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Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Zeren Elizabeth Zaren.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, what girl? How are you doing? Pretty good?

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Speaker 4: Are you feeling?

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Speaker 3: You know?

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Speaker 5: I got like I said always, I'm upright and taking nourishment.

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Speaker 5: I'm on the right side of the grass. I got

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Speaker 5: nothing plain about.

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Speaker 4: Above ground and getting paid. No, girl, that's right, that

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Speaker 4: is right.

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Speaker 6: Uh, do you know what it's ridiculous?

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Speaker 5: I do tell me this one. I think you might

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Speaker 5: like because that has to do with animals, and I know

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Speaker 5: you like the animals. Animals, So you know Coco the Gorilla, right,

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Speaker 5: not personally, well, you know, Cocoa the Gorilla could speak

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Speaker 5: with sign language, yes, right, and they like they would

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Speaker 5: ask and then Coco Guerrilla to respond and they go

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Speaker 5: back and forth and have conversations in sign language. Well,

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Speaker 5: Coco the Gorilla wasn't the only ape that we've taught

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Speaker 5: sign language in fact, since like nineteen sixties, so you're

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Speaker 5: talking decades, like six six decades of teaching sign language

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Speaker 5: to apes. There's one thing that they have never ever

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Speaker 5: done in sign language.

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Speaker 3: You know what that is? Ask a question.

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Speaker 4: Apes have never asked us a question.

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Speaker 5: We ask them questions, they answer them, They express themselves.

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Speaker 5: They talk about their emotions, they talk about their inner reality,

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Speaker 5: they talk about their desires, their hopes, like Cocoa wants

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Speaker 5: a kitten. I mean they say all this stuff, Coco sad.

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Speaker 4: But wait, so they don't give a tinker's damn about us.

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Speaker 3: And it's not even that where you take it, But

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Speaker 3: it's the idea that they don't formulate in terms of

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Speaker 3: questioning reality. They accept reality as it is and comment

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Speaker 3: on it. So this may suggest an animal form of

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Speaker 3: consciousness that it just is and you can interact with reality,

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Speaker 3: but they don't question it. And this may be the

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Speaker 3: not that animals don't think, but they don't think the

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Speaker 3: way we think. And this is actually what separates us

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Speaker 3: from the animals. Is not just our opposable thumbs, but

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Speaker 3: the fact that we ask questions. Isn't that wild? That

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Speaker 3: is wild? And I just think that's kind of ridiculous

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Speaker 3: in a light scientific.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but that's really interesting here. I'm like, you don't

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Speaker 4: care about me, Coco. I feel like this is kind

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Speaker 4: of a one sided relationship, except.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I got you another Coco, you love me?

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Speaker 6: Now?

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Speaker 4: Do you want to know what else is ridiculous? I

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Speaker 4: do a gentleman's tiger.

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Speaker 3: Is that a euphemism?

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Speaker 4: You mean me? This is Ridiculous Crime, A podcast about

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Speaker 4: absurd and outrageous capers, heists and cons. It's always ninety

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Speaker 4: nine percent murder free and one hundred percent ridiculous.

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Speaker 3: Oh you damn right.

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Speaker 4: The Scots and the Brits, they sure know how to

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Speaker 4: name something that's true.

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Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, I'll give it to them like that,

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Speaker 3: even if it's silly.

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Speaker 2: It's so.

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Speaker 4: Scotland has a tradition of giving amazing names to the

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Speaker 4: gritter trucks that they used to clear the roads of ice,

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Speaker 4: and so it all started. They were letting school kids

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Speaker 4: name them, and then during COVID they moved the naming

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Speaker 4: pole online. Here are some of the best ones thus far. Sleetwood,

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Speaker 4: Mac Good Spready van Halen, Nice, sweet child, O'Brien, You're

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Speaker 4: a blizzard Harry Carrie, Bradthaw Okay, Brinstone, plowboy like that,

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Speaker 4: buzz Ice clear and clever, Betty white out Yes, Sir,

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Speaker 4: David Atton Burr, Gritney Spears and picture snowing me, snowing you.

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Speaker 3: I like the Britney spears I imagined her and Gritty

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Speaker 3: the had a child and named.

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Speaker 4: It and it's a truck exactly. So this is like

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Speaker 4: the Scouts are an incredibly language savvy popular.

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Speaker 3: Oh yes, and their insults are always beautiful.

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Speaker 4: And then there was that auto sub used by the

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Speaker 4: UK National Oceanography Center that in twenty sixteen was allowed

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Speaker 4: to be named by the public and the poll's clear

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Speaker 4: winner was body mcboat face.

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Speaker 3: That's what I was thinking of.

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Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, so that's a classic. It's been often mimicked.

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Speaker 4: The proprietor of some of the best social media accounts,

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Speaker 4: the Orkney Library.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you.

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Speaker 3: Followed I'm familiar, made me familiar.

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Speaker 2: They named a.

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Speaker 4: Boat that they used to take books out to remote

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Speaker 4: islands bookie mcbook face good and so you know it's

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Speaker 4: the repetition that hooks yet.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's go back.

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Speaker 4: In history a little bit.

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Speaker 3: I loved doing it, or a lot bit y oh,

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Speaker 3: I really loved that.

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Speaker 4: I remember a while back I told you about Gregor

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Speaker 4: McGregor cod I got a mcgridg got I forget the

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Speaker 4: repetition of it. So he was a Scottish adventurer, con artist.

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Speaker 4: He tried to get investors in England. Scotland France to

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Speaker 4: get on board of the fake country that he said

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Speaker 4: he was establishing, and that was in the early eighteen

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Speaker 4: hundreds mix South of Marya. Yeah, yeah, that guy Mosquito Coast.

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Speaker 3: And he breaks the Scottish bank.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, pretty much like he just it was. It's horrible.

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Speaker 4: So about fifty or so years after Gregor MacGregor was

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Speaker 4: on the scene, another repetitive name con man emerged in Scotland.

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Speaker 4: This one called himself Lord Gordon Gordon.

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Speaker 3: Not Goon, Lord Gordon Gordon Botros Gordon from him is

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Speaker 3: Bold Bold flavors with that name.

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Speaker 4: So that's the guy I want to tell you about

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Speaker 4: today and is with many of our con artists. His

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Speaker 4: origin story is murky, so like some say that he

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Speaker 4: was the illegitimate child of the son of a preacher

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Speaker 4: man and his family's made. There's also the narrative that

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Speaker 4: he grew up in an upper middle class family, but

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Speaker 4: from childhood always talked about how he wished he was

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Speaker 4: super wealthy and a member of nobility. We hear that

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Speaker 4: in background information on some of these con artists that

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Speaker 4: they like always wanted to be royalty or famous or

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Speaker 4: something like I can't and you did that but did

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Speaker 4: you know anyone who did that? My sister, Oh, really,

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Speaker 4: she wanted to be royalty.

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Speaker 5: She wanted she still has. He's still like a royal watcher.

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Speaker 5: And she's like into like the British royalty and all that. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: also not just the Brits, like if you are a

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Speaker 5: royal of any world or any land or well, I

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Speaker 5: guess she's like a fan. She just loves the idea

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Speaker 5: of royalty shoes. She would be like princess whatever in

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Speaker 5: her made up name.

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Speaker 4: She should have been born to it.

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Speaker 5: She really should be like I was over there, just

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Speaker 5: a man of the people. From the get really frustrated

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Speaker 5: her that.

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Speaker 4: You know, I just I never knew anyone who did

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Speaker 4: come across these things.

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Speaker 3: That's actually far more common.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I met people in college. I tell them my sister,

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Speaker 3: they're like my brother.

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Speaker 4: I would have had to have friends find out about

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Speaker 4: those things. So the sort of consensus is that he

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Speaker 4: came from a very cultured family, and his speech, his accent,

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Speaker 4: knowledge of social customs that suggested that he'd gone to

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Speaker 4: like boarding school.

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Speaker 3: Or had to pull off that world.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, and he it must have.

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Speaker 4: Been somewhat familiar with British upper class life. He was

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Speaker 4: fluent in French, like maybe a couple other languages. He

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Speaker 4: had this cultivated understanding of aristocratic genealogy, which is very convoluted,

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Speaker 4: the clan histories and estate management. So these really niche

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Speaker 4: things about Scottish nobility and it doesn't reveal his origins,

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Speaker 4: but it reflects the type of environment in which he

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Speaker 4: was educated or trained. The people who interacted with him

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Speaker 4: described his speech as quote, refined English with a slight

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Speaker 4: Scottish intonation, gentlemanly but indistinctly local.

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Speaker 5: Now did the I don't know this did Did the

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Speaker 5: upper class Scots, after their interaction and melding with the English,

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Speaker 5: tried to have English accents with a slight Scottish lilt?

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Speaker 5: Or is it rare for someone like him to have

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Speaker 5: a English accent?

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Speaker 4: I need to know when you get into because so

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Speaker 4: many English who come in and taken the higher that

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Speaker 4: like the hierarchy of being landed in. The Edinburgh accent

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Speaker 4: is much softer and more English than like the you know,

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Speaker 4: the Luigi to speak, or further up into the Highlands

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Speaker 4: and then closer you get to like the Orkney's like

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Speaker 4: forget it anyway, So yeah, there is that influence though,

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Speaker 4: and I think it has a lot to do with

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Speaker 4: who's owning that land and from whence they came. So

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Speaker 4: there he is. There's those that believe he was born

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Speaker 4: Hubert Campbell Smith. Sometime between eighteen thirty five and eighteen

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Speaker 4: forty he floated the idea to some that he had

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Speaker 4: served as a lieutenant or lieutenant in a Scottish regiment

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Speaker 4: in India ins and he may have also gotten a

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Speaker 4: job at a commercial house as a young man, but

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Speaker 4: he was unhappy with the salary so he quit. Like

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Speaker 4: who's to say, only Lord Gordon Gordon. These are the

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Speaker 4: other aliases that are associated with him, Herbert or Hubert Hamilton,

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Speaker 4: Lord Glen Cairn, George Gordon, George Herbert Gordon, John Herbert,

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Speaker 4: Charles Gordon. It's like he's got four options, yet he

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Speaker 4: just slips them all back and forth.

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Speaker 3: Just think it's like a Rubik's cube of names.

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Speaker 4: Well, I'm just thinking, like the refrigerator poetry, but he's

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Speaker 4: only got four pieces. She's just gonna slide around. So

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Speaker 4: summer of eighteen sixty eight, dude rolls up to Edinburgh.

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Speaker 4: He's like, hey, guys, the name's Hamilton, and I'm a normal,

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Speaker 4: boring guy. According to the Manitoba Historical Society quote, no

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Speaker 4: one knew anything of him, and there was much surmising

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Speaker 4: as to who he was. But as he paid his bills, punctually,

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Speaker 4: lived quietly, and had the manners of a gentleman, no

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Speaker 4: one could find anything against his character or conduct. Normal guy,

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Speaker 4: boring dude. So off he went when the summer ended by,

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Speaker 4: and then he showed up again the next summer, summer

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Speaker 4: of sixty nine in Edinburgh, and only this time he

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Speaker 4: was calling himself Lord glen Cairn, a pile of rocks,

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Speaker 4: pyle of rocks. So he had a story that would

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Speaker 4: like kind of make sense though. So he was the

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Speaker 4: same guy, but a lot had happened to him. It's

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Speaker 4: a crazy year, you guys, so he told He told

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Speaker 4: people that his grandpa had left money to him, tons

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Speaker 4: of money, but he could only access said money if

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Speaker 4: he accepted the title of glen Cairn when he reached

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Speaker 4: the age of twenty seven and the old curse of

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Speaker 4: twenty seven. Do you know how many musicians are in

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Speaker 4: the twenty seven club?

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Speaker 3: It's not a few, it's all yeah.

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Speaker 4: Robert Johnson, the og Yeah, one of the first Ryan Jones,

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Speaker 4: Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Jim Morrison, pig Pen from The

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Speaker 4: Grateful Dead, Kurt Cobain, Amy Winehouse, Christin Faff the bass

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Speaker 4: player for M some other kind of lesser known musicians anyway, how.

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Speaker 5: Else other stars as well, not just musicians, just not

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Speaker 5: just limited. But it's most of the musicians you made

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Speaker 5: it famous, Yeah, Keith Ledger missed it by like a

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Speaker 5: few months.

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Speaker 3: And then at twenty eight.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, so twenty seven is big for old glen

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Speaker 4: Cairn here, but not hopefully he makes it he spoiler alert,

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Speaker 4: he does so. Our boy Gordon Squared aka the Glencarn

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Speaker 4: he was just about to turn twenty seven. He's like,

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Speaker 4: I hope I make it, you guys. According to him,

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Speaker 4: his agents in London were just finishing up the paperwork

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Speaker 4: on the whole inheritance thing. In just a few months

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Speaker 4: time he would officially be named heir to his grandfather

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Speaker 4: and the Earldom of glen Cairn. And he didn't elaborate

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Speaker 4: about this or tell people what land holdings this might involve.

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Speaker 4: He got really vague about that.

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Speaker 3: If it's an earldom former Viking lands, Elizabeth.

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Speaker 4: I think so, as Skull because of the Yeah, so

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Speaker 4: he didn't talk hard numbers about his inheritance, just that

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Speaker 4: the amount was like positively eyewatering.

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Speaker 3: There's a castle or two.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's just I couldn't even begin so constructed credibility

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Speaker 4: by dressing impeccably in the style of a young landed gentleman.

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Speaker 3: They say, dressed like that all you want to be.

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Speaker 4: That's so true. Every single time he had this exaggerated

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Speaker 4: but really informed knowledge of clan histories. Like I said,

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Speaker 4: he spoke with authority when it came to a state's

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Speaker 4: rents tenants. He was a huge tipper and he'd make

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Speaker 4: all these like small charitable gestures far yeah, and always

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Speaker 4: with cash. So it makes it seem like there's a

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Speaker 4: lot more where that came from. And I just spend

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Speaker 4: this jump change. And he had someone with him at

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Speaker 4: the time. He employed a young valet or valet as

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Speaker 4: they would have said. There are a handful of articles

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Speaker 4: about Gordo that say this type of valet was referred

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Speaker 4: to as a quote gentleman's tiger at the time. Oh

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Speaker 4: and when I researched the term, the only place I

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Speaker 4: found it come up in reference to a valet is

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Speaker 4: in those same articles, I think, so it's nowhere else.

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Speaker 4: So like, who's started this notion? I feel like one

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Speaker 4: of these sources.

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Speaker 2: Made it up and the rest ran with it because

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Speaker 2: by the tail.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, there's nowhere else do I see anything about a

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Speaker 4: valet being called a gentleman's Like you go to search

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Speaker 4: it in Gentleman's Tiger and it comes up with like

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Speaker 4: signet rings with a tiger eye, and so you'd start

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Speaker 4: eliminating you know, ring and jewelry and stone and then

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Speaker 4: add in valet and it's like, no, only these articles

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Speaker 4: makes no sense. I mean, it's badass, don't get me wrong,

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Speaker 4: I'm with it, but it just makes it makes no

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Speaker 4: sense a gentleman's tiger.

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Speaker 3: Like, how could a gentleman so?

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Speaker 4: According to historian W. A. Crawfet Gordon, Gordon kept this

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Speaker 4: boy quote dressed in buckskin breeches, long boots, blue coat

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Speaker 4: with gilt buttons, and an immense cockade upon his hat,

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Speaker 4: which in Great Britain denotes that his master holds a

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Speaker 4: commission under the sovereign. That's an outfit.

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Speaker 3: He's close to the king with his hat, and he's

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Speaker 3: close to the colonies with his pants.

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Speaker 4: That's that's when people knew how to dress Sarah, I'm

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Speaker 4: telling you, or how to dress their tigers. A cockade,

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Speaker 4: by the way, is a knot of ribbons. I imagined

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Speaker 4: it to be like a huge plume of feathers.

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Speaker 3: That's what kind of going with a pile.

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Speaker 4: It's like a round, pleated circle of ribbon. Still an

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Speaker 4: amazing outfit. It's very Andre three thousand. I could see

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Speaker 4: the outfit anyway. So there's Lord glen Cairn just lording

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Speaker 4: it up in Edinburgh. He's swanning around with his gentleman's tiger,

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Speaker 4: is cozied up to a well to do Scottish clergyman

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Speaker 4: named mister Simpsons.

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Speaker 3: Clergyman.

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Speaker 4: Yes, mister Simpson, mister Bartholomew Simpson. No, it's not his

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Speaker 4: first name. We don't know what it is, just Simpson. No,

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Speaker 4: no for his name. So this was the move though,

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Speaker 4: Like you get a member of the clergy with some

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Speaker 4: means and you get close to him and he's your

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Speaker 4: opening into society. Like you can get you in anywhere

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Speaker 4: and people trust you because they trust him.

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Speaker 3: Smart move somebody to go.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like you paler around with Father Brown.

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Speaker 6: You're good.

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Speaker 3: The Lord and the King that's right, gotcha, And so The.

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Speaker 4: New York Times described this as such quote In England,

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Speaker 4: persons who are termed confident swingers, which like again a

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Speaker 4: gentleman's tiger and a confidence swinger, like what I feel

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Speaker 4: like this is something a little.

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Speaker 3: Off English private school, right boys school.

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Speaker 4: Jeez, so very quote very often worm their way into

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Speaker 4: the books of the tradesmen through the agency of clergymen.

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Speaker 4: Gordon made very liberal use of this plan. There's this website,

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Speaker 4: hoaxes dot org, which I'm like, did you start the

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Speaker 4: whole gentleman's tiger thing? They said, quote I tried to

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Speaker 4: find like who who at hoaxes dot org wrote this

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Speaker 4: show yourself powards no no bylines quote. His basic method

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Speaker 4: of operation was the foot in the door technique. He

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Speaker 4: would make small requests of people to gain their trust,

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Speaker 4: and then he gradually increased the size of his requests,

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Speaker 4: and having gained the trust of a person, he would

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Speaker 4: use them as a reference to gain the trust of

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Speaker 4: other possible victims.

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Speaker 5: Con Men have taught us that if you want to

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Speaker 5: earn someone's trust, ask them to do you a favor,

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Speaker 5: and then they feel like somehow tied to.

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Speaker 4: Exactly so now Glenn Kern, and he's pals with He's

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Speaker 4: got this network of fat cats that he's hanging out

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Speaker 4: and through them and Simpson, he's able to establish credit

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Speaker 4: with jewelers both in Edinburgh and London.

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Speaker 3: Okay, score.

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Speaker 4: So he was introduced as Lord Glen Cairn to the

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Speaker 4: Edinburgh jewelers Marshall and Company. And this was the place

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Speaker 4: at the time for metals and gems. It was like

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Speaker 4: the height of fashion.

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Speaker 5: I was wondering if that' say this sound familiar. I

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Speaker 5: was wondering, what do they make like the Queen's necklaces.

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Speaker 4: That now they have stores all over now called Marshals.

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Speaker 4: It's a discount clothing store in the next of course,

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Speaker 4: I'm not when am I serious? So he told these

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Speaker 4: jewelers all about his estates in England and Scotland and Ireland,

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Speaker 4: about his solicitors, lawyer mister Patterson, he handled all his

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Speaker 4: business for him. Oh and and he had so much

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Speaker 4: money he just didn't know what to do with it.

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Speaker 4: Maybe buy some jewelry. Oh maybe he should just go

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Speaker 4: ahead and start a tab at the jewelers, like it

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Speaker 4: only made sense, right guys, And they're like, yeah, sure,

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Speaker 4: right on. So he starts to peruse the goods and

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Speaker 4: he has this like super keen eye for the best stuff, like, oh,

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Speaker 4: excellent taste.

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Speaker 3: Soon.

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Speaker 4: One item he really loved was a small silver casket

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Speaker 4: made in Venice, Italy.

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Speaker 3: Casket for a body.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's the thing.

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Speaker 4: Okay. So I saw a casket. I'm like, I need

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Speaker 4: to do a little investigation here.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So it's Venice, Italy, not Venice, California. And it's not

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Speaker 4: a casket like rip, let's get you six feet under.

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Speaker 4: It's a casket in the sense of a small decorative box,

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Speaker 4: so not as big as a chest, but maybe slightly

347
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Speaker 4: bigger than a jewelry box.

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Speaker 3: Okay.

349
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Speaker 4: And so glen Cairn sees this silver one loves it,

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Speaker 4: has to have it as the jeweler. To have it

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Speaker 4: delivered to his hotel is like a very posh place

352
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Speaker 4: in town. And then he came by with Simpson a

353
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Speaker 4: few days later to rave about what an incredible shop

354
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Speaker 4: this was and the stuff. They're convinced he's the real deal.

355
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Speaker 4: As far as they're moving to a clergy, he's like, you,

356
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Speaker 4: I'll tell you, you tell the Lord. So from there

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Speaker 4: he's like, okay, bye, I got to go to London.

358
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Speaker 4: Off he goes, and there he starts talking to a

359
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Speaker 4: diamond dealer and he tells that guy, you know, Marshall

360
00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:35,399
Speaker 4: and Company up in Scotland, they can vouch for me.

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Speaker 3: He's like, hey, Jared, I got a friend in the diamond.

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00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,680
Speaker 4: Business for you, yes exactly, and then he says, well,

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Speaker 4: you know what, In fact, they'll vouch for me. I've

364
00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:47,280
Speaker 4: worked with them for several years. So the diamond dealer

365
00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:50,760
Speaker 4: writes a note to Marshall and Company and says, you

366
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Speaker 4: know this man that you've known for several years, is

367
00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:55,880
Speaker 4: he on the up and up the whole several years?

368
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,040
Speaker 4: Thing through Marshall and Company for a loop? And like

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Speaker 4: they just the guy, like why is he saying this?

370
00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:05,919
Speaker 4: So they sent one of their employees, this guy, mister Smith,

371
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Speaker 4: to London to look into the matter.

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Speaker 3: Mister Smith goes to London precisely.

373
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Speaker 4: So Smith goes to London heads to the lawyer Patterson.

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Speaker 4: Patterson was appalled that anyone would be asking anything about

375
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Speaker 4: the credibility of Lord glen Cairn, and he told Smith

376
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Speaker 4: to like shut his pretty mouth about it. That's a

377
00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:28,200
Speaker 4: direct quote. I was there, Like, don't you dare say

378
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,760
Speaker 4: anything against that man, he's one of my best clients.

379
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:34,600
Speaker 4: So Smith, he's not buying it. Patterson said that he'd

380
00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:37,639
Speaker 4: have Lord glen Cairn return the jewelry that had been

381
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,240
Speaker 4: fronted to him, and then he'd cut a check for

382
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:42,840
Speaker 4: the amount of anything that he had already been given away.

383
00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,560
Speaker 2: All right, Like what good is a check?

384
00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:48,040
Speaker 4: Smith says, well, if he doesn't pay it by March

385
00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:51,080
Speaker 4: twenty fifth, eighteen seventy, I'll cover the debt. I believe

386
00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:53,680
Speaker 4: in him that much. So what Smith wasn't aware of

387
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:55,840
Speaker 4: is that glen Cairn had gifted a lot of that

388
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,959
Speaker 4: jewelry to Patterson and his family, and Patterson had advanced

389
00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:03,960
Speaker 4: Glen Caaren like forty five thousand dollars basically the equivalent

390
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:05,240
Speaker 4: of a million dollars today.

391
00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:05,680
Speaker 3: Hot.

392
00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:10,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, So Patterson had given Glen Karen the last four

393
00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,879
Speaker 4: thousand of that chunk of cash, and then suddenly started

394
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,359
Speaker 4: to wonder, like, wait, was that about idea? Is this

395
00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:20,000
Speaker 4: a little hanky? So Glen Karen Gordon whatever his name is,

396
00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:23,080
Speaker 4: tells Patterson, thank you so much. I'm heading back up

397
00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:25,600
Speaker 4: to Scotland. I'm going to close out this account at

398
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:28,960
Speaker 4: Marshall and Company. Off I go Patterson thought about it

399
00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,280
Speaker 4: for a bit and was like, I'm going to send

400
00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:34,439
Speaker 4: someone up to Edinburgh and I have them ask around

401
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:37,960
Speaker 4: and see what's really going down. So they're constantly sending people.

402
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,879
Speaker 4: It should come as no surprise that Glen Karen Gordo

403
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:46,600
Speaker 4: big G wasn't in Edinburgh, he wasn't in Scotland, he

404
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 4: wasn't in the UK at all. Frankly, no one knew

405
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:51,440
Speaker 4: where he was. At this point, the victims of his

406
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 4: swindles start coming forward. People in London, people in Edinburgh

407
00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:57,240
Speaker 4: had to cop to the fact that they fell for

408
00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,440
Speaker 4: the old I'm about to come into money thing. One

409
00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:02,680
Speaker 4: jeweler believed him when he said he was a close

410
00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:06,439
Speaker 4: power of the Duke of Hamilton and the Marquis of Hastings.

411
00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:07,359
Speaker 3: The Duke of Earl.

412
00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:12,479
Speaker 4: Yes, and so much so that the guy's like, oh,

413
00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:16,560
Speaker 4: you know them, here's fifty thousand dollars credit line. And

414
00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:19,200
Speaker 4: then someone asked the nobleman in question, like, hey, do

415
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:20,560
Speaker 4: you know this guy? They're like, I don't know who

416
00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,080
Speaker 4: you're talking about. Get out of my face. And then

417
00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:25,240
Speaker 4: that was it. So let's take a break. When we

418
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,040
Speaker 4: come back, we're going to track down that pesky Gordon.

419
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:50,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, Zaren Zaren.

420
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,679
Speaker 4: When we last saw Lord Glen Cairn, he was conning

421
00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:57,880
Speaker 4: people in Scotland. Then he vanished.

422
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm picturing a young Ewan McGregor playing this part.

423
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 3: It's working for me.

424
00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:03,680
Speaker 4: Oh it's good. Let's run with it because take it.

425
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:10,280
Speaker 4: He surfaced fifteen months later in Minnesota. I did not

426
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:13,200
Speaker 4: expect that, I know, right, And he was no longer

427
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:17,600
Speaker 4: Lord glen Cairn. Now he was Lord Gordon.

428
00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:20,200
Speaker 3: Gordon. Okay, yeah, I'm still waiting for you to go.

429
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,520
Speaker 2: No, not really, that one for real.

430
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:27,160
Speaker 4: So his earliest documented Minnesota residence was in Saint Paul.

431
00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,240
Speaker 4: He stayed at this prominent hotel there, and then he

432
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:34,840
Speaker 4: moved into private accommodations. He quickly became a familiar figure

433
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:39,640
Speaker 4: in Saint Paul and Minneapolis society. He went to these receptions, dinners,

434
00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 4: legislative gatherings. He's just a man about town. He was

435
00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:46,680
Speaker 4: just as elegant and reserved as before, and like maybe

436
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 4: a little more reserved because this time he didn't come

437
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:53,159
Speaker 4: out and say that he had a title and money. Instead,

438
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:57,840
Speaker 4: he was discreet, so he would let it slip. He'd

439
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 4: like casually mentioned that he was the of the Great

440
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:06,879
Speaker 4: Earls of Gordon, cousin of the Campbell's collateral relative of

441
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:12,000
Speaker 4: Lord Byron, oh descendant of the bold locking Ver and

442
00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,120
Speaker 4: the ancient kings of the Highlands. Ah, you know those

443
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,119
Speaker 4: kind of oops. I can't believe I just said that.

444
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 4: I've said too much.

445
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:20,960
Speaker 3: You might people.

446
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 4: And he he had an income also he let slip

447
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:28,680
Speaker 4: of over a million dollars a year.

448
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:30,159
Speaker 3: That just slipped out.

449
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:32,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, oopsie, Oh did you see that? Did you see

450
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:38,280
Speaker 4: my bank book open? For all my fellow inflation calculator

451
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 4: officionados out there, that's twenty six and a half million

452
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:42,880
Speaker 4: dollars today.

453
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:44,919
Speaker 3: A year a year income.

454
00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:46,920
Speaker 4: I would very much like for that to be my

455
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 4: annual salary.

456
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 3: What would you do with that?

457
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:52,480
Speaker 4: I would live the basically the same life why you

458
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 4: needed that, But I wouldn't work, and I would just

459
00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 4: like I would outfit like my kitchen super nice, okay,

460
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 4: and I would I don't know.

461
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,480
Speaker 3: Like finally spread the slots.

462
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 4: Little upgrades for stuff here and there. Oh, little upgrades, okay,

463
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:11,879
Speaker 4: But that's basically it.

464
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,560
Speaker 3: I think you would actually run like a Brewster's million

465
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,399
Speaker 3: style charity where you're just giving out a million dollars.

466
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,400
Speaker 4: Would I probably would. I would be I would hand

467
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:26,919
Speaker 4: it out so fast that's okay, But I'd still like night,

468
00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 4: I'd still get a new kitchen anyway. So he's super

469
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,000
Speaker 4: casual about this though, right, and so casual. He goes

470
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,720
Speaker 4: to a bank in Minneapolis. He's like, I'd like to

471
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:42,440
Speaker 4: deposit forty thousand dollars please, And that's the cash that

472
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:43,679
Speaker 4: he got from Patterson.

473
00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 3: Yes, and remember that's like.

474
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:47,000
Speaker 2: A million dollars today.

475
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:50,159
Speaker 4: So cruise down to the bank, Navy, Federal, Zaren, go

476
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:50,600
Speaker 4: in there.

477
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:51,560
Speaker 3: Okay, here's a.

478
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:56,280
Speaker 4: People talk, Zaren.

479
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 7: I know that people talk.

480
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 4: Word got around about this Scott lord who was just

481
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:04,160
Speaker 4: flushed with cash. According to the Manitoba.

482
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 3: Trying to beat criminals is what he's like. No drafting,

483
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 3: you know, he's just gotta.

484
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 4: He's gotta scent.

485
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:10,120
Speaker 1: The Air.

486
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:16,520
Speaker 4: Manitoba Historical Society, they said, quote a lord in Minneapolis

487
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:21,159
Speaker 4: in eighteen seventy one with great resources, was obviously a

488
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 4: social lion, and was made a house guest of one

489
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,360
Speaker 4: citizen and take it to Minnetonka on an elaborate picnic

490
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 4: by another. Among much entertaining, the husbands were interested in

491
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,639
Speaker 4: business deals for their mutual advantage. He was courted and

492
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 4: banqueted and entertained in the best of style at private

493
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 4: and civic functions, and lavishly. It's reported that he spent

494
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 4: rather freely.

495
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 5: It's odd how when you have money people give you more. Yeah, right, No,

496
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 5: one like like, oh, we got these impoverished people.

497
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 3: Let's like lavish that. They're like, no, we found the

498
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:56,199
Speaker 3: richest guy we've ever met.

499
00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 8: We've given him all this stuff we had drobe and

500
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 8: everything else was Oh my goodness, Gordon, whatever brought you

501
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,639
Speaker 8: to the Land of ten thousand Lakes?

502
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 2: That is a good question, a very good question.

503
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,680
Speaker 4: I'm so glad that someone asked it. I don't want

504
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:15,680
Speaker 4: to disclose. I'm just here to report. He told folks

505
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 4: that he arrived from Scotland to do land deals. He

506
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 4: planned to invest a million dollars or more in the

507
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,800
Speaker 4: wild railroad lands o Lumber.

508
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 8: No.

509
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,159
Speaker 4: So here's how folks who met him described him, so

510
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 4: you can get a mental picture. Is he going to

511
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 4: remain you in McGregor we shall I don't know.

512
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 3: I'm curious.

513
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,880
Speaker 4: I think he will quote slender of build about five

514
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:40,400
Speaker 4: feet ten inches in height. So far as they're good

515
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:45,640
Speaker 4: and dressed with the greatest care, usually wearing gloves, patent leathers,

516
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,520
Speaker 4: and a silk hat. His hands were frequently manicured, and

517
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 4: his hair was brushed as smooth as curly hair could be.

518
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 4: He was clean shaven, except for two tufts of side

519
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 4: whiskers along glaise. He was exceedingly self poised, calm and

520
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 4: deliberate of speech, articulated with much precision, and posed with

521
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 4: an amount of ceremony seldom seen on the American continent. Additionally,

522
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:17,400
Speaker 4: he was calm and demeanor, poised, ceremonious, and spoke excellent

523
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 4: English with careful articulation. He was apparently a successful after

524
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 4: dinner speaker. Successful who who wants to hear me?

525
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 6: Go?

526
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 4: I'll just stand rock back and forth. He was fancy,

527
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 4: y'all wine glass. Everyone wanted to be around him. They

528
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 4: wanted to hear what he had to say after dinner

529
00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:46,879
Speaker 4: speaking voice. That's me and the dogs man, I'm like, okay,

530
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,400
Speaker 4: ding ding ding ding, They run they run far away.

531
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,159
Speaker 4: Everyone wanted to ask him questions, but he was cagy,

532
00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:56,240
Speaker 4: so if someone was like, hey, are you really a

533
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 4: large he said, it made little difference if he was

534
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 4: or he wasn't. A lord and in any case, he

535
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,399
Speaker 4: didn't want to talk about it, and like, that's how

536
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,399
Speaker 4: you get people to think you're a lord. In the

537
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 4: course of his Minnesota days, he met Colonel John S. Loomis,

538
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 4: and Loomis was a lumber tycoon from Chicago. He was

539
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 4: also the land commissioner for the Northern Pacific Railroad. Okay, yeah,

540
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 4: he has nothing to do with Loomis Fargo.

541
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 3: I was figuring different. Yes, it's different.

542
00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:27,360
Speaker 4: So Gordon told Loomis that he eventually wanted to buy

543
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,200
Speaker 4: hundreds of thousands of acres of railroad land in Minnesota.

544
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 4: He said he was going to ship in a bunch

545
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 4: of tenants from his quote overcrowded Scottish estates onto that land.

546
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 4: That's always some thing keep the feudalism going, you know.

547
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 4: So right then he said he was interested in getting

548
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 4: his hands on somewhere between like fifty to sixty thousand acres.

549
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 4: Here's the thing. The Northern Pacific Railroad wanted to expand

550
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 4: they wanted to go west. West Coast is the best

551
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 4: coast and all that they said it not me. West

552
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 4: Coast is the best coast. That was painted on the

553
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 4: side of all the trains they wanted to connect up

554
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 4: and eventually get that golden spike Son, which they did.

555
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 3: Oh that's what the continents I figured it was. Once again,

556
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:11,040
Speaker 3: I'm still going with logging.

557
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:12,719
Speaker 5: I'm like, they want to connect to Seattle to get

558
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 5: that stuff out of the body.

559
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 4: But they wanted to hold hands and West Coast is

560
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 4: the best coast and spike yeah baby. So in order

561
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 4: to stretch out, the railroad had to raise some money,

562
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 4: and they'd just begun construction at this point. The government

563
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 4: had granted them forty million acres and they'd been selling

564
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 4: that off to raise money already. If they could get

565
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 4: some goofy rich Scott to buy up a bunch more land,

566
00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 4: it would more than fund the projects. So Loomis told

567
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 4: the railroad big wigs about Gordon's plans, and they're like

568
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 4: drooling all over themselves, I mean, just puddles.

569
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 2: So they spared no.

570
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 4: Expense when whining and dining Gordon in order to get

571
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 4: their hands on what could be like millions and millions

572
00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:57,840
Speaker 4: of dollars for them.

573
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 3: This was the railroads were the AI of their day.

574
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 4: Yes, first the NFTs, then the AI. It takes money

575
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 4: to make money's errand I've heard this, so they put

576
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 4: Loomis in charge of rolling out the red carpet for

577
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 4: our guy here. He set up an all expense paid

578
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:17,240
Speaker 4: tour of the railroad lands in Minnesota and the Dakotas

579
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 4: for Gordon. Keep in mind these railroads weren't really built then.

580
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, so building the horseback what they're doing.

581
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 4: But they weren't rustic trips. The trips were posh. So

582
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 4: dinner service every night was attended by waiters in white

583
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 4: aprons and white silk gloves, with silver platters and fine china.

584
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 3: Like when they pull the wagon over.

585
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 4: They served all the finest, most gourmet items available, everything

586
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 4: fresh and exotic. As the New York Times put it,

587
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 4: quote from Woodcock to Buffalo.

588
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 3: That's just about to say, I bet you liked Woodcock.

589
00:30:53,080 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 4: Tropical fruits, an apple figure, it's the two thousand snacks.

590
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:05,600
Speaker 4: They also apparently had champagne three times a day. Okay,

591
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,240
Speaker 4: so you're just sitting on a horse glugging.

592
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 3: It, just like drink to night. I like to start

593
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:16,000
Speaker 3: with the brandy, Lord Gordon.

594
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 4: Gordon wasn't solo on this. He had his valet, the

595
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 4: Gentleman's Tiger, reporting for duty. Sir. Okay, so this guy

596
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 4: he would shave each morning, not himself, he was Gordon,

597
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 4: and get him Gordon dressed.

598
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:33,440
Speaker 3: You got to get the test to be sharp, exactly clean.

599
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 4: People were marveling at the fact that Gordon traveled with

600
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 4: fourteen different outfits, four fourteen for this like I'm going

601
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 4: to go into the back country. Yeahfferent color, so that

602
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 4: the valet would take dictation of the lord's correspondence, like

603
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 4: penning them out, sealing them with the official seal of

604
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 4: Gordon whatever that was in that situation, and he always

605
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 4: referred to Gordon is my lord. So there they are

606
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:06,120
Speaker 4: tripping about in luxury. Gordon would stop every so often

607
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,920
Speaker 4: at like potential sites to see if he should or

608
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 4: they would be good places for towns or schools or

609
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 4: what have you for this incoming Scottish band of indentured servants.

610
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 4: And he dramatically like think up and then select names

611
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 4: at each place.

612
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:24,600
Speaker 2: Really yeah.

613
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 4: A historian that W. A. Crawford wrote, quote, his lordship

614
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 4: saw the state thoroughly and inspected and selected vast areas

615
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 4: of arable land that would rejoice the soul of a highlander.

616
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 4: He also incidentally located and named several cities explaining that

617
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 4: it would be necessary to have churches and schools well

618
00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 4: organized before his colonists would flock thither in large numbers.

619
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 4: Sites for cities were selected, and the historic banner of

620
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 4: the Gordons of Scotland and the stars and stripes fluttered

621
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 4: side by side.

622
00:32:57,480 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 3: Oh so they that with flags and like this one

623
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 3: day will be Gordon Landia.

624
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 2: Whatever Gordon mcgordon face.

625
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 4: And so this went on for three months, wow, three months,

626
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 4: and it took a crew of twenty men to run

627
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,200
Speaker 4: this adventure. Yeah, thirty to forty horses. I say all

628
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:20,240
Speaker 4: the waiters, this is no joke, this is absolutely no joke.

629
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:24,160
Speaker 4: So all told, the railroad spent about forty five thousand

630
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:26,280
Speaker 4: dollars on the trip. If you'll remember, that's a million.

631
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 3: That's why my eyes did that.

632
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 4: And they came out and then I was like, what

633
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 4: catch them quick?

634
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 3: Quick?

635
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 4: Put them back in. The railroad figured though they were

636
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 4: going to see at least five million from Gordon.

637
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 3: This is like chump change, five million in their money.

638
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 4: In their money, which is like nine hundred trillions today.

639
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 4: So January eighteen seventy two, Gordon bid them farewell. He's

640
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 4: like waving holding a handkerchief. He told the railroad that

641
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 4: he had to head back east to get the money

642
00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 4: transfers going. He was eager to get the rail road

643
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 4: paid so he can enact his dream. And like all

644
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 4: the irritated Scott's and dump them in Minnesota. And the

645
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 4: railroad guys, they're stoked. They want to help in any

646
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 4: way they can, and they just want to get their

647
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:16,200
Speaker 4: grubby fingers. So they gave him letters of introduction to

648
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,520
Speaker 4: the cream of the crop of New York society.

649
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 3: How did they know the cream of the crop of

650
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:21,839
Speaker 3: New York society.

651
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 4: You know, like a lumber tycoon. So and he's like,

652
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:32,880
Speaker 4: my name is Louis, I'm fencing. You'll fence it to

653
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:38,840
Speaker 4: this guy's fancy. Let's be fency to get us. And

654
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 4: so now they just got to wait. It's just a

655
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 4: waiting game. And they wait and they wait. And I

656
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 4: know this is really hard to believe, but Lord Gordon

657
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 4: Gordon never went back to Minnesota. He was not feeling Minnesota.

658
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:59,839
Speaker 4: Plucked around there for a while. He he did tell

659
00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 4: the truth a little bit.

660
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 2: He did go to New York.

661
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:05,879
Speaker 4: He arrived in New York in early eighteen seventy two,

662
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 4: and you know what was happening.

663
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 3: Then eighteen seventy two an election.

664
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:13,040
Speaker 4: Something called the Eerie War.

665
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 3: Oh the Canal.

666
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, let me lay this out on you. So the

667
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 4: Erie War was a violent, highly publicized corporate and political

668
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,000
Speaker 4: battle that went on from eighteen sixty eight to eighteen

669
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,840
Speaker 4: seventy two. And it was all about control of the

670
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 4: Erie Railway that was one of the most important rail

671
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,879
Speaker 4: lines in the United States post Civil War.

672
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:34,880
Speaker 3: Okay, so it.

673
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:38,959
Speaker 4: Involved some of the era's most powerful financiers and politicians,

674
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 4: Jay Gould, James Fisk Junior, Daniel Drew and then indirectly

675
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 4: Cornelius Vanderbilt.

676
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,320
Speaker 3: And if I'm not mistaken, grant us grant.

677
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:54,600
Speaker 4: Yes he avoids mention here. Yes, yes, So it was

678
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:58,680
Speaker 4: one of the most infamous episodes of Gilded Age financial corruption.

679
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:01,400
Speaker 2: Oh, totally manipulation.

680
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 4: Bribery, forged securities, courtroom warfare, literal armed standoffs.

681
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, like so much crime on paper or paper work

682
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:11,960
Speaker 3: based crime he could manage.

683
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 4: So the Eerie Railway connected New York City to the

684
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,880
Speaker 4: Great Lakes and this was a major freight shipping like

685
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 4: Western expansion control of the Eastern transportation.

686
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 3: Yes, so much shipping back and forth.

687
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:28,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, whoever controlled this railroad would make huge amounts of

688
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 4: money and have incredible political power and influence because.

689
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,920
Speaker 5: I think like two thirds of the income in the

690
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:37,759
Speaker 5: United States went through the Port of New York, and

691
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:39,400
Speaker 5: this was a huge artery for.

692
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 4: The Port of exactly exactly, So people were obviously fighting

693
00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:46,399
Speaker 4: over this. And you know who was at the time

694
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 4: the director of the railroad who boss tweet of Tammany

695
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:51,239
Speaker 4: Hall Fame.

696
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 3: Yeah.

697
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:56,839
Speaker 4: Yeah. So when I say people fighting, I mean Cornelius Vanderbilt,

698
00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 4: the commodore. He already controlled New York Central Railroad. He

699
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:05,280
Speaker 4: wanted to absorb the Eerie and build a transportation monopoly.

700
00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:09,239
Speaker 4: Then there was Daniel Drew. He was a longtime Wall

701
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:13,560
Speaker 4: Street operator. He was treasurer of the Erie Railway, and

702
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,800
Speaker 4: he was also a master of stock watering, which is

703
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,320
Speaker 4: issuing new shares to manipulate prices.

704
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 3: Okay, so it's like what Zuckerberg did to his co founders,

705
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 3: right r.

706
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 2: Value.

707
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 4: Yeah. One of his initial allies was Jay Gould, and

708
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,400
Speaker 4: he was a rising financier and a brilliant strategist. He

709
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:36,319
Speaker 4: wound up partnering with James Fisk Junior aka Diamond Jim

710
00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 4: Oh Fisk was a showman political operator, and he handed

711
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,720
Speaker 4: out bribes like Candy Nice and then so together Goldfisk

712
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 4: and Drew became known as the Eerie Ring. In early

713
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 4: eighteen sixty eight, Vanderbilt began buying large quantities of Eerie

714
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:57,400
Speaker 4: stock to gain the majority control. So Drew, Fisk, and

715
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:00,960
Speaker 4: Gould came up with their counter attack, stockwall watering. They

716
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:05,240
Speaker 4: issued floods of new stock without authorization. Then they sold

717
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 4: that stock to Vanderbilt at inflated prices, and that became

718
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:13,359
Speaker 4: their bribe in money. So Vanderbilt spent millions buying stock

719
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:17,279
Speaker 4: that was like rapidly diluted out from under him. The

720
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 4: courts issued injunctions against gold, Fisk and Drew. In response,

721
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,279
Speaker 4: they fled to New Jersey with the corporate books.

722
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 3: Back then cross Lines kept Chaser, and then they.

723
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 4: Physically barricaded themselves in the Jersey City Erie offices. Vanderbilt's

724
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 4: men tried to seize control in New York with armed

725
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:40,279
Speaker 4: guards posted on both sides. This was the centerpiece of

726
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 4: what newspapers at the time called the Erie War. So

727
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 4: the Erie Ring they needed to strengthen their position, so

728
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 4: they bribed members of the New York State legislature, and

729
00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:53,440
Speaker 4: they also sponsored a bill to legalize their previously illegal

730
00:38:53,520 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 4: stock issuances, and they paid off influential political powerworkers. Will

731
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 4: not be surprised that the bill passed no, so the

732
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 4: fraudulent stock was retroactively legalized, stripping Vanderbilt of potential legal victory.

733
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 3: So we've always been like this.

734
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:14,120
Speaker 4: Basically, I read that it's exactly what I thought, like,

735
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:18,360
Speaker 4: there's nothing new under the sun. Vanderbilt ultimately like accepted.

736
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:23,200
Speaker 4: Here's another one, a financial settlement, a classic Gilded Age quote,

737
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 4: buy out of peace.

738
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 3: Okay, sounds familiar totally.

739
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 4: So after the victory against Vanderbilt, though, the eerie ring,

740
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 4: they start to fall apart.

741
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 3: They gotta be fighting each other.

742
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,040
Speaker 4: They need a common enemy, so they start turning on

743
00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:40,440
Speaker 4: each other. First, Gould manipulated stock to ruin Drew financially.

744
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 4: Drew loses his fortune.

745
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:43,400
Speaker 3: Ok.

746
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:48,240
Speaker 4: Fisk turns on Gould. Fisk and Gould start plotting against

747
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 4: each other. Gould temporarily lost control in eighteen seventy, regained

748
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,879
Speaker 4: it and then lost Fisk as an ally. But things

749
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 4: kept falling apart. There were investigations, lawsuits, all this like

750
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 4: political pressure. By eighteen seventy two, Gould was forced to

751
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,080
Speaker 4: resign from the Erie Railway, and under his management, the

752
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 4: Erie had become a symbol of absolute corruption. It was

753
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 4: financially unstable, it was plagued by fraudulent accounting. Yeah and

754
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 4: fortune correct, now here comes Lord Gordon Gordon. So, according

755
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:27,360
Speaker 4: to that Manitoba Historical Society quote, it is apparent that

756
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:29,920
Speaker 4: he spent some time looking over the situation.

757
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:31,480
Speaker 2: Whether the J.

758
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:35,279
Speaker 4: Gould Erie Railway development was a flash of inspiration or

759
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 4: a pre arranged scheme cannot be proved. Either Khan's illusion

760
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 4: could fit the method of Gordon. Gordon arrived in New

761
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 4: York at the height of a speculative boom and at

762
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,680
Speaker 4: the peak of the commercial and political corruption which followed

763
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 4: the Civil War. In the two months following his arrival,

764
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 4: he obviously gained much information about past operations from the

765
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 4: men with whom he was associating, so he got a

766
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 4: suite of rooms at the Metro Hotel. He used those

767
00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 4: letters of introduction from Colonel Loomis to meet Horace Greeley,

768
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,279
Speaker 4: then founder and editor of the New York Tribune, Go

769
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:14,840
Speaker 4: West Young mang Right. He became acquainted also with Horace F. Clark,

770
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:19,280
Speaker 4: the politician and railroad executive, so he's just collecting Horace's

771
00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:23,760
Speaker 4: everywhere he goes. Gordon told Greeley that he owned sixty

772
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:27,800
Speaker 4: thousand shares in the Erie Railway and quote, with this

773
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 4: and the holdings of his English friends, he intends to

774
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 4: control the next election for directors. So Greeley he's stoked. Right.

775
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 4: The idea that a group with their wits about them

776
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 4: come in and reform the railway was refreshing. Greeley wanted

777
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:44,200
Speaker 4: to make sure that Gordon met all.

778
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 3: The big players, so he takes him around like.

779
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:51,320
Speaker 4: He's the clergyman for him. So, according to writer Charles

780
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:55,200
Speaker 4: Lewis Shaw, quote, word of this imminent management shakeup quickly

781
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 4: spread throughout New York's business community and caused Gordon Gordon

782
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 4: to receive a frantic visit from Jay Gould on March second,

783
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:06,760
Speaker 4: eighteen seventy two. Let's stop here for a bit, okay,

784
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 4: and when we get back, we'll see what happens when

785
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 4: the con man meets the robber barons.

786
00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:34,279
Speaker 2: Zarin, we're back.

787
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 4: We're back, bite good ads, right, Oh the best, gimme some.

788
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:40,520
Speaker 3: I just kept throwing money at my ears.

789
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:42,759
Speaker 4: That's the only way to do it.

790
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:43,919
Speaker 3: Why bye, so bye.

791
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 4: Let's get back to this story. Jay Gould robber baron.

792
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:52,760
Speaker 3: Yes, he had been pro I love robbing robber barons,

793
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,240
Speaker 3: so I'm so screws turned.

794
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:58,560
Speaker 4: He'd been the president of the Eerie Railroad, but no more.

795
00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 4: After the Eerie War, his position had become fragile. He

796
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,560
Speaker 4: had power still as treasurer and the de facto controller

797
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 4: of the company, but then he had been ousted from

798
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 4: official control March of eighteen seventy two. So all these

799
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 4: new factions are fighting for dominance on the board. Newspapers

800
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 4: and political rivals are like attacking his credibility. Lord Gordon Gordon,

801
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 4: thanks to the introduction letters from Loomis met Horace Greeley.

802
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 4: Greeley connects him. Greeley's supporters thought that maybe Gordon could

803
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:36,440
Speaker 4: help raise funds for Greeley's eighteen seventy two presidential campaign.

804
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 4: That one did not go well, right, and so that introduction,

805
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:46,280
Speaker 4: though gave Gordon political credential. Goulds impressed, so Goulden Gordon.

806
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 4: They first met March second, eighteen seventy two, at the

807
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:53,239
Speaker 4: Erie Railway offices in New York. Gordon presented himself as

808
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:56,719
Speaker 4: acting on behalf of British shareholders. He said he was

809
00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 4: committed to supporting Gould's leadership and ironically opposed the eerie corruption.

810
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:08,520
Speaker 4: It's so easy to say, but also it's you know,

811
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,920
Speaker 4: it's like it's projection, it's you.

812
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 3: Know, yeah, of course I'm against. You are literally implement.

813
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 4: Every accusation is a confession. So he wanted to negotiate

814
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 4: a truce among the warring factions and Gould he's like

815
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:28,600
Speaker 4: accustomed to all these like elaborate financial maneuvers, but he

816
00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:32,800
Speaker 4: was really impressed by how fluent Gordon was and stuff

817
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:37,560
Speaker 4: like railroad governance and European investment practices and even eerie

818
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 4: shareholder distribution. I guess, yeah, he was well versed. He's

819
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:47,120
Speaker 4: a good con man, like he just tips, yeah, And

820
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:51,120
Speaker 4: I think he focused on obscure information to really hone

821
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,560
Speaker 4: in like and give the impression of this deep knowledge.

822
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:58,840
Speaker 4: So he also it seemed like he knew details about

823
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:02,840
Speaker 4: the eerie capitalization structure that weren't widely published.

824
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:04,600
Speaker 5: So it's not like what you would find in like

825
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:08,319
Speaker 5: essentially the business not business newspapers, but like the publications

826
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 5: of stockholding right, So.

827
00:45:10,239 --> 00:45:13,560
Speaker 4: Gould later said under oath that Gordon Gordon displayed quote

828
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:17,400
Speaker 4: a perfect knowledge of Eerie's shareholder politics. I mean like

829
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:22,840
Speaker 4: he almost certainly learned things from newspapers but also public filings.

830
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what I was wondering. But this seems like

831
00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:25,600
Speaker 3: he knows even more than.

832
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:28,959
Speaker 4: That, figured out how to get information out of people.

833
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:32,719
Speaker 3: He's also just a good researcher, charming fellow, a big

834
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:33,240
Speaker 3: time reader.

835
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:33,799
Speaker 2: Yeah.

836
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:36,680
Speaker 4: So Gordon said that he held power of attorney for

837
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:40,360
Speaker 4: a major block of Erie stock owned by English and

838
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:43,840
Speaker 4: Scottish investors, and he could deliver enough votes at the

839
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:49,040
Speaker 4: upcoming shareholder meeting to restore Gould. Right, he could also

840
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:52,720
Speaker 4: prevent the anti Gould faction from consolidating control.

841
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:54,440
Speaker 3: Okay, because the percentage you own.

842
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:58,320
Speaker 4: Sure this is entirely false. Of course, no part of

843
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 4: this is true so Britain, I mean the true part.

844
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 4: They did hold large amounts of American railroad stock, which

845
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:09,120
Speaker 4: made the claim plausible. And Gould he's just like politically isolated,

846
00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 4: He's hungry for allies.

847
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:19,040
Speaker 3: Andy's got charming believable, He's so believable, American susceptible to

848
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:20,960
Speaker 3: a charming bri accent.

849
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 4: He dressed and he spoke and behaved convincingly like a

850
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 4: Scottish aristocrat, and he had like financial authority, can.

851
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:29,920
Speaker 3: Put his elbows on the table.

852
00:46:32,440 --> 00:46:35,759
Speaker 4: The barn door was never down, zipper up. It would

853
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 4: come out later that there were several respectable New Yorkers

854
00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:41,920
Speaker 4: had already been taken in by him, like he was conning,

855
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:48,240
Speaker 4: like just doing little side gig cons so Gordon. Gordon

856
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:52,640
Speaker 4: told Gould that to persuade British shareholders to side with him,

857
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 4: he needed to demonstrate that Gould was trustworthy. So to

858
00:46:56,840 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 4: prove this up, he needed temporary cut study of eerie securities,

859
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,279
Speaker 4: you know, as like a good faith bond. But don't worry,

860
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:09,320
Speaker 4: these are going to be returned once the shareholder alignment

861
00:47:09,480 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 4: is secured. I just want to hold him real close

862
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:13,919
Speaker 4: and put him in my pocket and get them warm.

863
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:18,839
Speaker 4: Gould thought he was engaging in like a private political negotiation,

864
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:22,439
Speaker 4: not a criminal act. He believed Gordon. He was sure

865
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:25,839
Speaker 4: that the shares would serve only as like symbolic collateral

866
00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:31,440
Speaker 4: during these negotiations. So mid eighteen seventy two, Gould delivered

867
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:37,120
Speaker 4: to Gordon about a million dollars worth of negotiable eerie securities.

868
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:40,280
Speaker 4: Now remember a million, then twenty six point five mil today.

869
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:45,960
Speaker 4: Gould delivered these personally, He's like, here you go, Gordon, Gordon.

870
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:48,800
Speaker 4: He immediately starts selling them in New York and Chicago,

871
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:53,880
Speaker 4: selling these securities like hot sheeting of like, like, folks,

872
00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,400
Speaker 4: what we got here is some good old fashioned fraud.

873
00:47:57,080 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 4: When the securities began turning up on the market, brokers

874
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:04,840
Speaker 4: notified Eerie officials and Gould realized he'd been duped, so

875
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 4: he demanded their returne He confronts Gordon. Gordon's like, whoa,

876
00:48:10,360 --> 00:48:14,360
Speaker 4: I sold them to test the market. In fact, I

877
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:17,640
Speaker 4: need more securities to complete the deal. Come on, this

878
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 4: is this is how it.

879
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 3: Works, don't you know how high finance.

880
00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:23,279
Speaker 4: It's like big nope, no, no, no, We're not doing that.

881
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 4: So Gordon returned all the cash, but he only had

882
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 4: some of the shares he'd sold the rest. Gould calculated

883
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:33,600
Speaker 4: the missing shares as being worth about one hundred and

884
00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:37,240
Speaker 4: fifty thousand dollars, so he filed a formal criminal complaint

885
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 4: against Gordon in New York for fraud, larceny, and grand embezzlement.

886
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:45,919
Speaker 4: Oh it was grand Gordon. He gets arrested on April ninth,

887
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 4: eighteen seventy two, and in a surprising turn, Horace Clark

888
00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:55,840
Speaker 4: Horace paid Gordon's forty thousand dollars bond. Whoa, yeah, so

889
00:48:55,960 --> 00:49:02,040
Speaker 4: he's walking free, saying I didn't expect Yeah. So Gordon

890
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 4: gets brought before a police court like magistrates court in

891
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 4: New York City to answer the complaint. So it's like

892
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 4: a preliminary here. Yeah, it's not a formal trial. So

893
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:17,319
Speaker 4: Gould presented his accusations and witnesses described the transfer of securities.

894
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 4: Gordon responded with all He's like, I got well, see

895
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:23,759
Speaker 4: here's the thing. It's might a little complex. See for

896
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:27,680
Speaker 4: your tiny little brains, what had happened was But he says,

897
00:49:27,719 --> 00:49:29,759
Speaker 4: look I was acting in good faith and this was

898
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 4: all within an agreement. And his lawyers also argued that

899
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:36,440
Speaker 4: the dispute was civil not criminal. What are we doing

900
00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:38,759
Speaker 4: here in criminal court? This is civil matter.

901
00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:41,839
Speaker 3: I've been there. This is criminal here.

902
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:47,320
Speaker 4: May seventeenth, eighteen seventy two. Gordon Gordon. He spent the

903
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:51,520
Speaker 4: day being questioned and he denied everything. Gould's lawyer was

904
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 4: asking Gordon about his family, and this kind of caught

905
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 4: Gordon out. He gave the names and addresses of people

906
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 4: he said were his stepfather, sister, a brother in law,

907
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:04,240
Speaker 4: and an uncle. And then he said he wouldn't answer

908
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:07,759
Speaker 4: anything else about his family because it was irrelevant. Okay, Yeah,

909
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:11,080
Speaker 4: So the judge agreed and adjourned the court for the day,

910
00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:15,600
Speaker 4: and Gould's lawyers immediately sent cables to the American consulates

911
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:18,759
Speaker 4: in Paris, London, and Burne, asking them to look into

912
00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:22,279
Speaker 4: the names and the addresses. They checked and they responded,

913
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:25,320
Speaker 4: no one Gordon mentioned had ever lived at any of

914
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:26,160
Speaker 4: those addresses.

915
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:29,400
Speaker 3: How is he forgetting that a telegram goes across the

916
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 3: I don't know.

917
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:31,919
Speaker 4: But what is interesting is I did I didn't mention

918
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:34,920
Speaker 4: it earlier, but about like his life history, there was

919
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,880
Speaker 4: like a theory floated that he came you know, he

920
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:40,879
Speaker 4: had this like step stepdad and a sister in all

921
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:45,400
Speaker 4: and they were from the Isle of Jersey, and they

922
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,600
Speaker 4: were well to do because they were the heart the

923
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:54,400
Speaker 4: center of an international smuggling ring, but like the high level,

924
00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 4: like the capo, right, and so that was kind of

925
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 4: never it wasn't There wasn't enough to back it up,

926
00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:03,680
Speaker 4: but I thought it was interesting they named off the

927
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:08,320
Speaker 4: same you know, family members for that anyway, so no

928
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,560
Speaker 4: one knows Gordon at any of these places. So, but

929
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:15,680
Speaker 4: where's Gordon now? Where he's on the night train to Montreal.

930
00:51:18,120 --> 00:51:18,279
Speaker 9: Yeah.

931
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:23,000
Speaker 4: Gould then puts up a bounty twenty five thousand dollars

932
00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 4: for Gordon's arrest.

933
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 3: He's not hiring pinkertons, Like, what the hell?

934
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:26,000
Speaker 7: Bro.

935
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,800
Speaker 4: He also sent detectives to Europe to investigate Gordon's past.

936
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:31,960
Speaker 4: I pray those were pinkertons.

937
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:32,600
Speaker 6: Oh God.

938
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 4: The detectives found out about the whole Lord glen Cairn

939
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:39,479
Speaker 4: thing from the jewelers. When they were there, they showed

940
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:42,320
Speaker 4: photos of Gordon. They're like, oh, that's Lord glen Cairn.

941
00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:46,279
Speaker 4: He stole from us. What a Gordon care? He's hiding

942
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:49,560
Speaker 4: out in Canada. So the bail bondsman got wind of

943
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 4: this though about the Canada thing, and they sent a

944
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 4: dispatch to Minnesota. If they could get together a group

945
00:51:56,719 --> 00:51:59,960
Speaker 4: of bounty hunters to snatch Gordon and bring him back

946
00:52:00,160 --> 00:52:02,360
Speaker 4: across the border to face justice, they could make a

947
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:05,320
Speaker 4: pretty penny. Oh, Jay Gould would see to it. I

948
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:10,440
Speaker 4: bet Zarin, close your eyes. I want you to picture it.

949
00:52:17,480 --> 00:52:21,880
Speaker 4: It's the evening of July second, eighteen seventy three. You

950
00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:25,680
Speaker 4: are a merchant in Saint Paul, Minnesota. You got word

951
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 4: that a guy calling himself Lord Gordon. Gordon had skipped

952
00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:32,719
Speaker 4: bail in New York and was hiding out in Winnipeg, Manitoba.

953
00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:35,880
Speaker 4: You remember the guy he fleeced some railroad guys in

954
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:39,640
Speaker 4: Minnesota a while back. You were currently in a saloon

955
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:43,520
Speaker 4: in Fort Gary, Winnipeg. You and a couple of pals

956
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:45,719
Speaker 4: made the trek up from Saint Paul to get this

957
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,160
Speaker 4: Gordon character and take him back across the border. You

958
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:51,640
Speaker 4: talk to locals who told you about the Scott who

959
00:52:51,719 --> 00:52:54,239
Speaker 4: liked to drink here, and you matched him with the

960
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 4: photo the Minneapolis police had provided you with.

961
00:52:57,719 --> 00:52:58,319
Speaker 2: And that's how you.

962
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 4: Find yourself sitting next to Gordon, getting him incredibly drunk.

963
00:53:02,960 --> 00:53:06,720
Speaker 4: It's a lively crowd, lots of hooping and hollering. Gordon

964
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:09,160
Speaker 4: thinks you're matching him drink for drink with your wee

965
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:12,560
Speaker 4: DRAMs of whiskey, but in truth you've been slyly dumping

966
00:53:12,600 --> 00:53:15,200
Speaker 4: your drinks into a bucket next to your chair. One

967
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:17,600
Speaker 4: of the other guys in your party is nursing beers,

968
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 4: getting them down about a third and then jumping up

969
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:23,360
Speaker 4: to declare that he needs a refill. Gordon's too slosh

970
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,960
Speaker 4: to notice, his eyelids are getting heavy, and he's entering

971
00:53:27,040 --> 00:53:30,480
Speaker 4: the maudlin drunk portion of the evening. You chatted with

972
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:33,279
Speaker 4: the piano player earlier in the evening. You look over

973
00:53:33,320 --> 00:53:36,840
Speaker 4: at him and nod the signal. He begins a mournful

974
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:42,520
Speaker 4: rendition of the Bonnie Banks O La Polomen. Gordon lifts

975
00:53:42,560 --> 00:53:46,360
Speaker 4: his head toward the piano. Tears begin to rim his eyes.

976
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 4: He mouths the words to the first verse, and when

977
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:53,760
Speaker 4: the chorus begins, he belts out at full volume.

978
00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:58,520
Speaker 7: Oh you take the high road, and I'll take the

979
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 7: lo and I'll be in scarl Duffior, but me on

980
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:09,600
Speaker 7: Metrolaw will never meet again.

981
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:15,520
Speaker 2: On the body money Banks soul lock Loo Man.

982
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:22,239
Speaker 4: Fat tears fall from his face onto the scarred, lacquered tabletop.

983
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 4: You put your arm around him as you turn and

984
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 4: wink at the piano player. He nods back at you.

985
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:29,480
Speaker 4: You tell Gordon that maybe it's time to call it

986
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:31,839
Speaker 4: a knight. You and your pals will get him home.

987
00:54:31,960 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 4: Where are you staying? You ask? He mumbles the name

988
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,160
Speaker 4: of a hotel, and you and your posse all stand,

989
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:41,359
Speaker 4: bringing a limp Gordon with you. He continues to sing

990
00:54:41,520 --> 00:54:47,000
Speaker 4: Lochloman with boozy vigor, punctuating verses with comical hiccups. You

991
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 4: get him outside and load him into the back of

992
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:52,480
Speaker 4: a wagon. What you don't see is a telegraph man

993
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:55,920
Speaker 4: standing in the doorway of a post office. He's got

994
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 4: his eyes on you, his flaming red hair and bushy

995
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 4: beard glow in the moonlight, a tartan vest visible under

996
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:05,640
Speaker 4: his jacket. You toss a blanket over Gordon, and you

997
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:07,759
Speaker 4: and the posse hop in the front bench seat and

998
00:55:07,840 --> 00:55:11,040
Speaker 4: whip horses into action. You tear down the street and

999
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:14,560
Speaker 4: head south befoard the border. About fifty miles away is

1000
00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:18,920
Speaker 4: the Pambina border crossing. It's the port of Emerson. The

1001
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:22,000
Speaker 4: wagon is screaming along at full speed, dust flying up

1002
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:24,840
Speaker 4: behind the wheels in the darkness. The horse hooves and

1003
00:55:24,920 --> 00:55:28,040
Speaker 4: creak of wood the only sound while this is happening,

1004
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 4: and Scott, who runs the telegraph and Fort Garry, takes

1005
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:34,399
Speaker 4: the initiative to send a message to Pembina. He says,

1006
00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:37,320
Speaker 4: it looks like some Feenians have abducted a nobleman and

1007
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:40,120
Speaker 4: are headed for the States. Take action. He tells the

1008
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 4: custom house. There you can see the dim light of

1009
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:48,920
Speaker 4: the Pembina Customs building in the distance. Almost there. You're

1010
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 4: so close to a payday you can taste it. But

1011
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:53,759
Speaker 4: as you hit the rise right before the border, you

1012
00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:55,759
Speaker 4: have to pull back on the reins as tight as

1013
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:58,520
Speaker 4: you can and come to a screeching halt. In front

1014
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:02,680
Speaker 4: of you is a wall of men Canadian police, English troops,

1015
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:07,280
Speaker 4: guns up, aimed your way, your plans. Aaron has been flied.

1016
00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:12,440
Speaker 3: Damn right it has. Wow. So I was wondering if

1017
00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 3: the amount of Scots over in Canada would be a problem,

1018
00:56:15,400 --> 00:56:16,080
Speaker 3: A big problem.

1019
00:56:16,160 --> 00:56:16,359
Speaker 7: Yeah.

1020
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:17,880
Speaker 3: I was like, you know, that's the wrong place to

1021
00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:19,800
Speaker 3: go trying to grab a Scott, right.

1022
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:24,040
Speaker 4: So the kidnappers were sure that they were a few

1023
00:56:24,280 --> 00:56:27,400
Speaker 4: yards across the border in US territory.

1024
00:56:27,480 --> 00:56:28,080
Speaker 2: It didn't matter.

1025
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,720
Speaker 4: They all got arrested and thrown in jail. Gordon escaped

1026
00:56:30,719 --> 00:56:34,799
Speaker 4: into the night, Off he goes. This kicked off an

1027
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:40,319
Speaker 4: international set to so Canada. The US and Britain fought

1028
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:43,520
Speaker 4: over the legality of the pickup in the bar, the

1029
00:56:43,680 --> 00:56:46,799
Speaker 4: arrest of the posse, and like the court proceedings within

1030
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:51,560
Speaker 4: their respective authorities. The border and kings got tense, really

1031
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:53,560
Speaker 4: this was he could have kicked off like.

1032
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:57,120
Speaker 3: The Queen Victoria would think, I'm coming back from Canada.

1033
00:56:57,560 --> 00:57:04,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, like everybody grab your arms. So so things are

1034
00:57:04,600 --> 00:57:07,560
Speaker 4: so tense. A headline in the Saint Paul Pioneer of

1035
00:57:07,640 --> 00:57:11,920
Speaker 4: August first read quote our people should make ready, and

1036
00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:14,560
Speaker 4: then it went on to rant about the corrupt Canadian

1037
00:57:14,600 --> 00:57:17,760
Speaker 4: authorities harboring a criminal, and it went so far as

1038
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:21,160
Speaker 4: to take the side of the Fenian Brotherhood, the Irish

1039
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:24,440
Speaker 4: republican organization that was operating within the US with the

1040
00:57:24,520 --> 00:57:27,640
Speaker 4: aim of ending British rule in Canada in the spirit

1041
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:32,160
Speaker 4: of Finn McCool. So finally a solution was agreed upon.

1042
00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:36,640
Speaker 4: The kidnappers would serve there twenty four hours in jail

1043
00:57:36,680 --> 00:57:39,920
Speaker 4: and then be released. An arrest warrant would be issued

1044
00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:42,840
Speaker 4: by a Canadian court for Gordon's arrest in the matter

1045
00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:47,680
Speaker 4: of the Edinburgh Jewelry con and Gordon would be captured

1046
00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:52,000
Speaker 4: and extradited to the US, specifically to New York. Oh wow,

1047
00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:53,560
Speaker 4: so Gordon was located.

1048
00:57:53,560 --> 00:57:55,160
Speaker 3: I guess everyone gets their piece of the pie.

1049
00:57:55,240 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 4: Everyone gets their piece Gordon. They found him. He met

1050
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:00,480
Speaker 4: a very tragic end and I'm not going to tell

1051
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:02,760
Speaker 4: that part of the story. It's his life and his

1052
00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:03,920
Speaker 4: escapades that matters.

1053
00:58:04,040 --> 00:58:07,000
Speaker 2: Okay, asking a question, but.

1054
00:58:07,040 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 4: We now draw to a close the life and crimes

1055
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:10,600
Speaker 4: of Lord Gordon.

1056
00:58:10,680 --> 00:58:12,720
Speaker 3: Gordon. I'm just gonna pretend he was eating by wolverine.

1057
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 3: He just went out of the woods and cons right.

1058
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:20,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I tried to see if like was there.

1059
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:27,720
Speaker 4: Now there's no chance you know what and scene drop

1060
00:58:27,760 --> 00:58:32,080
Speaker 4: the curtains. What's your ridiculous takeaways?

1061
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:32,840
Speaker 2: Oh?

1062
00:58:33,160 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 3: Man, one, I guess like the just straight straight off

1063
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:43,080
Speaker 3: you and McGregor could probably still play the part.

1064
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:45,480
Speaker 5: But he really made a mistake not having this become

1065
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 5: a movie. I think you could have done a heck

1066
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:49,600
Speaker 5: of a job. But he was like, I like doing

1067
00:58:49,680 --> 00:58:50,280
Speaker 5: period pieces.

1068
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:51,120
Speaker 4: You could do it now.

1069
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:52,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I think he could think he could

1070
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:55,120
Speaker 5: play young enough to make it reasonable and whatever.

1071
00:58:55,280 --> 00:58:57,360
Speaker 3: He could see g I D agent or whatever.

1072
00:58:57,440 --> 00:58:59,960
Speaker 5: I don't know, but like he could do the charm

1073
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:02,240
Speaker 5: part in the smart part, and they're like, oh, I'm

1074
00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:04,400
Speaker 5: also like able to go to Minnesota and being the

1075
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:07,320
Speaker 5: rustic you know, like pretend I'm on a motorcycle, you know,

1076
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,520
Speaker 5: like you get the idea. But uh, more than that

1077
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:15,480
Speaker 5: is I loved all the nuances of the northern latitudes

1078
00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:20,320
Speaker 5: of America, the Canadian border, the Scottish English, like the

1079
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:22,520
Speaker 5: fact that, like, you know, there's so many Scots in Canada,

1080
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:24,480
Speaker 5: and that the English law is still the law of

1081
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:28,280
Speaker 5: the land, all of that because we don't normally talk

1082
00:59:28,320 --> 00:59:31,120
Speaker 5: about that here in America. We're not too we forget

1083
00:59:31,160 --> 00:59:33,800
Speaker 5: all of our past involvements with one Canada, the UK

1084
00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:37,920
Speaker 5: Scotland in particular, And I thought that his story is

1085
00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:40,400
Speaker 5: nice bringing it back around, like of like, oh yes,

1086
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 5: and I want to know is how much the people

1087
00:59:44,360 --> 00:59:48,400
Speaker 5: in Scotland mostly and then also the English were tickled

1088
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:51,640
Speaker 5: by him basically mugging the robber barons who think they're

1089
00:59:51,680 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 5: on their high horse at this time, or if if

1090
00:59:54,800 --> 00:59:58,000
Speaker 5: that's what it was even part of it, now, what

1091
00:59:58,040 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 5: would your ridiculous take away, Elizabeth?

1092
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:05,240
Speaker 4: I just love that it's Gordon Gordon. My takeaway is

1093
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:09,200
Speaker 4: that you know these cons all we see so many

1094
01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:13,800
Speaker 4: repetitive elements of them, and I'm just charmed by the

1095
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:18,120
Speaker 4: weird little details so that the I could see in

1096
01:00:18,200 --> 01:00:21,840
Speaker 4: the end game the purpose of the Minnesota trip. But

1097
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:24,760
Speaker 4: it's hilarious of like You're gonna go to Minnesota and

1098
01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 4: make them drive you around on horseback for three months,

1099
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:30,080
Speaker 4: like that's a that's a long con.

1100
01:00:30,520 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, but go out to see the country.

1101
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:34,960
Speaker 4: Life.

1102
01:00:35,080 --> 01:00:35,880
Speaker 3: I mean he's got.

1103
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:37,720
Speaker 2: Nothing anywhere exactly.

1104
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:41,720
Speaker 4: There's all these letters that like yeah.

1105
01:00:42,360 --> 01:00:43,920
Speaker 3: And also the memories Elizabeth.

1106
01:00:44,080 --> 01:00:46,640
Speaker 4: But I'm just curious, how did he think the eerie

1107
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:48,440
Speaker 4: railway thing would resolve itself?

1108
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:50,560
Speaker 5: Because, like, I think he was planning on going over

1109
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:52,800
Speaker 5: the border and getting away and then catching a boat

1110
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:54,240
Speaker 5: up to Saint Lawrence and going back to St.

1111
01:00:54,640 --> 01:00:54,920
Speaker 2: He went.

1112
01:00:55,080 --> 01:00:56,520
Speaker 4: He went up with the big dogs.

1113
01:00:56,280 --> 01:00:56,720
Speaker 6: On that one.

1114
01:00:56,920 --> 01:00:57,240
Speaker 4: Why not.

1115
01:00:57,600 --> 01:00:59,040
Speaker 3: He's been working his way up the ladder.

1116
01:00:59,080 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 4: It's true.

1117
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:02,919
Speaker 6: I would like a talk back.

1118
01:01:07,240 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 3: Oh my god, did.

1119
01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:12,640
Speaker 6: I let cheat?

1120
01:01:17,560 --> 01:01:20,680
Speaker 9: Hi? I just wanted to share a ridiculous dream that

1121
01:01:20,800 --> 01:01:25,040
Speaker 9: I had the other night with Elizabeth and Zarn doing

1122
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:30,080
Speaker 9: a live podcast episode, and you guys were just so funny,

1123
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:33,720
Speaker 9: and I was laughing so so hard in the dream

1124
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:36,880
Speaker 9: that I guess I ended up laughing in real life

1125
01:01:37,560 --> 01:01:41,280
Speaker 9: so hard that I was shaking the bed and woke

1126
01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:44,400
Speaker 9: my husband up and really freaks him out because I

1127
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:45,440
Speaker 9: was just shaking.

1128
01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 3: It that hard.

1129
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:47,720
Speaker 7: I love it.

1130
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:51,640
Speaker 4: I love it that you're a fellow laugh in your

1131
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:55,120
Speaker 4: sleeper because I laugh in my sleep and it's creepy apparently,

1132
01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:58,360
Speaker 4: but sometimes i'll laugh so hard I wake myself up

1133
01:01:58,520 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 4: and then I try to remember what was so funny,

1134
01:02:00,760 --> 01:02:02,920
Speaker 4: and I have a hard time remembering it. But what

1135
01:02:03,080 --> 01:02:04,240
Speaker 4: a way to sleep, right.

1136
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:07,240
Speaker 3: Dude, I love That's like one of your dreams, you know.

1137
01:02:07,280 --> 01:02:10,080
Speaker 3: Whe's just like, it's so ridiculous one you laugh out

1138
01:02:10,120 --> 01:02:12,960
Speaker 3: loud in real life, but also you're like, Okay, so

1139
01:02:13,040 --> 01:02:14,760
Speaker 3: there's this podcast I listened to and I'm at a

1140
01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:17,720
Speaker 3: live taping and it's so funny I'm laughing. Of course,

1141
01:02:17,720 --> 01:02:20,440
Speaker 3: yours would involve, like, you know, a talking celebrity that

1142
01:02:20,600 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 3: no one can remember and an animal that is on

1143
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:24,000
Speaker 3: their shoulder who's also talking.

1144
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:26,320
Speaker 2: That is true, but I like that.

1145
01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:30,080
Speaker 4: You know what, Let's celebrate dreams full of laughing. Oh yeah,

1146
01:02:30,480 --> 01:02:35,400
Speaker 4: you know, instead of sleep paralysis or no sleep at all. Anyway,

1147
01:02:36,080 --> 01:02:38,120
Speaker 4: that's it for today. You can find us online at

1148
01:02:38,200 --> 01:02:41,600
Speaker 4: ridiculous Crime dot com. We're also at Ridiculous Crime on

1149
01:02:41,720 --> 01:02:45,560
Speaker 4: both Blue Sky and Instagram. We're on YouTube at Ridiculous

1150
01:02:45,640 --> 01:02:49,160
Speaker 4: Crime Pod. Email Ridiculous Crime at gmail dot com, and

1151
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:52,280
Speaker 4: please please please leave a talkback on the free iHeart

1152
01:02:52,400 --> 01:03:00,880
Speaker 4: app reach Out. Ridiculous Crime is hosted by Elizabeth Dutton

1153
01:03:00,920 --> 01:03:04,440
Speaker 4: and Zaren Burnett, produced and edited by Lord Dave Dave Cousten,

1154
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:08,600
Speaker 4: starring Annale Rutger as Judith. Research is by Monarch of

1155
01:03:08,640 --> 01:03:12,160
Speaker 4: the Glenn Marissa Brown and Laird of the Realm Jabbari Davis.

1156
01:03:12,560 --> 01:03:15,320
Speaker 4: The theme song is by Feenian up starts Thomas Lee

1157
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:18,880
Speaker 4: and Travis Dutton. Post wardrobe is provided by Botany five hundred.

1158
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:23,640
Speaker 4: Guest heron makeup by Sparkleshot and mister Andre. Executive producers

1159
01:03:23,640 --> 01:03:28,080
Speaker 4: are Railroad Baron, Ben Bollen and Tammany Hall, Groupie, Noel Brown.

1160
01:03:33,400 --> 01:03:38,720
Speaker 6: Dick QUI Say It One More Time CUI.

1161
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:43,200
Speaker 1: Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio four More Podcasts

1162
01:03:43,320 --> 01:03:46,480
Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

1163
01:03:46,520 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.