I love is the discretion.

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Speaker 1: You know, Grandma will never know sling this six ft

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Speaker 1: stick behind. Admittedly Grandma's hearing is going a little bit,

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Speaker 1: so probably a good whisper would have done the trick.

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Speaker 1: But I love the ritual of this, and that's sort

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Speaker 1: of the the red thread. And in this two part

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Speaker 1: episode is the is these rituals. It becomes a little

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Speaker 1: more like almost rather than functional. It's got this kind

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Speaker 1: of like ritualistic quality. So I think that's fascinating. Also

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Speaker 1: in defense of the matriarch question here, uh it is

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Speaker 1: probably older, right, her amorous days maybe behind her. So

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Speaker 1: there's there's a little bit of a possible like vicarious titulation,

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Speaker 1: you know, because they could probably hear this stuff and

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Speaker 1: they're like wounds talking about ankles. I wonder if there

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Speaker 1: was any sort of like generational, like if the was

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Speaker 1: a new technology. Grandma didn't understand kids these days with

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Speaker 1: their tubes. Back in my day, we wrote a lot

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Speaker 1: of how common was this? I think it was pretty common.

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Speaker 1: It was pretty common because this was the only way

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Speaker 1: to kind of get to know a girl more officially.

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Speaker 1: I think they had surely some some less some more

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Speaker 1: casual kind of like let's walk next to each other

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Speaker 1: on the way to church maybe one day and chat.

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Speaker 1: But if he wanted to come over and like make

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Speaker 1: his intentions known that he's like actually really seriously interested

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Speaker 1: in this girl, I think they would pretty commonly have this.

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Speaker 1: And I kind of wondered, like you, Eli, I was like,

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Speaker 1: I wonder if they the tube got shorter over time

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Speaker 1: and they'd be like five feet No, no, it's gotta

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Speaker 1: be six to eight. Well, also like is the tube

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Speaker 1: is the tube blessed by a member of the clergy?

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Speaker 1: Is this a community tube is? Or a tube per household?

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Speaker 1: I have so many questions, and one of that too

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Speaker 1: is like does he bring the tube with him or

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Speaker 1: is it already there and everyone has one? Is it

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Speaker 1: also for like mom and dad to kind of be like, hey,

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Speaker 1: when I get busy tonight or something like, I mean,

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Speaker 1: how many potential romances were ruined because because you know,

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Speaker 1: Elijah forgot his tube at Homelija com prepared. Man, how

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Speaker 1: scandalous if you find that someone has reused the tube,

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Speaker 1: you know, and it's like, that's the same tube you

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Speaker 1: had with Goody Walthrop, unclean, unclean. And then the other

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Speaker 1: question would be like, uh is it. I wonder if

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Speaker 1: they became heirlooms, you know, if there's some mother it's like,

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Speaker 1: or some father who's like, I'm gonna pick on your eli.

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Speaker 1: He's like, and I asked, my boy, I'm here, you know,

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Speaker 1: at twelve now, and it's time you became a man. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he is my courting tube and my rifle and us

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Speaker 1: and the parts of the Bible I agree with go forth.

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Speaker 1: Or the mom pulls it out from under the bed

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Speaker 1: and it's like telling her daughter, like it was with

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Speaker 1: this tube that your father first told me he loved me,

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Speaker 1: the old tube. I can't wait till a boy uses

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Speaker 1: a tube with me. I found my mom's tube when

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Speaker 1: I get your tubes tied after that? So what Okay,

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Speaker 1: So let's assume maybe that this this conversation goes really well.

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Speaker 1: They managed to do their whatever. Yeah, yeah there, what's

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Speaker 1: the guy snake from who always sneaks around in video games?

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Speaker 1: Metal heavy Metal Metal Snake. He's just solid snaked. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so they solid Snake the grandma and she did like

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Speaker 1: literally really bad. Well, we managed to make it past

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Speaker 1: courting stick without calling it to euphemism. So we're we're

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Speaker 1: doing all right, We're doing and and and then they

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Speaker 1: hit it off. They've got to like a lot in

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Speaker 1: common or you know, they they revealed that they each

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Speaker 1: like each other. Then I mean, what happens next? Like

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Speaker 1: when do you how long do you tube it? Well,

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Speaker 1: I don't actually know how long you would too, but

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Speaker 1: as soon as you were like, oh yeah, I like

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Speaker 1: tube and with this guy, I need to know more.

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Speaker 1: I need to get I need to get further into

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Speaker 1: this relationship. He would go to your parents and say,

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Speaker 1: let's say, I'm I'm goody. I guess before she's goody.

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Speaker 1: Really just for for the audience, goody was just a

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Speaker 1: generic term for a woman. I think it means good wife.

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Speaker 1: So I'm pretty good wife. I'm not a wife yet.

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Speaker 1: I think you would say good like Mrs was gooddy. Um,

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Speaker 1: it he proct her um. So yeah, if you're real

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Speaker 1: into each other, he'd go to the parents and be like, hey,

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Speaker 1: I'd kind of like to take this to the next level,

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Speaker 1: and the parents were like on it. But again, you know,

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Speaker 1: they all share personal space. There's not a lot of

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Speaker 1: privacy in Puritan society. So what they would do is

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Speaker 1: have you come over on a Saturday night, because a Saturday,

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Speaker 1: you know, the night for flirting and forgetting it on.

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Speaker 1: And so what they would do is they would put

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Speaker 1: they would tie the girls ankles together and then put

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Speaker 1: her in a sack and that tied at her waist

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Speaker 1: or at her neck, and then they would put her

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Speaker 1: in the sack in her bed, and then you, the boy,

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Speaker 1: would have to be fully clothed, sometimes also put in

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Speaker 1: a sack, but not always, And then you would get

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Speaker 1: in the bed as well, and they would put a

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Speaker 1: thick plank of wood in between the two of you

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Speaker 1: and you would get to spend the night together. I'm sorry, no,

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Speaker 1: you gotta you gotta bring your own plank if you

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Speaker 1: want to have a hole in. But this was really

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Speaker 1: interesting because it sounds crazy. I mean I was like, uh, please,

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Speaker 1: don't tie me up and put me in a sack.

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Speaker 1: That sounds so claustrophobic. I'm so scared. And why are

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Speaker 1: we sleeping in the same bed Before we even i

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Speaker 1: mean kissed and stuff. So far we've been eight feet apart.

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Speaker 1: I don't think we've held hands. Um. Apparently the idea though,

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Speaker 1: was that you would get to know each other really well.

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Speaker 1: You get a little time together, you know, hours of

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Speaker 1: the night. You get to see if you actually wanted

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Speaker 1: to wake up next to this person for the rest

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Speaker 1: of your life. And they kind of expected like some

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Speaker 1: handsy stuff to happen. They sort of expected you to

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Speaker 1: kind of do some heavy petting, but the board was

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Speaker 1: there so that you wouldn't actually get pregnant. Although apparently

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Speaker 1: that was not super successful because in the seventeenth century,

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Speaker 1: before they started this practice, which is called bundling by

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Speaker 1: the way, uh, it was like ten percent of women

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Speaker 1: were pregnant when they got married. And after they started bundling,

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Speaker 1: it was so a lot of a lot of a

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Speaker 1: lot of them just went ahead and anticipated their vows,

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Speaker 1: you might say, and went ahead and took care of

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Speaker 1: business in that bed. Probably wouldn't use it on our podcast,

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Speaker 1: but but yeah, they they they were kind of like,

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Speaker 1: at least if we if you get pregnant, if you

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Speaker 1: mess up and you have sex, like you're not supposed to,

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Speaker 1: wag wag um. We know who it is. There's a

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Speaker 1: million witnesses who was over here last night? So you're

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Speaker 1: getting married even if you didn't intend to. So it's

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Speaker 1: kind of worked out pretty well. I guess we're all involved.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know, do you guys want to sit

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Speaker 1: fully clothe it in a bag next to you? Why?

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Speaker 1: My question is why aren't clothes enough? Why do you

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Speaker 1: need the extra layer of the bag? Clothes come off

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Speaker 1: nor I thought the same. I guess it was just

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Speaker 1: like you have so many layers, it's like two annoying

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Speaker 1: was like a new technology at the time that mystified

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Speaker 1: and confused people know it was It came from Ireland

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Speaker 1: and rural UK societies and the Puritans brought it with

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Speaker 1: them and they got very Apparently it enjoyed a little

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Speaker 1: revival among Amish communities in the nineteen sixties and something,

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Speaker 1: and like up until the nineties or something, they were

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Speaker 1: doing it. I guess my thing is this like the

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Speaker 1: dress you know we've been and I literally just did

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Speaker 1: an episode on the history of underwear, and we know

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Speaker 1: about this period, like the dress was very prohibitive in

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Speaker 1: terms of getting it off, even us in the bathroom.

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Speaker 1: So it just seems like a little extra to to

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Speaker 1: insist on including this bag when you already you are wearing,

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Speaker 1: like you know, your outer gear and then your shift

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Speaker 1: or whatever that you have tucked in and it's very

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Speaker 1: difficult to get off. It takes a lot of doing.

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Speaker 1: So it's just it really speaks to the purity of

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Speaker 1: the Puritans that they would insist on this extra layer

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Speaker 1: uh of prohibitive you know, fabric between a man and

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Speaker 1: a woman. Plus this board is a whole board, the board.

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Speaker 1: We also have to remember that this is a little

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Speaker 1: bit of speculation, but people at this time probably had fewer,

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Speaker 1: let's say, outlets for their amorous impulses, and therefore we're

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Speaker 1: a little more likely to be excited and go the

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Speaker 1: extra mile, right to actually have a sexual experience. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you would have to because to your point, all,

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Speaker 1: you're not only wearing so many clothes plus a sack,

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Speaker 1: plus blankets on the bed, plus a board, but also

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Speaker 1: your whole family sleeps in the same room, So you

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Speaker 1: got to be real quiet with all that wrestling you're

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Speaker 1: gonna be doing if you don't want to wake up anybody.

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Speaker 1: So the handsy stuff happens, and then they hear, just

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Speaker 1: in the darkness the grandmother either say hold on, which

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Speaker 1: is bad embarrassing, or nice, which is way worse. She's

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Speaker 1: just like, I don't think he's the one for you, doll.

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Speaker 1: He didn't really have a lot of funness, I could tell.

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Speaker 1: The girl says, wait, wait, is there anyone awake? No?

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Speaker 1: The chorus of no, no from the room way tougher

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Speaker 1: than dating in uh well this, this is way tougher

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Speaker 1: than dating in the modern age. I guess, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but it is funny because yeah, right, I I don't

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Speaker 1: want to deal with the sack. Either nobody tied me

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Speaker 1: by the ankles or that just feels very confident. Somehow

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Speaker 1: it's not not for me. I don't. I don't know

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Speaker 1: why this makesically think of this, but for some reason,

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Speaker 1: my mind goes to a very incredible passage of dialogue

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Speaker 1: from the movie The Silence of the Lambs, where Hannibal

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Speaker 1: Lecter is kind of trying to freak out Clarius and

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Speaker 1: he says, all those clumsy, sticky fumblings in the backseats

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Speaker 1: of cars. You know, it's like the Puritan verse of that.

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Speaker 1: They're clumsy, sticky fumblings in the room with your grandma, right,

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Speaker 1: and you foul. Okay, So now we're following this fictional

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Speaker 1: couple and they've they've been having they've gone through their trials,

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Speaker 1: you know, like a tray, you having to go through

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Speaker 1: those three gates. Never in story. Yes, they got they

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Speaker 1: got through the sack night swamps of sadness, the swamps

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Speaker 1: of sadness, and they found one. Um, Dana, you found

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Speaker 1: one one other. Almost uniquely puritanical courting practice, is that correct? Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: After you got hands e, after you tube all that stuff, Um,

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Speaker 1: it's time to commit. So usually, you know, we would

400
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Speaker 1: think you get a ring, you put a ring on it.

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00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 1: But Puritans didn't wear jewelry. They thought that was real frivolous,

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Speaker 1: and you know, they were very plain and not adorned,

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Speaker 1: so they were like, jewelry is not our thing. So

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Speaker 1: instead a Puritan man would give his intended goodie a thimble,

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Speaker 1: and the thimble she would use and I guess dream

406
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:12,160
Speaker 1: over all her linens that she would sew in her

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00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:16,359
Speaker 1: clothes that she would sew for her new married life. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and then on the on the day they got married,

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Speaker 1: they would cut the thimble cup off and she would

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Speaker 1: wear the rim as a wedding band. It's very practical.

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Speaker 1: It's a very practical gift. Don't give it to me,

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Speaker 1: but it's a very practical wedding ring if you've got

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Speaker 1: a crafty girl in your life. Wait, so, okay, Like

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Speaker 1: what you just shear off literally the bottom of this

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Speaker 1: tiny thimble, presumably with some sort of metal like sheer, Like,

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Speaker 1: how do you even do that? Yeah? I guess the

417
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Speaker 1: blacksmith is at your wedding and he just brings brings

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Speaker 1: a little weldern table with them or something I would

419
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Speaker 1: like to like. Thimbles are pretty mall, A lot of them,

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Speaker 1: I hope they. I mean, how do you guess while

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Speaker 1: he's there, he like makes it, he like sizes it

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Speaker 1: for you smaller back in the Puritan days, you know, less,

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Speaker 1: less hormones in the milk over your thumb. It could

424
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 1: probably slip around your ring finger, maybe because it only

425
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 1: goes up to the first knuckle of your thumb. I

426
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:17,440
Speaker 1: don't know if that would get over the women notoriously

427
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 1: huge thumbs. I was gonna say it's I read that

428
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 1: in a scientific journal earlier. It's like the main like,

429
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:29,080
Speaker 1: that's why Puritans left England, right because they're huge hands. Yeah, yeah,

430
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,560
Speaker 1: they had their thumbs were like big toes and the

431
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 1: rest of their fingers were normal. It's very weird pissed

432
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 1: about that. It was like, I can tell a perodi

433
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,359
Speaker 1: from a mile way, what went we out into this

434
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 1: wilderness to find acceptance for our overly large thumbs, Like

435
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:51,159
Speaker 1: the taste of that always our touch point for for

436
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: Puritan chat is the witch live ach that would like

437
00:26:55,920 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 1: to live thim maliciously thimously symbols. Just that's that's a

438
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:05,120
Speaker 1: great Hans Christian Anderson's story. Actually I believe that's correct. Yeah.

439
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 1: So so this is first off, I feel like for

440
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 1: anybody listening to this in the modern day apparently as

441
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,639
Speaker 1: opposed to anybody listening to this from the Puritan days, Um,

442
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:21,120
Speaker 1: this this is pretty instructive because, uh, it feels like

443
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,119
Speaker 1: the average person in you know what became the US

444
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 1: probably has an easier time dating in general. Right, there's

445
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: no sacks unless it's like a very specific consensual thing

446
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 1: for that couple. Right, you can talk to people post pandemic,

447
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,119
Speaker 1: you can talk to people in person. I guess to

448
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 1: that point about the Internet, there was definitely speaking to

449
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,600
Speaker 1: vibe as people are kind of pandemic dating. Um. But

450
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:54,600
Speaker 1: what so, how how long did this continue? I'm gonna

451
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 1: have my mind, like I'm I'm quitting the show. If

452
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:01,320
Speaker 1: this is still happening in Boston, I'm lose my mind.

453
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:03,960
Speaker 1: Please don't know. I think I don't know about the

454
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: thimble thing. I'm sure that got you know, tossed aside.

455
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 1: When engagement rings and jewels rings started really popular, yeah,

456
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: teramter beers, um. But as for bundling, it really went

457
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 1: out of favor in like the eighteenth century. Um. They

458
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: there was a lot of reverends who were like, this

459
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 1: is so raunchy. You're letting the children have their sexual

460
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: awakenings together and they are getting they are getting pregnant.

461
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,639
Speaker 1: And they had like a whole outrage. They wrote poems

462
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 1: about working they were still getting pregnant. I'm confused. Well, yeah,

463
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: because remember sometimes they would go ahead and do it

464
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 1: and get That's why the number of Puritan women who

465
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: were pregnant when they got married shot up to they

466
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: would have their babies eight months instead of nine. And

467
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, because you went ahead and jumped that board,

468
00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: I guess. But this was this was sex for prokri asia,

469
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 1: not for pleasure, Like sex for pleasure was right out,

470
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:07,240
Speaker 1: and this was absolutely functional sex to make more little Puritans,

471
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: to put out the world, cause they come out fully

472
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:20,880
Speaker 1: formed like that with So they stopped this because tying

473
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: them up in a sack, putting them in bed together,

474
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: and putting a board between them was encouraging sex too

475
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: much somehow, Yes, but it puts a whole new meeting

476
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 1: to wood in bed. Yeah, Max, thank you for that.

477
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 1: Thank you for that. Whatever that was, So you worked

478
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 1: on that? Did you work on that offer? No? No, Max, Ma,

479
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 1: it would have been better if I worked right. So

480
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,440
Speaker 1: with this with this in mind, then, first, I don't

481
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: know about you all, but I have definitely gained greater

482
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 1: appreciation for what what Puritan couples had to go through.

483
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 1: I mean, let's also, you know, not forget that they

484
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,840
Speaker 1: were doing this amid the constant threat of starvation, violence, disease,

485
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 1: and possession. Yeah right, that's pretty pretty impressive. I mean

486
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: with doctor in his side, you know. And I'll say

487
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: the women wanted to keep bundling. The women specifically were like, uh,

488
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 1: if we don't bundle, then we won't have any fun

489
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: until our wedding day. And I was like, Randy Beard

490
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: and ladies were like, let me get handsy. Before I

491
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:48,760
Speaker 1: thought it was the way around. I thought they wanted

492
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: to protect themselves against hans Nous. But it's all it's

493
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 1: all the It was all the male reverence who were like, oh,

494
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: this is really too much for me, and the women

495
00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 1: were like, I like this. I like trying to figure

496
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 1: out if I want to actually see this guy every

497
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 1: single morning or if we you know, if we have

498
00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:07,360
Speaker 1: no chemistry, if we if I he wakes up and

499
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 1: I'm like, so sick of this dude after eight hours.

500
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 1: Like it's nice to know there's actually an interesting parallel

501
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 1: in the story that I'm going to do, which will

502
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: save for for the next episode. But in terms of

503
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:23,880
Speaker 1: like this being somewhat progressive, would think that Puritans would

504
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 1: be like, so it makes sense that like the reverence

505
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 1: did eventually kind of walk it back. But for a time,

506
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 1: I would argue, this is a pretty progressive sexually progressive,

507
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 1: you know rich it was? It kind of was because

508
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 1: again it went out of fashion when the idea of

509
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 1: women being a sexual and pure and like we you know,

510
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: sex is literally functional, we don't have any reaction to

511
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 1: it at all, it's all for the baby part. That

512
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 1: kind of ideal started to grow in the eighteenth century,

513
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 1: so that's when it went away. I guess in this

514
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 1: point they were still like, oh well, there's still human beings,

515
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: and they have of, you know, a reaction to being

516
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 1: rubbed up on. Some reverends like woman't control thyself and

517
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 1: like I picture like the flappy arm inflatable. Yeah, car dealerships.

518
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:19,760
Speaker 1: Did you know those were invented for the Atlanta Olympics.

519
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 1: What a weird thing, you like. They had to figure

520
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 1: out what to do with them afterwards, you know. They

521
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:26,880
Speaker 1: made them like in this massive array, you know, which

522
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: is probably a lot cooler than just a single weird

523
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,920
Speaker 1: kind of like dingy one that you see outside a

524
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,520
Speaker 1: used car lot. But I was recently clued into that fact.

525
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 1: It's pretty cool. Strengthened numbers. That's that's how they work.

526
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:40,840
Speaker 1: I don't know why I said that, like their threatening.

527
00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:46,040
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, honestly I did a sketch about that. I forgot. Yeah,

528
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 1: I imagine that these reverends. The first reverend to have

529
00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 1: a real problem with it was a guy who got

530
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 1: rejected after the girl was like the girl was like, oh,

531
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 1: he's all thumbs. I'm not having it. He bungled the

532
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 1: bundle and she was like, I'm not wasting this, Oh,

533
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: the little bundle bungler Taylor's oldest. Well, Diana, thank you

534
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:12,960
Speaker 1: so much for for looking into this one and bringing

535
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 1: this one to us. I think this is something that

536
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 1: I certainly didn't know about, and uh, I have a

537
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:20,000
Speaker 1: feeling that others didn't either. Yeah, I was saying I

538
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 1: was happy to learn about it because this was a

539
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: new one for me too. I thought I was also,

540
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 1: I'm with you. I thought it was all witches and

541
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 1: burning and prayers and but no, they had sticks and stuff. Yeah,

542
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 1: they had technology. And uh, I believe you may be

543
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: able to see a cinematic reference to this and the

544
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: mel Gibson vehicle The Patriot, where one of the yeah,

545
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 1: one of the characters is you know, he's courting and

546
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 1: the family really likes him and they're like, all right,

547
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 1: we're sewing you into the bag. Yeah, nodding intensely with approval. Here,

548
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:04,800
Speaker 1: Max Will for the record, Dana and Eli Uh sit

549
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 1: for an entire episode knowing a question that Nolan and

550
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 1: I are fumbling with, only to tell us after the episode, like,

551
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 1: you guys know, it's Pensacola, I'm making We were saying

552
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:26,360
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania the whole time. We sounded like a real asshole. Yeah,

553
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: very far away And speaking of far away and awkward segues,

554
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:38,160
Speaker 1: why don't we travel to Mauritania next? This is a

555
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 1: bit of a downer, but it's an important story that

556
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people aren't aware of, and

557
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 1: we're returning with the host of ridiculous romance Diana and

558
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,560
Speaker 1: Eli Banks. Then did you just do an ad throom?

559
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 1: I did? I think I did? Yeah? Yeah, is that

560
00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 1: our first one? I think it might be, Max says is,

561
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 1: once again nodding intensely with approval. Yes, can keep doing them. Also,

562
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 1: it would be really nice. Okay, Okay, never sorry, I'm

563
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,279
Speaker 1: not gonna do it. We're already improving the show for

564
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 1: Mac at least. Okay, don't don't go too hard on

565
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,960
Speaker 1: the honor student vibe, you guys. Okay, I guess if

566
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:25,720
Speaker 1: we keep it up, we'll have to start wearing ties

567
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: or something. But while we were on break and ridiculous historians.

568
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:33,680
Speaker 1: We hope you had a bully break as well. We were.

569
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 1: We've left off right before we went to uh segue

570
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:42,880
Speaker 1: and our segue takes us to Mauritania and other parts

571
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: of the African continent to a a controversial practice that

572
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 1: more people should know about called l e b l

573
00:35:56,239 --> 00:36:02,040
Speaker 1: o u h. It is also known as gavage. And

574
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: we are lucky enough to have to have Eli here today. Eli,

575
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:10,000
Speaker 1: you have studied French bit in the past in your

576
00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 1: sketchier years, are you? Are you familiar with the synonym gavage?

577
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 1: I am uh not no, well uh, by my sophomore

578
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,919
Speaker 1: year at college. It's a very specific one. It would

579
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:26,520
Speaker 1: be weird for your professor in college to have like

580
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 1: lead with this word. It's the French term for force

581
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,520
Speaker 1: feeding geese to create fa ra oh. Yeah, and if

582
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: any you know foodie's out there. I like a good

583
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,400
Speaker 1: fog gra as much as the next uh barbarian. But

584
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:45,040
Speaker 1: it is really truly a despicable practice. If you see

585
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,200
Speaker 1: videos of it, it's grow, it's gross, it's bad times.

586
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:50,680
Speaker 1: Um yeah, you really do have to do a little

587
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 1: suspension of disbelief to truly enjoy some fua gras once

588
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,080
Speaker 1: you see the video, though, it's probably hard to ever

589
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 1: go back. And actually, Ben, I can tell you the

590
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:00,719
Speaker 1: reason I didn't know that French word now that you

591
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 1: mentioned it is because I'm a lifelong vegetarian and have

592
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 1: to work that into every episode. And uh so I was.

593
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,799
Speaker 1: I was permitted to leave class before we talked about

594
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:16,719
Speaker 1: that one. No. No, but the lifelong vegetarian part is true. No,

595
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 1: that's true, and I didn't believe it for like the

596
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:24,319
Speaker 1: first two years I knew Eli Banks, I thought I was.

597
00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 1: I was not to the level where I was one

598
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 1: of those annoying people who was like, are you sure?

599
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: You what about the oil? Are you sure? Because that's

600
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:36,360
Speaker 1: just so boorish. But but Eli, you once described this

601
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:39,240
Speaker 1: has nothing to do with anything. But you once described

602
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 1: yourself as a French fry vegetarian because I asked you.

603
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember, but god, this must

604
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,960
Speaker 1: have been decade ago. Now. I was like, hey, man,

605
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 1: you're healthy. How do I do that? No? No, no,

606
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:55,799
Speaker 1: no doubt. Being a vegetarian and being a healthy are

607
00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: not inherently linked. There a pizza and French fries or

608
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: vegetarian and that was most of my age sixteen to eight.

609
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 1: Probably when you say lifelong, was this because of your family, Like,

610
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 1: did you literally grow up vegetarian like as a child.

611
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 1: That's my mom started when she was a teenager and

612
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,399
Speaker 1: raised me and all my sisters that way. That's really cool.

613
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 1: And my my dad is effectively vegetarian at home. He

614
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: doesn't care. Certainly makes it easier for you than like

615
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 1: making a switch, you know in your thirties. The way

616
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,000
Speaker 1: I have made to switch is my point. I am

617
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 1: incapable of making the switch. I never would have. Yeah,

618
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 1: it's tough, but this also to set the record straight.

619
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 1: Uh Eli's old band is definitely not a vegetarian. That's

620
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: an awkward step I had one time. We're out there,

621
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:46,960
Speaker 1: but but why are we talking about food? Why are

622
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,319
Speaker 1: we talking about controversial food practices. It's because of a

623
00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: practice that dates back to the eleventh century. Uh It's

624
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 1: primarily known in rural areas of Mauritania, but it occurs

625
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:02,400
Speaker 1: in Sudan, in Uganda, it occurs in Nigeria, Tunisia, a

626
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:08,600
Speaker 1: lot of places, and it is a practice wherein as

627
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 1: part of the path to marriage and courtship, young women, girls,

628
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 1: children from the age of five to nineteen are force

629
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: fed because in some of these communities, obesity is typically

630
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:29,919
Speaker 1: regarded as a desirable trait, a body type of form

631
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 1: of wealth that I would be cool with that. Well, well,

632
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 1: god knows, you know. Um, I don't think it's a

633
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:42,480
Speaker 1: controversial statement that Puritan times, in the in the in

634
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:46,320
Speaker 1: the eleventh century, pretty much anywhere you look across human history,

635
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:49,480
Speaker 1: there's some dudes trying to control women's bodies right one

636
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: way or another. They're like, they're like, hey, it's uh

637
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:55,920
Speaker 1: not like when we were talking about underwear recently, there

638
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,319
Speaker 1: was this whole thing of like, let's make your butt

639
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,120
Speaker 1: look like a big balloon kind of hidden by a

640
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,799
Speaker 1: long dress. Certainly, I mean the same way that it

641
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 1: is today. A lot of those ideals of beauty and

642
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:12,759
Speaker 1: fashion are driven largely by the patriarchy. I mean that

643
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 1: hasn't changed. I mean, it certainly has changed to some degree,

644
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:17,839
Speaker 1: but it's certainly still out there in terms of who

645
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:23,800
Speaker 1: controls advertising and who controls you know, the biggest fashion brands. Yeah,

646
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:29,880
Speaker 1: this is so, this process is um, it is a

647
00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:32,000
Speaker 1: long term process, you know what I mean, It's not

648
00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:36,760
Speaker 1: just one unpleasant weekend. The girls, specifically in Mauritania, are

649
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 1: forced to swallow gallons of milk, loads of couscous peanut

650
00:40:41,480 --> 00:40:43,719
Speaker 1: oil and then check this out. You'll love this. He

651
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:48,319
Speaker 1: like cups of pure animal fat. This. You can see

652
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:51,479
Speaker 1: his excitement. Uh, you make this a video show. So

653
00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:57,280
Speaker 1: there's there's something crazy here if you look at the science. Uh,

654
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:00,600
Speaker 1: the one of the most reliable statistics can find for

655
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:05,800
Speaker 1: this is that about every twenty four hours, these people

656
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:08,920
Speaker 1: are being forced to consume on average, fourteen thousand to

657
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 1: sixteen thousand calories. Jeez, it sounds like the kind of

658
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 1: ritual like a method actor would use to fatten up

659
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:18,640
Speaker 1: for a role. Yeah, it's Christian Bale, hard at work.

660
00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 1: Maybe that's how he got started. I don't know, a

661
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: story for another day, but I'm not sure if his

662
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:29,080
Speaker 1: activities are Mauritania. To be honest with you, but this

663
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: is this is literally force feeding. Because some people, you know,

664
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 1: do participate of their own free will. But if there

665
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 1: is a young girl who refuses to drink the crazy

666
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 1: amount of milk, like twenty liters of milk a day,

667
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 1: then they get subjected to these various punishments. One of

668
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:54,400
Speaker 1: which is called toe squeezing. Oh god, I mean it

669
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 1: seems like the description, but just let's hear it. Let's

670
00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:02,520
Speaker 1: hear it. Then, Yeah, it's a there's this thing made

671
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 1: of sticks that is pinched on the skin so it

672
00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:10,920
Speaker 1: crushes the toes. This has, of course some echoes of

673
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:15,200
Speaker 1: the horrific practice of footbinding, but it's less permanent because

674
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:19,320
Speaker 1: they will be able to recover. Uh. The most common

675
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,920
Speaker 1: reason that children are forced into this is that the

676
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,560
Speaker 1: family believes this is the best way to ensure that

677
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:33,719
Speaker 1: their daughter is marriageable and has financial uh financial security,

678
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:37,799
Speaker 1: and that the you know, the courtine men of the

679
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 1: community are able to will look at them and say like, oh,

680
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:46,319
Speaker 1: that's awesome. I guess you should get married. So is

681
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:48,719
Speaker 1: this something that starts when their kids or is it

682
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 1: when like after puberty or like when are they starting

683
00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:58,279
Speaker 1: to try to like fatten them up? Like it must

684
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:00,160
Speaker 1: start it pretty early, and it's it's more of a

685
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:02,640
Speaker 1: regiment like a diet than it is some sort of

686
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:05,760
Speaker 1: thing for public consumption, Like this isn't done with people

687
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:08,480
Speaker 1: watching where it's like a like a you know, eating

688
00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:12,880
Speaker 1: competition or something. Right. So, yeah, there are older women

689
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 1: who are called fatteners who are kind of the the

690
00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: head mistresses of this process, and they're they're private, like

691
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,880
Speaker 1: their private Yeah, it's not it's not a public spectacle.

692
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:29,799
Speaker 1: So at least people aren't getting around and you know,

693
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,920
Speaker 1: pointing and laughing and being like ha ha, drink more milk,

694
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 1: which would just be insult to injury at this point.

695
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: But the thing that's strange about this too is that

696
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:48,400
Speaker 1: the people who are subjected to this have about thirty

697
00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:53,919
Speaker 1: fo higher odds of being married in this community because

698
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 1: it is a in these areas, and of course this

699
00:43:57,280 --> 00:43:59,840
Speaker 1: is not all of Mauretania, nor all of any of

700
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:04,239
Speaker 1: the other countries I mentioned. In this area, in these communities,

701
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:10,720
Speaker 1: the men will have this belief that a larger spouse

702
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 1: will bear healthier children or have a higher chance of

703
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:17,320
Speaker 1: doing so, and so they're willing to pay a higher

704
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:21,719
Speaker 1: bride price for these people, or a dowry. I'm sorry,

705
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:25,000
Speaker 1: bride price. That's the first I've heard of that expression. Dowry.

706
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 1: I know, bride price sounds very uh callous and kind

707
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:33,160
Speaker 1: of like transactional, but I guess that's what marriage was.

708
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,919
Speaker 1: I don't know why it sounds surprised. Yeah, it's a dowry,

709
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 1: you know, is the same thing as a bride price

710
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 1: is just a different word really from the same practice.

711
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 1: So when when we look at this, we know that clearly, right, clearly,

712
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:56,200
Speaker 1: this can be linked to profoundly harmful physical consequences, including

713
00:44:56,239 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 1: stuff like cardiovascular disease. But it's it's tough to trace

714
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:07,800
Speaker 1: the origins of it. But people believe that it dates

715
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 1: back to uh the time when the majority of the

716
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:16,400
Speaker 1: population in modern day Mauritania was comprised of nomadic societies.

717
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:21,319
Speaker 1: And so because people were, you know, constantly on the

718
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:24,760
Speaker 1: move and maybe food insecurity was just a daily fact

719
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:27,399
Speaker 1: of life in a harsh environment, this would have been

720
00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,600
Speaker 1: seen as um as a status symbol. Well, and they're

721
00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:33,399
Speaker 1: also getting their steps in at least, you know, so

722
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 1: that's that's a good thing. I you know, it's strange

723
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:42,680
Speaker 1: because when we read about these kind of things, it's

724
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,759
Speaker 1: all too tempting to say something like, well, you know,

725
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:49,360
Speaker 1: that's something for the dusty footnotes of history. People figured

726
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:53,680
Speaker 1: out the medical advantages to not force feeding their children.

727
00:45:54,400 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 1: I'm sad report does not entirely the case in this uh,

728
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:03,319
Speaker 1: in this current age, there are still people who are

729
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 1: forced to consume you know that sixteen thousand, fourteen thousand

730
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:12,040
Speaker 1: calories a day, which is more than four times that

731
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:16,799
Speaker 1: of a male bodybuilder or male identifying bodybuilder. Uh. And

732
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:19,200
Speaker 1: I wanted to I want to throw it, throw it

733
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:23,960
Speaker 1: to you all, like what what is the situation that

734
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:28,080
Speaker 1: it feels very patriarchal? Right like this this is now

735
00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: a symbol of my wealth or something right like this

736
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:37,080
Speaker 1: person um, But why do you think it persists? Well?

737
00:46:37,719 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 1: I sort of have another question kind of along that

738
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:43,239
Speaker 1: line too, is is there an economic factor in this?

739
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,080
Speaker 1: Like this sounds like a lot of resources going to this.

740
00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 1: Is this something that only here families can afford? Is

741
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 1: this something that you know, a substantial personal population wishes

742
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:54,440
Speaker 1: they could be part of and are left out of

743
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: or vice versa. Yeah, that's that's a that's a good question.

744
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: So there is a socio economy factor, because again it

745
00:47:01,840 --> 00:47:07,239
Speaker 1: is it is seen as for the family of of

746
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,400
Speaker 1: you know, for like the daughter's family, and for the

747
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:14,839
Speaker 1: perspective groom, it's seen as a public statement that we

748
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:18,960
Speaker 1: are doing well right, and so it's kind of like

749
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 1: it's just inherently identified with prosperity. And you can read

750
00:47:26,840 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: you can read a lot of articles about this that

751
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:33,080
Speaker 1: give lie to the idea that it's an ancient practice.

752
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 1: There's one in Marie Claire from two thousand eleven by

753
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:41,280
Speaker 1: Abigail Howorth that really hit home and I recommend reading

754
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 1: it for anybody who wants to learn more. It goes

755
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:49,719
Speaker 1: into detail about the diet, about how the process begins. Uh.

756
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 1: It is a sobering read. But you hear directly from

757
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 1: some of these children, and you hear directly from some

758
00:47:57,480 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 1: of the fatteners, and one of them, identified as El Hassan,

759
00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:05,400
Speaker 1: definitely seasoned as a business. She makes a hundred and

760
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:08,799
Speaker 1: fifty five dollars every three months for each girl she

761
00:48:08,920 --> 00:48:12,560
Speaker 1: forced feeds through the program, just like a force feeding

762
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:15,799
Speaker 1: doulah or like a force feeding kind of mystic or

763
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 1: something that's so weird. Yeah, and uh she was the

764
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 1: Some of the interviewers naturally asked the question like, hey,

765
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:30,360
Speaker 1: so I've eaten too much in the past. How do

766
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:34,360
Speaker 1: you force children to do this? And uh, El Hassan

767
00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:38,120
Speaker 1: specifically says, quote, I'm very strict. I beat the girls

768
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:40,880
Speaker 1: or torture them by squeezing a stick between their toes.

769
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:43,840
Speaker 1: I isolate them, and I tell them that thin women

770
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,200
Speaker 1: are inferior. Is that the same as toe squeezing or

771
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,480
Speaker 1: is that something different? I think it's a variation on

772
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 1: a theme, very toe oriented, can I say, And I

773
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:56,200
Speaker 1: think a lot of people know this, But Marie Claire

774
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:59,239
Speaker 1: excellent work, Like they're a source for my story that

775
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:01,960
Speaker 1: we'll do in the next episode. But they sort of

776
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 1: turned a corner. They used to be sort of like

777
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 1: kind of a fruit fru tween magazine, I think when

778
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:09,280
Speaker 1: we were younger. But they've actually done some really excellent

779
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 1: journalism over the last maybe ten years or so, kind

780
00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: of like teen Vogue amazing or I'll see it. BuzzFeed

781
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 1: News has done some good stuff. They did they got

782
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:30,319
Speaker 1: a pulitzer they yes, and like a tweet round up,

783
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: like we can have it all. But here's another thing

784
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:36,759
Speaker 1: I thought, because this is a very serious thing and

785
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:39,960
Speaker 1: it needs more awareness. Um and you know, there's a

786
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:45,439
Speaker 1: whole conversation about cultural imperialism, right telling people uh not

787
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 1: to practice their traditions or something. But there's also the

788
00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:52,120
Speaker 1: importance of informed consent, and there's importance of protecting people's health,

789
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:54,319
Speaker 1: and they're right to choose what they want to do.

790
00:49:54,600 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 1: One of my first questions I can't be the only

791
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:59,839
Speaker 1: one thinking this is Uh, how did the guys get

792
00:49:59,840 --> 00:50:02,440
Speaker 1: all so easy? You know what I mean? What's that

793
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:07,440
Speaker 1: conversation like where they're like, we're fattening up our children

794
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 1: to show how successful we are. And I'm marrying this

795
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:14,439
Speaker 1: person because she was forced to gain weight to show

796
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 1: how successful I am. As nobody ever said like, okay, cool,

797
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:24,160
Speaker 1: what what what about? You wouldn't what would And when

798
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:26,279
Speaker 1: you said the guys get off so easy, in my

799
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:30,680
Speaker 1: mind went instantly to the gutter. And that's just guys

800
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 1: for you, you know, it's just easier. Um, But no,

801
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:35,319
Speaker 1: it's true. And that's the thing we I mean, you know,

802
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:39,239
Speaker 1: you you really don't see many societies that put the

803
00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:44,920
Speaker 1: same you know, um prohibitively ridiculous strictures on dudes as

804
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:48,800
Speaker 1: they do on women. You know. Um, It's a sad

805
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:52,800
Speaker 1: fact of humanity, it seems, but there it is. And

806
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:59,520
Speaker 1: younger people, for their part in Mauritania, are less into

807
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 1: this actice less approving of it as time goes on.

808
00:51:03,239 --> 00:51:06,120
Speaker 1: But there's still you know, one thing we know is

809
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:09,480
Speaker 1: the body image or what is considered attractive from one

810
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 1: culture to the next, is not constant. Right there, have

811
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:16,960
Speaker 1: been uh errors of history where the sexiest thing you

812
00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:20,760
Speaker 1: could have is like totally blacked out teeth and that's

813
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 1: really solid unibrow or that still happens, the row is

814
00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:33,120
Speaker 1: still for sure. I you know, I I make no judgments.

815
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:35,319
Speaker 1: I think there's nothing wrong with a with a good brow.

816
00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:40,080
Speaker 1: But this, this gets us to this gets us to

817
00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:44,600
Speaker 1: maybe where we start to sow up or bundle part

818
00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 1: of this episode because thank you it was you know

819
00:51:48,080 --> 00:51:53,879
Speaker 1: segways callbacks, we got them all and sound effects back

820
00:51:53,920 --> 00:52:04,600
Speaker 1: to hit us with what just rather is what gus?

821
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 1: So this um, this issue is is something where you

822
00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 1: could argue that cultural imperialism can be harmful because if

823
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:23,760
Speaker 1: you ask people, you know, men or women, however they identify,

824
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:28,160
Speaker 1: like what what an attractive body type is, then you'll

825
00:52:28,200 --> 00:52:34,520
Speaker 1: see cases where people are genuinely appalled by a female

826
00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:38,400
Speaker 1: figure that they feel is too skinny. They say like, oh,

827
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:41,120
Speaker 1: they look sick or they look like they have liposuction,

828
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:45,160
Speaker 1: and it ranges to mockery. So it's it's tough to

829
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:47,759
Speaker 1: see how how to fix this, and I think it's

830
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:54,240
Speaker 1: an interesting counterpoint to what we hear often in the West,

831
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:58,600
Speaker 1: where so many kids, so many young women grow up

832
00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:02,959
Speaker 1: feeling like they're not good enough because they don't have

833
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:06,280
Speaker 1: the you know, the typical like skinny or our glass

834
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:08,840
Speaker 1: body type. That's that's here. I don't I don't know

835
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:11,160
Speaker 1: what the solution is. Well, that's what I was about

836
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:13,840
Speaker 1: to say, because it would be like really hard to

837
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 1: want to bring our thing about being thin and given,

838
00:53:18,239 --> 00:53:21,200
Speaker 1: you know, bringing a whole other eating disorder, possibly to

839
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:24,759
Speaker 1: the to the people of this community and stuff by

840
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:30,680
Speaker 1: shoving our own unhealthy you know, body body shaming practices

841
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,439
Speaker 1: on them. And uh, I don't know. I just think

842
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 1: that would be a hard line to walk, to be like,

843
00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:39,080
Speaker 1: what's healthy, you know, depending on the diet of where

844
00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:42,040
Speaker 1: you are, and like the climate. I mean, there's so

845
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:45,520
Speaker 1: many factors that affect how you develop over time as

846
00:53:45,719 --> 00:53:48,839
Speaker 1: a as a community. I don't know, it would just

847
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:50,920
Speaker 1: be really hard to be like, let's send them some

848
00:53:51,040 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 1: Marie Clayers and see what changes. Maybe look get into

849
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:55,320
Speaker 1: thigh gaps. All of a sudden, I'm like, oh, I

850
00:53:55,360 --> 00:53:58,719
Speaker 1: don't want that. It's so interesting. You know, I have

851
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:01,000
Speaker 1: a twelve year old daughter, and I mean, you know,

852
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 1: with the Internet and the kind of democratization of information

853
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:06,799
Speaker 1: and the availability of like literally every thing that's ever

854
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 1: been out there throughout history. Um, it's still like so

855
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:14,839
Speaker 1: toxic the way body image is just pushed upon young

856
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:17,480
Speaker 1: girls in particular, and how trippy would it be to

857
00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:19,880
Speaker 1: be like, oh, if only I were thirty pounds heavier,

858
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:22,319
Speaker 1: you know, and then for that. But at the same time,

859
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:24,120
Speaker 1: when you look at it on a long enough timeline,

860
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:28,000
Speaker 1: it really is just different strokes for different eras kind

861
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:30,960
Speaker 1: of you know, and it's like we associate skinniness and

862
00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 1: you know, all of this body and stuff as being

863
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:36,400
Speaker 1: that's of course what is attractive, but that can absolutely

864
00:54:36,480 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: change depending on the culture and depending on the time

865
00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:41,960
Speaker 1: that you're living in. And I think it ties into

866
00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 1: the image where I see people trying to break down

867
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: now of ascribing one body type too healthy and and

868
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:52,799
Speaker 1: another body type to not, whereas that's going to be

869
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:57,560
Speaker 1: different per individual. I don't think force feeding anyone is

870
00:54:57,560 --> 00:54:59,480
Speaker 1: going to be a healthy habit, no matter how you

871
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:00,880
Speaker 1: do it. But not there is, you know what, we

872
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,840
Speaker 1: kind of forced starved people here, and force any cultural

873
00:55:04,920 --> 00:55:08,360
Speaker 1: way usually seems like a bit of a red flag. Yeah,

874
00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:10,640
Speaker 1: that's that's one of the that's one of the biggest

875
00:55:10,640 --> 00:55:13,879
Speaker 1: things because if it were something where it seemed as

876
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:19,319
Speaker 1: though the entire the entirety of community was kind of

877
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,960
Speaker 1: into it. Uh, and these children weren't like being beaten,

878
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:26,920
Speaker 1: being forced and then try literally trying to run away

879
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:30,399
Speaker 1: from these fattening camps. Then that would be that would

880
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:34,680
Speaker 1: be a different conversation. And I know that's you know,

881
00:55:34,760 --> 00:55:40,239
Speaker 1: maybe not as not as funny as somebody squeezing an

882
00:55:40,280 --> 00:55:43,520
Speaker 1: apple under their armpit for the entirety of a dance.

883
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:46,080
Speaker 1: That's another weird one. If you search, if you search

884
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:51,759
Speaker 1: swent soapple. I think that's right. I had a hard

885
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:54,400
Speaker 1: time finding enough information about that one to warrant a

886
00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:58,560
Speaker 1: whole conversation, but it's definitely on a few listicles of these,

887
00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:02,240
Speaker 1: uh these weird courtship or jewels, but god, these two,

888
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:04,239
Speaker 1: I mean, we always do this, or we have like

889
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:06,200
Speaker 1: a couple of guests on I think we've done it

890
00:56:06,239 --> 00:56:09,359
Speaker 1: with Miles and Jack from the Daily Zeit Guy. So yeah,

891
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:12,400
Speaker 1: we'll bring to a piece and then one a piece

892
00:56:12,520 --> 00:56:15,640
Speaker 1: ends up being more than enough for like two episodes.

893
00:56:15,719 --> 00:56:17,960
Speaker 1: So I think we found our way to the end

894
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:22,719
Speaker 1: of part one of Ridiculous Courtship Rituals with Eli and

895
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:26,080
Speaker 1: Diana of Ridiculous Romance. Thank you guys so much for

896
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:28,960
Speaker 1: joining us, and gosh, I can't even imagine what the

897
00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:32,080
Speaker 1: second episode is going to be like spoiler spoiler to

898
00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:34,719
Speaker 1: go back, The thing is that if the girl in

899
00:56:34,760 --> 00:56:37,320
Speaker 1: Austria likes you after she's dancing with the apple and

900
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:39,759
Speaker 1: her armpit, and you like her, then you have to

901
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:45,640
Speaker 1: eat the apple slice. And would you eat an apple

902
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:48,360
Speaker 1: slice that I kept under my armpit for the entirety

903
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:52,399
Speaker 1: of If that was the rule of courtship, I would

904
00:56:52,440 --> 00:57:00,040
Speaker 1: be celibate for life. Okay, you won't even eat a

905
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 1: sweat soapple slice on the table. That's okay. I wouldn't

906
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:09,120
Speaker 1: eat your sweat soaked apple slice either. If you ate

907
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:12,320
Speaker 1: my apple soaked in sweat, I'd leaved like we can't.

908
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:18,080
Speaker 1: Honesty is the key to any good relationship, and a

909
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:22,000
Speaker 1: good relationship is the key to uh any excellent podcast,

910
00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:24,880
Speaker 1: I would argue. So as as we said at the top,

911
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:29,120
Speaker 1: please do go check out Ridiculous Romance and come back

912
00:57:29,160 --> 00:57:31,959
Speaker 1: to Ridiculous History even if you like the show. Better

913
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:38,360
Speaker 1: to check out part two of Weird Courtship Rituals Diana Eli,

914
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:42,160
Speaker 1: Where can people learn more about the show and your

915
00:57:42,160 --> 00:57:45,520
Speaker 1: work well. You can find us on anywhere you get

916
00:57:45,560 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: your podcast, you can find Ridiculous Romance. You can also

917
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,280
Speaker 1: reach out to us. Uh that our email address Romance

918
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 1: at I heart media dot com, or you can find

919
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 1: us on the Twitters and the Instagram's. Uh my handle

920
00:57:58,120 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 1: is at Oh great, it's Eli, and I'm at dianamite

921
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:04,240
Speaker 1: Boom and we're at ridic Romance as well. If you

922
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:06,080
Speaker 1: just want to follow the show and keep up with

923
00:58:06,240 --> 00:58:10,000
Speaker 1: episodes and memes and stuff, we we have that one too. Yeah,

924
00:58:10,040 --> 00:58:12,040
Speaker 1: you guys do a really great job with your social

925
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:16,400
Speaker 1: media account. Just at Ridiculous Romance. Um, we do a

926
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:19,440
Speaker 1: piss poor job on ours. It's literally just images of

927
00:58:19,480 --> 00:58:26,080
Speaker 1: the new episodes, so kudos to you for that. Thanks. No, no,

928
00:58:26,160 --> 00:58:28,840
Speaker 1: it's we're being honest. Um, this we're not. This is

929
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 1: no smoke. We want to thank you guys so much

930
00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:33,880
Speaker 1: for coming on the show. Of course, as always, thanks

931
00:58:33,920 --> 00:58:39,240
Speaker 1: to our super producer Max Williams h Noel. Thank thank

932
00:58:39,280 --> 00:58:42,400
Speaker 1: you man. This is I'm excited for part two because

933
00:58:42,720 --> 00:58:45,480
Speaker 1: the five of us know what's on the horizon, so

934
00:58:46,120 --> 00:58:48,120
Speaker 1: we're not gonna we're not gonna spoil it too much,

935
00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:52,200
Speaker 1: I hope because we want everybody to tune in, right absolutely,

936
00:58:52,880 --> 00:58:55,680
Speaker 1: you can find our instagram um at ridiculous history. But

937
00:58:55,720 --> 00:58:57,960
Speaker 1: if you want a little more maybe dynamic content, you

938
00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:00,560
Speaker 1: can find Ben and I as individuals. I am at

939
00:59:00,600 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 1: how now Noel Brown on Instagram. You can give behind

940
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:07,680
Speaker 1: the scenes look at my various misadventures and rabbit holes

941
00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:10,920
Speaker 1: of research at Ben Bullen in a burst of creativity.

942
00:59:12,120 --> 00:59:15,480
Speaker 1: It's not all misadventures, right, yeah, you know, under promise

943
00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:18,280
Speaker 1: over deliver. That's uh at Ben Bullen bo w l

944
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 1: i in on Instagram and at Ben bulland hs W

945
00:59:21,640 --> 00:59:25,600
Speaker 1: on Twitter. Uh fakes of course, as always to our

946
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:29,680
Speaker 1: old you know, we almost sabotaged you, Eli and Diana.

947
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:33,960
Speaker 1: We have an MSCs. You've heard the name Jonathan Strickland

948
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:36,280
Speaker 1: DK the Twister. We didn't want to do that to

949
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:40,280
Speaker 1: you sort of Boldemore type figureas we try not to

950
00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:42,840
Speaker 1: use his name. We just recorded in the studio for

951
00:59:42,840 --> 00:59:44,640
Speaker 1: the first time and he was in the buildings, so

952
00:59:44,680 --> 00:59:47,440
Speaker 1: we had to whisper his name like scheming around ye

953
00:59:47,600 --> 00:59:49,720
Speaker 1: beetle juice rules on the show, so we try not

954
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:52,760
Speaker 1: to see his name three times. But but with that,

955
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:55,840
Speaker 1: since we've already I think reached two times, maybe saying

956
00:59:55,880 --> 00:59:58,600
Speaker 1: his name. Let's let's what do you say? We? Uh?

957
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 1: We hit the podcast room from now. We'll be back

958
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:05,960
Speaker 1: this Thursday to hear even more weird courtship rituals. We'll

959
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:15,000
Speaker 1: see you next time, folks. For more podcasts from My

960
01:00:15,040 --> 01:00:17,720
Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

961
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:19,920
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows