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Speaker 1: The volume The Colin Cowherd Podcast, brought to you by

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Speaker 1: Fan Duel. It's never been easier to play fantasy on

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Speaker 1: Fan Duel. Whether you love basketball, golf, soccer, or any

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Speaker 1: fantasy sport. There is a contest for every fan. Fan

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Speaker 1: Duel more ways to win, all right, everybody, welcome in.

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Speaker 1: It is our Thursday, Yeah, a day early, Our Thursday,

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Speaker 1: Colin Coward Podcast, Nick Wright, Chad Mellman. It'll be great.

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Speaker 1: We always do fake questions, real answers. At this time.

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Speaker 1: I've got a lot of things I want to talk about,

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Speaker 1: but I don't want to wait for you to ask

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Speaker 1: the questions. It's fake questions, real answers. First question, dear Colin,

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Speaker 1: of all the teams that made the NBA Playoffs, which

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Speaker 1: one took the biggest step back? What a great question.

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Speaker 1: Boston has a dilemma on its hands. They're not great

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Speaker 1: with Jaylen Brown, Marcus Smart and Jason Tatum. Is their

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Speaker 1: three most valuable players? Didn't say three best? Two are

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Speaker 1: the best ones valuable, but they're not bad enough to

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Speaker 1: get great draft picks. They're in NBA quicksand they feel

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Speaker 1: like Portland to me. One great player, another really good one,

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Speaker 1: Portland and Boston need to make a big swing for

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Speaker 1: the Celtics with a now rookie head coach and a

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Speaker 1: rookie GM to catch a Milwaukee I think you have

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Speaker 1: to trade Jaylen Brown, swing big, get a Bradley Beal,

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Speaker 1: get a Dame Lillard, and start over. Otherwise you're Portland

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Speaker 1: somewhere between the eleventh and sixteenth best team in the league,

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Speaker 1: not bad enough to get a great pick, not good

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Speaker 1: enough to matter. Dear Colin, if you could buy one

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Speaker 1: suffering pro sports franchise right now, because you could turn

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Speaker 1: it into a success, which one you buy in? You know,

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Speaker 1: I thought about this. I'd go Cincinnati Bengals. First of all,

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Speaker 1: get him at a discount. Mike Brown's been the owner

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Speaker 1: since nineteen ninety one. He's arguably the cheapest owner. They

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Speaker 1: haven't won a playoff game in that entire time. That

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Speaker 1: is hard to do in the NFL. Vanilla Ice has

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Speaker 1: had more success in that time span. I wish I

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Speaker 1: was joking. The Steelers and the Ravens have strong owners

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Speaker 1: and are very well run. And now the Cleveland Browns

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Speaker 1: appear to have an Andrew Berry Kevin Stefanski combo. That's

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Speaker 1: certainly commendable. What are they Well, what they are is

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Speaker 1: a team that averages five wins a year in the

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Speaker 1: last half decade. But I've got Joe Burrow, Joe Mixon,

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Speaker 1: t Higgins, They've elevated the offensive line, and I think

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Speaker 1: Zach Taylor is going to work This team. With the

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Speaker 1: right ownership, I think would have a real chance to

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Speaker 1: break through. That's the kind of team I'd buy the

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Speaker 1: Cincinnati Bengals, Believe it or not, Dear Colin people, Adam

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Speaker 1: Schefter a lot of shit for dropping that Rogers news

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Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers news member that on Draft Day, but it's

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Speaker 1: pretty much been the only news that's happened all offseason.

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Speaker 1: Shouldn't we be thanking him for his service to sports talk? Actually? Yes,

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Speaker 1: if the world was full of Mike Trouts and Kawhi Leonard,

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Speaker 1: I would own a bait and tackle shop. I would

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Speaker 1: literally not have a career in the end. I'm loyal

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Speaker 1: to tire fires. I need problems. I need car Wrex

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Speaker 1: and Aaron Rodgers. Let's be honest. Is great content Lebron

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Speaker 1: James Aging is no longer a driving force in my business.

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Speaker 1: Tom Brady's probably got two years left. Russell Wilson is

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Speaker 1: great but kind of boring. Aaron Rodgers, we can't deny this.

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Speaker 1: He's the most interesting quarterback in the NFL. Mahomes, He's

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Speaker 1: a good soldier. He's loyal. Josh Allen, same thing, justin

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Speaker 1: Herbert not overly verbal. In the world I live in

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Speaker 1: the NFL is king and I need a court jester.

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Speaker 1: I need somebody that pushes back, and that's what Aaron

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Speaker 1: Rodgers is. You watch the match, you watch that celebrity

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Speaker 1: golf tournament. He was toying with the packers. He was

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Speaker 1: poking them in the ribs. He's great content. Dear Colin,

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Speaker 1: I want you to know you're the world's greatest sports opinionist.

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Speaker 1: It is awfully kind. But who are the people you

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Speaker 1: turn on when you hear a sports opinion? You know

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Speaker 1: I'll be honest with you. I don't listen for sports opinion.

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Speaker 1: I've got my own takes I always have. I listen

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Speaker 1: for format teasing, your guest list, your advertisers. Can I

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Speaker 1: steal one? In my business? Opinions are not something I'm

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Speaker 1: ever short of. But I do look at my competition

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Speaker 1: to see who's getting booked, what are the topics, who

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Speaker 1: are the advertisers. It's a combative, competitive world. I'm here

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Speaker 1: for it. The truth is, when it comes to content,

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Speaker 1: if I want politics, I tend to go Bill Maher.

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Speaker 1: He makes me laugh. If I want sports, there's a

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Speaker 1: handful of column I trust Bob Kravitz Indianapolis. If there's

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Speaker 1: a coal tissue, he and Greg Doyle usually come out

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Speaker 1: with a smart answer. I just go to cities often

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Speaker 1: rely on veteran newspaper guys. They've been around, they're well connected,

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Speaker 1: they're smartly sourced. That's who I rely on for information.

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Speaker 1: I don't really rely on anybody for a take. Dear Colin,

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Speaker 1: we're about halfway through the year. What's the best story

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Speaker 1: in sports that happened this year? And please don't say

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Speaker 1: Brady winning the Super Bowl? I actually think we're watching

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Speaker 1: it with Chris Paul and the Phoenix Suns. Think about this.

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Speaker 1: You do not go from awful for a decade to

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Speaker 1: the best team in college sports men's women's lacrosse, football, basketball, soccer.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't work that way. The only place it could

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Speaker 1: potentially happen is say professional sports. A baseball team Kansas

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Speaker 1: City Royals years ago, Ned Yost, the manager all those

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Speaker 1: draft picks. They pop in a year. That was a really,

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Speaker 1: really captivating story. The Royals were accumulated draft picks, were

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Speaker 1: a very athletic team that didn't really have an ace.

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Speaker 1: They had a very good bullpen, they manufactured runs, and

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Speaker 1: they become a World Series champ. That's a little bit

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Speaker 1: like Phoenix. All these young players pop at the same time.

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Speaker 1: Add Chris, Paul Stir and Serve. I think it's a

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Speaker 1: fascinating story. I don't think you see it. I don't

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Speaker 1: think you see a team that's bad for nine years,

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Speaker 1: has a regrettable owner. At times they had to go

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Speaker 1: get a coach at GM they liked. But it does

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Speaker 1: prove that if you draft well and you develop and

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Speaker 1: your patient and Phoenix did. Sometimes it just takes one

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Speaker 1: smart veteran to make the difference. The Suns are largely

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Speaker 1: the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Good young players. Quarterback and point

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Speaker 1: guard were always the issue. Think about it. Tampa Bay

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Speaker 1: for years would get a's, b's on their draft picks.

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Speaker 1: Jason Light was a great GM, but they didn't have

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Speaker 1: somebody that could bring it together. Brady shows up and

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Speaker 1: they look like far and away the most talented team

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Speaker 1: in the NFL. Well, what was Phoenix? Mikhail Bridges, DeAndre

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Speaker 1: at and Devin Booker drafted well developed, but they didn't

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Speaker 1: have somebody to pull it together. So I think it's

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Speaker 1: interesting that in the last calendar year the Bucks and

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Speaker 1: the Phoenix Suns are largely the same story, bad and

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Speaker 1: irrelevant for a decade, suddenly appear to be easily the

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Speaker 1: best team in the league because of one transformative leader,

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Speaker 1: Tom Brady. Chris Paul all right, let's bring him my

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Speaker 1: buddy Nick, right, we only get him once twice a month.

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Speaker 1: We love it every time we get him, So no

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Speaker 1: big surprises. Game one for me. Milwaukee did what Milwaukee

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Speaker 1: did and often does. They start slow, they don't make

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Speaker 1: a lot of adjustments. Phoenix, meanwhile, I think it's a

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Speaker 1: tough team to play an opener. The Lakers found that out,

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Speaker 1: Denver found that out, the Clippers found it out. The Bucks.

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Speaker 1: They're very relentless, they play with urgency, They're very quick,

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Speaker 1: they're young, they're twitchy, They're a hard team to match

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Speaker 1: up with. And I just I mean, all four of

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Speaker 1: those teams have faced kind of the same thing. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think it's incredible. They shot twenty free throws made

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Speaker 1: all of them. Yeah, it's just and I said this

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Speaker 1: before the series. I said, don't let this stat be forgotten.

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Speaker 1: Milwaukee's not a great free throw shooting stretch. Phoenix is amazing.

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Speaker 1: And three of these games will be decided in the

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Speaker 1: last two and a half minutes. Now, that wasn't the

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Speaker 1: case in this one. But I nothing through me for

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Speaker 1: a loop. It looked like I thought it would look

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Speaker 1: like your thoughts. Well, the most surprising thing to me

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Speaker 1: was that Jannis played. And that's why if I'm Milwaukee,

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Speaker 1: I actually feel pretty good about being down. Oh one,

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Speaker 1: I listen, You're right that Phoenix has been at their

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Speaker 1: best in game ones, and conversely, Milwaukee has been at

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Speaker 1: their worsting game ones. Game one they beat Miami soundly

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Speaker 1: three times. The one they almost lost was Game one.

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Speaker 1: Remember Jimmy Butler forces overtime, you know, at the buzzer

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Speaker 1: driving past Jannis. So they weren't good in that Game one.

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Speaker 1: Brooklyn beat him up in Game one in Brooklyn and

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Speaker 1: Trey Young scored forty seven on them after and that

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Speaker 1: was kind of remarkable because that was Philly. They had

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Speaker 1: just played Philly two days prior in a Game seven,

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Speaker 1: so Milwaukee had the extra day of rest and still

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Speaker 1: Atlanta came in and beat them, So it wasn't shocking

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Speaker 1: to me that Milwaukee lost. That. There's two to me

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Speaker 1: most interesting things, aside from Chris Paul, which I know

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Speaker 1: we'll get to. One is the free throws, And you're right,

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Speaker 1: Phoenix is the far better free throw shooting team, but

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Speaker 1: Milwaukee should get to the line more often than them,

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Speaker 1: so they should probably in this series both make about

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Speaker 1: the same amount of free throws per game, but it's

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Speaker 1: because Phoenix is are gonna go seventeen of nineteen and

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Speaker 1: Milwaukee is gonna go seventeen to twenty six. Right last night,

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Speaker 1: Milwaukee didn't get to the line at all except for

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Speaker 1: Yannis Drew, Holiday drew one shooting foul brooklyn As drew

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Speaker 1: one shooting fell. That was it. If you look at

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Speaker 1: the free throws, Yannis has twelve, Drew and Brooke two,

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Speaker 1: and that's the entirety of it. So to me, there

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Speaker 1: is they will get a better whistle. But the more

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Speaker 1: important piece, in my opinion, is that Jannis looked like

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Speaker 1: he's going to be fine for this series. And if

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Speaker 1: he's fine, he scored forty seven against him. In the

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Speaker 1: regular season in the first game thirty three in the

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Speaker 1: second game. They don't have a real answer for Yannis.

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Speaker 1: So I think this will be a long series, and

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Speaker 1: I think Jannis will be able to put his imprint

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Speaker 1: on it. But obviously, if Chris Paul out scores Yannis

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Speaker 1: every game that happened, the Bucks are gonna lose. Fining.

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Speaker 1: The Bucks should feel pretty decent about being down O one.

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Speaker 1: You know, they remind me a little of the Ravens.

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Speaker 1: They play better downhill and with a lead. They're not

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Speaker 1: a team really built to play from behind. You know,

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Speaker 1: their star doesn't shoot great threes, middle and streaky. I

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Speaker 1: think their biggest issue is going to be can they

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Speaker 1: go into games with two and a half minutes left

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Speaker 1: with a four to a six point lead. Then I think, yeah,

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Speaker 1: then they get their twos, they can get their dunks,

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Speaker 1: then they're fine. It's like Baltimore. Baltimore is built they

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Speaker 1: can win from behind, but they're not built to win

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Speaker 1: from behind, and I think that's Milwaukee's issue. I do

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Speaker 1: think Phoenix I said this the other day. They're the Buccaneers,

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Speaker 1: good young players, all peaking, They've developed them. They just

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Speaker 1: didn't have a guy to send it all together. So

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Speaker 1: you bring a Hall of Famer past his prime who's

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Speaker 1: sort of known as more leader than great athlete, Chris

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Speaker 1: Paul Brady, and a year later you're like, oh, wow,

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Speaker 1: this is the best team. Perhaps easily. Maybe there's the Chiefs,

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Speaker 1: maybe Buffalo and in the NBA, if A d and

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Speaker 1: Lebron are healthy, maybe, but I do think there's the

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Speaker 1: equivalent team here is that and it's a great It's

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Speaker 1: a cautionary tale on be patient, draft well, develop and

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Speaker 1: then you don't have to add a lot of pieces

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Speaker 1: to make it work. I mean, you had Ricky Rubio

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Speaker 1: out Chris Paul in it's a completely different franchise completely.

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Speaker 1: Jamis Winston is good enough to start for a lot

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Speaker 1: of teams. He's out, Brady's in. It looks like a

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Speaker 1: completely different franchise. So there are similarities here that I think.

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Speaker 1: This is where I say Chris Paul, Chris Paul screws

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Speaker 1: up a lot of arguments and a lot of stats.

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Speaker 1: They shouldn't be this good, right, So that I agree with.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a really great comp And it took

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Speaker 1: your less than five minutes to bring up the super Bowl.

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Speaker 1: So your streak remains intact of torturing me with the

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Speaker 1: Bucks Chief Super Bowl, So congrats to you on that.

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Speaker 1: But the last point to me is the most relevant one,

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Speaker 1: which is the stats. And you know, when I first

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Speaker 1: started coming on your show five years ago, you know,

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Speaker 1: I was kind of like the stat guy, Like I'd

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Speaker 1: bring up these like Lebron numbers or numbers people hadn't heard,

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Speaker 1: and try to tell the story through the numbers. I

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Speaker 1: understand the numbers. I respect the numbers. I appreciate the numbers,

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Speaker 1: and I think they're useful in formulating arguments and opinions.

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Speaker 1: But NBA evaluation, not just in the media, by the way,

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Speaker 1: by some front offices, has become so exclusively about the

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Speaker 1: numbers that I think sometimes you miss the brilliance of

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Speaker 1: an individual player and the things that he does. And

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Speaker 1: Chris Paul is the perfect example of this. And Colin,

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Speaker 1: You've heard me use this comp before, but I'm going

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Speaker 1: to use it again because it's the perfect one and

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Speaker 1: it's instructive. So let's think about Isaiah Thomas, the original

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Speaker 1: Isaiah Thomas to win championships the nineteen eighties, in his

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Speaker 1: own conference, he had to go through the Celtics, who

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Speaker 1: had four Hall of Famers at one point five Hall

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Speaker 1: of Famers. You had to go through the Bulls, who

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Speaker 1: had Jordan for the almost entirety of the eighties, the

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Speaker 1: entirety of when the Pistons were great, and then they

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Speaker 1: did have Pippin three years after Jordan got there. And

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Speaker 1: so you have one of the two greatest players ever,

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Speaker 1: plus Scotty who's one of the forty greatest players ever,

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Speaker 1: and of course they bring in Phil Jackson, and then

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Speaker 1: if you get to the finals, you're probably going to

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Speaker 1: have to go through the Lakers, who are they of

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Speaker 1: magic and Kareem and Worthy, Isaiah Thomas Mars who's a

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Speaker 1: good player, Adrian Danley for part of the run, Mark

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Speaker 1: Aguire for part of the run, and Dennis Rodman again

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Speaker 1: all really great, good players. But who's the best of

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Speaker 1: that group? Probably Rodman, who is a specialist, a great

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Speaker 1: defender and a great rebounder, but can't score to save

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Speaker 1: his life. So how did those Pistons win two titles?

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Speaker 1: And arguably we're an Isaiah Thomas sprain ankle or just

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Speaker 1: a bad call in Game six against Skaream away from

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Speaker 1: winning three in a row. How did he have a

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Speaker 1: winning record in the playoffs against Bird, a winning record

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Speaker 1: in the playoffs against Jordan, and break even with Magic.

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Speaker 1: How oh, well, he must have been one of the

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Speaker 1: greatest players ever. We'll go look at his numbers. It's

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Speaker 1: like seventeen points a game. So how does it compute?

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Speaker 1: Because he understands what Chris Paul understands, which is it

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Speaker 1: is my job to get the most out of this team,

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Speaker 1: which means I need to understand what makes DeAndre Ayton tick?

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Speaker 1: I need what will What do I need to do

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Speaker 1: for DeAndre Ayton to make him the best rim protector

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Speaker 1: he can be? What do I do need to do

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Speaker 1: for Devin Booker to make him fully engaged for forty

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Speaker 1: minutes that he's on the court. What do I need

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Speaker 1: to do for campaign to convince him, dude, for ten

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Speaker 1: minutes a night, you can be me, you can be

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Speaker 1: better and press all those buttons. And when I've talked

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Speaker 1: to Isaiah, Isaiah and he was right because and I

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Speaker 1: know I'm going on and on, but I think it's

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Speaker 1: worth it. Because Isaiah saw that I had referenced when

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Speaker 1: I was initially doing my all time NBA list that

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Speaker 1: he was lower than he thought he should be. And

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Speaker 1: I was like, man, I was like, it's tough. Like

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Speaker 1: I appreciate you as a player. I was like, but

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Speaker 1: you know, never want an MVP. The numbers are what

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Speaker 1: the numbers are. And he said, Nick, you think I

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Speaker 1: couldn't score thirty five whenever I wanted to. He goes,

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Speaker 1: that's not what our team needed to win. That is

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Speaker 1: not Andy. And he told me, he goes, look look

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Speaker 1: at the playoff games when I knew we needed me

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Speaker 1: to score. He goes, I did, I always could, but

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Speaker 1: it wasn't the best way for us to win. And

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Speaker 1: when you see Chris Paul, who has scored more than

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Speaker 1: thirty two points three times in the last three regular seasons,

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Speaker 1: last three years, he's done it three times. But he

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Speaker 1: did it to close out the Nuggets, and then he

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Speaker 1: did it to close out the Clippers, and then he

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Speaker 1: did it in his first NBA Finals game ever. And

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Speaker 1: he's also a guy who's gonna end his career with

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Speaker 1: no MVPs and with good but not overwhelming counting stats.

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Speaker 1: It's like, oh, he just understood what it took for

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Speaker 1: his team to win and sacrificed on his own and

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Speaker 1: by the way it did it shorter than you. I

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Speaker 1: mean he's I've stood next to Chris Paul, I stood

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Speaker 1: next Isaiah Thomas. They are both a fraction shorter than

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Speaker 1: I am. I'm barely six ft tall. To do that,

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Speaker 1: it's just remarkable, and to me, they are the same,

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Speaker 1: not the same guy, but very similar guys in different eras,

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Speaker 1: and almost the last of the true true point guard

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Speaker 1: and start betting smarter. Yeah, the best point guards I've

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Speaker 1: ever seen our magic one Steph Curry to Isaiah three.

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Speaker 1: Everybody else can argue I didn't watch Oscar play. Stockton

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Speaker 1: wasn't pable of scoring a lot of points. There were

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Speaker 1: limitations there. You know, it goes back to something. You know,

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Speaker 1: when Julie Talbot hired me as the president of iHeart

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Speaker 1: and Premiere Radio, she said, I hired a storyteller. Wasn't

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Speaker 1: about my sports knowledge. It wasn't about my voice, it

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Speaker 1: wasn't about my resume. She said, I listened to you

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Speaker 1: and thought he's a good storyteller. It's not always about

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Speaker 1: sheer numbers, data's stats. Take Charles Barkley. If I was

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Speaker 1: to say the best basketball analyst is probably the greatest

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Speaker 1: player to never have won a title. He didn't work

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Speaker 1: terribly hard. I'm not sure he watches the games all

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Speaker 1: the time. He's easily the best analyst in NBA history.

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Speaker 1: You'd be like, that doesn't make that's Charles Barkley. And

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Speaker 1: but Charles tells a good story, Charles has good timing.

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Speaker 1: Charles is funny on this set. He's got to He's

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Speaker 1: got a Terry Bradshaw comedic DNA that you just can't teach.

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Speaker 1: And I think to Isaiah and Chris Paul, there is

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Speaker 1: there is. We never understand the value of self awareness.

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Speaker 1: Carmelo Anthon, he's more talented, he always kind of lack that.

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Speaker 1: He just didn't quite understand the value of committing in

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Speaker 1: the offseason, the value of committing on the defensive end.

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Speaker 1: You know, he was offended by Jeremy Lynn. You know

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Speaker 1: it's like, dude, just embrace it, right. And I think, Chris,

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Speaker 1: I think you have to be I think Chris and

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Speaker 1: Isaiah and there are players like this now less skilled

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Speaker 1: with Shane Battier or Chauncey Billups, they understood how to

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Speaker 1: lubricate the moment. There are certain people that in a

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Speaker 1: room of tension, a good attorney does this, or a

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Speaker 1: marriage counselor they balance the argument out. They asked the

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Speaker 1: right questions. And I think, to your point, we get

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Speaker 1: so caught up in data. There are just certain guys

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Speaker 1: that like lubricate a locker room. And I think, and

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Speaker 1: I've seen this all, they're just certain people you put

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Speaker 1: in a TV set and they make the set better well.

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Speaker 1: And there's certain things I thought you were going to

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Speaker 1: take a different direction when you mentioned Julie, which is

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Speaker 1: the best point guard share the same features as the

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Speaker 1: best bosses. You understand the people you work with and

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Speaker 1: understand that different people need different things to get the

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Speaker 1: most out of them. You know what I mean that

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Speaker 1: you might respond very differently than someone else that she

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Speaker 1: works with to criticism. Maybe you know is somebody that

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Speaker 1: I know. It's an old cliche, but you know you

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Speaker 1: go to the sugar cube or you go to the

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Speaker 1: whip like, well, it depends on what horse, You're right,

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Speaker 1: It depends on who you're working with and the ability

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Speaker 1: to understand the different things. And by the way, Chris

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Speaker 1: maybe didn't always have that Chris. You know when you

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Speaker 1: see him with the Clippers and he gets there and

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Speaker 1: Blake thinks it's his team and DeAndre Jordan's a foot

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Speaker 1: taller than him, and Chris is screaming at both of them.

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Speaker 1: Maybe Chris didn't understand exactly the right lead ship style.

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Speaker 1: I also think it helps that everyone on the Suns

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Speaker 1: is so much younger than him. There's almost like a

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Speaker 1: respect your elder's component to it, like they literally grew

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Speaker 1: up watching him and so they are going to fall

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Speaker 1: in line. But I want to go one more thing

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Speaker 1: on the on the numbers, which is I there is

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Speaker 1: because you mentioned Barkley and Berkeley. You're right, he's the

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Speaker 1: he's the best basketball broadcaster. But you know he's not

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Speaker 1: someone I necessarily would hire in my front office, at

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Speaker 1: least in a leadership role, because I think he is

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Speaker 1: too dismissive of the numbers. Right, the numbers are valuable,

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Speaker 1: But the same arrogance that some of the retired players

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Speaker 1: have with the if you didn't play, you don't know

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Speaker 1: what you're talking about, or those numbers are stupid, some

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Speaker 1: of the numbers folks have mimicked the exact same thing,

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Speaker 1: which is a thing as if sports basketball in particular

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Speaker 1: can be boiled down to a science and it's not

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Speaker 1: a science. There is some science to it, but there

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Speaker 1: is also an art. There is also a feel. There

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Speaker 1: is also a hey, guys, I know all your numbers

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Speaker 1: told me all year I should be terrified of Utah.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't and I wasn't wrong. Like there is there

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Speaker 1: is an element of if your numbers are telling you

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Speaker 1: that Rudy Gobert has more of an impact on winning

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Speaker 1: than Chris Paul, then your numbers are wrong and you've

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Speaker 1: got to understand that some of those numbers are fungible

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Speaker 1: and are they're not set in stone the way we're

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Speaker 1: coming up with some of these advanced metrics. Now, some

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Speaker 1: of them are super useful, but you've got to be

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Speaker 1: able to take them, put it all in a pot

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Speaker 1: and stir it together and then say what makes the

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Speaker 1: most sense. And I think Chris Paul's example of it,

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Speaker 1: because by the numbers, Chris Paul should not have been

424
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:08,480
Speaker 1: in the top ten in league MVP voting. By the

425
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:12,679
Speaker 1: eyes and by the story of the season, he should

426
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 1: have been top three, and I think you and I

427
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 1: think should have been number one. Yeah. And the reason

428
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 1: I was using that Julie references. She said, Colin, I

429
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 1: hired you as a storyteller, not because of your sports

430
00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 1: knowledge or voice. And yet she's a great radio exec.

431
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,439
Speaker 1: And I guess my point was with Barkley and with

432
00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:33,600
Speaker 1: Chris Paul, you can look at certain things, but there

433
00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 1: are just certain qualities that the box score cannot tell

434
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: you and analytics can't. I had an NFL GM tell

435
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: me one time, he said, and I've used this many times.

436
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,399
Speaker 1: He goes, you'll see this guy that dominates college, he

437
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:49,479
Speaker 1: gets to the NFL and he doesn't want to get hit,

438
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:53,200
Speaker 1: and he goes a lot of these big guys dominate

439
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:55,320
Speaker 1: high school, in college, they're just they're just the bully.

440
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: They're the bigger, stronger kid. And then they in the

441
00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: NFL they meet their equal and they don't have the

442
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 1: stomach for it. Do you have the GM said, do

443
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:08,879
Speaker 1: you kind of have the makeup to burrow through another

444
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,760
Speaker 1: man's soul. You've got to be as a defensive player,

445
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 1: a little off. You've got to be offensively. I needed

446
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 1: to memorize a playbook. Defensively, I needed to run through

447
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:25,160
Speaker 1: walls and play with Paine. And that doesn't show up anywhere.

448
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,959
Speaker 1: If you're a bully in the college game, you just

449
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,160
Speaker 1: run over players, except maybe in the Big Ten when

450
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 1: you face Ohio State. That's why that Ohio State video

451
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,000
Speaker 1: becomes crucial in the Big Ten, because that's when you

452
00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,680
Speaker 1: meet your physical equal, if your iowa's best linebacker, and

453
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,119
Speaker 1: so you know, it's one of those things, none of it.

454
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:48,120
Speaker 1: Ninety percent of Alabama players, you don't know. That's why

455
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,360
Speaker 1: so many Alabama players go to the NFL and they're

456
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 1: topped out. They don't have a second gear. They just

457
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: can't physically dominate anyway. So I want to go to

458
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:59,360
Speaker 1: a topic that's non basketball, but it's interesting. And I've

459
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:05,120
Speaker 1: even seen liberal or conservative a lot of commentators land

460
00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 1: where I do. So. Shakari Richardson is a great sprinter,

461
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: her mother passes away, and we all do this. You

462
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 1: have a cocktail, you smoke a joint, whatever you do

463
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 1: to medicate. Yeah, and I've done it more than a

464
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:27,520
Speaker 1: few times this week. So the point being, there are

465
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 1: those who say rules or rules. Now, first of all,

466
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 1: there are bad rules. So I don't think I think

467
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 1: performance enhancing drugs should be banned. I don't think pot

468
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 1: and alcohol should be or a cigarette, by the way,

469
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: nicotine you want it, smoke a cigarette. But I've also

470
00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:49,400
Speaker 1: had throughout the course of my career lots of contracts

471
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,359
Speaker 1: and contracts have been torn up regularly, or rules have

472
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:57,159
Speaker 1: been broken in contracts, and that contracts a lot of

473
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,760
Speaker 1: times aren't worth the money they're written on. Remember years ago,

474
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,879
Speaker 1: when I worked at ESPN, there was a stipulation in

475
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: the contract so that other networks would have the opportunity

476
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: to buy in the NBA. And so I was talking

477
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: to an executive at ESPN and he said, yeah, our

478
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 1: window doesn't open for a year to talk with him,

479
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 1: but we're already negotiating with them. And I said, you know,

480
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:22,760
Speaker 1: is that illegal And he said no, it's just this

481
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 1: is the way the game works. Even though it's rules.

482
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: Networks could sue and you're talking leagues, sports companies, and

483
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: the reality is you put it in the contract and

484
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 1: in the end it just doesn't matter. You have relationships

485
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:40,600
Speaker 1: Fox and ESPN and NBC and T and T have

486
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 1: relationships with people, and you start working on the contracts

487
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 1: even outside of your negotiation window. And so in miss

488
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: Richardson's case, my takeaway was, this is an exception, and

489
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 1: exceptions are part of life, and she gets to do

490
00:28:56,400 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 1: over and just let her compete. There are people that

491
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: are rules are rules people, and there are many instances

492
00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: country club don't wear a denim jacket, you know, don't

493
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 1: wear a tank top like I get it. I get it.

494
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 1: But in this instance, my guess is you side with me?

495
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:18,880
Speaker 1: Which is nicotine alcohol pot that's not what we're testing for.

496
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:24,000
Speaker 1: And listen, we don't even have to go down the Listen.

497
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 1: There's a whole separate conversation about the origins of any

498
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: type of cannabis prohibition and how it takes ten minutes

499
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 1: of light research to be like, oh wow, this is

500
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 1: wildly racist. Like the whole thing was about scary Mexicans

501
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: and Native Americans seventy years ago, and then it just

502
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 1: became a way to keep the thumb on your thumb

503
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:50,840
Speaker 1: on black people. Like we don't even have to go

504
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 1: down that route about how insane America's war on weed

505
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 1: has been. Take that out of it. Let's just talk

506
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 1: about what you're talking about, which is the rules or

507
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 1: rules people. Because you said it very diplomatically, I'll say

508
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: it another way and do it. Yeah, they're dumb. There's

509
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 1: a word for them, dumb, the inability to recognize that

510
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:23,719
Speaker 1: how your world is built on rules changing, being ignored

511
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: or bending. So like you there was I'm gonna there

512
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: was an article today about the FTC taking a hatchet

513
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 1: potentially to non compete clauses. So noncompete clauses are a

514
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 1: big thing in our business, which is like you know,

515
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 1: if I today quit FS one, I'm not allowed to

516
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: tomorrow just show up on ESPN like I have a

517
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 1: non compete clause. And while maybe I don't love that

518
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 1: in our business, I understand it. I understand why it's

519
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 1: dangerous for a broadcast company. And they're like, well, if

520
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 1: you know you have a job with someone else, you

521
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 1: might on your last day say some wild things and

522
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:05,600
Speaker 1: like come watch me. Like I get that part of

523
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 1: it right. But Jimmy Johns, the sandwich maker, was making

524
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: their cashiers agree to non compete clauses that was in

525
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 1: their employment contract that they couldn't for six months go

526
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 1: work its subway. That's a rule. That was a rule

527
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 1: that sandwich artist agreed to. Anybody actually think they should

528
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,760
Speaker 1: have to follow that? Anybody, that's a rule. I don't

529
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: know what to tell you. I know what to tell you.

530
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:36,360
Speaker 1: That rule is fucking stupid. Pardon me. And they should

531
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:40,560
Speaker 1: have the ability to ignore it and it should be changed.

532
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: So why do I bring that up? People act like

533
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:49,840
Speaker 1: the USA track and field by laws were given by

534
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: Moses upon high on stone tablets. They're just words written

535
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,240
Speaker 1: on a piece of paper that anyone at any time

536
00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 1: can change. And so you of an instance where you

537
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 1: have a generational talent for an event that is held

538
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: maybe maybe twice in her entire athletic prime, which, by

539
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 1: the way, already all of this is weird because it

540
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: was supposed to be held a year ago. Guess what

541
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: she wouldn't have tested positively a year ago, or mom

542
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 1: didn't die a year ago. But a damn pandemic is

543
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:29,920
Speaker 1: she's in a state where marijuana is legal. She finds

544
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: out from a reporter her mom has passed away. She

545
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: self medicates, so she tests positive, and then she runs

546
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 1: that hundred. They could have simply said, you know what,

547
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 1: we're changing our rules. You don't like it, apply to

548
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 1: be the president of US Track and Field, good luck

549
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 1: to you. They decided not to do that, But then

550
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: they went a step further, which was even by their

551
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 1: own rules. She was eligible for the relay team. So

552
00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 1: the relay team has six spot to only four actually run,

553
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 1: but you bring six. Two of those six are coaches picks.

554
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: They could have picked literally any woman they wanted to.

555
00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 1: She was eligible for them, and they still chose not

556
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: to pick her because they said it would have been

557
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:22,200
Speaker 1: unfair to the one of the women who was already picked.

558
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 1: But she was going to be on that team. Virtue

559
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: of winning the hundred meters, you have an autospot. It

560
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 1: is beyond me that some of these organizations insist on

561
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:42,040
Speaker 1: cutting off their nose to spite their face. It is

562
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 1: beyond me that some people, ostensibly smart people who want

563
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 1: to act like that every rule there is isn't changeable.

564
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 1: We have a constitution and it's been amended what twenty

565
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 1: seven times? That's the constitution. You don't think us Track

566
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: and Field can say Shakari richards Shakary Richardson can run.

567
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:10,720
Speaker 1: Of course they can. And we also saw some smart

568
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 1: ish people, you know, start being to argue while the

569
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 1: slippery slope. If you allow marijuana two days before qualifying,

570
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 1: who's to say you're not going to allow them to

571
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:24,600
Speaker 1: you know, inject black tar, heroine and the starting blocks.

572
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:26,960
Speaker 1: And it's like, you just sound stupid, and it's just

573
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:33,760
Speaker 1: so frustrating, you know. It's whenever somebody is very rigid,

574
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:38,759
Speaker 1: one of the things my mind goes to to prove

575
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:41,359
Speaker 1: them wrong is what do they deeply care about? Well,

576
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:45,240
Speaker 1: all people deeply care about their kids. So if somebody

577
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,759
Speaker 1: came to me and said rules or rules, and I say,

578
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 1: it's interesting because your daughter has a mid term tomorrow

579
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 1: which will decide her grade point. She needs an a

580
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:58,320
Speaker 1: to go to college eight thirties when she has to

581
00:34:58,360 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: be in class, and I know there was a car

582
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 1: wreck outside of the school and she showed up only

583
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:04,399
Speaker 1: five minutes late. But rules are rules. She can't take

584
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 1: the mid term, not college. It's amazing how quickly rigid

585
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 1: guy wants breathing room. Like how many times in your

586
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: life have you had to argue on behalf of your

587
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:19,319
Speaker 1: kids who have broken a rule, have been late, have

588
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: screwed up. But we understand their kids. And there are

589
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: weird circumstances and there's a wreck outside the school and

590
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 1: you're late. If you look in your own life, how

591
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: often do we all break rules? It's called the speed limit.

592
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: It's the speed limit. And you bring up kids, and

593
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 1: you know, I'll share something with you. It's now been

594
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 1: almost five years, so I don't think he'll mind. But

595
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 1: I look at um that a very similar rules or

596
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 1: rules instance as a fork in the road moment for

597
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 1: my son in a in a bad way. He has

598
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 1: since recovered from it. But he and some friends his

599
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: senior year of high school was right when I was coming,

600
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 1: right when I started working with FS one. So I

601
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,600
Speaker 1: was going LA to Houston, back and forth. And he

602
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:14,400
Speaker 1: and some of his friends his senior in high school,

603
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:22,480
Speaker 1: some of his basketball teammates got caught smoking weed and

604
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 1: This is the other The other element to it, to

605
00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 1: the Shikarry thing, is she admitted to it. And I

606
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 1: think there is an argument to be made that this

607
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:35,320
Speaker 1: is another example of why even if you did something

608
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,160
Speaker 1: you should never admit to it. You got nothing for it.

609
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 1: You got no grace whatsoever for admitting to it. You

610
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:44,400
Speaker 1: were getting no dispensation. And if you just said a

611
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,719
Speaker 1: false test, nonsense, I'm appealing. Maybe she gets to run.

612
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,240
Speaker 1: Who knows, but to go back to what I was saying,

613
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:54,200
Speaker 1: So my son and a few of his teammates get

614
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: caught and the coach does the listen, whose is it?

615
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,760
Speaker 1: You know, if someone doesn't say something, everyone's in trouble.

616
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 1: And to this day, I don't really know the exact story,

617
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: except for the fact that my son said mine, coach,

618
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 1: and the coach thought it was going to be okay.

619
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: Coach thought, okay, you're not going to play in this tournament,

620
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:19,440
Speaker 1: but I have to report it to the school Colin.

621
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 1: They kicked him out of school for two months, ended

622
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 1: his basketball season, ended his college recruitment. He had to

623
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: go to a school forty five minutes away that my

624
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: poor wife, I'm in La you know, during the week

625
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:36,360
Speaker 1: had to drive him to every morning, like a school

626
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 1: for it or reformed school or something like. I called

627
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:43,799
Speaker 1: the school board, like what are we doing here? He's

628
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 1: never been in trouble. He's a good, not great, but

629
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 1: a good student. He's an exemplary athlete, a great citizen.

630
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 1: They're like, well, it says right here if at a

631
00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: you know these this is this is the black and

632
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 1: white rule. And he admitted to it, like you gotta

633
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:04,800
Speaker 1: be kidding me, like so like that that's an instance

634
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 1: where you and I thought wrongly. All right, I'm gonna

635
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,280
Speaker 1: get a human being on the line and we're gonna

636
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: talk like human beings. Like hold on, let's all pause

637
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 1: for a moment here. Nobody benefits from this. He's not

638
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 1: accused of doing anything violent and nefarious anything. It's high

639
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:26,279
Speaker 1: schoolers smoking pot. Now. Should he do it? Of course not.

640
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,360
Speaker 1: But their stance was it's like a it's a black

641
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: and white this is there is you know, like a

642
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:39,440
Speaker 1: mandatory minimum thing. And I think people's lack of flexibility

643
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,359
Speaker 1: on certain things they don't. The question I always ask

644
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: is to whom does that benefit? To whom does Shicarry

645
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 1: Richardson not going to the Olympics benefit to whom does

646
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 1: saying we can't use reason and logic and evaluate things

647
00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,840
Speaker 1: on an individual basis benefit. I don't know that to

648
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 1: this day, and it's infuriating to Yeah. No, I think

649
00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:07,719
Speaker 1: as I've aged, I was more black and white in

650
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 1: my twenties. I think, as I've aged, gray as the

651
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: predominant color I live my life by. Is that. You know,

652
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 1: I've got two biological kids for step kids, I'm divorced,

653
00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 1: I bounced around in my career, had multiple homes just

654
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:26,319
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles. My life's a lot of gray day

655
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 1: to day decisions. I mean, there are certain rules I

656
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,360
Speaker 1: live by, you know, spend less than I make, be

657
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:38,240
Speaker 1: a good citizen, help other people. But I find rigid

658
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,080
Speaker 1: people not able to adapt. I mean, you see it

659
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: in the sports nick There's just a lot of people

660
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 1: that can adapt. And it's what's always amazing to me

661
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 1: is when somebody can adapt, they get fired a GM

662
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:52,960
Speaker 1: or a coach, next job, they still can't adapt. I'm

663
00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:55,719
Speaker 1: always fascinated. There has to be a lack of i Q,

664
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 1: A lack of self awareness, Like if I got fired

665
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,560
Speaker 1: for some then the next job, I wouldn't do that,

666
00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 1: or I try to improve upon that. But what you'll

667
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 1: find over time is people who are unable to adapt

668
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 1: in their personal life can adapt in their professional life,

669
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:14,320
Speaker 1: and it haunts them for their entire life. It haunts

670
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:18,839
Speaker 1: them in social settings, relationships, and jobs. I also think

671
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:24,839
Speaker 1: some people find it easier to live life by as

672
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 1: if there is an instruction manual, so you never have

673
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:33,200
Speaker 1: to really actively think on your own. And if you

674
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 1: simply say what you know, I am who I am,

675
00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: I'm not going to adapt or rules or rules under

676
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: all circumstances, then every decision is far easier as opposed

677
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:47,200
Speaker 1: to evaluating things on its marriage or be willing to evolve,

678
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:51,240
Speaker 1: be willing to say, okay, this is what to your point,

679
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:53,920
Speaker 1: this is what costs me either in a previous relationship

680
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 1: or a previous business. And now I'm going to try

681
00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 1: to take the lessons I learned from that, whether you

682
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:02,239
Speaker 1: want to call it failure or whatever, and apply them

683
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: to the next one. Some people are just flatly uncomfortable

684
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:10,160
Speaker 1: doing that. All right. Before we go July twenty eighth,

685
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 1: at the Poker Go Studios, a fifty thousand dollars buy in,

686
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:20,640
Speaker 1: you will face the most notable, recognizable, well known poker

687
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,839
Speaker 1: player in America Phil Hellmuth, who I once saw an

688
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 1: elevator in Las Vegas. He's a big man. He plays

689
00:41:27,160 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 1: an big, interesting style of poker where he doesn't suffer

690
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:34,440
Speaker 1: many big losses. He either wins the tournament or bows

691
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:37,960
Speaker 1: out quickly. He's a different style. Now, this is the

692
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 1: biggest moment in your poker playing career. I told my

693
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:41,880
Speaker 1: wife about it. I said, I think Nick could make

694
00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 1: several hundred thousand dollars a year minimum playing poker. I'm

695
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: not sure he may want to do radio, TV, satellite whatever.

696
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:55,640
Speaker 1: I said. I really think Nick's colling is poker, and

697
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:58,719
Speaker 1: that's hard when you grew up wanting to be a broadcaster.

698
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: But his real future is probably in sports, gambling, in poker.

699
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:08,799
Speaker 1: So we got a couple of minutes here. As I

700
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:12,919
Speaker 1: say that to you, you're a great broadcaster. I think

701
00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 1: you're as I think you're as sharp and as nimble

702
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:21,279
Speaker 1: intellectually as anybody that's ever done radio. And but I

703
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 1: look at poker and are there ever moments that you

704
00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 1: think to yourself, I'm just gonna go for it. I'm

705
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: going to become a professional poker player, because I think

706
00:42:31,520 --> 00:42:32,840
Speaker 1: if I was as good as you, I would I

707
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:38,440
Speaker 1: would think about it. So I if this is where

708
00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:45,400
Speaker 1: the responsibilities of you know, wifeing kids all like you,

709
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,319
Speaker 1: you evolve as a person, you evolve as your priorities.

710
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:52,360
Speaker 1: I think the answer to that question is if I

711
00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:57,880
Speaker 1: were a single guy with no kids, yes, absolutely, I

712
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 1: think I would have already given it a shot. And certainly,

713
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:05,880
Speaker 1: you know, at this point I would be you know, trying,

714
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:10,239
Speaker 1: I would be actively thinking about it now where I

715
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:13,759
Speaker 1: am Now, do I think that is going? Do I

716
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 1: think that if I take advantage of this opportunity against

717
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:23,439
Speaker 1: phil and then kind of build that into something, could

718
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: it become a bigger and bigger part of my professional life,

719
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:31,040
Speaker 1: not just recreation. Yes, But the other part of it

720
00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 1: is that is Colin. The thing is this, let's just

721
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 1: say you're right that I could make say I could

722
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: make half a million dollars a year playing poker, just

723
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 1: make up a number. It's still not the same as

724
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 1: making half a million dollars a year that comes every

725
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:55,320
Speaker 1: two weeks. Like that the life and that I respect

726
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 1: it and I like it, and I kind of it's

727
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 1: part of my personality, But it is a very the

728
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 1: lifestyle of the folks that don't have the consistent, you know,

729
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:12,040
Speaker 1: guaranteed income. It's different and it has The other thing

730
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:14,799
Speaker 1: is and this is what's hard. And this is where

731
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: you see a lot where the professional gamblers will tell

732
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 1: you the bank roll management is such a big part

733
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 1: of it is it's hard to recognize if you hit

734
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 1: a score, if you win a tournament for two hundred

735
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 1: thousand dollars, you did that in four days, right, three days.

736
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: Maybe it's hard to recognize that might be half of

737
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 1: the money I make all year. I have to spend

738
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:39,400
Speaker 1: it accordingly. It's hard not to be like, I just

739
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: want two hundred thousand dollars. I'm going to go buy

740
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 1: a car. I can now, you know what? Because and

741
00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:48,960
Speaker 1: so there's a lot of parts to the professional gambling

742
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 1: that is riskier. Obviously, it's also to me wildly exciting.

743
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,759
Speaker 1: But the other reason I'm so excited for this is

744
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,319
Speaker 1: and I'm obviously contractually obligated to bring up Lebron, and

745
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 1: we haven't brought him up yet, so I'll fit it

746
00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 1: in here. Lebron always talks about the Teddy Roosevelt quote

747
00:45:09,239 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 1: about the man in the arena. He writes it on

748
00:45:11,680 --> 00:45:16,239
Speaker 1: his shoes. Sometimes. I've never been able to be the

749
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 1: man in the arena. My athletic career ended in high school,

750
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:24,000
Speaker 1: and since then, I've been a commentator. I've been a critic.

751
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 1: I've been someone that talks about the people in the

752
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:31,880
Speaker 1: arena right, at least in this instance, against Phil. And

753
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:34,279
Speaker 1: then we'll see how far I take it. I get

754
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 1: to actually be in the arena, I get to be

755
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 1: competing with the best in the world and seeing how

756
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 1: I stack up. Now, maybe I get rolled over. We'll see.

757
00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 1: But it is incredibly exciting. And I've played with Phil

758
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:53,520
Speaker 1: in some of these pros before at the same place,

759
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 1: in a different format, on shows that actually will air

760
00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,800
Speaker 1: after this one. This one's gonna air live. It'll be

761
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 1: we'll get to see it as it's happening. It'll be

762
00:46:02,200 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 1: anywhere from two to five hours long of me and

763
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:07,200
Speaker 1: Phil going back and forth. So I do think I

764
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:10,200
Speaker 1: could hold my own, and I do think I'm I

765
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:13,919
Speaker 1: understand like I'm a good enough player to hold my own.

766
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 1: And then we'll see. Maybe I'll be wrong or maybe

767
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:18,560
Speaker 1: I'll be great, but I just I'm I mean, it's

768
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:22,120
Speaker 1: in three weeks, Colin, It's three weeks from today that

769
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 1: it happened, And so yeah, I can't wait, Nick, I

770
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:29,879
Speaker 1: want to I want to let you go. We got

771
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:35,120
Speaker 1: Track and Field, poker, Chris Paul, and a story about

772
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:39,440
Speaker 1: my radio boss, all in thirty minutes, yep, and I

773
00:46:39,719 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: when I fit in a little, nice little commentary on

774
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:44,480
Speaker 1: the history of marijuana laws in the US. That was

775
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:48,759
Speaker 1: a nice little twelve seconds of politics for you. All right,

776
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 1: Buddy Goods seeing But all right, he's the CEO of

777
00:46:54,239 --> 00:46:57,920
Speaker 1: the Action Network, Chad Milman. So I just talked to

778
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 1: Nick Wright. He's playing phil hell youth. I do not

779
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:08,319
Speaker 1: play poker a little blackjack. You apparently have a story

780
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: that you have thrown money and caution to the wind.

781
00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:16,360
Speaker 1: What is your gambling story? So well, many many stories.

782
00:47:16,400 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: As you know, I'm you know, very involved in the

783
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: gambling space. But many many years ago when I was

784
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:24,840
Speaker 1: at ESPN, you were there at the same time. It

785
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 1: was like twenty ten, I think, because I was deep

786
00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:31,399
Speaker 1: in the gambling space and I had written the book

787
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,320
Speaker 1: The Odds, and so I knew people in Vegas really well,

788
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:40,160
Speaker 1: and I had then when we were at ESPN started

789
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 1: the gambling be right, I was doing a podcast about it.

790
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,040
Speaker 1: I was, you know, doing radio shows with you and

791
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 1: I was writing a column about it every day. Included

792
00:47:48,239 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 1: in that it was mostly sports betting, but I also

793
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 1: started to cover a lot of poker, and so I

794
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:55,839
Speaker 1: became known as the guy who was covering poker as

795
00:47:55,880 --> 00:48:02,200
Speaker 1: a story, news, breaking, moment, event form for ESPN. So

796
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: one day I'm sitting at my desk in New York

797
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:07,440
Speaker 1: City at three four Street at ESPN, the magazine, and

798
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:11,240
Speaker 1: I get a call from a guy who represents Phil Ivy,

799
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:14,480
Speaker 1: who is by far one of the greatest poker players

800
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:17,319
Speaker 1: who's ever lived. In twenty ten, he was in the

801
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: middle of this run where he was winning World Series,

802
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:22,400
Speaker 1: break bracelets and tons of cash games, you know, gambling

803
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:25,240
Speaker 1: with Jay Z, gambling with Tiger Woods, gambling with Michael Jordan.

804
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:28,880
Speaker 1: So there they say to me, look, Phil never does anything,

805
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:32,640
Speaker 1: and he does, and he's very reclusive. He's going on

806
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:37,200
Speaker 1: and around the world gambling tour on his private jet

807
00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:40,520
Speaker 1: for seventy two hours. That is going to start in

808
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 1: Connecticut and it's going to end in Austria, where at

809
00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:47,080
Speaker 1: the time he was working with full Till Poker. You know,

810
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 1: online poker was becoming huge at the time, and so

811
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 1: he was going to be in a tournament for Full

812
00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:55,480
Speaker 1: Till Poker in Austria. They're like, do you want to go?

813
00:48:56,200 --> 00:49:00,160
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna go. So I call up

814
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:02,880
Speaker 1: our buddies at East sixty. They send me a camera crew.

815
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:05,200
Speaker 1: I'm going there. I'm doing a story for E sixty.

816
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:07,359
Speaker 1: I'm doing a story in the magazine. I meet Phil

817
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 1: in Connecticut. We get into the casino in Connecticut and

818
00:49:13,120 --> 00:49:15,919
Speaker 1: he goes to a private room, a private cage where

819
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:18,880
Speaker 1: they keep all the money. He withdraws two hundred thousand dollars,

820
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:22,480
Speaker 1: plays craps at a private table, just him for about

821
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:25,560
Speaker 1: thirty five minutes, wins one hundred and fifty grand. We

822
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 1: go have a steak dinner, me, Phil, his buddies. We

823
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:32,640
Speaker 1: get on a plane. We fly to Montreal Land in Montreal,

824
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:35,360
Speaker 1: sleep at the hotel, get picked up in a limo,

825
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 1: go to a new hotel, a new casino, another private room,

826
00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,720
Speaker 1: massive room, another private crabs table with his own croupier.

827
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:48,920
Speaker 1: And he withdraws a million dollars and he is playing craps.

828
00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:51,399
Speaker 1: He's got dice, he's got chips all over the table.

829
00:49:51,400 --> 00:49:54,319
Speaker 1: He's throwing dice everywhere. And when you're playing craps on

830
00:49:54,360 --> 00:50:00,440
Speaker 1: a casino floor. Everything happens in hyperspeed. Right. It's so noisy,

831
00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:03,200
Speaker 1: it's so loud. It's the most fun experience in the world.

832
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 1: When you're playing craps in a private room with a

833
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:09,439
Speaker 1: private croupier and your own private table. You're not doing

834
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 1: it for fun. You're doing it because you need the

835
00:50:12,239 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 1: rush of gambling. It is a quiet, intense, joyous experience.

836
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 1: And at one point fills up about seven hundred and

837
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:26,040
Speaker 1: fifty grand and out of the million that he withdrew.

838
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:27,719
Speaker 1: And he looks at me and he goes, you want

839
00:50:27,719 --> 00:50:32,720
Speaker 1: to roll. I'm like, okay, So I start rolling, and

840
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:35,920
Speaker 1: I don't crep out, but I don't cash him anything.

841
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: So I don't roll twice on any particular number. So

842
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:41,279
Speaker 1: at one point I've rolled so many times he's got

843
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:44,799
Speaker 1: every number covered. The next roll is either going to

844
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:49,760
Speaker 1: be I'm crapping out or he's making a boatload of money.

845
00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 1: I roll the dice, I crap out. I cost him

846
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,000
Speaker 1: seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars that was on the table.

847
00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:01,240
Speaker 1: He looks at me, He looks at me, he goes, dude,

848
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,759
Speaker 1: And remember he is an incredibly intimidating guy. Like if

849
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: you look at old clips at phil Ivy. It is

850
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,520
Speaker 1: phil Ivy giving people stare downs and people like starting

851
00:51:11,560 --> 00:51:14,919
Speaker 1: to scratch their head because they itch so much by

852
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:18,800
Speaker 1: sort of the laser focus of his perspiration that begins

853
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:22,040
Speaker 1: on your fores. Honest to God, Colin, he is the

854
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:24,800
Speaker 1: most intimidating person I've ever interviewed in my life. I

855
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 1: would sit down behind, like across from him, and like

856
00:51:27,560 --> 00:51:30,160
Speaker 1: have nervous laughter because I was afraid. He's so much

857
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 1: smarter than everybody, and he doesn't care about like giving

858
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 1: you a good anecdote. He's just going to tell you

859
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:37,440
Speaker 1: what's on his mind. And sometimes what's on his mind

860
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:40,720
Speaker 1: is scary to hear if you're the person asking the questions.

861
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:44,240
Speaker 1: He looks at me and he goes, dude, you're fucking

862
00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:49,640
Speaker 1: mush And that was it. Like we then flew from

863
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:54,719
Speaker 1: there to Amsterdam. Longest flight of my life. And by

864
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:59,680
Speaker 1: the way, he ended up making another one point two million.

865
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:02,480
Speaker 1: It's not like he walked away losing money on the day.

866
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:07,280
Speaker 1: It was incredibly intimidating, but made for a great story,

867
00:52:07,560 --> 00:52:11,200
Speaker 1: made for a great story that was good content right there, Yeah,

868
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:14,200
Speaker 1: it was. It was great content. In twenty ten, it's

869
00:52:14,239 --> 00:52:17,080
Speaker 1: still good content in twenty twenty one. Okay, I'm gonna

870
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:20,280
Speaker 1: tell you my my bet this week my Action Network

871
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 1: bet Bucks plus five and a half game two Chris

872
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:28,120
Speaker 1: Middleton over twenty five and a half points. Why natural letdown?

873
00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 1: Little bit for Phoenix, a little desperation for Milwaukee, they'll

874
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:37,560
Speaker 1: probably get more free throws. And the truth is the

875
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:40,120
Speaker 1: Suns play a style. You can ask the Lakers, you

876
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:42,239
Speaker 1: can ask the Nuggets, you can ask the Clippers, and

877
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:46,359
Speaker 1: now you can ask the Bucks. It's very hard, relentless

878
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:51,320
Speaker 1: offensive style with great urgency to get your arms around.

879
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:55,200
Speaker 1: In Game one, it's a it's a they play with

880
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:59,319
Speaker 1: almost a collegiate intensity. It's a march badness feel. Some

881
00:52:59,440 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 1: of it's the naivete or the juice of youth. We

882
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:08,400
Speaker 1: don't get. They're just I've compared to the Seahawks. The

883
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:11,960
Speaker 1: first year they want it. The year before they were interesting.

884
00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:14,960
Speaker 1: The next year they look like the best football team

885
00:53:15,000 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 1: in the world. Everybody peaked. And I do think that

886
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 1: Seahawk team. Go ask Denver, go ask the Patriots. In

887
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:27,040
Speaker 1: the second Super Bowl, that first quarter against them, it's

888
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:31,320
Speaker 1: just a rush. Seattle was so fast and so loose,

889
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:34,760
Speaker 1: and aggressive. I think Phoenix is. I think they're really

890
00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:38,799
Speaker 1: hard out of the gate. They burst out of the

891
00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:43,359
Speaker 1: gate and it's hard. They play fast. I do think

892
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:47,479
Speaker 1: over the course of a series you get a little

893
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:51,319
Speaker 1: more balance and understanding of the tempo. And maybe I'm

894
00:53:51,320 --> 00:53:54,040
Speaker 1: talking out of my butt, but I do feel like

895
00:53:54,440 --> 00:53:59,680
Speaker 1: there are teams that are just built for first quarters.

896
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:01,600
Speaker 1: I mean, you know what, Patriots have never had a

897
00:54:01,600 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 1: touchdown in Tom Brady in New England first quarter. Y.

898
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:10,000
Speaker 1: They're tactical, they're methodical. The Ravens team with Ray Lewis

899
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,279
Speaker 1: will blow your doors off. Kansas City can blow your

900
00:54:12,320 --> 00:54:14,640
Speaker 1: doors off. There are teams. I think Phoenix is a

901
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:19,360
Speaker 1: team I'd bet against later in series, but never early.

902
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 1: That's my thought. Is it stupid? So a couple of

903
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:26,479
Speaker 1: things can be true. One you can be talking out

904
00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:31,719
Speaker 1: of your butt and you can also be right. And

905
00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:36,080
Speaker 1: so I agree with you about backing the Bucks in

906
00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:39,200
Speaker 1: game two. There's an old theory, and you probably remember

907
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:41,160
Speaker 1: this from when you lived in Vegas because it was

908
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 1: most prevalent and most obvious as an opportunity for professional betters,

909
00:54:47,600 --> 00:54:52,760
Speaker 1: probably about seven from the seventies through like the early

910
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 1: two thousands, which was. It's called the zig zag theory,

911
00:54:56,840 --> 00:55:02,960
Speaker 1: and bookmakers and betters would automatic be shading or favoring

912
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:09,200
Speaker 1: the team that lost the first game of a playoffs series. Yeah,

913
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:11,000
Speaker 1: the public will be all over him. The public is

914
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:13,160
Speaker 1: now going to be all over the Suns, right, and

915
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:16,040
Speaker 1: the betters are going to come in. You notice this,

916
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:19,520
Speaker 1: The spread for game one was Suns six and a half.

917
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:24,320
Speaker 1: Suns won Game one going away, They won by thirteen points.

918
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:26,919
Speaker 1: It was never really a contest outside of the first

919
00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:30,400
Speaker 1: seven or eight minutes. The spread in game two is

920
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:34,480
Speaker 1: five and a half. So clearly the bookmakers are expecting

921
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:38,399
Speaker 1: professional betters to favor the Bucks. I would still favor

922
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: the Bucks at plus five and a half, largely because

923
00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:44,000
Speaker 1: of a lot of what you just said. There is

924
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 1: an adjustment, but also it was the first game back

925
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:50,120
Speaker 1: for Yannis. They're trying to figure out how to incorporate

926
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:52,680
Speaker 1: him back into the game plan, which sounds weird, like

927
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:55,160
Speaker 1: how hard is it to incorporate the two time MVP

928
00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:56,920
Speaker 1: in one of the top three players in the league.

929
00:55:57,239 --> 00:55:59,759
Speaker 1: But look, Chris Middleton and Drew Holiday in those last

930
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:02,640
Speaker 1: two games against the Hawks, they were world beers, and

931
00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:04,880
Speaker 1: then they came out and they were seven for twenty

932
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:07,319
Speaker 1: two and parts of the game, you know, as we

933
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:09,719
Speaker 1: were getting through the end of the game. So I

934
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 1: do think they needed to adjust a little bit. And

935
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:14,120
Speaker 1: I agree with you on Middleton. He's always a bounced

936
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:17,760
Speaker 1: back guy. And I am not a huge fan of Middleton.

937
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:20,080
Speaker 1: When I think about the Bucks and needing a Big three,

938
00:56:20,120 --> 00:56:22,200
Speaker 1: I don't think Chris Middleton, Oh my god, he's the

939
00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:24,399
Speaker 1: guy that is going to get me over the top.

940
00:56:24,840 --> 00:56:26,800
Speaker 1: And there's a lot of factors that got the Bucks

941
00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:30,640
Speaker 1: to the finals this year. Chris Middleton, to me, is

942
00:56:30,680 --> 00:56:34,279
Speaker 1: a nice player, not a got a half player, and

943
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:37,520
Speaker 1: I do think part of that is the inconsistency. That

944
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:41,600
Speaker 1: said inconsistency holds form. He will have him much better

945
00:56:41,600 --> 00:56:44,160
Speaker 1: shooting game in game two than he had in Game one.

946
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:47,600
Speaker 1: By the way, I also think I consider this. I

947
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:52,720
Speaker 1: usually bet SEC teams to win and cover in Bowl games,

948
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:58,000
Speaker 1: and the reason being is, and that's baked in. They're

949
00:56:58,080 --> 00:57:04,600
Speaker 1: usually favored, but there's an intensity and almost a violence

950
00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:08,880
Speaker 1: and speed to SEC defenses that cannot be duplicated in

951
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:13,640
Speaker 1: your practice, and sometimes the time off makes it worse.

952
00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:17,120
Speaker 1: You're better to have played a week before when you

953
00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:20,840
Speaker 1: play an SEC team, you're ready for game speed. So

954
00:57:20,920 --> 00:57:24,080
Speaker 1: I like first half bets on SEC teams. I like

955
00:57:24,200 --> 00:57:28,080
Speaker 1: betting SEC teams. There is a style of play in

956
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:30,960
Speaker 1: a Bowl game six weeks off, four weeks off, and

957
00:57:31,040 --> 00:57:34,920
Speaker 1: you're playing Mississippi and they've got seven NFL players and

958
00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 1: you have two, and it's like whoo wo whoa, whoa,

959
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:40,200
Speaker 1: whoa whoa. I feel that way with the West. Is

960
00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:42,720
Speaker 1: that just to give you the difference. I like Phoenix

961
00:57:42,800 --> 00:57:46,200
Speaker 1: in this series because sometimes we don't give Western teams

962
00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 1: credit because they're facing Western teams. A prime example, if

963
00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:51,600
Speaker 1: the Bucks got swept in this series, they would still

964
00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:54,600
Speaker 1: probably be favorite, your co favorites to get to the

965
00:57:54,680 --> 00:57:57,840
Speaker 1: finals out of the East next year. If the Sun's

966
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:01,080
Speaker 1: swept the Bucks, they would not be favored in the

967
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:05,560
Speaker 1: West to win. Kawai comes back, Lebron and Ad come back.

968
00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:10,000
Speaker 1: Golden State's gonna take big swings. Is I think Phoenix

969
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:15,560
Speaker 1: in the East would have swept virtually every team. So

970
00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:18,480
Speaker 1: one of the reasons, I just like there are some

971
00:58:18,920 --> 00:58:22,200
Speaker 1: matchups physically that God Milwaukee's way, but I think the

972
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:24,480
Speaker 1: West is so much better. I mean, think about this,

973
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:28,640
Speaker 1: the bad teams in the West have stars, Zion Williams

974
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 1: and Pelicans. The good teams in the East have stars,

975
00:58:33,520 --> 00:58:36,120
Speaker 1: Janis Ben Simmons. You don't trust in second halfs or

976
00:58:36,160 --> 00:58:38,960
Speaker 1: latent games. So I'm just gonna take Phoenix on kind

977
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:43,080
Speaker 1: of my sec football theory Bowl game theory. We almost

978
00:58:43,120 --> 00:58:46,000
Speaker 1: don't understand how much better Phoenix and the Western Champ

979
00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:51,520
Speaker 1: is over the Eastern champ. Not only not only that

980
00:58:52,440 --> 00:58:57,640
Speaker 1: outside of Brooklyn, you don't even have stars on Philadelphia

981
00:58:58,200 --> 00:59:02,200
Speaker 1: that you mentioned, Ben Simmons, I'm thinking Joel Embiid. You

982
00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:05,280
Speaker 1: double team Joel Embiid. He can't pass his way out

983
00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:08,560
Speaker 1: of it, so you're completely eliminating the two best players

984
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:11,480
Speaker 1: on that team. The only team that has stars you

985
00:59:11,560 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 1: can consistently count on who can play sort of your

986
00:59:14,520 --> 00:59:18,520
Speaker 1: full round pedal strokes game are the Brooklyn Nets. And

987
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 1: we saw what happened this year. They all couldn't stay

988
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:24,560
Speaker 1: on the floor at the same time. And Steve Nash,

989
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:27,000
Speaker 1: he had an incredible year, but he's still had moments

990
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:30,600
Speaker 1: where he was outcoached by Mike Budenholzer, and Mike Budenholzer

991
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:33,080
Speaker 1: has been outcoached by everybody the past three years in

992
00:59:33,200 --> 00:59:36,720
Speaker 1: the playoffs for his lack of ability to make any adjustments,

993
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:39,360
Speaker 1: which is what's going to make the game in Game

994
00:59:39,400 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 1: two so much more interesting because it is going to

995
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:45,560
Speaker 1: pit Monty Williams, who has been a brilliant coach with

996
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:49,160
Speaker 1: the Suns these past two seasons against Budenholzer, whose fatal

997
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:53,760
Speaker 1: flaw has been his inability to make in series adjustments

998
00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:56,400
Speaker 1: and be flexible. Well, plus the pick and roll. I mean,

999
00:59:56,480 --> 00:59:59,360
Speaker 1: you got DeAndre Ayton and Chris Paul. I'm not sure

1000
00:59:59,680 --> 01:00:01,840
Speaker 1: even a coach with great adjustments can stop it. I

1001
01:00:01,880 --> 01:00:06,400
Speaker 1: mean there are teams nobody stopped, including the Jordan Bulls

1002
01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:09,320
Speaker 1: and Phil Jackson. Nobody stopped Stockton Malone's pick and roll.

1003
01:00:09,880 --> 01:00:12,800
Speaker 1: I mean they there are teams that do things so well.

1004
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:15,600
Speaker 1: You know, I don't care if the Baltimore Ravens. There

1005
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:19,040
Speaker 1: were certain efficiencies with New England's offense you can't stop.

1006
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:22,880
Speaker 1: That's what makes the sound so interesting is because they

1007
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:26,080
Speaker 1: do have three point threats around the perimeter, so you

1008
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:29,960
Speaker 1: can't leave these guys open. But what Chris Paul can

1009
01:00:30,040 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 1: do to break down a defense and then to have

1010
01:00:32,640 --> 01:00:36,320
Speaker 1: DeAndre Ayton playing the way that he's playing, there's nobody

1011
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:38,840
Speaker 1: who can tell me when he was drafted number one,

1012
01:00:39,200 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 1: that they predicted him becoming not just a double double guy,

1013
01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:46,200
Speaker 1: but a record setting double double guy, a fifteen fifteen guy,

1014
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:49,800
Speaker 1: each twenty guy as he's been dominating during the playoffs.

1015
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:52,080
Speaker 1: All credits to Chris Paul for finding a way to

1016
01:00:52,160 --> 01:00:54,800
Speaker 1: motivate him, which Ayton has said, but also all credits

1017
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:57,600
Speaker 1: to Chris Paul for finding ways to use his dribble

1018
01:00:57,720 --> 01:01:00,080
Speaker 1: to create space and then put himself into position to

1019
01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:01,840
Speaker 1: score in a spot that he likes and some mid

1020
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:04,280
Speaker 1: range around the elbow and if it's not there, to

1021
01:01:04,400 --> 01:01:08,000
Speaker 1: have DeAndre Ayton wide open. It's been a masterclass in

1022
01:01:08,120 --> 01:01:10,240
Speaker 1: how to run an offense from a point guard perspective.

1023
01:01:10,560 --> 01:01:13,120
Speaker 1: All right, Chad Milman, Nick right, good show, have a

1024
01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:15,800
Speaker 1: great weekend. I'm going to Jackson Hole, Wyoming. Can't wait

1025
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:19,160
Speaker 1: with my kids. Dude, I know you know what you're doing,

1026
01:01:19,360 --> 01:01:24,160
Speaker 1: what you're living. Yep, you're just living big big, bigley. Enjoy.

1027
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:29,960
Speaker 1: Thanks Buddy at The Volume Sports, Twitter and Instagram, Rate review, subscribe,

1028
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:31,960
Speaker 1: Good show, have a great weekend. That was a lot

1029
01:01:32,000 --> 01:02:04,400
Speaker 1: of fun. The Volume