1
00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:06,480
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You From how Supports

2
00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:15,000
Speaker 1: dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Caroline

3
00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:17,560
Speaker 1: and I'm Kristin, and today we have a very special

4
00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:20,239
Speaker 1: guest on our show. We're talking to Sarah Martin of

5
00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:23,520
Speaker 1: Belle and Sebastian and Sarah's great actually met her a

6
00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:26,400
Speaker 1: little while ago in Atlanta, and why don't you invite

7
00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:28,640
Speaker 1: her onto the show to talk not only about her

8
00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:32,279
Speaker 1: career with Belle and Sebastian, but also about women in

9
00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,560
Speaker 1: indie rock today and maybe some of her idols when

10
00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:39,959
Speaker 1: she was growing up. But so, we've actually had Christina Lee,

11
00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:42,160
Speaker 1: a music journalist on the podcast before, to talk about

12
00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:44,320
Speaker 1: women in hip hop, and today we want to talk

13
00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:47,800
Speaker 1: about women in indie rock, small labels versus big labels,

14
00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,479
Speaker 1: women in music in general, and of course talk to

15
00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:52,720
Speaker 1: Sarah about what's going on with her. Yeah, And on

16
00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:54,840
Speaker 1: a personal note, I have to say that I've been

17
00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:59,680
Speaker 1: so excited about this interview because Belle and Sebastian was

18
00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:03,920
Speaker 1: a ormative band of my youth. I listen to so

19
00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:06,679
Speaker 1: many of the albums, cried to so many of the

20
00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,560
Speaker 1: albums as well, So I've been really excited and I

21
00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:12,759
Speaker 1: know that a lot of our listeners too are probably

22
00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:15,280
Speaker 1: big fans of Belle and Sebastian. So this is a

23
00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,280
Speaker 1: really special interview for us to get to do today. Yeah. Absolutely,

24
00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:26,240
Speaker 1: so welcome Sarah. Hi, Hello, Hello, Hello. Um So, first

25
00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:28,840
Speaker 1: things first, Sarah, let's talk about you as a kid.

26
00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:32,039
Speaker 1: I want to know if you had a musical upbringing.

27
00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:34,760
Speaker 1: Were you a musical kid, did you play instruments? Did

28
00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:37,480
Speaker 1: you want to be a musician? What's the deal? And

29
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:39,920
Speaker 1: I didn't really, I don't think I wanted to be

30
00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:44,000
Speaker 1: a musician particularly, And I mean I think music was

31
00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:46,920
Speaker 1: always sort of around in my family and my parents

32
00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:49,880
Speaker 1: both they were both just kind of teachers a lot

33
00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,160
Speaker 1: of modern languages, but they both said, you know, they

34
00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:56,760
Speaker 1: both played instruments as well. And I'm you know, I

35
00:01:56,800 --> 00:02:00,000
Speaker 1: guess my brother and I both sort of went from

36
00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,600
Speaker 1: music lessons and stuff. But you know, it was it

37
00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:06,600
Speaker 1: was just it didn't seem like a a thing, particularly

38
00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:08,679
Speaker 1: so many you know, so many of my friends did

39
00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:11,440
Speaker 1: the same, and you know, it was mostly social. Actually,

40
00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:13,959
Speaker 1: you know, the fun the fun part of music was

41
00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:17,600
Speaker 1: always social. It was getting to kind of get out

42
00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:21,160
Speaker 1: of school and go to choir days and go to

43
00:02:21,280 --> 00:02:24,880
Speaker 1: orchestra practices and things like that. You know, that was fun. Well,

44
00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:27,800
Speaker 1: one thing we've talked about in the podcast before, um

45
00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,200
Speaker 1: in a lot of different fields and industries is the

46
00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:36,000
Speaker 1: importance of visibility really and having role models to kind

47
00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:39,720
Speaker 1: of introduce kids, especially young girls and young women into

48
00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:41,960
Speaker 1: different fields. And I think the same thing could be

49
00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:45,000
Speaker 1: said of music. Did you have any role models growing

50
00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:48,280
Speaker 1: up or as you got older? You know what? I

51
00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:51,720
Speaker 1: I just so someone came back into my head there

52
00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:54,720
Speaker 1: that I probably haven't thought of in like thirty years

53
00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:56,600
Speaker 1: or something, but there was my Mommy used to thank

54
00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:59,680
Speaker 1: me to this to see this woman. She was called

55
00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 1: a are A Bental Vim I think, and she played

56
00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,840
Speaker 1: the flute. And you know, when I was perhaps four

57
00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,639
Speaker 1: or five or something, someone used to take her to

58
00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,800
Speaker 1: these take me to her concerts, and you know they

59
00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:15,600
Speaker 1: were very aimed at little girls probably, but you know,

60
00:03:15,639 --> 00:03:18,760
Speaker 1: I loved I totally loved that. You know, I would

61
00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,400
Speaker 1: kind of ask for her records and stuff, and so

62
00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:25,200
Speaker 1: I guess she would have been quite an early role model,

63
00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:27,880
Speaker 1: and that, you know, that was probably why I was

64
00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:31,720
Speaker 1: determined that I would play the flute as well. Well.

65
00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:34,480
Speaker 1: Speaking of playing the flute, could you tell us a

66
00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:38,360
Speaker 1: little bit about your start with Belle and Sebastian, how

67
00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:41,600
Speaker 1: that happened, and in addition to the flute, what instruments

68
00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:45,320
Speaker 1: you play as well. Um, well, I I guess like

69
00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,960
Speaker 1: when I started with the band, it was it was

70
00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:52,240
Speaker 1: mostly because I I knew. I was in a class

71
00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:57,240
Speaker 1: at university with Stewart's girlfriend at the time, who is Joanne,

72
00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,440
Speaker 1: who was on the front of Tiger milk Um, and

73
00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:05,320
Speaker 1: she was saying, you should you know, start was trying

74
00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:07,400
Speaker 1: to get a band together, you should join his band.

75
00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:14,080
Speaker 1: And I was going absolutely not, No, I don't want

76
00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,400
Speaker 1: to join a band. And then I heard his songs

77
00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:18,880
Speaker 1: and I was like, yes, I should join the Stuart's band.

78
00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:21,520
Speaker 1: I like, I like this, this is this is my

79
00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,400
Speaker 1: this is my thing really and so that was it.

80
00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:28,720
Speaker 1: You know, he kind of just I think he'd been

81
00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:30,880
Speaker 1: trying for a long time to get people that would

82
00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,800
Speaker 1: just humor him. You know, so many people had I

83
00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:39,679
Speaker 1: just thought he was going, you know, just not really

84
00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:43,200
Speaker 1: getting anywhere for a long time. And I think, you know,

85
00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:46,760
Speaker 1: people had been in his band for a few weeks

86
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:48,839
Speaker 1: and then just dumped him for so long that I

87
00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:51,920
Speaker 1: think anyone that was actually kind of happy to hang

88
00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:53,880
Speaker 1: about with him. He was happy to hang about with

89
00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:57,159
Speaker 1: them as well. Really, what was your initial resistance to

90
00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:01,120
Speaker 1: the mere idea of joining a band just out of curiosity? Well,

91
00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:05,440
Speaker 1: mostly because I I've spent so I mean, all the

92
00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:07,839
Speaker 1: time I was at university, I was really good friends

93
00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:13,000
Speaker 1: with this guy called Jason, who am I was? You know,

94
00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:14,960
Speaker 1: he he was you know, we kind of had similar

95
00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,920
Speaker 1: taste in music, but he, you know, to him, like

96
00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,400
Speaker 1: the all important thing seemed to be to have a band.

97
00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:24,440
Speaker 1: But you know, he kind of he you know, he

98
00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:27,200
Speaker 1: would always just try and get me Sunday mornings into

99
00:05:27,320 --> 00:05:30,400
Speaker 1: rehearsal space or something, and I was just like, come on,

100
00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,039
Speaker 1: come on, we're not doing anything here. This is but

101
00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:35,400
Speaker 1: it was, you know, it was just it was just

102
00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:37,600
Speaker 1: kind of what I guess I was being to him

103
00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:40,800
Speaker 1: what everybody had been like to Stewart for years, you know,

104
00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,839
Speaker 1: just like not really not really feeling it at all,

105
00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:47,320
Speaker 1: and you know that just you know, I just spent

106
00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,239
Speaker 1: two long surrounded by boys that wanted to be in bands,

107
00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:53,920
Speaker 1: and I just thought it was kind of nonsense really,

108
00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:58,760
Speaker 1: And not that not that I didn't think bands were good,

109
00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,560
Speaker 1: but I just thought that you know that the idea

110
00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:04,560
Speaker 1: of being in a band to be the most important

111
00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:07,160
Speaker 1: thing to see. You know that that seemed to be

112
00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,440
Speaker 1: what they maybe suffered from a little bit to my

113
00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:15,520
Speaker 1: you know, I was obviously like twenty or something and

114
00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:19,120
Speaker 1: thinking that there were you know, there were there was

115
00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:24,200
Speaker 1: something special about proper bands or something, and you know

116
00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:27,440
Speaker 1: that you didn't realize that actually, you know, there's not

117
00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:32,200
Speaker 1: much difference between proper bands and your friends bands. Actually, also,

118
00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:35,360
Speaker 1: how did you, horror, how did that perspective shift though

119
00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:38,520
Speaker 1: as you as you joined up with Stewart and joined

120
00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,640
Speaker 1: the band. Well, it was it was actually, you know,

121
00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:43,320
Speaker 1: just kind of listening to what he was. He was

122
00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,839
Speaker 1: trying to persuade my my roommate Jason too, and to

123
00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:49,440
Speaker 1: join his band, which would never have worked because they're

124
00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:53,240
Speaker 1: both kind of like they couldn't be in someone else's band,

125
00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:57,320
Speaker 1: either of them. Um, but you know, Jason played me

126
00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:00,320
Speaker 1: this tape and I was like, that's amazing, And I

127
00:07:00,320 --> 00:07:03,520
Speaker 1: guess the band, you know, the band sort of you know,

128
00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:06,400
Speaker 1: you just I guess you just realized that we we

129
00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,400
Speaker 1: kind of made records. I suppose we were a little

130
00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:12,520
Speaker 1: bit more, we were a little bit more kind of

131
00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,760
Speaker 1: business like about things in a way. In a way,

132
00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: I mean, we were pretty uh it was quite. It

133
00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:23,240
Speaker 1: was ramshackle, but it wasn't It wasn't just about kind

134
00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:25,280
Speaker 1: of getting in a room and making as much noise

135
00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,040
Speaker 1: as possible. It was always quite. You know, Stewart always

136
00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,080
Speaker 1: kind of disciplined everybody quite a lot in terms of

137
00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,320
Speaker 1: you know, he used to really not like folks just

138
00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,520
Speaker 1: noodling away and jamming and stuff. He would be like, no,

139
00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:40,480
Speaker 1: come on, let's focus on on the songs and stuff.

140
00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:43,040
Speaker 1: And I suppose, like I suppose that's the thing. That's

141
00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:46,000
Speaker 1: what I love about our band, that there's there's kind

142
00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:50,520
Speaker 1: of songs and stuff. And what I always felt less

143
00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:54,040
Speaker 1: rewarding about other friends bands was that they would just

144
00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:59,960
Speaker 1: kind of often degenerate into just lengthy drum and get

145
00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,600
Speaker 1: are based rock out jams or something, and you know,

146
00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:07,280
Speaker 1: I kind of didn't really feel very at home in that.

147
00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:12,760
Speaker 1: But you know, Sebastian is quite focused on singing and

148
00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,560
Speaker 1: things as well. You know, yeah, well I have to

149
00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:18,640
Speaker 1: ask because you weren't the only woman in the band

150
00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:23,960
Speaker 1: when it first started, right well, there was Isabelle whom

151
00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,160
Speaker 1: she was the only woman in the band for the

152
00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:31,000
Speaker 1: first album, and then I joined after that, and and

153
00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:34,080
Speaker 1: and then there was the two of us for a

154
00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,000
Speaker 1: few years, and then she yeah, then she really I

155
00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,240
Speaker 1: think she was much more into doing her own thing.

156
00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:41,920
Speaker 1: She had she had her own sort of solo project,

157
00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:46,439
Speaker 1: and that was really what she was mostly focused on. Really,

158
00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,040
Speaker 1: would you say that being the only woman in the

159
00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,600
Speaker 1: band colors your experiences at all, like as far as

160
00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:56,600
Speaker 1: touring or songwriting, even I don't know about songwriting wise,

161
00:08:56,679 --> 00:09:00,080
Speaker 1: but maybe maybe the boys would disagree. I don't know.

162
00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:03,079
Speaker 1: I guess there's like a couple of days of month

163
00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:08,000
Speaker 1: where I sometimes don't feel very well for girlish reasons

164
00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:12,360
Speaker 1: and um, and I maybe you know, obviously boys don't

165
00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:16,760
Speaker 1: have periods and lucky boys and but I think I

166
00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:20,320
Speaker 1: think other than that, there's not you know, there's not

167
00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:25,080
Speaker 1: really much of an impediment kind of touring wise too.

168
00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,480
Speaker 1: And actually, you know, there's there's a girl who plays

169
00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:31,960
Speaker 1: cello with us um on tour and so you know,

170
00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,719
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not usually the only girl when we're

171
00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:38,800
Speaker 1: away on tour, And Fiona, who works in our office

172
00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,520
Speaker 1: sometimes comes away with us as well, and you know

173
00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:45,080
Speaker 1: there's there's both about but I don't really, I don't

174
00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:48,720
Speaker 1: think it very much. It's not that much difference really

175
00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:53,360
Speaker 1: between the boys and me. I don't think, I mean,

176
00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:59,000
Speaker 1: I don't. I'm not. I'm not like a girly girl really,

177
00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:01,880
Speaker 1: and I I kind of, you know, I do, I

178
00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,960
Speaker 1: do sort of make it a sort of you know,

179
00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:08,280
Speaker 1: it's a bit of a point of principle that I

180
00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:10,640
Speaker 1: kind of carry my own stuff and things like that.

181
00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:13,360
Speaker 1: You know, I don't expect the boys to be my

182
00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:17,200
Speaker 1: butlers or whatever. You know, Um, I don't really think

183
00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:20,080
Speaker 1: there's that much difference. Actually, they're not you know, none

184
00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:25,439
Speaker 1: of them are monsters or anything. And you know, hopefully

185
00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:30,319
Speaker 1: I'm not some horrible diva or anything. And I mean

186
00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:34,040
Speaker 1: Stuart can. I think Stuart can probably seeing higher than me.

187
00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:36,959
Speaker 1: And you know, there's I think there's a lot of

188
00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:39,480
Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff that's not that different between

189
00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:43,079
Speaker 1: being a boy and being a girl. Well that's good

190
00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:45,160
Speaker 1: to hear. I mean it sounds like it's a fairly

191
00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:50,840
Speaker 1: you know, egalitarian. I think it is. And I mean

192
00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:53,120
Speaker 1: I know that, like I know that the boys would

193
00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,679
Speaker 1: probably if they could, you know, if they could have

194
00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,959
Speaker 1: some a couple of girls in their late twenties hang

195
00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,040
Speaker 1: and about they would probably really really like that, and

196
00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:08,120
Speaker 1: people get older. You know, I can't stay twenty six forever.

197
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:11,400
Speaker 1: And we're you know, we're all We're all just who

198
00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,360
Speaker 1: we are. I suppose. Well, I know one of the

199
00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,160
Speaker 1: reasons Caroline was really interested to talk to you on

200
00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,960
Speaker 1: the podcast in addition to learning about your musical background

201
00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:23,199
Speaker 1: and your insights on all of that, but also learning

202
00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:28,000
Speaker 1: more about your non music playing duties for the band,

203
00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,400
Speaker 1: because as they understand you are also you also have

204
00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:35,840
Speaker 1: a big role in the business side of Balance Sebastian,

205
00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,000
Speaker 1: and especially as large and well known as the band

206
00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:41,240
Speaker 1: is today. Um, could you talk a little bit about

207
00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:44,000
Speaker 1: what you do on that end of things? Well, I,

208
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,480
Speaker 1: you know, I don't really feel as though I do

209
00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:51,520
Speaker 1: have a big role in the business end of things really.

210
00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:54,280
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess we're we all have sort of

211
00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,600
Speaker 1: a certain amount of responsibility for just the running of

212
00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:01,720
Speaker 1: the band. I guess it's like if you're an independent band,

213
00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:05,960
Speaker 1: then you do you do kind of have to take

214
00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,000
Speaker 1: decisions as a as a group, and you know that

215
00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,760
Speaker 1: some some decisions are kind of hard to take. And

216
00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:14,600
Speaker 1: but yeah, you know, we're I'm not really more involved

217
00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,199
Speaker 1: in that stuff than any of the others, I don't think,

218
00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:20,320
Speaker 1: but you know, I kind of I may be held

219
00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:22,960
Speaker 1: out in the office a bit more than most, you know,

220
00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,600
Speaker 1: when there's when there's a lot of t shirts to

221
00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,920
Speaker 1: send out and stuff or posters that need to be

222
00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:30,920
Speaker 1: rolled up and taken to the post office, than I

223
00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:35,160
Speaker 1: quite like. I like clerical tasks from time to time.

224
00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,120
Speaker 1: I like a pile of things that starts off not

225
00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:40,520
Speaker 1: done and ends up done. I think there's something very

226
00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:44,160
Speaker 1: satisfying that. Well, it could probably be a nice break

227
00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:47,880
Speaker 1: to at least when I'm deep in creative work. Clerical

228
00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:52,160
Speaker 1: tasks like that. Oh so healing, Yes, because it's like

229
00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:56,079
Speaker 1: a finite thing you can cross the list. Yes, because

230
00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,080
Speaker 1: you know songs are never finished, really are they, And

231
00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:01,880
Speaker 1: you know wreck chords there. You just kind of have to.

232
00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,200
Speaker 1: It just comes a point where you kind of have

233
00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:07,560
Speaker 1: to go, right, We've we've done our best. We have

234
00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:10,680
Speaker 1: to just kind of let this go now. And you know,

235
00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:14,360
Speaker 1: you can actually post something to the right address and

236
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,520
Speaker 1: stick the right pristage on it and and you know

237
00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:19,600
Speaker 1: you've done You've done it right. You know it's good,

238
00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:23,520
Speaker 1: it's enjoyable, it is enjoyable to do that stuff. I'm

239
00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,120
Speaker 1: glad I don't do it day and day out every day,

240
00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:29,360
Speaker 1: but it's a it's a good thing. And you know,

241
00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,760
Speaker 1: I kind of I've been known to do some sort

242
00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:35,640
Speaker 1: of design for T shirts and stuff like that, and

243
00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,520
Speaker 1: you know, I also I enjoy I enjoy kind of

244
00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:45,679
Speaker 1: proof reading album sleeve inserts and things like that. You know,

245
00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:49,160
Speaker 1: I like, I like grammar and spell checking and things

246
00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:51,960
Speaker 1: which I don't think too many of the boys would do.

247
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:59,720
Speaker 1: You're a woman after our own hearts rather Nazi, that's right. Um,

248
00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,600
Speaker 1: Christian and I definitely wanted to get into talking about

249
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:07,080
Speaker 1: sort of indie Iraq in general, and um, one of

250
00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:09,440
Speaker 1: the things we were thinking about is the fact that

251
00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:12,000
Speaker 1: indie i RAQ and indie labels are often said to

252
00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:15,199
Speaker 1: be friendlier to women compared to the bigger labels or

253
00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,640
Speaker 1: bigger genres. And is this something that you would agree with?

254
00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:22,720
Speaker 1: And and what about your own label? Well, we we am,

255
00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:25,280
Speaker 1: I guess. I mean, I think I feel as though

256
00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:28,520
Speaker 1: Mattador who are are like for the first time there

257
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:31,560
Speaker 1: are kind of worldwide label, you know, they in the past,

258
00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:34,920
Speaker 1: there've been our label for more or less from the start,

259
00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,720
Speaker 1: but they were kind of a license, see I suppose,

260
00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:41,640
Speaker 1: so we didn't have a direct relationship in the same

261
00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:43,360
Speaker 1: way that we do now. But I feel that they

262
00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:46,360
Speaker 1: are really you know, they've got they've definitely got a

263
00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:51,640
Speaker 1: pretty solid track record of putting out, you know, putting

264
00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:58,200
Speaker 1: out records by women who maybe you know, I don't know.

265
00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:01,080
Speaker 1: I just I just think, you know, they've put out

266
00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:06,160
Speaker 1: all the all the Ola Tango records and stuff, and um,

267
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,000
Speaker 1: you know, I just I don't know. I think I

268
00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:10,480
Speaker 1: think that I'm I feel pretty I feel pretty happy

269
00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,120
Speaker 1: that we are on that label really at the moment.

270
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:18,560
Speaker 1: But we've never been on a major label, so I

271
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:22,760
Speaker 1: don't know whether I would be able to compare, But

272
00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:27,640
Speaker 1: I do sort of suspect. But um, I think an

273
00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:30,120
Speaker 1: awful lot about our band wouldn't really fly with a

274
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:36,000
Speaker 1: major label. But I think we're just not I don't know.

275
00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:43,400
Speaker 1: I think we're probably not very marketable or something, um

276
00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:46,320
Speaker 1: or I don't know. I just I just think we're

277
00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:48,440
Speaker 1: we are. I think we are kind of there's no

278
00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:51,520
Speaker 1: there's no way other than independence for us. I think

279
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:56,320
Speaker 1: we're just we're just kind of can only be the

280
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,360
Speaker 1: thing that we are, you know, and the the band

281
00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:02,840
Speaker 1: that we are, and you know, we have we have

282
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:08,120
Speaker 1: kind of ambition and aspirations and stuff. But um, you know,

283
00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:12,000
Speaker 1: I don't think I don't think anybody would be you know,

284
00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,360
Speaker 1: put into a flash suit and stuck in a video

285
00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:17,880
Speaker 1: or so, you know, I think I think that's there's

286
00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,600
Speaker 1: too much that we're too old as well to be

287
00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:24,640
Speaker 1: sort of crammed into someone else's idea of what what

288
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:26,760
Speaker 1: a band should be, or what a singer should be

289
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,760
Speaker 1: or whatever. You know. I wish I wish i'd listened

290
00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:32,920
Speaker 1: to your thing about hip hop labels though that would

291
00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,080
Speaker 1: be interesting. Well. One thing that came up in that

292
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,760
Speaker 1: conversation about hip hop, and also comes up a lot

293
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,680
Speaker 1: when it in these discussions of whether indie rock is

294
00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:47,280
Speaker 1: friendlier in quotes to women, is an issue of marketing.

295
00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:51,160
Speaker 1: Exactly what you're talking about in terms of having more

296
00:16:51,160 --> 00:16:55,120
Speaker 1: freedom and independence to let your music stand on its

297
00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:57,720
Speaker 1: own and kind of be who you are. And in

298
00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:03,200
Speaker 1: that way, it seems women and whether she's a frontwoman

299
00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:06,960
Speaker 1: or a solo artist or a member of an ensemble,

300
00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:13,280
Speaker 1: is often less subjected to sexualizing in marketing that we

301
00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:19,000
Speaker 1: will often see in female musicians in more mainstream music

302
00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:21,439
Speaker 1: and also, I suppose the thing is, I think I

303
00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:25,520
Speaker 1: think major labels and like more mainstream things the only

304
00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:29,080
Speaker 1: the only way that they can kind of I think

305
00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:31,920
Speaker 1: it probably does come down to the fact that they

306
00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,600
Speaker 1: they need to spend quite a lot of money to

307
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:39,000
Speaker 1: to make to make something a success, you know, even

308
00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:44,320
Speaker 1: even if there's an inherent amazing quality to something. I think,

309
00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:47,639
Speaker 1: just to get things into the mainstream, it means that

310
00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:51,080
Speaker 1: people need to grow so much money advertising and all that.

311
00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:53,680
Speaker 1: But they don't want to take any chances at all,

312
00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:56,239
Speaker 1: and so they want people I think I think they

313
00:17:56,240 --> 00:18:01,520
Speaker 1: do probably want people to look a certain way and um,

314
00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:05,240
Speaker 1: you know, probably getting the press in a certain way

315
00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:09,240
Speaker 1: or whatever. And I think it's it's a kind of trying,

316
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:11,360
Speaker 1: you know. I mean, if you go to the Motown

317
00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:14,040
Speaker 1: Museum and they you know, they tell you about the

318
00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:17,240
Speaker 1: charm school and everything, and you know, the girls being

319
00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:20,480
Speaker 1: taught to get out of cars without showing their underwear

320
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,720
Speaker 1: and stuff, and you know, it's all it's all very

321
00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,520
Speaker 1: it's all very kind of cooke, you know. I think

322
00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:29,040
Speaker 1: that I think you can you can need quite a

323
00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:33,800
Speaker 1: lot of sort of coaching or something to to do that.

324
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:37,640
Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know, I think things are No, nobody's

325
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,280
Speaker 1: going to take a chance when they talking about mega books,

326
00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,520
Speaker 1: I think, But I guess, I guess that's the thing

327
00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:47,680
Speaker 1: with with indie rock labels. There's maybe not so much

328
00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:50,920
Speaker 1: mega books at stake, so they can, you know, they

329
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:54,720
Speaker 1: can afford to let you be yourself a little more so.

330
00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,760
Speaker 1: Matador did not send you to a charm stake, wouldn't

331
00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:01,120
Speaker 1: send me to charge school. I know you think that

332
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:04,680
Speaker 1: they would, definitely. I mean, I could do with some polish,

333
00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:09,080
Speaker 1: not for sure. I don't know, Sarah, I think you're

334
00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:14,160
Speaker 1: pretty polished. Yeah, well I'm I mean, I'm probably about

335
00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:17,680
Speaker 1: as polished as most of them. You know, we're we're

336
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:21,920
Speaker 1: kind of slightly unpolished people together, but I mean, I

337
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:25,800
Speaker 1: think that's a better way to be. Yeah. Well, we're

338
00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:27,760
Speaker 1: going to take a quick break, but when we come back,

339
00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:29,960
Speaker 1: we're going to talk to saras some more about indie

340
00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,120
Speaker 1: rock in the US versus the UK. So hold tight

341
00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:40,960
Speaker 1: and now back to the show. So we we've talked

342
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,000
Speaker 1: about kind of the major label versus any label thing

343
00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:46,919
Speaker 1: and women's ability to kind of move around in that

344
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:50,800
Speaker 1: arena um, but we also wanted to ask you about

345
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:53,879
Speaker 1: your perspective on the US versus the UK, because Kristen

346
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,920
Speaker 1: found this great piece in The Guardian. It was talking

347
00:19:56,920 --> 00:20:00,840
Speaker 1: about indie rock in the United States versus the Okay,

348
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,359
Speaker 1: and there was a quote that said, British indie has

349
00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:07,399
Speaker 1: been and still is consistently and significantly more egalitarian in

350
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:12,320
Speaker 1: terms of gender relations than America. What I you know,

351
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,280
Speaker 1: I'm always I always kind of feel like there's maybe

352
00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:19,720
Speaker 1: more you know, indie girl bands from Americas than than

353
00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:23,879
Speaker 1: from here. But maybe that's maybe that's just because we

354
00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,840
Speaker 1: kind of spend time over there and we kind of

355
00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:32,080
Speaker 1: have friends, but you know, usually a Kinney's and all

356
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:34,440
Speaker 1: this kind of thing, you wouldn't, you know. I'm never

357
00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:39,040
Speaker 1: really aware of that kind of thing in British indie

358
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,040
Speaker 1: circles really in the in the same way, you know,

359
00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:49,359
Speaker 1: not not that becomes such established groups really, you know,

360
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,960
Speaker 1: I think I think American indie is pretty good for

361
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:57,239
Speaker 1: the girls, really. Yeah, who, what kind of bands are

362
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:01,640
Speaker 1: you thinking besides Later Kenny and Yeah, I don't know,

363
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:07,320
Speaker 1: like Plumber Party and um Dun Dumb Girls and that

364
00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:09,199
Speaker 1: kind of you know, I think there's some. I think

365
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:13,680
Speaker 1: it's hard, it's hard to think of as many parallels

366
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: in Britain as there are as as the American kind

367
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,480
Speaker 1: of things. But then again, you've got a bigger country,

368
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:25,600
Speaker 1: you've got a lot more people, you've got more girls. Um,

369
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:29,240
Speaker 1: but no, I think America is pretty good. I mean

370
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:32,000
Speaker 1: when I was, when I was like a teenager, I

371
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:35,200
Speaker 1: still can Gordon and I was just like, wow, that

372
00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 1: is that's what you know. I would one, you know,

373
00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,119
Speaker 1: I would love to be as cool as her. You know,

374
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,520
Speaker 1: she just seemed to have like the best of you know,

375
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: the best of everything, you know, the whole sonic youth

376
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 1: for my favorite band in the world when I was

377
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:57,960
Speaker 1: like sixteen, seventeen, eighteen ninety and there. Yeah, I mean,

378
00:21:58,640 --> 00:21:59,840
Speaker 1: you know, they were just a way of life to

379
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,480
Speaker 1: and I just you know, she's not just involved in music,

380
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,640
Speaker 1: you know, she was kind of designing stuff and involved

381
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 1: in art and things. And I just thought, well, that's

382
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:13,879
Speaker 1: that's the ultimate kind of renaissance woman thing. And you

383
00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:17,440
Speaker 1: know it's it's not like I kind of had ambitions

384
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,880
Speaker 1: or anything to to be, you know, to be like her,

385
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 1: but I just thought, well, you know, she's just the

386
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:27,120
Speaker 1: coolest and I could I couldn't really, I couldn't say

387
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:31,399
Speaker 1: that I had a similar hero on that scale in

388
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 1: Britain to be honest, but if i'd if I'd been

389
00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,280
Speaker 1: a little older than maybe Kate Bush would have been that.

390
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: You know, she's kind of that sort of multidisciplinary thing

391
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 1: that I think. I think, you know, I think I'm

392
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,320
Speaker 1: just slightly too young to maybe have got Kate Bush

393
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:51,240
Speaker 1: the first time around. I'm also curious to just thinking

394
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:56,960
Speaker 1: about the whole girl group movement in the US of

395
00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,800
Speaker 1: there's recently been a lot of revived attention to Riot Girl,

396
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:05,040
Speaker 1: Kathleen Hannah and all of that here, and wondering if

397
00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: there were what kind of exposure too, if any, to

398
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:12,719
Speaker 1: that movement there was overseas, and whether there was like

399
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,280
Speaker 1: a similar kind of I mean, I guess that's more

400
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:20,040
Speaker 1: getting into punk than Indy, but I'm sure those circles intersect. Yeah,

401
00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 1: I mean, I think like when I was when I

402
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:26,280
Speaker 1: was at high school, that was something that you know,

403
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,159
Speaker 1: because it like boardered on Sonic Youth and I was

404
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:31,720
Speaker 1: I was kind of interested in it a little bit.

405
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:35,480
Speaker 1: It wasn't really the I wasn't really majorly into the

406
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,200
Speaker 1: records or anything, but because you know, it kind of

407
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 1: it was definitely a sort of crossover and a lot

408
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:43,800
Speaker 1: a lot of my friends were really, you know, really

409
00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:48,040
Speaker 1: into the kind of babes in Toiland riot girl kind

410
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,720
Speaker 1: of thing. Well, so, I guess, moving off of that,

411
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:55,680
Speaker 1: the riot girl question, um something that seems to come

412
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 1: up a lot in the media nowadays. Not to sound

413
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:03,639
Speaker 1: like I'm some fogy the media nowadays, um, but a

414
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:09,199
Speaker 1: lot of journalists nowadays are asking young musicians whether they're feminists,

415
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:12,680
Speaker 1: and there's always this big bruhah with However, the young

416
00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: star responds like, what do you what do you think

417
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,359
Speaker 1: of that? Both of the whole issue of feminism in music,

418
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 1: which is a large issue to talk about, but more

419
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:25,159
Speaker 1: specifically journalists sort of pinning this on young pop stars.

420
00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:28,480
Speaker 1: It's funny because like I, you know, I had a

421
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 1: friend who was like totally you know, really really really

422
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:38,440
Speaker 1: kind of proud to describe ourself as a feminist, and

423
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 1: you know, we used to argue a lot because I

424
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:42,359
Speaker 1: have I was like, well, I don't know whether I

425
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:44,720
Speaker 1: am a feminist. There are things that it's kind of

426
00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:48,439
Speaker 1: pointless to to kind of kid yourself that men and

427
00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:52,760
Speaker 1: women are the same in some respects and there but

428
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:55,919
Speaker 1: you know, I think, as I you know, the the

429
00:24:56,000 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 1: new kind of I feel more more like a fem now.

430
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 1: It feels as though feminism has maybe changed a little bit,

431
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:07,200
Speaker 1: and people don't kind of necessarily kind of go, well,

432
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,440
Speaker 1: I should be able to do this and have it.

433
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 1: I guess it's the it's the whole having it all thing,

434
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,760
Speaker 1: you know. I think it's very hard, and I know,

435
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,880
Speaker 1: I know, I've got a couple of friends who do

436
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 1: have really exciting careers and families as well, but they,

437
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:27,199
Speaker 1: you know, they really really have to work for it.

438
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:29,959
Speaker 1: You know. It's it's a it's a very difficult thing.

439
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 1: I don't I think it is. Um. You know, there's

440
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:35,880
Speaker 1: a there's a there's a right to equality, but there's

441
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 1: also I think that you need to be kind of

442
00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:45,439
Speaker 1: reasonably accepting of the fact that it's hard to have

443
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 1: it all. I think it is hard to have it all,

444
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: and I think opportunity, you know, the opportunity to to

445
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 1: you know, pick the way you want to go in life.

446
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 1: Is that's That's the kind of feminism that I embrace wholeheartedly.

447
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,800
Speaker 1: I think if you if you want to kind of

448
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:06,879
Speaker 1: have a have a family and a career, then I

449
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 1: don't see why there shouldn't be a way to make

450
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 1: that happen. But there are there are obviously some careers where,

451
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 1: you know, through no fault of anybody's, it's not easy

452
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:21,159
Speaker 1: to achieve that, you know, I think it would be

453
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,199
Speaker 1: quite hard to be a musician doing the stuff that

454
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 1: our band does and be a mom for instance. You know,

455
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:32,199
Speaker 1: I think it would be quite difficult. Well, tell us

456
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,439
Speaker 1: a little bit about who you're listening to today. Are

457
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 1: there any especially female friended bands or women musicians who

458
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:44,440
Speaker 1: have especially cut your ears lately? I'm I'm pretty into

459
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 1: this this girl, this Welsh girl Kate Leabam, who am

460
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,919
Speaker 1: really quite into. And um, I don't know whether I

461
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,720
Speaker 1: don't know whether you've heard of Bat for Lashes. It's

462
00:26:55,800 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 1: this yeah, oh yeah, I really like I really like her, kay,

463
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:05,240
Speaker 1: And you know, I just whenever I whenever I see

464
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,880
Speaker 1: you lot Ango, I'm just always blown away by Georgia.

465
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 1: I think I just think she's so inspiring, really inspiring

466
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 1: person to to watch and to be around and things.

467
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:21,119
Speaker 1: She just she's just so she just seems like the

468
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 1: steadiest person and I do admire that. Well, that's about

469
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 1: all the questions that Kristen and I had for you. Um,

470
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 1: we would love it if you could tell our listeners

471
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 1: where they could find out more about you and the

472
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 1: band and some details about the upcoming record. Well, um,

473
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: we have a reasonably occasionally maintained website which is balanced

474
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: the Vastian dot com. But we're also on Twitter at

475
00:27:54,480 --> 00:28:00,560
Speaker 1: its Bell's Glasgow and and also on Instagram with the

476
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: same handle, and we are on Facebook as well. And um,

477
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:10,959
Speaker 1: we've got record coming out in January and it's going

478
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: to be called Girls in Peace Time Love to Dance

479
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 1: and I want to Dance Girls in Peace Time Want

480
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 1: to Dance. Um. And the and the album was made

481
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:32,200
Speaker 1: in Atlanta, Georgia. Wheah whoa um, and Caroline's boyfriend played

482
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 1: a major part in this. Yeah, those boys in Georgia

483
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 1: did a really good job. Well, they had fantastic talent

484
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 1: to work worth. I'm sure they definitely made us very welcome.

485
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 1: Were good boys. Well, thank you so so so much

486
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 1: for talking to us today. We really appreciate it. I

487
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: I have one last question, okay for you. Okay, So

488
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: if there are younger girls listening who are interested in

489
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: music and want to make it a career, or you know,

490
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:13,600
Speaker 1: like parents with musical children, what advice would you give

491
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 1: to ambitious musical girls. I you know, I don't know,

492
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: I kind of I think that it's the best. The

493
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: best thing that you can do musically is play stuff

494
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: that you like. Really, I mean I always, I always

495
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 1: hated most of what my violin teachings to make me play.

496
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 1: And then you know, every couple of years she would well,

497
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 1: like I probably only had lessons with it for a

498
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,600
Speaker 1: couple of years, but you know, ever, every like long

499
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: period of time, she would give me something and I

500
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 1: would get really really into it and should go why

501
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:53,640
Speaker 1: can't why can't you play? Play these other things with

502
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 1: the enthusiasm let you go about this, and it's just

503
00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: it's I think it's just all about finding me music

504
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: that you actually want to play. And I don't think that.

505
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 1: I don't think that sort of making people play stuff

506
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:12,320
Speaker 1: that they're not into is going to feed an ambition somehow.

507
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 1: That's that would be That would be my tip. Just

508
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: you know, play what play what you like, and don't

509
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: make people play things they're not really feeling. Help them find,

510
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 1: help them find something that they they do love, you know,

511
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: because I don't you know, music is all that's kind

512
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 1: of all musics about. If you can't. If you can't

513
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: really enjoy it, then there's not so much point really,

514
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 1: so huge things again to Sarah Martin. And if you

515
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: are not familiar with Belle and Sebastian and want an

516
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: introduction to the band, I can recommend listening to Tiger

517
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 1: Milk and if you're feeling sinister, which I'm not kidding

518
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 1: when I say that, those were the soundtracks of my

519
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:00,960
Speaker 1: high school and early college days, so give it a listen.

520
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 1: It's fantastic music and they are incredibly talented musicians. And

521
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:10,680
Speaker 1: if anyone is a fan of Balance Sebastian or musically

522
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: talented or in a band, we'd love to hear from you.

523
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:15,960
Speaker 1: What do you think it's like out there for women

524
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: in indie rock. Let us know your thoughts. Mom Stuff

525
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com is our email address.

526
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 1: You can also tweet us at mom Stuff Podcasts or

527
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 1: messages on Facebook, and we've got a couple of messages

528
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: to share with you when we come right back from

529
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 1: a quick break and now back to the show. I

530
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:41,479
Speaker 1: have a letter here from Dan in regards to our

531
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 1: PMS podcast. Dan says, I just wanted to thank you

532
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: for the language you used in your PMS podcast that

533
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 1: was trans inclusive. Trans Awareness Week is coming up and

534
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,640
Speaker 1: I'm doing work to organize it along with other gender

535
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 1: women's studies organizations on my campus. Many people often use

536
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 1: the vagina as a symbol for women's pride, when not

537
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 1: all men have vaginas and not everyone with a vagina

538
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 1: is a woman. That is such a difficult thing to

539
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 1: deal with and explain to people. So hearing trans inclusivity

540
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 1: on your podcast with such a great start to my day.

541
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: Thank you again, Dan, and Dan, thank you well. I've

542
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 1: got a letter here also about our p MS podcast

543
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 1: from Christian subject Line, a dude with PMS. He writes,

544
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 1: i just started listening to the show, and I've got

545
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 1: to say I'm already in love. The PMS episode especially

546
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 1: made me realize I've found pretty much the perfect podcast.

547
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: As a transman, I expect not to be included in

548
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: discussions of typically women's health issues like p MS, which

549
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 1: is fair to some extent because we make up a

550
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,280
Speaker 1: super small percentage of the population and because a lot

551
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 1: of it stops applying to a lot of trans men

552
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: at some point. Even so, I'm always extremely grateful when

553
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: people acknowledge men with uterus is even more, you acknowledge

554
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 1: that not all people who identify as women have the

555
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 1: same biological parts, which was a nice inclusion of trans

556
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,160
Speaker 1: women as well. I wanted to write and not only

557
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 1: to thank you for acknowned trans meant, but to share

558
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 1: my recent experiences with p MS as well. I've had

559
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,440
Speaker 1: it to some extent since I started menstruating, not enough

560
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 1: that I ever went on medication for it, but enough

561
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 1: that it was noticeable every month. I haven't had a

562
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: period in six months now, but whenever my wife where

563
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,719
Speaker 1: I noticed as I'm getting particularly cranky, we'll look at

564
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 1: the calendar and try to assess what part of my

565
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: menstrual cycle I'll be at. Inevitably, we'll look at one another,

566
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 1: nod sagely, and say, ah, yes, it's that time of

567
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 1: the month. Now. I wonder if I'm just using the

568
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,239
Speaker 1: social construct as an excuse for being snarky, or if

569
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:35,360
Speaker 1: there's something to it. Many trans men report this kind

570
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: of thing after starting hormone therapy, the ghost of periods

571
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: past perhaps Anyway, thanks for the fantastic podcast. As a transdude,

572
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: I feel like it's especially important for me to stay

573
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 1: rooted and mindful to women's issues and feminist conversations, and

574
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,960
Speaker 1: your podcast seems like a really great way to do that,

575
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 1: So thanks Christian, and thanks to everybody who's written into us.

576
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,280
Speaker 1: Mom stuff at how stuff works dot com is our

577
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: email address and for links to all of our social

578
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:04,719
Speaker 1: media blogs, videos, and podcasts, including this one with links

579
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:10,839
Speaker 1: to balance Sebastian's website, which is apparently sometimes updated. You

580
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: can head on over to stuff mom Never Told You

581
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 1: dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics.

582
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 1: Doesn't how stuff works dot com