WEBVTT - Ep32 - Sam Elliott / "The Hero" 0:00:18.720 --> 0:00:22.439 You're listening to play back a Variety podcast. I'm your host, 0:00:22.560 --> 0:00:26.320 Variety of Awards Editor, Chris Tapley. Icon is a word 0:00:26.360 --> 0:00:28.400 that gets thrown around a lot, but I think my 0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:31.880 guest today qualifies. Even the man's voice is iconic, which 0:00:31.880 --> 0:00:35.040 should make for some great radio today. But that's also 0:00:35.159 --> 0:00:37.520 the entry point for his character and Brett Haley's new film, 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:39.840 The Hero, and which he starts as a voice actor 0:00:39.920 --> 0:00:42.519 searching for that next gear in life. His name is 0:00:42.560 --> 0:00:44.159 Sam Elliott and we're excited to have him on the 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:46.120 show today. Thanks for being here, sir, Thanks for having 0:00:46.120 --> 0:00:48.760 me on. Chris pure to be here. I want to 0:00:48.760 --> 0:00:51.160 start by saying, I hope course pays you handsomely because 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:54.400 I bought my share because of you. Oh good. I'm 0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:58.600 gonna pass that on to him. You've got a good relationship. 0:00:58.840 --> 0:01:00.760 You know, They've been good to me over the years. 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:04.280 And just to start off somewhat irreverently before we get 0:01:04.319 --> 0:01:07.160 to the to the meat of this, uh, you are 0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:11.800 responsible for uttering probably my favorite line in movie history 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:16.520 from Roadhouse. Uh. That place has a sign hanging over 0:01:16.520 --> 0:01:18.160 the year and all that is don't eat the big 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:22.000 white man. Don't eat the big white man that kills me. Yeah, 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:25.440 me as well. I enjoyed that one. What was that? 0:01:25.480 --> 0:01:27.960 What was that? Shoot? Like, let's start? It was fun, 0:01:28.000 --> 0:01:31.760 you know, I think it's it was mindless on some level. 0:01:31.840 --> 0:01:34.080 I think on some level it was like the ultimate 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:38.880 male fantasy, you know, a thing, you know. But working 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:42.440 with Patrick and working with Ben Gazzara and working with 0:01:42.520 --> 0:01:45.400 Joel Silver, who was the producer who's kind of one 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:49.120 of those old throwbacks from the old days of Hollywood, 0:01:49.600 --> 0:01:53.840 was quite a joy. Beat the ship out of each 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:57.240 other on the thing and happened. That part was also fun. 0:01:57.440 --> 0:02:00.760 I was young enough at that point where my body 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:04.880 could withstand it. We had a good time, you know. 0:02:05.160 --> 0:02:08.760 It's it's always fun to play those characters that are 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:15.120 albeit not very well drawn, they're still fun to try 0:02:15.160 --> 0:02:18.080 to breathe life into them, you know. And when you 0:02:18.160 --> 0:02:22.799 have enough good one liners here and there, then that's 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:24.720 a good time. I don't eat the Big White Man 0:02:25.880 --> 0:02:29.680 the Hero. This is your second film with Brett Haley. Um. 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:31.639 You know, as I said at the top, I've known 0:02:31.639 --> 0:02:33.280 Brett for a number of years now, going back to 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:36.040 film school. He must have impressed you enough with his 0:02:36.240 --> 0:02:39.720 second film. I'll see you in my dreams. I don't 0:02:39.720 --> 0:02:41.960 know even think it was a matter of Brett impressing me. 0:02:42.080 --> 0:02:45.080 I just you know, maybe if you know, I don't know. 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:47.520 I just don't think it in terms of that with Brett. 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:52.000 But Dreams was such, you know, it was a short 0:02:52.080 --> 0:02:56.880 lived two week experience. But I hadn't had an opportunity 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:00.160 to play a character like that and a lot a 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:03.280 long time, you know, kind of the leading man, kind 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:09.280 of a character piece. This came out of the journey 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:12.480 that Bred and I went on after we made Dreams. 0:03:12.480 --> 0:03:15.520 When we went on the road to do the promotion 0:03:15.639 --> 0:03:19.880 for it. We traveled a bunch together back and forth 0:03:19.919 --> 0:03:23.720 across the country and ate a lot of meals together, 0:03:23.840 --> 0:03:26.960 logged a lot of miles together, had a few drinks together, 0:03:27.080 --> 0:03:30.520 and had a lot of dialogue, a lot of talking together. 0:03:30.800 --> 0:03:34.400 And he got to know me, and I got to 0:03:34.440 --> 0:03:39.000 know him, and you know, we I think dug up 0:03:39.040 --> 0:03:42.960 a pretty close relationship. And he said I want to 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:45.280 write something for you, and I said, yeah, right man, 0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:48.480 He said, no bashing, all right, something And so he 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:51.680 and he went home and he and Mark Bash came 0:03:51.760 --> 0:03:57.880 up with this concept for something called the Iceberg. Actually 0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:01.320 it was called Iceberg in the beginning when Brett gave 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:06.080 me it in treatment form, and it was really the 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:10.160 whole theory was on that piece that's on Nick's screensaver 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:16.080 in the film about how an actor's career, you know, 0:04:16.400 --> 0:04:22.160 comparison to an Iceberg, like what you see on the 0:04:22.279 --> 0:04:25.400 top of the water isn't necessarily what it's all about 0:04:26.320 --> 0:04:34.200 below the surface, which to me is it's an interesting comparison, 0:04:34.680 --> 0:04:39.080 you know. But the marketing people the people, and then 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:41.440 then they developed a script and it was still called 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:45.120 Iceberg for a moment, but then they got funding for it, 0:04:45.240 --> 0:04:48.479 and the people that came up with the money didn't 0:04:48.480 --> 0:04:52.280 think that Iceberg was going to be a marketable name, 0:04:52.720 --> 0:04:57.880 so they changed it to a zero hero works. Yeah, 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:02.200 I guess it does. It's an overused term, boy, I 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:06.320 think at this point, and there's nothing heroic about Lee 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:12.680 Hidden well. It's an interesting juxtaposition with today's uh zeitgeist 0:05:12.720 --> 0:05:15.280 in the industry, superior Rose flying around and it's a 0:05:15.400 --> 0:05:20.120 very different story. Is there anything particularly exciting striking to 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:22.880 you about working with up and coming talent versus you know, 0:05:22.920 --> 0:05:28.400 a veteran filmmaker. Oh, absolutely, I mean, it gives you 0:05:28.480 --> 0:05:30.799 hope for where the game's going, for where the business 0:05:30.880 --> 0:05:32.880 is gone. And you know, I've been in this business 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:36.960 a long time, almost fifty years, you know, and wanted 0:05:37.080 --> 0:05:40.599 to do it since I was a kid. I have 0:05:40.760 --> 0:05:46.080 seen a number of changes. I think mark most prominently 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:52.880 by you know, the introduction of the chip so to speak. 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:57.599 It's really kind of revolutionized the business. And here comes 0:05:57.600 --> 0:06:02.640 this kid. It's comes from that side of it. That's 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:08.280 a filmmaker, you know. I mean, I think a brilliant filmmaker. 0:06:08.400 --> 0:06:12.320 I think Brett has an opportunity to do some really 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:15.800 important work over the years, over the long haul, and 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:17.640 I think if he wants it, he will have a 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:20.200 long haul career. It will be there a long time 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:24.040 because he has things to say and he knows how 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:27.240 to go about putting it together. Does he communicate with 0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:29.479 you differently on the set in a way that's notable 0:06:29.520 --> 0:06:38.159 for you? Uh? You know, he communicates period period, Like 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:44.200 he just knows how to talk to people, and it's 0:06:44.240 --> 0:06:47.719 not like to hear himself talk. You know. He comes in, 0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:49.800 he knows clearly what it is he wants to do. 0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:53.760 He certainly has his vision, but he's also smart enough 0:06:53.800 --> 0:06:57.119 to get out of the actor's way on a certain level. 0:06:58.440 --> 0:07:01.320 But if you kind of stray too far one way 0:07:01.400 --> 0:07:07.240 or another, you need to be brought in or he 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:10.960 wants to talk. He just comes in says a few words. 0:07:11.760 --> 0:07:15.200 You know. That to me is just you know, a 0:07:15.280 --> 0:07:18.360 director that knows what he wants, but at the same 0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:21.400 time as willing to kind of keep an open mind 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:27.080 or he's going to come up with something really good 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:29.520 in the end. The other thing about Bread is he 0:07:29.560 --> 0:07:36.080 always he's always open to doing one kind of an 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:41.280 option piece. It's like he gets what he wants, gets 0:07:41.320 --> 0:07:43.320 the takes that he wants, and then he just kind 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:45.840 of throws it up and said, you know, maybe it's 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:48.400 like just as simple as not do whatever you want 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:52.920 a little fun. Yeah, you didn't ever know what's going 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:56.760 to come out of one of those. Yeah, indeed, something 0:07:56.840 --> 0:07:59.280 might spark in the moment. This is one of the 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:01.920 most intimate formances I think you've given. And you probably 0:08:01.920 --> 0:08:04.880 get asked this a lot, but at least one wondering 0:08:05.920 --> 0:08:08.240 did you put a lot of yourself into this? And 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:10.280 I think by virtue of the fact that I'm an 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:15.040 actor and I'm of Lee's age, that probably there is 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:19.200 a certain amount of myself in there, and the fact 0:08:19.200 --> 0:08:22.520 that it was born out of a you know, long 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:28.640 extended conversation with the guy that wrote the screenplay. I 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.280 think there's no question on some level it's me, but 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:33.640 it's you know, it's not like it's a documentary about 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:39.760 Sam Eliott. There's a couple of glaring differences right off 0:08:39.760 --> 0:08:44.160 the top. I'm happily married to Catherine still for thirty 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.520 three years. We've been together for thirty nine years. I 0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:50.240 love my daughter more than anything. I see her all 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:54.600 the time. I don't have cancer and I don't smoke dope. 0:08:55.160 --> 0:08:59.400 So apart from that, you know, there's some stuff that 0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:03.840 I identify with. I know, characters that had a you know, 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:07.840 had a good run at it, a short run actors, 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:12.400 and then nothing happened after that, and I watched those 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:15.880 guys dry on the vine, waiting for it to turn around. 0:09:16.640 --> 0:09:19.920 There's certainly guys there that, you know, his business is 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:23.840 not easy on its actors. I don't think so. My 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:29.120 friend Bill Paxton told me and Catherine one time, standing 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:32.680 in our kitchen women right after we'd done Tombstone. He said, 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:36.559 we're all just grisped for the mill, you know, And 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:40.600 I just fun man, that's the truth of it. That's 0:09:40.679 --> 0:09:45.080 the truth. That had a way of putting things in words. Uh, 0:09:45.280 --> 0:09:48.439 you know, that idea of putting a lot of yourself 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:51.080 into a role and if it cuts close to the bone, 0:09:51.480 --> 0:09:54.400 not saying this necessarily did, but if it did, is 0:09:54.440 --> 0:09:57.920 that kind of thing scary or exciting as an actor 0:09:57.920 --> 0:09:59.400 when you when you cut that close to the bone 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:01.760 of who you I don't know that I've ever had 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:05.360 an opportunity to do this before, to go that close 0:10:05.400 --> 0:10:10.200 to the bone, as you say, And I just looked 0:10:10.200 --> 0:10:13.880 at it as an opportunity, a gift, if you want 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:15.720 to call it that. I've called it that a bunch 0:10:15.720 --> 0:10:18.320 of times. You know, I'm seventy two years old. I'm 0:10:18.320 --> 0:10:20.240 doing what I wanted to do since I was a 0:10:20.280 --> 0:10:22.080 little kid. I don't know how much longer I'm going 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:25.040 to be around or how much more I'm gonna be 0:10:25.160 --> 0:10:29.640 offered to work things that i want to do. And 0:10:30.400 --> 0:10:34.520 this opportunity came, and you know, there was really a 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:37.720 chance to bear my soul in some ways. And because 0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:42.439 I have understand this guy, I understand what he's given 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:45.720 up in pursuit of a career. I understand it. He's 0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:50.000 totally fucked it up on by the choices that he's made. 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:53.719 And you know, it just seemed the right time. It 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:57.120 seemed the right time to let it go and do 0:10:57.240 --> 0:11:01.160 the best I could with this material. As you say, 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:03.760 nearly fifty years into a career, and you said, you 0:11:03.800 --> 0:11:05.520 say you wanted to do whatever since you were a kid. 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:09.240 What what What was the early hook that got you? 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:14.040 I think I'm sure going to too many Saturday matinees 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:19.720 in Sacramento where I grew up, the Sequoya Theater, which 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:21.840 I'm sure is at the bottom of some mini mall 0:11:21.960 --> 0:11:27.400 by now. It's just you know, I read there was 0:11:27.440 --> 0:11:32.040 this really kind of alarming piece, not alarming, but I 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:35.720 don't know, off putting peace to me in the l 0:11:35.760 --> 0:11:40.880 A Times last Sunday. But all the exhibitors are all 0:11:40.920 --> 0:11:43.760 trying to figure out how to bring the audience back 0:11:43.760 --> 0:11:46.880 into the fold, so to speak. You know, all the 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:51.160 bells and whistles that they're offering, you know, the food, 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:55.480 the reclining chairs. You know, it doesn't sound like they 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:59.719 really enforced the rule of no cell phones anymore. The 0:12:00.160 --> 0:12:03.959 blean seats and the spray depending on where you are, 0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:07.720 you know, but it's like, what the funk man. I mean, 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:11.600 for me, going to a film is about going into 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:14.760 a dark in theater, and it's a relationship you have 0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:17.720 with what's going on on the screen. It's not about 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:20.760 all the distractions that are going on around you. It's 0:12:20.760 --> 0:12:24.200 not about trying to have to focus and like block 0:12:24.400 --> 0:12:27.839 things out. That's why you would go in there. That's 0:12:27.840 --> 0:12:29.480 why I went in there as a kid, and I 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:32.959 was like mesmerized, remb We're going in there just watching 0:12:33.520 --> 0:12:40.280 Flash Gordon cereals, you know, or I'm not even sure 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:42.880 whether I'm not even in a ventuary. I guess maybe 0:12:42.880 --> 0:12:45.200 some of those Westerns back. Yeah, there's no doubt that 0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:49.240 there were Westerns. I think I saw red River very 0:12:49.240 --> 0:12:52.040 early on. I know I saw The Searchers Barrier early on. 0:12:53.920 --> 0:12:56.680 But there were Western series, and I guess it was 0:12:56.800 --> 0:12:59.560 Tom Mix and I'm trying to think of and that 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:05.359 they were like cereals as well. But it was that exchange, 0:13:05.400 --> 0:13:09.120 that audience exchanged with those lights flickering on the screen. 0:13:09.200 --> 0:13:14.040 It just I thought, Wow, it's incredible to make somebody 0:13:14.080 --> 0:13:16.480 feel like I'm feeling that. That's what I want to do. 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:20.200 We talked about the chip. I mean, I guess that's 0:13:20.200 --> 0:13:24.679 what we're that that's what we're losing it to, is 0:13:24.880 --> 0:13:28.120 the ease of viewing things on the laptop or a 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:29.760 phone or what have you been A lot of that's 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:32.839 going to TV, which is something I wanted to talk 0:13:32.880 --> 0:13:35.360 about as well. A lot of great stuff being done 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:37.800 on TV these days. And you've had a unique perch. 0:13:38.920 --> 0:13:41.280 You've been involved with TV much of your entire career, 0:13:41.440 --> 0:13:45.079 so you've seen that shift in that platform. So what 0:13:45.400 --> 0:13:47.600 do you what do you think about how TV has 0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:51.319 changed over the years and where it is now. I think, 0:13:51.400 --> 0:13:55.199 like film, TV has changed radically. I mean, if you 0:13:55.240 --> 0:13:57.640 look at the number of platforms and the number of 0:13:57.800 --> 0:14:02.559 content that's been generated today and developed this today, I mean, 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:06.520 it's mind boggling wonderful for an actor, you know, because 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:10.600 there's work out there, and good work, and the work 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:13.040 that's being done today. I think on some level it's 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:18.560 like the golden age of television. That's said. I think there's, 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:21.440 you know, all this stuff with cable television. It's like, 0:14:22.040 --> 0:14:24.920 I don't know, you know, there's this big rub as 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:28.960 to whether all of that stuff should be competing on 0:14:29.160 --> 0:14:32.480 equal ground with the movies that are getting generated out 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:36.560 there and you know, I don't know. You may be 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:40.520 asking the wrong fellow for you know that kind of 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.360 I'm I'm really pretty much of a techno peasant by 0:14:43.480 --> 0:14:48.120 choice and hope to remain so I don't email, and 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:52.520 I don't Facebook and tweet and all that other business. 0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:59.560 Can't imagine you on Twitter, nor can I, nor can I. Uh, 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:01.560 you know, I guess said nearly fifty years into it, 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:04.560 what's for you? Do you think the secret to the longevity? 0:15:06.080 --> 0:15:08.920 I think making the right choices in the long run 0:15:09.600 --> 0:15:13.280 and not having to take a job for money, which 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:17.800 allowed me to make what I considered the right choice 0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:23.760 in terms of the material. You know, I because I 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:26.480 wanted it early on, and I thought a lot about 0:15:26.480 --> 0:15:30.120 it when I started when I literally became an actor, 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:35.520 and I've discovered earlier on for whatever reason, and I 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:37.320 think a lot of it was I watched a lot 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:41.760 of bad television back and then, like fifties and sixties. 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:44.880 There was also a lot of great television in that 0:15:44.960 --> 0:15:47.280 period of time, but there was some pretty bad stuff 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:52.600 as well. I think I decided then that if I 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:56.000 wanted a long I wanted to go the distance I 0:15:56.000 --> 0:15:59.920 have longevity in my career. That I should be choose. 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:04.720 You about what I did to maintained I just worked 0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:09.520 for money, but go for good stuff. What I thought 0:16:09.600 --> 0:16:13.320 was good stuff. I wanted to venture out a little 0:16:13.360 --> 0:16:16.080 bit and talk about we we just touched on the Westerns. 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:18.120 I'm a huge fan of the genre. I'm always hoping 0:16:18.160 --> 0:16:22.080 it can have a huge, lively comeback. Obviously, you're one 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:24.160 of the icons of that genre, with the Louis Lamore 0:16:24.240 --> 0:16:28.120 stuff and Tombstone Buffalo girls and whatnot. What do you 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:31.720 think of that? This is maybe an unnecessarily heavy question, 0:16:31.800 --> 0:16:35.920 but it's something I think about just the genres viability, 0:16:36.160 --> 0:16:38.560 the contemporary viability like that. Do you think the genre 0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:42.280 still has something to say today? I think it's timeless 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.360 on some level, you know. I mean, you know, the 0:16:46.400 --> 0:16:49.240 Western was Hollywood was bread and butter for quite a 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:54.720 period of time. By the time I got to Hollywood, 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:59.080 the Western was pretty much on its way out, falling 0:16:59.120 --> 0:17:03.080 out of favor. But there were still we still have 0:17:03.240 --> 0:17:06.960 capabilities in l A to mount or Western. Today, you 0:17:07.000 --> 0:17:09.800 couldn't mount a Western if you if your hat depended 0:17:09.880 --> 0:17:12.560 on it, you have to go to Texas or New Mexico. 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:16.040 That's that's most of the livestock, and most of the wagons, 0:17:16.080 --> 0:17:23.040 most of the equipment is now. But there's also I 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:27.200 think no desire in the business, and I think it's 0:17:27.240 --> 0:17:30.880 based upon you know, I'd say it's all so much 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:36.120 of it now is based upon what the marketplace once 0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:41.000 or what we think the marketplace wants to see. And 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:44.440 I'm not sure that anybody in Hollywood thinks that there's 0:17:44.480 --> 0:17:49.080 a market for a good Western anymore. You can take 0:17:52.240 --> 0:17:58.520 the Lone Ranger, for lack of a better example, cast 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:02.480 a white man playing Tom too and have all that 0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:06.959 computer generated stuff in it, spend the kind of money waste, 0:18:07.040 --> 0:18:09.560 the kind of money that they made that they spent 0:18:10.119 --> 0:18:13.720 making that film, that has nothing to do with what 0:18:14.359 --> 0:18:18.360 I see is what is most interesting about that genre 0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:22.000 to me. It was always the simplicity of that genre, 0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:27.280 the clear delineation between good and bad. There wasn't a 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:32.240 lot of gray area. The outdoors, the real outdoors, not 0:18:32.400 --> 0:18:36.280 something that's computer generated, was always a prime character in 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:40.400 the piece, the classic struggles between man and man, man 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.440 and the outdoors, man and nature. Call it what you want, 0:18:44.359 --> 0:18:50.119 you know, and a good story with good characters, believable characters, 0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:53.840 and an opportunity to tell the truth about a time 0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:59.640 when you know, life was a simpler thing. And there's 0:18:59.680 --> 0:19:02.359 nothing wrong with the vision of a man on horseback either, 0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:07.119 and particularly in beautiful country. What's your favorite Western? Do 0:19:07.160 --> 0:19:09.040 you have one? Oh? My god, I don't know. I 0:19:11.320 --> 0:19:14.359 don't know how many times I watched The Searchers over 0:19:14.400 --> 0:19:18.720 the years. And actually one of the first film that 0:19:18.800 --> 0:19:22.800 I started in it was right after I left twentieth 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:25.760 Century Fox as a contract player, and it was a 0:19:25.800 --> 0:19:31.440 movie called Cactus at the time, and a woman named 0:19:31.560 --> 0:19:38.639 Vera Miles started in it, and Vera was in The Searchers. 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:43.440 You mentioned red River earlier. That's definitely a favorite of mine. Yeah, 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.239 hard to beat. That's probably I've heard. I think that's 0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:51.760 his best performance. John Ford came to visit Vera on 0:19:51.840 --> 0:19:56.520 the set of Cactus, which later was called Molly and Law. 0:19:56.640 --> 0:19:59.879 Was John maybe repeating myself now, sorry if it was. 0:20:00.400 --> 0:20:03.480 I got to meet John Ford on that film. That 0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.639 was pretty incredible. I think he had a soft spot 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:11.520 for very Miles but which comes as no surprise, which 0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:14.720 she was a beautiful woman. You have to meet John Ford. 0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:18.600 You got to be in Butch Cassidy and Barely I'm 0:20:18.600 --> 0:20:20.840 a shadow on the wall and that thing I'll take 0:20:20.880 --> 0:20:23.800 two is my line and it's off camera. I always 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:26.639 know somebody that hadn't seen that film or is really 0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:28.960 asking me for something that they don't want. When I 0:20:29.000 --> 0:20:31.520 get a letter, I get a comments saying Hi, I 0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:35.280 love you and butch cast. You know, the only my 0:20:35.480 --> 0:20:37.480 only reason my name is in the credit is because 0:20:37.480 --> 0:20:39.680 I was in her contract to Fox where they made 0:20:39.680 --> 0:20:42.320 the film. Well, it's cool to be in that scene. 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:45.800 Iconic scene. Yeah, that's a good one. It's fun and 0:20:46.000 --> 0:20:50.919 sit there watching Redford, you know, calling those guys and 0:20:51.320 --> 0:20:55.280 see Neuven come through the door and pretty cool. You 0:20:55.359 --> 0:20:57.240 got a more unique perspective on that scene than any 0:20:57.280 --> 0:21:02.119 of us do. Uh. Another TV project you were involved with. 0:21:02.160 --> 0:21:04.840 I just wanted to ask about because I love the 0:21:04.880 --> 0:21:07.760 original film was fail Safe. When Clini made Failsafe into 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:10.040 the live thing, what was that set like, because that's 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:15.960 obviously a unique, pretty incredible, and I remember it'd being 0:21:16.040 --> 0:21:19.080 pretty daunting at the same time. You know, we rehearsed 0:21:19.119 --> 0:21:25.280 for a few days. I got that call. I'd never 0:21:25.440 --> 0:21:29.119 worked with George before, did you see he just had twins. 0:21:29.240 --> 0:21:32.800 By the way, that a wonderful thing. One of each, 0:21:32.840 --> 0:21:40.320 I believe, yeah, and Stephen Frears was a director on that, 0:21:41.040 --> 0:21:43.920 and I had worked with Stephen on a picture called 0:21:43.920 --> 0:21:49.439 The High Low Country, and then you know, I was like, 0:21:49.560 --> 0:21:51.560 I don't know, I think it was maybe that same 0:21:51.640 --> 0:21:54.480 year I got a call to come and do this 0:21:54.600 --> 0:21:58.359 thing on fail Safe, and so I of course jumped 0:21:58.359 --> 0:22:01.360 at it. I mean, number one, it was an opportunity 0:22:01.359 --> 0:22:04.600 to work with Stephen again and I loved him, but 0:22:04.720 --> 0:22:07.679 an opportunity to do live television. You know, at that 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:10.960 period of time, it just and I never was one 0:22:11.080 --> 0:22:13.479 to do much theater, and I think that's why I 0:22:13.560 --> 0:22:16.120 was a little freaked up by it. That's the way 0:22:16.160 --> 0:22:18.399 I get every Friday night on the ranch when we 0:22:18.440 --> 0:22:21.000 do our taping in front of a live audience. I 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:25.800 always get a little nervous, overly amped up for that. 0:22:27.040 --> 0:22:30.199 But it was great. It wasn't It was an incredible experience. 0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:37.239 You know, George is phenomenal on almost everything, and I 0:22:37.240 --> 0:22:39.920 can't even think about in terms of being a good man. 0:22:40.080 --> 0:22:45.359 And you know, somebody that survived this game and worked 0:22:45.400 --> 0:22:47.439 hard on it, and you know, I don't know how 0:22:47.480 --> 0:22:50.280 many pilots George did over the years before he had 0:22:50.480 --> 0:22:54.440 hit the brass ring and and I think that he's 0:22:54.600 --> 0:22:59.080 probably moved on from it. You know, I think we're 0:22:59.080 --> 0:23:02.320 going to see a lot were from Mr Clooney. Then 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:05.359 being an actor, you sure isn't going to go the 0:23:05.359 --> 0:23:10.719 way of Lee Hayden, right, you know, I'm anxious to 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:15.119 see when his next trick is going to be. And 0:23:15.160 --> 0:23:18.800 then just talking about the progression of the industry today, 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:22.160 we find ourselves a wash and the Marvel properties. And 0:23:22.600 --> 0:23:26.080 you were part of Angley's Hulk and then Marvel moved 0:23:26.119 --> 0:23:31.080 on with with a different incarnation there. You know, what, 0:23:31.680 --> 0:23:33.160 did you feel like you wanted to be a part 0:23:33.200 --> 0:23:35.679 of that locomotive? I mean, I kind of feel like 0:23:35.680 --> 0:23:37.639 the answer is no, but I don't know. Yeah, I 0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:41.119 feel like the answer is no too. You know, there's 0:23:41.480 --> 0:23:43.439 there's very few things that I would like to have 0:23:43.560 --> 0:23:47.760 continued on with in terms of one of those blockbuster types. 0:23:47.880 --> 0:23:50.760 Number one, I do want to say in terms of 0:23:51.400 --> 0:23:55.399 The Hulk that the reason for doing that film was 0:23:55.480 --> 0:24:00.840 an opportunity to work with Angle and that was undeniable 0:24:00.960 --> 0:24:04.920 that that was the right choice. And working with Jennifer 0:24:04.960 --> 0:24:08.359 conny woodn't bad either. And I loved Jennifer since she 0:24:08.480 --> 0:24:14.720 was a child actress, and she's phenomenal. But the only 0:24:14.760 --> 0:24:16.840 thing that I think that I've ever wanted to see 0:24:17.000 --> 0:24:20.640 go on that didn't was a project called The Golden Compass, 0:24:21.119 --> 0:24:24.720 which was a trilogy in which we did the first 0:24:24.760 --> 0:24:27.840 one of and then that was the end of it. 0:24:28.080 --> 0:24:33.600 It basically sank New Line pictures or films. Whatever's got, 0:24:33.600 --> 0:24:40.680 there's pictures, I think cinema, Yeah, cinema, you know. And uh, 0:24:40.880 --> 0:24:43.920 the movie did really well overseas. I think it made 0:24:44.000 --> 0:24:48.720 like million, but it only made eighty million in the States, 0:24:49.080 --> 0:24:52.960 which is a little less than what it cost. And 0:24:53.000 --> 0:24:56.000 I think the way that New Line financed their films 0:24:56.080 --> 0:25:00.040 was by selling off all the foreign rights. So do 0:25:00.080 --> 0:25:04.560 we need any money to be made? But that character 0:25:04.720 --> 0:25:10.040 that I played, Lee Hayden Natallee Hayden, Lee scoresby how 0:25:10.080 --> 0:25:14.520 many played more than one. I just realized that it 0:25:14.640 --> 0:25:18.159 was something that fared much better in the second and 0:25:18.240 --> 0:25:23.760 third books. But you know, it wasn't in the cards. Yeah, 0:25:23.800 --> 0:25:26.800 that was a property that easily could sustain to number 0:25:26.800 --> 0:25:31.879 of films could have. Uh. And currently you're working on 0:25:32.000 --> 0:25:35.600 The Star is Born with Bradley Cooper directing. How's he 0:25:35.680 --> 0:25:41.960 striking you as a director. Pretty well, I'm I'm still 0:25:42.000 --> 0:25:48.280 a little I don't know, I'm not in awe of him, 0:25:48.440 --> 0:25:50.960