Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, home of the
Speaker 1: modern whitetail hunter and now your host, Mark Kenyon. Welcome
Speaker 1: to the Wire to Hunt podcast. I'm your guest host
Speaker 1: Tony Peterson, and today I'm speaking with the one and
Speaker 1: only Beau Martinic. All Right, folks, welcome to the Wire
Speaker 1: to Hunt podcast, brought to you by First Light. You
Speaker 1: guessed it. This is not Mark Kenyon's voice. It's your
Speaker 1: old backup quarterback, Tony. Mark is off. I guess you
Speaker 1: could say, fighting the good fight with his friend Spencer.
Speaker 1: They are actually in West Hollywood, but probably not for
Speaker 1: any of the reasons you're thinking. West Hollywood happens to
Speaker 1: be where ticket Master's headquarters are located. The boys are
Speaker 1: out there protesting that company after sitting in a virtual
Speaker 1: queue for like fifteen hours only to not get tickets
Speaker 1: to Taylor Swift's new tour. I know it's a shame.
Speaker 1: I know those guys are big, big fans of hers,
Speaker 1: and I hope the picketing and they're harshly worded signs
Speaker 1: will do them some good and they get their tickets.
Speaker 1: And speaking of doing you some good, I have Beau
Speaker 1: Martonic on this episode to talk about public land hunting
Speaker 1: in the late season. You know bo is Aware to
Speaker 1: Hunt contributor. He's a podcast host and he's a Pennsylvania
Speaker 1: native who devotes a stupid amount of time to mountain
Speaker 1: bucks that anyone can theoretically hunt, but very few kill
Speaker 1: like he does. But whether you're a public land hunter
Speaker 1: yourself or have something a little more cushy for your
Speaker 1: late season endeavors, this show is just full of good advice.
Speaker 1: Martonic is one of the best hunters out there, and
Speaker 1: it's safe to say if you listen to this all
Speaker 1: the way through, you'll pick up a thing or two
Speaker 1: at least that you could put to good use on
Speaker 1: a buzzer beater book no matter where you live or hunt.
Speaker 1: How are you, buddy, good talk to you again, Dude,
Speaker 1: you're looking skinny. Nothing nothing, you weren't skinny before? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I uh, I just I actually just got back from
Speaker 1: the gym because this is my first week back in it,
Speaker 1: and I am one of those people that I try
Speaker 1: every year to stay in the gym and working out
Speaker 1: during hunting season, and it's just traveling back and forth
Speaker 1: and try to get work done in between. Wasn't working
Speaker 1: and um, yeah, I lost about I think it was
Speaker 1: sixteen or seventeen pounds since uh late August when when
Speaker 1: I kind of started my my trips out west and
Speaker 1: then white tail hunting. So yeah, I'm I'm definitely looking
Speaker 1: a little skinny cheeseburger. Man. Uh, this is not what
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about on this podcast, but we're
Speaker 1: gonna talk about it a little bit. When when you yeah,
Speaker 1: I know you you you've worked out for a long time.
Speaker 1: Is it like, is it something for you where you're like,
Speaker 1: I know, I'm going elk hunting every year, so I
Speaker 1: gotta stay in shape for it, or was it something
Speaker 1: even before maybe you started traveling to hunt where you're
Speaker 1: just like it was sort of a part of your life.
Speaker 1: It's always been a part of my life. Like that's
Speaker 1: been something since high school when I was in sports,
Speaker 1: and then even in college when I had no real
Speaker 1: reason to do it. I just like I like working out.
Speaker 1: I feel good when I do it, and I just
Speaker 1: when I have like a routine of just doing it
Speaker 1: every day, Like it's even say something little like my
Speaker 1: my workouts have changed. I went through different I guess
Speaker 1: different parts of my life where there's parts where I
Speaker 1: got in a real high intensity stuff and like just
Speaker 1: beating yourself down every day, and I realized that wasn't
Speaker 1: really sustainable. And my goal is just like I want
Speaker 1: to be able to hunt as long as I can
Speaker 1: in my sixties seventies, and I just want to I
Speaker 1: want to stay you know, competent and be as good
Speaker 1: as I can in the field. So that's that's kind
Speaker 1: of the mentality I've had. But definitely elk hunting and
Speaker 1: stuff gives me a little more motivation when I'm not
Speaker 1: feeling like it to to make myself do something, you know.
Speaker 1: That's that's kind of the way that that I look
Speaker 1: at it. Yeah, it's uh, I mean people use different reasons,
Speaker 1: right like when when you talk to you know, the
Speaker 1: average person, especially right now this time of year where
Speaker 1: we're coming up on the New Year and you know,
Speaker 1: everybody makes their New Year's resolutions or whatever, it's like, Oh,
Speaker 1: I wanna I want to lose weight, so I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go to the gym. And I was thinking about that.
Speaker 1: I was actually talking to my wife about it, and
Speaker 1: I was like, that's kind of the wrong way to
Speaker 1: look at it, like really should be looking at like
Speaker 1: I just want to get in shape and feel better
Speaker 1: like mentally, physically, the whole thing. And you know, there's
Speaker 1: some awesome side of effects of that, Like there's some
Speaker 1: benefits right, like you will lose weight. But it's like
Speaker 1: it's it's easy for people to kind of like pick
Speaker 1: one reason or another one motivation, like well, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: I'm finally gonna take that ELK trip, so I gotta
Speaker 1: do it. And it's like, man, that's great. But if
Speaker 1: you can find a way to, you know, be like
Speaker 1: be in it all year round, or like be dedicated
Speaker 1: to it a little bit more instead of that because
Speaker 1: that ELK take is gonna go away, or you know,
Speaker 1: you might roll your ankle or something, and you know,
Speaker 1: like things change, and it's it's tough to do, but
Speaker 1: it's such a benefit to enjoying hunting, I think, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: and and just enjoying life. Like just in general, I
Speaker 1: feel so much better. I have more energy when I'm
Speaker 1: working out consistently. I just feel better in general. And
Speaker 1: the one thing too, is like I feel like I
Speaker 1: build uh by being consistent with it and doing it
Speaker 1: all the time. Once you get later in the season
Speaker 1: and you've been hunting for two months, you know, whether
Speaker 1: it's just weekends or you're hunting all the time, whatever
Speaker 1: it is, you kind of get war out and this
Speaker 1: kind of helps you continue with it, in my opinion,
Speaker 1: to be able to help continue just going day after
Speaker 1: day because you're used to just the consistency and and
Speaker 1: just need to, you know, put in the work and
Speaker 1: and go with it. And I think that the mental
Speaker 1: side of working out has helped me as much and
Speaker 1: hunting as the physical side has. You know, not not
Speaker 1: all my you know white tail months or spots that
Speaker 1: I go into or you know, a mile or two deep,
Speaker 1: and not all like that, like someone aren't really that
Speaker 1: physically exerting. But at the same time, it just helps me,
Speaker 1: you know, when I have to get up, you know,
Speaker 1: five in the morning to go do there at four
Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning, that I just I can continually
Speaker 1: do that. And you know, even sitting in a tree,
Speaker 1: you know, back in November, trying to sit all day it.
Speaker 1: I feel like there's all these extra benefits that come
Speaker 1: from from consistently working out, and uh, to me, I
Speaker 1: think that it just it helps out a ton. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I do too, I mean, and I noticed that especially
Speaker 1: on some of my traveling trips where it's like you go,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe sit sit the stand for a couple
Speaker 1: of hours, and then you could go back to the
Speaker 1: you know, camp or go back to your tent and
Speaker 1: take a nap or chill out or whatever, or you
Speaker 1: could go scout someplace new and then go sit and
Speaker 1: just like as far as being in the moment and
Speaker 1: being like really efficient with your time, it sure helps.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it definitely does. And yeah, just like you said,
Speaker 1: instead of feeling like you're tired and want to go
Speaker 1: back and take a nap, yeah, you can be more
Speaker 1: efficient and drive down the road and check out this
Speaker 1: other spot and walk around, and you just feel more
Speaker 1: energized throughout. So that's that's where I see a lot
Speaker 1: of the benefits. And I think I think I would
Speaker 1: do better if I did it throughout the season. You know,
Speaker 1: we were talking a little bit before we started recording,
Speaker 1: and you said you were keeping up with it, you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of days a week at least, And I
Speaker 1: think that's a I think that's a big deal. And
Speaker 1: I had no reason not to other than uh, I
Speaker 1: just I you know, sometimes you can get in your
Speaker 1: own head that you're busier than you probably are to
Speaker 1: be able to squeeze up even at twenty or thirty
Speaker 1: minute workout, and really, isn't that hard. You just got
Speaker 1: to be better at time management. I guess maybe you know.
Speaker 1: The other thing is maybe you just need a case
Speaker 1: of like crippling depression, so you have to go and
Speaker 1: otherwise otherwise you'll be absolutely miserable if you don't go
Speaker 1: work out. Yeah, that could definitely be it. So I
Speaker 1: think I think, Sorry, I just just gonna say I
Speaker 1: think that, like I was struggling so bad of trying
Speaker 1: to find a deer in October that that's just like
Speaker 1: all my head was focused on was just running around
Speaker 1: trying to do that that. Uh yeah, I wasn't thinking
Speaker 1: about anything else. Did you have an unusual year that way? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I did. Yeah, I Um, I struggled. I was traveling
Speaker 1: a little bit at the beginning, well through September and
Speaker 1: beginning of October. So when I came back to Pennsylvania,
Speaker 1: I felt like it was my I felt like the
Speaker 1: woods were all brand new to me. And normally I'm
Speaker 1: kind of keeping up with things and you know, run
Speaker 1: trail cameras and out scouting and seeing what the food
Speaker 1: sources are, and I just I felt like I was
Speaker 1: just dropped in the middle of somewhere and trying to
Speaker 1: figure it out. And I just wasn't finding signed like
Speaker 1: I normally was, and I had to move around a
Speaker 1: lot to try to try to find it, and even
Speaker 1: some of the his I'm big on historical data, and
Speaker 1: a lot of my historical data wasn't lining up with
Speaker 1: how this year worked. So it took some kind of
Speaker 1: freelancing around a little bit to be able to figure
Speaker 1: it out. And where I ended up finally killing a
Speaker 1: deer at the beginning of the member was in a
Speaker 1: spot that I didn't even have any trail cameras that
Speaker 1: year anything. It was just like a spot that I,
Speaker 1: you know, new deer traveling through some hot sign and
Speaker 1: and um I set up on it for the last
Speaker 1: evening I had to hunt in Pennsylvania. So that was, uh, yeah,
Speaker 1: it was. It was a tough year for me, to
Speaker 1: be honest. Do you do you find because I know
Speaker 1: you do a lot of trail camera work. Do you
Speaker 1: find yourself? Because I have this struggle. I have to
Speaker 1: struggle struggle on private land and public land, but on
Speaker 1: on public land a lot where I start hunting off
Speaker 1: of memories, and it usually doesn't play out very well
Speaker 1: for me, and I have to go figure out what's
Speaker 1: going on? Do you? Is that what you're talking about
Speaker 1: a little bit here where you're like, I'm coming into this,
Speaker 1: I've been gone, and you know, instead of like just
Speaker 1: buckling down and you know, going I don't know what's
Speaker 1: going on, you kind of like rely on what you knew,
Speaker 1: and it's always freaking changeing, and so you end up
Speaker 1: getting forced to go find him anyway. Yeah, I know,
Speaker 1: and I've I've done well with the historical data at times,
Speaker 1: but I've also learned. I talked to somebody else about
Speaker 1: this recently. It was like I definitely crippled myself from
Speaker 1: the standpoint of I do better hunting areas that I
Speaker 1: don't have the historical knowledge, and sometimes then I do
Speaker 1: the areas that I do because I'm like, yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't like you know, when when, especially when around a
Speaker 1: bunch of cameras or you know, you have years of
Speaker 1: history in there, it's like, Okay, this spot is normally good,
Speaker 1: and you start start putting that time in there, but
Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, it's not really happening, you know, where
Speaker 1: if I go into a new area, I'm looking for
Speaker 1: the hottest sign. I'm trying to find it and do it.
Speaker 1: And it's not saying I won't put three to four
Speaker 1: sits at some of these spots, like especially you know
Speaker 1: in the big woods where it's low deer density. But
Speaker 1: but when you just go off of like they should
Speaker 1: be coming here, at some point you start chasing. You
Speaker 1: know you're not not doing as well as uh as
Speaker 1: you could be. At least that's the way I feel
Speaker 1: about it. Yeah, I I that really hit home for me.
Speaker 1: I had had two times in my life when when
Speaker 1: we had the girls and I kind of went from
Speaker 1: having tons and tons of free time to like really
Speaker 1: planning short three or four or five day trips. It
Speaker 1: made me realize how kind of behind the curve I was.
Speaker 1: Even if I had to take five or six days
Speaker 1: off of or I was going to travel someplace this
Speaker 1: weekend and next weekend, that time between change things a lot,
Speaker 1: and then it kind of it made me realize at
Speaker 1: what disadvantage you really are if you're a weekend warrior,
Speaker 1: whether you're at home or traveling. It's like that that
Speaker 1: space between when you're there is really important, and you know,
Speaker 1: trail cameras can fill in the gaps a little bit,
Speaker 1: but there's a lot you're gonna miss. And the other
Speaker 1: time for me, you know, you talk about the big woods.
Speaker 1: I hit on a spot in northern Wisconsin I don't
Speaker 1: know six seven years ago. Now that was pretty damn
Speaker 1: good for you know, like decent bucks for that area,
Speaker 1: and it was kind of this creek bottom system that
Speaker 1: just it was right. And I hit it a couple
Speaker 1: of years and killed a few deer and had some
Speaker 1: good encounters with some really big deer. And then I
Speaker 1: don't know, probably three years ago, four years ago, it
Speaker 1: just went dry in there, like just and you know
Speaker 1: when it's a big woods thing, and you're like why, like,
Speaker 1: you know, why would this change that much because it's
Speaker 1: not like egg rotation or anything like that. And I
Speaker 1: just started, you know, through winter scouting, started finding okay, well,
Speaker 1: somebody brought in a letter stand here, and somebody had
Speaker 1: to stand across the creek here, and it was just pressure,
Speaker 1: just guys coming in and that that place has never
Speaker 1: been the same since. And it's one of those spots
Speaker 1: where I'm like, I want this to be on because
Speaker 1: it was so fun going in there knowing the deer
Speaker 1: we're using it, but it's just it's it's a freaking memory. Now. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and and and that's that's I mean that that spot
Speaker 1: on for a kind of how this year went for me,
Speaker 1: is this spot had been so good the last couple
Speaker 1: of years. It's one area and I was hunting one deer,
Speaker 1: and I always like target one deer if I if
Speaker 1: I'm in an area, I'm running trail cameras, but I'll
Speaker 1: shoot other deer like I'm not at all there, not
Speaker 1: the guy with it. But it was kind of that
Speaker 1: way in this area this year because all the other
Speaker 1: bucks that there used to be multiple, like great bucks
Speaker 1: that shoot, and this year here was there was one
Speaker 1: and I couldn't find him and he ended up getting
Speaker 1: shot in gun season, so I don't have to worry
Speaker 1: about him anymore, thankfully. But well, hold on, but what
Speaker 1: do you think happened there with that buck concentration? It
Speaker 1: was people, There was there was pressure and not the
Speaker 1: exact spots I was hunting, but people moved in. And
Speaker 1: also there was there was no food. I mean there
Speaker 1: was brows, don't get me wrong, but there was no
Speaker 1: mass from you know, years prior looked at there was
Speaker 1: some oak trees in there, and those oak trees had
Speaker 1: produced on year one, which was incredible because it was
Speaker 1: the only oaks in the area, and you know your
Speaker 1: two they didn't produce, but there was a good black
Speaker 1: cherry crop and beech crop. This year, none of those,
Speaker 1: none of those things happened. And so I think there
Speaker 1: was a little bit of the food that was that
Speaker 1: was causing that. And then also the pressure because there
Speaker 1: was just there was people everywhere. I was getting trail
Speaker 1: cameras messed with. I was having just problems that I
Speaker 1: hadn't had in the past. So I mean, really at
Speaker 1: that point I should have just kind of moved on
Speaker 1: right when that was the case, but I was really
Speaker 1: stubborn on wanting to hunt this deer, and and uh,
Speaker 1: and I just I never never really figured it out.
Speaker 1: He did end up showing up on one of my
Speaker 1: cameras in daylight when I was down in West Virginia.
Speaker 1: I had already filled my tag at this point, the
Speaker 1: last day of the season, and he shows up at
Speaker 1: like eight am. He's looking right in my camera and
Speaker 1: just walked by, and then uh, I ended up he
Speaker 1: stuck around all through until rifle season and then uh,
Speaker 1: someone ended up shooting him on the second second day there.
Speaker 1: But uh yeah, so that that was kind of that
Speaker 1: was kind of a learning curve for me. And I
Speaker 1: ended up just like, once I realized I wasn't finding
Speaker 1: him and I was kind of wasting time per se
Speaker 1: on it, I just started moving around and covering ground
Speaker 1: and then that's when it ended up working out for me.
Speaker 1: And and you know, obviously there's always a little bit
Speaker 1: of a luck involved and uh and with the weather
Speaker 1: being so hot, it was seventy two degrees when I
Speaker 1: shot my dear, and I was like, okay, I need
Speaker 1: to go and some dark timber and some creek bottoms
Speaker 1: and that was it felt ten fifteen degrees cooler down there.
Speaker 1: And I don't I don't typically, I don't typically like
Speaker 1: let the weather determine completely how I'm gonna move unless
Speaker 1: it's like sustained weather. You know, if it's like one
Speaker 1: day of seventies some degrees, that's not typically from from
Speaker 1: my experience, gonna shift that deer movement to the point
Speaker 1: that all they're going to the bottoms, so they're doing
Speaker 1: going to the north slopes, like that's not typically what
Speaker 1: I've seen, but once you started getting you know, five
Speaker 1: six days or even three to six days of that
Speaker 1: kind of weather, then it starts seemingly affecting the daylight
Speaker 1: movement down in the bottom. So that's, uh, that's kind
Speaker 1: of what I had to do when you when you
Speaker 1: talk about kind of riding out that spot that had
Speaker 1: had some mass for you and then didn't have mass
Speaker 1: for and people moved in there. I honestly think that
Speaker 1: that might be the number one hang up that that
Speaker 1: most hunters have as far as their own success, because
Speaker 1: we fall in love with the idea of a hunt
Speaker 1: happening where we want it to happen, and man, it
Speaker 1: that is a great way to kick yourself in the
Speaker 1: nuts because it's so rarely happened. I mean, if you
Speaker 1: if you just look at like where most of the
Speaker 1: hunting content is produced, and you look at I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess, maybe not today, but ten years ago, where
Speaker 1: the hunting content was produced. It's places that are so
Speaker 1: tightly controlled that you know, those year are coming into
Speaker 1: that food plot every Halloween or whatever, and nobody's touched them,
Speaker 1: and that hunt can happen this year just like it
Speaker 1: happened last year and the year before, and you know,
Speaker 1: the box changed, but the situation really doesn't. And you know,
Speaker 1: for most people that's really not an option, even if
Speaker 1: they're trying to work on private land and that happen,
Speaker 1: Like it's kind of a different deal for for most people.
Speaker 1: And that idea of just like, well, I wanted to
Speaker 1: happen this way, you know, I wanted to be November
Speaker 1: three on my favorite stand. And it's like, god, you know,
Speaker 1: that's such a trap. Yeah, oh, it definitely is, And
Speaker 1: and I fall into it from time to time. As
Speaker 1: much as I know that, like I have experienced that
Speaker 1: and understand it, it's still hard to get your own
Speaker 1: personal Like if you were to ask me if you were,
Speaker 1: if you laid out the situation I had, I feel
Speaker 1: like I could give you decent advice. But when it's myself,
Speaker 1: that's where I struggle. I mean, it's it's a it's
Speaker 1: a hard thing, man. I mean I think I think
Speaker 1: that's why you know, people such as yourself and you
Speaker 1: know other guys who travel a lot and hunt in
Speaker 1: public land a lot get really good at this stuff
Speaker 1: no matter where they go, because you're just forced to
Speaker 1: face that reality all the time, like you can't. You
Speaker 1: know what it's like to feel like you're wasting your
Speaker 1: time and when you're really on a limited schedule and
Speaker 1: you know your income like depends on it, it's like
Speaker 1: you can't. You can't. You literally can't afford to make
Speaker 1: a bunch of dumb, lazy decisions. Yeah, that's a good
Speaker 1: good way of putting it. So are you? Are you
Speaker 1: working on you? You have any buck tags left now?
Speaker 1: I do have a buck tag left in West Virginia.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I'm gonna actually I don't think
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make it back down there. I'm focusing on
Speaker 1: late season, uh dough tags in Pennsylvania, though, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: take my flint lock out. That's a goal to shoot
Speaker 1: one with a flint lock muzzleloader. So I'm kind of
Speaker 1: focusing on that. But I'm also playing I'm hunting as
Speaker 1: if I'm hunting bucks, and I'm even moving cameras around
Speaker 1: so that you know when I am in this position,
Speaker 1: because ultimately I will be in a position where I
Speaker 1: have a buck tag in my home state here at
Speaker 1: some point in the late season that uh, I want
Speaker 1: to be able to kind of figure it out a
Speaker 1: little bit and or at least have more information with it.
Speaker 1: And I do that every year to try to try
Speaker 1: to learn and understand these deer a little bit better.
Speaker 1: But so personally, No, I don't really have an more
Speaker 1: buck tag that I'm gonna be hunting as of right now.
Speaker 1: How about yourself? UM, I'm I'm kind of out of
Speaker 1: buck tags. I have one left in South Dakota, but
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna stay home and hunt pheasants. But
Speaker 1: I was just curious because I I kind of do
Speaker 1: the same thing. I don't need a buck tag to
Speaker 1: keep hunting this time, and I and I still have
Speaker 1: some dough tags left, and I want to ask you
Speaker 1: about that. I I just wrapped up a muzzle older
Speaker 1: season a little bit ago in Minnesota. UM, not the
Speaker 1: same muzzle older season that you guys have, though. What's
Speaker 1: what's your range on that flintlock? Hundred yards at most? Um?
Speaker 1: I mean, people can shoot them further, That's what I
Speaker 1: feel like. It's my effective range. UM, but I'd like
Speaker 1: I'm looking for a fifty to sixty yard shot is
Speaker 1: what my goal is with it. When you're carrying that though,
Speaker 1: do you look at it? I mean, because I know
Speaker 1: where I muzzled or hunting. Now we can use scopes.
Speaker 1: It's just kind of changed the whole thing. But I
Speaker 1: grew up, you know, I had years where it was
Speaker 1: just open site. So it was to me it was
Speaker 1: like you're you're talking a hundred yard max weapon and
Speaker 1: I was always looking for that like kind of double
Speaker 1: my bow range shot, you know. So if it's like
Speaker 1: if I want to kill a deer at my bow
Speaker 1: and like fifty sixties awesome with open sights, So do
Speaker 1: you do you treat your hunts like that where you're like,
Speaker 1: this is basically like a bow hunt, but I got
Speaker 1: a little more reach to work with. That's exactly how
Speaker 1: I look at it, and I almost set up just
Speaker 1: like that I would be bow hunting, and like during
Speaker 1: the late season it's late archery in Pennsylvania and the
Speaker 1: traditional uh flint lock. So I'll use both of those
Speaker 1: as I as I kind of go throughout the season,
Speaker 1: depending on how what my set up looks like and
Speaker 1: how I want to hunt um. In the past, I've
Speaker 1: usually used archery equipment because I felt like it was
Speaker 1: easier than using the flint lock. I've I've struggled trying
Speaker 1: to do well with that flint lock muzzleloader. But now
Speaker 1: I'm really just trying to focus on it. But how
Speaker 1: did you struggle with it? What do you mean as
Speaker 1: far as missing deer because you have that, it's with
Speaker 1: the flint lock. Once once that hammer drops and hits
Speaker 1: that powder ignites it, it's not the same time it's
Speaker 1: going to go off every time. And maybe there's there's
Speaker 1: probably better ones out there than I have that do
Speaker 1: fire the same every time, but it's just you know,
Speaker 1: if it's wet or sometimes it doesn't go off, and
Speaker 1: you know, it's easy to flinch. And it's always been like, uh,
Speaker 1: clean miss or perfect shot. And that's kind of how
Speaker 1: how that that has been with it, And that's that's
Speaker 1: how I struggle. So let's let's take the clean miss
Speaker 1: versus the perfect shot. Was it like, do you remember
Speaker 1: the difference being tied to the delay in the fire? Yeah? Yeah, definitely,
Speaker 1: Like and that's where I've been practicing as far as
Speaker 1: trying to understand that you just gotta get a hold
Speaker 1: hold even when you got this flash of flame in
Speaker 1: your eyes, that which is hard to just continue holding
Speaker 1: because sometimes you have that flash and then it'll still
Speaker 1: take a little bit before it goes off and uh yeah,
Speaker 1: that's it's the people that do the flint lock stuff
Speaker 1: is I mean, I have a lot of respect for
Speaker 1: them that that do it every year, and I think
Speaker 1: it's pretty cool um to do that. But I'm going
Speaker 1: to I'm gonna have two different strategies for that late season.
Speaker 1: One is if we get a lot of to know,
Speaker 1: do some tracking um, and then other than that kind
Speaker 1: of stand sitting like like I would if I was,
Speaker 1: you know, using a bow at that time of year.
Speaker 1: So those are the kind of like the two different
Speaker 1: approaches to it. Are you are you hunting those doughs
Speaker 1: in the same places you're hunting these bucks in the mountains? Are?
Speaker 1: And p A, yeah what what? So? This is this
Speaker 1: is something we struggle with all the time because when
Speaker 1: you talk about late season advice, it always defaults to
Speaker 1: the food sources, right, you know, get on the cut
Speaker 1: corn and get on the brassicas whatever. But there's so
Speaker 1: many situations out there with people who are like I
Speaker 1: don't have you know, I'm out in public land, I
Speaker 1: don't have a Brassica food plot, right, So what what
Speaker 1: are your dear you like you you're gonna go out
Speaker 1: there with that primitive weapon. You're gonna hunt these places.
Speaker 1: You scout a lot for bucks. What are those doughs
Speaker 1: gonna be keying on? So it's a lot of woody brows. So,
Speaker 1: you know, especially if there's if there's leftover acorns, that
Speaker 1: will be that's definitely a hot, hot ticket item. But
Speaker 1: if there's not, it's a lot of woody brows so,
Speaker 1: and a lot of clear cuts. Um really targeting the
Speaker 1: younger cuts, even some that are freshly being logged. You know,
Speaker 1: even if there's skinners still in there. Those deer will
Speaker 1: come out before dark and start working the edges and
Speaker 1: then as those people go home for the night, they
Speaker 1: work their way into the rest of the cut and
Speaker 1: eating the tops. Um. So, a lot of those brows.
Speaker 1: If the weather is really bad and it's hard for
Speaker 1: them even to even dig up even black cherry seeds,
Speaker 1: those are things, but as that gets bad, they'll even
Speaker 1: feed on you know, hemlock and pine branches and and
Speaker 1: mountain laurel, the twigs and stuff like. It's just it's
Speaker 1: a lot of that browse, but also an area that
Speaker 1: doesn't have a lot of cuts or actually even in
Speaker 1: combination of cuts is where you can find grasses. Um
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of natural grasses that don't have
Speaker 1: to be you know, necessarily food plots that will be
Speaker 1: able to do that. A lot of our creek bottom
Speaker 1: systems have openings with grasses in it, and that that
Speaker 1: tends to be you know, a little bit wetter areas.
Speaker 1: It doesn't freeze as quick so as you start getting
Speaker 1: into January and stuff, those areas can be good. And
Speaker 1: I've really learned that from shed hunting, where you know
Speaker 1: that that where the places that I'm finding sheds on
Speaker 1: some of those bad weather years. I tend to find
Speaker 1: the bucks in uh in the late season as well.
Speaker 1: But um so those are kind of the areas of
Speaker 1: focusing on. But like the my if I could put
Speaker 1: an ideal situation out there for you, it would be
Speaker 1: kind of a um anywhere from a tune of five
Speaker 1: year old clear cut that's got some briars coming up,
Speaker 1: you know that that has like a lot of that
Speaker 1: browse that's readily available. They're probably laying down almost in
Speaker 1: the same spots that they're gonna get up. Um But
Speaker 1: you're just trying to be just off it kind of
Speaker 1: on those edit edges and being able to get them
Speaker 1: as they come by feeding or even in the center
Speaker 1: where you get like a log landing that has a
Speaker 1: bunch of grasses from where they used to have a
Speaker 1: log landing, and and then also a bunch of brows
Speaker 1: around those areas are places that that I've learned from
Speaker 1: a lot of it too. In addition to shed hunting,
Speaker 1: was just tracking deer in the late season eve when
Speaker 1: I didn't have attack, just kind of following tracks and
Speaker 1: seeing what they're doing. And uh, I've learned a lot
Speaker 1: about that. Yeah, I think you get a real crash
Speaker 1: course on how deer actually feed when you watch them brows,
Speaker 1: like through clear cuts and when you do the big
Speaker 1: woods thing, and you see, just especially this time of year,
Speaker 1: how important those soft edges are, Like you just like
Speaker 1: a little bit of change in habitat. It's it's so
Speaker 1: important to them and it's so easy to overlook if
Speaker 1: you have destination food sources that are like really reliable,
Speaker 1: but many they teach you a lot when you watch
Speaker 1: the mill through those clear cuts. Well I learned, I
Speaker 1: mean just even this week, so our guns season ended
Speaker 1: on Saturday, and then that was coincided with some cold
Speaker 1: weather and some snow that we got the Sunday right
Speaker 1: after it ended. Thankfully, I didn't have a buck tag,
Speaker 1: so I was glad that we had a pretty terrible
Speaker 1: rifle season weather wise. But anyways, I so I don't
Speaker 1: have many spots that I can run like cell cameras
Speaker 1: just because the signal for the most part. But I
Speaker 1: do have a couple of cell cameras out and I
Speaker 1: have them on like a hemlock, so like a conifer
Speaker 1: edge right where it goes into a cut that had
Speaker 1: been cut two years ago. And the last two days
Speaker 1: has been crazy with the amount of deer movement. And
Speaker 1: this is you know, in a lower deer density area,
Speaker 1: but it seems like all these deer I've had more
Speaker 1: movement on my cameras the last few days than I
Speaker 1: did um because it's actually a good rut spot too,
Speaker 1: but even more than I did during the rut. Um
Speaker 1: some younger bucks moving in, a bunch of does hanging
Speaker 1: out around that area, basically coming up into that cut
Speaker 1: to feed um. And they've they've a lot of a
Speaker 1: lot of clear cuts now on this I learned this
Speaker 1: from my forestry buddy. But they'll lead of the tops
Speaker 1: down because the and I was I almost thought, there's
Speaker 1: just being lazy, But what I learned was it's to
Speaker 1: help keep the deer out of the center so they
Speaker 1: can regrow the trees. So they'll keep them kind of
Speaker 1: you know, laying down and make it kind of nasty
Speaker 1: in there, but that does provide good bedding on the
Speaker 1: edges of it, and they'll feed the edges of those
Speaker 1: instead of going in the center of all these blowdown
Speaker 1: or tops. They're gonna feed on those edges. And that
Speaker 1: was something that I've that I've learned, and it really
Speaker 1: clicked when he told me the reason for doing that
Speaker 1: and what the intention of it was, and that's kind
Speaker 1: of how the deer are are using it. And so
Speaker 1: those are those are things that I really look at.
Speaker 1: You mentioned something earlier that I wanted to touch on
Speaker 1: when you said if there were acorns left. You know
Speaker 1: that's that's a big draw, do you guys out there,
Speaker 1: because we get this big time. It's one of my
Speaker 1: favorite late season things. If I if I have the
Speaker 1: opportunity where if you've got to mix a white and
Speaker 1: red oaks, and you know, they're clean up those white
Speaker 1: oaks in October whenever they're falling, and then they kind
Speaker 1: of if they have enough good food. And I've even
Speaker 1: seen this up in northern Wisconsin and some or central
Speaker 1: I should say, where it's kind of big woods ish
Speaker 1: where they won't target those red okay corns nearly as
Speaker 1: much until it gets to like December and we get
Speaker 1: a foot of snow on the ground, and then the
Speaker 1: turkeys and the deer and everybody's like, well, I guess
Speaker 1: we better get back to those. Is that what you're
Speaker 1: talking about. That's exactly what I'm talking about. And and
Speaker 1: also like so chest not oaks, so I in October,
Speaker 1: it'd be hard pressed to find a deer to even
Speaker 1: pick up a chest not oak acorn. You know, they
Speaker 1: just don't like it. And and as as my buddy Kenny,
Speaker 1: my forestry buddy, calls them the sheets hot dog of
Speaker 1: the deer woods. So if you're if you're from eastern
Speaker 1: you know, the Eastern United States, the sheets gas station
Speaker 1: that are going up, it's like, okay, you'd prefer the
Speaker 1: flame and yon, which is the white oak, but the
Speaker 1: sheets hot dog is kind of your last resort, like
Speaker 1: you got you gotta eat, Okay, I'm gonna stop in here,
Speaker 1: real quick, I'm gonna hit the touch screen, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: order it. I'm gonna have my hot dog and in
Speaker 1: a short amount of time. And that's kind of the
Speaker 1: way looking at Chestnut oaks, which there seemed to be
Speaker 1: a good um crop of those, even in West Virginia
Speaker 1: where I was at, and and in Pennsylvania versus even
Speaker 1: the Reds this year, so that was that's interesting. But
Speaker 1: this this is the time of year when they might
Speaker 1: start hitting that versus um, you know, earlier, when they
Speaker 1: have better food available, They're gonna they're gonna pick that.
Speaker 1: You know, do you do you feel because I'm trying
Speaker 1: to I'm trying to look at this stuff, like what
Speaker 1: what are the positives that we have going on? Because
Speaker 1: we we always focus on the negatives, right, you know,
Speaker 1: like it's too hot or it's too windy, or the
Speaker 1: full moon or whatever bullshit, or there's too many people out.
Speaker 1: And you know, when you look at late season hunting,
Speaker 1: I I don't maybe you disagree, but I think it's
Speaker 1: the hardest hunting of the season. Just generally, Like I've
Speaker 1: never had like really like awesome ladies. It's always been
Speaker 1: a kind of a grind. I've had good hunts, but
Speaker 1: it's it's work. So you know, like looking at that,
Speaker 1: I go, Okay, what's the benefit? And I know for me,
Speaker 1: I don't have a whole lot of competition out there,
Speaker 1: And it feels like a part of the season where
Speaker 1: you can sort of just work the deer and and
Speaker 1: not think about constantly like who's coming in to hunt
Speaker 1: this spot or how many people are gonna be out
Speaker 1: there on the weekends. And I feel like you get
Speaker 1: a pretty decent advantage that way over the rest of
Speaker 1: the season if you're a public land hunter, and I
Speaker 1: think maybe that doesn't get a whole lot of credit. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're you're spot on, And there's there's a couple of
Speaker 1: things I look at with that and as an advantage,
Speaker 1: because like you said, there are a bunch of disadvantages
Speaker 1: that we don't need to to harp on. It's hard.
Speaker 1: It's hard hunting late season, the weather just dear being pressured.
Speaker 1: But as you get later on, they start acting like
Speaker 1: deer again. It's they start acting like deer supposed to
Speaker 1: and they're not you know, they might even come out
Speaker 1: and feed on those acorns um an hour and a
Speaker 1: half two hours before it gets dark, rather than barely
Speaker 1: coming out of that cover at the last minute, if
Speaker 1: at all, you know, and when there's more pressure. But
Speaker 1: you know, even in a heavily hunted state like Pennsylvania,
Speaker 1: I don't see too many people out other than maybe, uh,
Speaker 1: the occasional guy walking around with a with a muzzleloader.
Speaker 1: There's not a whole lot of pressure, so you can
Speaker 1: find you can get away from people a lot easier
Speaker 1: in my opinion. Uh. And if you're willing to grind
Speaker 1: it out through the weather and everything else, that's kind
Speaker 1: of dealing with it. There's a lot of opportunities not
Speaker 1: to mention that, you know, there's not any vegetation on
Speaker 1: the trees now. The bedding cover, even in areas that
Speaker 1: are all look like bedding cover, are narrowed down, and
Speaker 1: you know, and and if you if you're getting in
Speaker 1: some nasty weather, say you're getting you know, temperatures ten
Speaker 1: fifteen degrees depending on where you're at, like that's now,
Speaker 1: they're gonna they want to be closer to that food.
Speaker 1: So you find some cover that's close to that food.
Speaker 1: They're probably betting in that area, and you might even
Speaker 1: be able to set up a little bit more of
Speaker 1: an open spot um with you know, just some briers
Speaker 1: around or whatever that's you know, right there available and
Speaker 1: not not overthink it like you like you have to.
Speaker 1: And times of the year when there's there's more pressure. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's a good point. And there there's something else too.
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe it's a little bit different out where
Speaker 1: you live, but I know that a lot of the
Speaker 1: places I hunt, some of the best geothermal cover you're
Speaker 1: gonna find in an entire county is going to all
Speaker 1: be public land. Like if you take some of this
Speaker 1: egg heavy stuff, you know, like some of the stuff
Speaker 1: that I hunted for one week in November in Minnesota here,
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's flat prairie egg everywhere type of stuff.
Speaker 1: And if it can be farmed, it's gonna be farmed,
Speaker 1: and it's gonna be private. And if it can't be farmed,
Speaker 1: it might be public. And so all of the you know,
Speaker 1: willow creek bottoms and freaking cattails, slews and these little
Speaker 1: bands of timber that are just like in these places
Speaker 1: that they can't run a plow through. Those you know
Speaker 1: might look at them and go, well, yeah, there's people
Speaker 1: peasant hunting the neurial of time or deer hunting. They're
Speaker 1: all guns season well now when most people are kind
Speaker 1: of out of the woods, those places offer those deer
Speaker 1: the best cover. So they might have been riding it
Speaker 1: out in a private fence line or a little homestead
Speaker 1: or something for much of the season, or a CRP field,
Speaker 1: and now they need real geo thermal cover and in
Speaker 1: so many different places the best cover available to them
Speaker 1: will be public. Yeah, and and and I've also I've
Speaker 1: all always thought that you needed like the really thick,
Speaker 1: you know, geothermal cover basically that to hold those deer,
Speaker 1: to keep the wind block. But what I've learned is
Speaker 1: even mature hamlock and pine forest that may cover a
Speaker 1: side hill or creect bottom or whatever it is, it
Speaker 1: offers such a blanket over the top. You know, I've
Speaker 1: noticed it by just dropping milkweed. So like in and
Speaker 1: earlier in the season, I like those bots because it's
Speaker 1: very dependent that if I dropped my if I dropped
Speaker 1: my milkweed, it's gonna run downhill no matter even what
Speaker 1: time of day it is. Because it blocks out the
Speaker 1: sun as much it keeps it cool. But as you
Speaker 1: get in a late season, it actually does the opposite
Speaker 1: and you start seeing it coming up, which means it's
Speaker 1: a little warmer in there. You might not you as
Speaker 1: a person might not be able to feel it as much,
Speaker 1: but that's offering that wind break, that's offering a little
Speaker 1: bit of warmth extra for those deer. So anything with
Speaker 1: with that, with having like the conifers and having that
Speaker 1: thermal cover, uh, that's you know, you butt that up
Speaker 1: against food. And when I say food as far as
Speaker 1: like good brows or whatever, man like, those are those
Speaker 1: are the spots that I'm that that get me excited
Speaker 1: when it comes to the late season. Yeah, I don't.
Speaker 1: I think that we are really disconnected from like an
Speaker 1: awareness of those spots out there, because I noticed, like we,
Speaker 1: you know, we do so much late season pheasant hunting
Speaker 1: and we jump deer all the time, doing it right,
Speaker 1: like all the freaking time, and it's almost always like,
Speaker 1: you know, the wind's blowing thirty miles an hour, so
Speaker 1: you're like, okay, the pheasants are probably gonna stack up
Speaker 1: here or there or whatever, and you know, you get
Speaker 1: out it's brutal, brutal cold, and you get into some
Speaker 1: of these spots where you jump a good buck right
Speaker 1: next to you, and it's almost always one of those
Speaker 1: places where you didn't even notice it, but you got
Speaker 1: in there and it was way calmer, and you immediately
Speaker 1: felt way warmer, and there was like all these little
Speaker 1: advantages to those spots that if you were just standing
Speaker 1: there looking at this land, or especially if you're scrolling
Speaker 1: over at looking at aerial photography, like you wouldn't probably
Speaker 1: get this because it's you know, it's like two situationally
Speaker 1: variable right, Like you're not it's not zero degrees when
Speaker 1: you're looking at it, you're not standing out there in wins.
Speaker 1: But you get into him and you go, this is
Speaker 1: this makes so much sense why he was here, And
Speaker 1: I think that stuff so valuable. Oh yeah, it is
Speaker 1: so valuable. And it's it's for example, like Ohio is
Speaker 1: one of those states that runs a very late season
Speaker 1: that you know goes from you know, all runs all
Speaker 1: into February, I believe. And I remember years ago I
Speaker 1: was working in Ohio and I just used this, I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna hunt lay season. I've hunted Ohio during
Speaker 1: the a lot, which is super busy on on public
Speaker 1: land anymore, and that late season, I didn't run into
Speaker 1: a single person, and I was not using my normal
Speaker 1: rules of thumb of trying to stay away from city areas,
Speaker 1: you know, population. It was in a very populated area.
Speaker 1: I didn't run into anybody that was out there. And
Speaker 1: you know places like that that have still have they
Speaker 1: have big deer every year, but they have a lot
Speaker 1: of hunting pressure makes it a a little bit difficult during
Speaker 1: some of the prime times. But you can take advantage
Speaker 1: of that later on. Or if you say you did
Speaker 1: go on that rout trip and you didn't fill your tag,
Speaker 1: you can go back and in late season and you know,
Speaker 1: with with some leg work and getting around, especially if
Speaker 1: you have snow. That's gonna tell you right now kind
Speaker 1: of where they're spending their time. And uh, I think
Speaker 1: there's there's a there's a big advantage to that. And
Speaker 1: I do a lot of um the week after Christmas
Speaker 1: here we have a snowshoe hair hunting and I like,
Speaker 1: I love going out doing that. It's just fun to me.
Speaker 1: And a lot of places they live in or some
Speaker 1: of those cuts and I'm always just blowing deer out
Speaker 1: and uh, and that that's that taught me a lot
Speaker 1: kind of with with where they were living at at
Speaker 1: that time. Man, I'll tell you what, if you want
Speaker 1: to become a good big woods hunter, you go out
Speaker 1: and sneak around and try to shoot snowshoe hairs. So fun.
Speaker 1: I mean not not only for just training your eye.
Speaker 1: I mean sometimes you get those days where they're out sunning,
Speaker 1: you know, because they don't they don't go underground like
Speaker 1: a cotton tail will like there. They're a different thing.
Speaker 1: And you get those times where they're out like sun
Speaker 1: and in the afternoon and you see them sitting on
Speaker 1: the edge of a you know, the edge of the
Speaker 1: conifers or something, but it's always like an edge, like
Speaker 1: they're always in those places where it's like the clear
Speaker 1: cut met the evergreens or whatever. And the deer always
Speaker 1: there too. Yep. That's yeah, you're and and it's not
Speaker 1: to get off topic with it, but they're fun to
Speaker 1: hunt because they just do big circles. They they're just
Speaker 1: fun to hunt because hunting any kind of rabbit is
Speaker 1: is fun. Yeah, And I've never done it so and
Speaker 1: I'd love to do it with dogs sometimes, so I
Speaker 1: just I'm basically the dog and the hunter at the
Speaker 1: same time as I'm going and doing it. But it's
Speaker 1: it's fun to watch them. And you're right, they live
Speaker 1: in those same places a lot of the edges of
Speaker 1: of the hemlocks and the clear cuts, you know, speaking
Speaker 1: specifically in Pennsylvania, and they just you know, kind of
Speaker 1: go around and and and do big loops there. But
Speaker 1: I've learned so much about deer and I also use
Speaker 1: it to scout new places for deer uh and and
Speaker 1: I've found some of my best deer hunting spots by
Speaker 1: hunting snowshoe hair. So man, I think, you know, maybe
Speaker 1: this is a topic for a different one, but maybe
Speaker 1: it is actually a good late season topic. Is when
Speaker 1: you go try to run rabbits or hairs, or you
Speaker 1: do some squirrel hunting, or we used to do a
Speaker 1: lot of gross hunting in January when or when Wisconsin
Speaker 1: kept their season open through January. The amount of antlers
Speaker 1: you find and the amount of stuff you run across,
Speaker 1: and the rub lines that are laid bare, it is
Speaker 1: such a valuable time to be out there. And I
Speaker 1: think that, you know, we we preach a big game
Speaker 1: about winter scouting, right, but I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people don't really buy into it. Like they don't either,
Speaker 1: you know, like it just gets to be that time
Speaker 1: of year. They maybe they like the idea, but I
Speaker 1: don't think a lot of people are out there like
Speaker 1: really winter scouting. But if you can find an excuse
Speaker 1: to be out there, that's a hell of a lot
Speaker 1: of fun, like chase and snowshoe hairs, do it. It'll
Speaker 1: help everything. Yeah, at that point that you know, sometimes
Speaker 1: I get tired of sitting in the tree, you know,
Speaker 1: and when you can go around and do something that's
Speaker 1: different than deer hunting and and uh walk around me.
Speaker 1: My favorite thing to do is scouting. So like as
Speaker 1: you're combining a couple of those different things, it's uh,
Speaker 1: it's a it's a lot of fun and and you
Speaker 1: can honestly with you know, even if you are hunting
Speaker 1: deer in that late season and a lot of a
Speaker 1: lot of times you're going to be at least I
Speaker 1: spend a lot of time walking versus the actual sitting
Speaker 1: because I'm trying to find where those deer hanging out at.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not putting all day sits in or anything.
Speaker 1: It's not they're not moving it all day. Maybe a
Speaker 1: little bit within their bedroom there, but it's hard to
Speaker 1: get close without any cover, without any leaves or anything
Speaker 1: on the trees at that time of year. So I
Speaker 1: think that's a a's super valuable. You and I talked
Speaker 1: about it all the time, but that that winter, that
Speaker 1: winter scouting is is critical, uh to being able to
Speaker 1: help you out. And you know, and as we just
Speaker 1: talked about earlier with struggling based off that historical data
Speaker 1: that you find. But to put it this way is
Speaker 1: like that gives you a really good starting point and
Speaker 1: places to be able to check and see if it's hot.
Speaker 1: You know. That's that's how I look at it, Yeah,
Speaker 1: for sure. And I mean having those spots that are
Speaker 1: sort of historically good, figuring those out from year to
Speaker 1: year helps you. And you know, if one of them
Speaker 1: goes cold because a bunch of people move in or something,
Speaker 1: finding another one gets a little easier if you've already
Speaker 1: found one in your life, you know. But I think
Speaker 1: I want to talk about the the small game thing
Speaker 1: and the winter scouting thing a little bit more because
Speaker 1: I think when you know, when we talk about this stuff,
Speaker 1: a lot of times we paint this picture of like, Okay,
Speaker 1: you're winter scouting, You're you're going out, you're looking for
Speaker 1: giant beds in the swamp, you're looking for rubs, you know,
Speaker 1: if there's no snow, you're looking for scrapes, whatever last
Speaker 1: year's sign. But we are like super predictable, Like humans,
Speaker 1: how we enter the woods and where we walk and
Speaker 1: how we like to walk through the woods were super predictable.
Speaker 1: And when you go with a different purpose in mine,
Speaker 1: if you're like, I'm gonna go find some snowshoe hairs
Speaker 1: and I'm not out here just to scout, dear, You're
Speaker 1: gonna go where you think those snowshoe hairs are gonna be,
Speaker 1: and it probably take you into different little spots than
Speaker 1: a pure scouting mission would. And I think I think
Speaker 1: some of that stuff is maybe like the undermost underrated
Speaker 1: aspect of becoming better at figuring out a deer. Yeah. No,
Speaker 1: And and no matter how much you do it or
Speaker 1: how long you've done it, you do get predictable. I
Speaker 1: mean I get predictable, especially in spots that I feel
Speaker 1: like I know from hunting it for so long. You start,
Speaker 1: you park the same place as you walk the same
Speaker 1: way in, or you might be like, oh, I have
Speaker 1: a destination to get to before you start scouting. But
Speaker 1: once you once you're you know, doing something different, Like
Speaker 1: when I'm hunting snowshoes, I'm basically hunting them from the
Speaker 1: time I'm off the road, especially if there's you know,
Speaker 1: cuts right there or whatever. And it might be a
Speaker 1: spot that I'm like, oh, there's gonna be people there
Speaker 1: for you know, deer season, and I overlook in my
Speaker 1: own head. But then you figure out like, oh, this
Speaker 1: is actually everybody's overlooking it, and you bump some deer,
Speaker 1: you find some sign in there, and whether you actually
Speaker 1: throw a hunt at it or you just set up
Speaker 1: a trail camera and learn like, there's there's so much
Speaker 1: value in that. And and that's that's why I mean,
Speaker 1: even when I'm not small game hunting, when i'm you know,
Speaker 1: shed hunting or winter scouting or whatever and just walking
Speaker 1: whatever you learn, you learn ton because you know, when
Speaker 1: I'm when I'm actively hunting, a lot of the times,
Speaker 1: you know, you're you're thinking about the wind you don't
Speaker 1: want to blow, and deer out you don't want you know,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of things that you do where when
Speaker 1: you're not hunting, you don't think about those things, and
Speaker 1: you can find some pretty cool spots yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I think there is. I think maybe the biggest benefit
Speaker 1: of winter scouting is just simply because you're not that
Speaker 1: concerned with what happened, you know, like you just you
Speaker 1: can go scored stirth a little bit and and look
Speaker 1: at some stuff. But I also think, you know, like
Speaker 1: I know, not a lot of people are gonna listen
Speaker 1: to this and go snowshoe hair hunting to get better
Speaker 1: at deer hunting. But I'll tell you, we had my buddies,
Speaker 1: and I had some years where we hit them hard
Speaker 1: like we we would, you know, And and obviously it
Speaker 1: was tied to some grouse hunting and some contentails whatever
Speaker 1: we're but but the snowshoe thing was always kind of
Speaker 1: a novelty to us because we never grew up with that.
Speaker 1: And I'll never forget some of the some of the
Speaker 1: public land spots at bow Hunt, you know, they got
Speaker 1: they have snowshoe hairs in them. So we've in there
Speaker 1: and you know, you you picture like a older growth conifers,
Speaker 1: like you've got a bunch of pine trees that maybe
Speaker 1: we're planted or whatever, and then you've got that clear
Speaker 1: cut next to it, and you think about like a
Speaker 1: two year old clear cut, and you're like, you're not
Speaker 1: gonna walk through there. You're gonna walk the edge, and
Speaker 1: the snow shoes are gonna be somewhere, you know, the
Speaker 1: hairs are gonna be somewhere there. But then you get
Speaker 1: like that five year old clear cut or six seven
Speaker 1: year old clear cut that's like starting to get some
Speaker 1: trees in it and some space, and you know, so
Speaker 1: you put it. You put somebody on the edge of
Speaker 1: the pines and that clear cut, and then you cut
Speaker 1: in fifty yards into that clear cut where you might
Speaker 1: not have gone in there if you were just walking
Speaker 1: through there, because it's a hell of a lot easier
Speaker 1: to stay in those pine trees. And now you're looking
Speaker 1: at a different forest, like you're looking at something that's
Speaker 1: security cover everywhere and brows everywhere and bedding cover, and
Speaker 1: you go, there's a different vibe to this than even
Speaker 1: that edge, and then definitely than that open pine tree.
Speaker 1: You know, desert that's like a hundred yards away from me,
Speaker 1: and that kind of stuff is like it's not even
Speaker 1: like an intentional way to get out of your comfort zone.
Speaker 1: It's just doing something else. And then going where the
Speaker 1: deer have already figured out they want to be and
Speaker 1: you can learn so much. Yeah, I mean, think about
Speaker 1: when you walk the edge of like a cut like
Speaker 1: you're talking about with the conifers on one side, and
Speaker 1: you look in you kind of just see a wall
Speaker 1: of trees. You know, you just even if it's not
Speaker 1: even if it's starting to get some space. But once
Speaker 1: you get in there and you look, you can kind
Speaker 1: of picture how you know, you might find a bed
Speaker 1: in there and you're like, holy cow, he can lay here.
Speaker 1: I can't see him from the outside, but he's watching
Speaker 1: me walk that edge. Even like just flipping your roles
Speaker 1: as far as that that point of view can change,
Speaker 1: can change things a lot. And you know, like when
Speaker 1: I feel like, like you know, we talk about you know,
Speaker 1: bucks like liking edges and bedding on those edges, but
Speaker 1: sometimes that doesn't mean right on that edge too. It
Speaker 1: can be in a little bit but where they can
Speaker 1: see that that edge out there in front of them,
Speaker 1: And that's what that what I've found in And And
Speaker 1: also you know, talk to a bunch people, um, you know,
Speaker 1: growing up hunting, these types areas like all those big
Speaker 1: box living those those big those big thickets, you know,
Speaker 1: they live in those thickets, well, they might not be
Speaker 1: in that direct center of it. They might just be
Speaker 1: in a little bit. And you find that by being
Speaker 1: able when you're hunting hairs or whatever else by doing it,
Speaker 1: and I spend time in the winter, I'll walk every
Speaker 1: not literally every square inch, but you know, every forty
Speaker 1: fifty yards through those cuts and kind of go back
Speaker 1: and forth and learn how they're using them, because not
Speaker 1: not every cut or every or every thicket is treated
Speaker 1: the same from the deer. And there might be something
Speaker 1: that you're not picking up on from an aial photograph
Speaker 1: that you have to get in there and see it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I think some of the hardest ground to
Speaker 1: really scout with aerial is that big wood stuff where
Speaker 1: you're dealing with clear cuts, because it's it looks like
Speaker 1: such mono habitat you know so often from satellite imagery,
Speaker 1: and then you get in there and you realize how
Speaker 1: much is going on, and then you know, like you're
Speaker 1: talking about, you know, it's like I always picture those
Speaker 1: spots like there's an access, you know, if you have
Speaker 1: that older growth for us, and then you have the
Speaker 1: clear cuts like you're already talking about, like two layers
Speaker 1: from the easy access, and it might be a situation
Speaker 1: where there are only two yards from where everybody parks,
Speaker 1: but it doesn't matter because they're they're back in that
Speaker 1: security cover and they know it. And we always kind
Speaker 1: of get it in our head that you know, all
Speaker 1: the public land got hunted so hard by the gun
Speaker 1: hunters and it's gonna be all blown out. They're all
Speaker 1: gonna be on the private place down the road that
Speaker 1: only hunts trophies or whatever. And then you go out
Speaker 1: right now and you see all the sign that's out there,
Speaker 1: and you find those beds and you jump those deer,
Speaker 1: and you go, no, no, no no. They rowed this out
Speaker 1: right here where they got hunted hard every single day,
Speaker 1: and they just figured out how to make it through.
Speaker 1: And it might be as simple as being the first
Speaker 1: layer into that clear cut. Well I learned it this year.
Speaker 1: Um during gun season. They had some buddies up hunting
Speaker 1: with me, and and I was putting on some couple
Speaker 1: man like bump drives going through some of these areas
Speaker 1: and the you know, not finding deer. It was it
Speaker 1: was difficult, Like man, they're you know normally here, but
Speaker 1: what I you know, I was like all right, let
Speaker 1: me just do like I would see, like a little
Speaker 1: group of blowdowns. It might only be sixty yards for me,
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna do another a little sweep through there
Speaker 1: and see and all of a sudden you jump a
Speaker 1: dough up, or you might jump a small buck or
Speaker 1: whatever it is. And they're so used to that pressure
Speaker 1: that they'll just lay down and they're not They're just
Speaker 1: not moving unless you're almost stepping on them. Literally, And
Speaker 1: you have to be super close because you know, when
Speaker 1: it comes to gun season and you go in there
Speaker 1: and you start hearing the shots and and there's all
Speaker 1: this stuff going, You're like, how do these deer make it?
Speaker 1: But every year I'm getting deer, you know, getting a
Speaker 1: little older. You know these five years, always six years,
Speaker 1: already seven years old. I'm like, this area is funt
Speaker 1: a hard is He's not you know, he's not going
Speaker 1: to another county during this time. He's finding some good,
Speaker 1: good places to hide, and it's trying to figure out
Speaker 1: where those little places to hide. And sometimes it's not
Speaker 1: not even what you what you think there was. I
Speaker 1: remember finding a shed uh off a buck I was
Speaker 1: hunting years ago. I found it Christmas Eve so it
Speaker 1: was he dropped early. And but where it was laying
Speaker 1: in a bed, and this bed was on there was
Speaker 1: kind of a swampy big woods area, pretty flat, and
Speaker 1: there was one little tiny group of trees like a
Speaker 1: triple cherry tree, and it was all kind of open
Speaker 1: swamping this around there, and there was a blown down
Speaker 1: log that was there and he was laying right up
Speaker 1: against it, and he could watch this access trail that
Speaker 1: went by. And it was a spot that I never
Speaker 1: thought of. I didn't even think it was enough cover
Speaker 1: to hold a deer there, and I wouldn't doubt that
Speaker 1: he didn't lay there. A lot of times when you
Speaker 1: walked out to the trail, you couldn't see where he
Speaker 1: was laying at. But you got to where his bed
Speaker 1: was and looked out, it's like, okay, he had he
Speaker 1: had an advantage here. And that that that taught me
Speaker 1: a lot. I mean, think about think about I mean,
Speaker 1: it doesn't happen very often, but think about the time
Speaker 1: was when you've been on a stand and watched the
Speaker 1: deer walking that bedded down and you're like, that deer's
Speaker 1: forty seven yards away from me right there, and if
Speaker 1: you look away and you look back, you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: let's go on, and then the ear flicks and you go, oh,
Speaker 1: it's it never moved. I mean, and that's a deer
Speaker 1: that you have every advantage over possible because you watched
Speaker 1: it walk in there. And then now you think about
Speaker 1: the average person walking through the woods, and there's a
Speaker 1: deer that's better than a blowdown like that, with every
Speaker 1: advantage in the world. Yeah, like they're they're so safe
Speaker 1: from most people, it's not even funny. Yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 1: And and and as you're walking, think about as you're walking,
Speaker 1: you're looking, you look at something for a short period
Speaker 1: of time. It's you know, even if you're pretty good
Speaker 1: at still hunting and walking through, you're not You're not
Speaker 1: staring at a spot for three minutes. You know, you're
Speaker 1: you're kind of glazing over things as you go unless
Speaker 1: you catch that ear flicker at that time or you
Speaker 1: catch that antler at that time. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: times that you know, even the most seasoned people walk
Speaker 1: past deer that they don't even see. And and when
Speaker 1: they're used to that pressure there that they know how
Speaker 1: to how to handle it, especially if they get to
Speaker 1: an older age, like they're not they're not dumb about it.
Speaker 1: Just because there's a ton of pressure doesn't mean that
Speaker 1: they're all dead like that. They figure it out. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: let me let me ask you this because that kind
Speaker 1: of reminds me of something I wanted to bring up. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, you're hunting for years and years and years,
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania was like sort of the gold standard for pressure, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm sure it still is, and you know,
Speaker 1: you hear so much. So many people say, like where
Speaker 1: I hunt, none of the bucks get past two and
Speaker 1: a half. They get killed off. And I've heard that
Speaker 1: place so many places. I've hunted, so many places I've lived,
Speaker 1: and I've never found it to be true anywhere. Like
Speaker 1: I literally I'm like, there's bucks out there in the
Speaker 1: most heavily hunted place that are big enough for anyone
Speaker 1: to be pretty happy with. It's just there's not that
Speaker 1: many of them, and they're awful good at like not
Speaker 1: letting you know they're there. Yeah. Oh yeah, And it's
Speaker 1: it's funny, you know, with and Pennsylvania. You know, I
Speaker 1: I run a lot of cameras, So I got ever
Speaker 1: run in p a alone thirty five or forty cameras,
Speaker 1: maybe even uh more than that. I can't even I
Speaker 1: don't even know exactly what my inventory looks like. But
Speaker 1: I run a lot of cameras, and I bet on
Speaker 1: any given year, I get you know, bucks that are
Speaker 1: five plus, you know, years old. I bet there's eight
Speaker 1: or ten of them that I can find, sometimes more,
Speaker 1: sometimes a little bit less. But on some areas that
Speaker 1: are really heavily haunted, like not, I would say, like
Speaker 1: our rifle season, our guns season isn't as pressured as
Speaker 1: it used to be when I was a kid. Um,
Speaker 1: the there used to be a there used to be
Speaker 1: a lot more deer and uh not any there wasn't
Speaker 1: really any big deer then. It was just higher populations
Speaker 1: a deer and not as many and they just they
Speaker 1: get kind of wiped out. But as you as the
Speaker 1: deer density dropped down, um, it did reduce pressure a
Speaker 1: little bit. But still you'll go into a spot um
Speaker 1: where there's people everywhere, but they're still you'll still find
Speaker 1: these deer in this place, like the one area I'm
Speaker 1: thinking of, um that I mentioned earlier with that buck
Speaker 1: land there, like this is a very flat, easy access
Speaker 1: type spot with roads everywhere, and there's always people in there.
Speaker 1: And guns season, but I find the biggest oldest deer
Speaker 1: there every year, and it's just it's even bogged with
Speaker 1: my mind like that, even though I've seen it before,
Speaker 1: Like it just it boggles my mind how they do
Speaker 1: that and they do And I think it's just trying
Speaker 1: to figure out what your area looks like. You know,
Speaker 1: I can't give a specific situation that's going to be
Speaker 1: exactly relatable to somebody in Michigan or somebody in Wisconsin.
Speaker 1: But if you use you kind of look at that
Speaker 1: mindset or you think about it from the standpoint of
Speaker 1: all right, how how are they living, what are they doing,
Speaker 1: how are they working through this? And try to figure
Speaker 1: out what that looks like in your area. I think
Speaker 1: it's I think you can be surprised on what you find. Well,
Speaker 1: I think it's just the more time you spend out there,
Speaker 1: and you know, if you have the chance to run
Speaker 1: cameras like you're talking about, or do a lot of
Speaker 1: shed hunting, you just figure out that there's there's a
Speaker 1: lot more going on out there than people give it
Speaker 1: credit for. It's like easy, it's really easy to be
Speaker 1: dismissive about, you know, like big Bucks in an area
Speaker 1: or overall deer population or anything like that. And it's like,
Speaker 1: man in in so many situations, you have more to
Speaker 1: work with than you think. It's just not going to
Speaker 1: be easy. Yeah, yeah, you're yeah, there's there's no easy
Speaker 1: part about that. And like I can check out, you know,
Speaker 1: I can, especially you know winter in the spring. The
Speaker 1: amount of miles I put on it in the woods
Speaker 1: are crazy, and there's a lot of things that just
Speaker 1: aren't good. Like I'm not always just all of a
Speaker 1: sudden going in every area and finding the best of
Speaker 1: the best. But you just got to keep doing it.
Speaker 1: It's like, what when I had um these guys hunting
Speaker 1: with me the other day, It's like, you know, there's
Speaker 1: two days of like not seeing any deer and it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, they kind of see him looking at me,
Speaker 1: like is there any deer around here? It's like it's
Speaker 1: just repetition. It's just like, you know, even though that
Speaker 1: was different with the way we were gunn hunting, but
Speaker 1: it's the same way with scouting. It's just continually just
Speaker 1: moving and checking different places and trying to trying to
Speaker 1: figure it out. And you know, there's and maybe there's
Speaker 1: some places that are good that I'm just not recognizing it.
Speaker 1: But it's the more time you spend out there, obviously
Speaker 1: you're gonna find more. And it's it's sounds super simple,
Speaker 1: and it kind of is, but it takes a lot
Speaker 1: of work too to be able to figure that out.
Speaker 1: And that's where I've always struggled on the late season
Speaker 1: side of not being able whether it was time or whatever,
Speaker 1: to put that in to be able to find them.
Speaker 1: But I think and the way I look at late
Speaker 1: season now, it's spending more time scouting than that actual hunting,
Speaker 1: which really that kind of coincides with most times of
Speaker 1: the year, but like spending more time scouting and finding
Speaker 1: where the deer are before you uh, before you set up. Essentially, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think that what you're talking out there a
Speaker 1: little bit with the late season hunting, I mean, one
Speaker 1: of the lessons that's really important there is you know
Speaker 1: these deer that you're hunting here now these doors you're
Speaker 1: gonna go try to shoot with that flint lock. They
Speaker 1: maybe weren't there for a couple of weeks during rifle season.
Speaker 1: I mean they may be went and hold up a
Speaker 1: little bit someplace else, or they might be concentrated in
Speaker 1: a spot now because it's some food source or something.
Speaker 1: And it's like, that's another thing with the white tailed
Speaker 1: world that we have trouble with, is we we assume
Speaker 1: like a constant presence, like, well, the deer have a
Speaker 1: home range of this, so they they're gonna be here.
Speaker 1: It's like, well, if you're hunting forty acres or eighty
Speaker 1: acres or something, it's like there, it's nothing for them
Speaker 1: not to be where you're hunting, you know. Or if
Speaker 1: you have one part of this big chunk of public
Speaker 1: that you really like, that concentration might only be there
Speaker 1: a week a year, and it might be because of
Speaker 1: those red oaks in the late season or something like that.
Speaker 1: And just the more time you spend out there and
Speaker 1: the more time you hunt now when it's the hardest,
Speaker 1: it's probably going to be the more you learn that
Speaker 1: you've got to show any time. Like if you can
Speaker 1: go out there on public land and some of these
Speaker 1: states that get really pist pounded and you can go
Speaker 1: find a concentration to deer, and even if it's you're
Speaker 1: hunting for a scrapper or a doll or whatever, and
Speaker 1: you can get on those deer right now, you can't
Speaker 1: tell me that you're not gonna have an easier time
Speaker 1: next September October, you know what I mean. Like it
Speaker 1: all feeds into itself. But if you decide that it's
Speaker 1: like not worth it and don't go, then it's like
Speaker 1: it works the other way too. Yeah, and and and
Speaker 1: you made a really good point there that uh, and
Speaker 1: I was talking to Andy May about this was like,
Speaker 1: you know, it's very rare that you find an area
Speaker 1: that's good all year, like even even just like a
Speaker 1: general area, Like I have places that have better food
Speaker 1: that I know there's gonna be oak trees and if
Speaker 1: there's acorns, it's a better early season spot. Where I
Speaker 1: have spots that are have no oak trees at all
Speaker 1: and no mass crop that are better during the rout
Speaker 1: because it's more consistent as far as where the deer
Speaker 1: hanging out and doing that, and then late seasons a
Speaker 1: whole another game that might be that's more of me
Speaker 1: being mobile and seeing what the cuts are doing. You
Speaker 1: know that that changes every couple of years on finding
Speaker 1: good late season spots, and it's like it's it's just
Speaker 1: trying not getting so in tune with uh, you know,
Speaker 1: this is my spot and this is where I need
Speaker 1: to be. And if you can kind of open your
Speaker 1: mind up to it, I think you can can find
Speaker 1: success in the late season. Again, doesn't matter if you're
Speaker 1: hunting an old deer, if you're hunting any buck that
Speaker 1: comes by or any dough you know, that's I think
Speaker 1: it's it's just a different mindset and you and you've
Speaker 1: got to think too, kind of you know, on being mobile,
Speaker 1: being open to where they're going to be right now,
Speaker 1: is you might you might have to think about this
Speaker 1: like where are they going to be? You know, kind
Speaker 1: of like skate to where the puck is going to
Speaker 1: be type of strategy. You know that that goes for
Speaker 1: all year, and we sort of take it for granted.
Speaker 1: We're like, oh, if it's late season, they're gonna be
Speaker 1: really patternable and they're gonna be on this food source
Speaker 1: and they're gonna bed here. And it's yes, yes, especially
Speaker 1: if you're if you're hunting public land and it's you know,
Speaker 1: if you're on a browse pattern or something that some
Speaker 1: kind of food source that's gonna get cleaned up, whether
Speaker 1: it's today or next week, and it's not you know,
Speaker 1: not to draw anymore that stuff is going to change
Speaker 1: out there, and I think it's really hard to get
Speaker 1: tuned into that stuff. Like I had. This happened to
Speaker 1: me right at the end of the Minnesota muzzleloader season.
Speaker 1: I had hunted, I had hunted Wisconsin, I had hunted
Speaker 1: southern Minnesota. A little bit got my ass kicked. I
Speaker 1: came home and I have permission to doll hunt this
Speaker 1: farm by my house here in the Cities, and I
Speaker 1: go out there and we have a long season here
Speaker 1: started November five and went till like November for the
Speaker 1: general gun season. Then we have sixteen days of you
Speaker 1: know whatever, So it's it's a long season. They get
Speaker 1: piss pounded, and this farm they hunt them so hard
Speaker 1: every day. There are people out there, and so when
Speaker 1: I talk to the landowner, he's like, yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: they're they're pushed out pretty good. But you know what,
Speaker 1: I go ahead. So I go out there and kind
Speaker 1: of just observe first, see what's what's going on, because
Speaker 1: there's a pick bean field on there, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm I'm hunting for eight year like I want to do.
Speaker 1: To walk by right and I can see a group
Speaker 1: of like fifteen of them across the road, which they
Speaker 1: might as well be on Mars there. I can't hunt
Speaker 1: over there. It's nobody's hunting over there or whatever. And
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, there's all my dear. But I ended
Speaker 1: up having he's sitting this spot to just kind of
Speaker 1: observe and cover this cattail slew and some other some
Speaker 1: of the other better cover on there that I know
Speaker 1: doesn't get hunted. And the only deer I see that night,
Speaker 1: it's like a hundred and thirty and shade pointer gets
Speaker 1: up out of his bed out in these cat tails
Speaker 1: and walks right by me a d rs. I can't
Speaker 1: shoot him because the landowner won't let me, and so
Speaker 1: I have to let a late season and thirty inchrigo
Speaker 1: and it's yeah. I was like I saw it coming,
Speaker 1: and I texted him. I was like, hey, hey, bro,
Speaker 1: I got a really good one, and he's like nope.
Speaker 1: I'm like, all right, you know, it's his land whatever whatever.
Speaker 1: So then the only deer I see, and I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: you know, this is like a place on paper should
Speaker 1: have everything. It's got food, it's got cover, it's got
Speaker 1: suburbs right next to it. So there's some sanctuary. But
Speaker 1: the pressure on there was enough where those deer are
Speaker 1: mostly gone. But that buck, who's been haunted pretty freaking hard,
Speaker 1: just he's got his little thing figured out there in
Speaker 1: that little security cover. And so I went out the
Speaker 1: next night and the landowner told me. He's like, he's like, listen,
Speaker 1: if you want to shoot a little buck, go ahead,
Speaker 1: not that one. And I'm like, are you sure, because
Speaker 1: if I have a little book, come on, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: freaking lace him. He's whatever. I go back out, get
Speaker 1: into a different stand, to get back into the cover
Speaker 1: a little more, and I'm just like, you know, we
Speaker 1: have fresh snow, there's no tracks. I'm watching turkeys. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I I as soon as I get into my stand,
Speaker 1: I can see fifteen deer, including bucks, across the road,
Speaker 1: all the deer that I'm hunting, And it's just like
Speaker 1: one of those deals where I'm like, I know they're
Speaker 1: gonna come back, like they'll work their way back here.
Speaker 1: But those deer are effectively just it's like you picked
Speaker 1: them up and you put him in a place you
Speaker 1: can't freaking touch him anymore. And it's so wild to
Speaker 1: see that on private and and then you go into
Speaker 1: public land and you think Okay, well the rifle season
Speaker 1: just came through here, Like yeah, it's gonna affect things,
Speaker 1: but they're gonna like normalize again, you know, like they're
Speaker 1: gonna it's it's gonna happen. It's just like you gotta
Speaker 1: be in tune enough to know, like, is this are
Speaker 1: they coming back together here now that most people have
Speaker 1: left them alone. If they have, you're gonna have badass hunting.
Speaker 1: If not, you gotta keep looking. Yeah, And I want
Speaker 1: to go back to something that you said with the
Speaker 1: pattern the pattern ability of them, So should we air
Speaker 1: called that the patterns they have, the patterns that you're
Speaker 1: gonna buy air quotes and like, so I've gotten messages
Speaker 1: from people that are like newer to hunting big woods
Speaker 1: and be like, hey, how many days in a row
Speaker 1: is this buck need to show up on camera before
Speaker 1: you think I should hunt them? I'm like, One, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't I don't ever have I don't
Speaker 1: ever have a buck that shows up multiple days in
Speaker 1: a row. That just doesn't happen. And it's like a
Speaker 1: lot of that comes down to your intuition on you know,
Speaker 1: and find that sign. And that's where people can use
Speaker 1: trail cameras to a detriment of themselves. And I use
Speaker 1: a lot of trail cameras, but I don't for the
Speaker 1: most part, I don't even use it for that season
Speaker 1: other than knowing that a bus they're like, that doesn't
Speaker 1: that's that's past until it don't matter. The Big Woods
Speaker 1: is a little bit different, and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: other scenarios that are probably similar to this, but this
Speaker 1: is kind of what I'm familiar with. And you gotta
Speaker 1: you gotta use kind of your gut instinct when you
Speaker 1: see that sign of like hunting it. And just because
Speaker 1: you don't see anything one day doesn't mean that, you know,
Speaker 1: if you're good and you didn't blow anything out, you
Speaker 1: can go back in there that next day and hunt
Speaker 1: it again. It might take a few sits before you
Speaker 1: see anything, and that's just the nature of it. And
Speaker 1: and uh, I just but I will say that I do.
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't sit the same spot like I
Speaker 1: do during the rut for four days in a row
Speaker 1: or anything a lot of times, especially if it starts
Speaker 1: getting again. I keep referring to, you know, bad weather,
Speaker 1: but they will kind of hurt up a little bit.
Speaker 1: So it's trying to find where the concentration a deer
Speaker 1: are and then and then putting yourself in the game.
Speaker 1: But I just I think trill cameras um can't can
Speaker 1: be a detriment when you're looking at big woods hunting,
Speaker 1: like you're just not you're not gonna find that pattern. Well,
Speaker 1: I think in general there's there's a high potential for
Speaker 1: misuse there and in a way to hurt yourself. But
Speaker 1: I think the late season two, you can you can
Speaker 1: get yourself into trouble thinking that you're gonna get pictures
Speaker 1: of them over and over and over again, and it's
Speaker 1: just not gonna break that way. I want to ask
Speaker 1: you another thing. So like when I when I told
Speaker 1: you that that landowner Green let me on shooting a
Speaker 1: scrapper or a doll. It was so freaking fun because
Speaker 1: I knew. I'm like, actually I knew there was a
Speaker 1: little buck living in this one spot. I'm like, if
Speaker 1: that sucker walks out, I'm gonna shoot him. And he did.
Speaker 1: He was the only deer that came out and I
Speaker 1: killed him and I was so freaking happy, a little
Speaker 1: three point It was awesome. Uh, But what what I
Speaker 1: love about that? What I love about the late season,
Speaker 1: especially on public Land or you know, this flintlock hunt
Speaker 1: you're doing, is you get to go hunt deer. It's
Speaker 1: not like I'm waiting for that great big buck to
Speaker 1: show up on camera on that scrape or whatever, or
Speaker 1: it's prime time and I want to just tiptoe around
Speaker 1: the woods and not not make the wrong move. You
Speaker 1: just get to carry that flint knock out there, and
Speaker 1: now you're hunting deer like you're just like you see
Speaker 1: some doughes coming through the woods. That's that's awesome. And
Speaker 1: I think I think we were kind of forgetting about
Speaker 1: that in hunting, like the trophy. The push for trophies
Speaker 1: is like so heavy now that people are kind of
Speaker 1: skipping a lot of steps to get good at hunting
Speaker 1: and forgetting like, yeah, okay, if you have the right
Speaker 1: scenario and you've worked your way into it, and you
Speaker 1: and that's what what blows the wind up your skirt,
Speaker 1: great one sixties or bust. But there's a lot of
Speaker 1: situations where you're just setting yourself up for a horrible
Speaker 1: season or a horrible hunt if your standards are just
Speaker 1: so out of whack with your situation. And it's so
Speaker 1: nice you know, when you're down to this fourth quarter,
Speaker 1: last couple of minutes of the fourth quarter, and you're like,
Speaker 1: I'm going out on public land now for something. It's
Speaker 1: fun to just go hunt year. No, You're You're so right,
Speaker 1: And I think about this all the time, and and
Speaker 1: so I had, I had. Uh. I started kind of
Speaker 1: filming some of my hunts uh recently, and I put
Speaker 1: out a couple of videos this year for me self
Speaker 1: filming some hunts. And I went from shooting a pretty
Speaker 1: well one of my best books in Pennsylvania to the
Speaker 1: next video of me shooting this little seven pointer in
Speaker 1: New York that was like, you know, a year and
Speaker 1: a half, two year old maybe, uh. And it's like,
Speaker 1: how how do you have these different standards? Like I
Speaker 1: don't like, I'll have like really high standards in places
Speaker 1: if I if that's what I feel like I want
Speaker 1: to do, but I also want to have fun and
Speaker 1: like and I do have fun. Like in West Virginia
Speaker 1: this year, I put very high standards on on myself
Speaker 1: and I let some really nice bucks go that that
Speaker 1: um that I would have been happy with anywhere else.
Speaker 1: But I was like, I just wanted to shoot something
Speaker 1: really big there, but that doesn't mean that, you know,
Speaker 1: and when it comes to Pennsylvania, I've also been targeting
Speaker 1: older deer, especially in the last five six years. But
Speaker 1: when it comes to late season, if I want to
Speaker 1: go out and have fun and shoot a scrap buck,
Speaker 1: I'll do that. And that's like I'm and I don't
Speaker 1: fault anybody that has the different mentality of like it's
Speaker 1: this or bust throughout the whole thing. That's just not
Speaker 1: where I'm at, And that doesn't seem fun to me.
Speaker 1: If I'm like, oh, I'm setting a hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: standards across the board. And then I I also like
Speaker 1: shooting deer and I have fun doing that, and and
Speaker 1: I have just as much fun shooting smaller bucks I
Speaker 1: do older ones. And it's it's, uh, you're you're right.
Speaker 1: You can't get caught up, and especially um when you're
Speaker 1: especially you when you're newer to it, Like it's one
Speaker 1: thing too, you know, say someone like yourself that's hunted
Speaker 1: for a while, and I want to challenge myself and
Speaker 1: I'm trying to hunt some big deer and that's like
Speaker 1: that's a new challenge for you. But when you're new
Speaker 1: to it, like there's nothing like repetition and and and
Speaker 1: getting yourself in that scenario of going back to full
Speaker 1: draw or pulling a gun up on something and seeing
Speaker 1: how your emotions react to any deer. Like that's I
Speaker 1: And that's you know, the way I looked at elk
Speaker 1: hunting for since I've started with it. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: I've been doing it now for five years, but it's
Speaker 1: not or maybe even six years, but it's not. I
Speaker 1: still feel brand new to it. Like that's to me,
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to kill, you know, elk. And that's
Speaker 1: that's the way that it that it comes down to it,
Speaker 1: and I think it I think you can get caught
Speaker 1: up in seeing what so and so is doing or
Speaker 1: this or that and try to make that your goal,
Speaker 1: and it can be frustrating. Yeah. Well, and you know
Speaker 1: I mean that that's another good point, Like the elk thing.
Speaker 1: I mean, whatever, do what people can do, whatever they
Speaker 1: want to set their standards wherever. I just see a
Speaker 1: lot of people set pretty high standards for elk hunting
Speaker 1: that when they don't know what they're doing and end
Speaker 1: up not going back, end up taking one trip. And
Speaker 1: I just look at this and I'm like you know
Speaker 1: what you said about it's just fun to shoot deer. Dude,
Speaker 1: I'm to the point now where I'm like, I I
Speaker 1: look at these situations. My my favorite things about deer
Speaker 1: hunting a couple of them are. I like looking into
Speaker 1: I have two freezers now, how to buy an extra
Speaker 1: one from my elk this year, And I like looking
Speaker 1: in those freezers and seeing ship tons of meat, like
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna freaking run out for the year. I
Speaker 1: love it. But I realized, I'm like, I just like
Speaker 1: shooting deer, Like I like when you when you have
Speaker 1: that situation where it's like whatever, dear it is that
Speaker 1: you see it and you're like, I'm gonna try to
Speaker 1: kill that one and it starts getting into your red zone.
Speaker 1: That's the best, Like there's there's nothing better like you,
Speaker 1: and you don't get that very often. And I noticed that,
Speaker 1: Like it kind of really hit home for me with
Speaker 1: my daughters taking them this year, because when I took
Speaker 1: my I took one daughter out skill spike right away
Speaker 1: and that was done. There was a quick little encounter.
Speaker 1: But my other daughter we went out. She shot a
Speaker 1: dough in the morning and she had another dough tag
Speaker 1: and I was like, let's go sit. We got a
Speaker 1: doll in a buck tag and we had these does
Speaker 1: really cagy like they were like I don't think, I
Speaker 1: don't think we're going through there, and you could see them,
Speaker 1: and I remember just like the whole time because I'm
Speaker 1: like I can't whisper to her or anything. I'm like,
Speaker 1: we're just she's got to read this situation and we
Speaker 1: have to stay no noise, no movement, and just hope
Speaker 1: they settled down and come in. And it was like
Speaker 1: a long encounter with them close before this one dough
Speaker 1: finally broke and came in, and I just remember thinking
Speaker 1: like that was so freaking fun, Like just just that
Speaker 1: like like anticipation of like is this shot gonna happen?
Speaker 1: Is this gonna blow up? And I just can't Like
Speaker 1: this is just me personally. I don't want to go
Speaker 1: into a season where if I know I'm targeting really
Speaker 1: big deer, which can be super fun in some situations,
Speaker 1: I'm just not gonna feel that. Like I might go
Speaker 1: my entire season and maybe only feel that once or
Speaker 1: twice and it might not break my way. Or I
Speaker 1: can get into these situations where you're talking like you
Speaker 1: go hunt late season does on public land, like you're
Speaker 1: gonna your heart rates gonna spike at some point during that.
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to that as much as any hunt
Speaker 1: this year. And it was. It was funny and I
Speaker 1: got to see it again where um what I kept
Speaker 1: reffort thing this this recent gun hunt that I did
Speaker 1: with somebody. So Lee ellis from Sequan. He's killed three
Speaker 1: d seventy in plus dear in other states. This year.
Speaker 1: He came to Pennsylvania with me and he told me,
Speaker 1: he's like, I want to have fun, like I want
Speaker 1: to learn your style hunting. And he's like, what should
Speaker 1: I be looking at? I said, any legal buck as
Speaker 1: like yeah, three days like and he end up shooting
Speaker 1: a nice three year old and but I was and
Speaker 1: he was like he goes bo. I was excited as
Speaker 1: excited as shooting any of those big deer and had
Speaker 1: just as much fun of doing that. Um, even though
Speaker 1: this doesn't, you know, compare as far as chips on
Speaker 1: the on the wall. And I thought that was really
Speaker 1: cool to see that and be a part of it.
Speaker 1: And I was even the one pulling the trigger and
Speaker 1: I was just ecstatic, like and then my buddy shot
Speaker 1: another buck later a younger deer, and just like we
Speaker 1: had him hanging at the pole camp. We cooked tender
Speaker 1: loins at night because we've done a podcast, and then
Speaker 1: afterwards cooked up a bunch of tender loins and it
Speaker 1: was just like this is fun, Like that's that's a
Speaker 1: really cool experience. And that's why I'm looking forward to
Speaker 1: this late season and just getting out there and hunting
Speaker 1: deer and just and to be honest, I mean, trying
Speaker 1: to shoot a dough. When you're trying to shoot dough
Speaker 1: is not easy. Sometimes it's it could be just as hard,
Speaker 1: if not harder, when you don't want to shoot a dough.
Speaker 1: They're they're everywhere. But that's the well, I mean, that's
Speaker 1: that's a really good point there that nobody ever talks about,
Speaker 1: is like we we take dose so for granted, right, Like, oh,
Speaker 1: I could kill those anytime I want, because you're condensing
Speaker 1: an entire season of not trying to kill them into
Speaker 1: your head and you're going I was all over him,
Speaker 1: you know. It's kind of like the dude, it's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I could have shot the one thirty but you look
Speaker 1: kind of young, and it's like yeah, and he was
Speaker 1: fifty four yards away in the brush and you never
Speaker 1: had a shot, you know what I mean, Like when
Speaker 1: you actually get out there and you're like, Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm gonna kill one. I'm not just gonna sit here
Speaker 1: and watch him and not pick up my bow or
Speaker 1: not pick up my gun. Totally different. You know that
Speaker 1: farm that I killed that little buck on here with
Speaker 1: a muzzle, or last year I did a bunch of
Speaker 1: late season bow hunting on there for a dough and
Speaker 1: I never killed one. And I mean I would see
Speaker 1: those doughs coming in and I had a lot of
Speaker 1: encounters and I would be like, oh my god, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get busted drawn again because they're gonna hear it,
Speaker 1: you know, like dead calm, And every freaking time I
Speaker 1: had a chance, something went wrong. And I was like,
Speaker 1: if you think you're really, really good, like there's some
Speaker 1: situations where you'll go out and you'll try to kill
Speaker 1: a late season dough in a place where a lot
Speaker 1: of people hunting. You go like, this is not this
Speaker 1: is not easy, This is not what we make it
Speaker 1: out to seem. It's freaking tough. Yeah, I know, and
Speaker 1: I'm I'm concerned about that part like I when I
Speaker 1: don't know if it was it was last year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: last year I tried and I failed, Like I didn't.
Speaker 1: I didn't do any good one. I was targeting a
Speaker 1: dough specifically, and it was just like and I had
Speaker 1: like a decent amount of time to put towards it,
Speaker 1: and I was like, how is this the case? Like
Speaker 1: it it's not. It's not as easy as you put
Speaker 1: it out too. And I had a guy messaged me
Speaker 1: about that too. It's like I'd love to hear like
Speaker 1: some talks on just shoot hunting does and I'm like
Speaker 1: thinking about it, I'm like, yeah, I don't really think
Speaker 1: about that that much. And and you know, in my
Speaker 1: own head other than when all of a sudden I
Speaker 1: have tags filled, then I go out and try to
Speaker 1: do it and it's a struggle. It's not just because
Speaker 1: it's a dough doesn't mean it's easy. You know, some
Speaker 1: of those some especially you can start getting some of
Speaker 1: those old does whole. They're they're smarter than those Bucks are. Dude.
Speaker 1: I actually just wrote about this, like I I honestly
Speaker 1: think that we give Bucks too much credit and do
Speaker 1: is not enough credit because you know, people talk about
Speaker 1: how big books are a different species and all this stuff,
Speaker 1: and we we've always had a vested interest in making
Speaker 1: them seem like mythical, right, like it does guys like
Speaker 1: you and I. It serves us well if people think
Speaker 1: that bucks have a sixth sense and they're impossible to
Speaker 1: kill in all this bullshit, right, But when you think
Speaker 1: about their life, you know, most of the time, those
Speaker 1: big bucks, the reason that they're so hard to kill
Speaker 1: is they're pretty freaking rare, right, compared to a lot
Speaker 1: of the other deer, Like, they just aren't that many
Speaker 1: of them. And yeah, like listen, they're good at surviving,
Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, Like I fully believe that. But
Speaker 1: when you start dealing with a lot of doughs, they
Speaker 1: get a lot of pressure, they're just as good at surviving. Like,
Speaker 1: they're just as good at figuring out where the pressure
Speaker 1: is and reacting to it. And I mean, I think
Speaker 1: that I have more dose pick me off or you know,
Speaker 1: blow up a set up than bucks do. Like bucks
Speaker 1: seem like when you get them to move, they're pretty
Speaker 1: confident and sometimes not as cage as those doughes. And
Speaker 1: a lot of times those pressure does especially they're a
Speaker 1: couple of years old man, they will get you every time. Yeah, No,
Speaker 1: you're you're, you're, you're spot on and and trying not so.
Speaker 1: Another thing about late season I think would be a
Speaker 1: good thing to hit on is when you're hunting in
Speaker 1: that cold and say it's still, it's a lot tougher
Speaker 1: to after you've been sitting in a while to draw
Speaker 1: your bow, if your bow hunting, to even get your
Speaker 1: bow back, and then everything starts making creaking noises and
Speaker 1: you know, whether it's your stand or saddle platform, wherever
Speaker 1: you're using, like, there's a lot of things that can
Speaker 1: go wrong, and it seems so much more still, and
Speaker 1: it's harder and there's not as much cover, so even
Speaker 1: when your trees stick out a little bit more, it's
Speaker 1: tougher to to make that happen. And you know, I
Speaker 1: was up in Alberta recently and when I was hunting
Speaker 1: up there, it was negative. The cold is really freaking cold.
Speaker 1: Try drawing your bow back if you have it at
Speaker 1: seventy pounds, no matter how strong you think you are,
Speaker 1: when you've been sitting there not moving for hours on end,
Speaker 1: and then try to do that. It takes a different level.
Speaker 1: And I'm actually in the process of setting up a
Speaker 1: specific bow for hunting cold weather that's an in shorter
Speaker 1: draw length and set it sixty pounds in to the
Speaker 1: seven and so it's just easier to be able to do.
Speaker 1: And when you start having layers on, um, you know,
Speaker 1: practicing with all that stuff on, because it's different, and
Speaker 1: it's everything is different. You know, when I and when
Speaker 1: I shoot, I shoot a thumb release, uh for most
Speaker 1: of the season. When it comes to late season, I
Speaker 1: use a trigger style again because I can't have that
Speaker 1: close to my face because I have the the potential
Speaker 1: to hit the trigger and I've done that in practice
Speaker 1: by hitting my caller or doing you know something, And
Speaker 1: those are all things that I think it overlooked as
Speaker 1: when it comes to late season, but are the things
Speaker 1: that you should you know, practice and make sure you're
Speaker 1: you're competent and um. And it's it's it's hard, yeah,
Speaker 1: when you when you hunt cold late season like calm conditions,
Speaker 1: you you get reminded of all the holes in your
Speaker 1: game pretty quick when you've got to go, like when
Speaker 1: you've got to draw and just like a hood scrape
Speaker 1: in the tree or your your elbow or something just
Speaker 1: a little bit or a little tiny creek in your
Speaker 1: cams or anything like that. It's a it's a different deal,
Speaker 1: and it you know, it's one of those situations where
Speaker 1: if you do get caught drawing, like, they're not going
Speaker 1: to stick around, like if they pick you up there,
Speaker 1: you know, you're not gonna get like that stomp and
Speaker 1: walk around and position themselves a little better. It's like
Speaker 1: those days that was two months ago. This is a
Speaker 1: different world. Now, yeah, you're the you're the nineteen guy
Speaker 1: that they've saw since that time two months ago. They're
Speaker 1: not they're not sticking around and looking at they're they're
Speaker 1: they're bolting at that at that point. So it's yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a that's a that's a good point. It's just uh,
Speaker 1: it's it's a different time a year, and you've got
Speaker 1: to kind of look at it that way. And that's
Speaker 1: why it's that's why it's fun too. Like I I
Speaker 1: I look at you know, these different situations and it
Speaker 1: took trying to change in my mindset. Like even when
Speaker 1: like this year with the run, I think mostly across
Speaker 1: the country people dealt with warm weather at the beginning
Speaker 1: of November and I I feel like everyone gets really
Speaker 1: down about it, and you know, including myself, I don't.
Speaker 1: I'd rather have cold weather. Everybody would. But it's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: look at this as a different thing, like what can
Speaker 1: I do differently to be able to kill something in
Speaker 1: this this scenario, especially if you're on like public ground
Speaker 1: and and you know, and and you have limited time
Speaker 1: to hunt, Like you have a specific time. You can't pick.
Speaker 1: You can't be like, oh, I'm not gonna hunt these
Speaker 1: days because they're not perfect. You know, change up your
Speaker 1: strategy a little bit. You know, your high wind days,
Speaker 1: maybe you want to just still hunt. You want to
Speaker 1: be on the ground and do that. And I think
Speaker 1: late season offers a little bit of that, that challenge
Speaker 1: and that those differences, And I think no matter what
Speaker 1: time of year, it is using those different scenarios that
Speaker 1: you're kind of dealt with and looking at as a
Speaker 1: game and trying to to to figure it out. And
Speaker 1: I learned a lot of that, and even recently I
Speaker 1: was reminded of it. I guess is what I should say.
Speaker 1: Zach Farenball Uh. He he was talking to me about it,
Speaker 1: and he's just like, man, I just whatever condition they
Speaker 1: are thrown at me, just figure it out. Try something new,
Speaker 1: you know, and and I think you can learn so
Speaker 1: much of that even if it doesn't work out for you. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: I mean, and the reality is it mostly won't. But
Speaker 1: that's okay because it mostly doesn't anyway. I mean, I
Speaker 1: look at this and I go because I'm like that,
Speaker 1: Like I just I just want to hunt. If it's hot, cold, whatever,
Speaker 1: If I have a chance to go, I'm gonna go.
Speaker 1: And you know, you see people make excuses to not
Speaker 1: go in those conditions a lot, and I get it.
Speaker 1: But then you look at like the success rate when
Speaker 1: the conditions are perfect, and still most people are not
Speaker 1: killing deer, and so it's like, well, why not go
Speaker 1: try when it should maybe theoretically shouldn't be the best
Speaker 1: because when you think, you know, especially talking about coming
Speaker 1: from public land, I love really shitty conditions for deer
Speaker 1: hunting when I'm hunting public land because people are gonna
Speaker 1: just not go, you know, like if you're if you're
Speaker 1: there in September and it's ninety degrees, people are gonna hunt.
Speaker 1: You know. If you're there during the rut, some people
Speaker 1: will be there, but if it's seventy five degrees in
Speaker 1: the day, you'll have less pressure than you would if
Speaker 1: it was twenty five degrees. You know, like you have that,
Speaker 1: you have that to work with, and you go out
Speaker 1: there and realize that, like this stuff can still happen.
Speaker 1: It can happen early season, late season, it can happen
Speaker 1: right now on public plan. It's still worth going. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like in guns season, that's actually my favorite. When you
Speaker 1: get like a lot of rain. Yeah, it doesn't make
Speaker 1: favorable conditions as far as hunting, and it kind of
Speaker 1: sucks sometimes, but that's gonna keep people out of the woods.
Speaker 1: It's it's and even if at first light you have
Speaker 1: a lot of people out, they're gonna be wet cold.
Speaker 1: By nine am, they're going back. They have lunch and
Speaker 1: then they sit back camp or whatever. They Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe they'll just go out tomorrow. I'm not. I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna go out for the evening or whatever. It's like, man,
Speaker 1: that's fine, keep doing that. That's that's great. Like you
Speaker 1: guys stay in and watch the Packers game. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: maybe not this year, but but we gotta wrap this
Speaker 1: sucker up. Where can everybody finds you out there? You're
Speaker 1: doing all kinds of stuff. Yeah, I say that I say,
Speaker 1: the main thing that kind of links to everything is
Speaker 1: my upsite, East Meat to West Hunt dot com. If
Speaker 1: the East Meat to West Hunt podcast anywhere podcasts are found.
Speaker 1: My YouTube channel is just under my name Beaumar Tonic.
Speaker 1: If you search either of those things on social media,
Speaker 1: you'll find me. They're kind of stay active in all
Speaker 1: the all those places. So a bunch of scouting videos
Speaker 1: and stuff on YouTube, video podcasts, and then uh, but
Speaker 1: the podcast is probably my main main gig. So a
Speaker 1: lot of big woods, white tail stuff, planning Western hunts,
Speaker 1: those types of things, a lot of good info there.
Speaker 1: It's always a blast talk any man. Thanks so much
Speaker 1: for coming on. Yeah, thanks for having me on, Tony,
Speaker 1: I appreciate it. That's it for this week, folks. Be
Speaker 1: sure to tune in next week for more white tail goodness.
Speaker 1: This has been the Wire to Hunt podcast. I'm your
Speaker 1: guest host, Tony Peterson. As always, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for listening. And if you're looking for more white tail content,
Speaker 1: be sure to check out the metator dot com slash
Speaker 1: Wired to see a pile of new articles each week
Speaker 1: by Mark myself and a whole slew of white tail addicts,
Speaker 1: or head on over the wire to Hunt YouTube channel,
Speaker 1: to view our weekly content that we put up