1
00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:04,040
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, alongside

2
00:00:04,040 --> 00:00:06,920
Speaker 1: my co host Matt Miller. Every business day we bring

3
00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:11,520
Speaker 1: you interviews from CEOs, market pros, and Bloomberg experts, along

4
00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:15,600
Speaker 1: with essential market moving news. Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast

5
00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:18,439
Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, and

6
00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:22,759
Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. Looking at w T

7
00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:25,680
Speaker 1: I crude oil up just slightly here, hundred ten dollars

8
00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:28,040
Speaker 1: a barrel, certainly off the highs of north of one twenty,

9
00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:31,480
Speaker 1: but boy, it's still a hundred ten dollars a barrel.

10
00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:33,839
Speaker 1: That's pretty significant. And you know, people tell me the

11
00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:35,920
Speaker 1: reason that gas is still so high is there's just

12
00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:39,400
Speaker 1: no refining capacity out there, which I just don't get.

13
00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:40,800
Speaker 1: I mean, I think if I go down to the

14
00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:43,360
Speaker 1: Gulf Coast, I can find some refineries, but they're telling

15
00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:45,240
Speaker 1: me that's not the case. But let's talk energy. Here.

16
00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:48,280
Speaker 1: Is that trade over Liz Young, head of Investment strategy.

17
00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:50,720
Speaker 1: It's so far joins this here, and Liz, you know,

18
00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,640
Speaker 1: we're still paying near five dollars a gallon at the pump.

19
00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,960
Speaker 1: W t A crude still north of a hundred dollars

20
00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:00,720
Speaker 1: a barrel. Is this energy trade for investors? Is that

21
00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:03,480
Speaker 1: played out? We're off the highs, but boy, it's still

22
00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,119
Speaker 1: stubbornly high here. How do you think about that? Yeah? Look,

23
00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:11,200
Speaker 1: I mean we're offo highs, but given the elevated prices

24
00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:13,880
Speaker 1: of oil, and I do think that oil stays elevated,

25
00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:18,280
Speaker 1: which helps energy company profit margins and helps their ability

26
00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:21,680
Speaker 1: to increase dividends and engage in stock buybacks that can

27
00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:25,280
Speaker 1: all be supportive of the stock price. What I'm warning

28
00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:27,520
Speaker 1: people about right now is that I think we've made

29
00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,279
Speaker 1: a lot of money in this energy trade, and energy

30
00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,520
Speaker 1: is the only sector that's still positive. You're to date

31
00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:37,560
Speaker 1: three months and six months behind us, and if you're

32
00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:39,880
Speaker 1: looking at that as the last sector sort of the

33
00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,600
Speaker 1: last man standing in positive territory, the chances of it

34
00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:47,039
Speaker 1: seeing downside are just higher. And you want to be

35
00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:51,240
Speaker 1: able to position yourself for some price appreciation in sectors

36
00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:54,240
Speaker 1: that have really been beaten up. So it's okay to

37
00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,440
Speaker 1: take profits in some of these energy names and redeploy

38
00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,880
Speaker 1: that capital into sectors like finance, unchilds or even some

39
00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,040
Speaker 1: of the really beaten up consumer discretionary names or small

40
00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:06,840
Speaker 1: cap names that have seen a lot of pain to

41
00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:09,679
Speaker 1: valuations over the last few months. By the way, Liz,

42
00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:13,880
Speaker 1: how do you UM talk to investors, especially younger investors,

43
00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:18,960
Speaker 1: about making these moves? UM? Is it about individual names?

44
00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:22,480
Speaker 1: Is it about indexes? Do you like ETFs? I mean,

45
00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:25,800
Speaker 1: is there one strategy that you think works best for

46
00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:29,920
Speaker 1: this new generation of investors. I do think that we

47
00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,799
Speaker 1: have to be more specific this year than just broad indexes.

48
00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,320
Speaker 1: I think that there's been a lot of pain that's

49
00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:38,680
Speaker 1: felt on a broad index level, and you want to

50
00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:42,760
Speaker 1: be specific about sectors or industry groups that you see

51
00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,720
Speaker 1: as themes that could work going forward, let's say the

52
00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,679
Speaker 1: next two to five years. But individual names are good

53
00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,680
Speaker 1: in that too, And unfortunately I can't speak about individual

54
00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:54,880
Speaker 1: names in particular, but it's okay to choose individual names

55
00:02:54,919 --> 00:02:59,200
Speaker 1: that you think are well established or top of their game,

56
00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:03,120
Speaker 1: best in class in their sector, industry group, because I

57
00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,079
Speaker 1: think that fundamentals in an environment like this are going

58
00:03:06,160 --> 00:03:09,760
Speaker 1: to reign supreme, and you want to have sectors, industry

59
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:13,760
Speaker 1: groups and companies that can survive not only pricing pressure,

60
00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:17,440
Speaker 1: but can finance their own growth and can survive through

61
00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,600
Speaker 1: a cycle that's going to be really painful and really

62
00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:23,560
Speaker 1: challenging for a lot of companies as their profit margins

63
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:26,520
Speaker 1: get hit. I'm just thinking of, uh, you know, when

64
00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:31,040
Speaker 1: I think of Sophie, I think of uh, younger maybe

65
00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,240
Speaker 1: family starting up that has a few thousand dollars a

66
00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:35,720
Speaker 1: month to put away. I don't know what you would

67
00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,280
Speaker 1: call a yuppie today, but you know, people my age

68
00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,839
Speaker 1: remember what yuppies are. Yeah, something I don't know, but

69
00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,400
Speaker 1: you know, does it make sense to try and pick

70
00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:48,360
Speaker 1: individual names? You're gonna hold these those people probably into

71
00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:52,080
Speaker 1: retirement or um. We keep seeing these themed e t

72
00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:53,960
Speaker 1: F pop up, and I don't know if they're just

73
00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,400
Speaker 1: a fad or if they're a good way to get into, uh,

74
00:03:57,600 --> 00:04:01,640
Speaker 1: you know, a certain idea or a certain segment. Yeah.

75
00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:03,320
Speaker 1: I mean some of the themed es t F s

76
00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:04,960
Speaker 1: or or other types of e t F that I

77
00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:08,839
Speaker 1: would consider more like active beta exposure are a good

78
00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:12,640
Speaker 1: way to have a specific exposure to a certain theme

79
00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,760
Speaker 1: or a certain idea that you have without taking on

80
00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:19,480
Speaker 1: you know, the entire industry, are taking on the entire sector.

81
00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:21,640
Speaker 1: And I think that those are good ideas, keeping in

82
00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:24,040
Speaker 1: mind that they're probably going to carry a little higher

83
00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:27,080
Speaker 1: fee than just a broad based index E t F,

84
00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:29,600
Speaker 1: but there's still a lower fee than a lot of

85
00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:32,280
Speaker 1: mutual funds out there, So you're looking at kind of

86
00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:34,560
Speaker 1: that middle ground where you can be more specific about

87
00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,320
Speaker 1: the investment. Now to your question about younger investors or

88
00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,960
Speaker 1: maybe people that have smaller balances in accounts and don't

89
00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,600
Speaker 1: want to spend all of that balance on one or

90
00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:46,200
Speaker 1: two names, E t F s are a much easier

91
00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:51,160
Speaker 1: way to get a diversified basket of securities. Also, platforms

92
00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:53,920
Speaker 1: like so FI, we do offer fractional shares, so you

93
00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,600
Speaker 1: can look for opportunities like that where you don't have

94
00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,160
Speaker 1: to buy an entire share of something, especially in those

95
00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,039
Speaker 1: names that cost thousands of dollars per share, so you

96
00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:05,880
Speaker 1: can buy fractional units and still diversify your portfolio by

97
00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:10,719
Speaker 1: using individual names. So, liz on on the so FI platform,

98
00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,359
Speaker 1: what are you guys seeing in terms of fund flows?

99
00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,520
Speaker 1: Where are the funds going these days? Because there's so

100
00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:19,080
Speaker 1: many different narratives out there the fund, the FED will

101
00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:22,440
Speaker 1: be successful, the FED won't be successful, push us into recession.

102
00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:27,000
Speaker 1: Lots of different theories out there. Yeah, I mean, not surprisingly,

103
00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:30,640
Speaker 1: we've seen outflows in risk assets and when I talk

104
00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,680
Speaker 1: about risk assets and thinking some technology, even crypto. You've

105
00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:38,520
Speaker 1: seen investors just really dial back their risk appetite this year,

106
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,560
Speaker 1: but I think a lot of people have still held strong,

107
00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:45,960
Speaker 1: and our user base does skew. Younger people believe in technology,

108
00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,919
Speaker 1: and they believe in communications as still the way of

109
00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:51,960
Speaker 1: the future, and there's a decent amount of activity in

110
00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:54,680
Speaker 1: all of those factors. So I think as long term

111
00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:57,400
Speaker 1: investors we have to remember that. The other thing is

112
00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:01,000
Speaker 1: when you look at defensive sectors or been in paying sectors,

113
00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:03,400
Speaker 1: those are not usually sectors that are really popular with

114
00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,240
Speaker 1: a younger crowd. But that's something that I would remind

115
00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:09,880
Speaker 1: younger investors are still important to balance out the portfolio

116
00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:12,599
Speaker 1: with and to make sure that you're not overly exposed

117
00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:14,320
Speaker 1: to some of these areas that are going to have

118
00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,200
Speaker 1: a lot more pain because of rate hikes. Yeah. Well,

119
00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,560
Speaker 1: it seems like the destruction that we've seen already in

120
00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:23,400
Speaker 1: terms of wealth has eclipsed what we saw during the

121
00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:27,839
Speaker 1: Great Financial Crisis, even though I don't feel the same anxiety,

122
00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:31,320
Speaker 1: not even close to what we felt then. And and

123
00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:34,360
Speaker 1: the reason is um as far as I can tell

124
00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:38,040
Speaker 1: back then, what you lost in equities, those losses were

125
00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:43,200
Speaker 1: buffered by your bond holdings, and today they're both going down. Um,

126
00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:45,839
Speaker 1: can you hide in those defensive names? Is there someplace

127
00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:47,640
Speaker 1: else you want to put your money? Are you seeing

128
00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:52,920
Speaker 1: clients just hold cash? Yeah? I mean, look, there's there's been,

129
00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:55,880
Speaker 1: unfortunately really nowhere to hide recently, and I think a

130
00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,000
Speaker 1: lot of the defensive sectors have been bid up to

131
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,080
Speaker 1: a point that they're pretty expensive right now. It is

132
00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:05,200
Speaker 1: not a mistake to hold some extra cash while you're

133
00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:09,360
Speaker 1: waiting out the volatility, or while you're just systematically putting

134
00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,480
Speaker 1: money into the market. Right you can put it in

135
00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,800
Speaker 1: in little drips, you can do dollar cost averaging. It's

136
00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,440
Speaker 1: okay to have a higher than usual percentage of cash

137
00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:20,000
Speaker 1: right now while we get through some of this really

138
00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:24,559
Speaker 1: tough part. I'd also say bonds have definitely corrected quite

139
00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,000
Speaker 1: a bit over the course of this year. But if

140
00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:31,000
Speaker 1: recession fears continue to rise, and if growth continues to slow,

141
00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:33,480
Speaker 1: I think there's a good possibility that we see a

142
00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:36,400
Speaker 1: rally in something like the tenure treasury and we see

143
00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,760
Speaker 1: some of those yields come back in a little bit.

144
00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:40,800
Speaker 1: So I think in the second half of the year

145
00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:45,160
Speaker 1: there's a possibility that bond do actually protect in times

146
00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:48,200
Speaker 1: of stock market pullback. Hey, Liz, thanks so much for

147
00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:52,240
Speaker 1: joining us. We always appreciate getting your perspectives there. Lizzie Young,

148
00:07:52,280 --> 00:08:00,120
Speaker 1: head of investment strategy at so Far. Joshua see Oh

149
00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:04,880
Speaker 1: of spark Charge uh joins us here, josh I drove

150
00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:07,080
Speaker 1: my first electric vehicle a couple of weeks ago for

151
00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:11,320
Speaker 1: Deflon fifty Lightning and it was awesome. Now, fortunately I

152
00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:14,680
Speaker 1: have a charging station near my house which fires it

153
00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:17,400
Speaker 1: up really quickly. But at the country club, at the

154
00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:19,880
Speaker 1: country club, it worked out great. I didn't know it

155
00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:23,000
Speaker 1: was a thing until I actually had this truck. Talk

156
00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:27,400
Speaker 1: to us about the state of the charging system in

157
00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:30,000
Speaker 1: the United States today and how you think it's gonna

158
00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:32,839
Speaker 1: evolve is there's more and more auto manufacturers are are

159
00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:37,360
Speaker 1: really getting into the evy business. Absolutely, and once again

160
00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:39,720
Speaker 1: thank you for having me having me on. Super excited

161
00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:42,440
Speaker 1: to talk about the ev industry. When we think about

162
00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,320
Speaker 1: the electricical industry today, right, you know, we're starting to

163
00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:48,120
Speaker 1: see more and more electric vehicles hitting the road. We're

164
00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:50,480
Speaker 1: starting to see, you know, a ton of new makes

165
00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:54,520
Speaker 1: and models from different automakers constantly getting announced, right, And

166
00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:58,240
Speaker 1: I think that's an amazing, you know, progressive statement for

167
00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:00,920
Speaker 1: where the EV industry is going and where it's been.

168
00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:05,080
Speaker 1: But there's still a lot of issues around e V charging. Right,

169
00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:08,840
Speaker 1: So typically when we think about EV charging, we often assume,

170
00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,280
Speaker 1: you know, hey, a pole in the ground goes in here,

171
00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,800
Speaker 1: someone shows up and they you know, they plug in

172
00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:17,600
Speaker 1: their car. But that's really not the case in a

173
00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:20,400
Speaker 1: lot of cities, right There's a lot of gaps in charging.

174
00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,520
Speaker 1: There's a lot of infrastructure problems that come with charging.

175
00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 1: UM and at spart Charge, you know, we announced currently

176
00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,319
Speaker 1: are mobile on demand charging apps where an EV owner

177
00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:32,640
Speaker 1: could get rains delivered with the push of a button,

178
00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:35,280
Speaker 1: and we started to see the closing of a lot

179
00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:37,600
Speaker 1: of those gaps where EV owners no longer have to

180
00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:40,960
Speaker 1: worry about finding sitting and waiting at an evy charging.

181
00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:44,920
Speaker 1: That is unbelieved. I've never even heard about this now.

182
00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:47,760
Speaker 1: I know you were on the Shark tank UM recently

183
00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:50,680
Speaker 1: and got a million dollar investment from Mark Cuban and

184
00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:54,880
Speaker 1: Lorie Griner. But so the idea is, if I'm parked

185
00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:59,160
Speaker 1: right here outside one Lexington Avenue in New York City

186
00:09:59,240 --> 00:10:02,440
Speaker 1: and I'm what a member of your service, I can

187
00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:04,800
Speaker 1: have you just come over here and charge my car

188
00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:08,600
Speaker 1: while I'm at work. Absolutely, it says easy. You know,

189
00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:11,400
Speaker 1: we we like to joke around, but our goal was

190
00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:14,800
Speaker 1: to make easy charging as simple as ordering a pizza. Right. So,

191
00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,040
Speaker 1: the same way that you can get groceries and food

192
00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:20,719
Speaker 1: delivered to you just where you're located, you can now

193
00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:23,720
Speaker 1: have charging delivered to your car. So you can be

194
00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:25,800
Speaker 1: at work, you can be at home, you can be

195
00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:28,040
Speaker 1: out on the go, you can be eating at a restaurant.

196
00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:30,640
Speaker 1: And if you want to have your car charged right

197
00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:32,760
Speaker 1: there on the spot, Um, it can be brought to

198
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:35,080
Speaker 1: you and charged your car, and your car can be charged.

199
00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,960
Speaker 1: That is awesome. So what's the what's the pricing? Look

200
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,640
Speaker 1: like I'll just for comparisons, say that we have my

201
00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,480
Speaker 1: garage across the street here on fifty eight Street. They

202
00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:46,560
Speaker 1: charge me twenty dollars if I want to plug in

203
00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:49,679
Speaker 1: the car. Really, yeah, that's a scam. Wow, that's that's

204
00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,839
Speaker 1: a lot. But um yeah, I mean our pricing in

205
00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:55,880
Speaker 1: some cases is a lot cheaper than going to a

206
00:10:55,920 --> 00:11:00,320
Speaker 1: six infrastructure charging station. So you know, our pricing thinks

207
00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:02,680
Speaker 1: with like our you know Explorer plan is only about

208
00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:06,000
Speaker 1: fifty sets kill a lott hour. UM, so during peak

209
00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:10,440
Speaker 1: times you're actually saving money using our service. You know.

210
00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:12,840
Speaker 1: I see one of your investors is Kyrie Irving in

211
00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,560
Speaker 1: sports Fans net Fans, and though that he opted into

212
00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,600
Speaker 1: his contract yesterday, so he'll be set for another thirty

213
00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:20,440
Speaker 1: six point five million dollars. So if you need some

214
00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,360
Speaker 1: extra working capital, I suggest you maybe you call Mr

215
00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,360
Speaker 1: Irving here talk to us about the kind of the

216
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,960
Speaker 1: growth now you're expecting here, Josh, because again, if if

217
00:11:29,160 --> 00:11:33,400
Speaker 1: Luddites like me start getting into the EV market, this

218
00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:35,640
Speaker 1: thing is just going to explode, and I would think

219
00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:39,920
Speaker 1: your business would be in a pretty good position there. Absolutely,

220
00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,080
Speaker 1: So when you think about the growth, I mean it's

221
00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:46,520
Speaker 1: really been unprecedented. EV owners want the convenience of having

222
00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,080
Speaker 1: the charge delivered to them, not having to go, you know,

223
00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:51,800
Speaker 1: find sit and wait for it. UM. When we first

224
00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:54,280
Speaker 1: started out, I think, you know, our goals are investors,

225
00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:57,240
Speaker 1: was hey, can we deliver you know, ten thousand miles

226
00:11:57,280 --> 00:11:59,520
Speaker 1: here up in the first couple of months, and we

227
00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:02,160
Speaker 1: have met imediately blew right past that goal. Right. We

228
00:12:02,280 --> 00:12:05,160
Speaker 1: delivered over a hundred miles e V owners within the

229
00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:08,080
Speaker 1: first couple of months, and this year alone, we're on

230
00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:11,040
Speaker 1: track to deliver over a million miles the e V owners.

231
00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,720
Speaker 1: And when you think about you know that that stat

232
00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:18,640
Speaker 1: in itself is something truly amazing, right, miles of range delivered, right,

233
00:12:18,679 --> 00:12:20,880
Speaker 1: And that's something that we take a lot of pride

234
00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:23,240
Speaker 1: and it's our guiding light. And when you think about

235
00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:25,480
Speaker 1: the scale of you know, where we started. When we

236
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:30,200
Speaker 1: first started, we were just you know, l A, San Francisco, Dallas, Texas.

237
00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:35,559
Speaker 1: We've now expanded in San Jose, Oakland, Berkeley, Fremont, Um,

238
00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:39,560
Speaker 1: We've now expanded into Long Beach, Anaheim, Orange County, and

239
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,320
Speaker 1: we're gonna be opening up here San Diego and Boston

240
00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:44,720
Speaker 1: the next couple of months. But when we think about

241
00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:48,560
Speaker 1: the scale of the service, we're planning the scale into

242
00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:51,160
Speaker 1: over twenty cities here over the next couple of months,

243
00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:53,520
Speaker 1: which is truly amazing. Josh, I want to just ask

244
00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:56,559
Speaker 1: about the possibility of an exit UM Mark Cuban's not

245
00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:58,640
Speaker 1: going to throw in a million dollars until he knows,

246
00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:02,480
Speaker 1: you know, what the idea about how you make money.

247
00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,600
Speaker 1: On the other end, what are you thinking about in

248
00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:08,240
Speaker 1: terms of UM the possibility of an I p O

249
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:10,880
Speaker 1: of a sale, are you just looking to generate a

250
00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,959
Speaker 1: ton of free cash flow. How does it look? Yes,

251
00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:15,760
Speaker 1: I mean when you think about it, it's the really

252
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:19,120
Speaker 1: cool part about this, right is the fact that you know,

253
00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:24,359
Speaker 1: we are actually growing faster than traditional pull based infrastructure.

254
00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:26,760
Speaker 1: So we can be up and running in a city

255
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:30,360
Speaker 1: is in under fourteen days, where traditional pull based infrastructure

256
00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:33,520
Speaker 1: takes anywhere from six months to two years, right, And

257
00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:36,479
Speaker 1: we can blanket an entire city and then be generating

258
00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,040
Speaker 1: revenue right and under fourteen days in the city. So

259
00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:42,240
Speaker 1: when we think about, you know, the chances of you know,

260
00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:46,080
Speaker 1: us going public idea, and I think we're outperforming at

261
00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:48,360
Speaker 1: an early stage a lot of these companies that have

262
00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,360
Speaker 1: gone public vias facts of done public traditional routes were

263
00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:56,160
Speaker 1: actually outperforming them from a revenue standpoint because we're able

264
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,960
Speaker 1: to be everywhere and grow faster. All right, you look

265
00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:01,880
Speaker 1: at the market took a lot of these infrastructure company,

266
00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,679
Speaker 1: you know, five years. All right, Josh, we're gonna have

267
00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:06,160
Speaker 1: to let leave it there, because we're gonna go. We

268
00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:07,959
Speaker 1: have a hard start. For our next interview, Josh Vi,

269
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:14,400
Speaker 1: CEO and founder of Spark Charge, we welcome our television

270
00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,760
Speaker 1: viewers and our radio listeners joining us now live from

271
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,520
Speaker 1: the NASDAG. It's Thomas Ingle Lad poll Stars CEO Wood,

272
00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:24,480
Speaker 1: joined also by my good friend and colleague Good Looks

273
00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:28,040
Speaker 1: Matt Miller. Thomas, you have taken the company public. You

274
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,800
Speaker 1: are now a public organization, a public company. You did

275
00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:33,600
Speaker 1: that buy a a spack at the back end of

276
00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:37,600
Speaker 1: last week Friday. It's an interesting time to be making

277
00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:41,920
Speaker 1: such a transaction. Generally, EVI spank combinations, Thomas have not

278
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:45,360
Speaker 1: gone well over the last couple of years. Why is

279
00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:51,480
Speaker 1: poll Star and It's deal going to be different? Well,

280
00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:57,400
Speaker 1: we finished successfully our listening together with our partner and

281
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:01,240
Speaker 1: go Scoopenheim, and I think us being a real company,

282
00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:05,760
Speaker 1: delivering already for two years to satisfied, happy customers, and

283
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:10,320
Speaker 1: having a real business going on with a product portfolio

284
00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:14,160
Speaker 1: ready developed ruling out now, I think that made the difference.

285
00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:17,120
Speaker 1: Talk to us about your portfolio. I've riven the poll

286
00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:22,520
Speaker 1: Star one, which was an extraordinarily exciting vehicle but also

287
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,680
Speaker 1: um very expensive and very limited. You've got the two,

288
00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:30,160
Speaker 1: and you've just introduced the three. What are you expecting

289
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:35,160
Speaker 1: in terms of a fleet? Yeah, well this is now

290
00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:39,240
Speaker 1: the new chapter opening with three cars that are rolling

291
00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:40,960
Speaker 1: out in the next three years. The first will be

292
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:45,520
Speaker 1: the suv Post of three as well produced in the US.

293
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,320
Speaker 1: We have a second suv coming in the year twenty three,

294
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:53,560
Speaker 1: and then the beautiful precept concept CARB becoming reality and

295
00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:56,760
Speaker 1: form of the Post of five g T four door

296
00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:00,080
Speaker 1: that we have actually just driven up the hill and

297
00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:04,600
Speaker 1: and Goodwood and showed the the real far advanced stage

298
00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:08,120
Speaker 1: of the prototype there in the public in Goodwood. And yes, guy,

299
00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:11,440
Speaker 1: have you been to Goodwood? He's talking about the Festival

300
00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,880
Speaker 1: of Speed which is just finished. Over the weekend. I saw,

301
00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:16,000
Speaker 1: like I lived fairly close to Goodwood, so I saw

302
00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:19,200
Speaker 1: plenty of cars going up the hill um away from

303
00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:22,680
Speaker 1: me towards Goodwood. No, it's it's an interesting little hill climb. Mat.

304
00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,280
Speaker 1: It's a lovely weekend. The weather this weekend was pretty nice.

305
00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:30,760
Speaker 1: It is hugely important in the car world. But what's

306
00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 1: even more important than that in the car wheel right now, Thomas,

307
00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,600
Speaker 1: is chips and supply chain. Um, you talked about the

308
00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:40,280
Speaker 1: fact that you're producing in the US as well as

309
00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,640
Speaker 1: I assume in Goldenburg in Sweden. Um, what does your

310
00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:46,320
Speaker 1: supply chain look like? What's the strength, what's the solidity

311
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,960
Speaker 1: of that so you're not talking about fishness ships but

312
00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:52,720
Speaker 1: the other chips. Yes, yeah, no, um yeah, of course

313
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,600
Speaker 1: pick topic. And it has been into twenty one already.

314
00:16:55,680 --> 00:17:01,480
Speaker 1: We had made that journey, was very very short visibility

315
00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:06,120
Speaker 1: on our production planning, but of course we're trained. By

316
00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:12,360
Speaker 1: now twenty one and twenty two we successfully have managed

317
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:16,600
Speaker 1: to get our cars out of the factories. And now,

318
00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:20,679
Speaker 1: of course always the question about COVID nineteen lockdowns. Of

319
00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:23,520
Speaker 1: course this will be still even in the year twenty three,

320
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:28,040
Speaker 1: one of the topics that will be around in terms

321
00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,359
Speaker 1: of where the business goes. You've got one, two, three,

322
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,399
Speaker 1: As you say, you're going to be expanding the fleet

323
00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:37,320
Speaker 1: even further than that. Who who is your target here?

324
00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:39,840
Speaker 1: It was interesting we were we were hearing from Elon

325
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,040
Speaker 1: Musk a few days ago in Dohar, and he talked

326
00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:45,560
Speaker 1: about the supply chain being the opposition rather than other

327
00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:48,639
Speaker 1: car companies. Do you see it the same way? And

328
00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:50,840
Speaker 1: if you don't, who are you going to take market

329
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:54,359
Speaker 1: share away from? Who's the target here? I think that

330
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,640
Speaker 1: might be a slight different game. Ellen and the millions

331
00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,159
Speaker 1: of cars that he has on his again, we are

332
00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:04,159
Speaker 1: obviously positioned in a very different segment. We are aiming

333
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:10,280
Speaker 1: for the luxury premium segment and clearly wanna target that

334
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:15,280
Speaker 1: market high profit margins and the volume for that reason

335
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:21,560
Speaker 1: um being rather clearly defined by this target group. So

336
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,639
Speaker 1: two D ninety southern cast we are aiming for in

337
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:28,480
Speaker 1: the year two thousand twenty five. And of course that

338
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:33,679
Speaker 1: that is a dimension where we have already secured the

339
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,720
Speaker 1: production in the factories and where they're purchasing for all

340
00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:41,840
Speaker 1: our parts has happened already. Do you, um, do you

341
00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:45,399
Speaker 1: have any influence on the charging infrastructure, because that's one

342
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:47,960
Speaker 1: of the biggest problems for me when it comes to

343
00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,600
Speaker 1: electric cars. There just aren't enough chargers around the corner

344
00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:54,640
Speaker 1: from my house. There are like six gas stations, none

345
00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:56,480
Speaker 1: of them are for electric charging, and I have no

346
00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,680
Speaker 1: idea where I would go if I needed some. Well,

347
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,359
Speaker 1: let's um indeed a very very important factor in it.

348
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,760
Speaker 1: We have a very strong momentum in electrification double this

349
00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:12,520
Speaker 1: year from last year, and indeed the charging infrastructure has

350
00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:14,919
Speaker 1: to develop along the line, because otherwise it would be

351
00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:18,879
Speaker 1: a big threat to that movement. Now, one thing is

352
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,399
Speaker 1: the charges that you find right next to you. The

353
00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,679
Speaker 1: other question is where your charge when you're on your

354
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:29,760
Speaker 1: trip Electrify America. Our important partner here is obviously developing

355
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:34,600
Speaker 1: and investing lots of money into developing this infrastructure. Same

356
00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:37,880
Speaker 1: goes goes for Europe. That is a big momentum, but

357
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:40,440
Speaker 1: indeed is it enough for the big movement that we

358
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,600
Speaker 1: have towards e V Still, Thomas just want to ask

359
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:45,840
Speaker 1: about dealerships. Am I going to only be able to

360
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,879
Speaker 1: get your cars through Volvo Dealership your former parent company?

361
00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:50,480
Speaker 1: Are you gonna be working with Jeelie to put up

362
00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:54,720
Speaker 1: your own dealerships? How's that gonna work? We worked together

363
00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:58,200
Speaker 1: with Volvo dealers to actually build up and set up

364
00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:01,600
Speaker 1: new post what Pig called spaces where you physically go

365
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,080
Speaker 1: for the test WEP and beat the brand. This we

366
00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:08,400
Speaker 1: have already done in the US and big times last year.

367
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:13,040
Speaker 1: It will continue this year. We have a very branded

368
00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:20,479
Speaker 1: experience for our customers far away from the Volvo dealership. Thomas,

369
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:22,840
Speaker 1: I'll see you the Festival of Speed next year. A

370
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,520
Speaker 1: quiet run up the hell at the Festival of Speed

371
00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,960
Speaker 1: as opposed to the noisy ones that we've had in history. Thomas,

372
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:31,840
Speaker 1: thank you very much. Indeed, to think of that postar

373
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:35,199
Speaker 1: CEO and of course, my good friend and colleague this

374
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:42,919
Speaker 1: see you there. There's been a lot of finger pointing

375
00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,840
Speaker 1: ever since this inflation started to take off, right. We've

376
00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:49,040
Speaker 1: heard President Biden numerous times putting all the blame on

377
00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:54,000
Speaker 1: Vladimir Putin. Of course, if you watch the conservative news channels,

378
00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:58,200
Speaker 1: they put all the blame squarely on President Biden and um.

379
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 1: In the market, people look at low rates as or

380
00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:04,840
Speaker 1: or the big fiscal spend as one of the reasons.

381
00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:08,640
Speaker 1: Vince Signarella put out a story yesterday the Fed's balance

382
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:13,600
Speaker 1: sheet caused inflation, not low interest rates, and Barry Ridholtz

383
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:16,720
Speaker 1: wrote a piece today the fifteen causes of inflation. So

384
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,080
Speaker 1: let's get them together. Let's get them together. Right now,

385
00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:22,000
Speaker 1: we have Barry Ridholts in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio

386
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: and Vince Signarella on the phone from somewhere. He's never

387
00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:29,000
Speaker 1: coming back, never ever. I guess I wouldn't either if

388
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,600
Speaker 1: I had his job. Vince, let me give you the

389
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,400
Speaker 1: honors you kick it off, because I thought your piece

390
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,520
Speaker 1: was fascinating Reddit last night before bed, since I go

391
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:41,439
Speaker 1: to bed at six pm. Um, but it's it's pretty

392
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:43,520
Speaker 1: scary to think about how the feed is going to

393
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 1: unload this right now, eight point six trillion dollar balance sheet. Yeah,

394
00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:51,240
Speaker 1: and that's the point of the story, to be honest,

395
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:54,080
Speaker 1: was basically the Set is changing the price of money

396
00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:58,320
Speaker 1: by raising interest rates. They're not really reducing stimulus. The

397
00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:00,960
Speaker 1: stimulus is the balance sheet. As you mentioned, eight point

398
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:04,560
Speaker 1: six trillions, that that money is still slashing around. It's

399
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:08,120
Speaker 1: been slashing around while fiscal policy put in how many

400
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:12,560
Speaker 1: trillions of dollars for the pandemic. So the Fed is

401
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 1: trying to curb demand by raising interest rates and all

402
00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:19,120
Speaker 1: they're doing is creating confidence. As as Green Jared mentioned earlier,

403
00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 1: the expectation part of that conference board index dropped to

404
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,880
Speaker 1: sixty six and a half with down ten almost ten

405
00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:28,560
Speaker 1: points below estimates. So what the Fed really should be

406
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 1: doing right now is reducing the balance sheet, leaving interest

407
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,840
Speaker 1: rates alone. Let the market set the interest rates, not

408
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 1: the Fed. It's not their job to tell the market

409
00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:39,480
Speaker 1: where in trist rates are. It's their job to deal

410
00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 1: with supply and demand of money supply and if they

411
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 1: did that, they would very slowly bring down demand for

412
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:50,119
Speaker 1: the consumer, and when the supply and balance retreated, we

413
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 1: would have the equilibrium again and inflation issue would not

414
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:56,239
Speaker 1: be a question. We would have maybe modest inflation, but

415
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:59,400
Speaker 1: we would be going along with positive growth. I think

416
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,320
Speaker 1: they're making a tragic or by what see you? So

417
00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:07,679
Speaker 1: everybody hates this answer, which is the world is complicated,

418
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 1: there is no one single cause of these big complex issues,

419
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 1: lots of nuance and shades of gray um. You know,

420
00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 1: on the one hand, the worst answer, Yeah, peo, people

421
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: hate that, but you know what, it's the reality. Look,

422
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,160
Speaker 1: we we've had a rising FED balance sheet and zero

423
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 1: interest rate policy and quantitative easing from two thousand nine

424
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:36,639
Speaker 1: to Inflation was very subdued during that period, COVID lockdown,

425
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 1: massive fiscal stimulus, not one, not to but three CARES

426
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 1: acts that added up to five trillion dollars. You know,

427
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,919
Speaker 1: when the first Cares Act was passed in it was

428
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,959
Speaker 1: ten of g d P. Was the biggest ever fiscal

429
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 1: stimulus in American history. And then at the same time

430
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,439
Speaker 1: you have, you know, a very fragile supply chain just

431
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,360
Speaker 1: in times livery was was really a problem. I don't

432
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 1: want to suggest that the Fed is not relevant here,

433
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 1: Clearly there a factor in this, but you know, when

434
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:15,520
Speaker 1: you look at the fiscal stimulus June one, unemployment insurance

435
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:19,120
Speaker 1: paid one point for trillion dollars. You put that much

436
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,200
Speaker 1: cash in the hands of Americans and we're going to

437
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,120
Speaker 1: go out and spend it. And if the goods aren't there,

438
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: we're gonna go pay up for things that we want,

439
00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: regardless of price. And that's a key, one of the

440
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,439
Speaker 1: many key drivers of inflation. I mean, you ever expect

441
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:39,200
Speaker 1: politicians to be logical at all or intelligent, but um

442
00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 1: members of the Federal Reserve should know, vince that there's

443
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 1: no such thing as a free lunch, right, absolutely no.

444
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,000
Speaker 1: I think Barry hit the nail right on the head.

445
00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: And that's what what my my feeling is. When the

446
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,880
Speaker 1: set is sitting there and watching all the stimulus coming

447
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: into the economy. Their job is to raise rates. Their

448
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 1: job is to balance the supply and demand of money,

449
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 1: and it had they started reducing the balance sheet as

450
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,399
Speaker 1: the FETE was pumping money into the system, it would

451
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 1: not have disturbed the economy. It might not have looked

452
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 1: good politically for them, but that's not their job to

453
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 1: worry about politics. They're not elected pisitions. You know, maybe

454
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: somebody should put some former traders on the feed and

455
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: not activeidition. But why why didn't they Why. I mean,

456
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:25,720
Speaker 1: in hindsight, it seems like an easy call, but everybody knew.

457
00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 1: Everybody on the street knew it wasn't transient inflation. We

458
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 1: all knew they were lying to us or or telling

459
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 1: some story to keep us calm. And so my point is,

460
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 1: I think this inflation is more transient than it was

461
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 1: a year and a half ago, because, as Barry said,

462
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:41,680
Speaker 1: to put a lot of money into the system, there

463
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 1: is a supply and balance. When the supply and balance

464
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:49,160
Speaker 1: comes back to me reversion and and money is not

465
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 1: in savings as as it was due to the pandemic,

466
00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 1: everything is going to come back down again. There's no

467
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: reason to raise rates till three and a half percent

468
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: to scare the heck out of everybody. I think he's right.

469
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,920
Speaker 1: And really, the big criticism I have of the FED

470
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,119
Speaker 1: is not so much that they were behind the curve

471
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 1: in inflation, but there was just no reason for them

472
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 1: to be on an emergency footing throughout all of twenty

473
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 1: They should have recognized that. And again, if they were

474
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 1: traders there, they might have seen this, but the market

475
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,639
Speaker 1: was telling them that the economy was fine, that people

476
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 1: would eventually get vascinated that the world was returning to normal. Instead,

477
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 1: they stayed at ZERP, they stayed with quantitative easing. Why

478
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,200
Speaker 1: why do you think? Because I think they were very terrified.

479
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 1: I think they were so terrified of of what was

480
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 1: going on with COVID that they acted with a tremendous

481
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 1: lag that the issue in wasn't um both pre pandemic

482
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,920
Speaker 1: and post pandemic. Wasn't that inflation was rearing its head.

483
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 1: It's that Why are we still on an emergency footing?

484
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:02,679
Speaker 1: Why are it FED rate at zero when it was

485
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 1: pretty clear the post financial crisis um recovery was was

486
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: pretty fully expressed that things were doing better. There was

487
00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: just no reason to stay at zero for the previous

488
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:19,199
Speaker 1: couple of years before the pandemic and then when the

489
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 1: market lit up from April forwards to to not recognize, oh,

490
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:26,119
Speaker 1: the economy is doing pretty well. Maybe we could go

491
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 1: to fifty or seventy five basis point Vince will that

492
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 1: we were talking to Greg Han earlier from Winthrop and

493
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: he said he doesn't think that Fed's going to be

494
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 1: able to reduce this balance sheet, and they certainly didn't

495
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: after the Great Financial Crisis. What do you expect well,

496
00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: I mean, they're gonna have to reduce the balance sheet,

497
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 1: because that's really the issue from inational money in the system.

498
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 1: If they don't reduce the balance sheet, these rates are

499
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,040
Speaker 1: going to go a heck of a lot higher than

500
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 1: they're prepared to deal with. But you know, like a

501
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 1: lot of traitors already pricing in, there's a reasonable chance

502
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: they have to pause and maybe even cut in early.

503
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: Because this isn't the first time they've made this mistake.

504
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 1: I think it was in two thousand and eighteen. I

505
00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:04,919
Speaker 1: can't remember the EUAR off top of my head. They

506
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,640
Speaker 1: raised rates very quickly by a hundred basis points twenty

507
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 1: five at a time, and then three months later they're

508
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:12,919
Speaker 1: cut him by a hundred bas points because they realized

509
00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:15,400
Speaker 1: they were too regressive. I mean, I think that the

510
00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,439
Speaker 1: path is very clear. The fet forecasting has been awful.

511
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,280
Speaker 1: Oh alright, Vince Signarella, global macro strategist from Bloomberg News

512
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 1: calling us from the work from home remote location, which

513
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: is where I think we're gonna be able to find him. No,

514
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:33,359
Speaker 1: Mettal what disclosed? Undisclosed? As we say, uh and Barry

515
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:36,000
Speaker 1: rid Hultsford Hults Wealth Management joining us here on our

516
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Interactive Brokers to you. Thanks for listening to the

517
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can subscribe and listen to interviews

518
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 1: with Apple Podcasts or whatever podcast platform you prefer. I'm

519
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 1: Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter at Matt Miller V three

520
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:55,280
Speaker 1: pt on False Sweeney I'm on Twitter at pt Sweeney

521
00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 1: Before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide at

522
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio