1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:03,600 Speaker 1: Before we begin, I want to remind you that we'd 2 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 1: still like to hear from you. We're looking for more 3 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: of your questions about the ethics and etiquette of social distancing. 4 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: If there's a situation, behavior, or activity in your life 5 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:17,319 Speaker 1: that you're not your how to handle, and the age 6 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: of COVID nineteen, leave us a voicemail at six four 7 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:26,119 Speaker 1: six three two four. We may use your voice on 8 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 1: the show. And now let's get started. Welcome to Prognosis. 9 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: I'm Laura Carlson. It's day forty eight since coronavirus was 10 00:00:41,120 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 1: declared a global pandemic. Our main story, the goal of 11 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: widespread testing, seems to finally be one the White House 12 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 1: is taking seriously. President Donald Trump announced a comprehensive testing 13 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 1: plan on Monday, but the country is already months into 14 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 1: a testing crisis that may be too far gone to fix. 15 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: It leaves open the question can the US prepare itself 16 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: for the next phase. But first, here's what happened today. 17 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 1: After an outrage about how funds for a government relief 18 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:25,320 Speaker 1: program for small businesses were dispersed, the government says it 19 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: will keep a close eye on who's getting the money 20 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,919 Speaker 1: and whether they need it. U s. Treasury Secretary Stephen 21 00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: Menuchin said the government will audit every small business loan 22 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:41,759 Speaker 1: of more than two million dollars under the Paycheck Protection Program. 23 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:43,960 Speaker 1: In the first round of funds from the p p P, 24 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 1: large amounts went to big public companies and chains. Menu 25 00:01:49,040 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: Chan's comments came in a CNBC interview today. Some American 26 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: car manufacturing is revving up again. Ford said it intends 27 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 1: to restart initial production at most of its main European 28 00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: plants starting May fourth. The company said manufacturing will resume 29 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:11,520 Speaker 1: in a phased approach, and employees will receive personal care kits, 30 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: including masks and thermometers. Finally, President Donald Trump plans to 31 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:21,400 Speaker 1: order meat processing plants to remain open. According to a 32 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 1: person familiar with the matter, the government will provide additional 33 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 1: protective gear for employees, as well as guidance. The order 34 00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:33,200 Speaker 1: comes under the Defense Production Act, which gives a president 35 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:38,600 Speaker 1: broad powers to direct industrial production in a crisis. The 36 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 1: order sets the stage for a showdown between America's meat giants, 37 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: who have been pressing to reopen plants, and local officials 38 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 1: and labor unions who say the government is not protecting 39 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 1: workers across the country. At least six hundred meat processing 40 00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:01,079 Speaker 1: employees have either tested positive for the disease or had 41 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 1: to go into self quarantine. According to the United Food 42 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 1: and Commercial Workers Union, the largest private sector union, twenty 43 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 1: workers have died and now our main story. The Trump 44 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: administration announced a plan yesterday to ramp up coronavirus testing. 45 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 1: The White House said its goal was to provide enough 46 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 1: tests to allow every state to test at least two 47 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: percent of residents. But even as it announces a new 48 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: commitment to testing, the federal government has pushed much of 49 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 1: the responsibility to states. Because of the lack of federal 50 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 1: leadership on testing, experts say the result has been a 51 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 1: free for all among states who are all desperate to 52 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: get their hands on tests. The competition drives up prices, 53 00:03:55,720 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 1: eats up time, and ultimately dictates how many tests can do. 54 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 1: And the Court in John Tazzi has both reported on 55 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 1: the difficult logistics required to mount a meaningful testing operation. 56 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: I talked to them to understand how prepared we really 57 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:21,120 Speaker 1: are to scale up widespread testing. Why is testing so 58 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 1: important for COVID nineteen? So usually when we think about testing, 59 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,279 Speaker 1: you think of it in the scenario that you're sick, 60 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: but It actually has a really tremendous kind of importance 61 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 1: when you think about the health of our communities and 62 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 1: our states and the country, because you if you someone 63 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 1: is sick, you want to make sure that they are 64 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 1: not kind of out in the community and going to 65 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 1: the grocery store and seeing their friends and things like that, 66 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,279 Speaker 1: because that's how this disease spreads. So testing has a 67 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 1: really important role when you think about kind of public 68 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 1: health and and you know, preventing this infection from spreading 69 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 1: further and preventing sort of a second wave of infections. 70 00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 1: You know, so many people are social distancing right now, 71 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: and that's really really important, but testing is actually even 72 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:06,040 Speaker 1: more important when people sort of relax the social distancing 73 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: as we're starting to see sort of happen, you know 74 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,279 Speaker 1: in states all around the US right now. Who oversees 75 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:19,400 Speaker 1: how and to what extent communities are tested for coronavirus. Yeah, 76 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 1: so the testing landscape is incredibly fractured. Um. You know, 77 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 1: we talk about US testing like it's one monolithic entity, 78 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:31,480 Speaker 1: but it's actually carried out by a ton of different 79 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:35,919 Speaker 1: actors around the country. Commercial labs like Quest Diagnostics and 80 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: lab COREP do a lot of the testing, but you're 81 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,119 Speaker 1: also seeing you know, hospitals do testing. You're seeing state 82 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 1: public health labs do testing in a in a given 83 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: state or area. So there's been a lot of criticism 84 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 1: of the White House since they put out some guidelines 85 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 1: about states reopening about ten days or so ago, and 86 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 1: public health experts saying, we need a sharper focus on testing. 87 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 1: Testing is what's going to really be key and getting 88 00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:05,799 Speaker 1: us out of this situation and allowing economies to reopen. 89 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 1: And so we saw this come out of the White House, 90 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 1: you know, yesterday, is saying testing is important. Here's our plan. 91 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 1: We're gonna try to help, uh, you know, states test better. 92 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: But they're still really putting this emphasis on the states 93 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:22,599 Speaker 1: leading the charge. And so we're hearing public health experts 94 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:25,360 Speaker 1: say this is great that there's a new focus on testing, 95 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 1: but the federal government needs to be involved more, you know, 96 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: as sort of the link the link and the key 97 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:33,839 Speaker 1: kind of authority that that can kind of act between 98 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 1: states and across states. You know, what are some of 99 00:06:36,400 --> 00:06:40,159 Speaker 1: the things that they're able to do that states individually 100 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:43,600 Speaker 1: can't do with regard to testing. A big thing we've 101 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:47,039 Speaker 1: been hearing from labs around the country is we need 102 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:51,600 Speaker 1: you to really coordinate the sort of division of supplies 103 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 1: among different labs. So a big problem facing labs and 104 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 1: inhibiting how much testing they can do has been you know, 105 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: one lab maybe doesn't have enough jobs to take the 106 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 1: samples to do the testing, the diagnostic testing for COVID nineteen. 107 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,919 Speaker 1: Let's say, another lab maybe is having trouble getting the 108 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: right re agents needed to process the testing. Um. You know, 109 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:14,240 Speaker 1: some labs are struggling with getting enough protective equipment, which 110 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 1: has been an issue not just in hospitals but also 111 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:19,560 Speaker 1: in labs, because labs also need to protect their people, 112 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:23,440 Speaker 1: you know, from getting this infection. So we're seeing labs say, 113 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: the divisions of these supplies around the country are very uneven. 114 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: You know, some people have too much, some people have 115 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 1: too little. So what exactly is the Trump administration doing 116 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 1: about testing and and what has led so much criticism 117 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: of their approach. So it's important to say that the 118 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: Trump administration is aware of these issues, aware of the 119 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 1: supply chain problems you know, involved, and trying to to 120 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: make some differences in these sort of challenges. The real 121 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: thing that has been sort of a persistent criticism of 122 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: the Trump administration has been this sort of the fact 123 00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: that they came out with this guideline, these guidelines the 124 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 1: other week for reopening state economies, saying this is how 125 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 1: we measure it, this is how we know if a 126 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 1: state is prepared to reopen. But by the way, these 127 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 1: guidelines are voluntary, and these guidelines talked about testing, but 128 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: they didn't set specific goals in terms of testing, leading 129 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 1: to a lot of criticism that the Trump administration wasn't 130 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: stressing testing enough in terms of its talking about reopening. 131 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 1: So fast forward to this week on Monday, you're having 132 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 1: more states talking about reopening, pressing towards reopening, and the 133 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:35,479 Speaker 1: Trump administration is putting out that same day new guidelines 134 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: about testing, sort of outlining what they've done so far 135 00:08:38,920 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: and saying, you know, testing is important. Deborah Burkes, who's 136 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:46,160 Speaker 1: a top medical advisor to the administration, has been involved 137 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: in talking to lab directors about the situations in their lab. 138 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:54,120 Speaker 1: There's one diagnostic manufacturer that has actually too much supply 139 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:57,320 Speaker 1: of their testing product, and she's trying to figure out 140 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: why aren't labs using this product. So they're out there 141 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 1: they're listening to these problems. But you know, you also 142 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: have the President repeatedly stressing that we have enough testing 143 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:12,400 Speaker 1: capacity right now, and experts say that's just not true. John, 144 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: you wrote about contact tracing. Explain what contact tracing is 145 00:09:17,120 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 1: and what it has to do with testing. Yeah, so, 146 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:24,520 Speaker 1: contact tracing is something that public health departments have done 147 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 1: for decades. It's sort of bread and butter detective work 148 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: to understand how diseases are spreading and to really stop 149 00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 1: that transmission. We're hearing a lot more about it now 150 00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 1: because of the coronavirus, and the idea behind it is, 151 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 1: you know, if you have someone who has an infectious disease, 152 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 1: you know they may be in contact with a number 153 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: of other people who are susceptible to that disease. With 154 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 1: the coronavirus, they may have those contacts before they even 155 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,200 Speaker 1: realize they were sick themselves, or they may never realize 156 00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 1: that they were sick because they were asymptomatic. So the 157 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 1: idea behind contact tracing as you find out all the 158 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: people who may have been in touch with someone who 159 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: is infected and might have transmitted the disease to and 160 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: then you monitor them. In the case of COVID nineteen, 161 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 1: you ask them to isolate for fourteen days to see 162 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: if they develop symptoms. If they do, you know that 163 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:25,360 Speaker 1: that person may have infected others. So you kind of 164 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:29,360 Speaker 1: repeat the process case by case, chasing down their contacts, 165 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: asking people to isolate, finding out who that who else 166 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 1: they might have been in touch with. And that's really 167 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: what's UM essential to breaking the chains of transmission for 168 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: the virus. So your article focuses on a new software 169 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:47,439 Speaker 1: UM that's that's being developed and currently being implemented, called 170 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 1: Sarah Alert, And I was wondering if you might just 171 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:54,439 Speaker 1: explain how does sarah alert work. It's really a tool 172 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: for public health to kind of track and isolate people 173 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: who may have of COVID nineteen or people who may 174 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 1: have been exposed. So, uh, you know, when a public 175 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:08,840 Speaker 1: health worker gets UM, they basically developed lists of UM 176 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: contacts from known cases, right, all the people that you 177 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 1: may have been UH in touch with in the period 178 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: when you were potentially infectious and spreading the virus. Those 179 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:22,040 Speaker 1: contacts are entered into a system. Health workers reach out 180 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:26,079 Speaker 1: to them and ask if they've experienced any symptoms, and 181 00:11:26,400 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 1: you know, may recommend testing or treatment based on their answers. 182 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 1: Whether software basically does automate much of the process of 183 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 1: checking in on them. They can decide whether they want 184 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:40,079 Speaker 1: to be contacted by text message, by email, by voice call, 185 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:44,560 Speaker 1: and then every day they are contacted automatically UM they're 186 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 1: asked to report symptoms. People who do report symptoms get 187 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,000 Speaker 1: flagged for public health workers that they may need more 188 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 1: follow up, and people who don't respond at all also 189 00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,640 Speaker 1: get flagged UM that they may need a human intervention. 190 00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 1: So basically it it's kind of automates much of the 191 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: manual work done by public health departments. Right now, and 192 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: who is using SARAH alert? So the first three UM 193 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,480 Speaker 1: places to start using it in April where the State 194 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:22,479 Speaker 1: of Arkansas, the city of Danbury, Connecticut, and the Territory 195 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: of the Northern Mariana Islands uh A, US Commonwealth in Pacific. 196 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: And you know, those were I think chosen as sort 197 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: of test cases so they would have it in you know, 198 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:38,560 Speaker 1: three very different types of jurisdictions, A state, local, and 199 00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: a territory. So how do these two different prongs of 200 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: testing inform each other? Testing itself and contact tracing? Yeah, 201 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: I think I mean both are important, right, I mean 202 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 1: I think one one without the other is probably not 203 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:56,160 Speaker 1: going to get us there, and there's lots of sort 204 00:12:56,200 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: of basic public health activity around testing and contact tracing 205 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: um that we need to do, and we need to 206 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 1: do much better and much faster, I think, than than 207 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:10,800 Speaker 1: we have you know, in the United States. This is 208 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: work that's sort of distributed across many different local, county, 209 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:20,199 Speaker 1: state government entities, and some are better equipped to do 210 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,319 Speaker 1: it than others, and I think, you know, they're all 211 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 1: being kind of strained by the current situation. So you know, 212 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 1: the scale of the undertaking ahead is pretty astonishing, and 213 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:33,920 Speaker 1: you know, we're we're sort of still finding out where 214 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,839 Speaker 1: those stress points and fractures in the system and our 215 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:44,199 Speaker 1: ability to respond. Our that was Bloomberg Reporters and the 216 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: Court and John Tazzi, and that's our show today. For 217 00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:54,920 Speaker 1: coverage of the outbreak from one and twenty bureaus around 218 00:13:54,960 --> 00:14:00,719 Speaker 1: the world, visit Bloomberg dot com slash Coronavirus and if 219 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:03,439 Speaker 1: you like the show, please leave us a review in 220 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: a rating on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. It's the best 221 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 1: way to help more listeners find our global reporting. The 222 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:17,280 Speaker 1: Prognosis Daily Edition is hosted by me Laura Carlson. The 223 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:21,600 Speaker 1: show was produced by Me tophor Foreheaz, Jordan Gospoure, and 224 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: Magnus Hendrickson. Today's main story was reported by Emma Court 225 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: and John Tozzi. Original music by Leo Sidrian. Our editors 226 00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 1: are Francesca Levi and Rick Shine. Francesco Levi is Bloomberg's 227 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: head of podcasts. Thanks for listening.