Speaker 1: Think Team Sideways. I don't. You've never known stories of
Speaker 1: things we simply don't know the answer to. Hey, guys,
Speaker 1: welcome Thinking Sideways, the podcast Team Sideways here to solve
Speaker 1: a mystery for you. I'm Devin, joined this time by
Speaker 1: Joe and Steve, as opposed to the other times, which
Speaker 1: is where I am Joe, I'm Steve. Yep, that's true.
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to adjust the way you talk to
Speaker 1: you too. Now I'm gonna have to lower my voice
Speaker 1: and way slower. I can't help the rate I have
Speaker 1: my speech patterns at this week, we're going to talk
Speaker 1: about something that was requested by a number of people. Uh,
Speaker 1: lots and lots of people. It's pretty much since we
Speaker 1: started doing the podcast, it's been a pretty constant stream
Speaker 1: and we've been saying no, no, I wouldn't say we
Speaker 1: said to tackle not tonight, but a kind of hurts.
Speaker 1: But there's been a recent development there has so we're
Speaker 1: gonna yeah, it's good, it's good. Yeah, this is we
Speaker 1: do wait sometimes, and this is this is a good
Speaker 1: reason why we're gonna talk about the disappearance of zeb
Speaker 1: Quinn nine pm on January two, two thousand, Zeb Quinn
Speaker 1: finishes his shift at Walmart. He's eighteen years old, and
Speaker 1: he and his friend Robert Jason Owens decided to go
Speaker 1: look at a car that Zeb has been thinking about buying.
Speaker 1: They converse about it quickly for a minute in the
Speaker 1: parking lot, and then they take They each get in
Speaker 1: their own cars, and they stop at a gas station
Speaker 1: at about nine pm, after which Owen's reports that Zeb
Speaker 1: flashed his lights at him. Zeb was mind yeah, and
Speaker 1: he flashes his lights, which I guess is like universal
Speaker 1: signal for hey, pull over. I didn't know that, but
Speaker 1: you really Yeah, No, I've had I've had cell phones
Speaker 1: as far as long as i've you just text the person, say,
Speaker 1: stopped making me feel old. So they pull over and
Speaker 1: Zeb hops out of the car and he says he's
Speaker 1: gotten a page, so he's going to go walk over
Speaker 1: to the pay phone to make a phone call. Okay,
Speaker 1: Now I read that he actually drove back somewhere to
Speaker 1: make the call, that there wasn't a pay phone where
Speaker 1: they pulled. Yeah, I read that too. I've seen it
Speaker 1: both ways. That's why I bring it up, because I
Speaker 1: don't know that he wouldn't necessarily back to the gas station.
Speaker 1: Where they because we know that the time that the
Speaker 1: gas station, because he were on camera, but there was
Speaker 1: no camera of him coming back, so I suspect it
Speaker 1: wasn't the They would have mentioned that. There could have
Speaker 1: been phones. Oh, I'm sure there were. There were lots
Speaker 1: of payphones in those days. I remember that. I don't
Speaker 1: see so many of them anymore. That's because nobody has pages.
Speaker 1: When Zeb returned, Owens described him as kind of frantic,
Speaker 1: and Zeb said he needed to cancel their plans to
Speaker 1: go look at the car and drove off, re ending
Speaker 1: owens car on the way. That's how much of a
Speaker 1: hurry he was in. I guess again. That's another another
Speaker 1: inconsistent one between various accounts of the story, because the
Speaker 1: one that I heard is that after he took out,
Speaker 1: after he said he needed to go return the page,
Speaker 1: he rerended his car then and then came back ten
Speaker 1: minutes later after making the phone call and apologize and
Speaker 1: said he couldn't go look at the car. That's interesting.
Speaker 1: I actually hadn't seen that anywhere, so he either did
Speaker 1: it as he went to answer the page or after. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of a trivial thing, but somebody's going to
Speaker 1: call us on that, probably but probably. Yeah. Around midnight,
Speaker 1: Owens shows up at a hospital with a couple of
Speaker 1: fractured ribs and a head injury. He says he was
Speaker 1: in a car accident, though of note, there was no
Speaker 1: car accident reported, And by the way, is I never
Speaker 1: I was not able to find this out anywhere? Was
Speaker 1: that was? Was that a single car accident or I
Speaker 1: don't think that anybody knows because I guess what wasn't reported.
Speaker 1: Whoever else was involved didn't ever come forward, or if
Speaker 1: he ran into a poll was a single car? He said?
Speaker 1: You know, he told the I guess the police. I
Speaker 1: guess the hospital called the police or something like that.
Speaker 1: But the report was that it had happened near the
Speaker 1: waffle house on Interstate Love the waffle house house waffle house. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So anyway, so that's that's an interesting thing. It's like,
Speaker 1: maybe the police have more more detailed records, but it
Speaker 1: hasn't been released. So yeah, that's the thing. It has
Speaker 1: been released, So it's just frustrating. I have a lot
Speaker 1: of questions about this. Yeah, I I totally agree with that,
Speaker 1: and I do want to pause here for a second.
Speaker 1: I think some of our listeners are going to be
Speaker 1: excitedly sitting and listening driving. I think most of you drive, driving,
Speaker 1: commuting in some way, going I know that name? Why
Speaker 1: do I know that name? Why does Robert Jason Owen
Speaker 1: sounds so familiar? Well, friends will talk about that. Not
Speaker 1: quite yet, but not yet, So just chill for a second.
Speaker 1: Can't get there. We will get there, I promise. Two
Speaker 1: days after Zeb disappeared, a phone call was placed by
Speaker 1: someone claiming to be Zeb to his place of work, Walmart,
Speaker 1: claiming to be sick so he wouldn't be into work.
Speaker 1: The coworker that he spoke to the call the Yeah.
Speaker 1: The coworker that was answering the call knew Zeb pretty
Speaker 1: well and decided that the voice didn't sound like him,
Speaker 1: even if he was sick, so he called the cops.
Speaker 1: Because by this point, it should be noted I just
Speaker 1: totally glossed over this. By this point, Zeb's mom had
Speaker 1: reported him missing it. And by the way, another version
Speaker 1: I heard of this is said the guy was suspicious.
Speaker 1: He didn't call the cops, but he did a star
Speaker 1: six nine on. Somehow him back and somebody answered, and
Speaker 1: then later on he told the police. But somehow the
Speaker 1: call was traced to a Volvo factory that happens that
Speaker 1: Owens worked at, and and uh. The cops questioned him
Speaker 1: and said, hey, dude, like was that here, Like what's
Speaker 1: going on? And Owen said, oh, no, zeb called me
Speaker 1: and he said he he needed me to call in
Speaker 1: to work for him, which like, if you're if you
Speaker 1: can use a phone, why don't you just call Walmart
Speaker 1: yourself and say, hey, I'm sick, I won't be in.
Speaker 1: I don't know why you call your friend to call
Speaker 1: the place. But I actually have an idea on that.
Speaker 1: I've had jobs where you had to call in within
Speaker 1: X amount of time of the before your start of
Speaker 1: your shift. So you couldn't call in four hours before
Speaker 1: your shift, but you could you had to call in
Speaker 1: at least you could call in two hours before your shift.
Speaker 1: So let's say you started ten early. You can't call
Speaker 1: in and say I can't come in is eight, So
Speaker 1: that I mean, I don't know what Walmart's policy is
Speaker 1: or what it was at that time, but I've been
Speaker 1: in jobs where you couldn't call You couldn't go out
Speaker 1: and have too much to drink and call in it
Speaker 1: two in the more so that you could keep drinking
Speaker 1: kind of situation, which is why those policies were in
Speaker 1: place so people don't pull that garbage. Sure, that's fair. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's a good thought, thanks Steve. Yeah, it doesn't make
Speaker 1: any sense to me. Still, I agree. But hey, two
Speaker 1: weeks after he disappeared, his car showed up. It was
Speaker 1: parked in a parking lot of a restaurant called The
Speaker 1: Little Pigs Barbecue Barbecue. Which is that a Is that
Speaker 1: a franchise? Is that what you're saying or do you
Speaker 1: know of it? No? I have no idea. I just
Speaker 1: Little Pigs Barbecue. I like barbecue. Anyways. This restaurant is
Speaker 1: right next to a hospital that happens to employ Zeb's grandma, mom,
Speaker 1: and sister. They all worked in a neonatal care unit there. Nurses,
Speaker 1: I'm guessing, okay. A hotel key card, uh, several plastic
Speaker 1: empty drink bottles, hair, a jacket not belonging to Zeb,
Speaker 1: and a three month old Labrador mixed puppy were found
Speaker 1: in the car by the puppy. Yeah, on the rear windshield,
Speaker 1: somebody had drawn large lips with two exclamation points in lipstick,
Speaker 1: and the driver's side seat was adjusted for someone who
Speaker 1: was much shorter than Zeb. How how do you know
Speaker 1: how tall Zeb was? He was like six two, I
Speaker 1: think I want to say, Okay, I never saw I
Speaker 1: never remember seeing it specifically, you know what, No, maybe
Speaker 1: he was like five ten. There's not much a taller
Speaker 1: guy taller, not taller. By the way, the jacket that
Speaker 1: was found, was that a man's jacket or a women's jack.
Speaker 1: I wasn't able to find that information. Again, it's always
Speaker 1: listed as a jacket, yep, just as a jacket not
Speaker 1: belonging to him. I also wasn't able to find any
Speaker 1: height information for any of the people who have been
Speaker 1: implicated in this case. I've actually found a little bit
Speaker 1: on that. Okay, great, we'll talk about that in a minute.
Speaker 1: Then too. Forensic evidence was collected at um from the
Speaker 1: car at the scene, but nothing ever really came of it.
Speaker 1: And don't worry. Don't worry unless we get side tracked.
Speaker 1: One of the investigators adopted the puppy, so the puppies okay,
Speaker 1: well that's good, but don't worry about when shining spot
Speaker 1: in this story, one of the puppy. Though they find
Speaker 1: any any pooper or urine in the car, there's no
Speaker 1: mention of that. Yeah, I haven't seen any either, but
Speaker 1: that would indicate how long the dog would be. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't think there wasn't any mention of that. The
Speaker 1: implication that I had that it was fairly recent and
Speaker 1: it's it's the thing is I think that it's the
Speaker 1: dog could have been in the car. The car could
Speaker 1: have been there for hours without an issue. Because we're
Speaker 1: talking January Asheville. It's going to be cold, but it's
Speaker 1: not freezing cold, so therefore it's not like it would
Speaker 1: be a hot summer day where in an hour and
Speaker 1: a half a dog would expire. Yeah, luckily for the puppy. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Another interesting thing that we're going to talk about as
Speaker 1: it pertains to this story is Zeb's aunt and kind
Speaker 1: of girlfriend. Not they're not the same person. I'm sorry
Speaker 1: the wa clarification. Yeah, yeah, Yeah. The relationship with the
Speaker 1: sort of girlfriend is kind of nebulous. Yeah, a relationship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Apparently Zeb had kind of started a relationship slash friendship
Speaker 1: with this girl named Misty. Misty had a boyfriend who,
Speaker 1: according to Zeb, was abusive. There's not a whole lot
Speaker 1: of information about Misty out there. I did read that
Speaker 1: she had a kid with her boyfriend, but I can't
Speaker 1: confirm that through other sources. On the Wikipedia page it
Speaker 1: says her boyfriend's name is Wesley, which just that's what
Speaker 1: I've heard too. But I also I always this is
Speaker 1: one of my hard things with retellings of stories, and
Speaker 1: then they go through like forums and whatnot, is everybody
Speaker 1: says the boyfriend was abusive. That could have been as
Speaker 1: simple as he was a jerk, and the way that
Speaker 1: it was described as ZEB he then translates that into
Speaker 1: abusive or some low variant that, and then the retellings
Speaker 1: turns out that he's basically a wife beater. Like I
Speaker 1: wanted people to keep that in mind. We don't know
Speaker 1: really what this guy did. For all we know he
Speaker 1: swore at her, and ZEB equated that to something else. Yeah,
Speaker 1: next up, is I a you tish anyways that Zeb's aren't.
Speaker 1: And though he she hadn't spoken to him in years,
Speaker 1: is that true? I thought they just didn't speak often.
Speaker 1: I read years, but often could be possible to the
Speaker 1: description that I read most frequently is that they were
Speaker 1: kind of estranged. They weren't. Again, this is the same
Speaker 1: thing as the abuse. This thing has been retold so
Speaker 1: many times that it's easy to read something like that
Speaker 1: and believe that's cast iron. They haven't talked in years,
Speaker 1: and it could be they just talked once in a
Speaker 1: while when they see each other. On the night in question,
Speaker 1: January second, apparently I know was having dinner with her
Speaker 1: friend Tamara, who happens to be Misty's mom. And it's unclear,
Speaker 1: but it's possible that Misty and Wesley were also at
Speaker 1: the dinner at Anna's house. I started to do this.
Speaker 1: I've heard it was dinner elsewhere, not her house. I've
Speaker 1: actually seen that. I've seen it. Well again, it's I've
Speaker 1: seen it both places. This is yeah, this is the
Speaker 1: hard it's a hard. Part of this case is yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I think, you know on balance, having seen
Speaker 1: it both ways. But I know that she also the
Speaker 1: next day report that place has been broken into. So
Speaker 1: if there were four people there, so that's why I
Speaker 1: think that probably they were, she was not home, and
Speaker 1: they were all having their dinner else It does make sense,
Speaker 1: based on circumstances that I know. Joe started to go
Speaker 1: into it, it would make sense that they weren't at
Speaker 1: her house, but having dinner. Having dinner could be anywhere
Speaker 1: The reason that it's interesting to mention this, this whole
Speaker 1: family girl family conundrum, is the they were able to
Speaker 1: track the phone that the page to Zeb's pager where
Speaker 1: that came from, and it came from Mina's landline at home.
Speaker 1: So whether they were home or not is a fairly
Speaker 1: important question, but one that I was never able to
Speaker 1: pin down, and apparently near the regain. And I had
Speaker 1: heard that it was at a later date that she
Speaker 1: filed the police report, not she didn't do it, it
Speaker 1: was I heard that it wasn't I didn't. I didn't
Speaker 1: understand it to be that evening or the day after
Speaker 1: I I understood it to be a few days later.
Speaker 1: But agree with that and the police report that she filed,
Speaker 1: she said, somebody broke into my house and they said, oh, well,
Speaker 1: what's missing, and she said nothing, There's just a few
Speaker 1: pictures moved around. That's a little strange, yeah, which could
Speaker 1: literally mean somebody that has a key to my house
Speaker 1: in the family came over to see me, came in
Speaker 1: the house. I wasn't there. They bumped some stuff around
Speaker 1: and then they left, or I bumped into something when
Speaker 1: I was drunk one night on accident and forgot had happened.
Speaker 1: I noticed that it was different, and then they said, hey,
Speaker 1: somebody paged you're missing nephew from your phone? You know
Speaker 1: anything about that? And you go, Now my house was
Speaker 1: broken into. I don't know anything. Yeah, that's that's that's.
Speaker 1: It does seem a little strange, the thing about her
Speaker 1: putting up such a stone wall about the phone call.
Speaker 1: To me, it's so funny is that in this is
Speaker 1: two thousand. Of course we've got phones that have memory,
Speaker 1: so it very easily could have been that Zeb's phone
Speaker 1: pager number was the last would have been with a Z,
Speaker 1: the last thing in her phone book, and she went
Speaker 1: too far, scrolled too far, and then hit the send
Speaker 1: button and then realized what was going on and and
Speaker 1: stopped the call. I mean, that's do you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying? Yeah, But I think the way he reacted
Speaker 1: to the page indicated that something there was something more.
Speaker 1: Usually your page comes up with the number and then
Speaker 1: some kind of me the input message was if there was,
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody knows that, and not I don't
Speaker 1: think all pages are even capable of having actually additional anything,
Speaker 1: So it could have just been the number. That's that's fine,
Speaker 1: and that's what that's where I'm leading to, is that
Speaker 1: there wasn't anything input. It was just a crap I'm
Speaker 1: calling the page er and Zeb of course doesn't understand that,
Speaker 1: so then he immediately, well I never hear from her.
Speaker 1: I gotta go figure out what's going on. Yeah, that's fair.
Speaker 1: The you know, the the other I guess not to
Speaker 1: you know, really go too far into it. But the
Speaker 1: suspicious part to me about her finally, that police report
Speaker 1: was I understand she specified it was around nine pm
Speaker 1: that her house got broken into that night. The window. Yeah,
Speaker 1: although you know, because if somebody just moved the pictures around,
Speaker 1: I don't know how you would know when somebody broke
Speaker 1: into your house. But it just depends on how many
Speaker 1: hours you've been gone. I mean, if you were gone
Speaker 1: from eight thirty to nine thirty, then obviously not. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but it seems like it would take a little long,
Speaker 1: short dinner. That's pretty brief dinner. Yeah. Miss and Wesley
Speaker 1: deny involvement in the case at all, which you know,
Speaker 1: if they were at the home, there's a smart thing
Speaker 1: to do. And they did both give samples for DNA
Speaker 1: testing against the samples that were found both in the car. No,
Speaker 1: just in the car, because that was the only place
Speaker 1: there were samples that were found in the car, and
Speaker 1: there were no matches in the puppy. No, they did,
Speaker 1: but they did. No. Apparently they kept like clippings of
Speaker 1: the dog's hair just in case, in case there was
Speaker 1: some trace evidence on him they could find out later.
Speaker 1: Investigators agree that there was probably more than one person
Speaker 1: involved in the disappearance of zeb Quinn, and his family
Speaker 1: is pretty sure that he was He was murdered that night.
Speaker 1: According to his mother, he didn't have anything extra with him,
Speaker 1: no money or clothes or he wore contact lenses. He
Speaker 1: didn't have any contact lenses or anything like that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's and it's certainly possible that he had gotten some
Speaker 1: He did have a job, but we worked at Longart
Speaker 1: because a shoplifted tons he could have that's true. But
Speaker 1: I from everything I've read about zeb I'm willing to
Speaker 1: believe her. Well, he seems like a pretty upright kid. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it seemed like a good kid. No, I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: why I run away? Yeah No, No, that makes sense,
Speaker 1: absolutely no sense. So that's that's the story. That's literally
Speaker 1: everything we know. Theories since Joe's kind of going there already. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well I was, and in fairness, I was kind of
Speaker 1: setting up for that. Yeah. The first theory is that
Speaker 1: Zeb ran away, which actually I I totally believe it
Speaker 1: because he worked at Walmart. He would have been able
Speaker 1: to keep me to the lifetime supply of food and
Speaker 1: other stuff. He was definitely in the black market contact
Speaker 1: lens solution probably, Yeah, totally totally makes sense. No, I
Speaker 1: don't think. I don't think Zeb had any reason. As
Speaker 1: far as I can tell, he was a happy kid,
Speaker 1: and he had nothing in the kate he had a
Speaker 1: reason to know. Okay, ready, next theory is that Zeb
Speaker 1: and Misty ran away to get the lover's got it.
Speaker 1: So if you choose to believe what Owen says at
Speaker 1: face value right that he had two car accidents in
Speaker 1: one day somehow, then it could it could make sense
Speaker 1: that Misty and Zeb ran away together. The theory kind
Speaker 1: of goes that, you know, Misty had been being abused
Speaker 1: by Wesley. She had had enough, so she paged Zeb
Speaker 1: from Aina's phone because they were there, and said, come
Speaker 1: get me, come get me, basically, and so Zeb hurried off,
Speaker 1: really ready to just do whatever she shining armor, picked
Speaker 1: her up, took her to a hotel, explains the hotel
Speaker 1: car key or the hotel card key not. Have you
Speaker 1: ever seen a card keeper hotel. It didn't have the
Speaker 1: hotel's name on it. I have, yeah, the really cheap
Speaker 1: one about to say they are the super cheaper at
Speaker 1: the white key. They don't have a number on them,
Speaker 1: they don't have anything, just a white card. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: Ze picked her up. They hold up in a hotel
Speaker 1: for a couple of days. Wesley finds that he buys
Speaker 1: her a dog. I don't know. I don't know how
Speaker 1: the dogs involved. I gotta be really the biggest mystery here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he he buys her a dog, I guess, or something,
Speaker 1: or she already had the dog maybe. I think that
Speaker 1: would have mentioned that, you think so. I think she
Speaker 1: would have said, oh my dog maybe, or somebody would
Speaker 1: have said, yeah, missy had a dog for a while
Speaker 1: and now she doesn't. If if where we're heading in
Speaker 1: this theory is correct, she would have shut her mouth
Speaker 1: about her missing three month old puppy because it would
Speaker 1: have been in the car. Yeah, well, she wouldn't have
Speaker 1: said anything if if if the theory were running through
Speaker 1: is correct, she wouldn't have, but somebody else would have
Speaker 1: probably mentioned to somebody, Hey didn't Missy's dog went missing,
Speaker 1: and that like miss dogs bad. They didn't have Facebook,
Speaker 1: and ye kind of incriminating pictures out there. We did have.
Speaker 1: My Space sucked, well, people didn't. People didn't post of
Speaker 1: my Space is often because camera phones were not as common.
Speaker 1: That's true, I remember, and you never could tell what
Speaker 1: the picture was. That's true. Anyways, The theory continues on
Speaker 1: that Wesley either found out of his own volition or
Speaker 1: Misty decided, oh I miss my kid who somehow was
Speaker 1: being taken care of by parents, or if the kid
Speaker 1: even existed, or she called Wesley and was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think so too. I'm sorry, baby, I take you back.
Speaker 1: Come save me from zeb he's holding me hostage or whatever.
Speaker 1: Wesley comes, so they tell there's an altercation. He kills
Speaker 1: zeb In somehow, somehow accidentally or intentionally, They together Misty
Speaker 1: and Wesley disposed of the body. Then they take the
Speaker 1: car and drop it in really super weird mysterious circumstances
Speaker 1: for reasons unknown, instead of just like leaving it in
Speaker 1: the middle of the forest or the hotel or something. Well,
Speaker 1: that's that's intriguing because if you if you're driving around
Speaker 1: a car for two weeks it belongs to somebody who's disappeared,
Speaker 1: presuming murdered, that's kind of risky, don't you think. At
Speaker 1: the same time, it couldn't have been in that parking
Speaker 1: lot for a full two weeks with the puppy. It
Speaker 1: couldn't have probably even for a couple of days. To
Speaker 1: be honest with you, people notice if a dog's in
Speaker 1: a car. Yeah. Well, And and the other weird thing
Speaker 1: that I I came across and I couldn't I couldn't
Speaker 1: find the source of this. I found it repeated in
Speaker 1: some other places, but can never find the initial source.
Speaker 1: Is that there are reports that Misty was spotted in
Speaker 1: Zeb's car in Nashville. Yeah, I've heard that. Nashville is
Speaker 1: three hundred miles away, which is a four to five
Speaker 1: hour drive one way. How she was spotted I don't
Speaker 1: know in a city the size of Nashville. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: that's weird. I kind of discounted that. Oh yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I don't, but it's a weird. It's one of those rumors.
Speaker 1: I guess it is the best way to put it, Huh. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't play any side, which you know,
Speaker 1: Misty is a very common name. The other part, the
Speaker 1: other variant, yeah, variant on this theory is that Zeb's
Speaker 1: interest and advances were misinterpreted by Misty or by Wesley
Speaker 1: as kind of stalking behavior. Because we've all we've all
Speaker 1: been there. Do you remember when you were like an
Speaker 1: old like a you know, seventeen eight year old kid,
Speaker 1: you would get obsessed with somebody and you would be like, well,
Speaker 1: it would be so romantic if I would just go
Speaker 1: stand outside their door all day to show them how
Speaker 1: much I love them, and you know, the other parties
Speaker 1: standing there like, oh my god, he's back, like what
Speaker 1: is going on right now? Again, in the movies, it's
Speaker 1: always like, it's always romantic in the movies. It's not
Speaker 1: in real life. Just gentlemen and ladies who may be
Speaker 1: thinking about this. It's not a good idea. It's never
Speaker 1: a good idea. Yeah, don't do it. Not not a
Speaker 1: good idea. But I guess it's it's possible that you know,
Speaker 1: he was smitten with her and she was being friendly
Speaker 1: but not necessarily flirty, or even just being a little flirty,
Speaker 1: but wasn't actually interested. I would say, probably more nice
Speaker 1: than anything, because if it is a misinterpreted love, then
Speaker 1: just being nice is really all it takes. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: he was She wasn't blatantly saying no freak get away
Speaker 1: from me, so he interpreted that for whatever reason, and
Speaker 1: then you know, Wesley thought, well, I'm just gonna take
Speaker 1: care of this guy, beat the crap out of this weirdo,
Speaker 1: and beat him too hard. Whatever happened, it does happen.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's lots of times where guys get into
Speaker 1: fights and somebody dies in a simple fist fight. It happened.
Speaker 1: So that's actually the I might have mentioned this before,
Speaker 1: but the FBI has got a whole separate category in
Speaker 1: their homicide table by murder weapon, and the category is
Speaker 1: called hands, fists, feet, And I checked the most recent
Speaker 1: time I checked that not too long ago, and for
Speaker 1: the past five years, there's about averaging about eight hundred
Speaker 1: deaths a year, eight hundred homicides a year just bare hands.
Speaker 1: That's crazy. Yeah, it actually that's you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: rifles death by all kinds of all rifles of all kinds,
Speaker 1: including those deadly assault rifles, is more like in maybe
Speaker 1: three hundred a year something like that. Yeah, more people
Speaker 1: just get beaten to death. Especially people don't don't think
Speaker 1: it's super dangerous. But you don't think that of your
Speaker 1: body when you're using it as a weapon. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it's Yeah, you can have a cerebral hamor rage and everything.
Speaker 1: Although you know, again I've mentioned before, I'll mention again,
Speaker 1: I don't have any information on Wesley's size versus zeb side.
Speaker 1: I don't know if that would have been something that
Speaker 1: would have been possible or even probable. I don't know
Speaker 1: very I know very little about Wesley and his temperament.
Speaker 1: I don't know. You know, again, if he just interpreted
Speaker 1: Wesley being a little bit of a jerk to Misty
Speaker 1: as being highly abusive behavior, or if he was actually
Speaker 1: physically abusive, or if he was just emotionally abusive, or
Speaker 1: what that situation is, and the kind of mitigating factors
Speaker 1: that would go into this being a likely theory. The well,
Speaker 1: the other thing that I'll throw in since we're on
Speaker 1: this theory is that I did come across chatter on
Speaker 1: the internet about that Zeb and Misty had had a
Speaker 1: several hour long conversation on the phone the night before,
Speaker 1: which would have been the January one, New Year's Day. Well,
Speaker 1: if that was true, I would be interested to know
Speaker 1: where that call was placed from. In other words, did
Speaker 1: it come from Zeb's aunt's house, did it come from
Speaker 1: her mom? Like, you know, to try and try and
Speaker 1: tighten up the circle a little bit on on some
Speaker 1: of this. Yeah, I've never been able to Again. This
Speaker 1: is another one of those ones where he I see
Speaker 1: it in places, but I never can find where it
Speaker 1: originated from. Yeah, it really would be nice to be
Speaker 1: able to get ahold of the police files because I
Speaker 1: I assume they've checked all this stuff out. Well it's
Speaker 1: I mean, it's an active case. Yeah, I know that's why,
Speaker 1: because I don't think we said it yet. But a
Speaker 1: body nothing, Yeah, nothing, although somebodies have recently showed up.
Speaker 1: We'll talk about that a minute. The next theory is
Speaker 1: that Zeb was lured to the aunt's house by an
Speaker 1: angry Wesley variant another variant, Yeah, and I think it's unlikely,
Speaker 1: particularly because all Wesley would have had to do is
Speaker 1: pretend to be misty, and it seems that Zeb would
Speaker 1: have gone anywhere for her. He could have learned him
Speaker 1: out into the middle of the four I mean it
Speaker 1: could have been anywhere. Why picked the aunt's house. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that is a little a little strange. I mean I
Speaker 1: could see where she could she hear that. Somebody could
Speaker 1: could have broken in and the and then dial this
Speaker 1: page or and that. Way. You don't have say, say
Speaker 1: you're Wesley, you want to murder, beat beat him seriously
Speaker 1: or talk to him? Yeah, start out talking to him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe you don't want to have you die les page
Speaker 1: from your number. Yeah, but pay phones are a thing.
Speaker 1: The thing, though, is that if if you want to
Speaker 1: lure somebody unsuspecting into a confrontation, you lure them somewhere
Speaker 1: that you entice them to go somewhere that's familiar. You've
Speaker 1: thought about this before, haven't you? Oh? Of course, of course.
Speaker 1: I mean I never was going to tell you guys
Speaker 1: to meet me at the rock Quarry. But no, I
Speaker 1: mean you you would say, okay, Well I could say
Speaker 1: meet me at the Piggly Wiggly, which is on the
Speaker 1: exact opposite side of town. Or I could say, hey, come,
Speaker 1: you know, just do it from this phone number, Come
Speaker 1: meet me. Zab doesn't know exactly who it is, but
Speaker 1: he knows the phone number, so he would go there.
Speaker 1: Because this is the day and age when you still
Speaker 1: knew phone numbers, so he would automatically he may not
Speaker 1: know who it was and just go be an easy
Speaker 1: way to get somebody there. Yeah, that's fair, that's a
Speaker 1: fair point. You're ready to go into the next area. Oh,
Speaker 1: let's have this one. As I mentioned that Robert Jason
Speaker 1: Owens has been in the news a little bit lately,
Speaker 1: right that there's some cheering from the people who are listening.
Speaker 1: I can hear it. I hear it. So this theory
Speaker 1: is Zeb was killed by Robert Jason Owens. And the
Speaker 1: reason this is a pretty good theory is a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons. There was a check in at the hospital
Speaker 1: with the broken ribs and the head injury. Well, to
Speaker 1: start with Owen, the counting of the events that led
Speaker 1: up to Zeb's disappearance are questionable at best, and also
Speaker 1: only of his own words. Yeah, he's the only one.
Speaker 1: He's only with the exception. The last time anybody can
Speaker 1: corroborate where Zeb was is with the surveillance tape at
Speaker 1: nine fifteen at the gas station. So the whole and
Speaker 1: he did he did get a page the truth about
Speaker 1: the truth about that, But you can't corroborate that zeb
Speaker 1: went anywhere. Can't corroborate anything else. You can definitely can't
Speaker 1: corroborate the fact that Owens got into a separate car accident.
Speaker 1: There's there's a whole host of questions that I have
Speaker 1: around Owens that I know we're unanswered, and I don't
Speaker 1: know if you want me to ask those questions now
Speaker 1: or later. Let's do it later, because I want to
Speaker 1: say that not only is this questionable accounting a thing,
Speaker 1: but it turns out that Robert Jason Owens is an
Speaker 1: actual total murderer, kind of documented, an actual convicted murderer.
Speaker 1: He's not convicted yet. I think they only they only
Speaker 1: arrested him in March, right, Yeah, trial is not done
Speaker 1: yea as of the day of this recording. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: the evidence and he's not convicted. I doubt that he's
Speaker 1: going to get off because it's kind of admitted to
Speaker 1: one of the killings, and they found some pretty damning
Speaker 1: evidence they did. Do you. I don't know if either
Speaker 1: of you know who Christie cod is. You did not know? Okay.
Speaker 1: Christie was a finalist on the Food Network competition The
Speaker 1: Next Food Network Star, and she and her husband j
Speaker 1: t Cod as well as her unborn child, were murdered
Speaker 1: by Owens. Not I won't go I won't go into
Speaker 1: too much brutally, by the end of it, they fit
Speaker 1: into a fireplace, wood stove, what stove, and they didn't.
Speaker 1: They didn't fit all at once, And reportedly he murdered
Speaker 1: them on a Thursday and then broke into their house
Speaker 1: and stole a laptop, jewelry and a handcun I think
Speaker 1: it was on Friday or Saturday. Yeah, something like that
Speaker 1: A while after yea, so basically hack hack hack. Oh
Speaker 1: hey yeah, not quite the whole thing about breaking into
Speaker 1: their house. I mean, because he would have had access
Speaker 1: to their keys, right you would assume, but did he
Speaker 1: just did he access the house through the key? I
Speaker 1: have no idea super active investigation happening right now. Yeah.
Speaker 1: He also spent I think it was twenty three months
Speaker 1: in jail within a few years after zeb disappeared for
Speaker 1: unrelated charges. I was never really able to to be fair,
Speaker 1: I didn't like go access his actual criminal history and
Speaker 1: all that. It wasn't like no, no, and it wasn't
Speaker 1: like a murder or something. It was all kind of
Speaker 1: there's a drunk driving thing and then there was one
Speaker 1: where another one where was driving drunk and he got
Speaker 1: in the chase with the police and he was shooting
Speaker 1: out of him. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, he shot at the cops.
Speaker 1: Brilliant not a model citizen. So I guess the question
Speaker 1: is kind of asked, could he I mean, could they
Speaker 1: have gotten into a fight? Could Zeb kind of what
Speaker 1: I was saying, could Zeb of you know, accidentally reinded
Speaker 1: him and hopped out and said, oh my gosh, I'm
Speaker 1: so sorry, and he It seems like this guy has
Speaker 1: a little bit of a temper, maybe a little bit.
Speaker 1: Could he have flown into a rage? Yeah, flown into
Speaker 1: a rage? Would that explain also his injuries? Well that's yeah.
Speaker 1: Kind of what I'm thinking is that Zeb, you know,
Speaker 1: he attacks zeb Zeb pot back and broke a few
Speaker 1: ribs and dipped him in the face a few times.
Speaker 1: But then then he picks up a big rock and
Speaker 1: hits Zeb with it. You might not even even have
Speaker 1: intentionally killed him. Yeah, as we talked about, you can
Speaker 1: punch somebody, one punch just the wrong way, and that's
Speaker 1: all it takes. Yeah, I think the key to solving
Speaker 1: that mystery is to go for the police to go
Speaker 1: look at their files, and I don't know if they
Speaker 1: ever looked at this. You would hope that they did.
Speaker 1: But what was the status? Uh, I once was driving
Speaker 1: a pickup truck that night, correct, thank you. I believe
Speaker 1: he was driving a pickup truck. So he got in
Speaker 1: a serious enough wreck to go to the hospital with
Speaker 1: broken bones, et cetera. So there's that truck. Should have
Speaker 1: been pretty racked up, you would think. So did the
Speaker 1: police ever look at that? Not as far as I
Speaker 1: could tell. To dovetail on that question. When Zeb's car
Speaker 1: was found to the barbecue joint, what condition was it in?
Speaker 1: I mean, rear ending somebody can be as simple as
Speaker 1: backing up and touching them, kissing bumpers, or wailing into
Speaker 1: them at you know, at full throttle. So I never
Speaker 1: saw anything that describes the damage to his car. I mean,
Speaker 1: you can, like you said, you can just kiss a car,
Speaker 1: you know, discuff some paint. I don't have the impression
Speaker 1: that the car that Zeb was driving was in particularly
Speaker 1: good condition. But you know, if if it's going to
Speaker 1: be uh, correct me if I'm wrong, But I think
Speaker 1: where Joe was kind of leading this was maybe it
Speaker 1: was more of they had more than just a little
Speaker 1: rear ending. But one of them hit the other and
Speaker 1: caused an accident. Well, if one of them has broken
Speaker 1: ribs and knocked up skull, both cars should show a
Speaker 1: significant damage and be paint scrapings from one should be
Speaker 1: on the other. I don't think that was what Joe
Speaker 1: was saying. I thought he said that he meant the
Speaker 1: injuries were sustained during a fight and so and so
Speaker 1: that you know, it could have been as simple as
Speaker 1: a little scrape, and that would have been like, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm so sorry, and Owen's the fight could
Speaker 1: have happened later on after But yeah, but I'm also
Speaker 1: asking That's what I'm saying, is that is that if
Speaker 1: you've got in the wrecked, it should be all His
Speaker 1: truck should be wrecked up. Did the police look at it?
Speaker 1: Because if you said he got in I wrecked, but
Speaker 1: his truck is perfectly straight and looking pretty good and undented, Well,
Speaker 1: obviously you got the injuries somewhere else. Yeah, I presume
Speaker 1: they looked at the truck, but I don't. I didn't
Speaker 1: never see a record of it. I think that, you know, Actually,
Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you the truth. I'm optimistic that
Speaker 1: this is going to be going to be solved. I
Speaker 1: am too, and I'll tell you why. But I wouldn't
Speaker 1: wait till the end if you want, or I can
Speaker 1: tell you now, you can tell us now, I'll tell
Speaker 1: you now. I think that I think that he's he's
Speaker 1: murdered three people Owen. That is he very likely it
Speaker 1: is going to get the death penalty. And if I
Speaker 1: were to judge in the case, I think I would
Speaker 1: I think I would tell him, look, offer him a plea.
Speaker 1: Here's your deal. You can have life in prison rather
Speaker 1: than death, but you gotta you gotta come clean on
Speaker 1: zeb Quinn. Yeah, I think that seems to be the
Speaker 1: general feeling. And you know, we're not done with this
Speaker 1: episode because there's still lots of questions. Because I do
Speaker 1: have some serious questions about if he did it. There
Speaker 1: are a lot of other questions of things that happened
Speaker 1: in the night that I don't understand why that happened.
Speaker 1: But I am also optimistic that in a plea bargain
Speaker 1: sort of situation, he will come clean about what happened
Speaker 1: to Zeb at the very least, even if he didn't
Speaker 1: do it, he will be able to provide many more
Speaker 1: details or something like that, because I think the one
Speaker 1: thing we haven't talked about is that he was sort
Speaker 1: of cooperative in the first day that after zeb disappeared,
Speaker 1: and then he shut down and he was completely uncooperative
Speaker 1: after that. So to kind of dovetail off of this.
Speaker 1: The things that concerned me about the Owens did it
Speaker 1: theory is there there's no connection between Owens and Aina
Speaker 1: or Misty or or Wesley or Tamarra. So why did
Speaker 1: the page happen or was it just coincidental? Was it
Speaker 1: just coincidental or did accidental or accidental? But then why
Speaker 1: would Iina lie and say somebody broke into my house
Speaker 1: at that time? Again? I can I can tell you
Speaker 1: is that people are weird about the cops. They don't
Speaker 1: like the cops around their place for whatever reason, and
Speaker 1: they'll just start coming up with excuses. I've seen people
Speaker 1: do that a million times. Do I think that's what's
Speaker 1: going on? No, but I can see that as oh
Speaker 1: the five oh or here again, just tell him somebody
Speaker 1: broke in, get him out of here. You know, maybe
Speaker 1: somebody did break into but she didn't. But she it
Speaker 1: was my impression that she she voluntarily submitted a police
Speaker 1: report that her house was broken into. It wasn't my
Speaker 1: impression that the cops showed up and she said, oh,
Speaker 1: somebody broke into my house. It was that A couple
Speaker 1: of days later she said, oh, you know what, somebody
Speaker 1: broke into my house. So that's weird. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, the timing doesn't change my
Speaker 1: my idea. But but you're right, I mean that the
Speaker 1: timing of when she decides to come forward with the
Speaker 1: I've been broken into, he's a little weird. Yeah. And
Speaker 1: if she was indeed broken into, and somehow, for some
Speaker 1: reason or somehow Owen's broke into her house, even though
Speaker 1: that seems super unlikely because he was with Zeb when
Speaker 1: the page there, wouldn't. I don't have the impression that
Speaker 1: there was time between the time that the page came
Speaker 1: in and the time that they were seeing at the
Speaker 1: gas station for him to go break into a house.
Speaker 1: Page the guy unless Zeb didn't tell Owen's he had
Speaker 1: to go on his own, but he went with him
Speaker 1: and they both go to the aunt's house. The aunt
Speaker 1: has since left to go to dinner. Zeb's got a key.
Speaker 1: I'm totally making this up. As I go, they walk
Speaker 1: into the house. Owen's is just kind of walking around
Speaker 1: poking things, just you know, killing time, while Zeb's looking
Speaker 1: for everybody. And then they locked the place up and leave,
Speaker 1: and whatever happens after that happens. But of course the
Speaker 1: house is now slightly different than when she left it
Speaker 1: after a day or two of looking around. Go wait
Speaker 1: a minute, that picture is facing the wrong way. But
Speaker 1: then she again said, I accidentally paged Zeb and then
Speaker 1: I left, and then she may not have realized that
Speaker 1: she page Zeb. I mean, how many people do you
Speaker 1: know that that butt dial? That's not butt dialing, though
Speaker 1: it is. If the phone is in the couch and
Speaker 1: you're sitting on the couch and it's hitting the buttons,
Speaker 1: that's a that's basically that's a couch dial. It's the
Speaker 1: it's the old nineties for a two thousand phone version
Speaker 1: of a butt dial. Maybe I guess it could happen
Speaker 1: because the call would go through, it would hit the pager,
Speaker 1: and then the pager would terminate the call and and
Speaker 1: then give it a dead signal, and eventually the phone
Speaker 1: would I presume, would have to shut itself off with
Speaker 1: no signal. They usually just beat I'm thinking it was
Speaker 1: more of not accorded phone. But why your list photos?
Speaker 1: So the battery died? Is that what we're sorry? We're
Speaker 1: I know we're so we're really going down. But um okay,
Speaker 1: so okay, fine, And the next and the next big
Speaker 1: question right is why dumped the car, particularly with a
Speaker 1: bunch of stuff in it? Like what happened to the car?
Speaker 1: The car might not have been dumps you might have
Speaker 1: the person who was driving the car might have been
Speaker 1: inside the little piggies. That's true. Yeah, that's definitely. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Gally speaking, when I have in a restaurant, you know,
Speaker 1: I have a nice dinner and I know its police
Speaker 1: swarming around my car outside that I've stole. You're not
Speaker 1: going to go out, just go out the back door. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess the question. It seems like the lipstick note
Speaker 1: on the back of the car. That seems like a note, right,
Speaker 1: That doesn't seem like, Hey, I've stolen a car, so
Speaker 1: I'm gonna write some stuff on it and all that
Speaker 1: that seems weird or more of a teenage gag. Well,
Speaker 1: even then, you stole a car, you're not going to
Speaker 1: draw on it. But if but if friends are walking
Speaker 1: by and or young people and they think they know
Speaker 1: that car. They would do that as it not two
Speaker 1: weeks after somebody has been reported missing. The person in
Speaker 1: possession of the car, I might not know that the
Speaker 1: owner of the car because because let's say, oh it
Speaker 1: was killed killed zeb and then sells the car. No
Speaker 1: even sell it. He just leaves it in the parking
Speaker 1: lot somewhere and with the keys in it, and then
Speaker 1: somebody else comes along and steals it and just drives
Speaker 1: it around for a week or two, because that's what
Speaker 1: people you know, people around in a lot of places
Speaker 1: where car theft is basically treated like you know, they
Speaker 1: give you a tap on the wrist, you're not even
Speaker 1: likely to go to change. Yeah, I guess my. My Still,
Speaker 1: my argument is the lips with the exclamation points, like
Speaker 1: why why why if you've stolen a car, even if
Speaker 1: you've just stolen it out of a parking lot, you
Speaker 1: don't decorate it like that. So then because why it's
Speaker 1: not going to get The only thing that matters is
Speaker 1: what's going to get you noticed by the police, are
Speaker 1: pulled over by the police, and something like that. No,
Speaker 1: I won't necessarily get you, but you are going to
Speaker 1: get more noticed. I don't think that that's going to
Speaker 1: put you on the red flag, I mean on the
Speaker 1: cops radar, because we all see cars driving around with
Speaker 1: stuff written on the windows from the volleyball team or
Speaker 1: the basketball team or whatever or whatever it is all
Speaker 1: the time. I see that. I never read it. I
Speaker 1: don't care. It doesn't It doesn't make anybody stand out
Speaker 1: to me, that's fair. But there's also not like a
Speaker 1: man hunt happened, like if if if like there could
Speaker 1: be a man hunt going on right now, and the
Speaker 1: one that I went by today, I have no idea
Speaker 1: because Asheville is not a teeny tiny town. No, but
Speaker 1: I guess I would. I would to put it in
Speaker 1: like local perspective, I would say that the disappearance of
Speaker 1: zeb Quinn is probably on part with the disappearance of
Speaker 1: Karen Hormon. Yeah, you knew about that. And if somebody
Speaker 1: were like, hey, keep an eye out for this car,
Speaker 1: it's like associated with Again, how long did it take
Speaker 1: for the Kiren Hormon story to gain enough traction that
Speaker 1: everybody knew about it? Was it three days later? Was
Speaker 1: it a month later? I don't remember how long. Kids
Speaker 1: are much quicker, but I'm just saying there's there's a
Speaker 1: time scale here. So all right. The next question is, then,
Speaker 1: if you have killed this guy, why, or even if
Speaker 1: you haven't killed the guy, why two days later make
Speaker 1: the phone call the Walmart. Yeah that's kind of inexplicable,
Speaker 1: I know, and I don't understand that at all. So
Speaker 1: that those are my big three questions. Know, there's a
Speaker 1: few more too, Well, those are just just pertaining specifically
Speaker 1: to this theory. I have a lot of other questions
Speaker 1: for this case, but that's that theory. Well, there's also, uh,
Speaker 1: one of your other questions, I know is why they
Speaker 1: why were they going to look at a car at
Speaker 1: nine pm? Yeah, and I don't know that we got
Speaker 1: that from any anybody other than Robert Owens? Did we
Speaker 1: that they were looking at they're going to car? I
Speaker 1: don't know that the source was anybody but him. I
Speaker 1: don't think that it was. But it's also possible I
Speaker 1: didn't see, but it's totally possible that it was corroborated
Speaker 1: with by his coworkers, like his CoA like I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go look at a car, or even his mom. I
Speaker 1: can't remember if his mom ever knew where he was
Speaker 1: going after work. Yeah, I want some kind of second
Speaker 1: source confirmation of that. He didn't report him missing until
Speaker 1: the next morning, so I'm not given to understand that
Speaker 1: she was expecting him right after work. Yeah, but you
Speaker 1: know what it's funny is I've seen a lot of
Speaker 1: people saying, why why were you looking at a car
Speaker 1: at nine o'clock? At nine Oh my gosh, what the
Speaker 1: hell possible? People have lodges, but like your lights. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you're eighteen, and you don't work full time, like a
Speaker 1: nine to five Monday through Friday. Find a different day
Speaker 1: to go where you can actually take a look at
Speaker 1: the car or take it on the drive, or it's
Speaker 1: not dark out and like weird in the middle of
Speaker 1: the winter. I don't know. But if but if you
Speaker 1: if you go to somebody's house and they say, hey,
Speaker 1: I've got yeah, the cars in the garage and you
Speaker 1: turn on the light, it's the same thing as coming
Speaker 1: over there nine o'clock in the morning when the sun
Speaker 1: is shining, you can see the car, you can still
Speaker 1: take it for a test drive. All these things are
Speaker 1: still viable scenarios. Os. Yeah, but this isn't a huge
Speaker 1: part of the mystery. It's just kind of like a
Speaker 1: weird I don't find the going to look a car
Speaker 1: at a car at nine o'clock in that weird. But
Speaker 1: again I don't know. Maybe because I'm a lady, I
Speaker 1: don't I don't like doing things. I think that's it's
Speaker 1: probably part of it. As a guy, i'd be like, oh,
Speaker 1: it's eleven o'clock a night, Yeah, let's go look, let's
Speaker 1: check out that carver? Not interested? Thank you? If it's
Speaker 1: dark outside and there's not a lot of people around me, no,
Speaker 1: thank you. My next question is where did that dog
Speaker 1: come from from? Yeah? You guys are the worst, But seriously,
Speaker 1: like what like I think they I think they made
Speaker 1: some inqu is trying to figure out, like they talked
Speaker 1: to breeders and shelters and and they couldn't track it down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know. There's a lot of puppies being born though,
Speaker 1: it could just come from somebody, but it's still a weird,
Speaker 1: a weird bit. And if it came from somebody, right, Like,
Speaker 1: it's not as though again it's not as though there
Speaker 1: weren't inquiries. It's not as though people weren't on the
Speaker 1: news all the time saying hey, do you guys know
Speaker 1: where this dog came from. It was weird put it
Speaker 1: on the news, but you know it might not everybody
Speaker 1: watches the news. It's fair, I understand, but but I mean,
Speaker 1: this might be I might tie in with the hotel
Speaker 1: key to the other question, and am I tieing with
Speaker 1: the fact that they were driving this car around for
Speaker 1: two weeks and didn't get pulled over and busted, which
Speaker 1: is that they might have been on it. They might
Speaker 1: have been like out of town. They might have been trip.
Speaker 1: They might have been road trip into god knows where,
Speaker 1: and at some point along the way they stayed in
Speaker 1: a hotel, and sometimes at some point along the way
Speaker 1: they picked up a puppy not in that town. So
Speaker 1: that explains why no no breaders or shelters or anybody
Speaker 1: else in that town would recognize the puppy. Although at
Speaker 1: the same time, of course, if it wasn't just a
Speaker 1: black lab puppy, then well sorry, yeah, it's all alike. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's true. I guess I don't know. I one of
Speaker 1: the things that I wish I knew about this case
Speaker 1: was things as simple as odometer readings, right that, granted,
Speaker 1: his mom probably wouldn't know exactly what the odometer was
Speaker 1: on his car. He's eighteen, he was a zone free kid.
Speaker 1: But she would probably know like, oh, we had the
Speaker 1: oil changed this longer and go to the place that
Speaker 1: did the oil change or even I don't know it
Speaker 1: had about this much on it. If he's driving, you know,
Speaker 1: to Nashville. If he's driving, if it's this long road trip,
Speaker 1: that's happening, those miles are being racked up much quicker
Speaker 1: than he would have just driving around normal day to
Speaker 1: day life. I wish that was information that we had
Speaker 1: because it would sign some light on what was going on,
Speaker 1: at least with the car, if not with zev Man.
Speaker 1: It might be it might be information that the police have,
Speaker 1: at least, you know, if they're confident, because I'm sure
Speaker 1: they have the o'dominant reading, but I don't know if
Speaker 1: they have like a difference or anything like that. It
Speaker 1: just depends on things like did he get his oil
Speaker 1: change to Jiffy versus doing it himself. Um, you know
Speaker 1: that's changing now. You got to change there, and they
Speaker 1: had that little sticker they stick in the windshield, you
Speaker 1: got the odometer reading. They also keep records. Yeah, might
Speaker 1: also changed his oil because especially when you're young, and
Speaker 1: you know, young kind of broke. It's a lot cheaper
Speaker 1: to change your road yourself. Yeah, lots of people don't
Speaker 1: know how to do it. I mean again, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe he did. It's yeah, I can see a guy,
Speaker 1: you know, knowing how to do that. It's not rocket
Speaker 1: sign it's yeah really yeah, I mean I know how
Speaker 1: to do it. I just choose not to because put
Speaker 1: the bolt in, undo a thing, put the thing in
Speaker 1: phil or use synthetic oil and never change it. Whatever
Speaker 1: you want to do. Actually, I mostly go to Jiffy
Speaker 1: Live these days. But it's not because it's that hard,
Speaker 1: but just because I don't want to deal with getting
Speaker 1: rid of the old oil. Yeah, that is. My next
Speaker 1: question is about the hotel, right, is that you know
Speaker 1: they couldn't ever figure out where the key card was from.
Speaker 1: I don't know how key card technology works. None of
Speaker 1: our experts are experts in the hospitality business, unfortunately. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's so. In other words, you're
Speaker 1: saying there's no there's no way that they could have signature. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a generic thing. I've I've seen him do it.
Speaker 1: They they punched something and it just it's a magnetic
Speaker 1: impression that then the card reader at the door knows
Speaker 1: to pick up youation, does this frequency code, and does
Speaker 1: the next one, and that there is, but there's nothing
Speaker 1: unique like about the hotel itself. It's a it's a
Speaker 1: magnetic signature that is probably in every card reader or
Speaker 1: whatever the machine that that puts it into it, because
Speaker 1: I've watched them just grabbing out of the stack that
Speaker 1: was probably discharged and just stick it into the machine
Speaker 1: spits it out. It's yeah, so and but you know,
Speaker 1: it's not that puzzling really because it's very likely the
Speaker 1: hotel is not even in Asheville, North Carolina. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: that's a fair point. You know, as we've talked about that.
Speaker 1: While I was asking these questions, I kind of was like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's right. It could have been from not local. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's not that many hotels that don't, you know, some
Speaker 1: how put their name on the cards or anything like that.
Speaker 1: It seems like, hey, let's do a three hundred mile
Speaker 1: search radius for the hotels that don't have these specific
Speaker 1: key cards. And to be fair, right, because it's a
Speaker 1: very specific, especially in two thousand, it's a very specific
Speaker 1: set of hotels because many of them still had the
Speaker 1: actual physical keys that you have. It wasn't full key
Speaker 1: card technology yet. And then most of the ones that
Speaker 1: had key cards were the nicer, more expensive hotels that
Speaker 1: you've got their image on the back or whatever. So
Speaker 1: it seems like it again this is because I'm not
Speaker 1: a police officer, it seems like it would have been
Speaker 1: at least worthwhile to figure out which of those hotels
Speaker 1: were and see if you could pass a picture of
Speaker 1: zeb around and say, hey, did you see this car
Speaker 1: or did you see this guy. I'm gonna guess that
Speaker 1: the pool of hotels that you are thinking is rather
Speaker 1: small is quite large, because there is a lot in
Speaker 1: any town. There is a huge number of cheaper hotels
Speaker 1: that don't necessarily have the best clientele and therefore going
Speaker 1: to go to the magnetic system because they can't use
Speaker 1: a true key because you know, they're getting stolen all
Speaker 1: the time. But you know what, I'm not going to
Speaker 1: also invest in getting custom keys printed because that's not cheap.
Speaker 1: And if they're stealing the regular keys, you're gonna steal
Speaker 1: the electronic keys trying to use them on whatever. You know,
Speaker 1: I I'm not gonna go into cultures, but in terms
Speaker 1: of drug culture stuff. But people do this kind of
Speaker 1: weird stuff. So it's just screw it. We're going with
Speaker 1: the cheapest one possible. Shut it down. Yeah. But the
Speaker 1: other thing, and I'm sure you guys don't know this,
Speaker 1: the police know that they didn't. They didn't lift any
Speaker 1: fingerprints off the hotel card. I've never seen anything like that.
Speaker 1: They must have they did print it, but I didn't.
Speaker 1: I didn't ever hear that. But the thing about it,
Speaker 1: I mean, they could have lifted prints that just didn't
Speaker 1: match anything. That has to be it, because I mean,
Speaker 1: this is this is the other thing that will tell
Speaker 1: you something significant about the whole thing. That is, if
Speaker 1: they lifted no prints from the hotel key card, that
Speaker 1: means it was planted there deliberately. Yeah, it's a false clue.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, but they Yeah, Well, hopefully the police are
Speaker 1: smart enough to figure that out there are no prints
Speaker 1: on and hopefully they figured out that this is following
Speaker 1: this thing as a waste of resources. That is scary. Actually,
Speaker 1: that's a really scary thought. I hadn't thought about that.
Speaker 1: I hadn't thought about somebody think taking the time to
Speaker 1: white everything just plant stuff, plant stuff, you know, grab
Speaker 1: a jacket from somebody off the bus and then drop
Speaker 1: a key card that's generic, and then wipe the car down. Gosh,
Speaker 1: it would explain why it's such a random assortment of
Speaker 1: stuff in the car, right, I'll throw up puppy in here,
Speaker 1: and here's some drink bottles, and here's a key card
Speaker 1: and some weird random message on the back of the
Speaker 1: card and then drop it where. You know. The thing
Speaker 1: is is that it was dropped in a very strategic location,
Speaker 1: a stu. It was dropped, right, It's fair Maybe it
Speaker 1: wasn't dropped. Maybe it's that that person happened to be
Speaker 1: at that restaurant. It's a pretty large coincidence. In fairness though,
Speaker 1: that his car was found right next to the place
Speaker 1: of work of three is of his relatives. That's a
Speaker 1: huge coincidence. It was one of his relatives. It's not
Speaker 1: just kidding. Would have parked in the hospital parking lot, Yeah,
Speaker 1: they would be smarter than to do that. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, so, I think the senses that it was
Speaker 1: deliberately dropped to be found. If it was, then like,
Speaker 1: why with all that stuff in it? Was it? Oh?
Speaker 1: My gosh, was it? That's actually not a fantastic amount
Speaker 1: of stuff to leave in a car. It's not, but
Speaker 1: it's a weird assortment of stuff. It's not that it's
Speaker 1: that much. It's just a lot of random stuff. And
Speaker 1: somebody has said that the the combination of the puppy
Speaker 1: and the and the lipstick message actually was a was
Speaker 1: a message in it of itself, which was a puppy
Speaker 1: love I mean, the originally that one about you got
Speaker 1: the lips on the exclamation points and then I mean,
Speaker 1: it's possible. Yeah, I don't know. I don't even know
Speaker 1: what that means. But okay, all right, okay, so yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess all we can do is really hope that
Speaker 1: this case will be solved in the next year or
Speaker 1: two as the trial of Owens continues. If Owens did it,
Speaker 1: if Owens did it, certainly he might not even know
Speaker 1: anything about it. I mean, he's certainly after after what happened,
Speaker 1: and after what happened in March, she's certainly my favorite
Speaker 1: candidate now. But he also he also must know at
Speaker 1: least a little more given the call that he placed
Speaker 1: two days later, right because either zeb was truly alive
Speaker 1: and called him and said, hey, dude, call in for me,
Speaker 1: or he wasn't and he just decided to place the
Speaker 1: call for whatever reason. Right. I think if somebody says,
Speaker 1: I know I'm on death row, but no, I'm sticking
Speaker 1: to my story about what happened to zeb you, but
Speaker 1: probably trust what they're saying. Well. The other hard part though, this,
Speaker 1: this is my my concern with this offer of a bargain,
Speaker 1: is he may just fess up just to get off
Speaker 1: a death row. That's true too, they usually require proof, like, hey,
Speaker 1: tell us where you buried the body, right, You've got
Speaker 1: to be able to prove something. But it just it
Speaker 1: always I always am hesitant with those things because it's
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what I would do if I got
Speaker 1: convicted and went to death row. Not that I'm going
Speaker 1: to do something I swear you too don't do here
Speaker 1: have those drinks. But if if I was going to
Speaker 1: do something that I did go to death row and
Speaker 1: they said, oh, hey, you know, Steve, we think you
Speaker 1: did this other thing and if you admit to it
Speaker 1: will totally give you a life. Oh yeah, I totally
Speaker 1: did it, absolutely well. I did it. I killed the stuffalophagus.
Speaker 1: I totally did it. But again, now they'll probably demand
Speaker 1: a no worry dispposed to the body and stuff like that,
Speaker 1: you know. So yeah, oh yeah, I shredded him and
Speaker 1: I recycled him. He's made him nothing, but felt that's
Speaker 1: totally recycling. He certainly one of the long ways towards
Speaker 1: disposing of those other bodies. Yeah, So I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's kind of my feeling is that all I can
Speaker 1: do is hope. Honestly, I hope that Owen's did it
Speaker 1: and that he confesses and that that's what happened, because
Speaker 1: I want to know what is going on. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think that I'm more than that this is going to
Speaker 1: be solved, not to not too sure. I hope that's true,
Speaker 1: so people find out the way. Yeah, just there's so
Speaker 1: many damn questions. Yeah, there really are. I don't know
Speaker 1: what I feel. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And again I don't
Speaker 1: think it's not necessarily true that Owen's even murdered him deliberately.
Speaker 1: It could have been a fight and then actually death.
Speaker 1: You know, it could have been you know, and that
Speaker 1: happens happens to the best of us, and you know,
Speaker 1: you just hide the body and get on with your life. Right,
Speaker 1: So that's yeah, totally normal. Well, if you want to
Speaker 1: see some of our research that we did for this episode,
Speaker 1: you can find that as well as stream or download
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