1 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to stuff 2 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:20,320 Speaker 1: I've never told your production of I Heart Radio. So, Samantha, 3 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: what's your favorite thing about working remotely? Um? Not having 4 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: to wear a bra mm on a consistant basis. See, 5 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: there's so many, honestly, so many things. Being able to 6 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 1: wait to the last minute to make your face known 7 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 1: instead of coming in and talking to everybody, you know 8 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,360 Speaker 1: what I mean, and like having the conversation of like 9 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:47,440 Speaker 1: seeing people passing by, people, having the moment of you know, 10 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: all these things. So you have to get ready and 11 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: all this FaceTime with people essentially have face to face 12 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: time and then start working. As when we're doing it remotely, 13 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: I'm like barely sitting at the computer like all r lets, 14 00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:02,920 Speaker 1: let's get started. I love that it sounds like water 15 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:06,640 Speaker 1: cooler talk is your nightmare? Well, to me, this is 16 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 1: like the introverted dream, Like this is an introverts dream, 17 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 1: especially because these are people you work with and not 18 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,759 Speaker 1: necessarily choose to hang with. Not that other people aren't cool, 19 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 1: A lot of people are. Try to put that out there. 20 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 1: People are super cool. I will, but it's still hard 21 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:26,399 Speaker 1: when you're in that work environment, work mentality. So kind 22 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: of not having to worry about that has been really nice. 23 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:33,480 Speaker 1: What about you, I definitely am with you on the 24 00:01:33,520 --> 00:01:38,400 Speaker 1: clothes thing. I barely put on like real clothes anymore. Uh. 25 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:42,560 Speaker 1: And I think the second thing is um working on 26 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 1: my own kind of weird schedule and not feeling bad 27 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: about that, and then also having usually a horror movie 28 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: on in the background, uh, and not feeling bad that 29 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: like someone's going to look over my shoulder and be like, hey, 30 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 1: you're not working, you're watching bad horror movies. I am. 31 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm doing both. I'm a multitasker. I like to have 32 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 1: noise in the background as well, so if it's a 33 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:08,600 Speaker 1: show that I'm rerunning or if it's like loud music 34 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:11,000 Speaker 1: or something, it's really nice to have that too, and 35 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,720 Speaker 1: not worrying about people judging my taste. Yes, And I 36 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:18,239 Speaker 1: will say we come from a very like flexible Even 37 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 1: before this, when you had to go into the office, 38 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:21,919 Speaker 1: it was a very flexible schedule and a lot of 39 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 1: people did watch stuff on the computer while they were working. 40 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:29,480 Speaker 1: It's a very low key office. But my my anxiety 41 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 1: was that people were judging me for what I was watching, 42 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 1: so I didn't do it right. Yeah, you also had 43 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 1: like the facing like everybody walked by you computer giant. Yeah, 44 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:44,959 Speaker 1: I was very mad when they moved to me there. Yes, 45 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: you were out of your corner. Um. But yeah, I 46 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,840 Speaker 1: will say for our office is inerally quiet, like everybody 47 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:53,639 Speaker 1: is so in their zone and such great workers, that's 48 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 1: what it really means. But it's there so silent you 49 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: walk in and a small sound everybody knows. So it 50 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:05,000 Speaker 1: was definitely kind of erie as well as Yeah, I 51 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,240 Speaker 1: was overly conscious of being super quiet and I'm not 52 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: a quiet person. Yeah, And that's actually a good point. 53 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: I want to get back to you for this episode 54 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 1: because today we're talking about remote work and what that 55 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:20,360 Speaker 1: looks like for women particularly, And this was a listener 56 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 1: request from Julia, So thank you, Julia, Yeah, thank you Julia. Yeah. 57 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: And she was specifically saying, like, when it comes to 58 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:33,080 Speaker 1: things that women often face in the office, like sexual harassment, 59 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:39,240 Speaker 1: being judged by looks, fashion, how remote work might remove 60 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 1: those things or less than those things having to deal 61 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: with those things, And um, when we look at COVID nineteen, 62 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:51,119 Speaker 1: it has changed how a lot of us work. Yes, 63 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: I am coming to you from my cosplay studio, still 64 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:56,880 Speaker 1: in a very short amount of time. Companies had to 65 00:03:56,880 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 1: pivot to one or nearly one remote work are. A 66 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 1: lot of companies did not all of them. I think 67 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 1: we did it. Our office did it in a matter 68 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 1: of days. It was fast. Um. Even the Trump White 69 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:16,440 Speaker 1: House recommended that people work from home quote whenever possible. However, 70 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 1: many many companies resisted this, as did several government agencies. 71 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:26,919 Speaker 1: For example, one CEO even message employees, we are collectively 72 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 1: more productive working in our corporate offices, and another said 73 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:33,280 Speaker 1: if we wish to maintain our productivity, we need to 74 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:37,280 Speaker 1: continue working in these offices. It is soul stealing and 75 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 1: abilitating to embrace the notion of social distancing and economic 76 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 1: hiber nation. Now, to be fair to this guy, he 77 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:51,119 Speaker 1: did later reverse his statement, but he put that down 78 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 1: in Texas in it two employees. Yeah, and I have friends. 79 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: I have friends who have received similar messages from bosses, 80 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 1: and some of m like around this time or having 81 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 1: to go back into work right, even though clearly things 82 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 1: are not under control. Right. I've talked to old coworkers 83 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,600 Speaker 1: of mine who are in the state agency, and they 84 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 1: a lot of them that because it is a face 85 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,160 Speaker 1: to face job, you have to see people you have 86 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: to see because you have to see parents, you have 87 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: to make visits. UM. It was really difficult for the transition, 88 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 1: and everything went to telecommunications so zoom meetings and by 89 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:32,039 Speaker 1: the way, surprise, surprise, the state agency doesn't have a 90 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 1: lot of money and doesn't have much invested in things 91 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: like that, in equipment like that, um, even though it 92 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 1: had actually been talked about previously, like why can't we 93 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 1: just do this because people were traveling so much, A 94 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:45,159 Speaker 1: big part of the budget was being taken out for 95 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:47,839 Speaker 1: travel reimbursement, which I know we're gonna talk a little 96 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 1: bit more about later, but it is it's kind of 97 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:51,800 Speaker 1: interesting to see how they all kind of had to 98 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,279 Speaker 1: quickly change and what is needed, what isn't needed, and 99 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 1: then how so having to backtrack and realize maybe part 100 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: of this is because they're trying to maintain control over 101 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:05,039 Speaker 1: their workers because they didn't trust their productivity. Yeah, which 102 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:08,040 Speaker 1: is the whole thing. Yes, yes, And that comes up 103 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: a lot in this of this. I believe that people 104 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:16,800 Speaker 1: are just shirking, so ready to shirk off their responsibilities 105 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 1: and do less work and that is not the case. 106 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 1: And we have some numbers on that later for you 107 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:25,479 Speaker 1: in this so many remote work policies implemented in the 108 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 1: Pandemics Wake were confusing or workers were afraid to use them, 109 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:34,200 Speaker 1: much like myself. Um, some required managerial approval, meaning that 110 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:37,720 Speaker 1: it wasn't uniform. Even this week, the boss over at 111 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 1: Netflix said he saw only negatives of working from home, 112 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: which I'm really surprised by. Remote work is often framed 113 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:49,040 Speaker 1: in direct opposition of collaborative open space work, particularly in 114 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: the text sector, and we've kind of talked about open 115 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 1: works force and all of that, because I'm like, what 116 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 1: is this. Yeah, I know I've said it before on 117 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:59,280 Speaker 1: this show, but one of the first, like when we 118 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: moved to our open space office, one of the first 119 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 1: meetings we had in there turned into a two hour 120 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: session of people complaining about how they did. I'm telling 121 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 1: you because like, because I came from a very individualistic 122 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 1: case management type of world and coming to that, I 123 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 1: was like, what's happening? What is happening? So yes, but 124 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 1: I was definitely one of those I was confused. But 125 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:25,000 Speaker 1: all of this is complicated. Some companies cannot close, like 126 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: we just said, or they'll go under, but stayed open 127 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 1: puts workers, as we know, at risk. A lot of 128 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 1: the bosses making these decisions have the option to work 129 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 1: from home while asking their employees to go in. If 130 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 1: we had a government safety net, we might be having 131 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: a different conversation. Yeah. Yeah, And again with all of 132 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 1: this issues of access, not everyone has the internet or 133 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 1: even fast enough internet or laptops, and not all companies 134 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 1: are providing these things, even if they're asking their employees 135 00:07:56,560 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: to work from home, so that is an issue as well. 136 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: All other companies are reevaluating remote work policies. And I 137 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 1: know we've had conversations among our coworkers if we're ever 138 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: going to truly go back to the office like we 139 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:14,840 Speaker 1: used to. It definitely feels like this has changed how 140 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: we work, and it will. It's a change that's here 141 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 1: to stay. I personally think it's going to be more 142 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 1: remote work. Maybe you have to come in for our 143 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: in our case, like one to two days, and we'll 144 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 1: have not the big office space we have now. I 145 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 1: think that's going away. Um and uh. Big companies like 146 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:36,680 Speaker 1: Facebook and Twitter have announced they're making remote work permanent 147 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 1: after this. Mm hmm. Now, no, before we get into this, 148 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: there isn't a lot in the way of data when 149 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,679 Speaker 1: it comes to remote working, though more and more is 150 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: starting to be collected. However, my own personal caveat, I 151 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:55,920 Speaker 1: think that we can't necessarily extrapolate too much out of 152 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,679 Speaker 1: the data being collected. Now we can, but we just 153 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 1: have to always have that aspects of like, it is 154 00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:04,559 Speaker 1: a unique stressful time. It is a pandemic, right, so 155 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 1: numbers are changing, Right, how does it look outside of 156 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 1: a pandemic? Right? And on top of that, a lot 157 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 1: of us are seeing our coworkers in their home environments 158 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 1: for the first time, which is sometimes really funny, sometimes 159 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 1: really embarrassing. Um. And some speculate that this will encourage 160 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 1: manages to be more flexible post pandemic with remote options 161 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: and schedules. Others think that unless work culture changes, people 162 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 1: who use work from home policies to work late and 163 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 1: get work done will be rewarded, while others will use 164 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: it for family reasons, mostly women, who will be penalized. Right. 165 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:43,679 Speaker 1: And this is called the ideal worker norm. And this 166 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:47,200 Speaker 1: is a worker who comes in early, stays late, and 167 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,360 Speaker 1: never has to leave for family reasons or any reason 168 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 1: really and therefore is a better worker and treats the 169 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 1: job more seriously, which also ties into the FaceTime bias, 170 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 1: which is going to come up a lot in this um. 171 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:06,680 Speaker 1: So yeah, there there's some people speculate unless we change 172 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 1: that whole idea, than even this kind of equalizing remote 173 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: work time is not gonna it's still going to carry over, right, 174 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 1: which is a very u s idea like that when 175 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,319 Speaker 1: you hit that in there, that this whole not taking 176 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: time off of work, not having vacations and running yourself 177 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: into the ground. Definitely, this whole bootstrapping, this is how 178 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:29,680 Speaker 1: we do it. This is how you do it. You 179 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 1: sacrifice everything for your job, which is a whole other conversation. 180 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 1: But all of this has sparked conversations around work culture, 181 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: whether it's outdated, who business, who benefits from it, and 182 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: how we can make it better. So we're going to 183 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 1: get into some basics. Yes, So when we say remote 184 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,520 Speaker 1: work also telework or tele commuting, what we mean is 185 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 1: the ability to accomplish work outside of an office. Most 186 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,200 Speaker 1: of the very first work from home options offered in 187 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: the United States in the nine nineties were part of 188 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: women's initiatives, only available to women because it was assumed 189 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:07,199 Speaker 1: men didn't need them or want them because they weren't 190 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 1: involved in caregiving, and because of this, these options soon 191 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 1: earned the nickname the mommy track. However, these programs were 192 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:18,839 Speaker 1: so rarely used for fear of panormalization, some HR professionals 193 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: called them ghost benefits. A new study out of M 194 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 1: I T found that since the pandemic, about half of 195 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:29,600 Speaker 1: Americans who are employed before the pandemic are now working remotely, 196 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 1: compared that too before the pandemic, when only seven percent 197 00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 1: of Americans had access to flexible schedules and work from 198 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,199 Speaker 1: home policies, according to the U. S. Bureau of Labor, 199 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 1: perhaps because of a history of articles out there claiming 200 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: that working from home will lead to once again a 201 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: decrease in job performance and effectiveness, companies have been very 202 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:53,079 Speaker 1: resistant to moving to remote work or allowing for more 203 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:57,680 Speaker 1: flexible schedules. But that is changing thanks to quarantine as 204 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:00,000 Speaker 1: many of them are forced to adjust and their employee 205 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 1: these along with them, and those beliefs about a reduction 206 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: in productivity from remote workers are actually not true, which 207 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,079 Speaker 1: I feel like it's not a big surprise, but he 208 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: study found that working from home actually increased productivity and 209 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:21,200 Speaker 1: saved companies surprise money. Of course, the caveat with the 210 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: study is it's survey a sector that could easily a 211 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 1: work from home, and it was a self selected group. 212 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:29,240 Speaker 1: So remember that when you were thinking about all these 213 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 1: good things, right, But other studies have found similar things. 214 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 1: They found that remote work options not only increased productivity, 215 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:41,439 Speaker 1: but also increased satisfaction employee satisfaction, engagement, and retention while 216 00:12:41,640 --> 00:12:45,920 Speaker 1: decreasing stress. Remote workers often work harder and for longer, 217 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 1: giving time without pay, which is not good actually, but 218 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: it shows how incorrect the reigning assumption is. And I 219 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: actually wonder because that is the assumption that you're working less, 220 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,240 Speaker 1: that you work more to prove that it's not true, 221 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: that you're you're definitely getting your work done in and 222 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:08,200 Speaker 1: actually I'm doing even more, see right, And that's exactly 223 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:10,199 Speaker 1: I know. This has been a conversation for many of 224 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: us who may have had flexible schedules previously because we 225 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: had to be the the keepers and may being able 226 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: to prove that people can do this, and so I 227 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 1: would be more likely to answer emails so much faster 228 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: if I was at home then I would if I 229 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: was at the work space. I'm like, I'm here, you 230 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,840 Speaker 1: got right here, that's all you get right, right, right, right? Right, 231 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: which was not necessarily the best attitude. But yeah, if 232 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,199 Speaker 1: I was at home and I was given that option, 233 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: or if I were able to do something else, I 234 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: was quickly on it. I made sure to be more attentive, 235 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:42,680 Speaker 1: so you did not have any questions about whether or 236 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:46,840 Speaker 1: not I'm working or being productive. Yeah, and this goes 237 00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: back to what I actually wanted to bring up about 238 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 1: how you said everyone in our office is so quiet, 239 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,920 Speaker 1: and at least in my case and I and most 240 00:13:55,000 --> 00:14:00,880 Speaker 1: of my team members case, there's know we're working in audio. 241 00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: There's part that's part of it. But also there was 242 00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:05,960 Speaker 1: just this idea that if I can get my work 243 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 1: done as quickly as possible, I can go home and 244 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,679 Speaker 1: be done with work. Right. So the work day had 245 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: this clear separation, whereas now for remote work, I do 246 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 1: feel like I'm working more and it's kind of surprised me. 247 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 1: There's not the clear like, oh, I'm going home, I'm 248 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 1: done with work now, it's it's work question shrug emoji. Right, Um, 249 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: so I do feel like I am putting in more time. Right. Oh. 250 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 1: And another study found that children with mothers who had 251 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:42,280 Speaker 1: access to flexible work options slept more so, which is awesome, 252 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 1: which is something to think on, except for the fact 253 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: that I have been reading as school is back in 254 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 1: and people are doing remote learning, that the school time 255 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: still starts at seven. That's kind of shocking. Oh no, yeah, yeah, 256 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,040 Speaker 1: So as before when it was summertime, I think that 257 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:02,640 Speaker 1: change a little bit now that school started. It's almost like, okay, 258 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:06,440 Speaker 1: for the mothers or fathers who are working at home, 259 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 1: they don't actually start till eight thirty nine o'clock. But 260 00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: now because schools back in, school starts even earlier for 261 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:14,960 Speaker 1: a lot of them, so they kind of lose that now. 262 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: But that's a whole of the conversation. So employees have 263 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 1: also reported feeling their work is more innovative when telework 264 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: options are available, which I'm trying to see if that's 265 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,480 Speaker 1: true for me um, and that they felt more informed, 266 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 1: both which were frequently side concerns of remote work, right, 267 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 1: that it would be less innovative and they would feel 268 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: employees would feel less informed, but actually the opposite is true. Now, 269 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: this was a specific study to Australia, so just put 270 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 1: that out there, right, and that's just a taste of 271 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 1: some of the potential positives of remote work, and we'll 272 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:52,480 Speaker 1: get into more, but first we're going to pause for 273 00:15:52,480 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 1: a quick break for a word from our sponsor, and 274 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 1: we're back. Thank you sponsored. All right, so now we 275 00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 1: kind of want to talk about the pros because we've 276 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: already talked a little bit about the positive. So what 277 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 1: are these pros? So lately we've seen more and more 278 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:22,280 Speaker 1: stories about the benefits of remote work flexibility, time and 279 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:24,920 Speaker 1: money saving. And one found study that here in Atlanta, 280 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 1: people who are full time office workers say five hundred 281 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:31,400 Speaker 1: fifty five dollars on commuting costs a year when they 282 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 1: started remote working, which is significant for us. And in 283 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: New York, eliminating commutes, say full time employees and average 284 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: of three hundred and forty three hours a year. Wow, 285 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,320 Speaker 1: which is about two weeks. Yeah when Yeah, which is 286 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: about two weeks. But like such, so been so beneficial. 287 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: The communal loan just kind of zapps people from their interview. Yeah, 288 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: so it's better for the environment and minimizing FaceTime, yes, 289 00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 1: and the biases that often come with it. And we've 290 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 1: heard about the benefits especially for women and especially when 291 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 1: it comes to childcare and things like breastfeeding or providing 292 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: care in general, not to mention the benefits for people 293 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: who can't go into the offices for whatever reason or 294 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: having difficulty doing so. Yes, and we have talked on 295 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:19,720 Speaker 1: this show so many times about how women are penalized 296 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 1: for having children or even the assumed potential to have children, 297 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:29,120 Speaker 1: not getting jobs, not getting promoted, losing jobs, losing promotions. 298 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: We talked about this recently in our animal Care episode. 299 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:37,600 Speaker 1: Working from home can help in those areas. Not only that, 300 00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:39,960 Speaker 1: a lot of mothers report a guilt factor of not 301 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:43,119 Speaker 1: having a flexible schedule, and work from home policies could 302 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 1: ameliorate that as well. Research from Pew found that fifty 303 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 1: of working mothers said having a family made career advancement difficult, 304 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:54,160 Speaker 1: while only six of working fathers said the same thing. 305 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: Of mothers took reduced hours to support their families compared 306 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: to only twenty eight percent of fathers, and that is 307 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:06,960 Speaker 1: a huge difference. Yeah. University of Wisconsin Milwaukee study found 308 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: one third of women in tech left their jobs due 309 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 1: to lack of work life balance. In a seventeen study 310 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 1: out of the UK, seventy percent of women cited remote 311 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 1: working options as vital if companies wanted to keep them 312 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,359 Speaker 1: as employees for the long term right, and another recent 313 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 1: survey found that while women are more likely to request 314 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 1: the option to work from home of women compared to 315 00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 1: the percent of men, they're less likely to get it. 316 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 1: Of female respondents reported quitting their job because that option 317 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:39,920 Speaker 1: wasn't offered. Another report found that women who work from 318 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:42,199 Speaker 1: home are twice as likely to feel comfortable going to 319 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 1: h R compared to in office women, and sixty seven 320 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: percent of women who work from home field that HR 321 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 1: understands their needs compared toft of in office women, which 322 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: makes me wonder. So that kind of surprised me too. 323 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: That makes me wonder if the office culture really is 324 00:18:57,040 --> 00:19:02,639 Speaker 1: just such a masculinized space that you feel less comfortable. Well, 325 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 1: and I know, I know for me, sometimes it's just 326 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:07,240 Speaker 1: easier to being able to write things to people and 327 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: not have to sit there and explain. That can be 328 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,159 Speaker 1: more succinct, and that can be more professional without them 329 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:15,119 Speaker 1: assuming on being emotional or you know, just that I 330 00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: would think any of those things maybe a little better. 331 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:19,359 Speaker 1: And especially if you have evidence like these are the 332 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: things I'm talking about that's true, you know, so that 333 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,719 Speaker 1: could be a whole big thing. Uh. That same report 334 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:27,440 Speaker 1: found that in twenty nineteen, fifty seven percent of women 335 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 1: who worked remotely reported a promotion in that year, compared 336 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: to thirty of in office women and fifty one of 337 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 1: male remote workers, which is interesting numbers. Yes, and on 338 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: the other side of the coin, if you look at 339 00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: remote work companies, that is, companies that specialize in remote work, 340 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 1: of presidents, founders, and CEOs are women of those companies. 341 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:55,400 Speaker 1: Another study found that eight of the dreaded millennials reported 342 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: work life balance was important to them, and eighty five 343 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 1: percent wanted to remote work one percent of the time. 344 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 1: Seventeen survey of four hundred millennial women found that percent 345 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,919 Speaker 1: of them wanted to start their own businesses and also 346 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: put family first. They wanted both of those things right. 347 00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:17,719 Speaker 1: Other studies have had that video conferencing can help equalize 348 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:21,480 Speaker 1: in terms of appearance, while science indicates taller, louder people 349 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:24,600 Speaker 1: typically men get more attention of meetings when we're all 350 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: reduced to a small square. Even if that which is yeah, 351 00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 1: often adobs, we get a little slat or just text 352 00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 1: you know, but lessons that advantage. Yeah. One report, looking 353 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: specifically at military spouses of whom are women, found that 354 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: remote work could be a real positive for them. The 355 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 1: unemployment rate for military spouses is about compared to the 356 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:52,160 Speaker 1: pre pandemic, not true anymore of four percent. Uh. This 357 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:55,159 Speaker 1: could be due to inability to speak of language as 358 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: they move from base to base, difficulty finding short term employment. 359 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,600 Speaker 1: Because of this, they are often targeted for MLMs. More 360 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: remote work options could change that could give them something 361 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:10,880 Speaker 1: else that they could do. So remote working flexible scheduling 362 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 1: options don't just help women, but also other marginalized groups. 363 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,920 Speaker 1: So there are some positives, but as expected, there are 364 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 1: some downsize and we'll get into those after a quick 365 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: break formal war from our sponsor and we're back, Thank 366 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: you sponsor. Uh So, yeah, it's not all good. We've 367 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:47,600 Speaker 1: been painting a very rosy picture here, but there are 368 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:50,679 Speaker 1: some definite downside. A recent I m F study found 369 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,640 Speaker 1: that in the face of the pandemic, one million workers 370 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 1: and thirty five advanced and emerging companies are at risk 371 00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:59,640 Speaker 1: of losing their jobs due to their inability to work 372 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,640 Speaker 1: remotely in a majority of those impacted are the young, 373 00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: the poor, and women, potentially compounding wealth and gender wealth gaps. 374 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 1: For women specifically, this is due to the fact that 375 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,840 Speaker 1: they do make up a large chunk of hospitality jobs 376 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:18,119 Speaker 1: and also carry the primary responsibility for child care, while 377 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: these services are currently largely unavailable. Right. I actually just 378 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:28,359 Speaker 1: read something about people who work lunch spaces and things 379 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:30,639 Speaker 1: like that at work offices and how they've lost their 380 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: business because of that. So it is is a question 381 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:36,040 Speaker 1: of yes, we understand, but these other businesses grew because 382 00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 1: of needs in office types of workplaces. So but for 383 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,400 Speaker 1: those that can work remotely, one of the potential issues 384 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,720 Speaker 1: has to do with increased domestic work. We've talked about 385 00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: this before. Several studies have found that while men who 386 00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: work from home focus on their work, women are expected 387 00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:57,280 Speaker 1: to pick up more domestic responsibility, particularly now with homeschooling. 388 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: Um that can and that can be distracting and frustrate, 389 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 1: leading to family conflict, job creeps into family time, and 390 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:07,680 Speaker 1: extreme multitasking. And to that end, some studies have found 391 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,719 Speaker 1: that companies that allow for flexible war schedules do retain 392 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 1: women with children at lower menagement positions, but that doesn't 393 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:17,640 Speaker 1: translate to women advancing to more senior jobs. And one 394 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:19,679 Speaker 1: way to combat this is having an office that has 395 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 1: a door you can close to have a separate sphere, 396 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:27,560 Speaker 1: even if it's an office that's in the closet, right yeah. Um. 397 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:29,760 Speaker 1: And if you're in a relationship with a significant other, 398 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,120 Speaker 1: having them share the load also helps. And other experts 399 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,360 Speaker 1: suggest that home life interruptions during video meetings may make 400 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:43,199 Speaker 1: women doubt their capabilities. Yeah, sort of the remote working 401 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:48,120 Speaker 1: version of impostor syndrome. Right. Um. Another issue that might 402 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 1: come up is a lack of access to informal networks, 403 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 1: particularly largely male decision makers. If you're in a zoom meeting, 404 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 1: it's more difficult to get informal feedback and advice that 405 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:02,520 Speaker 1: often transforms employees into leaders. And while remote work canon 406 00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 1: theory democratize promotions, it depends on people putting themselves forward, 407 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,240 Speaker 1: their resumes, for speaking up for themselves when it comes 408 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 1: to promotions, negotiation, negotiating salaries, all of those things that 409 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: we know do have gender differences with women putting themselves 410 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:22,439 Speaker 1: forward less. On top of that, who's getting invited to 411 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 1: those informal work happy hours and what decisions are being 412 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: made on sidebar conversations. How many women stay on you 413 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,439 Speaker 1: to hide household disruptions. This is not a thing that 414 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,760 Speaker 1: I had considered, but yes, I guess that is true. 415 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: If you've got something going on, you wouldn't a mute right. Yeah. Uh. 416 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,560 Speaker 1: Something else to be watching is what happens when some 417 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: of us do start re entering the office and for 418 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:51,320 Speaker 1: some uh, that won't be an option due to relocation 419 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: for whatever reason. Um. Will it be more men running 420 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: into each other and traveling for work and therefore getting 421 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: more promotions? Will women miss out on those quick and 422 00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,760 Speaker 1: form decision making conversations, which, by the way, we call 423 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,959 Speaker 1: it our office fly bys. Um? I didn't know this 424 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:08,640 Speaker 1: because I do not like fly buys, because it's like 425 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,720 Speaker 1: you freeze because you you understand that this decision needs 426 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:14,480 Speaker 1: to be very made, very quickly. And I'm someone who 427 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:18,399 Speaker 1: likes to consider all of the options, so I usually 428 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: panic and immediately regret what I say, and then I 429 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:26,239 Speaker 1: debate on do I email and like, actually, yeah, so 430 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 1: I don't like those. I'm not a fan of those, 431 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: but they do happen. Um. Essentially, would we all end 432 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,600 Speaker 1: up going to the office anyway because we're afraid of 433 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: being left out or out of sight, out of mind. Uh? 434 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:39,360 Speaker 1: In one article I read, they said, well, the office 435 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: become the new status symbol, like going into the office. 436 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: That's interesting because, as you and I've talked about, I 437 00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: have not been in the office that often and I 438 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:55,520 Speaker 1: just kind of officially started right as the pandemic quarantine happened, 439 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:57,880 Speaker 1: and so I got went in the office a few 440 00:25:57,920 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 1: times and and didn't see them many people. I don't 441 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,120 Speaker 1: even have a desk there, not because they didn't offer. 442 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,280 Speaker 1: I'm just like, why would I need it? You know, 443 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:06,360 Speaker 1: I don't know what I would need it more than 444 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: because I can do this from this table over here, 445 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,200 Speaker 1: because it does an open space with large tables and such. 446 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:13,760 Speaker 1: But yeah, I thought about this. I'm like, people don't 447 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 1: know why exist in that office because they don't realize 448 00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,520 Speaker 1: they I was hired so close to the quarantine happening, 449 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,760 Speaker 1: and it sound like, oh, yeah she does work there, 450 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 1: doesn't she Like, yeah, hey, I'm over here, So this 451 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:27,760 Speaker 1: is interesting. I do think about that too. I'm like, oh, well, 452 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:30,480 Speaker 1: I guess people don't know who I am. That's cool 453 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,240 Speaker 1: and interesting. Well, even I worry about it because I, 454 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: as you know, and I'm almost afraid to admit this, 455 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:41,520 Speaker 1: but I hate meetings and I don't frequently go to 456 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,640 Speaker 1: them even if I'm invited to them, And sometimes I'm 457 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: worried that, well, it's probably really not a good career. Again, 458 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 1: so you don't like face times either. Uh So. New 459 00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 1: data also indicates that remote work days right after the 460 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:06,240 Speaker 1: pandemic were longer and filled with more emails and so 461 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:10,160 Speaker 1: many more meetings. Um, but it has evened out a bit, 462 00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:17,440 Speaker 1: I will say that. Yeah. Yeah, So if we look 463 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,439 Speaker 1: at recommendations, how do we how do we go forward? 464 00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: Experts recommend collecting and analyzing data, examining work cultures to 465 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 1: determine if work from home is suitable and keeping in 466 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,480 Speaker 1: mind issues of gender and access, and have women in 467 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,800 Speaker 1: other marginalized groups involved in these discussions and decisions. Education 468 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 1: for managers and clear communication of rules and avoiding rewarding 469 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:45,919 Speaker 1: people who come in over those who don't, which scientifically 470 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 1: there is a lot of research that shows that's difficult. Um. 471 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: But if you know that, keep that in mind and 472 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 1: keeping an eye on output, like if remote workers getting 473 00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 1: all of their work done timely manner, that's got to 474 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,680 Speaker 1: keep an eye on that output. Yeah mhm um. And 475 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 1: of course communication always communication, and it is a little 476 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,160 Speaker 1: more difficult now that we are in pandemic and get 477 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,240 Speaker 1: just come up and talk to someone about a quick 478 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,920 Speaker 1: idea or have a flyby, apparently I've learned as a thing. 479 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,199 Speaker 1: But yeah, to have to actually type it out and 480 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 1: send it on and hoping that you can have a 481 00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:27,199 Speaker 1: clear communication, which I've You and I talked about this 482 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: other day as we were talking about interviewing people. We 483 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,639 Speaker 1: weren't short exactly if everything has been communicated, but we 484 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: didn't want to step on toes even though it's a 485 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: damn email. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's I can see 486 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,160 Speaker 1: the positives of it in the negatives of it, because 487 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 1: on one hand, it's harder to have a fly by, 488 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: which means that hopefully more people are involved or less 489 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 1: people are left out. Maybe it's a better way of 490 00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: saying it as opposed to an informal conversation decision that 491 00:28:56,160 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 1: just happened, like you know, as you walked by somebody. Um. 492 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,560 Speaker 1: But uh, and also there'd be a record of it. 493 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:09,280 Speaker 1: But I can see the the downside as well, the difficulties. 494 00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: And you know, we don't really use slack at our office, 495 00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: or at least our team doesn't. Other teams in our 496 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:19,160 Speaker 1: office does, But I've heard about like slack secret slack discussions, 497 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: and that's happening like on there So this is where 498 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:24,880 Speaker 1: I feel left out because I have no idea what's happening, 499 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,880 Speaker 1: because I have not invited too many because people don't 500 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 1: know I exist as much because I haven't been on 501 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 1: people's radar. So I'm like, what what's happening? Who would? 502 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: So I have to use other people to tell me 503 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: what's happening. But that was just decided to note about communication. 504 00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: It is important. It can be difficult sometimes because you 505 00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 1: have to put a little more effort so on a 506 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:48,479 Speaker 1: governmental and corporate level, not surprising, providing social programs and 507 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:52,600 Speaker 1: safetiness with the input of those most impacted, which I 508 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: know it's kind of been a lesson of who are 509 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,480 Speaker 1: you listening to? Whose voices should be race And it's 510 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:01,680 Speaker 1: important that we do that within jobs insector of remote work, 511 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: yes yes, um And to be clear, remote work doesn't 512 00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:08,240 Speaker 1: make sexy spices go away. I know I probably don't 513 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 1: have to say that, but I'm gonna say it anyway. 514 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 1: Until we change things, women will still be judged in 515 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:17,040 Speaker 1: video calls by their looks. I've seen these Zoom articles 516 00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 1: of how to how women can look so good in 517 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: their Zoom meetings, um are by the way they phrase 518 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: things in text. How many exclamation points did we use 519 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 1: or didn't use? Yeah emojis so much judgment. But in 520 00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 1: a lot of ways, remote work and flexible hours are 521 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:38,120 Speaker 1: beneficial to women and not just women. Of course, we've 522 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 1: talked about the economic and professional penalties to women during 523 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,640 Speaker 1: this pandemic too. So while this pandemic might be pushing 524 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 1: corporate culture towards more flexible work hours and remote work options, 525 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 1: which does and will continue to benefit a lot of women, 526 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:57,040 Speaker 1: we can't forget all other areas we've been women have 527 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:00,560 Speaker 1: been hurt in during this pandemic and in any cases 528 00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: for the long term, and how we can tackle those 529 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:11,240 Speaker 1: things too. Um and also always worth reiterating access who 530 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 1: has access to remote working? So um, that's that's an overview. 531 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,160 Speaker 1: It is interesting doing this right now when so many 532 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:26,719 Speaker 1: of these things are unfolding. Uh, and we're seeing I know, 533 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 1: when our meetings, our boss is brought up several times, 534 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,520 Speaker 1: like my kids are here, and I'm having to rethink 535 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:35,560 Speaker 1: all of this stuff and it's just interesting to watch 536 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: it play out. And thanks to Julia for suggesting it right, um, 537 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:46,440 Speaker 1: definitely worth discussing, and kudos to her and how she's 538 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:51,400 Speaker 1: having to handle her situation. Yes, yes, yes, yes um. 539 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 1: If you listeners have any suggestion for us, we would 540 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: love to hear them. You can email us at Stuff, Medium, Bomb, 541 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 1: Stuff at I Aren't media dot com. You can find 542 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,000 Speaker 1: us on Instagram at Stuff I've Never Told You or 543 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 1: on Twitter app mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to 544 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: our super producer Andrew Howard. Thanks Andrew, and thanks to 545 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: you for listening. Stuff I've Never Told You is the 546 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 1: protection of iHeart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart 547 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,120 Speaker 1: Radio is the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever 548 00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:17,320 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.