WEBVTT - TikTok's Ban Upheld By SCOTUS 0:00:01.080 --> 0:00:05.320 From the heart of where innovation, money and power collide 0:00:05.600 --> 0:00:10.880 in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:32.480 Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow. 0:00:27.040 --> 0:00:30.000 Live from New York. I'm Caroline Hyde and. 0:00:29.920 --> 0:00:33.400 I'm Mike Sheppard in Washington. This is Bloomberg Technology and. 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:37.080 Today's key story, the Supreme Court upholds the law that 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:40.120 threatens TikTok's shut down in the United States. We get 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:43.440 straight to breaking news coming from CNN, reports that Trump 0:00:43.479 --> 0:00:46.960 will indeed make a decision on TikTok, and even the 0:00:47.000 --> 0:00:50.000 White House saying that the TikTok action falls into the 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:54.800 Trump administration. According to Reuter's Bloomberg's Ben Main, this is 0:00:54.840 --> 0:00:59.000 all perfectly obvious in many ways, and the decision was 0:00:59.040 --> 0:01:01.800 as expected. But then take us to the letter of 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:05.920 the law here. Ultimately, this cannot be distributed by the 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:07.280 likes of the app stores. 0:01:07.000 --> 0:01:09.160 And it cannot be supported by Oracle and others. 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:14.320 So that's right, and I think in looking at the 0:01:14.360 --> 0:01:20.000 decision specifically, the Court was very clear about the national 0:01:20.040 --> 0:01:23.839 security interest that Congress laid out in passing this law 0:01:24.319 --> 0:01:28.679 and President Biden signing it as being more important or 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:32.200 the most important thing when considering whether to let this 0:01:32.280 --> 0:01:36.840 law stand versus the arguments that from a free speech perspective, 0:01:37.080 --> 0:01:39.760 TikTok is important, and certainly from a commerce perspective, for 0:01:39.880 --> 0:01:42.840 the whatever percentage of one hundred and seventy million Americans 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:45.679 that use this app, they need to rely on it. 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:49.680 So essentially, the Supreme Court went ahead today and said 0:01:49.760 --> 0:01:53.080 national security, this argument is justified here. And now it 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:55.920 does fall to Donald Trump, and remembering back to his 0:01:55.960 --> 0:01:59.440 first term, this is a very different posture that he's 0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:02.760 taking here. He and his administration came out in favor 0:02:02.920 --> 0:02:06.160 of taking action against TikTok during his first term, and 0:02:06.200 --> 0:02:08.960 now we're seeing a very different position here, and we're 0:02:08.960 --> 0:02:10.520 going to see what happens Monday. 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:14.400 So, Ben, your team has been covering the TikTok legal 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:18.040 saga for months now, ever since they filed their claim 0:02:18.080 --> 0:02:20.480 back in May. But the story is not over. Talk 0:02:20.520 --> 0:02:23.240 a little bit about how the reprieve might work under 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:26.480 the law and what the Justice Department perhaps could do 0:02:26.760 --> 0:02:29.720 to hold back on enforcement, at least at first. 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:31.680 Exactly so effectively. 0:02:32.000 --> 0:02:33.680 Now that this law is on the books, I mean 0:02:33.680 --> 0:02:35.160 it was on the books, but now that it's going 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:37.640 to stay on the books, it falls to the executive 0:02:37.639 --> 0:02:41.000 branch and the president, and certainly the Justice Department and 0:02:41.080 --> 0:02:44.359 Donald Trump's incoming Justice Department and Attorney General. 0:02:44.240 --> 0:02:45.000 To enforce it. 0:02:45.440 --> 0:02:48.080 What we understand is that Donald Trump very much wants 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:50.520 to cut this deal. He has said that he is. 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:53.480 In his brief that was a Friend of the Court 0:02:53.520 --> 0:02:55.880 brief filed a few weeks ago, he said he's the 0:02:55.919 --> 0:02:58.360 person who can cut this deal once he takes office. 0:02:58.440 --> 0:03:00.480 So I don't think we're going to see any movement 0:03:00.880 --> 0:03:03.880 necessarily in the next few hours or the next day 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:06.440 or two. But Donald Trump, once he comes in, has 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:08.360 made clear that he wants to get this done. He 0:03:08.360 --> 0:03:10.360 wants to figure out a solutionaire and he thinks he 0:03:10.400 --> 0:03:12.960 can do it. Like he has expressed the ability and 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:15.359 confidence in himself to do many things, this is one 0:03:15.360 --> 0:03:17.520 of them he thinks he can get done. So the 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:20.000 next step is essentially whether a deal is going to 0:03:20.040 --> 0:03:25.000 get done. That both the outgoing Biden administration and the 0:03:25.040 --> 0:03:27.680 incoming Trump administration have signaled they are not going to 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:31.360 enforce this ban immediately, so we're not going to see 0:03:31.800 --> 0:03:36.080 January nineteenth, the Biden administration Justice Department really taking any 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:39.520 action and we're not expecting to see the Trump administration 0:03:39.640 --> 0:03:42.000 do anything when they take office on Monday as well. 0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:45.840 Bloom Meg's Ben Main we thank you, but well, could 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:48.840 TikTok and bite douts decide to do on the nineteenth 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:51.560 We turn to bluem Meg's Alexandra Levine for that, alex 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:55.200 they could decide that we can't use it, and indeed 0:03:55.200 --> 0:03:58.360 the infrastructure might not be there to support it absolutely. 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.120 So, we've seen reports that TikTok is thinking of just 0:04:01.160 --> 0:04:03.760 shutting the app off, making it go dark on its own, 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:06.120 and we heard some references during the Supreme Court hearing 0:04:06.200 --> 0:04:09.119 last week to TikTok going dark, and it didn't quite 0:04:09.160 --> 0:04:11.840 make sense because we knew TikTok was never going to 0:04:11.880 --> 0:04:15.440 go dark immediately, because once Apple and Google and Oracle 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:18.799 begin to stop hosting and distributing the platform, we knew 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:20.880 that what it would be would be a slow deterioration 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:23.479 for people who use the app, not in immediate going dark. 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:25.800 What we've heard in reports though more recently, is that 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:28.080 TikTok made to shut the whole thing off come Sunday, 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:30.800 and that users who open the app may see some 0:04:30.960 --> 0:04:32.839 kind of a pop up that directs them to a 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:35.919 website to talk about the ban. And it's a really 0:04:35.920 --> 0:04:38.640 fascinating strategic move if that does come to pass, because 0:04:38.640 --> 0:04:41.240 I think it would really mobilize one hundred and seventy 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:44.359 million Americans, which is roughly half the country, to be 0:04:44.440 --> 0:04:46.680 angry about this, to protest it, and then to of 0:04:46.720 --> 0:04:50.120 course demand action from Trump and his new team to 0:04:50.160 --> 0:04:51.160 do something about it. 0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:59.160 Alex, those protests didn't succeed in getting the ban staved 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:02.279 off back in March and April when it was going 0:05:02.320 --> 0:05:05.120 through Congress. Do we think they'll stand a better chance 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:08.760 this time around with the incoming Trump administration those kinds 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:09.360 of appeals. 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:11.960 I do think these kinds of appeals could have more 0:05:12.040 --> 0:05:16.280 luck this time. You know, when TikTok mobilized its very 0:05:16.279 --> 0:05:19.400 dedicated base to call Congress right when the law was 0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:21.919 introduced to try to prevent them from passing it, it 0:05:22.000 --> 0:05:25.320 actually stoked lawmakers' fears even more about the potential for 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:30.400 the app to create outrage, to create discord, to really 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:33.880 anger lots of Americans, and it actually drove home the 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:36.000 point for them that they needed to do something about 0:05:36.000 --> 0:05:38.960 the app in this case, now that Trump has campaign 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.640 on the app, he credits the app potentially with him 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:43.960 reaching many young voters that he thinks moved the needle 0:05:44.000 --> 0:05:45.720 for him. I think he's going to be a much 0:05:45.760 --> 0:05:48.680 more willing audience for any kinds of pressure. And we're 0:05:48.720 --> 0:05:51.679 already seeing creators who, for example, were live streaming outside 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:55.240 the Supreme Court last week. Who are you know sending 0:05:55.240 --> 0:05:59.600 the message? Trump campaigned on promising that he would help 0:05:59.640 --> 0:06:01.080 us with the app. He would say if he would 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:03.120 resuscitate it, and now we're going to hold him to 0:06:03.160 --> 0:06:03.760 his word on that. 0:06:05.320 --> 0:06:09.359 Bloomberg's Alexandra Levin, thank you so much. Let's bring in 0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:14.320 Gen Munster now from Deepwater Asset Management. Gene talk us 0:06:14.360 --> 0:06:17.640 through what this means for all the competitors out there 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:20.800 to TikTok. If you're an investor looking to trade this, 0:06:21.040 --> 0:06:24.400 it is murky. You have the Supreme Court in upholding 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:27.000 this ban, and yet you have Donald Trump saying he 0:06:27.080 --> 0:06:29.840 may give the company a reprieve. What is an investor 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:30.920 or trader to do now? 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:35.360 Well, Meta Trader deep Water we own Meta, and as 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:39.080 an owner of Meta, we're expecting that this ban is 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:41.680 not going to be upheld at the end of the day. 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:44.960 This even though despite what's happened with the Supreme Court. 0:06:45.120 --> 0:06:48.480 I think that writing is clearly on the wall. TikTok 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:52.160 is going to remain, and the big change wasn't about 0:06:52.160 --> 0:06:55.680 the Supreme Court largely doesn't matter. What matters is the 0:06:55.720 --> 0:06:58.560 tone on the Democratic Party. And I think that that 0:06:58.640 --> 0:07:03.240 speaks to what is a strong bipartisan support back in 0:07:03.279 --> 0:07:07.039 April eighty two, eighty seven percent the House and Senate support. 0:07:07.440 --> 0:07:10.720 Typically a bill gets passed around fifty five percent, So 0:07:10.800 --> 0:07:16.240 this is unprecedented bipartisan support that is now shifting. And 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:19.800 I think that for an investor, from investor standpoint, I 0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:23.800 think that one piece is just for meta that we're 0:07:23.840 --> 0:07:26.720 expecting kind of a five up to a ten percent 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:30.640 tailwind if they would have captured fifty seventy five percent 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:35.720 of that time spent on Instagram reels. And so I 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:38.120 think I'll start there, Mike Is. I think that that's 0:07:38.600 --> 0:07:42.160 from investor piece. There's another lesson here for investors that 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:45.720 go well beyond what's happening with TikTok. And there's no 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:48.080 other app in the world that I can imagine that 0:07:48.120 --> 0:07:51.520 could cause this kind of uprise, And the reason is 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:54.600 it is the power of a strong product an addictive 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:59.360 product and the power of I think people in this 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:04.000 case that product influencing political decision. And so what does 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:08.000 that mean for broader investing is that companies that have 0:08:08.080 --> 0:08:11.560 that leverage, and in Nvidia, for example, it's just really 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:12.440 hard to displace. 0:08:13.360 --> 0:08:16.320 Really interesting considering the pressure in video is putting on 0:08:16.360 --> 0:08:19.520 the next set of potential laws coming its way to 0:08:19.600 --> 0:08:24.320 limit its selling abroad. Gene this about face of lawmakers, 0:08:24.640 --> 0:08:28.160 this bipartisanship of against TikTok to now suddenly everyone wanting 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:30.960 to see it continue. How does that materialize in the 0:08:30.960 --> 0:08:33.120 next few days. I know it's hard to discern, but 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:36.920 Chuck Schumer, of course, minority leader in the Senate saying 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:39.560 we need to find a US buyer. What does that 0:08:39.679 --> 0:08:42.200 mean for the addiction of the algorithm with a new owner. 0:08:44.120 --> 0:08:45.679 Well, first of all, I don't think it's going to 0:08:45.760 --> 0:08:48.520 there will be a new owner. I think that ultimately 0:08:48.840 --> 0:08:50.720 what will happen is this is going to go back 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:53.320 to some sort of House and Senate vote, and I 0:08:53.440 --> 0:08:56.800 think that it actually will h TikTok will be allowed 0:08:56.800 --> 0:09:00.000 to remain. I think that there's just that much political pressure. 0:09:00.000 --> 0:09:02.960 What we saw from buying today was I think evidence 0:09:03.040 --> 0:09:06.319 of how strong that political pressure is. If I'm wrong 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:10.839 and there's ultimately a sale, that algorithm effectively doesn't change. 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:13.680 I think the question wasn't whether or not, from a 0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:17.000 logistics standpoint, whether the algorithm would change, as where as 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.320 that data ultimately go. And so I don't think that 0:09:19.040 --> 0:09:20.720 that piece changes. 0:09:22.520 --> 0:09:25.440 Jane, we saw that Donald Trump spoke today with Chinese 0:09:25.440 --> 0:09:29.760 President Xi Jianping, whose blessing would be needed ultimately for 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:33.680 any sale of the app by byte Dance. Do you 0:09:33.840 --> 0:09:38.240 see any buyers emerging, perhaps including Elon Musk, whose name 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:40.240 has been floated in Chinese circles. 0:09:41.840 --> 0:09:45.080 So I'm wrong, and this does go the route of 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:49.160 a sale, Elon's a buyer. I think there can be 0:09:49.200 --> 0:09:53.560 other constituents. You could see groups potentially telcos involved with 0:09:53.920 --> 0:09:56.240 a sale. We've seen them start to venture into things 0:09:56.280 --> 0:09:59.080 like this, of course Megacap, and maybe they've got some 0:09:59.160 --> 0:10:02.320 more room with closer relationship that Megacap has had with 0:10:02.320 --> 0:10:07.160 the Trump administration. So something along those lines, and so 0:10:08.360 --> 0:10:11.080 I mean something will come on. It's worth probably fifty 0:10:11.120 --> 0:10:14.280 to one hundred billion dollars somewhere in that range, which 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:19.000 for these companies is a very doable ticket. So again, 0:10:19.240 --> 0:10:23.880 I think that TikTok users should rest easy because they're 0:10:23.880 --> 0:10:25.240 going to get their product. They're going to get to 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:27.840 continue their product, whether it's in the current form or 0:10:27.880 --> 0:10:29.040 just under some new leadership. 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:32.439 Wow, up to one hundred billion, Gene Munster, It's been 0:10:32.440 --> 0:10:35.280 great to have you from deep Water Asset Management. Thank 0:10:35.320 --> 0:10:38.439 you coming up as tech CEOs. They flock tomorrow lago 0:10:38.480 --> 0:10:42.079 and then to the inauguration. How will industry policy change 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:45.000 under the upcoming Trump administration? Jason Oxman's joining us on 0:10:45.040 --> 0:10:49.480 the Information Technology Industry Council. That's next. Meanwhile, keep a 0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:52.400 close eye on Intel shares. We digress from TikTok for 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.440 but a moment. Shares rising after a report from a 0:10:55.480 --> 0:11:00.400 website called semi accurate and semi being of course about semikinductors. 0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:04.640 But he said the company will be potentially an acquisition target. 0:11:05.240 --> 0:11:24.960 But this is Bloomberg Technology. 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:18.480 Today. 0:11:19.559 --> 0:11:22.840 An oligarchy is taking shape in America of extreme. 0:11:22.440 --> 0:11:26.480 Wealth, power and influence that literally threads our entire democracy. 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:29.439 Are basic grades in freedoms. 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:33.400 President Biden, speaking from the Oval Office on Wednesday, taking 0:11:33.440 --> 0:11:36.880 aim at what he calls a tech industrial complex. 0:11:37.200 --> 0:11:38.199 While he didn't name anyone. 0:11:38.240 --> 0:11:40.920 In particular, several of the biggest names in the industry 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:43.960 have donated millions to President Trump's inaugural fund and plan 0:11:44.040 --> 0:11:46.720 of course, to attend the ceremony on Monday. Bloomberg's Kaylee 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:49.960 Lines is in Washington with more and well. One key 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:53.880 partner of his throughout the campaign and donating millions was 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:55.760 Elon Musk, and now many more follow suit. 0:11:55.800 --> 0:11:58.640 Kaye. Who will be there on Monday, Well, it's a 0:11:58.720 --> 0:11:59.959 laundry list, Carolina. 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:01.560 A lot of wealth is going to be not just 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:05.040 at the inauguration, but physically on the platform with Donald 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:07.600 Trump as he takes the oath of office, seated next 0:12:07.600 --> 0:12:10.599 to the likes of a senior members of Congress, cabinet secretaries, 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:12.920 and even former presidents. Elon Musk, of course, who you're 0:12:12.960 --> 0:12:15.439 referring to. They're the world's richest man, but the second 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:18.559 and third richest man men according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index, 0:12:18.600 --> 0:12:21.640 will also be there. Mark Zuckerberg and Jeff Bezos will 0:12:21.679 --> 0:12:24.680 be in attendance. Tim Cook, the CEO of Apple, also 0:12:24.679 --> 0:12:27.240 according to our reporting, is planning to attend. One notable 0:12:27.280 --> 0:12:30.320 exception maybe is the CEO of Nvidia, Jensen Wong that's 0:12:30.400 --> 0:12:33.160 just a travel thing. He's currently in Southeast Asia. But 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:34.880 by and large, this is going to be a huge 0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:38.240 who of big technology and noteworthy, especially given the news 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.320 today the TikTok band being upheld by the Supreme Court. 0:12:41.400 --> 0:12:44.559 The CEO of TikTok, Show Chew, will also be an inauguration, 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:46.920 though we've been told that he's just attending. He won't 0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:49.520 actually get one of those prize seats up on the platform. 0:12:49.559 --> 0:12:51.680 But that platform is going to be stacked with a 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:52.400 lot of wealth. 0:12:52.480 --> 0:12:53.160 Just those three. 0:12:52.960 --> 0:12:57.679 Individuals Musk, Zuckerberg, and Bezos together collectively have a net 0:12:57.679 --> 0:12:59.599 worth of nearly one trillion. 0:12:59.240 --> 0:13:00.720 Dollars, Kaylee. 0:13:00.720 --> 0:13:04.120 With Donald Trump taking attendance in a way and making 0:13:04.160 --> 0:13:08.280 sure that all of these industry allies and billionaires are 0:13:08.360 --> 0:13:11.560 there in his court, what are they looking for from 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:12.559 him in return? 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:15.000 Well, you can take for example, Tim Cook, because we've 0:13:15.000 --> 0:13:17.800 actually seen this in the first Trump administration. Apple would 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:21.360 be highly susceptible to potentially problematic tariffs on things like 0:13:21.440 --> 0:13:23.640 China that would have drastic impact on the iPhone. So 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:25.800 there are policies in which they are hoping they might 0:13:25.800 --> 0:13:29.000 be able to avoid negative impact. And the same goes 0:13:29.040 --> 0:13:32.199 for social media companies. We've already seen Mark Zuckerberg taking 0:13:32.200 --> 0:13:36.520 action at meta reshuffling, personnel reshuffling policy as well as 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:39.240 they've stopped fact checking or they're going to be pulling 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.520 back on it. And we've heard from President Biden in 0:13:41.559 --> 0:13:43.640 his Oval Office address there. Yes he didn't name Mark 0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:47.359 Zuckerberg directly, but in his warning about a burgeoning American oligarchy, 0:13:47.400 --> 0:13:51.840 he specifically referenced social media companies pulling back on fact checking. 0:13:51.679 --> 0:13:53.360 So it was only so veiled. 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:54.840 So a large part of this is trying to make 0:13:54.840 --> 0:13:57.600 sure that big tech can see its interest aligning with 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:01.240 the president, who has not been shy about targeting some 0:14:01.320 --> 0:14:02.439 of these companies in the past. 0:14:02.640 --> 0:14:06.600 Right Bloomberg's Kaylee lines, thank you so much. Here with 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:10.240 more on tech policy under the incoming Trump administration is 0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:14.760 Jason Oxman, President and CEO of the Information Technology Information 0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:19.560 Technology Industry Council. Jason, thank you for joining us today. Jason. 0:14:19.600 --> 0:14:21.160 We wanted to talk to you a little bit more 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.040 about trade and your concerns there. This is something that 0:14:24.120 --> 0:14:28.320 your group has singled out as an area of priority 0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:31.720 and of concern. The Biden administration has put a lot 0:14:31.760 --> 0:14:34.160 of pressure in particular on China, but that has a 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:34.840 ripple effect. 0:14:34.920 --> 0:14:35.800 Talk about that a little. 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:38.600 What we're really looking for and enthusiastically looking for from 0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:41.440 the Trump administration is more of a strategy that takes 0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:46.880 advantage of opportunities for US companies to succeed internationally. Leadership 0:14:46.920 --> 0:14:49.400 and technology. That's what the US is known for, and 0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:52.200 what we've seen in the Biden administration, unfortunately, is a 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:57.160 lack of strategy, an inability to match the significant and 0:14:57.600 --> 0:15:02.720 serious national security interests with economic activity that promotes US 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.800 opportunities internationally. So on trade, our excitement and enthusiasm about 0:15:06.800 --> 0:15:10.120 the Trump administration is they're very focused on working in 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:13.520 partnership to address the China question. And we've seen the 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:17.280 President elect already talk to President she about the strategy 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:20.120 for dealing with that, about moving forward, working together. What 0:15:20.160 --> 0:15:23.480 we want to make sure happens US technology leadership continues. 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:26.960 The economic driver of the US economy is technology, so 0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:29.920 we can make sure that trade becomes a real opportunity 0:15:29.960 --> 0:15:30.720 for further growth. 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:35.680 Jason, do we not need, though, acts like a potential 0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:39.840 banning of a significant social media app that touches one 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:44.040 hundred and seventy million users to ensure national security. That 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:47.120 was bipartisan in nature, and yes, Trump might come in 0:15:47.160 --> 0:15:49.840 and have a conversation with she about it, but ultimately 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:53.240 this was bipartisan in nature because of national security concerns. 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:57.920 The TikTok news of the days, of course very interesting, 0:15:57.920 --> 0:15:59.840 and one hundred and seventy million people are watching the 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:02.160 outcome there. I don't have any prediction about what's going 0:16:02.200 --> 0:16:05.200 to happen on Monday at noon when President elect Trump 0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:09.920 takes over, but it does highlight how really difficult these 0:16:09.920 --> 0:16:13.640 issues are to address, and the larger question of how 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.760 we address the China issue, I think is one that 0:16:16.800 --> 0:16:19.440 requires a real strategy. And what we're looking forward to, 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:21.000 what the tech industry is looking forward to in the 0:16:21.040 --> 0:16:24.240 Trump administration is he does seem to have more of 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.320 a focus on making this a strategic approach rather than 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:29.720 just a one off approach. For example, we saw earlier 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:33.360 this week the Biden administration adopted rules around AI diffusion. 0:16:33.400 --> 0:16:36.000 So these are rules that restrict the ability of US 0:16:36.160 --> 0:16:41.000 companies to export AI technology, including too allied countries around 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:43.400 the world. That's a huge mistake. It wasn't done in 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:45.960 consultation with industry. We think the Trump administration will do 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:48.200 a better job with that kind of issue. But that's 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:50.560 an example of the need to balance national security with 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:53.920 economic interests and make sure that US leadership is not 0:16:54.120 --> 0:16:57.000 harmed by skewing too far in one direction or the other. 0:16:57.040 --> 0:16:59.520 That's what we're looking forward to seeing done differently in 0:16:59.520 --> 0:17:01.280 the trumpstration. 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:04.520 And certainly Jensen Huang of in videos maybe feels similarly 0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:08.280 and in video pushed back significantly against that latest announcement announcement. 0:17:08.320 --> 0:17:11.800 But what is interesting is that perhaps jd Vance has. 0:17:11.720 --> 0:17:15.280 Supported well some views coming from Lena Khan, for example, 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:19.159 about some of the strength and the overall domination some 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:21.639 would say of certain players in tech. Just listen to 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:23.840 what Lena Khan said a little bit about the bipartisan 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:24.479 nature of that. 0:17:25.480 --> 0:17:29.960 There's no doubt that there is strong bipartisan concern about 0:17:30.320 --> 0:17:34.840 the economic power of large technology companies and how that 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:39.919 can undermine fair competition, undermine people's free speech rights, and 0:17:40.040 --> 0:17:42.160 so well. Of course, have to see what the next 0:17:42.200 --> 0:17:45.240 administration does, but it's certainly been an area of strong 0:17:45.320 --> 0:17:47.680 bipartisan concern during my tenure. 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:51.760 The FTC chair has some support, as I say, from 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:57.000 Vice President elect. Will you see an enthusiasm around future 0:17:57.119 --> 0:17:58.480 M and A in technology. 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.959 Do you think, well, Leida Khana has about seventy two 0:18:02.000 --> 0:18:04.040 hours left on the job, and the person that the 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:06.879 President ELECTA is designated to replace her has taken a 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:10.240 much more balanced approach and we think a more favorable 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:14.119 approach to advancing US innovation. Look, the President himself is 0:18:14.160 --> 0:18:18.080 a technology innovator. He is surrounding himself by technology innovators 0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:20.439 who are coming into office, people who will be serving 0:18:20.480 --> 0:18:23.679 in crucial roles and understand the vital role that the 0:18:23.800 --> 0:18:28.000 US technology industry plays in economic growth. As far as 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:31.760 trade and export around technology. For example, we run a 0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:35.400 three hundred billion dollars surplus in the US on digital trade, 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:39.080 that's exports of US technology around the world. So I 0:18:39.119 --> 0:18:42.040 think as long as we can place regulators as the 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:44.879 President elect is looking to do, who are willing to 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:47.640 listen to industry and make sure that balance is struck 0:18:47.800 --> 0:18:50.800 between national security and economic growth, I think will be 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:52.960 in a much better place for the next four years 0:18:53.080 --> 0:18:55.760 to ensure that the technology industry can work in partnership 0:18:55.760 --> 0:18:57.760 with government to advance economic growth. 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:01.960 Jason Oxman, President of the Information Technology Industry Council, Thanks 0:19:02.000 --> 0:19:11.439 so much for your time today. We must return to 0:19:11.480 --> 0:19:14.440 the TikTok decision that came from the Supreme Court earlier today, 0:19:14.480 --> 0:19:17.280 standing by the law to ban or divest. The latest 0:19:17.280 --> 0:19:20.880 coming from President elect Trump on truth Social Trump saying 0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:22.960 that the TikTok decision will come in the not too 0:19:23.000 --> 0:19:25.919 distant future from him. He says he needs time to 0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:30.119 review the TikTok situation. Obviously he's been promising to solve it. 0:19:30.119 --> 0:19:33.080 Bloomberg Intelligence senior analyst man Neet Sing joins us now. 0:19:33.560 --> 0:19:36.760 And if I'm an oracle and an infrastructure provider, if 0:19:36.800 --> 0:19:40.800 I'm Apple and I'm Google, the app providers, what. 0:19:41.080 --> 0:19:44.520 Do I do in this situation on the nineteenth. 0:19:43.840 --> 0:19:47.159 I mean, given the liabilities of you know, keeping the 0:19:47.240 --> 0:19:49.600 app up, you are going to shut it down periods, 0:19:49.640 --> 0:19:52.320 so the app will go. Derek, The question is what 0:19:52.359 --> 0:19:55.439 will the President Trump do on day one? And my 0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:58.560 sense is, given all the tech executives are coming to 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:02.280 his inauguration, you'll probably find a way to migrate that 0:20:02.480 --> 0:20:07.080 TikTok data to the competing platforms, whether it's YouTube or meta. 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:11.200 Because right now everyone is scared like they will suddenly 0:20:11.240 --> 0:20:14.399 lose all their business because all the followers and the 0:20:14.640 --> 0:20:16.920 content will go away. Well, guess what if you can 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:20.120 migrate that data to a meta or a YouTube, then 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:23.240 you can potentially keep your business running. So that data 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:26.440 aspect is huge. I think far too much focus has 0:20:26.480 --> 0:20:29.880 gone on the sale of the US business in this case. 0:20:29.920 --> 0:20:32.080 If you can migrate the data, even if you keep 0:20:32.080 --> 0:20:35.920 aside the algorithm, the data is huge because that's what 0:20:36.160 --> 0:20:38.359 I think everyone cares about when you talk to the 0:20:38.400 --> 0:20:41.399 creators and the people who consume the content, and I 0:20:41.400 --> 0:20:43.879 think the migration of data would be a huge factor 0:20:43.920 --> 0:20:46.720 when it comes to the future of TikTok. 0:20:47.880 --> 0:20:51.720 Mendeep. We've seen Donald Trump present himself as the deal 0:20:51.760 --> 0:20:54.800 maker and he really would like to see this problem 0:20:54.880 --> 0:20:57.879 solved by selling it and finding a buyer, but that 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:01.120 is no easy feat. He talked about some of the hurdles, 0:21:01.160 --> 0:21:04.639 including the cost and then who would be able to 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:07.880 pay for it, and then clear the national security hurdles. 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:11.479 Yeah, look, there has been some private equity interest in 0:21:11.520 --> 0:21:15.320 the past, and obviously Musk has been mentioned as a 0:21:15.359 --> 0:21:19.479 potential buyer given you know, his closeness with President Trump 0:21:19.520 --> 0:21:23.040 and also uh you know, with the Chinese authorities. So 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:27.000 clearly there are a number of potential buyers, even you know, 0:21:27.040 --> 0:21:30.240 the likes of Walmart and Oracle who have been mentioned 0:21:30.280 --> 0:21:32.080