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Speaker 1: Hey, lady, is doctor dom here. If you like this

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Speaker 1: show and you want to make your own, let me

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Speaker 1: so it can be heard on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and more.

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Speaker 1: Download the free Anchor app or go to anchor dot

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Speaker 1: fm to get started.

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Speaker 2: On this week's episode in her Space.

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Speaker 3: I quickly realized how common that was for black folks

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Speaker 3: in particular, that we had left many of us to South,

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Speaker 3: wound up in other places, or remained in the South

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Speaker 3: by the reasons why we stayed or the reasons why

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Speaker 3: we left, you know, were very unclear and they were

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Speaker 3: often painful. And so this process of telling narratives is

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Speaker 3: a process for me. This process of sharing the narratives

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Speaker 3: with other folks is also, I understand, healing for them

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Speaker 3: as well. It's answering those questions that are difficult.

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Speaker 4: Welcome to her Space, a podcast dedicated to uplifting women

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Speaker 4: like you. We're your hosts, Doctor Dominique Broussard, a college

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Speaker 4: professor and psychologist.

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Speaker 2: And Terry Lomax, a techy and motivational speaker. In a

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Speaker 2: world where black women are often misrepresented and misunderstood, please

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Speaker 2: join us as we initiate authentic conversations on everything from

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Speaker 2: fibroids to fake friends and create a safe space where

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Speaker 2: black women can just be.

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Speaker 4: Hey, Lady, is doctor Dom here from the her Space podcast.

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Speaker 4: Do you have a burning question you're dying to get

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Speaker 4: feedback on? Do you want an unbiased perspective on a

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Speaker 4: situation you're facing? If so, visit herspace podcast dot com

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Speaker 4: and click ask doctor Dom under the start here option.

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Speaker 4: Every Tuesday, I'll choose a few questions and answer them

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Speaker 4: at random. Lady, today, you are in for a treat.

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Speaker 4: We are joined in her Space by doctor Kandace Harrison,

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Speaker 4: a Kansas City native. Doctor Harrison received her PhD in

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Speaker 4: history from Emory University. She has been teaching history at

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Speaker 4: the University of San Francisco since two thousand and eight.

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Speaker 4: At USF, she is currently the faculty Director of Black Achievement,

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Speaker 4: Success and Engagement, and has also served as director of

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Speaker 4: the African American Studies Program.

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Speaker 5: Welcome doctor Harrison.

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Speaker 3: Thank you such your pleasure to join you both.

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Speaker 4: We are looking forward to this conversation on history. So

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Speaker 4: we are going to start off with our quote of

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Speaker 4: the day. You can tell a great deal about a

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Speaker 4: country and the people by what they deem important enough

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Speaker 4: to remember to create moments for what they put in

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Speaker 4: their museum, and what they celebrate. That quote comes to

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Speaker 4: us from Lonnie Bunch, founding director of the National Museum

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Speaker 4: of African American History and Culture.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful, awesome, Well, Candice, we're just going to dive right on,

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Speaker 2: and if you can just tell us a little bit

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Speaker 2: about the work that you do at USF, that would

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Speaker 2: be awesome.

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Speaker 3: Oh sure, So I've the past few years I have

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Speaker 3: been the director for the Black Achievement Success an Engagement

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Speaker 3: program also known as BASE, and that's given me an

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Speaker 3: opportunity to continue teaching history, but really embed that into

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Speaker 3: a student's daily experiences, but also create an immersion trip

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Speaker 3: through ten different cities at least four different states throughout

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Speaker 3: the Deep South, really allowing our students to walk in

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Speaker 3: the footsteps of our ancestors and come face to face

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Speaker 3: with historical narratives that I normally just get to teach

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Speaker 3: in the classroom. So it's really the past few years

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Speaker 3: have been about just strengthening my own love of history,

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Speaker 3: my own love of Black history, and allowing students to

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Speaker 3: immerse themselves in that.

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Speaker 2: It's been amazing, That is incredible, And I know Dom

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Speaker 2: has had some experience with this here, so I just

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Speaker 2: want to put it out there if you ever are,

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Speaker 2: if you're ever looking for an additional person to join.

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Speaker 2: I mean these trips when Dona's here, just a little

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Speaker 2: bit of her experience going I think on to the

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Speaker 2: emergent trips. I was just blown away by what she

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Speaker 2: experienced there.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't want to speak for her, but I

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Speaker 3: will say it's an extraordinary trip. It's something that I've

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Speaker 3: dreamt about creating for students for a long time. So

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Speaker 3: to be able to have this opportunity to actually create

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Speaker 3: a chance for us to reflect as a Black community

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Speaker 3: on the significance of Black historic and sacred spaces, and

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Speaker 3: to go back to your quote that you read at

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Speaker 3: the beginning, Dom, just about you know you can tell

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Speaker 3: a lot right by a nation by what it remembers

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Speaker 3: and what it doesn't, and so on the trip, we

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Speaker 3: really get a chance to do that. We get a

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Speaker 3: chance to see how museums, how historic sites recognize or

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Speaker 3: don't recognize black folks, and then we get to change

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Speaker 3: the narrative up a little bit, right, because the whole

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Speaker 3: trip is about honoring and recognizing our black ancestors. So

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Speaker 3: it is, it's emotional, it's a roller coaster, it's powerful,

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Speaker 3: and it's definitely life changing.

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Speaker 4: All the adjectives that I was getting ready to put out, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: just reiterate that how incredible it is, and like such

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Speaker 4: a unique opportunity for students to be able to.

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Speaker 5: Have that experience.

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Speaker 4: And so can you talk to us a little bit

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Speaker 4: about what sparked that dream to create this emersion trip,

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Speaker 4: to create these experiences for students.

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Speaker 3: You know, at USF we care a lot about changing

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Speaker 3: the world. There's a lot of emphasis on these kinds

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Speaker 3: of immersion trips, and especially immersion trips where you travel

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Speaker 3: globally right to experience different cultures. And you know that

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Speaker 3: always it's beautiful, but it always irked me a little

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Speaker 3: bit that there weren't more immersion trips domestically and that

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Speaker 3: there wasn't enough focus on other unseen histories or narratives,

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Speaker 3: and to me, that is black history. So again, having

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Speaker 3: an opportunity to create this for students who even if

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Speaker 3: you know, we've got a handful who may actually be

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Speaker 3: from the South, they're being introduced to this beautiful, extraordinary, powerful,

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Speaker 3: emotional legacy of black folks who are rooted firmly in.

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Speaker 6: US history, who built US history.

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Speaker 3: And so to me, creating this immersion trip is a

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Speaker 3: way to honor the signify eificiants of that narrative, to

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Speaker 3: really ground it in the larger narrative of the United States,

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Speaker 3: and to also recognize their power and their agency and

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Speaker 3: building this country.

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Speaker 4: I guess I can't say enough how fortunate the students

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Speaker 4: are to have that experience, because one of the things

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Speaker 4: that we know is that the narrative that is often

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Speaker 4: taught is not always truthful or accurate, for sure.

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Speaker 3: It's even if it is accurate, that's usually they get

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Speaker 3: little pieces of accuracy, right, So, you know, I mean

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Speaker 3: most of us have the same story that we went

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Speaker 3: through school. You know, increasingly we learned about some major

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Speaker 3: black historical figures.

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Speaker 6: Arthur King Junior.

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Speaker 3: Obama, you know, has now become a major historical figure

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Speaker 3: everybody points to. But it's all the little folks in between.

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Speaker 3: It's the vast majority of African American lives and experiences

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Speaker 3: that again laid the groundwork for this country that we

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Speaker 3: just don't learn about. And there's real beauty to me

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Speaker 3: in the everyday folk. And so bringing against students back

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Speaker 3: to the South, bringing staff, bringing friends, bringing my own

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Speaker 3: family on these trips over the past couple of years.

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Speaker 3: I think it's just it reinvigorates me. It reinvigorates my

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Speaker 3: love for everyday people and every day black folks and

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Speaker 3: the power that they really had and shaping the country.

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Speaker 3: So it is, it's an amazing opportunity.

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Speaker 2: And Kenda's quick question for you when it comes to

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Speaker 2: researching our history and trying to sort of put the puzzles,

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Speaker 2: you know, the puzzle pieces together, how do we know

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Speaker 2: what we can trust? I feel like I wish I

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Speaker 2: would have gotten into history a lot sooner than I did.

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Speaker 2: But I feel like when I did, you know, start

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Speaker 2: googling or finding books, It's like, how do we even

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Speaker 2: know what to believe when we've had when we have

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Speaker 2: this history that has it seems as though it's been

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Speaker 2: people have been trying to erase it for the longest, right,

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Speaker 2: how do we know what we can trust?

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Speaker 6: Yeah? It's a great question.

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Speaker 3: Next, especially at this moment in time, we get all

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Speaker 3: the fake news and fake media and all these things,

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Speaker 3: you know, trust academic sites in general. Even if some

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Speaker 3: historians are biased in their interpretations, at least you can

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Speaker 3: trust that academics in particular have been trained to tell

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Speaker 3: you know, accurate narratives.

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 3: They're not going to be false. They may still leave

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Speaker 3: out bits and pieces, but they're not going to be

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Speaker 3: false typically, So as you're googling, you know, google away,

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Speaker 3: go down the rabbit hole, right of historical information, but

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Speaker 3: just sort of fact check those things by really paying

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Speaker 3: attention to educational sites, right, any sort of dot edus Right,

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Speaker 3: you're going to stumble across historians in particular who are

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Speaker 3: giving more accurate narratives. And then don't just read one.

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Speaker 3: Read fifteen, Okay, if that's too much, I get it.

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Speaker 2: Fifteen.

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Speaker 3: Okay, that was five.

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Speaker 5: I'm like fifteen. We're there for like real, well, to

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Speaker 5: be down a rabbit hole.

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Speaker 6: You will, But that's the fun in it too.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you know, if you if you you definitely

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Speaker 3: need to read more than one, right, because again it's

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Speaker 3: not you know, historians in particular, it's not that we

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Speaker 3: are intentionally leaving out information. It's that we've got different

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Speaker 3: focuses overall. So reading multiple academics, reading the way that

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Speaker 3: they interpret different historic events or people, it's actually really

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Speaker 3: important to completing the whole story for you. So yeah,

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Speaker 3: that's what I would suggest.

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Speaker 2: Well, and I will say I feel like I didn't

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Speaker 2: really start to gain an interest in learning my history

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Speaker 2: and ancestry. Unfortunately, it wasn't until I began to look

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Speaker 2: at starting a family I sort of got to this.

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Speaker 2: I was in this space where I was like, you

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Speaker 2: know what, I want to make sure that I can

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Speaker 2: tell my child, like where we came from and what

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Speaker 2: is this family tree going to be like? And so

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Speaker 2: that's literally what prompted me to you know, get that

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Speaker 2: ancestry account sending that DNA and all that. What's spoke

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Speaker 2: to your interest in history and why is it important

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Speaker 2: for us to understand our history?

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Speaker 3: Oh boy, we opened the cannon. Now, Well, when I

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Speaker 3: was six years old, I'm just kidding. I get it.

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Speaker 6: This is not free therapy for me.

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Speaker 2: So I don't know.

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Speaker 3: You know, I did have an interest at a really

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Speaker 3: young age, and for me, I think it was because

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Speaker 3: there were so many silences within my own family, and

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Speaker 3: I didn't quite understand, you know, the reasons why people

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Speaker 3: were silent. If I can flesh this out a little

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Speaker 3: bit more, because I think it's a really common situation

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Speaker 3: for a lot of us, right, Like, our families represent

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Speaker 3: a lot of love, hopefully, but also a lot of pain.

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Speaker 3: And so sometimes, right our parents, our siblings, our aunts

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Speaker 3: and our uncles, right, they sort of just go dark

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Speaker 3: and when we ask questions, they don't want to answer

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Speaker 3: because it's scratching the surface of a lot of trauma

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Speaker 3: for them.

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Speaker 6: So that's how I.

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Speaker 3: Grew up, right, I mean, I grew up with a

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Speaker 3: family again who was incredibly loving to me, incredibly supportive.

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Speaker 3: But when I would try to ask questions about you know,

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Speaker 3: their former lives in Louisiana, most of them came to

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Speaker 3: Kansidy from the second grade migration, I wasn't getting a

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Speaker 3: lot of answers. When I asked farther back than that, right,

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Speaker 3: there was just total silence or clearly what to me,

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Speaker 3: even at the age of ten, I could read as

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Speaker 3: a sugarcoating. So you know, it was for me about

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Speaker 3: trying to answer those questions, trying to fill in those gaps,

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Speaker 3: and I think that just turned into my entire life,

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Speaker 3: you know, doing that for myself became doing it for

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Speaker 3: other people. I quickly realized how common that was for

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Speaker 3: black folks in particular, that we had left many of

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Speaker 3: us to South, wound up in other places, or remained

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Speaker 3: in the South, but the reason why we stayed or

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Speaker 3: the reasons why we left, you know, were very unclear,

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Speaker 3: and they were often painful. And so this process of

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Speaker 3: telling narratives is a healing process for me. This process

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Speaker 3: of sharing the narratives with other folks is also, I understand,

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Speaker 3: healing for them as well. It's answering those questions that

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Speaker 3: are difficult. Wow, I took you a different way than

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Speaker 3: you expected. Probably, Sorry, No.

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Speaker 4: And we've talked to We've had doctor tame O'Briant Davis

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Speaker 4: on a previous episode, and she talked about intergenerational trauma. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: and so what you're saying makes sense ties into that

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Speaker 4: that a lot of that intergenerational trauma is because of history. Yeah, absolutely,

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Speaker 4: and trying to protect ourselves or doing what we think

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Speaker 4: is protecting ourselves from things that are harmful in the past.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, And so you know we've again, right, previous

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Speaker 3: generations have tried to shelter us from those things. But

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Speaker 3: in the process they have and you know, severed our

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Speaker 3: relationships with our ancestors. And you know, when you do that.

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Speaker 3: To me, what's problematic is that you know, you sever relationships.

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Speaker 3: You you don't pass on stories of folks who actually

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Speaker 3: made you who you are. You know whose traits you

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Speaker 3: carry without realizing it. You know, if you're an artist,

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Speaker 3: you have no idea that two generations back or three

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Speaker 3: generations back, right, your family was full of artists. You

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Speaker 3: have no idea, and then you stumble upon that, and

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Speaker 3: suddenly you know your own life makes sense, that you

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Speaker 3: are part of something bigger and better and more beautiful,

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Speaker 3: you know, than you could have imagined. It's very affirming

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Speaker 3: to find you know your people.

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Speaker 2: That is so true. And it just made me think

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Speaker 2: about the fact that I remember when I was younger,

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Speaker 2: I would have like, not the non black really the

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Speaker 2: white friends that I had. They would always talk about

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Speaker 2: how they would travel overseas to like go visit their

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Speaker 2: you know, their family. They appear to be so well traveled,

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Speaker 2: but also so connected to their history. So they'd have

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Speaker 2: heirlooms and they talk about oh yeah, my third you know,

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Speaker 2: great great great uncle and grandfather. And I'm just like,

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Speaker 2: I don't know shit about my family. I had no

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Speaker 2: outside of Nana, who was my mom, my grandmother's mom.

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Speaker 2: Like that was it for me, you know. Wow, mm hmmm,

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Speaker 2: that's true.

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Speaker 3: And what does it mean right to be to to

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Speaker 3: really be reconnected? And again to me, that that's why

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Speaker 3: I don't take my students all the way to the continent.

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Speaker 3: I don't take them right to Ghana.

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Speaker 2: I don't.

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Speaker 3: I don't take them to the west coast of Africa,

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Speaker 3: not yet anyway, that's in the works. But to me, right,

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Speaker 3: our grounding is still in the Deep Souff. Not for

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Speaker 3: all of us, right, some of us have roots in

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Speaker 3: the Northeast, but the majority of us have our roots,

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Speaker 3: our heirlooms, our land right, our values, our culture, our

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Speaker 3: ancestral experience is what we created in this nation is

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Speaker 3: rooted in the Deep South. So taking them there is

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Speaker 3: taking them home.

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Speaker 2: And speaking of the Deep South, there's a sort of

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Speaker 2: I want to say, there's a question or a sentiment

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Speaker 2: that often either white people or non black people will say,

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Speaker 2: and sometimes we'll see it in media, and it's so

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Speaker 2: annoying to me. So I really want to address this

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Speaker 2: so that black people can feel equipped to answer this

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Speaker 2: when it comes up. But they often say, like, oh,

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Speaker 2: slavery was so long ago. Are black people still talking

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Speaker 2: about it? Oh my gosh, it was so long ago.

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Speaker 2: If you could just understand how we're still very much

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Speaker 2: impacted by slavery and all the implications, like can we

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Speaker 2: just talk about that, Candace, can you just dive into

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Speaker 2: like how the slavery impact black people in African Americans?

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Speaker 2: But how are we still being impacted by everything after that?

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Speaker 2: Yes in that show.

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Speaker 3: Well, that is a super easy question to answer. You know,

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Speaker 3: when you think about what it means to enslave people

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Speaker 3: for two centuries, to handicap an entire race, it means

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Speaker 3: you handicap an entire race, And the idea that we

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Speaker 3: would be able to get over that at any moment

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Speaker 3: is insane. First of all, there's that intergenerational trauma, right

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Speaker 3: Tom just talked about that we absolutely carry with us.

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Speaker 3: It's become popular, i'd say, in the past thirty forty

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Speaker 3: years to talk about this knapsack of white privilege, right,

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Speaker 3: that white folks carry well in our knapsack as black people.

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Speaker 6: There's a whole lot of.

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Speaker 3: Trauma that we carry with us, and so it's important

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Speaker 3: to root that out for ourselves. You know, we'll never

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Speaker 3: convince I think other people that it's real what we carry,

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Speaker 3: the pain that we carry. But we know that the

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Speaker 3: other obvious way that slavery is important is the way

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Speaker 3: that it went on to affect, you know, generations of

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Speaker 3: folks afterwards. So by handicapping us socially, economically, and politically,

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Speaker 3: it meant that for the next two centuries we have

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Speaker 3: had to fight. Our entire narrative is about fighting for social, economic, political,

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Speaker 3: racial equality overall. But you know, I mean to give

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Speaker 3: you a more concrete example, not as a sociologist, but

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Speaker 3: as a historian. One of the things that I'm researching

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Speaker 3: right now about my own family is about the loss

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Speaker 3: of our land that took place after the Civil War.

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Speaker 3: So one of not many folks, but some folks that

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Speaker 3: come from a family on both sides, my mother's and

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Speaker 3: father's side, they both owned property as free black people

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Speaker 3: before the Civil War, and actually a substantial amount of

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Speaker 3: property in Louisiana, and then I don't know, thirty forty

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Speaker 3: years after the Civil War ended, we went from owning

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Speaker 3: collectively more than three thousand acres to owning none. Yeah, right,

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Speaker 3: And so when you think about, right, how slavery impacts you,

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Speaker 3: how again, the war over slavery impacted my own family.

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Speaker 3: That rippled out right, So people lost their land, they

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Speaker 3: lost their economic and political status as landholding people, and

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Speaker 3: then because they were driven off that land by racial terror.

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Speaker 3: Pretty much, right, we have no property that there's no

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Speaker 3: I own nothing, right, My family owns no land, which

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Speaker 3: today right could be worth a small fortune in Louisiana.

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Speaker 3: So there's been no inheritance, there's no homes passed through

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Speaker 3: right like, there's no tax breaks, there's none of those

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Speaker 3: economic things, let alone again political and social things in

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Speaker 3: my family because that land was stolen from us because

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Speaker 3: of the war over slavery and the attempts right to

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Speaker 3: put black folks in their place before the war began.

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Speaker 3: So these are long term, right again, economic and political

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Speaker 3: things that have manifested from the institution of slavery. But

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Speaker 3: you don't get rid of an institution like that or

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Speaker 3: its effects that lasted again over two hundred years quickly.

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Speaker 3: It's a long gradual process.

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Speaker 4: As you come across this information, like as you're researching

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Speaker 4: your family history and learning all this information. Are you

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Speaker 4: sharing this with your family? And what has been their

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Speaker 4: reaction to the information that you've been coming across.

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Speaker 6: Oh?

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Speaker 3: We yeah, let me just say it's been complicated.

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Speaker 5: I can imagine, yeah.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: I mean I started the book project working on now

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Speaker 3: is about my own family, five generations actually of folks.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I started it because there were a

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Speaker 3: lot of myths, you know, that I could recognize as

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Speaker 3: myths that were being passed down orally right through our

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Speaker 3: families history. And you know, I was curious, like where

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Speaker 3: we really descended from this governor of Louisiana right from

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Speaker 3: the night singh century or not? Were we really Indian

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Speaker 3: or not?

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Speaker 6: Right?

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Speaker 3: You know, that's a famous one, right. So I started

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Speaker 3: this project for that reason. I wanted to find out

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Speaker 3: if they were accurate or if they were false. And so,

371
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Speaker 3: you know, I found a little bit of both. And

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Speaker 3: when you find out, you know, historical truths that counter

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Speaker 3: what your family has passed down, that's very difficult for

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Speaker 3: them to deal with.

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Speaker 6: Overall.

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Speaker 3: I remember, for example, sharing with my mother that you know,

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Speaker 3: we came from in part a free black slaveholding family.

378
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Speaker 3: She did not want to hear it, right. I mean,

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Speaker 3: that was a very difficult conversation.

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Speaker 5: That's a hard one to hear.

381
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Speaker 3: It was the flip side when I told other family

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Speaker 3: members that, you know, we were descended from slaves, who

383
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Speaker 3: believe that we'd never been enslaves, right, That was also

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Speaker 3: very difficult for them to process. So, you know, it's challenging.

385
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Speaker 3: I don't share everything that I turn up because you

386
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Speaker 3: know that's yeah, you got me on that one. It's hard.

387
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Speaker 3: It's hard, and I'm trying to figure out how to

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Speaker 3: navigate that as I move forward. I'm worried about some

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Speaker 3: of the stories that I tell. I'm worried about publishing

390
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Speaker 3: a book because I'm worried about how that will change again,

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Speaker 3: how a couple of generations of my living family members

392
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Speaker 3: understand themselves.

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Speaker 2: That's a lot to consider, it is, and it makes

394
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Speaker 2: me think about just the emotions that come up when

395
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Speaker 2: you're researching. I remember when I did my ancestry. I

396
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Speaker 2: was very excited. I started off very excited. I had

397
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Speaker 2: this family treat built out, and then there was there

398
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Speaker 2: were some developments that it was not expecting, and that shifted.

399
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Speaker 2: But then I also got to the point where I

400
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 2: was able to trace back so far to actually see

401
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 2: the house that my ancestors lived in, which looks I mean,

402
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Speaker 2: it's like the typical down South slave master like home.

403
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Speaker 3: Wow.

404
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Speaker 2: And that I googled it and found it, and that

405
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 2: broke my heart. I didn't realize it was going to

406
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Speaker 2: be that emotional for me to actually put names, you know,

407
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Speaker 2: to the the images that we've sort of had all

408
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Speaker 2: these years. So my question for you, Candice, is when

409
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Speaker 2: these emotions come up, I can imagine for most Black people,

410
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Speaker 2: it's a lot of rage, it's a lot of anger,

411
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Speaker 2: it's a lot of pain when they realized just how

412
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Speaker 2: deep slavery and racism goes. How do you express those emotions?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 2: What do you do with all of that? Because it's

415
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Speaker 2: so heavy, and I feel like we don't live in

416
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Speaker 2: a world that allows us to express that. People often

417
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,320
Speaker 2: pretend that it doesn't even exist, right, So what do

418
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Speaker 2: you do?

419
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Speaker 3: You know, Well, there's the question of what I do

420
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,440
Speaker 3: and then how I also, I think help people process

421
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 3: some of that emotion. So you know, I've been doing

422
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 3: this work for a long time. I teach it every day,

423
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Speaker 3: and so for me, it's not that I'm immune to it.

424
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Speaker 3: It's that this pain and this trauma and the difficulty

425
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Speaker 3: of these emotions are part of the Black historical narrative period.

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Speaker 3: And so I tend personally right. I mean, I'm honest

427
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Speaker 3: about those right, I'm candid with them as they come up.

428
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 3: I acknowledge them. But there's also an incredible beauty and

429
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Speaker 3: a sense of accomplishment and a narrative about resilience and

430
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Speaker 3: perseverance and the spite right of all of this negativity

431
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:50,479
Speaker 3: and pain that I find equally as important. And so

432
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Speaker 3: to me, finding out these difficult periods and these very

433
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Speaker 3: painful personal stories actually inspires me more because it makes

434
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Speaker 3: me realize how extraordinary it is, right that I had

435
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,440
Speaker 3: ancestors who still found a way to make a way

436
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Speaker 3: out of no way, and that you know, I'm in

437
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Speaker 3: the Ivory tower, like I'm an academic with a PhD

438
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,919
Speaker 3: teaching history, and yet you know, these are what generations

439
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 3: of my folk had to go through. So for me,

440
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,400
Speaker 3: it's a balance. I honor all of the emotions as

441
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,359
Speaker 3: they come up, and I sat with them, and I

442
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:28,800
Speaker 3: encourage other people who are going through this process and

443
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 3: finding these personal stories to do the exact same. It

444
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:37,040
Speaker 3: is the beauty and the complexity, and it's about human

445
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 3: agency of American history, and that's amazing.

446
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 4: It is so amazing to hear both sides or the

447
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,639
Speaker 4: whole story right of the pain that we've gone through,

448
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,880
Speaker 4: the pain that o've ancestors have experienced, the tragedies, the turmoil,

449
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:58,680
Speaker 4: and then also being able to recognize that they went

450
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:02,439
Speaker 4: through it, they got through, they were resilient so that

451
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 4: we could be where we are. And then I think about, Okay,

452
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 4: well what helped build that resiliency, Like what were they doing,

453
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,040
Speaker 4: what did they have to cope? Like what were their

454
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 4: coping skills? And so then I'm curious for you, Candice,

455
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,639
Speaker 4: what are your coping skills? As you were sitting with

456
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 4: this every day?

457
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:26,879
Speaker 6: I laugh a lot.

458
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 3: That's one of my coping skills, you know, And that

459
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,200
Speaker 3: I say that with all seriousness.

460
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 6: I have, you know, a.

461
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:40,479
Speaker 3: Huge sense of humor, and I flex it at all times,

462
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 3: even when it seems appropriate to other people down make

463
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 3: you know what I'm talking about. Yeah, I make a

464
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 3: lot of jokes. Yeah, you know, Like I said, I mean,

465
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 3: I honor the feelings as they come.

466
00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:57,400
Speaker 6: But I'm so moved.

467
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm standing to be completely cliched right

468
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:07,760
Speaker 3: on the shoulders of giants. There's nothing that to me,

469
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 3: I go through or have gone through in my life

470
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 3: that people before me didn't go through ten twentyfold. And

471
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 3: so I'm moved and I'm inspired, and I hold on

472
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 3: to their resiliency, and so, you know, it makes the

473
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 3: things that I have to endure seem frankly, really minuscule.

474
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:31,639
Speaker 3: When you're talking about people.

475
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 6: Who persevered through slavery.

476
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:37,440
Speaker 3: When you're talking about people who you know were terrorized

477
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,639
Speaker 3: or run out of their homes or off their land,

478
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 3: when you're talking about people who lost right everyone to

479
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,200
Speaker 3: an epidemic, you know, when you're talking about people who

480
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,479
Speaker 3: survived war, right, Like, can I get up and go

481
00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 3: to work the next day even though I was disrespected?

482
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 6: I think? So, you know, right.

483
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:57,200
Speaker 5: Respect?

484
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I think that's what it is. I mean,

485
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 3: I think that history gives you perspective. It grounds me,

486
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 3: and it gives me perspective to just keep on pushing.

487
00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 3: And I always think this is Bill Withers. I hope

488
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 3: you know Bill Withers. I hope that audience know Bill's Withers. Well, yeah,

489
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:18,959
Speaker 3: he has a song right about basically being used up

490
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 3: and I think Oprah referred to it to that, you know,

491
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 3: at the end of your life, what you really want is,

492
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,479
Speaker 3: you know, to be completely used up. And I feel

493
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 3: that way because I look at the people that I

494
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 3: admire historically, and they gave everything they had to the

495
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 3: fight for equality. They were you know, as used up

496
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 3: as they could be at the end of their lives.

497
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 3: And so, you know, I carry that responsibility with me

498
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 3: as well because I know their narrative that's.

499
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 2: Beautifully stated, and I think about what we many of

500
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 2: us have learned in school and a lot of a

501
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 2: lot of us the story begins with slavery, even though

502
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 2: that's not where our story really begins. Right. I saw quote,

503
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 2: I don't remember it verbatim, but it was something along

504
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,080
Speaker 2: the lines of, you know, they didn't bring slaves over

505
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 2: on this ship, right, They brought over doctors and teachers

506
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 2: and you know, herbalists and just all kinds of professions.

507
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 2: They brought people that were living their life over on

508
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 2: the ship. And so can you just speak to a

509
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 2: little bit of what life was like and like, what

510
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 2: are many of our ancestors were doing before slavery, before

511
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 2: they even got to you know, Virginia all those years ago.

512
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 3: I love that sentiment again talking about perspective, right, I

513
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 3: think that we have a tendency just to use the

514
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 3: word slave right and not realize that they were skilled, smart,

515
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 3: capable people who endured tragedy. So, you know, it really depends.

516
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 3: You're talking about a long era of slave trading overall,

517
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:57,479
Speaker 3: but when the slave trade started, you're mostly talking about

518
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:01,240
Speaker 3: folks who were kidnapped from the continent, forced into slavery,

519
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 3: who had already built very sophisticated societies. They were arranged

520
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 3: according to political hierarchies that were very similar to European societies.

521
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 6: At the same time.

522
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 3: There were carpenters, There were lots of farmers, right. There

523
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,560
Speaker 3: were merchants and traders, There were herbalists as you mentioned, right,

524
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 3: there were spiritual guides and leaders of communities. So these

525
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 3: folks who came, especially that first generation of folks who

526
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 3: were enslaved, the historians referred to them as the Atlantic creoles,

527
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 3: and they weren't especially skilled generation, the first one, because

528
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 3: these folks were basically moved across the Atlantic, and they

529
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 3: didn't come just to what would become the United States, right,

530
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 3: They didn't wind up just in places like Brazil, they

531
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 3: actually were used as guides for European exploration. So these

532
00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 3: are folks who had skills. Essentially, they could take on

533
00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 3: multiple languages right very quickly. They were highly adaptable, flexible,

534
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 3: I'm sure incredibly charming because when you think about what

535
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 3: these first explorers were out there doing, they were meeting

536
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 3: indigenous folks throughout the world. They were brokering deals, right,

537
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 3: and peace treaties. They were political go betweens in addition

538
00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:25,280
Speaker 3: to sometimes being soldiers or being healers or musicians, I

539
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 3: mean all sorts of different things. So that first generation

540
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 3: was particularly highly skilled. And then as time goes on, right,

541
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 3: European slave traders began looking for folks who are skilled

542
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,760
Speaker 3: in particular forms of agricultural work. So the people who

543
00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 3: were forced to come here from the continent who grew rice,

544
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 3: for example, well they had been growing rice on the continent, right,

545
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 3: So I mean they'd been growing corn right on the continent.

546
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 3: So they were looking for folks. They were taking folks

547
00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 3: from certain tribes and communities on the continent who already

548
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:03,320
Speaker 3: had these high level agricultural skills in these particular crops.

549
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 3: They were forcing them into slavery, bringing them over and

550
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,920
Speaker 3: thus reaping the profits off of what seems like to

551
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 3: us just right enslaved workers, but who actually skilled farmers.

552
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:14,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

553
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 4: I'm just sitting with like just the further acknowledgement that

554
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 4: we truly are like the best.

555
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:26,640
Speaker 6: Hey a question.

556
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 4: You think about it, right, when you think about what

557
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 4: you said, like that Europeans went to us to help

558
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 4: them because they didn't have the skills necessary.

559
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 6: Right, Yeah, and that's true.

560
00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 3: Again, I think I think it's such a myth that

561
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:48,280
Speaker 3: you know, these European slavers just rolled up, you know,

562
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 3: on the west coast of Africa and just took whoever

563
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 3: they could find. But it's not true. Slave trading was

564
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 3: a business. And when you think about it as a

565
00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:01,479
Speaker 3: business from that vantage point, right, you're not going after random,

566
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 3: unskilled folks that you can just beat into submission. You're

567
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:08,840
Speaker 3: looking for folks that are skilled that you can employ

568
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 3: in these particular agricultural pursuits in order to make you money.

569
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:15,920
Speaker 3: And then you keep them obviously in those positions through fear.

570
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 2: And I was going to ask, so when you think

571
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 2: about the way that this happened, because it was really

572
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 2: like a global takeover, and the way that I'm thinking

573
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 2: of it is like the most brilliant but also disgusting

574
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 2: global takeover, and that if you have a group of

575
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 2: folks that you want to subjugate and just destroy psychologically, economically,

576
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 2: in all these ways, if that was the ultimate goal,

577
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 2: they did a hell of a job, right. Unfortunately we

578
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 2: were at the run of that. So I guess the

579
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 2: question is, how does something like this even happen? You

580
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 2: know what I mean? Because I feel like it's still

581
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 2: happening today in some ways, but I don't know what times.

582
00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 2: Right back then, it's just mind boggling to know that

583
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 2: this could happen on such a global scale and they

584
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 2: could have slaves on basically every almost every continent, right

585
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 2: because I know they dropped off various ancestors a different

586
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 2: you know in the Caribbean and different you know countries.

587
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:13,520
Speaker 3: So I don't know, Candice, Yeah, that's the question for

588
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 3: you too, right. I mean, a huge part of this

589
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 3: was was psychological warfare. It was deeply political. I always,

590
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:25,320
Speaker 3: you know, have to tell the truth that Europeans could

591
00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 3: not have created this massive transatlantic slave trade with you know,

592
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 3: twelve plus million people being sold without Africans themselves, right,

593
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:42,080
Speaker 3: participating and doing the work of kidnapping and sailing to Europeans.

594
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:45,760
Speaker 3: When you go back right to that level of detail

595
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 3: and you recognize that you have to understand again the

596
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 3: significance of warfare. You have to understand the politics right

597
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,600
Speaker 3: that were taking place in the continent itself, within Africa,

598
00:34:56,040 --> 00:35:00,479
Speaker 3: and you know, you have to understand that to keep

599
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,960
Speaker 3: people because I think the question is not necessarily I'm

600
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,799
Speaker 3: guessing Terry, the question is not about, you know, how

601
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:07,840
Speaker 3: does slavery begin?

602
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:10,319
Speaker 6: It's how does it last? For so very long?

603
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 2: Yes? Right?

604
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:13,759
Speaker 6: Yeah, and that.

605
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 3: You know, our dear friend Kanye got that terribly wrong, right,

606
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 3: and he talks.

607
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 6: About right lord.

608
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 3: I won't even repeat his quote, but you know, I mean,

609
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 3: there is an idea out there that you know, that

610
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:30,200
Speaker 3: we were better off or that we chose to be enslaved,

611
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 3: and that's incredibly inaccurate.

612
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 6: Slavery persists for.

613
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:39,680
Speaker 3: So very long because different societies actually crafts right series

614
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:43,440
Speaker 3: of legislation, They construct whole societies based upon a certain

615
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 3: political and economic hierarchy in order to both create and

616
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 3: then perpetuate and maintain slavery. It was so deep right

617
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 3: by the eighteen sixties that that's why we have a

618
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,319
Speaker 3: civil war because there's nothing else that could bust up

619
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 3: that institution of slavery besides war, you know, and you're

620
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 3: talking about the fear of death, the threat of loss

621
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,399
Speaker 3: not just of your own life, but of limbs of

622
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 3: people that you love being sold away from you. That's

623
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:20,240
Speaker 3: psychological warfare, and you know that works.

624
00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:28,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I feel like that psychological warfare continues today.

625
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:30,520
Speaker 2: That's us.

626
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:35,879
Speaker 4: And so when you are in the classroom where you're

627
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 4: interacting with students, it talk to us a little bit

628
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:43,280
Speaker 4: about how you get them to see that connection between

629
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:48,879
Speaker 4: like what's happening today and learning from our past. Yeah.

630
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,799
Speaker 3: I try to stay away from the present as much

631
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:55,440
Speaker 3: as I can. I try to stay in my lane.

632
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 3: As a story that certainly creeps in, you know that.

633
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 3: You know, to me, it's really really important that folks

634
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:07,719
Speaker 3: develop critical thinking skills. And as a historian, right what

635
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 3: I do is try to help people understand how an

636
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 3: equality was constructed in the first place, right historically, and

637
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 3: the goal of that for me is that they understand

638
00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:24,520
Speaker 3: how to deconstruct it in its present day forms. So

639
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 3: I actually think that you know, when you highlight concrete

640
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:34,120
Speaker 3: examples of oppression, right from two centuries ago. Students are

641
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 3: very quick, right, young folks are very quick actually to recognize,

642
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,919
Speaker 3: you know, the consistencies to this day.

643
00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:41,759
Speaker 6: You know.

644
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 3: So that's to me, that part's not hard. It's getting

645
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,439
Speaker 3: them to understand the intricacies of it. And it's also

646
00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:51,400
Speaker 3: getting them to understand that they actually have the agency

647
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 3: and the power right to deconstruct those present day inequalities.

648
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 3: I'd like to always say this to burn them to

649
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 3: the ground, right, build something in their place that is equitable.

650
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:07,800
Speaker 6: Was that too much? Does that makes sense?

651
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 4: We're letting it soak in because we are we like

652
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,880
Speaker 4: to be critical thinkers of ourselves, and so we're letting

653
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 4: that kind of soak in.

654
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:20,280
Speaker 2: And Q's an important skill these days, like thinking critically

655
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:22,680
Speaker 2: and not just reading or hearing a sound bite or

656
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 2: reading a headline and just running with it. But it's like,

657
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 2: have you done your own research? And by the way, Candace,

658
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 2: I'm going to research on my own after our interview,

659
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:33,239
Speaker 2: because there were some questions I asked you, and I

660
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 2: was like, I should probably do a little digging on

661
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,239
Speaker 2: my own as well. So I appreciate your insight and

662
00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 2: I'm going to build upon what you've shared with us.

663
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 2: But one question that I wanted to ask is, you know,

664
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:46,319
Speaker 2: as you know our podcast, we have women from all

665
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,879
Speaker 2: over the globe the tune in and I have been

666
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 2: taught that, oh, you're African American right, and we have

667
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 2: some folks that identify as being black. Like what, I know,

668
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 2: we're so complex where black people were so complex? What

669
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:05,160
Speaker 2: is the right term for us? And like what should

670
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,360
Speaker 2: how should we figure out how to identify ourselves but

671
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:09,840
Speaker 2: also connect with others because I know that we have

672
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,359
Speaker 2: some women that might be let's say in Brazil, maybe

673
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:16,400
Speaker 2: you're you're from Puerto Rico, but you're like Afro Latina.

674
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:18,560
Speaker 2: How do we all connect so that we can sort

675
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 2: of build together if that makes sense.

676
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, naming ourselves is impossible, it seems, and

677
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 3: certainly there's a new term right, whether it's Afro this

678
00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 3: or black or one of my favorites, Negro. I keep

679
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 3: trying to bring it back. Nobody is with me on

680
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:40,319
Speaker 3: that point. I get it, you're hard so apparently apparently,

681
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 3: but you know, I just just a plug for Negro.

682
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 3: That was like the chosen respectable word right long before

683
00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:50,839
Speaker 3: African American right or Afro American or Afro Latina, right,

684
00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:52,480
Speaker 3: like that was the chosen word.

685
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 6: But I'll leave that.

686
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 3: There in the past for now. We're not in the

687
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 3: nineteen fifties, and I.

688
00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:58,400
Speaker 6: Get that, you know.

689
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:01,879
Speaker 3: To me, it's it's just about like we're all part

690
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:06,239
Speaker 3: of the diaspora. And when you say and acknowledge that

691
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 3: you're part of this larger African diaspora, it's about to

692
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 3: me honoring the fact that you're very different, right, Like

693
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:17,879
Speaker 3: my identity and I know this because I spent quite

694
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 3: a bit of time in Brazil. My identity is very

695
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 3: different as a black person than Afro Brazilians are, than

696
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 3: how they see themselves or the memories that they carry.

697
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 3: Even their connection to slavery, right, feels dramatically different than

698
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:35,520
Speaker 3: my own as somebody who identifies as American and black.

699
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:39,920
Speaker 3: But what connects us is that slave trade. What connects

700
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 3: us is that, you know, we are all descended from

701
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,840
Speaker 3: you know, these folks who to quote a dear friend

702
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,080
Speaker 3: who quoted another scholar.

703
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 6: And forgive me because I can't remember the original.

704
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 3: Scholar's name, he said, you know, we are descended from

705
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:58,840
Speaker 3: those who would not die, right, It's beautiful. I have

706
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:01,240
Speaker 3: to find out originally that because I need to credit

707
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 3: that person. But that's what's up right, Like to me,

708
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,840
Speaker 3: that's the spirit of the diaspora. That's what binds us all.

709
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:12,399
Speaker 3: It's that, you know, we are the folks who are

710
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 3: still living in spite of this historic systemic as you

711
00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:21,399
Speaker 3: said earlier, Terry, this global effort essentially to erase us.

712
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:24,959
Speaker 3: We are still here and we would not and will

713
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 3: not give up.

714
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 2: I think that's a beautiful way to allow us to

715
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:34,439
Speaker 2: connect with our differences, because I think that sometimes there's

716
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 2: so much division when you try to think of a

717
00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 2: word to call us, all right, whether it's black, or

718
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 2: you're this, or you're you know, African American or American

719
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,680
Speaker 2: African descent, which is what my mother taught me when

720
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 2: I was younger, because we were trying to figure out

721
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 2: a suitable and respectable word for being black in America.

722
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 2: And so I love that you pointed that out. And

723
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:56,759
Speaker 2: one thing Don and I were talking about before we,

724
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 2: you know, started chatting with you. We started chatting about

725
00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 2: how in school we're always taught the same black people,

726
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,000
Speaker 2: typically every Black History Month. As far as being a

727
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:10,320
Speaker 2: student where we didn't really realize that we had the

728
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:12,399
Speaker 2: agency to go do our own research, maybe, right, But

729
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 2: the school sort of fed us the same figures, but

730
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:17,280
Speaker 2: there were so many, and you talked about some obscure

731
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 2: figures before, just that everyday people. Do you have any

732
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:24,400
Speaker 2: unsung heroes that you want people to research that we

733
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 2: can I mean, we need to research them all obviously, right,

734
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:29,360
Speaker 2: But do you have any that you can think of, Candice,

735
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,279
Speaker 2: that you would want our listeners and us to do

736
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 2: our research on.

737
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:35,840
Speaker 3: I know, to me, like the unsung heroes that I

738
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,360
Speaker 3: would want people to know about are the heroes and

739
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:41,479
Speaker 3: heroines in their own family like that too. I would

740
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:47,280
Speaker 3: really encourage everyone to research, right, like shake that family tree,

741
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 3: because you are absolutely bound to stumbled across people who

742
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:58,280
Speaker 3: have these inspiring narratives, who change the course of history

743
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 3: in big ways and in small always. But you know,

744
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:06,680
Speaker 3: in terms of famous figures, I think we're doing a

745
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 3: better job. I think that, you know, school teachers are

746
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 3: doing a better job of pointing out different folks like

747
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:17,520
Speaker 3: Ella Baker. But what I would encourage is that you

748
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 3: actually keep going in your research of the folks that

749
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 3: you've already learned about. Right, So Harriet Tubman, right, for example,

750
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,640
Speaker 3: Harret Tubman now has a film out, Thank goodness. But

751
00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,279
Speaker 3: I can't tell you how many students said to me

752
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 3: or other people said to me, Oh, I didn't know

753
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,560
Speaker 3: Harriet Tubman was a spy in the Civil War, And

754
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, she was, right. Like these major figures

755
00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 3: have really complicated, powerful, extraordinary backgrounds and they're they're very nuanced,

756
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:50,680
Speaker 3: and we don't know those stories, and what that means

757
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 3: is that we don't actually understand their full humanity as people.

758
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:56,440
Speaker 2: The multifaces.

759
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, and you know what they're up against and

760
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:00,800
Speaker 3: decisions that they made.

761
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:01,920
Speaker 6: So that's what I would say.

762
00:44:02,239 --> 00:44:06,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, just to find your own heroes and heroines among

763
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 3: your own people, number one, and then find out more

764
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 3: about you know, the seemingly two dimensional heroes that we

765
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:16,240
Speaker 3: hear so much about.

766
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:18,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love it, me too.

767
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 4: And so speaking of being multifaceted and not just two dimensional,

768
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,480
Speaker 4: we're gonna shift the energy up a little bit, okay,

769
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 4: And because we truly do recognize, appreciate, and celebrate the

770
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:42,960
Speaker 4: multifaceted woman and believe that it's okay to be classy and.

771
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 5: Ratchet and you can.

772
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 4: And dance to strip club music, we invite you to

773
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:54,520
Speaker 4: the Oh you clatchet segment do you take on the challenge.

774
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:55,520
Speaker 6: I don't know.

775
00:44:55,920 --> 00:45:05,319
Speaker 3: Maybe we'll see okay before.

776
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:14,839
Speaker 2: With the question, yes, ye, okay, So what's the most

777
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 2: spontaneous thing you've ever done?

778
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:21,720
Speaker 3: Oh, the most spontaneous thing I've ever done. I booked

779
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 3: a trip to Peru to see this man that the

780
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 3: relationship had gone way too long, and I've booked it

781
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 3: in like two days, and then I ended up spending

782
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 3: two weeks and it was it was. It turned out

783
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:38,920
Speaker 3: to me an extraordinary trip, but a bad decision in

784
00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:43,319
Speaker 3: terms of taking this spontaneous flight for a man when

785
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:44,520
Speaker 3: I knew the relationship was over.

786
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,759
Speaker 2: That's a good one, though. I'm glad. I'm glad you

787
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 2: found that to answer the question. That was actually a

788
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 2: good example.

789
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 4: I think, yes, that is that is like probably the

790
00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:56,680
Speaker 4: most spontaneous response that we've gotten from someone.

791
00:45:56,840 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 3: Really, Yes, okay, shouldn't have been so honest.

792
00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 4: No, we appreciate that.

793
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 5: That's what we want. I mean, I think that speaks to.

794
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 4: Being a multifaceted person and having lived a little, you

795
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:25,279
Speaker 4: maybe a lot.

796
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:32,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, you got the deep laugh on that one. Made

797
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:36,279
Speaker 3: some choices, Yeah.

798
00:46:35,400 --> 00:46:38,480
Speaker 4: Well, speaking of choices that we might not be too

799
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:44,280
Speaker 4: proud of what's the most cringe worthy outfit you've ever worn?

800
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:49,880
Speaker 3: Oh, I think I look fine all the time. Let's

801
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:55,600
Speaker 3: see cringe worthy outfits. This is probably not what you're

802
00:46:55,600 --> 00:47:00,640
Speaker 3: looking for. But I had a conversation over brush. I

803
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,279
Speaker 3: was worried about a student, and so i'd you know,

804
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 3: I hope she never listens to this. I mean, I

805
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 3: hope she does because it's a great show, but not

806
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:12,839
Speaker 3: this particular segment. So I took her to I took

807
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:14,960
Speaker 3: her to brunch because you know, she.

808
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:15,839
Speaker 6: Was going through it.

809
00:47:16,560 --> 00:47:20,760
Speaker 3: And over the course of the meal, she was inquiring

810
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:25,880
Speaker 3: about my sexual identity, and you know, so I'm fielding

811
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,239
Speaker 3: her questions. I'm like, this is none of your business, right,

812
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 3: Like you're my students, right, But you know, I'm I'm,

813
00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:33,640
Speaker 3: you know, just trying to sort of divert and focus

814
00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 3: back on her. And then she interrupts me to tell

815
00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 3: me that, you know, she made certain assumptions because you know,

816
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:45,319
Speaker 3: I dressed pretty dowdy, and I was like dowdy and

817
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 3: so AnyWho. Yeah, so apparently for a good six years

818
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:52,520
Speaker 3: of my career as a professor, I was dressing like

819
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:55,359
Speaker 3: a dowdy school teacher. So I had to change up

820
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 3: my entire wardrobe. So here came all the pencil skirts,

821
00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 3: like the yeah, like just I just changed everything about

822
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 3: the way that I dressed because of that conversation. So

823
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 3: apparently I was wearing cringe worthy things for a long time. Yeah,

824
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 3: and not.

825
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:13,120
Speaker 6: In a good way.

826
00:48:13,400 --> 00:48:17,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, you have good stories with your answers.

827
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:31,279
Speaker 6: Keep Yeah.

828
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:35,200
Speaker 2: So our next question for you is, let's just dive

829
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 2: right into it. Are you going to talk or two step? Candice?

830
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 2: If those are your two options, talk or two steps?

831
00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:43,319
Speaker 3: Oh my god, So I'm gonna have to say two

832
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:47,720
Speaker 3: step because when I tried to learn how to twork,

833
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 3: and then my dog sort of barking at me, and

834
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:54,000
Speaker 3: so every time since then that I've attempted to towork,

835
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:56,960
Speaker 3: the dog starts barketing, and I know I'm not doing

836
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:59,040
Speaker 3: it right. So I'm going two steps.

837
00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:02,400
Speaker 5: Domina.

838
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:04,319
Speaker 2: I have to bring you to the Turk class that

839
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 2: we go to so they can teach you how to

840
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:06,520
Speaker 2: really work.

841
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:10,880
Speaker 3: I'll give it a shot. My back is hurting more

842
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:13,360
Speaker 3: as I age, but I'm I'll give it a shot.

843
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 6: Yeah, all right, Yeah.

844
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 3: I would. I mean I admire it. I admire it greatly,

845
00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:20,600
Speaker 3: that's true.

846
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:23,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, Yeah, yeah, it takes a lot of talent.

847
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,960
Speaker 3: Okay, clearly then I do not have yet, but I'm

848
00:49:27,320 --> 00:49:31,799
Speaker 3: hopeful that a class will somehow, you know, make it

849
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 3: okay for me.

850
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:35,719
Speaker 6: Okay.

851
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:40,360
Speaker 5: Our final question, what do you do for fun?

852
00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:45,840
Speaker 3: I drink wine?

853
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 2: Yeah?

854
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:47,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah. I bought a.

855
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 3: Hot tub recently that I love. Yes, one of the

856
00:49:52,040 --> 00:49:56,960
Speaker 3: best decisions of my entire life. For fun, I still dance,

857
00:49:57,239 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 3: even though my dog barks at me in the background.

858
00:50:01,120 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 3: Dancing is still one way and just getting my body

859
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:06,640
Speaker 3: connected to my spirits, which quiets my mind.

860
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:07,719
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah.

861
00:50:08,239 --> 00:50:11,400
Speaker 3: And then I spend time eating good food and drinking

862
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,040
Speaker 3: more wine with friends.

863
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 6: That's how I have fun.

864
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:15,439
Speaker 5: I love it.

865
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:17,000
Speaker 2: Sounds like you're living your life.

866
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 3: I'm working on it yea yeah.

867
00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 6: Always.

868
00:50:20,719 --> 00:50:24,520
Speaker 4: Well, we want to thank you so much for sharing

869
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:29,279
Speaker 4: your insights with us today. And would it be okay

870
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,600
Speaker 4: if our listeners wanted to reach out to you for

871
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 4: information on how to dive into their own family history.

872
00:50:37,719 --> 00:50:39,279
Speaker 6: Well, sure that would be.

873
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:43,680
Speaker 3: Look, I'm like, oh, let me tell you about my

874
00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:47,720
Speaker 3: side business I'm starting right now. I'm just kidding. Absolutely yeah.

875
00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:51,279
Speaker 4: So how could our listeners get in touch with you?

876
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:53,840
Speaker 4: Do you have social media? Do you have an email like,

877
00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:55,920
Speaker 4: how would you want them to reach out to you.

878
00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I don't. I don't have social media because

879
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:02,040
Speaker 3: I'm a historian. I live in the past. Yes, you

880
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:05,839
Speaker 3: can find me on the University of San Francisco's website.

881
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:10,000
Speaker 3: My email address is c al Harrison too at USFCA

882
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:12,799
Speaker 3: dot edu. I do and it suggest for people who

883
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:16,160
Speaker 3: are just starting their research about history and their own

884
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:19,839
Speaker 3: family histories to check out. As Terry said, early, ancestry

885
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:23,120
Speaker 3: dot com is a great site. Genealogy Bank is a

886
00:51:23,160 --> 00:51:26,440
Speaker 3: free site where you can get started that's shared or

887
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:30,000
Speaker 3: created by the same people who run Ancestry. There's newspaper

888
00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:33,480
Speaker 3: sites online. There's lots of things to do right as

889
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:35,480
Speaker 3: you're trying to get started and answer some of these

890
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:37,200
Speaker 3: great questions about your own family.

891
00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:40,640
Speaker 2: Amazing. Thank you so much, Kendice. This was so much

892
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 2: fun and so insightful. Thank you so much for your time.

893
00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:46,880
Speaker 6: I appreciate you both of you. Thank you.

894
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,279
Speaker 2: Hey girl, Hey, it's Terry here from the Heirspace podcast.

895
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:55,480
Speaker 2: Every Wednesday, I release a Wisdom Wednesday mini episode that'll

896
00:51:55,520 --> 00:51:58,359
Speaker 2: give you the quick boost you need to get you

897
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:02,120
Speaker 2: through hump day. At herspace podcast dot com and click

898
00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 2: the Wisdom Wednesday with terrylink under start here to get

899
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:08,279
Speaker 2: your weekly gems. I hope to see you there.

900
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 4: Thanks for joining us today in her Space. Please note

901
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:18,120
Speaker 4: that our show may contain conversations about self help, advice,

902
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 4: self empowerment, and mental health, but it is by no

903
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:25,360
Speaker 4: means meant to be a substitute for an ongoing formal

904
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:30,120
Speaker 4: relationship with a trained mental health provider. If you are

905
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:33,120
Speaker 4: someone you know is in need of mental health care,

906
00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:37,760
Speaker 4: please visit the Therapy for Black Girls directory Psychology today

907
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 4: or contact your insurance provider.

908
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:42,440
Speaker 2: If you liked what you heard and want to keep

909
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:45,840
Speaker 2: the conversation going, connect with us on Facebook, Instagram, and

910
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:50,800
Speaker 2: Twitter at her Space podcast or check out our website

911
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 2: at herspacepodcast dot com. And before we meet again, repeat

912
00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:59,440
Speaker 2: after me, There's something inside of me that's bigger than

913
00:52:59,480 --> 00:53:00,400
Speaker 2: any option stacle.

914
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:02,800
Speaker 5: We'll see you next week, lady,