WEBVTT - How Quantum Computers Could Change the World 0:00:15.356 --> 0:00:33.876 Pushkin. I'm Jacob Goldstein, and this is What's Your Problem, 0:00:34.156 --> 0:00:37.996 a show about people using technology to solve problems that matter. 0:00:38.676 --> 0:00:42.116 My guest today is Ben Bloom. He's the co founder 0:00:42.116 --> 0:00:45.756 and CEO of a company called Atom Computing, and his 0:00:45.876 --> 0:00:50.796 problem is this, how do you build a useful quantum computer? 0:00:51.476 --> 0:00:54.516 If Ben succeeds, or if one of the other companies 0:00:54.556 --> 0:00:59.116 working on quantum computers succeeds, quantum computers could make profound 0:00:59.116 --> 0:01:03.676 improvements in everything from discovering new medicines to building cheaper 0:01:03.716 --> 0:01:07.516 ways to store energy. Quantum computing today kind of reminds 0:01:07.556 --> 0:01:11.156 me of where AI was, say, ten or fifteen years ago. 0:01:11.356 --> 0:01:15.836 Huge possibility, lots of people working on it. Still not mainstream, 0:01:16.276 --> 0:01:18.716 but it's worth talking about now for a few reasons. 0:01:19.436 --> 0:01:23.316 For one thing, if or when quantum computers do work, 0:01:23.476 --> 0:01:27.476 they will be an extremely big deal. The science is 0:01:27.516 --> 0:01:30.436 clear that they can solve problems that are just too 0:01:30.556 --> 0:01:35.156 complex for traditional computers or even AI to ever solve. 0:01:35.756 --> 0:01:39.996 There are the potential energy and medical breakthroughs I mentioned before. Also, 0:01:40.236 --> 0:01:44.076 quantum computers can crack a common, widely used form of encryption. 0:01:44.956 --> 0:01:48.396 At the moment, giant tech companies like Google and IBM 0:01:48.476 --> 0:01:51.516 and Amazon are spending billions of dollars on their own 0:01:51.636 --> 0:01:57.356 quantum computing projects. Several smaller companies, including Ben Bloom's Atom Computing, 0:01:57.716 --> 0:02:01.236 have had money pour in from venture capitalists and public markets, 0:02:01.876 --> 0:02:04.956 and the Chinese government is spending billions more on its 0:02:04.956 --> 0:02:08.396 own quantum computing project. A lot of money and a 0:02:08.396 --> 0:02:10.876 lot of smart peace people and a high stakes outcome 0:02:10.916 --> 0:02:14.476 if it works. That's why quantum computing is worth talking about. Now, 0:02:15.076 --> 0:02:17.356 before we get to the interview, here's the basic idea 0:02:17.356 --> 0:02:20.516 of how a quantum computer is different than a traditional computer, 0:02:20.676 --> 0:02:24.236 a classical computer. In a classical computer, as you probably know, 0:02:24.716 --> 0:02:28.516 the basic unit of information is a bit. A bit 0:02:28.556 --> 0:02:29.996 can only be one of two. 0:02:29.836 --> 0:02:36.236 Things, zero or one off or on. Amazingly, everything that 0:02:36.276 --> 0:02:39.276 computers do is just built on lots and lots and 0:02:39.356 --> 0:02:42.036 lots of zeros in ones. And you can do a 0:02:42.076 --> 0:02:45.196 lot with zeros and ones. But you cannot do everything. 0:02:45.956 --> 0:02:49.996 For one thing, you can't crack standard methods of online encryption. 0:02:50.676 --> 0:02:54.836 For another, you can't build a complete model of even 0:02:54.876 --> 0:02:58.156 a simple molecule, say the kind of molecule you would 0:02:58.276 --> 0:03:01.476 use as a drug. This is where quantum computers come 0:03:01.516 --> 0:03:04.716 in quantum computers are not built out of bits, out 0:03:04.716 --> 0:03:07.156 of zeros and ones. They're built out of what are 0:03:07.196 --> 0:03:12.356 called cubitsum bits. To build a quantum bit, you use 0:03:12.436 --> 0:03:13.436 a quantum particle. 0:03:14.076 --> 0:03:14.236 Then. 0:03:14.276 --> 0:03:18.316 Bloom's company is called Atom Computing because they build each 0:03:18.396 --> 0:03:21.636 cubit with a single atom, and when the quantum computer 0:03:21.756 --> 0:03:25.076 is working, each atom, each cubit is not limited to 0:03:25.156 --> 0:03:27.556 being in a single state, to being just a one 0:03:27.676 --> 0:03:32.116 or zero in a weird quantumy way, a single cubit 0:03:32.356 --> 0:03:35.916 can be in many different states at once. And on 0:03:35.956 --> 0:03:39.076 top of that, when you combine cubits, what happens to 0:03:39.116 --> 0:03:42.996 each one instantly affects the others. What this means in 0:03:43.076 --> 0:03:46.916 practice is that a quantum computer with enough cubits could 0:03:46.956 --> 0:03:51.716 solve some problems that the most powerful classical computers literally 0:03:51.796 --> 0:03:56.316 could not solve in a million years. But quantum computers 0:03:56.316 --> 0:03:58.956 today are too small to do that, or at least 0:03:59.076 --> 0:04:02.276 they can't do it for any practical worldly problems. They 0:04:02.316 --> 0:04:05.316 just don't have enough cubits, and as Ben and I 0:04:05.356 --> 0:04:08.996 discuss in our conversation, building a function in quantum computer 0:04:09.196 --> 0:04:11.596 with lots of cubas is in fact a very hard 0:04:11.676 --> 0:04:15.076 engineering problem. So to start, I asked Ben to tell 0:04:15.116 --> 0:04:17.116 me how the field of quantum computing will look in 0:04:17.156 --> 0:04:20.876 a few years, when, if things go well, those engineering 0:04:20.916 --> 0:04:22.596 problems will have been solved. 0:04:23.436 --> 0:04:27.636 So I think in five years what you'll see is 0:04:28.596 --> 0:04:34.956 quantum computers attacking problems for national labs, for defense, for 0:04:35.036 --> 0:04:38.556 all these kind of esoteric industries who could call them 0:04:39.716 --> 0:04:44.076 that want calculations done that cannot be done on classical computers. 0:04:44.436 --> 0:04:47.676 It's probably going to be something like materials simulations. So 0:04:47.796 --> 0:04:49.836 how electrons behave in materials? 0:04:49.996 --> 0:04:53.956 And why are national labs interested in that? Ooh? 0:04:54.276 --> 0:04:57.636 I think that's a funny question. I think the Department 0:04:57.636 --> 0:05:03.076 of Energy is really interested in understanding materials at their extremes. 0:05:03.116 --> 0:05:03.276 OK. 0:05:04.036 --> 0:05:07.796 And I think that's true to both make it more 0:05:07.796 --> 0:05:11.596 efficient for the USA government to deal with all of 0:05:11.596 --> 0:05:15.396 the equipment they have, and also really true I mean, 0:05:15.516 --> 0:05:18.596 obviously for the Department of Energy main mission, which is 0:05:19.076 --> 0:05:21.996 understanding nuclear weapons and doing that without having to test 0:05:22.076 --> 0:05:22.876 nuclear weapons. 0:05:23.436 --> 0:05:27.316 So five years from now, quantum computers are where classical 0:05:27.356 --> 0:05:31.276 computers were in the nineteen forties, right, A few giant, 0:05:31.396 --> 0:05:35.276 crazy expensive ones being used by the government or a 0:05:35.276 --> 0:05:38.356 couple governments. Two things people talk a lot about with 0:05:38.436 --> 0:05:43.756 quantum computing are drug discovery, discovery of new drugs, and energy. 0:05:43.796 --> 0:05:46.396 For some reason, people talk about energy, they talk about batteries, 0:05:46.476 --> 0:05:49.076 that kind of thing. So if things go relatively well 0:05:49.076 --> 0:05:51.316 in quantum computing, like, are we going to be seeing 0:05:51.876 --> 0:05:54.796 meaningful impacts on those fields and what in ten years 0:05:54.836 --> 0:05:57.116 and if so, how will they be different? 0:05:58.036 --> 0:05:59.636 Yeah? I do think we will. I mean, I think 0:05:59.676 --> 0:06:02.156 ten fifteen years we will see new drugs on the 0:06:02.196 --> 0:06:05.556 market that we're designed on a quantic computer. I think 0:06:05.596 --> 0:06:08.916 we will see batteries they can do more recharge cycles 0:06:09.116 --> 0:06:12.556 because we understand the materials and understand the various properties 0:06:12.596 --> 0:06:16.636 that you know, cause them to lose charge over recharge cycles, and. 0:06:16.916 --> 0:06:20.836 More recharge cycles means cheaper in the long run importantly, right, 0:06:20.916 --> 0:06:23.116 Like batteries are constrained by cost now, and if one 0:06:23.156 --> 0:06:27.076 battery can last longer, that effectively means you it's cheaper 0:06:27.116 --> 0:06:27.756 per cycle. 0:06:28.476 --> 0:06:28.676 Yeah. 0:06:28.716 --> 0:06:30.396 And I think another example of this is, you know, 0:06:30.476 --> 0:06:33.316 the one that people throw out a lot is kind 0:06:33.316 --> 0:06:37.596 of understanding, you know, how you actually do fertilizer production. Like, 0:06:37.636 --> 0:06:40.116 it turns out a few percent of the world's energy 0:06:40.276 --> 0:06:42.836 is spent on fertilizer production. And so if you can 0:06:42.876 --> 0:06:47.116 find a new catalyst that could do that same process 0:06:47.356 --> 0:06:51.676 with slightly lower temperature or slightly less pressure, you know, 0:06:52.396 --> 0:06:58.076 marginal savings in that process turn into gigantic global savings 0:06:58.156 --> 0:07:00.716 in an energy budget sense. And so all of these 0:07:00.756 --> 0:07:03.396 problems kind of have this general idea behind them, which 0:07:03.436 --> 0:07:07.636 is that chemicals and materials and understanding the physical processes 0:07:07.676 --> 0:07:09.796 which we kind of have built our old on top 0:07:09.836 --> 0:07:13.556 of understanding them to a point where you could engineer 0:07:13.596 --> 0:07:16.996 around them or engineer them to work better, could have 0:07:17.156 --> 0:07:19.116 these you know, giant lever arm effects. 0:07:19.356 --> 0:07:23.036 So it's basically, I mean a more and better drugs 0:07:23.076 --> 0:07:27.076 and then be just efficiency gains. So that's fewer emissions, 0:07:27.116 --> 0:07:30.996 more power, lower costs. Like those are the dreams broadly. 0:07:31.076 --> 0:07:35.836 Yeah, okay, so where are we today? 0:07:36.556 --> 0:07:40.916 Yeah, we're building toy systems. I mean, there's no question 0:07:41.156 --> 0:07:44.396 I think that over the past I would say two years, 0:07:45.236 --> 0:07:47.436 a lot of technologies, including the one I work on, 0:07:47.476 --> 0:07:50.116 neutral atoms, have kind of crossed a threshold where you 0:07:50.156 --> 0:07:54.676 can build better and better cubits by taking that quantum information, 0:07:55.276 --> 0:07:58.556 spreading it around and doing error correction. And one of 0:07:58.556 --> 0:08:01.756 the examples that you know is probably what some sense 0:08:01.796 --> 0:08:04.276 started this entire race is it turns out you can 0:08:04.356 --> 0:08:07.196 factor numbers on a quantum computer efficiently. 0:08:06.836 --> 0:08:10.596 Which sounds trivial to the initiated, but it turns out, 0:08:10.636 --> 0:08:13.356 among other things, if I have this right to allow 0:08:13.396 --> 0:08:16.516 you to crack most of the encryption on the Internet, 0:08:16.556 --> 0:08:17.916 true or not true, It's true. 0:08:18.036 --> 0:08:21.356 The kind of encryption we have now was was a choice, 0:08:21.516 --> 0:08:23.716 and in some sense right now it's even a choice 0:08:23.756 --> 0:08:27.676 in your browser or in your operating system. And the 0:08:27.876 --> 0:08:31.236 likes of you know, Apple or you know, the Linux 0:08:31.236 --> 0:08:35.596 maintainers or Microsoft, they can literally just you know, quote 0:08:35.636 --> 0:08:38.036 unquote flip a switch and it can switch to what 0:08:38.076 --> 0:08:39.876 they call is post quantum cryptography. 0:08:39.956 --> 0:08:42.556 So people have come up with new systems that are 0:08:42.716 --> 0:08:47.076 quantum resistant that can work to secure our data in 0:08:47.116 --> 0:08:48.156 the post quantum world. 0:08:48.676 --> 0:08:51.076 Exactly. Yeah, and so I think that the future is 0:08:51.116 --> 0:08:53.476 bright in that sense. Now. The funny thing that you know, 0:08:53.756 --> 0:08:56.556 governments around the world are a little probably freaked out 0:08:56.556 --> 0:09:00.516 about is the past, which is that we've been using 0:09:00.876 --> 0:09:05.276 for you know, decades upon decades, we've been transmitting information 0:09:05.396 --> 0:09:09.556 between you know, people and businesses and government enter prizes 0:09:09.596 --> 0:09:13.596 and stuff like that. That if someone stored it and 0:09:13.716 --> 0:09:16.436 waited until they had a quantum computer. They can just 0:09:16.516 --> 0:09:19.316 go and read in the future when quantic computers are available. 0:09:19.596 --> 0:09:22.276 And so I think that is the kind of issue 0:09:22.276 --> 0:09:24.676 that I think most people think of when they think, oh, 0:09:24.756 --> 0:09:26.836 they're going to break encryption. How bad is that going 0:09:26.876 --> 0:09:28.676 to be. It's not going to be, you know, five 0:09:28.756 --> 0:09:30.596 years from now that people are worried about how do 0:09:30.596 --> 0:09:33.076 you pay for something online? It's more going to be 0:09:33.156 --> 0:09:36.996 these kind of you know, big government issues of Okay, 0:09:37.036 --> 0:09:39.196 you know, twenty years ago we sent a cable to 0:09:39.276 --> 0:09:40.396 so and so and it said this. 0:09:41.516 --> 0:09:44.636 I mean, we can let's talk about geopolitics here. Now, 0:09:44.636 --> 0:09:46.676 when people say let's talk about geopolitics in the US, 0:09:46.756 --> 0:09:50.236 they basically mean let's talk about China, and specifically, I. 0:09:50.196 --> 0:09:52.036 Mean, what happens if China gets there first? 0:09:52.196 --> 0:09:54.196 Right? Like, I do feel like, I know that's a 0:09:54.236 --> 0:09:56.076 crude way to ask the question, but I also know 0:09:56.156 --> 0:09:58.396 China is putting a lot of money into quantum computing, 0:09:58.556 --> 0:10:01.236 right Like? Is there something of a race here? Is 0:10:01.276 --> 0:10:02.396 that a way to think about it? 0:10:03.156 --> 0:10:04.876 I think it is a race. I mean, I think 0:10:04.916 --> 0:10:08.076 that they're doing it differently than the US. I mean, 0:10:08.076 --> 0:10:10.556 at the US. You know, my company out in Computing 0:10:10.636 --> 0:10:13.636 is one of many companies in the United States who 0:10:13.636 --> 0:10:16.676 are pursuing quantic computing, are trying to build a quantic computer. 0:10:18.156 --> 0:10:20.116 I think it's all private. You know, there is some 0:10:20.236 --> 0:10:23.756 public funding which we're accessing. There's Darper programs and things 0:10:23.796 --> 0:10:27.276 like that, but it's mostly private funding. Whereas you talk 0:10:27.316 --> 0:10:29.636 about what's going on in China, and I think there 0:10:29.676 --> 0:10:33.796 are big governmental initiatives, and I also think there are 0:10:33.916 --> 0:10:36.796 in some sense state backed companies that exist. 0:10:36.836 --> 0:10:40.516 This is very much in keeping with both of our countries, right, 0:10:40.836 --> 0:10:42.156 exactly what you would expect. 0:10:42.316 --> 0:10:44.876 Perhaps it's a test of our various systems. 0:10:45.316 --> 0:10:47.556 Yeah, yeah, So, I mean I think that the question 0:10:47.676 --> 0:10:50.996 of you know, is it bad if China, you know, 0:10:51.036 --> 0:10:53.916 builds a quantum computer and we don't have one, I mean, potentially, 0:10:53.996 --> 0:10:56.116 I mean, I think that a lot of the advances 0:10:56.156 --> 0:11:00.156 we were talking about earlier. Yeah, there are performance gains, 0:11:00.156 --> 0:11:02.556 efficiency gains and things like that, but those are the 0:11:02.676 --> 0:11:04.836 kinds of things that really I would say, drive an 0:11:04.836 --> 0:11:08.716 economy in the sense where the numbers associated with them 0:11:08.796 --> 0:11:12.236 are so so large that it's hard for me to 0:11:12.236 --> 0:11:14.596 wrap my head around. Like if you can decrease the 0:11:14.716 --> 0:11:19.356 energy budget of your country by five percent. Uh, that's 0:11:19.356 --> 0:11:21.956 a huge number, and I think it can actually make 0:11:22.116 --> 0:11:23.396 big changes possible. 0:11:23.796 --> 0:11:25.596 Yeah. I mean in a way, it makes you much richer. 0:11:25.836 --> 0:11:28.236 Right, it allows you to do things you could otherwise 0:11:28.276 --> 0:11:30.596 not afford to do, or you wouldn't otherwise have the 0:11:30.636 --> 0:11:36.916 resources to do. Y. I mean, presumably it gives you 0:11:36.996 --> 0:11:39.636 some kind of cryptographic power. 0:11:40.356 --> 0:11:42.116 Well, I mean it goes back to this idea that 0:11:42.156 --> 0:11:47.556 there's you know, there's this store now, decrypt later philosophy, 0:11:47.556 --> 0:11:50.876 which I've heard, you know, espoused by various government officials 0:11:50.876 --> 0:11:53.436 as you know, others are doing this and so on 0:11:53.516 --> 0:11:55.636 and so forth, which is that they're you know, storing 0:11:55.676 --> 0:11:58.996 all the communications and things like that. I think that 0:11:59.156 --> 0:12:01.556 is a problem. There's no question if if you know, 0:12:01.596 --> 0:12:04.676 we're successful and we build quantic computers, you will be 0:12:04.716 --> 0:12:08.116 able to decrypt later. I guess the question is how 0:12:08.276 --> 0:12:11.356 useful is old information? That would be the problem, And 0:12:11.396 --> 0:12:14.716 the question is how how bad is that going to be? 0:12:14.756 --> 0:12:17.316 Maybe it's not so so bad on individual scale, but 0:12:17.436 --> 0:12:20.756 on a kind of company scale or a country scale, 0:12:20.756 --> 0:12:22.716 maybe it could be quite quite problematic. 0:12:23.436 --> 0:12:26.396 So let's talk a little more about the difference between 0:12:26.476 --> 0:12:30.996 quantum computers and regular computers, classical computers. And maybe one 0:12:31.036 --> 0:12:33.356 way to do that is to talk about classical computers, 0:12:33.356 --> 0:12:35.556 the kind of computers we have now, the kind of 0:12:35.556 --> 0:12:39.596 computers that underpin AI are bad at, like what is 0:12:39.636 --> 0:12:41.876 their meaningful limitation in this context. 0:12:42.276 --> 0:12:45.636 So, say you have an electron and you want to 0:12:45.876 --> 0:12:48.996 understand the properties of that electron. And because you're designing 0:12:48.996 --> 0:12:50.996 a drug, you're you're looking at a material, You're doing 0:12:51.036 --> 0:12:52.356 something like that. 0:12:52.716 --> 0:12:55.556 A particular electron on a particular molecule. 0:12:55.636 --> 0:12:58.276 Yah, yeah, yeah, yeah, And all you want your classical 0:12:58.316 --> 0:13:01.716 computer to do is write down the state of that electron, 0:13:01.876 --> 0:13:05.036 very very precisely, where is it and what is it doing, 0:13:05.756 --> 0:13:09.356 and it's spin and things like that. Yeah yeah, Now wow. 0:13:09.396 --> 0:13:11.476 You try to write that down, and it turns out 0:13:11.516 --> 0:13:14.076 you use a lot of binary data. You use a 0:13:14.076 --> 0:13:16.716 lot of classical data to do that. Now, if you 0:13:16.796 --> 0:13:20.956 want two electrons, you have to use more classical data 0:13:21.036 --> 0:13:24.276 describe it. But it turns out, and this is where 0:13:24.636 --> 0:13:28.116 quantum mechanics starts mattering. It turns out you don't just 0:13:28.196 --> 0:13:31.476 care about the individual electrons in their states. You actually 0:13:31.556 --> 0:13:34.436 care about all the correlations, all the ways the two 0:13:34.476 --> 0:13:37.556 electrons are interacting with each other and are linked together, 0:13:38.156 --> 0:13:41.036 and that turns out to require more classical data to 0:13:41.076 --> 0:13:45.516 write down and very very quickly with tens to less 0:13:45.516 --> 0:13:48.316 than one hundred electrons. If you tried to write down 0:13:48.636 --> 0:13:52.116 all the classical data you needed to describe that situation 0:13:53.436 --> 0:13:57.276 you would need, I think it was more bits of 0:13:57.356 --> 0:14:00.716 information than there are, like atoms in our universe. 0:14:01.116 --> 0:14:03.676 It would be impossible. It would just be impossible for 0:14:03.716 --> 0:14:06.956 a classical computer yourself. And so it is the case 0:14:06.996 --> 0:14:12.036 that like once you get to the really fundamental level 0:14:12.196 --> 0:14:14.756 of what's going on with energy or what's going on 0:14:14.836 --> 0:14:18.476 with matter, with materials, it behaves in a quantum way, 0:14:19.116 --> 0:14:23.556 and classical computers can't understand what's going on once you 0:14:23.596 --> 0:14:27.516 get to that level, and quantum computers, at least the 0:14:27.516 --> 0:14:31.116 theoretical quantum computer, if you could solve the engineering problems, 0:14:31.556 --> 0:14:32.196 could do it. 0:14:32.836 --> 0:14:36.156 Yeah exactly. I mean, I think that the cool thing 0:14:37.636 --> 0:14:40.876 about quantum computing we kind of do have Norse stars. 0:14:41.236 --> 0:14:43.076 We know that if you can build a quantic computer, 0:14:43.276 --> 0:14:46.916 you can factor large numforts. We know that if you 0:14:46.956 --> 0:14:49.316 can build a quantic computer that you know, can deal 0:14:49.356 --> 0:14:52.436 with billions of operations that you can find the you know, 0:14:52.516 --> 0:14:55.476 structure of some molecule or something like that. And so 0:14:55.556 --> 0:14:58.876 we know that the goal is go from the short 0:14:58.916 --> 0:15:02.236 little calculations you can do now to longer and longer 0:15:02.276 --> 0:15:04.796 and longer calculations to the point where you can reach 0:15:05.076 --> 0:15:05.636 these goals. 0:15:05.716 --> 0:15:09.356 Yes, and so maybe there's one. 0:15:09.636 --> 0:15:16.876 There's one sort of problem broadly stated that seems particularly 0:15:17.196 --> 0:15:19.076 interesting and worth discussing. 0:15:21.476 --> 0:15:23.156 Let me see if I have this right? Is it 0:15:23.276 --> 0:15:24.076 right that. 0:15:26.036 --> 0:15:30.516 Each bit, each cubit of a quantum computer needs to 0:15:30.596 --> 0:15:34.596 be entirely isolated. It needs to be sort of not 0:15:34.916 --> 0:15:37.916 in touch with anything in the world. No, not a photon, 0:15:38.116 --> 0:15:41.396 not another molecule, not anything, right, because it is sort 0:15:41.436 --> 0:15:46.916 of sitting in this what a quantum superposition I'm reaching here, 0:15:47.636 --> 0:15:50.516 and if anything, if anybody sees it, if any light 0:15:50.596 --> 0:15:52.676 photon hits it, if anything happens to it, it kind 0:15:52.676 --> 0:15:56.316 of breaks, it decoheres and it doesn't work right? And 0:15:56.436 --> 0:16:00.676 is it fair that it's extremely hard for maybe obvious reasons, 0:16:00.956 --> 0:16:03.636 everything is touching everything else all the time. Is that 0:16:03.756 --> 0:16:06.996 like a central problem? Is that a problem worth talking about? 0:16:07.356 --> 0:16:11.036 It is because I think it's actually that the fundamental 0:16:11.116 --> 0:16:14.396 challenge of building a quantum computer is having that isolation, 0:16:15.156 --> 0:16:18.556 but then making sure that you have complete control over 0:16:18.636 --> 0:16:20.236 that quantum system. 0:16:19.996 --> 0:16:22.116 Right, And like, how could you have both at once? 0:16:22.196 --> 0:16:22.316 Right? 0:16:22.316 --> 0:16:26.036 If it's completely isolated, how can you control it? So, 0:16:26.716 --> 0:16:29.196 I mean, let's talk a little bit about your approach. 0:16:30.276 --> 0:16:35.236 You are working with Microsoft to build a thing for 0:16:36.916 --> 0:16:39.476 the Novo NORDESK foundation and what is part of the 0:16:39.556 --> 0:16:40.596 Danish government? 0:16:41.036 --> 0:16:45.956 Yeah? Yeah, so what are you building for the Danes? Yeah? 0:16:45.996 --> 0:16:50.716 So it's a twelve hundred cubit system, okay, And that 0:16:50.876 --> 0:16:52.836 is a kind of our part of this, which is 0:16:52.836 --> 0:16:54.996 that we're building the hardware. So it's a system that 0:16:55.156 --> 0:16:58.316 has all of the classical control around it, all the 0:16:58.436 --> 0:17:01.356 quantum control around it, so that they can trap, cool, 0:17:02.196 --> 0:17:05.116 manipulate twelve hundred physical cubits. 0:17:04.716 --> 0:17:06.836 Okay, and each one of those is one atom. 0:17:07.156 --> 0:17:08.556 Yes, each one of those is one atom. 0:17:08.636 --> 0:17:10.716 Yeah, very small number of atoms. 0:17:10.796 --> 0:17:13.076 Yeah. And actually the quantum part of our system is 0:17:13.156 --> 0:17:16.036 very very small, Like it's like half a millimeter by 0:17:16.116 --> 0:17:17.876 half a millimeter. It's very very. 0:17:17.796 --> 0:17:19.996 There's like a box or something. What is it? What 0:17:20.516 --> 0:17:20.756 is it? 0:17:20.876 --> 0:17:22.716 Yeah? Yeah, No, it is pretty much. 0:17:22.596 --> 0:17:26.076 A box half a millimeter by half a millimeter, which 0:17:26.116 --> 0:17:29.436 is I don't know what, like a size of like 0:17:29.476 --> 0:17:30.876 a hair or something like. 0:17:30.916 --> 0:17:31.596 It's so small. 0:17:31.596 --> 0:17:32.436 It's a little bigger than it. 0:17:32.516 --> 0:17:34.356 Okay, but yeah, what is it like? But it's bigger 0:17:34.396 --> 0:17:36.356 than like a little fingernail trimming. 0:17:36.076 --> 0:17:37.716 Right, yeah, fingernail trimming. 0:17:37.716 --> 0:17:40.996 That's a good bigernail trimming. And that's where all of 0:17:41.036 --> 0:17:43.356 the action is. That's the that's it. That's all of 0:17:43.356 --> 0:17:48.876 your Yeah, I guess twelve hundred atoms. Yeah, And what's 0:17:48.916 --> 0:17:52.036 going on in that tiny box? What do you start with? 0:17:52.916 --> 0:17:54.276 It's a metal, right, what's the element? 0:17:54.956 --> 0:17:55.796 Uh? Uturbium? 0:17:55.836 --> 0:17:57.956 Okay, so you start with this element, just a thing 0:17:57.996 --> 0:18:00.596 that exists in the world called U turbium. You don't 0:18:00.596 --> 0:18:01.436 need very much of it. 0:18:01.476 --> 0:18:02.076 What do you do? 0:18:03.596 --> 0:18:03.716 So? 0:18:03.836 --> 0:18:05.676 First off, we have to take we have a chunk 0:18:05.676 --> 0:18:07.956 of it, so we have to heat it up. So 0:18:08.036 --> 0:18:11.116 you go from a solid gas. That gas kind of 0:18:11.156 --> 0:18:14.956 streams down our system. We have lots of lasers kind 0:18:14.996 --> 0:18:17.796 of hit that gas so that it goes from hundreds 0:18:17.836 --> 0:18:21.276 of kelvin down to about a microkelvin, so ten to 0:18:21.316 --> 0:18:24.436 the minus six kelvin, so very very cold. 0:18:24.236 --> 0:18:27.676 And zero zero degrees kelvin is absolute zero. It's as 0:18:27.676 --> 0:18:29.996 cold as anything in the universe can ever be. So 0:18:30.036 --> 0:18:33.676 you're making it very, very very cold. And is that 0:18:33.716 --> 0:18:35.676 because you don't want it moving around, because you want 0:18:35.676 --> 0:18:36.316 it isolated? 0:18:36.356 --> 0:18:39.636 That's the exactly okay, yeah, pretty much like the temperature 0:18:39.716 --> 0:18:41.716 is pretty much the velocity it goes at and things 0:18:41.756 --> 0:18:44.916 like that. So we get the atoms, we get them 0:18:44.916 --> 0:18:48.036 down to a microkelvin, and then we kind of shuttle 0:18:48.076 --> 0:18:50.156 them using a laser. We kind of push them up 0:18:50.596 --> 0:18:53.996 into that tiny little area that's half a millimeter by 0:18:53.996 --> 0:18:54.316 half a. 0:18:54.236 --> 0:18:57.836 Million little box that's computer sort of. 0:18:58.476 --> 0:18:59.836 And then all of a sudden we get to this 0:18:59.876 --> 0:19:03.156 little area. And what we do through that microscope objective 0:19:03.316 --> 0:19:05.396 is we put a big beam into the back of 0:19:05.396 --> 0:19:08.036 that microscope objective. And the reason why we put a 0:19:08.076 --> 0:19:11.756 big beam when I say, it's like twenty millimeters yeah, okay, 0:19:11.756 --> 0:19:14.396 So you're shooting light through the microscope lens, let's say 0:19:14.556 --> 0:19:18.436 lens lens, okay, and when you do that, you put 0:19:18.436 --> 0:19:22.196 a big light beam into the back of that lensky 0:19:22.236 --> 0:19:24.436 What it does is it focuses down really really tight, 0:19:24.596 --> 0:19:27.236 and it creates an optical tweezer. Okay, And this won 0:19:27.316 --> 0:19:30.876 the Nobel Prize, and I think it was like twenty 0:19:30.996 --> 0:19:34.196 nineteen or something like that. The cool thing here is 0:19:34.236 --> 0:19:37.716 that this optical tweezer at the very focus of that 0:19:37.836 --> 0:19:41.436 lens gets really really tight and diverges really really quickly 0:19:42.196 --> 0:19:45.916 and for some light, and we very very carefully choose 0:19:45.996 --> 0:19:48.916 what kind of laser we're doing this with. Atoms are 0:19:49.396 --> 0:19:52.436 tracted to the point of highest intensity, okay, and so 0:19:52.516 --> 0:19:55.116 the atom kind of gets sucked in to the optical 0:19:55.156 --> 0:19:58.476 tweezer and then it wants to sit at the exact 0:19:58.636 --> 0:20:00.156 center of that pholk. 0:20:00.196 --> 0:20:02.676 So it's called an optical tweezer because it is grabbing 0:20:02.796 --> 0:20:04.196 a single atom. 0:20:04.516 --> 0:20:07.996 Yeah, okay, So what we do is we do a 0:20:08.036 --> 0:20:09.756 bunch of tricks so that we we don't just create 0:20:09.796 --> 0:20:15.916 one optical tweezer, but generally speaking, we build display technology 0:20:16.236 --> 0:20:20.836 that creates the image of many, many optical tweezers and 0:20:20.956 --> 0:20:23.036 just stuffs that into the back of the lens. 0:20:23.316 --> 0:20:27.676 So you basically have like what twelve hundred optical tweezers 0:20:27.676 --> 0:20:30.596 in each way, he grabs one atom and exactly sticks 0:20:30.636 --> 0:20:31.316 it in the box. 0:20:31.996 --> 0:20:33.756 Exactly. No, no, that is exactly what we do. 0:20:33.836 --> 0:20:36.996 So now there's this box that's ready to help someone 0:20:37.076 --> 0:20:40.436 figure out something about the world. What is something about 0:20:40.476 --> 0:20:43.836 the world that it might actually help them understand. 0:20:44.436 --> 0:20:47.436 Yeah, So, say there's a user in Denmark and Copenhagen 0:20:47.436 --> 0:20:50.196 who wants to understand the ground state of some molecule. 0:20:50.956 --> 0:20:54.076 They write down an algorithm that says, I am going 0:20:54.156 --> 0:20:58.756 to simulate many, many electrons, and I am going to 0:20:58.876 --> 0:21:01.796 use it such that it kind of gets down to 0:21:01.836 --> 0:21:04.076 the lowest energy state, Okay, and then I will read 0:21:04.116 --> 0:21:08.076 out the cubits in their various positions and things like that. Aha, 0:21:08.196 --> 0:21:10.876 so that we can actually understand what was the state 0:21:10.956 --> 0:21:13.396 of the electrons in this simulated system. 0:21:13.956 --> 0:21:17.716 So are they're sort of saying to the quantum computer 0:21:17.916 --> 0:21:20.476 that you have built, act like you are this molecule. 0:21:20.476 --> 0:21:23.436 Act like you are the electrons in this molecule exactly 0:21:23.476 --> 0:21:26.356 in their lowest energy state, and tell me what state 0:21:26.356 --> 0:21:41.876 you're in, Yes, exactly. We'll be back in just a minute. Hey, 0:21:42.076 --> 0:21:44.036 it's Jacob, and I want to tell you that I 0:21:44.036 --> 0:21:47.636 am hosting a new show called Business History. It's about 0:21:47.676 --> 0:21:52.396 the incredible innovations and massive failures and unbelievable characters in 0:21:52.436 --> 0:21:55.356 the history of business. And I hope I think the 0:21:55.436 --> 0:21:59.236