1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 3 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:11,559 Speaker 1: today's best minds. And Peter Navarro has become the first 4 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:15,960 Speaker 1: Trump White House official to report to prison. Over January sixth, 5 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: we have such a great show for you Today, Congresswoman 6 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: re Lisa Blunt Rockchester talks to us about her Senate 7 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,159 Speaker 1: run as well as being a co chair of the 8 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:27,000 Speaker 1: Biden campaign. 9 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:29,880 Speaker 2: Then we'll talk to former political reporter. 10 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 1: Amy Chosek about her new MAC show The Girls on 11 00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: the Bus, which is inspired by her time on the 12 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:40,920 Speaker 1: twenty sixteen campaign tail. But first we have the host 13 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 1: of the Bulwarks daily podcast, The Bulwarks, Tim Miller. Welcome 14 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 1: back to Fast Politics, Tim. 15 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:52,200 Speaker 3: Miller, Boom, ready to be here. Let's do this. 16 00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 1: You know, it's funny because it's like I was thinking 17 00:00:54,760 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 1: we're just chatting before, I was like, I really do 18 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: like you so much. When I ever end up on 19 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: a panel with you, I'm always just delighted to talk 20 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: to you. 21 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 2: But I also like, I think that watching the RNC 22 00:01:10,319 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 2: be destroyed with a sledgehammer must be a little bit 23 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 2: uncomfortable for you. 24 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 3: No, it's a little satisfying actually, so thank you for asking. 25 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 4: Yeah. 26 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 3: I love being on with you always too. You know, 27 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 3: it's been nice to be doing the Board podcast where 28 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 3: I'm asking people questions and it's, as you know, it's 29 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 3: like a new skill. You're trying to draw people out 30 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:33,000 Speaker 3: and all that. But you know, sometimes I just like 31 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 3: to let it rip, and you know, we can come 32 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 3: over here and you can just put it on a 33 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:38,319 Speaker 3: tee for me and let me let it rip. And 34 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,400 Speaker 3: like in this situation, which is yeah, these fuckers are 35 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:43,959 Speaker 3: getting exactly what they've deserved for a long time now, 36 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 3: and it's been a long time coming. And what they 37 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 3: have done to the RNC during the Rona Romney years 38 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 3: was absolutely shameful. They should all feel ashamed. And I'm 39 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 3: glad that they're running out of money and I'm glad 40 00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 3: that they are now officially a cult to like the 41 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 3: daughter in law of the president, which is a former president, 42 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 3: excuse me, which is very bizarre and very freakish, and 43 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 3: it's everything they deserve. 44 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: It is interesting to me, and I'm curious what you 45 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 1: think about this. Like, so Rona gets in trouble because 46 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,519 Speaker 1: she can't raise money, so they decide to put someone 47 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:20,839 Speaker 1: in there, who absolutely doesn't know any of the donors. 48 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: I mean, maybe she knows a few of them, but 49 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,640 Speaker 1: who does not have nearly the same kind of experience 50 00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 1: raising money. 51 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, Rona was just a classic fall girl 52 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 3: in this thing. The question is why it took so long, really, 53 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 3: you know, because she had just had loss after loss 54 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:38,360 Speaker 3: after loss. You know how I monitor my MAGA Twitter 55 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:40,639 Speaker 3: feeds and all these guys, and I saw a funny 56 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 3: quote from somebody where I guess my old boss, rites 57 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:46,080 Speaker 3: was on Sean Hannity saying, Okay, this is what Lauren 58 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 3: Lara needs to do. It's easy. You just got to 59 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:50,240 Speaker 3: raise forty million in the first month, and then you 60 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 3: do this, and then you do that, and then you 61 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 3: do the other thing. And one of one of the 62 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 3: MAGA guys I followed was like, well, maybe this guy 63 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 3: should have been in charge, And I was like, yeah, exactly, yeah, okay, 64 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 3: good luck Lara. Just it's just gonna be so easy, girl. 65 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:04,920 Speaker 3: Well you just gonna have to RaSE forty million, No 66 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 3: big deal. You've never done anything, You've never really had 67 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 3: a job in your life. Here you go, good luck. 68 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 1: You think about Mike Johnson, it's a similar situation. You know, 69 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 1: Democrats are always like, we didn't put our fifth or 70 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 1: sixth guy in there. 71 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:20,359 Speaker 3: Yeah, it is similar situation. 72 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:20,920 Speaker 5: You know. 73 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 3: It's funny. I saw so they had this little confab 74 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 3: out that the Greenbrier in West Virginia. Yeah, weekend. A 75 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 3: lot of weird stuff was leaking out of that. Like 76 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,600 Speaker 3: Tom Memer was like, Joe Brden was too mean to 77 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 3: us at the State of the Union. We shouldn't invite 78 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:35,840 Speaker 3: him back next year if he wins. I was like, 79 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 3: what what is wrong with you guys? Okay, So that 80 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 3: was one. Then Patrick McHenry, you know, the little guy 81 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 3: at the bow Tie, who was the heir apparent to 82 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 3: McCarthy that they passed over from being two establishment or whatever. 83 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 3: He's been ripping Johnson ever since Johnson took over, and 84 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 3: and you know, he was saying, reporter, it's like, well 85 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 3: he's doing a little bit better. 86 00:03:54,200 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 4: You know. 87 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 3: It's kind of like how you're talking about your kids. 88 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 3: They're learning how to read, or learning how to ride 89 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 3: a bike or something like, well, we're taking the training 90 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 3: wheels off now. And uh, you know, he can go 91 00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 3: a full block by himself without any help. And so 92 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 3: I guess I haven't seen a lot of evidence that 93 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:14,320 Speaker 3: he's doing better. You know, he hasn't had to actually 94 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 3: make any of the hard decisions that he keeps kicking 95 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 3: the can with these little mini extensions. 96 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 5: For a few weeks. 97 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's like eventually, you know, the rubber is 98 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 3: going to meet the road and they're they're going to 99 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 3: they're either going to have to vote to fund Ukraine 100 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:29,720 Speaker 3: and need Democrats to get it passed, or they're not. 101 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:31,600 Speaker 3: And they're gonna either have to vote to keep the 102 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 3: government open and need Democrats to get it passed, or 103 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 3: they're not going to keep the government open. And at 104 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:40,280 Speaker 3: those moments, we'll see how little Mike Johnson is doing, 105 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:41,240 Speaker 3: how much he's improved. 106 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't seem like he is still able to 107 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,719 Speaker 1: like he really is one of those people sort of 108 00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: thinking that he can pull the rabbit out of the hat. 109 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: The good news is that they somehow managed not to 110 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 1: shut down the government. 111 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I guess it's good news. So I just 112 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:00,160 Speaker 3: want to be abundantly clear about this and nobody misunderstands. 113 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 3: And the crazy Nazi right, there's this thing since called accelerationism. 114 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,599 Speaker 3: They're accelerationists. They like want the race war. They're rooting 115 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 3: for it. I am not rooting for the race war. 116 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 3: I am kind of an accelerationist when it comes to 117 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:16,480 Speaker 3: the Republican's demise. So, you know this whole let's let's 118 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 3: let them give him a little more leash, give a 119 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 3: little more leash, give a little time, let's work with them. 120 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:24,400 Speaker 3: I interviewed a couple of weeks ago Jake Auchincloss from Massachusetts, 121 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 3: So I really like and that guy is just a Democrat. 122 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 3: He's basically just like I'm not voting for these little extensions, 123 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,479 Speaker 3: you know, like put up or shut up, like either 124 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 3: let's either fund the government and fund Ukraine or not. 125 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 3: And I kind of side with him on that. And 126 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 3: so I guess it's good that the government hasn't been 127 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 3: shut down, but I think it's time to put the 128 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 3: screws to this guy and say, Okay, look, you're either 129 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:45,839 Speaker 3: going to be with the crazies in your caucus and 130 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 3: you're gonna cut off your nose despite your face by 131 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:50,479 Speaker 3: shutting down the government, or you're going to be an 132 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:52,359 Speaker 3: adult and a grown up and you're gonna work with 133 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:55,719 Speaker 3: Democrats to fund our obligations and to support our friends 134 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:58,200 Speaker 3: in Ukraine and deal with the consequences. 135 00:05:58,400 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean those are the choices. 136 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 1: I mean, ultimately, Republicans are sort of hoping that there's 137 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 1: some third choice. At the end of the day, the 138 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: Republican Party is still very much run by Trump. 139 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 3: Oh oh my god. Yeah, And obviously the party is 140 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:15,840 Speaker 3: still controlled by Trump. You can see it with Johnson, 141 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:18,280 Speaker 3: you can see it in all these primaries. I mean, 142 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 3: maybe not every single one. There could be some weird exceptions, 143 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 3: but look, I mean, Johnson can't do anything. None of 144 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 3: these guys can do anything without knowing that Trump will 145 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 3: have their back. And the TikTok thing will be an 146 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 3: interesting another example of this, right, Like, it passes fifty 147 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:35,760 Speaker 3: to zero initially in committee, and then Trump comes out 148 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:37,480 Speaker 3: and is like, no, I'm not for it anymore because 149 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 3: some billionaire that wants to give me money and I'm 150 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 3: despert for money says I shouldn't be for it anymore. 151 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,280 Speaker 3: And so now like the rubber is going to meet 152 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 3: the road on that right, it's going to be like, 153 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 3: are are these Republicans going to back down again? Just 154 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 3: like they did on immigration, just like they did on 155 00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 3: all these other things, but to appease mister Trump, or 156 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 3: are there any areas where he doesn't control it? 157 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 2: Trump is having kind of an incredible cash crunch. I mean, 158 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: and it's one thing not to be liquid. 159 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:06,280 Speaker 1: It's another thing, like so he owes half a billion 160 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 1: dollars again. My favorite tweet of the week was that 161 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: Republican from Fox, the guy Mark Levin. 162 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 3: Like Leavin, Yeah, they call him the great one? 163 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 2: Do they really? And why? 164 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 4: Yeah? 165 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 3: They call him the great one. I don't know. Bar 166 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 3: the bar is so well over there that you know, 167 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 3: somebody can do four syllable words. They think they're a genius. 168 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 2: I don't know. I'm going to read you this quote. 169 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 1: I know you've seen it because I feel that you 170 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 1: will have hilarious things to say about it. Why are 171 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 1: there no Republican multi billionaires offering to lend President Trump 172 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:46,119 Speaker 1: the funds to file his appeal in the outrageous case 173 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 1: in your state? And none of them liquid enough to 174 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:50,840 Speaker 1: help or join with others to help. 175 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 2: This is an outrage. 176 00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 3: You first, Mark, Let's see how much you got here 177 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 3: saving the coup. Let's put it up off a coup. 178 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 3: I don't know, why not, Mark Levin? Yeah, I mean 179 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 3: I think that the obvious thing answer for the listeners 180 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 3: of this podcast know is that generally rich people do 181 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 3: not like to loan money to like one of the 182 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 3: greatest welchers in the history of the world. So, you know, 183 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 3: it's another example of the fuck around and find out 184 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 3: principle of Trump, right, which is like eventually the build 185 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 3: these bills come due in this case literally and a 186 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 3: lot of these guys aren't don't want to give money. 187 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:29,119 Speaker 3: And it's astonishing, frankly, how much money he has got 188 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:33,560 Speaker 3: from Rubes to fund his various legal defenses, given his 189 00:08:33,800 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 3: track record of scams and bankruptcies and screwing over people 190 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 3: that loaned the money or did work for him. So no, 191 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:42,200 Speaker 3: I don't think that a couple of billions have come 192 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 3: to his defense. But here's the thing I'm worried about, 193 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 3: and I think everybody should be worried about, is who 194 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:48,240 Speaker 3: might come to his defense. Who might come to his 195 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 3: aid here and give him some loans? Foreign interests, right, yeah, 196 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 3: Saudis people with big deals before the government, you know, 197 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:58,959 Speaker 3: people that are going to want bailouts from the government 198 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 3: on the back end. I don't don't know, Like I 199 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 3: think that it's a big, big question and a big 200 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:06,840 Speaker 3: big vulnerability to have a presidential candidate that is like 201 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 3: desperate for bond cash. You know. I think that there 202 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 3: is just some potential leverages, you know, and this is why, 203 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 3: like we have, if you want to go work in 204 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:19,120 Speaker 3: the White House, you have to have a background check. 205 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 3: And let me tell you. If you want to go 206 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 3: work in the National Security Agency, one of the NATSAC agencies, 207 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 3: and you had hundreds of billions of dollars in leans, 208 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:31,280 Speaker 3: you know out against you, you're not going to get 209 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:33,320 Speaker 3: the job. All right. There's going to be concerns that 210 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:36,679 Speaker 3: you could be a right target for foreign influence operations, 211 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:40,040 Speaker 3: and so that should be concerning meut ofresidential candidates. So 212 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:42,959 Speaker 3: you know the types of Republicans that pretend to care 213 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:45,359 Speaker 3: about this stuff. Your Marco Rubio is, your Tom Cotton's, 214 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 3: they've just been completely castrated and are just unwilling to 215 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 3: say anything if it fit Boss Trump. 216 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 2: Right again, I'm going to ask you an impossible question, 217 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:59,840 Speaker 2: but I'm just curious what you how if you'll answer it, 218 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 2: and what you think about it. Do you think that 219 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 2: in their heart of hearts, these people think this is 220 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 2: going to work or do you think they know that 221 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:09,840 Speaker 2: they just have to go along with Trump. 222 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, I have to tell you. I mean, obviously it's 223 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 3: different for different people, but just as a broad brush, 224 00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 3: something that's been pretty alarming to me is I think 225 00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 3: that a lot of them have now gotten very deep 226 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 3: into a bubble and a kind of resentment fueled bubble 227 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 3: where they look out and they say, oh, man, you know, 228 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 3: these media people are so unfair to us. The never 229 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:35,840 Speaker 3: trumpers are so unfair to us. And we survived the 230 00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:38,079 Speaker 3: first Trump administration. Well there was the one that one 231 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 3: day with the Capital starring, but if you just forward 232 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 3: past that, like, most of it was pretty good, right, 233 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 3: most of it was fine. We got our tax cuts, 234 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 3: and you know that they've all just kind of rationalized this. 235 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 5: I guess. 236 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:53,560 Speaker 3: One of the most revealing the insights into the mind 237 00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 3: of this crowd that I've listened to recently, which I'd recommend, 238 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 3: is Jamie Weinstein over at The Dispatch interviewed Dan Crenshaw. 239 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 3: And I would love to enview Dan Crenshaw, but he's 240 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 3: too scared to come into Bolwerk podcast, But he was 241 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 3: willing to do the Dispatch podcast, and it was like 242 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 3: he has you could just hear him kind of convincing 243 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:17,240 Speaker 3: himself in real time that the never trumpers were overstating 244 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 3: what happened on January sixth, and it wasn't really that bad. 245 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 3: And Trump's sport policy was pretty good. 246 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:22,520 Speaker 5: It was just his. 247 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:24,600 Speaker 3: Words that were bad. And the words don't matter and 248 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 3: the actions right, you can just and it's like, oh, 249 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 3: everybody's so mean to me for trying to apologize him, 250 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 3: and I did my best. Like it's just you can 251 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 3: just hear this real time rationalization happening. And I kind 252 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 3: of think that is pretty representative of where most of 253 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 3: these guys are. And I think they all have legitimate 254 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,320 Speaker 3: fears and concerns at some level, but they're more intense 255 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 3: feeling is of resentment towards you know, DEM's libs sil 256 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 3: eat the media however you ought to put it. 257 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, and maybe that's why they want to stick it 258 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 2: to Dems and they feel that nominating Trump will do that. Yeah. 259 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know some of these I wouldn't 260 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:02,760 Speaker 3: have wanted to dominate Trump if they could wave a 261 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:05,680 Speaker 3: wand but they just couldn't, didn't have any power to 262 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 3: and didn't want to waste any more political capital. And 263 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:10,440 Speaker 3: their cowards. I think maybe last I was on this podcast, 264 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 3: I was talking about how few of them had indorsed 265 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:14,680 Speaker 3: Nikki Alen, you know, and they'd all convinced themselves as like, 266 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:17,200 Speaker 3: there's no point, there's no point in tried the campaign, 267 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:19,280 Speaker 3: Why should I even do it? And so, you know, 268 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 3: anythink if you gave any of them, you know, three 269 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 3: magic beans, they would they would use the first one 270 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:26,680 Speaker 3: to get rid of Donald Trump, right, But they don't 271 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:30,079 Speaker 3: have magic beans, and so instead they coward, right, And 272 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 3: I think that's basically their their mindset these days. 273 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:37,560 Speaker 2: One of the problems that Trump has that I have 274 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 2: noticed is that he's really having trouble raising money. Right. 275 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,439 Speaker 2: He's got his donor numbers, he's hemorrhaged. 276 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 3: Small dollar donors are even bad. 277 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, small dollar donors a big dollar nobody's willing to 278 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: write him a half billion dollar check. 279 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:54,200 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm curious, Like I've argued. I have a 280 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:56,560 Speaker 2: friend who's a straight journalist who I like to argue with, 281 00:12:56,679 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 2: and he said, well, Trump doesn't need as much money 282 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 2: as by does, as a normal political candidate does. But 283 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 2: don't you think this is a sign that MAGA they 284 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 2: might be all tapped out? 285 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 3: Yeah? You know, I've been spent a lot of time 286 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,640 Speaker 3: thinking about this, and I just I don't know that 287 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 3: we're going to really know the answer for a few months. 288 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:17,679 Speaker 3: And at the one level, I just want to say this, 289 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 3: I am not of the view that whoever raises the 290 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:24,079 Speaker 3: more money in presidential races like really matters. I think 291 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 3: that there's a law of diminishing returns on presidential money, 292 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 3: right that tv ads. There's a certain group of people 293 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 3: can be reached with tv ads. These guys are bon 294 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 3: the presidents. A lot of this stuff is kind of 295 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:36,920 Speaker 3: baked in with people, and so I think money matters, 296 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 3: but I don't think it matters as much as some 297 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 3: commentators do. Now. Having this big of a gap, though, 298 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,840 Speaker 3: is pretty noteworthy, and like it's one thing, it's like, oh, well, whatever, 299 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:49,199 Speaker 3: Biden raised fifty million more, and if you divide that 300 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,760 Speaker 3: between the five states, it's not really that munch on balance. 301 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 3: But if it's like he's already raised fifty million more, 302 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,360 Speaker 3: that you know the gap is going to expand. And 303 00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:00,040 Speaker 3: Trump doesn't have enough money to run his operations, and 304 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 3: you know he's also stressed about the money in his 305 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:04,640 Speaker 3: personal life because he can't pay these bonds and he's 306 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 3: redirecting money from the RNC that should be going to 307 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:11,080 Speaker 3: grassroots instead it's going to pay his lawyers. At some 308 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 3: point that has to matter. And at some point, only 309 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 3: raising three million online in the month of January or 310 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 3: whatever it was has to show that, Yeah, some of 311 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 3: these small dollar dollars are like they don't have any 312 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 3: more to give. Eventually, you do run into a limit 313 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:26,680 Speaker 3: on this. So I'm not ready to kind of dance 314 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 3: on his grave over it yet, but I do think 315 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 3: it's a really concerning sign. 316 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 1: Maybe this is just blewing on, but don't you think that. 317 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 1: And again, like poor Jesse has heard me bring this 318 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 1: up a number of times, and probably the most embarrassing 319 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: time was when I brought up to Paul Krugman. 320 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 2: But I do bring this up a lot. So, you 321 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 2: have a million people who died of COVID right two 322 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 2: hundred thousand before the vaccine. Approximately, These are approximate numbers 323 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 2: because I don't have them in front of me. Then, 324 00:14:55,280 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 2: significantly more after many of whom had been encouraged right 325 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 2: wing media to take Horse de Warmer to not take 326 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 2: the vaccine, you know, many of which were like really preventable, Dace, 327 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 2: I had a theory that I could never prove that 328 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 2: there was some economic fallout from that just having less people. 329 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: And I do wonder, I mean, even though those people 330 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: maybe didn't turn on Trump, there has to be some 331 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: voter or the possibility of some voter fallout from that, 332 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 1: don't you think. 333 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a complicated ecosystem, right like our politics, it's 334 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:36,480 Speaker 3: always evolving and changing a little bit. It's not a 335 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:38,760 Speaker 3: static as people want it to want to think it is. 336 00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 3: It's funny for the focus group podcasts so long while 337 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 3: we're listening to like the twenty twenty focus groups of 338 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 3: swing voters and COVID and just how terrible Trump was 339 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 3: at handling that was so front of their mind that 340 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 3: that's obvious now in retrospect, Like listening to it, it 341 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,120 Speaker 3: was pretty jarring to hear them talk about him then 342 00:15:56,520 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 3: versus kind of how much you hear about it now 343 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 3: with swing voters. So I do think that there was 344 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,760 Speaker 3: some impact there that it really hurt him in twenty twenty, 345 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 3: his mishandling. Then I think that pressing forward, you had 346 00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 3: the vaccine desks and how they were over indexed in 347 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:15,200 Speaker 3: red areas. That's been well documented or over indexed among 348 00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 3: older voters who Trump does better with. And so you know, 349 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 3: I do think that there is potentially some impact about that. 350 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 3: I know is just you know, thinking about Georgia for example, 351 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 3: you know you've had still four more years of like 352 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:30,040 Speaker 3: people from blue states moving into Atlanta. You know, you 353 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 3: had an over indexing of I think death rate. That's 354 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 3: just something that we know happened. And the more conservative 355 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 3: parts of Georgia. Now, how does all of that kind 356 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 3: of demographic change, which like marginally accruised to Biden's benefit, 357 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 3: is that offset by if there's some bleed among black voters, right, 358 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 3: if he goes from ninety two to eight to eighty 359 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:52,040 Speaker 3: seven thirteen, right, is that more people than the demographic change. 360 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 5: Right. 361 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:54,840 Speaker 3: It's kind of tough to do the Ledger on all that, 362 00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 3: but I do think that it makes it made a 363 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:57,760 Speaker 3: marginal difference for sure. 364 00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 2: Yeah. 365 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: And again like enthusiasm, with these elections we have are 366 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: such small margins. 367 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:08,080 Speaker 2: The enthusiasm is so it's such an important element. Thank you, 368 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 2: Tim Miller, Ollie. 369 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 3: Jong Fast, thank you. I'm sure I'll be back soon. 370 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 3: I'm still I'm waiting for that chart on who's been 371 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 3: guests the most times. I just want to kind of 372 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 3: see where I look where I am on the power rankings. 373 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 3: That's some homework for ester. 374 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 1: Congresswoman Lisa Blunt Rothchester represents Delaware's first district. Welcome too 375 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 1: Fast Politics, Congresswoman Lisa, Wait, do you say your whole 376 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: last name? 377 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 5: So a lot of times we go by LBR. Sometimes 378 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 5: it's the ho Lisa Blunt Rochester. 379 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 1: I feel like LBR is good because like when you're 380 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 1: going by initials, you know you've hit the big time. 381 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 5: Well, I definitely feel like an LBR. I love it. 382 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 2: So I want to talk to you. 383 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 1: You are the congresswoman from Delaware and running for the Senate. 384 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:04,600 Speaker 1: You will be This is like an obsession of mine. 385 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 1: Will you only be the fourth black woman senator or 386 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: the third? 387 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:14,920 Speaker 5: The fourth in the history of the country and insane? Yeah, 388 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 5: like think about it, and only two of them have 389 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:20,200 Speaker 5: been elected. And then that would be Carol Moseley Braun 390 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,160 Speaker 5: who was the first, and then you've got the Vice 391 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 5: President Kamala Harris as the second. And then the third 392 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 5: is appointed and currently serving. That's Lafonza Butler, who was 393 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:34,159 Speaker 5: appointed after the passing of Dianne Feinstein by Governor Newsom 394 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 5: So there's only been three in the history of the country, 395 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 5: and you know, hopefully I will be number four. 396 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 2: It's what my people call a Shonda. It's just so 397 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 2: blatantly incredibly infuriating to me that you will be the 398 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:53,600 Speaker 2: fourth black woman ever to be in the Senate is crazy. 399 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 5: It truly is mind blowing. I mean, even in twenty 400 00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 5: sixteen when I won my in Congress, I was the 401 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:05,480 Speaker 5: first woman and first person of color elected to Congress 402 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 5: from Delaware, And so you know, you would think in 403 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 5: this day and age, we wouldn't still be hearing about first. 404 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:14,159 Speaker 5: But it's all the more reason why we've got to 405 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 5: keep going. It's all the more reason why you got 406 00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:19,240 Speaker 5: to break those ceilings, bust down those doors. And is 407 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,120 Speaker 5: the late great Shirley chisen On, the first black woman 408 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 5: in the House, said if they don't give you a 409 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:25,440 Speaker 5: seat a the table, we can bring a folding chair. 410 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. 411 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:30,960 Speaker 1: Can we talk for two seconds about how inherently racist 412 00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: and sexist America is and how much harder black women 413 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 1: have to work. You know, it's true for white women, 414 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 1: but not the way it's true for black women. Like 415 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:45,960 Speaker 1: I just see KJP is judged just at a totally 416 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 1: on a much harsher level than someone like Kirby. And 417 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:53,800 Speaker 1: I know that you have prevailed and you're, you know, 418 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 1: now running for the Senate, but it just is so 419 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:02,639 Speaker 1: shocking to me how much it's so baked into everything. 420 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 5: You know, It's interesting, Molly. Years ago, I went to 421 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:10,480 Speaker 5: this black women's conference and I heard this term that 422 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,680 Speaker 5: like stuck with me. It's be conscious but not consumed. 423 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 5: And what that meant, especially to me because even in Delaware, 424 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 5: I was the first black woman Secretary of Labor. I've 425 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 5: had these positions where you sometimes walk into a room 426 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 5: and you are the only one. And in that conference, 427 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 5: what they talked about is that you got to be 428 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:37,200 Speaker 5: conscious of it. Yeah, isms exist, racism, classism, sexismisms exist, 429 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,120 Speaker 5: but to the extent that I get consumed by that, 430 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 5: I'm ineffective. I'm not breaking that door open. And so 431 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 5: part of it is you got to be conscious of it. 432 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 5: Because when it's time to do things, we do feel 433 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:53,880 Speaker 5: the difference, you know, whether it's walking into a room 434 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,439 Speaker 5: and feeling I'd better be ten times better or smarter 435 00:20:57,720 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 5: or whatever. But at the same time, I'm knowing that 436 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 5: I've got to be effective, and in order for me 437 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:08,160 Speaker 5: to be effective. I've got to be conscious but not consumed. 438 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 5: And so for me, that's sort of how I operate, 439 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 5: and I think it gives me a different lens for 440 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 5: other folks that walk in the room, and maybe they're 441 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:18,879 Speaker 5: the only ones. I worked for a think tank that 442 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 5: focused on the inclusion of people with disabilities, and you 443 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 5: think about how, you know, we do things with bias 444 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 5: that we don't even know sometimes that we have, or 445 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:31,639 Speaker 5: you know, I've lived in over thirty you know, and 446 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,600 Speaker 5: traveled and worked and played in over thirty countries in 447 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 5: the world. My son was born in France, I lived 448 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 5: in Shanghai. How it feels to be the other coming 449 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,560 Speaker 5: into a place, and so I think I try to 450 00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:46,959 Speaker 5: bring those lived experiences with me to the work, you know. 451 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:51,639 Speaker 5: And that's so valuable about having representation in the Senate 452 00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 5: is that we have different lived experiences. I know what 453 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 5: it's like to have a son who stopped by the 454 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,359 Speaker 5: police at night as a black mom. But at the 455 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 5: same time, as a congresswoman, I helped to bring together 456 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:06,159 Speaker 5: community activists and law enforcement and get body war on 457 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 5: cameras in my state. It's because I had those lived 458 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 5: experiences and those relationships, so I always say conscious but 459 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:15,000 Speaker 5: not consumed. 460 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:19,679 Speaker 1: Really important point and I think that's so interesting. So 461 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 1: now you are the national co chair of the Biden 462 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 1: reelection campaign. 463 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 2: What does that mean? 464 00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,920 Speaker 1: Are you a surrogate and are you out there and 465 00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,040 Speaker 1: what does that look like? 466 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 5: Yeah, well, this is actually my second time being a 467 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 5: co chair of the Biden Harris campaign. It was so 468 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 5: nice they asked me twice and so I am very 469 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,920 Speaker 5: excited about being on the campaign trail. As a co chair, 470 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 5: I do a little bit of everything, you know, from 471 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,240 Speaker 5: providing advice. We have co chair meetings, to actually being 472 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,639 Speaker 5: in different parts of the country, whether it's being on 473 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:58,320 Speaker 5: radio or TV, or opening up a grand opening for 474 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 5: one of our offices, you know, and kind of motivating 475 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:04,959 Speaker 5: those folks and also helping with fundraising and then just 476 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:09,239 Speaker 5: again giving advice on things that we see and you know, 477 00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:13,160 Speaker 5: I will tell you when I first was asked by 478 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 5: President Biden in the first term to come on board 479 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:19,880 Speaker 5: and be a you know and dorset them right out 480 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 5: the gate, it was really after having a one on 481 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:27,119 Speaker 5: one conversation with him and you know, seeing and feeling 482 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:31,640 Speaker 5: and hearing what his motivation was and that motivation of 483 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 5: you know, restoring the soul of this country, making sure 484 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 5: that everybody gets a fair chance and gets opportunity. Those 485 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 5: things are still relevant today. And as somebody who has 486 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:45,120 Speaker 5: lived through one term of Donald Trump and one term 487 00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:47,439 Speaker 5: of Joe Biden, I can tell you there is a 488 00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:51,959 Speaker 5: serious and real difference between the two of them and 489 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,480 Speaker 5: who they stand for and how they operate and how 490 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,480 Speaker 5: effected they've been. And so I am excited again to 491 00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,439 Speaker 5: be a national CoA chair and we're doing and everything 492 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,439 Speaker 5: we can to make sure they are reelected. 493 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: Do you think Black voters are still with Biden? Do 494 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 1: you think it's a challenge to win them back? What 495 00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:11,359 Speaker 1: are you seeing in that group? Do you think that 496 00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:13,720 Speaker 1: he's speak enough to those voters? 497 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I think one of the things that 498 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 5: is important for us as a campaign, and is one 499 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,680 Speaker 5: of the hallmarks of who he is and who they 500 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 5: are as a team, is that we don't take any 501 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 5: vote for granted. And I think that's really important that 502 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 5: we want to hear from people, want to We want 503 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,600 Speaker 5: them to see, feel and hear the things that we've accomplished, 504 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 5: but also know that there's a vision for the future 505 00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 5: that includes things like voting rights, that includes reproductive freedoms, 506 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:45,280 Speaker 5: and you know, I had heard a recent data point 507 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 5: that even for something like reproductive rights and abortion rights. 508 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 5: The Ohio election, I had heard that black men showed 509 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 5: up and voted in more in favor than any other group. 510 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 5: Because I think sometimes people make assumptions about groups based 511 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,679 Speaker 5: on polls instead of really talking to people and the 512 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 5: things that are important to our communities. First of all, 513 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 5: we're not monolithic. Different people have, you know, different backgrounds 514 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,720 Speaker 5: and different motivations. But access to capital and the fact 515 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 5: that we now have you know, the lowest unemployment rate 516 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 5: in the Black community, the greatest investment in hbc US. 517 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 5: My two kids and my daughter in law, they all 518 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 5: graduated from HBCUs. And so to actually like put their 519 00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:32,800 Speaker 5: money where their mouth is, meaning you know what the 520 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:36,719 Speaker 5: Biden Harris administration, that's important to people. And then in Delaware, 521 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 5: we have a lot of people don't realize we're the 522 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 5: lowest mean elevation state in the country, and so climate 523 00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,680 Speaker 5: is important, and you know, like we got the beaches, 524 00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 5: but we also have farmers, we also have environmental justice communities. 525 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 5: And so this president again has put his money where 526 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 5: his mouth is and really invested in those communities, clean 527 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,639 Speaker 5: drinking water, air quality monitors. Those are two of the 528 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 5: things that I've worked on personally because I heard it 529 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,879 Speaker 5: from my constituents. And so I think for us, we 530 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,800 Speaker 5: take nobody for granted. We're going to work hard for 531 00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,720 Speaker 5: everyone's vote, and we're also going to like meet people 532 00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,800 Speaker 5: where they are and that's important as well. You know. 533 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 5: So I'm excited about being on the road and talking 534 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:22,120 Speaker 5: to people and hearing from them. And I'm really excited 535 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:26,480 Speaker 5: that President Biden and Vice President Harris have really listened, 536 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 5: even on things like the Safer Community dropped. You know, 537 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 5: I was able to get piece of legislation in that's 538 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 5: called break the cycle of violence, which because one of 539 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,879 Speaker 5: the inspirations for me running in the first place was 540 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,600 Speaker 5: because my city of Wilmington was being called Murdertown because 541 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,439 Speaker 5: of gun violence. And so they're listening, and you know, 542 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,720 Speaker 5: like I said, for me, it was a weird situation 543 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,720 Speaker 5: that propelled me to run. But the inspiration and the 544 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:56,000 Speaker 5: ability to do the work makes me even more want 545 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 5: to go to the Senate and do it on a 546 00:26:57,800 --> 00:26:58,440 Speaker 5: deeper level. 547 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:03,439 Speaker 1: It is so interesting when we talk about climac and 548 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: we talk about these little states because Rhode Island two 549 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 1: Senator white House is one of the great I feel 550 00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:13,000 Speaker 1: like a climate senators Rhode Island two has done a 551 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:17,800 Speaker 1: lot of really interesting stuff with climate. Gina Romando now 552 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: and the Admin. But another person who I think of 553 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:24,600 Speaker 1: as someone who's very focused on this sort of transition 554 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,600 Speaker 1: to clean energy and a sort of more sustainable way 555 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:30,280 Speaker 1: of living. 556 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,359 Speaker 2: So I'm curious in Delaware, what is. 557 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: The sort of what do you feel like are the 558 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 1: priorities when it comes to climate. 559 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,359 Speaker 5: One of the great things that I was able to 560 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:42,600 Speaker 5: work on with my senior Senator, who is actually the 561 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:46,679 Speaker 5: Chairman of Environment and Public Works, Tom Carper, is a 562 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:49,080 Speaker 5: bill called the Shore Act, and it really is about 563 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 5: the resiliency and protection of not just our shores, but 564 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:57,200 Speaker 5: our riverbanks. I mean, I went to towns like Inland 565 00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:01,000 Speaker 5: that because of the flooding, they were feeling it not 566 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 5: just on the beach but in off of riverbanks. And 567 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 5: so part of what we are working on is legislation 568 00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,200 Speaker 5: that deals with that, you know, making sure that we 569 00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:12,760 Speaker 5: are looking at the prevention side of it, but then 570 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 5: we got to mitigate the risks and so you know, 571 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,880 Speaker 5: we are doing I also am on the Health Subcommittee, 572 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,359 Speaker 5: so we have a health aspect to this as well 573 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 5: when it pertains to clean air and clean air monitors 574 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,479 Speaker 5: to make sure you know that our air is okay. 575 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,200 Speaker 5: And then working with the administration, with the President. One 576 00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:32,960 Speaker 5: of the bills I had was called the Alert Act, 577 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 5: is that if there's an environmental spill, if there's something 578 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 5: that happens, communities need to and have a right to 579 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 5: be notified, notified of what happened, when it happened, and 580 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 5: what the plan is for it. And so doing those 581 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 5: kind of things I think is really important. But it 582 00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 5: kind of takes me back, like Molly when I first 583 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 5: decided to run. It's kind of First of all, the 584 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,880 Speaker 5: guy that I just mentioned, Tom Carper, I worked for 585 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,880 Speaker 5: him back in nineteen eighty eight. I went to a 586 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 5: town hall meeting with my two year old son on 587 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 5: my head. I was a grad student and I didn't 588 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:06,280 Speaker 5: even realize that I was pregnant at the time, and 589 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 5: he told me they had internships, and that internship turned 590 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 5: into me being a caseworker in a congressional office, to 591 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:16,600 Speaker 5: being in his cabinet, his deputy Secretary of Health and 592 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 5: Social Services and Secretary of Labor, and then going on 593 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 5: to work for our first woman governor and you know, 594 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 5: working for the Urban League. But it was really after 595 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:30,080 Speaker 5: this story, but after a twenty year marriage. And I 596 00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 5: always quote Beyonce because I love Beyonce. But in her 597 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 5: song you Won't Break My Soul, there's a line that says, 598 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 5: I just fell in love, I just quit my job. Well, 599 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,360 Speaker 5: in two thousand and three, I think it was I 600 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 5: fell in love. I quit my job, I sold my 601 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 5: house and sold my car, and I moved to Shanghai 602 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,880 Speaker 5: for love and love of my life a guy named 603 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:53,600 Speaker 5: Charles Rochester. And you know, Charles and I were living. 604 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 5: I wrote a book with two other women. We came 605 00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 5: back to the States and he went on a business 606 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,240 Speaker 5: trip before his meetings. I'm sure his achilles ten then 607 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:04,239 Speaker 5: and blood clots went to his heart and lungs. And 608 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 5: at fifty two, the love of my life passed away. 609 00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 5: I did not know what was next. I knew that 610 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 5: I was, you know, sad and mad. And some days 611 00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:19,480 Speaker 5: I tell people just getting up in the morning was 612 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 5: a success, and I was. It was maybe eight nine 613 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 5: months later. I was on autopilot in the supermarket and 614 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,520 Speaker 5: I saw a dad in front of me with two 615 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 5: I think it was two or three kids, and he 616 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 5: put back grapes because they were nine dollars, and it 617 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,240 Speaker 5: just snapped me out of my own pain. Like I said, 618 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,640 Speaker 5: I'm blessed. I'm okay. I got a house, I've got family, 619 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 5: I've got mental health care. But a lot of other 620 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,040 Speaker 5: people were struggling, and it was like, I don't have 621 00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 5: anything to lose. My city was being called murdered child. 622 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 5: I was like, I'm going to run. And I decided 623 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:52,840 Speaker 5: to run for Congress and I was in a six 624 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:56,040 Speaker 5: way primary debating lawyers. I had never even been in 625 00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:59,840 Speaker 5: a debate before, let alone run for anything, and we won. 626 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 5: And I guess part of my message is to me, 627 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 5: the Senate is an opportunity to do all this work 628 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 5: in an even deeper level, to be able to work 629 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,200 Speaker 5: on the planet, to be able to work on giving 630 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 5: people jobs and making sure we have a strong economy 631 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,200 Speaker 5: and healthcare. It's also the police where I can fight 632 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 5: for democracy. And that's to me, having been trapped in 633 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 5: the gallery on January sixth, this moment is real, you know, 634 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 5: And I want people to feel that sense of urgency 635 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,240 Speaker 5: about the choice that we have between Donald Trump and 636 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 5: Joe Biden, this moment is real. Who you put in 637 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 5: the Senate, who you put in the House, who you 638 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 5: put on your school board. This moment is real, and 639 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:44,400 Speaker 5: we've got to make sure that we take advantage of 640 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,160 Speaker 5: it and that we use our power. 641 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:49,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that's such an important point. 642 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 1: And also, you know something that I write a lot 643 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 1: about this idea that it is one of the most 644 00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 1: important elections of our lifetime. I can't believe we keep 645 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 1: having these elections. I just want to have normal elections 646 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: where we beat Mitt Romney, you and me both, right, 647 00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,240 Speaker 1: who is a very nice guy, but you know, right, 648 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 1: talk to us about January sixth for a second, because 649 00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:15,520 Speaker 1: I mean, it must be hard to be a member 650 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 1: of Congress to have lived through this, to have seen 651 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:22,080 Speaker 1: Republican members run for their lives and then the cognitive dissidence. 652 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,800 Speaker 5: Yeah, it's so strange because that day, you know, as 653 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 5: I shared, I have served as a co chair of 654 00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 5: the campaign. So for me, this was the culmination and 655 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:34,720 Speaker 5: of all that work on the campaign trail with you know, 656 00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:38,960 Speaker 5: Joe Biden and Kamala and being a part of the team. 657 00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:41,280 Speaker 5: And I was like, okay, I will be there to 658 00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 5: witness the certification, and Nancy Pelosi said, the members, you 659 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:48,600 Speaker 5: can volunteer to take ships up in the gallery, up 660 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:53,480 Speaker 5: like the balcony area, to watch what is going to happen. Well, 661 00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:56,880 Speaker 5: we never got to shift number two because while we 662 00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,360 Speaker 5: were up there, we could hear the banging. We could 663 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:01,720 Speaker 5: see people skirted off of the floor, all of the 664 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:04,560 Speaker 5: leadership first and then all of the members. And then 665 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,120 Speaker 5: I don't know if people forgot that we were up 666 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 5: in that gallery, but we were trapped. We could hear 667 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,040 Speaker 5: the noises outside of those doors. We were told to 668 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:15,880 Speaker 5: put on gas masks, that the hoods that were under 669 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 5: our chairs that we didn't even know were there or 670 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:20,360 Speaker 5: didn't even know how to open them. And we were 671 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 5: crawling up and down, just trying to get to someplace 672 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 5: that we thought was safe. And I will never forget 673 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:29,920 Speaker 5: it because I feel it like it was yesterday. It 674 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,600 Speaker 5: was I could look down and see guns being pointed 675 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,520 Speaker 5: at one door, and I could hear the gunshot at 676 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 5: the other door, and you know, in that moment, and 677 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:41,880 Speaker 5: I tell people, it was almost out of body thing. 678 00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,760 Speaker 5: I could feel history, I could feel our ancestors, I 679 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 5: could feel like time going by, and all I could 680 00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 5: think to do. I was pray and I prayed for everybody, 681 00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 5: you know. I didn't just pray for one group of people, 682 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,040 Speaker 5: you know. And I could feel other members touching my 683 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,640 Speaker 5: back or touching my arm as I prayed. And then 684 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,440 Speaker 5: they let us out of that room. And I will 685 00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 5: tell you on the anniversary, it was important to me 686 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:12,840 Speaker 5: to not forget what happened, so to remember to reflect 687 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:16,359 Speaker 5: on how close we were to losing it, and then 688 00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 5: to recommit to our democracy. Like I felt more on 689 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:24,000 Speaker 5: fire to do the work than ever before. And I 690 00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:27,719 Speaker 5: think that this moment again, it is important for people 691 00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:32,160 Speaker 5: to know we were close. And when Donald Trump starts 692 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:35,480 Speaker 5: talking about words like blood bath, that ain't about cars 693 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 5: as far as I'm concerned. I mean, he was talking 694 00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:40,440 Speaker 5: about American carnage in the first one. And there's a 695 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 5: great Maya Angelo quote, when somebody shows you who they are, 696 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,160 Speaker 5: we'll leave him. He's telling us who he is, he's 697 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,960 Speaker 5: telling us what he will do. We also know that 698 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 5: Joe Biden is telling us what he would do in 699 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,839 Speaker 5: a second term, and so we just need to see 700 00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 5: what people have done. Think about it. I've been one 701 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:02,840 Speaker 5: president who talked about him for structure Joe Biden did infrastructure. 702 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,080 Speaker 5: You know one president who talked about a fair tax code. 703 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,960 Speaker 5: Joe Biden really is doing a fair tax code, not 704 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 5: just for rich people, but for all of us. Just 705 00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,560 Speaker 5: look at the record, look at who they are, and 706 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:17,799 Speaker 5: look at how they even talk. I believe that as 707 00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 5: this election goes and the more people here and remember 708 00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,880 Speaker 5: who Donald Trump is, they'll remember why they need to 709 00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:28,080 Speaker 5: have that sense of urgency, not only for Joe's campaign, 710 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 5: but even for people like me to support people like me. 711 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,400 Speaker 5: The theme of my campaign is Fright Hope, which was 712 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:36,880 Speaker 5: the church my grandmother attended for seventy years. And it 713 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,359 Speaker 5: is not just the church name. It is a way 714 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,200 Speaker 5: of being when you feel dark. And in this moment, 715 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,080 Speaker 5: people feel dark. But I'm like, look, if you just 716 00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:49,080 Speaker 5: got to match side light, our match flights coming together 717 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 5: can create something bright. And that's what I'm trying to 718 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,720 Speaker 5: bring to the Senate. Fright Hope and so so yeah, 719 00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:57,440 Speaker 5: and hey, hey, if anybody out there likes with you here, 720 00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:00,920 Speaker 5: go to least a Bluff Rochester dot com, Little shameless plug. 721 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 1: Yes, that's good, that was great, Thank you, thank you, 722 00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:04,839 Speaker 1: thank you. 723 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 2: I hope that you will come back. 724 00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:11,280 Speaker 5: I hope you will have me back, Molly. I really 725 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:12,000 Speaker 5: enjoyed this. 726 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:18,360 Speaker 1: Amy Chosen is the creator of the New MAC series 727 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,560 Speaker 1: The Girls on the Bus and author of the New 728 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,200 Speaker 1: York Times bestseller Chasing Hillary. 729 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:26,960 Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics, Amy. 730 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:28,960 Speaker 5: Chose, Thank you so much for having me. Excited to be. 731 00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,920 Speaker 2: Here, delighted to have you so talk to us about 732 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:36,200 Speaker 2: how you got to this book and then to the 733 00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 2: show The Girls on the Bus. 734 00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 5: Sure Well, I was a political reporter for many years. 735 00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:44,440 Speaker 4: I covered Hillary Clinton and Obama in two thousand and 736 00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:46,440 Speaker 4: eight when I was at the Well Street Journal, and 737 00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 4: then when I was at the New York Times for 738 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:52,640 Speaker 4: many years I covered the twenty sixteen campaign Hillary Trump. 739 00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 4: All that, I wrote a book What came out in 740 00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 4: twenty eighteen, a memoir about covering both of Hillary's campaign 741 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 4: and how that sort of took over my life, that 742 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:03,439 Speaker 4: ended up. 743 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:05,440 Speaker 5: Getting optioned by Warner Brothers. 744 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:10,040 Speaker 4: Landing with the producer Grin Burlanti, and we got together 745 00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:13,440 Speaker 4: and started scheming up a fictional backdrop that would be 746 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,000 Speaker 4: inspired by my book for female journalists covering a fictional 747 00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:20,640 Speaker 4: Democratic primary. That became The Girls on the Bus, a 748 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:23,680 Speaker 4: Max series that came out last week. So that's a 749 00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:25,919 Speaker 4: I guess a short version of how I came about 750 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,120 Speaker 4: that is like the dream having your memoir made into 751 00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:30,320 Speaker 4: a television show. 752 00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:36,800 Speaker 2: So explained to us, you covered the sort of campaign 753 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:40,400 Speaker 2: that broke all our brands twenty sixteen. How have you 754 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:44,120 Speaker 2: sort of moved on in your life from that moment? Because, 755 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:47,040 Speaker 2: I mean, it's one thing to have watched it from 756 00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:51,400 Speaker 2: the outside. I can't even imagine the level of feeling 757 00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:54,279 Speaker 2: you must have had from living it on the inside. 758 00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean it is. It was hard to move on. 759 00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:59,560 Speaker 4: And actually, I think one of the beautiful things about 760 00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,239 Speaker 4: the process of turning it into fiction, turning in I 761 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,120 Speaker 4: know it's a TV show, but I you know, it's 762 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:08,319 Speaker 4: turning it into a form of art, like is cathartic? 763 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:08,600 Speaker 5: You know? 764 00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:10,719 Speaker 4: It was very cathartic for me, and I think being 765 00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:13,640 Speaker 4: able to very initially from the very first conversation we said, 766 00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:15,800 Speaker 4: nobody wants to really live the twenty sixteen campaign. 767 00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:17,799 Speaker 5: This has to be fiction. But in a way I 768 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:19,120 Speaker 5: was able to kind of. 769 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:22,000 Speaker 4: Explore all of the themes, all of the things still 770 00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 4: kicking around in my head. 771 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:24,719 Speaker 5: Every day i'd come to the writer's room. 772 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,760 Speaker 4: A lot of people say like, what were you adamant 773 00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:28,760 Speaker 4: about keeping in the book, And it was much less 774 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:30,759 Speaker 4: like this thing from the book has to be in 775 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:34,160 Speaker 4: the show, and much more my partner asking me, what's 776 00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:36,160 Speaker 4: the conversation you wish you would have had, or what's 777 00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:38,160 Speaker 4: the thing you wish you would have done that you didn't, 778 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 4: And so being able to play in this fictional world, 779 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,200 Speaker 4: I got to have all of these. If you get 780 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,959 Speaker 4: to watch the whole season, in the finale that I wrote, 781 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,920 Speaker 4: in particular, there's a conversation between the journalist and a 782 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:52,520 Speaker 4: female candidate. You know, these are conversations you never get 783 00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:55,359 Speaker 4: to have in real life. So it was actually very 784 00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 4: cathartic to be able to do that. We we created 785 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 4: a democratic mash convention and I got some of my 786 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:04,560 Speaker 4: friends from real the real political world, Jen Palmery and 787 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,560 Speaker 4: Eric Schultz and some others to make cameos. It was 788 00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:10,440 Speaker 4: so fun, but Jen Jen Palmery was like pretending to 789 00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:11,680 Speaker 4: check pressing at the stake. 790 00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:12,680 Speaker 5: It looks so real. 791 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 4: Our production value was amazing, and we looked at each 792 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,560 Speaker 4: other and it was just like the weirdest, most meta 793 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 4: feeling because I'm like, oh, the last time you were 794 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:22,640 Speaker 4: doing this, It was at the real one, and it's 795 00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:26,600 Speaker 4: so strange, we like sort of rewritten history here in 796 00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:27,800 Speaker 4: our in our fictional world. 797 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,080 Speaker 5: So it's been it's a great question, and it's been 798 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:31,600 Speaker 5: a pretty casartic process. 799 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:36,400 Speaker 1: So one of the things that readers always get upset about, 800 00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,280 Speaker 1: and I say this is someone who's married to a normal, 801 00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:44,120 Speaker 1: furious Democrat, is that they get mad at conventional political 802 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,799 Speaker 1: reporting because they feel that it doesn't necessarily meet the 803 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:51,000 Speaker 1: moment with journalism. What do you think about that now 804 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:53,840 Speaker 1: that you're not you're sort of in a completely different world. 805 00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:55,080 Speaker 2: You live in La. 806 00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:56,160 Speaker 5: Yeah, that's true. 807 00:39:56,200 --> 00:39:58,040 Speaker 4: I do live in LA. If you ask me about 808 00:39:58,040 --> 00:39:59,920 Speaker 4: the specifics, I'll be like, I don't know. It was 809 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:01,480 Speaker 4: Barber's Market, Like you know that. 810 00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:04,640 Speaker 1: I mean, but what do you think about the idea 811 00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:07,280 Speaker 1: that normal political reporting can't meet the moment? 812 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,000 Speaker 5: I mean, that is something that I think so much about. 813 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 4: And given we made a light dramedy, but this is 814 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:15,240 Speaker 4: sort of the central premise of what we were exploring. 815 00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:18,759 Speaker 4: If we covered politics differently, would we have different politics? 816 00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:25,280 Speaker 1: Right, that's a great line though, if we covered politics differently, 817 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:26,600 Speaker 1: would we have different politics? 818 00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:27,759 Speaker 5: Well, what do you think would we? 819 00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:28,399 Speaker 4: Yeah? 820 00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:29,880 Speaker 2: Well, no, it's a great question. 821 00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:32,320 Speaker 5: It's like I think that Genie's out of the bottle. 822 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:35,240 Speaker 4: So it's not like I'm gear professing to know the answer, 823 00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 4: but it is a great question. It's something I think about, 824 00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:41,960 Speaker 4: whether it's the fact that you know, whether it's a 825 00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:45,240 Speaker 4: false balance. Obama used to always complain about false balance, 826 00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,759 Speaker 4: but I think those complaints have even gotten much more 827 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,800 Speaker 4: heightened when you're comparing of candidate to Tropsa or other Republicans. 828 00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,360 Speaker 4: But so I think the fust balanced debate is And also, 829 00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:56,759 Speaker 4: I you know, something that frustrated me. And by the 830 00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,520 Speaker 4: way I'm taking I take responsibility for this. But the 831 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:03,520 Speaker 4: idea that like no policy, nothing that actually impacts people's 832 00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:06,800 Speaker 4: lives ever broke through, And I don't you know, I 833 00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,440 Speaker 4: would get I would like fly to Landsing, Michigan to 834 00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:12,920 Speaker 4: cover a speech on economics or or a public private partnership, 835 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:15,280 Speaker 4: you know, some kind of interesting wonky thing that Hillary 836 00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:16,160 Speaker 4: loves to talk about. 837 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:17,960 Speaker 5: It, and I would write like two thousand words on it. 838 00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:19,439 Speaker 4: And then people would be like, oh, you write about 839 00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,320 Speaker 4: his emails, and I'm like, I actually write about the 840 00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:21,880 Speaker 4: other things. 841 00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:22,879 Speaker 5: They just don't break through. 842 00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:24,440 Speaker 4: I mean, I think the Daily has done a good 843 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:26,919 Speaker 4: job of like biting off a policy thing going deep 844 00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:29,880 Speaker 4: in it. So I really think the emphasis is on us. 845 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,439 Speaker 4: But that was a frustration, Like I did an event 846 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:36,799 Speaker 4: here for frank Yeah, Franklin Force's book is filled with 847 00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:40,360 Speaker 4: policies that the Biden administration accomplished that And this is 848 00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:41,680 Speaker 4: my own la ignorance. 849 00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 5: I guess. I'm like, I had no idea about the chips, So, like, 850 00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:46,919 Speaker 5: how do we do that? How does that break through? 851 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,080 Speaker 5: I just don't know in this current ecosystem. 852 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 1: That's a really good point about how important policy is 853 00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:58,240 Speaker 1: and how how hard it is to get readers interested 854 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:01,040 Speaker 1: in it. But also I would say to cover it 855 00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:04,959 Speaker 1: in a way that makes it feel germane to their lives, right, 856 00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,680 Speaker 1: I mean that's the you know, for example, like people, 857 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,839 Speaker 1: I mean, I've talked so much about fucking chips, and 858 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:15,000 Speaker 1: it's because it's like it is a paradigm shift, right, 859 00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:17,640 Speaker 1: the idea to bring that we're going to bring ship 860 00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:21,759 Speaker 1: manufacturing back to the United States from Taiwan because of 861 00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:22,680 Speaker 1: the danger of China. 862 00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:23,920 Speaker 2: I mean, really that's what it is. 863 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:27,680 Speaker 1: So like it's two part right to bring American manufacturing back, 864 00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:31,840 Speaker 1: but also because of the enormous threat that China poses, 865 00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:35,000 Speaker 1: and because everything we own has got these chips. So 866 00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:38,800 Speaker 1: I wonder though a lot about like the larger shift 867 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,719 Speaker 1: of chips, right, is that it will eventually if you 868 00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:45,840 Speaker 1: live in a you know, a town in Michigan or 869 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,839 Speaker 1: Wisconsin or wherever it is they're putting the factories. 870 00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:49,600 Speaker 2: I think some. 871 00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:53,279 Speaker 1: Are in Ohio. You know that you now go work 872 00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:54,600 Speaker 1: in a chip factory. 873 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:56,879 Speaker 2: It also a lot of this stuff has these very 874 00:42:56,920 --> 00:43:02,759 Speaker 2: complicated tax incentive structures that are not something readers like 875 00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:06,719 Speaker 2: can grasp a few lines, right, I mean that is 876 00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:10,279 Speaker 2: a larger question is It's just hard to convey that, 877 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:12,960 Speaker 2: but it is interesting and I do think like how 878 00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:14,320 Speaker 2: anxious do you feel? 879 00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:16,840 Speaker 1: And now I feel like you're so are in a 880 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,279 Speaker 1: totally different world. So I feel like this is I 881 00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:21,319 Speaker 1: think it's like actually quite. 882 00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:24,280 Speaker 2: Useful to think of this stuff in hindsight sometimes how 883 00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:29,360 Speaker 2: much anxiety did you feel about the worry of seeming partisan? 884 00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:30,319 Speaker 2: You know what? 885 00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:32,880 Speaker 4: I've The more I think about it, the more I 886 00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,840 Speaker 4: feel like it's how many people really think that the 887 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,440 Speaker 4: New York Times or CNN reporters are running around and 888 00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 4: they're actually Republicans. 889 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:40,960 Speaker 5: Like I just don't know. 890 00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:44,399 Speaker 4: I think we really, you know, it's very important as 891 00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:48,600 Speaker 4: serious news people to project objectivity. I just think it's 892 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,520 Speaker 4: a it's sort of a false contra it's a contradiction 893 00:43:51,600 --> 00:43:53,760 Speaker 4: in terms I just don't And you know what, partly 894 00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:55,120 Speaker 4: that's because of the way. 895 00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,680 Speaker 5: Newsrooms have been hiring for the last twenty years. 896 00:43:57,719 --> 00:43:59,640 Speaker 4: When I started at the Wall Street Journal, as the 897 00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:02,680 Speaker 4: news is, some of the best investigative journalists did not 898 00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:05,080 Speaker 4: have a college, didn't go to college. It was still 899 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:07,360 Speaker 4: it was still sort of a trade, and it was 900 00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:10,560 Speaker 4: still yeah, and it was still like a mid middle 901 00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:14,319 Speaker 4: class trade, and it recruited from people from all over 902 00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:17,480 Speaker 4: the country. I think mostly newsrooms are from elite universities 903 00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:20,640 Speaker 4: now and anyway, I think that I think the structure 904 00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:23,359 Speaker 4: of who populates the media has changed, and I think 905 00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:28,399 Speaker 4: kind of pretending that you're not biased is actually sort 906 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:29,560 Speaker 4: of dishonest in a way. 907 00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:31,120 Speaker 5: I mean, that's sort of the debate. 908 00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:33,600 Speaker 4: That's a debate that we get into this kind of 909 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:36,920 Speaker 4: objectivity versus authenticity. But you know, in my and when 910 00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:38,920 Speaker 4: I started at The Times, a lot of the senior 911 00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:43,319 Speaker 4: political journalists didn't vote in elections they covered because you 912 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:46,040 Speaker 4: had to declare your party, and I understand, but I 913 00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:46,680 Speaker 4: don't know. 914 00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:48,160 Speaker 5: I just feel like now. 915 00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:52,080 Speaker 4: To to pretend that you're going into a Trump rally 916 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,080 Speaker 4: and you're just as sympathetic to the people you're interviewing 917 00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:57,359 Speaker 4: as when you're going to I just like, who are 918 00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:57,960 Speaker 4: we kidding? 919 00:44:58,560 --> 00:44:59,440 Speaker 5: That's kind of my. 920 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,759 Speaker 4: I don't know the answer, but I feel like there 921 00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:03,800 Speaker 4: is something about being honest with readers. 922 00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:05,799 Speaker 5: This is how I feel about women's rights, because I'm 923 00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:06,759 Speaker 5: a woman. That's it. 924 00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,239 Speaker 4: I'm still going to be tough on this candidate who's 925 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:11,839 Speaker 4: screwed up. Like I think you can be fair and 926 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,360 Speaker 4: still be honest that like you're a human being with opinions, 927 00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:15,839 Speaker 4: you know. 928 00:45:16,200 --> 00:45:19,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's right. It's really interesting to just 929 00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:20,960 Speaker 1: sort of talk about this stuff. 930 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:21,160 Speaker 3: You know. 931 00:45:21,200 --> 00:45:24,719 Speaker 1: I wrote a piece about like the Autocrat stuff yesterday, 932 00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:27,520 Speaker 1: and like my editor, who I love so much, was like, 933 00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:31,080 Speaker 1: there are many many questions in this piece because like, 934 00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:33,680 Speaker 1: you know, if you want to just do more opinion 935 00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:35,799 Speaker 1: of your opinion and less of that, And it's like, 936 00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:40,960 Speaker 1: because there are so many questions about like modern political reporting, 937 00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:45,000 Speaker 1: there aren't like really clear answers for any of this, right, 938 00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:47,040 Speaker 1: I mean, the larger question is, how does a free 939 00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:49,920 Speaker 1: press cover in autocracy and you know or want to 940 00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:50,560 Speaker 1: be autocrat? 941 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:52,160 Speaker 2: And I don't know the answer to that. 942 00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:55,440 Speaker 4: We're all operating under the guys of objectivity because it 943 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:56,799 Speaker 4: makes us more trustworthy. 944 00:45:56,880 --> 00:45:59,520 Speaker 5: Like, guys, it's not working, like we've never been trusted with. 945 00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:05,040 Speaker 2: It's true, it's true, that's a good void. 946 00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:07,400 Speaker 5: I mean, I don't want everything to descend. 947 00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:09,400 Speaker 4: I would hate for everything to descend into like a 948 00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:10,880 Speaker 4: hot take opinion piece. 949 00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:13,720 Speaker 5: I firmly believe in in journalism and reporting. 950 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:15,840 Speaker 4: I just think that this whole idea that I don't know, 951 00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:18,440 Speaker 4: Like it's like it's the trust that they trust us 952 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 4: less than they ever did. 953 00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:23,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's the problem of American institutions, right, 954 00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: Like there's always a sense in which we're always having 955 00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,000 Speaker 1: this argument like have the guardrails held? And like the 956 00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:32,560 Speaker 1: reality is that, you know, you know, if you can 957 00:46:32,719 --> 00:46:36,200 Speaker 1: work for different trials to put them off so you 958 00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:39,239 Speaker 1: can run for president, then obviously the guardrails haven't held, right, 959 00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:42,600 Speaker 1: And the question is, like, you know, our American institutions 960 00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:46,320 Speaker 1: as as safe as we think they are, and obviously 961 00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:49,920 Speaker 1: they're not, or they've always been, you know, a cryptocracy 962 00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:53,120 Speaker 1: and the affluent white men will always be able to 963 00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:54,520 Speaker 1: bend them to their will. 964 00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:56,359 Speaker 5: Well that's dark, that's dark. 965 00:46:57,200 --> 00:47:00,239 Speaker 1: Sorry, and it's always been that way. Now, should talking 966 00:47:00,239 --> 00:47:00,880 Speaker 1: about your show? 967 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,080 Speaker 4: No, No, it's okay because in our show, you know, 968 00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:05,240 Speaker 4: we wrote it for several years. We went and Julie 969 00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:07,200 Speaker 4: Black and I created it with her. We went to 970 00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:10,320 Speaker 4: the Caucuses in twenty twenty. We were on the Warren 971 00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:12,799 Speaker 4: Boss bouncer around to Bernie and you know, we kept 972 00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,279 Speaker 4: rewriting things. You know, it's fiction, but we still wanted 973 00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:17,640 Speaker 4: to be a little bit you know, accurate, and. 974 00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:19,480 Speaker 5: We were like, still, no woman president, that one. We 975 00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:21,399 Speaker 5: don't have to rewrite. That's fine, that's all. 976 00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:24,040 Speaker 4: We're like, like, the only thing that really fucks up 977 00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:25,560 Speaker 4: our show is if they elect a woman. 978 00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:27,720 Speaker 5: And they were like, no, it's fine, that didn't happen. 979 00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,360 Speaker 2: I shouldn't laugh, but I laughed to keep from crying. 980 00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:33,359 Speaker 5: It gott a laugh. 981 00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:35,359 Speaker 2: It is so incredibly fucked up. 982 00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:39,200 Speaker 1: How you know, We're gone through so many machinations and 983 00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:41,640 Speaker 1: the one thing that Democrats seem to have agreed on 984 00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:45,680 Speaker 1: is that it's just completely impossible to elect a woman president. Please, 985 00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:49,360 Speaker 1: when you listen to this, please don't write me mean emails. 986 00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:52,359 Speaker 1: I want to have a woman president, probably more than 987 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:54,960 Speaker 1: anyone in the world. But the anxiety, I think is 988 00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:57,360 Speaker 1: such that, you know, we're more likely to have a 989 00:47:57,440 --> 00:47:59,399 Speaker 1: Nikki Haley candidate than. 990 00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:01,399 Speaker 5: I was just about to say that. 991 00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:03,920 Speaker 4: I've been saying that, like, if there's a first woman presence, 992 00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:05,280 Speaker 4: she's probably gonna be a Republican. 993 00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:06,359 Speaker 5: I kind of steel that way. 994 00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:10,319 Speaker 2: It's so dark, or it isn't dark. It's subversive in 995 00:48:10,360 --> 00:48:11,040 Speaker 2: a weird way. 996 00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:14,080 Speaker 1: After twenty sixteen, there was a feeling that nobody ever 997 00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:16,719 Speaker 1: wanted to relive it. And when you said that, I 998 00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:18,799 Speaker 1: was thinking about it because like I've definitely heard from 999 00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:20,319 Speaker 1: like publishers and this and. 1000 00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:24,680 Speaker 2: That, and the reality is like, yes, and we are 1001 00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:27,680 Speaker 2: still stuck re fucking living twenty sixteen. 1002 00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:28,000 Speaker 4: Yeah. 1003 00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:31,120 Speaker 1: Now, yeah, So like nobody wants to relive it, and 1004 00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:32,240 Speaker 1: yet we. 1005 00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:35,040 Speaker 2: Are an ammobius strip of it discussed. 1006 00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:36,680 Speaker 5: Totally, totally, No, it's fascinating. 1007 00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:38,960 Speaker 4: It's actually like I think about that a lot because 1008 00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:41,560 Speaker 4: that was when I got out of political coverage, right 1009 00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:44,399 Speaker 4: see the book ends of My Little I was Ayeah, 1010 00:48:44,600 --> 00:48:46,800 Speaker 4: I went the poor reporter with Obama in two thousand 1011 00:48:46,800 --> 00:48:48,640 Speaker 4: and eight, so like we watched elections come in, we 1012 00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:51,080 Speaker 4: wrote into Grant Park, rode to Grant Park with him 1013 00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:52,960 Speaker 4: in the motorcade, like I just happened to be the 1014 00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:56,319 Speaker 4: pull reporter, and then the book and the Javit Center 1015 00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:58,560 Speaker 4: her her speech the next day. 1016 00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:01,280 Speaker 5: So I'm like, Okay, I'm good. Those are the bookends 1017 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:03,080 Speaker 5: of my political coverage. 1018 00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:05,759 Speaker 4: But but no, I think it was such a watershed 1019 00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,279 Speaker 4: that it is still reverberating. I think that it's less 1020 00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:12,680 Speaker 4: reverberating like Hillary and Trump, and it's more reverberating of 1021 00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:14,880 Speaker 4: all of the themes that we did. I mean, it 1022 00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,000 Speaker 4: was such a wake up moment and nobody thought that 1023 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:18,920 Speaker 4: was going to happen, right, and then it happened, and 1024 00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:21,640 Speaker 4: it feels like it's still happening, and there's still like 1025 00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:24,239 Speaker 4: a trauma associated with it. I think for a lot 1026 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:26,279 Speaker 4: of people who didn't think this could possibly happen, and 1027 00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:28,319 Speaker 4: now it's happening, and it's going to happen again. I mean, 1028 00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:30,319 Speaker 4: so I think that it was such it was such 1029 00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:32,239 Speaker 4: a watershed moment that You're right. 1030 00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:33,800 Speaker 5: I didn't want to I didn't want. 1031 00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:36,200 Speaker 4: To do like game change the twenty sixteen version. I 1032 00:49:36,239 --> 00:49:38,440 Speaker 4: didn't want to like cat that makes. 1033 00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:39,560 Speaker 2: Me want to die. 1034 00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:42,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think primary colors and Emma Thompson like killed 1035 00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:44,799 Speaker 4: it as Hillary in that movie, and like I didn't 1036 00:49:44,800 --> 00:49:46,440 Speaker 4: want to cast tru like I don't want to. I 1037 00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:49,120 Speaker 4: didn't want to do that. But I think you're absolutely 1038 00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:52,360 Speaker 4: right that, like all of the themes that were exposed 1039 00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:55,920 Speaker 4: in twenty sixteen are absolutely things that we're still thinking about, 1040 00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:59,480 Speaker 4: and you can't make a show about politics without leaving 1041 00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:02,800 Speaker 4: those in. And that's certainly kind of the underpinnings of 1042 00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:04,840 Speaker 4: our dramedy are the themes? 1043 00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:05,480 Speaker 2: Right. 1044 00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:07,959 Speaker 1: I had somebody on this podcast who wrote a book 1045 00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:11,480 Speaker 1: about the election that ruined all our lives, and the 1046 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:15,360 Speaker 1: hot take was it was two thousand oh that was 1047 00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:17,640 Speaker 1: the election that ruined all our lives. I was like 1048 00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:20,960 Speaker 1: waxes thing, what but it did? It ruined a different 1049 00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:22,280 Speaker 1: generation of lives. 1050 00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:24,880 Speaker 4: No, And certainly when people and I don't have a 1051 00:50:24,920 --> 00:50:27,239 Speaker 4: fast answer like some people like I've been asked like, well, 1052 00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:28,880 Speaker 4: why do you think people don't trust the Media'm like, 1053 00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:30,520 Speaker 4: oh God, where do I start? But I do think 1054 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:33,160 Speaker 4: certainly the Bush years and the lead up to Iraq, 1055 00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:35,160 Speaker 4: Like I think all these things, I don't think twenty 1056 00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,319 Speaker 4: sixteen happened, and distrusting the media happened just because of 1057 00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:38,920 Speaker 4: Trump and a. 1058 00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:39,600 Speaker 5: Vacuum, right. 1059 00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:42,720 Speaker 1: I agree. I also think though that it's been covered. 1060 00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,759 Speaker 1: I don't think it's covered as causality as much as 1061 00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,920 Speaker 1: it should. Is that some of what happened to the 1062 00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:52,560 Speaker 1: mainstream media is that tech used us for free content 1063 00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:55,600 Speaker 1: and then got mad at us when they got so rich. 1064 00:50:56,040 --> 00:50:58,279 Speaker 2: You know, like Elon is a great example, Like. 1065 00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:02,560 Speaker 1: Twitter grows on free content and then all of a sudden, 1066 00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:04,960 Speaker 1: Elon's like, I don't like any of this, and just 1067 00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,239 Speaker 1: because I take a little kenemy and that's not a 1068 00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:09,719 Speaker 1: big story, and fuck the Wall Street journal. 1069 00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:12,120 Speaker 2: And then you know, he's like, we don't need journalists. 1070 00:51:12,120 --> 00:51:17,560 Speaker 1: We need random anonymous accounts on acts that post videos 1071 00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:18,080 Speaker 1: from two. 1072 00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:20,279 Speaker 2: Thousand and eight. You know. I mean that's some of it. 1073 00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:22,680 Speaker 5: Right, No, I A thousand percent. 1074 00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:25,640 Speaker 4: And that's what's kind of fascinating and terrifying, right, because 1075 00:51:25,719 --> 00:51:29,239 Speaker 4: the changing economics of the news business. I don't think 1076 00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,920 Speaker 4: it's a coincidence that the kind of different economic incentives 1077 00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:36,920 Speaker 4: that have really gutted newsrooms are coinciding with a feeling 1078 00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:39,480 Speaker 4: that media can be trusted and all of these things 1079 00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:43,360 Speaker 4: and allowing for, as you said, these right wing forces. 1080 00:51:42,920 --> 00:51:43,720 Speaker 5: To take hold. 1081 00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:46,719 Speaker 4: It actually gets back to our policy conversation. You're not 1082 00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:48,640 Speaker 4: going to write a story about the Chips plan if 1083 00:51:48,680 --> 00:51:51,200 Speaker 4: you're chasing clicks. And I don't think we're chasing clicks anymore. 1084 00:51:51,239 --> 00:51:53,120 Speaker 4: I think we've got to move past that because that 1085 00:51:53,160 --> 00:51:53,839 Speaker 4: doesn't even work. 1086 00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:57,640 Speaker 2: That's right, clicks have died, that's right. We are pivoting. 1087 00:51:57,880 --> 00:51:59,239 Speaker 2: We're pivoting to video. 1088 00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:02,640 Speaker 5: Again, We're a pivoting now. I've heard podcasts with video 1089 00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:03,239 Speaker 5: is the thing. 1090 00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:06,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, except you say this on a podcast with that video, 1091 00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:09,600 Speaker 2: thank god face. 1092 00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:11,520 Speaker 5: Now. 1093 00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:15,760 Speaker 4: And I also feel for newsrooms that are incredibly understaffed, 1094 00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:18,320 Speaker 4: like I think that's you know, it's like it's all 1095 00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,120 Speaker 4: feeding into this. I mean I think about that sometimes 1096 00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:23,120 Speaker 4: because I do think there's like a nostalgia to the 1097 00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:26,600 Speaker 4: show in that it's like a robust press score following 1098 00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,960 Speaker 4: a you know, a crowded democratic primary, like oh, what's that? 1099 00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:30,279 Speaker 5: Like? 1100 00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:32,799 Speaker 4: You know, I think post post COVID and now you 1101 00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:35,840 Speaker 4: have basically two incumbents running and it's still expensive to 1102 00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:38,880 Speaker 4: send reporters out in the road. That some of that 1103 00:52:39,239 --> 00:52:42,400 Speaker 4: traditional way of covering gut or bat traditional wave covering 1104 00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:43,799 Speaker 4: campaigns has changed to. 1105 00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:48,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, Amy chose. The show is on Max. You can 1106 00:52:48,719 --> 00:52:51,239 Speaker 1: stream it right now. How many episodes? 1107 00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:55,480 Speaker 4: There's two episodes out now and another one drops on Thursday. Yes, 1108 00:52:55,920 --> 00:53:01,280 Speaker 4: all right, doing weekly weekly? How many have episodes all together? 1109 00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:02,799 Speaker 5: There's ten episodes. 1110 00:53:03,200 --> 00:53:08,000 Speaker 4: Oh fantastic, Yeah, thank you, thanks great target to you. 1111 00:53:10,040 --> 00:53:16,360 Speaker 3: Now, Jesse Cannon, Maley, Jung Fast I hear there's a 1112 00:53:16,440 --> 00:53:17,520 Speaker 3: whole lot. 1113 00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:19,560 Speaker 2: The fuck are you going on down in Louisiana? What 1114 00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:20,279 Speaker 2: are you seeing here? 1115 00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:20,719 Speaker 3: So? 1116 00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:25,239 Speaker 1: I want to talk about this rh Impact report that 1117 00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:30,280 Speaker 1: has been released. It's been released by a think tank. 1118 00:53:30,719 --> 00:53:34,359 Speaker 1: It's from rh Impact and it is a report it's 1119 00:53:34,360 --> 00:53:39,279 Speaker 1: called Criminalizing Care How Louisiana's abortion bands in danger patients 1120 00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:45,480 Speaker 1: and clinics. And it's really important statistics about how the 1121 00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:50,000 Speaker 1: state of Louisiana has criminalized women's healthcare. They have made 1122 00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:54,040 Speaker 1: it more likely there are less hospitals, less doctors, less 1123 00:53:54,239 --> 00:53:58,520 Speaker 1: options for treatment, and one of the many findings they 1124 00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:04,000 Speaker 1: have found is that women are less likely to get treated, 1125 00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:07,120 Speaker 1: more likely to die, more likely to die in childbirth. 1126 00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:11,560 Speaker 1: They have theirs, basically existing federal statutes put in place 1127 00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:14,960 Speaker 1: to protect patient access to emergency care, including the federal 1128 00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:19,959 Speaker 1: law called m TALA, are being nullified by Louisiana's abortion bands, 1129 00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:23,480 Speaker 1: which means, if you are dying, you can die in 1130 00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:26,759 Speaker 1: a Louisiana hospital because they don't care. 1131 00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:29,440 Speaker 2: That is our moment of Fuckray. 1132 00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:33,839 Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in 1133 00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:37,080 Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday to hear the best minds 1134 00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:40,320 Speaker 1: in politics makes sense of all this chaos. If you 1135 00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:43,120 Speaker 1: enjoyed what you've heard, please send it to a friend 1136 00:54:43,200 --> 00:54:46,760 Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going. And again, thanks for listening.