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Speaker 3: responsible gaming resources. Welcome to Jenkins and Jones on the

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Speaker 3: Volume podcast Network. It is Saturday, December thirtieth, and we

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Speaker 3: are very excited to be joined today by one of

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Speaker 3: our Volume teammates, Hoophead Extraordinary film grinder Jason.

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Speaker 4: Tim Jason, Welcome to the show.

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Speaker 5: What's up, boys, I'm excited to talk some basketball. I

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Speaker 5: had a lot of fun last time. I've been looking

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Speaker 5: forward to coming back. It's gonna be fun.

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Speaker 6: Oh yeah, you're.

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Speaker 3: You're the guardrails that keep us on track when we

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Speaker 3: get to into eating eggs and stuff like that. Jackson's like,

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Speaker 3: I better bring Tim fond to with these boys into shape.

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Speaker 6: Real quick talk.

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Speaker 7: Some hoops had had to prove the nay stayers on Twitter?

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Speaker 5: Did you guys pull it off? I have three eggs

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Speaker 5: every single day, but the idea of sitting a dozen

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Speaker 5: in the sitting is that's crazy.

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Speaker 7: It was light work.

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Speaker 1: They should be embarrassed how easily we smacked those twelve,

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Speaker 1: bro You know what I mean, Like I thought they

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Speaker 1: were gonna put a better, more of a fight.

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Speaker 4: It was super.

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Speaker 3: Easy, John said, John said, with how little of a

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Speaker 3: fight the chickens put up.

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Speaker 6: They deserve to be eating.

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Speaker 4: You know that's what that's what that's because that was crazy.

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Speaker 6: John's over the yellow getting a stance and.

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Speaker 1: Compete to slapping the ground something, nigga, pretend like you're

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Speaker 1: trying to.

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Speaker 5: Play deep you guys see did you guys see the

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Speaker 5: Peta the video where the egg was on the skill

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Speaker 5: The egg was making screaming noises.

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Speaker 2: That motherfucking pig squeal is the funniest ship I ever heard.

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Speaker 2: I dead ass believe that Pete is trolling us because

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Speaker 2: they are too too consistently unintentionally funny. They're intentionally funny, dog,

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Speaker 2: and there's no fucking way you can convince me they're not.

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Speaker 1: Also, you can't make a like a fried egg not

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Speaker 1: look delicious. I don't care if it's screaming or not.

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Speaker 7: You know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: I want it?

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Speaker 5: Oh, I like that. We're putting it on more stuff too.

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Speaker 5: It's on hamburgers now, man, Like Bro, I'm a big

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Speaker 5: like three over medium eggs late at night as a

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Speaker 5: snack kind of thing like that that I enjoyed too.

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Speaker 4: So I know you're still in shape.

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Speaker 6: Bro, late night eggs.

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Speaker 4: That's my wife's family. No late night snack.

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Speaker 5: Oh oh no, there's sugar involved. There's there's I'm a

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Speaker 5: Cereal late night snacker. It's a problem.

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Speaker 3: Uh God blessed, bro. Congrats you're in I mean, one

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Speaker 3: man to another, You're in tremendous shape for a late

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Speaker 3: night snacker.

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Speaker 4: Those those shoulders look amazing.

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Speaker 5: I'm just getting back out onto the court, I will say, though, Dude,

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Speaker 5: I'm slow as ship coming back from this Achilles thing. Man,

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Speaker 5: I'm slow, that is. I never realized how much it sucks.

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Speaker 7: To slow time with that.

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Speaker 4: How does that spin move feel?

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Speaker 1: I remember one time actually making a spin movement, thinking

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Speaker 1: I'm still spinning.

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Speaker 3: Like yeah, John said he was like he was turning

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Speaker 3: the page on the calendar of Midspin movie.

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Speaker 1: I was Mida, and I'm like, heyn, I'm still spinning life.

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Speaker 4: Right like no, should it be over by now? Like

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Speaker 4: I should be at.

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Speaker 1: The rim dog, I'm midspinn nigga, Like I half a

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Speaker 1: spin laught.

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Speaker 5: I was literally complaining about that with the Nerd Sash

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Speaker 5: guys yesterday. Like, I take a lot of movement jump

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Speaker 5: shots for like I'm either sprinting into a shot or

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Speaker 5: like hard side steps or turn around fade aways, and like,

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Speaker 5: so I have a pretty big frame, like I when

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Speaker 5: I'm having all my shoes on and shit, I'm probably

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Speaker 5: about two thirty and so like when I'm going into

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Speaker 5: those moves, like trying to stop all my weight all

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Speaker 5: of a sudden, it's a huge pain in the ass

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Speaker 5: and like it's gonna be Like I was literally thinking yesterday,

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Speaker 5: I'm like, it's gonna be a month or two before

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Speaker 5: I can move again.

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Speaker 3: Oh god, Yeah, you gotta go slow, brother. Trying to

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Speaker 3: go fast and stop is what gets us into trouble

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Speaker 3: at our.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, listen to.

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Speaker 7: Your body body grind some Kish tape. You know what

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Speaker 7: I'm saying, adjust your gang.

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Speaker 2: He become like the flat footed you know what I'm saying,

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Speaker 2: all offensive distributor, you know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 5: So are you guys thinking of the Jokic Like I

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Speaker 5: hate being an NBA player act? Did you see that

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Speaker 5: clip from the interview with Michael Porter Junior yesterday where

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Speaker 5: he was all like uh, he basically just said, like

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Speaker 5: I want my kids to not remember me as a

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Speaker 5: basketball player. I'm like, what in the Like I'm I'm

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Speaker 5: getting I love Jokic for the record, Like, there are

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Speaker 5: a lot of guys in the league that drive me crazy,

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Speaker 5: and be drives me crazy watching like Lucas sometimes when

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Speaker 5: he gets a little too helio centric, drives me crazy.

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Speaker 5: But like, man, like I love watching Jokics play, but

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Speaker 5: this off the court thing is getting out of control. Like, dude,

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Speaker 5: Like you're the best player in the world. We know

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Speaker 5: you love the game. Why are you lying to us

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Speaker 5: like this? Like I don't understand in a beautiful situation,

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Speaker 5: I think he's I think he's playing up the indifference

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Speaker 5: towards the NBA life. I just don't There's no way

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Speaker 5: he would be as obsessive and as great as he

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Speaker 5: is if he didn't love the game and appreciate it

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Speaker 5: for what it is. And like think about it too,

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Speaker 5: like like we didn't even make it to the NBA,

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Speaker 5: think about how much we revere the NBA as an entity,

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Speaker 5: and like he doesn't even seem like he likes it,

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Speaker 5: Like he just wants to go home.

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Speaker 1: I think you can love hoops and not really enjoyed

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Speaker 1: as much as a job, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 1: because there's a lot that goes in being the NBA

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Speaker 1: that you know, this not on the basketball court. So

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Speaker 1: like after the game, like doing an interview, like he's

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Speaker 1: probably like, I didn't.

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Speaker 4: I don't. I didn't.

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Speaker 1: I didn't fall in love with basketball to be doing

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Speaker 1: all of this shit that I have to do outside

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Speaker 1: of this, you know, especially being the best player in

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Speaker 1: the world, you got a lot of responsibilities, so I

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Speaker 1: can it seems genuine to me. I seek like he

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Speaker 1: genuinely is, like I just want to fucking hoop and

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Speaker 1: that's it. It's kind of like the KD shit to me,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. That's all Katie wants to

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Speaker 1: do is play basketball.

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Speaker 5: That's fair, I think, But why is he still saying

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Speaker 5: it every other week? Like we get it, we get it.

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Speaker 6: That's why.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think KD and Yolkis kind of

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Speaker 2: have a different approach of the game. I think KD

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Speaker 2: because you know, the whole thing we've always said about

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Speaker 2: KD is like we need his coaches to save him.

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Speaker 2: He'll play all forty eight minutes if you let him right,

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Speaker 2: and I think Jokic I can totally see Yokic pulling

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Speaker 2: like a Barry Sanders in and retiring like at the

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Speaker 2: tail end of his peak. Bro, you know what I'm saying, Like,

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Speaker 2: like like one more Max contract after this and clocking out.

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Speaker 2: I would not be surprised at all. Meanwhile, KTI is

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Speaker 2: probably gonna out there till HEA's like forty five or

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Speaker 2: some shit, you know, Oh.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, like k Yeah, That's my point is like I

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Speaker 5: pick up an entirely different like reverence for the game

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Speaker 5: from from KD And maybe maybe I'm overthinking it, And

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Speaker 5: like again, I'm gonna give Yokich the benefit of the doubt.

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Speaker 5: But like when I saw a quote yesterday, I'm like, dude,

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Speaker 5: are you really doing this again? Are you really laying

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Speaker 5: out for us eloquently how you don't like playing in

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Speaker 5: the NBA? Is that what you're gonna do? Again? Like?

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Speaker 1: Ugh, I think Kadi will play basketball regardless of the circumstances.

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Speaker 4: Joker won't, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: So they both love the game in a particular, but

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Speaker 1: Katie's just you know, he's locked in regardless of what's happened.

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Speaker 4: Jokers like you know, fuck it.

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Speaker 3: I kind of think all three of you are right

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Speaker 3: on different elements of Jokic. I think that foreign players

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Speaker 3: always have this this we always you them in as

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Speaker 3: being a little bit off just because their values are

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Speaker 3: so different from you know what I mean, the way

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Speaker 3: that they grew up in the sport is so different.

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Speaker 3: Like I think Jason's right, like obviously he's obsessed with

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Speaker 3: basketball to be as good as he is.

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Speaker 6: He's not, like, but I and I do agree.

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Speaker 3: I think there's some element of I don't know if

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Speaker 3: it's a natural feel from him or if a publicist

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Speaker 3: told him, but clearly he understands that this is this

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Speaker 3: is what the marketing thing about him that has broken

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Speaker 3: through to a national audience, like clearly, you know, Like yeah,

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Speaker 3: I think Jannis does the same thing too, where it

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Speaker 3: was like, Okay, now I'm gonna try an oreo for

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Speaker 3: the first time, and now I'm gonna try to like

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Speaker 3: because when you're new here and it's like, oh, people

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Speaker 3: love this, I think that that's sort of natural that

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Speaker 3: you're and and publicists can get involved in going hey,

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Speaker 3: I could sell a I could sell a TV show

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Speaker 3: if you trying American shit for the first time, Like

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Speaker 3: you know, all of that stuff factors into it, and

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Speaker 3: I do think Joki is playing that up to some extent.

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Speaker 3: We know people in the Nuggets organization that dude, that

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Speaker 3: dude likes like he enjoys being as good as he is.

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Speaker 3: He does feel slighted when he's not included in you know,

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Speaker 3: Christmas Day graphics and stuff like that, Like he does

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Speaker 3: think about that stuff. So I do think he's playing

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Speaker 3: it up to some extent.

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Speaker 5: But I agree with I.

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Speaker 3: I do think he's not lying when he says when

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Speaker 3: he retires, he's not going to be at.

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Speaker 4: Everything, you know what I mean. I think that's true

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Speaker 4: for sure.

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Speaker 7: He's going to disappear.

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Speaker 2: Like I mean, this is the biggest star in the

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Speaker 2: in with the biggest the best player in the NBA,

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Speaker 2: and he doesn't have a fucking mansion in La or Miami.

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Speaker 2: In the off season, that dude goes back home in Serbia.

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Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying to his and his horses.

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Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying, Like, when he's done with

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Speaker 2: this ship, we are never going to see that dude

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Speaker 2: again until this fucking the Hall of Fame induction.

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Speaker 4: Bro.

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Speaker 7: That's it.

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Speaker 5: Quick follow undred if we fast forward to I don't

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Speaker 5: know what year it's going to be, but twenty years

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Speaker 5: from now, Kd's fifty five and he's living in averaging

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Speaker 5: somewhere in New York. Where how many times a week

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Speaker 5: is KD playing basketball at age fifty five? Like, how

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Speaker 5: many times does he going to the pickup games?

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Speaker 4: Oh? Eight days?

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Speaker 7: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: For sure, I for sure seek working with players and

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Speaker 2: like in a cheam olage, want capacity when right, Like,

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Speaker 2: I feel like he doesn't want the bullshit that comes

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Speaker 2: with with actually dealing with a front office and all that.

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Speaker 2: But he loves the sport so much and he loves

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Speaker 2: the players so much. You know what I'm saying. I

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Speaker 2: could see him being like a mentor and a tutor

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Speaker 2: to you know guys working on the game, like in

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Speaker 2: a lodge one capacity.

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Speaker 7: Wouldn't be surprised at all.

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Speaker 3: I mean we might not pick basketball up, you know, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we we We've talked about this with KD. They both

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Speaker 3: talked about it publicly, so I feel comfortable speaking on it.

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Speaker 3: But like KD, you know Peyton Watson with the Nuggets

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Speaker 3: I covered in high school. I have known him since

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Speaker 3: he was a kid. KD showed up to one of

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Speaker 3: his games when he was a junior in high school

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Speaker 3: before he blew up like the dude had like three

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Speaker 3: offers at that point, and KD showed up because someone

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Speaker 3: told him this kid's game reminded them.

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Speaker 6: Of him, so he came to this game. It was

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Speaker 6: like on the road too.

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Speaker 3: He pulled up to the high school game, talked to

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Speaker 3: him afterwards, and from that point has been great. Like

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Speaker 3: as he went to as he got into the USA

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Speaker 3: Basketball campus, he blew up. He's been like a great like.

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Speaker 3: He embraces that aspect even while he's playing, which is

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Speaker 3: not super common, especially for dudes to do. Not like

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Speaker 3: let me associate with myself with this future superstar, but like, oh,

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Speaker 3: here's a kid I can tell really loves the game,

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Speaker 3: is really cerebral. I can be of use to him, right,

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Speaker 3: like in genuine service, not just the kind of like

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Speaker 3: let me co sign a dude that's gonna be famous

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Speaker 3: so that I'm in his highlight reel when he starts

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Speaker 3: his career, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 5: He appreciates his and his role in the in basketball history,

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Speaker 5: like he he understands his responsibility, which I think is

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Speaker 5: really really cool. I think he's been so good for

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Speaker 5: the game.

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Speaker 7: And the KD Tree is a very real thing.

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Speaker 2: Like fucking you know, the two best rookies this year,

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Speaker 2: you know, fucking you know, Chet and Wimby, they're on

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Speaker 2: the KD Tree. You have Kat who said, you know,

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Speaker 2: he grew up emulating KD, Like KD got sons, man,

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Speaker 2: you know, and and he embraces them because you know,

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Speaker 2: he just loves the game so much. So you know

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Speaker 2: a lot to see that form KDI.

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Speaker 6: All right, let's talk to some Detroit Pistons basketball.

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Speaker 4: As promised. They did.

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Speaker 3: They lost it in so we're recording this Friday morning

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Speaker 3: to drop Saturday. They lost a crazy game, the most

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Speaker 3: electric game between the best and worst teams in basketball

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Speaker 3: that you could ever see in Boston last night. Pistons

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Speaker 3: had a nineteen point lead at halftime. A lot of

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Speaker 3: casinos were going to be hurting. That was the biggest

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Speaker 3: bet in the NBA last night was a Pistons money

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Speaker 3: line to win that game with the biggest spread of

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Speaker 3: the year against them in favor of the Celtics. And

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Speaker 3: they proceeded to blow that nineteen point lead in one quarter.

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Speaker 6: It was tied going to the fourth, went to overtime.

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Speaker 3: They made some plays Jaydon and ivyat thought looked great

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Speaker 3: in the game, and you know, it just didn't go

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Speaker 3: their way. The Celtics crowd was locked in like it

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Speaker 3: was a Game seven. Jackson was talking beforehand. Chris STAPs

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Speaker 3: was like getting the crowd juiced, Like is the wildest

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Speaker 3: shit I've ever seen. And so I have a commemorative

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Speaker 3: the Japanese death poem for the episode, and actually I

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Speaker 3: have two because.

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Speaker 4: I couldn't pick between the two of them. They're both

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Speaker 4: equally depressing.

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Speaker 3: This is from Teshu, who died on June sixth, seventeen

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Speaker 3: seventy five at the age of fifty two. Nikugan o

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Speaker 3: hanarette mitashi hasu no hanna. When I leave these eyes

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Speaker 3: of flesh, I wish to see the lotus. And then

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Speaker 3: we have Tokyu, who died on August fifteen, seventeen forty nine,

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Speaker 3: at the age of forty four. Non no mama no

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Speaker 3: kou hat mo, nashi aki no kase. When autumn winds blow,

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Speaker 3: not one leaf remains the way it was.

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Speaker 4: Damn that's heavy, that's beautiful.

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Speaker 6: The Detroit Pistons.

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Speaker 2: Bro whenever poets like mentioned autumn, I already know like

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Speaker 2: we we about to dance for like, hey, poet, when

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Speaker 2: Poe's getting that automag is different, man. But going back

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Speaker 2: to the Pistons, I'm gonna say I was impressed last night.

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Speaker 2: I you know, you could say you don't believe in

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Speaker 2: moral victory or whatever, but hey, these motherfuckers got to

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Speaker 2: get some type of victory, you know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: So I'm giving them a moral victory for how they

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Speaker 2: came out last night after such a crushing loss versus Brooklyn,

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Speaker 2: right like you had fucking k leave it all out there,

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Speaker 2: forty one, nine to five, I think. And then they

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Speaker 2: come back and they they go up on you know,

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Speaker 2: they go up by twenty against the best team in

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Speaker 2: the league who hasn't lost at home.

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Speaker 7: You know, they put up a good fight, they take

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Speaker 7: it to ot.

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Speaker 4: Bro.

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Speaker 2: It's like I gained a bit of respect from them

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Speaker 2: because I thought that that the subtles, we want to

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Speaker 2: blow the fucking doors off them. I thought they were

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Speaker 2: gonna come in there defeated after that, you know, deflating

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Speaker 2: loss that they took. But bro, these motherfuckers are like

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Speaker 2: Stan Marsh from fucking South Park, Like I ain't here

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Speaker 2: la Bell.

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Speaker 7: Like like they still got some fight in them. I

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Speaker 7: am thoroughly impressed.

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Speaker 3: Though.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's funny because there's a narrative surrounding the Pistons

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Speaker 5: that like they have no talent, which is actually completely

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Speaker 5: misplaced in my opinion, that it's really just poor management

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Speaker 5: and coaching. In my opinion, they've got good players. As

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Speaker 5: a matter of fact, every young team should be striving

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Speaker 5: to get their core five, and I think they have

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Speaker 5: four of those five guys. Like I think Jalen durn

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Speaker 5: is the right center for them to build around. I

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Speaker 5: think Asar Thompson is like this three that is an

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Speaker 5: incredibly agile perimeter defender. He's one of the best defenders. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: and then Jade and Ivy, Like this recent stretch where

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Speaker 5: he's been hooping, it's the first time all season he's

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Speaker 5: consistently gotten good minutes. It's literally the first time. And like,

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Speaker 5: if you actually dig into the numbers, like Jaden's been

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Speaker 5: an awesome on the ball creator. All of his like

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Speaker 5: static half court creation stuff has been over a point

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Speaker 5: per possession. And if you actually combine the minute, if

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Speaker 5: you look at just the minutes where Cade, Jade and

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Speaker 5: Ivy and Jalen Dern are on the floor together this season.

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Speaker 5: They have a positive net rating, they literally do. It's

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Speaker 5: come down to injuries. That's been a part of it

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Speaker 5: for whatever reason, Monny Williams being unwilling to give Jad

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Speaker 5: and Ivy the same long leash that most young teams

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Speaker 5: that have young draft prospects get, you know. And then

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Speaker 5: the bench man, the incessant playing of just like straight up.

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Speaker 2: No bench, straight straight you know, he rolls out five

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Speaker 2: man rotations of straight bench players, not a starter in

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Speaker 2: the mix at all, like that.

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Speaker 7: That's madness, bro.

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Speaker 3: This this and this is what I wanted to get

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Speaker 3: into with Jason, because I know that you are an

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Speaker 3: analytics guy and a film grinder. Is we've as we've

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Speaker 3: all come to know so much more about the Pistons.

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Speaker 3: You see this like the Pistons beat writers almost screaming

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Speaker 3: onto Twitter, like thank god, the national audience is finally

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Speaker 3: seeing how much of this is mismanagement by Monnie Williams,

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Speaker 3: you know, because I do think there were there. You know,

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Speaker 3: there's some clips that go out of like bad turnovers

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Speaker 3: and stupid plays that I think led to the narrative

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Speaker 3: like you were talking about, like this is just a

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Speaker 3: bunch of juco players trying to.

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Speaker 6: Play in the NBA or something.

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Speaker 3: But there is all this mismanagement and it's Tyler pointed out,

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Speaker 3: I think they had like eight minutes last night where

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Speaker 3: they had no starters in the game in a game

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Speaker 3: where they were winning. You know, the Celtics going to

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Speaker 3: fourteen to two run with no time out for Monny

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Speaker 3: Williams in the third quarter. So, Jason, you know how

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Speaker 3: much of this is? Wow, If you put someone in

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Speaker 3: there who is really trying to win games, maybe this

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Speaker 3: stuff goes different. Like how much of this do you

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Speaker 3: think is on the way the game's being managed?

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Speaker 6: Most of it?

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Speaker 5: Because you know what's so silly about it is like,

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Speaker 5: if you're gonna be bad, be bad with the sense

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Speaker 5: of direction, meaning like if you're gonna be bad, be

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Speaker 5: bad with the intention of accumulating draft assets and by

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Speaker 5: giving your young players super long leashes to figure out

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Speaker 5: how to play together. And you know, one of the things,

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Speaker 5: like with Killian Hayes, for instance, like we have a

401
00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:32,800
Speaker 5: pretty large sample size of Killian Hayes being mostly bad, right,

402
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Speaker 5: But Jayden Ivy is a young player who's literally in

403
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Speaker 5: a second season, who you brought off the bench the

404
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Speaker 5: majority of this year as like a guy that like

405
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Speaker 5: legitimately was one of the big standouts in Summer League

406
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Speaker 5: for his brief little stint like he had this I

407
00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,280
Speaker 5: was there two years ago. Literally just was killing everybody

408
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Speaker 5: for half a quarter before he sprained his ankle. No

409
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Speaker 5: one could keep him in front off the dribble. He's

410
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Speaker 5: been one of the most exciting like dribble drive two

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Speaker 5: guards that we've seen come out of the draft in

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Speaker 5: a long time. They actually have all of these like

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Speaker 5: position groups. You know, they all compliment each other actually

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Speaker 5: pretty well, which I think is why they've been good

415
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Speaker 5: when they've played. It's just been a mismanagement of the rotation.

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Speaker 5: And again it makes no sense, like why would you

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Speaker 5: be bad without a sense of direction, meaning like like

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Speaker 5: you're giving the wrong guy's long leashes, You're giving the

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Speaker 5: wrong guys tons of minutes. And you know, I've had

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Speaker 5: a lot of Pistons fans ask like what do they

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Speaker 5: need to do to the lineup? What do they need

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Speaker 5: to do to the lineup. What they need to find

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Speaker 5: is a four so that they stop playing two bigs.

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Speaker 5: They need to find a four that they can play

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Speaker 5: between you know, in the big picture of Sar eventually

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Speaker 5: at the three, although he's been coming off the bench,

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Speaker 5: and Jalen Dern. You know, the guy that I'd like

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Speaker 5: to see the Pistons go after is Kyle Kuzma. I

429
00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:41,479
Speaker 5: think he'd be a really really interesting fit with them,

430
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Speaker 5: is a little bit more of a grown up, a

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Speaker 5: guy who has a championship pedigree. They don't need a

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Speaker 5: perimeter defender. They don't need a perimeter defender at the

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Speaker 5: four because Sar Thompson is such a good perimeter defender

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Speaker 5: and Jade and Ivy I think will be one day

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Speaker 5: once he kind of figures those pieces out. But like,

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Speaker 5: I actually think there's a bright future that they just

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Speaker 5: like don't underestimate how much like this kind of stuff

438
00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:05,680
Speaker 5: plays a wrong. I mean, we're gonna talk about the

439
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,000
Speaker 5: Lakers later. Like the Lakers have a coach that like

440
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:10,680
Speaker 5: straight up like just will not start their third best player,

441
00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:11,920
Speaker 5: just won't do it, you know what I mean. Like

442
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,080
Speaker 5: this kind of thing is a thing that happens in

443
00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,320
Speaker 5: the NBA, and it plays a bigger role than you think.

444
00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,399
Speaker 3: That's a good segue into asking you about the Lakers,

445
00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:25,240
Speaker 3: And this is what I want to do, because I

446
00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 3: think I remember I've told this story on the POP.

447
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:30,600
Speaker 3: I was texting with a friend of mine who's a

448
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:33,000
Speaker 3: pitcher in the major leagues, and he was watching a

449
00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:38,520
Speaker 3: finals game a couple of years ago, and the broadcasters

450
00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:41,200
Speaker 3: mentioned that the coach had called a play. And this

451
00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:43,560
Speaker 3: dude is, you know, he's an obviously baseball meathead, major

452
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:47,360
Speaker 3: league pitcher for several years, but he's a big basketball fan,

453
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,560
Speaker 3: always been a big basketball fan. And what he told

454
00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:53,560
Speaker 3: me was, he texted me he said, the coaches call plays,

455
00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:55,760
Speaker 3: and he said, like, you know, he's like, I'm a

456
00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,000
Speaker 3: casual basketball fan. He's like, I watch every playoff game

457
00:19:58,000 --> 00:19:59,239
Speaker 3: all this stuff. He's like, I didn't know that they

458
00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:01,520
Speaker 3: ran plays. Thought they were just out there playing basketball.

459
00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,359
Speaker 3: I do think there's like a fair portion of like

460
00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,239
Speaker 3: basketball fans who just they know the players and they

461
00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:10,000
Speaker 3: don't really think about the coaches or the strategy or

462
00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:12,560
Speaker 3: five man basketball or whatever else. Right, these are the

463
00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 3: people who are like, always think Lebron should force a

464
00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,040
Speaker 3: shot through a triple team, you know, at the end

465
00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:18,399
Speaker 3: of the game, right, And we know there's a lot

466
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,240
Speaker 3: of those people out there. So my question to you is,

467
00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:24,919
Speaker 3: can you put into like into words for a casual

468
00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:30,280
Speaker 3: listener how important coaches are, and give me the galaxy

469
00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,560
Speaker 3: brain explanation for why Darvin Ham should be fired, because

470
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:36,880
Speaker 3: on the base level, there's like, always fire the coach.

471
00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:38,160
Speaker 4: It's always the coach's fault.

472
00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:40,800
Speaker 3: On the second level, it's like no, no, no, no,

473
00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:43,520
Speaker 3: it's so much more about the players all this other stuff.

474
00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 3: And then there is the galaxy brain thing of like

475
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,320
Speaker 3: Manti Williams is fucking the Pistons by playing an all

476
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:51,719
Speaker 3: bench lineup, or Darvin Ham is mismanaging this team by

477
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 3: not starting Austin Reeves. So like, make that case for

478
00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,119
Speaker 3: us on the importance of coaching and why Darvin Ham

479
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,199
Speaker 3: is failing the Lakers.

480
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:01,680
Speaker 5: So you know, I think, I think coaching and organization

481
00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:03,880
Speaker 5: on both ends of the floor is way more important

482
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:06,360
Speaker 5: than people realize. I mean, we've seen so many examples

483
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,160
Speaker 5: of it over the course of even just this season,

484
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:11,800
Speaker 5: like silly things like the Bucks being really good defensively

485
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:14,280
Speaker 5: forever by running a deep cover, a deep drop coverage

486
00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,639
Speaker 5: with Brook Lopez and then Adriane Griffin comes in and

487
00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,879
Speaker 5: starts bringing Brook up high to the level of the

488
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:20,600
Speaker 5: screen and they start getting their ass cooked. You know

489
00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:23,200
Speaker 5: what I mean, like that kind of thing. To put

490
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:25,680
Speaker 5: it simply, like, I think what ends up happening in

491
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:28,879
Speaker 5: a lot of cases is coaches have a philosophy and

492
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,000
Speaker 5: it's their personal opinion about how to win basketball games.

493
00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,880
Speaker 5: And then there's the roster, which has a specific set

494
00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:37,679
Speaker 5: of strengths and weaknesses. And to me, the best coaches

495
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:39,840
Speaker 5: are the ones that can learn how to bridge that gap,

496
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,560
Speaker 5: inflicting some of their ideology on what the roster strengths

497
00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:45,879
Speaker 5: and weaknesses are, but at the same time adjusting their

498
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,680
Speaker 5: ideology to meet the roster at some point. And the

499
00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 5: vast majority of issues start from like things like this,

500
00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:55,440
Speaker 5: like Darvin Ham, I genuinely think there's I think Darvin

501
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 5: Ham is convinced that he can solve all of his

502
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:02,760
Speaker 5: problems with defense. And the problem is is like my

503
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,040
Speaker 5: guy Mark Titus with Barsol Sports coined to this term

504
00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 5: and I'm stealing it from him, but basketball is more

505
00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:11,640
Speaker 5: art than science, and every time you do something, there's

506
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:15,479
Speaker 5: an equal and opposite reaction somewhere else in the roster, right,

507
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 5: And that's what's kind of beautiful about basketball is it

508
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:20,320
Speaker 5: is a mix of different types of talent that make

509
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:22,120
Speaker 5: it work, but Darvin's just like, I'm just gonna put

510
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:24,480
Speaker 5: all my best defenders out there and see what happens.

511
00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:27,960
Speaker 5: And it's been funny because those groups have been terrible defensively.

512
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:30,640
Speaker 5: Every group this year that has Anthony Davis and Lebron

513
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:33,200
Speaker 5: James on the floor with Austin Reeves, Gabe Vincent, and

514
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:35,560
Speaker 5: D'Angelo Russell all on the bench at the same time,

515
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 5: those lineups are giving up almost one hundred and nineteen

516
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,919
Speaker 5: points per one hundred posessions. They haven't been getting stops,

517
00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:45,159
Speaker 5: and it's because when a basketball lineup is playing to

518
00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,760
Speaker 5: its best, it's because they believe in their ability to

519
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,440
Speaker 5: succeed on both ends of the floor. They see success

520
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:52,359
Speaker 5: on both ends of the floor, which causes them to

521
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 5: play harder on both ends of the floor. When you

522
00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 5: can't score, it causes you to deflate, it causes you

523
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:00,600
Speaker 5: to play poorly defensively. And I think one of the

524
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,000
Speaker 5: things that's interesting is there is absolutely no debate that

525
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 5: Austin Reeves is the third best Laker in terms of

526
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:10,440
Speaker 5: total two a impact. Hasn't been as good defensively as

527
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,160
Speaker 5: he was last year, but he still is by far

528
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:15,920
Speaker 5: the third best offensive player on the team, and he's

529
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 5: been really good, especially as of late and even in

530
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 5: the Ncason Tournament in some big games. Again, So there's

531
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 5: really only one of two reasons why Darvin ham is

532
00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,119
Speaker 5: bringing him off the bench. One, he's invested in some

533
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 5: sort of sixth Man of the Year campaign, which I

534
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 5: can tell you for a fact from people close to Austin,

535
00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:33,760
Speaker 5: they could give a shit about that. They just want

536
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:35,439
Speaker 5: to win. They don't care about six Man of the Year.

537
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,000
Speaker 5: That's for Darvin's benefit if that's something that they're doing.

538
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,120
Speaker 5: And then secondly, he just doesn't think Austin is very good,

539
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,200
Speaker 5: and that to me is where it can be a problem.

540
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:45,119
Speaker 5: It's one of those two and both of them are

541
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:49,920
Speaker 5: completely irrational reasons. And you know, there's multiple elements to it.

542
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 5: There's the schematic element to it, which we won't get

543
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:53,920
Speaker 5: into now, but like, you want to build a scheme

544
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,920
Speaker 5: that actually accentuates your player's strengths and weaknesses, right, Like,

545
00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:58,720
Speaker 5: one of the things that's worked for the Lakers this

546
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 5: year is in order to help help weaponize their athleticism,

547
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,439
Speaker 5: they've been blitzing a lot of ball screens, not as

548
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:05,919
Speaker 5: of late, since they went so big, and they've been

549
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:07,679
Speaker 5: doing switching, but they blitz a lot of ball screens.

550
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 5: It's something that accentuates their strengths. We saw that in

551
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 5: the Ncason tournament, right. But the second piece of it

552
00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 5: is the rotation, And in my opinion, every lineup needs

553
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,880
Speaker 5: a certain like mix of different basketball skills. You need

554
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,040
Speaker 5: a skill guard. You need a guard that can bring

555
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:23,960
Speaker 5: the ball up the floor and set the offense up,

556
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:25,680
Speaker 5: that can run a ball screen and get the ball

557
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 5: into position of advantage. Then you need an athlete guard,

558
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 5: a guy who can guard the other team's skill guard

559
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,000
Speaker 5: and apply that ball pressure and stuff like that. And

560
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,560
Speaker 5: you need play finishers, you need weak side shooters. You

561
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,679
Speaker 5: need all these different things. And when you put lineups

562
00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 5: out there that are strong in one area but week

563
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 5: in others, you get diminishing returns because then what ends

564
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:45,240
Speaker 5: up happening is the guys who are really good at

565
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 5: stuff they end up stepping on each other's toes in

566
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 5: a lot of ways. And then when you have vacancies

567
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,080
Speaker 5: in other areas, and so it plays a much bigger

568
00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 5: role than people think.

569
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 1: You know.

570
00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:55,880
Speaker 5: The thing with Darvin Ham in particular, I actually thought

571
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:57,840
Speaker 5: he did a good job with adjustments last year in

572
00:24:57,840 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 5: the playoffs, and it very well could have been Lebron,

573
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:01,680
Speaker 5: who knows, but I thought they did a decent job.

574
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 5: But this year, that lineup going without your skill guards,

575
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 5: most importantly, going without your third best player, saying things

576
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 5: in press conferences like I like Austin around twenty eight minutes,

577
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:14,880
Speaker 5: but then playing Cam Reddish and Toryan in the high

578
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 5: thirties every single night, Like, to me, it's a it's a.

579
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 5: It's it's either stubbornness or its foolishness, and both of

580
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 5: those have no place in a team that's trying to

581
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 5: win a championship. And so I don't think Darvin will

582
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 5: be fired. Most importantly, I don't think there's a guy

583
00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:30,680
Speaker 5: that they can replace him with other than just maybe

584
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 5: go giving the keys to fill Handy for a season.

585
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:35,000
Speaker 5: But I am legitimately concerned about it.

586
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:36,880
Speaker 6: Ron Player Coach Championship.

587
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,399
Speaker 5: I'm concerned about it, man, I'm concerned about it just

588
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,119
Speaker 5: from the standpoint of like Anthony Davis again last night

589
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 5: was like I expect this starting lineup to stick for

590
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 5: a while, and it's like, man, like you were you

591
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 5: were sabotaging yourself. This is self sabotage.

592
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, so so where are you at with it? Because

593
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be honestly, I'm confused as fuck with the Lakers.

594
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 2: The trajectory for me with the Lakers this season was,

595
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:00,359
Speaker 2: you know, at the top of the season, like, this

596
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 2: is a team that you know, they might make some

597
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:04,640
Speaker 2: noise in the postseason, but they're not going anywhere. Then

598
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:08,080
Speaker 2: that end season tournament happened, right and I was like, okay,

599
00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 2: I'm buying some Laker stock because the brand of basketball

600
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,880
Speaker 2: they were playing it looked like twenty twenty championship basketball.

601
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:14,520
Speaker 7: It reminded me of that.

602
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 2: Right You saw the commitment to defense, you saw them

603
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:18,840
Speaker 2: committed to turning defense in the offense. You saw them

604
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:21,639
Speaker 2: attacking the paint. You know, bron didn't score outside the

605
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 2: paint end the championship game, right, like that was all

606
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:26,359
Speaker 2: the shit that they did when they won the championship

607
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 2: and fucking ad turning into like ninety eight MJ in

608
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,760
Speaker 2: the mid range lighting in the bottleshit right there.

609
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:34,560
Speaker 7: But it's I'm and now you know. I was like, okay,

610
00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 7: I was like, I think you stay pat with this group.

611
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,400
Speaker 2: You see what they can do, you know, you don't,

612
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 2: you know, get out there and try to look for

613
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:41,879
Speaker 2: a trade, and then they lose four straight out to

614
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 2: the n Season Tournament, and I'm like, Okay, I don't

615
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 2: know what the fuck to make out of this team.

616
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:45,679
Speaker 7: So where are you at?

617
00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 2: Do you have any ideas or suggests or do you

618
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 2: think that there's a fix with the with the lineups

619
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 2: or do they need to get out there and get

620
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:52,879
Speaker 2: a trade or what.

621
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,400
Speaker 5: So to me, it's really simple, like we were talking

622
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 5: about it with the Pistons, this idea of like filling

623
00:26:59,560 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 5: the five.

624
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:01,160
Speaker 4: It's weird.

625
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:05,159
Speaker 5: Basketball is positionless, but it's not roleless, Like you need

626
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 5: guys that fill roles. And so, like I said, I

627
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 5: like a team with a skill guard, an athlete guard,

628
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,080
Speaker 5: kind of a taller, slender forward who's more of a

629
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:15,160
Speaker 5: perimeter oriented forward, and then like a big, strong forward,

630
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,879
Speaker 5: think like Aaron Gordon as like a perfect example of

631
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:19,880
Speaker 5: that type of archetype. And then I want an athletic

632
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 5: center that can defend in a bunch of different coverages. Right,

633
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 5: And so when I look at the Lakers in particular,

634
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,720
Speaker 5: like they've got a plethora of certain position types and

635
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 5: then they've got weak players playing other position types. Right,

636
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 5: they have three skill guards that are all pretty good, right,

637
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 5: Like Austin's pretty good. I'm not as high on d

638
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 5: Lo as everyone else is, but he's a pretty good

639
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 5: basketball player. Gabe Vincent literally started for a finals team

640
00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:46,160
Speaker 5: last year. But they have Cam Reddish starting at the two.

641
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 5: And I know that Darvin ham is like invested in

642
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 5: trying to revamp his career. But the two guys they

643
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 5: have basically playing the two right now are Cam Reddish

644
00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,200
Speaker 5: and Max Christy is like these athlete wings and they're

645
00:27:56,280 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 5: just not good enough to be starters on a championship team.

646
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 5: Looking further down the four spot, that big athletic forward,

647
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:06,000
Speaker 5: it's Lebron and Ruey hotcha Mura. They're kind of redundant,

648
00:28:06,040 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 5: and they've been playing Ruey hotcham Moore in the last

649
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,200
Speaker 5: few games as they've been doing more switching. But in

650
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:12,360
Speaker 5: the big picture, especially as we saw in the postseason,

651
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,120
Speaker 5: specific matchups that ask Ruiy to chase over the top

652
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,960
Speaker 5: of screens, they're gonna have trouble in those situations with

653
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 5: Ruey and so Ruey and Dlo represent redundancies, and then

654
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 5: they have weaknesses at the two and three, and so

655
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 5: what's good for the Lakers. There's so much good because

656
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 5: Rui is a good player that people will want in

657
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,680
Speaker 5: a trade. D' Angelo Russell has some value on a

658
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 5: discounted deal as a guy who can help run your

659
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 5: bench units, and it's very good passer who can run,

660
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 5: pick and roll and do that kind of stuff. They

661
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:41,960
Speaker 5: have a first round draft pick that because of the

662
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 5: Lakers incompetence, is something that people view as valuable around

663
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 5: the league. They have draft as sets. So the deal

664
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:49,880
Speaker 5: that I've been looking at as of late, I'll be

665
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 5: interested to hear what you guys think about this one.

666
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 5: So I don't know if you saw yesterday, but Bovada

667
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 5: had the favorites to land de Jonte Murray and a

668
00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,719
Speaker 5: trade as the Los Angeles Lakers, and so I one

669
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 5: of the deals that I saw that I kind of

670
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 5: like is, like, you know what, D'Angelo Russell and Ruyha

671
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,400
Speaker 5: Chimura and one more of their smaller deals for Capella

672
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 5: in de Jontay Murray is super interesting to me because

673
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 5: Dejontay Murray represents that athlete guard that can defend at

674
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 5: the point of attack the way that Austin can't. But

675
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 5: he's also a very good offensive player. The dude's hitting

676
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 5: like fifty five percent in effective field goal percentage on

677
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 5: pull up jump shots this year. I was watching tape

678
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 5: on him this morning. He can beat people off the

679
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 5: dribble like crazy, Like that dude is a legit dribble

680
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 5: drive guy, which is something that Dennis Schroeder brought last year,

681
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 5: which was super valuable. If you guys remember, like beating

682
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:36,800
Speaker 5: people off the dribble is one of the most important

683
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,560
Speaker 5: elements to getting a defense in rotation, so that you're

684
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 5: operating with an advantage instead of kind of like stagnant,

685
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 5: you know, not like the Lakers kind of looks stagnant.

686
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 5: Sometimes it's because Lebron's the only guy who can beat

687
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 5: people off the dribble, and so Dejonte could help with that.

688
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 5: He's having a career best year in terms of efficiency

689
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,680
Speaker 5: and knocking down catch and shoot threes. He's learning how

690
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 5: to play off the ball next to Trey Young. I

691
00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 5: really like that specific fit. And then Click Capella is

692
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 5: a legitimate backup center as good as Christian would have

693
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 5: and Jackson Hayes have been in spurts. I don't view

694
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 5: them as guys that could play significant minutes in a

695
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 5: playoff rotation. So I like the idea of having like

696
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 5: a legitimate backup center slash, a guy that could play

697
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 5: big with And then you start to look at it

698
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 5: and it's like Austin skill guard Dejonte athlete, guard Torrian,

699
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 5: you know, kind of slender, perimeter, perimeter oriented forward Lebron

700
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 5: Anthony Davis. You've got a bench player to come off

701
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:25,760
Speaker 5: the bench for Capella. That's where I start to see

702
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 5: the Lakers is just more balanced down the roster. And

703
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 5: I don't even if it's not that Atlanta trade, It's

704
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 5: just got to be trades that turn those redundancies d

705
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 5: Loo and Rui into weaknesses, which is that two and three? Like,

706
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 5: that's that's where they need to get a significant upgrade.

707
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:41,680
Speaker 5: What do you guys think about de Jontamurray with the

708
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 5: Lakers that I'm curious.

709
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 4: I like it.

710
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 2: Shit, I'm sold, bro, Like that was a hell of

711
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 2: a elevator pitch right there. Yeah, yeah, you know, I'm

712
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 2: I'm for sure on the side now that you got

713
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 2: to shake some shit up and make a trade. I'm

714
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 2: for sure on the side of that. And and I do,

715
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 2: like you know what you said about Dejoonte and Clint.

716
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 2: I think that that be a very, very very very

717
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 2: good fit for them. So that's something uponder for sure.

718
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 5: One quick thing too, like there are two things that

719
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 5: matter way more than anything else. Anthony Davis looks better

720
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 5: than he's looked since twenty twenty, and Lebron James looks

721
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 5: better than he's looks since twenty twenty. So like they

722
00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 5: legit like last year, Lakers fans would be like, oh,

723
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,200
Speaker 5: we have two top ten players, and it was like

724
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 5: kind of debatable because Lebron after the foot injury just

725
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,280
Speaker 5: wasn't very good and Anthony Davis literally couldn't shoot and

726
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 5: all these other things. Anthony Davis has made fourteen of

727
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 5: his last twenty nine catch and shoot jump shots. He's

728
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 5: legitimately looking confident knocking down that shot. He's been one

729
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 5: of the very best post up players in the league

730
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 5: and is having by far his best post upseason since

731
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 5: he came to the Lakers. Lebron is shooting his jump

732
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 5: shot better than he has in forever, like they have.

733
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 5: I really do think this team has a championship potential

734
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,840
Speaker 5: if they can organize the rest of the roster like

735
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,440
Speaker 5: they There is no other team that brings the top

736
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 5: end talent that the Lakers bring to the table. There

737
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 5: is no other team that can say definitively we have

738
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 5: two times ten players. So like they they have that capability,

739
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:05,719
Speaker 5: they just have to they have to play to their

740
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 5: strengths and they have to orient like kind of reorient

741
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 5: the roster towards more balanced.

742
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 3: What bothers me and and troubles me bridging the two

743
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 3: comments that you just made though, is you make a

744
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 3: trade to calibrate the roster. I'm not confident because of

745
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 3: the lineups that they they're we're really seeing the most

746
00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:27,720
Speaker 3: out of what the current roster can do. And so

747
00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 3: the idea of mixing that up, Like I think any

748
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 3: Lakers fan has been paying attention from Steve Nash forward, right,

749
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 3: you know, like you get a guy who's who you're

750
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 3: excited to get, it does not always equal positive things happening, right,

751
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 3: Russell Westbrook one of my favorite basketball players of all time.

752
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 4: I literally just every morning try and black out the

753
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 4: period of time when he was a Laker.

754
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:56,479
Speaker 5: We agree that was a bad idea in the moment, right,

755
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 5: we all, yeah, yeah.

756
00:32:57,560 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 3: Well I was excited about it, but yes, I mean

757
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 3: I thought it was going to work x's and yes,

758
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 3: I mean like the moment I was excited about it

759
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 3: in the moment.

760
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: When it first happened. I was very excited. Then the

761
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 1: next podcast came and I'm like, how is this going

762
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:13,239
Speaker 1: to work? And they're like, John, shut the fuck off

763
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: and just enjoy basketball, and I'm like, look at a mask,

764
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 1: not math is.

765
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 2: So I also was still family on the side that

766
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 2: lebronos more about basketball to me, and if he wants

767
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:24,840
Speaker 2: the guy, then let's roll with that, you know. Now,

768
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 2: you know, I feel like the the you know, lud

769
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 2: gm tag it's taking a bit of a hit, you know,

770
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 2: with with the Lakers. So I'm not really necessarily trusting

771
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 2: Italian evaluation I as much as I did before. You Yeah,

772
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 2: so that played a part too, But.

773
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:41,200
Speaker 3: I think my but my concern is do we like

774
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 3: there's too many variables to know if I knew exactly

775
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 3: what this roster was, if Darvin Ham's playing a correct

776
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 3: lineup in rotation, then you can say, Okay, this lineup

777
00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 3: is X, and then it's easier to say if you

778
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 3: take these pieces out and put to Dante murriy in

779
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 3: is why better than X? I don't know what the

780
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 3: value is of X right now, because, like Tyler said,

781
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 3: like at the end of the end season tournament, I'm

782
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 3: going I think this team could win a championship absolutely,

783
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,360
Speaker 3: and then right now they lose those four games in

784
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 3: a row and there's some pretty bad basketball there, and

785
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:13,719
Speaker 3: you're like, I just don't know. And so if you're

786
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:16,960
Speaker 3: not getting the consistency of the team being close to

787
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,880
Speaker 3: their ceiling from what the coach is rolling out, it

788
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 3: just makes me hesitant, Like what confidence do I have

789
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 3: we're going to get that if you bring to Jonte

790
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:26,800
Speaker 3: Murray in that's my concern.

791
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,440
Speaker 1: You're making changes in places where the change may not

792
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: need to be made. Maybe it's the coaching, regardless of

793
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:33,719
Speaker 1: the players you have, you know what I mean, I

794
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:34,719
Speaker 1: completely agree with that.

795
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,560
Speaker 5: So to be clear, I think two things are true.

796
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 5: I think the Lakers are clearly underachieving this season and

797
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:44,920
Speaker 5: should have a better record relative to their talent, and

798
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 5: that strategy has been a huge factor there. But I

799
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:52,720
Speaker 5: said before training camp that I thought of D'Angelo Russell

800
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:54,799
Speaker 5: trade was the safest bet in the NBA this year,

801
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 5: and that ruyachamurroa just depending on what kind of player

802
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 5: you could get back. And it's literally because these issues

803
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:02,800
Speaker 5: have been in place since last year in the postseason,

804
00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 5: and the lack of having like a really athletic guard

805
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 5: that could that could come face to face with someone

806
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 5: like a Christian Brown or a Bruce Brown and not

807
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 5: get scared and not scares the wrong word, but not

808
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 5: be able to hang physically. Right, we knew they needed that, right.

809
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,400
Speaker 5: We knew going in that that three spot was like

810
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 5: a big question mark, like they can either go in

811
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 5: on defense with a guy like Vando, or they can

812
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 5: go in on offense with a guy like Ruy, Like

813
00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 5: there's all these different options, but we knew that they

814
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 5: were flawed options, and so I always saw this as

815
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 5: a train headed towards there in February, going to swap

816
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,720
Speaker 5: Dlo at least, if not Dilo and Rui for upgrades

817
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:40,960
Speaker 5: at the two and three. That to me was like

818
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:44,399
Speaker 5: just that's all about what their playoff shortcomings were, which

819
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,279
Speaker 5: we knew at the Denver series. Right that said, within

820
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 5: the scope of this regular season, there's to me, it's

821
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 5: so simple. You start Austin, you start Lebron and ad

822
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 5: Torrian Prince is shooting the shit out of the basketball.

823
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 5: You start him at the three, you start Vando or

824
00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:01,800
Speaker 5: cam at To. I would go with Vando because I

825
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 5: think Cam is a bad offensive player that thinks he's

826
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,120
Speaker 5: a good offensive player, and Vanda is a bad offensive

827
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:09,279
Speaker 5: player that knows he's a bad offensive player. And so

828
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 5: I think I think in general, like I'd rather have

829
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 5: vand do not want to shoot and get ignored, then

830
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 5: Cam get ignored, and then like try to run pick

831
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:18,839
Speaker 5: and rolls and try to throw the needle and turn.

832
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:22,719
Speaker 2: The basketballak like ten threes this season or something like that, right, Yeah,

833
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:24,440
Speaker 2: And I also think spots.

834
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 5: I think Vanda's not playing particularly well because he's still

835
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 5: dealing with his injuries, not quite all the way there,

836
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 5: So like in the big picture, I think Vando will

837
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 5: eventually get his legs underneath him, and I think he

838
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 5: will be a better offensive player than he's been. So

839
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:39,680
Speaker 5: I would be like, until February, Austin, Vando, Torre, and

840
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:42,880
Speaker 5: Lebron ad run our traditional drop coverage, stop this stupid

841
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,320
Speaker 5: switching game that they've been doing, be aggressive, start blitzing

842
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 5: ball screens again, and lean into the Austin thing. Because

843
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 5: by far the dumbest thing about this Austin thing is

844
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 5: they don't use that damn lineup at any point in

845
00:36:54,239 --> 00:36:56,960
Speaker 5: the game except for to start the game and to

846
00:36:57,120 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 5: start the second half. Austin is their cling point guard.

847
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 5: Austin is the guy that they use in all these

848
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:07,080
Speaker 5: big groups. It's so silly to me because like, there's

849
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 5: no there's no reason to start the game with a

850
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 5: lineup you have no intention of using at any other

851
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 5: time other than to start the game. It literally makes

852
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 5: no sense. It's one of the most bizarre things I've

853
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:18,719
Speaker 5: ever seen.

854
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,400
Speaker 3: And it's a lineup that they've never played. It was

855
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,400
Speaker 3: like like half the games they've played, they've started a

856
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 3: lineup they've never started before as a unit or whatever.

857
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:29,120
Speaker 3: And yeah, like like like we said this team had

858
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:31,880
Speaker 3: this team won the N Season Tournament over good teams.

859
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 3: They look great during the N Season Tournament. Then they

860
00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:36,719
Speaker 3: lose four games in a row with different lineups, and

861
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,359
Speaker 3: then he's like, the solution is not to go back

862
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 3: to what was working, but to roll out a completely

863
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 3: new lineup.

864
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 6: We're a third of the way into the season.

865
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 4: Like, it just doesn't make any fucking sense to me.

866
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 5: Bro Well, the Vanda the lineup they used last year.

867
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 5: And by the way, I'm not recommending this lineup because

868
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 5: I don't think Delo should start, but I do think

869
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 5: it's actually really interesting that Austin dil Vando lebron Ad

870
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 5: hasn't played yet, Like it's it's shocking to me that's

871
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 5: something that he has evidence that works, at least in

872
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,880
Speaker 5: some capacity. It hasn't even been attempted this year. Like

873
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 5: it's crazy to me that he thought hmm, cam Van

874
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 5: do doh Tory and lebron a d before he thought

875
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 5: anything that worked at previous iterations of the team, Like

876
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 5: it's bizarre, And I think I almost wonder if it's

877
00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 5: a point of pride. He benched Austin and then said

878
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 5: he's gyenobly and now if he puts him back in

879
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 5: the starting lineup, he's basically admitting he was wrong about that.

880
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 5: And I do think there's a certain pride element, And

881
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:29,360
Speaker 5: that's the thing, Like it even if we go to

882
00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 5: other coaches around the league, even going to like like

883
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,400
Speaker 5: a guy like Steve Kerr, Like you don't think that

884
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 5: there's a pride element in how reticent he was to

885
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 5: start to tweak the lineup and start to give these

886
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,799
Speaker 5: young guys some some you know, opportunity. Like I think

887
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:45,360
Speaker 5: that coaches have a lot of ego and it can

888
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 5: get in the way.

889
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,319
Speaker 3: It's better to have an ego when you win a championship. Man,

890
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 3: you know, it's like I do get it, but it's like,

891
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 3: get the fuck out of your own way.

892
00:38:55,719 --> 00:39:00,000
Speaker 4: You know. I don't know, guys, you got any more question?

893
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 4: Can I ask Jason some Star Wars questions?

894
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:04,680
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask him that question about Katie. We

895
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 1: were talking earlier. Yeah, we we, we are we We

896
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:09,120
Speaker 1: didn't argue about this.

897
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 4: I don't know.

898
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 1: I mean, Tyler and Mike or Moore convinced of how

899
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:16,399
Speaker 1: they feel. But to me, you're like, uh basketball Bill nine,

900
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:19,879
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, Like you take you take

901
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:23,400
Speaker 1: the science of basketball and make it more relatable. You

902
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:26,960
Speaker 1: feel me and so like, I wonder how you feel

903
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:27,319
Speaker 1: about this.

904
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 4: He's trying to say.

905
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:31,280
Speaker 3: He's trying to say, you understand and use advanced analytics

906
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 3: without making us angry. Still, clearly you understand the physicality

907
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 3: of the actual game that you played it at a

908
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 3: high level as well.

909
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:42,239
Speaker 1: You you you played basketball, you're a hooper, right, but

910
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,840
Speaker 1: you understand the points of analytics, but you understand the art,

911
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 1: like you just spoke to that, Like I.

912
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:46,719
Speaker 4: Talk about that all the time.

913
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 1: I think what I think when we talk about basketball,

914
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 1: we're losing the art of basketball, you know what I mean.

915
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: I think the eye test matters, the beauty of it matters,

916
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:56,360
Speaker 1: you know, as well as the analytics. But anyway, so

917
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 1: I was wondering, like we were talking about Steph when

918
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,279
Speaker 1: when Kady left, Katie was by far the better player

919
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:06,279
Speaker 1: to most people in perception, right, Katy when Kady left

920
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:09,879
Speaker 1: the Warriors, Right, So Tyler mentioned something where Steph has

921
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:14,439
Speaker 1: passed KT like Stephan and stepf is a better BASKETBA player.

922
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 1: He's higher on the top ten than Katie is, you know,

923
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 1: in his opinion. And so for me, what I thought

924
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: was interesting was I think one year they were both heard.

925
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 1: There's been four or five years since they left. One

926
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,120
Speaker 1: year they both were hurt. Kat has had a better

927
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 1: year every year.

928
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 6: Except for one.

929
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 1: As far as numbers, and you know what I mean,

930
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 1: I think Steph won the CHIP obviously, which is a

931
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: big you know, and he got the finals MVP, which

932
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,480
Speaker 1: is very important, right with that, which will sway things.

933
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,840
Speaker 1: But other than that, Kd's played great basketball, you know

934
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. We talk about him in the playoffs

935
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:47,440
Speaker 1: last year average twenty nine a game, you know what

936
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 1: I mean, we're talking about him like he's like he's

937
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 1: been trashed because Booker was the better player and he

938
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:52,960
Speaker 1: averaged I mean, he looked like the best player in

939
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:55,879
Speaker 1: the playoffs at that time period. So for you, I'm

940
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,239
Speaker 1: wondering if somebody who hoops, you know, values hoops and

941
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 1: outside analytics, I'm wondering how you feel as far as

942
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 1: like who's a better player overall at this point? Do

943
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 1: you think Steph is the past KD as a better player.

944
00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 1: We all agree that you're talking about in terms of

945
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 1: like historical like ape like playing that Steph is past

946
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 1: KD for the second player of this era. Tyler told me,

947
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:22,439
Speaker 1: Tyler set up flat out that he thinks that Steph

948
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,919
Speaker 1: is a better basketball flight out and so that's what Yeah, yeah,

949
00:41:26,040 --> 00:41:26,839
Speaker 1: so we're taking career.

950
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:29,080
Speaker 6: I'm more on the I'm more on the career.

951
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:30,880
Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean career.

952
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:33,040
Speaker 1: I don't think this I'm a Tyler career. I mean,

953
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: I think, you know, but I think that's circumstantial. I

954
00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 1: don't know if that has anything, you know, Like I

955
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 1: think I think career Jordan is better than Bron, but

956
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 1: Bron is a better basketball player than me. So how

957
00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,360
Speaker 1: do you feel about that, Katie or Steph who's a

958
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:45,319
Speaker 1: better basketball player?

959
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 3: To you?

960
00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 5: Well, that's literally it. There's there's two different approaches. There's

961
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:50,879
Speaker 5: like the in a vacuum approach, which is like let's

962
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,880
Speaker 5: just talk skill set, and that gets really complicated because

963
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:58,400
Speaker 5: it's like Kevin Durant when he's locked in defensively as

964
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 5: a low man, when like when he's not guarding the

965
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,440
Speaker 5: ball screen, but when he's guarding the weakside shooter and

966
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:03,799
Speaker 5: he can like step in and kind of be two

967
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:07,399
Speaker 5: places at once. He's devastating because he has athletic tools

968
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:10,120
Speaker 5: similar to Anthony Davis, Like he's just this big, long

969
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 5: forward that can cause a lot of problems and like

970
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:16,840
Speaker 5: he straight up has a ability to inflict his physicality

971
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 5: on the game that Steph never could do, even on

972
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:21,719
Speaker 5: the offensive end of the floor. Like one of the

973
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:23,440
Speaker 5: things that's been a little bit of a weakness for

974
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 5: Steph throughout his career is like and we've seen that,

975
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:28,000
Speaker 5: we saw it with in the Oklahoma City game the

976
00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:30,800
Speaker 5: other night, Like he can take some really tough step

977
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 5: back three or some really tough drifting three, but like

978
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 5: it's really difficult for Steph to in a set situation

979
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 5: like late game, ten seconds left to get an easy

980
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 5: shot closer to the basket, Whereas with the KD, it's

981
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:46,320
Speaker 5: like you're watching him and it's like he can he

982
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 5: can literally catch. Remember when he used to, especially in

983
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:50,560
Speaker 5: the early Oklahoma City years, when he would just like

984
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:52,800
Speaker 5: catch around the elbow like Dirk and he would just

985
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 5: iso from there and he had like a little one

986
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 5: leg fade away or something like. Kd's athletic tools definitely

987
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:03,239
Speaker 5: bring a complicate that discussion, and I would say, I'll

988
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 5: just put it this way. I think it's extremely close

989
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:10,240
Speaker 5: in a vacuum, and it's really just what you personally value,

990
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:11,400
Speaker 5: and so much has to do with what kind of

991
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:12,400
Speaker 5: players are surrounding them.

992
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 7: Can I pause that?

993
00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 4: Actually? Just real quick?

994
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 3: Like their their best game, peak physical condition. We're picking

995
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:24,920
Speaker 3: teams KD and STEPH are up, Like, who does everyone

996
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,240
Speaker 3: here pick KD or STEPH to put on their best Gamey?

997
00:43:28,800 --> 00:43:31,239
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think i'd lean Kate, Like, do you guys

998
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:32,680
Speaker 5: remember two thousand KD?

999
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 6: No hesitation for me?

1000
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:37,719
Speaker 5: Twenty eighteen Game four, it was either game three or

1001
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:40,000
Speaker 5: Game four, like because Lebron had the fifty in game

1002
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 5: one and that kind of stole the show. But KT

1003
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:43,719
Speaker 5: had a game one of the two in Cleveland that

1004
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 5: was like one of the best individual basketball games I've

1005
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:47,720
Speaker 5: ever watched a guy play. It was like a forty

1006
00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:51,040
Speaker 5: something point triple double. He was dominating the game defensively,

1007
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 5: he was dominating the game.

1008
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:53,040
Speaker 6: On the glass.

1009
00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:55,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, had a bunch of blocks. He was

1010
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:57,879
Speaker 5: picking them apart and picking Roll as a passer hit

1011
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:00,239
Speaker 5: the biggest shot of the game at the end, like like.

1012
00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:04,439
Speaker 4: Are you talking about the three ball three point line?

1013
00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 5: It's it's bothering me that I can't remember exactly which

1014
00:44:06,680 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 5: game it was. There's either three or four. But like

1015
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 5: he had like where I literally watched a game and

1016
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 5: I was like, you know how I felt after Game

1017
00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:13,719
Speaker 5: one where I was like Lebron just played the best

1018
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 5: game I've ever seen. Like KD entered into that conversation

1019
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:19,680
Speaker 5: with that type of game. I think I think Kd's

1020
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:22,920
Speaker 5: ceiling is higher in that regard. That said, like, I

1021
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 5: do you know Bill Simmons calls it the championship?

1022
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,600
Speaker 3: Hold on, who do you who are you picking? Just again,

1023
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:29,880
Speaker 3: like who's on the.

1024
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,799
Speaker 7: I'm I'm picking KD. And but I still think Steph

1025
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:33,359
Speaker 7: is the best player.

1026
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 2: I'll tell you why, because I think that just because

1027
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:38,319
Speaker 2: someone is a bigger matchup nightmare does not make them

1028
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:40,879
Speaker 2: a better player necessarily, right, because you know, we we've

1029
00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:43,160
Speaker 2: discussed before, like if we were doing an all time

1030
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:46,399
Speaker 2: pick your start and five four run, you know, any

1031
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:49,839
Speaker 2: player at their peak throughout basketball history, I'm taking Shack first.

1032
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 2: And I don't think Shaq is the greatest player ever.

1033
00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:54,120
Speaker 2: Like I said, I think he's the biggest mismatch in

1034
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:56,839
Speaker 2: NBA history. Right, So just because I would pick KD

1035
00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:58,840
Speaker 2: in that situation, I don't think that that that you know,

1036
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 2: the gates what I said about Steph a better player, No,

1037
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:01,280
Speaker 2: it's just it's.

1038
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:04,399
Speaker 1: Just I think it's I think when we're talking about

1039
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 1: Katie is not just like a bigger mismatch, like he's

1040
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:10,080
Speaker 1: the best scorer in the history of basketball, you know

1041
00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:10,440
Speaker 1: what I mean.

1042
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:12,520
Speaker 4: And then he's better deficively too.

1043
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:14,320
Speaker 1: I think at one point with the Warriors, he's averaging

1044
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,399
Speaker 1: two blocks a game or nearly two blocks a game.

1045
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:19,160
Speaker 1: You feel me so like, and we talk about Steph

1046
00:45:19,280 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 1: is being food on the other end, So that's where

1047
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:23,320
Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, I mean, you know how I

1048
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 1: feel about bringing in defense when it comes to like

1049
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,359
Speaker 1: the best best basketball players, I mean, but I mean,

1050
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:32,200
Speaker 1: you know, but but but for me, I feel like,

1051
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 1: I mean, Katie is proved Like to me, Katie, I mean,

1052
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:39,360
Speaker 1: career wise, yes, I get it, But as far as basketball,

1053
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:42,480
Speaker 1: we're talking about somebody just hooping. And that's what we

1054
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:44,160
Speaker 1: talked about when we talked about the greatest. I think

1055
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:46,239
Speaker 1: that's why we say Lebron's best because he's a we're

1056
00:45:46,239 --> 00:45:48,320
Speaker 1: looking at me, and he's a better basketball player. I

1057
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 1: think Katie to me, like I didn't necessarily know what,

1058
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:51,799
Speaker 1: but I'm be thinking about a lot late. I think

1059
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 1: Katie's Katie's better and I mean, and that's and that's

1060
00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:57,440
Speaker 1: I mean, we're picking straws like you know, I mean,

1061
00:45:57,480 --> 00:45:58,479
Speaker 1: it's it's they're so close.

1062
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:00,239
Speaker 4: When we were talking about the top ten, you.

1063
00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 1: Know, I'll be like like five to through ten, like bro,

1064
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: you know, like you throw them anywhere in that top

1065
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:09,959
Speaker 1: ten and you know, like I'm not gonna really argue

1066
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:12,880
Speaker 1: with you, but just personally, I just I don't. I

1067
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:17,080
Speaker 1: don't understand how that chip was a big deal, you

1068
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: know what I mean, for for more more more so

1069
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 1: for STEP's career and that finals MVP was a big

1070
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 1: deal for STEP's career. You know, we needed that from

1071
00:46:23,560 --> 00:46:25,399
Speaker 1: Steph that got him in the top ten.

1072
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:26,880
Speaker 4: To me, you know what I mean?

1073
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:31,120
Speaker 1: But I still think when we take away circumstance, when

1074
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 1: circumstance was the same for both of them, even though

1075
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:37,440
Speaker 1: that was STEP's team, Katie was the better basketball player.

1076
00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:39,840
Speaker 4: And there were moments we talked about it with the Clippers.

1077
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 1: I think it was the first round when they just

1078
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,920
Speaker 1: fed KD like, Okay, we can't we can't figure this

1079
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 1: shit out. Katie's going to get us a fucking bucket,

1080
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: and he's also better on the defensive end.

1081
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 4: We're gonna give Katie the fucking ball. And so like

1082
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:56,520
Speaker 4: when you take circumstance away, I think Katie's just proven

1083
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:57,279
Speaker 4: to be better.

1084
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:00,399
Speaker 1: And that's and you know, y'all know, Like as much

1085
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:02,759
Speaker 1: as I've talked shit about Steph, you know what I mean, Like,

1086
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:05,640
Speaker 1: because I'm a bron fan, you know, I fucking love Steph.

1087
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: His game is fucking beautiful. I'm a basketball purist. You

1088
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:09,920
Speaker 1: can't be a basketball purist and not love what you

1089
00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:12,319
Speaker 1: see with Steph's doing that you want Steph's doing. Steph,

1090
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: it's maybe more exciting than anybody I've ever seen, with

1091
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:19,640
Speaker 1: Steph's being Steph, but in basketball, like as a better player.

1092
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 4: I don't see how we say Steph's better than Katie.

1093
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,640
Speaker 1: When we saw them both at their peak and Katie

1094
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:27,600
Speaker 1: looked like Bro, there were moments when Katie looked better

1095
00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:29,719
Speaker 1: than Bron. Like you talk about that series, I'm like

1096
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:32,840
Speaker 1: that series, Katie was the best basketball player, and I

1097
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:35,480
Speaker 1: even say twenty seventeen it felt like that, even though

1098
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,120
Speaker 1: Bron averaged a triple double, it felt like Katie was

1099
00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:42,279
Speaker 1: the better basketball player that in that series. So I've

1100
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 1: never it's hard for me to say Steph even though

1101
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:46,240
Speaker 1: I think Steph is top ten easily.

1102
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:47,839
Speaker 4: But that's just my personal film.

1103
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 5: So I disagree about twenty seventeen in twenty eighteen because

1104
00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 5: I do think, like like when Lebron's job is just

1105
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 5: so much harder than Katie and Steph's, Like I think sure,

1106
00:47:57,320 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 5: I think a lot of the conversations in those two

1107
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 5: years failed to account for the fact that, like, yeah,

1108
00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:05,239
Speaker 5: if you put the second and third best players in

1109
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:07,080
Speaker 5: the world on the same team against the best player

1110
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,680
Speaker 5: in the world, the two of them will look better

1111
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:12,200
Speaker 5: and probably win. Like that's that's just what's probably what's

1112
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 5: going to happen. And to your point, we're splitting hairs,

1113
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:17,360
Speaker 5: Like I think Lebron was clearly indiscernibly the best player

1114
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:20,319
Speaker 5: from twenty twelve to twenty twenty, but I think from

1115
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:23,880
Speaker 5: basically twenty fifteen on it was close, Like it was

1116
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:27,000
Speaker 5: always close in that regard. Now like it's to the

1117
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:29,760
Speaker 5: defense stuff is real, Like I mean, here's the reality.

1118
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:31,920
Speaker 5: Like KD when he wants to be is one of

1119
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:33,759
Speaker 5: the best defensive players in the world. It's funny that Luca,

1120
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:35,799
Speaker 5: Luca and the MAVs torched the Suns the other night.

1121
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 5: I don't know if you guys saw that game, and

1122
00:48:37,480 --> 00:48:42,080
Speaker 5: like literally almost made him quit and Luca was killing everybody. Yeah,

1123
00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:45,280
Speaker 5: gets Luca gets Yeah, Luca gets KD on a switch

1124
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:48,200
Speaker 5: on the left wing and literally like he tries to

1125
00:48:48,239 --> 00:48:50,520
Speaker 5: make a couple moves on him and then Luca's like,

1126
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:51,640
Speaker 5: ah fuck, it just gets.

1127
00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 6: Hurt of the ball.

1128
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:54,319
Speaker 5: He just like he wanted no parts of KDE because

1129
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 5: like Katie, Katie, legit legitimate is a problem. And then

1130
00:48:56,760 --> 00:48:58,000
Speaker 5: when we look back and it's like, hey, guess what,

1131
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:00,719
Speaker 5: Like in the Lakers series last years, went out of

1132
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 5: their way to spam attacking Steph all series long, like

1133
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 5: that was a real thing. Going back to twenty sixteen,

1134
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:08,640
Speaker 5: it's like biggest play of the series. We're going at Steph.

1135
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:10,880
Speaker 5: No one's doing that with KD and so I do

1136
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:12,680
Speaker 5: think that's an important element. But the flip side of

1137
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:15,320
Speaker 5: that is, I do think when you factor in Steph

1138
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:17,719
Speaker 5: hunting threes, which are a more efficient shot, and all

1139
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:19,480
Speaker 5: of his work off the ball and how that creates

1140
00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:22,760
Speaker 5: things easier opportunities for his teammates, I think Steph's clearly

1141
00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 5: a better offensive player, which is what makes it like

1142
00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 5: super close. But the thing is is hypotheticals don't really

1143
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 5: mean anything. Like if I was like, it'd be like

1144
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:33,560
Speaker 5: if I was like, oh, if I was six', Nine

1145
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:35,359
Speaker 5: i'd be playing in THE. Nba, okay, Cool But i'm

1146
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:37,920
Speaker 5: not six, Nine so like it doesn't make it. Different,

1147
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:40,400
Speaker 5: so like the reality is is that over the course

1148
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:43,680
Speaker 5: of this last you, know decade and a, half Like

1149
00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:47,280
Speaker 5: Steph curry more or less has had a more productive

1150
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:50,200
Speaker 5: basketball career in terms of winning basketball. Games now we

1151
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 5: can dive into the seventeen different factors that have manipulated

1152
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:55,880
Speaker 5: it one way or. Another but at the end of the,

1153
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 5: Day i'd rather just be, Like, hey we can have

1154
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,480
Speaker 5: a conversation about skill sets With katie And steph and

1155
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 5: break it, down or we can talk who gets the

1156
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:07,319
Speaker 5: championship belt based on who won more. Games then that's

1157
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 5: that the term that you, Know Bill simmons coin and

1158
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:12,439
Speaker 5: like the reality is is Like i'm a big believer

1159
00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:16,359
Speaker 5: in respecting the. Banner like Like, logan our mutual, Friend Logan,

1160
00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:18,920
Speaker 5: swam he always calls me a loyalist to the. Banner to,

1161
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,680
Speaker 5: me it's like like that that to me has to mean.

1162
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:25,800
Speaker 5: Something it has to mean. Something and so LIKE i,

1163
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 5: THINK i, think like it's okay to be, like who's

1164
00:50:28,320 --> 00:50:31,760
Speaker 5: a better all time basketball? Player K kt Your? Steph Clearly,

1165
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:34,799
Speaker 5: steph who's a better basketball? Player katie Your. Steph, okay

1166
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:36,720
Speaker 5: let's get into. It there's a lot of interesting stuff.

1167
00:50:36,760 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 2: There i'll SAY i was gonna say K. K i'll

1168
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:45,040
Speaker 2: say that there was ever a version Of katie that

1169
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:46,240
Speaker 2: was better than fifteen Sixteen.

1170
00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 5: STEPH i think That steph in twenty twenty two is

1171
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:55,279
Speaker 5: better than fifteen Sixteen. STEPH i think one of the,

1172
00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:57,720
Speaker 5: THINGS i think one of the things in fifteen sixteen

1173
00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:00,080
Speaker 5: that people don't realize is Like steph was barbecuing a

1174
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:04,000
Speaker 5: lot of traditional. Coverages it really wasn't until the playoffs

1175
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:07,680
Speaker 5: that you started to see teams consistently Blitz, steph and, so,

1176
00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:10,239
Speaker 5: LIKE i think a big part of that's not to

1177
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:12,320
Speaker 5: undercut his achievement in that, year but, like to, me

1178
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 5: what makes twenty twenty Two steph a better player is

1179
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:18,839
Speaker 5: like the league had fully and completely adapted to him

1180
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:22,880
Speaker 5: and he was still busting their. Ass like, that to

1181
00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 5: me is the. Difference but LIKE i go to the

1182
00:51:27,520 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 5: point of that, Question like we talked about this, earlier

1183
00:51:30,239 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 5: Like kd's best game is better Than steph's best game

1184
00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:35,239
Speaker 5: because he's seven feet. Tall like there's just there's no

1185
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:37,840
Speaker 5: other There's it's really not any more complicated than. That,

1186
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:39,640
Speaker 5: like he can hold it down for you on the,

1187
00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 5: glass he can hold it down for you defensively at the,

1188
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:44,360
Speaker 5: rim he can hold it down for you defensively on the. Perimeter,

1189
00:51:44,719 --> 00:51:47,759
Speaker 5: he LIKE, kd has always been an underrated. Passer that

1190
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:49,200
Speaker 5: was a big part of how they won In houston

1191
00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:50,920
Speaker 5: the other night was they were just, like screw, it

1192
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 5: let's give the ball TO. Kd he literally ran more

1193
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:55,560
Speaker 5: picking rolls Against houston than he had in any game all,

1194
00:51:55,680 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 5: year and they took the second best home defense in

1195
00:51:58,600 --> 00:52:01,800
Speaker 5: the league In houston and them and won. Comfortably and

1196
00:52:01,880 --> 00:52:05,279
Speaker 5: so Like, KAY i, THINK i think, yeah and like

1197
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:07,359
Speaker 5: and like it's always funny because when we talk about

1198
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 5: the the Like i'm sure you guys have hashed this

1199
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:11,359
Speaker 5: out already OR i don't, Know i'm not sure if

1200
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:13,880
Speaker 5: you guys, have but the whole, like, uh Did katie

1201
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 5: screw up Leaving Golden? State and like is this a?

1202
00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:19,400
Speaker 5: Failure because Now phoenix looks bad and it's Like brooklyn

1203
00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:25,759
Speaker 5: was this close to, winning like kat went out. There

1204
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:29,239
Speaker 5: do you remember when kat after that series was like

1205
00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 5: was LIKE i don't care when anybody says like we were, Fatigued, like,

1206
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:33,759
Speaker 5: yeah it's easy to say we would have, won but

1207
00:52:33,880 --> 00:52:38,040
Speaker 5: that's not necessarily. TRUE i entirely. Disagree The nets are

1208
00:52:38,120 --> 00:52:41,440
Speaker 5: beating The. Hawks they're beating The, hawks and then and

1209
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:44,239
Speaker 5: Then kyrie's healthy for the finals and they're beating The

1210
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:47,759
Speaker 5: suns like they were. Disclosed. Guys he was so incredible

1211
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:51,320
Speaker 5: in that playoff run that after the, series When jannis

1212
00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 5: won and put up big, numbers he got for the

1213
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:56,040
Speaker 5: microphone and was like that guy's better than.

1214
00:52:56,080 --> 00:53:01,440
Speaker 7: Me, yeah that's the best playoff series played in my.

1215
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:04,760
Speaker 7: Opinion that's so for me seeing.

1216
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:07,800
Speaker 1: THAT i don't THINK i Think katie could have in

1217
00:53:07,880 --> 00:53:11,239
Speaker 1: any Situation STEP's been, in could have they Still Worris

1218
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:13,320
Speaker 1: will still been, successful you know WHAT i. MEAN i

1219
00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:16,440
Speaker 1: don't Think steph could have done or made that series

1220
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:20,680
Speaker 1: close as As katie did Because harden had had one

1221
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 1: leg and and And kyrie was, hurt you know WHAT i.

1222
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,960
Speaker 1: Mean AND i think in THOSE i think a lot

1223
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:29,280
Speaker 1: of Where steph is good Is. Steph it's that system,

1224
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:31,400
Speaker 1: great you know WHAT i. Mean AND i, think like you,

1225
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:34,919
Speaker 1: Know steph is good at making a good team, better

1226
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 1: you know WHAT i. Mean like we we've talked about

1227
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:38,680
Speaker 1: that when they would like when they when they were,

1228
00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:41,759
Speaker 1: Struggling steph, struggled you feel. Me but in twenty twenty,

1229
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 1: two like you spoke, To steph was fucking. INSANE i

1230
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:47,160
Speaker 1: think that first half of the season was the Best.

1231
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:49,000
Speaker 1: STEPH i, think you, know he kind OF i think

1232
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:49,439
Speaker 1: some other.

1233
00:53:49,320 --> 00:53:49,839
Speaker 4: Ship was going.

1234
00:53:49,880 --> 00:53:52,759
Speaker 1: On he got hurt a little, bit got, yeah but,

1235
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 1: yeah but that that first half of the season was

1236
00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:57,560
Speaker 1: the best Step BUT i don't see them switching and

1237
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:01,919
Speaker 1: and the. Like we talked about winning. GAMES i Don't

1238
00:54:02,080 --> 00:54:04,080
Speaker 1: and this is like we said this. HYPOTHETICAL i don't

1239
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:07,920
Speaker 1: see them switching And steph winning those games That katie couldn't,

1240
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,359
Speaker 1: win or making this This sun's team better than they are,

1241
00:54:11,520 --> 00:54:15,319
Speaker 1: now or making the next. Team are those nets teams

1242
00:54:15,360 --> 00:54:17,000
Speaker 1: do things that they, could they wouldn't they didn't. DO

1243
00:54:17,239 --> 00:54:18,040
Speaker 1: i just don't see that.

1244
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:22,480
Speaker 5: One last piece too really, Quickly like it's a game of.

1245
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 5: Inches like If Klay thompson doesn't get hot in game,

1246
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:27,080
Speaker 5: six how do we look at The STEPH kd debate over?

1247
00:54:27,160 --> 00:54:30,760
Speaker 5: Time because through about six, games through six, Games katie

1248
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:33,640
Speaker 5: was better and The thunder were going to one and

1249
00:54:34,120 --> 00:54:38,080
Speaker 5: Then clay literally went Like clay went like fucking, insane

1250
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:38,759
Speaker 5: and that's.

1251
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:42,239
Speaker 4: Where play, began right and then, began and.

1252
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:45,239
Speaker 5: Then steph was unbelievable in game. Seven it like to be,

1253
00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:47,960
Speaker 5: clear but like it's so funny how perception kind of

1254
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 5: hinges on these like singular moments in, Time and.

1255
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:53,400
Speaker 1: That's why that's WHAT i talk about. It but the

1256
00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: perception is really, interesting being that one thing can change

1257
00:54:56,520 --> 00:54:58,840
Speaker 1: something so. Much AND i think That, CHIP i, mean

1258
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 1: at least For tyler has switched. Things you know What

1259
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:02,520
Speaker 1: i'm saying, DRAFT.

1260
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:03,920
Speaker 8: I would say not JUST i would say that that

1261
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:07,560
Speaker 8: is the. Feeling, Yeah LIKE i don't think that's Just

1262
00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:09,640
Speaker 8: tyler and. ME i think That i'm speaking Of tyler

1263
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:12,439
Speaker 8: BECAUSE i Know tyler cicly. Right he says he says

1264
00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:15,120
Speaker 8: he Thinks steph is a better basketball. Player you didn't say,

1265
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:18,759
Speaker 8: that you said. Career, yeah so that But i'm speaking To,

1266
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,080
Speaker 8: YEAH i think there's no Question steph has a better.

1267
00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:24,480
Speaker 8: Career like if any all time lift that the list

1268
00:55:24,560 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 8: that has kd Over steph is just it's it's going

1269
00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:30,960
Speaker 8: based on personal. Preference But i'm not Even i'm not

1270
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:33,000
Speaker 8: even gonna SAY i Think kadie's better in the. VACUUM

1271
00:55:33,040 --> 00:55:35,560
Speaker 8: i just think it's really really. Close like like they

1272
00:55:35,800 --> 00:55:39,839
Speaker 8: they they they're. They they're fundamentally different players. Too that's

1273
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 8: the thing that always gets silly in the. Conversations like

1274
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:44,839
Speaker 8: even when we're Talking lebron AND, mj it's like it's, like, oh,

1275
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:46,719
Speaker 8: yeah WELL mj did this better And lebron did this.

1276
00:55:46,760 --> 00:55:48,920
Speaker 8: Better it's, like, yeah, no, shit they're entirely different. Players

1277
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 8: they're completely different. Positions it's, like of COURSE mj was

1278
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:55,279
Speaker 8: a better late game shot. Creator that was the one

1279
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:57,800
Speaker 8: thing he was better than everybody in the. WORLD a but,

1280
00:55:57,920 --> 00:55:59,960
Speaker 8: like there's no question that if you wanted a team

1281
00:56:00,160 --> 00:56:02,760
Speaker 8: a guy to run an offense for forty eight, Minutes

1282
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:03,799
Speaker 8: lebron's just better at.

1283
00:56:03,840 --> 00:56:04,279
Speaker 7: That he just.

1284
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 5: Is so it's like it's it's it's always, complicated.

1285
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:08,440
Speaker 7: Yes And i'm.

1286
00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:11,320
Speaker 2: Not i'm Now i'm not like submit boot all the

1287
00:56:11,360 --> 00:56:14,080
Speaker 2: way down On. Steph you, know it's extremely, Close like,

1288
00:56:14,160 --> 00:56:15,400
Speaker 2: Shit katie could have an amazing.

1289
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:16,480
Speaker 7: Post y'all said it wasn't.

1290
00:56:16,480 --> 00:56:19,120
Speaker 4: Close y'all said it wasn't. Close y'all said it's not.

1291
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:20,400
Speaker 4: Close y'all said it no.

1292
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:24,480
Speaker 5: All, time all time in terms of the Career, careersok,

1293
00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:25,239
Speaker 5: career we were saying.

1294
00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:27,319
Speaker 7: Close, yeah because it.

1295
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:29,919
Speaker 3: Because because, again regardless of what happens from this, POINT

1296
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:31,600
Speaker 3: i know what you're gonna, say maybe The sun maybe

1297
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:32,440
Speaker 3: maybe The sun's win.

1298
00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:34,480
Speaker 6: CHAMPIONSHIP i don't see that, happening but, maybe.

1299
00:56:34,360 --> 00:56:34,840
Speaker 4: But maybe that.

1300
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:38,280
Speaker 3: Happens, Right but regardless of whatever else, happens we're gonna

1301
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 3: get spammed with for the rest of our fucking. Life

1302
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,920
Speaker 3: Steph curry has twice as many three pointers made is

1303
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:46,840
Speaker 3: this like that ship is just gonna be and that

1304
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:48,839
Speaker 3: is what the game is, now, Right so, like those,

1305
00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 3: numbers to me are a big part of this separation.

1306
00:56:52,040 --> 00:56:53,759
Speaker 4: In addition to the twenty twenty two. Finals but go.

1307
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:57,920
Speaker 1: AHEAD i was wondering where does, like is there a

1308
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:01,839
Speaker 1: point where that you you're eye tests surpasses what you see.

1309
00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:05,240
Speaker 1: Analytically is there a point where you're like the. Numbers

1310
00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:07,840
Speaker 1: don't say, it but this motherfucker is a?

1311
00:57:07,880 --> 00:57:10,960
Speaker 4: Hooper you. KNOW i see something THAT i just wonder

1312
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:14,080
Speaker 4: where that meets being you, have like you know those two.

1313
00:57:14,160 --> 00:57:19,040
Speaker 5: Minds, well So i'm you. Got i'm actually anti analytics

1314
00:57:19,160 --> 00:57:22,360
Speaker 5: in a lot of, ways specifically as it pertains to catch.

1315
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:25,720
Speaker 5: ALLS i Just i'm, LIKE i saw this Thing Andy

1316
00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:28,520
Speaker 5: bailey put out from Bleacher report put out yesterday and

1317
00:57:28,520 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 5: it was, like this is a ranking of EVERY nba

1318
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:36,320
Speaker 5: player based on all the catch alls averaged, together and

1319
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:39,480
Speaker 5: it's Like Raptor lebron like all those weird. Metrics AND

1320
00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:42,280
Speaker 5: i literally looked at that And i'm, like this is completely, useful,

1321
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:50,480
Speaker 5: right we are not pro. Raptor, Yeah but like like

1322
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:52,520
Speaker 5: So i'll give you an, Example, like SO i use

1323
00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 5: the the primary data THAT i use is like possession

1324
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:00,480
Speaker 5: based and play type based, data so like and even

1325
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:02,600
Speaker 5: that stuff Spot So i'll give you an, example Like Anthony,

1326
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:06,440
Speaker 5: davis he's getting you one point one four points per

1327
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:11,080
Speaker 5: post up including. Passes now that is that even that

1328
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:14,760
Speaker 5: has factors that go because guess what he's been posting

1329
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:17,120
Speaker 5: up the last few games in this dumbass starting, lineup

1330
00:58:17,320 --> 00:58:19,320
Speaker 5: getting triple team. THAT i was literally thinking As i'm

1331
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:21,480
Speaker 5: watching The hornets last, Night i'm, like, man as long

1332
00:58:21,520 --> 00:58:23,640
Speaker 5: as long as ad can Keep dunkan over three, dudes

1333
00:58:23,640 --> 00:58:25,920
Speaker 5: i think they're gonna be. Fine but, like like the the,

1334
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:28,640
Speaker 5: Like but what that tells me, though just as a

1335
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:31,440
Speaker 5: point of, data at least for This lakers, Team, like,

1336
00:58:31,600 --> 00:58:36,400
Speaker 5: okay like when we post Up Anthony, davis we generally

1337
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:39,480
Speaker 5: get a good. Shot we have extensive data that shows.

1338
00:58:39,560 --> 00:58:41,920
Speaker 5: That then we can look at things like spot up,

1339
00:58:42,120 --> 00:58:45,040
Speaker 5: Efficiency so, like, okay this guy gets a spot up

1340
00:58:45,080 --> 00:58:47,320
Speaker 5: opportunity for this guy is worth this many. POINTS a

1341
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:49,360
Speaker 5: spot up opportunity for this guy is worth this many.

1342
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 5: Points you can look into all these and those are

1343
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:53,560
Speaker 5: just two, examples but there's so many different pieces of

1344
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:56,960
Speaker 5: data for play types where it's Like i'm Taking i'm

1345
00:58:57,000 --> 00:59:00,919
Speaker 5: not trying to take this unbelievably, complex some beautiful game

1346
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:05,120
Speaker 5: of basketball and crunch it down into one, number which

1347
00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:07,360
Speaker 5: is the dumbest Shit i've ever heard in my entire

1348
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:10,000
Speaker 5: life and is doomed to. Fail AND i hope those

1349
00:59:10,080 --> 00:59:12,600
Speaker 5: nerds try for all eternity because they're never going to

1350
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:12,960
Speaker 5: figure it.

1351
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:13,120
Speaker 4: Out.

1352
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:16,760
Speaker 5: Problem they will never ever ever be able to be, like,

1353
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:18,760
Speaker 5: well our model tells us that this guy is the best,

1354
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 5: player and this guy is gonna. Win that'll never that'll never.

1355
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:23,920
Speaker 5: Happen like it's they're they're going to fail forever in.

1356
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:28,040
Speaker 5: Perpetuity but but there is useful data in there if

1357
00:59:28,080 --> 00:59:30,520
Speaker 5: you know where to look and like and to, me, like,

1358
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:34,120
Speaker 5: uh just like we were talking About Joel embiid in

1359
00:59:34,240 --> 00:59:38,240
Speaker 5: the past with, Foulgrifting, like as a, competitor you should

1360
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:40,720
Speaker 5: look to gain every advantage you can and so taking

1361
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:42,960
Speaker 5: advantage of the. Data, yeah and you should take advantage

1362
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:45,080
Speaker 5: of the data that's available to. You so Like i'll

1363
00:59:45,120 --> 00:59:47,200
Speaker 5: give you an an example of a flaw with an eye.

1364
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:49,880
Speaker 5: Test katie is considered one of the best pull up

1365
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:51,080
Speaker 5: shooters in the history of THE.

1366
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 4: Nba so Is.

1367
00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:55,360
Speaker 5: Steph But steph is a monumentally better pull up shooter

1368
00:59:55,400 --> 00:59:57,480
Speaker 5: because he takes so many pull up threes that they're

1369
00:59:57,560 --> 00:59:59,960
Speaker 5: just straight up worth more. Points so that's an example

1370
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:02,720
Speaker 5: of an eye test thing where it's, like, Actually denver was,

1371
01:00:02,840 --> 01:00:05,360
Speaker 5: like we'll live With katie taking these contested pull up

1372
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:07,840
Speaker 5: mid raine jump shots because they're really only worth like

1373
01:00:08,240 --> 01:00:11,640
Speaker 5: zero point nine to four points per, shot Right versus,

1374
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 5: man if we run drop coverage and we Give steph

1375
01:00:14,120 --> 01:00:17,040
Speaker 5: pull up, threes that's worth like one point one seven

1376
01:00:17,160 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 5: points per. Shot that's untenable for our, defense. Right so,

1377
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:22,640
Speaker 5: like those are where data can be, useful BUT i

1378
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:27,120
Speaker 5: always lean eye, test especially When i'm evaluating players like

1379
01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:31,040
Speaker 5: De Jontay. Murray, today everyone's, like, oh his rim finishing is,

1380
01:00:31,080 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 5: down and it, is BUT i dug into it this

1381
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:35,000
Speaker 5: morning And i'm watching the tape And i'm, like but

1382
01:00:35,120 --> 01:00:36,520
Speaker 5: no one can stay in front of the, guy so,

1383
01:00:36,720 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 5: like and a lot of these miss layups are leading

1384
01:00:39,840 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 5: to offensive rebound putbacks for guys Like Clint, capella And i'm,

1385
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:44,240
Speaker 5: like so, like that would be an example of a

1386
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:45,720
Speaker 5: thing where it's, like if you just looked at, it you're, like,

1387
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:48,280
Speaker 5: oh De Jontay, murray he's making you know less than

1388
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:51,080
Speaker 5: fifty percent of his layups this, year but he's attempting

1389
01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:53,680
Speaker 5: six tenths of a layup more than he did last.

1390
01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:55,720
Speaker 5: Year so he's getting to the rim more, frequently and

1391
01:00:55,800 --> 01:00:58,360
Speaker 5: he's consistently beating people off the dribble and engaging the rim.

1392
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:00,520
Speaker 5: Protector so that's an example of a piece to data

1393
01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:03,960
Speaker 5: that actually is kind of misrepresenting the value of what

1394
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:06,720
Speaker 5: De Jontay murray brings to the table as a slasher

1395
01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:08,920
Speaker 5: and so like to, me they always go hand in,

1396
01:01:09,040 --> 01:01:11,480
Speaker 5: hand but fuck the catch alls like, that to me

1397
01:01:11,640 --> 01:01:12,920
Speaker 5: is the most ridiculous Shit i've ever.

1398
01:01:13,000 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 1: Seen, Yeah i'm TAKING i think numbers don't take into

1399
01:01:17,320 --> 01:01:20,080
Speaker 1: account a lot of circumstance and, situation you know WHAT i.

1400
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:21,960
Speaker 1: Mean you have to watch the games to release. YOU

1401
01:01:22,000 --> 01:01:24,160
Speaker 1: i think the Aye tis is really. Important but one

1402
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:25,680
Speaker 1: THING i thought you brought up too was the fact

1403
01:01:25,720 --> 01:01:28,440
Speaker 1: that the game is so. Beautiful why look at it

1404
01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:31,640
Speaker 1: in programming? Language it's not the, matrix, Bro why do

1405
01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:34,000
Speaker 1: you see ones and zeros where you looking at a?

1406
01:01:34,080 --> 01:01:35,919
Speaker 4: Game this is fucking. Art enjoyed.

1407
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:37,320
Speaker 1: It that's not why we fell in love with this

1408
01:01:37,360 --> 01:01:39,600
Speaker 1: shit talking about it like like it's a math you,

1409
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:40,520
Speaker 1: know like long.

1410
01:01:40,440 --> 01:01:41,920
Speaker 4: Division whatever the, fuck you know WHAT i?

1411
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:44,280
Speaker 1: Mean, like, YEAH i THINK i think THERE'S i think

1412
01:01:44,760 --> 01:01:47,600
Speaker 1: that analytics are really important AND i really enjoy. Them

1413
01:01:48,000 --> 01:01:49,960
Speaker 1: but when we're just talking about them from that standard,

1414
01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 1: alone like those catch, alls like you, SAID i just

1415
01:01:51,760 --> 01:01:54,400
Speaker 1: think we're losing the essence of why we love the

1416
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:57,840
Speaker 1: fucking game and why the game is. Beautiful, anyway my

1417
01:01:57,880 --> 01:01:58,400
Speaker 1: bad tell to go.

1418
01:01:58,400 --> 01:01:58,640
Speaker 4: Ahead.

1419
01:01:58,720 --> 01:02:02,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, No i've always, said Like i've always likened advanced

1420
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:05,440
Speaker 2: analytics like YOUR, gps, Right LIKE i believe that it

1421
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:06,920
Speaker 2: could be a two that can help you see things.

1422
01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:08,400
Speaker 2: Better like you, know there's sounds where you put some

1423
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:09,920
Speaker 2: shit in YOUR, Gps you're, like oh, shit this is

1424
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:11,680
Speaker 2: a short cut THAT i never knew. About and then

1425
01:02:11,720 --> 01:02:13,880
Speaker 2: there's times where you, know you're putting some shit in

1426
01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 2: YOUR gps trying to go home and it's gonna take

1427
01:02:16,320 --> 01:02:18,760
Speaker 2: you like twenty minutes out the way through a fucking

1428
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:19,320
Speaker 2: eight dollars.

1429
01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:21,080
Speaker 7: Toll you're, like hell, no just get me to the

1430
01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:22,480
Speaker 7: interstate AND i got it from, here right.

1431
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:25,760
Speaker 2: RIGHT i, remember like last, year you, know some people

1432
01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:28,080
Speaker 2: who are going hard For yolkics during THAT mvp, race

1433
01:02:28,240 --> 01:02:30,560
Speaker 2: they they were pointing to certain advanced analytics that Said

1434
01:02:30,600 --> 01:02:33,160
Speaker 2: yolkic was a better defender THAN embiid AND i was,

1435
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:35,360
Speaker 2: like come, on, MAN i was, LIKE i was, like

1436
01:02:35,440 --> 01:02:37,080
Speaker 2: let's pump the brakes, here, right like going back to MY,

1437
01:02:37,200 --> 01:02:40,000
Speaker 2: gps you, know fucking. Analogy i'm, like if you're gonna

1438
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 2: take me to to Fucking yokic is a better defender

1439
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 2: Than Embid, Turnpike i'm not going that, route, bro you

1440
01:02:45,840 --> 01:02:46,160
Speaker 2: know What i'm.

1441
01:02:46,160 --> 01:02:48,200
Speaker 7: Saying i'm not paying that eight dollars, toe you know

1442
01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:48,480
Speaker 7: What i'm.

1443
01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 4: Saying SO i do.

1444
01:02:49,200 --> 01:02:51,600
Speaker 2: THAT i love, analytics and LIKE i, SAID i think

1445
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:53,640
Speaker 2: they're a useful tube that can help you see the game.

1446
01:02:53,680 --> 01:02:55,920
Speaker 2: Better but you have to know when you LIKE i,

1447
01:02:55,960 --> 01:02:58,600
Speaker 2: said when when when you when YOUR gps is fucking

1448
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:00,600
Speaker 2: up in certain situations With, Anna that's.

1449
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:02,440
Speaker 5: The funniest part about the catch all thing is like

1450
01:03:02,520 --> 01:03:04,919
Speaker 5: when they see something that like fits their, narrative they're,

1451
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:07,520
Speaker 5: like holy, shit look at This yoki's better. Defender but

1452
01:03:07,640 --> 01:03:09,800
Speaker 5: like a time it doesn't make. Sense they're, like, oh,

1453
01:03:09,880 --> 01:03:11,880
Speaker 5: well catch all's are a flawed, system like you, know

1454
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:15,560
Speaker 5: Doesn't it's very selective in confirmation biases with the way

1455
01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:17,480
Speaker 5: that they use that kind of. Stuff and, again LIKE

1456
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:20,080
Speaker 5: i want to be clear BECAUSE i was being pretty derogatory.

1457
01:03:20,160 --> 01:03:22,080
Speaker 5: Earlier there are a lot of there are a lot

1458
01:03:22,120 --> 01:03:25,880
Speaker 5: of analytics professionals out there that that are hunting useful

1459
01:03:25,920 --> 01:03:29,280
Speaker 5: data and that make it like cleaning the, glass for,

1460
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:32,160
Speaker 5: instance does a really nice job like sorting into Specific it's, like,

1461
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:34,120
Speaker 5: oh let's how about we just take offensive rating of

1462
01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:37,160
Speaker 5: only half court possessions because like when you get to the,

1463
01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:39,280
Speaker 5: playoffs like teams are just more locked in in transition

1464
01:03:39,400 --> 01:03:41,000
Speaker 5: defense and they get back and they build a, wall

1465
01:03:41,240 --> 01:03:43,280
Speaker 5: they take away those types of. Possessions the game solos,

1466
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:44,720
Speaker 5: down it's more in the half. Court like that's a

1467
01:03:44,840 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 5: useful piece of. Data like there's so many different like

1468
01:03:48,600 --> 01:03:51,440
Speaker 5: like there's a lot of use useful data out, there

1469
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:54,320
Speaker 5: like nearest defender. DATA i find that useful with catch

1470
01:03:54,360 --> 01:03:57,080
Speaker 5: and shoot, stuff like when one of the reasons WHY

1471
01:03:57,120 --> 01:03:58,880
Speaker 5: i was excited About victor Wembin yama is like he

1472
01:03:58,960 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 5: shot really poorly last, year but if you like filtered

1473
01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:04,880
Speaker 5: out to like when he got a chance to really

1474
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 5: set his feet and take his, time he was making,

1475
01:04:08,360 --> 01:04:10,960
Speaker 5: them but like he would always disrupt his energy transfer

1476
01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:13,520
Speaker 5: when guys would be close and contesting and swiping and so,

1477
01:04:13,640 --> 01:04:15,960
Speaker 5: LIKE i feel pretty comfortable that like five years from,

1478
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:18,240
Speaker 5: Now victor is gonna be a really good shooter because

1479
01:04:18,280 --> 01:04:21,240
Speaker 5: clearly the touch is. There he just he struggles shooting

1480
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:23,760
Speaker 5: contested shots because he gets antsy with his. Form, Right,

1481
01:04:23,960 --> 01:04:26,640
Speaker 5: like there's so much useful data out, there it's just

1482
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 5: a lot of people are digging down the wrong.

1483
01:04:28,120 --> 01:04:31,760
Speaker 2: Holes, WELL i, think you, know like there's there's quite

1484
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:34,000
Speaker 2: a few people in the analytics community WHO i, love

1485
01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:37,120
Speaker 2: like Like Kurt goldsberry For. Instant i'm a huge fan

1486
01:04:37,200 --> 01:04:39,600
Speaker 2: of his ship because he makes analytics, fun you know

1487
01:04:39,640 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 2: What i'm, Saying, like so so, yeah we're not at,

1488
01:04:41,480 --> 01:04:43,600
Speaker 2: all you, know staking our flag here against the, nerves.

1489
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,400
Speaker 4: Using, Analytics using.

1490
01:04:47,280 --> 01:04:50,520
Speaker 1: Analytics as the bumper on the bumpers on the bowling

1491
01:04:50,560 --> 01:04:51,920
Speaker 1: alley is, great you.

1492
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:52,120
Speaker 4: Know WHAT i.

1493
01:04:52,200 --> 01:04:54,960
Speaker 1: Mean If i'm going, left throw me a. Number, okay,

1494
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:56,920
Speaker 1: Yeah i'm, tweaking thank, you you know WHAT i.

1495
01:04:57,000 --> 01:04:58,720
Speaker 7: Mean you know you feel.

1496
01:04:58,800 --> 01:05:00,680
Speaker 1: Me but when it's like when it's you, know it's

1497
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:03,800
Speaker 1: the bowling alley and the beauty is the are the,

1498
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:05,960
Speaker 1: bumpers you, KNOW i, MEAN i think that's where we,

1499
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:07,680
Speaker 1: right you know WHAT i.

1500
01:05:07,720 --> 01:05:10,000
Speaker 3: Mean that's a good analogy IF i, can IF i

1501
01:05:10,080 --> 01:05:14,200
Speaker 3: can synthesize the whole conversation around the value of COACHES

1502
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:18,520
Speaker 3: kd Versus, steph how small these points are that change

1503
01:05:18,560 --> 01:05:21,880
Speaker 3: perception all this other, Stuff like the limits of statistics

1504
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:24,800
Speaker 3: to me in every sport are that they don't there's

1505
01:05:24,880 --> 01:05:29,800
Speaker 3: no way to actually quantify physical skill and, ability which

1506
01:05:29,840 --> 01:05:31,760
Speaker 3: are the things that we rank and judge players, on

1507
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:35,720
Speaker 3: because the statistics are defined by coaches. Decisions, Right so

1508
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:39,760
Speaker 3: if you had a player who in nineteen sixty went

1509
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:42,880
Speaker 3: ten for ten in half court, shots and it just

1510
01:05:42,960 --> 01:05:45,840
Speaker 3: so happened this player actually was the greatest half court

1511
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:48,320
Speaker 3: shooter in the history of, basketball would have shot ninety

1512
01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:50,840
Speaker 3: percent if he was shooting fifteen of, those we would

1513
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:54,320
Speaker 3: never know that unless he ended up on a franchise

1514
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:58,640
Speaker 3: that completely rewired their offense around letting this dude shoot

1515
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:01,880
Speaker 3: half court, shots brought in players to allow him to

1516
01:06:02,000 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 3: do that the most. Efficiently AND i do think when

1517
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 3: we talk about A kd and His, steph that's what's

1518
01:06:06,720 --> 01:06:09,480
Speaker 3: so fascinating About. Steph you're talking about someone with a

1519
01:06:09,520 --> 01:06:13,720
Speaker 3: super super specialized skill set who did develop skills around.

1520
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:16,320
Speaker 3: That but who's the best shooter of all time and

1521
01:06:16,520 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 3: landed in a place that was happy to pay a luxury,

1522
01:06:19,200 --> 01:06:22,880
Speaker 3: tax that that hired coaches who valued his skill and

1523
01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:25,840
Speaker 3: built a dynasty around. Him that dude could have landed

1524
01:06:25,880 --> 01:06:29,040
Speaker 3: on twenty five other franchises and not Been Steph.

1525
01:06:29,120 --> 01:06:33,640
Speaker 6: Curry and then we have forget, right right right.

1526
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:37,960
Speaker 3: Yes and then IN kd you have almost the exact,

1527
01:06:38,080 --> 01:06:40,440
Speaker 3: opposite where you have a dude who look at the

1528
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:42,920
Speaker 3: other players in the top, ten they all have a

1529
01:06:43,040 --> 01:06:45,920
Speaker 3: team that they're the guy for that. Team they're the

1530
01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:48,200
Speaker 3: guy for a, Dynasty they're a guy for an. Era

1531
01:06:48,880 --> 01:06:55,680
Speaker 3: AND kd is A sonics Thunder Nets sons like you,

1532
01:06:55,760 --> 01:06:59,880
Speaker 3: Know warriors like to use the baseball thing if you

1533
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:02,320
Speaker 3: When katie goes into The hall Of, fame whose hat

1534
01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:02,600
Speaker 3: is he?

1535
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:05,800
Speaker 4: Wearing? Right like he's he's going to The.

1536
01:07:09,760 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 5: Can we all? Agree can we can we just like just, say,

1537
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 5: okay SEE i feel like it should be, okay see

1538
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:14,840
Speaker 5: it should.

1539
01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:18,240
Speaker 3: Be but my, god how long ago was that at this?

1540
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:21,280
Speaker 3: Point and no one here thinks he's retiring with The, suns,

1541
01:07:21,400 --> 01:07:23,400
Speaker 3: right you know WHAT i? Mean like that's gonna be

1542
01:07:23,560 --> 01:07:30,280
Speaker 3: six teams, ago but it would be so dope just

1543
01:07:30,480 --> 01:07:33,800
Speaker 3: happened to be drafted by A sonics team that was

1544
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:36,640
Speaker 3: in a city environment that was appealing to him as

1545
01:07:36,680 --> 01:07:38,240
Speaker 3: a young dude who was rich.

1546
01:07:38,400 --> 01:07:42,280
Speaker 6: And then got moved To Oklahoma. City like that just

1547
01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 6: so happened to be what happened to this.

1548
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 3: Dude so when he got a, Chance oh, wow, STRUCTURE

1549
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:49,040
Speaker 3: i don't have to be the end all be all

1550
01:07:49,400 --> 01:07:51,480
Speaker 3: the people around, me or with all due, respect a

1551
01:07:51,520 --> 01:07:54,800
Speaker 3: little more mature on the, court Maybe James harden And Russell.

1552
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:56,200
Speaker 4: Westbrook of, course that was.

1553
01:07:56,240 --> 01:08:00,840
Speaker 3: Appealing thebility of the coaching right that you've seen that

1554
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:03,400
Speaker 3: they're willing to build teams, around like you talked About

1555
01:08:03,560 --> 01:08:07,560
Speaker 3: jason bridging coaches philosophy to, players skills Set Steve kurz

1556
01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:10,760
Speaker 3: that guy for this, era right so like of course

1557
01:08:10,800 --> 01:08:12,640
Speaker 3: that appealed to, him and then of course he. Won

1558
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:15,200
Speaker 3: like so it's just, that but it's the fascinating thing

1559
01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:17,920
Speaker 3: to me because there won't be another player like Kd

1560
01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:21,559
Speaker 3: like you get a dude Like giannis and like he's

1561
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:23,960
Speaker 3: on a, franchise it's, like we'll build. It, well do

1562
01:08:23,960 --> 01:08:25,439
Speaker 3: you want to be the Mayor, Brough, like do you

1563
01:08:25,479 --> 01:08:27,240
Speaker 3: want to be the governor of this? State we'll make,

1564
01:08:27,280 --> 01:08:28,840
Speaker 3: sure you're the governor of this state if it will

1565
01:08:28,920 --> 01:08:31,880
Speaker 3: keep you, here, Right but it's kd is just this

1566
01:08:32,040 --> 01:08:34,559
Speaker 3: dude who, again like maybe he goes from The suns

1567
01:08:34,600 --> 01:08:37,080
Speaker 3: to another team and wins two championships in the next two,

1568
01:08:37,160 --> 01:08:39,479
Speaker 3: years and that's how he's, like we just Will it's

1569
01:08:39,560 --> 01:08:42,200
Speaker 3: a totally unique case in basketball.

1570
01:08:42,320 --> 01:08:45,720
Speaker 1: History the only place where he would be revered like

1571
01:08:45,880 --> 01:08:47,640
Speaker 1: the other players in the top team would have Been,

1572
01:08:47,680 --> 01:08:50,880
Speaker 1: okac you know WHAT i. Mean but he was playing Alongside,

1573
01:08:50,960 --> 01:08:53,400
Speaker 1: westbrook who thought he was the best player on the, court.

1574
01:08:53,360 --> 01:08:55,800
Speaker 6: AND i thought he was the best, player, RIGHT i,

1575
01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:57,200
Speaker 6: mean you know What i'm, saying and so and.

1576
01:08:57,280 --> 01:08:59,600
Speaker 1: So then he goes to The warriors and regardless of

1577
01:08:59,720 --> 01:09:02,479
Speaker 1: what he did in the, court that's Steph. City they

1578
01:09:02,520 --> 01:09:06,080
Speaker 1: don't give A then he goes to the, nets and you,

1579
01:09:06,160 --> 01:09:10,280
Speaker 1: know Like harden and And kyrie are like the opposite of,

1580
01:09:10,360 --> 01:09:12,479
Speaker 1: stability you know WHAT i, Mean and he did the

1581
01:09:12,600 --> 01:09:12,920
Speaker 1: best he.

1582
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:16,240
Speaker 6: Could pandemic.

1583
01:09:17,479 --> 01:09:17,519
Speaker 4: Was.

1584
01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:18,720
Speaker 7: Good that next team was.

1585
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:21,720
Speaker 5: Good was kicking. Everyone they were kicking everybody's. Ass But

1586
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:24,280
Speaker 5: kyrie was in a contract situation where his team wouldn't

1587
01:09:24,280 --> 01:09:25,800
Speaker 5: extend him and he had no choice to go but

1588
01:09:25,920 --> 01:09:27,560
Speaker 5: to get a trade somewhere where they, wouldet where he

1589
01:09:27,560 --> 01:09:30,760
Speaker 5: would get, extended like like he talk about bad, luck they,

1590
01:09:30,960 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 5: LIKE i bet You kyrie And katie in a vacuum

1591
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:35,320
Speaker 5: would have stayed In brooklyn and.

1592
01:09:35,400 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 4: Then but and also the thing With, steve why do

1593
01:09:37,200 --> 01:09:39,000
Speaker 4: you Have Steve nash coaching these?

1594
01:09:39,080 --> 01:09:41,519
Speaker 1: Guys why do you have a guy go out and

1595
01:09:41,560 --> 01:09:44,360
Speaker 1: get a bucket coaching, dude if you just have some.

1596
01:09:44,520 --> 01:09:47,639
Speaker 1: Sex we saw that against the fucking The. Celtics, nigga

1597
01:09:47,720 --> 01:09:49,479
Speaker 1: you need to have some. Sex there needs to be a.

1598
01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:52,120
Speaker 4: Philosophy the philosophy was just hoop.

1599
01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:56,719
Speaker 7: Nigga, yeah, yeah.

1600
01:10:00,360 --> 01:10:00,479
Speaker 4: Right.

1601
01:10:00,680 --> 01:10:04,599
Speaker 1: Exactly give him a decent coach and have that squad

1602
01:10:04,600 --> 01:10:07,360
Speaker 1: and they probably still win even with the instability of you,

1603
01:10:07,439 --> 01:10:10,599
Speaker 1: Know kyrie And. Harden mentally you feel, me but, yes you're,

1604
01:10:10,680 --> 01:10:13,439
Speaker 1: Right so like there's like that's why WHEN i talk about,

1605
01:10:13,479 --> 01:10:16,560
Speaker 1: basketball like we gotta take career an, account you know

1606
01:10:16,560 --> 01:10:16,680
Speaker 1: WHAT i.

1607
01:10:16,760 --> 01:10:18,640
Speaker 4: Mean of, course we're talking about all time greats for

1608
01:10:18,800 --> 01:10:19,599
Speaker 4: show you feel. Me it's.

1609
01:10:19,600 --> 01:10:22,200
Speaker 1: Important but If i'm talking to the homies about, Hoops

1610
01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:25,360
Speaker 1: i'm not talking about, circumstance But i'm talking about fucking.

1611
01:10:25,120 --> 01:10:27,519
Speaker 4: Hoop and a lot of that's from.

1612
01:10:27,800 --> 01:10:31,360
Speaker 1: Ye IF i write about, it IF i wrote about,

1613
01:10:31,400 --> 01:10:33,640
Speaker 1: BASKETBALL i was still over y'aho writing about. Shit, bro

1614
01:10:34,320 --> 01:10:36,240
Speaker 1: you know What i'm. Saying you got to take career in, account.

1615
01:10:36,280 --> 01:10:39,120
Speaker 1: Right but If i'm talking to my, niggas you feel. Me, Like,

1616
01:10:39,280 --> 01:10:41,799
Speaker 1: Bro i'm talking to my. Niggas we talking about, hoops,

1617
01:10:42,040 --> 01:10:43,120
Speaker 1: Right so that's Where i'm met with.

1618
01:10:43,200 --> 01:10:45,240
Speaker 4: It you feel. Me but if with everything you said about,

1619
01:10:45,280 --> 01:10:46,040
Speaker 4: career if.

1620
01:10:45,920 --> 01:10:48,360
Speaker 5: We can agree That katie was the best player in

1621
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:50,800
Speaker 5: the twenty twenty One Eastern conference semis against The, bucks

1622
01:10:51,040 --> 01:10:54,120
Speaker 5: and Yet Yis yannis came out of that playoff run

1623
01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:56,880
Speaker 5: as the consensus best player in the, world right because

1624
01:10:56,880 --> 01:10:59,640
Speaker 5: he hung in fifteen game. Six, so like what you're

1625
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:05,040
Speaker 5: really are deserving the exactly that there is an obvious

1626
01:11:05,360 --> 01:11:09,960
Speaker 5: fact that, like the best team, wins not the. Bestest

1627
01:11:10,439 --> 01:11:13,760
Speaker 5: but when it comes to these, conversations but they are

1628
01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:19,040
Speaker 5: so like no matter, what there's, like there's no way

1629
01:11:19,160 --> 01:11:22,600
Speaker 5: to have this conversation without. Subjectivity it is baked in.

1630
01:11:22,840 --> 01:11:25,880
Speaker 5: Automatically Nicole, JOKIC i think all four of us Agree

1631
01:11:25,960 --> 01:11:27,360
Speaker 5: jokic is the best player in the.

1632
01:11:27,400 --> 01:11:27,599
Speaker 4: World.

1633
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:31,920
Speaker 5: Right he literally plays on the perfect basketball team to

1634
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:34,960
Speaker 5: accentuate his. Skills there is a version of this where

1635
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:38,040
Speaker 5: he's in some ship situation and everyone thinks he's the

1636
01:11:38,080 --> 01:11:39,920
Speaker 5: seventh or eighth best player of the world when he's

1637
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:42,479
Speaker 5: actually the. Best, like it's very possible That luka Don

1638
01:11:42,600 --> 01:11:46,120
Speaker 5: Child like If luca And tatum swapped places to, day

1639
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:50,320
Speaker 5: they'd probably win the next two titles and literally The

1640
01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:53,240
Speaker 5: celtics would Be tatum would be or excuse, me Don

1641
01:11:53,320 --> 01:11:55,240
Speaker 5: chic would be revered as by far the best player

1642
01:11:55,280 --> 01:11:57,360
Speaker 5: in the. World, like this kind of stuff does play a,

1643
01:11:57,520 --> 01:11:58,800
Speaker 5: Role it absolutely.

1644
01:11:58,840 --> 01:12:01,479
Speaker 3: Does all, right before we get out of, here this

1645
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:04,720
Speaker 3: has been an extraordinary long, pod but it's. Nice but

1646
01:12:04,760 --> 01:12:10,280
Speaker 3: it's been great to just. Talk BUT i, know you,

1647
01:12:10,360 --> 01:12:11,800
Speaker 3: know when we have people, on we like to do

1648
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:14,080
Speaker 3: a little more than just sports. STUFF i know you're

1649
01:12:14,080 --> 01:12:16,559
Speaker 3: a Big Star wars, guy both because you've done content

1650
01:12:16,600 --> 01:12:18,680
Speaker 3: Around Star wars but ALSO i can see the art

1651
01:12:18,760 --> 01:12:21,479
Speaker 3: you have in the backdrop. There give me your. Best

1652
01:12:21,920 --> 01:12:23,439
Speaker 3: it doesn't have to be a. Movie it could be a,

1653
01:12:23,479 --> 01:12:25,960
Speaker 3: book A tv, show. Whatever what is the Best Star

1654
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:27,160
Speaker 3: wars thing ever?

1655
01:12:27,360 --> 01:12:27,920
Speaker 6: Produced to?

1656
01:12:28,120 --> 01:12:31,160
Speaker 4: You and what is the? Worst jason Oh.

1657
01:12:31,320 --> 01:12:35,200
Speaker 5: Man, okay So i'm gonna go with the best piece

1658
01:12:35,320 --> 01:12:37,519
Speaker 5: just Because i'm gonna be weird on purpose, Here i'm gonna.

1659
01:12:37,520 --> 01:12:42,160
Speaker 5: Go there's a book Called Darth plagus and it, actually

1660
01:12:42,320 --> 01:12:45,799
Speaker 5: basically what it functions as is a prequel to The Phantom,

1661
01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:49,799
Speaker 5: Menace and, essentially if you guys, know in the prequel

1662
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:52,080
Speaker 5: to the prequel in The.

1663
01:12:52,160 --> 01:12:55,280
Speaker 3: Star Wars book Of verse has some fucking some real

1664
01:12:55,400 --> 01:12:58,240
Speaker 3: bangers out. There oh, yeah how many how Many Star

1665
01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:00,320
Speaker 3: wars novels out? There like six hundred or something like.

1666
01:13:00,360 --> 01:13:02,360
Speaker 5: That there's a ton and there's still a ton THAT

1667
01:13:02,400 --> 01:13:04,560
Speaker 5: i haven't read THAT i plan on. Reading but, like but,

1668
01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:07,439
Speaker 5: basically Like revenge of The, Sith order sixty, six they

1669
01:13:07,479 --> 01:13:12,240
Speaker 5: overthrow The. Jedi there's an immaculately complex plan involving all

1670
01:13:12,320 --> 01:13:15,600
Speaker 5: these political machinations and military machinations and stuff behind the.

1671
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:20,240
Speaker 5: Scenes and the Book plagis does two. Things it explains

1672
01:13:20,400 --> 01:13:23,200
Speaker 5: that plan and much further, detail like little things like

1673
01:13:23,360 --> 01:13:26,880
Speaker 5: why they like how they started The Clone army, idea

1674
01:13:27,160 --> 01:13:30,200
Speaker 5: and how they actually formed The separatists and why they

1675
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:33,400
Speaker 5: separated from like they go into like specifically why they

1676
01:13:33,479 --> 01:13:35,679
Speaker 5: wanted to secede from The republic and all this. Stuff

1677
01:13:36,040 --> 01:13:38,920
Speaker 5: And Darth plagas is like this Dope sith lord that

1678
01:13:39,360 --> 01:13:41,080
Speaker 5: was one of the most powerful people in the galaxy

1679
01:13:41,160 --> 01:13:44,080
Speaker 5: and Trained palpatine to become the guy that he. Became

1680
01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:46,960
Speaker 5: and like it's a long. Book there's tons of dialogue in,

1681
01:13:47,040 --> 01:13:50,639
Speaker 5: it but LIKE i just finished it for the second

1682
01:13:50,760 --> 01:13:53,120
Speaker 5: time AND i was, like, man this is this is

1683
01:13:53,240 --> 01:13:55,240
Speaker 5: like my Favorite Star wars, Book like this is so.

1684
01:13:55,640 --> 01:14:01,280
Speaker 5: Good worst Worst i'll go with just because it's just because,

1685
01:14:01,960 --> 01:14:06,839
Speaker 5: seriously just because the sequel trilogy is so is so publicly,

1686
01:14:06,920 --> 01:14:09,479
Speaker 5: Hated i'll go a different. Direction but they're they're opening

1687
01:14:09,560 --> 01:14:12,600
Speaker 5: this New High republic thing and they're trying to like

1688
01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:14,719
Speaker 5: they're trying to get away from like The Sith jedi

1689
01:14:14,840 --> 01:14:17,120
Speaker 5: fighting against each other. Thing so what they're doing is

1690
01:14:17,160 --> 01:14:19,400
Speaker 5: they're bringing in this new villain that they call The. Nile,

1691
01:14:19,640 --> 01:14:22,599
Speaker 5: now has anybody in This zoom call played a game Called?

1692
01:14:22,680 --> 01:14:25,920
Speaker 6: Fallout i'm familiar with.

1693
01:14:26,000 --> 01:14:29,680
Speaker 5: It, Okay So fallout is like it's like a it's

1694
01:14:29,720 --> 01:14:33,680
Speaker 5: like a post nuclear holocaust type of, Environment like it

1695
01:14:33,800 --> 01:14:35,479
Speaker 5: like the world is destroyed and like people are like

1696
01:14:35,560 --> 01:14:37,400
Speaker 5: kind of coming back and living think like Mad max

1697
01:14:37,479 --> 01:14:37,720
Speaker 5: kind of.

1698
01:14:37,960 --> 01:14:39,960
Speaker 7: Well like, yeah there's. It got the cover with the

1699
01:14:40,040 --> 01:14:41,720
Speaker 7: homie with the gas mass on, It, yeah.

1700
01:14:41,760 --> 01:14:44,160
Speaker 5: Exactly and when you go from town to town to

1701
01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:45,960
Speaker 5: do your, thing one of the enemies they have you

1702
01:14:46,040 --> 01:14:48,080
Speaker 5: fight are like these little bands of raiders and they're

1703
01:14:48,160 --> 01:14:50,479
Speaker 5: just like dudes that have like weird masks and stuff,

1704
01:14:50,479 --> 01:14:52,200
Speaker 5: on and then they just kill you and do drugs

1705
01:14:52,240 --> 01:14:54,559
Speaker 5: and do all this other crazy. Stuff, well Like Star

1706
01:14:54,640 --> 01:14:57,400
Speaker 5: wars is building this new universe called The High, republic

1707
01:14:57,439 --> 01:14:59,439
Speaker 5: which takes place like three to five hundred years before

1708
01:14:59,479 --> 01:15:01,800
Speaker 5: The Phantom, men and the enemy is like a band

1709
01:15:01,880 --> 01:15:05,360
Speaker 5: of raiders and like it's super boring and like they're

1710
01:15:05,360 --> 01:15:07,800
Speaker 5: even like you know how Like fanos like would break

1711
01:15:07,920 --> 01:15:10,000
Speaker 5: down why he wanted to kill half the, universe and

1712
01:15:10,040 --> 01:15:11,880
Speaker 5: you'd be, like, this dude's got a, point, Man like

1713
01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:15,719
Speaker 5: you're kind of like there's like a like a almost

1714
01:15:15,760 --> 01:15:17,639
Speaker 5: like a weird like kind of he's kind of good

1715
01:15:17,680 --> 01:15:19,720
Speaker 5: and bad at the same time kind of. Thing that

1716
01:15:19,920 --> 01:15:21,680
Speaker 5: is entirely not the case for. This it's just the

1717
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:24,160
Speaker 5: stupid band of raiders that they're that like somehow are

1718
01:15:24,240 --> 01:15:27,040
Speaker 5: like conquering the. GALAXY i just finished the latest book

1719
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:29,240
Speaker 5: it's Called The eye Of, darkness AND i literally it

1720
01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:31,920
Speaker 5: was it was a chore to get through and it

1721
01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:34,680
Speaker 5: was incredibly boring and just in, General disney has been

1722
01:15:34,760 --> 01:15:36,639
Speaker 5: like really like hit and miss since they took.

1723
01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:38,840
Speaker 6: Over but they also made and or.

1724
01:15:41,200 --> 01:15:43,320
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, yeah, exactly that's the flip, side all. Right,

1725
01:15:43,400 --> 01:15:45,799
Speaker 3: jason thanks so much for hoping on with. Us obviously

1726
01:15:45,960 --> 01:15:48,760
Speaker 3: Check jason show out on the. Volume uh and we'll

1727
01:15:48,800 --> 01:15:50,599
Speaker 3: have to have you on again, soon, brother appreciate.

1728
01:15:50,680 --> 01:15:53,479
Speaker 5: You this was a, blast. GUYS i really enjoyed talking

1729
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:56,320
Speaker 5: hoops for over an. Hour that was a, blast man.

1730
01:15:56,439 --> 01:15:59,080
Speaker 1: Crazy and it was a Compliment basketball and mill AND

1731
01:15:59,160 --> 01:16:01,639
Speaker 1: N i was a, HEY i, SINCERELY i love doing.

1732
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:04,880
Speaker 5: THAT i sincerely.

1733
01:16:07,080 --> 01:16:09,040
Speaker 1: Hm the volume

1734
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:12,200
Speaker 3: M hm