WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: The Missing Postman of Stradbally 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:02.680 This episode of Thinking Sideways is not brought to you 0:00:02.720 --> 0:00:07.120 by Porcupines, who are also blue artists. Instead, it's brought 0:00:07.160 --> 0:00:09.960 to you by Pitney Bows. No matter what your small 0:00:10.000 --> 0:00:14.720 office needs or sends, Pitney Bows send pros C two hundred. 0:00:14.760 --> 0:00:17.560 Has you covered the C two hundred lets you send 0:00:17.600 --> 0:00:21.000 mail and packages right from your desk, Plus save three 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:25.480 cents a letter and up to the off retail shipping rates. 0:00:25.880 --> 0:00:28.880 Start saving today and get a free sixty day trial 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:33.120 of a Pitney Bows C two hundred. Visit them online 0:00:33.280 --> 0:00:38.720 at PB dot com slash sideways. That's p B as 0:00:38.760 --> 0:00:41.319 in peanut butter. I guess it wouldn't be peanut butter, 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:42.960 be more like Pitney Bows, but you got the point. 0:00:43.120 --> 0:01:00.440 PB dot com slash sideways terms apply Sea side for details. 0:01:08.160 --> 0:01:11.240 Hey guys, welcome to another episode of Thinking Sideways the 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:17.119 podcast I Am Devin, joined as always by Steve and 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:22.920 Joe the Boys. Today we're gonna talk about God. Today 0:01:22.959 --> 0:01:27.440 we're going to talk about a mystery. Yes, it's actually 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:33.640 a mysterious disappearance that happened on Christmas Day. The disappearance 0:01:33.720 --> 0:01:37.200 was of a postman in Ireland was, by the way, 0:01:37.200 --> 0:01:39.839 a big deal in Ireland still actually is a little 0:01:39.880 --> 0:01:43.800 bit of Yeah. I saw actually an article from two 0:01:43.840 --> 0:01:46.520 thousand twelve they were gonna like go search for him 0:01:46.600 --> 0:01:49.480 yet again. Yeah, yeah, I still haven't found him them. 0:01:50.480 --> 0:01:54.440 This episode was actually suggested by a number of people. Kira, 0:01:54.720 --> 0:01:58.320 also Mary and Kilkenny and David were the three names 0:01:58.360 --> 0:02:00.280 that we actually bothered to write down before where we 0:02:00.280 --> 0:02:06.280 started just saying yeah, it's on the list. Yeah, I 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:08.800 feel like three of a good number. Listen, We're better 0:02:08.840 --> 0:02:10.840 than we were at one time when we were so 0:02:10.919 --> 0:02:13.080 overwhelmed with emails that I would go into the list 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:15.400 and I would find the date and the method of 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:18.000 the suggestion in the story name and links and not 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:22.480 who had suggested it, because somehow we forgot. Yeah, yeah, 0:02:22.520 --> 0:02:25.959 it's not so much of a mess anymore, I don't forget. 0:02:26.120 --> 0:02:29.240 I checked. So let's start with our postman, shall we. Yeah, 0:02:29.280 --> 0:02:35.600 the missing Postman is No, that's the wrong postman. That 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:38.920 was z post but not the missing I literally just 0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:40.600 didn't even know what you were talking about for a minute. 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:45.200 Once I referenced you, crap, Well, it's just the old 0:02:45.240 --> 0:02:51.560 and awful anyway. Our postman's name was Larry Griffin. He 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:56.680 was born in Waterford, Ireland in eighteen eighty. He served 0:02:56.680 --> 0:03:00.200 with the British Army from eighteen to nineteen o seven, 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:04.359 and he spent most of his first army stint in India. 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:09.680 And then he was discharged and married a woman named 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:13.920 Mary makes sounds Mary Mary ye. And then when World 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:17.600 War One started he re enlisted. A lot of people 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:20.360 did as a lot of people did. He was honorably 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:24.600 discharged in June of nineteen sixteen, having suffered some pretty 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:28.720 bad injuries. His arm was damaged. Whatever that maybe a 0:03:28.720 --> 0:03:32.040 little damage. It sounds like he had use of it. Really, yeah. 0:03:32.320 --> 0:03:36.080 I suspect it was, you know, lack of I think 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:39.080 it was a loss of motion, range of would suspect 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:42.240 something like that. I think something blew up beside him 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:45.440 because his arm was damaged. Part of his ear and 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:47.560 many of his teeth from one side of his face 0:03:47.600 --> 0:03:50.240 were missing. Some kind of ordinance probably went off near him. 0:03:50.400 --> 0:03:54.040 Suspect pictures of them, and maybe these were taken before 0:03:54.080 --> 0:03:57.120 the war. I don't know, but he looks he looks okay. No, 0:03:57.280 --> 0:03:59.880 I think it was. I think it was mostly I 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:03.120 think it was. That was the major reason. They don't 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:05.640 care if your ear looks ugly, and if your teeth 0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:07.320 are all messed I think they do care if you 0:04:07.320 --> 0:04:10.680 can hear out of but if you messed up looking yeah, 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:12.720 but still functional, they don't care. But I think that 0:04:12.800 --> 0:04:16.919 the probably limited arms was the issue nextually by World 0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:19.200 War One standards, he got off pretty light. He did 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:21.960 he really light, and he actually was given some awards 0:04:22.000 --> 0:04:26.359 in nineteen eighteen for his bravery. So whatever happened, it 0:04:26.440 --> 0:04:29.040 was a brave act. I took out He took out 0:04:29.040 --> 0:04:32.640 a German machine gun nest just with one hand. Yeah, yeah, 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:35.800 he just threw his arm, just kidding, using rocks. Yeah. 0:04:35.960 --> 0:04:38.440 After his discharge, he got a job as a postman, 0:04:38.920 --> 0:04:44.080 moving to kill mc thomas with his wife and three 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:47.200 of his children. He had additional children. Actually don't know 0:04:47.240 --> 0:04:51.080 how many children total he had. I think it was 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:55.680 four too, but it's kind of just this. Nobody really 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:59.240 cares apparently, but one of his children was working I 0:04:59.279 --> 0:05:04.760 believe in England, and then the other three lived with 0:05:04.839 --> 0:05:07.240 them in um what we're now going to call kill 0:05:07.320 --> 0:05:10.640 Mac for the rest of the episode. Actually that's actually 0:05:10.680 --> 0:05:12.760 the abbreviation. That's what all people call. Yeah, I mean, 0:05:12.760 --> 0:05:14.479 if you lived in that town, would you pronounce the 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:18.279 entire freedom name every time they call it. Kill Mac. Yeah, 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:24.479 in those days, for God's sakes. So in those days, 0:05:24.720 --> 0:05:28.359 it was apparently customary for postmen to deliver mail on 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:32.560 Christmas Day, though often they were given great hospitality for 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:35.720 doing their job. On that day. They would have been 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:39.760 offered meals and drinks at pretty much every house they 0:05:39.800 --> 0:05:42.960 called on. There was some discussion about whether or not 0:05:43.000 --> 0:05:45.880 it was actually postman would call for tips, but I 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:49.160 believe it was hospitality that they received. But people like 0:05:49.400 --> 0:05:54.040 rubbish men and other things that collected we would expect 0:05:54.040 --> 0:05:57.479 tips on Christmas Day, which I think is actually even 0:05:57.640 --> 0:06:00.360 here in America today, tipped their tip the amen in 0:06:00.400 --> 0:06:05.240 the holidays. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, present cookies and stuff 0:06:05.279 --> 0:06:09.480 like that. Yeah, Larry, it is reported had at least 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:12.920 two different dinners on Christmas night at two separate houses, 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:15.839 and a lot of drinks. So I want to point 0:06:15.880 --> 0:06:18.960 out the number of meals that this guy has had 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:24.000 because to me, it his state later on as it's 0:06:24.040 --> 0:06:28.560 described is a bit confusing. It depends on who you ask, well, actually, 0:06:30.480 --> 0:06:33.400 but for the amount that he has eaten, I it 0:06:33.520 --> 0:06:38.520 makes me always question his state of inebriation. Well, I mean, 0:06:38.560 --> 0:06:40.520 I think you can get drunk even if you've had 0:06:40.560 --> 0:06:43.360 a ton of food. I suspect that he was also 0:06:43.440 --> 0:06:46.640 drinking while he was eating. It wasn't just sitting down 0:06:46.720 --> 0:06:48.840 to a meal, you know, I get that. My point 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:52.240 is he wasn't on an mp stomach just knocking back shot. 0:06:52.400 --> 0:06:54.640 So that's why, absolutely, I just wanted, as I always do, 0:06:54.720 --> 0:06:56.160 I just want to throw that out there so people 0:06:56.240 --> 0:06:58.760 keep that in mind. I think that might maybe that 0:06:58.920 --> 0:07:01.960 the people of Strade Valley probably after this just chipped 0:07:02.000 --> 0:07:04.760 in and got the postman a bottle for Christmas, probably 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:07.040 get to send it home with him. So actually, so 0:07:07.120 --> 0:07:09.040 actually that brings up a good point. Let's let's talk 0:07:09.040 --> 0:07:11.600 about this a little bit. We Larry lived in kill 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:15.840 Mac but his postman route was actually in Stradberry Root 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:19.280 postal Root. What did I say, postman? I think it 0:07:19.320 --> 0:07:22.520 was actually and he has stops in between also, but 0:07:22.680 --> 0:07:26.640 I think but it was all in the Stradbally area. Yeah, 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:30.840 and and and so his house was about six miles 0:07:30.880 --> 0:07:34.840 or ten kilometers away. It was eight miles. Uh strad 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:40.520 Valley is eight miles away from kill Mack. And so 0:07:40.840 --> 0:07:45.440 they bicycle it's so bad. I mean, you can walk 0:07:45.520 --> 0:07:48.960 a walk a mile in twenty minutes. It all depends 0:07:48.960 --> 0:07:51.280 on whether it's like level or uphill. That kind of 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:54.960 thing is pretty level anyway, it doesn't really matter that much. 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:57.640 What we know about Larry and what he did on 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:00.280 that day is Christmas Morning. He got it up and 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:04.440 went to Christmas Mass like most Catholics do. Then he 0:08:05.840 --> 0:08:08.640 delivered a few gifts to local families and kids that 0:08:08.680 --> 0:08:10.920 I think that his family was friends with, and then 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:13.640 around noon he put on his uniform, got on his 0:08:13.680 --> 0:08:16.960 standard issue bike and took off for strad Valley. He 0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:21.000 would have been expected back around seven pm, maybe a 0:08:21.040 --> 0:08:25.720 little later, depending on what happened, well, depending on the 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:28.800 nature of the evening, you know, drinking and eating and 0:08:28.800 --> 0:08:31.760 stuff like that. However, that night it started to snow. 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:36.600 So when Mary, his aforementioned wife, saw that he just 0:08:37.240 --> 0:08:41.360 wasn't home and it was snowing, and she just kind 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:43.720 of thought, well, he probably just stayed over in Strade 0:08:43.800 --> 0:08:47.600 Valley because it's hard to ride a bicycle, and he 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:51.400 had probably and she knew he had probably been drinking, 0:08:51.520 --> 0:08:54.200 and he probably just said, you know, it's safer for 0:08:54.240 --> 0:08:57.160 me to just stay here than to make the trek back. 0:08:57.240 --> 0:09:01.800 That's a logical thing to do, of course. Yeah, and 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:04.600 you know this is pre cell phone, so it's not 0:09:04.640 --> 0:09:06.280 as though he could have just picked up a phone 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:09.320 and called her. She actually, yeah, probably didn't even have 0:09:09.320 --> 0:09:10.960 a phone in the house, and if it did, it 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:13.760 was a party line and whatever. Anyway, she probably just 0:09:13.800 --> 0:09:16.320 said whatever, he'll be home tomorrow morning. After this all 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:21.040 blows over the next morning. However, at about seven o'clock, 0:09:21.120 --> 0:09:23.920 I think it was a local, a man local to 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:29.200 Strade Valley. I don't know. Maybe he was walking on 0:09:29.320 --> 0:09:32.840 the road between Strade Valley and Killmack and found a 0:09:32.880 --> 0:09:37.040 postman's bike laid carefully a few feet off the road. Larry, 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:40.760 can I ask what does the description? Because I've never 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:43.679 I've always just seen laid careful that is the description. 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:46.559 What do you think that means? I think it means 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:51.120 not haphazardly tossed and doesn't look like somebody had just 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:55.880 fallen off of it, that they had been it. Maybe 0:09:55.880 --> 0:09:58.080 they had been walking it and carefully laid it over 0:09:58.120 --> 0:10:02.559 on side, because it didn't a kickstand. Again, I never 0:10:02.559 --> 0:10:05.600 found a good description, so I was curious. I'm just 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:08.000 making an assumption. And you know, the thing is is 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.120 I would assume, given that it was a postman's bike, 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:13.120 I would have assumed that it would have a kickstand 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:17.200 on it. But you know, they clearly didn't use it 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:18.960 for this. You know, I don't know when the kickstand 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:21.880 was invented. I know I don't either. This is this 0:10:22.040 --> 0:10:24.520 actually kind of the kickstand was invented pretty early on 0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:27.640 when they had those stupid bicycles with the giant front 0:10:27.720 --> 0:10:30.760 and rear wheels, and the only way that Parkham was 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:33.200 to stand him. You just had a servant run behind you. 0:10:34.200 --> 0:10:37.360 That's actually, but it's actually I kind of wonder if 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:39.560 it stopped snowing early on in the snow turned to rain, 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:43.000 if maybe, because I mean, otherwise you'd see tracks and 0:10:43.040 --> 0:10:45.160 stuff like that, like the tracks, you know, if somebody 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:47.160 rode the back up or walked the bike up and 0:10:47.160 --> 0:10:49.440 then laid it down there, walked away and kept on 0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:51.760 going towards killing back, or walked back. I have I 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:54.080 have no idea. There's no mention of any kind of 0:10:54.120 --> 0:10:56.560 tracks or anything like that, so I assume it must 0:10:56.760 --> 0:11:02.960 just stopped snowing. Must have anyway, Larry, Larry was nowhere 0:11:03.040 --> 0:11:06.520 to be found and remains so to this day. The 0:11:06.600 --> 0:11:10.840 local man is unnamed, but he reported the bike to 0:11:11.040 --> 0:11:16.160 the police in Strade Valley, not in Killmack. I'm not again, 0:11:16.200 --> 0:11:19.560 I'm not. It's all local police, is how it's always named. 0:11:19.720 --> 0:11:23.680 And I know that the police department that did the 0:11:23.679 --> 0:11:26.400 most of the investigation was based in Strade Valley and 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:28.520 I don't know if they also served kill mac and 0:11:28.640 --> 0:11:32.160 other regions. But yeah, but we're going to call police 0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:37.319 officers because it's easier. But so they were the first 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:41.560 people to receive this report that the bike and Larry, 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:45.440 it's my understanding, was kind of the only postman that 0:11:45.559 --> 0:11:48.680 served that area, so they just thought, well, it's probably 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:51.040 Larry's bike. I don't know if it had a name 0:11:51.080 --> 0:11:54.120 on it or something like that. It's possible it probably 0:11:54.120 --> 0:11:56.560 actually had some kind of number on it because it's 0:11:56.559 --> 0:12:00.240 a postal issue. It's post office bike. Yeah, it's kind 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:03.000 of like I would imagine it's got something identifying it 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:06.080 as opposed to like, well it had his bags and 0:12:06.520 --> 0:12:09.880 the somewhere on it, almost like a license plate, kind 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:12.839 of not necessarily a license plate, but something they identified. 0:12:12.960 --> 0:12:16.640 I think in those days that wasn't a relaxed about 0:12:16.640 --> 0:12:21.160 that stuff Ireland back. But either way, it doesn't really matter. 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:23.800 That they probably had his name like scratched into, you know, 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:27.079 into a nail bag or something. I don't know. Well, 0:12:27.120 --> 0:12:30.320 so the police decided, while we're going to do a search. 0:12:30.720 --> 0:12:34.840 I have seen reports that there were police and postmen 0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:38.840 and a bunch of local farmers civilians, like they're like 0:12:38.880 --> 0:12:42.000 almost a hundred people or more. We're looking for Larry 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:45.559 that day, on the day after Christmas Day, which in 0:12:45.600 --> 0:12:49.319 Ireland is St. St. Stephen's Day, my favorite day because 0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:56.120 it's my day. State on that day, some other Steve. Yeah, 0:12:56.520 --> 0:12:59.640 not a state, you know what, I'm in a state 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:07.559 on that day, which yeah, apparently so between strad Valley 0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:13.520 and kill Mack is mostly marshlands, big bogs. If you've 0:13:13.559 --> 0:13:17.680 listened to our for instance, Tunguska episode, you know those 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:23.360 bogs can be quite deep often. They started the people 0:13:23.520 --> 0:13:25.680 initially kind of thought that maybe in his drunken state, 0:13:25.720 --> 0:13:28.880 he had accidentally fallen in, so they started looking in 0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:31.959 that area, but they there was no trace of him 0:13:32.000 --> 0:13:34.959 at all anywhere. When they couldn't find Larry on they 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:40.120 the investigators, the police department there decided that maybe they 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:43.400 should report this to their higher ups. So they did. 0:13:43.760 --> 0:13:49.319 They called Chief Superintendent Harry O'Mara to let him know 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:53.920 that Larry had gone missing from He was based out 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.280 of Waterford, which I guess would have been the local 0:13:57.000 --> 0:14:01.360 head brass office, county seat or something like that. It 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:06.080 was Waterford County. His first act was to travel to 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:09.800 strad Boy to question the police who had been investigating. 0:14:10.080 --> 0:14:16.319 And there they were named officers Delay, Frawley, Murphy, and Sullivan. 0:14:16.840 --> 0:14:20.000 They are the main named police officers. They might have 0:14:20.000 --> 0:14:23.160 actually been the that is the entire bunch of Irish 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:26.720 names right there. I think. Actually they were the only 0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:31.040 police officers in that area at the time, and they 0:14:31.040 --> 0:14:33.360 were all but they were all based in right there 0:14:33.360 --> 0:14:37.840 in strad Valley, Yeah, where our postman was last seen. Yeah. 0:14:38.000 --> 0:14:42.160 Frawley was married and so he lived actually above the 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:48.160 post office in straw BALI not in Kim Yeah, but 0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:51.800 the others lived in an officers barracks, so they were 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:55.120 allowed to I don't know whatever. They all denied seeing 0:14:55.200 --> 0:14:59.400 Larry leave the village, and also all of them, particularly Delay, 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.920 claimed the Larry was sober. I do love that the 0:15:03.000 --> 0:15:05.280 officers were like, no, no, no, we didn't see Larry. 0:15:05.320 --> 0:15:06.800 We didn't see him, but we know we was sober. 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:12.840 It was definitely sober. It's kind of funny when your 0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:14.720 worst witnesses in the case what happened to be the 0:15:14.760 --> 0:15:17.680 local police. Yeah, that is actually kind of what happened here. 0:15:18.400 --> 0:15:21.560 Other people from strad Valley said that Larry was quote 0:15:21.640 --> 0:15:25.760 unquote a bit jolly, a k a drunk While he 0:15:25.840 --> 0:15:30.160 was investigating. O'Mara was also able to establish that Larry 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:32.520 had not made it to the houses at the end 0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:34.800 of his route, which were on the road back to 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:37.920 kill Mac, nor was his bike on the road at 0:15:38.000 --> 0:15:40.640 four am when a different local man was walking along 0:15:40.680 --> 0:15:43.680 the road, presumably back to his house from the town. 0:15:44.040 --> 0:15:47.720 This is Christmas at four am. Christmas. It's supposed to 0:15:47.760 --> 0:15:52.560 take after Christmas, but at four am in an area 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:58.000 that probably doesn't have street lighting, it's really freaking dark. 0:15:59.360 --> 0:16:03.000 But I'm amazed that they grabbed onto this. It couldn't 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:06.360 have been there at this time because this guy didn't 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:11.240 notice it. Well, so, yeah, that's fair. Certainly, I'm inclined 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:15.680 to believe that the conclusions that o'mera was able to 0:16:15.800 --> 0:16:20.440 draw from his investigations were by and large correct, but 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:23.640 it's totally fair to say we don't know the situation. 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:27.240 You know, we there weren't street lights, right, but we 0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:29.280 don't know if by that point the moon had come 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:32.720 out and it was glowing off of the snow and 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:35.160 it was super bright, and he was able to say 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:37.960 no with with the absolute certainty the bike was. You know, 0:16:38.040 --> 0:16:42.240 we don't know, but so we The timeline then becomes 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:45.960 some time between four am and seven thirty am, Larry's 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:48.720 bike made it a few miles out of town, and 0:16:49.720 --> 0:16:53.320 this point you aren't suspicious about something. You are far 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:56.680 behind where o'mera was at, because it started to become 0:16:56.800 --> 0:16:59.920 very suspicious. Pretty much a lot of people, you know, 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.440 you know who else was suspicious? Yeah, well yeah, but 0:17:03.560 --> 0:17:05.600 you know the local priest actually he was like doing 0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:08.320 doing all Father Brown on these guys. He was actually, yeah, 0:17:08.320 --> 0:17:09.960 we're about to talk about that. We'll talk about that 0:17:10.240 --> 0:17:15.800 actually right now. Okay. Yeah, So O'Meara continued to investigate 0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:18.159 because he just kind of thought, you know, there was 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:23.679 some something we're going Yeah. On January six, local priest 0:17:23.840 --> 0:17:27.320 named Father O'Shea told O'Meara that he should question a 0:17:27.359 --> 0:17:31.600 sixteen year old boy from Stradbally named John Power. Seems 0:17:31.640 --> 0:17:34.800 that the father had likely heard a confession from John 0:17:35.480 --> 0:17:39.560 that made him think that the strad Bali police might 0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:46.080 be covering something up. Turns out probably don't, don't. Emera 0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:48.520 set up an interview with young John Powers at a 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:52.840 different police station that didn't include our named officers. Already, 0:17:52.840 --> 0:17:56.879 he's not trusting these guys already. What he told Amara 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:59.600 was actually very different than the story that the police 0:17:59.600 --> 0:18:03.040 officers had told him about that night. He told them 0:18:03.119 --> 0:18:05.840 that he had witnessed a set of events on Christmas 0:18:05.920 --> 0:18:08.359 Day night, and that there were three other people with 0:18:08.440 --> 0:18:11.840 him that night who could corroborate his story. His story 0:18:12.000 --> 0:18:14.640 was basically that he had been standing outside the window 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:18.480 of Wheeland's Pub with three these three other men who 0:18:18.520 --> 0:18:20.960 we'll talk about a second. And by the way, sorry 0:18:21.000 --> 0:18:22.840 to interrupt you. I just want to say, if you 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:25.720 get on Google Street you and go to Stread Valley, 0:18:26.160 --> 0:18:28.840 there's like a center part of town, like a crossroads 0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:31.040 right there. There's a little almost town squarish kind of 0:18:31.080 --> 0:18:33.440 like a little parkas thing right there, and you'll see 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:35.800 all these places at a reference here. The Wheeland's Pub 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:39.080 is like right there that's still operational. Toe and still open. 0:18:39.200 --> 0:18:41.920 And then right next to it is the post office 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:47.480 which garda policeman Frawley lived above, and then the hall 0:18:47.680 --> 0:18:49.479 is like to the right and across the street, and 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:54.359 the police barracks is next door to that. Still anything away. Yeah, 0:18:56.640 --> 0:19:00.080 and I'm probably in pretty much the same condition. Just that, 0:19:00.400 --> 0:19:04.520 probably a little updating, but yeah, go ahead and just 0:19:04.600 --> 0:19:06.520 go check it out. Yeah, because I I kind of 0:19:06.560 --> 0:19:09.280 just assumed people would look it up. I didn't spend 0:19:09.280 --> 0:19:11.280 a lot of time kind of describing where things aren't 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:14.199 relation to each other. So so anyway, the story that 0:19:14.320 --> 0:19:17.199 John Powers told was that he had been standing outside 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:20.800 the window of Wheeland's Pub and with the other three 0:19:20.800 --> 0:19:24.840 men from six pm on Christmas Day and then they 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:29.720 had seen Larry and Officer do Lay outside the post 0:19:29.760 --> 0:19:33.120 office at six thirty and then they walked past them 0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:36.280 and around the corner. Officer do Lay was pushing a 0:19:36.280 --> 0:19:40.720 bike and Larry appeared to be really drunk um and sick. 0:19:41.320 --> 0:19:43.760 Well sorry, the quote is trying to empty the contents 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:49.919 of his stomach, not Yeah. Power said that he remained 0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:52.720 outside Wheeland's for another hour and he did not see 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:59.000 do Lay or Larry again. So based on this testimony 0:19:59.200 --> 0:20:04.520 evidence whatever it is superintended. O'mea. O'Meara, of course goes 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:08.320 back to question Delay again, and Delay says at this 0:20:08.400 --> 0:20:12.080 point basically, well, yeah, okay, fine, Yes, I was with 0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:15.520 Larry that night, but he was definitely totally sober. And 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:17.280 I didn't tell you about it because I mean, I 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:19.120 didn't lie about it because no, I mean I didn't 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:21.399 tell you about it because I just didn't think it 0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:25.880 was important. He literally literally the quote attributed to him 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:28.040 is that he said that it was of no consequence 0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:29.800 that he had actually seen Larry on the night that 0:20:29.840 --> 0:20:34.040 he disappeared, just that wasn't important, of course, not right, 0:20:34.520 --> 0:20:36.920 to which anyone with a brain, of course, would say, well, 0:20:36.920 --> 0:20:40.360 clearly you are hiding something more on this. Later, O'Mara 0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:44.600 continued to investigate, and you know, the story around this 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:47.640 is really hazy because there's a lot of conflicting accounts 0:20:47.640 --> 0:20:50.080 of things. This is my least favorite kind of story 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:54.800 because everybody is contradicting each other and changing and themselves. Yeah, 0:20:55.080 --> 0:21:01.119 pretty much, any time anybody was interviewed, their story changed substantially. 0:21:01.240 --> 0:21:04.639 These guys did not get together and get their stories 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:08.080 all alone, clearly not. But even the locals. They would 0:21:08.119 --> 0:21:11.119 talk to locals and it seemed like their stories would shift. 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:13.200 We're going to talk about that in a little bit. Actually, 0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:16.080 there's some pretty compelling testimony that they thought they could 0:21:16.080 --> 0:21:20.480 get a conviction on that later when they called that person. Yeah, 0:21:20.520 --> 0:21:23.240 they called them into the to testify in court, and 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:26.159 they were like totally totally different stories. So we'll talk 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:28.960 about that in a second. But this haze is kind 0:21:29.040 --> 0:21:31.040 of we're trying to clear it away a little bit, 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:33.840 and this is just one of many. It seems to 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:37.320 be pretty much accepted by both the research that I did. 0:21:37.359 --> 0:21:40.520 It seems to be the most consistent story, and like 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:43.119 you know, reading around the internet, people pretty much agree 0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:46.200 this is kind of the most consistent stuff. But again 0:21:46.400 --> 0:21:49.280 it's not changes a million times. So the people who 0:21:49.359 --> 0:21:52.960 lived in strad Valley were able to solidify the story 0:21:53.000 --> 0:21:56.360 that it sounds like about after six pm, a clearly 0:21:56.440 --> 0:22:01.560 drunk Larry had called had called on sorry head, visited 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:08.960 Officer Frawley's flat, the one that's above the post office, right, yeah, 0:22:09.040 --> 0:22:12.480 and he had actually apparently showed up with Officer do 0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:17.679 Lay where they all of them had some more alcohol. 0:22:18.160 --> 0:22:25.120 More being an operative term on Christmas in that town. 0:22:25.160 --> 0:22:27.040 I mean, that's what I do all day, and I 0:22:27.119 --> 0:22:28.960 have a lot of other stuff going on. There's not 0:22:29.080 --> 0:22:32.879 much going on in that town. Yeah, And from there, 0:22:32.960 --> 0:22:37.440 the three men went outside, and the officers, in their 0:22:37.800 --> 0:22:41.000 clearly sober state, decided that Larry was too drunk to 0:22:41.080 --> 0:22:46.320 go home. So apparently Officer Frawley went to Wheelands to 0:22:46.400 --> 0:22:49.920 see if they could let him stay there for the night, 0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:54.360 sleep it off, whatever, But he realized that he had 0:22:54.359 --> 0:22:59.480 been followed into Wheelands by h Sergeant Gain. Yeah. Apparently 0:23:00.040 --> 0:23:02.560 it sounds like the actual what's the word I'm thinking about, 0:23:02.560 --> 0:23:06.520 the actual sergeant well in charge, in charge, But he 0:23:06.520 --> 0:23:08.159 sounds like he was the more of the law and 0:23:08.280 --> 0:23:10.600 order guy in the crowd there, the local police, and 0:23:10.640 --> 0:23:13.200 so he was the one that that followed was by 0:23:13.280 --> 0:23:15.240 the book. Well, so yeah, I think that I think 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:18.199 that Delay realized, oh my god, he's following me into 0:23:18.200 --> 0:23:19.800 the pub. I better turn around and back right out 0:23:19.800 --> 0:23:23.639 of because the people in the pub. Yeah. So from there, 0:23:23.960 --> 0:23:28.800 apparently Officer Delay took Larry around the corner, which would 0:23:28.800 --> 0:23:32.840 have been I guess when John and his friends saw 0:23:33.560 --> 0:23:36.240 Larry with Delay, because there was a back door in 0:23:36.320 --> 0:23:39.520 the back door into the pub, and they both went 0:23:39.560 --> 0:23:42.679 into Wheeland's by the back door, and then neither of 0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:45.240 them were seemed to leave again. This, of course was 0:23:45.280 --> 0:23:49.080 all news to O'Meara, because this version of the story 0:23:49.119 --> 0:23:51.840 had not been presented to him yet, which yeah, which 0:23:51.920 --> 0:23:54.520 was a problem, because he had interviewed the police officers 0:23:54.600 --> 0:23:57.679 now not once but twice and had not heard this 0:23:57.760 --> 0:24:01.439 story from any of them, so that was probably a problem. 0:24:01.680 --> 0:24:04.080