1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 1: Warning. This episode contains references to sexual violence. Listener discretion 2 00:00:06,600 --> 00:00:19,919 Speaker 1: is advised. There are thousands of bodies buried in the 3 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 1: fertile soils of El Salvador, deep beneath the volcanic ash 4 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:30,120 Speaker 1: feeding the coffee plantations in the mountains. The practice of 5 00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 1: burying multiple bodies in a common grave goes back centuries 6 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:38,879 Speaker 1: when the conquistador is killed with swords and plagues when 7 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,080 Speaker 1: the government massacred our indigenous people in the nineteen thirties. 8 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: Often common graves are marked with nothing more than two 9 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 1: sticks in the shape of a cross, a simple memorial 10 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:52,160 Speaker 1: to lives lost. 11 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 2: After pushing the bodies into the grave, the villagers covered 12 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 2: it and placed a simple cross us made out of 13 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 2: tree branches on the grave. I always thought it was 14 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 2: just some little twig cross, and it was big three 15 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 2: feet tall, this cross. And I think it was very 16 00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:16,679 Speaker 2: obvious that the compasinos wanted this grave to be found, 17 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:18,839 Speaker 2: otherwise they wouldn't have marked it that way. 18 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 3: That's my opinion on that. 19 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: That's sister Cynthia glavic an Ursulae nun from Cleveland, Ohio, 20 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 1: and she's talking about a common grave that was discovered 21 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: in the afternoon of December fourth, nineteen eighty four women's 22 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: bodies had been found sprawled along the roadside in the 23 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:43,880 Speaker 1: village of Santiago Nonualco. Local campasinos had found the women 24 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 1: and buried them together in a shallow grave. This is 25 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: nine months after Oscar Romero's assassination. By this time, the 26 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: country was teetering on the brink of all out war 27 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: and finding bodies along the road side was becoming more 28 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:06,000 Speaker 1: and more common. But one detail about these women stood 29 00:02:06,040 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 1: out so much so that one of the villagers who 30 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 1: was there went back and told his priest about it. 31 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 2: The sandals was an interesting detail because the Salvadoran women 32 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 2: didn't wear any shoes, so the fact that these women 33 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 2: had sandals, it was like an identifying item that they 34 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 2: were who they were, that these were the missionaries. 35 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 1: Four American missionaries had gone missing. They'd been coming back 36 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: from the airport in a big white van when they 37 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 1: just disappeared. So when the priest heard about the women 38 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:58,960 Speaker 1: in sandals, he immediately raised the alarm. He called the 39 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 1: American embassy and the US ambassador Robert White. We heard 40 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,080 Speaker 1: about in the last episode. White went to the grave 41 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: site and asked the local authorities to dig up the bodies. 42 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:14,280 Speaker 2: The bodies were unearthed and pulled out of the shallow 43 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:18,880 Speaker 2: grave one by one with ropes, first, then more than Dorothy, 44 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:20,799 Speaker 2: and finally Ita. 45 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: This graphic moment was caught on film by reporters and 46 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:31,360 Speaker 1: broadcast all over the US. Sister Cynthia was one of 47 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: the people watching on TV. 48 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 2: Those bodies being pulled out of the grave over and 49 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 2: over again on TV. I think that just reinforced the 50 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 2: brutality of this the whole thing. 51 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 1: For Sister Cynthia, this footage hit especially hard because she 52 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: recognized some of these women from back home. 53 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: We were especially shocked in Cleveland because Dorothy and Jean 54 00:03:56,480 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 2: had lived among us, so when they were found in 55 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 2: a shallow grave in this deserted cow pasture, this news 56 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 2: made headlines in every local and national news program and 57 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:14,960 Speaker 2: in every newspaper. Their deaths brought the tiny country of 58 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 2: El Salvador and its problems to the intention of the 59 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: entire world. 60 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 1: The news that four American churchwomen had been killed execution 61 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 1: style in El Salvador broke in the United States like 62 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 1: a bomb. It was the first time that the general 63 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 1: public in the US had heard any detail about what 64 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: was happening in El Salvador. Oscar Romero had been murdered 65 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: earlier that same year, but the murder of these four 66 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: churchwomen would bring a whole new level of international scrutiny. 67 00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:58,839 Speaker 1: This moment became a litmus test for the United States 68 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 1: what they do about this heinous crime. Were they willing 69 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:06,840 Speaker 1: to keep funding a war that had killed its own citizens? 70 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: The answer would reveal a murky cover up and would 71 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:18,359 Speaker 1: threaten the relationship between these two countries. I'm Jasmine Romero, 72 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,920 Speaker 1: and this is sacred Scandal. Nation of Saints, Episode four. 73 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 1: The nuns. I don't know about you, but when I 74 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:44,360 Speaker 1: think about nuns, I generally picture them walking around in 75 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:49,480 Speaker 1: clusters around a cathedral, heads bowed and counting their rosary beads. 76 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:53,120 Speaker 1: What I don't picture is nuns canoeing. 77 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 2: I just have this memory of us laughing, kind of 78 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 2: screaming on the river wherever we were. We were in 79 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:04,480 Speaker 2: some park and trying to maneuver the canoes. 80 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 1: But that's how Sister Cynthia remembers her time with Dorothy Kasel, 81 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: one of the four churchwomen who were sent to El Salvador, 82 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,479 Speaker 1: not as a nun, but as the vibrant and dynamic 83 00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 1: woman she was. 84 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 3: She was very outgoing. She had a huge smile, a. 85 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 2: Lot of energy, the ability to make you feel special. 86 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:34,160 Speaker 1: Cynthia first met Dorothy when she joined the Ursuline Sisters 87 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 1: of Cleveland in nineteen seventy three, but it turns out 88 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 1: that Dorothy and Cynthia had actually grown up in the 89 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 1: same place. 90 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 2: Her family lived on the same street as I did, 91 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 2: Shoreview Avenue, in Ublite, Ohio. They lived six doors away, 92 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 2: so I knew her parents pretty well. So when I 93 00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 2: told her that I was from Shoreview Avenue, she called 94 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 2: us the Blondes from Shoreview because she always had nicknames 95 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:04,960 Speaker 2: for people. 96 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: Sister Cynthia is now the director of Archives for the 97 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:12,640 Speaker 1: Ursuline Sisters of Cleveland, and she wrote a book about 98 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 1: Dorothy after her death. It's called In the Fullness of Life, 99 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 1: and in the process of writing her book, she researched 100 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: deeply how her fellow sister came to be in El 101 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: Salvador and what her time there was like. In the 102 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:36,080 Speaker 1: nineteen sixties, the Pope had asked religious congregations to send 103 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 1: missionaries to Latin America to support the new vision for 104 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 1: the Catholic Church. Dorothy immediately knew that she wanted to 105 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: be involved. 106 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 2: Sister Dorothy wrote a letter volunteering and she mentioned that 107 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 2: she had always had this desire since she was a 108 00:07:55,680 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 2: child to serve the Spanish and Indian people, that she 109 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 2: wanted to stay there and get to know them and 110 00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 2: help them. 111 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 1: In the summer of nineteen seventy four, Dorothy landed in 112 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 1: El Salvador. This was well before Oscar Romero was named archbishop, 113 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:19,119 Speaker 1: before Rorito, that we saw and had death squads, before 114 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: the pressures of the country would boil over into all 115 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 1: out war. 116 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 4: Wednesday around enjoying thirty first, I think, and we arrived 117 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 4: here on Monday afternoon. A plane came in early, it 118 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 4: was about four o'clock. We had a beautiful flight. The 119 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 4: flight down was really nice. 120 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:43,240 Speaker 1: Throughout her time there, Dorothy Kasel recorded audio cassette letters 121 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:45,439 Speaker 1: that she sent back to Cleveland. 122 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 5: The country is really exquisite. It's mountainous and green, very 123 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 5: green right now, and you really have to see it 124 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:55,679 Speaker 5: to appreciate it. It really is beautiful. 125 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:02,079 Speaker 1: Tapes that describe her new life in El Salvador. Listening 126 00:09:02,120 --> 00:09:04,680 Speaker 1: to her, it kind of reminds me of my own 127 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: reactions when I arrived, taking in the beauty but also 128 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: the poverty of this place. 129 00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:16,120 Speaker 4: When you pull into Cherry Library, you just pull onside 130 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:17,520 Speaker 4: too a dirt road which. 131 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 5: Is really rocky and pitted. So we went around a village. 132 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 4: And if they say it's great powerty stricken, it's just 133 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 4: something you. 134 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 5: Get used to living with and used to looking at it. 135 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 4: Really, it is amusing to see these pigs tranding around 136 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 4: those too, big pigs, little pigs, big counse, little counts, 137 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:40,679 Speaker 4: big bulls all over the place. 138 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 3: It's different. 139 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 1: Dorothy worked with priests administering to the community. She worked 140 00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 1: in three different parishes and was eventually sent to the 141 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: Immaculate Conception parish in La Libertad. 142 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:01,440 Speaker 2: They planned an organized celebrate rations of the Eucharist and 143 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 2: other liturgies. They played music and conducted choirs for the liturgies. 144 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:10,679 Speaker 2: They prepared adults and children for the reception of the sacraments. 145 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 3: They also visited the sick. 146 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:18,599 Speaker 1: She also trained Salvadorans to be religious teachers. She distributed 147 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,360 Speaker 1: food to mothers and young children as part of Catholic 148 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:25,200 Speaker 1: relief programs. She and the other nuns they became a 149 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 1: real presence in the area. 150 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:32,360 Speaker 2: Now whereas a priest could only visit his entire area 151 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:36,640 Speaker 2: once a month, the sisters and laywomen visited their areas 152 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 2: all ten or more villages weekly alone and usually on 153 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:45,800 Speaker 2: horseback or by motorbike because of the rough terrain. So 154 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 2: since the women served as such a vital link of 155 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 2: communication between the parishes and its prisoners, the sisters really 156 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 2: guided the work of the parish. 157 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:01,240 Speaker 1: Dorothy committed to stay six year years in El Salvador 158 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 1: from nineteen seventy four to nineteen eighty. In those six years, 159 00:11:07,360 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: she became part of the community. She slowly learned Spanish, 160 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:14,440 Speaker 1: learning the names of the towns that she was working in, 161 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: and she grew to love the people that she was helping, 162 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:22,880 Speaker 1: and they too loved her. She became known as Madre 163 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 1: de Rothera. In nineteen eighty, her term was ending and 164 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:31,560 Speaker 1: she was due to go back to Cleveland, but then 165 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 1: Oscar Romero was killed. 166 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 6: Everybody's just in a stage of shot, because you know, 167 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 6: it's just he had just given us beautiful, beautiful homily 168 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 6: and Sunday very strong. It was very his message was 169 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:48,240 Speaker 6: very strong, you know, he says, and to the soldiers, 170 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 6: I have a specialness. And she says, I beg of you. 171 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 7: I pleaded with you in the name of God, stop 172 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 7: the repression. 173 00:11:55,160 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 6: Don't kill Oh it was you know and in your years. 174 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: Dorothy was at Romero's funeral. You can see her in 175 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 1: the photos that were published from that day, standing by 176 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 1: his casket. She was inside the cathedral while the bombing 177 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:18,960 Speaker 1: and the shooting was happening outside. In letters back home, 178 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 1: she describes the horror of that day, watching the bodies 179 00:12:23,120 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: of those killed be carried into the cathedral. Soon, Dorothy 180 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: would be faced with a choice, one that directly tied 181 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:53,680 Speaker 1: to Oscar Romero's assassination. That's after the break, it was 182 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: clear that the situation in El Salvador was rapidly deteriorating. 183 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: The Bishop of Cleveland worried about Dorothy and her safety, 184 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,640 Speaker 1: but he also knew how much good the missionaries were doing. 185 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: After Romero was assassinated, the bishop asked Dorothy if she 186 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: wanted to come home or stay for another year. 187 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:18,040 Speaker 3: She so, well, of course I will stay, you. 188 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:21,600 Speaker 1: Know, But this wasn't the same El Salvador that she 189 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 1: had arrived to in her six year stay. The political 190 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: landscape had completely changed that Wisun's TV programs and death 191 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 1: squads were fully operational in two months. The leftis Gerrias 192 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:43,000 Speaker 1: the FMLN will declare war on the Salvadoran government. Suddenly, 193 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 1: Dorothy and the missionaries are not just spreading the word 194 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 1: of Jesus. They're tending to wounded civilians and assisting people 195 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 1: who had become refugees within their own country. 196 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 2: A call would come for one of the gringas to 197 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 2: transport refugees from a bombed out village to a refugee center. 198 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 1: The women helped refugees find whatever they needed, medicine, shelter. 199 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:13,280 Speaker 1: All four of the churchwomen who were murdered in El 200 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: Salvador were involved in this kind of humanitarian work, including 201 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 1: Mary Noll's sisters Mara Clark and Eda Ford, and lay 202 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: missionary Jane Donovan. 203 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 2: So anyway, with their white Toyota van, Dorothy and Jean, 204 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 2: who had been called the rescue squad by more and Ida, 205 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 2: traveled through the hills, moving food supplies and refugees to 206 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 2: refugee centers. They distributed medicine to the sick and wounded people, 207 00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 2: took them to medical clinics. 208 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 3: They couldn't take the people to. 209 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 2: Government hospitals for fear the people would be killed there. 210 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 1: It was clear to the sisters how bad things were getting, 211 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: especially as they were working in and around towns with 212 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 1: heavy Geria presences. They saw a lot of death. 213 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 7: On Friday, the next day and the twenty third, they 214 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 7: found their bodies and I thought they were hacked. One 215 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 7: of them was decapitated. I mean, it was just gruesome, 216 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:19,640 Speaker 7: just gruesome. So you know, it's just why why. 217 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 6: I couldn't believe, you know, how these people can endure 218 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 6: all of this. 219 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 7: It's just been, you know, something's been happening like every week, 220 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:31,400 Speaker 7: you know, every day in the paper, ten bodies found 221 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 7: in Santa on a five, and Ali Chapon with E M. 222 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:39,080 Speaker 7: The Squadron written on another twelve, and Son Miguel. It 223 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 7: just gets to be too much. Sometimes it's so sad 224 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 7: and it's just like so out of control. 225 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: But Dorothy was determined in her decision to stay. 226 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:54,840 Speaker 2: She wrote, I could not leave Salvador, especially now, because 227 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 2: I am committed to the persecuted church here. 228 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: Now. I don't doubt for a moment Sister Dorothy's resolve 229 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 1: and her desire to help. But there's also something else 230 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: that influenced her decision to stay. 231 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 2: They were well aware of the danger of doing that 232 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 2: type of work, and they were fearful. But because they 233 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 2: look so American with their blonde hair and blue eyes, 234 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 2: Dorothy and Jean believed that they were safe. 235 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: Whiteness americanness. It was a kind of unspoken protection that 236 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: they carried. Dorothy wrote in her letters that even the 237 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: local priests liked to have the American women with them 238 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 1: when they walked around because they knew it was a 239 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 1: kind of armor. 240 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 2: Gane used to say, they the military don't shoot blonde, 241 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 2: blue eyed North Americans, and Dorothy said, being a gringa 242 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 2: is an asset. They wouldn't do anything to hurt you. 243 00:16:55,480 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: But that protection only went so Fardnesday, November twenty sixth 244 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: of nineteen eighty, Dorothy and Jean were invited to visit 245 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: the US Ambassador Robert White at his home. 246 00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 2: They had met at a Thanksgiving ecumenical service the week 247 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 2: before Thursday before, and they were talking about the political situation, 248 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 2: and White said, well, why don't you come, We'll continue 249 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:27,160 Speaker 2: this conversation. Why don't you come to the American embassy. However, 250 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 2: because of the curfew, please bring an overnight back, you know, 251 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:33,560 Speaker 2: so you could stay overnight. 252 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,640 Speaker 1: They spent the night, and the next day sister Dorothy 253 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: and Jean went to the airport to pick up sisters 254 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:43,639 Speaker 1: Mara Clark and Eta Ford, who had been at a 255 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:46,200 Speaker 1: conference in Nicaragua. 256 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,800 Speaker 2: So the plane landed at seven o'clock. Dorothy and Jean 257 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:55,600 Speaker 2: greeted more and Ida, and they proceeded to the baggage 258 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:58,600 Speaker 2: claim to pick up their baggage there. And while they 259 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:01,000 Speaker 2: were waiting for their baggage, which they chatted with a 260 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,680 Speaker 2: group of Canadians who were arriving and. 261 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 3: Kind of milling around there. 262 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 2: The Canadians then got their luggage and said goodbye. 263 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: That's really the last time that anyone saw the four 264 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:21,120 Speaker 1: women alive. The next day, the pastor at Dorothy's parish 265 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 1: went to Dorothy and Jean's apartment. He was confused when 266 00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:29,920 Speaker 1: they weren't there. He and others in the surrounding parishes 267 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:33,679 Speaker 1: started to make phone calls searching for the women. The 268 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,440 Speaker 1: American Ambassador, Robert White and the Minister of Defense were alerted, 269 00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: and several of the sisters themselves started to search. Two 270 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:46,040 Speaker 1: of them drove to the airport. On their way, they 271 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 1: spotted a burnt out vehicle, a wreck surrounded by police 272 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 1: a large white van that looked familiar. When they got 273 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:00,919 Speaker 1: to the airport, they asked around about the nuns, showing 274 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: their photographs. Witnesses confirmed that they had been there. When 275 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:10,119 Speaker 1: the sisters got home, they looked up that white van's 276 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 1: serial numbers, and. 277 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:17,480 Speaker 2: The numbers listed on the van's registration papers matched the 278 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 2: numbers stamped on the motor block of the abandoned, burned 279 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 2: out van, so they knew that that was their van. 280 00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:31,800 Speaker 1: The women's bodies would be found the day after they 281 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:37,159 Speaker 1: went missing, but now the question was who had taken 282 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: them and why. That's after the break the bodies were 283 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 1: buried in the red clay earth of Santiago Nonualco in 284 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:56,399 Speaker 1: the Salvadorn Hills. Local Gumpasinos were ordered to reopen the 285 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,719 Speaker 1: grave and pull up the bodies of the four churchwomen. 286 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 1: When they were exhumed. US Ambassador Robert White was there. 287 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: Just three days before he had dined with the women. 288 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: Now he watched their bodies being pulled from their shallow grave. 289 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:22,719 Speaker 2: It was apparent they had been executed military style. When 290 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:26,880 Speaker 2: the back, they were probably forced to lie on the ground, 291 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:30,439 Speaker 2: face down, and they were shot by the way Dorothy 292 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 2: was shot twice. She was shot in the shoulder, they 293 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:37,400 Speaker 2: missed her head. I know that sounds horrible, and she moved. 294 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,600 Speaker 1: The investigations that followed showed that the women were not 295 00:20:42,760 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 1: only murdered, they were also raped. Almost immediately. Robert White 296 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:53,920 Speaker 1: suspected that the Salvadoran government and the National Guard were involved. 297 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,399 Speaker 1: Sister Cynthia interviewed Robert White for her book in nineteen 298 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 1: ninety three, and he told her that he began to 299 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: think that something was fishy when he talked to the 300 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: Minister of Defense hened al josegi More Garcia on the phone. 301 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,760 Speaker 2: He told Garcia that the women were missing. The first 302 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 2: thing Garcia asked was were they wearing habits. Ambassador White 303 00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 2: then said that he had a very very bad feeling. 304 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 2: This is in his own words, because that's the kind 305 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 2: of standard defense that they make. 306 00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: As if not wearing habits, not being recognizable could have 307 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 1: led to their deaths. This question, it got to the 308 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 1: very core of the religious persecution in El Salvador. What 309 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: he was really asking was were these traditional nuns who 310 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,160 Speaker 1: wore habits and stood with the elites, or were these 311 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 1: part of the new and radical church that, in their 312 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:57,200 Speaker 1: eyes stood with the communists. 313 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 2: But I do think that because they were working with 314 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 2: the poor, this seemed to be the pattern with the military, 315 00:22:04,640 --> 00:22:09,040 Speaker 2: that they were considered subversives and they were maybe even 316 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 2: being watched. I think that, you know, maybe that was it. 317 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: Whatever the reason, the killing of four Americans in Alsalvador 318 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,680 Speaker 1: was an undeniable shock to the United States. 319 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:29,680 Speaker 2: Up until that time, American citizens had not been killed. 320 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:35,439 Speaker 1: When the women were killed, Jimmy Carter was president. Like 321 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:38,760 Speaker 1: we mentioned in the last episode, Carter was concerned about 322 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: human rights abuses, but he was also hesitant to clamp 323 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: down on the Salvadoran government. Up until this point, he 324 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: had resisted any calls to suspend AID, including a letter 325 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:56,399 Speaker 1: from Archbishop Romero himself, sent a few weeks before his death. 326 00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:00,200 Speaker 1: In the letter, he pleaded with Carter to stop supporting 327 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,880 Speaker 1: the Salvadoran government. But the murder of the churchwomen would 328 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 1: finally wake up the American public and force President Jimmy 329 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:08,960 Speaker 1: Carter to take action. 330 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:14,680 Speaker 2: After the bodies of the women were found, the United States, 331 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,919 Speaker 2: and this was under President Jimmy Carter announced that it 332 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 2: was suspending military and economic assistance pending clarification of the 333 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 2: circumstances of the killings of the women. 334 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 1: Following the announcement of the churchwomen's murders, the US government 335 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:35,280 Speaker 1: sent two State Department officials to conduct a preliminary investigation. 336 00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 1: They would look into the killings of the churchwomen and 337 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaker 1: whether the Salvadoran government had been involved. They sent FBI 338 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 1: specialists to look at the evidence, fingerprints and bullet fragments. 339 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:54,000 Speaker 1: All the evidence pointed towards it being Salvadoran National guardsmen 340 00:23:54,840 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 1: who were responsible for these murders. To this stay, there 341 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: are still holes in the timeline, but here's sister Cynthia 342 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 1: paraphrasing the FBI's report. 343 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,359 Speaker 2: The women got into their white Toyota van and proceeded 344 00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 2: to leave the airport and at the first toll station 345 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:16,120 Speaker 2: outside the. 346 00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 3: Airport, National guardsmen. 347 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:23,120 Speaker 2: Sergeant Louise Antonio Kalndra Aloman and four other guardsmen ordered 348 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 2: the women to vacate the van, and then after they 349 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 2: interrogated the women, the guardsmen ordered them back in the van, 350 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,920 Speaker 2: got into the van with them and proceeded to drive 351 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 2: the van in the direction of the town of Santiago 352 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:41,520 Speaker 2: Nannualco to a deserted area a dirt lane by an 353 00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,600 Speaker 2: empty field and Klendre Aloman then ordered the women out 354 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 2: of the van. The guardsmen then proceeded to rape the women. Afterwards, 355 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:54,399 Speaker 2: they killed the women execution style and left the bodies 356 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 2: along the roadside. 357 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: Afterwards, the women's van was driven outside of La Libertad. 358 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: Their personal items were removed, and so were the license 359 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:10,360 Speaker 1: plates on the van. The killers then. 360 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 2: Took a can of gasoline and poured gasoline on the 361 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,000 Speaker 2: inside and outside of the van and set the van 362 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 2: on fire. 363 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:25,480 Speaker 1: This information was all based on US led investigations. The 364 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:28,920 Speaker 1: US State Department wanted the Salvadoran authorities to conduct their 365 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,920 Speaker 1: own independent investigation and find out if these National guardsmen 366 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:37,919 Speaker 1: had acted on their own or on higher orders. The 367 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 1: Salvadoran government assured the US that it was doing everything 368 00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: it could to figure out what had happened, but really 369 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:50,440 Speaker 1: there was already a rushed cover up happening. The guardsmen 370 00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 1: had been transferred away from their airport post right after 371 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:58,439 Speaker 1: the murders, and they'd had their rifles exchanged so that 372 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: the ballistics couldn't be traced for months. Salvadorn authorities reassured 373 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 1: the US and continued to hide the truth, but the 374 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: families of the women, and US Ambassador White would continue 375 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 1: to speak out and insist that there was a bigger 376 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,800 Speaker 1: cover up at play. You know. 377 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:23,720 Speaker 2: The argument was always that these lower National guardsmen would 378 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,960 Speaker 2: never have done this, They never would have singled out 379 00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 2: for American women to kill. From the beginning too, the 380 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 2: Salvadoran government wanted to make clear that those guardsmen acted 381 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,840 Speaker 2: on their own see, because they wanted military aid. 382 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 1: Military aid. Jimmy Carter, a president committed to human rights, 383 00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:51,480 Speaker 1: had suspended the aid immediately after their deaths, but that 384 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:56,680 Speaker 1: pause didn't last long. And how quickly does the aid resume? 385 00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,400 Speaker 2: It was resumed On December seventeenth. 386 00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,679 Speaker 1: Two weeks after the women were found dead. Twenty million 387 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:06,920 Speaker 1: dollars in economic aid resumed. 388 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:11,200 Speaker 2: So and there was outrage in the United States. 389 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,959 Speaker 1: Cynthia went to Washington, d C. To protest with an 390 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 1: organization called the Religious Task Force. 391 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,800 Speaker 2: We went on a bus, the big bus went from Cleveland, 392 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 2: you know, filled with people, to go to this protest. 393 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,320 Speaker 2: And I remember it so well because it was just 394 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:34,359 Speaker 2: so moving with seeing so many people, you know, the crowds, 395 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:38,960 Speaker 2: and we carried coffins, cardboard coffins of the four women 396 00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,680 Speaker 2: and had their names on the side, and we had 397 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 2: a huge assembly at the Washington Monument. 398 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:48,880 Speaker 3: Now by then, you know, Carter was out. 399 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 2: This was before Reagan was inaugurated. 400 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: The women had been murdered in December while Carter was 401 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 1: on his way out. Reagan inaugurated the next month in 402 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: January of nineteen eighty one, and despite those protests, he 403 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,560 Speaker 1: would continue to send aid to El Salvador. 404 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 8: Good evening, the Reagan administration today won preliminary approval in 405 00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 8: the Senate for its plans to increase military aid to 406 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:18,119 Speaker 8: El Salvador. 407 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 1: The Reagan administration approved a huge increase in military funding. 408 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:30,160 Speaker 1: Ambassador White began to speak out very publicly and criticized 409 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:34,119 Speaker 1: this continued aid, and he quickly became an enemy of 410 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:40,320 Speaker 1: Reagan's administration. Here he is testifying before Congress. 411 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,240 Speaker 9: The security forces at Al Salvador have been responsible for 412 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,880 Speaker 9: the deaths of thousands and thousands of young people. Are 413 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:53,600 Speaker 9: we really going to send military advisors in there to 414 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 9: be part of that type of machinery. 415 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,560 Speaker 1: Ambassador White openly criticized the Gold government's investigation into the 416 00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 1: women's deaths. 417 00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 2: And he told me that the Department wanted White to 418 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:13,240 Speaker 2: certify that there was progress in these investigations, and he 419 00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:17,680 Speaker 2: refused because he said that simply was not true. And 420 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,920 Speaker 2: White said he wouldn't have any part in a cover up, 421 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 2: and that decision not to participate in the cover up 422 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:27,680 Speaker 2: costom his job. 423 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 1: Two weeks after Reagan was inaugurated, Robert White was fired. 424 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 1: White felt that the Reagan administration was downplaying the Salvadoran 425 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: government's involvement in the killings because they wanted to support 426 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 1: their ally in the proxy Cold War. 427 00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 8: I think that the Reagan administration is so completely transfixed 428 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 8: by their interpretation of Central America that it's an East 429 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 8: where conflict, that they are ready to embrace anyone, no 430 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 8: matter how reprehensible, as long as he or she will 431 00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,240 Speaker 8: say that they are anti communists. 432 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 1: He also pointed to statements made by government officials about 433 00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: the nuns, statements that implied that the nuns weren't just 434 00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:23,600 Speaker 1: innocent victims but part of the Gerria, or that they 435 00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 1: had been killed by accident. This is Jeane Kirkpatrick, Ambassador 436 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 1: to the UN. I'll warn you the tape is a 437 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: little hard to hear. 438 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:38,000 Speaker 3: Not just now. 439 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:41,280 Speaker 5: This, We're going to get a little more great cut. 440 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:42,720 Speaker 5: A participantly usually on. 441 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: It's hard to hear in the tape, so I'll say 442 00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 1: it again because it's worth repeating for just how tone 443 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 1: deaf it is. The nuns were not just nuns. The 444 00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 1: nuns were also political activists. She made this comment on 445 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:02,120 Speaker 1: December twenty fifth of nineteen eighty, just weeks after the 446 00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 1: rape and murder of the four churchwomen. And then there 447 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 1: was Alexander Haigh, Secretary of State, who had just a 448 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 1: few months later, told Congress perhaps the vehicle in which 449 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 1: the nuns were writing may have tried to run a 450 00:31:15,720 --> 00:31:18,719 Speaker 1: roadblock or may have accidentally been perceived to do so, 451 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 1: and that there had been exchange of fire, implying that 452 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,600 Speaker 1: the nuns had guns of their own and had been 453 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 1: in a shootout. Cynthia and her fellow sisters remember hearing 454 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 1: these public comments. 455 00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 2: And we were just outrage and we have a whole 456 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,960 Speaker 2: file of letters that some of our sisters wrote. Mother 457 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 2: Bartholomew wrote a searing letter to Jan Kirkpatrick. She was 458 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 2: a very wonderful, quiet, soft spoken, gentle person, and yet 459 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 2: she wrote this letter really accusing Jan Kirkpatrick. It was 460 00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 2: just outrageous that the nuns would have guns and would 461 00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 2: have exchange fire and also that they were left as 462 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 2: you know. 463 00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 3: Our mission team. 464 00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,920 Speaker 2: They stayed out of politics, and they were there to 465 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 2: be pastoral ministers and later to help the refugees, to 466 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,760 Speaker 2: give them food, to give them, you know, they were 467 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 2: not to be involved in politics. 468 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 1: For years on end, this charade went on. The US 469 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: would dangle its aid package in front of the Salvadorans 470 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 1: and say, you need to show us that you're making 471 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: progress on this investigation, threatening to stop aid, and the 472 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:43,080 Speaker 1: Salvadorans would call their bluff. They'd say sure, sure, we're 473 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,479 Speaker 1: looking into it and make no progress. Inevitably, another one 474 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:54,160 Speaker 1: hundred million dollar check would get sent. The Reagan administration 475 00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: would end up sending over four billion dollars to all 476 00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:01,800 Speaker 1: Salvador basically the entire Civil War. 477 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 2: Robert White also told me quote that when the Reagan 478 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:12,880 Speaker 2: administration reached the conscious decision not to pursue this issue, 479 00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 2: meaning the churchwomen's murders, with the salvador military, they were 480 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 2: giving a very clear signal to the military that we 481 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 2: would not try to hold them accountable for civilian deaths, 482 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 2: whether they were foreigners or whether they were Salvadorans. 483 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:33,080 Speaker 3: End of quote. 484 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:38,120 Speaker 1: I mean if the US government wasn't willing to protect 485 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:44,479 Speaker 1: their own citizens and was willing to defame nuns who 486 00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:47,520 Speaker 1: are raped and murdered. What hope did the Salvadoran people have. 487 00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, there's no other way to interpret that. 488 00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: Eventually there would be some sort of justice once the 489 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:04,560 Speaker 1: Cold War connection and the allyship was no longer necessary 490 00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 1: to the US. Five National guardsmen, including Colindre A. Leimann, 491 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 1: would be charged with the women's killings in the spring 492 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:19,640 Speaker 1: of nineteen eighty one. It would take many years, but 493 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:21,720 Speaker 1: they would eventually go on trial. 494 00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:26,840 Speaker 2: Nineteen eighty four, the five men named responsible for the 495 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,479 Speaker 2: murders of the churchwomen went on trial and were found 496 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:34,439 Speaker 2: guilty of murder and sentenced to thirty years imprisonment. 497 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:41,359 Speaker 1: The head of the Salvadoran National Guard, Vivez Casanova, spent 498 00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,960 Speaker 1: years freely living in the US. So did the Salvadoran 499 00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 1: Minister of Defense, Jose Yermo Garcia, the one who White 500 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 1: claims asked him if the nuns were habits. 501 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,759 Speaker 2: Videes Casanova was in charge of the National Guard. They 502 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:02,080 Speaker 2: were in command when the women were killed and when 503 00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 2: a lot of other atrocities were taking place. 504 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,920 Speaker 1: After ten years of lawsuits. In twenty fifteen, human rights 505 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:14,440 Speaker 1: groups finally succeeded in getting the US government to deport 506 00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:18,839 Speaker 1: Videes Casanova for the killing and torture that happened under 507 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 1: his command, including the killing of the four churchwomen. The 508 00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:29,000 Speaker 1: next year, josegi Or moo Garcia was deported too, for 509 00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 1: his role in extra judicial killings, including the killing of 510 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:38,200 Speaker 1: Oscar Romero. These were some of the few government officials 511 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,640 Speaker 1: who saw consequences for the human rights abuses that happened 512 00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:46,239 Speaker 1: during the war, which got it something that's bothered me 513 00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:53,719 Speaker 1: since I started this reporting. What happened to these four 514 00:35:53,760 --> 00:36:00,840 Speaker 1: women is unspeakably horrible, that's without question. But at the 515 00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:04,319 Speaker 1: very least there was an investigation done to hold their 516 00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:08,759 Speaker 1: killers to account. But what about the thousands of Salvadorans 517 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 1: whose lives were also lost, the ones whose names never 518 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:17,880 Speaker 1: appeared in a newspaper. Didn't their lives matter? Without the 519 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 1: US involvement, the Salvadoran Civil War does not happen, at 520 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: least not to the scale that it did. El Salvador 521 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:32,319 Speaker 1: was just a pawn in a much larger game, and 522 00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:36,640 Speaker 1: the lives lost were just nameless casualties to the politicians 523 00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:45,040 Speaker 1: in DC. Dorothy's family member Joseph Kasel would later tell 524 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:51,600 Speaker 1: The Washington Post, at least this is some justice being done. 525 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if there'll be enough justice done for them. 526 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,399 Speaker 1: They killed the four missionary girls, but how many other 527 00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:08,560 Speaker 1: people killed that's another question. After their deaths, a service 528 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,919 Speaker 1: was held for the churchwomen in El Salvador. We've spent 529 00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 1: this entire episode talking about Dorothy's story, the fullness of 530 00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:20,840 Speaker 1: her life, but she was only one of the four killed. 531 00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:26,200 Speaker 1: Mara Clark, Eda Ford and Jane Donovan's lives were just 532 00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: as full, just as meaningful. They left their mark on 533 00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: the people around them. A salvador In priest that I 534 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,359 Speaker 1: interviewed told me that there are still little girls named 535 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:45,160 Speaker 1: Eda in his parish. The reason why Cynthia has so 536 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:49,359 Speaker 1: much detail about Dorothy's life is because Dorothy left these 537 00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:54,440 Speaker 1: tapes behind, tapes of the things that she witnessed, the 538 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:58,320 Speaker 1: things she felt and saw during her time in El Salvador. 539 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:01,759 Speaker 7: Lots of things have been happening that I want to 540 00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,799 Speaker 7: tell you about, and again, I wish you would hold 541 00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:05,920 Speaker 7: on to this tape for me. 542 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,120 Speaker 1: She sent them to a friend of hers, trusting her 543 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:13,040 Speaker 1: to keep her words. And her record of her life 544 00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:17,560 Speaker 1: in El Salvador. She wanted to remember everything she'd seen, 545 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:19,719 Speaker 1: but not scare her parents. 546 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:22,640 Speaker 7: Please don't yeah tape over it. 547 00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:26,160 Speaker 1: Just save it for me, Remember the way that each 548 00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:31,359 Speaker 1: day she and her sisters did what they could. Each 549 00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:35,120 Speaker 1: day they lived with Salvadorans who never knew, moment to 550 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,800 Speaker 1: moment if they were safe. 551 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,040 Speaker 7: So to this day, we don't know who knows. That 552 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 7: we'll never know, but oh, the poor poor families. That 553 00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:52,279 Speaker 7: was really a grueling thing for us. But it's over 554 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 7: with and you know, we're still living with the sin 555 00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:54,440 Speaker 7: of it. 556 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:05,279 Speaker 1: On the next episode, my family finally tells me the 557 00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:22,800 Speaker 1: story of what pushed them to leave El Salvador. Ra gea, Hey, yeah, aviao, 558 00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:32,880 Speaker 1: ya ya lato, that's next time. A Nation of Saints 559 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 1: Sacred Scandal. Nation of Saints is a production of a 560 00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:45,840 Speaker 1: HA podcast in partnership with Iheartsmichael Dura podcast Network, and 561 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,880 Speaker 1: is hosted and written by me Jasmine Romero, produced by 562 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:54,319 Speaker 1: Jazmine Romero, Sofia Palita car Renald Gutierrez with help from 563 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:59,360 Speaker 1: Jorge Just and a research and reporting by Jasmine Romero, 564 00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:03,839 Speaker 1: edited by Cyda Kevelo, Jorge Just and rose Red. Nation 565 00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:05,759 Speaker 1: of Saints was recorded in New York City at the 566 00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:09,279 Speaker 1: Relic Room, with engineering by Sam Bear. Mixing and sound 567 00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,840 Speaker 1: designed by Bacchiquinones. Original music by Golden Mines, Darko and 568 00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:18,440 Speaker 1: Diame based on Patrick Hart's original composition, fact checking by 569 00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:23,800 Speaker 1: Erendidra Aquino Ayala. Executive producers are Gorman gerterol Isaac Lee 570 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:27,520 Speaker 1: rose Red, and Nando Villa. Our executive producers at iHeart 571 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:31,600 Speaker 1: are Giselle Bansis and Arlene Santana. Sacred Scandal was created 572 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:35,760 Speaker 1: by Melanie Bartley and Baula Varro's Special thanks to Cynthia Glavick, 573 00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:40,400 Speaker 1: Joanne Gross, and the Ursuline Sisters of Cleveland. The recordings 574 00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:43,600 Speaker 1: of Dorothy Kasel in this episode were provided courtesy of 575 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:47,719 Speaker 1: the Ursuline Sisters of Cleveland Archives. For more podcasts, go 576 00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,440 Speaker 1: to the iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen to your 577 00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:51,400 Speaker 1: favorite podcasts