WEBVTT - 77: Where There’s A Callowill There’s A Calloway 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:04.560 Welcome to Nightcall, a production of My Heart Radio. Because 0:00:04.559 --> 0:00:07.280 of the sensitive nature of this topic and to protect 0:00:07.280 --> 0:00:10.680 our guests from further harassment, some of the names will 0:00:10.720 --> 0:00:15.280 be leaped out in the following segment about the housing crisis. 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:24.279 It's three am in the bathroom of a bar in 0:00:24.360 --> 0:00:44.800 Amsterdam and you're listening to Nightcall. Welcome to Nightcall, a 0:00:44.920 --> 0:00:48.479 podcast for your strange days and lonely nights. My name 0:00:48.520 --> 0:00:51.280 is Emily Oshida. I'm here in Los Angeles, and with 0:00:51.320 --> 0:00:55.560 me are Molly Lambert and Tess Lynch. Hello. We've got 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:59.320 a great show today, a hot show, a hot pod. Um. 0:00:59.320 --> 0:01:02.000 We've got two guests coming on later in the show, 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:05.520 Jed Pariot and Theo Anderson from Street Watch l A 0:01:05.560 --> 0:01:08.080 to talk um a little bit about the homelessness crisis 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:13.199 in l A and recent violence against unhoused people. UM, 0:01:13.240 --> 0:01:16.440 so stay tuned for that. It's a really good conversation. 0:01:16.520 --> 0:01:19.360 We were really glad to have them on. Uh. First 0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:25.640 things first, though, we got to talk about fashion. Blasting fashion, 0:01:25.640 --> 0:01:29.600 blast fashion, I mean, I even I mean, I do 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:37.800 you should blast the fashion? We stand by, but this 0:01:38.160 --> 0:01:41.560 was an email that came to us after I guess 0:01:41.600 --> 0:01:45.640 it was sort of inspired by talking about my my 0:01:46.200 --> 0:01:48.520 face massage, which I have to say, like in the 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:52.040 time since that, since I was into face massage, I 0:01:52.080 --> 0:01:54.320 did end up kind of bruising, right, So you went 0:01:54.360 --> 0:01:57.720 too far and not not visibly, but just enough where 0:01:57.720 --> 0:02:00.080 it was like sort of tender and uncomfortable. Also and 0:02:00.120 --> 0:02:03.120 you're like, my skull is right under my face and 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:06.480 you can also make yourself like, um no, we we 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:10.120 we've we we've established this, We've said every time we 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:12.360 talk about it. I just like I want to leave 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:16.959 my body. A skull is under a face, under a face, 0:02:17.800 --> 0:02:20.040 Like if you go in the crevices of your skull, 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:22.639 it doesn't feel good, but it also feels like you're 0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:26.520 not and sometimes you can flame it and you can 0:02:26.560 --> 0:02:29.480 also just get like break out because you love touching 0:02:29.560 --> 0:02:33.080 your face will make you break out. Anyway, Um I 0:02:33.160 --> 0:02:37.880 still enjoyed my time doing the face massage, but anyway, uh. 0:02:38.040 --> 0:02:41.239 In response to that, we got an email from Amanda 0:02:41.639 --> 0:02:45.720 who says, um, re your facial massage discussion, I guess Ray, 0:02:45.840 --> 0:02:50.160 it's Ray, it's Ray guarding guard. Well, it's Latin. Did 0:02:50.160 --> 0:02:54.800 you know that Ray is Latin? What? Okay, we can 0:02:54.840 --> 0:03:00.760 discuss this later mind blowing facts on short for re artgard. 0:03:01.360 --> 0:03:06.800 I think that's that's that's a common misconception. Find out. 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:11.480 Let's never leave it to chance. It is anyway. Um. 0:03:11.520 --> 0:03:14.760 I perform a very effective, albeit terribly named method of 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:19.720 myofascial release called fashion Lasting. It uses a tool parentheses 0:03:19.800 --> 0:03:23.480 blaster to essentially comb and remodel the connective tissue in 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:27.519 your body. It increases blood flow, encourages lymphatic drainage, increases 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:30.680 your ability to recover from muscle fatigue. It got popular 0:03:30.720 --> 0:03:33.440 because it also produces a reduction in cellulight appearance and 0:03:33.480 --> 0:03:35.880 improve skin tone. If you haven't looked into it yet, 0:03:35.920 --> 0:03:38.320 I highly recommend it. It's improved my quality of life, 0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:41.400 my posture, my skin and energy level. Thanks for reading. 0:03:41.480 --> 0:03:45.800 Not an ad. I just love this tool. Um. I 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:48.680 think this might be an ad, but it's okay. You're cool, Amanda. 0:03:48.880 --> 0:03:51.160 Um So, Emily was right. I just looked it up. 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:56.040 Thank you. I can't prove it's rain, but it says 0:03:56.280 --> 0:04:01.080 Latin in re Latin for in the matter of yep. Wow, 0:04:01.280 --> 0:04:10.160 it's Latin. Um So okay, Amanda. Hashtag it's Latin, hash jack, 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:13.560 it's Latin um. Oh God, that reminds me of that 0:04:13.640 --> 0:04:17.800 horrible tweet about how they shouldn't speak uh languages other 0:04:17.800 --> 0:04:20.920 than English at the debate and then like SETTI floor 0:04:21.000 --> 0:04:26.720 baunam in the same tweet. Anyway, that's hopefully old news 0:04:26.720 --> 0:04:29.200 by now. I think I missed that one. I never 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:31.240 look at Twitter, and you guys are just avoiding the 0:04:31.320 --> 0:04:34.919 really important stuff, which is talking about fashion. Okay, okay, 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:38.800 so Amanda with the fashion blaster, Um, I just had 0:04:38.839 --> 0:04:41.640 to look this up. So I think you're being a 0:04:41.680 --> 0:04:48.200 little disingenuous, no offense. But the reason it became popular was, yes, 0:04:48.440 --> 0:04:52.120 it can you know, some people report a reduction in 0:04:52.200 --> 0:04:57.479 stelly light, but also the Kardashians endors It was a Kardashiana, 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:02.039 it was Chloe Gwyneth, also in Dorset. I'm sure it 0:05:02.160 --> 0:05:04.719 seemed like a thing where they sent out a bunch 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:08.560 of product to influencers and rich people to be like, 0:05:08.640 --> 0:05:11.240 check out this new thing, and then everybody promoted it. 0:05:11.680 --> 0:05:14.560 But if you look into the woman who invented it, 0:05:14.720 --> 0:05:18.880 Ashley Black. Ashley Black, not to be confused with the 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:25.640 TV writer, Um, it is a scam. Seemingly well first 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:27.360 thing I did because I had never really heard a 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:30.600 flash of blasting before was I went to as always 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:34.599 my resource for all things um possibly scams that have 0:05:34.680 --> 0:05:39.599 to do with the body and face real self dot com. Oh, 0:05:39.680 --> 0:05:44.320 I looked on Reddit, Um I look at real self. 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:48.560 Look at skincare addiction on Reddit skincare addiction. Real self 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:51.320 tends to be as much as it is sort of 0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:55.279 like a way for um plastic surgeons and um like 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:59.560 dermatologists to advertise. It also tends to eventually kind of 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:02.400 weed out some kind of truth about all these procedures, 0:06:02.600 --> 0:06:04.880 and like there's there's a percentage of like because people 0:06:04.960 --> 0:06:07.279 report their experiences and say whether or not they had 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:11.160 a good experience or not. So it's a it's worth 0:06:11.200 --> 0:06:15.200 it right now. Um, that's a little on the low side. 0:06:15.240 --> 0:06:17.800 It's not on the it's on the damning end of things. 0:06:18.080 --> 0:06:21.360 UM like cool sculpting I think has a lower um 0:06:22.040 --> 0:06:24.640 worth it right is just like they gave a new 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:29.280 name to liposuction, right, No, it's not come on Verez, 0:06:29.680 --> 0:06:32.760 but it's the same LPO section sucks the fat out 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:37.080 actually work, Yeah, and it's like an actual way to 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:39.680 treat like if you want to actually remove fat from 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:44.040 your body. That's the only doesn't actually work. No, you 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:46.960 like to out some like you lose some water way. 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:49.160 I think there's also that one for your chin. Then 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:52.640 I forget what um kibella kibella, and it's like the 0:06:52.680 --> 0:06:56.040 kind of that's it's supposedly freeze off your skin. No, 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:58.080 they don't freeze off your skin. You want your skin. 0:06:58.160 --> 0:07:00.720 They freeze your fat that you suppose the we don't want. 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:03.400 And then it's it is like expelled by your body 0:07:03.600 --> 0:07:06.039 anything like that where it's like and then your body 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:09.720 will either reabsorb it, because I've seen that a lot 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:13.239 about lip injections too. It does well, that's just tire 0:07:13.600 --> 0:07:19.240 high lauronic acid, but apparently that yellowronic. I guess how 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:23.559 people respond to lip injections totally just depends on random 0:07:23.560 --> 0:07:26.200 stuff having to do with themselves. Well, and some people 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:31.240 reabsorb it like immediately. Yeah, no, everybody metabolizes it differently. Anyway, 0:07:31.320 --> 0:07:35.720 back to fashion blasting. The fashion blaster looks like um, 0:07:36.240 --> 0:07:41.840 like five baby octopus is a stick and apparently you 0:07:41.880 --> 0:07:44.120 have to use it hard. But I mean that's the thing. 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:48.120 It looks like a green thresher for your leg. I 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:50.480 had a thing that was not this, but it was 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:52.400 sort of like this that was just like such a 0:07:52.440 --> 0:07:54.360 pain to use. I never did that was supposed to 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:56.520 reduce silly light or whatever. I don't. I think I 0:07:56.560 --> 0:07:58.240 got it for free and it was just but it 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:00.360 was like the same kind of concept. It was these 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:03.840 like it was hard plastic, but the nubs on it 0:08:03.920 --> 0:08:07.840 were soft so you could just kind of rush. Okay, Yeah, 0:08:08.720 --> 0:08:11.600 I was saying, I know from personal experience, this does 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:13.840 not work for me, because I did it once accidentally 0:08:14.400 --> 0:08:18.720 with like a back massager tool, where I just was like, oh, 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:21.080 my hip feels tight. I'm just gonna like dig on 0:08:21.160 --> 0:08:25.520 this pressure point until it makes a bruise. Um. And 0:08:25.560 --> 0:08:28.520 then I realized that I probably what I really needed 0:08:28.720 --> 0:08:32.720 was probably the stretch. Stretching is good, like even starry 0:08:32.760 --> 0:08:36.440 brushing is good. Dry rushing, improved circulation doesn't like leave 0:08:36.480 --> 0:08:39.720 you bruise. The problem with fashion lasting is that it 0:08:40.280 --> 0:08:43.240 if you're doing it as in as directed, you get 0:08:43.240 --> 0:08:46.600 these huge bruises. And then I was talking with like 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:49.280 a bunch of my friends who are real deep into 0:08:49.280 --> 0:08:51.560 the self care and a lot of them were doing 0:08:51.559 --> 0:08:53.800 fashion blasting, and they said that it made them after 0:08:53.840 --> 0:08:56.120 they started, it made them feel sick like they had 0:08:56.160 --> 0:08:59.560 like a virus, and then they thought it was the 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:02.280 talks sins that were being stored somehow. I mean it 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:05.280 just like I didn't actually like sweat that. I think 0:09:05.320 --> 0:09:07.559 you need to like go in a sauna then, and 0:09:07.640 --> 0:09:11.280 it's doing something like even with that, there's so little 0:09:11.280 --> 0:09:13.880 that we know about what's actually happening that it seems 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:15.599 to me a little buck and made me to be like, 0:09:15.640 --> 0:09:17.520 I'm going to rub this thing all over my thighs, 0:09:17.840 --> 0:09:21.320 get bruises, and then I'm gonna like sweat out whatever 0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:23.280 was in there. And I believe in this stuff. I 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:26.199 have to say, if you believe in it, it feels 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:29.000 like you probably get a little of the effects. If 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:31.600 you think it's working, it's gonna work. But I think 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:33.600 the thing with stuff like this, where you're you know, 0:09:33.760 --> 0:09:37.320 actually possibly doing damage to like tendons and muscles and 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:40.240 stuff like that, well, I mean, there was there was 0:09:40.320 --> 0:09:44.680 a period of time during our tenure at Grantland, uh, 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:47.880 during a certain story that I was working on where 0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:49.600 I was working so hard on it that I ended 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:51.400 up having to go to the hospital because I couldn't 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:55.240 move the right side of my body. And apparently this 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:58.640 was all just from an I had dislocated my right 0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:01.800 shoulder at one point. Um no, I mean it wasn't 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:05.199 dislocated then, but I had done it years ago. But like, 0:10:05.280 --> 0:10:08.120 your muscles are never fully recover when you do that, 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.440 and if you're not getting enough rest and enough sleep 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:14.040 and just generally taking care of yourself, your muscles will 0:10:14.080 --> 0:10:17.520 start really complaining. And so I had that and I 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.280 was like, I'm gonna go do a really intense massage, 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.600 and it was the worst idea. I came out like 0:10:23.840 --> 0:10:26.680 so in so much pain. So I think like there's 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:29.160 this tendency to be like, oh, I have a like 0:10:29.200 --> 0:10:31.760 I have a problem. I'm gonna like hit it. It's 0:10:31.800 --> 0:10:35.640 like it's like the thing, the computer isn't working. I'm 0:10:35.640 --> 0:10:38.480 gonna say also, maybe being hunched over computers for like 0:10:38.520 --> 0:10:42.120 a full decade probably wasn't good for anyone, even though 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:45.760 we know it wasn't the skull horns or whatever. Just 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:51.640 just talking about it, I'm just yeah, move your body. 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:53.640 I think a lot of these things are trying to 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.040 provide a quick fix for something that seems like it 0:10:56.120 --> 0:11:00.360 probably is a process. Yeah. Um. I think also anything 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:02.120 that says it's going to get rid of cellulate to 0:11:02.160 --> 0:11:05.680 me just always pings the scamometer. Cellulate is not something 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:11.560 you need to feel bad about. Everybody has it. It's 0:11:11.559 --> 0:11:16.840 fun and also don't damage. But it's fine. But it's 0:11:16.880 --> 0:11:21.600 just Actually Demilovato just posted a photo with all her 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:24.840 cellulate and she said it's cellulate trying to start do 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:31.679 it really quick. BuzzFeed had an article or in seventeen 0:11:32.080 --> 0:11:35.000 um where they the title is women say a popular 0:11:35.040 --> 0:11:37.480 new device to get rid of cellulate left them injured 0:11:37.559 --> 0:11:41.600 and it's people talking about fashion blasting gone wrong. Um, 0:11:41.640 --> 0:11:43.800 So if you do decide to fashion blast, which we're 0:11:43.800 --> 0:11:47.079 not saying don't, but just like look into it first, 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.160 make sure you're apprepared. And I want to say that 0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:52.040 I fully endorse foam rolling a thing that I don't 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:54.800 understand how it works at all, and it also works 0:11:54.800 --> 0:11:58.439 in some mysterious way involving your fascia. I don't understand 0:11:58.440 --> 0:12:00.959 why I think. I thought phone rolling with something different 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:02.720 than it is. I thought it's when you lie on 0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:06.040 the on the phone noodles and that's all it is. 0:12:06.200 --> 0:12:09.560 But it's like you give yourself a massage. It's like 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:11.800 a deep tissue massage, but you give it to yourself 0:12:11.840 --> 0:12:15.360 you have to wiggle around. I didn't even makes you 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:19.120 feel like a cat's the best. It's like masturbating your 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:22.000 whole body is how that's such a good That's how 0:12:22.080 --> 0:12:25.000 Mary H. K. Choi by Mary H. K. Choys new 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:28.040 book Permanent Record, That's how she described it. I was like, 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:31.440 that's the best description of it. But it is just like, 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:33.800 if you do it for long enough, it releases endorphins, 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:36.000 and there's just something about rolling around on the floor 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:39.960 that does feel really good. Um So, we're not against 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:45.680 all pseudoscience. Just just don't hurt yourself. Stick. Yeah, if 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.720 your octopus stick makes you feel good, like, by all means, 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:51.440 keep keep doing it. Just be be safe, don't don't 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:56.680 bruise yourself. Um So, we wanted to talk about the 0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:01.920 Internet dust up of the week. Um like not. I mean, 0:13:01.960 --> 0:13:04.680 obviously there's a zillion Internet dust stops every day, but 0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:07.440 this is one that feels very specifically of a certain 0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:11.560 a certain echelon of Internet life that I feel like 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:13.640 we all have a lot of favorite story of the year, 0:13:13.760 --> 0:13:17.080 my favorite story of the year, my favorite phenomenon. We're 0:13:17.080 --> 0:13:19.480 being sarcastic. She is not into it. We have to 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:25.000 talk about nat and Caroline. Unfortunately at this point have 0:13:25.120 --> 0:13:28.800 been a couple of weeks. People will Nat Caroline just 0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:31.800 just on call it or Nat instead of Natalie. Yeah, 0:13:32.440 --> 0:13:35.040 and care Net and care but we should just say 0:13:35.040 --> 0:13:38.480 they were referring to Caroline Callaway and Natalie Beach and 0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:44.720 their toxic friendship that exploded onto the cut, We're going 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:47.920 to play a video clip and stay tuned while we 0:13:48.000 --> 0:13:50.400 watched them explode their friends. It does sound like there 0:13:50.440 --> 0:13:52.440 should be a go to, like clip real from a 0:13:52.480 --> 0:13:56.000 reality show or it's like you said that you would 0:13:56.200 --> 0:13:58.880 write this and that I don't know whether would picture 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:02.520 the movie, which is why I think this was a 0:14:02.559 --> 0:14:05.040 smart movie. I can picture of the movie, and I 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:08.360 am ready to take a nap. Look, I'm just saying, 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:10.960 if you're going to be trapped in a toxic friendship 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:13.640 for a decade, use it to me. Everything is poppy. 0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:17.360 I guess I can we do some background for people 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:20.840 who might not because I actually like you feel about Caroline. 0:14:22.000 --> 0:14:25.000 You didn't know, Okay, So Tessy were like, the Caroline 0:14:25.320 --> 0:14:27.280 Callaway story is going to come out, and like, is 0:14:27.360 --> 0:14:30.120 she the lady who had all the jars? Like I can't, 0:14:30.520 --> 0:14:34.040 but I don't I wasn't following it. I'm so ash. Well, 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:36.640 I okay, I hadn't been following it forever, but I 0:14:36.640 --> 0:14:39.800 had heard tell someone someone I follow on Instagram had 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:43.160 mentioned her a couple of months ago, just in an 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:45.800 off hand way, and I clicked and then I was 0:14:45.880 --> 0:14:49.240 like this, this doesn't interest me. But it's the thing 0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:51.880 that did interest me was that she had so many followers, 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:54.600 but the content did not seem to warrant it. And 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:57.000 I was like, it seems like people I know are 0:14:57.080 --> 0:15:00.160 following this woman. Why I can't understand. And then a 0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:03.400 couple of weeks ago, someone was like, oh, I you 0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:05.800 know the there's going to be this big story on 0:15:05.840 --> 0:15:08.400 the cut Caroline Callaway. So of course I just went 0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:11.040 to Caroline Callowie's page and went back in time to 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:15.080 basically the beginning of time. Did you find Natalie Well, 0:15:15.120 --> 0:15:17.480 I mean Natalie on the photographs? This is part of 0:15:17.480 --> 0:15:21.320 the Natalie's but Natalie was mentioned like obviously you know 0:15:21.400 --> 0:15:23.720 the story broke, But for a couple maybe like two 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:27.560 weeks or something before that, Caroline had been alluding to 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.880 Natalie talking have you ever had a friend a friendship 0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:33.840 that ended? Have you ever hurt someone in Amsterdam in 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:36.480 a way that and I was like, what does she mean? 0:15:36.720 --> 0:15:39.000 And it totally worked on me. It built up this 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:43.000 anticipation for something that I knew logically I didn't actually 0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:45.560 care about, but I was so desperate for something that 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:48.720 was a low state, exciting thing. So Tess and I 0:15:48.760 --> 0:15:53.160 are the defense. We're defending the Natalie and Caroline saga. 0:15:53.320 --> 0:15:56.040 On the ground that it was like a breath of 0:15:56.360 --> 0:16:00.120 fresh air and a horrible climate where it's very hot 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:02.600 and everything is going to die. It was like, hey, 0:16:02.720 --> 0:16:06.640 remember remember the two thousands when you could just have 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:13.160 like a long read. I remember like long reads, remember 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:17.040 like crown nuts, Crown Nuts, just like a petty drama, 0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:21.000 A lot of things like gladly or not our priorities anymore. Well, 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:24.000 it reminded me of waiting for a season finale of 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:27.600 a show before you had the ability to record it 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:30.480 and watch it whenever or binge what you watched, because 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:32.680 it was like, you have no choice but to wait. 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:35.920 They made it a content event, a content event, but 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:39.240 also you didn't know what's going to happen. You knew 0:16:39.240 --> 0:16:42.000 it was going to happen, but you didn't know it 0:16:42.040 --> 0:16:44.600 wasn't Maybe Natalie was going to back out and not 0:16:44.640 --> 0:16:47.000 publish it. You didn't care what was in it. You 0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:49.120 just wanted to see if it was going to happen. 0:16:49.560 --> 0:16:55.560 When it's exactly sure, guys, we can't lower stand here. Okay. 0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:58.560 You want to say also that I agree with Emily 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:01.920 that the way that this type of content is like 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:06.840 feminized only published on women's interest sites. I totally am 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:11.919 against that. I've been rereading Peter Biskin's Easy Writer's Raging Bulls, 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:15.639 and like every relationship between seventies directors is like a 0:17:15.680 --> 0:17:20.840 Caroline and Natalie relationship. They all are like frenemies, like jealous, 0:17:20.880 --> 0:17:24.280 but also like close but petty and always plotting about 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:26.400 how to get back at people. Men do that too. 0:17:26.600 --> 0:17:30.679 It's not a female behavior in any way. Um. I 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:37.080 thought Natalie was was like very self aware about what 0:17:38.960 --> 0:17:42.080 are you fucking kitty me? I thought she was writing 0:17:42.080 --> 0:17:44.560 the story with the perspective of somebody who was like, 0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:48.399 I did some dumb ship in my early twenties. I 0:17:48.440 --> 0:17:50.640 forgot so I forgot to explain what it was because 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:54.920 I just got a lot story short. There's an Instagram 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:58.479 influencer who became a scammer when she decided to have 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:02.040 these like this work shop line. Caroline, Caroline Callaway. She 0:18:02.200 --> 0:18:05.640 is like an upper middle class person's ch okay, fine, 0:18:05.680 --> 0:18:08.080 she's rich. Her parents, we found out her parents or 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:12.960 great grandparents developed Sara Sota, Florida. Somebody was like, why 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.440 does she have a real leopard skin coat? And that 0:18:15.560 --> 0:18:19.560 was the answer. Yeah, So she she became she and 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:21.520 and it turns out that like a lot of her 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:24.360 popularity was fabricated. She bought followers and stuff. But she's 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:27.280 like a rich person who ended up making a friend 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:30.320 at n y U and it was this really toxic friendship. 0:18:30.400 --> 0:18:33.520 Mostly Caroline was just treating this this girl terribly, and 0:18:33.600 --> 0:18:36.320 she ended up having this girl whose name was Natalie 0:18:36.440 --> 0:18:41.800 Beach writing her Instagram captions, basically ghostwriting, and then Caroline 0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:45.119 for free. And then Caroline got a book deal with 0:18:45.160 --> 0:18:47.760 an advance, and she told Natalie that she would give 0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:52.920 Natalie thirty of this and then Caroline like couldn't, wouldn't 0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:56.760 flaked out on writing the book, screwing Natalie over and 0:18:56.760 --> 0:19:00.399 then the wind the book because that's all somewhat reass 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:06.480 And I've also seen people arguing from Caroline's side, saying, hey, 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:10.239 this girl is like clearly having drug issues and like 0:19:10.359 --> 0:19:14.080 mental illness. Yes, how dare you like make it look 0:19:14.119 --> 0:19:16.119 like she just scammed you because she didn't get the 0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:19.840 money herself either. She just like didn't follow through and 0:19:19.880 --> 0:19:22.639 a bunch of this stuff that she did. You could argue, 0:19:22.760 --> 0:19:24.520 I mean, you're getting natalie side of the story because 0:19:24.560 --> 0:19:27.160 she published this in the cut. But for instance, say 0:19:27.200 --> 0:19:31.119 you're in a bar in Amstagram in Amsterdam, in Amstergram, 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:34.919 which is the Instagram Amsterdam. Uh, You're there with a friend. 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.320 The friend is like, I'm interested in the bartender. You 0:19:38.400 --> 0:19:40.919 can go home, and you do go home and you 0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:43.919 go to bed. Your friend is calling you. It's like 0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:47.399 maybe you're asleep. There's a lot of like detail in 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:50.879 some of the things that Caroline supposedly did to Natalie 0:19:50.880 --> 0:19:54.440 that are immediately picking holes in the story. Picking holes, 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:59.480 poking holes. Yeah, both of them fashion fashions. Holes in 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:03.280 the story about whether Natalie really worked at a pencil store, 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:05.359 she did. It was proven she worked at the pencil 0:20:05.359 --> 0:20:08.760 store on the indignity of the pencil community came out 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:12.040 to pencil store owners were like, Natalie never worked here. 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:15.640 It wasn't our pencil so we only pencil but it wasn't. 0:20:15.720 --> 0:20:18.320 It was it's the one in like Soho or that 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:21.280 one Natalie. They were like, she didn't work here, and 0:20:21.280 --> 0:20:22.879 people were like, see she's lying, and then they were like, no, 0:20:22.960 --> 0:20:25.919 she worked at the one on York longhand I think 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:29.840 it's called Wait. But when they said the pencil store, 0:20:29.840 --> 0:20:33.399 I was like, oh, in Highland in Highland Park, but 0:20:33.440 --> 0:20:34.960 I thought she worked in I thought it was in 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:37.240 New York. No, she moved here and got a job 0:20:37.280 --> 0:20:40.360 at the pencil store. It's hard to keep it. There's 0:20:40.359 --> 0:20:45.280 so many locations of her, all of her quick name 0:20:45.400 --> 0:20:49.399 checking of her supposedly so in like undignified jobs that 0:20:49.440 --> 0:20:53.560 she had to take while Caroline was off traveling the 0:20:53.560 --> 0:20:56.160 world made me so mad because she was like, I'll 0:20:56.160 --> 0:20:59.200 be an urban farmer, like a carpenter or something. It's 0:20:59.240 --> 0:21:01.840 like they're all totally like if you're if you want 0:21:01.840 --> 0:21:03.960 to be a writer, people have fucking odd jobs, get 0:21:04.000 --> 0:21:07.800 over yourself, Like I don't know, I just like they weren't. 0:21:08.440 --> 0:21:11.200 It's like not like you're slinging hamburgers for minimum wage 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:13.560 at McDonald's, like you're working in an organic farm and 0:21:13.640 --> 0:21:16.600 go wanness like you're fine, it's just like a lot 0:21:16.600 --> 0:21:19.840 of ship talking about Goanes. I felt bad. I was like, 0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:23.680 that was a real job, that there's a job harvesting 0:21:23.880 --> 0:21:27.480 there for whole foods. It's the Whole Foods is very good. 0:21:27.600 --> 0:21:30.480 It's true. So no, but they paid they they just 0:21:30.520 --> 0:21:33.439 cut healthcare for like a billion people. But this was 0:21:33.480 --> 0:21:39.320 before before that, before the Amazon probably look, so I 0:21:39.640 --> 0:21:41.879 don't know. I'm just saying that. I'm just like she's 0:21:41.880 --> 0:21:44.080 trying to like paint this woe is Me picture and 0:21:44.080 --> 0:21:46.440 I'm like, you still like live in New York when 0:21:46.480 --> 0:21:49.520 you have like you know, like fine jobs, like I 0:21:49.560 --> 0:21:51.000 don't know, and you're trying to be a right, you're 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:52.760 young and you're trying to be a writer like what 0:21:53.359 --> 0:21:56.200 Caroline was snobby and a dick, and May and Natalie 0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:59.879 feel bad because Caroline was like, I'm living this lavish lifestyle. 0:22:00.040 --> 0:22:04.280 But also Carolyn didn't have that life at all. That 0:22:04.359 --> 0:22:05.920 was the whole point was that she went to visit 0:22:05.960 --> 0:22:08.119 her and she was like, I've been imagining that everything 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:11.359 this person posts on Instagram is true and it's all 0:22:11.400 --> 0:22:15.280 made up and they're just living in their dorm, ripping 0:22:15.280 --> 0:22:20.919 the carpet up up. My favorite details I saw a 0:22:20.920 --> 0:22:23.400 lot of people be like, Oh, anyone who's done adderall 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:27.240 can tell you about They were like, you know, do 0:22:27.359 --> 0:22:32.399 an adderall? Sometimes you just clean the house, do Yeah. 0:22:32.520 --> 0:22:34.720 I mean we've all heard stories about how speed makes 0:22:34.760 --> 0:22:38.760 people clean the house. Um. Um made me also be like, 0:22:38.880 --> 0:22:42.960 was I the only blogger not taking adderall right? Probably 0:22:44.160 --> 0:22:45.639 the only time I ever took into my life was 0:22:45.640 --> 0:22:47.600 when I worked at a grocery store and it was 0:22:47.640 --> 0:22:51.560 like perfect for like stocking shelves. Just your brain doesn't work. 0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:53.960 So here's my issue with the story. I have a 0:22:53.960 --> 0:22:56.840 few issues with the story. Um. One, I think both 0:22:56.920 --> 0:23:01.200 main characters, including the narrator, are boring as paint. Um 0:23:01.240 --> 0:23:04.919 I think you mean unreliable. Um, They're not unreliable in 0:23:04.960 --> 0:23:07.359 an interesting way. Like I so like a lot of 0:23:07.359 --> 0:23:09.439 comparisons could be made with this story and with the 0:23:09.520 --> 0:23:11.840