Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, this is Matt and as you know, we
Speaker 1: are going to be taking the next few weeks off
Speaker 1: a little winter break for us, but we wanted to
Speaker 1: use this time to not have the feed be totally empty,
Speaker 1: So we are going to be doing some re releases
Speaker 1: and the intent behind these is to share some episodes
Speaker 1: that we just want to shine a light onto some
Speaker 1: of the best of the year. So this week is
Speaker 1: my choice, and the next week you're going to hear Bowens,
Speaker 1: and then the week after that, our producers Ana Hasnie
Speaker 1: and Becca Ramos have teamed up to choose their top
Speaker 1: episode of the year. This was not a difficult decision
Speaker 1: for me at all. I have chosen for the Night
Speaker 1: with Charlie XCX and here's a little bit about why.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think we can all agree that Bratt
Speaker 1: was the cultural phenomenon of the year. It just had
Speaker 1: so much crossover appeal in fashion and music and politics yish, but.
Speaker 2: Looking back, we did not know that at the time.
Speaker 1: I remember we got Brat a little bit early and
Speaker 1: I listened to it the morning of our episode, and
Speaker 1: I was really struck by the honesty in Charlie's lyrics,
Speaker 1: the progression in her music like I always am, but
Speaker 1: there was something really different and special about Brat And
Speaker 1: if you listen to the episode, a lot of the
Speaker 1: conversations that we have about you know, the lyrical content
Speaker 1: and the ideas that she's engaging in. This episode was
Speaker 1: the first time where she talked about a lot of
Speaker 1: that stuff. You even hear her say like in terms
Speaker 1: of girls so confusing. We asked her who it's about,
Speaker 1: and we have like a little bit of a fun
Speaker 1: back and forth with her about it, and she's, you know,
Speaker 1: she's weighing whether or not to even say who it's about.
Speaker 1: And then weeks later, obviously, you know, the Lord remix
Speaker 1: came out, and then you know, just snowballed into this
Speaker 1: cultural phenomenon that I feel like this had to be
Speaker 1: the episode that we re released, So I'm super excited
Speaker 1: to share again with you for the night with Charlie XCX.
Speaker 1: She also has a lot of interesting, fun things to
Speaker 1: say about Salt Lakes these last season, so it's kind
Speaker 1: of reaching back to our last episode with Angie two.
Speaker 2: But I just felt like this was the perfect episode
Speaker 2: to share with all of you. And I love Charlie,
Speaker 2: and you.
Speaker 1: Know, the Grammys are coming up, so I guess you
Speaker 1: can consider this a four year consideration ad as well.
Speaker 1: Y'all know how I feel about BRATT and how it
Speaker 1: should be taking out of the year. That's just my opinion.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so this is for the night with Charlie
Speaker 1: XCX WAH. Happy holidays, Thank you all so much. We'll
Speaker 1: see you in twenty twenty five. Next week is Bowen
Speaker 1: Yang's pick, but here's Charlie for now.
Speaker 2: Look mare, oh, I see you my own bowe And
Speaker 2: look over there is that the culture? Yes, goodness, Woe
Speaker 2: loves culture, ding dong los culture.
Speaker 1: He's just calling We're off to the races here today
Speaker 1: we prep British culture, British culture.
Speaker 2: More to com.
Speaker 1: I will say I'm a little upset about how much
Speaker 1: amon milk is in this.
Speaker 2: Okay. If the cameras are picking this up listeners at home,
Speaker 2: we can't see this. This is Duncan Donuts level chicanery.
Speaker 2: It's pure milk with a little bit of ice coffee.
Speaker 1: I was going to use the word chicanery two for
Speaker 1: the record, And I just want to say I wouldn't
Speaker 1: even want to walk down the street and people think
Speaker 1: that I have to coffee like this, like this is
Speaker 1: just more omond milk than anything. Can I get an
Speaker 1: amen up and hear in the words of RuPaul, this
Speaker 1: is just that. There's also like a weird pallid color
Speaker 1: to it. It doesn't have what I would call a
Speaker 1: healthy looking color. And you guys all feel me out there.
Speaker 1: You want coffee, not milk.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Becca. It looks like chocolate milk. I was
Speaker 2: going to say, next quick rabbit random mud lest I checked.
Speaker 1: I wasn't eight years old in my basement where I
Speaker 1: would drink chocolate milk on the regular.
Speaker 2: What's your merch story, Matt, just with like an artist
Speaker 2: that you love. My merch story, I'm wearing merchant. We merchant,
Speaker 2: but Bowen is in Charlie Merchant. By the way, it's
Speaker 2: very cute merch, which I say is a commment to
Speaker 2: you the wearer and you the seller. My merch story
Speaker 2: is I'm also currently wearing merch for drive away dolls.
Speaker 2: This is Focus Features.
Speaker 1: Send us this merch and I said, that's cute and
Speaker 1: I will wear it on the thing.
Speaker 2: I didn't know they were going to do this. They
Speaker 2: send it to us, and.
Speaker 1: After seeing the movie Challengers, I thought three someome cultures
Speaker 1: sort of in I do think of the threesome of
Speaker 1: MMF of MMF threeesome, and so I'm just sort of
Speaker 1: encouraging that. Yeah, here on the podcast, I hope you
Speaker 1: received who knows what happens today during the episode. I
Speaker 1: don't think it will be an MMF threesome, but we've
Speaker 1: got MMF here. Now, would you say that, like if
Speaker 1: between between let's say like MMF two dicks one bad,
Speaker 1: let's just go in with that parameter.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I might get so like Dick confused that I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 2: of course there's a vagina in the nex.
Speaker 1: Listen all I know, it's not shocked. You can't think
Speaker 1: about it too hard. I think when it comes to threesomes,
Speaker 1: you have to just take.
Speaker 2: It moment by moment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've had two in my life, Uh huh, and
Speaker 1: getting out of my way was important.
Speaker 2: No, I've had three.
Speaker 1: So the first one I was very in my own
Speaker 1: way the entire time, and I was like, I am
Speaker 1: doing this with more than one person, and it's a
Speaker 1: little bit of a break teaser. And then the second
Speaker 1: you just let that go and you have a wonderful time.
Speaker 1: You know what happened to me the first time what
Speaker 1: I was facing forward, facing someone great true North, and
Speaker 1: it was and then jump scare behind me, literally like oh,
Speaker 1: like I want someone to stick it in.
Speaker 2: They didn't stick it in. They just kind of kind
Speaker 2: of nestled behind me, and I was like, oh, I forgot.
Speaker 1: The crazy thing is when you're facing true North and
Speaker 1: sort of giving that are one one, you're a giving partner,
Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden you feel the third
Speaker 1: kind of really come through the back and you're like,
Speaker 1: I'm not in that zone right now.
Speaker 2: I need to know. So let's just all.
Speaker 1: Communicate and take it moment by moment everyone, And that's
Speaker 1: sort of our treative Challengers.
Speaker 2: If you want a little educational video. But again, you
Speaker 2: never see any three Challengers. You don't see any penetration anyway.
Speaker 2: What's penetrated me is the new album. It's a really
Speaker 2: penetrative album.
Speaker 1: Emotionally penetrative, obviously sonically and physically pet and the best
Speaker 1: way in a way that I invite and I'm open
Speaker 1: wide for angels.
Speaker 2: If you're listening, this might be offensive to the guests.
Speaker 2: If you mourn XCX world the way that some of
Speaker 2: us out here do. This album is gonna give you everything.
Speaker 1: You want and more. You're about to party. We're about
Speaker 1: We're about to party, but.
Speaker 2: You're also about to feel.
Speaker 1: And this is what I love about our guest and
Speaker 1: like it's just so sort of singular and iconic. Is
Speaker 1: like what I love is like you know, like emotional
Speaker 1: pop music, and you always get our guest perspective, her POV.
Speaker 1: It's always interesting and specific no matter what it is.
Speaker 1: I was telling Bowen, like when we were just at
Speaker 1: Prada Mange where we have all of our good conversations.
Speaker 1: I'm a huge fan of our guest ballads, ballad like
Speaker 1: I'm a ballad girl, and like you give that And
Speaker 1: I'm just so excited. The new album, Bratt is coming
Speaker 1: out June seventh and seventh. She's doing the Brat Tour
Speaker 1: and then she's going to the Sweat Tour with the
Speaker 1: Choicevon and on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so she's just doing Brat, Sweat, Brat. Why are
Speaker 2: you laughing? It's just so funny that I'm just sired, silent.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm.
Speaker 3: Two three tries. That was so fun linking to you
Speaker 3: guys gabaway thing about what you gab and saying about
Speaker 3: on your records.
Speaker 1: We're having fun too good. You are the most fun.
Speaker 1: You do truly.
Speaker 2: Intrinsically understand how to make us have fun. So nice,
Speaker 2: we're having fun on the way. You get a Big
Speaker 2: Day Baked Day recording that we're gonna release it closer
Speaker 2: to the album released. But you're going on seth with Troy. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and then watch it happens life also with Toy with
Speaker 2: a housewife. Do you know? No, I'm so sad about
Speaker 2: that you're just on solo.
Speaker 3: No, it's another man, Okay.
Speaker 2: I couldn't tell you who it is.
Speaker 1: I love that we will find out later episode like,
Speaker 1: oh that's true, and I'll be like, it's I love.
Speaker 2: Vineyards, I love I don't know. I think his name
Speaker 2: is Joe.
Speaker 1: Joe, And honestly, he's gonna ask you to be.
Speaker 2: We're going to really burn it out. We were talking
Speaker 2: here about last time you were you were on you
Speaker 2: were not as versed in the Bravo verse, and now
Speaker 2: you are all in one city exactly so, and you
Speaker 2: asked us a really important question, which was you want
Speaker 2: to ask us again? Yeah?
Speaker 3: My question for you both is are you pro Monica
Speaker 3: or the anti Monica?
Speaker 2: I'm tie sorry, no, no, no, that's okay. We and
Speaker 2: the way we answered was an we're Auntie Monica. We
Speaker 2: we were don't make fun of our guests, No I say,
Speaker 2: I say Auntie as well. We were so what my
Speaker 2: answer was. In the beginning when it all went down,
Speaker 2: we were very anti, were like get her off, like
Speaker 2: like none of the women want to film with her,
Speaker 2: like she is not allowed anywhere near them. And then
Speaker 2: now that they announced that she is no longer there,
Speaker 2: we're like, oh, it's going to miss something. The travesty.
Speaker 1: My thing is like I just want to watch a
Speaker 1: show where everyone speaks to each other because it gets
Speaker 1: boring when you.
Speaker 2: Have a cast that's like, I'm not talking to her.
Speaker 1: You don't see like once you branch out to other franchises,
Speaker 1: it's like when a cast is like not operating as
Speaker 1: a group. And they were also scorched earth with Monica
Speaker 1: at the end, like unwilling to speak to her. Can
Speaker 1: you give thoughts on Mary Cosby from your Charlie perspective?
Speaker 2: I mean, this woman is just She's on the album,
Speaker 2: she's gonna be.
Speaker 3: On the follow remix record, is just she is. I mean,
Speaker 3: I don't even know where you begin it's like I
Speaker 3: love her and I hate her, sure.
Speaker 2: But do we love you love her her hair? No,
Speaker 2: that's totally fair.
Speaker 3: My friend saw her at Sounds Hot Tower and apparently
Speaker 3: she was really rude to her.
Speaker 2: She was like.
Speaker 3: My friend was like, oh, can I sit here at
Speaker 3: the bar and she was like no. And then my
Speaker 3: friend was like, do you have someone coming? And she
Speaker 3: was like yeah, and then obviously no one came and
Speaker 3: it was just for her bag.
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
Speaker 4: And at the same time, I'm like, that's married legend.
Speaker 2: Yeah her do what? She inbread comment? Yeah, I was
Speaker 2: gonna say, and then she called your friend in brad
Speaker 2: or something.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But the inbred comment followed up with Heather asking her
Speaker 3: did you really call me inbred?
Speaker 2: And she goes, I did did?
Speaker 3: Yeah, you damn bitch, I did I do?
Speaker 2: I do?
Speaker 1: And then when they like went through it at the
Speaker 1: reunion to it was so bizarre because Heather was kind
Speaker 1: of just like threw up her hands and was like, listen,
Speaker 1: I respect that she said it.
Speaker 2: She speaks her truth. It's like, can you please Heather
Speaker 2: do all that? They talked to her like she's five
Speaker 2: years old. Either she's a mental patient, which she might
Speaker 2: be and like she's afraid of her, they're afraid.
Speaker 3: I mean, she gets a lot of free passes, you know,
Speaker 3: because well.
Speaker 1: That was funny when she was on Watch What Happens Live,
Speaker 1: Like they asked her a question like why did you
Speaker 1: come back?
Speaker 2: And she fully just goes.
Speaker 5: To help you guys out, I mean love, love, because
Speaker 5: you want to know why there's like not a thirsty
Speaker 5: bone in her body or like a bothered because you
Speaker 5: can tell she doesn't.
Speaker 2: Really get it right.
Speaker 1: So she's just like going to show up and say
Speaker 1: whatever the fuck it is. The rumor is now that
Speaker 1: she called Lisa Barlow's youngest son the word. That is
Speaker 1: the rumor that's happening for next season. Thoughts on that, I.
Speaker 2: See, I see, I see it. I can imagine it happens.
Speaker 2: You can imagine it happening.
Speaker 3: Yes, I imagine it happening. I'm fascinated by her wardrow.
Speaker 1: Yes, and the choices and the choices many colors, many
Speaker 1: actually got dressed in the.
Speaker 2: Dark times in a run and then she just went
Speaker 2: out with all of it.
Speaker 1: And isn't it funny that she's like the fashion She's
Speaker 1: the fashion god.
Speaker 3: I mean, the thing is she's gonna come for us,
Speaker 3: So are you ready? Like she's coming for us.
Speaker 2: I think she cares. I don't think she cares what
Speaker 2: we think. Yeah, maybe maybe.
Speaker 1: Feud for you though, Mary m Cosby.
Speaker 2: That's why no one. It would be so good. It
Speaker 2: would be so good. I'm pro Monica. That's great. I
Speaker 2: just want to pivot back to that.
Speaker 1: I'm pro Monica, and you said to us, you know,
Speaker 1: what she did wasn't really that bad, and we agree
Speaker 1: that it would be like if Troy ran a patrol
Speaker 1: account for like an anti Charlie Troy, like.
Speaker 2: Everyone leave after my set.
Speaker 3: But but was she Okay, here's the thing. I'm pretty
Speaker 3: like Flag in the Sand, like, I'm pro Monica, but
Speaker 3: I haven't actually done much research into reality vuntee, so
Speaker 3: I'm basing that on nothing. But I've heard from friends
Speaker 3: who I trust dearly that she wasn't really like talking
Speaker 3: shit about the.
Speaker 2: Women, so she was it was really.
Speaker 3: More of a gent and obviously that was her narrative
Speaker 3: on the show, which I was a little bit like,
Speaker 3: a right, yeah, yeah, but you know, God love her.
Speaker 3: But I was like, surely she's using that a little bit.
Speaker 3: But my reliable friends say that that was the case
Speaker 3: that she wasn't really talking about the women.
Speaker 2: I believe you're reliable friends.
Speaker 3: So then I'm just like, also, I'm like, guys, you're
Speaker 3: on Housewife.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know what it was those back she ran
Speaker 1: out of steam when it came to defending herself and
Speaker 1: explaining it.
Speaker 2: Like I felt like she sort.
Speaker 1: Of like threw up the white flag as it were.
Speaker 1: When it was go time. It was like, Okay, this
Speaker 1: is the reunion, explain what it was and what exonerates
Speaker 1: you about this, And it felt like she kind of
Speaker 1: just took it because she got confused and started to
Speaker 1: lean into the villain narrative, right, thinking that's what people
Speaker 1: would want, when it was like, no, what you want
Speaker 1: is to stay on the show, and they won't film.
Speaker 2: With you unless you can explain you get them on board.
Speaker 2: And then I think she was like gearing up to
Speaker 2: bring out that burn Book prop, like she was like,
Speaker 2: probably rough and a half the burn Book didn't learn
Speaker 2: that all went a bit a ride, isn't it. So yeah,
Speaker 2: you got to You've got to mean girls track on
Speaker 2: your album.
Speaker 1: I love this song thank You because it really is
Speaker 1: for that girl, thank you for the days that are
Speaker 1: trying to be that girl that day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know what's interesting about that song is I'm
Speaker 3: going to tell off you have Mark.
Speaker 2: Okay, excellent.
Speaker 3: So the thing is about the mean Girl's song on
Speaker 3: the album is that it's kind of like.
Speaker 2: A fascination with women like that in the culture. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Oh you know what, I was actually totally in my
Speaker 3: brain talking about a different song.
Speaker 4: No, I know, I remember talking about mean girls.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 4: Sorry, No, that really is just about like being a bit.
Speaker 3: Love So sorry, I was thinking, sorry, I was thinking
Speaker 3: about so confusing.
Speaker 1: Questions about this and okay, you don't have wonder if
Speaker 1: you answer. I think I think you've already and look,
Speaker 1: we're not entitled to any information.
Speaker 2: Okay, who's just about.
Speaker 3: No, I Miriam Cosby totally no, you know, I haven't.
Speaker 3: This is early Yeah, like this is the first time
Speaker 3: I've spoken about the songs. You guys are the first
Speaker 3: people to ask me. So I haven't quite decided whether
Speaker 3: I'm revealing.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: The problem when I wrote it, I was like, I'm revealing,
Speaker 3: But now you know, now the time is here, I'm like,
Speaker 3: I'm really I think I should reveal.
Speaker 2: I think not for your benefits, just in general, I
Speaker 2: think that whatever we're going to I feel at some point, yeah,
Speaker 2: in thirty years.
Speaker 3: My thing is people are going to guess Yeah I
Speaker 3: already probably both have an accurate guess, and I'm not
Speaker 3: going to ask you to say out loud because you'll
Speaker 3: tell by my face.
Speaker 2: Yeah okay, yeah, but I like that person, right, yeah,
Speaker 2: well you know you know what, yeah, like say it
Speaker 2: with your eyes.
Speaker 3: I think it's yeah, okay, okay, now I think.
Speaker 1: So.
Speaker 3: The thing is, it's like, I think we live in
Speaker 3: this like world of pop music right now, where like
Speaker 3: women are like I support other women.
Speaker 4: I love women. I'm a feminist and that's great, like
Speaker 4: love that, but artifice to it.
Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely, And I don't think that you become a
Speaker 3: bad feminist if you maybe don't see eye to eye
Speaker 3: with every single woman. That's just like not the nature
Speaker 3: of human beings. You know, there is a competitiveness between us.
Speaker 3: There is envy, there is camaraderie, there is you know,
Speaker 3: all of these different like dynamics, and I mean I
Speaker 3: feel that working in entertainment, there is this kind of
Speaker 3: dance that we all do with.
Speaker 2: Each other, whether you're in music.
Speaker 3: Whether in your you're in your world like, no matter
Speaker 3: how you identify, there is this dance that everybody's everybody's
Speaker 3: watching each other.
Speaker 4: Everybody's like posing in the picture, like hey, this is he.
Speaker 2: You're some good friends.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but then you're also like I want what they have,
Speaker 3: And then the next day you're like, they suck. I
Speaker 3: killed it today. And this happened, but no one really
Speaker 3: is like willing to discuss it. But we've we all
Speaker 3: probably have our person, yeah, maybe a few different people,
Speaker 3: and I'm sure we are that person for other people.
Speaker 3: And I just find that there is this like strange,
Speaker 3: like unspoken thing that often happens, particularly with women, because
Speaker 3: there is such a narrative of pitting women against each
Speaker 3: other within music. And sometimes that's not totally like fabricated.
Speaker 2: Do you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3: Sometimes there is like what's the phrase smoke where the smoke?
Speaker 3: Like I do feel like that sometimes does happen, And sometimes.
Speaker 4: It's like I don't know, everybody's just doing this little like.
Speaker 2: Square dance, totally like this idea like oh, women are
Speaker 2: pitted against each other. That shouldn't make you feel any
Speaker 2: worse or more complicated about the fact that like it happens.
Speaker 2: It's not. Why is it this red line all of
Speaker 2: a sudden you're not supposed to get into any other
Speaker 2: conflict with any other It's.
Speaker 4: Like it's unrealistic. It's unrealistic, and.
Speaker 1: It's not saying fuck her, You're saying it's confusing. When
Speaker 1: I feel like we got a lot of people saying
Speaker 1: that we do great stuff together. It feels like the
Speaker 1: vibe is good, and then I'm confused. It's like, am
Speaker 1: I okay with who the audience might fill in this spot? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Well that's the other thing about it.
Speaker 3: It's like, for me, this is like my favorite part
Speaker 3: of the high artness of music and the low artness
Speaker 3: of like pop stop ye. Like I like the marriage
Speaker 3: of the two, and I like that maybe people are
Speaker 3: getting it wrong, but they're like having fun playing the game. Yeah,
Speaker 3: because I think that that brings like kind of this
Speaker 3: three dimensional world two songs, you.
Speaker 4: Know, outside of just like the song's really good.
Speaker 3: It's like it's nice to plant like theories and ideas
Speaker 3: and let people like live their kind of Paris Lindsay
Speaker 3: fantasy with it. It's fun, but I also think it
Speaker 3: does this thing of like with the whole record, I'm
Speaker 3: kind of like doing that in ways, it's like holding
Speaker 3: a mirror to this kind of culture that we're in
Speaker 3: right now where everybody is really I feel like everybody
Speaker 3: is like their moral compass has to be so in
Speaker 3: check all the time, but it's like sometimes it's just
Speaker 3: like fun of it's not and everybody the listeners, like
Speaker 3: your moral compass isn't always like bang on.
Speaker 2: Like everybody's a little fucked.
Speaker 3: Everybody's like like shady. Everybody has like thoughts of all
Speaker 3: these different things, like everyone's kind of a bitch sometimes
Speaker 3: and that's okay, Like it doesn't make you a bad person,
Speaker 3: it makes you af flawed human beings.
Speaker 1: To put that into work too, because like I mean,
Speaker 1: I can't stand the morality thing as it applies.
Speaker 2: Like, but when did pop stars and let's just include
Speaker 2: in lump in like actors and shit, like when did
Speaker 2: they become like moral parragons because like, actually it's from
Speaker 2: my mom, Like in the seventies there would be signs
Speaker 2: up that said no actors. It's like we were like
Speaker 2: like we like they were like the rowdy, fucking like
Speaker 2: chaotic people and that's what everyone understood them to be.
Speaker 2: It's like these are not good people. Keep them out,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, and like maybe that's okay. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I wondered, like, it's interesting this celebrity culture, especially over
Speaker 3: the past like ten maybe fifteen years, has really like
Speaker 3: changed a lot in the I think niceness became a commodity,
Speaker 3: Whereas before niceness wasn't cool, right, you know, it wasn't
Speaker 3: like cool to be nice. No, yeah, and then like
Speaker 3: suddenly it really was. It was like, oh, well, if
Speaker 3: you're not nice, like you're dead, you know. But it
Speaker 3: actually just used to be like really cool to be
Speaker 3: like County. And I feel like we're slowly edging back there,
Speaker 3: but I still think we're in all nice era. I
Speaker 3: still feel like we're in our lights and everybody has
Speaker 3: to be so nice all the time, and that's like
Speaker 3: cool if you're like really actually just like chill and nice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, sometimes I'm like, I see you see through it,
Speaker 2: and we'll do. I think everything is too sensitive now
Speaker 2: to actually who you are.
Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
Speaker 2: Like the media, it's like if people are.
Speaker 1: Watching, they're watching so closely so that you can't really
Speaker 1: get away with like putting on a persona anymore. That's
Speaker 1: like really different from who you are because we see
Speaker 1: so much of it and we're inundated in the discourse
Speaker 1: and et cetera, that like we're ahead of the game
Speaker 1: that you're.
Speaker 2: Playing right, and you play it like really well, yeah,
Speaker 2: some people do really good team to cover shit up.
Speaker 2: But I feel like, and I mean this on such
Speaker 2: a complimentary level. You, I feel like you've stuck to
Speaker 2: your countiness the whole the whole way through.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I appreciate that. It's funny. It's like I
Speaker 3: think I.
Speaker 2: Can be bitchy. I don't know that I'm a bit right.
Speaker 3: That is a big distinction, you know, like I'm never
Speaker 3: going to be horrible to someone for the sake of it,
Speaker 3: because it's actually I personally find it a lot harder
Speaker 3: to be like deliberately like emotionally or mean or whatever,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. Like, And don't get me wrong,
Speaker 3: I'm sure I have my bad days. Like I'm not
Speaker 3: saying I'm a saint.
Speaker 2: But I'll also just like tell it how it is.
Speaker 3: And I think that gets misconstrued as being mean, but
Speaker 3: it's actually just I'm just being real because I don't
Speaker 3: think that it's that interesting to have this sort of
Speaker 3: like facade of.
Speaker 2: Like yourself and.
Speaker 4: You're all gonna die and I'm just like just.
Speaker 2: Like have fun. I mean, I think this album is
Speaker 2: kind of like on this frontline where a lot of
Speaker 2: a lot of artists are doing this now where it
Speaker 2: is like transparency, I'm bringing the fourth wall, Like you're
Speaker 2: singing about a G and Sophie and like like for
Speaker 2: the first time probably right and a little way and like, yeah,
Speaker 2: you're being very real about ships, like you're singing. I
Speaker 2: don't want to spoil the rest of the album, but
Speaker 2: like you were singing about things that like are very surprising,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, oh, I didn't think she would be
Speaker 2: she would have a song about like I think is
Speaker 2: that I think about it all the time? Yeah fourteen
Speaker 2: is that? Yeah? Yes?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I just remember because what track fut.
Speaker 1: Analogy It goes into the last track and I love
Speaker 1: the two together because it's such a psych out Like
Speaker 1: it's like you're talking about like really weighing things in
Speaker 1: your in the way where you are in life, Like
Speaker 1: now is the time when I should maybe really think
Speaker 1: about a family, if that's what I want, Like, is
Speaker 1: it okay with you that I think about this? Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: this occupies a lot of Space and then the next
Speaker 1: song is keys.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and I was like, and I was like, is
Speaker 7: this her answering it or is this her having fun yeah?
Speaker 2: Or is it both? Like it's it's not.
Speaker 3: The answer because I definitely I don't think I have
Speaker 3: an answer.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you have baby, we do cocaine is what
Speaker 2: you're saying.
Speaker 4: Totally all brand deal's gone.
Speaker 2: That's school.
Speaker 4: But no, I don't have an answer.
Speaker 3: But I think it's an interesting question to muse over
Speaker 3: because I mean, do you guys have many friends who
Speaker 3: have kids?
Speaker 1: Female friends are really starting I mean like even in
Speaker 1: the past six to eight months, like four or five
Speaker 1: of my friends I've had their.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like one of my friends had her third Wow. Yeah,
Speaker 2: oh wow? Is this your friend group?
Speaker 4: I don't have loads of friends who have kids.
Speaker 3: Yeah, But I had kind of one, like major friend
Speaker 3: in my life who's a songwriter who had a baby.
Speaker 3: She was kind of the inspiration for this song because
Speaker 3: I went to her house to visit her in Stockholm
Speaker 3: with her partner. They've been together for years, but they
Speaker 3: never really were like we're having kids. It just kind
Speaker 3: of happened, you know, And then it was so crazy
Speaker 3: going over to their apartment writing songs with them. She's
Speaker 3: wearing the same clothes she always wore, the apartments the same,
Speaker 3: they're exactly the same, we're writing songs, but it's just
Speaker 3: like everything is different because she has the key to
Speaker 3: this door that like, I'm not even in the same
Speaker 3: room as yet, do you know.
Speaker 2: What I like?
Speaker 1: It's almost like they now know something you don't know.
Speaker 1: And it's that wanting that like is driving the question
Speaker 1: in you exactly really interesting.
Speaker 3: Exactly and it's like you don't not to say that
Speaker 3: you can't you know, get the same sort of level
Speaker 3: of person. I'm not saying that, but I just I think,
Speaker 3: particularly like with her, for me, I was just like, wow,
Speaker 3: like we used to be so similar, and now your worldview,
Speaker 3: even though you're saying all the same things and you're
Speaker 3: the same person, you're also just like completely different because
Speaker 3: you have this new perspective that I can't even really
Speaker 3: begin to understand.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and it's just strange. But does it
Speaker 2: not give you some comfort that like she she's wearing
Speaker 2: the same clothes, nothing about her.
Speaker 3: Absolutely no, It's totally comforting. But then it's at the
Speaker 3: same time, it's just like, I mean, missing out like,
Speaker 3: and I think for me, it drives me to this
Speaker 3: place of like, do I want kids? Will I feel
Speaker 3: this new lease of life and this whole new world
Speaker 3: open up?
Speaker 2: If I have kids? Will I feel resentment towards the kid?
Speaker 3: Will I seamlessly be able to do both things and
Speaker 3: exactly the way that I want?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 3: Probably not unless I like kind of disregard the kid.
Speaker 1: Like you want to do an amazing job at both,
Speaker 1: And so I would also if I were in that position.
Speaker 1: I don't I'll ever have children, But if I were, really,
Speaker 1: if it was something that was on my mind, I
Speaker 1: would worry that it would like harm my passion and
Speaker 1: like what I know I'm supposed to do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like, is it going to change the
Speaker 1: way that I relate to myself as like this person
Speaker 1: who like in your cases out there creating and like
Speaker 1: being this like pop idol? And then I don't know,
Speaker 1: like it would it would change a lot, Like you
Speaker 1: don't know that you're gonna be exactly like your friend
Speaker 1: wearing the same ship talking about the same ship. For
Speaker 1: some people it really changes hard.
Speaker 2: But I feel like you have already been through a
Speaker 2: situation where everything was taken from you in some sense
Speaker 2: with lockdown. Like your response to that was like how
Speaker 2: I'm feeling now? So I feel like if like in
Speaker 2: a big life change situation like that, you already kind
Speaker 2: of I'm not saying what happened exactly that way, but
Speaker 2: you already know that. Like your response would be to
Speaker 2: like keep making true. Yeah, that's pretty interesting. I never
Speaker 2: thought of it like that, Noah, connecting dots. Last time
Speaker 2: I saw you was at SNL and at the Good
Speaker 2: Nights you were like, what's going on after? And I
Speaker 2: was like, there's a horse meat disco? And then I
Speaker 2: almost did you know? I went after you didn't miss much?
Speaker 2: That was that we love horse.
Speaker 1: Meat, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean you know this because you do it. But
Speaker 2: it's it's a lot of it's a lot of energy.
Speaker 3: It's late, it's late, but.
Speaker 2: Like the boiler room set looks fucking late. But I
Speaker 2: mean this is like, because when do you end one
Speaker 2: one and then then you go to the funny Mexican restaurant?
Speaker 2: Where was it Ro Mexico? What is okay? We rotate,
Speaker 2: we rotate restaurants.
Speaker 3: Why isn't it okay the same place? Why isn't it
Speaker 3: just a better place.
Speaker 2: You know what, do you really roll the dice and can't.
Speaker 1: But like sometimes I'm like where we're going and it's
Speaker 1: either a fuck yes or a calm on?
Speaker 2: But has it? It has been a.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and they would I went ROAs Mexico.
Speaker 2: Mexicano was oscar Isaac. I mean I had fun, but
Speaker 2: I had fun. You had a margarita. It was funny
Speaker 2: and you described it as a funny restaurant, and it
Speaker 2: is a very funny restaurant.
Speaker 1: It's hilarious. And we love Rose Mexicanos so much. We
Speaker 1: love them, we love them, but we want a table.
Speaker 2: To know it was gone. My brand Mexicano gone. But
Speaker 2: I like Charlie Famously, it's not a budget thing. It
Speaker 2: kind of is like it's getting a slash. I know,
Speaker 2: budget you need to come back when the party is
Speaker 2: at Love and you at Sacks. It's chic. There's there's
Speaker 2: room to walk around. But Charlie famously was the musical
Speaker 2: guest during the Omicron episode where it everyone was gone, right, well,
Speaker 2: can I say can I reveal? Like on the monitors
Speaker 2: on Thursday, like all the writers were fucking screaming because
Speaker 2: it was like, oh my god, it's.
Speaker 1: Like Caroline polojecks here, Christine's here, They're doing new shapes.
Speaker 2: And then like the world missed out on like the
Speaker 2: three of you being on the same stage on TV
Speaker 2: doing it was that was crazy.
Speaker 3: Gra that was crazy also because yeah, I guess we
Speaker 3: never did that performance that was we had.
Speaker 2: We were on a did you see a sound check?
Speaker 3: We're on a spinning platform, so cool, and like I
Speaker 3: love Caroline and Christine, but my god, that it was crazy,
Speaker 3: like because.
Speaker 2: Guys go crazy on it. It was like.
Speaker 3: Caroline wanted the platform to spin one way, one speed,
Speaker 3: Christine wanted to spin.
Speaker 1: The other way.
Speaker 2: I was like, I don't care what platform.
Speaker 3: COVID. It was just like so stressful. It was just
Speaker 3: like a lot, and then we finally figured out. We
Speaker 3: were so feeling so good about it, but like dancing
Speaker 3: on the platform.
Speaker 2: We're not falling over. We like we fucking killed it.
Speaker 3: And then we're literally we were in like we were
Speaker 3: getting ready like.
Speaker 2: And then on Saturday.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I was in gum and then
Speaker 3: Caroline was like it's not happening.
Speaker 2: I was like, what do you mean You're not coming
Speaker 2: and she was like no, It's like it's they pulled
Speaker 2: the plug on it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, entirely, well not my meatball sketch.
Speaker 2: Thank god? Played meat show?
Speaker 1: Was it?
Speaker 2: That was? That was the second show. That was the
Speaker 2: time you came back.
Speaker 4: Oh, I got a chicken Chicken, I was, I did
Speaker 4: some sketch.
Speaker 2: You were you were you were tricking or repair it.
Speaker 2: You were a parrot. You were a parrot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I was.
Speaker 2: Kind of like, oh.
Speaker 4: Well at least I kept that.
Speaker 1: And it was yeah, yeah, wow, a good one though,
Speaker 1: to play chicken with Paul. That's so snl coded.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1: Sketch comedy. Yeah, I was, I was a chicken in
Speaker 1: me ball.
Speaker 2: But then you were. But then the second show you
Speaker 2: did baby and then what what did you do for you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Rena wasn't there for Rena was not then.
Speaker 2: But speaking of sons of Towers, Towers holds a very
Speaker 2: special place in my heart because that was where I
Speaker 2: was when Crash came out, the whole album, and I like,
Speaker 2: it was just me in a room listening to that
Speaker 2: whole album. Went to the tour. You were fantastic, And
Speaker 2: I still say that that is the most well behaved
Speaker 2: audience because it's these lovely boys and girls just jump
Speaker 2: up and down the article. No one's like throwing elbows
Speaker 2: in the pit, you know what I mean. Everyone watches
Speaker 2: and they're polite. Angels are polite, But with this, do
Speaker 2: you want them to get a little a little bit more.
Speaker 3: I always want them to get chaotic, like whenever they
Speaker 3: You know, I'm lucky because whenever I bump into like
Speaker 3: a mass group of angels, they're very like.
Speaker 2: Sweet, you know, they like wait in line, they.
Speaker 3: Like have the lids off their sharpie like organized.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's never like like a ship show like I
Speaker 3: saw this TikTok of Paris. Hilton had done like a
Speaker 3: signing and it had got a little hectic and someone
Speaker 3: had like drawn on her like chanel bag, and I
Speaker 3: was just like that. I mean, I'm sure there's like
Speaker 3: there's lots more where it came from, but that is
Speaker 3: really like that's such a bummer.
Speaker 2: That would never happen with the.
Speaker 3: Angel Always, I always travel on a hair left it
Speaker 3: on the plane.
Speaker 2: You did you have my favorite? What's my bad? Because
Speaker 2: you have the banana, you have the line, yes, and
Speaker 2: you have the barreto. Is it the true emotion?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 2: No, no, No, that's that's no. What is it? It's
Speaker 2: that I just mixed emotions. You and I have the
Speaker 2: same fragrance.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm wearing a lots too late today. It's a
Speaker 3: new I haven't done it before.
Speaker 1: It's at a new thing. Yeah, I've switched and it's
Speaker 1: just like, what are you? I am on Delo Santos
Speaker 1: from Okay, I have that.
Speaker 2: I will say. Bow and Yang really tried to get
Speaker 2: me into Sunday cologne and that was not for me.
Speaker 2: Sunday it's called no, No, it's as well. It's called Sunday.
Speaker 3: Yes, Sunday something rainy Sunday. No, that's much I think
Speaker 3: about Sunday. It's just called Sunday. Sunday Colon Sunday.
Speaker 1: I found and I actually was wearing. It had its
Speaker 1: debut at Coachella on me, and I felt very good
Speaker 1: by the way. You didn't You didn't say me, but
Speaker 1: I saw you. Last year went off, people were getting
Speaker 1: people were getting fun, rowdy fun.
Speaker 2: How was Coachella this year? I tell she was fucking great.
Speaker 2: But makes an appearance in the Mean Girls song.
Speaker 3: Yes she does, because because hot girls listen.
Speaker 2: To Landa and me girls listen to It's true. It's true.
Speaker 4: I feel like any cool, like genuinely cool.
Speaker 3: Girl not only like likes Landad, but like understands like
Speaker 3: the law, like Lana in.
Speaker 2: A really deep way. She's total real.
Speaker 4: She's an art figure.
Speaker 1: She really is something symbolic, something right. Yes, when I
Speaker 1: was hearing that song, I was like, I see this girl. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you see her.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she like smokes skinny cigarette and being.
Speaker 3: Being she's a little le Yes, she's a little bit
Speaker 3: like she's got a vocal, fry vocal.
Speaker 2: But it doesn't feel dated. It feels very good on her. Absolutely,
Speaker 2: And I will say being at.
Speaker 1: Coachella around seventy five thousand of those girls, yeah, was
Speaker 1: a good vibe cool. And I wasn't sure about her
Speaker 1: doing the Friday night because I felt like that should
Speaker 1: be a party. Like in my head, I was like
Speaker 1: switch Dojah and Lana. Put Lana on Sunday night, Dojah
Speaker 1: will get everything started. And then now having seen it,
Speaker 1: I'm like everything was exactly it was, Yes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, did you go? I didn't gone. I've never been
Speaker 2: never been what people do with your music, though, I
Speaker 2: think like, if we're gonna compare Lana heads to like Angels,
Speaker 2: and people like really like love you. I feel like
Speaker 2: you get people to like do the digging of like
Speaker 2: oh my god, like it's this there's this whole album
Speaker 2: that you know, like they they really start to like
Speaker 2: dig through the crate. And I think people love to
Speaker 2: like take your stuff, all the stamms whatever, and then
Speaker 2: just like rearrange it and like they they have fun
Speaker 2: with the building blocks that you're giving. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: I think my music is like intrinsically like for the night. Yes,
Speaker 3: you know, you can't listen to it in the day.
Speaker 3: You can in the car like whatever, but generally it's
Speaker 3: like the best time.
Speaker 1: I remember, like I saw you at the will Turn
Speaker 1: a few years ago and just like what was happening
Speaker 1: on stage was so great and one of my favorite
Speaker 1: songs of yours is I Don't Want to Know, and
Speaker 1: like I just like you had this like really cool
Speaker 1: purple light just like I don't know, just like you're
Speaker 1: not like synesthetic, are you?
Speaker 2: I I could tell yeah, someone like got into your
Speaker 2: face was like you're not actually.
Speaker 3: No, no, no, I just it's like one of those
Speaker 3: things where you know, like when you do your first
Speaker 3: interviews and it's like one of the first things you've
Speaker 3: ever said.
Speaker 1: And then like it follows it's people are like she's synesthetic,
Speaker 1: test her, but you actually experience that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And for me it's like really helpful with writing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, when I'm writing, I'm like, this song is purple
Speaker 3: like and then I'll be like, hey, gee, you make
Speaker 3: the purple.
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you this question about like, when
Speaker 1: you sit down to write a song, is it like
Speaker 1: because it feels like equal parts important and obviously it is,
Speaker 1: but I guess my question is is it the sounds
Speaker 1: and like where you're going sonically that dictates what something
Speaker 1: is going to be about, or do you come in
Speaker 1: with an emotion that you need to get up?
Speaker 3: With this record, it's been very much that I came
Speaker 3: in with what I wanted to say, whereas on previous
Speaker 3: records it's not actually really been like this.
Speaker 2: With this record, it's been so lyrically led.
Speaker 3: Like I've been like I want to write a song
Speaker 3: about my kind of sticky relationship with my mom and dad,
Speaker 3: which was apple, or like I want to write the
Speaker 3: song about not being sure ever I want to have kids,
Speaker 3: or you know, like it's been very like it's there,
Speaker 3: it's in my head, like mean girls kind of like
Speaker 3: piecing that around like a few different girls I know,
Speaker 3: and thinking about like qualities that they have and putting
Speaker 3: that in a song three sixty.
Speaker 2: Luck and your bookends are there, it's thanks, yeah.
Speaker 3: And with that it was very like, Okay, I want
Speaker 3: to talk about me like being the like a sonic
Speaker 3: reference for people, but through the like lens of Julia
Speaker 3: kind of being the like New York like it girl,
Speaker 3: street fashion girl that everybody's referencing, you know.
Speaker 2: Julia Fox meaning yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: So it was like very specific and then kind of
Speaker 3: fun to build out these like pop songs that hopefully
Speaker 3: like a lot of people can relate to, but they're
Speaker 3: coming from like quite a specific idea.
Speaker 2: Right in place. And why do you think it didn't
Speaker 2: happen with the other albums. It just like wasn't the
Speaker 2: way it was.
Speaker 3: I think I was writing very much like the way
Speaker 3: I would write on previous records.
Speaker 2: We would build a track.
Speaker 3: And then I would get on the microphone and literally
Speaker 3: be like and then I would figure out the lyrics
Speaker 3: that fit the vowel sounds I was kind of making.
Speaker 3: So there was already this sort of like map of
Speaker 3: sound that you know, I was trying.
Speaker 2: To fit words to you're saying, this is lyrically.
Speaker 3: Where lyrically love and not really focusing too much on
Speaker 3: rhyme or worrying about like what fits within a stanza
Speaker 3: or anything like that.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: So actually, just I was really able to kind of
Speaker 3: just write lyrics I would actually say in a conversation
Speaker 3: rather than crafting them into this sort of like song
Speaker 3: version of what I would.
Speaker 1: Say, and even like melodically in the way that like
Speaker 1: the song forms around is like even with girls so confusing,
Speaker 1: it's girl, you know what I mean, Like there's something
Speaker 1: there that's the melody, like the way you.
Speaker 2: Really say it, like I want to do this, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, Like you know, it's just like
Speaker 2: it's like it feels.
Speaker 1: Like it's born out of something you want to say
Speaker 1: yes this time, and to hear that you say that
Speaker 1: is yeah, it works.
Speaker 2: But back on this thing of like I think this
Speaker 2: is like extremely transparent in the way and it is
Speaker 2: like holding up this mirror because like the worshack test
Speaker 2: of this album is the cover and everyone having all
Speaker 2: these opinions about like the care right and it's in
Speaker 2: your and I think you kind of threw it back
Speaker 2: of people in a nice way where you're like, no,
Speaker 2: this is actually like this completely reveals what you think
Speaker 2: like pop really should appear and how they should put
Speaker 2: out their work and stuff like that, which I think
Speaker 2: is great. But I think with the content of the album,
Speaker 2: it's more about like guys, like I think about like
Speaker 2: easy dark shit about my career. I'm not putting words
Speaker 2: in your mouth, but it's like, I think it is
Speaker 2: your most vulnerable album because you are being very honest
Speaker 2: about like how you regard yourself in a way that
Speaker 2: would have never occurred to me. You know, like there
Speaker 2: are allusions to like your career being in this in
Speaker 2: between and I'm like, oh, like six albums in like
Speaker 2: you feel that way, yeah, totally.
Speaker 3: Well, I just it's I think there aren't many people
Speaker 3: who have a path that I have that there are,
Speaker 3: Robin being one, and I think that's why there's a
Speaker 3: lot of like synergy between the two of us. But
Speaker 3: you know, somebody who had speaking about Robin now huge
Speaker 3: commercial success, yes, right at the beginning of her career, yes,
Speaker 3: and then kind of had to like rebrand and then
Speaker 3: became this kind of gay icon, kind of.
Speaker 2: Like Girl of the Night. No, that sounds wrong, but you.
Speaker 3: Know, like nighttime music like club like always no matter
Speaker 3: what she does, is always going to be kind of
Speaker 3: like looked upon as like a really important artist who's
Speaker 3: kind of like treading new ground and.
Speaker 2: You know, kind of like timeless.
Speaker 3: And I think, you know, we share similarities in that,
Speaker 3: you know, not my first music, but music for my
Speaker 3: second record was globally like commercially successful. But at that
Speaker 3: point of time, for me, I didn't really have my
Speaker 3: artistry kind of totally figured out in the way that
Speaker 3: I feel that I do have now. I mean, there
Speaker 3: were definitely like good through threads, but when I look
Speaker 3: at for example, like Sour Olivia Rodriguez, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: I wish i'd done Sucker kind of like that, like
Speaker 3: because I think there are parallels within those universes. But
Speaker 3: I think she just did it better because I think
Speaker 3: she I don't know, I don't think I knew myself
Speaker 3: that well at that point in time when I was
Speaker 3: doing that record, and I look at some of the
Speaker 3: decisions she made and I'm like, oh wow, it's like
Speaker 3: still really like pop and kind of like touching on
Speaker 3: this like live like punkish stuff, but it's done in
Speaker 3: a way that to me is still very cool. Whereas
Speaker 3: I feel like when I look back on Soccer, there
Speaker 3: at elements of it that I'm like, oh, that was
Speaker 3: just a bit annoying.
Speaker 2: Shing, you know what I mean. I've told you though,
Speaker 2: that like True Romance is still the perfect I don't
Speaker 2: know how you feel about that album, but it's like
Speaker 2: I feel like that is still for Charlie. That is
Speaker 2: still like that's the through throughout, that's the thing, And
Speaker 2: like I still listen to So Far Away and I'm like,
Speaker 2: this is fundamentally the same stuff she's putting it, she's
Speaker 2: put out through her whole career, and like that is
Speaker 2: like music of the Night where it's like it's like
Speaker 2: the beginnings of like bedroom pop, this whole thing now
Speaker 2: that has this whole you know, life and culture around it.
Speaker 2: Like I think you really broke ground in that way
Speaker 2: with it, Like yeah, Sucker is its own thing and
Speaker 2: that must been so strange and so complicated, but it's
Speaker 2: still a great record, The True Romance. I think it's
Speaker 2: still like you you can always always fall back on
Speaker 2: that first record is like yeah, I love that record.
Speaker 2: I love that record. But yeah, anyways, I think it's
Speaker 2: like it's just interesting. My career hasn't been like a
Speaker 2: to be It's been like kind of it's like a
Speaker 2: weird JPQ.
Speaker 3: To and it's like straddling this like commercial thing also
Speaker 3: being a songwriter, also being linked to the underground, disregarding
Speaker 3: that and coming back and you know, it's a mess.
Speaker 2: It's not a mess. It's that I think. I'm sure
Speaker 2: you nice way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. People don't have that
Speaker 2: trajectory anymore because we're so afree to take the risk,
Speaker 2: whether from the label or from the artists themselves. Like
Speaker 2: I think you have been so good about using whatever
Speaker 2: the apparatus is, whatever you have within you just like
Speaker 2: make it. Like that's like that's how I'm feeling now.
Speaker 2: Is to me, it's like, yeah, you just fucking made it,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: You have had these like when you describe it as
Speaker 1: a mass, it is interesting because it's like there's these
Speaker 1: spikes of like these mainstream moments, like going back to
Speaker 1: like boom Clap like that, being in like love Simon.
Speaker 3: Like that was.
Speaker 7: But I guess that's what it's like that kind of
Speaker 7: was our fault. They they're still gay though, but like that, And.
Speaker 1: Then I remember it was a few years ago now,
Speaker 1: but we were in the Fire Island movie, and when
Speaker 1: we found out that the Boys remix was going to
Speaker 1: be in our trailer, I was like, thank God, because
Speaker 1: this is going to get across like the fun of this.
Speaker 1: It's going to make it seem even more fun than
Speaker 1: it is like and also just like there was something
Speaker 1: about doesn't that song also start promising young women?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 1: Like so it's just like there are these like moments
Speaker 1: in like big mainstream that like you're right there, and
Speaker 1: so I wonder how do you feel when something is
Speaker 1: perceived on that level?
Speaker 2: Is that like an exciting thing or is it a
Speaker 2: little bit like.
Speaker 3: H no, no, I feel good about it. It's like, okay,
Speaker 3: I think because there are some things you mentioned that
Speaker 3: so like Fire Island promising young woman, those things feel
Speaker 3: really exciting to me and inspiring and happy to be
Speaker 3: involved in them. But I think it's like what I've learned,
Speaker 3: like going back and forth between this kind of like
Speaker 3: more commercial version of myself to this kind of more
Speaker 3: I'm really just leading with like what's in my brain
Speaker 3: and my you know, instinct.
Speaker 2: I've just learned now from doing it, So.
Speaker 3: I can't like fake. I just can't like fake pushing
Speaker 3: the commercial button.
Speaker 2: Likely. I can't. I can't do it. I can't like
Speaker 2: and that's no disrespect to the people who do.
Speaker 3: Some people are just like made to like live in
Speaker 3: that world and like they want to make the music
Speaker 3: that it's going to like really succeed in that world.
Speaker 4: And it's really hard to succeed in that world.
Speaker 3: Like I'm not taking that away from anyone, but like,
Speaker 3: I just can't do it because when I've written those
Speaker 3: songs and I put them out, it's like they only
Speaker 3: go so far because I think there's a block that
Speaker 3: the fans see as well.
Speaker 4: They're just like, she's not that girl. Like that's not
Speaker 4: who she really is.
Speaker 2: She's not that girl.
Speaker 3: Like some of them can, like maybe a less hardcore
Speaker 3: fan can get down with it, but it's like, you know,
Speaker 3: it's just like when you smell a rat or whatever.
Speaker 1: It's like, I have to just be yourself. Myself in
Speaker 1: the milk ain't clean. Yes, when you're not being yourself.
Speaker 3: And I can't fucking nor should you have to. I
Speaker 3: can't do because it makes me miserable.
Speaker 2: You have to sing that music every night.
Speaker 1: I think it was Dua who said we were just
Speaker 1: talking to her about her album and she we were
Speaker 1: talking about this like theme that she has of like positivity,
Speaker 1: and the messages that she has are usually like up
Speaker 1: and she's like, well, I have to sing it every
Speaker 1: fucking night. So if it's gonna be something that's in
Speaker 1: my mouth every single night, it better tastes good, like
Speaker 1: you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Like it's so funny because I'm the opposite of Yeah,
Speaker 3: really like if I had to sing really overly positives
Speaker 3: like boom clap is a good example.
Speaker 2: Obviously, it's so different from like.
Speaker 3: Radical optimism, like completely different sounding records, et cetera. But
Speaker 3: like that's funny that she says that, and that makes
Speaker 3: sense for her because she is I think she is
Speaker 3: always really kind of like seizing like the positivity in life.
Speaker 4: I kind of like to dwell in the Yeah, to
Speaker 4: kind of like sit in the ship.
Speaker 1: And externalize that because that is also a valid emotion
Speaker 1: that people out there are.
Speaker 2: I have to do it, I could. Yeah, that's so
Speaker 2: that's really interesting. Yeah. Yeah, But like I feel that
Speaker 2: this is like just like like the pendulum, like.
Speaker 3: A vision of like me performing Radical Optimism and doing
Speaker 3: Brat Brat being like three six five putty girl, and
Speaker 3: then me doing Yeah and like both of us like
Speaker 3: being on our like the versions of what those tours are.
Speaker 2: And I want to see that how is that? How's
Speaker 2: how's it going down? This is? But this is how
Speaker 2: you know that? Like you're doing the right thing?
Speaker 1: Is that?
Speaker 2: Like you Yeah, Like we love Doua.
Speaker 1: It would be crazy if she did three sixty, and
Speaker 1: it would be kind of crazy if you did Radical Optimists.
Speaker 1: It's like you are doing the thing you were meant
Speaker 1: to do. It is purely externalized from whatever your inner
Speaker 1: life is.
Speaker 2: And I feel like you're what you're saying is maybe
Speaker 2: the pendulums stops swinging, like you've landed in this nice
Speaker 2: space of like I'm in between or I'm more of
Speaker 2: this one thing than I am this thing, And like
Speaker 2: I feel like reflective surfaces are a big part of
Speaker 2: this album. That you look at the mirror, you see
Speaker 2: me like and you're holding up a mirror to society,
Speaker 2: the reflective but like it.
Speaker 1: Use it like a mirror, like a mirror. We had
Speaker 1: asked Charlie the question, yes we do. So this is
Speaker 1: the central question of last culture. It's what was the
Speaker 1: culture that made you say culture is for you? You
Speaker 1: can look back and be like, I am largely me
Speaker 1: because of this thing I experienced.
Speaker 3: I think it was and maybe this is not its
Speaker 3: very surprising, but I think it was like the London
Speaker 3: rave scene and that like culture of like London warehouse
Speaker 3: policies that I kind of came up through because that
Speaker 3: sort of in turn put me very onto kind of
Speaker 3: like club kids stuff.
Speaker 2: When I was younger and when I was in art school,
Speaker 2: I was always kind of like in this sort of
Speaker 2: like Lee Bowery like buyer, like Michael Alec kind of yeah,
Speaker 2: but still there was a cool scene.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like those parties, like that level of yes, totally
Speaker 3: and that level of kind of like diy esthetic with
Speaker 3: clothes and music.
Speaker 4: And yeah, I think that really formed who I am.
Speaker 2: How did you find it?
Speaker 3: I think it was from starting going to these parties
Speaker 3: because when that.
Speaker 4: Must have been like two thousand and seven and eight.
Speaker 2: When I was going in London I was young. I
Speaker 2: would go with my parents, Oh wow, which was not cool.
Speaker 2: But were you guys like in Essex going to Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: they would drive me.
Speaker 3: I would get asked ahead of my space, and I
Speaker 3: knew this like promoter who was like come and play
Speaker 3: and we would like drive into London and I would
Speaker 3: play at like three am.
Speaker 2: Being booked for these yeah, it was being booked.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And that was kind of my first like look
Speaker 3: into kind of night life and like party culture at
Speaker 3: that point in time.
Speaker 4: I guess it was like our version of Indie Sleeves.
Speaker 3: It was New Rave, which was like you know for sure, Yeah,
Speaker 3: And so that was sort of like a kind of
Speaker 3: regurgitation of you know, all the prior like first second
Speaker 3: wave of club kids that were coming before. So I
Speaker 3: kind of just got sort of like sucked in through
Speaker 3: that way.
Speaker 2: But like and then you learned about the prior wave,
Speaker 2: it felt like education. There was some like rooting for this.
Speaker 2: It wasn't like it just kind of came about of nowhere,
Speaker 2: like you had a history to like, yeah, I had.
Speaker 4: I had to soak in the history because I wanted
Speaker 4: to understand.
Speaker 3: Like what Michael Atlck was doing and what like that
Speaker 3: original like club scene and like those club kids were
Speaker 3: doing back here in New York and those levels of
Speaker 3: like crazy parties they would throw like they threw one
Speaker 3: on a bridge where all they like shut both ends
Speaker 3: of the bridge and like you know, just this like
Speaker 3: lore of like partying and how that kind of like
Speaker 3: spawned into music and then began to kind of create
Speaker 3: like new sounds of music.
Speaker 2: I think that it's like such a rich thing thing
Speaker 2: for me. Yeah yeah, yeah, like like you like at
Speaker 2: the Limelight would have been so fucking imagine. Yeah, wild.
Speaker 2: But that's where do you live now? Do you do
Speaker 2: you still like I'm half in La and half in London. Yeah,
Speaker 2: back and forth La out of necessity or.
Speaker 3: Do you like it?
Speaker 2: I am beginning to maybe be over it. I've been
Speaker 2: there for ten years. That feels like that feels like
Speaker 2: double yeah, the amount of time it would take over it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm thinking about New York. Actually, I think New York.
Speaker 2: I lived here. I think New York is New York
Speaker 2: and London.
Speaker 1: Like I guess, like if you were someone who wanted
Speaker 1: two different experiences in the two places you live, Like
Speaker 1: I'm here because I want to rest, meaning LA, and
Speaker 1: I'm here because I want to be included in what's
Speaker 1: going on and like the culture that's London, but like
Speaker 1: New York is New York.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do. If we can rest in New York.
Speaker 2: I love London too. Did you love performing at Coachella?
Speaker 2: I was, honestly so scarce.
Speaker 3: Was it scary yeah, because you know with stage Yeah,
Speaker 3: and everyone was like, it's all about the live stream.
Speaker 4: Everyone's like about the live stange. That made me kind
Speaker 4: of treat them.
Speaker 2: On like TV. Oh was that helpful?
Speaker 6: Now?
Speaker 2: Well, I was happy with.
Speaker 3: How it looked and how I sounded because I was
Speaker 3: thinking so much about the broadcast.
Speaker 2: But it definitely like was just stressful. That wasn't a
Speaker 2: major you know, it was a major change.
Speaker 1: I remember we saw Chapel in the Golbie tent and
Speaker 1: then right after that we walked over to Sabrina Carpenter
Speaker 1: on the Coachella stage, and I remember.
Speaker 2: It felt like the energy was lower.
Speaker 1: But then I was like, oh, but on this stage
Speaker 1: they're thinking about the live stream, whereas in like the
Speaker 1: Golby and Sahar tents, they're just giving.
Speaker 2: A live show and it feels like that.
Speaker 1: Like, so the live experience does feel I would imagine,
Speaker 1: and like more alive there, and maybe as the performer
Speaker 1: it feels more connected, whereas like on the Coachella stage
Speaker 1: where you were, it is a lot about like they're
Speaker 1: watching it at home.
Speaker 2: Yeah it was scary. Yeah that's okay. I mean what
Speaker 2: would I was having the best? Lee? You used to
Speaker 2: do these like videos, these little short films of him
Speaker 2: like teaching you how to like have tea. Like he
Speaker 2: was just so adorable people don't talk about with Lee
Speaker 2: Bowry is like, yeah, it's like the looks and all
Speaker 2: these things, but it's like at his heart he was
Speaker 2: just like sensitive Australian Australian may I got confused to
Speaker 2: as a bread But you know, maybe maybe you're right,
Speaker 2: Maybe you're right. No, we can't look it up. I hope,
Speaker 2: I hope you're both wrong. But like, did it take you? Like,
Speaker 2: was there a developmental thing for you to like grow
Speaker 2: up in that and then be like I'm gonna like
Speaker 2: do you like I'm gonna make this like part of me.
Speaker 3: I don't think it was a choice. I think it's
Speaker 3: like it just I gravitated so hard towards it. I
Speaker 3: think it was like I saw elements of myself in
Speaker 3: what was being created in the world that I was
Speaker 3: looking into. There was there was like a punkness and
Speaker 3: like a kind of freeness, and it felt that there
Speaker 3: was like a possibility to be a little messy and
Speaker 3: not perfect and not look a certain type of a
Speaker 3: way to still be able to express yourself and feel
Speaker 3: really like validated or something.
Speaker 2: And I think I was searching for.
Speaker 6: That a lot when I was growing up, and that
Speaker 6: that could be a version of success is just going
Speaker 6: there and participating and being in the culture and being
Speaker 6: around people that make you feel good and not this
Speaker 6: like more calculated metric of like, well did this happen?
Speaker 2: Did you look like this right?
Speaker 4: And be rewarded for being a freak?
Speaker 3: I think that was I think that was something that
Speaker 3: really like made me like gravitate towards that world, because
Speaker 3: that was what was like celebrated if you would like
Speaker 3: really like wearing something like weird or like you know
Speaker 3: what I mean, or like you got attention, you got
Speaker 3: like something, yeah, right, I was like, Oh, that's cool,
Speaker 3: Like you don't have to be this kind of traditional
Speaker 3: version of beauty or talent or like whatever it is.
Speaker 3: It's that you can kind of make a fantasy and
Speaker 3: it be valid even if it's like a little fucked.
Speaker 2: And ugly, you know, or whatever that's your rout though,
Speaker 2: Like that's why it's like you don't have to worry
Speaker 2: about being like the moral model for anything. It's like
Speaker 2: just like let that shit go because you started out
Speaker 2: in this like environment where like it didn't really matter.
Speaker 2: Like nightlife culture is about like unrepressed everything. It's just
Speaker 2: like humanity revealing itself and being so like, no, I
Speaker 2: love it, you know what I mean? And I love it.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting. Have you done Mighty Hoopolo? I have
Speaker 2: been to Mighty Hooplo. I don't don't want that. Things
Speaker 2: like big queer, Like it's like a weird.
Speaker 1: When is that?
Speaker 2: Four times? What's that? What's that? There's a park that's Victoria.
Speaker 2: I haven't done it.
Speaker 1: You haven't done it, no problem, but it's like it's
Speaker 1: like a teeny tiny coach but in London with all
Speaker 1: queer Jason.
Speaker 2: That's so yeah, it's fed. It's fucked in a crazy way.
Speaker 2: Excited for tour, I am. Have you guys been wanting
Speaker 2: to tour together? It feels like such a natural. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, we have the same manager.
Speaker 3: Our manager has been trying to get us to talk
Speaker 3: together for years and every time we're like, yeah, like
Speaker 3: obviously we love each other. But I think the music
Speaker 3: has never quite lined up, and now it's like so
Speaker 3: lining up.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 3: So this time when our manager like for like literally
Speaker 3: the fifth time, was like, you guys want to together,
Speaker 3: we were like, yeah, we do because it really made sense.
Speaker 2: Could see how it would really like flow and work together. Yeah,
Speaker 2: sung together, I think so.
Speaker 3: Were to be honest, we're still putting it together. But
Speaker 3: I think that yes, it's what people. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: I don't think it's going to be like a full
Speaker 3: Medley situation, but there's definitely going to be a few moments.
Speaker 2: You guess. I did see you guys. I think it
Speaker 2: was also at the will Turn like it was just
Speaker 2: you guys were on the same show. Yeah, it was
Speaker 2: a festival that I think we both did together. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because I remember just thinking that I forget festival.
Speaker 4: That maybe was Troy's invention, but maybe it was also
Speaker 4: my mind.
Speaker 2: But I don't remember. He totally did every year he did. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: well it's going to be it's gonna be.
Speaker 1: Wait, people were freaking out, yes situation, which is always
Speaker 1: a good feeling when it's like.
Speaker 2: Tickets, I know. So yeah, we're so happy. We're really happy.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be fun. It's like pretty quick. Huh, I don't.
Speaker 2: It's like a couple of months, right, It's like not
Speaker 2: even is it like five weeks? Okay? Where is it
Speaker 2: in New York? Is it m S G y? Obviously
Speaker 2: it's gonna be really fun. And you know I've paid
Speaker 2: top dollar for you, like I don't anymore. Yeah, I'll
Speaker 2: take it. I'll take it.
Speaker 1: I did hear a story one time of I won't
Speaker 1: say any details until after, but there was an artist
Speaker 1: who was in a big feud with this other famous
Speaker 1: person and the famous person reached out like years after
Speaker 1: to like get tickets to a show, and the person
Speaker 1: just sent back a ticket link and said buy one.
Speaker 3: I love.
Speaker 2: All right, So it's time for I don't think so many, okay,
Speaker 2: and I just know.
Speaker 1: You're gonna pop the fuck off. So this is this
Speaker 1: is our sixty second segment where we drag name cultural item.
Speaker 5: Here.
Speaker 2: I walked into this myself today. Uh it's my own fault,
Speaker 2: but I am gonna okay, here we are there's some
Speaker 2: self accountability. Yes, is Matt Rodgers. I don't think some
Speaker 2: of these time starts. I don't think so, honey. Wearing
Speaker 2: a graphic tea on the subway in New York. Because
Speaker 2: here's the thing.
Speaker 1: People are gonna read it, and then they were gonna
Speaker 1: engage with it, and then you're trapped with them for
Speaker 1: what could be as much as a half hour. So
Speaker 1: today I have a shirt on that says, is it
Speaker 1: gonna be a threesome? I'm challengers coded my whole life
Speaker 1: right now. This is merch from Focused Features. Thank you again,
Speaker 1: Driveway Dolls and for Driveaway Dolls. Haven't seen it yet,
Speaker 1: but Wade's sister. I just know that I was on
Speaker 1: the subway today with a gentleman who could read the
Speaker 1: shirt and did out loud, and so then he was
Speaker 1: engaging with it. He caused everyone to turn and I said,
Speaker 1: you know what, maybe if I hadn't worn a shirt
Speaker 1: with words on it that could be read, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: be having a conversation at all, least of all about threesomes.
Speaker 1: And this person was not necessarily someone I wanted to
Speaker 1: engage with about threesomes.
Speaker 2: If you know, if you see me wearing this and
Speaker 2: you think we would vibe, I don't know. Maybe I
Speaker 2: will be wearing it the whole rest of today. This
Speaker 2: episode comes out in like three weeks, but I'll wear
Speaker 2: it again.
Speaker 1: Actually, yes, today this episode is released, I'm gonna be
Speaker 1: walking the streets and you're wearing.
Speaker 2: It, say hi, but not if you're like a crazy
Speaker 2: person on the STU. And that's one minute. So that's
Speaker 2: my I don't think on today. Very so good, Thank you,
Speaker 2: I'm going to You're gonna be so good. We all
Speaker 2: we all know you talk super fast? Do I recording media?
Speaker 1: You go?
Speaker 2: Let me tell you something like in a way now,
Speaker 2: I'm like, do you know way that It's like, oh,
Speaker 2: you mean in song? I'm just saying your we know
Speaker 2: you can get, you can hit, you can rip. You
Speaker 2: know what I mean in that way? Is that like
Speaker 2: a problems? Yeah, everyone's thinking about Charlie's. They're like, yeah,
Speaker 2: she just talks too fast.
Speaker 3: It wasn't so fa.
Speaker 2: I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1: No, I'm just saying, like, I've heard that album. I
Speaker 1: know that, I know that you can keep up the tempo.
Speaker 1: I understand speaking of tempo, you're ready to fucking do this? Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so this is Villa Yang's I don't think so, honey.
Speaker 1: As time starts now, I don't think so, honey, pubic hair,
Speaker 1: Why is it looking different down there than up here?
Speaker 1: I look like miss Frizzle got a dye job, and
Speaker 1: I'm curly, curly curly, and I wish I could get
Speaker 1: a perm up here and make my give myself a
Speaker 1: little swoop. My pubic hair is so tightly coiled down there,
Speaker 1: and when you see it on the bathroom floor, you go,
Speaker 1: oh no, that is not something I want to see.
Speaker 2: And it's if you're living alone like me, it's just you.
Speaker 2: I don't like how I don't like it. I don't
Speaker 2: like what it says about me. I think pubic hair
Speaker 2: like either. When you have it, it's like, oh, let's
Speaker 2: let's shear it, and then when you don't have it,
Speaker 2: it's like sheer, well, now.
Speaker 1: You look like a fucking mole rat. There's between second.
Speaker 1: Why can't we just stay there?
Speaker 2: And I'm as sure as helling are removing it because
Speaker 2: it's like because, like I said, if it's gone, it
Speaker 2: looks even crazier than if it is. A five seconds
Speaker 2: but it's a jungle, and I have a really crazy situation.
Speaker 2: I don't know why it's different down there. It is
Speaker 2: in body hair all supposed to be the same, and
Speaker 2: that's what minute.
Speaker 1: You are the only person I believe in history to
Speaker 1: say you wish what was down there, You wish your
Speaker 1: pubic hare was on your head.
Speaker 2: I just wanted to go both ways. If my hair
Speaker 2: on my head looked pubic, I'd be like, well, at
Speaker 2: least it's consistent, right, This is so shocking. First of all,
Speaker 2: laser hair removal on your pubic area, asshole. Maybe some
Speaker 2: people do it.
Speaker 1: The guys I've been hooking up with lately don't seem
Speaker 1: to care at all about maintaining it down there, right,
Speaker 1: or maybe they just think they don't care what I think. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it has been so wild and free you
Speaker 1: as I think, no matter your gender. It's like there
Speaker 1: is not a great way to manage it, like period.
Speaker 1: Well maybe it's also because I'm hooking up with like
Speaker 1: men that are my age in their thirties and not
Speaker 1: like just giving up. This isn't like when you're in
Speaker 1: fresh in your twenties and everyone thinks like, oh, I
Speaker 1: should like manscape or whatever, or like really keep it
Speaker 1: clean down there. It's like give it a rest, girl,
Speaker 1: Like we're all just trying to live life. When no
Speaker 1: one cares that you're a hairy one.
Speaker 2: No one cares. But I bet your people cares thrilling,
Speaker 2: it's freshly shorn. Why you have plans later? No, I
Speaker 2: just it was getting out of hand and I am
Speaker 2: in that liminal space now where I'm like, this sucks. No,
Speaker 2: I'm actually okay, I'm moisturizing cool down there.
Speaker 1: I guess I should use I should try my purple
Speaker 1: shampoo for my blonde get blonde pube.
Speaker 2: Do my heart just skipped me something, You're like, just
Speaker 2: speak the truth. This is Charlie Xx's I don't think
Speaker 2: so many of your time starts now, Okay, I don't
Speaker 2: think so, honey.
Speaker 3: I'm actually coming for a group of people, these people
Speaker 3: who have this stuck up I roll the attitude towards
Speaker 3: reality TV, you know what I mean. Back to the
Speaker 3: beginning of our conversation, what is not to love? I
Speaker 3: feel like there is such a high low conundrum to
Speaker 3: reality TV that just makes me want to sink my
Speaker 3: teeth in. Whether it be our favorite Housewives for Salt
Speaker 3: Lake City Potomac also heard, also heard it's pretty good,
Speaker 3: but also what about some other amazing shows below Deck,
Speaker 3: below Deck, Down Under Below Decks, Sailing Yard, below Deck,
Speaker 3: Mediterranean Love Island, Australia, British heard the US wasn't that good.
Speaker 3: But anyway, I just think that there is such a psychology,
Speaker 3: such a wonderful, amazing world to delve into on reality TV.
Speaker 3: It's like the factory. It's absolutely fabulous. Just keep it
Speaker 3: coming and don't judge it.
Speaker 2: And I don't think still, honey, the world there. Reality
Speaker 2: TV is not trash. It's not trash.
Speaker 3: It's all it's art. You watched Sweat during that, Oh
Speaker 3: my god, I was like sweated and look, but that's
Speaker 3: like a.
Speaker 2: Good sign like we had. It was just like, oh
Speaker 2: my god, wait to clearvoid come in recently and he
Speaker 2: when he sweats, he means it's the spirit movie. It's
Speaker 2: like energy is moving through. That's what's happened. Amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you should watch Couple's Therapy. Oh, it's so good
Speaker 1: with around.
Speaker 2: She is the sexiest. She so sexy. Do you want
Speaker 2: to be here? I love her and what just happened here?
Speaker 2: I love just a tiny little what and what's and
Speaker 2: what what was? She's like talk about this, She's amazing.
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you watched it. I love her. I
Speaker 2: think her fashion is incredible. It just cheat.
Speaker 4: Yeah, her apartment's really cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah, have you gotten to the lockdown stuff yet where
Speaker 2: they bring the cameras into her apartment because she's doing
Speaker 2: all of it through like tell her. So you see
Speaker 2: her apartment and it's like kind of messy in a
Speaker 2: very charming way. She's got our kids running her round?
Speaker 2: How many kishses does she have to? I think she's
Speaker 2: so fast. I love is when she speaks to her therapist.
Speaker 3: Yeah, real, yeah, Virginia, Virginia's fron coat.
Speaker 2: She's a real super sar. But you've finished it all
Speaker 2: the way through, there's like, I mean, whatever we want
Speaker 2: to talk about. There's there's really Palestinian queer couple that's amazing.
Speaker 2: And then like and then Order is like when she
Speaker 2: finds out that one of them is Palestinian and she goes,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm from Israel, right, and then order like
Speaker 2: blessed like is like on socials being like this is
Speaker 2: crazy anyway, but you should watch it all the way through.
Speaker 2: You would love it. I hon't wait. But that's between
Speaker 2: like that's not quite reality. It's not quite documentary, right.
Speaker 2: It's like they know they're being filmed, but they can't
Speaker 2: see the cameras.
Speaker 3: I think they've done that. Shut by I have no
Speaker 3: idea how long we have left, but I'm like, please don't.
Speaker 3: We could do a whole episode on this. I feel
Speaker 3: like they've shot that show in a really tasteful way. Yes,
Speaker 3: and I hope it never changes, you know.
Speaker 2: What you want to what it is.
Speaker 1: It's like you can tell that well, obviously it's all
Speaker 1: hit and that's like part of it, but it's still
Speaker 1: really elevated the way they shoot it. And I just
Speaker 1: what I love is that they seem to catch micro
Speaker 1: emotions like it's really like intentionally edited, and I believe
Speaker 1: it's like really smartly done through her lens. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: we're making a joke about like what was that? We
Speaker 1: saw it too, you know what I mean? And also
Speaker 1: it has to be so crazy like to be in
Speaker 1: those sessions and then watch it after because it's also
Speaker 1: an edited version of that session. That would also maybe
Speaker 1: give you a little bit of a complex like why
Speaker 1: am I being edited this way and not that way?
Speaker 1: Like I can't understand saying yes to that, but I'm
Speaker 1: so thrilled that people do me too.
Speaker 2: Do you have a favorite couple or most nice?
Speaker 1: Like the young queer couple, Like they were really young
Speaker 1: and they had been in a relationship for like three
Speaker 1: years sort of formatively, and one of them wanted to
Speaker 1: be in an open relationship and the other did not
Speaker 1: or was adjusting to that. And I think ultimately what
Speaker 1: they had to really figure out and admit to each
Speaker 1: other was that they were not.
Speaker 2: Right for each other.
Speaker 1: For watching that play out was heartbreaking, and I just
Speaker 1: hope that they could still figure it out to be
Speaker 1: in each other's lives, because that's I think the hardest
Speaker 1: thing about when a relationship ends is it's like I
Speaker 1: don't want to lose you as the person, you know
Speaker 1: like that, And I thought that was just like a
Speaker 1: beautiful illustration and like.
Speaker 2: You know, examination of that kind of thing, like I
Speaker 2: love you more than anything. This is not right. Do
Speaker 2: you have a favorite? Yeah? Mine is also season one.
Speaker 4: It was the kind of like very sort of setting
Speaker 4: his ways quite sexy.
Speaker 2: Oh, I know you're talking about man. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the woman who was sort of willing to try anything,
Speaker 3: and he was just he would like get up during
Speaker 3: the session and walk around.
Speaker 2: I can't stand it, and he was just like being
Speaker 2: like very controlling. But his story is interesting.
Speaker 1: His story was so wild that woman like fucked him
Speaker 1: when he was like fourteen, tied into a.
Speaker 4: Bed and yeah, so the way it came out again
Speaker 4: could be the edit.
Speaker 2: We don't know.
Speaker 3: It was just sort of like they'd done like four
Speaker 3: or five sessions. Yeah, nothing was really like going anywhere.
Speaker 3: And then one day he's just like, well, you know
Speaker 3: there was that time where I got tied.
Speaker 2: To a bed, Like Awna is like what really, Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's just like he just like throws it in out
Speaker 2: of nowhere. Yeah that's real though, that's a real therapy ship. Yeah,
Speaker 2: there's no like easing into it. Sometimes it just kind
Speaker 2: of you drop it off.
Speaker 1: Well, you get the sense that he either was just
Speaker 1: as stubborn controlling with like releasing that information as he
Speaker 1: is in the immediate thing, or I think some guys
Speaker 1: that are like that just don't understand that affected.
Speaker 2: Them in that way. I mean, who knows, but I
Speaker 2: was under the impression that maybe he just like wasn't there.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But then the thing that was really interesting about them
Speaker 3: was then Awna would go and speak to her therapist
Speaker 3: about how she was getting very triggered specifically by him,
Speaker 3: and that was like this extra dynamic that was really interesting,
Speaker 3: and she was kind of talking about how she needed
Speaker 3: to make sure she was providing like fair and equal counsel,
Speaker 3: but she was like so annoyed by him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that is interesting. I think there's multiple like people
Speaker 2: like this, Like he's one of the people who says her,
Speaker 2: I could do your job. Yeah, I really I couldn't
Speaker 2: believe that. Do you imagine the gall Do you have
Speaker 2: a favorite couple? I like, there's a couple of season
Speaker 2: two that's really great. It's two men. One of them
Speaker 2: is a ballet dancer. One of them, Oh, they were great.
Speaker 2: They were great, and then one of them had a
Speaker 2: really horroring journey with like sobriety, and then then the
Speaker 2: pandemic happened. Then the pandemic happened, and then there's this
Speaker 2: one couple. There's a problem couple of season three, and
Speaker 2: she order talks to Virginia and she talks to a
Speaker 2: peer group of other therapists and all of them like
Speaker 2: help her crack this one couple because it's she hits
Speaker 2: the watches like I don't know what because the guy
Speaker 2: was and there's there's such a sensational clip of her
Speaker 2: like they play at the beginning of the season where
Speaker 2: she she just like Yep, they're screaming, and she goes
Speaker 2: to stop. You guys, right now, I'm not the right
Speaker 2: therapist for you. And then you're like, you're like, how
Speaker 2: does it get there? How does it get there? Watch
Speaker 2: you watch it?
Speaker 1: And great, there was a great couple that was she
Speaker 1: was a dancer in The Lion King, yes, and and
Speaker 1: like she was like she was always busy at night
Speaker 1: and so she could never have dinner with the family
Speaker 1: and her kids, and like it was like a thing.
Speaker 1: He's like, well, you're never home for dinner. It's like,
Speaker 1: I'm in the Lion King. And you knew this when
Speaker 1: you married me. She went the Lion King for as
Speaker 1: long as the earth has been there.
Speaker 2: I know, security are icon? Are you a therapy icon?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I meant the Lion King being what a yall? Honestly,
Speaker 2: I can't believe I was never not in it. I
Speaker 2: can't believe I was. No, I can't believe I was
Speaker 2: ever not in it because therapy.
Speaker 1: Again, the King, I was like lying, I don't think
Speaker 1: there's many roles for me and the Lion King on Broadway.
Speaker 1: But I would love to help out you ushering, But no,
Speaker 1: therapy is great. Therapy is great, speaking of great, Speaking
Speaker 1: of great, The album is fucking sublime. Yeah, good for you,
Speaker 1: and I'm glad you responded.
Speaker 2: Seems like you responded positively when I when I made
Speaker 2: a comparison to XX World. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 1: Of course.
Speaker 3: No, you're right, and I'm I think, yeah, you nailed
Speaker 3: itailed it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, fucking good. We love you, Charlie, I love you.
Speaker 2: But of course it's pretty fun. Let's the end every
Speaker 2: episode with the song I'm breaking, Why do I Love
Speaker 2: all your bells? You know what I love? Official officially
Speaker 2: reminds me of he was my boyfriend, my friend.
Speaker 1: We figured it out that I hope that couple therapy
Speaker 1: couple did. But Official was like I was the song
Speaker 1: whoa like the little things are happening that make me?
Speaker 1: Isn't that make us? Official?
Speaker 2: Lots of culture eats. It's the production by Will Ferreld's
Speaker 2: Big Money Players and I Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: Podcasts, created and hosted by Matt Rodgers and Bowen Yang.
Speaker 1: Executive produced by Anna has Nier and Hans Sonni, produced
Speaker 1: by Beck Ramos, edited mixed by Doug bamm anichel Board and.
Speaker 2: Our music is by Henry Kbirsky.
Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's me Matt Rogers letting you know. Tickets
Speaker 1: are on sale now to see me on tour, the
Speaker 1: Prince of Christmas Tour, that is, I'm doing my whole
Speaker 1: album Have You Heard of Christmas, plus a lot more
Speaker 1: with the whole band all throughout December. Go to www
Speaker 1: Dot Matt Rodgers Official dot com. See me in a
Speaker 1: city near you.
Speaker 5: Oh,