1 00:00:15,264 --> 00:00:24,704 Speaker 1: Pushkin Hey producer Kate. What's the story of the week, Hi, Joel. 2 00:00:25,504 --> 00:00:28,984 Speaker 1: This week's story of the week is Saturday Morning with 3 00:00:29,064 --> 00:00:36,824 Speaker 1: the Parkslow Panthers by Esther Wong from Hellgate. When I 4 00:00:36,824 --> 00:00:39,544 Speaker 1: first looked through posts on the app next Door, I 5 00:00:39,664 --> 00:00:42,424 Speaker 1: knew I had a mission. It was to keep my 6 00:00:42,504 --> 00:00:46,064 Speaker 1: lovely wife Cassandra from ever seeing it. Next Door is 7 00:00:46,104 --> 00:00:48,904 Speaker 1: this app that allows neighbors to post about whatever they want, 8 00:00:49,304 --> 00:00:52,104 Speaker 1: and what they want to post about is their deep 9 00:00:52,184 --> 00:00:55,784 Speaker 1: suspicion of crimes being committed in their neighborhood. And these 10 00:00:55,824 --> 00:00:59,544 Speaker 1: are often crimes that I've never even heard of, lurking 11 00:01:00,544 --> 00:01:06,024 Speaker 1: light bulb stealing, coating mailbox flaps with glue, and asking 12 00:01:06,064 --> 00:01:09,904 Speaker 1: for jumper cables but not actually having a car. Three 13 00:01:09,904 --> 00:01:13,504 Speaker 1: months later, of course, Cassandra had found out about next Door. 14 00:01:14,144 --> 00:01:17,104 Speaker 1: She very quickly started expressing her lack of faith in 15 00:01:17,144 --> 00:01:20,384 Speaker 1: the police. We would take these walks around our neighborhood 16 00:01:20,384 --> 00:01:23,224 Speaker 1: and she would point to each house and declare, either 17 00:01:23,784 --> 00:01:27,584 Speaker 1: that's a secure home or that is not secure home, 18 00:01:28,144 --> 00:01:33,504 Speaker 1: and as I feared, ours was not a secure home. Then, 19 00:01:33,584 --> 00:01:35,824 Speaker 1: just a few months after she first saw next Door, 20 00:01:36,424 --> 00:01:38,904 Speaker 1: I was walking one night and yes, it was to 21 00:01:38,904 --> 00:01:41,984 Speaker 1: get my steps at I was almost home when this 22 00:01:42,064 --> 00:01:44,544 Speaker 1: guy kind of pops out of nowhere and asked me 23 00:01:44,584 --> 00:01:47,104 Speaker 1: if I want a party, and I shake my head 24 00:01:47,144 --> 00:01:49,384 Speaker 1: no because I do not want a party, and I 25 00:01:49,424 --> 00:01:52,104 Speaker 1: just kept walking home, and a few blocks later I 26 00:01:52,144 --> 00:01:54,864 Speaker 1: got there and opened my garage door, and then I 27 00:01:54,904 --> 00:01:58,024 Speaker 1: turned around and the party guy was there, like a 28 00:01:58,184 --> 00:02:01,064 Speaker 1: foot behind me. So I grabbed this broom and he 29 00:02:01,144 --> 00:02:04,824 Speaker 1: backs up, possibly threatened by my weapon, but more likely 30 00:02:05,064 --> 00:02:07,144 Speaker 1: thinking I was holding it because I was into something 31 00:02:07,224 --> 00:02:11,544 Speaker 1: kinkier than his idea partying. So he left and I 32 00:02:11,744 --> 00:02:13,664 Speaker 1: just sat down and tried to calm down. They went 33 00:02:13,704 --> 00:02:16,704 Speaker 1: back into the house, and I had to decide whether 34 00:02:16,744 --> 00:02:19,904 Speaker 1: to tell Cassandra about this or not, and eventually I 35 00:02:20,024 --> 00:02:23,024 Speaker 1: decided I had to because otherwise she'd probably read about 36 00:02:23,024 --> 00:02:26,264 Speaker 1: it from the party guys post on next door. The 37 00:02:26,344 --> 00:02:29,904 Speaker 1: drama that I experienced played out even more ludicrously in 38 00:02:29,984 --> 00:02:33,864 Speaker 1: Park Slope, Brooklyn, which is the Brooklyn of Brooklyn, and 39 00:02:34,224 --> 00:02:36,464 Speaker 1: Esther Wong saw it all happened when she went to 40 00:02:36,504 --> 00:02:40,624 Speaker 1: this tiny neighborhood meeting that kept getting more and more bizarre, 41 00:02:49,824 --> 00:02:53,024 Speaker 1: writing his hard Who's got that kind of time? When 42 00:02:53,024 --> 00:02:56,584 Speaker 1: You're already busy trying to be john Stein until it 43 00:02:56,624 --> 00:02:59,824 Speaker 1: turns on a mic made it twiddles and knob because 44 00:02:59,864 --> 00:03:03,224 Speaker 1: a journalist Frand who's got in that dual job out 45 00:03:03,264 --> 00:03:10,664 Speaker 1: of jories single story? Just listen to smart people speaking conversations. 46 00:03:25,744 --> 00:03:28,344 Speaker 1: Esther Wong lives with her dog in Brooklyn and her 47 00:03:28,384 --> 00:03:31,064 Speaker 1: story begins with a crime that happened not that far 48 00:03:31,144 --> 00:03:34,864 Speaker 1: from her apartment. Esther Wong, thank you for doing this today. 49 00:03:35,064 --> 00:03:39,024 Speaker 1: I love your story and desperately want to understand what 50 00:03:39,064 --> 00:03:41,264 Speaker 1: the hell happened here. Yeah, thank you so much for 51 00:03:41,344 --> 00:03:46,264 Speaker 1: having me on. So just to share what happened in August. Jessica, 52 00:03:46,544 --> 00:03:50,944 Speaker 1: who's a professional beekeeper? I think a professional beekeeper that 53 00:03:51,784 --> 00:03:53,984 Speaker 1: I've never lived in Brooklyn. That's maybe the number one 54 00:03:54,024 --> 00:03:55,904 Speaker 1: job in Brooklyn. Yeah, I would say about one and 55 00:03:55,944 --> 00:04:00,864 Speaker 1: every five people you ask them exactly. So. She lives 56 00:04:00,864 --> 00:04:05,424 Speaker 1: in the neighborhood. She regularly walked her dog moves through 57 00:04:05,424 --> 00:04:09,384 Speaker 1: the neighborhood. One morning in August, she was taking her 58 00:04:09,424 --> 00:04:12,344 Speaker 1: dog on a walk, her typical daily walk, when she 59 00:04:12,544 --> 00:04:17,464 Speaker 1: was attacked by a man in the park who, according 60 00:04:17,544 --> 00:04:21,544 Speaker 1: to the NYPD, according to people in the neighborhood, he's 61 00:04:21,624 --> 00:04:24,384 Speaker 1: kind of an unknown person in the park, you know, 62 00:04:24,464 --> 00:04:30,704 Speaker 1: possibly with mental illness, possibly homeless. He regularly carries a stick. 63 00:04:30,744 --> 00:04:33,464 Speaker 1: Apparently he tried to hit her with a stick. He 64 00:04:33,584 --> 00:04:36,544 Speaker 1: hit moose her dog with a stick, sprayed them with 65 00:04:36,824 --> 00:04:40,784 Speaker 1: urine that apparently he was carrying in a bottle. That's 66 00:04:40,784 --> 00:04:43,264 Speaker 1: a sign of mental illness. Not to judge. Yeah, I 67 00:04:44,104 --> 00:04:46,464 Speaker 1: carry around urine. I think that's fair. I think that's 68 00:04:46,464 --> 00:04:49,664 Speaker 1: fair to say, right, unless you're hunting in the wood 69 00:04:48,984 --> 00:04:53,304 Speaker 1: seem I mean, Prospect Park is is a rather large 70 00:04:53,384 --> 00:04:57,144 Speaker 1: urban park, so who knows. But Jessica was able to escape. 71 00:04:57,664 --> 00:05:01,064 Speaker 1: Apparently that day she noticed her dog Mouse was injured. 72 00:05:01,824 --> 00:05:04,184 Speaker 1: He was bleeding from his mouth. She took him to 73 00:05:04,224 --> 00:05:07,064 Speaker 1: the vet. I think they took out a tooth. Everything 74 00:05:07,104 --> 00:05:11,704 Speaker 1: seemed fine and and a few days later she noticed 75 00:05:11,824 --> 00:05:14,984 Speaker 1: he was not doing okay took him back to the vet. 76 00:05:15,664 --> 00:05:20,024 Speaker 1: It turns out during the attack, when the man hit 77 00:05:20,064 --> 00:05:25,024 Speaker 1: her dog with a stick, something had happened internally and 78 00:05:25,384 --> 00:05:29,664 Speaker 1: he had sepsiss and her dog Moves died. The incident, 79 00:05:29,784 --> 00:05:33,784 Speaker 1: which involved a black, apparently mentally ill, homeless man and 80 00:05:33,904 --> 00:05:36,424 Speaker 1: a forty year old liberal white woman who volunteered to 81 00:05:36,424 --> 00:05:39,944 Speaker 1: help the homeless was like a fable for the political 82 00:05:39,984 --> 00:05:42,904 Speaker 1: conflicts in our cities right now. It's one thing to 83 00:05:43,064 --> 00:05:46,064 Speaker 1: vote for liberal candidates and give to liberal causes, But 84 00:05:46,704 --> 00:05:50,424 Speaker 1: what happens when it affects you directly, when it's you 85 00:05:50,584 --> 00:05:52,944 Speaker 1: and your dog who are attacked by the group that 86 00:05:52,984 --> 00:05:55,704 Speaker 1: you want to help. How do your beliefs hold up? 87 00:05:55,784 --> 00:05:58,664 Speaker 1: Then you can see why this got a lot of 88 00:05:58,664 --> 00:06:01,664 Speaker 1: people's attention. It ticked all the boxes, the fact that 89 00:06:01,664 --> 00:06:05,344 Speaker 1: it happened in Prospect Park, right next to the neighborhood 90 00:06:05,424 --> 00:06:10,664 Speaker 1: park Slope. It's very Brownstone Brooklyn, very nice homes, but 91 00:06:10,784 --> 00:06:14,304 Speaker 1: also home to places like the Park Slope Food Coop. 92 00:06:14,544 --> 00:06:17,544 Speaker 1: So the neighborhood kind of has this reputation of I 93 00:06:17,584 --> 00:06:19,744 Speaker 1: think it'd be fair to say kind of like maybe 94 00:06:19,784 --> 00:06:23,784 Speaker 1: not limousine liberals, right, but certainly you know, Champagne liberals, 95 00:06:24,424 --> 00:06:29,224 Speaker 1: wealthier people who like to propride themselves on their progressive values. 96 00:06:29,704 --> 00:06:36,424 Speaker 1: So mooseties a tragic death, and then the story gets 97 00:06:36,944 --> 00:06:43,984 Speaker 1: shared quite a bit on next door in Facebook groups 98 00:06:43,984 --> 00:06:48,704 Speaker 1: and people are outraged. So how did the story divide people? Like? 99 00:06:49,064 --> 00:06:51,424 Speaker 1: What are the two camps? I would say one camp 100 00:06:51,624 --> 00:06:55,224 Speaker 1: was we need more cops, and we need the cops 101 00:06:55,264 --> 00:06:57,744 Speaker 1: to do their job. Their job is to apprehend this 102 00:06:57,824 --> 00:06:59,864 Speaker 1: man and he should be locked up. I would say 103 00:06:59,904 --> 00:07:03,024 Speaker 1: the other camp was, you know, arresting this guy is 104 00:07:03,064 --> 00:07:05,904 Speaker 1: not going to change anything. What he needs his support, 105 00:07:05,944 --> 00:07:10,464 Speaker 1: he needs housing, he needs social services. Is that's what 106 00:07:10,584 --> 00:07:13,184 Speaker 1: he needs and that's what we should be pushing for. Okay. 107 00:07:13,264 --> 00:07:16,584 Speaker 1: So this guy, Christian Nameick, he's on next door and 108 00:07:16,624 --> 00:07:19,104 Speaker 1: he decides to create a neighborhood watch group to try 109 00:07:19,104 --> 00:07:23,344 Speaker 1: and address this very problem. So Christian, he's an interesting guy. 110 00:07:23,504 --> 00:07:26,624 Speaker 1: You know. You go to his nextdoor profile and you 111 00:07:26,664 --> 00:07:29,584 Speaker 1: know he is this older white guy. You know, he 112 00:07:29,704 --> 00:07:34,944 Speaker 1: lists his progressive affiliations like Black Lives Matter, his support 113 00:07:34,984 --> 00:07:41,104 Speaker 1: for the LGBT community, he himself is gay. He's an environmentalist, right, 114 00:07:41,864 --> 00:07:45,304 Speaker 1: So to see him being the one pitching this idea 115 00:07:45,384 --> 00:07:48,624 Speaker 1: of a neighborhood watch and not since a neighborhood watch, 116 00:07:48,664 --> 00:07:53,704 Speaker 1: but named the park Slope Panthers of all names. Okay, 117 00:07:53,744 --> 00:07:55,984 Speaker 1: So I can't believe he names this thing the park 118 00:07:56,064 --> 00:07:58,584 Speaker 1: Slope Panthers like he does it because there are these 119 00:07:58,624 --> 00:08:01,264 Speaker 1: two panther statues that walk him in you into the park. 120 00:08:01,504 --> 00:08:03,944 Speaker 1: But I mean, he's got to know people are going 121 00:08:03,984 --> 00:08:07,144 Speaker 1: to think about the black panthers, right, Like, to introduce 122 00:08:07,344 --> 00:08:11,904 Speaker 1: that into this already ray charged issue seems insane. I 123 00:08:11,904 --> 00:08:14,464 Speaker 1: don't want to speak for Christian, but just based on 124 00:08:14,544 --> 00:08:18,104 Speaker 1: what he wrote in his mind, it seemed there was 125 00:08:18,264 --> 00:08:24,224 Speaker 1: no connection between operating a neighborhood watch group and the 126 00:08:24,864 --> 00:08:29,144 Speaker 1: connotation of naming the group the park Slope Panthers, even 127 00:08:29,184 --> 00:08:32,304 Speaker 1: though quite a few people you know, brought up like, hey, 128 00:08:32,344 --> 00:08:36,544 Speaker 1: maybe this isn't the greatest look. Yeah, so what does 129 00:08:36,624 --> 00:08:39,824 Speaker 1: Christian propose? Like, what's the purpose of the park Slope Panthers? 130 00:08:40,184 --> 00:08:45,864 Speaker 1: So he in the next door posts he wrote, do 131 00:08:45,944 --> 00:08:49,024 Speaker 1: we want to organize a community safety patrol and take 132 00:08:49,064 --> 00:08:53,064 Speaker 1: our park back? And then he referenced, oh, right, So 133 00:08:53,144 --> 00:08:56,504 Speaker 1: that language already to kind of a casual observer, right, 134 00:08:56,664 --> 00:08:58,984 Speaker 1: might be like huh interesting, Okay, what are you trying 135 00:08:58,984 --> 00:09:01,104 Speaker 1: to do here? Right? Right? Because the way you hear 136 00:09:01,144 --> 00:09:03,744 Speaker 1: that phrases normally take our country back, it's usually a 137 00:09:03,824 --> 00:09:07,984 Speaker 1: very xenophobic, right phrase. So that's a weird thing for 138 00:09:08,024 --> 00:09:12,584 Speaker 1: this guy who's very liberal, and it's surprising language. He 139 00:09:12,664 --> 00:09:15,784 Speaker 1: must know that. Yeah, he's a fascinating person. And then 140 00:09:15,864 --> 00:09:20,424 Speaker 1: he referenced the Guardian Angels, and he wrote, think what 141 00:09:20,544 --> 00:09:22,664 Speaker 1: the Guardian Angels did to take back the subways in 142 00:09:22,704 --> 00:09:25,704 Speaker 1: the seventies early eighties, we may also get to wear 143 00:09:25,944 --> 00:09:30,224 Speaker 1: cool brets. So I remember the Guardian Angels from going 144 00:09:30,264 --> 00:09:32,104 Speaker 1: to New York City when I was a kid, and 145 00:09:32,144 --> 00:09:35,064 Speaker 1: they were this neighborhood watch group that would like they 146 00:09:35,104 --> 00:09:38,704 Speaker 1: were berets and these satin jackets with their names on them. 147 00:09:38,904 --> 00:09:42,304 Speaker 1: They looked like somewhere between like a retirement community and 148 00:09:42,344 --> 00:09:45,424 Speaker 1: the French Foreign Legion. And they would stand around on 149 00:09:45,464 --> 00:09:48,464 Speaker 1: subway platforms and look kind of threatening and they were 150 00:09:48,464 --> 00:09:51,864 Speaker 1: empowered to make citizens arrests. And they were started by 151 00:09:51,864 --> 00:09:55,944 Speaker 1: this guy, Curtis Sliwa, who then in twenty twenty one 152 00:09:56,584 --> 00:09:59,984 Speaker 1: is the GOP nominee for the mayor of New York City. 153 00:10:00,424 --> 00:10:03,944 Speaker 1: So it's kind of a weird thing for Christian, who's 154 00:10:03,984 --> 00:10:07,464 Speaker 1: this like ultra progressive guy to bring up right now, 155 00:10:07,944 --> 00:10:10,504 Speaker 1: it's a curious thing to bre up. And he organizes 156 00:10:10,584 --> 00:10:14,584 Speaker 1: this group. He puts out a call for an open meeting, 157 00:10:14,784 --> 00:10:19,064 Speaker 1: a public meeting for the Parkslo Panthers. So he posts 158 00:10:19,064 --> 00:10:21,224 Speaker 1: that there's going to be a meeting on I assume 159 00:10:21,424 --> 00:10:24,304 Speaker 1: next door or Facebook, and as soon as he does, 160 00:10:24,344 --> 00:10:29,584 Speaker 1: the reactions are incredible. Someone bought the domain Parkslow Panthers 161 00:10:29,624 --> 00:10:32,184 Speaker 1: dot com and you go to the site and it's 162 00:10:32,224 --> 00:10:36,984 Speaker 1: literally just a landing page with a message that's basically 163 00:10:37,144 --> 00:10:40,704 Speaker 1: it basically says, Prospect Park doesn't need your racist bs, 164 00:10:40,744 --> 00:10:45,144 Speaker 1: thanks right. And then it became a big enough deal 165 00:10:45,184 --> 00:10:49,504 Speaker 1: where this guy Christian gets invited on the Tucker Carlson Show. Yes, 166 00:10:49,784 --> 00:10:53,704 Speaker 1: it turns out he declined that invitation, but that does 167 00:10:53,744 --> 00:10:56,344 Speaker 1: give you a sense, right of how the story had 168 00:10:56,344 --> 00:10:59,104 Speaker 1: been spread and how people were seeing it. And Curtis 169 00:10:59,104 --> 00:11:01,624 Speaker 1: Sliwa wanted to come to the meeting. Curtis Sliwa also 170 00:11:01,664 --> 00:11:04,104 Speaker 1: wanted to attend, and Christian said no to that too, 171 00:11:04,224 --> 00:11:06,904 Speaker 1: and Christian said no to that as well. So this 172 00:11:06,944 --> 00:11:09,584 Speaker 1: meeting is held during the day in the park or 173 00:11:09,584 --> 00:11:11,864 Speaker 1: what does it look like there? It was a weekend 174 00:11:11,904 --> 00:11:14,824 Speaker 1: morning in the park. It was a beautiful day. I 175 00:11:14,904 --> 00:11:18,464 Speaker 1: get to the park and it's Christian. He has a 176 00:11:18,464 --> 00:11:21,824 Speaker 1: stack of yellow T shirts that he had printed out 177 00:11:21,904 --> 00:11:23,904 Speaker 1: that said Parks Little Panthers that he was going to 178 00:11:23,984 --> 00:11:25,744 Speaker 1: give out to the first ten people who were there. 179 00:11:26,104 --> 00:11:29,264 Speaker 1: And oh, he made T shirts he did. He did. Yeah, 180 00:11:29,304 --> 00:11:31,424 Speaker 1: he was very committed. He was very committed. That's a 181 00:11:31,504 --> 00:11:35,304 Speaker 1: first step, I think in securing your neighborhood. Yeah. The 182 00:11:35,344 --> 00:11:39,664 Speaker 1: turnout for the meeting wasn't high. I would say it 183 00:11:39,664 --> 00:11:43,624 Speaker 1: was about ten people total. Not that long into this 184 00:11:43,784 --> 00:11:48,384 Speaker 1: tiny meeting, some protesters we're going to protest. This group 185 00:11:48,424 --> 00:11:50,744 Speaker 1: that's barely been going for a few minutes show up 186 00:11:51,184 --> 00:11:54,704 Speaker 1: And what were those people like? Sure? This is the 187 00:11:54,744 --> 00:11:57,464 Speaker 1: moment when I went, oh, this meeting is a lot 188 00:11:57,544 --> 00:12:02,104 Speaker 1: more interesting, I thought it. I think everyone's sitting there 189 00:12:02,184 --> 00:12:04,384 Speaker 1: thought that at this moment, right, right, So just to 190 00:12:04,464 --> 00:12:07,544 Speaker 1: kind of like late set the scene a little bit, right, 191 00:12:07,744 --> 00:12:10,464 Speaker 1: So at this point we're all kind of sitting in 192 00:12:10,504 --> 00:12:14,504 Speaker 1: a circle on the ground in the park. This young 193 00:12:14,544 --> 00:12:21,184 Speaker 1: woman came who announced herself as Susie and that she 194 00:12:21,304 --> 00:12:24,544 Speaker 1: was also a journalist. And I was like, oh, that's 195 00:12:24,624 --> 00:12:29,904 Speaker 1: that's Barry Weiss's sister, Susie Weiss, who writes for her publication. 196 00:12:30,264 --> 00:12:32,424 Speaker 1: Oh wow. So that was the first That was the 197 00:12:32,424 --> 00:12:34,624 Speaker 1: first moment where I was like, oh, this is interesting. 198 00:12:35,304 --> 00:12:38,144 Speaker 1: Okay for those of you without a culture Wars dictionary, 199 00:12:38,824 --> 00:12:41,664 Speaker 1: Barry Weiss was a New York Times columnist who was 200 00:12:41,824 --> 00:12:45,424 Speaker 1: run out by her colleagues for her anti woke politics, 201 00:12:45,464 --> 00:12:47,864 Speaker 1: like she is a Democrat, but she's kind of like 202 00:12:47,904 --> 00:12:51,824 Speaker 1: a female Bill Maher and her sister, who also writes 203 00:12:51,864 --> 00:12:55,224 Speaker 1: a column on Substack, was there. I think it was 204 00:12:55,424 --> 00:13:00,824 Speaker 1: actually as she was introducing herself or shortly after that, 205 00:13:01,504 --> 00:13:03,944 Speaker 1: the really interesting thing part of the meeting happened, which 206 00:13:04,024 --> 00:13:10,664 Speaker 1: was this group of four young people and their names 207 00:13:10,904 --> 00:13:14,624 Speaker 1: and fairly sertain certain we're all pseudonyms, because it was 208 00:13:14,704 --> 00:13:21,864 Speaker 1: things like Sky and Leaf, you know, all there. But again, 209 00:13:21,984 --> 00:13:24,344 Speaker 1: this is Brooklyn their parents. These are young people. Their 210 00:13:24,344 --> 00:13:28,624 Speaker 1: parents could have actually named them right, Apple, right, exactly, 211 00:13:28,784 --> 00:13:33,824 Speaker 1: easy stick. Who knows, But this may be a record 212 00:13:33,864 --> 00:13:36,664 Speaker 1: for how quickly a group has been protested because people 213 00:13:36,744 --> 00:13:40,704 Speaker 1: haven't even introduced themselves and they're already have a protest 214 00:13:40,744 --> 00:13:43,984 Speaker 1: group against them. And these Sky and Leaf and the 215 00:13:44,024 --> 00:13:47,384 Speaker 1: other two have brought a speaker with them so they 216 00:13:47,424 --> 00:13:50,584 Speaker 1: could blast edm and drown out this meeting. Right and 217 00:13:50,624 --> 00:13:53,264 Speaker 1: the one, the one who brought the speaker, their name 218 00:13:53,344 --> 00:13:57,744 Speaker 1: was snow Um. I know, it's hard to keep track. 219 00:13:58,144 --> 00:14:03,424 Speaker 1: And they stroll up and announce to the group that 220 00:14:03,584 --> 00:14:06,264 Speaker 1: they and I'm kind of paraphrasing with what they're saying. 221 00:14:06,304 --> 00:14:08,184 Speaker 1: At this point, they announced the group that they are 222 00:14:08,224 --> 00:14:12,584 Speaker 1: really not okay hey, with what the Parksill Panthers are doing, 223 00:14:13,464 --> 00:14:18,504 Speaker 1: and that they were there to perform an intervention. And 224 00:14:19,024 --> 00:14:24,384 Speaker 1: their position was this is racist. Y'all just want more 225 00:14:24,464 --> 00:14:28,024 Speaker 1: cops when what this guy needs and what we should 226 00:14:28,024 --> 00:14:31,784 Speaker 1: all be doing is mutual aid. Mutual aid is what 227 00:14:31,944 --> 00:14:35,584 Speaker 1: we'll keep us safe, not more please. They were talking 228 00:14:35,624 --> 00:14:37,224 Speaker 1: about things like, you know, we should get to know 229 00:14:37,304 --> 00:14:41,264 Speaker 1: our homeless neighbors, we should get to know each other, 230 00:14:42,104 --> 00:14:45,304 Speaker 1: you know, we should hand out water to people. So 231 00:14:45,344 --> 00:14:49,264 Speaker 1: how does Christian handle this interruption? It was interesting. So 232 00:14:49,344 --> 00:14:52,584 Speaker 1: at first he I think he reacted like probably a 233 00:14:52,624 --> 00:14:54,664 Speaker 1: lot of people would react, which would be like, what 234 00:14:54,744 --> 00:14:58,824 Speaker 1: are y'all doing here? I don't want you here? Go away, right, 235 00:14:59,024 --> 00:15:01,624 Speaker 1: But then he kind of had a little bit of 236 00:15:01,624 --> 00:15:05,784 Speaker 1: bit about face and actually changed tactics and then decided 237 00:15:05,824 --> 00:15:08,584 Speaker 1: to invite the four into the meeting. And then the 238 00:15:08,584 --> 00:15:11,624 Speaker 1: four came back and they announced we're gonna sit down, 239 00:15:11,784 --> 00:15:15,024 Speaker 1: We'll take part, and so they sat down and then 240 00:15:15,104 --> 00:15:18,544 Speaker 1: for the next hour there was just a lot of 241 00:15:18,584 --> 00:15:23,504 Speaker 1: back and forth about what public safety meant. The role 242 00:15:23,544 --> 00:15:28,184 Speaker 1: of the NYPD, what community residents should be doing to 243 00:15:28,304 --> 00:15:35,264 Speaker 1: actually promote safety. Basically a nextdoor conversation but in real life, 244 00:15:35,744 --> 00:15:40,944 Speaker 1: Oh that sounds awful. But at some point, in order 245 00:15:40,944 --> 00:15:45,064 Speaker 1: to bond this whole group together, Christian says that he 246 00:15:45,144 --> 00:15:47,664 Speaker 1: hates Curtis Leewa, and this is and he would never 247 00:15:47,704 --> 00:15:50,104 Speaker 1: try and copy what Curtis Leewa did with the Guardian Angels, 248 00:15:50,584 --> 00:15:53,264 Speaker 1: at which point the most amazing part happens, which is 249 00:15:53,264 --> 00:15:56,344 Speaker 1: what that was the moment when a woman who had 250 00:15:56,344 --> 00:15:58,824 Speaker 1: come a little bit later and had kind of just 251 00:15:58,824 --> 00:16:04,144 Speaker 1: been standing on the outskirts, she kind of just got 252 00:16:04,144 --> 00:16:09,344 Speaker 1: a little huffy, went up to Christian told him I'm 253 00:16:09,424 --> 00:16:13,064 Speaker 1: Nancy Sliwa, Curtis's wife, and then just kind of stalked 254 00:16:13,104 --> 00:16:18,744 Speaker 1: off in her like camo print yoga pants. Oh, never 255 00:16:18,824 --> 00:16:21,544 Speaker 1: to be seen again is not your favorite part? You know, 256 00:16:21,584 --> 00:16:25,144 Speaker 1: there were so many parts of this meeting where you know, 257 00:16:25,224 --> 00:16:29,584 Speaker 1: I was writing in my little reporter's notebook and literally 258 00:16:29,624 --> 00:16:34,984 Speaker 1: just went what what what it's Curtis Lee was fourth wife. 259 00:16:35,064 --> 00:16:37,944 Speaker 1: I think she owns like twenty eight cats. She's an 260 00:16:37,944 --> 00:16:42,104 Speaker 1: animal lover. She's she's a deep animal lover. Yes, yeah, 261 00:16:42,144 --> 00:16:44,904 Speaker 1: And they live in some tiny apartment full of cats. 262 00:16:45,624 --> 00:16:48,144 Speaker 1: This was her sweet spot, right, you have a vigilante 263 00:16:48,224 --> 00:16:51,944 Speaker 1: group protecting animals. Oh my god, that mentioned the Guardian 264 00:16:51,944 --> 00:16:54,824 Speaker 1: Angels in their their invite. Seems like if she if 265 00:16:54,824 --> 00:16:57,424 Speaker 1: she's not welcome there. Oh yeah, I mean, you know, 266 00:16:57,544 --> 00:17:02,184 Speaker 1: much to her chagrin, and I'm sure her surprise. She's 267 00:17:02,224 --> 00:17:04,744 Speaker 1: the victim. It did kind of. I was like, this 268 00:17:04,824 --> 00:17:09,024 Speaker 1: is like some sort of like weird cosmic juju that's 269 00:17:09,104 --> 00:17:13,184 Speaker 1: happening right now. I don't know what's going on, but 270 00:17:13,264 --> 00:17:16,144 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna roll with it. How crazy will this 271 00:17:16,184 --> 00:17:19,984 Speaker 1: meeting get? Will they write a protest song? Will Rudy 272 00:17:20,024 --> 00:17:24,024 Speaker 1: Giuliani come by in a twelve speech? Swin? But first, 273 00:17:24,064 --> 00:17:27,464 Speaker 1: our sponsors have some delightful products to sell you. And 274 00:17:27,584 --> 00:17:41,024 Speaker 1: if it's not kimbucha, then their algorithm totally sucks. The 275 00:17:41,064 --> 00:17:44,744 Speaker 1: first meeting of the Park Slope Panthers ends exactly how 276 00:17:44,784 --> 00:17:47,744 Speaker 1: you expect it would. The meeting ended like a lot 277 00:17:47,784 --> 00:17:51,704 Speaker 1: of these meetings, and which is to say, someone proposed 278 00:17:51,704 --> 00:17:57,024 Speaker 1: the creation of a Google doc. Everyone agreed and then 279 00:17:57,424 --> 00:18:01,584 Speaker 1: lent their merry ways. Right, So did the group decide 280 00:18:01,664 --> 00:18:04,184 Speaker 1: what they wanted? Like, did they want more cops, Did 281 00:18:04,184 --> 00:18:06,224 Speaker 1: they want more social services? Were they going to go 282 00:18:06,224 --> 00:18:08,464 Speaker 1: out and patrol the park? Like? Did they make decisions 283 00:18:08,504 --> 00:18:13,584 Speaker 1: like that or just concrete nothing concrete was decided. The 284 00:18:13,624 --> 00:18:15,984 Speaker 1: Google doc was to kind of come up with like 285 00:18:15,984 --> 00:18:18,664 Speaker 1: a mission statement. Don't you feel if these are Republicans 286 00:18:18,704 --> 00:18:20,784 Speaker 1: they would have already like gotten guns and been in 287 00:18:20,824 --> 00:18:23,584 Speaker 1: the park by the end of this meeting. They're going 288 00:18:23,624 --> 00:18:26,784 Speaker 1: to create a Google doc and a mission statement. It's 289 00:18:26,864 --> 00:18:29,584 Speaker 1: never gonna happen, I will say, you know, My takeaway 290 00:18:29,624 --> 00:18:31,904 Speaker 1: from kind of the conversation though, which I thought was 291 00:18:31,944 --> 00:18:36,144 Speaker 1: really interesting, was that the young people who came to 292 00:18:36,184 --> 00:18:39,624 Speaker 1: interrupt the meeting obviously didn't think, you know, more cops 293 00:18:40,464 --> 00:18:44,744 Speaker 1: was the solution. And then everyone else also expressed a 294 00:18:44,744 --> 00:18:50,664 Speaker 1: lot of hesitancy around or questions around, you know, what 295 00:18:50,744 --> 00:18:54,544 Speaker 1: can the NYPD even do? Are they even capable of 296 00:18:54,584 --> 00:18:58,784 Speaker 1: doing anything in this situation? What's the other option? I 297 00:18:58,784 --> 00:19:00,384 Speaker 1: think that's the question that a lot of people were 298 00:19:00,384 --> 00:19:02,784 Speaker 1: grappling with, you know, when we when people were talking 299 00:19:02,824 --> 00:19:09,424 Speaker 1: about can we divert money from police departments towards things 300 00:19:09,464 --> 00:19:16,224 Speaker 1: like social services, affordable housing, you know, supports for homeless people, 301 00:19:16,664 --> 00:19:20,184 Speaker 1: supports for homeless families. But I think that's the big question, right, 302 00:19:20,224 --> 00:19:23,184 Speaker 1: like what can we do? And I think that's the struggle, right, Like, 303 00:19:23,344 --> 00:19:26,824 Speaker 1: nothing that we kind of like have at hand in 304 00:19:26,864 --> 00:19:30,984 Speaker 1: the moment feels enough. And this is what I find 305 00:19:31,024 --> 00:19:36,464 Speaker 1: really interesting and telling is that Jessica Crustick mooses, this 306 00:19:36,624 --> 00:19:39,864 Speaker 1: is the woman whose dog was Moose, who was attacked. 307 00:19:40,104 --> 00:19:42,824 Speaker 1: You know, she has kind of taken it upon herself 308 00:19:42,904 --> 00:19:46,784 Speaker 1: to you know, try and mount this claim for accountability, 309 00:19:47,304 --> 00:19:50,784 Speaker 1: and it seems pretty clear her goal is to have 310 00:19:50,864 --> 00:19:55,904 Speaker 1: the NYPD arrest this man. Jessica was instructed by the 311 00:19:55,904 --> 00:19:58,824 Speaker 1: police to try and ide her attacker and then call 312 00:19:58,944 --> 00:20:00,704 Speaker 1: nine to one one as soon as she could so 313 00:20:00,744 --> 00:20:04,144 Speaker 1: she could press charges. So one day, a friend woke 314 00:20:04,144 --> 00:20:06,224 Speaker 1: her up with a call saying that she saw her 315 00:20:06,224 --> 00:20:09,784 Speaker 1: attack her in the park, and Jessica called nine on one, 316 00:20:09,904 --> 00:20:13,904 Speaker 1: got dressed and started following him in the darkness before sunrise. 317 00:20:14,944 --> 00:20:17,584 Speaker 1: And as she was following him for what turned out 318 00:20:17,584 --> 00:20:20,784 Speaker 1: to be fifteen minutes waiting for the cops to arrive, 319 00:20:21,264 --> 00:20:24,904 Speaker 1: the guy noticed her and turned around and came after her. 320 00:20:25,984 --> 00:20:29,064 Speaker 1: So Jessica took out her pepper spray, but it turns 321 00:20:29,064 --> 00:20:32,744 Speaker 1: out that the guy also carries pepper spray and he 322 00:20:32,784 --> 00:20:35,144 Speaker 1: took his out while he was starting to chase her. 323 00:20:36,184 --> 00:20:38,784 Speaker 1: No one winds up managing to pepper spray the other, 324 00:20:39,304 --> 00:20:42,424 Speaker 1: and eventually Jessica runs by a police car that's parked 325 00:20:42,664 --> 00:20:44,704 Speaker 1: and she tries to get them to roll down their window, 326 00:20:44,944 --> 00:20:48,824 Speaker 1: but they just wave her away. And then finally, after 327 00:20:48,984 --> 00:20:52,904 Speaker 1: forty minutes, cops come by, and by then she had 328 00:20:52,904 --> 00:20:55,224 Speaker 1: gotten away from the guy and they were unable to 329 00:20:55,264 --> 00:21:00,504 Speaker 1: find him. Police have since apologized for this. Okay, after 330 00:21:00,744 --> 00:21:05,464 Speaker 1: your article comes out, Christian is a little probably shaken 331 00:21:05,544 --> 00:21:08,544 Speaker 1: up from what's happened. And then someone spray paints the 332 00:21:08,584 --> 00:21:12,864 Speaker 1: sidewalk outside of his apartment building with the message don't 333 00:21:12,904 --> 00:21:16,864 Speaker 1: be a cop. Chris did that freak him out? From 334 00:21:16,904 --> 00:21:18,784 Speaker 1: what I could tell, you know, he was very upset 335 00:21:18,824 --> 00:21:20,944 Speaker 1: by it. I think that was one thing that might 336 00:21:21,024 --> 00:21:25,624 Speaker 1: have possibly played a role in his decision to terminate 337 00:21:25,664 --> 00:21:30,344 Speaker 1: the park slop Panthers. So since that meeting, Christian announced 338 00:21:30,904 --> 00:21:33,544 Speaker 1: the part slow Panthers were no more. That was it. 339 00:21:33,584 --> 00:21:36,624 Speaker 1: That's the whole park, that was it. Yeah, the rise, 340 00:21:36,784 --> 00:21:40,184 Speaker 1: the rise and fall. Imagine what those T shirts are 341 00:21:40,224 --> 00:21:45,624 Speaker 1: worth now? One totally? What was the response like When 342 00:21:45,624 --> 00:21:48,224 Speaker 1: the article came out, the response was interesting, right. I 343 00:21:48,224 --> 00:21:49,784 Speaker 1: think a lot of people were like, this is the 344 00:21:49,864 --> 00:21:56,064 Speaker 1: most park slope story ever, Right, I think it's the 345 00:21:56,144 --> 00:22:00,264 Speaker 1: most explain the problems in the Democratic Party story ever. Yeah, 346 00:22:00,344 --> 00:22:02,144 Speaker 1: he just definitely one way to look at it, right. 347 00:22:02,264 --> 00:22:06,664 Speaker 1: But I think the response really depended on kind of 348 00:22:06,864 --> 00:22:11,104 Speaker 1: where the reader was politically right, so I would I 349 00:22:11,104 --> 00:22:13,624 Speaker 1: wouldn't call it a Rorshach test, but people took out 350 00:22:13,624 --> 00:22:16,384 Speaker 1: of the story like what they felt would kind of 351 00:22:17,104 --> 00:22:21,864 Speaker 1: justify or support their preexisting beliefs. Where am I on 352 00:22:21,904 --> 00:22:24,704 Speaker 1: the political spectrum? If I found every single person in 353 00:22:24,744 --> 00:22:28,504 Speaker 1: this story hysterical, I mean you would be on the 354 00:22:28,504 --> 00:22:32,384 Speaker 1: correct side of the political spectrum, because I do agree 355 00:22:32,384 --> 00:22:34,984 Speaker 1: with you. Right. I certainly had that reaction too when 356 00:22:35,024 --> 00:22:36,704 Speaker 1: I was there in the meeting, and then I think, 357 00:22:36,744 --> 00:22:39,184 Speaker 1: like taking a step back, you know, I think the 358 00:22:39,304 --> 00:22:44,224 Speaker 1: interpretation I ultimately took away is that everybody there like 359 00:22:44,384 --> 00:22:48,344 Speaker 1: didn't want the same things, right. You know, I'm so 360 00:22:48,544 --> 00:22:51,504 Speaker 1: grateful that you wrote this story so I could experience 361 00:22:51,504 --> 00:22:54,704 Speaker 1: it without actually having to go, So thank you. Esther 362 00:22:54,824 --> 00:22:57,264 Speaker 1: Wong is a writer in New York City. You can 363 00:22:57,344 --> 00:23:00,744 Speaker 1: read our article Saturday morning with the Park Slope Panthers 364 00:23:00,864 --> 00:23:04,504 Speaker 1: on Hellgate. Thank you so much for explaining this all 365 00:23:04,504 --> 00:23:07,184 Speaker 1: to me. Yeah, thank you for having me appreciate it. 366 00:23:10,864 --> 00:23:14,624 Speaker 1: We are so torn over societal changes that our entire 367 00:23:14,784 --> 00:23:20,064 Speaker 1: life is being filtered by politics. Even dog murder, every 368 00:23:20,144 --> 00:23:23,304 Speaker 1: incident becomes a cable news circus, and there are so 369 00:23:23,384 --> 00:23:27,384 Speaker 1: many clowns that minor woke and anti woke celebrities show 370 00:23:27,424 --> 00:23:30,344 Speaker 1: up at our park get togethers. So now we have 371 00:23:30,384 --> 00:23:33,664 Speaker 1: a homeless man without social services who's in danger of 372 00:23:33,704 --> 00:23:37,264 Speaker 1: going to Riker's Island, which is a jail notorious for 373 00:23:37,264 --> 00:23:40,544 Speaker 1: its abuse of mentally ill people. And we also have 374 00:23:40,624 --> 00:23:43,424 Speaker 1: a woman who lost her dog and is now afraid 375 00:23:43,504 --> 00:23:47,464 Speaker 1: of walking around her neighborhood. After I finished my interview 376 00:23:47,464 --> 00:23:50,344 Speaker 1: with Esther, the Mayor of New York City, Eric Adams, 377 00:23:50,424 --> 00:23:54,904 Speaker 1: announced that cops and emt s will now involuntarily put 378 00:23:54,944 --> 00:23:57,704 Speaker 1: homeless people in hospitals if they seem like a danger, 379 00:23:58,264 --> 00:24:02,024 Speaker 1: even if that danger is just to themselves. Homeless advocates 380 00:24:02,064 --> 00:24:07,384 Speaker 1: are infuriated. I'm not sure what the solutions are except 381 00:24:07,424 --> 00:24:10,184 Speaker 1: to avoid people who are sure what the solutions are, 382 00:24:11,384 --> 00:24:21,064 Speaker 1: even if they're giving out cool T shirts at the 383 00:24:21,264 --> 00:24:24,464 Speaker 1: end of the show, what's next for Joel Stein? Maybe 384 00:24:24,504 --> 00:24:28,704 Speaker 1: he'll take a napper voke around online. Our show today 385 00:24:28,784 --> 00:24:31,944 Speaker 1: was produced by Kate mcculiffe and Nisha ben Cut. It 386 00:24:31,984 --> 00:24:36,264 Speaker 1: was edited by Robert Sniff. Our engineer is Amanda kay 387 00:24:36,304 --> 00:24:41,424 Speaker 1: Way and our executive producer is Katherine Shiradolf. And our 388 00:24:41,464 --> 00:24:44,624 Speaker 1: theme song was written and performed by Jonathan Colton and 389 00:24:44,704 --> 00:24:47,504 Speaker 1: a special thanks to my voice coach, Backy Merrick and 390 00:24:47,624 --> 00:24:51,784 Speaker 1: my consulting producer, laurenz Alasna. To find more Pushkin podcast, 391 00:24:52,224 --> 00:24:56,064 Speaker 1: listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 392 00:24:56,104 --> 00:24:59,424 Speaker 1: listen to your podcasts. I'm Joel Stein and this is 393 00:24:59,424 --> 00:25:03,624 Speaker 1: the story of the week. The one who brought the speaker. 394 00:25:03,984 --> 00:25:07,024 Speaker 1: Their name was Snow. This is not the Canadian rapper 395 00:25:07,104 --> 00:25:11,304 Speaker 1: Snow of Licky and boomed down. Oh that would have 396 00:25:11,304 --> 00:25:13,464 Speaker 1: made this Anything could happened in this story. I would 397 00:25:13,504 --> 00:25:15,744 Speaker 1: totally anything could happened in this story.