Speaker 1: Welcome to Katie's Crib, a production of Shonda land Audio
Speaker 1: in partnership with I Heart Radio. My oldest is fourteen,
Speaker 1: my middle is in middle school. And we got home
Speaker 1: from the beach the summer and I plopped down in
Speaker 1: the play room and I was like, I feel like
Speaker 1: we might need to turn the play room into something else, right,
Speaker 1: Like you guys are gonna kind of old, like you know,
Speaker 1: And all three of them were like no. Really was like, wow, Hi, everybody,
Speaker 1: Welcome back to Katie's Crib. I have been trying to
Speaker 1: get this guest for a very long time because she's
Speaker 1: one of my most favorite Instagram follows. She is a
Speaker 1: wealth of knowledge. Her name is Lizzie Asa and she
Speaker 1: has an incredible Instagram account called the Workspace for Children,
Speaker 1: and it has been instrumental in helping me with Albie
Speaker 1: because she talks all about independent play and how independent
Speaker 1: play really to avoiding parent burnout. We talk about close
Speaker 1: ended toys versus open ended toys. If you don't know
Speaker 1: what that is, that's okay, listen up, you'll figure it out.
Speaker 1: How to set up a playroom and how to get
Speaker 1: your freaking life back, because guess what with independent play.
Speaker 1: Your kid is going to play by themselves. Doesn't everybody
Speaker 1: want that? So let me tell you a little bit
Speaker 1: about Lizzie. She's a parenting strategist and a play advocate.
Speaker 1: She is the founder of the workspace for Children. Go
Speaker 1: follow that Instagram account right now. She's an inspiration source
Speaker 1: of living a play based life with kids. Lizzie helps
Speaker 1: parents trade in exhausting days filled with packed schedules and
Speaker 1: entertaining kids for days filled with independent play. Lizzie also
Speaker 1: offers play tips and resources to parents and teachers and
Speaker 1: caregivers through her blog and social channels. And she's a
Speaker 1: mom to three kids who are eight, eleven, and fourteen.
Speaker 1: I am so psyched to have you here. Welcome to
Speaker 1: Katie's crib Lizzie. Okay, we're all sinked up and you're
Speaker 1: not going to hear them right Good morning, everybody. Welcome
Speaker 1: to Katie's crib with Lizzie. I mean, as you can
Speaker 1: hear from my microphone. It's really early in l a
Speaker 1: and my son is not yet off to preschool, so
Speaker 1: good bye. Rest assured. This is happening all over the
Speaker 1: world right now, and everyone's houses. I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 1: So first and foremost, I want you to tell us
Speaker 1: about your children at their ages, and then also tell
Speaker 1: us a little bit about your background and why you're
Speaker 1: so knowledgeable about independent play and toddlers and siblings. Tell
Speaker 1: me it all alright, totally. So before I had kids,
Speaker 1: I taught nursery school in New York City. I went
Speaker 1: to the Bank Street School of Education, which is just
Speaker 1: the most progress a beautiful place to learn about becoming
Speaker 1: a teacher and an educator. And while I was there,
Speaker 1: I did my internship at the best little school in
Speaker 1: downtown Manhattan. And it was really there where I formed
Speaker 1: this love and appreciation for letting kids play and just
Speaker 1: be who they are instead of structuring every last move,
Speaker 1: telling them what to think, where to do it, and
Speaker 1: you know, all the things. And so then I had
Speaker 1: my own kids. I have three kids. So my oldest,
Speaker 1: Nate is fourteen, and he just started high school this week.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's insane. And Ruby is eleven and Sloan is eight.
Speaker 1: And Ruby just went to sleep away camp this summer
Speaker 1: on like a real camping trip, like in the woods
Speaker 1: for two weeks. She did. Not only are you so
Speaker 1: well studied and practiced in the toddler world, which is
Speaker 1: one of the world I'm currently in. But because your
Speaker 1: children are older, I'm able to see all the work
Speaker 1: that I'm doing sort of payoff through you, because it
Speaker 1: really looks like and we all know Instagram is truth,
Speaker 1: it's not, but it looks like your children are very independent.
Speaker 1: They are and very self assured in their decisions and
Speaker 1: their choices, and they're respectful of their own wants and needs,
Speaker 1: but also your own wants and needs. And it's really
Speaker 1: cool that you're so far ahead of me. I have
Speaker 1: a four year almost four year old and a ten
Speaker 1: month old, and my god, like, parenting in the way
Speaker 1: that you are speaking about and practiced when you were
Speaker 1: a teacher is so hard. Like yesterday I was at
Speaker 1: his nursery school and we've been dealing a lot with
Speaker 1: hitting and things like that, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I get it. Like in the fifties whatever, when someone
Speaker 1: would just be like, oh, no, I'm just locking you
Speaker 1: in your room or whatever it was, I'm like, that's
Speaker 1: the easier option. This is hard, like like like working
Speaker 1: through it, and what are you really trying to tell me?
Speaker 1: Are you frustrated? I think you maybe? Are you hung?
Speaker 1: You know you didn't have a nap whatever it is.
Speaker 1: But it's like, that's exhausting. It's so exhausting. But like
Speaker 1: you said, it's front loading and it will pay you
Speaker 1: back so much as they grow you can't even imagine.
Speaker 1: And that doesn't mean they stopped doing the middle school
Speaker 1: version of hitting or whatever it is, but it does
Speaker 1: mean that those conversations are so much faster, easier, and
Speaker 1: you can get right to the point because they're already
Speaker 1: speaking out language. Ah, that's such a relief. Tell us
Speaker 1: about Workspace for Children. What is it and how did
Speaker 1: you start it? So? Now, the Workspace for Children is
Speaker 1: an online platform and Instagram where I teach parents and
Speaker 1: educators how to really embrace play to actually end parental burnout.
Speaker 1: I want people to learn that they don't have to
Speaker 1: structure every second of their today and burn themselves out.
Speaker 1: And that exactly what you were just saying, Like, if
Speaker 1: you can put in that little bit of work in
Speaker 1: the beginning, it's going to pay you back so much
Speaker 1: in the end. The Workspace for Children, however, started when
Speaker 1: my youngest was one and I wanted to, you know,
Speaker 1: take her to like a mommy and me class. But
Speaker 1: I realized that every class I took her to, it
Speaker 1: was highly structured. There was a lot of you get
Speaker 1: what you get and you don't get upset type of language.
Speaker 1: And I really couldn't find a program for her that
Speaker 1: felt aligned with our values, and so I made one.
Speaker 1: And so I in my basement, I set up this
Speaker 1: parenting and play studio where parents and caregivers would come
Speaker 1: and we would do open ended art and I would
Speaker 1: model the appropriate language and just kind of show people
Speaker 1: that if you honor that your child inherently knows how
Speaker 1: to play and you don't tell them what to do,
Speaker 1: they actually will figure it out. And so that's how
Speaker 1: the Workspace for Children was born. That's even that's how
Speaker 1: I started my blog on my Instagram. Wow, those lucky
Speaker 1: mamas and caregivers that got to hang out in your basement,
Speaker 1: it was so much fun. I made some of my
Speaker 1: best friends there. Ah. I love it for all of
Speaker 1: you listening. I mean, it really just takes the pressure
Speaker 1: off in Albi's room. The relief I feel when I
Speaker 1: just get to sit back and let him take the
Speaker 1: lead and have there be no structure or no plans
Speaker 1: and I just sit back and watch, you know, or
Speaker 1: partake if he wants me to, but I'm not on
Speaker 1: my phone or anything like that, And even just fifteen
Speaker 1: minutes is so honestly relaxing and fulfilling, and also the
Speaker 1: relief that I feel, especially as I'm getting into this
Speaker 1: four year old age where I'm getting just so many
Speaker 1: texts and emails as we're opening up from the pandemic
Speaker 1: of like, well does he want to do soccer? Well?
Speaker 1: Does he want to do karate? Well? Does he want
Speaker 1: to do this? Isn't to that? And I'm like, you know, honestly,
Speaker 1: we'll do one thing a week, but it's big, and
Speaker 1: he's exhausted that he's even nursery school. These are the
Speaker 1: years we get to be home and he has a
Speaker 1: ten month old baby sister that we're all getting to know,
Speaker 1: and I'm just trying to take the pressure off myself
Speaker 1: of like, I don't need to spend my days in
Speaker 1: l a traffic, like driving a four year old to
Speaker 1: like a shipload of places. That's right, but most people
Speaker 1: think that being a good parent means signing them up
Speaker 1: for like every enrichment and every last thing. But what's
Speaker 1: happening is, and there are so many studies even now
Speaker 1: if you speak to like college professors and high school
Speaker 1: teachers where kids come in and if you're not telling
Speaker 1: them what to do and what instruments to hold and
Speaker 1: where to press, they have this like blank look on
Speaker 1: their face. They don't know how to take the first step.
Speaker 1: Since they were four years old, people were saying, on
Speaker 1: Monday we do soccer and karate and on Tuesday we
Speaker 1: have voice and I'm you know, and it's like, when
Speaker 1: are they ever home? And then they're sitting in the
Speaker 1: back of the car and they're winding and their board
Speaker 1: and and you're like crazy burned out. So you toss
Speaker 1: them a tablet or your phone because you need a second,
Speaker 1: as you should be the second to think. So you
Speaker 1: can back all that up to those early years. So
Speaker 1: tell me what exactly for those listen, what is independent play?
Speaker 1: Why is it important? So? Independent play is when your
Speaker 1: child is playing by themselves, directing their own play. They
Speaker 1: decided what to play and how to play it. Independent
Speaker 1: plays when your child is their most authentic self. Independent
Speaker 1: play doesn't mean sitting and playing quietly with blocks or dolls.
Speaker 1: I think there's a big thing there that people see
Speaker 1: on Instagram or in the nursery school classroom that like
Speaker 1: their child's not playing independently if they're not quietly you know,
Speaker 1: building a black building or drawing a pretty picture. Independent
Speaker 1: play can also be in like bouncing a ball in
Speaker 1: the backyard against the garage and getting in a rhythm
Speaker 1: with yourself. Independent play is just flow with yourself. Not
Speaker 1: only is independent play so important for your child for
Speaker 1: them to learn who they are, what their interests are,
Speaker 1: what their interests are, not what you're what you think
Speaker 1: their interests are supposed to be. It's also so important
Speaker 1: for the family system. When you can set up the
Speaker 1: habit of independent play, then that means caregiver parent gets
Speaker 1: time back for themselves to take care of their own needs.
Speaker 1: And then that's when it becomes the difference of being
Speaker 1: half in all the time or all in for a
Speaker 1: short time. All in for a short time is a
Speaker 1: billion times more valuable than half in all the time.
Speaker 1: How do we teach kids independent play? You can start small, right,
Speaker 1: You can start so small, and you can start anywhere
Speaker 1: you are. You can have a kid who watches TV
Speaker 1: all day every day and still start where you are.
Speaker 1: Anyone can do this anywhere. And the trick really here
Speaker 1: is is learning about who your kid is. Literally when
Speaker 1: you're in the car with them and they're staring out
Speaker 1: the window and they get excited out something, that's a clue.
Speaker 1: The kid who loves trucks and every time they see
Speaker 1: a truck drive by, they clap and get too excited,
Speaker 1: that's a clue. Literally, watch your child for a few minutes,
Speaker 1: even if you're not with them, sit down and think
Speaker 1: about your kid, Like set a timer for five minutes,
Speaker 1: and just think about who your kid really is, the good,
Speaker 1: the bad, all of it. What lights them up. When
Speaker 1: you can hone in on one or two of those things.
Speaker 1: You can set up the most simple environment, and I'm
Speaker 1: not talking about a fancy playroom. I'm talking about any
Speaker 1: little blanket on the floor in any part of your home,
Speaker 1: with just some things that reflect their interests. That's when
Speaker 1: you're going to start to see natural, independent play. And
Speaker 1: it's so simple that I think people miss that step
Speaker 1: and they start to think independent play means you buy
Speaker 1: all the wooden toys and you set up these fancy crafts,
Speaker 1: and then their kids don't play with it, and then
Speaker 1: you're annoyed and then they're like confused, like what did
Speaker 1: they do? And then they just want to watch TV
Speaker 1: because TV is so much easier on everyone, you know,
Speaker 1: and then that cycle continues. So if you can just
Speaker 1: really find the little things that light your kids up,
Speaker 1: and it can even be like just in that week.
Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be some grand thing that you're like,
Speaker 1: my kid loves, you know, whatever it is. I mean, literally,
Speaker 1: what did they talk NonStop about this week? It could
Speaker 1: be pop patrol and and that just means grab a
Speaker 1: handful of those pop patrol choice, put him down on
Speaker 1: a blanket, put a few magnetic tiles next to it.
Speaker 1: That's when you're going to spark kindly. How we started
Speaker 1: was like the tip I would lie like I would
Speaker 1: just as soon as I would set him up with something,
Speaker 1: I would just be like, oh, I have to go
Speaker 1: to the bathroom, and I would just go to the bathroom,
Speaker 1: you know, for five minutes and ten minutes than fifteen minutes.
Speaker 1: I mean. The great news about kids, they kind of
Speaker 1: have no concept of time, you know, like it is
Speaker 1: what you say it is. There's something actually really amazing
Speaker 1: that you do there that's making a kind of play happen,
Speaker 1: and that is that you're setting a limit. So for
Speaker 1: you you're comfortable setting a limit saying I'm going to
Speaker 1: the bathroom because you feel comfortable saying I have to
Speaker 1: go to the bathroom, and like if they're like, now,
Speaker 1: you know you can, but I'm going to the bathroom
Speaker 1: because like humans go to the bathroom. When people can
Speaker 1: set a limit that they can stand by, then your
Speaker 1: kid can stand by it. And when you can add
Speaker 1: those limits to play and quiet time, it's such a
Speaker 1: game changer. What would you say if you weren't going
Speaker 1: to use the party? So I teach a whole course
Speaker 1: on how to teach your child and your whole family
Speaker 1: to get in this rhythm of independent play, even with
Speaker 1: really little kids, like kids that are too and are
Speaker 1: dropping the nap. I would say, like, you know, something
Speaker 1: that older children do is called quiet time, and it's
Speaker 1: a time when you get to play with your things
Speaker 1: without anyone interrupting you. You don't have to share with
Speaker 1: your sister, you don't have to listen to my ideas.
Speaker 1: Quiet time means like this is for you. And then
Speaker 1: you're also going to say, like, this is also my
Speaker 1: quiet time. You know, you really like build that up
Speaker 1: as like a grown up important thing, because it is.
Speaker 1: It is and then when you can pair that with
Speaker 1: setting limits around that right, and then the course we
Speaker 1: talk about like why do you even want quiet time?
Speaker 1: Like why not just be like fine, like during quiet
Speaker 1: time you can watch screens because no judgment. For some people,
Speaker 1: that's what they do and that works, and that's totally fine.
Speaker 1: If you are someone though, who wants your child to
Speaker 1: play independently during quiet time. I help people look all
Speaker 1: the way into the future, what kind of personality traits
Speaker 1: do you want to help your child develop when they
Speaker 1: are in middle school or in high school, because those
Speaker 1: are things that are going to learn during independent play.
Speaker 1: And so when you can remember like the reasons why
Speaker 1: you really want your child to have these play skills.
Speaker 1: In my course, I have a whole workbook where we
Speaker 1: like work through that so that you can get super
Speaker 1: clear on why you're doing it. The truth of the
Speaker 1: matter is you can have any system, any bride, any anything.
Speaker 1: Your child is going to push back on you. They're
Speaker 1: supposed to. And we're so tired that like we want
Speaker 1: to just be like, oh, forget it, fine, don't do it.
Speaker 1: But if you have that like clear list of like nope,
Speaker 1: I'm setting this limit, like you know, same thing. A
Speaker 1: lot of parents feel guilty saying, you know, go play.
Speaker 1: I'm doing my thing, you do yours, And I totally
Speaker 1: get that. But when you look at it out through
Speaker 1: this other lens of that, you're like doing them such
Speaker 1: an amazing service by setting these limits and boundaries around
Speaker 1: this time where they get to figure out their true
Speaker 1: authentic self. Oh, this is such a relief. And guys like, yeah,
Speaker 1: let's change the perspective when they used to say, go
Speaker 1: outside and play. I don't want to see you till dinner.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're doing it in a little bit of
Speaker 1: a different way, but it's the same thing, is that
Speaker 1: you're doing a good thing. You are not expected as
Speaker 1: a parent to play with your child all day long
Speaker 1: and survive. What a nightmare. And if you do that,
Speaker 1: it's a disaster. I don't play with my kids. They
Speaker 1: never have. I don't. I'm a play expert, and I
Speaker 1: don't play with my kids. Guys, you heard it here first.
Speaker 1: I have goose bumps like sponges sponges at a bucket
Speaker 1: of water, have fun like you know, like it's oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's ranges if you know of what things cost and
Speaker 1: all of that, But you set your kid up and
Speaker 1: then you go away. Well, I mean, and that's part
Speaker 1: of like having successful independent play is like using that
Speaker 1: environment to set the limits for you or to spark
Speaker 1: ideas for you, so that you're not part of that
Speaker 1: and they come to it on their own terms. We
Speaker 1: as adults, we'll see like a project on Pinterest, say
Speaker 1: with soaphie water and a bucket, but like we'll start
Speaker 1: getting all fancy and adding food, coloring and slime and
Speaker 1: like this, and like a who has time for that?
Speaker 1: Because I don't be Then your kid comes to it
Speaker 1: and they're like and then you're annoyed, and then you're
Speaker 1: forcing them to do it, and then you're not doing
Speaker 1: it again. The other green thing about independent play is
Speaker 1: that now we're a little bit in a rhythm where
Speaker 1: he kind of does it at the same times every day,
Speaker 1: and now it's become almost like a self regulation for
Speaker 1: both of you, for both of us, even for example us.
Speaker 1: You know, my schedules a little bit different today because
Speaker 1: we're doing this call, like I said, early, so it
Speaker 1: kind of interrupted. He likes to do a good twenty
Speaker 1: thirty minutes of independently before he goes to school, Like
Speaker 1: he wakes up, has breakfast, plays around with me and
Speaker 1: his sister, and then he likes to really have some
Speaker 1: alone time with with with his things before he goes
Speaker 1: to school. I almost feel like it's his body knowing
Speaker 1: that he's about to go to school and interact and
Speaker 1: it's really intense. And then he does it when he
Speaker 1: gets home from school and he's just starting to drop
Speaker 1: his nap, which is crazy. I know people are like,
Speaker 1: he still naps, and I guess he does. Oh my god.
Speaker 1: But now we're doing this quiet time where for the
Speaker 1: first time over this weekend, I said, Okay, if you
Speaker 1: don't want to sleep, you're in your room. Your door
Speaker 1: is shown. Is that rhythm of nap time? Did you
Speaker 1: do quiet time? Oh yeah, we still do quiet time
Speaker 1: and middle school, I literally nap every Saturday and Sunday.
Speaker 1: I'm going to too. It is non negoci all like
Speaker 1: quiet time happens and I nap and my husband like
Speaker 1: watches football or whatever. And that is like hard line.
Speaker 1: You said you don't play with your kids, But I
Speaker 1: love this that you advised on the Balanced Parent podcast
Speaker 1: that a parent should play with their children in a
Speaker 1: way that is appealing to them. Yeah, it's cool to
Speaker 1: be the caregiver where this is the type of play
Speaker 1: I like, right, I mean, that's sort of so many
Speaker 1: purposes too. For me, I happen to be very artsy.
Speaker 1: I love art. I love to just like you know,
Speaker 1: rub a marker around on the paper, and to me
Speaker 1: like that is when I'm the most present and like
Speaker 1: listening to my kids the most. So a lot of times.
Speaker 1: You know, if you follow Instagram, you'll see after school
Speaker 1: I usually set up like a snack and really simple
Speaker 1: art on the table. That's how I can say to
Speaker 1: my kids, like, hey, I was thinking about you and
Speaker 1: we're gone. I'm here to connect if you want to. Also,
Speaker 1: this took me five minutes, so like if you don't
Speaker 1: or you're like, hey, I'm going to hang with my
Speaker 1: buddies or whatever, that's great too. I literally don't care,
Speaker 1: and I'll probably live it there for the whole weekend anyway.
Speaker 1: But it's just a way for me to connect with them.
Speaker 1: Whereas like for my husband, he loves building with blocks,
Speaker 1: so he'll hang out on the playroom floor. Was slowan
Speaker 1: and like listen to her ideas and help her create
Speaker 1: a structure for him. That's really satisfying. Neither of us
Speaker 1: sit there and play Unicorn because like that's what no,
Speaker 1: And it's like not, I don't know. I just I
Speaker 1: don't think that teaches my kids how to like be
Speaker 1: a good friend or a good human. You know, they
Speaker 1: could do that. That's amazing for them to do that
Speaker 1: with themselves, or to find a friend who loves to
Speaker 1: do that. For me to authentically sit there scroll my
Speaker 1: phone with one hand and like half make a Barbie move.
Speaker 1: That's not actually connecting with my kid and it's not
Speaker 1: going to solve any issues. Yeah, I found out this weekend.
Speaker 1: Like I've been doing a lot of weekends so because
Speaker 1: my husband started this pretzel business and so he's gone
Speaker 1: a lot. So I'm just like I'm the same. I
Speaker 1: fucking hate playing. But Albie and I have really taken
Speaker 1: to Vera goes down at nine and then he and
Speaker 1: I have time together before hopefully by eleven ish when
Speaker 1: she wakes up. I like to at least have some
Speaker 1: sort of playdate where we go to a friend's house
Speaker 1: outside or they come over to our house outside. In
Speaker 1: that time, he and I have started just baking together
Speaker 1: because I'm like, this is killing two birds with one stone,
Speaker 1: where he's playing with the measuring cups in the water,
Speaker 1: and he loves to be in the sink and cleaning
Speaker 1: all the dishes and stuff. But also it makes me
Speaker 1: feel good because I love being a host or going
Speaker 1: to someone's house and bringing something because I feel like
Speaker 1: it's a nice thing to do, and you're passing on
Speaker 1: like your values in a way that feels good to him. Oh,
Speaker 1: I did something, I'm saying, but you did something that
Speaker 1: felt like good to you. Yes, it's great to me.
Speaker 1: I felt right. If you go back and break this down, right,
Speaker 1: it's like developmentally appropriate for him because he's splashing and
Speaker 1: pouring and filling, right, and he's four years old and
Speaker 1: that's what kids love to do. He's also doing like
Speaker 1: an assigned task, that is, he's capable of doing like
Speaker 1: It probably wouldn't be fun for him if you were like, hey,
Speaker 1: sound out these words in the cookbook. You know that
Speaker 1: he would be like, no, like, and then you would
Speaker 1: get annoyed, and then he would get and like the
Speaker 1: fun would be over. But you're doing something that feels
Speaker 1: good to you, that passes on family values and is
Speaker 1: developmentally appropriate for him. Tell us what a closed end
Speaker 1: of toys versus an open end. So a closed ended
Speaker 1: toy would be a toy that does one thing, like
Speaker 1: there's one outcome to it, and the toy doesn't most
Speaker 1: of the playing for them, so like they pressed the button,
Speaker 1: the toy makes the thing spin around and the noise
Speaker 1: goes off. A closed end of toy would be like
Speaker 1: something that can only be one thing. So if it's
Speaker 1: like the pop Patrol pop tower, like that can really
Speaker 1: kind of only be the po patrol pop tower. That's
Speaker 1: not going to suddenly be volcano or a you know,
Speaker 1: it's just not. And then an open ended toy would
Speaker 1: be something that your child can use a million different ways.
Speaker 1: They have to put their own self, their own interests,
Speaker 1: their own stage of development. They have to work to
Speaker 1: make it become something, and they kind of have to
Speaker 1: learn how to do that. There's a lot of people
Speaker 1: who spent a lot of money on expensive wooden, open
Speaker 1: ended toys because Instagram told them to or interest told
Speaker 1: them to, and their kids are like, I don't know
Speaker 1: what to do with this, or the parents can look
Speaker 1: at and be like what are they supposed to do
Speaker 1: with this? That takes work, that takes development. But that's
Speaker 1: a way of thinking I had a real momentum actually
Speaker 1: in all honesty following you on Instagram, where I felt,
Speaker 1: I mean, this all happens to all moms, but I
Speaker 1: felt like like I really made a massive mistake. During
Speaker 1: the pandemic, I was pregnant and pediatrician was very We
Speaker 1: weren't sending out me to school or pladates or everything
Speaker 1: because we were like really scared about COVID and the
Speaker 1: fact that I was pregetting things and it happened to
Speaker 1: run into also Hanukkah, Christmas and his birthday. The amount
Speaker 1: of crap, close ended toys that showed up in my
Speaker 1: house was astronomical and really overwhelming for me. I don't
Speaker 1: like having a lot of things as a person to like,
Speaker 1: I just get really overwhelmed easily. I don't like a
Speaker 1: ton of toys, so that was hard for me. Also,
Speaker 1: I sort of was so tired with the newborn. I
Speaker 1: was like, I don't care, like his closet is bursting
Speaker 1: at the seems with plastic paw patrol things. My daughter
Speaker 1: is now ten months old, and I just did like
Speaker 1: while he was at school, I've done massive cleanouts and
Speaker 1: I have to say I feel so much better, like
Speaker 1: it's not that I got rid of them all. I
Speaker 1: have them. And I also had to really really struggle
Speaker 1: with him about what are the things you're giving away
Speaker 1: two people? What are the things you're handing down to
Speaker 1: your baby sister to make him feel better. I'm like,
Speaker 1: because we're making room. You know your birthday is coming up,
Speaker 1: and you're going to get to choose a few new
Speaker 1: things that you will play with. But I felt like
Speaker 1: a bad mom because of all the clothes ended toys
Speaker 1: I had. I don't think there's anything wrong with having
Speaker 1: some commercial, closed ended toys. I really don't. When Sloan,
Speaker 1: my youngest, was little, she was obsessed with Pot Patrol
Speaker 1: and I had two older kids, and so I literally
Speaker 1: bought the knockoff pot Patrol like mini figures and I
Speaker 1: would put them. I kept one in a pouch in
Speaker 1: my car, one in the diaper bag, and whenever I
Speaker 1: had to like take Nate to soccer or take rebeat
Speaker 1: a softball or whatever, and Sloan was like, I would
Speaker 1: pull out those little pot patrols, but instead of having
Speaker 1: those with the pop tower and with the truck that
Speaker 1: makes all the noises, I would give for those little
Speaker 1: pot patrols something she loves and thinks about, and the
Speaker 1: lights her up with maybe like a few blocks and
Speaker 1: you know, something that she can build, because now suddenly
Speaker 1: the pups can't aren't just going back and florth in
Speaker 1: the Pup tower like they did in the show. You know,
Speaker 1: they're going in this block building that she made and
Speaker 1: then suddenly she had an idea and it turns into
Speaker 1: a unicorn fairy land or whatever that she wouldn't have
Speaker 1: had that opportunity with just the pop tower, right, Okay,
Speaker 1: so we're not against close ended toys. It's not reality.
Speaker 1: And also because I was thinking, I was like, my god,
Speaker 1: like if I we're gonna get rid of close ended
Speaker 1: toys entirely. It really links back to television, to be honest.
Speaker 1: For in my household, it's like he's seeing that ship
Speaker 1: and he's seeing it and that's what his friends are playing.
Speaker 1: There's nothing wrong with it. I feel like the only
Speaker 1: time it becomes an issue is like when you have
Speaker 1: you know, say like the Daniel Tiger figures plus the
Speaker 1: clubhouse plus the other thing and the other thing and
Speaker 1: the other thing. Then they're only going to play that
Speaker 1: over and over and never taking the lead in their
Speaker 1: own play they're not using their own imagination, and they're
Speaker 1: also and they get sick of it because you can
Speaker 1: only do one thing with it. Whereas when you take
Speaker 1: an open ended toy like those wooden rainbows that are
Speaker 1: like so trendy, right, those are awesome because they make
Speaker 1: a great baby gift. They look great on the shelf, right,
Speaker 1: But then like you have a little sitting up baby
Speaker 1: who can bang them together because that's where they are
Speaker 1: in their development. And as they get a little older,
Speaker 1: they're going to use them again and they're gonna start
Speaker 1: to like stack them into each other and that. And
Speaker 1: now Nate who's fourteen, could do these like crazy balancing
Speaker 1: tricks with them with like these giant wooden marbles that
Speaker 1: like I'm like, you're fourteen, I can't believe you're still
Speaker 1: like attracted to this thing. But it's like, you know,
Speaker 1: he has an idea and he's like, oh, we could
Speaker 1: make this. So you talked on a Simple Families podcast,
Speaker 1: like we're saying that it's okay to buy close ended toys.
Speaker 1: You yourself have bought them from time to time, but
Speaker 1: you wouldn't have them in play rooms. So how do
Speaker 1: you transition your child back to enjoying playing with mostly
Speaker 1: open ended toys. Let's say that a people someone listing
Speaker 1: like I was, is right up the close ended toys
Speaker 1: ship show. How do we get them out? Okay, so
Speaker 1: the first thing is like, don't feel like you have
Speaker 1: to attack your whole playroom and start throwing everything out.
Speaker 1: It's so overwhelming and you're just not gonna do it.
Speaker 1: Take something that's sort of open ended, like you know,
Speaker 1: like those Melissa and Doug creative blocks that like someone
Speaker 1: gave you at some birthday party, because like everyone gives
Speaker 1: that is like a first birthday gift. Right, Dig that
Speaker 1: out of like the hole in the back of your playroom,
Speaker 1: and you know, put it on your coffee table in
Speaker 1: your living room, like set it up in a few
Speaker 1: little stacks, and honestly, get whatever they like. Are they
Speaker 1: into dinosaurs? Are they into whatever show they're into? And
Speaker 1: you have the closes ended toys, take that out too,
Speaker 1: and grab a few of them and just like sprinkle
Speaker 1: them around that black building and leave it there. Don't
Speaker 1: be like, look, look are you going to use this?
Speaker 1: Put it in an unexpected place, put it on your
Speaker 1: bathroom floor. Then you can take a shower. This is great.
Speaker 1: I'm already like my brain is spinning because he just
Speaker 1: left for preschool, and I'm like, okay, what could I
Speaker 1: just like I have that Melissa and Dug shit in
Speaker 1: the back. I should just put that out on our
Speaker 1: living room floor. Sloan was so needy she never just
Speaker 1: let me take a shower. I took everything out of
Speaker 1: my bathroom cabinet thing like everything and instead inside there
Speaker 1: and literally put like a few little blocks, a few
Speaker 1: little magnetic tiles. And whenever she wined at me and
Speaker 1: I wanted to take a shower, would just open the
Speaker 1: cabinet in my bathroom and like I took a shower,
Speaker 1: blow out my hair, like, do all the things. Because
Speaker 1: it wasn't like me being like go to the playroom,
Speaker 1: go make some you know. It's just like I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, well I'm showering. You can hang out and
Speaker 1: cry and wind and do the things, or like if
Speaker 1: you open that you can also play. So we're coming
Speaker 1: up on the fourth birthday and because I just I'm
Speaker 1: feeling way better about his toy consumption right now. Um,
Speaker 1: I just feel better that it's a really healthy for
Speaker 1: me mix of open ended toys and clothes ended toys,
Speaker 1: and I'm just really aware and like watching how he plays,
Speaker 1: and for me, it's a big value that he is
Speaker 1: taking the clothes ended toys and and coming up with
Speaker 1: stuff on his own. So what I did was I
Speaker 1: actually sent a text to those listening whatever if you
Speaker 1: want to, I'm just if this is helpful to anyone,
Speaker 1: it was super helpful to me. I have a group
Speaker 1: of people that all of our children were born in
Speaker 1: the same few weeks, and so the birthday gifts become insane.
Speaker 1: And I texted all of them and I said, please
Speaker 1: make a donation or nothing at all. Thank you so much,
Speaker 1: but we're at capacity and I'm not interested. And then
Speaker 1: his grandparents who really want to buy him a gift,
Speaker 1: and his aunt nuncles who really want to buy him
Speaker 1: a gift. I actually, maybe this is still controlling. I
Speaker 1: made a list on unshared note and I said, please,
Speaker 1: I just want to let you know we just did
Speaker 1: a big clean out of his toys and I'm really
Speaker 1: carefully curating this year what he's getting for his birthday
Speaker 1: that rolls into Hanukkah, that rolls into Christmas. And this
Speaker 1: is the list, completely affordable and inexpensive, and I feel
Speaker 1: really proud of myself and you can reframe your thinking.
Speaker 1: Are you being controlling or are you setting a boundary?
Speaker 1: You know, like he's really just gotten into costume play,
Speaker 1: Like really, I've noticed in another kid's house and we
Speaker 1: don't have any of that stuff. I know costumes can
Speaker 1: be really close ended, you know, a scarf versus a outfit.
Speaker 1: But like he loves the astronaut thing. He pretends to
Speaker 1: be an astronaut. I was like, great, that's from Grandma.
Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything wrong with that. And also
Speaker 1: like if you know that he loves astronaut things, have
Speaker 1: someone or you could do this for his birthday, like
Speaker 1: literally get a big shoe box, caught up some tinfoil,
Speaker 1: like some like you know, like some little boxes, or
Speaker 1: give him some like wooden play people with tinfoil and
Speaker 1: let him like turn that into something. That's great. Talk
Speaker 1: to me about TV watching totally. So I love TV
Speaker 1: like myself personally, like I love t V um and
Speaker 1: my kids like to be and I don't think it's
Speaker 1: the enemy. I'm just really clear with boundaries. So now
Speaker 1: that they are fourteen eight, were like the big kids
Speaker 1: are allowed to have like their you know, screen time
Speaker 1: or whatever at night on the weekends, and Sloan gets
Speaker 1: hers in the morning on the weekends, and she is like,
Speaker 1: why do they get it at night? And I'm like,
Speaker 1: they get it at night because when they're done, they're
Speaker 1: not asking me to tuck them in. You are when
Speaker 1: you feel comfortable being old enough, like having yours at
Speaker 1: night and then going to bed, then that's fine. But
Speaker 1: otherwise she also wakes up early early, So you know,
Speaker 1: we make screen time work for us. It's just the differences,
Speaker 1: Like it's not a fallback. So my kids know when
Speaker 1: screen time is allowed, what they're allowed to like watch
Speaker 1: and not watch, which is also changing now that Nates
Speaker 1: in high school, Like I'm learning a lot about like
Speaker 1: how to let go of that um. But our boundaries
Speaker 1: again are just like really clear around. Tablets are kept
Speaker 1: up high in the cabinet in our kitchen. They always
Speaker 1: have been their mine and Dave's. They're not the kids.
Speaker 1: Like I heard Slow the other day be like, where's
Speaker 1: my iPad? And I was like, oh, well, you don't
Speaker 1: have an iPad. Actually it's mine, and I let you
Speaker 1: use it. Remember when she rolled her eyes. But I
Speaker 1: think it's a pretty clear distinction, like it's mine, it's
Speaker 1: my rules, and that's sort of how we've always gone
Speaker 1: and I've always done it for me. You mentioned an
Speaker 1: Instagram post to use the always sometimes method when it
Speaker 1: comes to your kids watching TV. Can you tell us
Speaker 1: a little bit about that. That totally And it's so
Speaker 1: funny now because my big kids like fully roll their
Speaker 1: eyes at this, um But I tell my kids, you know,
Speaker 1: first slow, you always get to watch TV on Saturday
Speaker 1: and Sunday mornings. You can count on that. Sometimes on Thursday,
Speaker 1: I'm freaking tired and and I don't, you know, you
Speaker 1: get to watch a show like you know sometimes but
Speaker 1: that's up to me. But the weekends you will always
Speaker 1: get it. It's not conditional. I don't take it away
Speaker 1: from her, you know, for whatever reason, or like I
Speaker 1: really try not to. Then sometimes they get extra you know,
Speaker 1: you always get to watch on the weekends. Sometimes we
Speaker 1: go in a really long car ride and you get
Speaker 1: to and I mean even just recently, we were with
Speaker 1: the kids in the car. We're going on a short
Speaker 1: trip from Massachusetts to Maine. And the short trips we
Speaker 1: don't tend to like use devices in the car we
Speaker 1: just don't know judgment for people who do it. Whatever.
Speaker 1: It was a really quick drive and so the kids
Speaker 1: didn't even expect to have devices. But then Dave and
Speaker 1: I decided we wanted to listen to a true crime
Speaker 1: podcast and we want to listen to it. So you're like, guys,
Speaker 1: it's sometimes that's so funny, and they were on site
Speaker 1: they were like, yeah, this is such a win. I
Speaker 1: think what also made me feel good and change my
Speaker 1: perspective because my son is like U. I recently just
Speaker 1: changed to him only being allowed to watch on weekends
Speaker 1: and that's like our set rule, and my gosh, it's
Speaker 1: it's been so much better. I don't know why, but
Speaker 1: it does. It changes like it's been so much better
Speaker 1: because to be honest, sometimes the TV watching isn't worth
Speaker 1: it for me because the shut off and the boundary
Speaker 1: if he's is so upsetting to him that it's like, well,
Speaker 1: this was a fucking nightmare. And so the fact that
Speaker 1: on the weekdays that's just not an option and on
Speaker 1: Saturdays he's allowed to watch TV UM in the later
Speaker 1: afternoon and saying with Sundays like, that's it same. We've
Speaker 1: also set the boundary that Monday through Friday he has
Speaker 1: to get dressed for school, and Saturday and Sunday he
Speaker 1: can wear pajamas all day. I don't care. That's my thing.
Speaker 1: But that's the thing. You're apparent you're allowed to have
Speaker 1: your thing. Like that's my thing? Yeah, if okay? And
Speaker 1: always sometimes context like you always gonna get TV on
Speaker 1: the weekend and sometimes you might get it on a
Speaker 1: Thursday or something if mommy needs it. What happens if
Speaker 1: there's some acting out behavior? Um? Do you ever take
Speaker 1: away the always weekend TV? Is that ever on the table?
Speaker 1: I try really hard not to. I'm not gonna sit
Speaker 1: here and say I've never lost my temper and done it,
Speaker 1: because hi, I have, UM, but no, they're not related.
Speaker 1: I really try to use like consequences that are related.
Speaker 1: I want them to trust that always. That's you know,
Speaker 1: it's unconditional. Um. And Also, I mean I just feel
Speaker 1: like if they say they did something like kick down
Speaker 1: the block tower and I took away TV, like that
Speaker 1: doesn't really add up from that related, right. I might say, Hey,
Speaker 1: you know what, I'm gonna take away these blocks right now,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna put out only maybe ten of them
Speaker 1: instead of forty and as you learn how to like
Speaker 1: work more safely with blocks and I can help you
Speaker 1: with that, we can add them back it so you
Speaker 1: know something like that? Okay, what if? Oh? I was
Speaker 1: gonna say. The thing that changed my perspective so much
Speaker 1: about TV is the reason why I was like, why
Speaker 1: is my son so obsessed with television? Is something wrong
Speaker 1: with him? Something's wrong, Something's wrong. Still sitting in my
Speaker 1: therapist's office last Friday, being like, why do I default?
Speaker 1: Something wrong with her when like I teach other people
Speaker 1: how to not default too? Is something wrong with her?
Speaker 1: That's horrible. But what made me feel better about it
Speaker 1: is TV for our toddlers is a break for their brain.
Speaker 1: And that's what I learned from you doing independent play,
Speaker 1: go to school, all these things using their brain this way.
Speaker 1: It's hard, it's exhausting. It's hard work for them, as
Speaker 1: hard work as us adults are doing to work and
Speaker 1: do our jobs and multitask a million things. Is as
Speaker 1: hard as it is for Albie's brain to learn all
Speaker 1: day and negotiate all day and socialize and play with
Speaker 1: toys like that's their work. So when he gets to
Speaker 1: also veg out in front of the television. It's like
Speaker 1: vegging out. It's like the same ship we went, right.
Speaker 1: I love vegging out so totally. But the thing about
Speaker 1: independent play that's so cool is that the more they
Speaker 1: work in the beginning and like practice, then it becomes
Speaker 1: like this major like decompression. And for parents it's so
Speaker 1: cool because like, you know, you want to be like
Speaker 1: your kid after school, who'd you play with? What you do?
Speaker 1: Who got in trouble? Like all the things, which is
Speaker 1: obviously can't do and they're not going to tell you whatever.
Speaker 1: But if you set up like a dollhouse and two
Speaker 1: little people and stuff, you better believe they're going to
Speaker 1: go in there and act out every single experience. And
Speaker 1: it's going to be from their perspective, right, it's not
Speaker 1: going to be like what really happened? But like I
Speaker 1: can just spy on the play room and be like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know all those things, because that is when they're
Speaker 1: really processing their day out loud. How do you handle
Speaker 1: I don't I mean badhavior. My son's really really um
Speaker 1: physical and so we run into a lot of hitting, punching,
Speaker 1: tickling her sister in the eyeball. I try really hard
Speaker 1: to say I'm only saying this once, especially if something's
Speaker 1: crossing the line with safety. And I really say that
Speaker 1: for myself because I'm so mushy gushy lovey that it's
Speaker 1: really hard for me to stick to something. So I
Speaker 1: say that to myself, to stick to something, and then
Speaker 1: I'll take away whatever is currently being used as a weapon.
Speaker 1: I would too, I mean safety first, right, but like
Speaker 1: also like go back to like why you're doing it,
Speaker 1: Like when you want to get mushy gushy or like
Speaker 1: you feel bad, then be like, actually, no, why do
Speaker 1: I feel bad? Like he's poking his sister in the
Speaker 1: eye with this block, Like it's okay for me to say,
Speaker 1: like stop, I won't let you hurt her the same
Speaker 1: way I'm going to always keep you safe and I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna let anyone hurt you. I'm not gonna let
Speaker 1: anyone hurt her. So I'm going to take that. It's
Speaker 1: not up to you. I mean that's a big one
Speaker 1: that I say, Like I know you wish like you
Speaker 1: could be in charge of that, but I am the
Speaker 1: grown up in charge. And so then what do you
Speaker 1: do if he says no, I'm the grown up. That's
Speaker 1: what my son said. I would say, you really wish
Speaker 1: you could be in charge. I know it feels so good.
Speaker 1: Like you can be in charge of when you go
Speaker 1: to the potty, you can be in charge of if
Speaker 1: you have this or this for breakfast, But when it
Speaker 1: comes to keeping you and your sister safe, I am
Speaker 1: actually in charge. Hell yeah, oh I can't wait right,
Speaker 1: And you prove that all day every day. You prove
Speaker 1: that in like the soft moments, in the good moments,
Speaker 1: and in the hard moments. It's the same thing as
Speaker 1: like when they're having like a tant room and like
Speaker 1: completely falling apart and you're still saying like I'm here
Speaker 1: for you, like I'm not gonna let you kick down.
Speaker 1: You know this thing that could hurt someone, but I
Speaker 1: am here for you. That's the same thing. Like that's
Speaker 1: also you showing them, showing him that like you're in charge.
Speaker 1: Talk to me about your dining room being the playroom.
Speaker 1: Why did you decide this? Yes, okay, so a million
Speaker 1: and a half years ago when we moved to Maplewood,
Speaker 1: we had like an actual formal dining room because we
Speaker 1: thought that's like what grown ups do. And in the
Speaker 1: basement we put all the toys. But then I realized
Speaker 1: that like, no one goes in the basement, let alone,
Speaker 1: my kids let alone unless I go with them, and
Speaker 1: like that wasn't helpful. I had a two year old
Speaker 1: in a newborn. I wasn't going to basement and you
Speaker 1: want to drink wine upstairs with your friends. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: little by little I started to like first like the
Speaker 1: you know, the train table came up, and my husband
Speaker 1: came home and he was like, what's going on over here?
Speaker 1: And I was like, I could do whatever I want,
Speaker 1: Like if I'm in the same room as Nate, but
Speaker 1: the train tables here, I can like wash the bottles
Speaker 1: or like talk on the phone. He just wants to
Speaker 1: be in my vision. Long story short, kids want to
Speaker 1: be where we are, right And so we got rid
Speaker 1: of the designing room stuff because we're not formal people.
Speaker 1: We do not host formal things, like we have little kids.
Speaker 1: So if anyone comes over for dinner with their kids,
Speaker 1: were in the kitchen anyway, so we act to the
Speaker 1: dining room, and our playroom was born. And our playroom
Speaker 1: is right off of our kitchen. And so like my
Speaker 1: kids can sort of see me if they needs to
Speaker 1: see me, I can see them. I can you know,
Speaker 1: we can sort of talk, but I can do my
Speaker 1: thing and they can do theirs. Ah, this sounds incredible.
Speaker 1: And it's been years now that you've had this. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's in so many years. And like I said, like,
Speaker 1: my oldest is fourteen, my middle is in middle school.
Speaker 1: And we got home from the beach the summer and
Speaker 1: I plucked down in the playroom and I was like,
Speaker 1: I feel like we might need to like turn the
Speaker 1: playroom and does something else right, like you guys are
Speaker 1: gonna find of old like you know, And all three
Speaker 1: of them were like no, really, So it's like, wow, Okay,
Speaker 1: is that where they do their homework? Or is homework
Speaker 1: in bedroom? It's right off it's right off our kitchen.
Speaker 1: My oldest does his homework in his room. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure my middle really does her homework. It's in the kitchen. Okay.
Speaker 1: Tell me about like your kids all get along. It
Speaker 1: seems like it how the fund you do that. I
Speaker 1: don't show them fighting on Instagram because that would be
Speaker 1: hard for you. And yes, yeah, but I'm I really
Speaker 1: think it is from like having really clear and firm boundaries.
Speaker 1: I'm just getting into this now where my daughter just
Speaker 1: started crawling. So here we go, like she's going to
Speaker 1: take his ship. He's already pushing her. You know, I'm
Speaker 1: helping him learn a lot about Oh if you know,
Speaker 1: let's pick the things that's that sister is not going
Speaker 1: to play with today. Let's pick the things that you
Speaker 1: would be okay with her sharing. If you're she's coming
Speaker 1: close to something that you don't want to, you have
Speaker 1: to tell me, right, okay. So one another great way
Speaker 1: to use quiet time is like you can have fly
Speaker 1: time in your room and you can bring you know,
Speaker 1: whatever toys you don't want your sister to have, and
Speaker 1: like use them in your room for this whole time.
Speaker 1: You do not have to share them, because honestly, sharing
Speaker 1: is really hard, and it's really hard when it's your sibling,
Speaker 1: and it's really hard when it's all the time and
Speaker 1: they meet their life and their things in their space protected. Um.
Speaker 1: But so I feel like one that was like it
Speaker 1: was really protecting the things I don't make them share
Speaker 1: all the time. I learned this as a classroom nursery
Speaker 1: school teacher that like it's okay to say, like I'm
Speaker 1: still using that we're finished. Like I think we think
Speaker 1: our kids are like bad if they're not like I
Speaker 1: want that here, you know, No, you teach them how
Speaker 1: to advocate for themselves so that they can do it themselves.
Speaker 1: My kids do fight, um for sure, but they also
Speaker 1: love each other really hard. I think it also it
Speaker 1: was because I didn't sign them up for a million
Speaker 1: things when they were small. They are and we're each
Speaker 1: other's playmates, so you know, after school or after nursery
Speaker 1: school or whatever it was, and quiet time like they
Speaker 1: played together. Also, I don't want to spend all that money,
Speaker 1: like I really, like, I'm so stupid, Like he's just
Speaker 1: I'm spending two whatever soccer and he doesn't even really
Speaker 1: like it or like know what the fun it is,
Speaker 1: to be honest, it's like why does he have to
Speaker 1: do it? I mean I I just like even with that,
Speaker 1: like I did that stuff with He wasn't the first
Speaker 1: I signed him up for the two year old soccer
Speaker 1: and the three year old soccer and four year old
Speaker 1: soccer like every weekend. It was so annoying, And I
Speaker 1: remember in kindergarten looking at him being like, um, if
Speaker 1: you really like soccer and you want to practice it
Speaker 1: and get good at it, like I'm all in. But
Speaker 1: if you're not that into it, like could we not?
Speaker 1: He's like, this is not fun for anyone, And he
Speaker 1: was so relieved. I mean he was like, I ate it.
Speaker 1: How great? How great? Quickly? Boredom? Yeah, is it the best?
Speaker 1: Like boredom, you are not sailing as a parent when
Speaker 1: your child is like on board. No, no, In fact,
Speaker 1: you're like giving them the gift that it is. Listen,
Speaker 1: when your kid comes to you and tells you that
Speaker 1: they're bored, it is ingrained in you to be like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I should have signed them up for
Speaker 1: all the things were like I bought our on toys
Speaker 1: or like, oh my god, I'm the worst parent. I'm
Speaker 1: sitting here scrolling my phone and my kid is bored.
Speaker 1: Boredom is the entry point to how anything is created.
Speaker 1: And I know that sounds so cliche, but it's true.
Speaker 1: And let me tell you, like my eight year old
Speaker 1: still literally still says it's I'm board. The other day,
Speaker 1: my husband and I were laughing story because I looked
Speaker 1: and have you met me? Like just like really, and
Speaker 1: she was like whatever, and she went off and like
Speaker 1: did her thing. It's about as a parent tolerating that
Speaker 1: uncomfortable nous for them, and it's like knowing for you,
Speaker 1: Like what is it triggering you when they say you're bored?
Speaker 1: Figure that out, move past it and let them be bored,
Speaker 1: because I mean, my kids don't come to me on
Speaker 1: the weekend of day. What are we doing? What are
Speaker 1: we doing? I'm like, it's Saturday, and I was gonna
Speaker 1: like do this thing on my email. I wanted to
Speaker 1: like sitting backyard for a little while, like what are
Speaker 1: you doing? It's not my job to entertain you? Know?
Speaker 1: This is so helpful. Okay, as we wrap up any
Speaker 1: last tips on helping moms encourage and set up independent play.
Speaker 1: Make it so simple and easy the on yourself. The
Speaker 1: easier it is for you, the more you're gonna do it,
Speaker 1: and then that's how they're going to develop the skills.
Speaker 1: If you start doing these like complicated play prompts and
Speaker 1: your kid loves them, that's what they're going to require, right,
Speaker 1: So like, keep it super simple. I have a little
Speaker 1: I have a downloadable it's called the play Plan, and
Speaker 1: it's shows you, like five materials how to use the
Speaker 1: twenty five different ways. Because the idea is like less
Speaker 1: is more, and the less you do, the more they'll
Speaker 1: do and that's what you want, but you really want
Speaker 1: to make it. If you hate mass, do not set
Speaker 1: up messy projects because then you're not going to want
Speaker 1: to do that all the time. Yeah, Like I love cleaning,
Speaker 1: so like the fact that my son will stand at
Speaker 1: the sink and clean dishes and like loves loading the dishwasher.
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is like or he loves like watering plants,
Speaker 1: and that's the thing on my list. Like I've had
Speaker 1: to help him like figure out how to not over water.
Speaker 1: But like literally I'm just using my son to check
Speaker 1: off my lift. But but the thing is, that's so
Speaker 1: good for him. I taught Nate how to make coffee,
Speaker 1: and the curate when he that says every day he
Speaker 1: makes my coffee, it's the best. But it gives them
Speaker 1: such a good sense of purpose and instead of them
Speaker 1: feeling like they're in a in the way or needing
Speaker 1: to be entertained or any of those things, giving them real,
Speaker 1: actual jobs that help the family unit give them a
Speaker 1: sense of purpose, and that in itself is it changes
Speaker 1: everything about them. It changes their behavior, it changes how
Speaker 1: they see themselves, It changes their ability to take risks
Speaker 1: later in life because they feel good at something. Guys,
Speaker 1: it can be easier than what we're doing. Is there
Speaker 1: any other things you want to mention talk about anything?
Speaker 1: The biggest thing I want to hit on is saying that, like,
Speaker 1: when you take care of yourself, you can take care
Speaker 1: of your kids so much better. And if I could
Speaker 1: change anything for moms, especially post well is it post
Speaker 1: pandemic moms now in life? Um? Is that like it's
Speaker 1: okay for your kid to be upset or sad or
Speaker 1: whatever it is. While you're taking care of yourself. You're
Speaker 1: modeling for them that you have your own needs and
Speaker 1: you're also going to become like a better human being,
Speaker 1: which in turn a better parent. But like, I just
Speaker 1: feel like the more you can do your own thing,
Speaker 1: it is so good for your kids. Like just really quickly,
Speaker 1: Like but when I'm with with your son this morning,
Speaker 1: like as that happened, all I could think was, Wow,
Speaker 1: she just showed him that like a she can set
Speaker 1: a limit and stick to it, be that she has
Speaker 1: her own stuff that doesn't revolve around him like kids
Speaker 1: later in life, like when they think their parents life
Speaker 1: revolves around them, that's not good. Like, but you also
Speaker 1: showed him that, like you were okay with him being upset,
Speaker 1: and you were also okay with him like going off
Speaker 1: to he's gonna You have so much faith in him
Speaker 1: right that, like he can be upset, he cannot like
Speaker 1: your choices, but they still are what they are and
Speaker 1: he's still him and he's still okay. Lizzie, You've made
Speaker 1: me feel great today and I have learned endless amounts
Speaker 1: from you on Instagram, like endless amounts of ideas, and
Speaker 1: you make it so easy and accessible for all of
Speaker 1: us to just like go on your Amazon thing and
Speaker 1: go on your and like you're all of your different
Speaker 1: packets and things that we can sign up for. I
Speaker 1: really like you're truly one of my favorite follows and
Speaker 1: I really appreciate you coming on Katie's Crib. Thanks for
Speaker 1: having men. Yeah, thank you guys so much for listening
Speaker 1: to today's episode. I hope you enjoyed. I learned a
Speaker 1: ton and I feel like way better about being a
Speaker 1: mom today, So that's a huge win. How can I
Speaker 1: help you you feel better about where you're at in
Speaker 1: your parenting life. You can always find me at Katie's
Speaker 1: Crib at shawonda Land dot com. Katie's Crib is a
Speaker 1: production of Shawonda land Audio in partnership with I Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from Shawda land Audio, visit the iHeart
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
Speaker 1: favorite shops. You can never know until you try me
Speaker 1: ride than