1
00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:06,200
Speaker 1: Live from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound on

2
00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:11,680
Speaker 1: the United SIDS can never default on this legal obligation

3
00:00:11,920 --> 00:00:16,079
Speaker 1: to do so. With have catastrophic economic counterpoints. We've been

4
00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:18,919
Speaker 1: way too over the line on foreign market. People want

5
00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:23,119
Speaker 1: a great US job. Floomberg Sound on Politics, Policy and

6
00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:27,880
Speaker 1: perspective from DC's top names said, under Palace leadership has

7
00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:31,600
Speaker 1: basically shown the banks the test in advance. Mobilizing the

8
00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:35,040
Speaker 1: business community is a really good thing to do, yes,

9
00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:41,519
Speaker 1: Schloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. Oil

10
00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:44,159
Speaker 1: prices hit a fresh seven year high here in the

11
00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:45,920
Speaker 1: US to end a week that saw do W T

12
00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:48,320
Speaker 1: T I close above eighty dollars of bairel for the

13
00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:53,640
Speaker 1: first time since October when Joe Biden was Vice president.

14
00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:57,160
Speaker 1: Today we focus on why the policy is contributing to

15
00:00:57,160 --> 00:01:00,680
Speaker 1: the increases and what it means for the Biden economic agenda.

16
00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:03,880
Speaker 1: With natural gas prices going through the roof, gasoline prices

17
00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:07,320
Speaker 1: hitting a seven year high three dollars thirty cents a

18
00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:09,880
Speaker 1: gallon nationally, we'll talk about it all. Coming up with

19
00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:13,880
Speaker 1: energy analyst Tom Close of the Oil Price Information Service,

20
00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:17,200
Speaker 1: The Classic Panel with us on a Friday, Bloomberg Politics

21
00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,440
Speaker 1: Contributors Geanie Schanzano are Democratic analyst and Rick Davis, Republican

22
00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:24,000
Speaker 1: strategist or with us for the hour, and later on

23
00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:27,080
Speaker 1: we'll turn to the politics behind the January sixth Commission

24
00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:30,440
Speaker 1: subpoena is going out and very little information coming in.

25
00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,640
Speaker 1: Will be joined by law professor Jonathan Adler of Case

26
00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,600
Speaker 1: Western Reserve University. You just heard it from the source

27
00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:38,840
Speaker 1: from Charlie the price of a barrel w t I

28
00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:42,280
Speaker 1: eight two eight, he said, as I now read on

29
00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:45,600
Speaker 1: the terminal US oil hits Hya since OPEC began price

30
00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:50,160
Speaker 1: war against shale producers. Think of that that was, and

31
00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:52,680
Speaker 1: that's despite efforts by the Biden administration. The light of

32
00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:56,240
Speaker 1: fire under OPEC, though some would say it's thanks in

33
00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,680
Speaker 1: part to the administration's energy policies. Let's learn more from

34
00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:03,480
Speaker 1: the dean of US oil analyst Tom close Up at

35
00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:06,160
Speaker 1: the Oil Price Information Service, which he helped to found,

36
00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:08,760
Speaker 1: is with us right now. Tom, thank you for being here.

37
00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:10,760
Speaker 1: Do you see oil hitting a hundred dollars of barrel

38
00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,919
Speaker 1: as some are predicting, Well, I see it as a possibility,

39
00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:19,120
Speaker 1: but I see it as a possibility of a paroxysm

40
00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:21,400
Speaker 1: where it's not going to be sustained at that number

41
00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:24,919
Speaker 1: for a quarter or possibly even a month, but certainly

42
00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,840
Speaker 1: it's changed. And one thing about October is it's kind

43
00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:31,519
Speaker 1: of a honeymoon period. Uh, the winter is going to

44
00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:35,480
Speaker 1: have to deliver to send prices upwards, you know, into

45
00:02:35,520 --> 00:02:39,720
Speaker 1: the nine hundred dollar range. But this tempest of sort

46
00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:44,000
Speaker 1: of storms with the energy transition overseas in Europe and

47
00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,720
Speaker 1: Asia does kind of set the stage for some numbers

48
00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:51,880
Speaker 1: that we haven't seen well since the Arab Spring years

49
00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,760
Speaker 1: of two thousand and eleven thousand and fourteen. We hear

50
00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:58,079
Speaker 1: a lot about under investment. I know there's a supply

51
00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:01,720
Speaker 1: and demand equation here, but under investment in oil in

52
00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:04,359
Speaker 1: this country for many, many years is what brought us here.

53
00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,360
Speaker 1: Do you agree with that? No, I don't really agree

54
00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:10,320
Speaker 1: with that. I think, you know, oil contend to be

55
00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:13,680
Speaker 1: very bipolar, and we're entering a little bit of a

56
00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:17,040
Speaker 1: manic phase. And I do think that in terms of

57
00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:22,280
Speaker 1: oil shale managed by public companies, they did a particularly

58
00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:25,920
Speaker 1: bad job of managing it during the boom and bus

59
00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:28,560
Speaker 1: cycles when we had two of them. So there's a

60
00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:31,720
Speaker 1: lot of talk about ope OPEC plus discipline, and there's

61
00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:34,560
Speaker 1: a lot of talk about non OLPEC or U S

62
00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:39,360
Speaker 1: shale discipline, but history shows that the discipline gives way

63
00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:43,120
Speaker 1: to a little bit of a melee. And I suspect

64
00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:46,320
Speaker 1: we'll see considerably higher production from the US, and I

65
00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,120
Speaker 1: suspect we'll see OPEC and Russia and some of the

66
00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,040
Speaker 1: other parties probably put more oil on the market. In

67
00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:56,240
Speaker 1: so we hear from the White House, we're coming at

68
00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:58,720
Speaker 1: this from the Washington angle obviously here Tom and the

69
00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:00,800
Speaker 1: politics behind all of the As we hear the White

70
00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,440
Speaker 1: House say, well, we're asking OPEC, we're urging OPEC to

71
00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:08,160
Speaker 1: increase production just as as a non member nation. Does

72
00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:12,960
Speaker 1: that bring us anywhere? Why not fire up the show? Uh?

73
00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:16,880
Speaker 1: I think that they're probably using all diplomatic channels to

74
00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:21,039
Speaker 1: do what they can. But who knows what sort of

75
00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:25,120
Speaker 1: adversarial relationship that might be between the Bid and Biden

76
00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:28,520
Speaker 1: White House and some of the OPEC members, because after all,

77
00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,480
Speaker 1: you know, they are embracing climate change and they are

78
00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:37,200
Speaker 1: embracing the decarbonization of fuels much like your europeads. So

79
00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,800
Speaker 1: it's not in the OPEC's best interest. Let's say the

80
00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:45,159
Speaker 1: cow cow to the US, but I would maintain that,

81
00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,520
Speaker 1: you know, the stage for this was set and we

82
00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:53,600
Speaker 1: went to negative numbers, and we saw unprecedented cuts between Opak, Kazistan,

83
00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:57,880
Speaker 1: Russia and some of the other smaller countries, and uh,

84
00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:00,880
Speaker 1: that's really it's part of it. And we've also probably

85
00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,760
Speaker 1: been seduced by the notion that we can get off

86
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:07,760
Speaker 1: the fossil fuels and onto electricity and an other carbon

87
00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:13,720
Speaker 1: neutral uh fuels much much quicker than can happen. Uh.

88
00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:16,320
Speaker 1: You know, the population of the world is going to

89
00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,240
Speaker 1: grow by a billion people in the next fourteen years,

90
00:05:19,560 --> 00:05:21,640
Speaker 1: and that means it probably a billion people are going

91
00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:26,000
Speaker 1: to becoming mobile, you know, whether they use scooters or

92
00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:31,120
Speaker 1: automobiles or trucks. So it's gonna be tough to get

93
00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:34,200
Speaker 1: meaned off of fossil fuel in a matter of years.

94
00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:37,560
Speaker 1: It's a matter of decades or even scores. I'm fascinated

95
00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,200
Speaker 1: by the conversation about renewable energy here because in some

96
00:05:41,240 --> 00:05:45,360
Speaker 1: cases it in itself will send fossil fuel prices and

97
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:50,599
Speaker 1: oil prices higher. Right as we start the creation of

98
00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:53,640
Speaker 1: these charging stations, as we try to build all of

99
00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:56,159
Speaker 1: these e vs, it takes fossil fuels to do that.

100
00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,479
Speaker 1: So are the policies of this White House actually helping

101
00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:03,760
Speaker 1: to increase oil prices? I don't think so, not yet now.

102
00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:07,760
Speaker 1: I mean, if the policies get followed and get followed

103
00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:14,800
Speaker 1: through on, you can probably blame the administration. Now we

104
00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,039
Speaker 1: happen to think that the discipline is going to break

105
00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:21,120
Speaker 1: between OPEC plus plus. Uh. You know about fifty of

106
00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,719
Speaker 1: the US shell producers or private companies and you know,

107
00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:27,440
Speaker 1: private equity. If they could bring a billion barrels of

108
00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:29,960
Speaker 1: crude oil to the surface in about two weeks, they

109
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:33,440
Speaker 1: would do that. So, you know, it is a problem

110
00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:36,040
Speaker 1: to get off of oil, and we've been on it

111
00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:38,640
Speaker 1: for a long long time. And I think that's what

112
00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:41,159
Speaker 1: we're seeing in Europe. You know, they probably moved a

113
00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:44,279
Speaker 1: little bit too hastily to wind power and solar power,

114
00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:46,680
Speaker 1: and for a while the sun didn't shine in the

115
00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:49,680
Speaker 1: Indian blow and so you have the equivalent of three

116
00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:53,240
Speaker 1: hundred or four hundred dollars barrel for natural gas. And

117
00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,200
Speaker 1: you know, a company shutting down for lack of power

118
00:06:56,279 --> 00:06:59,440
Speaker 1: at a reasonable cost, and to a certain extent, that's

119
00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:03,400
Speaker 1: happening China. We're actually and this has nothing to do

120
00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:06,320
Speaker 1: with this president or the former president. But we're actually

121
00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:10,320
Speaker 1: a privileged continent when it comes to fuel prices because

122
00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,320
Speaker 1: we do have the shale, we have cheap natural gas.

123
00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:15,680
Speaker 1: It's just that we've been through a year where we

124
00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:18,560
Speaker 1: cycled lower on it, and so we're going to be

125
00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:22,200
Speaker 1: able to tromp probably transition a lot better than Europe

126
00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:25,960
Speaker 1: and portions of Asia. To what extent, Tom is our

127
00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:31,280
Speaker 1: allergy to pipelines contributing to these higher prices, Well, pipelines

128
00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:35,559
Speaker 1: are very very effective ways moving product around the country. Uh.

129
00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:38,040
Speaker 1: And you know, I mean the Keystone XL is dead.

130
00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:41,200
Speaker 1: We know that, Uh, and it's not going to be resurrected.

131
00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:43,600
Speaker 1: But some of the other pipelines that are probably talking

132
00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:48,920
Speaker 1: about shutting down would have some pretty severe consequences. Um.

133
00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:51,520
Speaker 1: You know, a pipeline as opposed to moving it water

134
00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:55,360
Speaker 1: borne by barge or cargo or via trucks when you

135
00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,320
Speaker 1: don't have enough trucks to move the fuel. We've seen

136
00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:00,720
Speaker 1: what can happen in the UK when you don't have

137
00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,200
Speaker 1: enough transport truck drivers. Then you have fuel outages. And

138
00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,760
Speaker 1: unlike the UK, I think gasoline prices and high gasoline

139
00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:13,520
Speaker 1: prices are a third rail of American politics. So the

140
00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:16,280
Speaker 1: White House has really got its work cut out for

141
00:08:16,440 --> 00:08:20,200
Speaker 1: it right now. There aren't any easy solutions, and I

142
00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:23,360
Speaker 1: think they probably have to play the long game, both

143
00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:27,680
Speaker 1: on decarbonization and also on getting some more oil out there.

144
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:31,760
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't look harshly upon

145
00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:35,400
Speaker 1: some of the U S companies which have been reluctant

146
00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:39,760
Speaker 1: to reopen some wells or drill in Texas and New

147
00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:45,760
Speaker 1: Mexico because they get blamed inaccurately for curtailing new production

148
00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:48,800
Speaker 1: on federal lands. But there's plenty of land that can

149
00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:52,679
Speaker 1: be exploited right now. That's sort of Grandfather Inn. Where

150
00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:57,080
Speaker 1: is it Texas and New Mexico, North Dakota. It's not

151
00:08:57,160 --> 00:08:59,920
Speaker 1: in New Jersey and New York. We know that. Which

152
00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,440
Speaker 1: talking with Tom closing the Oil Price Information Service every

153
00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:05,600
Speaker 1: year around this time, Tom, I ask you where we're

154
00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:07,679
Speaker 1: going with heating oil prices. I guess I would ask

155
00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:11,000
Speaker 1: you that as well as we consider the season when

156
00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:16,200
Speaker 1: it comes to gasoline, will will these two continue to rise? Yeah?

157
00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:18,880
Speaker 1: I think they will rise, And again I it's certainly

158
00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:21,839
Speaker 1: for October, and then I think the fourth quarter we're

159
00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:25,080
Speaker 1: gonna have to see winter sort of deliver some temperatures.

160
00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:29,360
Speaker 1: You'll hear all sorts of disaster stories about if it's

161
00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,240
Speaker 1: a colder and the normal winner. I'm not sure what

162
00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:35,719
Speaker 1: the data shows. Anecdotally, it seems like maybe we've had

163
00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,840
Speaker 1: three colder than normal winners in the twenty one century,

164
00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:41,920
Speaker 1: so the honeymoon will be over then. But I do

165
00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:44,320
Speaker 1: think that we're going to see numbers around four dollar

166
00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:46,880
Speaker 1: a gallon for heating oil. I think we're going to

167
00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,760
Speaker 1: see very very high numbers for propane and natural gas

168
00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:53,760
Speaker 1: where it's a time lag between what you see in

169
00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,120
Speaker 1: the spot markets and what you pay for your home.

170
00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,600
Speaker 1: It's certainly going higher, you know, in many cases, probably

171
00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:02,560
Speaker 1: twice what was paid last year four dollars a gallon

172
00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:05,000
Speaker 1: for heating oil. Tom close to thank you the Oil

173
00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:09,360
Speaker 1: Price Information Service. Thanks for your expertise being with us,

174
00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:13,520
Speaker 1: and thanks for being with us on sound on absolutely

175
00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:17,600
Speaker 1: and thank you as well for leaving us with the

176
00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:21,959
Speaker 1: crude oil blues. Remember gas price today, National gas price

177
00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:26,079
Speaker 1: has not been this high since President Biden was Vice presidents.

178
00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:29,120
Speaker 1: Some people, let me tell you something. I'll sang a

179
00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:34,959
Speaker 1: song called the Crudel Blue were low today. Gas prices

180
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,240
Speaker 1: are lower than they were early in this decade. We

181
00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:39,760
Speaker 1: got their crude home, but they're still high enough to

182
00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,360
Speaker 1: create a pitch on working families. We are not a

183
00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:44,720
Speaker 1: member of OPE, as you all know. We're also made

184
00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,360
Speaker 1: clear to OPEC. We are in regular touch with OPEC

185
00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:53,040
Speaker 1: that the production cuts made during the pandemic should be reversed. Blue.

186
00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:56,520
Speaker 1: If Hillary got in, you'd be doing wind. The wind

187
00:10:56,559 --> 00:11:00,920
Speaker 1: bills your gasoline prices up. If it doesn't blow, you

188
00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:03,800
Speaker 1: can forget about television for that night. And we have

189
00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:08,679
Speaker 1: also raised issues of supply. It's got the cool, Blue darling,

190
00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,960
Speaker 1: I want to watch television. I'm sorry, the wind isn't blowing.

191
00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:17,960
Speaker 1: No gas tax increases, No gas tax increases. I know

192
00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:20,719
Speaker 1: a lot about when I know a lot about what

193
00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:27,920
Speaker 1: I got the coudor bloom All right, you can't have

194
00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:32,080
Speaker 1: the front right. Coming up, we assemble the panel with

195
00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:36,640
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Politics contributors Genie chanzy No, our Democratic analyst and

196
00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:40,199
Speaker 1: Rick Davis are Republican strategists there with us for the hour,

197
00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:42,880
Speaker 1: and coming up, we're gonna find out what they are

198
00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:47,400
Speaker 1: paying for gas and the politics behind all of this.

199
00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:50,320
Speaker 1: So stay right where you are. We'll check markets and

200
00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:54,359
Speaker 1: traffic on the way. I'm Joe Matthew and this is Bloomberg.

201
00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:59,560
Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. You sound on with Joe Matthew

202
00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:04,840
Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. You don't need the headline on the

203
00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:07,600
Speaker 1: terminal because you already put it in your tank. A

204
00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:10,720
Speaker 1: gallon of gas well over three dollars and a quarter

205
00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:13,560
Speaker 1: in most areas of barrel of double d T I

206
00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,040
Speaker 1: crewed running over eighty two dollars, as we heard there

207
00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:20,440
Speaker 1: from Charlie. And we're not worried about inflation, right, Let's

208
00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:22,800
Speaker 1: talk it out with the panel with us on a Friday,

209
00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:26,520
Speaker 1: a special event here Bloomberg Politics contributors Genie Chance they know,

210
00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:30,240
Speaker 1: and Rick Davis with us for the hour. Genie, I'll

211
00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,800
Speaker 1: start with you. We've heard repeated references to high energy

212
00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,800
Speaker 1: prices and for that matter, high prices for food and

213
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:40,719
Speaker 1: other items from this White House. They claim inflation is transitory,

214
00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,560
Speaker 1: but there is a concern about energy prices. The White

215
00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:45,960
Speaker 1: House making phone calls to OPEC as we were just

216
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:50,480
Speaker 1: discussing with Tom close up. Is it the policy of

217
00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,439
Speaker 1: this administration that's contributing to this. We're making it better,

218
00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:56,080
Speaker 1: you know. And by the way, Joe. Now, I see

219
00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,440
Speaker 1: how much fun you have on Fridays as you're playing

220
00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:04,000
Speaker 1: all these great songs, and I love it. You know. Um,

221
00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,440
Speaker 1: the reality is is that the president is going to

222
00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:10,360
Speaker 1: get the administration, um is going to get blame as

223
00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,199
Speaker 1: these prices go higher. But there's not a lot that

224
00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,560
Speaker 1: they can do about it. I mean, their options are

225
00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:21,160
Speaker 1: to a certain extent fairly limited in terms of their

226
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:25,600
Speaker 1: ability to control the the energy sector around the world.

227
00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:28,480
Speaker 1: So you know, they are trying to do what they can.

228
00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:32,840
Speaker 1: My concern politically has been are they stepping in and

229
00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:35,800
Speaker 1: trying to, you know, take the reins of something that

230
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:37,800
Speaker 1: they're going to get blamed for if it doesn't the

231
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,480
Speaker 1: numbers don't start to go down. And yet they don't

232
00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:44,959
Speaker 1: seem to have a real good, sustained policy for addressing this,

233
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:48,280
Speaker 1: and so I am a bit concerned about that. You know,

234
00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:51,559
Speaker 1: there is something that the administration could do, as they

235
00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:54,720
Speaker 1: think about going to Scotland in just a few weeks,

236
00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:59,120
Speaker 1: and they think about addressing the Climate Change conference, they

237
00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:03,599
Speaker 1: could do something markedly different than either Republican or Democratic

238
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:07,199
Speaker 1: administrations in the US have done recently during energy crises

239
00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:11,240
Speaker 1: like this or higher prices. They could be an example

240
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:13,960
Speaker 1: for the rest of the world on how to handle

241
00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:18,960
Speaker 1: and transition fossil fuels. Uh, you know these fossil fuel sectors. Um,

242
00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:21,200
Speaker 1: But they haven't done that, and they haven't put a

243
00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:23,320
Speaker 1: plan for that. And that's what I think is a

244
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,840
Speaker 1: miss on their part. If this, if gas prices are

245
00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:29,440
Speaker 1: are the third rail politics is Tom Closes said, We've

246
00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,280
Speaker 1: got a lot of third rails around here, Rick, And

247
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:35,000
Speaker 1: we know that this administration is headed to copy six

248
00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:37,640
Speaker 1: is Genie just reference at the end of this month

249
00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:41,480
Speaker 1: into the beginning of November. What else can they do?

250
00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:44,880
Speaker 1: Are we gonna be talking about releasing supplies from the

251
00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:48,160
Speaker 1: strategic reserve next? What? What tools do they have? Yeah,

252
00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:51,440
Speaker 1: I mean nothing is going to happen overnight. You talked

253
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:54,120
Speaker 1: earlier about whether or not you could prod the fracking

254
00:14:54,640 --> 00:15:00,680
Speaker 1: industry into producing more. You you've got um strategic reserves

255
00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:04,720
Speaker 1: that I guess would have a quick short term uh, impact,

256
00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:06,760
Speaker 1: but I'm not sure it lasts through the winter, right

257
00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:11,800
Speaker 1: And and and these are these are inflationary activities, the

258
00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:15,080
Speaker 1: increasing oil and gas prices. It's been happening for a

259
00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,680
Speaker 1: long time in the sense that, um, you know, we

260
00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,960
Speaker 1: had we had artificially low UH prices for gas and

261
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:25,120
Speaker 1: oil over the last couple of years, partly brought in

262
00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:28,360
Speaker 1: by the lack of activity due to COVID. So um,

263
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,400
Speaker 1: you know, there's gonna be a reckoning. And what's interesting

264
00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:35,920
Speaker 1: is this administration is poorly positioned to haul in the

265
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:38,600
Speaker 1: oil industry in a public event to try and show

266
00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,200
Speaker 1: their metal and what they're trying to do, because they've

267
00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:43,680
Speaker 1: been railing against it, you know, for the last couple

268
00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:45,840
Speaker 1: of years as a lead up to the presidency and

269
00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,840
Speaker 1: now while they're in it and there, and it's absolutely

270
00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:51,920
Speaker 1: the worst timing because of what uh Genie was saying

271
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:53,520
Speaker 1: about the fact that they're on the verge of a

272
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:55,840
Speaker 1: COP twenty six where they're supposed to go out and

273
00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:58,520
Speaker 1: talk about how they don't want oil as an energy

274
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,080
Speaker 1: driver in the future. And so they're caught in a pinch.

275
00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,160
Speaker 1: I mean, this administration has been dealt a bad set

276
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:07,320
Speaker 1: of cards, but they don't seem to be playing the

277
00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:09,200
Speaker 1: ones that they've got very well. And this is a

278
00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:11,960
Speaker 1: good example where now they're in a vice at a

279
00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:16,480
Speaker 1: very import importuned time. Uh. And so the world's gonna

280
00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:21,080
Speaker 1: see John Kerry talking about, you know, being anti carbohydrates

281
00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:24,680
Speaker 1: are carbohydrates. I wish it was about putting cereal in

282
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:28,960
Speaker 1: your tank. Uh, hydro carbons and uh. And at the

283
00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,160
Speaker 1: same time, the White House begging these guys that turn

284
00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 1: on the Speckett So, um, you know that this is

285
00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:37,000
Speaker 1: gonna be a tough winter for the administration on this

286
00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:39,800
Speaker 1: issue of trying to fight inflation by trying to drive

287
00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,640
Speaker 1: down gas prices. We're not a member of OPEC genie,

288
00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:44,960
Speaker 1: but what leverage does this White House have to to

289
00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:49,880
Speaker 1: prod producers to crank up more? You know, they can,

290
00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:52,360
Speaker 1: they can prode, they can push, they can beg They

291
00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,280
Speaker 1: don't have a lot of tools at their disposal. But

292
00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:57,840
Speaker 1: I do think there is a way to just build

293
00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:59,600
Speaker 1: on what Rick was just saying, that they could try

294
00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:03,040
Speaker 1: to use this to their advantage. Um, you know, it's

295
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:05,400
Speaker 1: certainly it's not the crisis they wanted, but it's where

296
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:09,280
Speaker 1: they find themselves. And so we do know what we're

297
00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:12,120
Speaker 1: going to be hearing from the right, and conservatives were

298
00:17:12,119 --> 00:17:15,280
Speaker 1: already hearing it is that as these prices go up,

299
00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:19,240
Speaker 1: that this is because of the Biden administration's green policies,

300
00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:21,359
Speaker 1: This is because of the ao c s of the world.

301
00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:23,879
Speaker 1: This is because of the green movement, and that is

302
00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:27,000
Speaker 1: why we see the administration reacting and trying to have

303
00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:30,520
Speaker 1: it both ways. They shouldn't do that. They should go

304
00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,360
Speaker 1: and try to show the rest of the world this

305
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,880
Speaker 1: is a plan, This is a basic plan to help

306
00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:40,000
Speaker 1: transition from this fossil fuel sector. There's are ways to

307
00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:43,719
Speaker 1: do this, and the reality is everybody knows it needs

308
00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:46,680
Speaker 1: to be done. It is a crisis. It is a

309
00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,360
Speaker 1: crisis that we are all and all of our children

310
00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,000
Speaker 1: and grandchildren are going to suffer from. And you know,

311
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,280
Speaker 1: Biden and the administration could lead the world and showing

312
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:58,080
Speaker 1: them how to move through this, but I we have

313
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:00,560
Speaker 1: to see them take the reins of that. And there's

314
00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:02,520
Speaker 1: a lot of smart people who have plans in place

315
00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:05,240
Speaker 1: to do that, but they need the political will, quite frankly,

316
00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:08,040
Speaker 1: to take on this sector. And they're deathly afraid of

317
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:10,920
Speaker 1: the Joe Mansions and others in their old carting. It's

318
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,119
Speaker 1: gonna be an expensive winter. And I wonder what happens

319
00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,040
Speaker 1: when we finally get over this COVID, When we crest

320
00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:19,600
Speaker 1: the COVID and get back to reopening, that will only

321
00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:23,200
Speaker 1: increase demand coming up. We turn to the investigation into

322
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:26,720
Speaker 1: January six. Rick and Jennie will come back as Steve

323
00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:30,359
Speaker 1: Bannon is targeted for a contempt charge after refusing to

324
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,720
Speaker 1: cooperate with a subpoena. Will talk with law professor Jonathan

325
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:40,400
Speaker 1: Adler next. This is Bloomberg broadcasting live from our nation's capital.

326
00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:46,359
Speaker 1: Bloomberg to New York, Bloomberg eleven Frio to Boston, Bloomberg

327
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:50,040
Speaker 1: one oh six one to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty

328
00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:54,040
Speaker 1: to the Country Serious ex m General one, and around

329
00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:58,160
Speaker 1: the globe the Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com.

330
00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:05,040
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg with Joe Matthew headline on the terminal.

331
00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,840
Speaker 1: Bannon targeted for contempt charge in House riot probe. Not

332
00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,679
Speaker 1: a shocker to see Steve Bannon ignore a subpoena from

333
00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:15,480
Speaker 1: the House committee investigating the insurrection. Right, But how about

334
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:20,480
Speaker 1: the former chief of staff Mark Meadows. There's news today

335
00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,800
Speaker 1: his testimony has been delayed, postponed amid reports that he

336
00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,520
Speaker 1: is quote engaging with the panel. We will talk about

337
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:30,120
Speaker 1: it next with law professor Jonathan Adler from Case Western.

338
00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,600
Speaker 1: There should be some drama on Capitol Hill next Tuesday.

339
00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:37,720
Speaker 1: It's not about infrastructure or reconciliation, not in the debt

340
00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:41,399
Speaker 1: ceiling or government funding, but on whether to hold Steve

341
00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:45,840
Speaker 1: Bannon in contempt of Congress. It's after the former Trump

342
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:49,440
Speaker 1: advisor refused, at the request of the former president, to

343
00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:52,760
Speaker 1: not cooperate with a subpoena from the House committee investigating

344
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:56,800
Speaker 1: the attack on the Capitol of January six. This as

345
00:19:56,840 --> 00:19:59,560
Speaker 1: former Trump White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows quote

346
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,840
Speaker 1: engage use with the panel unquote, allowing his testimony now

347
00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:07,639
Speaker 1: to be delayed following President Biden's decision to not support

348
00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:10,520
Speaker 1: Donald Trump's assertion of executive privilege. We told you about

349
00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:12,800
Speaker 1: it when it happened. Press Secretary Jen Psaki was asked

350
00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:14,800
Speaker 1: about it. Shouldn't everybody want to get to the bottom

351
00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:19,640
Speaker 1: of that, Democrats, Republicans, people who have no political affiliation whatsoever.

352
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:23,280
Speaker 1: We're joined to talk about it by Jonathan Adler, law

353
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,520
Speaker 1: professor and director of the Burke Center at Case Western

354
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:30,840
Speaker 1: Reserve University. Professor, Welcome to Bloomberg Radio. We'll tick through

355
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:33,760
Speaker 1: this a little bit here, beginning with with the fact

356
00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:37,280
Speaker 1: that that Congress doesn't have a lot of teeth when

357
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:41,160
Speaker 1: it comes to holding someone in contempt, does it well?

358
00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:45,040
Speaker 1: Historically Congress did. Historically, Congress would actually send the sergeant

359
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:48,680
Speaker 1: of arms out to go detain the person until they're

360
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:52,879
Speaker 1: willing to testify. That's not something the modern Congress wants

361
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,959
Speaker 1: to do, and historically there's often a problem if the

362
00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,720
Speaker 1: information Congress wants from the executive is coming from the

363
00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 1: other party. Right now, however, Congress and the executive branch

364
00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:07,639
Speaker 1: are held by the same political party, so Congress is

365
00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 1: more likely to get cooperation and support from the executive

366
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:14,600
Speaker 1: branch if it pursues something like a contempt prosecution against

367
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,119
Speaker 1: Steve Bannon. So he could be in some trouble. What

368
00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:19,879
Speaker 1: would that result in, Well, it could be a rom

369
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:22,200
Speaker 1: I mean, he could be he could face prosecution if

370
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:26,040
Speaker 1: he refuses to cooperate. I assume that Bannon and his

371
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,760
Speaker 1: attorneys are in part trying to drag this out, trying

372
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,760
Speaker 1: to use a litigation or the forced prosecution as a

373
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:37,000
Speaker 1: means of delay. But I think ultimately the executive privilege

374
00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 1: claims here in Bannon's case are relatively weak and this

375
00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:45,359
Speaker 1: is really nothing more than a delay tactic, and that

376
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:49,440
Speaker 1: he could ultimately face a sanction if if he refuses

377
00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,080
Speaker 1: to cooperate, but it may take time for those legal

378
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 1: proceedings to go forward. You know a lot of people

379
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:55,959
Speaker 1: roll their eyes when they hear this because they say, well,

380
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,040
Speaker 1: my god, when's the last time anybody was honest on

381
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:03,200
Speaker 1: Capitol Hill? And these lawmakers are holding someone in contempt. Well,

382
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,880
Speaker 1: I mean, the the Congress wants to know what role

383
00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:10,359
Speaker 1: people like Steve Bannon had in the events of January six,

384
00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:14,280
Speaker 1: both the storming of the capital as well as the

385
00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:17,359
Speaker 1: machinations that occurred within the White House to try and

386
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:22,159
Speaker 1: engineer some sort of UH flip of the electoral college

387
00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:26,520
Speaker 1: county excluding states or delaying and so on. And there

388
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:30,600
Speaker 1: are potentially criminal charges that could arise out of involvement

389
00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:34,600
Speaker 1: in either of those activities. And it's something that Congress

390
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,880
Speaker 1: believes the American people should know more about, UH and

391
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,199
Speaker 1: the current executive branch agrees. You know that this was

392
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:45,800
Speaker 1: a fairly significant event and it is something that um

393
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:48,600
Speaker 1: that we should know more about, and and a congressional

394
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:50,880
Speaker 1: inquiries one way to do that. I want to explore

395
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,439
Speaker 1: the limits of executive privilege with you, but first I

396
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,680
Speaker 1: want to get your sense of what's happening with Mark

397
00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,240
Speaker 1: Meadows here. The fact that his testimony was delay, the

398
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,160
Speaker 1: fact that he's engaging the term they're using with the committee.

399
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 1: Does that mean he's singing? Does that mean he's making

400
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:10,560
Speaker 1: life more difficult for Steve Bannon? Well, I think he

401
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 1: probably is making life more difficult from Steve Bannon. I mean,

402
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,240
Speaker 1: the reality is, both sides know that if this is

403
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 1: a if they stick to their guns and refuse to cooperate,

404
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,440
Speaker 1: that can ultimately lead to a contempt referral that can

405
00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 1: ultimately lead to litigation and prosecution. And there is a

406
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:30,680
Speaker 1: there is reasons why folks don't want to go down

407
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 1: that road. And the other thing about executive privilege is

408
00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,159
Speaker 1: that it's always a bit of a balancing act. That

409
00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,520
Speaker 1: is to say, there are interests on the side of confidentiality,

410
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 1: their interests on the side of investigation. And if uh,

411
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:48,000
Speaker 1: Congress and Meadows are able to reach an accommodation about

412
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:51,679
Speaker 1: what sorts of information he can disclose, that is that

413
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,639
Speaker 1: is responsive to Congress's requests, but that doesn't tread all

414
00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:59,080
Speaker 1: in areas where there might be legitimate privilege claims. Well,

415
00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:01,040
Speaker 1: then that seems to give everybody a bit of what

416
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:05,440
Speaker 1: they want executive privileges maintained. Meadows doesn't have to risk

417
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,480
Speaker 1: something like a contempted prosecution. Um, But Congress gets the

418
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:13,640
Speaker 1: information that the American people legitimately want. And I should

419
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 1: note that that what these interviews initially are likely to

420
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:21,679
Speaker 1: be behind closed doors, which also can lessen the likelihood

421
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 1: of grandstanding, you know, and which we all know happen

422
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 1: in congressional hearings when they're public. And if the goal

423
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 1: is really to get information that the public is entitled to,

424
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:37,120
Speaker 1: allowing reaching certain or negotiating over what sorts of questioning

425
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 1: is is or is not going to be pursued behind

426
00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:42,399
Speaker 1: closed doors can be helpful. Last thing I'll note it

427
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 1: is possible, um, that part of a negotiation could relate

428
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:51,480
Speaker 1: to possible immunity. That is to say, Congress can Um,

429
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 1: well that's what I was thinking. That could be bad

430
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 1: news for Steve Bannon. Right, But while you're with us,

431
00:24:56,119 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 1: professor talked to us about the extent understood. Talk to

432
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 1: us about the extent of executive privilege for a former

433
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 1: president here without the support of the current president. Does

434
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,879
Speaker 1: that mean anything to Congress? Well, it weakens the claim.

435
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,399
Speaker 1: So a lot of people claim that once you're no

436
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:17,200
Speaker 1: longer president, you no longer have executive privilege because it's

437
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 1: a privilege of the executive, not any given president, and

438
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 1: that's not true. The Supreme Court actually rejected that position

439
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,920
Speaker 1: in one of the cases involving some of Nixon's papers.

440
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,360
Speaker 1: On the other hand, UM, the Court also noted that

441
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,520
Speaker 1: if the existing occupant of the White House, the existing executive,

442
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,200
Speaker 1: does not support the claim of privilege, that certainly weakens

443
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,239
Speaker 1: the claim. So in this case it involved in the

444
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: Nixon case, it involved access to some of his papers, UM,

445
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 1: after he had left office, and UM, the court ultimately

446
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 1: allowed most of the access to occur, but it didn't

447
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:56,360
Speaker 1: it didn't reach It didn't reach that conclusion by saying

448
00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,800
Speaker 1: there's no executive privilege. It's just saying that the claim

449
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:03,159
Speaker 1: is weaker. Similar Early, UM, the types of information affect

450
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 1: how strong are weak the privilege is, as does the

451
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 1: reason that Congress wation. Alright, Professor Jonathan Adler, Law, Professor,

452
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:15,199
Speaker 1: director of the Burke Center Case Western Reserve University, appreciate

453
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 1: the info. Here. We're going to reassemble the panel and

454
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 1: dig into this with Rick and Genie. Next, Joe Matthews,

455
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:26,199
Speaker 1: stay right here. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg.

456
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 1: You sound on with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. Good

457
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 1: lesson on executive privilege from Professor Adler. Let's get into

458
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 1: the politics around all this now with the panel Bloomberg

459
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:44,440
Speaker 1: Politics contributors Genie Chanzano and Rick Davis back with us here, Rick,

460
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 1: what do you make of this conversation with Steve Bannon

461
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 1: or the lack thereof? And and news today that Mark Meadows,

462
00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:53,840
Speaker 1: the former chief of staff the White House, is engaging

463
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: with the panel. You've seen blue ribbon panels before and

464
00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:01,159
Speaker 1: investigative panels on Capitol Hill. What does that indicates you

465
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 1: when you hear that they're engaged. You know, I think

466
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 1: he's trying to avoid a public show force. You know,

467
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: he's got Donald Trump on one side telling him, don't cooperate,

468
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: you know, you exert executive privilege. He knows as chief

469
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 1: as staff that he doesn't have an executive privilege at

470
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 1: this point and unlikely to get any breaks from this committee,

471
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 1: so he's try trying to work something out. I mean,

472
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 1: I doubt if if if if if if, Mark Meadows

473
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,560
Speaker 1: wants to be the center of attention. The difference is

474
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 1: Bannon wants to be the center of attention. He loved

475
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: to cause a fight with the Congress. I mean, he

476
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,400
Speaker 1: was already convicted of a criminal offense once got off

477
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:42,159
Speaker 1: by Donald Trump's pardon, and like, he's not afraid to

478
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 1: be purple locked into jail over a you know, contest

479
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 1: with Congress over executive privilege. For the brand, it's good

480
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: for the brand. It's it's it's actually something that I

481
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 1: think he revels in. So, uh, that's the day and

482
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 1: age we live in. I know that at least most

483
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 1: of my career people wanted to avoid jail. I mean,

484
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:03,480
Speaker 1: it's a good but that doesn't seem to be these guys.

485
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 1: I know, I'm so fashioned. Uh, he's definitely spent a

486
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,120
Speaker 1: little bit of time in and out of jail as

487
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,520
Speaker 1: opposed to Mark Meadows. Genie, how do you see that

488
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 1: playing out? Yeah, I mean it has sort of a

489
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,160
Speaker 1: whiff of Roger Stone to me that he does want

490
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:20,439
Speaker 1: to be in this spotlight. Of course, he has to

491
00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:23,280
Speaker 1: also pay back Donald Trump for pardnering him and getting

492
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 1: him out of jail the first time, and so he's

493
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:28,159
Speaker 1: willing to go back at it again. And you know

494
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 1: the reality of this, his claim of executive privilege. Gosh,

495
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 1: if Mark Meadows doesn't have it now, you know, Steve

496
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,959
Speaker 1: benn And certainly doesn't have it. It is it's you know,

497
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,160
Speaker 1: beyond the bogus claim. But of course everybody knows that,

498
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 1: including Steve Bannon, but he's going to push that. But

499
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 1: the reality is, even if they make the referral to

500
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,480
Speaker 1: the d o J, which they most certainly will, the

501
00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 1: d o J doesn't often act on these things, so

502
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 1: you know, it is not a sure thing that they

503
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,320
Speaker 1: will act on it. It's certainly better odds now that

504
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 1: they're controlled by the Democrats, but say, best case scenario,

505
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: they act. You know, Steve Bannon, even if he ultimately

506
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 1: did testify, we'll probably do what he did last time,

507
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 1: the scripted questions where he said nothing to Congress. He

508
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:15,760
Speaker 1: testified three times before and said literally nothing and used

509
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 1: it to grow his brand and this podcast that he

510
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: does and everything else he does. So you know, I'm

511
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 1: not sure it's going to listen to any information about

512
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 1: January six. Did Joe Biden do the right thing when

513
00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:30,120
Speaker 1: it comes to executive privilege here? Rick? And and does

514
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 1: the former Trump White House have any ground to stand

515
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,000
Speaker 1: on there at this point without the support of the

516
00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 1: current executive Yeah, I mean it's always one of these

517
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: things that you never want to test. You know, they

518
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 1: call it strategic ambiguity. Right, you want it. You want

519
00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 1: there to be executive privilege. You want that to be

520
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: kind of an amorphous thing that most people would say, oh, well,

521
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,280
Speaker 1: of course there's a executive privilege until you actually test it.

522
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 1: And when you test it, the last thing you want

523
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 1: is your coequal branch of government, the courts, to say, oh,

524
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,280
Speaker 1: where do you think you get executive privilege? Him? Uh,

525
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,400
Speaker 1: And the next thing, you know, there is no such

526
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 1: thing as executive privilege. So, I mean this has been

527
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: a kind of a concept that that administrations tend to

528
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 1: tread lightly on because they never want to actually have

529
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: to contest it. And it's obviously not great pr to

530
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 1: claim that you have a privilege as a as a

531
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 1: government employee, even the President United States, as a government employee,

532
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 1: and that you have this privilege that doesn't allow your

533
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: employee employer, the people to know what you're doing. As

534
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 1: we spend time with the panel here on our Friday,

535
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 1: I want to look forward to what's going on here

536
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,800
Speaker 1: next week, and we are all wondering if they're maybe

537
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 1: any news. As lawmakers start to come back to town,

538
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 1: and there's a big task ahead for Speaker Nancy Pelosi,

539
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: who wanted to have infrastructure and reconciliation wrapped up by Halloween.

540
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 1: I don't think either of our panelists expect that to happen,

541
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 1: but we'll ask The President. Meanwhile, left the bubble today.

542
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,959
Speaker 1: He was up in Connecticut for a couple of different reasons,

543
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: in part to make the case across the build back

544
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 1: better bill in terms of adding to the deficit is zero.

545
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 1: So when I hear people say it cost three point

546
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 1: five trillion, and be honest with you, we're probably not

547
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 1: gonna get three point five trillion this year. We're gonna

548
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: get something less than that. But I'm going to negotiate.

549
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 1: I'm going to get it done with the grace of

550
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 1: God and the good little neighbors and the Creek Knight Rises.

551
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:23,120
Speaker 1: My grandpapa said, did his grandpa really say that? Either way,

552
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 1: We're getting down to deadline time here as the White

553
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 1: House eyes a series of deadlines coming up, government funding,

554
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 1: the debt ceiling, never mind the end of the year.

555
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: If the President is saying openly, Genie that it's not

556
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:40,959
Speaker 1: going to be three and a half trillion dollars at

557
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 1: what point are we going to see progressives get their

558
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 1: heads around that and start to negotiate with the Speaker

559
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 1: to make some progress. Yeah, and Joe, you know, if

560
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:52,880
Speaker 1: they do get this by Halloween, we want you to

561
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: be wearing a costume on that day. Okay, because that's done,

562
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 1: Thank you very much. Um. You know, everybody knows it's

563
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: not going to be three point five. Pelosi has said it,

564
00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: the President has said it. Progressives don't like it. Um.

565
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 1: The real question is do Democrats, progressives, moderates and everybody

566
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:13,720
Speaker 1: in between feel that they are in trouble if they

567
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 1: don't get something? And I think that's the message that

568
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: they are. The White House is trying to send to

569
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 1: everybody on the hill that we are all in big

570
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 1: trouble if we don't get something, and everybody knows we're

571
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: looking at something around two trillion dollars plus or minus.

572
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 1: And the question is what do you cut out to

573
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:33,680
Speaker 1: get to that point? Do you you shrink the time frame,

574
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 1: do you go big on a couple of programs, do

575
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 1: you try to get everything you know? I think the

576
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 1: concerns are we've heard from the Progressive Caucus leader. She

577
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 1: is not yet at the point where she is willing

578
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 1: to accept any of that, And I don't know how

579
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 1: this is workable until they all agree they need something

580
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: to move forward. They're back in town late Monday, right, Rick.

581
00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 1: Does it matter if lawmakers are here? Does face to

582
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: face mattered as being summoned to the Speaker's office matter

583
00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: or is all of this being talked about remotely as

584
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,360
Speaker 1: we speak. Well, it's for sure being talked about remotely.

585
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 1: They're going to try and make as much progress as

586
00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 1: they can, you know where people are in place. But

587
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 1: I do think pressure tactics work better when you're in

588
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 1: the room, and especially in the room with the President

589
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 1: United States. Uh. We used to have when I was

590
00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 1: in the White House with Reagan, lots of cabinet members

591
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:21,960
Speaker 1: who told me, you know, I'm gonna tell him a

592
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,480
Speaker 1: little thing or two about this policy. And the minute

593
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 1: they got in the oval, officer like, yes, Mr President,

594
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 1: anything you say. And so that office and the the

595
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 1: the the importance of the president himself has not lost

596
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: its ability to convince people to to join in their

597
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: their their strategy. So absolutely having that physicality is part

598
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,160
Speaker 1: of the plan. I would say. The one thing Nancy

599
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 1: Pelosi doesn't want to do is take up valuable floor

600
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 1: time to process a contempt uh resolution by the Committee

601
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 1: on unbannoned, which is where it goes after committee. So

602
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 1: like talk about, you know, getting off script for this

603
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 1: administration when they have so many important things to take

604
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,840
Speaker 1: up to be to be talking about Steve Bannon is

605
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,959
Speaker 1: probably the worst possible option they have for this week.

606
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:12,800
Speaker 1: Oh my god. So it sounds to me, Jeannie, like

607
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:17,160
Speaker 1: Rick just called Joe Biden the closer? Is the president

608
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 1: the closer? Here? Do we actually see that happen? Yeah,

609
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 1: it's going to be the President, or it's gonna be

610
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,480
Speaker 1: God or somebody of that stature, because you know, there

611
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,239
Speaker 1: is nobody else. And you know, I think there's an

612
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,960
Speaker 1: interesting you know, uh juxtaposition. Here we see Steve Bannon

613
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: trying to run out the clock on on this entire thing,

614
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,359
Speaker 1: and we also see Mitch McConnell do the same. And

615
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 1: this is the fire that the president has got to

616
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:45,000
Speaker 1: lighten the leaders under Democrats and saying that if we

617
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: don't move now, we will not not get another bite

618
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:50,719
Speaker 1: at this apple. Historically that's probably the case. You guys

619
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 1: may need to call God to answer this, but I'd

620
00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:54,800
Speaker 1: love to know what both of you think the price

621
00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:57,479
Speaker 1: tag will be on this, it's if it's not three

622
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:00,080
Speaker 1: and a half, Rick Davis, what is it? Well, you

623
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: know it's crazy to say it's three and a half

624
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 1: paid for because when the Congress came up with their

625
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,359
Speaker 1: number that of pay for Us, it was two point

626
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: two trillion, And so my guess is it's going to

627
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 1: be below that because some of that was even shaky

628
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,520
Speaker 1: when it comes to whether or not Congress would support it.

629
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:17,399
Speaker 1: So you know, less than two trillion dollars with pay

630
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,919
Speaker 1: for Us, What do you think I'm gonna say? One

631
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 1: point eight trillion? There you go, Joe, Now both Friday,

632
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,280
Speaker 1: guess you're both below two? And you think that Primilla

633
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,919
Speaker 1: Gaya Paul is going to sign off on that? Genie, Um,

634
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,040
Speaker 1: I don't think she's gonna want to. But again, I

635
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:36,840
Speaker 1: think Democrats have got to get something, and something is

636
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:39,759
Speaker 1: not perfect, but it's better than nothing. They cannot go

637
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,240
Speaker 1: into this mid term with nothing. Wait, well, i'm whether

638
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 1: they will or should not. There are two different things. Rick,

639
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:48,880
Speaker 1: What are they jettison to get down to that number

640
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:52,000
Speaker 1: or is it just shorter durations on everything? You know,

641
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,400
Speaker 1: it's hard to tell where they're coming because every Democrat

642
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 1: who's been talking to the press this week has said

643
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 1: something different, and even Nancy Pelosi has said two different

644
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 1: things on the same you know, where she says, we

645
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: want a firm commitment ted years on these programs, and

646
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 1: so we're gonna have to make choices, and then she says,

647
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:08,439
Speaker 1: but maybe what we ought to do is just back

648
00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:10,520
Speaker 1: down off that spending and you know, try to get

649
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 1: as much done as we can. It's gonna be a

650
00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: real driver politically for them not to cut policies, because

651
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 1: then they run into these problems with the progressive left right,

652
00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,239
Speaker 1: and they can't leave them behind. They got to give

653
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:24,239
Speaker 1: them something. And so my guess is it's going to

654
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 1: be a funky combination. Things like the child tax credit,

655
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,040
Speaker 1: which is super expensive, may get cut back, but other things,

656
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: uh maybe left in if they aren't as expensive and

657
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 1: can go the duration. Fascinating. Look, do do shorter durations

658
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:41,160
Speaker 1: g make it easier for Republicans to kill those benefits

659
00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: should they take power. You know, I think it's hard

660
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,719
Speaker 1: to kill these once they get put into practice, once

661
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:50,439
Speaker 1: they're put out there. But you know, I do think

662
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 1: there's something to be said for doing something big and

663
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 1: doing it well and and running on that, and I

664
00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 1: hope that's what the Democrats consider a lot to think

665
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 1: about as we head into this weekend. I hope you

666
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 1: do have a weekend. Jeannie Chanzano and Rick Davis with

667
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: us here as our Bloomberg Politics contributors and the Classic Panel.

668
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,200
Speaker 1: Have a good couple of days. We'll get back here

669
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:14,000
Speaker 1: on Monday and do it all over again and see

670
00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 1: if there's any break on. It's gonna say Wall Street,

671
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:20,279
Speaker 1: how about Capitol Hill. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg