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Speaker 1: The volume. All right, Well, good to hoops tonight. You're

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Speaker 1: at the volume heavy Monday, everybody, Oh ball. If you

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Speaker 1: guys had a great weekend. We are continuing our player

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Speaker 1: rankings today. We are venturing into a different tier of players,

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Speaker 1: going into our second tier, our second tier superstars. We're

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Speaker 1: hitting number fourteen and number thirteen today. You guys know

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Speaker 1: the joke before we get started. Subscribe to Hoops and

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Speaker 1: I YouTube channels. You don't miss any more of our videos.

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Speaker 1: Follow me on Twitter and underscore j asnlts. You guys

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Speaker 1: don't miss show announcements. Don't forget about our podcast feed

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Speaker 1: where you get your podcast on our Hoops tonight. It's

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Speaker 1: also super helpful if you leave at rating and a

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Speaker 1: review on that front, Jackson's doing great work on our

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Speaker 1: social media feeds on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and TikTok. Make

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Speaker 1: sure you guys follow us there. In the last but

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Speaker 1: not least, keep dropping mailbag questions in those YouTube comments. Remember,

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Speaker 1: our mail bags are going to be geared towards the

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Speaker 1: player rankings. So if you disagree with any of the

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Speaker 1: numbers on this list, a player too high, a player

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Speaker 1: too low, play or should be on the list, or

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be on the list. Whatever it may be, Just

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Speaker 1: write your quick little elevator, pitch your quick concise basketball

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Speaker 1: argument for why you disagree, and we'll get to them

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Speaker 1: in our mail bags throughout the remainder of the summer.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's talk some basketball. So, as mentioned, we

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Speaker 1: just finished our third tier of superstars. These are the

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Speaker 1: guys that are firmly worth max contracts, probably not gonna

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Speaker 1: be the kind of guy that could be the best

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Speaker 1: player on a championship team. There were a couple guys

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Speaker 1: towards the top of that tier, guys like Jimmy or

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Speaker 1: guys like Book who like if the right situation presented itself,

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Speaker 1: with tons of surrounding talent, they could probably do it.

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Speaker 1: But that's a group that I think is below this

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Speaker 1: next tier, where with our second tier superstars, these are

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Speaker 1: guys that are absolutely capable on any given night of

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Speaker 1: staring down the very best players in the world and

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Speaker 1: out playing them. That means even yes, guys like Shay

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Speaker 1: and Jannis and Luka Dancic and even Nikola Jokich, these

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Speaker 1: are guys that can go toe to toe with those

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Speaker 1: guys and beat them, and we've seen them do it.

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Speaker 1: Both of the guys that were covering today have stared

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Speaker 1: down Nakola Jokic and outplayed him head to head before

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Speaker 1: in single games for one of these guys in the

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Speaker 1: regular season, and for one of these guys in one

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Speaker 1: playoff game where Jokic ended up having the last word

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Speaker 1: and getting the win. The point being, these are guys

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Speaker 1: that on any given night that can reach that level.

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Speaker 1: They have bonafide top tier superstar ceilings. But for various

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Speaker 1: reasons including age for guys like Lebron Steph or Kevin Durant,

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Speaker 1: or injuries for guys like Kawhi Leonard or Joel Embiid,

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Speaker 1: or youth for guys like Anthony Edwards and Victor wembin Yama,

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Speaker 1: these guys struggle to maintain that absolute peak level of basketball.

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Speaker 1: Several of these guys used to be firmly in the

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Speaker 1: top tier, including both guys were covering today, and for

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Speaker 1: guys like Anton Wemby, I'd be shocked if they weren't

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Speaker 1: in that top tier at some point over the next

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Speaker 1: two or three seasons. The guys that are a this group,

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Speaker 1: the players that I have in one through four, they

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Speaker 1: are consistently night to night able to reach that level

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Speaker 1: at least the vast majority of time, and that's really

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Speaker 1: the differentiator is the consistency. And I think there's like

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Speaker 1: a pretty substantial drop off from number four to number

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Speaker 1: five in terms of that night to night consistency there.

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Speaker 1: I actually really struggled with who to put in that

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Speaker 1: fifth spot really for that particular reason. We had a

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Speaker 1: mailback question the other day where we were talking about Tatum,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of why Tatum made so much sense

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Speaker 1: in that five spot. He's the one guy who's like,

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Speaker 1: obviously that number. He's clearly better than everyone below him,

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Speaker 1: but clearly not as good as the four guys above him.

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Speaker 1: It kind of like fits perfectly into that spot. So,

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Speaker 1: without any further doo, let's get started. Number fourteen Joel

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Speaker 1: Embi last season in review. Last season was just a miserable,

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Speaker 1: injury riddled season for Joelle. Played in just nineteen games.

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Speaker 1: He made three separate attempts to try to rejoin the

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Speaker 1: team and just was not able to get his body

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Speaker 1: to cooperate before this seventy six Ers finally shut him

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Speaker 1: down and it was the right decision. He didn't look

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Speaker 1: much like himself when he was on the floor there

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Speaker 1: weren't many examples of him looking like the Joel Embiid

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Speaker 1: that won the MVP previously. All of his numbers and

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Speaker 1: shooting metrics were down year over year. Flashed his upside

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Speaker 1: every once in a while. I had a couple thirty

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Speaker 1: point double doubles and think Gate a thirty seven point game,

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Speaker 1: but he just wasn't able to get healthy and to

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Speaker 1: stay on the floor. Joel's season is actually kind of

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Speaker 1: an interesting example of how this list works and how

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Speaker 1: I put it together. I ranked Joel eleventh last year,

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Speaker 1: and as many of you guys may remember, I took

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Speaker 1: a lot of shit for it, including Joel's trainer, Drew

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Speaker 1: Hanlin actually came after me for it. And here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: It's no secret Joel's not my favorite player. There are

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Speaker 1: several things about his game that I'm not a fan of,

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Speaker 1: But there are also several things about his game that

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Speaker 1: I really like and that are super impressive and that

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Speaker 1: I'm drawn to. My decision to put Joel at eleven

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Speaker 1: was simply weighing the realities of his health risks. In

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Speaker 1: this list, we're looking at who is the best option

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Speaker 1: to have on your team from October through June and

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Speaker 1: I absolutely view Joel Embiid is a bona fide top

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Speaker 1: tier superstar when he's healthy. But I just don't think

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Speaker 1: it was a safe bet for him to make it

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Speaker 1: through the season, and he didn't, and we have to

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Speaker 1: make the same call here. To me, Joel's upside is

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Speaker 1: way too high to drop him to the next tier

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Speaker 1: of guys. I think he'd be no lower than fifth

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Speaker 1: on this list, maybe sixth with Tatum if his knee

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Speaker 1: could hold up. He has a unique problem like this

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Speaker 1: is one of the unique things with Joel that kind

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Speaker 1: of makes him an interesting player to talk to in

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Speaker 1: this context because we talked about out playing the top guys.

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Speaker 1: Out of any of the top guys, Nikole Jokic has

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Speaker 1: issues with one, and that's Joel Embiid. He's the one

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Speaker 1: guy because of his size and his ability to really

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Speaker 1: kind of neutralize some of the scoring that Nikola Jokic

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Speaker 1: does and kind of turn him into more of a playmaker,

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Speaker 1: and his ability to attack Jokic in one on one

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Speaker 1: situations is something that gave Jokic problems in the regular

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Speaker 1: season context, obviously, but that is what makes him specifically

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Speaker 1: interesting as a top tier star. But I would argue,

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Speaker 1: out of this top fourteen group, the top tier superstars

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Speaker 1: and the second tier superstars, he's by far the least

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Speaker 1: likely to actually make it through a season, and so

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Speaker 1: he has to be down at number fourteen for me. Now,

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Speaker 1: for those who are not familiar with how I feel

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Speaker 1: about a healthy Joel, I do want to dig into

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Speaker 1: a little bit about that right here. I'd probably have

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Speaker 1: a healthy version of Joel without the knee issues, if

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Speaker 1: he's just operating at the same level that he is

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Speaker 1: when he's completely in rhythm and on the floor and

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Speaker 1: night tonight ready to go. I'd have him at five

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Speaker 1: or six, probably six if Jason Tatum was healthy. And

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Speaker 1: so in that sense, yes, I am lower on Joel

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Speaker 1: than most people at his absolute ceiling. It really comes

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Speaker 1: down to his playoff shortcomings for me, and that's been

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Speaker 1: a recurring theme as we've discussed some of the guys

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Speaker 1: that missed the list this year and guys that are

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Speaker 1: lower on this list. First of all, the defensive end.

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Speaker 1: When Joelle can stay near the rim, he's one of

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Speaker 1: the best defenders in basketball, but he's not very matchup resilient.

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Speaker 1: He has two specific issues that cause him issue speed,

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Speaker 1: teams that can really get up and down the floor

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Speaker 1: and transition, like I would feel very I would not

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Speaker 1: feel good about a healthy Sixers team against a healthy

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Speaker 1: Indiana Pacers team with Tyres Haliburton ready to go, I

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Speaker 1: think they would just run him off the floor. And

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Speaker 1: we saw many points over the course of the years

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Speaker 1: him really really struggle with transition attack. He just struggles

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Speaker 1: to change ends just because of his lack of foot speed.

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Speaker 1: And then secondly, teams that can really force him to

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Speaker 1: guard on the perimeter, so like excellent pull up shooting

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Speaker 1: teams that force him to come up to the level consistently,

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Speaker 1: or teams that force him to that kind of drag

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Speaker 1: him out and switches. You guys might remember Jason Tatum

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Speaker 1: in game seven of the was at Eastern Conference semis

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Speaker 1: if I remember correctly a couple years ago, Jason Tatum

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Speaker 1: like brutalized Joel Embiid in Game seven on switches and

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Speaker 1: pick and roll in the sense that, like, when he's

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Speaker 1: out at the rim, he's one of the top you know,

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Speaker 1: five or six guys that you can have in the league.

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Speaker 1: But when he's out on the perimeter, he actually suddenly

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Speaker 1: becomes a pretty bad defensive player, and so there's a

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Speaker 1: matchup resiliency thing with him. Defensively. I never viewed him

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Speaker 1: as nearly as good of a playoff defender as he

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Speaker 1: was a regular season defender, and so that was a

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Speaker 1: big part of why I had him lower. And then

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Speaker 1: on offense, he just was never able to really replicate

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Speaker 1: his regular season success when he got to the postseason.

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Speaker 1: The refs are less willing to reward his grifts, his

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Speaker 1: jump shot becomes super streaky. He was always more of

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Speaker 1: a jump shooter than he was like a short range scorer,

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Speaker 1: Like guys like Jokic, they use their body to get

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Speaker 1: closer to the basket, and they lean on hooks and

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Speaker 1: floaters more than they lean on jump shots. Like you'll

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Speaker 1: very rarely see Jokic take a mid range jump shot

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Speaker 1: unless he's up against the clock right or if like

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Speaker 1: it's dead wide open and it would break the offensive

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Speaker 1: rhythm to dribble out of it, and Bead hunts those opportunities,

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Speaker 1: and if they don't go in at a super high clip,

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Speaker 1: it ends up neutering his efficiency when he gets into

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Speaker 1: the postseason. And there was a proven way to have

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Speaker 1: success against him defensively in the postseason by doubling him,

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Speaker 1: specifically from behind if he doubled him from his blind side.

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Speaker 1: He consistently struggled with it for his career. He has

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Speaker 1: eighteen more turnovers than assists in the postseason. That was

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Speaker 1: another consistent issue that would come up. So I viewed

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Speaker 1: Embiid as a top tier superstar, but I viewed him

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Speaker 1: as at the bottom of that top tier because of

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Speaker 1: those limitations when he got to the postseason. All of

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Speaker 1: that said, I truly hope that JOELMBI gets healthy this

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Speaker 1: year and that he's able to make another run at

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Speaker 1: the title. The East is wide open, obviously, if Paul

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Speaker 1: George can get healthy, there's still a decent amount of

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Speaker 1: talent on that roster, and he's capable of being the

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Speaker 1: best player in that conference. And I'd argue a healthy

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Speaker 1: Sixers team is actually a better roster than a healthy

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Speaker 1: Bucks team, And so there's some potential there if all

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Speaker 1: the stars align for this to come together for a

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Speaker 1: moment for deemption for Joel Embii. I saw the article

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Speaker 1: about how bad his an he was, and I do

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Speaker 1: truly feel awful form like I don't wish that on anybody.

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Speaker 1: I hope he can get right, and I hope that

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Speaker 1: we can watch Joel play in some big playoff games

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Speaker 1: again this year. But in the meantime, I think fourteen

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Speaker 1: is the appropriate spot for him on this list. All right,

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Speaker 1: Last guy, Today's gonna be quick show today Number thirteen

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Speaker 1: Kawhi Leonard. Nothing says summer like long days, clutch plays

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Speaker 1: and firing off a few bets on the game, all

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Speaker 1: with DraftKings Sportsbook. As the season heats up, so do

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Speaker 1: the bats, and Draftking Sportsbook has you covered with live betting,

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Speaker 1: home run props, odds, boosts, and more. Whether you're chasing

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Speaker 1: dingers or jumping in mid game, there's always action to

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Speaker 1: be had. Never bet on baseball before. It's easy. Pick

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Speaker 1: a guy to go yard, hammer some live odds mid game,

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Speaker 1: co slash audio. Last season in review for Kawhi played

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Speaker 1: in just thirty seven games. He basically sat out until

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Speaker 1: January and then for the first month kind of slowly

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Speaker 1: ramped up and then more or less played like normal

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Speaker 1: through the end of the season, and it looked like

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Speaker 1: there was a stretch there where the Clippers lost a

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Speaker 1: couple back to back games to the Lakers, and like

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Speaker 1: it looked like Kawhi just didn't have that explosiveness, And

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Speaker 1: I remember talking about it on the show, like Kawhi

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Speaker 1: just doesn't look physically like himself. And then all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden, there was a runway there right before the

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Speaker 1: end of the season where you were like, hoh the shit,

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Speaker 1: Like Kawhi is starting to look a little bit like

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Speaker 1: Kawhi And it was like, are we heading for another

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Speaker 1: one of those environments where he just suddenly in a

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Speaker 1: playoff series looks like he might be the best player

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Speaker 1: in the world. But the bad news is is that

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Speaker 1: even though the plan worked and they got him to

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Speaker 1: the finish line and he was able to finish the

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Speaker 1: playoff run, they albeit short playoff run, without getting hurt.

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Speaker 1: It was also the first year that I can remember

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Speaker 1: where a healthy Kawhi didn't feel like the indomitable force

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Speaker 1: that he was in previous years when Kawhi was healthy

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty and in twenty twenty one and in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty three before he got hurt in those three

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Speaker 1: In the last two playoff runs, and before he got

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Speaker 1: eliminated in twenty twenty he was that classic robot Kawhi

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Speaker 1: with the scoring and efficiency. His numbers in those three

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Speaker 1: playoff runs are kind of insane. Thirty points, eight rebounds,

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Speaker 1: five assists, sixty three point four percent true shooting. That's

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Speaker 1: like off the charts good and all of us remember

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Speaker 1: what it was like watching him in those games. He

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Speaker 1: looked like he was every bit as good as the

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Speaker 1: very best players in the world when that was happening.

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Speaker 1: That was the upside that we were all clinging to

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Speaker 1: when we would discuss the Clippers. If Kawhi can stay healthy,

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Speaker 1: he can be the best player in a playoff run,

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Speaker 1: potentially for the handful of games. And what was it

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, he would look better than KD in

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Speaker 1: those games before he got hurt. That Clippers team looked

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Speaker 1: destined for a finals run in twenty twenty one before

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Speaker 1: he got hurt. But that upside just didn't materialize this year.

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Speaker 1: We got one game. Game two was wild vintage Kawhi

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Speaker 1: fifteen for nineteen from the field, four for seven from

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Speaker 1: three thirty nine points, walked down the Nuggets with two

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Speaker 1: ice cold jumpers in the final two and a half minutes.

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Speaker 1: It felt like those other playoff runs. But outside of

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Speaker 1: Game two against Denver, he was never able to bring

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Speaker 1: that true Superstar force to bear. Game one nine for

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Speaker 1: fifteen from the field, which is obviously efficient, but he

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Speaker 1: had just twenty two points, and he had seven turnovers

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Speaker 1: with only two assists. It was a bad game for Kawhi.

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Speaker 1: Game three seven for seventeen, Game four ten for twenty two,

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Speaker 1: twenty four points, two assists. That's a mediocre Superstar game,

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Speaker 1: a bad Superstar game. Game five eight for fifteen from

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Speaker 1: the field, twenty points, eleven assists, a fine game, but

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Speaker 1: nothing special. Game six twenty seven to ten to five

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Speaker 1: on eleven for twenty two. That's a really good game.

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Speaker 1: But that's not like Robot Superhero Kawhi. Game seven elimination,

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Speaker 1: Everything on the line six for thirteen, twenty two points,

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Speaker 1: five rebounds, two assists. And there's context there, like Denver

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Speaker 1: brought a lot of double teams against Kawhi in that series,

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Speaker 1: but at the same time, Kawhi did a really poor

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Speaker 1: job of managing and solving those double teams. So even

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Speaker 1: though the shooting percentages as you zoomed out from the series,

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Speaker 1: he was still fifty forty. Like the shooting percentages look fine,

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Speaker 1: but if you take out Game two, he was actually

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Speaker 1: pretty mediocre in that series, and his scoring volume wasn't

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Speaker 1: good at all. So the bottom line is, in years past,

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Speaker 1: it felt like a healthy Kawhi was as good as

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Speaker 1: the best player is in the league. But this year,

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Speaker 1: Kawhi went into the playoffs healthy and he didn't come

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Speaker 1: close to that level, and that was really sad for

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Speaker 1: me as a basketball fan. One of the things it

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Speaker 1: felt like as we were watching it was like, oh, man, like,

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Speaker 1: is this the end of Kawhi's prime? Like for me

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Speaker 1: as a basketball fan, I actually really like watching Kawhi.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of like when I play in the post,

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Speaker 1: a lot of the post work that I do, I've

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Speaker 1: tried to mimic Kawhi in terms of physical post up

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Speaker 1: play and using your to get separation. Like, Kwi is

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Speaker 1: a player that I've always been drawn to, and it

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Speaker 1: feels like we got robbed of his prime and now

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Speaker 1: it just feels like we're on the other side, and

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Speaker 1: that really sucks. Let's take a look at the season

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Speaker 1: real quick. Let's go through some of his numbers. Thirty

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Speaker 1: seven games played, he had twenty two points, six rebounds,

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Speaker 1: and three assists, two point one stocks per game, one

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Speaker 1: point six steals, which actually ranked seventeenth in the NBA.

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Speaker 1: His percentages, he was below fifty, just below fifty percent

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Speaker 1: from the field. That was his first time below fifty

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Speaker 1: percent since twenty twenty. Forty one percent from three and

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Speaker 1: five attemts per game. Shot the ball well there eighty

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Speaker 1: one percent from the line, but only three attempts per game.

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Speaker 1: And this is perhaps the most concerning stat as it

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Speaker 1: pertains to Kui's declining athleticism. Kawi is not a grifter.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't get to the line by doing jankie shit.

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Speaker 1: He gets to the line as a supreme athlete that

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Speaker 1: gets defenders out of position. But if you look back

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Speaker 1: his last full healthy season in San Antonio, his season

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Speaker 1: in Toronto where he won the title, his season with

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Speaker 1: the Clippers in twenty twenty, in those seasons he posted

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Speaker 1: over seven free throw attempts per game in each of

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Speaker 1: those three seasons, this year just three, so less than

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Speaker 1: half what he was at his peak. He's just not

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Speaker 1: getting defenders out of position the way that he used to.

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Speaker 1: Fifty six percent in effecive fielgal percentage, which is which

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Speaker 1: is fine, but it's not Kawhi. Fifty nine percent true shooting,

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Speaker 1: which is fine, it's not Kawhi. It's his lowest since

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty. Playtype data, this is where you can really

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Speaker 1: see the drop off down across the board. He was

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Speaker 1: below a point per possession in pick and roll. The

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Speaker 1: year before he was at one point zero four, which

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Speaker 1: was sixty nine percent TILE, so he dropped substantially year

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Speaker 1: over year as a pick and roll player. He was

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Speaker 1: below a point per possession in ISO this year. The

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Speaker 1: year before he was one of the best ISO players

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Speaker 1: in the league one point twenty five points per io

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Speaker 1: including passes, which was in the ninety sixth percentile. This

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Speaker 1: year in the post one point zero seven points per possession,

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Speaker 1: which is slightly above average, but one year prior one

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Speaker 1: point one four seven points better per one hundred possessions,

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Speaker 1: a massive year over year deep a dip in his

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Speaker 1: play type in his shot creation out of various play types.

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Speaker 1: So I mean the reason why Kawhi is dropped all

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Speaker 1: the way to thirteen on this list is simply that

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Speaker 1: the equation is changed. It used to be that like

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Speaker 1: if you could somehow navigate the season and get to

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Speaker 1: the finish line. With a healthy Kawhi, you got to

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Speaker 1: have a top tier superstar at that point, and he

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Speaker 1: had the potential to outplay the best players in the league.

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Speaker 1: He gave you a crazy upside, right that, like, maybe

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Speaker 1: they can win the title upside. But now it feels like,

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Speaker 1: if you get through a season with a healthy Kawhi,

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Speaker 1: you get a second tier superstar, a guy that on

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Speaker 1: any one night, like in Game two, can reach that

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Speaker 1: level and outplay the best players in the world. But

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Speaker 1: a guy who on most nights is probably going to

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Speaker 1: be a level below that. So that's how he lands

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Speaker 1: at number thirteen this year. All right, guys, that's all

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Speaker 1: I have for today is always to sincerely appreciate you

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Speaker 1: guys for supporting us, in supporting the show. We'll be

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Speaker 1: back on a Wednesday with number twelve and number eleven.

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Speaker 1: I will see you guys then